More With Ryan Murphy

Summary

Podcast Title: This is Gavin Newsom
Episode: More With Ryan Murphy
Release Date: July 24, 2025

In this engaging episode of "This is Gavin Newsom," Governor Gavin Newsom hosts acclaimed television producer Ryan Murphy for an in-depth conversation about the evolving landscape of Hollywood, the impact of streaming services, the challenges facing the entertainment industry, and their personal lives and routines. The discussion offers valuable insights into both the creative and political arenas, highlighting the intricate balance between maintaining cultural legacy and adapting to modern demands.

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1. The Evolution of Hollywood and Streaming Services

Gavin Newsom:
Gavin initiates the conversation by addressing Ryan's observation that Hollywood is "going younger" and exploring what this shift entails for the industry and content creation.

Quote:

[04:05] Gavin Newsom: "What do you mean by youth and younger people, what streaming means to you. What's the state of play from that perspective?"

Ryan Murphy:
Ryan reflects on his extensive experience since 1998, noting significant shifts in content trends and the rise of streaming platforms. He outlines the transition from the early days of cult shows to the dominance of prestige television and the subsequent explosion of streaming services.

Quote:

[05:12] Ryan Murphy: "I've been through a lot of different changes... the period from 2000 to 2013 was very like prestige push with sex and blood and gore... then during the Obama era, more female and progressive programming like Glee and American Horror Story... then the streaming wars began in 2016 which was the best thing that ever happened to me."

Analysis:
Ryan emphasizes how streaming services democratized content creation, allowing more diverse voices to emerge. However, he also points out the challenges brought about by the saturation of the market and the shifting preferences of younger audiences towards more cautious and emotionally driven content.

2. Challenges of the Entertainment Industry and Tax Credits

Gavin Newsom:
The discussion shifts to the financial aspects of the industry, particularly the role of tax credits in maintaining California's competitive edge in Hollywood.

Quote:

[18:40] Gavin Newsom: "We more than doubled the film tax credit. We needed to do that. The industry's on life support... competing globally, not just other states..."

Ryan Murphy:
Ryan shares his concerns about California's declining attractiveness for film production due to insufficient tax incentives compared to other states. He highlights the tangible impacts, such as increased vacancies on shooting lots and the emotional toll on industry professionals who have had to relocate, leading to strained family dynamics.

Quote:

[20:00] Ryan Murphy: "Hollywood is now a tech-controlled landscape... lot vacancies on shooting lots... people are leaving, tearing families apart."

Analysis:
Both Gavin and Ryan acknowledge the critical need for enhanced financial incentives to retain Hollywood in California. They discuss the broader implications for the state's economy and the well-being of those dependent on the entertainment industry.

3. Personal Routines and Work-Life Balance

Ryan Murphy:
Ryan delves into his personal routines, emphasizing the importance of discipline and health in managing high-pressure roles.

Quote:

[33:40] Ryan Murphy: "My morning routine is an hour of quiet reading and meditation... I do a vegan protein smoothie... eat four to six vegetables a day."

Gavin Newsom:
Gavin relates by sharing his own routines, highlighting the similarities in maintaining focus and health amidst demanding careers.

Quote:

[35:00] Gavin Newsom: "I’m a little bit, three, four days a week... Nothing exciting, but... I can't even imagine not having a smoothie or just fruit..."

Analysis:
The exchange underscores the significance of establishing healthy habits and routines to sustain productivity and personal well-being, especially in roles that require continuous creativity and leadership.

4. Future Projects and Creative Aspirations

Ryan Murphy:
Looking ahead, Ryan reveals his plans to explore new genres and themes in his work, including a vampire show and a faith-based movie.

Quote:

[26:00] Ryan Murphy: "I want to do a vampire show and a faith-based movie... something optimistic about perseverance and forgiveness."

Gavin Newsom:
Gavin encourages Ryan's ventures, appreciating his commitment to innovative storytelling and the positive messages embedded in his projects.

Quote:

[37:10] Ryan Murphy: "Being a showrunner is similar to being a governor... Could you imagine me as the governor?"

Analysis:
The conversation highlights Ryan's dedication to evolving his creative portfolio while maintaining meaningful and impactful narratives. It also reflects the intersection of creative leadership and political governance, drawing parallels between managing a television show and running a state.

5. The Intersection of Politics and Entertainment

Ryan Murphy:
Ryan humorously contemplates the idea of transitioning from television production to political leadership, drawing parallels between the roles.

Quote:

[37:10] Ryan Murphy: "Being a showrunner is similar to being a governor... Could you imagine me as the governor?"

Gavin Newsom:
Gavin engages in the playful banter, discussing leadership qualities and the importance of a clear point of view, ultimately reaffirming their mutual respect and the challenges each faces in their respective fields.

Quote:

[38:20] Gavin Newsom: "That’s important. Politicians don't explore that."

Analysis:
This segment illustrates the overlapping skills required in both entertainment and politics, such as leadership, strategic planning, and the ability to connect with diverse audiences. It also underscores the respect and camaraderie between creative and political leaders.

6. Retaining Talent and Supporting Families in California

Ryan Murphy:
Ryan expresses his dedication to keeping film production in California to support families and retain talent, emphasizing the human element behind the financial incentives.

Quote:

[23:29] Ryan Murphy: "It's about families depending on it... people are so appreciative for what you recently have done."

Gavin Newsom:
Gavin acknowledges the impact of Ryan's efforts and reiterates the need for ongoing support to ensure the sustainability of California's entertainment industry.

Quote:

[24:03] Ryan Murphy: "My great idol, Norman Lear... Every failure is a new open door you can walk through."

Analysis:
The focus shifts to the socio-economic implications of policy decisions, highlighting how strategic support for industries like entertainment can have far-reaching effects on community stability and economic growth.

7. Closing Thoughts and Mutual Support

Ryan Murphy:
Ryan concludes by commending Gavin's leadership and expressing a desire to continue supporting California's growth and resilience.

Quote:

[42:30] Ryan Murphy: "I admire what you've done and I know that you... You've inherited many messes... keep doing it because people are appreciative."

Gavin Newsom:
Gavin reciprocates the admiration, emphasizing the collaborative spirit necessary to navigate the complexities of leadership and industry challenges.

Quote:

[42:36] Gavin Newsom: "Gonna talk about when we launch your campaign for governor California."

Analysis:
The episode wraps up on a positive note, reinforcing the importance of collaboration between political leaders and industry influencers to foster a thriving cultural and economic environment.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Gavin Newsom [04:05]: "What do you mean by youth and younger people, what streaming means to you. What's the state of play from that perspective?"

• Ryan Murphy [05:12]: "I've been through a lot of different changes... the period from 2000 to 2013 was very like prestige push with sex and blood and gore... then during the Obama era, more female and progressive programming like Glee and American Horror Story... then the streaming wars began in 2016 which was the best thing that ever happened to me."

• Ryan Murphy [20:00]: "Hollywood is now a tech-controlled landscape... lot vacancies on shooting lots... people are leaving, tearing families apart."

• Ryan Murphy [26:00]: "I want to do a vampire show and a faith-based movie... something optimistic about perseverance and forgiveness."

• Ryan Murphy [37:10]: "Being a showrunner is similar to being a governor... Could you imagine me as the governor?"

• Ryan Murphy [33:40]: "My morning routine is an hour of quiet reading and meditation... I do a vegan protein smoothie... eat four to six vegetables a day."

• Ryan Murphy [23:29]: "It's about families depending on it... people are so appreciative for what you recently have done."

• Ryan Murphy [42:30]: "I admire what you've done and I know that you... You've inherited many messes... keep doing it because people are appreciative."

---

Conclusion

This episode of "This is Gavin Newsom" featuring Ryan Murphy offers a comprehensive look into the current dynamics of Hollywood, the critical role of streaming services, and the socio-economic challenges facing the entertainment industry. Through candid dialogue, Gavin and Ryan explore the intersection of creative ambition and political strategy, emphasizing the importance of supportive policies and personal resilience. Their conversation not only sheds light on the complexities of maintaining California's status as a global entertainment hub but also highlights the personal dedication required to lead and innovate in high-stakes environments.

For listeners who haven't tuned in, this episode serves as a valuable exploration of how leadership, both political and creative, can shape and sustain vibrant cultural industries amidst evolving global landscapes.

Transcript

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[Gavin Newsom]

This is Gavin Newsom and our conversation with Ryan Murphy continues. What you mentioned, Ted, Netflix. I mean, so the whole streaming thing. But now it's interesting. You're kind of back a little bit, the sort of Disney Hulu fx.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yeah.

[Gavin Newsom]

Thing. I mean, but where's. You said Hollywood's going younger. I mean, is that a time of life or is that a state of mind? What do you mean younger? It's always, isn't it been a youth? I mean, what's your journey here since 89. I mean, where are we in terms. And we'll get into tax credits competitiveness in a minute. But I'm just curious just what you meant by youth and younger people, what streaming means to you. What's sort of, what's the state of play from that perspective? Because you've seen every damn side of this. You've been part of every side of this.

[Ryan Murphy]

It's interesting because, you know, I've kind of been at this now since 1998. Was my first show popular? Yeah, it was a very cult show. It ran two years. Leslie Bibb, who was on White Lotus, was one of her first starring roles.

[Gavin Newsom]

Interesting.

[Ryan Murphy]

So I've been through a lot of different changes, you know, like that 2000 to 201314 was very like prestige push it as much sex and blood and gore and, you know, it was like that. It was like the period of the white male anti hero. You know, if you look at it, the Sopranos, Mad Men, these were the things that were very popular. And then I think there's the Obama section that sort of started 2012, that went through 2017. And that's, I think, you know, more female programming, more progressive programming. Glee certainly falls into that.

[Gavin Newsom]

Right.

[Ryan Murphy]

American Horror Story certainly falls into that. The Normal Heart, which I did. And now. And then what happened was there was the streaming wars began, you know.

[Gavin Newsom]

Right.

[Ryan Murphy]

That really started in 2016.

[Gavin Newsom]

And were you anxious at the time about that? You're like, this is the end of the world.

[Ryan Murphy]

No, it was the best thing that ever happened to me.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah. Well, for you personally?

[Ryan Murphy]

Well, I think for everybody what happened was, you know, literally production doubled overnight and there was a lot of new young voices that were able to get things made. For example, you know, I did pose during that time that never would have been on the air five years before then or even now, I don't think.

[Gavin Newsom]

Interesting.

[Ryan Murphy]

But. But then what happened was Covid and the strikes, and now it's really hard for young people to, I think, get things on the air. It's really hard for different points of view. I think we're in almost like a Victorian age, which is a reaction to Covid and perhaps the two Trump presidencies where I'm finding it very interesting. Like what you're saying is people don't want anything to push. They're freaked out enough about their lives. So. Yeah, also Gen Z is very pearl clutching. They're. They're much more like sort of. They don't like a lot of things that are in their face.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah.

[Ryan Murphy]

They don't date as much. They don't socialize as much crazy. And they don't, you know, it's a very cautious generation. So. But, you know, the state of the business is really, really bad right now. And I'm lucky in that I, you know, I went back with my. My great friend Dana Walden, but I really never left because I was doing all my shows. You know, that was part of my deal. I was lucky. I kind of had. I got to keep my legacy shows and go try new things at Netflix.

[Gavin Newsom]

Right.

[Ryan Murphy]

So I went back to Disney, Fox, and then I continue my monster show. So I kind of, I respect everybody, but, you know, I'm really excited. It always takes me a while with a while with a new deal to figure out what I'm gonna do. But I Think the stuff that I have coming up is like very four quadrant, very mainstream, interesting. And I'm doing what I've never done before where I go through every minute of the show and I'm like, how do I make this for everybody? How do I not, you know, alienate people?

[Gavin Newsom]

Pearl clutching Victorian. Is this sort of the anti woke pushback? Is it the sort of anti DEI you've been, you know, lgbtq? What I mean, what is it just, is it in that space that you're referring to? No, is it?

[Ryan Murphy]

I just think it's cultural taste. Like for example, without naming the show, a friend of mine does a show and it started off and it got really great reviews and in the first, you know, they did a test of it in the first 15 minutes of the show. It's a PG rated comedy. There was a very sexualized situation where you saw nothing, but it was hinted at and the dials went and they lost 20% of the audience in 30 seconds because of a joke like that never used to happen. And I just think that it's. Culturally people are, I don't know. Again, I say that, but again, I think people want their comedies and their dramas soft, but they also like their true crime shows clearly. Like they want to be able to pick. Okay, this is my mood and this is my level of anxiety, which is there's not a lot of blending of genres, which I think used to happen.

[Gavin Newsom]

More interesting.

[Ryan Murphy]

And I do think, you know, young people are not as. There's always the reaction. You know, I came up of age right after the, you know, the Reagan years. So that was the period of Madonna. If you look when I was a kid, she was so popular, I think because she was tapping into rebellion.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ryan Murphy]

Now the rebellion is how do you rebel? You become quieter and you're like, you're, it's, it's a softer, interesting, more, more emotional, introverted group of people. But I do think there's also a big changing of the guard right now. You know, like there's young voices fighting to get stuff on and I think it used to be 10 of them would, but now one of them will. But that one could be, you know, a Spielberg who could completely change the game and people will follow that person. I can feel that. I can feel a lot of young people chomping and I feel culturally things are shifting.

[Gavin Newsom]

You got another 20 years of this in you.

[Ryan Murphy]

That's interesting. You know what? Probably, yeah, love that. I really, I wasn't talking about like, I have a farm.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah.

[Ryan Murphy]

And upstate New York.

[Gavin Newsom]

I've always seen you as a farm guy.

[Ryan Murphy]

Well, I'm from Indiana, so you.

[Gavin Newsom]

I know you're an Indiana guy.

[Ryan Murphy]

I grew up in the back of a. Like, I shucked corn. Like, I. I know.

[Gavin Newsom]

I mean, we found out. I mean, you're an athlete, so that's most important.

[Ryan Murphy]

You didn't know that, did you?

[Gavin Newsom]

No. I love that you're Mr. Choir Guy.

[Ryan Murphy]

Geez. Yeah. I don't know. So I'm like, do I. Do I. Do I hang it up and make.

[Gavin Newsom]

You couldn't even handle that. You couldn't. Hanging out on a farm all day.

[Ryan Murphy]

Well, I love going there.

[Gavin Newsom]

I understand that, but every day. Seriously.

[Ryan Murphy]

No, but you're right. I probably can't, because I like. You know, I like show business, and I like. I like creation. It's like, I like the making of new things, and I like putting people together, and I love. I love my job.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah.

[Ryan Murphy]

And you know, my great idol, Norman Lear, he worked. I mean, he worked until his late 90s, which is an amazing thing.

[Gavin Newsom]

It is incredible.

[Ryan Murphy]

I think he probably worked three or four hours a day, but what are three or four hours, you know? But the thing about Norman that I marveled at was he was eternally curious, and young people love that. He sought me out when I had my first big hit, and I got.

[Gavin Newsom]

A call, meaning just to pick your brain, just to get to know you.

[Ryan Murphy]

I got a call out of the blue, and it was from Norman Lear. And I'm like, this is not Norman Lear. Because, you know, I grew up watching. You know, I was six when all in the Family came out, but I grew up with that show. And I was like, this is no way he's calling me. And I picked up the phone. I was like, who is this? Really? And he goes, hey, kid, I gave you the new me. I was like, wow. Really? And then I had dinner with him, and he would give me great advice. And the thing I love the most about him is he would call during disappointments. Like, he called me when the New Normal was canceled.

[Gavin Newsom]

Nice.

[Ryan Murphy]

And he was like, every. Every failure is. I think he said, like, something like, every failure is a new open door you can walk through.

[Gavin Newsom]

Love it.

[Ryan Murphy]

Best.

[Gavin Newsom]

The best.

[Ryan Murphy]

And I. Recently, at auction, I bought one of Norman's Ed Ruscha paintings. And the painting simply says Truth.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah.

[Ryan Murphy]

And so I like. I like, you know, the Menendez of it all. I like talking about my points of view and things that are truthful to me. I love that. And I'm like, why would I stop if I can keep my health. You know.

[Danielle Robaix]

What does feeling safe at home really mean to you?

[Gavin Newsom]

For many it might seem that having.

[Ryan Murphy]

Good locks and maybe an alarm that would, you know, make a lot of.

[Danielle Robaix]

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[Ryan Murphy]

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[Danielle Robaix]

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[Ryan Murphy]

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[Danielle Robaix]

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[Ryan Murphy]

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[Danielle Robaix]

Named Best Home security system of 2025 by CNET 4 million plus Americans Trust SimpliSafe ranked number one in customer service by Newsweek and USA Today Monitoring plans start around $1 a day, 60 day money back guarantee. Visit simplisafe.com Gavin to claim 50% off.

[Ryan Murphy]

A new system with a professional monitoring.

[Danielle Robaix]

Plan and get your first month free. That's simplisafe.com Gavin there's no safe like.

[Bob Crawford]

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[Ryan Murphy]

So what happened to Chappaquiddick?

[Danielle Robaix]

Well, it really depends on who you talk to. There are many versions of what happened in 1969 when a young Ted Kennedy drove a car into a pond and left a woman behind to drown. There's a famous headline, I think in the New York Daily News. It's Teddy Escapes, Blonde Drowns. And in a strange way, right, that sort of tells you the story really became about Ted's political future, Ted's political hopes. Will Ted Become President? Kappaquiddick is a story of a tragic death and how the Kennedy machine took control. And he's not the only Kennedy to.

[Bob Crawford]

Survive a scandal the Kennedys have lived.

[Danielle Robaix]

Through Disgrace, affairs, violence, you name it. So is there a curse? Every week we go behind the headlines and beyond the drama of America's royal family. Listen to United States of Kennedy on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Gavin Newsom]

What is the state of play out here? I mean, we did, we doubled it. We more than doubled the film tax credit. We needed to do that. Seems the industry's on life support. Yeah, out here, the world we invent is competing against us globally, not just other states, which I think we fully don't. A lot of us don't fully appreciate what's happening overseas.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yes.

[Gavin Newsom]

In particular, what more do we need to do? A lot more. I know tax credit's still not sufficient, but what's your sense of where Hollywood, broadly described or defined, will be in a decade if what doesn't happen?

[Ryan Murphy]

Well, another changing of the guard to answer that question is Hollywood used to be Hollywood, it was a dream place. Not that it isn't now, but Hollywood for the most part is without exception a tech business. And it is thus much more of a bottom line business. There's no more of that sort of, you scratch, you can have two bombs, but if you give me a hit, we're good, that's over. So it is a tech controlled landscape. Many good things have come of that, I think. But I'll tell you a story like I make between six and eight things a year and I was walking through.

[Gavin Newsom]

Proving it's not once a quarter, but anyway, I'll go back to that such.

[Ryan Murphy]

But some of these I don't run. I guess once a quarter I could say my new things that are unassailable. And I was walking some of the lots to look for sage space and I was astonished at how it was crickets like 80% vacancies. People that I have grown up with who run these lots of walking out with tears in their eyes. Please come here. I know, and I think the problem is, you know, if you're wanting to shoot in California and there's five other states that will give you better tax credits and now there's only one.

[Gavin Newsom]

So we're one and a half.

[Ryan Murphy]

Well, okay. But for a while we were five.

[Gavin Newsom]

I agree.

[Ryan Murphy]

And I used to, you know, and I'm very lucky and that I have enough clout where I could say, no, I'm shooting this here.

[Gavin Newsom]

Right.

[Ryan Murphy]

Like I will, I'm shooting this here. So, you know, the thing that I've also been astonished with, that's a new feeling. Like I was directing all's fair. Recently, my Kim show and I had so many. This is right after the fires, and I had so many crew members come up with tears in their eyes, thanking me for staying in California. Because the problem is so many people have left, and what has happened is they leave their families. And I know three people on my cruise who are currently going through divorces because their families were broken up and they had to leave for work. And also, it's very, very difficult because you think of, like, generationally, it's very easy for people in their 20s and 30s to pick up and go to Georgia, of course. But if you're in your 40s, 50s, 60s, we're losing a whole generation of talent that cannot do that, so they cannot go to where the work is. So I find it heartbreaking. And I do admire and commend you for what you have done, which is great. But I think that the more we could do because it's, you know, Hollywood is more than just a state of mind. It's a California legacy, 100%, you know, it really is. And it's a worldwide legacy. And I think you and I, before this, were talking about San Francisco, like, two years ago. I remember having a conversation with you saying, what the hell is happening with San Francisco? But in a recent trip, it's astonishing at how things can turn around and how so resilient. That's like AI Money, I think, and a lot of tech stuff. But I have great hope and I commend you. But I say keep fighting the good fight because we need you. Yeah. This town needs you to do more.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah.

[Ryan Murphy]

And what I'm seeing is it's just not individuals, it's families that are depending upon it. That's the thing that I never really put two and two together. Like, if you're a young family and dad or mom has to leave for four months, five months, what do you do? That's really difficult, morally, spiritually. So anything we can do to increase reasons why tech companies have a reason to say, okay, we'll keep that show here.

[Gavin Newsom]

That's right.

[Ryan Murphy]

And I'm very lucky this fall. Like, I have two things shooting, and I demanded that they both shoot here.

[Gavin Newsom]

Now you're talking keeping.

[Ryan Murphy]

Keeping people together and keeping my crews together. That's a very. And I'm thinking about that more and more and more. And because of the work that you've done, it's become easier for me.

[Gavin Newsom]

No good.

[Ryan Murphy]

But, you know, there's different things about the incentives that are very hard to, like, out of boundary, like you know, stuff like that that we should take out. It's hard.

[Gavin Newsom]

No.

[Ryan Murphy]

And the lottery system is also right.

[Gavin Newsom]

Which we're fixing and we fixed. I mean, so we went from $330 million, 750 million. And so the key was in a challenging sort of environment, political environment, to at least lock that in. Now we can start to unpack how within that framework we can be more competitive and make the adjustments. We've made a few, but we've got more that obviously need to be done in that space.

[Ryan Murphy]

But I mean, I really admire what you're doing. I don't know any politician that I've met in my lifetime who's gone through so much adversity from. I mean, everything from.

[Gavin Newsom]

Not much has happened the last six years. What are you talking about, Ryan? What are you talking about?

[Ryan Murphy]

I mean, I admire what you've done and I know that you, like, you've also inherited many messes.

[Gavin Newsom]

God bless you.

[Ryan Murphy]

I acknowledge your work and I say keep doing it. Because people, people are so appreciative for what you recently have done and I. Anything else you could do. I'm here as an advocate for my company town, but I think how you've turned things around in many areas is commendable. You're my long term friend and I say keep doing it.

[Gavin Newsom]

I appreciate it.

[Ryan Murphy]

Keep helping us.

[Gavin Newsom]

I appreciate it. Before I let you go, before I let you go back to your kids or your farm.

[Ryan Murphy]

My farm.

[Gavin Newsom]

Okay, stress test. That what I mean, what are the little scribbles on your little notepad? That little, you know, the thing that's like, you're looking four years from now. You're like, oh, you just wait, I've got a project. I've got. So I know you can't say anything, but is it like a. Oh, yeah.

[Ryan Murphy]

I can say, oh, you good?

[Gavin Newsom]

What do you got? Bring it on then.

[Ryan Murphy]

Well, you know, it's interesting because my life is. I'm already work. Like I don't even know if I'm here in this room because I'm like working a year ahead, right. It was funny, I heard an interview with Taylor Swift where she said the same thing. I was like, oh, I really relate to this. Like, I'm already planning my releases for 2027. 27, 2027.

[Gavin Newsom]

And we just talked about JFK Jr. That comes out.

[Ryan Murphy]

So, like, I'm really sort of plotting well. And I have two goals, to be honest, one of which is to keep as many of my shows in California as possible, which is why I'm glad to be here today.

[Gavin Newsom]

Well done.

[Ryan Murphy]

And I want to do a, a vampire show which I've never done. Vampire.

[Gavin Newsom]

So you did a little sci fi. Now we're going to vampires.

[Ryan Murphy]

I mean I've had vampires in my work. Like you know, American Horror Story, Lady Gaga famously played one. I want to do that. And I want to do a movie about faith I'm working on. One of my great friends is Dede Gardner who runs Plan B, Brad Pitt's company. And she and I are working on a faith based movie that kind of puts me in touch with my altar boy days.

[Gavin Newsom]

Look at that.

[Ryan Murphy]

Which people would never think of me doing. But I want to do, like you said, I want to do something optimistic and about perseverance and forgiveness. And so I'm working on those things. I mean vampires and you know, religion, vampires and faith.

[Gavin Newsom]

It was obviously.

[Ryan Murphy]

Well, that's the secret of my career. Do the opposite of what you just did. That's always what I've done. And if you look at my year rollout, it's everything is the opposite of the thing that came before it. You know.

[Bob Crawford]

If you run an e commerce business, you know, packages don't ship themselves, but with ShipStation it almost feels like they do. But it's not magic, it's powerful automation. Shipstation is the fastest, reliable and affordable way to get products to your customers. It integrates seamlessly with services and selling channels. And because it grows with your business, you'll never need to upgrade. Your customers benefit too. Automated tracking keeps them informed every step of the way. Plus, you'll both save money, a lot of money, thanks to discounts of up to 88% on rates from Ups and Downs, DHL Express and USPS and up to 90% off FedEx. More than 130,000 businesses already use Shipstation to grow their e commerce operations. And that number is rising fast. In fact, during the time it took me to tell you this, 1400 packages were shipped using ShipStation. Ready to upgrade your shipping experience? Go to shipstation.com and use code iHEART to start your free trial. No credit card or contract required and you can Cancel anytime. That's shipstation.com code iHeart.

[Danielle Robaix]

Tired of spills and stains on your sofa? WashablesOfAs.com has your back. Featuring the Annabe Collection, the only designer sofa that's machine washable inside and out. Where designer quality meets budget friendly prices. That's right, sofas start at just $699. Enjoy a no risk experience with pet friendly stain resistant and changeable slipcovers made with performance fabric experience cloud like comfort with high resilience foam that's hypoallergenic and never needs fluffing. The sturdy steel frame ensures longevity and the modular pieces can be rearranged anytime. Check out washablesofas.com and get up to 60% off your annabe sofa backed by a 30 day satisfaction guarantee. If you're not absolutely in love, send it back for a full refund. No return shipping or restocking fees. Every penny back. Upgrade [e-mail] Offers are subject to change and certain restrictions may apply. Just like great shoes, great books take you places through unforgettable love stories and into conversations with characters you'll never forget. I think any good romance, it gives me this feeling of like butterflies. I'm Danielle Roubaix and this is bookmarked by Reese's Book Club, the new podcast from hello Sunshine and I Heart Podcasts. Every week I sit down with your favorite book lovers, authors, celebrities, book talkers and more to explore the stories that shape us on the page and off. I've been reading every Reese's Book Club pick, deep diving booktok theories and obsessing over book to screen casts for years. And now I get to talk to the people making the magic. So if you've ever fallen in love with a fictional character, or cried at the last chapter, or passed a book to a friend saying you have to read this, this podcast is for you. Listen to Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Ryan Murphy]

So what happened at Chappaquiddick?

[Danielle Robaix]

Well, it really depends on who you talk to. There are many versions of what happened in 1969 when a young Ted Kennedy drove a car into a pond and left a woman behind to drown. There's a famous headline, I think, in the New York Daily News. It's Teddy Escapes, Blonde Drowns. And in a strange way, right, that sort of tells you the story really became about Ted's political future, Ted's political hopes. Will Ted become President? Chappaquiddick is a story of a tragic death and how the Kennedy machine took control. And he's not the only Kennedy to survive a scandal. The Kennedys have lived through disgrace, affairs, violence, you name it. So is there a curse? Every week we go behind the headlines and beyond the drama of America's royal family. Listen to United States of Kennedy on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

[Bob Crawford]

American history is.

[Danielle Robaix]

Full of wise people. Walt Whitman said something like 99.99% of war is diarrhea and 1% is gory. Those founding fathers were gossipy AF and they love to cut each other down.

[Bob Crawford]

I'm Bob Crawford, host of American History Hotline, the show where you send us your questions about American history. And I find the answers, including the nuggets of wisdom our history has to offer.

[Gavin Newsom]

Hamilton pauses, and then he says, the.

[Bob Crawford]

Greatest man that ever lived was Julius Caesar. And Jefferson writes in his diary, this proves that Hamilton is for a dictator based on corruption.

[Ryan Murphy]

My favorite line was what Neil Armstrong said. It would have been harder to fake it than to do it.

[Bob Crawford]

Listen to American History Hotline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Gavin Newsom]

What are the big sports ones you're gonna do?

[Ryan Murphy]

You know, I just did one. I did the Aaron Hernandez story, which was American Sports Story. Forgive me for getting. Of course. Come on. But of course it would be Aaron Hernandez. I don't know that I'll be like. If you ask me, I don't know.

[Gavin Newsom]

You're talking big game about your sports. I mean, I'm just trying to connect your story.

[Ryan Murphy]

My sports thing is my oldest child who is 12, wants to be Tom Brady, right? He's a big.

[Gavin Newsom]

Of course he's 12. Number 12.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yeah. He's a big footballer.

[Gavin Newsom]

So, yeah, you see, you got Giselle and Brady in your back. Your mind. Of course.

[Ryan Murphy]

That's right. That's what I wanted to do.

[Gavin Newsom]

I'm not surprised.

[Ryan Murphy]

Do you know him?

[Gavin Newsom]

I mean. Yeah, I met him a few times.

[Ryan Murphy]

He seems really cool.

[Gavin Newsom]

See, I mean, he's too perfect.

[Ryan Murphy]

So I'm kind of living my sports.

[Gavin Newsom]

I'm starting to read his blog every week now. He's got a new blog, Tom Brady every Monday. It's fantastic.

[Ryan Murphy]

Was it like.

[Gavin Newsom]

Everything he does is fantastic. It's upsetting actually, at a certain point.

[Ryan Murphy]

What do you mean?

[Gavin Newsom]

No, it's just a really well researched and written blog he does every week, which is motivating. It's contemporary. It's about health, it's about relationships, his relationship to what he's doing. It's fresh. It's very thoughtful.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yeah, it's excellent.

[Gavin Newsom]

It's like, just interesting.

[Ryan Murphy]

Do you use his products?

[Gavin Newsom]

I haven't. It's interesting. I've started to notice a few of them starting to get promoted.

[Ryan Murphy]

So, like, with your life, as. This is my last question for you, as high pressured as you are and like, what is your secret for keeping it all together. Like, what is your.

[Gavin Newsom]

I'm gonna answer that. What's your. Do you have a morning routine? Does Ryan.

[Ryan Murphy]

I do. My morning routine is I get up and I have coffee and no one is allowed to talk to me.

[Gavin Newsom]

Like, what? You just hear that guy?

[Ryan Murphy]

I have an hour of, like, quiet reading, meditation. I'm really cranky and I try and do some.

[Gavin Newsom]

But the kids know how to avoid you. Or do you? I mean, they just.

[Ryan Murphy]

I go to a room.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah, they can't get.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yeah, I mean, anybody can get me. Like, if you have kids, you know, they can always find you this.

[Gavin Newsom]

As long as they have no devices, they don't need you.

[Ryan Murphy]

But I try and do some, like, movement, you know?

[Gavin Newsom]

What do you mean, movement?

[Ryan Murphy]

I try and move. I try and go on a walk. I try and get on a treadmill. I try and walk around, you know.

[Gavin Newsom]

And that's part of that.

[Ryan Murphy]

I got my apple watch. I count my steps. I'm very conscious of that cup of coffee.

[Gavin Newsom]

What are you eating?

[Ryan Murphy]

Every morning I eat the same boring ass. I'm a person of tradition. I have a vegan protein smoothie that has eight fruits in it. I love that. And then I have, throughout the day, four to six vegetables. So.

[Gavin Newsom]

Wow.

[Ryan Murphy]

I. I really work hard on that.

[Gavin Newsom]

That's fantastic.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yeah. Like, I get a gold medal, right? Like, I work, but it's. It's a practice. Like, you got to work at it and it's not fun.

[Gavin Newsom]

It's not. You don't enjoy it.

[Ryan Murphy]

You know, I enjoy the tradition of it. It's fine.

[Gavin Newsom]

It's not that it's purple.

[Ryan Murphy]

It looks like blueberries.

[Gavin Newsom]

What do you miss? You miss, like, bacon and eggs from the back?

[Ryan Murphy]

Oh, yeah, Pancakes.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah, pancakes.

[Ryan Murphy]

But, like, what do you do? What are you. What's your fruit?

[Gavin Newsom]

And I'm the same thing. I do a smoothie every day.

[Ryan Murphy]

A big exercise guy.

[Gavin Newsom]

I'm a little bit, three, four days a week.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yeah.

[Gavin Newsom]

Nothing exciting, but. No, it's the fruit that's. I'm religious about it for years and years and years, but I love it. Like, I can't even imagine not having smoothie or just fruit until. And I say noon, whenever, 11:30.

[Ryan Murphy]

You were like a big dinner guy.

[Gavin Newsom]

It's all I care about.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yeah, me too.

[Gavin Newsom]

I live for it.

[Ryan Murphy]

Me too.

[Gavin Newsom]

Live for dinner.

[Ryan Murphy]

And I'm in the middle of, like, a hideous 90 day cleanse. So.

[Gavin Newsom]

Why are you doing that?

[Ryan Murphy]

Because I just came back from vacation and I was like, this is gross. Like, you know, it was Vacation supposed to be the. Yeah, but I just felt it was too much. And I'm like, I want to just spend the summer being one with the solstice and try and get in some healthy thing, you know?

[Gavin Newsom]

So an hour of sort of just.

[Ryan Murphy]

You time, me time. And that could also be reading or I stay up late, you know, like, told you so. I like to review what I'm getting ready to present to people because it's like being a public. It's like being a public speaker. You walk into a room, and I have people who are taking notes, and I perform the parts. My job is to have people heading in the same direction. And I've become better at it, I think, in the past year.

[Gavin Newsom]

Are you a better business person than you've ever been before, or are you still the more creative person?

[Ryan Murphy]

I always used to think I was a lousy business person, but then one day, one of my agents said, you know, you're really smart at business. And I was like, what? You know, I was like, I'm just like a creative person, like a dumb artist. But I make it a daily practice. And if I don't make my business a daily practice, I feel bad. I feel guilty, you know? But I'm also, like. I'm kind of insane. I have a very. I love collecting art. Like, I love the. I love that kind of stuff. It's a. I love that, you know, aesthetic design. It's my favorite thing. That's my hobby, design and art. That's how I like. I work on a lot of projects like that. I think in another life, I would be a landscape designer or something, because I love that I'm very odd. But, like, it's producing. I'm producing. I have a vision, and I. I love bringing people together.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah.

[Ryan Murphy]

To fight as you do the same fight. It's. It's almost like being a television showrunner is almost like being a governor, you know, it's the same thing. It's exactly the same thing.

[Gavin Newsom]

There's an opening about 18 months. I'm just saying.

[Ryan Murphy]

Can you imagine me as the governor?

[Gavin Newsom]

You have a point of view. I don't know. This seemed not so bad. What do you think?

[Ryan Murphy]

I don't know if I can.

[Gavin Newsom]

It's a good gig.

[Danielle Robaix]

I'll.

[Ryan Murphy]

Let me ask you. What are you gonna do next?

[Gavin Newsom]

I don't know. I just. You know, this production.

[Ryan Murphy]

You looked down when you said that, by the way.

[Gavin Newsom]

This production writing thing.

[Ryan Murphy]

We should flip like Freaky Friday.

[Gavin Newsom]

I've got a lot of. I've got A lot of ideas. A lot of ideas. I've been told you're pitching.

[Ryan Murphy]

You. You could run a studio. You have the glamour to run a studio. You could. Jesus. Would you ever want to.

[Gavin Newsom]

I just need a pair of sunglasses. What do you need down here? What do you just.

[Ryan Murphy]

You need a point of view. You need a point of view and you also need to be able to lead.

[Gavin Newsom]

Love that.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yeah, that's it. People want to be led, man. As you know.

[Gavin Newsom]

You did notice I looked down. That's impressive. Yeah, I'm very self conscious now.

[Ryan Murphy]

Why can't you talk openly about your future and what you want? Is there some day where that will happen?

[Gavin Newsom]

I mean, I'm not uncomfortable. I'm just moving around.

[Ryan Murphy]

You're very uncomfortable.

[Gavin Newsom]

Fidgety.

[Ryan Murphy]

Look at me. I haven't met.

[Gavin Newsom]

Sweating.

[Ryan Murphy]

Now, is there a day where you have given yourself to make a decision about your future without a date?

[Gavin Newsom]

I mean, that's what. Life evolves. You know how it works. It's a. You want to create, you want space. It's not linear.

[Ryan Murphy]

It's a very hard time to be doing what you're doing.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah, it's different. I mean, it's. Yeah, it's. There's a lot of. A lot. I mean, this. This gotten serious. Very serious. What's going on in D.C. and what's going on here? I mean, you got 5,000 military in U.S. city. You know, he didn't send military overseas. Said, I'm here in the United States.

[Ryan Murphy]

Do you ever speak to him privately?

[Gavin Newsom]

Yep.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yeah. Because I remember you two having, from what I always heard from you and from people close in, that you had a very nice relationship.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yep. 90 minutes in the Oval Office a few months ago, we had really good conversation. And then eight hours later, tweets out new scum and then federalizes the National Guard. It's a hell of a thing. Of course, no one worked with him more closely as a governor, a Democratic governor, than I did during COVID Yeah, it was extraordinarily collaborative. So it's. My mindset is open hand, not a closed fist. But what he's doing now is to vandalize this country and this democracy and just, you know, people out on the streets just going about their day and folks in masks humming up unmarked cars. This is different. This is different. So, you know, when you run for governor, we can talk about some strategies that I think may work.

[Ryan Murphy]

You can run my campaign. Can you imagine?

[Gavin Newsom]

I'm going to run your campaign. I'm going to do the creative, and I'M going to come up, we're going to come up with a slogan. I don't know, but I want this. I think this faith thing could work and it may help. So I need this to come out well.

[Ryan Murphy]

Right. I'm shocked myself.

[Gavin Newsom]

Vampire thing. I may want to push back the production schedule. We'll talk about fate.

[Ryan Murphy]

I'm only gonna talk about reconciliation. I'm only gonna send you copies of my shows that are literally the sweetest, kindest.

[Gavin Newsom]

I just. No more. I don't need people in refrigerators. Half bodies. Come on, man.

[Ryan Murphy]

You may not, but the world does. The world wants it. Deal with it.

[Gavin Newsom]

Listen, I may call you in August before this Menendez.

[Ryan Murphy]

I do things like that. It's not about the thing in the refrigerator. It's a question of why is it in the refrigerator? What happened to somebody. Yeah, no, I get it's, you know.

[Gavin Newsom]

This is what makes you qualified to be actually governor. It's a human condition.

[Ryan Murphy]

It does sound like the same job.

[Gavin Newsom]

But sincerely, like, literally, what is the motivation? The why. What's the sort of the essence.

[Ryan Murphy]

Right.

[Gavin Newsom]

Of the why.

[Ryan Murphy]

Right.

[Gavin Newsom]

That's important. Politicians don't. That they don't explore that.

[Ryan Murphy]

Well, that brings us back to the Menendez, you know, parole. It's just, it's the same thing.

[Gavin Newsom]

Should I watch it before I make the decision?

[Ryan Murphy]

No, I don't want to. You shouldn't.

[Gavin Newsom]

I'm not going to.

[Ryan Murphy]

And I admire you for your daughter not co. Opting you into watching. Did she watch it?

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah, they watched it. And it's. They. Because there's a few of them, not just one daughter. I mean, I've. They. Yeah, come on. It was, this was a cultural phenomena.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yes.

[Gavin Newsom]

Took off. I mean, they had to be in the know when they went to school. People, the kids, other kids were talking about it and remarkable. Like, I've not experienced that. Well, I've not experienced that as a father, obviously, and not in the position I'm in, where there's real accountability on it.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yeah. I mean, you know, on the positive side, the very idea that it would launch a conversation with your kids is not a bad thing.

[Gavin Newsom]

No, it's great. And I love that they're. And I also.

[Ryan Murphy]

They have a point of view.

[Gavin Newsom]

They have a point of view and, and allowed me to explain how this all works. I mean, the idea you're talking about with the parole system, commutations, resentencing, what youth offenders under the age of 26 and special dispensation that's offered to youth offenders and you talk about your 12, 13 year old kids is a hell of a thing. So in many ways it was great educational. It's been a great educational process.

[Ryan Murphy]

Yeah, I can see. I hear that. I feel that.

[Gavin Newsom]

Yeah.

[Ryan Murphy]

I mean, I get so many young people who write me about it. But I guess we'll talk at the end of August.

[Gavin Newsom]

Gonna talk about when we launch your campaign for governor California.

[Ryan Murphy]

You have to resign and then run my campaign. I would be the worst. I could never do that.

[Gavin Newsom]

I'm not convinced.

[Ryan Murphy]

I can't even run for mayor of West Hollywood. I can't even do that. I would be too nervous.

[Gavin Newsom]

I mean, you got farming background, we've got the faith. I mean everything about this.

[Ryan Murphy]

Maybe I should pray and plant vegetables instead. Thank you for having fun. It was very fun. Great to see you.

[Bob Crawford]

If you run an e commerce business, you know packages don't ship themselves. But with Shipstation it almost feels like they do. But it's not magic, it's powerful automation. ShipStation is the fastest, reliable and affordable way to get products to your customers. It integrates seamlessly with services and selling channels. And because it grows with your business, you'll never need to upgrade. Your customers benefit too. Automated tracking keeps them informed every step of the way. Plus, you'll both save money. A lot of money. Thanks to discounts of up to 88% on rates from UPS, DHL Express and USPS, and up to 90% off FedEx. More than 130,000 businesses already use Shipstation to grow their e commerce operations. And that number is rising fast. In fact, during the time it took me to tell you this, 1400 packages were shipped using ShipStation. Ready to upgrade your shipping experience? Go to shipstation.com and use code iHEART to start your free trial. No credit card or contract required and you can cancel anytime. That's shipstation.com code iheart.

[Danielle Robaix]

Join iheartradio and Sarah Spain in celebrating the one year anniversary of iheart women's sports with powerful interviews and insights insider analysis, our shows have connected fans with the heart of women's Sports. In just one year, the network has launched 15 shows and built a community united by passion Podcasts that amplify the voices of women in sports. Thank you for supporting iHeart women's sports and our founding sponsors, E L F Beauty, Capital One and Novartis. Just open the free iHeart app and search iHeart Women's Sports to listen now. Just like great shoes, great books take you places through unforgettable love stories and into conversations with characters you'll never forget, I think, any good romance. It gives me this feeling of like butterflies. I'm Danielle Robaix and this is bookmarked by Reese's Book Club. The new podcast from hello Sunshine and I Heart Podcast where we dive into the stories that shape us on the page and off. Each week I'm joined by authors, celebs, book talk stars, and more for conversations that will make you laugh, cry, and add way too many books to your TBR pile. Listen to Bookmarked by Reese's Book club on the iHeartRadio app. Apple Podcasts are wherever you get your podcasts. So what happened at Chappaquiddick? Well, it really depends on who you talk to. There are many versions of what happened in 1969 when a young Ted Kennedy drove a car into a pond and left a woman behind to drown. Chappaquiddick is a story of a tragic death and how the Kennedy machine took control. Every week we go behind the headlines and beyond the drama of America's royal family. Listen to United States of Kennedy on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Bob Crawford]

I'm Bob Crawford, host of American History Hotline, a different type of podcast. You, the listener, ask the questions.

[Gavin Newsom]

Did George Washington really cut down a cherry tree?

[Danielle Robaix]

Were JFK and Marilyn Monroe having an affair?

[Bob Crawford]

And I find the answers. I'm so glad you asked me this question.

[Danielle Robaix]

This is such a ridiculous story. You can listen to American History Hotline.

[Bob Crawford]

On the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Danielle Robaix]

This is an iHeart podcast.