El Libertator (Venezuela update)

Summary

Throughline (NPR): "El Libertador" (Venezuela Update)

Release Date: January 8, 2026
Hosts: Rund Abdelfatah & Ramtin Arablouei

---

Episode Overview

This episode of Throughline explores the deep historical roots behind Venezuela’s tumultuous present, triggered by recent (2026) US military action to seize President Nicolás Maduro. The hosts reflect on how the fates and personalities of two influential Venezuelan leaders—Simón Bolívar and Hugo Chávez—have shaped the country’s destiny over two centuries. By comparing their revolutionary rises, moments of triumph and downfall, and resulting legacies, the episode asks: How did Venezuela, once South America’s richest nation, descend into chaos?

• “How did such a once prosperous nation end up here?” (Ramtin Arablouei, 02:11)
  The Throughline team uses historic storytelling, expert commentary, and vivid anecdotes to connect the dots from Bolívar's liberation campaigns to today’s struggle for power, oil, and democratic stability.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Recent Dramatic Developments in Venezuela

• US Military Action: US forces seized President Nicolás Maduro for trial on federal charges, following deadly strikes on the Venezuelan capital (01:02).
• Ongoing Crisis: As of 2026, Venezuela faces economic collapse, humanitarian disaster, and mass emigration.
• Historical Framing: The episode revisits a 2019 show to offer context, arguing Venezuela’s issues long predate Maduro and go back at least to Chávez (01:38) and ultimately Bolívar.

---

2. Bolívar & Chávez: Myth, Power, and Revolution

Bolívar’s Mythic Origins & Legacy (05:41–16:09)

• Early Life: Born wealthy in Caracas, orphaned young, shaped by personal tragedy (death of wife) and revolutionary ideas from Europe.
  • “If she hadn’t died, he would have been a very successful landowner. He would have potted around his properties and... had a very, very much the same sort of life that his father and his grandparents and his great-grandparents had.” (Marie Arana, 12:40)
• Revolutionary Campaign: Initially on sidelines, then thrust into leadership after an earlier leader’s betrayal and exile (14:10–15:56). Bolívar’s charisma, vision, and adaptability turn failure into opportunity.
• Grand Vision: Radical shift from elite-centered revolt to inclusive continental liberation—Gran Colombia, a union of "independent republics, nevertheless united as one" (27:48).

Chávez’s Rise: Coup, Charisma, and the Bolivarian Dream (16:41–32:32)

• Early Life: Poor, mestizo background, army career; inspired by Bolívar’s revolutionary image and leftist ideology.
• 1992 Failed Coup:
  • Becomes a public figure due to his on-air “responsibility” during the failed uprising.
    • “I take responsibility for the failure of this project... This is a Bolivarian movement.” (Historian/Expert & Jennifer McCoy, 22:09–22:18)
• Political Ascent: Enters jail as a failed mutineer, emerges as the figurehead for change amidst economic and political disintegration (31:08-32:04).
• Presidential Election: In 1998, Chávez, channeling Bolívar and promising sweeping reforms, wins with 56% of the vote (34:23).

---

3. The Cycle of Power: Triumphs and Iron Hands

Bolívar: From Hero to Tyrant (35:05–38:04)

• Military Success: Liberates Colombia, Venezuela, Ecuador, Peru, and founds Bolivia.
• Downfall: The vision of a united continent crumbles amid social divisions and elite backlash.
  • “The moment he rode away, things would fall apart. So he became more and more convinced that the only way you were going to be able to rule these unruly people was to really have a strong iron hand.” (Marie Arana, 36:57)
• Autocracy and Resentment: Bolívar’s increasing authoritarianism leads to eventual exile and disgrace.

Chávez: Populist Rule and Oil-Backed Power (37:51–47:52)

• Constitutional Changes: Rewrites constitution to centralize power (38:29–38:47).
• Oil Wealth: Leverages rising oil prices to fund vast social programs and parallel state institutions, fostering dependency and corruption.
  • “Chavez invested a lot of that oil money in social programs for the poor.” (Rund Abdelfatah, 45:54)
• Opposition and Paranoia: Survives a coup (2002), returns hardened, redoubling repression and consolidating authority.

Chávez’s Personality Cult: TV & Theater (42:48–44:56)

• Alo Presidente Show: Chávez uses marathon, performance-filled TV broadcasts to promote his image and vision.
  • “He was very friendly... it was a show.” (Rory Carroll, 45:03)
  • “A showman, a visionary and a salesman. Someone who could put a bow on a broken down car and convince you to buy it.” (Rund Abdelfatah, 45:15)
• Vision vs. Reality: His pursuit of Bolívar-inspired unity leads to regional outreach but also economic mismanagement, with little saved for lean times (47:52–48:33).

---

4. Legacy, Memory, and Unfinished Revolutions

Bolívar’s Death and Reinvention (49:07–51:40)

• Lonely Demise: Dies in exile, name banned, legacy initially tarnished.
  • “He’s given over all of his wealth... penniless.” (Marie Arana, 49:52)
• Revival: Later generations—especially in Venezuela—reinterpret Bolívar to suit changing political needs.
  • “He became basically all things to all people.” (Historian/Expert, 51:28)

Chávez: Myth, Succession Crisis, and Lasting Impact (52:25–57:41)

• Final Campaign and Illness: Despite terminal cancer, Chávez rallies his supporters with theatrical bravado.

  • Memorable moment: Chavez arrives at a torrentially rainy rally, dancing and feigning strength despite illness (53:15–53:54).

• Death and Aftermath: Leaves behind an unfillable gap (“the aircraft carrier”) and a nation with destroyed institutions, reliant on a legacy no successor can match.

  • “You have a disruptive leader coming in. They can destroy things in the name of change. But the same leader is not the one who can necessarily rebuild.” (Jennifer McCoy, 56:00)

• Recurring Paradox: Like Bolívar, Chávez becomes irreplaceable in the national imagination, trapping Venezuela in cycles of hope, collapse, and leader-worship.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Timestamp | Speaker | Quote | |-----------|---------|-------| | 02:11 | Ramtin Arablouei (Host) | “Venezuela was once the richest country in South America. So the question becomes now, how did such a once prosperous nation end up here?” | | 12:40 | Marie Arana (Author/Biographer) | “If she hadn’t died, he would have been a very successful landowner.... a very, very much the same sort of life that his father... had.” (on Bolivar’s alternate destiny) | | 22:09 | Historian/Expert | “I take responsibility for the failure of this project. And then he also said, this is a Bolivarian movement.” (Chávez, on national TV after his coup failed) | | 27:19 | Ramtin Arablouei (Host) | “He imagined the South America under one flag that would be democratic and inclusive of all the diverse people that lived in it.” (on Bolívar’s Gran Colombia) | | 36:57 | Marie Arana | “The moment he rode away, things would fall apart. So he became more and more convinced ... [he] needed a strong iron hand.” | | 45:15 | Rund Abdelfatah (Host) | “Chavez in a nutshell. A showman, a visionary and a salesman. Someone who could put a bow on a broken down car and convince you to buy it.” | | 49:52 | Marie Arana | “He has no friends and he’s penniless. He's a pauper. At this point, he’s given over all of his wealth.” (on Bolívar’s end) | | 51:28 | Historian/Expert | “He became basically all things to all people.” (on Bolívar’s legacy in Venezuela) | | 56:00 | Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Prof.) | “You have a disruptive leader coming in. They can destroy things in the name of change. But the same leader is not the one who can necessarily rebuild.” | | 56:51 | Historian/Expert | “One of the great paradoxes that are parallel to Bolivar is that there is no succession. No one can fill Bolivar's shoes, just as no one can fill Chavez's shoes.” |

---

Important Segment Timestamps

• 00:21 - Simon Bolívar historic quote; opening context
• 01:02–02:22 - Setting up the recent crisis and central question
• 05:36–15:56 - Bolívar’s youth and reluctant revolutionary origins
• 16:41–24:15 - Chávez’s failed coup and mythmaking
• 27:19–30:28 - Bolívar’s vision and formation of Gran Colombia
• 34:23–37:17 - Chávez’s election and the dawn of a new era
• 38:29–40:49 - Chávez consolidates power, faces coup
• 42:48–45:34 - Alo Presidente: Media, spectacle, and power
• 49:07– 51:31 - Bolívar’s last days and posthumous reputation
• 52:25–54:45 - Chávez’s last campaign, illness, & endorsement of Maduro
• 56:00–57:41 - “No succession”: Enduring shadows of Bolívar and Chávez

---

Conclusion

By intertwining the personal and political journeys of Bolívar and Chávez, the hosts illuminate how myths, failures, ideals, and power struggles drive Venezuela’s cyclical crises. Both men, in death, cast immense shadows—many hope for new liberators, but the past weighs heavily. The episode ends with the pressing question: Who, if anyone, can lead Venezuela out of its labyrinth?

---

For Further Reflection

• The episode powerfully illustrates how Venezuela is haunted by the paradox of revolutionary leadership: inspirational figures can spark transformation but leave behind power vacuums and institutional wreckage.
• Bolívar and Chávez's legacies survive as both rallying cries and cautionary tales, continuously rewritten to justify today’s battles.

---

This summary captures the episode’s narrative flow, key themes, pivotal events, and memorable moments, providing a comprehensive guide for listeners new or returning to these enduring questions in Venezuelan history.

Transcript

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

Support for NPR and the following message come from Warby Parker, the One stop shop for all your vision needs. They offer expertly crafted prescription eyewear plus contacts, eye exams and more. For everything you need to see, visit your nearest Warby Parker store or head to warbyparker.com.

[Simon Bolivar (historical quotes)]

Encuhto la royca y desdichada Venezuela Sus acontecimientos an sido tan rapidos y sus devastaciones stales with respect to heroic and hapless Venezuela, events there have moved so rapidly and the devastation has been such that it is reduced to frightful desolation and almost absolute indigence. Nevertheless, it was once among the fairest regions that are the pride of america.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Simon Bolivar September 6, 1815. Hey everyone, it's Ramtin and rund.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

On January 3rd, the US military seized Venezuelan President Nicolas Maduro after a series of strikes on Venezuela's capital that killed at least 80 people. The military brought Maduro to the US for trial on federal drug trafficking and weapons charges.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

To understand what's happening in Venezuela and the US Government's latest escalation, we're bringing you an episode from our archive. The story of two leaders in Venezuela, separated by nearly two centuries, who shaped the country into what it is today.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

When this episode was first released back in 2019, Venezuela was facing an economic and humanitarian crisis that remains true today. And it's gotten so bad, nearly 8 million people have fled Venezuel in recent years to escape extreme poverty. The Justice Department's case alleges that while Venezuela's economy collapsed, Maduro used his power to run a narco terrorism operation that made him rich. Maduro pleaded not guilty to these charges.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

The thing is, Venezuela was once the richest country in South America. So the question becomes now, how did such a once prosperous nation end up here?

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

When we looked into this, it quickly became clear that Venezuela's problems began way before Nicolas Maduro. It goes back to Maduro's predecessor, Hugo Chavez.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

What happened with Maduro cannot be isolated from what happened under Hugo Chavez.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Populist politics, socialism, and his own personality cult with blowtorch rhetoric may be gone, but the Huachaves is far from forgotten. Chavez created the regime that Maduro has struggled to control since he assumed the presidency in 2013. So to understand Maduro, you have to understand Chavez, but you can always go deeper, right? Like what motivated Chavez? Well, the answer to that question takes us back to when Venezuela was created and a man named Simon Bolivar, or as he's become known across South America, a Libertador.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Their stories, Chavez and Bolivar and the rise and fall of the Venezuela they ruled over are strikingly similar and offer a window into the soul of a country that's been in a revolutionary cycle for centuries now.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

So today we present a split screen of sorts and travel back and forth through time between Bolivar's almost mythical story and Chavez's use of that powerful story to make his own.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer 2]

This message comes from Carvana, who makes buying and financing your next car easy. Thousands of vehicles, terms up front and 100% online. Even get it delivered to your door. Buy your car the easy way with Carvana. Delivery Fee May apply Support for this podcast and the following message come from Strawberry Me Be honest. Are you happy with your job? Are you stuck in a job you've outgrown or never wanted in the first place? Are your reasons for staying really just excuses for not leaving? Let a career coach from Strawberry Me help you get unstuck, Discover the benefits of having a dedicated career coach in your Corner and get 50% off your first coaching session at Strawberry.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

This message comes from Lisa from Night one. You'll feel the difference. Premium materials that deliver serious comfort and full body Support. Go to Leesa.com for 25% off mattresses plus get an extra $50 off with promo code NPR this message comes from Instacart. Did you see the game last night? Of course you did, because you used Instacart to do your grocery restock. Plus you got snacks for the game, all without missing a single play. And that's multitasking. So Instacart isn't saying it's a hack for game day, but it might be the ultimate play this football season. Enjoy zero dollar delivery fees on your first three orders. Service fees apply. Valid on three orders within 14 days. Excludes restaurants. Instacart We're.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Part one Rise of the Phoenix.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Some believe that on his deathbed in 1830, Simon Bolivar's final words were, damn it.

[Simon Bolivar (historical quotes)]

How will I ever get out of this labyrinth?

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

In the early hours of July 16, 2010, at the Northern edge of the old town of Caracas, Venezuela's capital, Hugo Chavez set out to free Bolivar from what Chavez had in the past called lies.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

They tell us that Bolivar left government because he was sick with tuberculosis. Lies, lies.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

A thousand lies. Chavez suspected foul play and wanted to check for himself whether Bolivar actually died from tuberculosis or something more sinister like poison. So he decided to exhume the body of Bolivar.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

And there's a whole lot of theater built around this moment.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Journalist Rory Carroll was there to witness it.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

I was the Guardians of Latin america correspondent from 2006 until 2012, based in Caracas, Venezuela.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

All this being recorded live on national television.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

People were glued to the TV because this had been built up as the moment when the. The Bolivarian Revolution reconnects with its namesake beyond symbolism, that this is where the two bodies, the political body and the actual body of the revolutionary leader here and the revolutionary leader then, are going to connect.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

This is Alejandro Velasco. He grew up in Venezuela and is.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Now an associate professor of history at New York University.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

So with the country looking on, the entourage of politicians, soldiers and scientists arrives at the National Pantheon. Decked out in white lab coats, hair nets, and ventilation masks, they enter a room with a casket in the middle. A handful of them then step towards the casket and lift up the lid. A Venezuelan flag covers the remains. After neatly folding up the flag, they remove the final layer. And there it is. A skeleton. The skeleton of Simon Bolivar.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Chavez looks into the camera and you could tell that there's a physical reaction of goosebumps. Call it something happening there.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

And he's giving the live commentary as the workers are digging up the crypt. And then his voice goes into this weird kind of like hush.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Feeling, the spirit of Bolivar sort of creeping into him.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

He was hamming it up so much. I mean, it was funny, but it was surreal. It was creepy.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

The.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

The coming of the Liberator back into a certain kind of life.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

Forget the Truman show, this was the Hugo Chavez show.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

But as a Venezuelan, as somebody who grew up in Venezuela and, you know, had Bolivar stories, field trips to Bolivar's childhood home, going to the sites of Bolivar's battles in Venezuela, I couldn't help but be also moved by that moment.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Sure, it was really good political theater, but scientifically, it was inconclusive. After the cameras were turned off, they packed Bolivar back up, and Chavez excitedly tweeted. Yes, tweeted to the world. My God, my God, I confess, we have cried, we have sworn. This glorious skeleton must be Bolivar, because you can feel his ardor rise up. Simon, as it's not time to die. Immediately, I remembered that Bolivar lives.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

It's 1803, and a young Simon Bolivar stands at his wife's deathbed, looking at her for the last time, the love of his life, Maria Teresa. What happens that day in 1803 would change Bolivar's life in South America forever. But first, let's go back to the beginning, to where his story started. Bolivar grew up in Caracas in a really wealthy family, one of the richest.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

Families in Latin America. It owned tobacco fields, it owned indigo.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Fields, and they also owned slaves. Despite that massive wealth, Boliva's early years weren't all that easy.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

His father died when he was very young.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

His mother died not long after that. So by age 9, he was an orphan. This is Marie Arana. She's written a bunch of books on Latin America, including the biography American Liberator. So Bolivar, now orphaned, was passed around from relative to relative.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

He was naughty. He didn't like the company of the aristocrats. He'd rather play in the fields with the slaves. And he did. He was basically rootless, really, until one of his uncles said, well, okay, let's send you to Madrid so you can get some manners.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

He goes to Madrid and it's there that he meets his future wife, Maria Teresa.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Like Bolivar, she also came from an aristocratic family. And in the way that these things happened at the time, it wasn't so much that it was prearranged, but that they were part of criollo elite.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Criollo is a term for people of mixed European and Afro Caribbean descent. Both Bolivar and Maria Teresa were from the upper class. So they rolled in the same social.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Circles and they sprung a romance that by all accounts was very genuine.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

They got married, returned to Venezuela, settled into a life on Bolivar's family plantation, and began the rest of their life together. All in all, they were happy. But less than a year after their.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Wedding, she became ill. I can't remember exactly what with.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Yellow fever.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

That's right, yellow fever. But it struck her very rapidly. And so she died very quickly after.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Bolivar was left devastated.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Oh, absolutely, yeah. He was destroyed.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Some historians believe if Maria Teresa had not died, Bolivar might never have gotten involved in the fight for independence. Bolivar himself said.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

He said if she hadn't died, he would have been a very successful landowner. He would have potted around his properties and, you know, had children and had a very, very much the same sort of life that his father and his grandparents and his great grandparents had.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Had a relatively quiet life in the country. But having just lost his wife, Bolivar began to search for a new purpose in life. So fast forward a few years, Bolivar is now in Paris, still depressed over the loss of his wife, still searching for a clear path for forward. Drinking a lot, womanizing. And while there, he witnessed a rebellious fervor taking over France. This was the era of the French Revolution, of Napoleon, of liberty, equality and fraternity. Meanwhile, the fight for independence was ramping up in Venezuela. At that time, Venezuela and most of South America was still a colony of the Spanish empire.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

The coincidence of history and personal tragedy and larger history is significant because this was also right around the time that Francisco de Miranda, who was the principal architect of a vision of liberation for Venezuela, was trying desperately to rile up the criollo elite to declare independence.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

And keep in mind, Bolivar was from one of the most elite families in Venezuela. Eventually, he decides to team up with Francisco de Miranda. But initially, Bolivar is not all that central to this movement.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

His initial role was primarily as the scion of a criollo elite family, very much on the sidelines.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Basically, he has money and his presence is good PR for the movement. In 1810, Bolivar's status suddenly changes. He and Miranda stage an uprising against the Spanish and catching the Spanish off guard, take Caracas. Venezuela formally declares independence in 1811. But then in 1812, a massive earthquake hits Venezuela, and Spanish priests convince a superstitious population that the earthquake was divine retribution. So the Spanish are able to rally their troops, recapture important ports, and take back control of the country. Amid all this chaos, the something unexpected happens. Bolivar, along with a few rebel generals, figure out that Miranda has been trying to broker a deal with the Spanish to end the war, effectively undermining the revolution. Disgusted by this betrayal, Bolivar decides that they should hand Miranda over to the Spanish. And in exchange, the Spanish agree to let Bolivar go. But he's banished from Venezuela and sent into exile. The revolution has been shut down for the moment. But by singling him out, the Spanish helped manufacture a new image of Bolivar as the natural replacement for Miranda.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

Here's this tiny man. He weighed all of 120 pounds. He had no chest to speak of. He was spindly.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

He was in a sort of accident of history. This guy is now the face of the revolution. But it turns out Bolivar actually had the traits of a serious leader.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

He would walk into a room and larger, taller people would be dwarfed really by his presence because he was so dynamic, friendly, the sort of warm personality that inspired people.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

After this first failed revolution, Bolivar is no longer on the sidelines. He's now at the center of the movement. And there he his desire for change will only intensify. February 4, 1992. And normal programming on Venezuelan TV was interrupted by this unfolding story.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

It's 1992.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

A press conference is announced very hastily.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

TV crews with microphones get in position.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

And then out comes the president, Carlos.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Andres Perez, followed by the Minister of Defense.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

And then this man who none of us knew and the president said, this is Lieutenant Colonel Guchaves. He has some words. And then he spoke for two minutes.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Two minutes. Actually, a little less than two minutes. Point is, not a long time. Before I tell you what Chavez said in that speech, let me first explain how he ended up there in roughly two minutes. So Chavez was born in 1954 in a part of Venezuela called Los Llanos.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

Their equivalent of the US Kind of wild west of these big rolling plains.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

One of six kids. They were very, very poor, raised mostly by his grandmother. He was mestizo, mixed race with African and indigenous roots, and by all accounts, a happy, outgoing kid with a wild.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

Imagination, imbibing the legends of headless horsemen of love, stories of the cowboys of the plains.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

He had dreams of becoming a professional baseball player until reality set in. In his early 20s, Chavez joined the Venezuelan army, one of the fastest ways to move up the social ladder.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

While there, he got inspired by some leftist Latin American generals who took a more reform approach to their societies, in contrast with the right wing military dictatorships in much of Latin America.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Above all, he was inspired by one guy, Simon Bolivar.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

I'll talk about that. We want to wait a minute because there's a police siren going by.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

By the way, this is Jennifer McCoy. She's a professor of political science at Georgia State University.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

Okay, I'm back. Simon Bolivar is.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Simon Bolivar is a hero to Chavez, someone he saw as a real trailblazer, a champion for the people who uprooted the political order. For most of the 20th century, which was the backdrop for Chavez's life, the political order of Venezuela was based around 1 oil.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

Oil is everything. Was and remains in Venezuela is everything because it's like economy almost hinges entirely on oil.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

In the 1920s, Venezuela became a major oil producer. The economy boomed, and eventually the oil industry was nationalized. Venezuela seemed to be a beacon of stability and prosperity in a region otherwise.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Ravaged by civil wars and dictatorships through.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

The 50s, 60s, 70s. Problem was, most of that wealth was concentrated in the hands of a few at the top. And in the 1980s, oil prices began to drop and the economy began to decline. The gap between rich and poor got bigger and corruption in the government was rampant. That's when Chavez began to think seriously about staging his own uprising. So he got a bunch of his friends in the military together and formed a group called the Revolutionary Bolivarian army, determined to lift up the poor by spreading the oil wealth around and championing a sort of deeper democracy. For a few years, they plotted, planned, and by 1992, the pieces were set. They were going to overthrow the president of Venezuela.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

An attempted coup was taking place on the streets of Caracas.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Here's how it went down. On the morning of February 4, five military units were dispersed across the country. Their mission, to take over key government, the Defense Ministry, the military airport, the military museum, the presidential palace, and the national TV station, where they plan to broadcast a video on the part of.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Chavez and other of the leaders of this movement calling on the population to rise up. I remember, you know, my mother turning on the television.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

The men in the red berets are rebellious paratroopers.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

And, you know, those things that you kind of see in movies, like a grainy video of. Of people, you know, in fatigues, speaking about the conditions of. Of significant inequality that existed and that something has to change.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Some of the military units quickly took control of a few large cities in Venezuela. But the unit led by Chavez, the one that was supposed to take over the presidential palace in Caracas, the and arrest the President.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

That coup was a military fiasco.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

He failed, and eventually they surrendered.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Okay, bizarre twist here. So Chavez, who failed in his mission, is then chosen by the president to make a speech on national television, mainly because he was the rebel leader who happened to be at the presidential palace, right place, right time.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

He is one of at least six or seven other people who could have taken up that role of prominent leadership. And it falls on Chavez because he is given airtime to tell all the other troops who had actually been successful in their own tactical missions to lay down their weapons.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

This was supposed to be his punishment, to go on TV and wave a white flag, admit defeat for two minutes.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

I take responsibility for the failure of this project. And then he also said, this is a Bolivarian movement.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

We were fighting for democracy. We haven't achieved it right now, but it's just over Bora for the moment.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Which created the expectation that this was not the end. This was the beginning.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

When this outsider emerged, first trying to stage a coup which failed, but then publicly recognizing that that failure was his own and accepting responsibility, that was something new for most Venezuelans.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

This is Raul Gallegos. He was a correspondent for the Wall Street Journal and Caracas from 2004 to 2009.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

So he became a star.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

That was his 30 seconds of fame. That's when he burst onto the world stage.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

And that was all that it took to completely alter the narrative of Venezuelan history.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

After giving the speech, Chavez was escorted to jail, which only added to his newfound stardom.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

And so in failure, he nevertheless became.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

The leader because of this circumstance, another accident of history.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

If somebody else had been, you know, given that airtime, maybe they would have been the ones to lead this movement. And to a large extent, that had also happened with Bolivar. Right? In both cases, it was out of failure and circumstance that propelled their image as something larger. And then they kind of rode that image into bigger and better things.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Well, not always better, but without a doubt much bigger things were just around the corner for both of them.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

Foreign.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer 2]

This message comes from NPR sponsor Adobe introducing the all new Adobe Acrobat studio. Now with AI powered PDF spaces need to turn 100 pages of market research into 5 insights with the click templates for a sales proposal that'll close that deal or an AI specialist to tailor the tone of your market report. You can do all that with the all new Adobe Acrobat Studio. Learn [e-mail] do that with Acrobat.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

This is Ira Glass on this American Life. One thing we like is a good mystery sometimes about really big things. But most times the little mysteries are the best. Our lost and found is currently filled with pants.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

I don't know, I've never seen this happen.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

This is true.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

This is true.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Mysteries of every size each week. This American Life.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Wherever you get your podcasts, we're excited to share that. In celebration of her 50th anniversary hosting FRESH AIR, Terry Gross will be a guest on the Late show with Stephen Colbert. Tune in on Thursday, January 8, on CBS. Part 2 the Iron Hand so last.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

We heard of Bolivar, he'd just been sent into exile after a failed attempt at Venezuelan independence. And it was during that time that Bolivar's revolutionary vision really took shape.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Most people at the time, you know, they never got beyond like 50 miles or radius. And he just traveled everywhere. Certainly by necessity, but also, you know, by choice.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Bolivar spent a lot of time outside of Venezuela organizing new rebellions, failing, and reflecting on what went wrong in that first rebellion, the one that came so close to succeeding. Those reflections led Bolivar to devise a whole new approach. First, if he wanted to build up an army, all types of people needed to be brought into the revolutionary fold. Not just as Miranda had thought, the elite, the criollos.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Criollos aren't going to, you know, be the ones who are charging into battle. People who are going to be charging into battle are mestizo, mixed race peoples who can imagine themselves in a better place in an independent system. It's slaves for whom he subsequently promises liberty.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Second, Bolivar decided that he would have to wage a different kind of war to stand a chance against the powerful Spanish army.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

He was one of the original guerrilla fighters, because he was all about surprise and all about numbers. So even though you were naked in a loincloth with nothing but a stick, you know, if you had enough of those people, you could run over a battalion of Spanish with better armor.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

And third, Bolivar rethought his mission altogether.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

This can't be a struggle to liberate Venezuela. This has to be a much larger continental struggle.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

He imagined the South America under one flag that would be democratic and inclusive of all the diverse people that lived in it. This wasn't just an effort to take power. It was supposed to bring a different kind of government, one not just ruled by the elite. He called this new vision of a united South America, Gran Colombia, Great Colombia.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Which would bring together a federation of independent republics, nevertheless, united as one.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

More.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

And more people across South America began joining his cause. And with this army, Bolivar began challenging Spanish troops in Venezuela and neighboring Colombia. But it wouldn't be an easy path to independence.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

The Spanish were a force, unbelievable force, very, very violent and very organized military structure.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

But then, in 1819, Bolivar's army marched towards Colombia. And Bolivar knew if they followed a typical route, the Spanish would defeat them again. So instead, he decided to take a less predictable but ridiculously dangerous route through the Andes mountains.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

It's cold, it's rocky, it's mountainous. Horses don't easily pass through there.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

It's uncharted terrain, hoping that the element of surprise would carry them to victory.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

When these armies traveled, and we need to remember this, it wasn't just soldiers. They traveled with their women because the women were cooking for the men right on the battlefield. They were bringing, bringing their children. So you would have these great long trains and caravans of people going into war, which were like whole populations.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

For weeks, this caravan of soldiers, women and children trudged through the mountains. Some people got sick, others died. But eventually the army arrived in Boyaca, a town in central Colombia, about 90 miles from the capital, Bogota.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

They come upon battalion of Spaniards who did not think that the Bolivar's army, again comprised of these people, would take that route.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

And Bolivar's army won their first major victory.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Bolivar needed a victory at that time to be able to turn the tide and to gain some momentum.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

And the Spanish finally began to look beatable, no longer an invincible force. And within a couple of years, Gran Colombia was declared a reality, as Bolivar set his sights on liberating the rest of Spanish South America. And Bolivar became the first president of Gran Colombia.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Just seven years after Chavez attempted to overthrow the president of Venezuela, he was being sworn in himself. I'm sure you're wondering how this could have happened. I mean, this is the same guy who tried to undermine democracy not that long ago by staging a coup. Well, his evolution from coup stager to candidate really began while he was in jail. During that time, Venezuela was facing some serious problems.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

The party system that had been held up as solid and strong had now collapsed. Then after that, you know, you had a tremendous banking cris. Several banks failed when that basically wiped out savings that people had had.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

But mainly oil prices were dropping. The poverty rate increased from about 25% to about 65% in the course of the 1990s. So it was really a difficult decade for them.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Nothing like what we're seeing today, for sure. But at the time, it was significant enough to create the sense that Venezuela can continue in the way that it's going. And so not that Chavez had been prophetic, right?

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

But that Chavez seemed to have predicted this economic and political turmoil in that two minute speech he gave after the coup. And many Venezuelans remembered it, which allowed.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Chavez's aura to grow even while he was in jail.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

So much so that this new president.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

That was elected in 1993, one of his first acts was to pardon Chavez. So Chavez was freed after two years in jail.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

But once out of jail, Chavez didn't embrace the spotlight right away.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

He, you know, tactically kind of retreated from the public eye.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Chavez knew that a lot of Venezuelans were still skeptical of his motives, even if they liked his ideas.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Do we really trust this guy? Does he actually mean what he says? He comes from the military, after all.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

So Chavez decided to leave Venezuela for a while, a sort of self imposed exile. He traveled all around Latin America, going.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

To other countries, meeting other leaders.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

This is Jennifer McCoy again.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

And in fact, that's when he met Fidel Castro. That began a lifelong friendship with Fidel Castro, whom he later used to consider almost like a father.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

While on these travels, Chavez was taking in new ideas, looking at what was happening in Venezuela, and began to kind.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Of create a vision for what a political project would look.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

He talked about a new constitution, he talked about a new form of democracy. He talked about an economy that would benefit, you know, bringing back the oil.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

Wealth, and that this would be like a great magical trick that he would just turn the oil wealth into a better life for everybody.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

So for the next couple of years, Chavez campaigned on that grand vision and he appealed especially to, to the lower and middle classes for support. By 1998, on the eve of the election, the country had two very different options for President Chavez's opponent, Enrique Salas.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Romer, this older white man of clear European descent from this elite background, or Chavez, you know, darker hued, working class person who had actually had the gall to follow through on his critiques of government and gone to jail for it after taking responsibility for a failed coup. The differences could not be starker between status quo or radical change.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

Hugo Chavez's message just galvanized them so they were ready for change. And he won with 56% of the vote.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

And that sort of began the Chavez era.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

After Bolivar was named president of Gran Colombia, he and his army set out fighting battle after battle across the South America, losing some, but winning many. First liberating Colombia, then Venezuela moves down.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

To Ecuador, liberates Ecuador.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Peru was up next.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

And that was the end. I mean, that was the cutting of the throat of the Spanish colonies. At that point.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Bolivar was appointed dictator of Peru and went on to liberate Panama and even has a country named after him, Bolivia. So now the Spanish were gone, South America was free from colonial rule and Bolivar was victorious. He was looking out on a massive diverse army of followers with the world seemingly at his feet. And even though the continent was scarred by years of fighting, it was a hopeful moment. Gran Colombia could now be fully realized.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

In theory, the vision that he had going into the revolution was not the reality that he had coming out.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

So yes, his moment of triumph happens, but it's very short lived.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

He was all about the rights of man, liberty number one, equality, very close thereupon. But then when he actually got into the reality of that hierarchy that Spain had built so carefully and had kept this little crust on top, it was a mess.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

It turns out while Bolivar was busy liberating all those countries, that little crust on top, the Criollo elite, the group he himself was a part of, had grown more and more angry with him, not only in Venezuela, but throughout South America. Resentful of what the independence movement had become and concerned about what their positions would be in this new order. Plus, Bolivar faced another challenge. He had brought together all these different people, former slaves, cowboys from the plains, indigenous people, and now he had to figure out how to get them all to follow the same rules.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

He would ride from town to town, from city to city, setting up institutions, establishing universities. Once the revolution was over, and what would happen is the moment he rode away, things would fall apart. So he became more and more convinced that the only way you were going to be able to rule these unruly people was to really have A strong iron hand.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Cracks were forming in Bolivar's dream of a democratic pan South American state. And he decided the only way to achieve his ultimate goal, to make sure things got done the way he envisioned was to consolidate power in his own hands.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Famously, Bolivar said, if nature stands against us, we will defeat her as well. Destiny is in our hands against any force real, imagined or ethereal.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Day one of Hugo Chavez's presidency, he.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

Had like 85% popularity. He had business owners supporting him all the way down to the poor. So it was quite widespread.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Again, Jennifer McCoy.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

And I think that was largely because people could make what they wanted to out of its promises.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

With all this public support, Chavez hit the ground running. He went all in on his Bolivar fandom.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

He cultivated himself as a 21st century Simon Bolivar.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

He even renamed the country the Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

And he started changing the rules of the game.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

The most immediate one was to get rid of the old constitution.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

The new constitution was really a mix of progressive human rights and at the same time giving more power to the president. It extended the term to six years.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Eliminated the bicameral Congress, and created a national Assembly.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

People didn't pay too much attention to the new constitution. But then Chavez started talking about oil.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Talked about that the nation's resources would be the primary source of revenue and wealth for the nation to rebuild itself.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

And people did take notice. For Chavez, oil was the key to establishing Bolivar's vision for Venezuela. But the more he talked about redistributing the oil wealth and shaking up the oil industry, the more enemies he made.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

That was the primary and initial battle that Venezuelan society split on in the early years of the Chavez era. What is the oil industry? Who does it serve? And how is it going to be controlled?

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Pretty soon, the widespread support Chavez started out with began to fade. Sure, he still had support among the lower class, but the upper class, the people who profited off of the old system, were nervous about what this new setup would mean for them. Chavez continued to consolidate more and more power, especially over the country's oil. And In April of 2002, he faced a dramatic coup attempt. Violence broke out. The military tried to get rid of him, and another guy was installed as a president. But then Chavez supporters took to the streets, and within two days, Chavez was back in power.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

When he comes back, though, he is very shaken by this because he, he didn't know what was going to happen to him. He didn't know if he was going to be killed or, you know, put in jail. The rest of his life or what was going to happen.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Despite that fear, Chavez didn't try to win over the people who had just attempted to get rid of him, the opposition, or even to extend an olive branch.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Quite the opposite. Now is a sense of okay, it's on.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Over the course of the next few years, Chavez would seek to consolidate more and more power from now on. Like Bolivar, he would rule with a strong, iron hand. Public media counts on your support to ensure that the reporting and programs you depend on thrive. Make a recurring donation today to get special access to more than 20 NPR podcasts. Perks like sponsor free listening, bonus episodes, early access and more. So start supporting what you love [e-mail].

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

This week on Up first, the Trump administration and Venezuela. Can the U.S. run a foreign government? As the president says, they simply may not adopt the policies that Trump would like to see.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

It's a complex, fast moving story.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

As always.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

We're working overnight and every night so.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

You can start each morning knowing what matters. Listen up first on the NPR app.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Or wherever you get podcasts.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer 2]

This message comes from NPR sponsor Shopify. No idea where to sell? Shopify puts you in control of every sales channel. It is the commerce platform revolutionizing millions of businesses worldwide. Whether you're a garage entrepreneur or IPO ready, Shopify is the only tool you need to start, run and grow your business without the struggle. Once you've reached your audience, Shopify has the Internet's best converting checkout to help you turn them from browsers to buyers. Go to shopify.com NPR to take your business to the next level.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Today, Part 3 Alo Presidente.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

It's August 2007 Sunday, and Hugo Chavez is getting ready to host his weekly talk show, Allo Presidente. And I should say this show was a defining feature of Chavez's presidency. He would get on TV every Sunday and it was like this variety show. He'd talk, interview people, sing songs. There were dancers. Sometimes it was kind of weird. And he could go on for hours. His guest this week, journalist Rory Carroll.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

It was actually on a beach way.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Out in the sticks on a really hot day.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

He had his desk plonked in the sand.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

And as the show opens, Chavez invites Rory to ask him anything.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

And so I asked him why was he preparing to have a referendum to get rid of limits on presidential terms, which would basically open the door to him being potentially rooting for life. You know, this course is on live television and his eyes narrowed in a kind of rather theatrical way, you know, and then he turned to the Audience, did you hear that? Did you hear what he said?

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Then Chavez goes on a tirade, a.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

Tirade about me being an embodiment of European colonialism, of European hypocrisy. And he tied this to first, you know, the sins committed by Columbus and then the Spaniards and then the British and the Royal Navy. And I'm sitting there sweating because it's a hot day, and I'm having Chavez pouring a bucket of rhetorical excrement over my head and turning me into rhetorical football. And, you know, it went on and on.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Hour one turns into two, then three, four, five, hour six.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

I think he came back to my question. And he did then, he did actually answer it with, by using a metaphor, he said that the revolution was an unfinished work of art and he was the artist and he could not in good conscience hand the brush over to another artist that he needed to finish it.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

After eight hours, the show finally comes to an end. And backstage, Chavez goes up to Rory.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

He was very friendly. I mean, he came up, we shook hands, and his tone to me was like, hey, don't, you know, don't sweat the, you know, the fact that I turned you into an imperialist villain for a while. You know, it's a show that was.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Chavez in a nutshell. A showman, a visionary and a salesman. Someone who could put a bow on a broken down car and convince you to buy it. By this time 2007, Chavez had managed to consolidate power in almost every sector of society. The military, the government, and oil.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

The price per barrel of oil when Ucha was elected in 1998 was $8 at the height of his presidency. And the price per barrel of oil was $150.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

He was so fortunate to be in office during this incredible oil boom.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Chavez invested a lot of that oil money in social programs for the poor.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

He decided that the best way to help people was to create the social programs that were parallel to the established.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

Government institutions, parallel institutions that he could have more control over and kind of squeezing and starving the others that were more independent.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

So Chavez was spending a ton of money, but not actually strengthening any of the existing infrastructure in Venezuela. Instead, he funneled all of it into these parallel institutions that spanned everything from media to NGOs, universities, healthcare. So there's basically two of everything. It was this mix of socialism and rampant consumerism. Point is, thanks to the oil boom from 2005 to 2012, Venezuela was in a golden age. People had more to eat, more money in their pockets, better health care. And meanwhile, Chavez became More and more drawn to a place Pan American vision like Bolivar, he started to see the end game as a united South America. He reached out to leaders throughout the region, openly criticized the United States, who he saw as an obstacle because of its tendency to meddle, and stopped internal production in Venezuela, instead importing products from other countries in Latin America to boost their economies. That decision was an ideological one that.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Derives directly from this Bolivarian vision, but also an economic one that's based on the idea that only united can we forge ahead as an independent Latin America.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

And every week when Chavez went on TV and hosted his talk show, he pushed that vision, bringing people on, like Rory Carroll, a foreigner, to use as a sort of stand in for the world order that he hoped to overturn. Plus, he made it seem like the money would never run out, like Venezuela would continue to be in this golden age forever.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

The problem was that he probably underestimated how quickly corruption and mismanagement can destroy wealth and leave you worse than you were originally.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

So even as Chavez projected this confident image, the reality was way more complicated. He still faced a lot of opposition, and all that money he was spending was really starting to add up. The bubble was bound to burst sometime.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

And that really, in a sense, was the story of Chavez's rule, that he was a brilliant communicator, a master strategist, and a terrible manager.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

They weren't saving for the rainy day, and when the rainy day hit, they were in very bad shape.

[Simon Bolivar (historical quotes)]

You have been witness to my efforts to establish freedom where tyranny previously reigned. I have worked without the thought of personal gain, sacrificing my fortune and even my peace of mind. I have been the victim of persecutors who have driven me to the very threshold of my grave.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

After facing years of opposition and stalled progress, Bolivar's vision of a united South America was fading. The cost of the revolution had been really high.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

All of this blood had been spilled, all of this incredible sacrifice. Whole cities wiped off the map.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

But it turned out picking up the pieces of that revolution was just as hard. Towards the end of his life life, Bolivar contracted tuberculosis.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

Not only he's getting sicker, but there are whole forces that are that are against him.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Angry about the extremely centralized government Bolivar has put in place, which consolidated all the power in his hands alone. Bolivar was on thin ice across South America, especially in Colombia. And finally the ice broke.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

He then is literally run out of Bogota and exiled from Colombia because they've had enough of Bolivar. They don't want him anymore. They want their little Pockets of turf, he has no friends and he's penniless. He's a pauper. At this point, he's given over all of his wealth.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

On December 10, 1830, Bolivar gave his final speech in Santa Marta, Colombia. From there, he planned to take a ship to an island and live out the rest of his life in exile.

[Simon Bolivar (historical quotes)]

My final wishes are for the happiness of the country. If my death contributes to the cessation of factions and the consolidation of the union, I will step peacefully into the grave.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

One week later, on December 17, 1830, Bolivar died unceremoniously and alone.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

No bells are rung particularly. Nobody makes any eulogies.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Soon after bolivar's death in 1830, in Colombia, actually, his name was banned.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Bolivar was remembered as a disgraced leader, a revolutionary turned tyrant. He left much of South America in disarray, with no clear plan for who would follow in his footsteps to lead all those countries he'd ruled over.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

Then everything changes because everyone at that point begins to think, oh my God, the revolution would not have been won except for this man and he started this revolution. The sort of engagement with the Bolivar legacy begins at that point.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

So he became basically all things to.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

All people, leader after leader across South America, but especially in Venezuela, invoked Bolivar using his legacy as a political tool.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

I think Chavez understood very well that Bolivar could be deployed very malleablely because that was ultimately the legacy of Bolivar. For Venezuelan politics to be this catch all figure that could stand for many things simultaneously. You can go from Bolivar the nationalist 2. Once we have a lot of oil money and can project more broadly Bolivar the Pan American, we can go from Bolivar the participatory democrat, to Bolivar the no. There's one leader here and the leader is me.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Whether it's tickling babies or slamming opponents, there are few politicians in the world who can match Hugo Chavez. For the past 14 years, the Venezuelan president has been arguably the most charismatic and controversial leader in the world. But this may be his last campaign.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

In 2012, Chavez was on the campaign trail, running for a third term in office. His work of art was not yet complete. At one of his final rallies, upwards.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Of a million And a half, 2 million people sort of descend on the. On Caracas. And the great question is, is Chavez going to show up?

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

That's because Chavez had been really sick.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

He's diagnosed with cancer in 2011.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

The crowd waited and suddenly Chavez just.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Kind of materializes, just at the time that a torrential downpour comes across. G and so Chavez just walks up to the stage and just takes the Rein in just no umbrella, right? Just as like everybody is getting soaked and he starts to like, dance and to pretend that he's like Muhammad Ali, like throwing some jabs here and there. It's just like this almost ineffable moment of a man that was otherwise and has seemed to be in his deathbed, suddenly doing this act where he's not only showing or performing this vitality, but once again saying, I am one of you.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Chavez went on to win re election in October of 2012. But by December of that year, his health had gotten really bad. So he decided to hold a press conference, tells the country he's leaving for.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Cuba to get treatment, the prognosis is.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Not good, and says if he doesn't.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

Return, I tell all of you to follow Nicolas.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Nicolas Maduro.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

De Venezuela.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

Maduro was in the Chavez government throughout, first as a deputy, eventually he became foreign minister, then vice president. So he had a variety of roles and was always present.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Still, Maduro was no Chavez. And the idea of anyone other than Chavez leading the country seemed almost beyond comprehension for a lot of Venezuelans, among.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

His hardcore supporters and also amongst the hardcore opposition, they just couldn't accept almost that he could die. He was such a huge figure in Venezuela. He was a colossus. He sucked up all the oxygen, had done so for. For nigh on two decades.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

It was this sense of, no, what are you talking, no, you're gonna come back. It's gonna be okay. How could we imagine a future? Chavizo de la Chavez at the helm.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

But a few months later.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

The provocative.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

And unpredictable strongman of Venezuela has died.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Chavez died.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

The streets are filled with mourners.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

The crowds have stretched over a mile across the Venezuelan capital of Caracas as the country says its final farewell to the President.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

Hugo Chavez leaves behind a divided nation and a country in the grip of.

[Marie Arana (Author/Biographer)]

A deepening political crisis.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

The Venezuela Chavez left behind was about to enter a really dark time, and his economic policies of the previous decade or so were to blame.

[Jennifer McCoy (Political Science Professor)]

Mismanagement opened up the door to a huge amount of corruption and also hurt the private sector, mainly the oil sector. He destroyed institutions, but did not do a good job at recreating institutions. And this is what people often say about revolutionaries. You have a disruptive leader coming in. They can destroy things in the name of change. But the same leader is not the one who can necessarily rebuild.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

He also left behind an almost mythical legacy, making it hard for anyone to follow in his footsteps. And when we look at what's happening in Venezuela today, we can see the shadow of Chavez looming just as Bolivar's has loomed over the country for centuries.

[Historian/Expert Commentator]

One of the great paradoxes that are parallel to Bolivar is that there is no succession. No one can fill Bolivar's shoes, just as no one can fill Chavez's shoes. In the, you know, in the common parlance of Venezuela's, you know, popular lingo, Chavez has un porta aviones. He's an aircraft carrier. He carries everything within it, right? And so what happens when the aircraft carrier is no longer there? All those planes collapse to the, to the ocean, right? And so he's understood by both foes and friends alike as irreplaceable.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

That's it for this week's show. I'm Ramtin Arablouei.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

I'm Rundhandel Fatah and you've been listening to Throughline from npr.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

This episode was made by me and.

[Rory Carroll (Journalist)]

Me and Jamie York, Jordana Hochman, Lawrence.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Wu, Smizing Summer n' Jeri Eaton. Original music was produced by Ramtin and his band Drop Electric.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Thanks also to Anya Grundmann, Bryn Winterbottom.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

Dee Dee Skanke and Federico Guerre for being the voice of Simon Bolivar.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

If you liked the episode, please write [e-mail] thanks for listening.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer 2]

This message comes from NPR's sponsor, Odoo Business Management Software. Some say Odoo is like fertilizer because it promotes growth. Others say it's a magic beanstalk scaling with efficiency. Odoo exactly what a business needs. Sign up today at o d o.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

O.Com Want to get strong in 2026? Turns out you don't need to spend hours at the gym every week, even.

[Ramtin Arablouei (Host)]

Just one session, 30 to 45 minutes a week, doing about one or two sets per exercise that can be quite effective.

[Rundhandel Fatah (Host)]

How to get started with strength training this week on the Life Kit podcast. Listen in the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts. Are you thinking about making any changes in the new year? The Life Kit Podcast is here to help. In each episode, we have research backed strategies and expert advice on everything from meal prep to strengthening relationships to paying down your credit card debt. Make your resolutions stick. Listen to the Life Kit podcast on the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.