C (3:03)

Yeah.

B (3:03)

So finally I just said, well, I'm just going to. Do I have to? Because I tried antibuse. But if you don't have someone partnering with you, in my experience, if you don't have someone partnering with you with Antibuse, which makes. Which I mean, I mean by that, I mean ensuring you take the pill, then you can fail. Because I would try int. Abuse. And then like any dirty, scheming alcoholic, you slowly go off it. And no one knows, right? So one of my best friends I've known since college, I said, hey, dude, I need help. I said, will you be my partner in this? And I'll take my antibuse pill because he's in Missouri. That's where I grew up. So I'll take it with him either on. On FaceTime or I'll send him a video. If. If three or four days goes by, he'll be calling Billy Dilly. So now I've been telling you so long, entomb stays in your system. So I don't know how long it would take. I've never looked it up. Take a long time to get it out, to flush out. So you'd still have bad symptoms if you tried to drink on it. Like, you can't take a day off and then. So that's good. I've got good protection. The best part is what it does for me personally is it stops any scheming or bargaining because you can't drink. So that voice is off, which is that. Which is the most dangerous voice for me, you know, like, can I, can I, can I, can I? So that one's. That one's shut off because it's not in the realm of possibility, right?

C (4:39)

And for our listener, I mean, you hear a lot about the GLP drugs or naltrexone for alcohol, and those help with craving. But Anabuse, or disulfiram, is a med that prevents the breakdown of alcohol. It blocks a critical enzyme, and so if you try to drink on it, you get toxic, and it can even cause, like, cardiovascular collapse and death. You get all flush, you feel terrible. It's sort of like an aversive conditioning thing. But nobody takes it because, you know, the brain and, you know, life conspires and so it's been best studied in the antibuse contract, where every day someone says, you know, I agree not to drink today. I'll take Antabuse. And then typically, a loved one watches them take it to sort of solidify that daily practice.

B (5:15)

Yeah, you'll violently throw up if you try it now. I don't know about those GLPs. I. There's another drug. A number of years ago, I had an implant put in. I forget what. What it is. It's like that probably now.

C (5:27)

Yeah.

B (5:27)

Yes, yes. Supposed to reduce your craving, right? No, no, come on, let's be real. You can't reduce an alcoholic craving. You can't. It's, you know, it's either the program or something else. The best is a combination of program and interviews. And now whatever the new ones are, I don't know. I don't get it. And it's interesting that I even had a physician go, you know, that one does it too. I'm like, no, it doesn't. Not like this is the. This is the dad. This goes. No, you're grounded.

C (6:01)

Exactly. It takes you completely offline, which is what you need sometimes.

B (6:05)

Yeah. And.

C (6:05)

And the striking thing about your story, I think when I heard your podcast, I mean, this is all pretty new. This off and on over the last five years, but you right away were sharing your story with everyone, which I imagine took some. Some courage to be vocal about it.

B (6:19)

Well, I don't think it is courageous. I just think it is the right thing to do. Plus, it helps me stay straight. That way, if anybody would see me, right? They go, hey, now, I have had the occasional 0 percentage IPA. They actually taste pretty good, although I've never had two. Because you're like, ah, I remember that taste. And then there's those women taste just like an ipa. So you appreciate that taste, but, you know, it's filling enough. Like, I don't. I don't. I'd rather not have that. Who cares? You know? Right.

C (6:58)

Well, I'm a psychiatrist, so I got to get to the bottom of how we got here to the anabuse and the. And the 12 steps, so. So walk me a little. You mentioned you're from Missouri. Walk me through what led you, I guess, both the comedy and to drinking. If you don't mind.

B (7:10)

They're one of the same, aren't they?

C (7:13)

They often are, yeah.

B (7:14)

I'm the third of six kids in a small town in Missouri. I was very different than my brothers and sisters. I was. I was raised in a very strict Catholic household. That software didn't necessarily, well, run very well with my mainframe. And so I was at conflict and at odds with that model, my parents model of, of life. And I felt it stunting. Claustrophobic. I grew in a very small town of 2,000 people. That wasn't enough for me. I had ADD, ADHD. They didn't know what to do with me. So I was kind of a fish out of water and a fish gasping for air for my own self. And so you want to leave as an alcoholic? Does you want to get out of here? And so also my mother was an alcoholic. My father was an alcoholic until he had a medical problem. He quit drinking. So as you know, the Catholic church has drinking in the ceremony. So all those things are, you know, accepted. It's not looked down upon like you couldn't smoke a cigarette. But if you drink, that's not. Not a big deal. So by the time I was in eighth grade, I was drinking regularly. By the time I was in eighth grade, I was getting drunk, like really drunk on the weekend, like on sweet wine. So you can start with something a little milder to drink. And then I. Then I started using marijuana probably in eighth grade. And then like that. Thank God there's no access to drugs in this small town. So that was the only thing that was there was marijuana and booze. And so I continued to drink throughout college. It was a problem. I didn't know it. I blacked out several times in college. And people would say, do you know what you were doing last night? I'm like, what do you mean? And they'd tell you stories like, wow, here's the weird thing. It didn't occur to me that I had a drinking problem. I just think, well, that's college. Or, you know, it's. You get to drink. Then I moved to Chicago and started studying at the Second City and the Improv Olympic at the same time. And man, did we drink collectively as a group of humans going through this amazing experience together. Part of it was alcohol. A lot of that is you have anxiety, perhaps going on stage. And part of it is just this fun because we had this group of people that all had that taste and thirst. And man, we drank. We drank before shows, we drank after shows. After shows would get hard. And again, thank God we had little money and not great access to drugs, which is great because otherwise even worse. And then I got onto Saturday Night Live and continued drinking to my own detriment. And then people would start giving you coke, you know, at the after party. On Saturdays. That's such a weird thing. When you can finally afford it, they just give it to you.

C (10:16)

But it seems like it served a lot of roles for you earlier. At first it was to sort of escape, and you sort of had that genetics and the family history. But it was also fun. It was what everyone was doing. It was just sort of the. The breadth of life back then.

B (10:30)

It sounds like, yep, 100%. And then I got married, and it was a difficult proposition. And so the drinking continued. And then it was just kind of like just a daily relaxer. And then as the difficulty increased over the years, about year 18, I'd say it got really rough. And so I was plowing it and it was really interfering with my life. So I went to rehab in 2018 and in 2019 and in 2020. And look, I'll just say this rehab's fine to dry out, but if your Rehab doesn't include 12 step program number one, and most of them, in my experience, don't. If that's not the, you know, forefront of what their treatment is, I don't. It doesn't have a chance of success. And a lot of these places like to not do it because they want their own way of treating you, which quite frankly, is. It's the program or nothing, in my experience.

C (11:45)

What is it that resonated with you about the program?

B (11:48)

Well, it works. And you've got this collective group of people that will ensure your sobriety if you allow it. Or you can go and hide. You know, you can't lie to an alcoholic.

C (12:04)

Yeah.

B (12:04)

Because they. They know. They know. You know, you. You look away or you go. Or you start telling a story. I mean, look, you know, are you sober? Ah, yeah. You're lying. Right. An alcoholic knows immediately. See, that's my experience. So, yeah, that's why I say that. And it's been proven to work, if you will do the work. Right.

C (12:32)

So a. Provide you a community where there was no hiding. And I guess an abuse does that too. There's just that accountability and there's no way to drink with those people. And that met India.

B (12:44)

Correct. Okay.

C (12:46)

And how did that impact your comedy and your fame through the years? You had your big break with sex Saturday Night Live and. And walk me through how that intertwined with. With the drinking and. And all the success you were having.

B (12:58)

Well, had I. Well, I would say it was just hand in hand. It was just whatever. Now, looking back, had I not drank and used all those years, I would have a much better career. I would have had A much better career. I think word probably gets around. Always a bit of a drinker, right? I mean, I don't know. I don't. I don't have testimony that I haven't been hired because of my drinking, but it wouldn't surprise me. You know, people talk, producers talk about whatever. Like, I've always done a good job. I could have done a great job. I would say people know when you're hungover on set and that becomes something like, well, yeah, he drank whatever, know. So, yeah, it impacted my career. Plus, you're just not as good or sharp as you could be.

C (13:52)

And it was tricky because some of your characters were sort of guys that had. That enjoyed excess. Right. And.

B (13:57)

And enjoyed sort of, not sort of. Champ kind is a raging alcoholic. Exactly. Yeah. And Todd packers had several DUIs.

C (14:08)

Did you worry when you stopped drinking, you would lose some of that?

B (14:12)

No, no, no, no, no, no, no. I. I know. You know. No, I never. That's a lie. If you say I can't find the magic without the drinking, you're lying. Good for you, but you know you're lying. If you couldn't do it without drinking, that means you couldn't do it at all. And you should be doing it, in my opinion. So, yeah. Yeah. There was never any fear of losing the. The, you know, the sun.

C (14:41)

Right. And what was fame like for you when it came?

B (14:44)

It wasn't something that happened immediately. And it's not even something I think about. It's something I remember like, all right, I forget. People know who you are, and as time goes on, you figure out how to deal with it. You just kind of look ahead. You don't look around or whatever, or you have your own negotiation with it, depending on how. What the situation is. Be grateful, be humble. I always say never leave anybody with a story. How was he? Nice guy. How was he? Kind of an a hole. Oh, my goodness. Right. But nice guy's not a story. A hole's a story. So that's number one. Don't leave anybody with a story. So like that. It happened very slowly for me. So it was kind of a. A gradual incline. So. Yeah, I like that. It's. It's. I don't have it like a lot of people do, you know, I have a marginal amount. You know, others get. I can't imagine their life, how they even negotiate daily.

C (15:53)

But sometimes. Sometimes the success goes to our. Our own head and it makes us hard to view our. Our drinking or other behavior. It's. It seems like you've always Kept very grounded.

B (16:02)

And I always kept very lubricated. I was always grounded. Was not the problem. It's the lubrication with the problem.

C (16:10)

Right.

B (16:12)

And I'd say the lubrication keeps you from being grounded. Like you. You have to feel your emotions. Right. When it comes down to it, isn't that where we're getting to? Right. You have to feel those emotions. And why numb yourself, Just sit there, let it come up. Your body's going to take care of it, right? Yeah. And feel it so much better. And then you're not in the. One of the stages of fear.

C (16:40)

How did that, you know, thinking back on your childhood or, you know, interacting with your parents and siblings as you get older, how did that change when you entered sobriety?

B (16:50)

Well, you know, at your long. If you've been. If you have a drinking problem for a long time, which I did, I would think you, you know, I'm sure I avoided talking to them because the subject would come up, how's the drinking? And then you feel like everyone's babysitting you.

C (17:10)

Right.

B (17:11)

People don't realize, like, don't ask me that. If you're not my sponsor, you don't have the right to ask that. It really bothered. The gossip bothers me. I know some people that I came up with in Chicago who are alcoholics, and they like to talk about your alcoholism, which is infuriating to me because that must make them feel better. Well, I'm not like him or whatever. Well, you know, I'm working on myself and doing myself. So what happens is you do have to, you know, separate yourself from some people that are toxic. I'd say that's probably the difference, which I might not have done. Had I continued to drink, I'm sure I wouldn't have done it.

C (17:55)

So you worked hard and the fame came. And then eventually came this point where you felt like you had to really tackle the drinking with intensive care and you went to rehab. 2018, 2019, 2020. What was it that finally pushed you over the edge in terms of really staying sober? Was it getting on the antibuse or was there other things that sort of solidified it for you?

B (18:15)

Well, getting on the interviews. My daughter went to a wedding, my oldest daughter, and she was recounting watching Father Daughter dance, and she said, dad, I want you to be there. And, you know, I know I can't be there if I continue down that path. Right. Because you make nothing but dumb decisions when you're drinking. Plus, you're just not any good. One drink makes you less than you should think. I have one beer before a show and I'll be nice and loose. Maybe worse, you're not as sharp. And then someone goes, oh, something's off. They don't. They can't put their finger on it. But if right now, like, I can tell someone's had one drink now, I'm sure you can, too. Yeah, it's the eyes. It's like, oh, you're. I can hear the tiniest slur. So some of that audience can too. Now, if you've had two or three and think you're fun, you're not. They go, oh, he's not all there. So those types of things, like, you owe it to the people that purchased a ticket to come see you. You owe them the best performance you can give them.

C (19:52)

Right. And. And then you were saying you owe your kids, I think having that very powerful moment with your. Your daughter. And you were telling me before we started that you have. You have five kids.

B (20:01)

Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, I have a responsibility to make sure they all get through to 18 and then, you know, hopefully are capable of, you know, economically taking care of themselves. But LA is very expensive. So I feel a great deal of responsibility and a great deal of love for my children, obviously. Well, not obviously, but I do. And so, yeah, I want to be there.

C (20:27)

And you're giving them a great gift to tell them about your sobriety and to be open with feelings. You know, I think I heard in your story your. Your parents sort of never made police with drinking until having a medical issue.

B (20:39)

And so did my dad quit because he had pancreatitis. And then so the alcohol would inflame this pancreatitis. And it turns out it was a gallbladder issue. Wasn't even pancreatitis, but it didn't matter. He quit cold turkey because, you know, the pain was so intense. And sadly, my mother never quit. Yeah. The doctor. Doctors there in Missouri, and she had a heart attack and they told her she could have one ounce a day. Do you know an alcoholic that you'd have one ounce a day?

C (21:13)

Yeah, that's.

B (21:14)

You can't have one else a day because one ounce today is a well, two today, no, then tomorrow, whatever. It's the bargaining. So, yeah, that was not a smart idea on their part.

C (21:27)

But you're giving your children something different, your recovery story. And I think sometimes people see your movies and it feels like you're superhuman and funny if you're drinking and partying. But the superpower really is in being sober and Open and honest in the way you've been able to do it for yourself and for your kids.

B (21:45)

Yep. Sobriety is the real force. Sobriety is the real force. I tell my kids, if I had one thing to do over in life, it would be I would never drink. And I mean that sincerely. If I had one thing to do over in life, I would never have drank. My God, could have had such a better life.

C (22:04)

Did the. The getting sober change your relationship with your fans who were expecting you to. To be a certain way or. Or not really?

B (22:10)

I. I don't. I don't add that into the metric.

C (22:14)

Yeah.

B (22:16)

What happens is I. I'm happy to say I don't drink because then you don't have to hang out with drunks because it's the same thing. Come on, just one. Oh, I'm gonna throw in my sobriety for you. Some stranger. It's interesting how insistent alcoholics and drunks get about you drinking with them. I mean, I get it, but I remember I drink a soda water on stage, you know, like a Pellegrino, which is green. And I saw you drinking on stage like, that was smoking water. Like, they're so inebriated. They. They thought they saw a Heineken because it's a green label. Right.

C (23:01)

And it's.

B (23:02)

It's soda water. I'm up there talking about my sobriety, and they're convinced that we should have a drink together. Plus, why. For what? Why should I drink with you? I. You know, that's the only time I can understand what women go through when a guy asks them if they want if they can buy them a drink, and then you're not allowed to say no. Now I can say no because I'm sober, right? You know, otherwise I'm not right now. Doesn't, like, come on, are you too good for me? All that stuff. But come on, dude. Plus, when someone buys you a drink, they're buying what? They're not. They're buying your time. So they think they get to interact with you for the time it takes to drink that, have that drink, which is such a burden, quite frankly. But now I get to say no. I went to a wedding in November. My God, Just every other person. Come on, let's do a shot. Come on. I said no, I don't drink. Come on. That pleading and begging, like, why is that important to you? And so the person asked you the first time will ask you six more because he keeps getting drunker and either forgetting or thinks he can seduce you into it. Such an Odd thing, but that's the alcoholic, right? I read something yesterday because of course, on my algorithm, I get a lot of sobriety stuff on Instagram. It said, don't call yourself an alcoholic. I don't know if I agree with that. What are your thoughts on that?

C (24:37)

For some people, it really helps. Some people, they feel it's sort of stigmatizing and shameful. But to own your sobriety, I think is really key. It gives you a power over it that hiding from it or running from it, you know, sometimes doesn't. And it sounds like that's your experience, huh?

B (24:55)

No, I talk about it in my show and I get some big laughs on my own foibles. So I, I, I like it because people go, that helps some of them. Like you said, your experience was. Helped someone that was one of your patients. And I know some people out there can see me up there succeeding. Hopefully I go, okay, yeah, there you go. You're a friend of Bill's. You're the brotherhood, the sisterhood. So I don't mind. And then maybe it makes someone out there think, oh, I guess I do have a drinking problem. Who knows? Because, look, a drinking problem means you have a problematic life and you need to get out of it. And the thing everyone worries about is, I can't quit forever. Yeah, you can, you know, because you can stop being in denial forever. That's, that's the, that's the good part.

C (25:46)

What, what part of recovery has surprised you the most? For better or worse? It sounds like it's been.

B (25:51)

Been mostly good self discovery.

C (25:53)

Self discovery?

B (25:55)

Yeah. I noticed in my first year, but every three months I'd have some depression and I wouldn't know, and I not, not great depression, but I just kind of like, just not feeling it. And I realized, well, I have to get up and move. I have to work out, do something. Then I realized, like, oh, you're feeling things, things are coming up, you have to deal with, and then it's not that hard. It's manageable. Yeah. So that's the thing that I've noticed the most. Just, you know, having more energy, being able to set goals and meet them. All the normal stuff of life. Recently, I did read something I've always thought in sitting in rooms, listening to everybody's story, right. I've always thought we're angels with our wings clipped. And I finally saw something on Instagram which says you, a lot of alcoholics are people that have. Because there's so much exploration now of what, who are we on this globe, what's going on. What is this whole experience? Is it, you know, interdimensional? Are we just in living one stream of life where there's five going on all the time and you have access to so much more if we could get our psychic energy open. But basically it's along the same lines, like angels who are stuck in the wrong spot. And I, I. It's interesting because I thought that years ago, these are all angels who just. Who were led, they weren't allowed to. To fly the way they needed to fly. Like they had to assimilate into a world that they don't belong in. Necessarily not. It is this world. But you could have, you could have made more of yourself and perhaps benefited the world more had you been allowed to or allowed yourself to live a fully activated life.

C (27:58)

I love that. And, you know, it speaks to the title of this podcast, which is, you know, thriving with. With addiction. And, and, you know, you're a good example of doing that and how you help others. Tell me a little bit about your comedy tour now and what you're doing on the road.

B (28:14)

It's never ending like that. I've got five kids. After you turn 60, things slow down in show business because you're not, you know, you're not younger, so you're either the dad or the grandfather. And they don't make comedy movies like they used to because they don't sell internationally. So now it's all economic metrics. So action movies, you can sell internationally. Comedy doesn't translate. Comedy here doesn't translate. Comedy all over the globe. It's. I don't expect most people to understand that, but it doesn't work. If you see comedy from another country, you're like, oh, why is that funny? That's what they see too. Why is that funny? It's cultural, so it doesn't work. Action is global. So there's been a reduction in the number of. What happened. How many great comedies did you watch this year? Used to be every month there'd be another great comedy coming out.

C (29:11)

Right now we're just watching Anchorman. Yeah.

B (29:14)

Nice. Well, yeah. Why are you watching anyway? Because there's none other. Anchorman or something like it. Because studios don't invest in that because it doesn't give them enough profit. So anyway, when. Then they're making fewer TV shows. So there's, There's. So about my tour, I guess that's what we're talking about. So that's why I have to go out on tour. I get to. Although I'm developing A couple projects that will help me do a balance of the road, plus other stuff, like other stuff I can do from my home, because that's the thing. You have to develop projects or else you'll be constantly out there. Just pick with a pick of the shovel, digging it, digging it, digging it. I'm great. I'm quite grateful that that exists. But, yeah, you had, you know, you've got to make your own changes and find new ways to succeed.

C (30:09)

That's great. And it's great that you've incorporated your sobriety into your act.

B (30:13)

Oh, it's fun. It's fun. I. There's a freedom to it. There's nervous laughter and then accepting laughter and understanding how it's limited my life. And I can make it the fool that I recognize as part of myself. And we're all a fool in some ways. So hopefully that's the. The light that goes on in the audience's head for sure.

C (30:45)

Well, Dave, I really appreciate you joining me today and telling your story and sharing it, and I wish you all the. All the best on your journey. Keep. Keep saying, you know, keep. Keep preaching the good word and, and helping our folks with substance.

B (30:58)

Yeah, it's. It's so. Such a better life.

C (31:01)

It is. Well, thank you again for coming. I appreciate it.

B (31:03)

Thanks for having me.

A (31:05)

Thanks for listening to the Thriving With Addiction podcast. If you found today's episode helpful, please follow and subscribe wherever you listen to your podcasts and share it with someone who might benefit. You can also connect with me on Instagram, LinkedIn and YouTube or visit thrivingwithaddiction.com to learn more. Stay tuned for next week's episode. And remember, thriving is possible.