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[00:00]
A
Welcome to the Thriving With Addiction podcast, where we explore how recovery is not just about surviving, but about truly living. Each week, we'll dive into the science stories and strategies that help people and families heal from addiction and build healthier, more resilient lives. I'm your host, Dr. John Avery.
[00:18]
B
Let's get started.
[00:26]
C
I'm John Avery, and welcome to Thriving with Addiction. Today I'm joined by David Kechner. David's an actor, writer, and producer best known for his iconic roles as Todd Packer on the Office and Champ Kind in Anchorman and Anchorman two. The legend continues. An alumnus of Chicago's Second City and a former Saturday Night Live cast member, Koechner has appeared in more than 200 films and television shows, including Talladega Nights, Get Smart Step thank you for smoking Krampus and the acclaimed thriller Cheap Thrills. His recent credits include the Goldbergs, Bless His Mess, Superior Donuts, and Twin Peaks, along with voice work on American Dad, F is for Family, and the epic Tales of Captain Underpants. When not on screen, he tours nationally with his live comedy act and co hosts the Big Slick Celebrity Weekend benefiting Children's Mercy Hospital in Kansas City. Dave, thanks for joining me today.
[01:22]
B
Thanks for having me.
[01:24]
C
I heard about your recovery story first from a patient of mine. He was struggling with alcohol. He had tried rehab, tried 12 step work, and then we were debating whether or not to start an abuse or not. And he was really on the fence, scared of being on it. And he listened to you tell your story, and that pushed him over the edge. And now he has a year of sobriety, taking Antabus every day in a suitcase way, all thanks to you and your story. So that. That really made me want to have you on here and to hear from you. So thanks for all you're doing.
[01:57]
B
Well, thanks for. To Madame Curie. That's a joke. Madame Curie, for our listeners, discovered penicillin. So I'm joking that she also discovered dysulfium, which is antibuse. Yeah, it's the only way I can do it, to be honest. You know, of course you had to continue to do the work. In fact, I have a four step workbook here in my hotel room. So you had to keep doing it. I mean, it's recommended. You don't have to do anything, but that's the only way I can get sober. My sponsor, my sponsor said, dave, you're a hardcore alcoholic. Because, you know, dude, I would, I would. I don't know, I'd say for the past five years, I had been Trying to get sober in earnest, right? Like, really trying. Going to meetings. And I did three months and relapse. Three months and relapse. That seemed to be my hurdle. And, you know, every time my sponsor would say, dave, you know, relapse is part of it because you get down on yourself, right?
[03:03]
C
Yeah.
[03:04]
B
So finally I just said, well, I'm just going to. Do I have to? Because I tried antibuse. But if you don't have someone partnering with you, in my experience, if you don't have someone partnering with you with Antibuse, which makes. Which I mean, I mean by that, I mean ensuring you take the pill, then you can fail. Because I would try int. Abuse. And then like any dirty, scheming alcoholic, you slowly go off it. And no one knows, right? So one of my best friends I've known since college, I said, hey, dude, I need help. I said, will you be my partner in this? And I'll take my antibuse pill because he's in Missouri. That's where I grew up. So I'll take it with him either on. On FaceTime or I'll send him a video. If. If three or four days goes by, he'll be calling Billy Dilly. So now I've been telling you so long, entomb stays in your system. So I don't know how long it would take. I've never looked it up. Take a long time to get it out, to flush out. So you'd still have bad symptoms if you tried to drink on it. Like, you can't take a day off and then. So that's good. I've got good protection. The best part is what it does for me personally is it stops any scheming or bargaining because you can't drink. So that voice is off, which is that. Which is the most dangerous voice for me, you know, like, can I, can I, can I, can I? So that one's. That one's shut off because it's not in the realm of possibility, right?
[04:39]
C
And for our listener, I mean, you hear a lot about the GLP drugs or naltrexone for alcohol, and those help with craving. But Anabuse, or disulfiram, is a med that prevents the breakdown of alcohol. It blocks a critical enzyme, and so if you try to drink on it, you get toxic, and it can even cause, like, cardiovascular collapse and death. You get all flush, you feel terrible. It's sort of like an aversive conditioning thing. But nobody takes it because, you know, the brain and, you know, life conspires and so it's been best studied in the antibuse contract, where every day someone says, you know, I agree not to drink today. I'll take Antabuse. And then typically, a loved one watches them take it to sort of solidify that daily practice.
[05:16]
B
Yeah, you'll violently throw up if you try it now. I don't know about those GLPs. I. There's another drug. A number of years ago, I had an implant put in. I forget what. What it is. It's like that probably now.
[05:27]
C
Yeah.
[05:28]
B
Yes, yes. Supposed to reduce your craving, right? No, no, come on, let's be real. You can't reduce an alcoholic craving. You can't. It's, you know, it's either the program or something else. The best is a combination of program and interviews. And now whatever the new ones are, I don't know. I don't get it. And it's interesting that I even had a physician go, you know, that one does it too. I'm like, no, it doesn't. Not like this is the. This is the dad. This goes. No, you're grounded.
[06:02]
C
Exactly. It takes you completely offline, which is what you need sometimes.
[06:05]
B
Yeah. And.
[06:06]
C
And the striking thing about your story, I think when I heard your podcast, I mean, this is all pretty new. This off and on over the last five years, but you right away were sharing your story with everyone, which I imagine took some. Some courage to be vocal about it.
[06:20]
B
Well, I don't think it is courageous. I just think it is the right thing to do. Plus, it helps me stay straight. That way, if anybody would see me, right? They go, hey, now, I have had the occasional 0 percentage IPA. They actually taste pretty good, although I've never had two. Because you're like, ah, I remember that taste. And then there's those women taste just like an ipa. So you appreciate that taste, but, you know, it's filling enough. Like, I don't. I don't. I'd rather not have that. Who cares? You know? Right.
[06:58]
C
Well, I'm a psychiatrist, so I got to get to the bottom of how we got here to the anabuse and the. And the 12 steps, so. So walk me a little. You mentioned you're from Missouri. Walk me through what led you, I guess, both the comedy and to drinking. If you don't mind.
[07:11]
B
They're one of the same, aren't they?
[07:13]
C
They often are, yeah.
[07:15]
B
I'm the third of six kids in a small town in Missouri. I was very different than my brothers and sisters. I was. I was raised in a very strict Catholic household. That software didn't necessarily, well, run very well with my mainframe. And so I was at conflict and at odds with that model, my parents model of, of life. And I felt it stunting. Claustrophobic. I grew in a very small town of 2,000 people. That wasn't enough for me. I had ADD, ADHD. They didn't know what to do with me. So I was kind of a fish out of water and a fish gasping for air for my own self. And so you want to leave as an alcoholic? Does you want to get out of here? And so also my mother was an alcoholic. My father was an alcoholic until he had a medical problem. He quit drinking. So as you know, the Catholic church has drinking in the ceremony. So all those things are, you know, accepted. It's not looked down upon like you couldn't smoke a cigarette. But if you drink, that's not. Not a big deal. So by the time I was in eighth grade, I was drinking regularly. By the time I was in eighth grade, I was getting drunk, like really drunk on the weekend, like on sweet wine. So you can start with something a little milder to drink. And then I. Then I started using marijuana probably in eighth grade. And then like that. Thank God there's no access to drugs in this small town. So that was the only thing that was there was marijuana and booze. And so I continued to drink throughout college. It was a problem. I didn't know it. I blacked out several times in college. And people would say, do you know what you were doing last night? I'm like, what do you mean? And they'd tell you stories like, wow, here's the weird thing. It didn't occur to me that I had a drinking problem. I just think, well, that's college. Or, you know, it's. You get to drink. Then I moved to Chicago and started studying at the Second City and the Improv Olympic at the same time. And man, did we drink collectively as a group of humans going through this amazing experience together. Part of it was alcohol. A lot of that is you have anxiety, perhaps going on stage. And part of it is just this fun because we had this group of people that all had that taste and thirst. And man, we drank. We drank before shows, we drank after shows. After shows would get hard. And again, thank God we had little money and not great access to drugs, which is great because otherwise even worse. And then I got onto Saturday Night Live and continued drinking to my own detriment. And then people would start giving you coke, you know, at the after party. On Saturdays. That's such a weird thing. When you can finally afford it, they just give it to you.
[10:16]
C
But it seems like it served a lot of roles for you earlier. At first it was to sort of escape, and you sort of had that genetics and the family history. But it was also fun. It was what everyone was doing. It was just sort of the. The breadth of life back then.
[10:31]
B
It sounds like, yep, 100%. And then I got married, and it was a difficult proposition. And so the drinking continued. And then it was just kind of like just a daily relaxer. And then as the difficulty increased over the years, about year 18, I'd say it got really rough. And so I was plowing it and it was really interfering with my life. So I went to rehab in 2018 and in 2019 and in 2020. And look, I'll just say this rehab's fine to dry out, but if your Rehab doesn't include 12 step program number one, and most of them, in my experience, don't. If that's not the, you know, forefront of what their treatment is, I don't. It doesn't have a chance of success. And a lot of these places like to not do it because they want their own way of treating you, which quite frankly, is. It's the program or nothing, in my experience.
[11:45]
C
What is it that resonated with you about the program?
[11:48]
B
Well, it works. And you've got this collective group of people that will ensure your sobriety if you allow it. Or you can go and hide. You know, you can't lie to an alcoholic.
[12:04]
C
Yeah.
[12:05]
B
Because they. They know. They know. You know, you. You look away or you go. Or you start telling a story. I mean, look, you know, are you sober? Ah, yeah. You're lying. Right. An alcoholic knows immediately. See, that's my experience. So, yeah, that's why I say that. And it's been proven to work, if you will do the work. Right.
[12:33]
C
So a. Provide you a community where there was no hiding. And I guess an abuse does that too. There's just that accountability and there's no way to drink with those people. And that met India.
[12:45]
B
Correct. Okay.
[12:47]
C
And how did that impact your comedy and your fame through the years? You had your big break with sex Saturday Night Live and. And walk me through how that intertwined with. With the drinking and. And all the success you were having.
[12:59]
B
Well, had I. Well, I would say it was just hand in hand. It was just whatever. Now, looking back, had I not drank and used all those years, I would have a much better career. I would have had A much better career. I think word probably gets around. Always a bit of a drinker, right? I mean, I don't know. I don't. I don't have testimony that I haven't been hired because of my drinking, but it wouldn't surprise me. You know, people talk, producers talk about whatever. Like, I've always done a good job. I could have done a great job. I would say people know when you're hungover on set and that becomes something like, well, yeah, he drank whatever, know. So, yeah, it impacted my career. Plus, you're just not as good or sharp as you could be.
[13:52]
C
And it was tricky because some of your characters were sort of guys that had. That enjoyed excess. Right. And.
[13:57]
B
And enjoyed sort of, not sort of. Champ kind is a raging alcoholic. Exactly. Yeah. And Todd packers had several DUIs.
[14:09]
C
Did you worry when you stopped drinking, you would lose some of that?
[14:13]
B
No, no, no, no, no, no, no. I. I know. You know. No, I never. That's a lie. If you say I can't find the magic without the drinking, you're lying. Good for you, but you know you're lying. If you couldn't do it without drinking, that means you couldn't do it at all. And you should be doing it, in my opinion. So, yeah. Yeah. There was never any fear of losing the. The, you know, the sun.
[14:41]
C
Right. And what was fame like for you when it came?
[14:44]
B
It wasn't something that happened immediately. And it's not even something I think about. It's something I remember like, all right, I forget. People know who you are, and as time goes on, you figure out how to deal with it. You just kind of look ahead. You don't look around or whatever, or you have your own negotiation with it, depending on how. What the situation is. Be grateful, be humble. I always say never leave anybody with a story. How was he? Nice guy. How was he? Kind of an a hole. Oh, my goodness. Right. But nice guy's not a story. A hole's a story. So that's number one. Don't leave anybody with a story. So like that. It happened very slowly for me. So it was kind of a. A gradual incline. So. Yeah, I like that. It's. It's. I don't have it like a lot of people do, you know, I have a marginal amount. You know, others get. I can't imagine their life, how they even negotiate daily.
[15:53]
C
But sometimes. Sometimes the success goes to our. Our own head and it makes us hard to view our. Our drinking or other behavior. It's. It seems like you've always Kept very grounded.
[16:02]
B
And I always kept very lubricated. I was always grounded. Was not the problem. It's the lubrication with the problem.
[16:11]
C
Right.
[16:12]
B
And I'd say the lubrication keeps you from being grounded. Like you. You have to feel your emotions. Right. When it comes down to it, isn't that where we're getting to? Right. You have to feel those emotions. And why numb yourself, Just sit there, let it come up. Your body's going to take care of it, right? Yeah. And feel it so much better. And then you're not in the. One of the stages of fear.
[16:41]
C
How did that, you know, thinking back on your childhood or, you know, interacting with your parents and siblings as you get older, how did that change when you entered sobriety?
[16:51]
B
Well, you know, at your long. If you've been. If you have a drinking problem for a long time, which I did, I would think you, you know, I'm sure I avoided talking to them because the subject would come up, how's the drinking? And then you feel like everyone's babysitting you.
[17:11]
C
Right.
[17:11]
B
People don't realize, like, don't ask me that. If you're not my sponsor, you don't have the right to ask that. It really bothered. The gossip bothers me. I know some people that I came up with in Chicago who are alcoholics, and they like to talk about your alcoholism, which is infuriating to me because that must make them feel better. Well, I'm not like him or whatever. Well, you know, I'm working on myself and doing myself. So what happens is you do have to, you know, separate yourself from some people that are toxic. I'd say that's probably the difference, which I might not have done. Had I continued to drink, I'm sure I wouldn't have done it.
[17:56]
C
So you worked hard and the fame came. And then eventually came this point where you felt like you had to really tackle the drinking with intensive care and you went to rehab. 2018, 2019, 2020. What was it that finally pushed you over the edge in terms of really staying sober? Was it getting on the antibuse or was there other things that sort of solidified it for you?
[18:16]
B
Well, getting on the interviews. My daughter went to a wedding, my oldest daughter, and she was recounting watching Father Daughter dance, and she said, dad, I want you to be there. And, you know, I know I can't be there if I continue down that path. Right. Because you make nothing but dumb decisions when you're drinking. Plus, you're just not any good. One drink makes you less than you should think. I have one beer before a show and I'll be nice and loose. Maybe worse, you're not as sharp. And then someone goes, oh, something's off. They don't. They can't put their finger on it. But if right now, like, I can tell someone's had one drink now, I'm sure you can, too. Yeah, it's the eyes. It's like, oh, you're. I can hear the tiniest slur. So some of that audience can too. Now, if you've had two or three and think you're fun, you're not. They go, oh, he's not all there. So those types of things, like, you owe it to the people that purchased a ticket to come see you. You owe them the best performance you can give them.
[19:52]
C
Right. And. And then you were saying you owe your kids, I think having that very powerful moment with your. Your daughter. And you were telling me before we started that you have. You have five kids.
[20:01]
B
Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, I have a responsibility to make sure they all get through to 18 and then, you know, hopefully are capable of, you know, economically taking care of themselves. But LA is very expensive. So I feel a great deal of responsibility and a great deal of love for my children, obviously. Well, not obviously, but I do. And so, yeah, I want to be there.
[20:28]
C
And you're giving them a great gift to tell them about your sobriety and to be open with feelings. You know, I think I heard in your story your. Your parents sort of never made police with drinking until having a medical issue.
[20:39]
B
And so did my dad quit because he had pancreatitis. And then so the alcohol would inflame this pancreatitis. And it turns out it was a gallbladder issue. Wasn't even pancreatitis, but it didn't matter. He quit cold turkey because, you know, the pain was so intense. And sadly, my mother never quit. Yeah. The doctor. Doctors there in Missouri, and she had a heart attack and they told her she could have one ounce a day. Do you know an alcoholic that you'd have one ounce a day?
[21:14]
C
Yeah, that's.
[21:15]
B
You can't have one else a day because one ounce today is a well, two today, no, then tomorrow, whatever. It's the bargaining. So, yeah, that was not a smart idea on their part.
[21:27]
C
But you're giving your children something different, your recovery story. And I think sometimes people see your movies and it feels like you're superhuman and funny if you're drinking and partying. But the superpower really is in being sober and Open and honest in the way you've been able to do it for yourself and for your kids.
[21:45]
B
Yep. Sobriety is the real force. Sobriety is the real force. I tell my kids, if I had one thing to do over in life, it would be I would never drink. And I mean that sincerely. If I had one thing to do over in life, I would never have drank. My God, could have had such a better life.
[22:04]
C
Did the. The getting sober change your relationship with your fans who were expecting you to. To be a certain way or. Or not really?
[22:10]
B
I. I don't. I don't add that into the metric.
[22:15]
C
Yeah.
[22:17]
B
What happens is I. I'm happy to say I don't drink because then you don't have to hang out with drunks because it's the same thing. Come on, just one. Oh, I'm gonna throw in my sobriety for you. Some stranger. It's interesting how insistent alcoholics and drunks get about you drinking with them. I mean, I get it, but I remember I drink a soda water on stage, you know, like a Pellegrino, which is green. And I saw you drinking on stage like, that was smoking water. Like, they're so inebriated. They. They thought they saw a Heineken because it's a green label. Right.
[23:01]
C
And it's.
[23:03]
B
It's soda water. I'm up there talking about my sobriety, and they're convinced that we should have a drink together. Plus, why. For what? Why should I drink with you? I. You know, that's the only time I can understand what women go through when a guy asks them if they want if they can buy them a drink, and then you're not allowed to say no. Now I can say no because I'm sober, right? You know, otherwise I'm not right now. Doesn't, like, come on, are you too good for me? All that stuff. But come on, dude. Plus, when someone buys you a drink, they're buying what? They're not. They're buying your time. So they think they get to interact with you for the time it takes to drink that, have that drink, which is such a burden, quite frankly. But now I get to say no. I went to a wedding in November. My God, Just every other person. Come on, let's do a shot. Come on. I said no, I don't drink. Come on. That pleading and begging, like, why is that important to you? And so the person asked you the first time will ask you six more because he keeps getting drunker and either forgetting or thinks he can seduce you into it. Such an Odd thing, but that's the alcoholic, right? I read something yesterday because of course, on my algorithm, I get a lot of sobriety stuff on Instagram. It said, don't call yourself an alcoholic. I don't know if I agree with that. What are your thoughts on that?
[24:37]
C
For some people, it really helps. Some people, they feel it's sort of stigmatizing and shameful. But to own your sobriety, I think is really key. It gives you a power over it that hiding from it or running from it, you know, sometimes doesn't. And it sounds like that's your experience, huh?
[24:55]
B
No, I talk about it in my show and I get some big laughs on my own foibles. So I, I, I like it because people go, that helps some of them. Like you said, your experience was. Helped someone that was one of your patients. And I know some people out there can see me up there succeeding. Hopefully I go, okay, yeah, there you go. You're a friend of Bill's. You're the brotherhood, the sisterhood. So I don't mind. And then maybe it makes someone out there think, oh, I guess I do have a drinking problem. Who knows? Because, look, a drinking problem means you have a problematic life and you need to get out of it. And the thing everyone worries about is, I can't quit forever. Yeah, you can, you know, because you can stop being in denial forever. That's, that's the, that's the good part.
[25:47]
C
What, what part of recovery has surprised you the most? For better or worse? It sounds like it's been.
[25:51]
B
Been mostly good self discovery.
[25:54]
C
Self discovery?
[25:55]
B
Yeah. I noticed in my first year, but every three months I'd have some depression and I wouldn't know, and I not, not great depression, but I just kind of like, just not feeling it. And I realized, well, I have to get up and move. I have to work out, do something. Then I realized, like, oh, you're feeling things, things are coming up, you have to deal with, and then it's not that hard. It's manageable. Yeah. So that's the thing that I've noticed the most. Just, you know, having more energy, being able to set goals and meet them. All the normal stuff of life. Recently, I did read something I've always thought in sitting in rooms, listening to everybody's story, right. I've always thought we're angels with our wings clipped. And I finally saw something on Instagram which says you, a lot of alcoholics are people that have. Because there's so much exploration now of what, who are we on this globe, what's going on. What is this whole experience? Is it, you know, interdimensional? Are we just in living one stream of life where there's five going on all the time and you have access to so much more if we could get our psychic energy open. But basically it's along the same lines, like angels who are stuck in the wrong spot. And I, I. It's interesting because I thought that years ago, these are all angels who just. Who were led, they weren't allowed to. To fly the way they needed to fly. Like they had to assimilate into a world that they don't belong in. Necessarily not. It is this world. But you could have, you could have made more of yourself and perhaps benefited the world more had you been allowed to or allowed yourself to live a fully activated life.
[27:58]
C
I love that. And, you know, it speaks to the title of this podcast, which is, you know, thriving with. With addiction. And, and, you know, you're a good example of doing that and how you help others. Tell me a little bit about your comedy tour now and what you're doing on the road.
[28:15]
B
It's never ending like that. I've got five kids. After you turn 60, things slow down in show business because you're not, you know, you're not younger, so you're either the dad or the grandfather. And they don't make comedy movies like they used to because they don't sell internationally. So now it's all economic metrics. So action movies, you can sell internationally. Comedy doesn't translate. Comedy here doesn't translate. Comedy all over the globe. It's. I don't expect most people to understand that, but it doesn't work. If you see comedy from another country, you're like, oh, why is that funny? That's what they see too. Why is that funny? It's cultural, so it doesn't work. Action is global. So there's been a reduction in the number of. What happened. How many great comedies did you watch this year? Used to be every month there'd be another great comedy coming out.
[29:11]
C
Right now we're just watching Anchorman. Yeah.
[29:14]
B
Nice. Well, yeah. Why are you watching anyway? Because there's none other. Anchorman or something like it. Because studios don't invest in that because it doesn't give them enough profit. So anyway, when. Then they're making fewer TV shows. So there's, There's. So about my tour, I guess that's what we're talking about. So that's why I have to go out on tour. I get to. Although I'm developing A couple projects that will help me do a balance of the road, plus other stuff, like other stuff I can do from my home, because that's the thing. You have to develop projects or else you'll be constantly out there. Just pick with a pick of the shovel, digging it, digging it, digging it. I'm great. I'm quite grateful that that exists. But, yeah, you had, you know, you've got to make your own changes and find new ways to succeed.
[30:10]
C
That's great. And it's great that you've incorporated your sobriety into your act.
[30:13]
B
Oh, it's fun. It's fun. I. There's a freedom to it. There's nervous laughter and then accepting laughter and understanding how it's limited my life. And I can make it the fool that I recognize as part of myself. And we're all a fool in some ways. So hopefully that's the. The light that goes on in the audience's head for sure.
[30:46]
C
Well, Dave, I really appreciate you joining me today and telling your story and sharing it, and I wish you all the. All the best on your journey. Keep. Keep saying, you know, keep. Keep preaching the good word and, and helping our folks with substance.
[30:59]
B
Yeah, it's. It's so. Such a better life.
[31:01]
C
It is. Well, thank you again for coming. I appreciate it.
[31:04]
B
Thanks for having me.
[31:05]
A
Thanks for listening to the Thriving With Addiction podcast. If you found today's episode helpful, please follow and subscribe wherever you listen to your podcasts and share it with someone who might benefit. You can also connect with me on Instagram, LinkedIn and YouTube or visit thrivingwithaddiction.com to learn more. Stay tuned for next week's episode. And remember, thriving is possible.

Summary6 min read

Podcast Summary: Thriving with Addiction with Dr. Jonathan Avery

Episode Title: Comedy, Chaos, and Clarity — Finding Recovery in the Spotlight with Dave Koechner
Release Date: February 3, 2026
Guest: Dave Koechner (Actor, Comedian, Writer)

Episode Overview

In this candid and humor-infused conversation, Dr. Jonathan Avery sits down with renowned comedian and actor Dave Koechner to explore the intersection of fame, comedy, and addiction recovery. Famous for roles in "Anchorman" and "The Office," Koechner offers a raw and relatable account of his struggles with alcoholism, efforts toward sobriety—including multiple stints in rehab and the use of Antabuse—and how recovery has transformed his personal and professional life. Their discussion blends clinical insight with lived experience, illustrating addiction’s complexities and the hope that can flourish in recovery, even under the showbiz spotlight.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Impact of Koechner’s Recovery Story

Personal Influence: Dr. Avery recounts a patient inspired by Koechner’s public recovery story, which encouraged the patient to try Antabuse—a key catalyst for his own sobriety (1:23).
- “He listened to you tell your story, and that pushed him over the edge. And now he has a year of sobriety, taking Antabuse every day … all thanks to you and your story.” — Dr. Avery (1:23)
Public Storytelling: Koechner reflects on sharing his struggles openly, saying it’s less about courage and more about keeping himself accountable:
- “I don't think it is courageous. I just think it is the right thing to do. Plus, it helps me stay straight.” — Dave Koechner (6:19)

2. The Mechanics of Recovery: Antabuse, Support, and Relapse

Use of Antabuse (Disulfiram): Koechner explains how daily accountability (taking Antabuse with a friend on video) was game-changing:
- “If you don't have someone partnering with you with Antabuse... you can fail.” (3:03)
- “The best part is… it stops any scheming or bargaining because you can't drink. So that voice is off, which is… the most dangerous voice for me.” (4:08)
Medical Context: Dr. Avery elaborates on Antabuse’s mechanism and why contracts with loved ones enhance its effectiveness (4:39).
On Pharmacological Options: Koechner is skeptical that medications alone can reduce craving, sees most value in combining medication with program work (5:27).

3. Comedy and Alcohol: Twin Threads in Koechner’s Early Life

Rooted in Upbringing: Raised in a small, strict Catholic home in Missouri, Koechner struggled to fit in, turned to drinking by 8th grade, and found camaraderie and relief in substances:
- “I'm the third of six kids... very strict Catholic household. That software didn’t necessarily well, run very well with my mainframe.” (7:14)
- “By the time I was in eighth grade, I was drinking regularly… really drunk on the weekend.” (7:58)
Comedy Scene Culture: Drinking was woven into the fabric of improv and sketch comedy, from Chicago’s Second City to SNL—serving to bond, ease anxiety, and as an accepted norm. (9:55)

4. Relapse, Recovery, and the Role of the 12-Step Program

Multiple Attempts at Rehab: Rehab felt incomplete without the 12-step foundation:
- “If your Rehab doesn't include 12 step program number one ... it doesn't have a chance of success. It’s the program or nothing, in my experience.” (10:46)
Power of Community: The shared honesty of other alcoholics keeps him in check—there’s “no hiding” (12:04):
- “You can't lie to an alcoholic... They know.” (12:04)

5. Career Reflection: Alcohol’s Downside in Hollywood

Professional Impact:
- “Had I not drank and used all those years, I would have a much better career… people know when you're hungover on set.” (12:58)
- Roles like “Champ Kind” and “Todd Packer” mirrored his own excessive persona, blurring lines between character and reality. (13:57)
No Fear in Sobriety’s Effect on Comedy:
- “If you couldn't do it without drinking, that means you couldn't do it at all.” (14:12)

6. Fame, Family, and Motivation for Change

Motivated by Family: A pivotal conversation with his eldest daughter after a wedding sparked resolve:
- “‘Dad, I want you to be there.’ And, you know, I know I can’t be there if I continue down that path.” (18:15)
Responsibility as a Parent: Koechner is driven by a deep desire to be present for his five children (20:01).
On Breaking Generational Patterns: Contrasts his journey with his parents', especially his mother’s unresolved alcoholism (20:39).

7. Navigating Social Situations Sober

Challenges with Fans and Peers:
- “It’s interesting how insistent alcoholics and drunks get about you drinking with them… I remember I drink a soda water on stage, you know, like a Pellegrino… they're so inebriated. They thought they saw a Heineken because it’s a green label.” (22:16)

8. Stigma, Identity, and Recovery Language

On the Label ‘Alcoholic’: Some online voices say to drop it; for Koechner, owning the identity is liberating and helpful:
- “I don't mind… maybe it makes someone out there think, oh, I guess I do have a drinking problem.” (24:55)

9. Unexpected Gifts of Recovery

Clarity and Emotional Growth:
- “You have to feel your emotions… let it come up. Your body's going to take care of it, right?” (16:12)
Self-Discovery: Regular periods of reflection and handling resurfacing feelings, leading to increased energy and goal-setting ability (25:55).

10. Comedy as Healing and Service

Incorporating Sobriety Onstage:
- “I, I like it because people go, that helps some of them… if you see me up there succeeding, hopefully [they] go, okay, yeah, there you go.” (24:55)
- Laughing at his own “foolishness” allows others to find light and relatability in recovery (30:13).

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

“The best part is… it stops any scheming or bargaining because you can't drink. So that voice is off… the most dangerous voice for me.”
— Dave Koechner, on Antabuse (4:08)

“If your Rehab doesn't include 12 step program number one ... it doesn't have a chance of success. It’s the program or nothing, in my experience.”
— Dave Koechner (10:46)

“Fame… it happened very slowly for me. So it was kind of a gradual incline… but I always kept very lubricated. I was always grounded. Was not the problem. It’s the lubrication with the problem.”
— Dave Koechner (16:02)

“If I had one thing to do over in life, it would be I would never drink. And I mean that sincerely.”
— Dave Koechner (21:45)

"You have to feel your emotions... let it come up. Your body's going to take care of it, right? Yeah. And feel it so much better.”
— Dave Koechner (16:12)

“I’ve always thought we're angels with our wings clipped... like they had to assimilate into a world that they don't belong in.”
— Dave Koechner (27:55)

“Sobriety is the real force.”
— Dave Koechner (21:45)

Timestamps for Key Segments

01:23 — How Koechner’s story inspired others to seek help
03:03 — Using Antabuse with a supportive partner for accountability
04:39 — Medical insight into Antabuse/commitment contracts
07:14 — Childhood, family, and early onset of drinking
10:46 — Importance of the 12-step program for lasting recovery
12:58 — Alcohol’s professional costs in showbusiness
14:12 — Rejecting the myth of “alcoholic genius”
18:15 — Family motivation: Daughter’s impactful words
20:39 — Breaking cycles: Contrast with parents’ experiences
22:16 — Navigating social and fan situations without drinking
24:55 — Owning the “alcoholic” identity, impact on others
25:55 — Surprising recovery “gifts”: clarity, energy, growth
27:55 — Metaphor of “angels with clipped wings”
30:13 — Using comedy and self-deprecation as healing and connection

Final Thoughts

This episode offers an insightful, unfiltered look into recovery as lived in the limelight. Koechner’s willingness to talk about setbacks, family legacy, accountability, and the real-life work behind sobriety is both grounding and inspiring. Blending dry wit with vulnerability, he and Dr. Avery reveal that thriving with addiction is possible—with honesty, support, and the courage to rewrite your story.

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Transcript77 lines

[00:00]
A
Welcome to the Thriving With Addiction podcast, where we explore how recovery is not just about surviving, but about truly living. Each week, we'll dive into the science stories and strategies that help people and families heal from addiction and build healthier, more resilient lives. I'm your host, Dr. John Avery.
[00:18]
B
Let's get started.
[00:26]
C
I'm John Avery, and welcome to Thriving with Addiction. Today I'm joined by David Kechner. David's an actor, writer, and producer best known for his iconic roles as Todd Packer on the Office and Champ Kind in Anchorman and Anchorman two. The legend continues. An alumnus of Chicago's Second City and a former Saturday Night Live cast member, Koechner has appeared in more than 200 films and television shows, including Talladega Nights, Get Smart Step thank you for smoking Krampus and the acclaimed thriller Cheap Thrills. His recent credits include the Goldbergs, Bless His Mess, Superior Donuts, and Twin Peaks, along with voice work on American Dad, F is for Family, and the epic Tales of Captain Underpants. When not on screen, he tours nationally with his live comedy act and co hosts the Big Slick Celebrity Weekend benefiting Children's Mercy Hospital in Kansas City. Dave, thanks for joining me today.
[01:22]
B
Thanks for having me.
[01:24]
C
I heard about your recovery story first from a patient of mine. He was struggling with alcohol. He had tried rehab, tried 12 step work, and then we were debating whether or not to start an abuse or not. And he was really on the fence, scared of being on it. And he listened to you tell your story, and that pushed him over the edge. And now he has a year of sobriety, taking Antabus every day in a suitcase way, all thanks to you and your story. So that. That really made me want to have you on here and to hear from you. So thanks for all you're doing.
[01:57]
B
Well, thanks for. To Madame Curie. That's a joke. Madame Curie, for our listeners, discovered penicillin. So I'm joking that she also discovered dysulfium, which is antibuse. Yeah, it's the only way I can do it, to be honest. You know, of course you had to continue to do the work. In fact, I have a four step workbook here in my hotel room. So you had to keep doing it. I mean, it's recommended. You don't have to do anything, but that's the only way I can get sober. My sponsor, my sponsor said, dave, you're a hardcore alcoholic. Because, you know, dude, I would, I would. I don't know, I'd say for the past five years, I had been Trying to get sober in earnest, right? Like, really trying. Going to meetings. And I did three months and relapse. Three months and relapse. That seemed to be my hurdle. And, you know, every time my sponsor would say, dave, you know, relapse is part of it because you get down on yourself, right?
[03:03]
C
Yeah.
[03:04]
B
So finally I just said, well, I'm just going to. Do I have to? Because I tried antibuse. But if you don't have someone partnering with you, in my experience, if you don't have someone partnering with you with Antibuse, which makes. Which I mean, I mean by that, I mean ensuring you take the pill, then you can fail. Because I would try int. Abuse. And then like any dirty, scheming alcoholic, you slowly go off it. And no one knows, right? So one of my best friends I've known since college, I said, hey, dude, I need help. I said, will you be my partner in this? And I'll take my antibuse pill because he's in Missouri. That's where I grew up. So I'll take it with him either on. On FaceTime or I'll send him a video. If. If three or four days goes by, he'll be calling Billy Dilly. So now I've been telling you so long, entomb stays in your system. So I don't know how long it would take. I've never looked it up. Take a long time to get it out, to flush out. So you'd still have bad symptoms if you tried to drink on it. Like, you can't take a day off and then. So that's good. I've got good protection. The best part is what it does for me personally is it stops any scheming or bargaining because you can't drink. So that voice is off, which is that. Which is the most dangerous voice for me, you know, like, can I, can I, can I, can I? So that one's. That one's shut off because it's not in the realm of possibility, right?
[04:39]
C
And for our listener, I mean, you hear a lot about the GLP drugs or naltrexone for alcohol, and those help with craving. But Anabuse, or disulfiram, is a med that prevents the breakdown of alcohol. It blocks a critical enzyme, and so if you try to drink on it, you get toxic, and it can even cause, like, cardiovascular collapse and death. You get all flush, you feel terrible. It's sort of like an aversive conditioning thing. But nobody takes it because, you know, the brain and, you know, life conspires and so it's been best studied in the antibuse contract, where every day someone says, you know, I agree not to drink today. I'll take Antabuse. And then typically, a loved one watches them take it to sort of solidify that daily practice.
[05:16]
B
Yeah, you'll violently throw up if you try it now. I don't know about those GLPs. I. There's another drug. A number of years ago, I had an implant put in. I forget what. What it is. It's like that probably now.
[05:27]
C
Yeah.
[05:28]
B
Yes, yes. Supposed to reduce your craving, right? No, no, come on, let's be real. You can't reduce an alcoholic craving. You can't. It's, you know, it's either the program or something else. The best is a combination of program and interviews. And now whatever the new ones are, I don't know. I don't get it. And it's interesting that I even had a physician go, you know, that one does it too. I'm like, no, it doesn't. Not like this is the. This is the dad. This goes. No, you're grounded.
[06:02]
C
Exactly. It takes you completely offline, which is what you need sometimes.
[06:05]
B
Yeah. And.
[06:06]
C
And the striking thing about your story, I think when I heard your podcast, I mean, this is all pretty new. This off and on over the last five years, but you right away were sharing your story with everyone, which I imagine took some. Some courage to be vocal about it.
[06:20]
B
Well, I don't think it is courageous. I just think it is the right thing to do. Plus, it helps me stay straight. That way, if anybody would see me, right? They go, hey, now, I have had the occasional 0 percentage IPA. They actually taste pretty good, although I've never had two. Because you're like, ah, I remember that taste. And then there's those women taste just like an ipa. So you appreciate that taste, but, you know, it's filling enough. Like, I don't. I don't. I'd rather not have that. Who cares? You know? Right.
[06:58]
C
Well, I'm a psychiatrist, so I got to get to the bottom of how we got here to the anabuse and the. And the 12 steps, so. So walk me a little. You mentioned you're from Missouri. Walk me through what led you, I guess, both the comedy and to drinking. If you don't mind.
[07:11]
B
They're one of the same, aren't they?
[07:13]
C
They often are, yeah.
[07:15]
B
I'm the third of six kids in a small town in Missouri. I was very different than my brothers and sisters. I was. I was raised in a very strict Catholic household. That software didn't necessarily, well, run very well with my mainframe. And so I was at conflict and at odds with that model, my parents model of, of life. And I felt it stunting. Claustrophobic. I grew in a very small town of 2,000 people. That wasn't enough for me. I had ADD, ADHD. They didn't know what to do with me. So I was kind of a fish out of water and a fish gasping for air for my own self. And so you want to leave as an alcoholic? Does you want to get out of here? And so also my mother was an alcoholic. My father was an alcoholic until he had a medical problem. He quit drinking. So as you know, the Catholic church has drinking in the ceremony. So all those things are, you know, accepted. It's not looked down upon like you couldn't smoke a cigarette. But if you drink, that's not. Not a big deal. So by the time I was in eighth grade, I was drinking regularly. By the time I was in eighth grade, I was getting drunk, like really drunk on the weekend, like on sweet wine. So you can start with something a little milder to drink. And then I. Then I started using marijuana probably in eighth grade. And then like that. Thank God there's no access to drugs in this small town. So that was the only thing that was there was marijuana and booze. And so I continued to drink throughout college. It was a problem. I didn't know it. I blacked out several times in college. And people would say, do you know what you were doing last night? I'm like, what do you mean? And they'd tell you stories like, wow, here's the weird thing. It didn't occur to me that I had a drinking problem. I just think, well, that's college. Or, you know, it's. You get to drink. Then I moved to Chicago and started studying at the Second City and the Improv Olympic at the same time. And man, did we drink collectively as a group of humans going through this amazing experience together. Part of it was alcohol. A lot of that is you have anxiety, perhaps going on stage. And part of it is just this fun because we had this group of people that all had that taste and thirst. And man, we drank. We drank before shows, we drank after shows. After shows would get hard. And again, thank God we had little money and not great access to drugs, which is great because otherwise even worse. And then I got onto Saturday Night Live and continued drinking to my own detriment. And then people would start giving you coke, you know, at the after party. On Saturdays. That's such a weird thing. When you can finally afford it, they just give it to you.
[10:16]
C
But it seems like it served a lot of roles for you earlier. At first it was to sort of escape, and you sort of had that genetics and the family history. But it was also fun. It was what everyone was doing. It was just sort of the. The breadth of life back then.
[10:31]
B
It sounds like, yep, 100%. And then I got married, and it was a difficult proposition. And so the drinking continued. And then it was just kind of like just a daily relaxer. And then as the difficulty increased over the years, about year 18, I'd say it got really rough. And so I was plowing it and it was really interfering with my life. So I went to rehab in 2018 and in 2019 and in 2020. And look, I'll just say this rehab's fine to dry out, but if your Rehab doesn't include 12 step program number one, and most of them, in my experience, don't. If that's not the, you know, forefront of what their treatment is, I don't. It doesn't have a chance of success. And a lot of these places like to not do it because they want their own way of treating you, which quite frankly, is. It's the program or nothing, in my experience.
[11:45]
C
What is it that resonated with you about the program?
[11:48]
B
Well, it works. And you've got this collective group of people that will ensure your sobriety if you allow it. Or you can go and hide. You know, you can't lie to an alcoholic.
[12:04]
C
Yeah.
[12:05]
B
Because they. They know. They know. You know, you. You look away or you go. Or you start telling a story. I mean, look, you know, are you sober? Ah, yeah. You're lying. Right. An alcoholic knows immediately. See, that's my experience. So, yeah, that's why I say that. And it's been proven to work, if you will do the work. Right.
[12:33]
C
So a. Provide you a community where there was no hiding. And I guess an abuse does that too. There's just that accountability and there's no way to drink with those people. And that met India.
[12:45]
B
Correct. Okay.
[12:47]
C
And how did that impact your comedy and your fame through the years? You had your big break with sex Saturday Night Live and. And walk me through how that intertwined with. With the drinking and. And all the success you were having.
[12:59]
B
Well, had I. Well, I would say it was just hand in hand. It was just whatever. Now, looking back, had I not drank and used all those years, I would have a much better career. I would have had A much better career. I think word probably gets around. Always a bit of a drinker, right? I mean, I don't know. I don't. I don't have testimony that I haven't been hired because of my drinking, but it wouldn't surprise me. You know, people talk, producers talk about whatever. Like, I've always done a good job. I could have done a great job. I would say people know when you're hungover on set and that becomes something like, well, yeah, he drank whatever, know. So, yeah, it impacted my career. Plus, you're just not as good or sharp as you could be.
[13:52]
C
And it was tricky because some of your characters were sort of guys that had. That enjoyed excess. Right. And.
[13:57]
B
And enjoyed sort of, not sort of. Champ kind is a raging alcoholic. Exactly. Yeah. And Todd packers had several DUIs.
[14:09]
C
Did you worry when you stopped drinking, you would lose some of that?
[14:13]
B
No, no, no, no, no, no, no. I. I know. You know. No, I never. That's a lie. If you say I can't find the magic without the drinking, you're lying. Good for you, but you know you're lying. If you couldn't do it without drinking, that means you couldn't do it at all. And you should be doing it, in my opinion. So, yeah. Yeah. There was never any fear of losing the. The, you know, the sun.
[14:41]
C
Right. And what was fame like for you when it came?
[14:44]
B
It wasn't something that happened immediately. And it's not even something I think about. It's something I remember like, all right, I forget. People know who you are, and as time goes on, you figure out how to deal with it. You just kind of look ahead. You don't look around or whatever, or you have your own negotiation with it, depending on how. What the situation is. Be grateful, be humble. I always say never leave anybody with a story. How was he? Nice guy. How was he? Kind of an a hole. Oh, my goodness. Right. But nice guy's not a story. A hole's a story. So that's number one. Don't leave anybody with a story. So like that. It happened very slowly for me. So it was kind of a. A gradual incline. So. Yeah, I like that. It's. It's. I don't have it like a lot of people do, you know, I have a marginal amount. You know, others get. I can't imagine their life, how they even negotiate daily.
[15:53]
C
But sometimes. Sometimes the success goes to our. Our own head and it makes us hard to view our. Our drinking or other behavior. It's. It seems like you've always Kept very grounded.
[16:02]
B
And I always kept very lubricated. I was always grounded. Was not the problem. It's the lubrication with the problem.
[16:11]
C
Right.
[16:12]
B
And I'd say the lubrication keeps you from being grounded. Like you. You have to feel your emotions. Right. When it comes down to it, isn't that where we're getting to? Right. You have to feel those emotions. And why numb yourself, Just sit there, let it come up. Your body's going to take care of it, right? Yeah. And feel it so much better. And then you're not in the. One of the stages of fear.
[16:41]
C
How did that, you know, thinking back on your childhood or, you know, interacting with your parents and siblings as you get older, how did that change when you entered sobriety?
[16:51]
B
Well, you know, at your long. If you've been. If you have a drinking problem for a long time, which I did, I would think you, you know, I'm sure I avoided talking to them because the subject would come up, how's the drinking? And then you feel like everyone's babysitting you.
[17:11]
C
Right.
[17:11]
B
People don't realize, like, don't ask me that. If you're not my sponsor, you don't have the right to ask that. It really bothered. The gossip bothers me. I know some people that I came up with in Chicago who are alcoholics, and they like to talk about your alcoholism, which is infuriating to me because that must make them feel better. Well, I'm not like him or whatever. Well, you know, I'm working on myself and doing myself. So what happens is you do have to, you know, separate yourself from some people that are toxic. I'd say that's probably the difference, which I might not have done. Had I continued to drink, I'm sure I wouldn't have done it.
[17:56]
C
So you worked hard and the fame came. And then eventually came this point where you felt like you had to really tackle the drinking with intensive care and you went to rehab. 2018, 2019, 2020. What was it that finally pushed you over the edge in terms of really staying sober? Was it getting on the antibuse or was there other things that sort of solidified it for you?
[18:16]
B
Well, getting on the interviews. My daughter went to a wedding, my oldest daughter, and she was recounting watching Father Daughter dance, and she said, dad, I want you to be there. And, you know, I know I can't be there if I continue down that path. Right. Because you make nothing but dumb decisions when you're drinking. Plus, you're just not any good. One drink makes you less than you should think. I have one beer before a show and I'll be nice and loose. Maybe worse, you're not as sharp. And then someone goes, oh, something's off. They don't. They can't put their finger on it. But if right now, like, I can tell someone's had one drink now, I'm sure you can, too. Yeah, it's the eyes. It's like, oh, you're. I can hear the tiniest slur. So some of that audience can too. Now, if you've had two or three and think you're fun, you're not. They go, oh, he's not all there. So those types of things, like, you owe it to the people that purchased a ticket to come see you. You owe them the best performance you can give them.
[19:52]
C
Right. And. And then you were saying you owe your kids, I think having that very powerful moment with your. Your daughter. And you were telling me before we started that you have. You have five kids.
[20:01]
B
Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, I have a responsibility to make sure they all get through to 18 and then, you know, hopefully are capable of, you know, economically taking care of themselves. But LA is very expensive. So I feel a great deal of responsibility and a great deal of love for my children, obviously. Well, not obviously, but I do. And so, yeah, I want to be there.
[20:28]
C
And you're giving them a great gift to tell them about your sobriety and to be open with feelings. You know, I think I heard in your story your. Your parents sort of never made police with drinking until having a medical issue.
[20:39]
B
And so did my dad quit because he had pancreatitis. And then so the alcohol would inflame this pancreatitis. And it turns out it was a gallbladder issue. Wasn't even pancreatitis, but it didn't matter. He quit cold turkey because, you know, the pain was so intense. And sadly, my mother never quit. Yeah. The doctor. Doctors there in Missouri, and she had a heart attack and they told her she could have one ounce a day. Do you know an alcoholic that you'd have one ounce a day?
[21:14]
C
Yeah, that's.
[21:15]
B
You can't have one else a day because one ounce today is a well, two today, no, then tomorrow, whatever. It's the bargaining. So, yeah, that was not a smart idea on their part.
[21:27]
C
But you're giving your children something different, your recovery story. And I think sometimes people see your movies and it feels like you're superhuman and funny if you're drinking and partying. But the superpower really is in being sober and Open and honest in the way you've been able to do it for yourself and for your kids.
[21:45]
B
Yep. Sobriety is the real force. Sobriety is the real force. I tell my kids, if I had one thing to do over in life, it would be I would never drink. And I mean that sincerely. If I had one thing to do over in life, I would never have drank. My God, could have had such a better life.
[22:04]
C
Did the. The getting sober change your relationship with your fans who were expecting you to. To be a certain way or. Or not really?
[22:10]
B
I. I don't. I don't add that into the metric.
[22:15]
C
Yeah.
[22:17]
B
What happens is I. I'm happy to say I don't drink because then you don't have to hang out with drunks because it's the same thing. Come on, just one. Oh, I'm gonna throw in my sobriety for you. Some stranger. It's interesting how insistent alcoholics and drunks get about you drinking with them. I mean, I get it, but I remember I drink a soda water on stage, you know, like a Pellegrino, which is green. And I saw you drinking on stage like, that was smoking water. Like, they're so inebriated. They. They thought they saw a Heineken because it's a green label. Right.
[23:01]
C
And it's.
[23:03]
B
It's soda water. I'm up there talking about my sobriety, and they're convinced that we should have a drink together. Plus, why. For what? Why should I drink with you? I. You know, that's the only time I can understand what women go through when a guy asks them if they want if they can buy them a drink, and then you're not allowed to say no. Now I can say no because I'm sober, right? You know, otherwise I'm not right now. Doesn't, like, come on, are you too good for me? All that stuff. But come on, dude. Plus, when someone buys you a drink, they're buying what? They're not. They're buying your time. So they think they get to interact with you for the time it takes to drink that, have that drink, which is such a burden, quite frankly. But now I get to say no. I went to a wedding in November. My God, Just every other person. Come on, let's do a shot. Come on. I said no, I don't drink. Come on. That pleading and begging, like, why is that important to you? And so the person asked you the first time will ask you six more because he keeps getting drunker and either forgetting or thinks he can seduce you into it. Such an Odd thing, but that's the alcoholic, right? I read something yesterday because of course, on my algorithm, I get a lot of sobriety stuff on Instagram. It said, don't call yourself an alcoholic. I don't know if I agree with that. What are your thoughts on that?
[24:37]
C
For some people, it really helps. Some people, they feel it's sort of stigmatizing and shameful. But to own your sobriety, I think is really key. It gives you a power over it that hiding from it or running from it, you know, sometimes doesn't. And it sounds like that's your experience, huh?
[24:55]
B
No, I talk about it in my show and I get some big laughs on my own foibles. So I, I, I like it because people go, that helps some of them. Like you said, your experience was. Helped someone that was one of your patients. And I know some people out there can see me up there succeeding. Hopefully I go, okay, yeah, there you go. You're a friend of Bill's. You're the brotherhood, the sisterhood. So I don't mind. And then maybe it makes someone out there think, oh, I guess I do have a drinking problem. Who knows? Because, look, a drinking problem means you have a problematic life and you need to get out of it. And the thing everyone worries about is, I can't quit forever. Yeah, you can, you know, because you can stop being in denial forever. That's, that's the, that's the good part.
[25:47]
C
What, what part of recovery has surprised you the most? For better or worse? It sounds like it's been.
[25:51]
B
Been mostly good self discovery.
[25:54]
C
Self discovery?
[25:55]
B
Yeah. I noticed in my first year, but every three months I'd have some depression and I wouldn't know, and I not, not great depression, but I just kind of like, just not feeling it. And I realized, well, I have to get up and move. I have to work out, do something. Then I realized, like, oh, you're feeling things, things are coming up, you have to deal with, and then it's not that hard. It's manageable. Yeah. So that's the thing that I've noticed the most. Just, you know, having more energy, being able to set goals and meet them. All the normal stuff of life. Recently, I did read something I've always thought in sitting in rooms, listening to everybody's story, right. I've always thought we're angels with our wings clipped. And I finally saw something on Instagram which says you, a lot of alcoholics are people that have. Because there's so much exploration now of what, who are we on this globe, what's going on. What is this whole experience? Is it, you know, interdimensional? Are we just in living one stream of life where there's five going on all the time and you have access to so much more if we could get our psychic energy open. But basically it's along the same lines, like angels who are stuck in the wrong spot. And I, I. It's interesting because I thought that years ago, these are all angels who just. Who were led, they weren't allowed to. To fly the way they needed to fly. Like they had to assimilate into a world that they don't belong in. Necessarily not. It is this world. But you could have, you could have made more of yourself and perhaps benefited the world more had you been allowed to or allowed yourself to live a fully activated life.
[27:58]
C
I love that. And, you know, it speaks to the title of this podcast, which is, you know, thriving with. With addiction. And, and, you know, you're a good example of doing that and how you help others. Tell me a little bit about your comedy tour now and what you're doing on the road.
[28:15]
B
It's never ending like that. I've got five kids. After you turn 60, things slow down in show business because you're not, you know, you're not younger, so you're either the dad or the grandfather. And they don't make comedy movies like they used to because they don't sell internationally. So now it's all economic metrics. So action movies, you can sell internationally. Comedy doesn't translate. Comedy here doesn't translate. Comedy all over the globe. It's. I don't expect most people to understand that, but it doesn't work. If you see comedy from another country, you're like, oh, why is that funny? That's what they see too. Why is that funny? It's cultural, so it doesn't work. Action is global. So there's been a reduction in the number of. What happened. How many great comedies did you watch this year? Used to be every month there'd be another great comedy coming out.
[29:11]
C
Right now we're just watching Anchorman. Yeah.
[29:14]
B
Nice. Well, yeah. Why are you watching anyway? Because there's none other. Anchorman or something like it. Because studios don't invest in that because it doesn't give them enough profit. So anyway, when. Then they're making fewer TV shows. So there's, There's. So about my tour, I guess that's what we're talking about. So that's why I have to go out on tour. I get to. Although I'm developing A couple projects that will help me do a balance of the road, plus other stuff, like other stuff I can do from my home, because that's the thing. You have to develop projects or else you'll be constantly out there. Just pick with a pick of the shovel, digging it, digging it, digging it. I'm great. I'm quite grateful that that exists. But, yeah, you had, you know, you've got to make your own changes and find new ways to succeed.
[30:10]
C
That's great. And it's great that you've incorporated your sobriety into your act.
[30:13]
B
Oh, it's fun. It's fun. I. There's a freedom to it. There's nervous laughter and then accepting laughter and understanding how it's limited my life. And I can make it the fool that I recognize as part of myself. And we're all a fool in some ways. So hopefully that's the. The light that goes on in the audience's head for sure.
[30:46]
C
Well, Dave, I really appreciate you joining me today and telling your story and sharing it, and I wish you all the. All the best on your journey. Keep. Keep saying, you know, keep. Keep preaching the good word and, and helping our folks with substance.
[30:59]
B
Yeah, it's. It's so. Such a better life.
[31:01]
C
It is. Well, thank you again for coming. I appreciate it.
[31:04]
B
Thanks for having me.
[31:05]
A
Thanks for listening to the Thriving With Addiction podcast. If you found today's episode helpful, please follow and subscribe wherever you listen to your podcasts and share it with someone who might benefit. You can also connect with me on Instagram, LinkedIn and YouTube or visit thrivingwithaddiction.com to learn more. Stay tuned for next week's episode. And remember, thriving is possible.