This Past Weekend w/ Theo Von - Episode #610: Steven Rinella

Release Date: September 15, 2025

Overview

In this episode, Theo Von sits down with renowned outdoorsman, hunter, author, and host of the Netflix show “MeatEater,” Steven Rinella. The conversation traverses hunting lore, wildlife conservation, American nature history, animal psychology, and prehistory, with a signature mix of humor and deep curiosity. The pair reflect on the wild turkey’s history, public perceptions of hunting ethics, the human relationship with nature and danger, as well as digressions into Neanderthal ancestry, Alaskan wilderness, and personal stories that blend wit with surprising detail. Throughout, Rinella imparts a treasure trove of ecological and historical knowledge—all in the context of playful, at times irreverent, banter.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Introduction and Icebreakers

• Fun with Amish and Energy Drinks
  • Theo shares a story about giving an Amish kid a Celsius energy drink during Rum Springa, joking about the resulting cultural collision.
    • “You put that brain petrol that is Celsius into a damn Amish, you know, he might wind up plugging something in.” (Theo, 01:24)

Wild Turkey: Anatomy, History, and Lore

• Turkey’s Reputational Misunderstandings

  • Theo describes turkeys as “unwell birds,” leading to spirited debate.
    • “They just seem like they, they got picked last for gym.” (Theo, 04:22)
  • Steve passionately defends turkeys as complex, formidable, and uniquely American birds, outlining their distinctive features (color-changing heads, spurs, beard, snood).
    • “That is the…best bird in our country.” (Steve, 06:17)
  • Historical tidbit: Ben Franklin favored the turkey over the bald eagle as America’s national bird for its virtues and beauty.
    • “Franklin said America ought to go with the wild turkey, because at least it’s a vain bird.” (Steve, 05:26)

• Turkey Behavior and Mating Rituals

  • Deep-dive into turkey courtship, vocalizations, and hunter strategies.
    • “When he’s coming in and his head gets that whitish color to it...he is fired up.” (Steve, 09:03)
    • Explanation of calls and how changes in head color signal mood.
  • Conservation history: Near-extinction and restoration in North America, led primarily by hunters and organizations like the NWTF (National Wild Turkey Federation).
    • “You can hunt turkeys now in more states than had turkeys.” (Steve, 15:18)

• Urban vs. Wild Turkeys

  • Discussion on how urban “town turkeys,” which behave differently from wild turkeys, distort public perception of their intelligence and vigilance.
    • “When I think of a turkey, I’m thinking of a persecuted turkey. Some people are thinking of a town turkey…it’s just different.” (Steve, 16:40)

Hunting, Conservation & American Wildlife

• The “North American Model” and Hunter Impact

  • Steve elaborates on how hunting-funded organizations supplied the main financial and labor backbone for species recovery in the US.
    • “The most impactful wildlife conservation organizations…that comes from hunters, that comes from hunting-based organizations.” (Steve, 76:21)
  • Example: Hunters restored turkey and wild sheep populations, often with little personal hunting opportunity as motivation.
  • “We fund it, we do the groundwork…that’s just the reality.” (Steve, 76:43)

• Ethics and Public Perceptions

  • Theo raises controversies about posting images with big game/trophy animals and public misunderstanding of “hunting as conservation.”
    • “How can you help a species by hunting it? Wouldn’t that be…illogical?” (Theo, 72:12)
    • Steve unpacks how hunting sustains conservation funding, habitat protection, and species restoration, both in the US and places like Tanzania.

• Historical Exploitation and Recovery

  • Steve discusses cycles where hunting led species to the brink, then reversed course to become agents of recovery, using the wild buffalo, beaver, and wild sheep as examples.
    • “The practice of hunting has done a lot of damage and has done a lot of recovery—we've righted the wrongs of our fathers.” (Steve, 111:50)

Evolution, Prehistory, and Human-Animal Connections

• Innate Fear of Snakes/Serpentine Lore

  • Anecdotes on childhood snake encounters.
  • Discussion on the possible evolutionary or genetic roots of human fear of snakes.
    • “We carry with us this innate…fear of serpents...it does you well to be like, stand off.” (Steve, 62:26)
  • Speculates about how first Americans reacted after thousands of snake-free generations upon entering lands populated with serpents.

• Neanderthal Ancestry and Human Evolution

  • Chat about DNA ancestry tests, interbreeding between modern humans, Neanderthals, Denisovans.
    • “At a certain time, you could have been in Spain...and you would have had to ask yourself, what kind of human is that?” (Steve, 84:29)
  • Steve seeks a legit, passionate Neanderthal behavioralist for his podcast guest slot.
    • “I want to find a really good Neanderthal behavioralist…a verbose, animated, Neanderthal researcher.” (Steve, 91:13)

• Ecological and Cultural Connections

  • Reflection on ancient practices (hunting, eating meat) as drivers of human development, social structure, and intellectual advances.
    • “That’s when humans became bright and developed like religion and organizational structure and language…when we discovered meat eating.” (Steve, 80:58)
  • Discussion on the prodigious presence of Eurasian-origin domesticated animals in America, with the turkey as a rare strictly North American contributor.

Life, Danger, and Perception

• Public vs. Actual Danger in Wilderness

  • Steve and Theo muse on the psychological gap between perceived and real outdoors dangers.
    • “The most dangerous thing that’s going to happen is us driving to the airport.” (Steve, 49:57)
    • Exposure and travel pose higher risks than wildlife, but snakes/cats capture greater imagination.

• Experiences in Africa & Ancient Cultures

  • Steve describes the immersive and profound experience of meeting Maasai herders and encountering Africa’s megafauna.
    • “It immerses you in a situation and environment…doing something very ancient and base.” (Steve, 99:26)
  • Africa as the “last Ice Age,” where megafauna diversity persists.
    • “Africa is the one continent where humans and all this megafauna never changed…so the Ice Age is alive and well.” (Steve, 103:24)

Memorable Moments & Quotes

• On Turkey Anatomy:
  • “They got a beard, which is actually a feather. When that gets so big that it drags on the ground, you know what you call them? Rope dragger.” (Steve, 08:08)
• On Conservation:
  • “Turkeys are so everywhere now that now we have town turkeys…so the mystique…it costs them some of their mystique.” (Steve, 15:42)
• On Conservation Funding:
  • “Your state’s fish and game agency gets the bulk of its funding from people buying hunting and fishing licenses.” (Steve, 73:31)
• On Human Prehistory:
  • “There’s an idea that humans’ intellectual renaissance…is when we discovered meat eating.” (Steve, 80:58)

Notable Timestamps

• [01:13] – [02:59]: Theo and Steve icebreak, Amish & Rum Springa, segues to unique lifestyles.
• [04:07] – [16:40]: Deep-dive into wild turkey biology, history, Ben Franklin lore, and restoration.
• [16:40] – [18:58]: Wild vs. “town” turkeys and the American origin of domestic turkey.
• [71:12] – [81:43]: Conservation, funding, hunting ethics, and the restoration of American game species.
• [60:50] – [68:51]: Snake psychology, evolutionary fear, and the story of the first Americans encountering snakes.
• [91:13] – [94:33]: Neanderthal pop-sci, “Neanderthal rebranding,” seeking experts, and genes.
• [98:35] – [104:22]: Africa, Maasai, megafauna, the lasting “Ice Age” in Africa, and emotional impacts of seeing large animals.
• [110:57] – [112:52]: Steve’s books and audio originals on American wildlife, conservation, and industry history.
• [112:19] – [112:52]: The arc from exploitative to restorative hunting; relationship with nature.

Closing & Invites

• Theo and Steve bond over mutual love of the outdoors and plan a future fishing trip in Montana.
  • “I would be honored to take you out fishing.” (Steve, 108:31)
• Steve discusses his latest work: new MeatEater season and “MeatEater’s American History” audio series.
• They encourage audience members to reach out if they’re experts or can connect to experts on topics like Neanderthals.

Tone and Style

The conversation is a blend of irreverent comedy, earnest learning, and rich anecdotal storytelling in true Theo Von style, with Steve bringing encyclopedic ecological knowledge and passion for the outdoors. The episode is lively, genuine, and sprawling—ranging from absurd hypothetical scenarios and riffs to surprisingly thorough explorations of conservation policy, prehistory, and cultural connections to nature.

Recommended for:
Listeners interested in wildlife, conservation, American history, quirky humor, or who are curious about the practical and philosophical sides of hunting and nature. This episode is a feast of both laughs and learning, and a showcase of the intersection between the wild and the world we shape.