Jayden Daniels’ Rise, Josh Allen’s Time, NFL Rule Changes & Patrick Renna’s Sandlot Memories!

Summary

Podcast Summary: Throwbacks with Matt Leinart & Jerry Ferrara

Episode Title: Jayden Daniels’ Rise, Josh Allen’s Time, NFL Rule Changes & Patrick Renna’s Sandlot Memories!
Release Date: January 23, 2025

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I. Introduction and Super Bowl Announcement

The episode kicks off with Patrick Renna reminiscing about his Hollywood audition experiences, revealing that he auditioned for the role of Turtle in the iconic TV series Entourage.

• Patrick Renna [00:00]: "I auditioned for Turtle. Did you know that?"
• Matt Leinart [00:08]: "Oh, no, I did not know that. Oh, damn. You would have been a good Turtle."

Matt and Jerry humorously discuss the logistics of recording the show, highlighting their busy lives and the challenges of keeping up with group communications.

• Matt [00:37]: "We were gonna record starting a few moments ago. I was late."
• Jerry [01:13]: "We just. People are soft."

Amidst the lighthearted banter, Matt delivers exciting news:

• Matt [01:46]: "Matt going to the Super Bowl, baby. Dude, we're going."
• Jerry [02:23]: "Throwback show is going to the Super Bowl. Are we just spilling the tea?"

They announce that Throwbacks will be broadcasting live from the Fanatics Red Carpet in New Orleans during Super Bowl week.

• Matt [03:10]: "We're going to be live from the Fanatics Red Carpet... So if you're subscribed and follow any of those platforms, you'll be able to watch."
• Jerry [03:37]: "Which by the way, pretty damn cool."

II. Jayden Daniels' Rise and NFL Discussions

The conversation shifts to the impressive performance of rookie quarterback Jayden Daniels amidst an exceptional quarterback class featuring Caleb Williams, Bo Nix, and Michael Penix Jr.

• Jerry [07:31]: "Jaden Daniels is the best rookie quarterback we've ever seen."
• Matt [12:49]: "He's been playing this way most of the year."

Matt elaborates on Daniels' consistent performance, comparing his poise and confidence to seasoned quarterbacks like Andrew Luck and Ben Roethlisberger.

• Matt [13:49]: "He just controls the game, almost like a great point guard."
• Jerry [15:22]: "Jaden Daniels is a top five quarterback in the league right now."

They discuss the potential impact of Daniels on his team’s prospects, including the possibility of challenging veteran quarterbacks like Josh Allen.

III. Favorite Sports Movies and Patrick Renna

The conversation delves into beloved sports movies from the '90s, with a special emphasis on The Sandlot.

• Matt [06:31]: "They cast a wide net... But at one time, it was... it's our showrunner, Doug Allen, who was like, no, it's got to be New York."
• Jerry [84:04]: "Rookie of the Year, Little Giants, Mighty Ducks were all fantastic."

Patrick Renna shares behind-the-scenes anecdotes from filming The Sandlot, highlighting memorable scenes and interactions with co-stars.

• Patrick Renna [63:52]: "That pool scene was pretty fun to shoot... I was doing the thing."
• Matt [76:14]: "That scene with me and Phillips on the sandlot was originally written for Benny."

IV. NFL Draft and Rule Changes

Matt and Jerry engage in a lively debate about the NFL draft system, advocating for a lottery system similar to the NBA to address the competitive balance among teams.

• Matt [17:59]: "I just think that if the NFL had a lottery system, it would take away this bizarre debate we're starting to get into."
• Jerry [20:48]: "It just doesn't have the same type of impact in the NFL that it does in the NBA."

They argue that a lottery would fairly distribute top picks among the five struggling teams—the Titans, Raiders, Giants, Patriots, and Browns—enhancing the league's competitiveness.

• Matt [18:29]: "Yes, but lottery. [...] It goes yes, the top."
• Jerry [21:06]: "I don't mind tanking, but it's just not a thing in the NFL."

V. Super Bowl Matchup Discussion

The hosts analyze the upcoming Super Bowl matchup between the Kansas City Chiefs and the Buffalo Bills, focusing on key players like Josh Allen and Patrick Mahomes.

• Jerry [30:50]: "This is Josh Allen's time, right? He just needs to win."
• Matt [32:13]: "It's the ultimate test because we know how hostile Philly's going to be."

They discuss the Chiefs' strengths, including Travis Kelce and Andy Reid, and the Bills' resilience and Josh Allen's growing legacy.

• Jerry [30:52]: "Their Chiefs defense is nice this year."
• Matt [32:13]: "It's the ultimate test... But I'm not trying to bring it back to the Giants here."

VI. Dynamic Duos

In a segment sponsored by Wendy's, Matt and Jerry discuss their favorite current sports broadcast teams, giving shout-outs to renowned commentators.

• Jerry [42:05]: "I'll give just a quick honorable mention to RJ and Mike Breen."
• Matt [44:07]: "Mike Breen has the best sports saying word 'bang.'"

They highlight broadcasters like Gus Johnson, Joel Klatt, Mike Breen, and Greg Olsen, praising their commentary styles and contributions to sports broadcasting.

• Jerry [43:43]: "Gus would be a great guest."
• Matt [44:15]: "He's done it."

VII. Guest: Patrick Renna - Sandlot Memories and Book Q&A

Patrick Renna joins the show to discuss his experiences filming The Sandlot, his upcoming book, and his life beyond acting.

• Patrick Renna [48:05]: "I have a book coming out... 'A Little Slugger's Guide to the Unwritten Rules of Baseball and Life.'"
• Matt [50:36]: "What's your golf obsession like these days?"

Renna shares stories from the set, including interactions with co-stars and the process of writing his book, which intertwines sports lessons with life insights.

• Patrick Renna [60:23]: "I've been playing golf for like 20, 30 years... but I did it. I've been playing for like 20, 30 years or something."

He emphasizes the parallels between sports and life, discussing how experiences on the field translate to personal growth.

• Patrick Renna [80:10]: "The process actually was really cool... sports and life are kind of one and the same."

VIII. Closing Remarks

As the episode wraps up, Matt and Jerry continue their nostalgic discussions about The Sandlot, share personal anecdotes, and tease future content.

• Matt [90:09]: "We gotta get a listener involved, too. Peace."
• Jerry [90:23]: "Thank you, man. Appreciate you coming on, buddy."

They reaffirm their Super Bowl plans, encourage listeners to follow their live broadcasts, and express excitement for the upcoming events and guest appearances.

• Matt [93:12]: "Look for the book again, but also look for... February 8th."
• Jerry [94:23]: "Peace."

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Notable Quotes:

• Patrick Renna [00:00]: "I auditioned for Turtle. Did you know that?"
• Matt Leinart [01:46]: "Matt going to the Super Bowl, baby. Dude, we're going."
• Jerry Ferrara [06:31]: "Jaden Daniels is the best rookie quarterback we've ever seen."
• Matt Leinart [17:59]: "I just think that if the NFL had a lottery system, it would take away this bizarre debate we're starting to get into."
• Jerry Ferrara [30:50]: "This is Josh Allen's time, right? He just needs to win."
• Patrick Renna [48:05]: "I have a book coming out... 'A Little Slugger's Guide to the Unwritten Rules of Baseball and Life.'"
• Matt Leinart [90:09]: "We gotta get a listener involved, too. Peace."

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Conclusion:

In this episode of Throwbacks with Matt Leinart & Jerry Ferrara, listeners are treated to a blend of nostalgic reflections, insightful sports analysis, and engaging conversations with guest Patrick Renna. From the rise of rookie quarterbacks to the magic of '90s sports movies, Matt and Jerry deliver a rich and entertaining discussion that captures the essence of both their sports and entertainment backgrounds. The upcoming live broadcast from the Super Bowl Red Carpet promises to add an exciting dimension to their already dynamic show.

Transcript

[Patrick Rena]

It was only until I got older that I started to live the weird Hollywood audition life. But I'm a huge Entourage fan and I auditioned for Turtle. Did you know that?

[Matt]

Oh, no, I did not know that. Oh, damn. You would have been a good Turtle. All right, welcome to another episode of Throwbacks. My co host laughing at me right now. I wish people.

[Jerry]

I wish people could just see your face right now. Actually, they can't.

[Matt]

Well, really quick.

[Jerry]

What's going on, buddy?

[Matt]

We meet every week about this show where we have. I guess this is like the realization that I'm just an old ass man. I cannot keep up with the group chat and the emails and everything that comes in. We were gonna record starting a few moments ago. I was late. You text me like, where are you? I was upstairs preparing lunch for myself because I haven't eate all day not realizing we were supposed to start 10 minutes ago because I missed the text that you.

[Jerry]

And then you. And then you come on, just fuming right now. I'm feel it. Like, what. What else is going on? Dude, do you need a hug? Do you. You know, you know me, man. I'm your number one therapist.

[Matt]

All right, I'm going to tell you what's going on and then we got to tell the audience something else that's going on. But my kids are home from school because it's too cold outside. I grew up in New York City. Never did they cancel school because it's too cold outside.

[Jerry]

We just. We're just like. We just. People are soft.

[Matt]

Get me out of here, man. So anyway, come back. Kids have been home since like Thursday of last week because in Cleveland, it's too cold outside.

[Jerry]

Never tell you the greatest. The greatest day on the. On the calendar is the day the kids go back to school.

[Matt]

Well, listen, really is all kidding aside, though, there is a good update that I have been paying much attention to and has taken a lot of my focus and your focus because Matt going to the super bowl, baby. Dude, we're going.

[Jerry]

We're going. Throwback show is going to the Super Bowl. Are we just spilling the tea? We're spilling the tea right now.

[Matt]

I think we're spilling the tea right now. We are gonna be doing a live show. It's like a combination episode combination. We're just live from the red carpet at not just any party. The party of super bowl week and weekend. The fanatics.

[Jerry]

Party fanatics, red carpet, a list everywhere. Athletes, entertainers, music, actors, obviously shout out to Michael Rubin, who, you know, who allowed us to be on There. It's going to be exciting, man. Like I go to the super bowl every year for the most part, right. Just either have appearances or stuff or just go as a casual fan and hang out with friends. It's a fun weekend. Obviously if you haven't gone, it's an incredible weekend. But to be able to do this right. We just launched a show what three, four months ago and now to have the opportunity to go on the red carpet and just do our thing together for throwbacks, meeting all the cool people shooting the shit, like it's going to be an experience. I'm super pumped and dude, it can't, can't come soon enough.

[Matt]

So everything you need to know, we're going to be live from the fanatics red carpet. We're going to be live on our YouTube channel, Throwback show as well as our Twitter X account, Instagram, Facebook, everything is at Throwback Show. So if you're subscribed and follow following any of those platforms, you'll be able to watch. So we're basically going to be like your guides, your Sherpas to the best party of the week weekend. And also we get to then go in the party after we do our.

[Jerry]

Which by the way, pretty damn cool.

[Matt]

Can't say we'll be live, but we'll definitely bring you some videos and we'll be posting some stuff from inside the party because your boy's gonna need a drink after this, right?

[Jerry]

Yeah. Saturday, February 8th, 3:30pm Eastern. Yeah, I think we go live, right? 2:30, we go live Central Time, 12:30 Pacific, depending where you're at. And again, like Jerry, like you said, I think it's just, it's just going to be fun, man. Like, like there's. I'm excited, I would say like I'm excited to see so and so. You know, we don't know yet who's coming, but if you just look at pictures of past parties, it's going to be pretty fun.

[Matt]

Yeah. And my goal is like I, I don't want to do the who's gonna win the big game. I, I mean I'm sure we're gonna keep like, yeah, give me a, give.

[Jerry]

Me, give me a. Well, depending on who we get, like give me a prediction what's the over.

[Matt]

Under of how many times if we, if we talk to 50 people, what's the over under of one of us? Probably me going, so who do you like this weekend is the over ten and a half.

[Jerry]

Yeah, we'll, we'll set that number for sure. 10 and a half. Yeah, but no, that's exciting, man. Yeah, we're. And then we're gonna, we're gonna be do. We're gonna be together. We're gonna do some stuff throughout the weekend. We're gonna have a lot of opportunity to do some content and just, and just hang out. And again, it's just a fun weekend. So we're excited to be kind of the, the voice, the ears, all that for the fans of the red carpet for fanatics.

[Matt]

And it will be cool to be there with you. I've gone to the Super Bowl a bunch of times and I've been, I have been treated well in the past, but it's just got to be different when you're at the super bowl and you're an athlete, someone who played the actual sport walking or. It's just got to be a little.

[Jerry]

I think it's very similar to you going to. We talk about the Golden Globes a lot. One of the awards, award show. And no matter, like for me, I'm old. I've been retired for 10 years. A lot of these kids were like, a lot of these players now weren't in the league when I was playing. Very few crossovers when I played with like Aaron Rodgers. I mean, only a couple guys back in the day, but it is, it is, it is a small community when you think about it. And so when I go there, you just, you just reconnect with a lot of people that you played with. You reconnect with younger guys, coaches, all that. And it's always like, it always, it's always good because it's like, man, like I, I still, I don't really think of myself as a football player anymore, you know, because it's just so far removed. But when you get back in that environment and you see so many people that you know or you cross paths with over the last 20 years, like it just makes you, you know, it's like, this is cool, man. Like, this is a great fraternity to be a part of.

[Matt]

You just reminded me of a fun story that I'm going to tell in one second, but also coming up on the show in a little while, this is a fun one for Matt and I, cuz we're, we're 90s kids. I'm a little older than Matt, but we came up watching the same movies. We got Patrick Rena joining us a little later. For those of you who don't know him by Patrick Rena, I hate to do this as someone who's called by a character name over and over again. But he played Hamilton Ham Porter in the Sandlot, which I think is our all time favorite, like sports, kids sports movie. Right. That's up there for me.

[Jerry]

I, I think. Did we do that for throwback? It's, it's, it's probably my number one sports, sports movie of all time.

[Matt]

Yes. And he's got a book coming out. He's got kids himself too. I think he coaches. So we're going to get into all sandlot stuff, but then we're just gonna. He's just a funny dude. Can't wait to talk to him. We're even gonna do our Throwback 3 with him, which our Throwback 3 is going to be in honor of him. Those 90s kids movies. Who are our Throwback 3 favorite characters? I'm gonna, I think we have to relieve him. We have to take the sandlot off the table, I think, don't we?

[Jerry]

Well, I may, I may have a. Honorable I may have a special sandlot character because I just, I want to get his reaction why I'm going to say my character.

[Matt]

So my first quick super bowl story. I. The first Super Bowl I ever went to was Packers, Steelers, Aaron Rodgers, lone Super bowl win in Dallas. Now if you remember Dallas, it snowed and hadn't snowed in Dallas in years. And they were not prepared for the snow. So it was kind of a mess. I was shooting stuff with Max Greenfield for this DirecTV show and this girl I was dating, not Bri, Sorry, this is 2010. It was going well. She was at the super bowl too. Took a left turn. Things didn't go so well at the Super Bowl. Realized that she wasn't Mrs. Ferrara. We kind of ended there at the Super Bowl. And then Sunday morning, my flight wasn't till like 4:00, so I was going to miss the game. So I ran into some friends, one of which happens to own a jet company. And I said, is there anybody on earth leaving Dallas, going back to LA Sunday morning? I, I mean, I'll pay a little. I really don't want to go for 40 grand to fly home. There's no flights home. So you're the, you're the guy that.

[Jerry]

Says, I'll pay a little, knowing that they're not going to take like a couple grand.

[Matt]

Right? But there's no coach flights. Spirit wasn't around. There's zero flights back to la. So I took a shot. If I had to wait for my flight, I'd wait. I took a shot. Everyone in the super bowl selling something. So I get a call saying, yeah, someone's going home at like 9:00 in the morning, Sunday. He's cool. He's. He's the only one on the plane. It's his plane. He's alone. He said, I'll fly you back. I show up to the airport, now they don't tell me who. I'm like, who the. Whose fucking plane is this could be. It could be anybody. I walk on the plane. David Spade. Me and David Spade just do. Just the two of us. By the way, coolest dude ever. We talked for, like, two hours. Back to la. I was back on my couch for the National Anthem, and I never saw that girl again.

[Jerry]

I mean, it was destiny, by the way. There's nothing better. I every. I've only been to one super bowl. As a fan. It was 07.06 or. Oh, seven. It was in Arizona, because I was in Arizona, so I hosted a lot of stuff. And actually it was. Sorry. It was the one with the Giants beat the Patriots.

[Matt]

Oh, that's a good. Yeah, I missed that one.

[Jerry]

So I was at that one in a suite. It's the only super bowl that I've stayed for since then. I've probably been from 07 to 24. I've probably been to 12. Like, week. I've been. I usually go fairly. Every year. I always come back and lay on my couch.

[Matt]

Right. What was the most fun, though? You've had, like, what city provided you the most fun at a Super Bowl?

[Jerry]

Oh, Miami.

[Patrick Rena]

Dude. Dude.

[Matt]

Miami. Oh, of course, of course.

[Jerry]

Miami. The. The super bowl. Miami. It was 06. It was. It was my Monday Night Football game. It was. It was. It was Bears, Colts in the rain. Rex Grossman led him to Super Bowl.

[Matt]

Right.

[Jerry]

That was the year that we played them on Monday Night Football. Yeah. And I remember I was at. Gosh, what's the mansion there? It was like the famous designer's mansion that had parties there.

[Matt]

Versace.

[Jerry]

Versace. The Versace Mansion. I was there with. I remember Fergie. I was hanging out with Fergie.

[Matt]

Very good. She didn't sing the National Anthem, I think.

[Jerry]

I think Scarlett Johansson, she probably remember. She probably remember me.

[Matt]

Oh, I. I hope she's at the red carpet.

[Jerry]

Shout out.

[Matt]

Do you remember, Matt?

[Jerry]

Shout out to Pantera. Sarah, you remember Pantera, sir?

[Matt]

Well, I mean, it was.

[Jerry]

Yeah, so Pantera. Serra's out there. Yeah, I remember. I think Andy Roddick. I mean, I'm just name dropping right now, but I'm just. It was. It was just like one of Those years, it was just all time like it was like I was 24 years old in Miami after my rookie year. It was pretty epic. But yeah, I mean I've had. There's a lot of great super bowl stories. I had a blast at Vegas last year.

[Matt]

Last year I was there eight days.

[Jerry]

Eight days removed from hip surgery.

[Matt]

Some might say the birth of throwbacks. Shout out Eric Wells and Alex Gleitman. The birth of throwbacks happen in Vegas at that Super Bowl. My first conversation I was going to.

[Jerry]

Say because I had nothing to do with that.

[Matt]

It was dinner in Aria super bowl week last year. So that was the birth of throwbacks.

[Jerry]

All right, well speaking of the birth of, you know, talk about the birth of throwbacks at the super bowl, how about the birth of Jaden Daniels? Jerry, like is. Is it the greatest he. I. I'm like, I'm still. I can't say that it's weird because I've been thinking about this a lot. It's like, you know, because there's so much. Caleb Williams went one. Daniels went to this quarterback class, right? It was like the six first rounders. Bo Nix was fantastic this year. I think Michael Penix is going to be great. Like it might. When it's all said, I might be the quarterback class ever, right? If you, if some of these guys start to win playoff games. Super Bowls have art. What is it about Jaden Daniels? Like, I just think he's. I think he's the best rookie quarterback we've ever seen. And Andrew Luck had a great rookie year. Ben Roethlisberger had a great rookie year. RG3 had a great. There's some guys that have been able to take their team to play. I just the maturity and what he's been able to do in one year from the Commanders winning what four games last year. New coach, GM like, like everything new on that team and for him to do this and put this team in this position and I think have a real shot of beating the Eagles this weekend.

[Matt]

Real shot.

[Jerry]

Like it is. It's wild to me how great he has been this year.

[Matt]

Here's my, my opinion on it. I think his. It's. It's so great. It's not even shocking at this point.

[Jerry]

Right.

[Matt]

Like meaning like it's expected.

[Jerry]

Like.

[Matt]

Right. It's one thing to feel like a guy plays well and then gets really, really hot. That that's not what this is. He's been playing this way most of the year. Then he got a little injury setback and then once he kind of Got past that, returned right back to form. It's the poise. It's the confidence when you. And, you know, that's why I almost want to ask you, like, go back to your rookie year. Like, this dude just. It doesn't feel like he's a rookie. I feel like he's been in my life for five years already, you know, And I'm not surprised by what he's doing, even though I should be, because this does not happen often. And he just controls the game, almost like a great point guard, even in the NBA. The tempo, the pace. Just when you think, oh, all right, third and seven, huge play. This moment might be too big for him, he wiggles out of the pocket. It just. It just looks so easy. And we know it's not. And you know it's not. You played the game, so that's what stands out to me. I don't feel like he's. I feel like I've been watching this dude for 5 years already.

[Jerry]

I saw. I saw, like, he came out and said. Talked about the VR training, like, the virtual reality. I don't know if you saw that.

[Matt]

Buy that stock. If you could buy VR quarterback training a lot. Copy that.

[Jerry]

Yeah. There's quarterbacks that have done that. That's been around for a little bit of time now. Not a long time, but a little bit of time. And I think Stanford.

[Matt]

Yes, Dave had that.

[Jerry]

I think it was back in Stanford did that. And I. I'm a. I was always a visual learner. Like, I would take my notes and, you know, you. You kind of study. You memorize the plays and whatever, and you go through them in your head. But, like, I was just visual. I had to see it in practice. I had to see it in a film, whatever. And, like, he spends hours and hours on VR, and it's. And it's. It actually makes a lot of sense because I was reading something where Kingsberry has. Is, like, in his voice notes and gives him the play in the VR. So it's actually his recorded voice. So, like, when you go through that.

[Matt]

Simulating it, and he.

[Jerry]

You're sim. You're a simulator, right? You go through that, and I don't know if you ever done it. I put on VR glasses, and it.

[Matt]

Is like, it's incredible now, but.

[Jerry]

But in a football thing, like, it is literally like your D tackles right here. You're like. You're seeing it like it's a real game, and then, boom, It. They're reacting on the snap. Like, it's like they're getting into their defensive coverages and I was like holy shit. Like that is unbelievable. And if you can master that and do that enough, then when you do in game day and you're just reacting right. Football is all about reacting right pre snap kind of having an understanding of where you want to go with the football and then you have the two or three seconds to react. He's doing it as good as anybody.

[Matt]

In, he has all the time in.

[Jerry]

The world and it's unbelievable. Like I was thinking about Josh Allen, Lamar, obviously Mahomes and he, Mahomes statistically didn't have a great year but look where he's at again. And Joe Burrow, Jaden Daniels a top five quarterback in the league right now. And I, and that, that's not, that's not far fetched but like he's above Herbert to me. He's above a lot of these guys that like we see talent and all that. He's going to be, I don't know. And he's doing it without I think an A list supporting cast. I mean if you really think about it, we've talked about that last week we talked about that with Shady, like who does Josh Allen have, right? Who does, you know, Lamar have? Who like some of these guys have like who does Jaden Daniel? It's not a shot. It's just like, you know, like they're going to start to get dudes because dudes are going to be like I want to go play with that quarterback and have a chance to win a Super bowl. And he's been incredible. I'm excited this weekend. I, I mean Philly's tough. That's obviously a tough matchup, tough pace to play in a great defense. But telling you man, you got to score 35 points to beat them.

[Matt]

It's the ultimate test because we know how hostile Philly's going to be. Yeah, we know now who knows what the weather's going to be. To me, the whole weekend just is just summed up with two teams played really, really well in those conditions. Like the Eagles played really well and the Bills played really well in those conditions. Those might be similar conditions. We don't know. It's. It's the ultimate test. But again, I'm not trying to bring it back to the Giants here, but this is a normal chain reaction that I followed going through my Jaden Daniels experience. I remember you. And we'll talk about really quick like Hard Knocks. Literally Shane's kid was telling them trade up and draft Jaden Daniels. And I'M sure he tried, by the way. I'm sure he tried. It wasn't going to happen. But Tommy DeVito two years ago and I love Tommy DeVito. Great story. Won a very, very pointless game for the Giants. Not pointless for him, not pointless for the players, for the organization and the fans. It was a pointless win for Tommy DeVito and the players playing for contracts and just pride. Very meaningful game of course. And it drops the Giants out of the two slot into whatever they were. I would like to avoid this meaning look at this year. We got the Titans, got the Raiders, Giants, Patriots, who else? Browns. Right. Those are our five poo poo teams. Do you think one of those teams deserves a number one overall pick more than the other? Like were the tight. If the Titans and the Giants played on a neutral field 10 times, do we think it's not 5 and 5? Maybe one team gets the 6 and 4. I you and your hypoth.

[Jerry]

You're in your hypothetical.

[Matt]

What I'm. I'm saying all that to say is.

[Jerry]

Why can't the worst team in the NFL gets the number one pick?

[Matt]

I get it. There's five really, really bad teams that all are worthy of that award. The tie break system is crazy of how they determin layered.

[Jerry]

Yeah, for sure.

[Matt]

It's layered with oh strength of schedule. Why not adopt the one thing that the NBA maybe does better than football. The lottery system. Why not? Why not take those five teams?

[Jerry]

So you're taking, you're saying take the. Because in the lottery in the NBA it's what, 1012.

[Matt]

Yes, but lottery. Yes, it's 1012 but really it's heavily weighted for three team five teams to be in the top three. And then you want to do a lottery. It goes yes, the top.

[Jerry]

The five worst teams in the NFL who. Who get to pick the top five. You want to do a lottery based.

[Matt]

For the number one overall pick? Yes, because I don't see a difference in the Giants, the Raiders, the Titans, the Browns. I don't see a difference. And you see now how quickly you could turn a franchise around. And NBA did it for what? To avoid. Oh, Jacksonville NBA did it to avoid tanking. Right. Andrew Gunling's Philadelphia 76ers won what, 12 games and and got to get the number one pick. We saw it with Wemby. Right. You couldn't just straight.

[Jerry]

But you can't compare. You can't compare the number one picks in the NBA to the number one picks in the NFL and there's only been one or two.

[Matt]

It's close now. Jaden Daniels and Wemby. Wemby has a much brighter future because it's basketball. But look at the, look at what.

[Jerry]

This Number one number one picks in the NFL are far less impactful than the number one picks in the NBA. Far less.

[Matt]

Over with the importance of quarterback now. Yes. Quarterback being the most.

[Jerry]

Yeah, because most number one. Most. Most number one quarterback picks don't pan out.

[Matt]

Right. But when you get that one, that does.

[Jerry]

Okay, but. But I'm saying. Yeah, one. Every, like, think about it. Like we, I mean, think about that. Like, who are the number. Like, I mean, obviously Baker was a number, but just like, it just doesn't happen that often. Whereas in the NBA it's a lot easier. You get WEMBY, you get LeBron, you get, you know, it was Anthony Edwards number one. You get like guys that literally. Because NBA is a lot different. You have five guys.

[Matt]

There's been some NBA whiffs.

[Jerry]

Oh, of course. But I would, I would, I would, I would die on a hill and bet more money that more number one draft picks in the NBA have had a more significant impact for their franchise quicker than number one draft picks for the NFL.

[Matt]

I just think that if, if the NFL had a lottery system, it would take away this bizarre debate we're starting to get into. When we get into week 15, 16, 17 and 18 of like teams going nowhere, why do they need to win this guy. Like, I get the player aspect. The players should not give a about the org in their draft.

[Jerry]

But that's the whole pointer.

[Matt]

But it does matter to the organization. Like, all right, we won three games instead of two. And it's only because this team rested every one of their players. The Bills sent out a second string unit and the Patriots won a game and they lost the number one overall pick. The Bills win the game.

[Jerry]

I think, I mean, yeah, but now, but now you're being so specific. With one week a year, that's like, okay, that just so happened that this, that this, like the Kansas City Chiefs.

[Matt]

Like, think about the content of a lot.

[Jerry]

The Kansas City Chiefs benched their starters. The Broncos beat them. Right. And if the Broncos were to lose that game, that was. The Bengals were getting like, everything was on the line. The Bengals are sitting there like, shit. I'm just saying, like, that happens. Yes, it happens. It happens in all sports. But like, tanking is not a thing in the NFL. It's too hard to do. There's too much that's on the line. I, I don't, I don't Look, I don't mind it. Like, I don't mind.

[Matt]

How fun would it be though? It would be fun.

[Jerry]

It would be fun. I don't mind it. I just don't think it has the same type of impact in the NFL that it does in the NBA. I just, it, it just doesn't in my opinion.

[Matt]

I'll hear you on that. I guess I really just, this is just more sour grapes of Wow. I wish the Giants had the two pick and took Jayden Daniels. And similarly this year I, I'm, I'm glad the players left the Colts out of pride, but I wish we were getting.

[Jerry]

I wish the last four number one picks to go. Trevor Lawrence, Trayvon Walker. You don't even know what team he probably plays on. Bryce. Jacksonville Jaguars, Bryce Young and Caleb Williams. And obviously Caleb's a rookie and had a pretty good year. Trevor Lawrence, I mean he's been paid, but I mean right.

[Matt]

But this even goes for the number two and three pick as well. That's what I'm saying. It's not just number one, it's number two, Jaden Daniels. Number three, Drake May.

[Jerry]

I will say this year, this year, Stroud.

[Matt]

Stroud was going to the T. You.

[Jerry]

Know, by the way, Stroud also rookie years, had a fantastic rookie year last year. I would say like this year more than ever. I don't think people, I'd say people care to be the number one pick in the draft. This is, it's not a, like you have, it's not last year you have Shador Sanders, you have a Cam Ward. Are your quarterbacks who, you know, like I, I just think this year people are going to, to, to stretch to get a player. Whereas last year you had, you know, I mean, God, I didn't even mention JJ McCarthy. Obviously you had four or five guys that just had like first round grades and like, like these are can't miss players. This year it'll be different. So that's why I don't think the Giants like Giants are picking three like you have. You have like Travis Hunters, you have other guys and you might. One of those QBs might fall the three. You just never know, dude.

[Matt]

But I just think it would be awesome. NFL Roger Goodell does not listen to this podcast. You know, that's a fun money making idea. You know it is.

[Jerry]

Again, you're speaking from a fan.

[Matt]

Imagine doing it at halftime of this weekend's games. Like coming up at halftime of the Bills Chiefs, we're gonna do the NFL lottery. Everyone right now listening to the show is like, wow, that would be fucking.

[Jerry]

You know how they bring like, they'll bring like a former player coach or like in the lottery room, maybe do the same thing.

[Matt]

Maybe they'll bring you for the Arizona Cardinals, Matt. Sitting in for the lottery, Matt. You'll be their good luck charm, bro. You could be their good luck charm. Then you have to go every single year.

[Jerry]

That would be funny.

[Matt]

Anyway, that's how I thought of J.

[Jerry]

Last on that list.

[Matt]

The point of this whole thing is, God, it would be fun to have Jaden Daniels on my favorite team. He's awesome. Congrats. I mean, and I really do give them a really, really good chance. So I do too. Did you. None of the teams you ever played for participated in Hard Knocks, right?

[Jerry]

No.

[Matt]

No. Well, you're probably better off because the other thing that jumped out to me, watching Saquon slap his helmet while he's running for touchdowns in snow. And apparently Shady McCoy tweeted gate, called Seiko. I gave him the blueprint to running in the snow. And Phil, even though I saw that.

[Jerry]

Cleats right.

[Matt]

Get your cleats right. We're done with this Hard Knocks front office thing. No team's ever gonna do that ever again. Right? After watching the drama with Joe Shane and Jaden Daniels and J.J. mcCarthy and then Saquon, like, no. T. It's. It's the worst idea of all time, right?

[Jerry]

So, I mean, some, some. Yeah, like when I was playing, I was on teams that were like, absolutely not. Hell no.

[Matt]

How'd you feel as a player if. Oh, man, we're going to be doing. Cameras are going to be everywhere now too. In addition to all the other.

[Jerry]

I mean, gosh, I. If I could put myself back in that, like, I think exposure for your organization sometimes, I think it does. I think I personally, and I'm sure you feel the same as a fan. I love that.

[Matt]

I enjoy watching.

[Jerry]

I love it. I think it's great because I also like, I love people getting a chance to see what we actually go through on a day to day basis. The grind, like the, the mental tool, the good, the bad, all of that stuff. I think it's awesome. I think it's really cool to see. I. But to your point, it's like, I don't think any team really in the NFL like, puts their hand up and says, hey, we'll be the. We'll be the team like we want now. Some do, like, if you're a new coach and like, shit, I want people to see this. Like, I believe in myself. Like, we're up. Like. Like it does have its benefits. But. But, yeah, I mean, but. But again we, like imagine if Saquon just didn't have the year he had then, you know, or like we wouldn't be talking about that moment. But God, that moment just sticks out with your kids.

[Matt]

So for me, as much as I enjoyed watching that and I love front office stuff and I like to pretend to be a GM, it's just what Biggie said in the 10 crack commandments, never let them know your next move even though the moves already happen. That's why I love Leon Rose with the Knicks. Everyone's so mad. Leon Rose doesn't do interviews, doesn't do press, doesn't talk. The fan, the fans feel some kind of. Let us know the plan. No, no, no.

[Jerry]

You'll know the plan when. When I tell you the plan.

[Matt]

Yeah, fun show, but I think we could say RIP to Hard Knocks front office. I can't imagine another team doing that. So right now at Wendy's, you can get two of these favorite items for just seven bucks. But not just any two. I told you favorite items and I meant it. Nothing snack sized around here.

[Jerry]

Choose from our OG Spicy or classic chicken sandwich, Dave's single or ten piece nugs. Any way you like them. Spicy or crispy. Three fantastic options. But here comes the hard part. Jerry choosing two.

[Matt]

So what do you do? You can go for a spicy chicken sandwich and a Dave single. Perhaps double the spice with the spicy chicken sandwich and a spicy 10 piece nug. Or you could go for the choice you forgot you could make but in an instant changes everything. Two ten piece nugs? Yep, I know. It's crazy, right? But two of your favorite items for seven bucks gotta be Wendy's.

[Jerry]

Limited time only. US Price and participation may vary. Select a request two for seven dollars. Deal to obtain a discount. It's not valid for a la carte or combo meal orders individual items at regular price exclude saucy nugs. Prices may be higher in Alaska and Hawaii.

[Matt]

The Apple Watch Series 10 is here. It has the biggest display ever. It's also the thinnest Apple Watch ever, making it even more comfortable on your wrist whether you're running, swimming or sleeping. And it's the fastest charging Apple Watch, getting you 8 hours of charge in just 15 minutes. The Apple Watch Series 10 available for the first time in glossy jet black aluminum. Compared to previous generations. IPhone XS are later required. Charge time and actual results will vary. Flex your business with an American Express Business Gold card. You'll earn four times Membership Rewards points on your top two eligible spending categories like transit and electronics each month on up to 150k in combined purchases per year. Plus, you can now earn 3 times Membership Rewards points on flights and prepaid hotels booked on amextravel.com terms and points cap apply learn more at american express.com business gold amex business gold Built for business by American Express Matt, I want to talk to you about Sunday, 6:30pm Eastern in a little place we call Kansas City. Bill's Chiefs is as much as Lamar Ravens Chiefs would have been a lot of fun too. To me this feels, this is it. This feels like the way it was going. It would have been great. Bill's Chiefs as well. I mean Ravens Chiefs as well. But I don't know, I just feel like these two teams have been circling each other all year long every year.

[Jerry]

Which is, I mean, fourth meeting is it, I feel like it's like it's, this is Josh Allen's time, right? It just feels like that. Like I don't know if he loses again because remember, I think the last time they lost, right? That was the last time he marched him down and then the Bills defense couldn't stop Mahomes. Was that the last time they matched it up?

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Jerry]

So 2020 terrific.

[Matt]

2020 AFC championship game Chiefs 38, 24 so they had it handling 2021 AFC divisional round Chiefs 42, bill 36 OT that's the 13 seconds game.

[Jerry]

That's the one that where Josh Allen's bald and bald out. Defense was absolutely terrible.

[Matt]

And then 2023 divisional round Tyler Bass had a field goal to tie it and missed it with a buck 43 left. Game over.

[Jerry]

So I, I, I just think this is like Josh Allen has to win. Like I think you like for your own psyche, confidence as a team. And they're, they've been arguably the best team in football this year outside the Lions obviously. And I don't know man, like, but it's just something about, we talked about last week, something about going on the road to Kansas City and you saw Kansas City last week. It's like, okay, well Travis Kelsey shows up in the playoffs. Mahomes shows up in the playoffs. Andy Reid is a Hall of Fame coach.

[Matt]

Spagnolo is a Hall of Fame decoy.

[Jerry]

Spagnolo is outstanding. Jones is an absolute monster up front. Their Chiefs defense is nice this year. I don't know. I'm, I don't have a, I don't have a dog in the fight. I, I'M rooting for Josh Allen and the Bills just to get to the bowl for him to win one. Because I, I like Josh Allen. But I'm telling you what, man, it is just something about playing up in Kansas City on the road in the playoffs.

[Matt]

Well, also, you know, if for some reason we, we all pretty much knew the Chiefs were probably going to handle business against the Texans, and I know everybody's up in arms with the way Mahomes is officiated. I'm curious to just hear any thoughts you have on. On that, too. I. I don't really see. I mean, I see it. You don't see. I do a little, but like this.

[Jerry]

I mean, Troy. Troy Aikman even called him out during the game, which I thought was great.

[Matt]

And we're gonna, we're gonna talk about maybe Troy in a minute too, when we do our dynamic duos for Wendy's. But what I was going to say, though, is Allen needs Mahomes in this moment. If, you know, he. I'm sure he'd be thrilled to make the super bowl no matter what. Beat the Texans. Beat whoever. Of course. I'm just talking about. I would have already heard the conversations if for some reason the Texans would have upset the Chiefs and then the Bills host Houston and beat. Ah, well, he didn't beat my home. So that's what we do. We poke holes. I don't always do that, but a lot of people do. So to me, this was the way it always has to end.

[Jerry]

This is you, you look at the run. He's. He might, he might be the mvp. We'll find out. He's going to be damn close if he doesn't win it. Look at his path. I mean, he plays. He beats Lamar Jackson, who's. Who may win the mvp. And then you beat Patty Mahomes and then.

[Matt]

And then Jaden Daniels. The best.

[Jerry]

Then we'll see in the Super Bowl. But yeah, I mean, this is, I think as a competitor and as a team, like, sure and Easy. You play who's in front of you. Your path is your path. But like, to be able to beat those guys on this path will only add to the hall of Fame career of Josh Allen that he's already built. Like, it, It's. I'm fired up for this game. Like, this is a game that I will be. I will be one week away from, you know, a week away from having a third baby.

[Matt]

Oh, gosh, kid.

[Jerry]

I will be fucking laid up on that couch watching this game. And I will tell my wife Babe, the kids, they can, they can sleep, right. They can sit right next to me and watch football with daddy because I'm not moving. Like I don't get fired up for a lot of NFL games. This one I'm fired up for. This one I'm fired. I'm excited to watch.

[Matt]

I'm not even going to ask you super bowl picks, but what would be the most fun matchup? Not even saying who should be there. X's and O's taking that take narratives in play and, and styles. What do you think would be the most.

[Jerry]

I think, I mean I think, I think Jaden Daniels by far.

[Matt]

Daniels versus Allen. That's my pick for most fun entertainment.

[Jerry]

Fun entertainment Storyline rookie stud Dan Quinn. Great coach, likable. Like, you know, they don't have a lot of stars on that team. Jaden Daniels is a star, so I think he's electrifying to watch. You can make the same for Eagles with Saquon Barkley. He's electrifying. Like they, you know, they have probably more stars on the team with AJ Brown, Jalen Hurts. I think story of the commanders getting to the super bowl is pretty awesome. And then. Yeah, I just think Josh Allen. I think the Josh Allen is, is a star. The Bills close for years and I think they're due, you know, and, and they have a fun team to watch too. And Josh Allen's just a, I mean you're, you're a cat, you're a die hard Giants fan, but you're, you're, you're an NFL fan.

[Matt]

Oh, I love to watch.

[Jerry]

Those are, those are probably the two most fun two quarterbacks that you just like to sit back and like have a bag of popcorn. Like these two dudes are just like, this is who I want to watch play a football game. Because, because they're a little, they're a little. Josh Allen's a little more reckless, a little more backyard football. He kind of runs around, makes plays. Jane Daniels is so polished for a rookie, but he's electric when he runs like a Lamar Jackson. We'll probably end up getting Eagles Chiefs, but you know.

[Matt]

Right. Well, I got two things for you too. I was trolling my nephew the whole game because, you know, he's the biggest Josh out, I think. I think he's the biggest Josh Allen Stan of all time. And that would have been my only fun thing. If the Ravens would have won. I would have just annihilated him. We played each game on Madden and it played out exactly this way. I was the favorite in every game. So I built Eagles and then he beat well he it played out to be Bill's commanders we did not play that game yet but the this past weekend this round it we're four for four and I bet it all four ways that the map so I'm guessing.

[Jerry]

I'm guessing if it's a Bill's commander.

[Matt]

So it's Bill's commanders according to our.

[Jerry]

Math Bills he gets oh yeah, we're.

[Matt]

Gonna play that probably tonight. Maybe we'll stream it. He of course I yeah he's gonna smoke me with the Bills. But yeah and then remember Justin Kroll who we had on a few weeks ago who said he had a bank account, A separate bank account with super bowl money. I have not texted him yet. Cuz he was giving him yeah I'm giving him a week. I'm giving him a I feel bad.

[Jerry]

For the Lions man giving up week.

[Matt]

Before I text him, I got a.

[Jerry]

Couple people in my circle of friends, a close friend of ours, she's a die Hard from Detroit Lions fan, like through and through, lived through the pain and it was just I, I, they lost and I immediately thought of her and I was just like I, I think I just text her how we doing?

[Matt]

I, I didn't even text Crow whatever she said back.

[Jerry]

I was like I, I literally felt, I felt her pain. I was like I could I feel it because it was like you only get so many opportunities, man. You know?

[Matt]

So you know what stood out to me with that Lions game? I wanted to ask you about this too. Again. I just did a whole rant about the NFL having a lottery. Maybe I'm dumb. I don't love that the prestigious O.C. and D.C. of A team can take these interviews while their team is on the playoff run. I don't think it's fair. Why? Because you're the Patriots that you are shittier than everybody else. You get to hire your coach. Like I'm sure the Lions are not interviewing replacements. Or maybe they are for Ben Johnson and for Aaron Glenn. Like last week before the game, knowing those guys are going to leave. I'm not saying it affects the outcome of the game in any way, but can we not make a league wide rule? Like, hey, the day after the super bowl, everyone can talk to everyone.

[Jerry]

What I texted our boy Peter Schrager.

[Matt]

What did Trager say?

[Jerry]

So he said they can do it after the playoffs. They just wait until the divisional round because then they do it in person. And the problem is and this is where you don't The. The NFL combine is literally like a week and a half after the Super Bowl. Okay, Maybe in Indy. So we were talking this week. So, like, you're like, it's year round, dude. So, like, the minute the super bowl is over and say, say Ben Johnson's coaching in the super bowl and he. And he's. He's. He's probably lined up that interview. He probably knows he's going to get that job. They won't announce it till after the Super Bowl. He's still coaching the next day. He's in Chicago. He's already gearing up for the combine and. And scouting. It's just like, you just don't have time, dude.

[Matt]

So I understand, but if the Lions win, Ben Johnson's not taking a. Like, if the Lions go to the Super Bowl. The Lions.

[Jerry]

Yeah. Then. Then it's.

[Matt]

Chicago has to wait.

[Jerry]

But. Yeah, but they. They will. But. But I will say this. They will already have done all their interviews and they will know that probably they will hire Ben Johnson the day after the Super Bowl. So they will already know that answer before it's done. Before.

[Matt]

And do you think there's even 1% if it's like a. Hey, Ben's like, all right, I'm in. Don't. We can't announce it yet. Bears are like, all right, it's done. Do. Is there a world where I'm not accusing Ben Johnson? There's any coach. Are they, like, texting, like, oh, here's who I really love. Let's tell the scouts to start looking at blah, blah, blah before it's inked. Because I don't know. See, I know. I don't see. I just don't understand why.

[Jerry]

No, dude, you're. You're pretty. You're. No, dude, you're like, these are professionals. You are locked and loaded to win a Super Bowl.

[Matt]

I get it. That's. That's why I'm like, for the spirit of the game. If it were my team, I would just be a little bit annoyed that, like, because the whole broadcast, too, they're talking about these guys aren't going to be here next year. And then we're seeing, like, Ben Johnson throw. You know, I think it's James Williams and throwing the pass. Like, was he not. He was showing off. I mean, I'm just saying, like, why do we even have to think that, like, this guy's not gonna be here. Let him enjoy this run.

[Jerry]

But they. But everybody. Everybody already knows he's not going to be there, players included. Jared Goff Included, like you. Like these are.

[Matt]

Jared Goff might not be. I'm kidding.

[Jerry]

I think the biggest question is just going to be whether you know who they replace. I mean.

[Matt]

Well, my biggest takeaways.

[Jerry]

Aaron Glenn, I think is Aaron Glenn's going the Jets.

[Matt]

Is that.

[Jerry]

Well, I mean, that's a possibility.

[Matt]

By the time this airs, it might all be done because we're taping this on a. On a Wednesday.

[Jerry]

So I, I will say this. I think the Lions. I think the Lions are going to be okay. It's a. It's a big hire, obviously, to get those guys. There's a lot of great candidates. The Lions had arguably the most unlucky run of injuries we have ever seen.

[Matt]

It was horrendous.

[Jerry]

I mean, defensively. I mean, how many start. So it lost.

[Matt]

Defensive player of the year, probably they.

[Jerry]

Lost by seven or eight starters, I think all year. Like, like the whole, like. So they were kind of playing with house money in the playoff. Playoff is a different beast. You run into a team like the Commanders, all of a sudden your defense, like, you have to score 40 points to win. That's tough to do. So it's not a cop out for the Lions. Like, it just sucks. But to get to where they at with all those injuries, Lions like, like the Lions still have a window because I think they have. Most of their core is back on both sides of the ball. They're not going to go through the same injury bug next year. It's. It's almost just impossible to do that. So the Lions are going to be around, man. Lions are going to. Lions are going to be. Dan Campbell's a hell of a coach. He's got that place going. They're going to be around. They got a good nucleus of players, but that was just absolutely heartbreaking.

[Matt]

We're going to do dynamic duos in a sec, duos in a second. But so, yeah, my big takeaways. If I had any power, it would be NFL lottery and coaches can't do zoom interviews or any interviews until the day after the Super Bowl. I would etch that in stone and it would be. We'd all be better off for it. You know I'm right. You won't admit it. You might like it. You like it.

[Jerry]

You might be better off for it. I don't think anyone else really cares.

[Matt]

All right.

[Jerry]

The lottery. You have some. The lottery. I, I kind of. I, I'm kind of. I kind of understand what you're saying now, but let's do dynamic duos.

[Matt]

Dynamic duos. Time for dynamic duos presented by Wendy's. Two faves for just seven bucks. Gotta be Wendy's. Terms apply. Each week, Matt and I, you know, we sort of pick a category. We're gonna name our dynamic duo, whether it's receivers in football or something with, you know, movies, television. This week, I think, because we've mentioned a few already, I think we're gonna do our dynamic duo broadcast teams. And there's been. Some of them have been very vocal, and I think we're gonna keep it current. We're not going to do all time. These are current broadcast duos. Any sport. Matt, who do you got?

[Jerry]

I mean, mine's just going to be so biased, but, I don't know.

[Matt]

Be biased. It's our show. We could do whatever we want.

[Jerry]

Well, I love. I love. I love college football.

[Patrick Rena]

Yes.

[Jerry]

So I'm gonna give my boys, Gus Johnson, Joel Klatt some love.

[Matt]

Love. Can we get Gus Johnson on the show, please?

[Jerry]

Gus would be a great guest.

[Matt]

I want to do a top five Gus Johnson call. And, like, I want him to hear the call, and I want to know what were you think? He's just. No one does it better with, like, 10 seconds.

[Jerry]

Gus has. We could get Gus on the show. Gus would be. Gus. You just be prepared to sit back and just let him go for about an hour.

[Matt]

Sounds good to me. Let the man cook.

[Jerry]

I. I love. You know, there's only a couple voices in college football. I think Gus and Joel do a fantastic job. Obviously, I'm a little biased there, but I love those guys. I'll give just a quick kind of honorable mention. I think Richard Jefferson is calling games with Mike Breen now. Is that right? Because I used to. Yeah, I used to love Breen with. With Van Gundy and Mark Jackson. I enjoyed those calls in the NBA, especially in the playoffs. Van Gundy's a coach now. I think Breen is doing with rj. So I think RJ took kind of. JJ Redick was doing it with Doris Burke and Breen. Now JJ's coaching. RJ kind of took some of that spot. So. And RJ is my boy, so as bald as he is, and. And just knowing him how I do, I'm gonna give a little shout out to rj. And Mike Breen's the best, too.

[Matt]

So Mike Breen, you know, he does the Knicks games as well locally, so he's with Clyde Frazier. But, I mean, Mike Breen has the best sports. Saying word bang. Like, that's. Yeah, he's made.

[Jerry]

He's just iconic.

[Matt]

He's done it.

[Jerry]

Yeah, he's great. I get.

[Patrick Rena]

You know what?

[Jerry]

I'm gonna. I'm gonna real quick. Burkhart and Brady. Okay.

[Matt]

Oh, we're going. He's Zacky.

[Jerry]

I'm gonna say this. Kevin. KB is the best of the best. He does our World Series on Fox. He's filled in for Stone on our show a couple times over the years. Like, KB is a pros. Pro. He's so good. I thought Tom. I. And I'm not just saying this. I thought Tom got better as the year went on, I think. And I believe he's calling the Super Bowl.

[Matt]

Yeah, that is correct. He's calling the Super Bowl.

[Jerry]

I mean, I should know this. It's on Fox, but, like, in year one, which is pretty cool, he had.

[Matt]

Such a good moment with the 12 men on the field. There's 12 men? There's 12.

[Jerry]

He's good. He's giving you enough over and. And you always knew, like, the dude's gonna prep and get better. Like, he just is, because that's his nature. I think he's given us enough to be like, he could be real. I think he could be really great at this if he. If he just sticks with it for as long as he wants to. So I'm gonna shout out Tom and. And KB and then also Greg Olson. I'm just. I'm just throwing in the fuck. They're all great.

[Matt]

Yes, but. And you should be a little biased. I mean, you should. I would be, too, if you asked me about the favorite, best HBO duos. I'm gonna say Turtle and Drama. You know, I'm not gonna say Tony Soprano and Paulie Walnuts for me. Well, real quick, honorable mentions. Kevin Harlan signing with Amazon for the NBA. Iron Eagle for the NBA. They're not paired with anyone yet, but those two are gonna be a force. I love Kevin Harlan, and I got to know his daughter a little bit. Look, and I'm not trying to not be a. I just love what Aikman and Bach are doing, specifically Aikman in the sense of. I do feel like Nansen. Romo got so much early love. And by the way, I haven't seen an audience turn on a broadcaster in a way as quick as they've turned on Romo. I don't quite get it. They've turned on them so quickly. But I feel like Aikman, maybe it's Brady's involved now Romo. I just feel like he's risen to the challenge, and it's like, I'm gonna Say some stuff like, I'm letting it fly. And Joe Buck has one of the best voices. Joe's great for baseball. I love him with baseball, but then with football, obviously.

[Jerry]

Don't you feel. I. I mean, I feel like Aikman. I mean, Aikman's Aikman. Like, he's one of those. He could say whatever he wants. I love calling everyone out, as I've learned. I know. I love that by the way, being in the. Being in media and being in. In what I do, like a studio pre game and analysts, all that I've. I've learned a ton. Right. And I listen. I listen to people differently now because I sure. Maybe like if you're watching actors, you're like, oh, I would have. I would have maybe done that scene.

[Matt]

You're looking at the art of it, like.

[Jerry]

Yeah, I do. I do. I still can separate and enjoy as a fan, but I do look at the art of it. Like who I personally like listening to or who I think talks too much or who I just can't stand and can't. And there's a lot of those dudes. Aikman and Buck are just. There's. They're just, they're. They're pros and they're just easy. Like, I love an easy listen, man. I love to sit back again. I played the game, so I don't need to learn a lot because I understand what's going on. So maybe it's different, but like, it's a very easy listen. I enjoy it. I don't need to turn the volume down. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, I don't know. And they just been doing it for such a long time. And. And to your point, Aikman seems a little more vocal this year.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Jerry]

And I don't know. That's just like, he's kind of. It. I don't care anymore. Or it's just, you know, like, maybe enough's enough with certain things that he's kind of calling it out because he's one of the few people that can call it out and actually have like some credibility. So. Yeah, they're great, man.

[Matt]

Although the, The Brady. The Brady Burke, I mean, that. That's going to be an interesting super bowl. And I, I really. I, I believe. I think it's going to be a good. They're going to be a good broadcast because either way there's going to be a lot. Two good, great quarterbacks regardless. People are down on Jalen Hurts, I think, from that. I mean, I just. Brady Flipping out over the 12 men on the field was awesome.

[Jerry]

It was great.

[Matt]

More of that. Give me more of that. I love it. Well, thank you, Wendy's. That's dynamic duo. Two faves again. Just seven bucks. Gotta be Wendy's. All right, let's bring on the one and only from the sandlot. Patrick Rena. There's only one place you can hear.

[Patrick Rena]

A three time national championship winning head.

[Matt]

Coach, a Heisman trophy winning running back and national champion and someone to keep everything on the tracks every week, coach Urban Meyer, running back Mark Ingram. Than me, Rob Stone. Get into what matters most to you. We take you inside the biggest moments of college football while having some fun bringing you guests from all over sports and entertainment. Watch triple option on YouTube or listen.

[Patrick Rena]

On Apple podcasts, Spotify or wherever you get your podcast.

[Matt]

All right. He starred in one of the greatest sports movies in my opinion ever made as Hamilton Porter in the sandlot. And he returned to baseball movies last year with the release of the film you gotta believe. And next month, which is what I'm excited for, he's got a brand new book coming out. Anyone who writes a book, in my opinion, like, I don't know, I just don't know how you even write a book. But we'll talk to him about that in a minute. Patrick, Rena, thank you for joining us, buddy. Appreciate it.

[Patrick Rena]

Thanks for having me, guys. Thanks for having me. I was looking at Matt's Heisman back there because our fantasy football is a Heisman guy. And I was like, I have one of those. But then I went, oh, no, I don't. That's a real one.

[Jerry]

But I mean, now that we're in fan. Well, one, I'm actually, I think Jerry and I are going to start a fantasy football league next year. And by the way, I mean, let's just throw it out there. Do you want to be our first.

[Matt]

The first member that we invite? Founding father. Even though.

[Patrick Rena]

Let's do it.

[Jerry]

Jerry's a. Jerry's a fantasy football hater. He hates it now, but I convinced him to come back. I'm in like six leagues.

[Patrick Rena]

He's just getting only in one, so I got room.

[Matt]

I'd love to.

[Patrick Rena]

Let's do it.

[Matt]

See, now this is how you get me to stick around. Fantasy Matt. We get Patrick in there. Now we're talking. That's right. I might be down on fantasy, but I'm a golf nerd. Like, I'm trying to get Matt to. To golf and he's going to be one of those, like, annoying like, he just swings a club three times and he's awesome because he's an athlete. He doesn't know the struggle. But I've seen some stuff on your ig. Is golf like a new thing for you? One of the videos you made was hilarious where you pulled your hamstring and went down and just started busting out with some moves. So what's your golf obsession like these days?

[Patrick Rena]

No, golf is actually. I've been doing it a long time.

[Matt]

Oh, okay.

[Patrick Rena]

I just took a break having kids because, like we were just talking about you guys going to the super bowl after Matt has his third. But, but I, my wife, like a whole Sunday, you know, with like me off a whole Sunday is just not happening. Not with young kids now they're starting to get older so they can have friend, you know, friend hangs and things like that. So I've been getting back out there, but I, I did it. I've been playing for like 20, 30 years or something.

[Matt]

Oh, wow.

[Patrick Rena]

I'm not good enough. I. I should be better. But no one.

[Jerry]

What's your, what's your handicap?

[Patrick Rena]

It. Well, it got down to about a 12 or 13, but it's definitely. It's not that right now, that's for sure.

[Matt]

So I already think the force, like we got the three of us, we just need a four. We're getting, we're getting out there in la.

[Jerry]

Do.

[Matt]

You were talking about our kids off the air. We all have young boys on this podcast. It's interesting. Are they playing some sports these days? Like what is their sport? Because it's a tricky thing. My kids, 5 and 3, like, they play, they love it. They're not very good, but it's a chance to just run around with their friends. So I've had to tame some of the coaching dad stuff in me. Where are you at with your kids in sports?

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah, my oldest plays baseball and I just tell them, you guys, you have to play sports. You don't have to be great at it, but you just can't be behind an iPad all day. So yeah, that's the only thing I know to do. And you know, he's. He didn't love baseball for two years, but then he got this great coach and great team and now he. All he wants to do is play baseball, so that's cool. And then my youngest, just the four year old, just started, bought a basketball at the toy store and we've been playing basketball every morning, which funny enough, is actually my, my favorite sport. Like that's the one that I Always. Yeah.

[Matt]

Same here, brother. Same here.

[Patrick Rena]

To watch play. It's probably the only one I'm really halfway decent at.

[Jerry]

I think it's hard like B baseball because I grew up a baseball, a whole baseball family was, it was probably my best sport, pitching until I got hurt. But I think at this age we all have, you know, we're all five, three, four. You have a seven year old. You said baseball is really tough for the first couple years because the game is just, even when you're older, like to watch the game is so slow I think for these kids. Do you, do you coach your other son's basketball team?

[Patrick Rena]

No. Well, no, he hasn't started yet. I coached T ball for my seven year old for two years. But then out, when they get past T ball they actually need real coaches. Right about like in T ball you're just like starfish. Okay, point and throw. Thank you. And then like don't run around and you know, kill everyone. So that's when it started to get real. I stopped.

[Jerry]

Jared, have talked about this all the time. Like what type of coach would you be? I mean you can only imagine Jerry's a New Yorker, right? So he's just like, like the pacing back and forth. Like I don't really like. I coached my 18 year old son who kind of followed in my footsteps. He's going to be a quarterback in college, which is like super cool, like proud dad moment. But I only coached him really in baseball and football. And I've never really been like the yeller and screamer, like, hey, I'm going to put pressure on you. Have always that my dad was like, what type of. I mean I know T ball is kind of different, but I was curious, listen, I mean, are you yelling? Are you yelling at these little rugrats?

[Patrick Rena]

No, no, I don't yell at the kids. I yell at the young slow. I definitely, I got work.

[Matt]

You're working them, you're working them.

[Patrick Rena]

I got some anger management issues that I need to work through on it. I. There was one game, I still kind of feel bad about it, but the my kids team was like the Bad news bears up until halfway and they finally tied a game. They tied. That was the best they could do. And it was the third out. Kid throws a pitch, the other team, he whiffs and the calls game. And then the guy on the pitching goes, no, no, he fouled it. And then the ump goes, oh yeah, he fouled it. So they give him another pitch and then the other team came back and won. And I was so pissed, I was like kicking dirt. They went back and listened to the audio. It's debatable. I don't know.

[Jerry]

I don't know.

[Patrick Rena]

I kind of did hear a little thing. So now I feel bad. But I. I'm the hated guy in the whole league now because I. I went for it.

[Matt]

I. I try to tell myself when that moment comes, first of all, I'll just be happy. If the kids like sports. They don't even have to be that good or anything. It's just. So we have stuff to talk about, Right. I just took them to their first basketball game last, you know, Cavs game. They really loved it. But I think I. I will have more worry about embarrassing them than actually being, like a good coach. So that would be top priority for me as coaching is like, don't embarrass your kids because they'll probably remember that forever.

[Patrick Rena]

For sure. For sure. I mean, it's a great time to be watching the Cavs, though. Damn.

[Matt]

Yeah. Listen, it's. It's not a great time to live in Cleveland because of the freezing cold temperatures, but I. Yeah, like, my kids are Knicks fan. I'm curious, who's your basketball team? Because you're a Boston guy, right?

[Patrick Rena]

I'm from Boston, so.

[Matt]

Celtics.

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah. I mean, I've been in LA a long time.

[Matt]

Say. Yeah, yeah, it's.

[Patrick Rena]

It's terrible. It's sacrilegious to say, but I grew up watching Shaq and Toby.

[Jerry]

Yes, me too, kid.

[Patrick Rena]

I'm like. And he was so nice to me. It won me over, so. But I like the Celtics from the Bird days and stuff, like, you know.

[Matt]

Right.

[Patrick Rena]

Parish, Kevin McHale, I went and watched those guys and I still love the Celtics. And I'm a Boston fan, for sure.

[Matt]

But if it's Lakers, Celtics, like we've seen so many times. You lived in LA a lot longer than Boston, right?

[Patrick Rena]

I know. And it's tough for me because I'm on the phone with my family. The luck. The thing for me is the Patriots was always easy because we had team.

[Jerry]

Yeah.

[Patrick Rena]

And I never. I mean, the Rams is cool now, but it took. It took a few years to catch on.

[Matt]

I still think it's taken. It's still catching on. Yeah.

[Patrick Rena]

It's still a little rough. Yeah.

[Matt]

I look at it like this with basketball, too. For me, as much as I love watching it, I do need football to end before I could fully commit because basketball is. It's not quite as long as baseball, but basketball certainly does drag to the All Star. Break. And then after the All Star break, it kicks off. So for me, I, I'm excited for football also to end because then we get to really nerd out on basketball. My Knicks are finally, finally good. So.

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah, I just watched it perfectly. The All Star break with the end of football.

[Jerry]

I'm just glad you're not a Clippers fan because.

[Patrick Rena]

Oh God, I feel so bad saying this, but it just is like go to another city already.

[Matt]

But where are they going to where.

[Patrick Rena]

They'Re gonna go, have you San Diego's incredible love. San Diego, Great city. They would be so loved there. And honestly, the Chargers need to go back to San Diego. I don't get it. I don't get it.

[Jerry]

Well, they wouldn't build, they wouldn't build the Chargers the new stadium. But I, I was just telling Jared the other day, I actually went to the Intuit Dome, which, which we got invited like, we got. It was, it was really incredible. And I'm, I'm a die hard Laker, so I can't, I've never been a Clippers guy. I do love Ballmer. I love what he's doing. I love the type of owner he is. It was a, it was the best in game experience I've ever seen for like a professional event. Oh, it was if, if you get a chance, like ever take the, the kids or whatever, like it was pretty cool. Just like, I know great owner.

[Patrick Rena]

He's like, like you hate him because they're, you're. But you're like, ah, but they're good owners. They're like, they love the game. They're trying to make it better.

[Jerry]

It's, you know, okay, so my, I'm 41 and so I'm, I'm pumped talking to you. But my, you know, Gosh, man, my 14 year old self is like just fired up and I know I'm sure you talk about sandlot all the time, but that's it. Literally. Jerry and I were talking all week about this and like the greatest sports movie of all time. Maybe in our opinion it's, it's, it's withstand the test of time. It's perfect. My kids, my kids have watched it and they're five and three and a half and you know, we're all in the same like it's pretty much 95% animated movies at this age going back like, and we're talking about this like ham had such iconic, you know, one liners and iconic role. I'm curious because Jerry, I share this all the time about how much of that even though your kid was you or was scripted or was it like improv when you look back?

[Patrick Rena]

So it was kind of like controlled improv. The director of Sandlot wrote it. He actually wrote and directed Radio Flyer, too. You remember that movie?

[Matt]

Yeah, yeah, of course. Wow.

[Patrick Rena]

He got fired as a director halfway through the thing, which is crazy.

[Matt]

Really.

[Patrick Rena]

Then he wrote Sandlot and directed it. I don't know why, but he is a genius. So he. He wrote, directed, and narrated Sandlot. So he was also probably. I don't even know how old he was. We were 13. He was maybe in his 20s. So he's kind of like a big brother to us. But he would let us riff, but sort of guide us. It's almost like Curb youb Enthusiasm, you know, where it's not just a hot mess. But that scene with me talking trash to the other team.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Patrick Rena]

On the other field. On their field. That he had a bullhorn in the dugout and he was just yelling. And it was one take. So we rolled camera for probably 10 minutes. I realized this is back when I was film.

[Matt]

Yeah. So the harder proposition shot.

[Patrick Rena]

So he. He has everyone, you know, rifling through, and he's yelling things for me to say at them. But then he's also cracking me up because he's like. I tell him if his sister was as ugly as you shave, whatever. So I'm like, 13, cracking up, going, really? And he's going, yeah, we're rolling. Go, go, go. So that. I would love to see that outtake. Like that whole. That whole shot. But the improv was sort of like that. The. The. The fight scene before that. It goes to there where they're on our field. That was all written. I mean, he fully wrote it, you know, and we would change things. Like, you're killing me, Smalls was written as you kill me, Smalls. So I sort of, like. I probably didn't come out right that well. So I was like, what about your killing me, Smalls? Or.

[Matt]

I don't know.

[Patrick Rena]

So there are little things that we added, but a lot of it was written.

[Matt]

So look, we. Another thing we talk about on the show because we do talk a lot about sports movies. One of my biggest pet peeves is when you can clear. And no offense to the actor, but you could clearly see they've never either held a bat or a ball or whatever. There's that famous meme. I forget that act. Robbie, whatever his name is, throwing a football. And he's like. He's like a snapback on his release and again, if you never played, that's fine. You might look apart and they cheat around it. But what I always loved about sandlot as a kid who grew up loving baseball is all of you as kids looked like you can play. And you seemed like, you certainly can play.

[Patrick Rena]

It's my biggest pet peeve too, dude. Right.

[Matt]

Like, I mean, a crazy one too.

[Patrick Rena]

Is when someone smokes a cigarette. I'm like, you've never, never smoked a.

[Jerry]

Cigarette in your life?

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah, the. That was. I mean, they didn't. It wasn't like we had to be amazing baseball players to get past, but you definitely couldn't lie your way through it. They had, they had us on the field auditioning, so they, they would hire.

[Matt]

That's what I was going to ask you.

[Patrick Rena]

Hired. Then all the kids were at a baseball field and they said, the director loves you, but you don't have it yet. You got to go play baseball with the kids. Make sure you can play and you get along. I was probably the second best baseball player, so I wasn't worried because I actually did play. And I've always been a moderately athletic guy for five, seven, white dude, you know, like, I'm decent, you know, But Mike Vitar was like, he went on to play college ball, right? And he was amazing. Brandon Adams played pretty well. Chauncey played well. I played well. There was a little bit of a drop off, but everyone knew what they were doing.

[Matt]

Yeah, it sticks out, like. And what, what made it work was, you know, then when you come see Smalls come in, who clearly, I don't know if he was able to play as a young kid, but that's what made it. Any kid out there who felt like, even if they played a little bit. But I remember those days seeing whether it was a basketball court or something, like, wow, those kids, maybe they're a year older, they're really good. I can't play with those guys. So I remember being a little kid when Smalls is like, I'll play. I'm like, what are you doing? You can't play with those kids.

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah, the funny thing is he actually was better.

[Matt]

He was good, right?

[Patrick Rena]

In my opinion, he was the best actor out of all of us. Like, he just was a trained. Like, I had never. That was my first job. So I just was, I was going natural, whatever, you know, just trying to be real. But he was like a trained actor and he. Thank God because he was actually pretty decent at baseball and had to act terrible.

[Matt]

Right?

[Patrick Rena]

A little bit. Like, I remember, I vividly Remember the director working with him on throwing a ball poorly because he was having a hard time doing it because, you know, he was an athletic kid.

[Jerry]

What you said you were 13. 13 or 14 when. That. When you auditioned.

[Patrick Rena]

I was 13 when we filmed at 14 when it came out.

[Jerry]

I mean, maybe you're too young looking back, but, like, when you sign on for that show and you get that role and you're shooting it and you're hanging out with a bunch, probably become some of your good buddies and, like, it's just like, I'm just looking back thinking, like, man, I'm shooting a baseball movie at 14 years old with a bunch of kids. Like, this is. Does it when you're done or while you're shooting it at all, does it, like, say, like, wow, this is going to be pretty special. This was your first job, so maybe you don't know what you don't know, but did you have a feeling? Did you have a feeling? No, no.

[Patrick Rena]

We didn't know it would be this, but we also knew that it was good because you. Even then, you know, they're watching dailies and they're coming back and they're super pumped. And it was my first movie. But you can tell if someone's lying. I mean, I. Movies where they're like, we just saw the Daisy. It's so good.

[Matt]

Yeah, we're in trouble, everybody.

[Patrick Rena]

I can tell. So it was never that people were coming out being like, well, guys, this is. This is good. But it's funny. I. So my first, first job was a Nickelodeon thing that I booked and I went and got like, the Hollywood agent for kids at the time, Judy Savage.

[Matt]

I was with Judy Savage for like three months. Yeah, she dropped me. I love Judy. She had Jessica Biel. That was the big.

[Patrick Rena]

That's right.

[Matt]

Big name back in the day.

[Patrick Rena]

That's right. So she told me, don't be surprised if you don't work for a year or two. And right out the gate I booked this Nickelodeon thing. And then my second audition was the Sandlot. So I'm like, dude, you're crazy. I'm golden.

[Matt]

I'm fire.

[Patrick Rena]

And then I came off of Sandlot and I think I did Son in Law with Paulie Shore that later that year. So I didn't know rejection in the first few years at all. It was only until I got older that I started to live the weird Hollywood audition life. And that. That's a wild life. Like, that's, you know, I mean, I'll turn it around on you guys. I'm a huge, huge. I see Queens Boulevard.

[Matt]

I love that.

[Patrick Rena]

I love that throwback. But I'm a huge Entourage fan, and I auditioned for Turtle. Did you know that?

[Matt]

Oh, no, I did not know that.

[Patrick Rena]

Damn you, New York accent to save my life. I can sort of. I can sort of squeak out a Boston one.

[Matt]

But it was Boston for a while. By the way. Wahlberg wanted the guys to be from Boston. It was our showrunner, Doug Allen, who was like, no, it's got to be New York. So Doug Allen screwed you, dude.

[Jerry]

Imagine if. Oh, my God, I'm talking to two turtles right now.

[Patrick Rena]

It'd be the roles we reverse. Yeah, I lived. I grew up about two blocks from Mark Wahlberg. Yeah, I lived in Dorchester.

[Matt]

Dorchester.

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah.

[Jerry]

Wow. That's crazy.

[Patrick Rena]

But, so it wasn't until then that I started to, you know, audition and not get things and really see what it's like and kind of come down to reality for a few years there. I mean, luckily I still worked consistently and, yeah, only had this job. But, you know, that beginning was weird. It was not like, not. Not a normal beginning in Hollywood, that's for sure.

[Matt]

Well, that. That era, too. I. I do want to ask some more Sandlot stuff, but, like, we. Something else that we talk about, and I rack my brain because that really was the golden age of, like, the youth sports movie. Right. Whether it's Sandlot, Mighty Ducks, Rookie of the Year, it just was this unbelievable run. And then even, like, if you look at the TV side, it was all like, Dawson's Creek and all this. Like, it was geared for teens and, like, young 20s.

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah.

[Matt]

And at some point, it all does go in a shift and it becomes 30 somethings and 40 somethings and it comes back. But the one thing that hasn't come back, and I'm very, very bummed, and I'm curious your take on it. I'm very concerned about sports movies in general because, number one, the documentaries are so good these days. They just are the 30 for 30. All the Netflix docs, they're great and they really happen. But there is something so magical about Sandlot and Mighty Ducks, about that nostalgia that you don't get from docs. Does it ever come back?

[Patrick Rena]

I think Moneyball ruined it. I think Moneyball is too good of a movie.

[Matt]

Right, Right.

[Patrick Rena]

They ruined it. Like, it's. You can't even call that one of those sports movies because it's like, it's a drama. Yeah. It's Oscar worthy. It's not Major League. It's not Sandlot. It's not bad News Bears. It's not. You know, I. I know what you mean. There's something about those late 90s, mid-90s movies they kind of followed on the. Like, all those Sweet 16 movies.

[Matt]

Right.

[Patrick Rena]

You know what I mean? The trend that they sort of had a bunch of those. Those kind of movies and then rolled into the nostalgic sports movies. So we'll see. I. I agree. It'd be great to have another one come out.

[Matt]

Yeah. So what? Go ahead, Matt. Sorry.

[Jerry]

No, go ahead, Go ahead, Go ahead.

[Matt]

No, they say what. What is life like for you, though, when Sandlock comes out? Like, I've seen, you know, through my experience with Entourage, it was such a slow burn, right. From getting the pilot to shooting the pilot. You wait four months, it gets picked up, it airs. Some people kind of watch it. Different experience. Totally. And you were obviously a lot younger. You were a kid. That movie hits theaters, Was it instant or was sandlot like a slower burn, too? That bikini?

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah, it's been a really slow burn because it was a. It was a success in the theaters. It made.

[Matt]

Right. I think.

[Patrick Rena]

I think it made like 40 million. So what is that today? Maybe 100.

[Matt]

Right.

[Patrick Rena]

So you're like, okay, it did well. Cool. Didn't break any records. Wasn't Mighty Ducks, you know, wasn't Home Alone, which came out a year or two before, but people loved it and it did well. Then it left the theaters and it came out on vhs, and I think it started to snowball because people started buying it on vhs.

[Matt]

Yep.

[Patrick Rena]

Then it sort of, you know, DVD came out, kind of started to snowball again, had a resurgence. So that first, like, 10 years, 15 years, it was really popular, and people loved it, and it was a big deal. But then when it hit the 20th anniversary and it started going to the next generation.

[Jerry]

Right.

[Patrick Rena]

I think it really started becoming something. Now I have three generations coming up to me. You know, grandfathers with their kid and their son and their grand. Like, and they've all seen it and love it. And there's something special about, you know, someone came up to me once and was like, thanks for being in our living room for the last 30 years.

[Jerry]

And you're like, oh, that's cool.

[Patrick Rena]

Thank you. You know, so there's something about that longevity, I think, that kind of makes it start being mean more to people. And it's been a slow burn because of that. Like, now it's hit, like, new heights, and it's just crazy.

[Matt]

Yeah, it's iconic. It's in the legendary does your.

[Jerry]

Does your 7. I'm assuming your boys have watched it with you, right?

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah, but it's not the same.

[Jerry]

They don't understand it yet. Right. The magnitude of it.

[Patrick Rena]

Like, I showed him Goonies and he loved it, and that was cool for me. But also realize I've seen Sandlot maybe five to ten times.

[Matt]

Right.

[Patrick Rena]

I don't. I don't like, just. It's not. It's not my sand. My Sandman is goodies or.

[Jerry]

Right, of course.

[Patrick Rena]

So there's so many other shows that I'll show them. I think they get confused because they're like, that guy looks like you. So they're more into the Tick Tock stuff. Like, they'll watch my Tick Tock videos.

[Jerry]

Yeah, I was. Well, I'm glad you mentioned that. I. I was scrolling your Tick Tock because I got on. I'm still trying to get Jerry to grow with Tick Tock, but. You're hilarious, dude. Well, and also, the hamstring thing was a trend. Jerry. Jerry doesn't know about these trains.

[Matt]

I don't know. I did see.

[Jerry]

I saw the one where you were, like, at the signing. Right, the memorabilia signing with all your boys. Yeah. How often do you guys get together? Like, does the group get together? And is it like, time never flew by when you guys are together?

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah, totally. I mean, we're. We're just like, you know, that was sort of like our high school or junior high, you know, high school. So it's kind of like a high school reunion every time we see each other. A lot of them, seven of them, travel more frequently with each other. Because I have young kids, I'll join them once or twice a year. And then Mike Vitar doesn't do any of it. He's a firefighter now, so he actually was front. He was in.

[Jerry]

Oh, wow.

[Matt]

Oh, wow. Really?

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah. I emailed him and checked in on him, and he said, yep, I was in the Palisades. We were fighting it for days. It was, you know, damn tough one. And so he turned into a real hero, you know, so he doesn't. He's kind of like, you know, he kind of quit acting and sort of isn't into the limelight. So he kind of just you know, does his thing. And of course, understandably, you know, so we will. We don't see him much, but.

[Jerry]

How many shows. How many shows do you do? Do you guys do a year when those types of things, like the.

[Matt]

I mean.

[Jerry]

Yeah, autograph stuff.

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah, you can do a lot. And If I was 20 and single and, you know, didn't, you know, like, it didn't matter. I probably would love to hop in a sprinter van and travel the U.S. you know, but married with kids, you're just like, I can't for my family that much. It's.

[Jerry]

Yeah.

[Patrick Rena]

So it's draining and it's a long hour. So I do a couple a year, you know, and it's fun. It's. It's cool. It's cool because you're there to meet people that love it and they're there to meet you. And it's sort of like you didn't just walk out of a hotel room not having coffee or showered and be like, oh, what's up? Like, it's nice because everyone's like, there.

[Matt]

It's organized.

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah, yeah, it's. It. I don't know. It's really special.

[Matt]

You know, one quick thing, because I get asked this a lot and I, I started thinking about it in a different way. I'll get asked from time to time, like, well, what was your. What's your favorite scene in Entourage? Right. And for me, similar to you, I've. I've seen the episodes like a couple of times here. I was not running on a loop in the house. My kids can't watch it. They got another 15 years before they probably can. But when I get asked that question, I, I more go to the place of what was the most fun scene to shoot. Right. Where I'm also thinking about the behind the scenes. You know, I could tell you, like, my favorite scene of sandlot to watch, the one that gave me the feels was the night game under the fourth of July lights. Maybe that's because I'm from Brooklyn. There was no fields lit up, so I thought, wow, what a great idea of how to play a night game. I never played a night baseball game until I was like 17 years old. But for you, take me back for a second. Not even your favorite scene in the movie, but your favorite scene to shoot for whatever the reason of what it meant to you.

[Patrick Rena]

Well, it's funny. I mean, that night scene was fun to shoot for us for sure, because we were doing all day shoots, right? They could only work us eight hours a day, so we got to stay late.

[Matt]

You guys, in De Niro, eight hours a day.

[Patrick Rena]

That's right. That's right. So he. We. That was cool, I would say. I mean, the pool scene was pretty fun to shoot.

[Matt]

You know, that's pretty iconic.

[Patrick Rena]

There are a lot of, you know, lovely, beautiful ladies there. For 13 year old dudes to be checking out Wendy Peppercorn. She only filmed one day. So we were like, oh my God, Marley Shelton's coming today. Well, you know, like, we're all freaking out. I mean, we're 13 year old boys. Like this was the best for us. And so I would say that was fun. It was freezing on that day, so.

[Matt]

That was, of course, of course it.

[Patrick Rena]

Was, it was 100 degrees every other day, but that day it was freezing. I think the, probably the carnival scene, we had a lot of fun.

[Jerry]

Yeah.

[Patrick Rena]

Getting big puke thrown on us and writing carnival rides. And then one of the, you know that the scene with me and Phillips on the sandlot was originally written for Benny Mike Vitor. And that morning the director changed his mind and said, you're gonna do it. So that was a cool experience to, you know, he knocked on my trailer. I opened dramatically, threw the script at me and said, it's yours, kid. Like, you know, some 50s movie. And like walked away. So I remember it like feeling cool, you know, it was an exciting moment.

[Matt]

You were really doing it. You were doing the thing.

[Patrick Rena]

I was doing the thing. So I think he didn't want his hero in Benny to, you know, say all that stuff and it made sense and he's so he probably thought, you know, who could say this stuff is him? So kind of, that, that was an exciting experience.

[Jerry]

Can we. So I literally I, I put in my notes, I have to ask you about Wendy Peppercorn and the pool scene. And you just brought it up the best. I mean, I can only imagine because there's, there's a few like, because we're all kind of the same age. So like that movie, you're a teenager and you think about like there's certain movies and TV shows where you're just like looking back, it's so like, it's kind of so lame. But it's like, oh my gosh, it's like the one, the scenes that you remember. She was there for eight hours. You said that was it one day. How many, how many takes.

[Patrick Rena]

She might have been there two days because there were a few scenes that she did outside of the pool.

[Matt]

Right.

[Patrick Rena]

But we weren't there with her. I remember to seeing the call sheet and it was, I think it was Marty York and maybe Chauncey had this scene with her and we were all jealous because we're like, we have the day off filming with her. And then there's the pool scene. The pool scene though was more than just her too. It was, you know, I Had my whole walk up.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Patrick Rena]

So. And then we're all playing in the pool, and then there's obviously the big scene with her. But, yeah, she came in this beautiful Wendy Peppercorn, and we're all. I think the director pulled us aside before, too, and was like, hey, guys, keep your shit together. So it. You know, he knew. He knew for sure.

[Matt]

That's all. Yeah. I don't know many. I love stories like that where it's like, wow. No one's really done more with one day of work than that.

[Patrick Rena]

Like, you know, that's like Marlon Brando's Superman.

[Matt]

Exactly.

[Patrick Rena]

I mean, it. You're right.

[Matt]

I put it up there.

[Jerry]

We were just watching Landman. Right. Landman's a show out right now with. With Billy Bob Thornton and Ali Larder. And Ali Larder. It's like. And she's terrific. But I think of the whipped cream bikini, like, that. That. That's like. That's like one of those scenes that you just like. And I honestly like Wendy Peffercorn in the. In. And Squint. Right. With Squint was. It gets. It's just amazing, man. And like, every time I watch Landman, I'm like, that is whipped cream bikini. I'm sure she doesn't want to be remembered for that. But, yeah, there's some. Some scenes.

[Patrick Rena]

Such a great career otherwise. And so is Marley Shelton.

[Jerry]

I think they're incredible. Yeah, they're both incredible.

[Patrick Rena]

I can't imagine they don't love it. I mean, every Halloween I see Squints and Wendy. It's the perfect, like, sexy outfit for the lady. And kind of not to involve outfit. Right.

[Matt]

It's gotta find a good pair of glasses.

[Jerry]

Oh, man.

[Matt]

I want to talk to you about your book because, number one, I. I secretly one day would love to write a book, but I don't know. The first. I. I just. I. I just don't think I have the wherewithal to do it. But the title is a little. A Little Slugger's Guide to the Unwritten Rules of Baseball and Life. So it's coming out February 25th. What I love before, without even reading it. It's such a smart move, and I'm curious to read it because your character in the sandlot was dishing out advice left and right, whether it was baseball. Like, he really was the voice in the movie that was trying to help Smalls along the way, but also giving us kids watching just, like, a little bit of knowledge. So what can you tell. Tell us about the book and how did that even come into play for you? Because you got, you know, you're acting, you're producing stuff. Writing a book is no easy task.

[Patrick Rena]

Well, I've been a writer for years. No, just kidding.

[Matt]

You had me. You had me, too.

[Patrick Rena]

I'm like you. And I, you know, I won't say I'm a director because I, you know, I mean, I'd love to direct and I'd love to try it, but, like, I'm not there. I would never say I'm a producer until I've been doing it now for five, six years. So now I can sort of say, yeah, I produce things, you know, But I. Writing is something I've never done, I think. Starting with a. You know, a smaller. It has a lot of pictures. So.

[Matt]

Good.

[Patrick Rena]

Love that get through. But I, you know, the process actually was really cool. I, you know, the senior editor at one of the senior editors at Penguin Random House, kind of, we worked really close together. And this sort of concept of 20 rules about baseball and also life, it sort of. It was kind of easy for me because it started to fall in place and you realize, wow, sports and life are kind of one and the same. Like, life is a game. And, you know, everything in sports, all these lessons, you can sort of just learn them in life. And don't take things too seriously. I mean, in acting, you know, auditions, you gotta leave it at the door. You know, I heard great advice from. Oh, God, I called it. I got Walter in my head now.

[Matt]

But from Breaking Bad, Bryan Cranston. It's funny. I'm doing my, like, annual rewatch of Breaking Bad, right?

[Patrick Rena]

Oh, yeah. He was Walter in that show.

[Matt]

Walter White. Sure.

[Jerry]

Yeah.

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah. So he has this great clip from something, and he just talks about sort of, you know, as an actor, putting your all into an audition, giving it everything you have going into that room, doing it, and the second the door closes, forgetting it, because it's out of your hands now and there's nothing you can do. And you just have to leave it at that. That moment that door goes, you're onto something else. And I just feel like there's so many things with acting in life and baseball and sports in life that it kind of. It was just fun to figure it out and, you know, put it together. So I'm really happy how it turned out. And it was a. It was a great start. I would love to write. I would love to do it more, but I'm like, you. I'm a little nervous. Like, is my vocabulary big?

[Matt]

Right, Right. Do I really have enough to say. I think I do, but do I really have enough to say? Yeah. Well, I'm excited to read it. I look forward to it. February. February 25th, everybody. Matt, should we. Should we ask them do we want to do. Listen, we do this thing every episode. It's the throwback three, right? I don't know.

[Patrick Rena]

I'm stressed out.

[Matt]

Well, we could even give you an option. If you don't. You don't necessarily. Necessarily.

[Jerry]

You can chime in.

[Matt]

You could. You could jump in on ours. But today's category, in honor of you, we're gonna do 90s kid sports movie characters, right? So you technically are a nominee. Although I feel like in honor of you, I. I don't. I don't want to put you on the spot where you have to give all sandlot characters. You could participate with us.

[Patrick Rena]

No, I. I wouldn't. It's top three, right?

[Matt]

It's top three. We're just doing three. And again, these are your. This is not what. Everyone.

[Patrick Rena]

Nicholas be asked who the Mount Rushmore of golf was. And. And he's like. I forget who. He said Ben Hogan was one of them. Someone else. And then he. But everyone. He was like, probably. Blah. Probably.

[Matt]

Right.

[Patrick Rena]

Probably Tiger Woods.

[Jerry]

Yeah, probably.

[Patrick Rena]

And then at the end, though, he goes. And I'd like to join them. A wonderful way of saying, you're on that list.

[Jerry]

You're definitely on that list.

[Matt]

You're definitely on the list, honestly. So I'm gonna say I'll.

[Patrick Rena]

I'll tell you my three when you guys are done, and then I'll finish with. And I'd like to join them.

[Matt]

All right. Matt, would you like to lead off? You want me to lead off?

[Jerry]

You know what? So why don't we do this? Because normally we go back and forth. I'll just give you my three.

[Matt]

Okay, Give me your three.

[Jerry]

And then if you want to chime in on any. So we are. Okay, look, we already talked. I. I had squints on there for the sole purpose of. He has one of the. My favorite scenes of all time of Wendy Peppercorn. We already kind of went into that. We don't have to die. So I'll do these three. I got. Gosh, where am I? Okay. Henry Rowan Gartner.

[Matt]

Yes.

[Jerry]

Rookie.

[Matt]

Rookie of the year, Right?

[Jerry]

One of the best. There was a great run of movies. Yeah. What you say?

[Patrick Rena]

I see him. I. I'll see him at those things. And we talked about going to Chicago and him throwing on a first pitch and me catching it.

[Matt]

Oh, My God. That would probably. That'll be electric.

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah.

[Jerry]

So I got Icebox Becky from Little Giants.

[Matt]

Okay, good one. Really Underrated movie.

[Jerry]

Underrated movie. Great movie, obviously. And then I got Goldberg. Mighty Ducks was one of my favorite. And you also. I mean, I. We didn't even mention the Big Green. You played goalie in the Big Green, which, by the. Great.

[Matt]

Good movie. Good movie.

[Jerry]

Underrated sports movie. One of my. I love that movie. Yeah. So those are my three. I got. I got. I got Squints, honorable mention. I got Henry from Rookie of the Year, Becky, Icebox, and Goldberg from Mighty Ducks. Okay, so.

[Matt]

All right, should I. I'm gonna. I. I as well have Henry Rowan Gartner. I went a different route. And look, by the way, I'm using the same thing as you, Patrick. Like, I. You're on my Mount Rushmore. For the sake of giving people a different look. I'm not putting you on. But you're. You're. You're my. You're my number.

[Patrick Rena]

I'll be the. I'll. I'll be an honorable mention for me. We'll be an honorable mention.

[Matt]

Yeah, we could. We could do a top three just with the sandlot alone. I went Billy Haywood right by the Little Big League. Basically, kid's grandfather dies, he inherits. You know, great, great movie. One of my favorites. And then.

[Patrick Rena]

Wait, what was that? No, that's Angel.

[Matt]

That's Angel.

[Jerry]

That's Angels in the outfield.

[Patrick Rena]

Little Big League is the one where he becomes the manager.

[Matt]

He become. Which to me, because I used to think I was a GM when I was a kid. I still do to this day. I wanted nothing more than to just pretend that I could do that. And look, this is like a different. I'm going with an adult for a second. You mentioned, you know, Little Giants. We got to give a shout out to Rick Moranis. Okay, who played the coach? Who was Ed O'Neill's little brother? I just talk about, like, the underdog. They have the brother verse, brother story. Ed O'Neill's character won the Heisman. Aw. More so for me. That gave people like us Matt, five seven, five foot, nothing. One hundred and nothing. Unlike you, who, when you were 13, were probably six three, £230.

[Jerry]

I was definitely six. I was definitely six three at 13. That's for sure.

[Matt]

So I go a little underdog with. With Rick Moranis as the coach in Little Giants.

[Patrick Rena]

That's a solid one.

[Jerry]

It's okay. It's okay.

[Patrick Rena]

It's okay. You don't like it?

[Jerry]

I mean, he's not.

[Matt]

It's not a kid, by the way.

[Jerry]

It's okay. I. No, listen, I. You thought out of the box a little.

[Matt]

In my alternate life, I was a 90s sports movie kid. Because a lot of people out there, if you see pictures of me early Entourage, were like, wow, Goldberg's playing Turtle on Entourage. We looked a little bit alike.

[Jerry]

I still can't get over the fact that Petra Patrick auditioned for Turtle. That's.

[Matt]

That's been a great, great. If it was Boston, he would have been a great Turtle.

[Patrick Rena]

That would have been it.

[Jerry]

All right, dude, what do you got? You got? I got.

[Patrick Rena]

So I'm. Here's the thing. I'm not a huge Mighty Ducks guy, but I think it's because there's probably some healthy competition going on.

[Matt]

Yeah, sure, sure.

[Patrick Rena]

Like, Brandon Adams is on Mighty Ducks and Sandlot. So whenever the Ducks are around, we'll give him a hard time. Like, who are you gonna go hang out with?

[Matt]

The Ducks. Cool.

[Patrick Rena]

And then Marty, now that he's all jacked up, is like, oh, give me the Ducks.

[Matt]

That's so funny.

[Patrick Rena]

It's pretty great, though. So I will say this from the Ducks. This is my favorite character, and I am going to put him on there. Is Elton Henson.

[Matt]

Yes.

[Jerry]

Oh, yeah.

[Patrick Rena]

Just didn't know what he was doing. I loved that guy. I'm going to put him on there.

[Jerry]

Intimidating. Yeah, he was great.

[Patrick Rena]

I'm going to go Todd Bosley, Jake Berman. I'm looking this up right now, but you know the guy? Yeah, that guy from Little Giants.

[Matt]

I love for sure.

[Patrick Rena]

So those two were really funny. And then I'm gonna do an honorable mention of Willie Mays Hayes. I know it's not kids, but I.

[Matt]

We're here for it, right?

[Patrick Rena]

Like, Major League, I think, is one of my favorite movies.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Jerry]

I think I put that as my top. I think we had that as my.

[Matt]

That was your top. Like grown up sports.

[Jerry]

Yeah, we did grow. We did like, top. Like adult sp sports movies, Major League, and like, White Men can't Jump. Those are like two of my top three of all time.

[Patrick Rena]

And then the third one, I did Dougie Doug from Cool Runnings because, yeah, I was sent. So I was like, hell, yeah.

[Jerry]

I love what an era is. Such an era of how. I mean, before we let you go, man, like, you just spent. How competitive were you guys with Mighty Ducks? I guess Mighty Ducks was probably the biggest franchise.

[Matt]

They were on your corner.

[Patrick Rena]

Yeah. We will mess. We'll mess them up. We'll mess the other Guys up. Devin Sawa and I, we kind of grew up together. And he'll throw jabs at me on Twitter once in a while, and I'll shoot back at him. We tried to start, like, a rock celebrity feud with what. You know, how they do it. It didn't go very far, but we'll mess with each other.

[Matt]

All right, I got a pitch for you then. Okay. And I don't know if this lines up. I don't know who golfs or not, but I would pay good money to watch whatever your foursome is with the sandlot versus whatever the foursome is. And wherever Brandon goes, it's a controversial draft pick. He can go ducks or sandlot. I don't know if the. I mean, I don't know if Josh.

[Jerry]

He may not be a great golf.

[Matt]

So we don't know. But I would pay to watch the sandlot versus it would be good.

[Patrick Rena]

I'm trying to think. I don't think any of those guys golf, which would be terrible.

[Matt]

So you're gonna have to carry the team, but it comes down to you, Patrick.

[Patrick Rena]

Or maybe not. Maybe it's just we put, like, an all star team together, and it's, you know, like, random people against my foursome, and you can be on my foursome, and we'll just go, fake Goldberg.

[Matt]

Fake Goldberg. I'll be fake Goldberg. Dude, you're the best, man. I really gotta say, I'm. I can't wait for the book, but also sound like, you know, you're doing the dad life just like Matt and I. So best you and the fam. Good luck with the book and come back on soon. And let's. Let's play some. Some golf, man. Let's tea.

[Jerry]

Fantasy football, dude. I mean that, by the way, you.

[Patrick Rena]

You got. I mean, I'll. I'll send you guys my info. Yeah, for sure.

[Matt]

All right.

[Jerry]

Thank you, man. Appreciate you. Coming on, buddy.

[Patrick Rena]

All right. Thanks, guys.

[Matt]

What a good dude. And honestly, Matt, I really do think, like, sometimes I'll get asked, like, was there ever any movies you wish you were in or that ones that you auditioned for you didn't get? And I really don't have that. But if I can go back in time, I used to think it was like, Rudy would be a pretty cool. Cool movie to be in because I'm undersized.

[Jerry]

But by the way, you kind of look like you could have played that role. For sure.

[Matt]

That's my Halloween costume every year, too. I just wear a Notre Dame jacket and carry a Bible around. But the sandlot that, that's the one, that's the one as a kid you'd want to be in.

[Jerry]

It is, it's, it's. There's, there's a handful of movies I think from that era, at least from our generation, like they just stand the test of time. Like you could like Home Alone, right? Home Alone is that sandlot. Whether whatever genre category you want to put in sports, drama, like whatever like it, it is just one of the greatest movies I think ever made. And, and I gotta be honest, man, like I don't really, I don't fan on people too much. Like if I see some people, I'm like, wow, that's so and so. Like I, I just like that's one of my favorite movies of all time. So to talk to Patrick with him to come on and like, you know, that was a cool. That was class. I said like my 14 year old self is just pumped right now.

[Matt]

Now because I'm like, well also, I mean, he told us about the heat check of Marley Shelton, which was Wendy Peffer Court. One day you come in for six to eight, eight hours and you now have like a definitive character that'll last a lifetime.

[Jerry]

I mean that scene, all of us in our, in the your 40s and probably 30s, when you think of Home Alone, you, you or excuse me, you think of a sandlot. You think of sandlot and then you're like, oh my gosh. But that pool scene, Wendy Peppercorn, how hot was she back in the day? Like that. Like, my brother has a Wendy Peppercorn shirt. My brother, My brother say tattoo.

[Matt]

That would be.

[Jerry]

He has all, you know, he has all those old, like, you know, they have all the old nostalgics or whatever. Yeah, like nostalgics, like the throwback shirts. He's got a Wendy Pepper Corn shirt. So look, he was great. The fact that he auditioned for Turtle is still mind blowing to me. I guess it's just. That's crazy.

[Matt]

They cast a wide net. They cast a pretty wide net. But at one time, for real, it was. Wahlberg wanted it to be sort of his Boston meatheads and Doug Allen made it New York. But I even want to say maybe Brandon, who we mentioned from Sand, Mighty Ducks, he might have been in the audition room. I remember they looked at lots of people for.

[Jerry]

I always wonder if, you know, like things happen for a reason, right? And obviously you crushed the role. That was your, that you were meant to add that role. But I always wonder when I go back to usc, like if Matt Castle would have won the starting job over me. Like, it was.

[Matt]

It was very sliding doors.

[Jerry]

It was just that stuff. It's like, I wouldn't be doing this. I probably would have never won the Heisman. I might not ever play. I. I don't know. Like, I would have probably transferred, like, things.

[Matt]

I just think about that stuff all the time. Yeah.

[Jerry]

Don't you think about it? I think it's just crazy. Like, it's like all the time, your. Your path is your path and it brings you to a certain point. But I always wonder, like, man, like, what if I didn't win? Or what if you didn't get Turtle for whatever reason? And what if it went to Patrick Rena? Like, it's just, like, it's just. It's just crazy how that happens.

[Matt]

A real big question that we could have fun with if. If we do a trade, would I trade Turtle for Ham? Like, would I go back and would I rap? Like, would I go play Ham or. Well, it's different because entourage was 10 years. Right.

[Jerry]

But, yeah, you were. Yeah.

[Matt]

In terms of iconic, I mean, Hamilton Porter is up there. So shout outs to Patrick Rena. Look for the book again, but also look for. For us February 8th. We said it earlier in the show. 3:30 Eastern, 12:30 Pacific. Follow the Throwbacks YouTube page. Follow us on all socials. We're going to be live from the red carpet of the fanatics party in New Orleans, baby. Can't wait. And then, Matt, I mean, big, big weekend. We talked about it all. So however you're watching, good luck to you this weekend. If you happen to be putting some money on this game like me, the.

[Jerry]

Bills Chase, baby, let's go.

[Matt]

Crushed with that Commander's Eagles like everybody else somewhere too. I mean, God, Saquon Barkley wins the Super Bowl. It's gonna.

[Jerry]

By the way, enjoy. We only got a handful of football games.

[Matt]

No, it's sad.

[Jerry]

Enjoy. We got, what, three games left. Three football games left until next year.

[Matt]

All right, have fun, everybody. Enjoy.

[Jerry]

Picked up a new fantasy football league with a new partner.

[Matt]

That's a good. You know what? Smart by you. We gotta get a listener involved, too. Peace.