The Sigurd Bank Interview with Throwing Fits

Summary

Throwing Fits: The Sigurd Bank Interview

Podcast: Throwing Fits
Date: October 13, 2025
Guest: Sigurd Bank (Founder & Creative Director of MF Pen)
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark

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Episode Overview

In this engaging episode, the Throwing Fits hosts sit down in Copenhagen with Sigurd Bank, the founder and creative director of MF Pen—a Danish menswear brand whose influence and popularity have soared as it approaches its 10th anniversary. With the Fall 2025 collection dropping, Sigurd offers a candid look into his creative process, the DNA and ethos behind MF Pen, and his personal relationship with Copenhagen, the fashion industry, and his own team. Expect laughter, behind-the-scenes stories, sharp insights about brand authenticity, and a celebration of slow, intentional growth over hype.

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Key Topics and Insights

1. Room/Setting Vibes & Fit Check (02:00-21:45)

• The episode opens in a quirky venue: an old post office, now part of MF Pen's building—a setting befitting the brand’s utilitarian, slightly off-kilter vibe.
• Sigurd runs through a detailed “fit check,” revealing his penchant for comfortable footwear (“new MF Pen derby, Spring 26 colorway”—04:04) and lack of rare sneakers, favoring staples like New Balance, Asics, and America’s Cup Pradas (05:10–05:16).
• Explains denim’s role in the brand (“I don't want MF Pen to be a denim brand…”—06:46), naming conventions (“Big Jeans, Bigger Jeans”—07:34), and product naming’s candid, sometimes whimsical process (“Sometimes you just find a word and just have it sound intriguing”—08:38).
• Touches on his layered look, eccentric hat (hand-customized with his daughter’s embroidering, a Yankees logo, and a safety pin—12:21), and the sentimental story of his “wedding shirt,” now an MF Pen sample (10:32).

Notable Quote

“I have a hat and then it has a life...when it starts breathing its own life, I kind of throw it out, get a new hat.”
—Sigurd [11:35]

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2. MF Pen’s Brand Philosophy: Authenticity Over Hype (14:22-26:47)

• Sigurd describes the unique sense of restraint in product categories: why MF Pen doesn’t chase trends in hats, sneakers, or products that don’t feel “true” to the MF Pen DNA (“We don’t have to make it just because we can do more sales”—14:41).
• Insight into MF Pen’s approach to growth and consistency: “The consistency of just doing products that feel like you, instead of chasing every single trend.”—15:39
• Reluctance towards hype-driven marketing or influencer seeding—prefers organic growth and pride in creating clothes his team would actually wear.
• Touches on the challenge of working with deadstock, focus on quality, and aversion to waste.

Notable Quote

“I think the consistency of just doing products that feel like you, instead of chasing every trend, is what makes a brand last.”
—Sigurd [15:39]

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3. Copenhagen Life, Work Culture & Fashion Scene (21:51–38:16)

• MF Pen: a small, close-knit team; Sigurd jokes about spending enough time with them already (22:05).
• On Copenhagen Fashion Week:
  • The low-stakes, community-oriented nature, compared to the business frenzies of Paris: “Paris is where we do our business...Copenhagen is for hanging out.” (24:19)
  • Fashion Week’s role in raising local awareness and creative community-building.
• Discusses why he loves Copenhagen, especially in summer when most leave: “I go camping...I love just like, laying on my couch in the afternoon watching Tour de France, you know?” (29:23)
• The Scandinavian preference for comfort and “hygge,” with Sigurd clarifying the national obsession with coziness (“You can even use the word for sex, I guess”—33:16).

Notable Quote

“Napping at Tour de France is like the prime nap, you know?”
—Sigurd [30:05]

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4. Design Philosophy & Melancholic Elegance (34:49–37:43)

• Sigurd explains the slightly melancholic, understated “vibe” of MF Pen, rooted in his personal taste and the Danish environment.
• Rejects color and “novelty” for their own sake, preferring subtle quirky details like flower rivets or mixed linings.
• Connects the “moodiness” of Scandinavian winters to the emotional sensibility of his clothing.

Notable Quotes

“I want my clothing to kind of, somehow express that, you know, like...melancholic.”
—Sigurd [35:18]
“I like that it’s a bit, somehow, dark in a way.”
—Sigurd [36:20]

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5. Process, Deadstock, and the Problem with Hype (38:38–56:58)

• The joy of deadstock idiosyncrasies: “You can buy another jacket, same jacket from a different store, and [it’s] a slightly different color...one of one.” (40:21)
• Brand is always “team first”—if they wouldn’t wear a piece, it doesn’t make it.
• Discusses influencer culture and MF Pen’s strict policy against seeding, gifting, and paid ads. Responds to DMs personally, but only if the sender actually follows the brand.
• On the fireman jacket hype/“brick” moments: delays and unexpected demand, revealing the unpredictability of what goes viral, and his discomfort with hype (“When something has hype, it gets a little...not dishonest, but a little diluted”—53:41).

Notable Quote

“We never ever paid for any ads...we never did any of that stuff.”
—Sigurd [56:23]

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6. Intentional Growth, Independence & Philosophy of Limitation (61:44–71:53)

• Sigurd breaks down how MF Pen’s growth has always been organic, debt-free, and independent—no investors, no push for unnecessary expansion.
• Candid about the fortunes left “on the table” by not scaling up inventory or chasing maximal distribution. “I would rather have a product selling out than having too much stock.” (67:59)
• Prefers to achieve “inevitable” growth through quality and staying niche.

Notable Quotes

“I never had any debt in the company...never had investors...all fully independent.”
—Sigurd [70:51]
“Growth is not necessarily the end goal.”
—Sigurd [63:49]

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7. Innovation, Mistakes, and Fashion’s Production Side (72:10–76:51)

• Ongoing experiments with treatments, like lasered corduroy, and candid talk about trial and error.
• How factories and laundry houses drive innovation. Funny anecdote about refusing “waterproof jeans” that later turned out to be hazardous (“...two years later...it gives you cancer”—73:55).
• Willingness to “freak” existing techniques (“We took their pattern and then did the punch out...” (76:28)) but always on MF Pen’s terms.

Notable Quote

“No, don't wear waterproof jeans.”
—Sigurd [74:44]

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8. LVMH Prize, Recognition, and Success (76:40–83:32)

• Reflects on being a semi-finalist for the LVMH Prize—felt exhausted by the “circus” of the competition, relieved not to win, and proud of MF Pen’s financial and creative independence.
• Tells stories about Anna Wintour and Jaden Smith visiting the booth: “He just picks out...a blue striped shirt. I was like, dude, it’s a blue striped shirt!” (80:17)
• Teases the use of deadstock Margiela fabrics for a future collection.

Notable Quote

“In all fairness, our stuff is very boring at LVMH Prize...but end of the day, we just want to do very, very good product.”
—Sigurd [81:19]

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9. MF Pen’s 10-Year Anniversary & The Next Decade (83:37–86:45)

• Details on 10-year plans: A collaboration with Japanese label Reproduction of Found (83:57), a New Balance collab using “forgotten fabrics” (84:39–85:49), and a special project in Dover Street Market London.
• A year of “colliding” projects—parties, “small collection,” and anniversary pieces (Magella deadstock-enhanced products).

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10. Music, Food, and Personal Life (92:53–94:52)

• Sigurd’s main personal splurges: food (“three days a week in summer eating out”) and vinyl records (“better to have good stuff than a lot of stuff”—94:32).
• Recaps his hardcore roots: into hardcore shows, bikes around tagging, and maintains a non-corporate personality despite MF Pen’s subtle “corporate” aesthetic (91:03).

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11. Final Thoughts & Constructive Criticism (95:07–97:01)

• When asked for constructive criticism for Throwing Fits, he jokes about the hosts not wearing enough MF Pen and reminisces about a wild New York night together.
• Final plug: “Go buy some MF Pen...Stay tuned for year ten, stay tuned for the next ten years.” (96:48–96:57)

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• "I have a hat and then it has a life...when it starts breathing its own life, I kind of throw it out, get a new hat." [11:35]
• “The consistency of just doing products that feel like you, instead of chasing every single trend, is what makes a brand last.” [15:39]
• "Napping at Tour de France is like the prime nap, you know?" [30:05]
• "I want my clothing to somehow express that, you know, like... melancholic." [35:18]
• “I would rather have a product selling out than having too much stock.” [67:59]
• “No, don't wear waterproof jeans.” [74:44]
• “In all fairness, our stuff is very boring at LVMH Prize...but end of the day, we just want to do very, very good product.” [81:19]

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Useful Timestamps

• Fit Check, Brand DNA, Naming: 02:00–14:06
• Product Restraint & Authentic Growth: 14:22–26:47
• Copenhagen, “Hygge”, and Work Life: 27:27–38:16
• Design Philosophy ("Melancholic" Fashion): 34:49–37:43
• Deadstock & Hype: 38:38–56:58
• Growth & Independence: 61:44–71:53
• Innovation and Production: 72:10–76:51
• Awards & Industry Recognition: 76:40–83:37
• Anniversary Plans: 83:37–86:45
• Personal Life, Hobbies: 92:53–94:52
• Closing Thoughts: 95:07–97:01

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Tone

As always, the Throwing Fits tone is irreverent, jokey, and candid—Sigurd matches the mood with warmth and honesty, adding a Scandinavian self-deprecating wit and humility.

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For New Listeners

This episode provides a deep, personable look into the mind of an independent designer committed to authenticity, sustainability, and slow growth in a hype-driven industry. If you care about how quality, vision, and a sense of self can quietly upend fashion’s rules—and want a peek behind the scenes of contemporary Copenhagen—this one’s for you.

Transcript

[Lawrence]

Morning Zoe Got donuts.

[Jeff Bridges]

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[Lawrence]

Well I dig the mattress and I.

[Sigurd]

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[Lawrence]

Commercial like you teach me.

[Jeff Bridges]

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[Sigurd]

Wow.

[James]

Impressive.

[Lawrence]

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[Jeff Bridges]

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[Sigurd]

You heard them.

[James]

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[Jeff Bridges]

Dude, my work here is done.

[James]

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[Sigurd]

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[James]

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[Jeff Bridges]

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[James]

Our guest this week wears the pants and is graciously hosting us on his home turf of Copenhagen. Like the gregarious Dane that he is, his brand has seemingly exposed exploded in the past few years as it approaches his first decade and his longtime friends and collaborators, there is really only one dude throwing fits wanted to pod with when we Touched down in Cuban haven. His fall 25 collection is on racks now around the world. And here to chat with us about his unwavering vision, experimenting with production techniques and wearing a lot of hats, but seemingly only owning one of them. The founder and creative director of Emma Pen Sigurd Bank. Sigurd, how the hell are you?

[Sigurd]

I'm good, thank you. How are you? Good, man.

[James]

Thanks for setting us in this abandoned kill room of a studio.

[Lawrence]

Saw four, dude.

[James]

Yeah, this really is like some. Some cast and couch, like you were saying.

[Lawrence]

What's normally in here?

[Sigurd]

This used to be an old post office.

[James]

Okay, so what happened? I'm sure it wasn't a lack of Danish taxes.

[Sigurd]

No, no one's sending letters anymore.

[James]

Oh, really?

[Sigurd]

It's emails.

[James]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Lawrence]

Oh, they do that here. You guys have that too? Yeah. Okay, cool. Thanks for having us, dude. Yeah. How's it going? Great to see you.

[Sigurd]

Good to see you.

[James]

Fresh off holiday.

[Sigurd]

Fresh off holiday.

[James]

This is the first thing you did when you got back? Except for what? Just deal with all the production delays?

[Sigurd]

Yeah, yeah. I went to the office this morning.

[Lawrence]

Shoes dropped. Today's Congratulations.

[Sigurd]

Today? Yeah, yeah. We had launch midday.

[James]

Do you ever confuse all the Caspers that work for you?

[Sigurd]

Because they're just all like only two. One with a C and one with a K. Is.

[Lawrence]

Is Casper like the Muhammad of Denmark? Is there just like mad Caspers? Is it a common name?

[Sigurd]

No, no, no. It is a common name, but not. It's up there. I guess.

[James]

You're the only cigared we know and the only cigared we with.

[Lawrence]

Yeah. Let's do a fit check. Dude. What are you wearing today? Is it all MF pen?

[Sigurd]

Almost new shoes, bottom up from the top? Yeah, we start from the bottom. So this is our event derby, which is. He's just released today.

[James]

This fall 25 or this is spring.

[Sigurd]

No. So this colorway is spring 26. Yeah.

[James]

It's your road. You're gear testing it.

[Sigurd]

Yes.

[James]

What's the review so far? Yeah, how are they so far?

[Sigurd]

Yeah, shitty. Do you. No. Very, very comfortable, actually. Yeah. I'm not a boot guy. I'm into shoes and derbies. So, yeah, they're very comfortable.

[James]

Were you ever a sneaker guy or was it always just shoes?

[Sigurd]

No, I wear sneakers.

[James]

Yeah, Danes were like. I don't know if this is factual or not, but I think from where we were sitting in like 2015, it felt like Danes were the first ones to do like S tier Nikes with menswear.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, yeah.

[Lawrence]

The grown man Streetwear look.

[Sigurd]

I, I don't know, maybe from fellow.

[James]

Get from over, from across the pond.

[Lawrence]

Were you wearing rare sneakers? Like, did you with like high end Nikes or rare Nikes?

[Sigurd]

No, I, I, I, I like sneakers mostly for the comfort.

[Lawrence]

Right, okay.

[Sigurd]

But it's, it's, I don't have any rare stuff. I wear my, you know, like New Balance, whatever. Some, some Asics.

[Lawrence]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

And some, I do love the Prada. Prada ones. What's it called?

[Lawrence]

America's Cup.

[Sigurd]

America's Cup. Yeah. I have a few, few pair of that. Oh, like all, all like 50. That. Like what's, what's the, what do you call it? Like all the colorways. Flea markets.

[James]

Oh, okay.

[Sigurd]

All, all 50 flea markets. I got a pair like a pink pair.

[Lawrence]

Oh, sick. For like you gotta wear those, dude.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, I do. Sometimes I'm like, it's like just this one size too small and Are you.

[James]

The, are you the only person Copenhagen wearing pink on that day? You love a neutral.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, yeah.

[James]

Gray, black, gray, black, brown, beige.

[Sigurd]

On a, you know, natural Fridays, maybe. Beige.

[James]

Oh, don't get too crazy with them. Sigurd.

[Lawrence]

Getting cheeky about the socks. Yeah, let's move on up.

[Sigurd]

It's black socks. I don't know. Just like socks. All right. I don't care much.

[James]

How about the pantalones?

[Sigurd]

That's MF Penny.

[James]

The good denim.

[Sigurd]

Denim from SS25.

[James]

How did the denim perform as a category?

[Sigurd]

Really well.

[James]

I feel like it's kind of like sneaky. Sneaky Good.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, it's like, it's, it's for us like we started doing a lot of like tailoring trousers. Yeah. And we had one pair of jeans. Like it's called the big jeans. Like, which was like, like, like it's denim but made as same construction as like, you know, suiting or like depletes. And they used to come creased as well.

[Lawrence]

Oh, nice.

[Sigurd]

Like the problem with the creases was like if the like half an hour wearing them, like, you know, little, little un.

[James]

Detail. Yeah.

[Sigurd]

But yeah. Yeah, so we did those and then was like, I was like, yeah, like, I don't want MF Pen to be a denim brand. So like I, you know, so we're just going to do like special iterations of, of denim. Yeah. And then that kind of stopped that thought and now we're just doing very like, you know, I wouldn't say, you know, like normal denim, but like we just like, hey, you know, like, let's just do some very good denim.

[Lawrence]

The fit is incredible.

[Sigurd]

That's right.

[James]

There's two. Two fits. Right. Straight and a little tailored.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. So we have the, the straight cut and then like we call them. I'm not always that creative. Shut the up. In terms of names.

[Lawrence]

Yeah. Right. You're not copywriter.

[Sigurd]

No, no, no.

[Lawrence]

That's not what people want from you.

[James]

Big jeans.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. At that, that time, like it's 10 years ago, like we released those and they were like.

[James]

I think there's several brands that have used the phrase big jeans to describe their product.

[Sigurd]

Yep. But they were big, so like let's call them big. You know, very literal. And then at one point we also had a bigger one that's called Bigger Jeans. Oh, wow.

[Lawrence]

So biggest is coming soon.

[Sigurd]

No.

[James]

Are you hiring a writer?

[Sigurd]

You know, you know Hugo, right?

[Lawrence]

Yeah, of course.

[Sigurd]

Like, he's. He's doing some of it and like sometimes he asked me like, dude, but what does this mean? Like, I was like. Because we like often we just name the products like from like a thought kind of like. So like we have a jacket like, oh, I imagine like a painter could wear this one or something like that. And then we call it like painter's brush jacket or something like, you know, like just having these.

[Lawrence]

Right.

[Sigurd]

And then, and then a few times I called it like a style. Something where I was like, oh yeah, we have a code coming out now called Accession. And Hugo is like, he's. He's from. From. From London.

[Lawrence]

Right.

[Sigurd]

So he's, he's like native English. And he was like, what does accession mean? Like, I, I don't know, like he's.

[James]

Not even making up words.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, you tell me. Because like you are actually very creative. Sometimes you just find and find a word and just have to sound like, intriguing.

[James]

I like this one. The convenient shirt. Yeah, it's convenient.

[Lawrence]

Mad convenient.

[Sigurd]

No, but.

[James]

Go. Good one.

[Lawrence]

Yeah, that's a.

[James]

Listen, sometimes.

[Sigurd]

A little stitch on the pocket so you can put a pen in there.

[Lawrence]

And like that's the convenience thing.

[Sigurd]

It's. It's convenience, right? Yeah. So that's kind of how we come up with names sometimes. Like, sometimes it has a, like a proper shirt, you know, like the executive shirt. Yeah, just.

[Lawrence]

That's more self explanatory.

[Sigurd]

Just, just like, you know, but it's about the.

[James]

That's the cut, right? It's not like the colorway.

[Sigurd]

No, no, exactly. Like we just like. Because we make like we make too many shirts. So like having to find a name every time, like it's just like we have the cut and then you Know, like the fabric. Y. You know?

[James]

All right, moving on up. Let's talk tops. You got a lot of them on.

[Lawrence]

You're layered up today, bro.

[Sigurd]

Death T shirt.

[James]

Okay. Oh, the.

[Sigurd]

The middle.

[James]

Yeah, the Swedish brand.

[Lawrence]

Inside out.

[Sigurd]

Inside out.

[James]

What about the underneath? Is that a wife beater?

[Sigurd]

Yeah. No, Wife pleaser.

[James]

Wife pleaser.

[Sigurd]

Okay. Just a tank. It's just a random tank.

[James]

What's up with the inside out of the te. Is that. That's an intentional move or is it laundry day?

[Sigurd]

No, it's. It's. I don't know. Like, sometimes they just go inside out.

[James]

It feels like a Scandinavian thing.

[Sigurd]

I don't know. Maybe.

[James]

Seen a lot of it.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

And then.

[Sigurd]

Oh, sorry. What's the belt?

[James]

What's the belt?

[Sigurd]

Belt? This is actually out now as well. Like, it's a. It's. I like that. It's MF Pen belt. It's like a white. Pale. Pale white croc. Yeah. Yeah. So. Yeah.

[James]

And what shirt.

[Sigurd]

Are we matching the shoes?

[James]

What shirt is this on? Is this the. Is this the pod shirt? What is this?

[Sigurd]

Yeah. No.

[Lawrence]

Is that convenient or executive?

[James]

This is.

[Sigurd]

I mean, I don't know.

[James]

I think it's executive, but it is pen.

[Sigurd]

It is pen.

[James]

Hell, yeah.

[Sigurd]

This is actually the shirt I got married in. Oh, yeah.

[Lawrence]

Game worn.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, it's. It's a sample from Ultimate25, so it's releasing.

[James]

You were a sample.

[Lawrence]

So on the two more most important days of your life, your marriage, and.

[Sigurd]

This podcast afternoon before my wedding, I was like, whoa, I need to find out, like, what I'm wearing tomorrow, bro.

[James]

What do you. What else would you wear? A suit?

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, I had a suit on and a tie, and like, all MF Pen was MFN tailoring. Yeah.

[James]

All right. Thank you.

[Sigurd]

So just. I just. I just. No, I was like, like. Because, like, it's something you postpone because it's so close to heart. Consider, like, you know where I think most guys.

[Lawrence]

That's a weird.

[James]

Postpone that until the day before.

[Lawrence]

Yeah. I think it might just be a personal problem with you, dude. You know?

[Sigurd]

Yeah. Maybe.

[Lawrence]

Like, it's so important, I'm gonna put it off as late as possible.

[James]

Did you wear this hat on your wedding day?

[Lawrence]

No.

[James]

Your wife would have killed you.

[Sigurd]

No, I think I've worn it at the party, maybe.

[James]

Okay, sure. Can you. What's the. What's up with this hat?

[Lawrence]

You have one hat?

[James]

It's a signature piece at this point.

[Lawrence]

Like, what is the deal, dude?

[James]

Do you. Is there one hat, or do you like, do you have a.

[Sigurd]

So the thing is, like, I, I have a hat. You do. And then, and then it has a life.

[Lawrence]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

And then when it starts breathing its own life, I kind of, like, throw it out. Get a new hat.

[James]

Okay.

[Lawrence]

How much life is left in this one?

[Sigurd]

Not much.

[James]

And do you, like, customize each one? And, like, you, you cut the brim, you've.

[Sigurd]

No. So, like, so, like, it's actually Hugo, he used to work for Cecil Tolkien's, if you know this brand from, from London. And she actually did it.

[James]

Oh.

[Sigurd]

And this is like, I know, five years ago. And then he came with one of her hats, and I was like, dude, that's sick, yo. And then like, can I do it? And it's like, I guess, you know, like, so I did it to my, to my own. Yeah. And then it's just like, kept on.

[James]

Going and you added a little accoutrement and the flair.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. So this one, this one has the Yankees. Has some embroidery from my daughter and a label. And, like, I just. Yeah. So I put the safety pin on, on the head. Because when we had photo shoots, it's always nice to have a safety pin very close to you. And then it just came on the head, and then it just like, started staying on the head.

[James]

So how many. What are you talking about? One. Had a year?

[Sigurd]

No, no, no. I have, like three, four in rotation.

[James]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

This is my favorite at the moment. Okay.

[James]

Okay. Why don't you do, why don't you guys do hats? Yeah, you can, like, again, it's a signature piece at this point.

[Lawrence]

Short brim, dad cap style.

[Sigurd]

We did, we did a few caps. When was this? Like a year ago. I think Autumn wins are 24.

[Lawrence]

Did you wear them yourself?

[Sigurd]

No, I don't think so. Maybe. I, I think I have one I like. But, you know, like, a cap can be very personal. Personal. Like you, you tend to, I tend to stick with, like, one certainly takes.

[James]

On a very personal smell.

[Lawrence]

But, but she's barking, dude.

[Sigurd]

No, but, like a cigarette scent. I, I, I washed the meal.

[James]

Okay, good. Yeah, that's great.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[Lawrence]

He's not a dirty guy.

[Sigurd]

Not an audience at home. No, he just looks that way. The thing with headwear, like, there's like, a few factories that can actually make them. Well, and it's, it's a lot of times it's, like, not cut. And so, like, you, you, you choose a shape. Yeah. So, like, you know, like, there's the factory in LA that, like, supreme, and everyone is doing it. Like, they do the Five panels and stuff. There's a factory in Portugal that we used to work with, and they do the. Like. They do the legacy hats. They do, like, hats for, like, a. Many, like, European brands. But, like, we wanted to do something like, with a different shape and with headwear. As soon as you start, like, experimenting with the shapes, it gets tricky.

[Lawrence]

Sure.

[Sigurd]

You know, like, because then the brim shape and, like, all these things, and, like, we just wanted to do, like, a lower profile, still have the pointy, blah, blah, blah, and they came out fine, but it's just, like, so much struggle with it.

[Lawrence]

Right.

[Sigurd]

So. And I was like, we don't need to make caps. Like, like, it's. It's not.

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Don't have to be a part of. It's a part of, like, I wear caps every day, but, like, it doesn't have to be a part of the. You know, the collection. We. A lot of times we think about, like, do we make this product because we would, like, is it an MF Pen product, or is it just, like, we can do more sales?

[Lawrence]

Right, Right.

[Sigurd]

You know, I mean, like, it's. It's. And for some reason, I think a cap doesn't feel like that much the MFP and aesthetic.

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Even though I think a lot of our customers wear a cap. I would. But. Doesn't have to be. We don't have to make it just because we.

[James]

What's another. Besides hats, what's another category that you're like, it doesn't feel MF Pen. We don't have to do it. Although it would maybe, you know, boots. The Numbies.

[Sigurd]

I don't know. Like, we. We did some samples on some sneakers. Oh, like. Like, our own sneakers. Like, not. Like. Not traditional sneakers. And I was like, at one point, I was like, nah. You know, like, there's so many brands doing that. Like, of course there's a lot of brands doing, like, leather shoes and, like, Derbies and stuff. But, like, it's.

[Lawrence]

It.

[Sigurd]

It's. It just felt like, are we just chasing something where instead of, like, just, like, staying true to our own, like, narrative and, like, aesthetic that's honest?

[Lawrence]

Because you could just make a quick buck. You could put out a, you know, subpar sneaker, subpar hat that didn't feel like the right DNA and just, like. Like James said, run the numbers up. But, yeah, you're better than that. No, that's why we love you.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. No, but I also think that, like. Like the consistency of just doing products that feel like you, instead of chasing every single trend Chase every single, like, you know, product group, you know.

[James]

What about jewelry? Jewelry is a relatively new endeavor. And are you just continuing with the fit check? Are you wearing Emma Pen Silver?

[Sigurd]

No.

[James]

Okay, what are the brands? We're still in the fit check portion.

[Sigurd]

No. So. So, like, I'm wearing my engagement ring or wedding ring, which my wife gave to me. Like, she proposed to me.

[James]

Oh.

[Sigurd]

It used to have a little rock in there, but, like, I lost it. I. I still have it, but, like, it fell out. It's a bit funky ring.

[James]

You got to reset that hoe.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[James]

Not your wife.

[Sigurd]

The ring. I kind of like. The thing is, like, it's. It's.

[Lawrence]

It's like a weapon.

[Sigurd]

It's. It's like knitwear killer.

[Lawrence]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

Put on, like, pulling all the. Pulling all.

[Lawrence]

Yeah, bro.

[James]

That's how I distress my nits. What's that?

[Sigurd]

And then this is from a employee of mine, like, Jonathan. Okay. He has a brand on the side.

[James]

Jonathan, for you English speakers at home.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, sorry. No, he's actually Swedish. It's his own brand. He has something called Culture 5 Fire. And he's. He's kind of the one in charge of our jewelry in the house. Yeah. So it's a ring I got from him. So we have this Christmas party in the company every Christmas, and we get, like, wasted. And then we have this, like. We have this game where we play. It's called Pagalai.

[James]

How do you play this game? Is it a drink?

[Lawrence]

Explain this ritual.

[Sigurd]

It's like. It's like. It's gifting. Gifting. Okay. So everyone. Everyone brings, like. I think it's like three gifts, like, all wrapped. And then you play with dices. And then you, like. You know, everyone like, picks up. Picks when you, like when you hit, like, a six or something.

[Lawrence]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

So you pick a gift and then. And then everyone is like. So, like, there's always, like, favorites, right? Like, it's a very famous Danish game. Like, everyone already wants the right ones. Like, oh, that's the good one. Like, it's all wrapped up.

[James]

I want the iPhone.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. You know, and then. And then a lot of times, the best gift turns out to be like a. Like, toilet roll. A toilet paper.

[James]

Yeah. Like, don't underestimate that.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, but. But then in the company, like, it's like, we. We. We encourage, like, very creative gifts. So one, one year, he had, like, this sort of gift was very heavy, and there was this, like, you know, like, the finger measurement. Like, there's these, like, where you can miss your fingers. Like, this, like.

[James]

Oh, with the ribs. Yeah.

[Sigurd]

So, like, that was the gift kind of like. And. And the person who wanted got a ring from him.

[James]

Oh, cool.

[Sigurd]

There's this one, but you thought.

[James]

You thought. You thought it was a bar of gold, but instead it was a. Just a way to measure the width.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly.

[James]

Girth your fingies.

[Sigurd]

But yeah. But I also. I have a. Like, I have a candle at the office, which is like goat's head, like skull. Like, as a candle. Like someone like, you know, like that. That was also from the. From that game.

[James]

Very metal.

[Sigurd]

Very metal. People got tattoos and you like handmade tattoos or homemade, you know.

[James]

What was the best gift that you gave?

[Lawrence]

Yeah. What were you bringing?

[Sigurd]

Oh, I don't know. Their.

[James]

Their paychecks.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

Here's two weeks vacation.

[Lawrence]

A gift card to Gasoline Grill.

[James]

A gift card to Emma Pen. That's what the money's for.

[Sigurd]

What. What did I give? I don't know.

[James]

Like, you gave him health insurance.

[Lawrence]

Thoughtful of you.

[Sigurd]

They all. They all get a bonus at Christmas. So, like.

[James]

Okay, so that's.

[Sigurd]

You gave. But that's not in the. That's not in the game.

[Lawrence]

Like, you don't have to roll dice to get your bonus.

[Sigurd]

Oh, sometimes.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[James]

It's like pick two cards. One is a bonus. One is. You're working Christmas Eve.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. What did I bring?

[James]

We'll have to ask the. The MF Pen staff at our dinner later.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. Do they. Yeah.

[James]

And last but not least, the panties.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[James]

Because Emma Pen doesn't do underwear yet.

[Sigurd]

Oh, my underwear?

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Are you asking about my underwear?

[Lawrence]

Yes, sir.

[Sigurd]

Wow. I don't know. Like, I'm. I'm not a. You know, I don't know, like, cdlp.

[James]

That's Swedish, right?

[Sigurd]

It's. It's not branded underwear.

[James]

Okay. Unbranded. You got them. You got them on Pusher Street? No, put your feet shut down.

[Sigurd]

That's why.

[James]

What are you sipping on? Some sparkling water and a nice vase that you brought from. By the way, we're potting in like, a building that houses the MF Pen store. But not the office. No, we're just in an abandoned room.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

But you can somehow meander through these back hallways to the MFEN store.

[Sigurd]

The back rooms, yeah.

[James]

Oh, what are the sunglasses? Real quick?

[Sigurd]

The sunglasses. This is a pair of vintage United colors of Benetton.

[James]

Oh, I never knew they did sunnies.

[Sigurd]

From Made in Italy, but it's. I found them at the. I went to Crete. You say Crete Yeah, not the band. The island.

[Lawrence]

Crete. Not Creed. You got another Creed concert?

[Sigurd]

No. So I went. I went to. To. To Crete with my wife and daughter. And, you know, like, you know, you're on a holiday, you want to find a pair of sunglasses.

[Lawrence]

Sure.

[Sigurd]

Like, even though you have a pair, you're just like, I'm on holiday. I need a pair of sunglasses. Yeah.

[James]

Money isn't real.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly. You know, they are, though, but. And then, you know, like, it's all like, like a lot of these. Like, you know, like, what is a coastal. Like beach cities or like, like towns. Like, it's all like these. Not necessarily fake, but just like random plastics yet. And then I found this random little eyewear store, and then they had like one rail of all of these, like, like 90s, all of this kind of this shape. I was like. And I was like. I had three pairs. Was like, okay, which one I'm gonna choose? And like, since. Since that day I bought that pair, I regret not buying. You're like, why? You know, like, money is. Isn't real, yo.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[James]

So why don't you book a flight back to Crete on a company card as a business expense because you want to use them as a reference or something, you know, Just saying. Yeah, there's ways around this.

[Lawrence]

Just a little hack, dude.

[Sigurd]

No, but I think that's, that's, that's. That's in terms of shopping. That's the. That's the best way. When you find this, like, kind of like the. The back of a store and they have this like, single or something.

[Lawrence]

Old stock.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

All right, let's get into meat and potatoes. Sigurd, the meat and potatoes.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

Because this fit. Check, drink check complete. Throwing fits in MF Pen together. We're hosting a dinner tomorrow night to celebrate the love between New York City and Copenhagen. Who do you not want to sit next to?

[Lawrence]

What?

[Sigurd]

I think my employees, yo.

[James]

Really?

[Lawrence]

You spend enough time with them?

[Sigurd]

No, no, like, I like. I like everyone on my team. It's more like I said with them every day.

[Lawrence]

Right? Yeah.

[James]

You know, do you guys do. Do you guys, like, hang out after work and like, like happy. I hit a happy hour. Like team dinners, and so it's a close, close knit squad.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, I think.

[James]

So how many people is it now at this point?

[Sigurd]

I don't know if you asked them, but, like, no. So, like, I think I'm the one that. That hang out the. The least.

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Because I have a daughter and.

[James]

Sure.

[Sigurd]

Like, you're a grown ass man. I'm trying to be a good dad.

[James]

Right, like, you're being an excellent dad.

[Lawrence]

Father of the year.

[Sigurd]

Father of the year.

[James]

40.

[Sigurd]

No, but yeah. So I think we are 13.

[James]

Okay, so you don't. So there's 13 people coming tomorrow. That and you don't want it.

[Sigurd]

No. Like, not everyone is coming.

[James]

You don't sit next to Jakob the store guy.

[Sigurd]

No, dude, I love Jakob. I love Jakob. Yeah, no, no, I, I, we're not, there's not purging from the team coming tomorrow. Like, it's, it's, it's, as you know, it's a limited space.

[Lawrence]

Right. So like the hottest ticket during Copenhagen.

[Sigurd]

Exactly. So like, like putting, putting like half of the, the spots up for like, the team would be random. Damn. What's the question, sir?

[James]

Who do you not want to sit.

[Sigurd]

Next to my team. Okay. All right.

[James]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

I don't know. I, I, I like to be honest, I haven't given much thought to the guest list. That's you and Hugo, who is on.

[James]

Me and Hugo are. We got to sit down and do a signed seating. Don't worry. So we'll sit you next to people that aren't that don't work for you.

[Sigurd]

I think maybe I don't want to sit back. Sit next to Chris Black.

[James]

Okay. Yeah. He'll laugh too loud.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, yeah.

[Lawrence]

He'll be, he'll chuckle your face off.

[James]

Yeah. Do you, but we're here for Copenhagen Fashion Week. Like, do you with Copenhagen Fashion Week? Just, we want to get the perspective of a Dane. Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, I think, I think I do. Like, like, it's, it's, it's, it's a bit ambiguous maybe.

[James]

It's fun, though. It's kind of like. Yeah, I don't mean this pejoratively or negatively, but it seems like kind of low stakes where it's like everyone's just here to, to really enjoy it and actually, I don't know, like, make new friends, hang out with. I mean, we were eating Orchard street pizza last night, and then I was getting a bun with cheese at La Cabra this morning. So it's kind of like, I think the New York Copenhagen connection is facts.

[Sigurd]

I've, like, we don't do anything at Copenhagen Fashion Week. Like, we had a show, like, almost two years ago. Just like, why not? Like, let's have a show this year. But like, for us, like, Paris is where we do all our business. Like, we have the showroom. We have, like, so and so many meetings and all these things. So, like, Paris is like where we do our business. We don't need cop making Fashion Week. But at the same time it's, it's, it's, it's. It's a very good week for hanging out. Yeah.

[Lawrence]

I mean everyone's in town, right?

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly. It's like, and it's good for that and, and, and, and, and shout out to, to, to Isabella and, and Cecilia for doing like, like getting like kind of a community around. Like. And you know, like there's a lot of events and, and all these things.

[James]

So I think it's also certainly put for people that maybe weren't aware. Like I think we became very aware of like Scandinavian brands, Danish brands in the menswear era, you know, and there was like a lot of Danish brands leading the pack then, but people that might not be familiar with like Danish design or brands now. It's like without forcing or jamming it down our throats, people I think are realizing like, oh shit, Copenhagen is a pretty creative.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[James]

I mean the fashion industry is like, you're one of your biggest industries in, in Denmark. So I don't know, it feels like kind of like a soft power thing where it's like, yeah, we do actually have like a lot of fire here.

[Sigurd]

I, I think the Fashion Week is like, it's amazing that we have it. Yeah. As a brand, like it brings us a lot of free stuff.

[James]

Jakob was saying you had like triple the amount of foot traffic on Monday.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[Lawrence]

I'm not even really surprised.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, but like it's, it's the people.

[Lawrence]

Need to get fly for all these.

[Sigurd]

Go to spot in Copenhagen right now. Right?

[James]

Mfn.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, I guess hq. But, but it's, it's, it's, it's more I think like with me as, as a person like not, not as like a fashion designer owner brand. It's. It's more like I don't like the circus Fashion Week. It. Sometimes it gets a little bit like fuck off.

[Lawrence]

You know, the influencer bullshit.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[Lawrence]

You know. Yeah, that's me New York. I mean honestly, that's every Fashion Week.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, but, but like. And that's why I'm like when I'm in Paris, we. You've seen our showroom. Like we have to. Showroom. We have meetings for me from the morning to the evening and then work for dinner and then we could get fucked and then, and then you know, like that's, that's work while in coping. It's not work. And I think that's probably what makes it great. That is not work. But it's also.

[James]

And go sleep in your own bed at the end of the night.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[James]

No, no, no, no.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

No, like, like, like, luckily my. My daughter is, like, older now, but, like, when she was, like, small, like, it. Going to Fashion Week or going traveling was just like, it. Everyone who's a dad knows that, like, that's a holiday.

[Lawrence]

Like, don't.

[James]

Yo.

[Lawrence]

My phone is on airplane mode.

[Sigurd]

Do not hit me. No, but, but, like, yeah, like, I. I cannot say there's anything that bothers me about coming Fashion Week.

[Lawrence]

It feels like it's definitely snowballing. Like, the. Whether it's Copenhagen or Berlin, like these. I think what people would view as like a secondary Fashion week, it really feels like there's momentum and be here, boots on the ground. Like, we're seeing ourselves.

[Sigurd]

It's cool.

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. I guess. Yeah.

[James]

Also, you're becoming a big fish in a small pond. It feels like MF Pen as the store to go to as the seemingly best menswear brand coming out of Denmark. One of the best out of Scandinavia. It feels. I mean, do you feel like a big fish in a small pond in Copenhagen?

[Sigurd]

Not at all. Not really. No. No.

[James]

I.

[Sigurd]

Also think the. There's, like, way bigger brains, like, menswear brands than us in Kongbing.

[James]

Like, costs.

[Sigurd]

That's Swedish. No, it's just like the bigger ones, but, like, more commercial ones.

[Lawrence]

Right, right.

[Sigurd]

It's. It's. It's.

[Lawrence]

Well, you guys have the juice.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, maybe. But, like, it's. At the end of the day, it's still me and my team sitting at the office. Like, it's not that I walk out the door and like, whoa. I'm. You know.

[Lawrence]

You're humble still.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, I guess so. Yeah.

[James]

You do love the city of Copenhagen, right? This is your first time here?

[Lawrence]

Yeah, it's awesome.

[James]

My second time here, like, you. Lifetime native.

[Sigurd]

No.

[James]

How long when you move here.

[Sigurd]

What's that, 15 years ago?

[James]

But you love this.

[Sigurd]

I love coming. Yeah.

[James]

You even spend your holidays in Copenhagen and don't leave a lot of the time. Why is that? Like, what do you do?

[Sigurd]

So it's. It's more like. So the weather in Copenhagen is like. Tends to be a bit like up and down.

[Lawrence]

Right.

[Sigurd]

And the winter is quite long and rainy and windy and stuff. And then the summer comes and then like, everyone leaves. Like, why?

[Lawrence]

This is the time to stay.

[Hugo]

Yeah.

[James]

You should be leaving in the winter.

[Sigurd]

And, you know, people. People go. People go to Spain or whatever, and there's like 40 degrees.

[James]

What's the hit and Ibiza.

[Sigurd]

I bet. I don't know where to go. Like, people go different places, but, like, it's just, like, you go to Southern Europe, like, during July and stuff. It's so hot, yo. And, like, I'm like, yo, this is the best time of the year in Copenhagen. Like, why should I leave? You know? So. So, yeah, so we go. I go camping. And, like, you know, just to be honest, I love just like, laying on my couch in the afternoon watching George Franks, you know?

[Lawrence]

Like, that's vacation for you.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. And, like, that's actually the only time of day where I'm allowed at home to watch TV during the day, the afternoon.

[Lawrence]

All these rules.

[Sigurd]

No, no, like, like, you don't. No, no, but you don't. You don't want your kid to watch tv, right? And you want to. You want to set, like, a standard. Like, I'm not watching TV by example, you know? But, like, except for two weeks every summer to the France, like, that. That I'm allowed to see that because, like, that's my right thing, right? And I. My wife, she's like, dude, you're just sleeping. Yeah, it's like, that's not the point. Like. So, no, but, like, napping, like, and, like, half of Denmark knows this.

[Lawrence]

To nap.

[Sigurd]

No, but napping at Tour de France is like the. Like, that's the prime nap, you know?

[Lawrence]

I love that for you.

[James]

You ever go. You ever go to the. To France, like, be one of the guys fucking, you know?

[Sigurd]

No, no, no, no, no.

[Lawrence]

Can't nap their person.

[James]

Trying to give them water like this. Getting their way.

[Sigurd]

No, I'm like. I like. I like. I'm more like. If I go see a bike race, it's more like criteriums, like, so like, city. City races where you, like, they come by a few times and like, whoa, you know, like, standing, waiting for four hours and then, like, like, right, they're gone, like. Yeah, you know?

[James]

Yeah, but all those French guys are just fucking getting fucking crunk off wine, right? All their homemade wine.

[Sigurd]

That's like. That's Danish people, Dutch people, Germany. Like, a lot of people go there and then, like, get drunk, 30 seconds.

[James]

Of, like, enjoyment, tailgating, and accidentally tripped by cyclist.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, no, no, I'm. I'm watching it from the couch.

[James]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

That's for sure.

[James]

I love that you're a man of comfort.

[Hugo]

Yeah.

[James]

What. What do you do in the winter to combat seasonal depression?

[Sigurd]

Oh, what? Sorry.

[James]

In the winters, when it's terrible here, like, what do you do to, like, not kill yourself.

[Sigurd]

Get drunk. Like, that's.

[Lawrence]

Yeah. That's all you can do.

[James]

Sounds like. Yeah. The depressants about.

[Sigurd]

No, like, so. So in, like, I. There's a lot of good restaurants in coping.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

And, like, I think the winter. You. You are like me. At least I go for dinners and I get. I do get drunk, but, like, I enjoy good food and, like, get some beers and, like, you know, I think that's. That's my alcohol. The water of life. Yeah, no, like, that's. That's.

[James]

No, too heavy.

[Sigurd]

That's. Yeah, that's older people.

[Lawrence]

Okay.

[James]

Bro, I didn't know it was. I didn't know it was, like, 45 alcohol. I thought it was like a.

[Sigurd]

Like, it was heavy.

[James]

No, I thought it was like a. Like a. Like a amaro or something. Right. I thought it was like 15, 20. And then I'm. I was drinking. I was like, why is this. Why do I feel like this? And then I look at the label and I'm like, oh, it's actually overproof.

[Sigurd]

Do you have that saying in. In English, it's like. Like, in Danish, you call it box event. It's like. It's like boxing water. No. What is that? It makes you want to fight.

[Lawrence]

Yeah, there's like a. Yeah, there's, like, in Scotland, they have a super lager. They call them wife beaters.

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. Or there's, like, tradition. Like these, like. It's called Christmas lunches. Lunches.

[James]

Just fight everything.

[Sigurd]

You have lunch. You. You have lunch during Christmas. Like, it's kind of like the Christmas party. Yeah, you have these long, like, you know, like the Danish open sandwiches and like, all these things. And then you have these, like, activities and, you know, like snaps, you know, like, on the side. But, like, people, like, get so aggressive.

[Lawrence]

Great way to get in the holiday spirit. Just beat the. Out of somebody.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly.

[James]

You know, then we called. He's called Whiskey Firewater.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[James]

In America. Can we ask you about, like, skinny scandi minimalism and he gay and all that? Like, what do you think of that stereotype as a. As a dean yourself? And he gay. He gay. What'd you call me?

[Sigurd]

No, I never heard that.

[James]

You know, he gay.

[Lawrence]

He gay.

[James]

Bro, you don't know he gay. H, Y, G, G, E. It's like a.

[Lawrence]

You don't have that design.

[James]

No, no, it's like. It's like being, like, cozy at home. It's like napping on the couch.

[Lawrence]

How is it pronounced? Oh, it's when he's watching the Tour de France.

[James]

Is that real philosophy? Is that real or just like, some. That, like.

[Sigurd]

No, no. Everyone. Everyone, like, practices in Denmark. Okay. Like, you can even. You can even use the word for sex, I guess.

[James]

Like, what?

[Sigurd]

Yeah, it's like, you wanna.

[James]

You want to just lay around and be lazy.

[Sigurd]

No, Hugi is like, you know, like, it's just when. When it's kind of like it's dim lights, it's like, nice cushioning. It's like all these things. Like, that's hygge. Like a nice big jacket like this. You know, it's. And I like it as a term or, like, as something you do, but I think as a trademark, it's a bit weird. Like, you can get, like, you can get sweatshirts, saying it kind of means cozy, right? Like that. I think that's the closest word.

[James]

But was it a thing that was like. Because it. It feels like in America, it was a very millennial thing where it's like, oh, like, make sure you practice Danish huge and just, like, be at home in your jammies. But it's a real thing. It's for real. It's a for real thing here.

[Sigurd]

No, it's more not just some side, I think. I think everyone, like. And that's. That's. That's a Danish cultural thing. Like, everyone practices. Like, if you have a. If you have a space, like a. Like a dinner or like, like, you want to make it. It's called hugely. Like, you want to make it huge.

[Lawrence]

You know, like, apply that to retail as well. Or is it more, like, for, like, a home?

[Sigurd]

Yeah, some retailers you, like. Like, you know, stores really have a lot of wood, and, like, that's. Yeah, exactly. That's. That, you know, like, it's not the case for. For my store.

[James]

No.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, but. Yeah, but, like, it's like, you want to, like, huge. Something you want to have at home.

[Lawrence]

Right.

[Sigurd]

Or maybe a restaurant or something. Right.

[James]

Is Mf? Pen, like, your design philosophy kind of intentionally stand in contrast to, like, just the larger Danish school of design, which is about warmth, comfort, sensibility, versus Mf? Pen being, like, a little, like, corpo, A little awkward, a little. A little off, a little imperfect, but also, like, still focusing on elements of beauty with textiles and the craft itself?

[Sigurd]

Well, I don't know. I don't know. I don't. Don't wake up in the morning. Like, I have to make a contrast to this. No, it's how you did. It's more. No, I think it's. It's. It's always as a designer or like, I think most designers have that way. It's like an extension of your own style. Yeah. All personal taste and style. And I think it's more, in my case, it's more like I always been a bit, you know, fan of like the melancholic kind of like, you know, and I think kind of I want my, I want my clothing to kind of like, somehow express that, you know, like the, like, wouldn't say, like the music I listen to, but like, you know, like all these things where it's, it's like I don't want it to look funny. I don't want it to look like, happy. Go lucky. I want. I like them all.

[Lawrence]

It's not a joke to you?

[Sigurd]

No, no, no. But like, it's funny how. No, no, but it's, it's more like I, I like quirky and stuff. I, I'm. For me, it's more like, I like it to be so.

[Lawrence]

It's like novelty, though. That's like, there's no substance behind stuff like that. Right. So I get what you're saying.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, but it's, it's also we, I like funny little details. Like, we have these like, like flower rivets and stuff. But like, end of the day, like, them, the look of it, like the expression of like, the overall feeling. I like that it's a bit like somehow dark in a way.

[Lawrence]

So we get dressed in MF Pen and we're depressed and that's how we know that you've done your job.

[Sigurd]

No, no, no, no. It's just more like, you know, like, I think like, some brands do this, some brands do do that. And like, But I think as, as a, you, as a customer, like, you wear different things. Right? Yeah. And I, I, I don't mind that MF pen is like slightly more like, you know, once it dark, wouldn't say serious, but like, has this like, like melancholic feel.

[Lawrence]

Sterile.

[James]

That's a Scandinavian thing though, right? Like Scandinavian or was it Swedish or just melancholy? I mean, you guys live in the darkness half the year.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Like Finland, Finland has get drunk and fight each other. Finland has the most or like the biggest amount of like, metal bands on the planet.

[Lawrence]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Sigurd]

And you know, like. No, I think like, the winters in Scandinavia is quite long and dark, so I don't know, like, I guess it's a thing. And I also like, in terms of like, culture and like, movies and like, like the humor, everything tends to be a bit dark.

[James]

Yeah. Playing chess against death up in the north of fucking? Yeah. What the hell's that? You guys are fucked up.

[Sigurd]

No, but twisted. Yeah. I think the winters gets you a bit moody, right? Yeah. And. But then, like, the good thing about it, like, everyone knows that, like. Like, during spring, like, everyone is just blooming insane. Like, everyone goes outside. Everyone. Like. Like, you, if it's, like, the weather's, like, the sun is up in March and you see everyone just naked in the park drinking beers and, like, it's not that warm yet. And then, like, everyone's sick. Right? But. But, like, that's. That's. That's kind of like the Copenhagen thing, right? Like, as soon as the sun is out, like, everyone is just, like, you know, they. Outside, you know? Yeah.

[Lawrence]

You guys know what you're missing, you know, so you know how to take.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly. So there's a big contrast.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[James]

What's your favorite? I agree with the. The little details that I think are. What's really nice is that sometimes they're just for the wearer. Like, they're not, you know, like, whether it's a little flower rivet or, like, a raw edge on, like, a trouser flap. What's your favorite little detail of a recent MF pen piece?

[Sigurd]

I like the flower details.

[James]

I like them on the jorts.

[Sigurd]

On the jorts. I don't know. Like, we're doing, like, it's random detail, but, like, we. We're doing. So we do a lot of that stock, as you know. And then. And then this season, we work with a supplier that does, like, a lot of suiting. And, like, they always have, like, they have, like. They do all our shooting and stuff, but they always have, like, dead stock of whatever, like, in stock. So, like, they have, like. They did. I think they did some suit for good example. Like, they did suit for Calvin Klein, I think. And then. I think it was whatever. Yeah. You know, and then they. They. Calvin Klein this. Or, like, the brand decided to. To change them. The buttons on the. On the cuff, on the blazer, like, from four to three. And then. And then they ended up with, like, 10,000 buttons because, like, they, like, take off. The production order was like, 5,000, maybe. And then. And then there's two buttons on each blazer, you know, like, and then. And then they, like, you know, 10,000 buttons. Right. But then they also have, like, tons of lining and stuff. And. And. And. And now we started, like, just mixing linings. So, like, on a jacket, like, you. You just, like, of course, like, it's. It's very classic, but you have Like a stripe lining in the sleeve and, like. Like a lining in the body. So we're doing that, but then it's all dead stock. And, like, sometimes we do. Sometimes there's not enough of that lining. So, like, you can buy a jacket from here, and it's like. Like this color in the. In the sleeve, and then you can buy another jacket, like, same jacket from a different store, whatever, and slightly different color, you know, And I think that that's a cool.

[James]

Fun for the.

[Lawrence]

Like James said for the wear. Like, you only know that when you put it on or take it off.

[Sigurd]

I think that's fun. That's a bit. You know, you only have that one jacket to compare with. Yeah. Like, so.

[James]

No, it's kind of one of one.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

I mean. All right, so Emma Pen is a bit of an extension of yourself, a moody boxing motherfucker. Who's. Who's the MF Pen customer? He had to, like, sum them up, describe them. Him or her?

[Sigurd]

Who he is. Yeah, it's. It's funny because that's a question you always get.

[James]

Oh, sorry.

[Sigurd]

No, no, no, don't get our.

[James]

Born with that. Okay.

[Sigurd]

No, I was like, who's. Who's your target? Or who's your. Like, it's a lame question. Or like, sorry, it's a lame answer. Like, but, like, you know, like, whoever wants to wear it, I guess, like, because that's.

[Lawrence]

That's actually.

[Sigurd]

You know, like, that's a good answer because we.

[James]

We.

[Sigurd]

We. We always say in the office, like, when you do a collect, sometimes we take pieces out of collection and, like. And someone's like, yeah, I could see a sell that. But we were like, yeah, but do we want to wear it? Oh, you know, like. And it's. It's not that it has to pass. Have to pass a test or anything. It's more like, even though we could sell it if we don't want to. Like, like, wouldn't say, feel proud, but, like, feel I get it. Like, comfortable wearing it. Like, why. Why would. What's the point? Why would we produce it? Right.

[James]

So it's team first.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, I guess. You know, but. But then I guess, like, at the same time, like, I. I trust myself and my team to have good taste. So if we think it's nice, probably a lot of other people.

[Lawrence]

So the customers, you guys, the team, the squad.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. Like, I think. I think we, to some extent, represent the customers. Right.

[James]

One, your team has the best. Best swag.

[Sigurd]

One of the Caspers.

[James]

Which one? We're not going to see which one.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[James]

No, man, we're not going to see which one. We'll post both. The audience can vote.

[Lawrence]

See your.

[Sigurd]

No, but Casper and Casper are cheating because, like, they're young guys, they have long hair, they're hot, like Scandinavian looking, you know, like, so, like, it's kind of like, you know, But I think, I think I would say maybe Mia mio, Hugo.

[Lawrence]

Okay, here's another lame question. Why is everyone in Copenhagen so hot? What's the deal? Everyone's so good looking here.

[Sigurd]

Thank you. You're welcome. Why?

[Lawrence]

What's the deal?

[James]

Genetic breeding.

[Sigurd]

Don't, don't do that. Like American eagles.

[James]

Hey, good genes.

[Lawrence]

Great genes.

[James]

Yeah.

[Lawrence]

Big jeans. They have big, big, great, beautiful jeans.

[Sigurd]

And I don't know, like, I think I've to, to some extent. I think it's a lot about, like, how you wear, wear yourself.

[James]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

How you present yourself.

[Lawrence]

Sure.

[Sigurd]

And, and, and, and, and I think Scandinavian or Danish people are good at that. Like, like some, some places. Like, you know, I don't know, like, how you present yourself in the, in what clothing you wear, like the makeup or the amount of makeup or, you know, I mean, like, there's, there's a lot of things where I think like, like, like it comes down to that maybe.

[Lawrence]

Right, so non Americans. Got it. Oh, totally.

[James]

Yeah. See what you. We see what you're saying without saying.

[Lawrence]

And if you guys aren't sloppy, you're put together, you present yourself well.

[Sigurd]

I think also, like, there's. There's Copenhagen, there's Denmark.

[Lawrence]

Oh, okay, right. Copenhagen.

[James]

Yo. That's shots at ahu's.

[Lawrence]

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[James]

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[Sigurd]

No, but it's.

[Lawrence]

It's.

[Sigurd]

It's like, you know, like, it's. It's. It's expensive to live in. Coping. It's. It's like if it's so a lot of. Am I going on?

[James]

So if you're rich or hot.

[Sigurd]

No, not saying that. But it's more like you. You. You people think about what they wear.

[James]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

And coping a lot. It's really just.

[James]

I think there's an emphasis on self presentation.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. You know, and. And it's also like. And then most people, they go to. To the gym and like eat healthy and like there's also like hit the sauna. Yeah, maybe I don't do none of that.

[James]

So.

[Lawrence]

Yeah, right.

[James]

You know, you're not. You're not Schwitzman. You're not out there sweating your balls off?

[Sigurd]

No, man.

[Lawrence]

The least healthy guy in Copenhagen.

[Sigurd]

No, I'm. I'm decently okay.

[James]

You bike and shit? No.

[Sigurd]

Bike and shit. Yeah, I have my, like, my green porridge every morning.

[James]

Green porridge? What's in your green porridge?

[Sigurd]

It's actually like this trendy thing. Sounds disgusting. I jumped on that trend.

[James]

The one triangle chase.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, no, it's. It's. No, like everyone, you know, you get just like an age and you're like, maybe I should start.

[James]

Just green porridge. Yeah, but it's not the pickled fish.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, it's. It's. It's like. Like tons of spinach.

[James]

Ew, yucky.

[Sigurd]

What do I put in it? Carrots, apple, ginger.

[Lawrence]

Okay.

[James]

Pooping like a champ.

[Sigurd]

No, no, it's very good.

[Lawrence]

So I'm sure you eat with a spoon and.

[Sigurd]

No, no, you just drink it.

[James]

Okay.

[Lawrence]

So it's. Oh, it's smoothie.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. No, it's not thick. Thick smoothie. What's. What's the orange thing? Like, the root?

[James]

An orange. Oh, ginger. Turmeric. Turmeric.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, turmeric. And like, like, just good stuff. Okay, good for you. Drink that in the morning and you're like, I'm healthy now.

[James]

I'm ready to go.

[Lawrence]

And then you're like, time to have a thousand beers.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. No.

[James]

Or that boxing water.

[Sigurd]

You feel like. I think it's more like a mental thing. Like you feel like you're leveling. Leveling stuff.

[Lawrence]

Stuff. Placebo effect.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, did that.

[James]

So you feel like you got to be healthy for your daughter. Just like. Cuz you hit a certain age.

[Sigurd]

No, just for me.

[James]

Yeah. What else do you do besides slug down some green porridge in the morning? Or is that it?

[Sigurd]

I play. I do some sports, I guess.

[James]

What do you do? Paddle?

[Sigurd]

No. Dude.

[James]

What the is up with padel? Or paddle?

[Sigurd]

Yeah. I don't know.

[James]

Do people with it or not? I can't tell.

[Sigurd]

I don't.

[James]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

Handball, like, it's. It's kind of like the guys who are wearing like the vest.

[James]

Like the Patagonia vests. Finance bros. Yeah. Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Like, they play that. Okay. And like, no hate. I know people. It's a sport. Like, for me, it's like something that's very easy to get into. It's very easy to. To. To learn. I never played it. But like, that's. Whatever.

[James]

It's the J. Crew of sports.

[Sigurd]

No, but like. What up, Chris? No, but it's just. It's it's so easy for everyone to play and then it gets kind of dull.

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

And I don't mind from my personal, like, I'm. I don't mind things are hard to get into. Like, it's. It's okay if you have to take time and you have to like. Sure. Effort. Like, that's. That's how I.

[James]

You know, that's how you make a brand.

[Sigurd]

True. Yeah, I guess.

[James]

So what do you do? Cycling a cycle a lot?

[Sigurd]

Not. Not like, not. Not. Not that like lycra cycling stuff.

[James]

Yo, you should do. What? Palace didn't sponsor a Tour de France team, bro. That'd be sick.

[Sigurd]

What? Sorry?

[James]

Palace. They were a sponsor of a Tour de France cycling team.

[Sigurd]

Education. Whatever.

[James]

Yeah. Why doesn't MFN do something?

[Sigurd]

No, they did it together with Rafa.

[James]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

Like this, Like a English friend. No, like, MF Penn is not cycling.

[James]

Yeah. Also, I don't know if you're making as much money as palace yet.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, no. Getting there.

[James]

Getting there, getting there. What's the best selling item for MF10? The executive shirt.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, but that's. That's not like. Not one item. Like, we do sell tons of shirts.

[James]

Is it like.

[Lawrence]

That's the number one category?

[James]

Is it blue striped shirts still?

[Sigurd]

No, like, it's all kind of shirts. Like, the thing is, with blue striped shirts, it's like never that. It never kind of peaking like one product. It's more, you know, it's more like it's a constant seller, I guess. But the thing is like, we. We rarely have like one product that's like, this is the best seller because we. It tends to sell out.

[James]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

If you know what I mean.

[James]

Because the using dead stock, your inventory is pretty limited.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. But also we also do like non dead stock stuff. But it's more like we don't. Like, we do a product and then we do this and this many in the production. And then like we did this jacket like this spring and it's sold out in one day, so. But we only. We could only make this in this much.

[James]

Is it the fireman jacket?

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly.

[Lawrence]

That was a banger.

[Sigurd]

Thank you. Did you get one?

[Lawrence]

No.

[Sigurd]

Sold out. Yeah, I know. Sorry. In one day.

[Lawrence]

It sold out before I could buy it.

[Sigurd]

So. So we sold. We sold this and this many and. And. But we still didn't sell as many as another product. It just sold out so fast that we will never know how many we actually could sell.

[Lawrence]

Only one way to find out.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, but like order like.

[Lawrence]

No, really, you do pre order.

[Sigurd]

I don't know. Like, I like that jacket, but just felt. So we presented it. The first time we presented that jacket was like, June, June last year. You know, like, it was in like, in the spring, summer, like, and then. It's funny because in the showroom, like, so little stores bought into it. Really? Yeah, it's like, I was like, you know, like the Essence, for example, like, they buy huge quantities. They bought four. Like, and you know, like, I know neighbor. They bought a few. And like, like Chris from Vince Bass, he didn't like, he's like, oh, damn. You know, like, and. And. But like, no one, like, kind of believed in it back then. I was like, weird. That's like, I felt it was such a. Like, I would say commercial product and still, like, you know, and then. And then it just got so delayed because, like, the. The clasps were like this, like, original Italian supplier making, like, from these, like, fireman's jackets. And then. But they're so shiny and, like, so we had to give them a treatment and that kind of destroyed the clasp. So they're like, there's so many things. And. And my production manager, she was like, fuck, Fuck this jacket.

[James]

You know, like, we're only making 12 of them anyway. Yeah.

[Sigurd]

And then. And then, and then. And then, like, this fucking Adrian. What's. What's his name? Adrian Brody.

[James]

Oh, maybe the artist painter.

[Sigurd]

Wow, that's amazing stuff.

[Lawrence]

He makes the Academy Award.

[James]

Skateboarder.

[Sigurd]

I think there's a lot of people playing pedal that would love someone.

[James]

Yeah, no, but the artist skater. Eden Brody.

[Sigurd]

But so he was wearing. Does this GQ shoot where he was wearing it as well.

[Lawrence]

Okay.

[James]

He's wearing the MFM one.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

And then I think it was a Brody. Yeah, it was. Yeah. But then. But then. But then.

[James]

Did he have a giant.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[James]

Nose.

[Lawrence]

That's how, you know, that's.

[Sigurd]

I think it was before his Oscar speech, though.

[Lawrence]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

No, so. Yeah, so. So he. He wore it in. And then it just like, got more and more hyped and I, like, I don't like hype. You know, like, I'm. I.

[Lawrence]

Well, fireman jackets became a trend. But you guys were like a whole.

[Sigurd]

No.

[Lawrence]

Eight months ahead.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, but that'. Thing. But just got so delayed. And then he started wearing it, like. And my customer service, like, he got like 10 emails today asking, like, when's the jacket coming out?

[James]

And like, we just seen when's a celebrity coming out?

[Lawrence]

I need to look like Adrian Brody.

[Sigurd]

No, no, but then. But then I'm not Saying it's because of him. It's just like, it's just. It just. Everything just got exaggerated on that jacket. And then like, the delays just got worse and worse and worse. So it ended up being released in March and we plan to release it in November. And then by March, like so many other brands picked up kind of. Right. Like all these like, direct to consumer, whatever brand. And so just started seeing everywhere on Instagram, this is new trend. Like, which is fine. Like, that's, that's. That's the cycle. Right? But then, but then we put it online, it got sold, sold out in an hour, which is not our thing. I don't like, right. You know, like, I don't like, want that hype stuff. Like, it's not like, that's not why we. We have the brain or anything. But then, then Bill and my production manager was like, what the fuck? So she spent like six months, like fighting this jacket and like all the supplies and like it one hour fun. Like, just gone. Right.

[James]

Well, that's got to feel a little good, no?

[Sigurd]

Yeah, of course. Like, yeah, no, no. Like, it's. It's. I. I like to sell products. Like, of course. It's more like, I think the hype gets. When something has hype, it gets a little bit. Wouldn't say dishonest, but it gets a little diluted. Yeah, it's like, why do people want this? It's because they seen on Instagram. It's because, like. Or is it because it's a good product?

[James]

But is that. Is that just what the modern. Or who the modern consumer is like, can you combat hype? Are you in control of that or is it kind of like up to the gods?

[Sigurd]

So, so, so we try kind of like wouldn't say and anti hype, but like, we. So like, we don't have a PR agency. We don't have like any like, like anyone in the company doing marketing. Like, it's like. But so we. We never like, do all these, like, we, we never seed anything. You guys know that. Like, we don't. We don't give away stuff, you know.

[James]

Two things for free.

[Sigurd]

Oh, yeah. Did you.

[Lawrence]

But they're few and far between. It's not like other people that are.

[James]

Not gonna tell you. I'm not gonna tell you who it.

[Sigurd]

Was who gave you that.

[James]

Don't worry about it. What the one came from you, which I was shocked by someone's getting fired. Like, yeah, well, you can't fire yourself. Okay. Oh, and then the first. The first piece of MFN I ever got was from someone who's no longer at the company.

[Sigurd]

Oh, Elias, Right.

[James]

I'm not sure.

[Sigurd]

I think it was fired.

[Lawrence]

It was like.

[James]

It was like. It was like 20, 19. 2020.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

And it was. And I still have it.

[Sigurd]

I still wear it. I see that all the time.

[Lawrence]

Yeah, all the time.

[James]

I think it's an executive. I think it's an executive shirt. And I'm not gonna lie, I got so much. Well, first I fell in love with it immediately, and then I get so many questions about it still to this day when I wear was a blue striped shirt.

[Sigurd]

I remember it was Ilias back then. Like, it's. It's a kid, a guy who used to. Who used to work for me, and he's like, yo, dude, does these podcasters.

[Lawrence]

He put you on? He put you on?

[Sigurd]

Yeah, like, shout back. No, I had no idea who you were. But this is all, like, to be fair, six years ago.

[James]

Yeah, probably.

[Sigurd]

Were you famous back then or like, big. No, no, but you know what I mean, like, like in the podcast realm.

[Lawrence]

Yes, probably. We were doing this for a long time.

[James]

We just. We just hit the. The Danish shores.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. No, no, but he was like, oh, just these guys. And like, can I send them a shirt? And like, I don't know. I don't know. And he was like, yeah, I think we should do it. Like, okay, like, send him a shirt. Like.

[James]

And look, look what happened.

[Lawrence]

I have the collab stuff that we worked on. Yeah, some of that. I don't. Yeah, that's weird. It's weird. I'm the only one who got that for some reason.

[James]

I got a. I got a shirt. I might have gotten two shirt. Maybe one shirt. I don't have the jeans, which is a bummer or whatever.

[Lawrence]

I have everything but the coat. No one got their. The coat sold out, I think.

[James]

But yeah, yeah, but you don't. See, you don't do marketing. You don't do like. Like, do you pay for, like, Instagram ads or anything? You just.

[Sigurd]

We never ever paid for any paid ads. We never did, like, like, influencer marketing, whatever it's called. I don't know. Yeah, but like, we never did any of that stuff.

[James]

Do you get a lot of people hitting up like, yo, yeah, every day. Let me get some.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, yeah, I'll promo you and. And like, no, like this. This needs to be on the record.

[James]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

You get so many people, like, I love your brand. I've been following it forever. Like, it's blah, blah, blah. Like, and then like, you click on the. Like, they write you on Instagram and you click on the profile. They don't follow you cappers. Like, that's. That's the easiest thing just to go and follow. Like, and you can always unfollow again.

[Lawrence]

But it's like, why follow before you send the messages?

[Sigurd]

Yeah. Like, it's just weird. You're like, don't. Don't say how. You're like, big fan. You've been for years. And like, so, like, Like, a shirt.

[James]

Does not cost that much money. No, it's like an MFN shirt.

[Lawrence]

That's one of the value props in.

[James]

The grand scheme of menswear. I'm looking at it right now, right?

[Sigurd]

Yeah. You have the VAT prices. Like us.

[James]

Kind of smells like broke when you're out here begging for some free.

[Sigurd]

No, I don't know. I don't mind people asking. It's more. It's more like if that's your thing, like, it's. It's fine. We just saying, like, politely. No.

[James]

What do you say?

[Sigurd]

Nah, son knows. Like, at one point I was like, replying to every message because I'm having the Instagram, it's on my phone, kind of. So we have Casper. He's doing the email, like, customer service, but I'm just taking everything on my phone. And at one point I was like, sorry, we don't do seating or like, collaborations, whatever they call it.

[James]

Yeah, we collab on a post.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly. I was like, sorry, we don't do that. Blah, blah, blah. And because pl.

[Lawrence]

We're cool.

[Sigurd]

And then. And then at one point, I started. I stopped doing it at all the ones that. Not following us. Like, you know, like, you don't even. You just, like, mess.

[James]

You're copying and pasting.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly. And then if someone follows us, like, hey, maybe he's genuine. Maybe he did follow us. Maybe he's a big fan. All these things. And I think it's okay to like, to take time out to make a sweet, polite saying no right off.

[Hugo]

Sorry.

[James]

Here's what you do, right?

[Lawrence]

Respectful.

[James]

Start a popular. You start a popular podcast, or you start one of cigarette's favorite restaurants, and that's how you get free mfa.

[Lawrence]

True.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

All right, so there's no.

[Sigurd]

I got some deals.

[James]

It's a barter system.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[James]

What product fucking sits. What sucks that you make that doesn't sell at all. A brick, if you will, like a scandi brick.

[Sigurd]

I think to some extent we're quite safe with all the products we do. Yeah.

[Lawrence]

There's got to have been one that.

[Sigurd]

Was like, yeah, there's been. But like, lately it's just like, I just feel like I'm. I'm so. I don't want to do products that don't sell. Like, I want to. I want to. I want to take risks. Right. But I don't want to have something piling up in boxes in the warehouse.

[Lawrence]

Sure.

[Sigurd]

You know, I mean, like, it's.

[Lawrence]

It's wasteful.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. 100. And it's just also like, it's just not that fun to make a product that no one wants. Right.

[Lawrence]

It's not fun to be bad at your job.

[Sigurd]

No. But you can still do very like, like experimental stuff. Like something that, like storytelling for the brand or whatever. But at one point I was just like. We tried to do some stuff where it's just like, it felt like, okay, we're going to do this because it's a bit crazy. It's a bit like, whatever. And like, and then, and then you were just like, why did we do this? Like, what was hindsight?

[James]

What was that?

[Sigurd]

No, so like we, at one point we worked with like someone's like in charge of a sales.

[James]

Like a sales agency. Okay.

[Sigurd]

And like, yeah, but like, do color. Like, you need more color.

[James]

Oh, they, they were. The merchandisers were leading the design kind of.

[Sigurd]

And I was younger and I was.

[James]

More like, okay, yo, collab with this podcast.

[Sigurd]

And then, and then. No, but then we did this like. I don't know. I don't want to say what it is because maybe someone is listening and someone who has. Has that item.

[Lawrence]

Oh, right, this.

[James]

But, but no, they were like, hey, the trend next year is going to be xyz.

[Sigurd]

You should know. It's more like, hey, you should put some color in there. Like the buyers love that. Like just to them. Yeah. And then, and then they push the color a lot for some extent and.

[James]

Then just, oh, I know what this was.

[Sigurd]

And you end up seeing it in sale and like, it's like, I don't. You know, and, and, and if you look at them with pen, since that day, we never had any color like this. Like non existent.

[James]

Of course it's my favorite.

[Sigurd]

No, no, we don't, we don't. We don't need that. Like pop pink, whatever. Like that everyone starts doing, you know, like, like after. I think Legacy did it. Right. Like so. And they were like, oh, let's put this pop. Whatever. Like, yeah, we don't need that. Like, it's, it's.

[Lawrence]

I was gonna wear my pink Interactive dinner tonight.

[Sigurd]

No, Like, I'm like, Like, you can wear all the pink you want.

[James]

Yeah. You bought some pink shoes. The pink cups, they're very pale.

[Lawrence]

Oh, okay.

[James]

It's a dusty.

[Lawrence]

They're a mel. It's a melancholic pale.

[James]

It's a sad pink.

[Sigurd]

No, but like, it's. It's more like since I was just like. Like, yeah. So, like, we don't do color. Not because of that. That episode or like that, like, that thing, but it's more like.

[Lawrence]

So to prove your point, though, reinforce. When it hits sale, you're like, oh, this is not.

[James]

See, right.

[Sigurd]

I didn't want to do it. Like, the sales team wanted to do it.

[James]

Also. It's like, it didn't sell.

[Sigurd]

So, like, what's the point?

[James]

Well, it's also like, if. If you're telling me that this is what every other brand is going to be doing, aren't we setting ourselves up to not fail?

[Sigurd]

But, like, no, but they, like, they didn't. They didn't say what color. They're just like, you should put some. Some pop in there, you know, like, and, And, And. And. And it's everything.

[James]

Make flip flops.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, no, every. Everything worked out fine, right, without the color.

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. So do you.

[James]

How often. So it's been nine years, right? And you've kind of, like, learned from your own. Sticking true to your vision, maybe making a few mistakes along the way. Do you still feel a lot of pressure to play the fashion game? And whether it's like doing a Runway show or suck editors dicks or seating, it sounds like you get a lot of ask or dress celebrities. Like, do you still get that? Or are you just, like, now we're. Do people now like, understand that you're good and you're in your own lane and you're gonna stay there?

[Sigurd]

I hope so. I think so. Like, we don't. We don't do anything for someone else, I would say, you know, like, we, like, of course we do. We have a showroom. And, like, we do, like, everything to maintain the. The brand and the success of the brand. But, like, we don't. We don't do anything that feels forced or forced upon us.

[Lawrence]

I think that's why people like you guys even. It's like a customer who's maybe not aware of all these intricacies until maybe they listen to this, because it just. It feels like it's, like, straightforward in a great way. Like, you're not trying to be anything that you're not. Right?

[Sigurd]

No, no. Like it's, it's, it's. And also like, I don't know all the other. I don't know. You know, I didn't know about you guys.

[James]

Now you do.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. No, no, but, no, but, you know, I mean like, it's, it's, it's. I, I think we just, we, we have a little bubble in the office. Like, like just doing our thing. Like we did a show in January last year, I think, like for Copenhagen. And like at that time, like someone be like, someone told me, like, you can't do one show you have to do.

[Lawrence]

Right.

[Sigurd]

Serious. If you. Like. I was like, why? Like, let's just do a show. I feel like doing a show this year. So we did a show and, and you know, I mean, I don't feel any pressure from outside. Like there is pressure, but like, I don't, like, I don't care, you know.

[James]

You don't let it. You don't. You block it out.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

You're too busy sleeping on the couch.

[Sigurd]

I think I have too much internal pressure, you know, Like, I push myself and I want to do this. I want to do like all these things and, and, and I don't give a shit about what everyone thinks we should be doing or whatever, you know. And I think also to some extent, like MF Pen could grow more and faster. How?

[James]

In what way?

[Sigurd]

If we did some stuff like marketing. Yeah, but like, but like, like for me, like the growth is not necessarily the, the end goal.

[James]

But do you want to grow it in any way at all?

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

More retail perhaps.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. So. Yeah. So when we. So this space, the space we got, like we opened the store in August last year.

[James]

Yeah. It's going to be a year. On the night of our dinner, by the way.

[Hugo]

Yeah.

[James]

Do you know that?

[Sigurd]

Oh no. Yeah. I was.

[James]

My speech.

[Sigurd]

Oh, nice. That's nice.

[James]

Y told me that.

[Sigurd]

I didn't even. You are, bro.

[James]

It was his one year anniversary a few days ago. I hope you wished him a happy one year anniversary.

[Sigurd]

I. I didn't know. Come on, man.

[Lawrence]

Happy belated.

[James]

Just give him a ring.

[Sigurd]

I brought, I bought them. I brought flowers to the office this morning. Yeah. I should go and get them.

[Lawrence]

Re gift them, dude.

[James]

Re gift your own. But yeah, how do you want to grow?

[Sigurd]

So like there's, there's been a lot of times in the MF Pen existence where, where I've been, like, like this is perfect now. Like now we're, you know, we don't, we don't need more staff. We don't need more. This and this. This. Now we're just like the right spot, everyone's happy and blah, blah. And then, but then, then it just feels like the growth sometimes is like inevitable.

[Lawrence]

Inevitable.

[Sigurd]

Inevitable.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Right.

[Lawrence]

It's gonna happen if you make good. Like.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly. And I'm not saying we try to force it like backwards or anything, but it's just like.

[Hugo]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

I don't know, like it's, it's we, we say like, like our. So we grow our production volumes a lot, but like not, not necessarily like the stores we work with. Right. So like it's, it's we, we, we. We keep the distribution quite limited. Right.

[James]

Tight.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. In terms of stores, like we opened the store like. Yeah. As you say, a year ago and it was.

[Lawrence]

Yeah, apparently allegedly.

[Sigurd]

No.

[James]

What a year, huh?

[Sigurd]

No, but like so, so time flies. This building, this building we're in used to be a post office and all offices and stuff. There's a few stores. Was all right. And then, and then the owners of the building, they got a company to find like the good stuff and then they, then they reached out to us and said like, yeah, we have the space and.

[Lawrence]

And they came to you?

[Sigurd]

Yeah. So. And so we didn't plan to open a store and like, and everyone always, always told me like, never start retail because like that's where you're going to lose all your money and all these things. And then Hugo was like, yo, dude, this, this space is amazing. Like, we should really consider it. And then I talked to the owners of the building. I was like, yeah, we can do it. But like, I want this and this and this and this and this. It's like they paid for the full refurbishment and like all these things made demands. Yeah. And then, and then we found Jakob, which is like the best store manager ever. Like, he's the coolest and sweetest dude.

[James]

But he's a great face for the brand, I will say.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. You know, puts that on and we use him as like, like when we do the outfits before they like lookbooks and stuff because like it's nice to have a cool looking dude.

[James]

Absolutely.

[Sigurd]

Outfits on never hurts.

[James]

But you don't want him on camera, but against him.

[Sigurd]

But like he did. I think he did some stuff. I don't know, it's. It's more like you don't want to force your employees to, you know.

[Lawrence]

Yeah. You shouldn't be forcing them to do things they don't want to do.

[Sigurd]

No, no, no, no. But it's more like if he doesn't feel like it's. Maybe it's hard to say no, like, when I ask him kind of like, and his job is like the storm and. Yeah, but. But yeah, then we opened the store and, like, and we. We set the budget here and then kind of like every single month has been like, way over the budget.

[James]

So that's great.

[Sigurd]

So. Yeah, that's amazing, you know, but. But I'm so. Yeah, so that, of course, gives you some. Some excitement or like, to open maybe another place, you know, Sir. But every time you open stores and every time you do, like, grow to some extent, it also comes with more like, like excess stock and like all these things. Right. I'm. Which I'm always trying to prevent. And. And the same. Same like people is always said, like, everything is like, sold out quite fast online. It's like not every. Every, like, not every product, but like some like. And it's. It's. It's. It's not because we're trying to. To. To create like, scarcity or hype or anything. It's more like I would rather have a product selling out than having too much duck.

[Lawrence]

Again, not wasteful.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly.

[James]

How much. How much money do you think you've left on the table over nine years by, you know, mainly using dead stock fabric and only. Only kind of boxing yourself into having relatively small runs of each design?

[Sigurd]

How much money I left, like, left out of.

[James]

Yeah. What do you think you could have gotten that you weren't able to get.

[Sigurd]

Like, ton of money.

[James]

All of this, like a million kroner.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, no way more.

[James]

100 million kroner.

[Sigurd]

You know, like, just. Just that jacket, like the. The fireman's, like the class jacket. I think we could have produced like, like thousands.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

You know, and still sell them out.

[James]

No. Do you ever get tempted to. To create your own. Like, do you create your own textiles or is it always just that?

[Sigurd]

No, yeah, we do. Yeah. Yeah, we do.

[James]

As. As like you've had to make more inventory has, like, it shifted from mainly focusing on dead stock to, you know, hey, let's be realistic. We gotta make our. We gotta sew our. We gotta weave our own.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

To meet demand in some. To some degree.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. So. So. So we never only did. Did deadstock.

[Lawrence]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

So it's just. That's kind of how it started. Like, I bought like, bulk of dead stocks.

[James]

Right.

[Sigurd]

And it. It was so when I went in Denmark. What's that?

[James]

No, it's a.

[Lawrence]

It's a reference that you don't get because you don't have hbo.

[James]

Did you ever watch the show how to make it in America?

[Sigurd]

Yeah, they bought that.

[James]

They bought the bolt of raw denim.

[Lawrence]

How to make it in Denmark.

[Sigurd]

Dennis, when is season two?

[James]

We'll ask our boys.

[Lawrence]

Been long canceled, my friends.

[Sigurd]

Is it you guys?

[Lawrence]

Oh.

[James]

How to. How to not make it in America.

[Lawrence]

How to do kind of well in America.

[Sigurd]

How to talk pink separate shorts.

[James]

No.

[Sigurd]

So, like, I was working for different companies.

[Lawrence]

Yep.

[Sigurd]

Like, doing, like. So I'm. I'm educated within production, like, sourcing and production. So I was working for different companies, like, doing production design and stuff. And then. And then I went to factory visits and like. Okay, so what's. What's up with all the dead stock? Like, they always have, like. Like rolls lying around the bolts. Yeah. And then they're like, yeah, it's just stuff. You can get it for cheap. And I was like, okay, let's go. And then Price is right.

[Lawrence]

Run it.

[Sigurd]

And then I got a job at a bar. Like, this Mexican bar.

[James]

Hell yeah. Mind if a white boy speak a little espanol tonight?

[Sigurd]

No, no.

[James]

Okay. You're at the bar and you got waste, and you're like, I got an idea. I'll start a brand.

[Sigurd]

No, no, I got. I got a job in the bar so I could start the brand.

[Lawrence]

Oh, to fund it, you had to fund so you could buy the bolts of.

[Sigurd]

Of that. Yeah. So, like, I was working and I got a shitty pay. Like, not in the bar. Yeah, shitty. But, like, also the companies I work for, because back then I was, like, freshly educated and I was like, I'm heavy as long as I get a job.

[James]

Right?

[Sigurd]

Right.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

So I. I underpaid very few money. But then I. I start buying, like, buying the. The fabrics and making samples and stuff. And like. And since that day, I never had any. What do you say? Like. Like, what's it called? Like, dead debt. Yeah. Yeah. I never had debt in the company. I never. I never had any investors or anything. It's.

[Lawrence]

It's all fully independent.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. And naturally growing since then. And that's because I started, like, just working my ass off, like, with other jobs.

[James]

Would you ever take invest like a investment from an outside party?

[Sigurd]

I don't think so, really.

[Lawrence]

Even if it was like.

[James]

I mean, college in Denmark's got to be, or. No, you have free education, rather.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, but, like, no, like, I'm. I'm like it. Not saying there's anything wrong about getting investments, but. Why would I want it, though?

[James]

Fucking cash out, baby.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

No, it's like, getting more sunglasses. No, I'm. I'm. I'm. I know. Like, I mf. Pen is in its own little, you know, its own little, like, bubble, like you said, entity. And, like, it's. It's quite successful. And I'm like, you could get money invested to. To grow. Yeah, but, like, if growth is not the answer, and if. Yeah, if you could get investments to cash out. But, like, that's not where I am right now.

[James]

I mean, you're a fabric nerd through and through, Right? Like, that's kind of what drives you. What's the one fabric for fall 25 that has got you most rock hard? Who's that inner nerd is just stroking for it?

[Lawrence]

I don't know.

[James]

We did.

[Sigurd]

We did a. We did a corduroy trouser with, like. Like, this. This wash effect we did with laser.

[James]

Oh, those weren't denim.

[Sigurd]

No, it's quarter cord, baby.

[James]

Are they. Are they in the store now?

[Sigurd]

Yeah, I think so.

[James]

Is it kind of like a fuzzy.

[Sigurd]

Pant, or is it gray beige?

[James]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Sigurd]

It has this wash effect. And then we did. Did. We did it with laser. But the thing with laser, it burns. Laser. Laser, it. It burns the fabric.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

So instead of getting it lighter, it gets it darker on some fabrics.

[James]

Right.

[Sigurd]

Oh, s. So it kind of looks stained.

[Lawrence]

Well done.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. You know, and. And. And I was like, yeah, that's. So we do a lot of. Lot of tests or, like, experiments with laser. Like, almost. Almost all of it doesn't make it to the collection, but let sometimes, like, this was also kind of as a. It came out as a mistake in a way. But, like, yeah, it looks pretty cool. Yeah, we kept it.

[James]

How do you. How does. Like, how do you hear about these, like, new production techniques? Are you. Like, some guys, you're like, yo, by the way, I got a laser in the back if you want to go some up.

[Sigurd]

So go door.

[Lawrence]

Door. Selling vacuums.

[James]

No, you're like, okay, yeah, we got the blue striped shirt. We got the denim. Yo, you guys want. You guys want to around with the laser, like, corduroy?

[Sigurd]

Everyone who works with textiles know, like, the factory is always pushing, you know? Like, I remember at one point there was, like, a factory, like, pushing. Like, why don't you want to make your jeans, like, waterproof?

[Lawrence]

Swimming in jeans?

[Sigurd]

No, it's like. It's like, it rains. It rains a lot in Denmark.

[Lawrence]

Like, why don't you do that Gore Tex jeans?

[Sigurd]

And I was like, yeah, it's just like, I think I prefer my jeans. If it rains, I would like to get them wet. Right.

[Lawrence]

Like, it's like them as a natural.

[Sigurd]

And then. And then. Yeah, and then. So we never. We of course never did it. And then like two years later, I was like, like, so what. What happens with waterproof jeans? And they're like, yeah, like, it gives you cancer.

[Lawrence]

Oh.

[James]

It only took two years. Jesus Christ.

[Sigurd]

So good call, bro. But like, it's like, it's like, like, no, not many brands invent stuff. It's like, it's. It's all the factories, laundry houses, they invent stuff and then they present you stuff, and then, like, you. You have that, and then you work out from that. So, like, we, we were like, okay, what happens if we do this on corduroy instead of den them and look at all these things? And, and, and to some extent, I would also say, like, a lot of credit to the big fashion houses.

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

You know, like, so we work with a laundry, like, Balenciaga, does stuff there like Louisville. And. And they, they experiment a lot. Like, we don't have a team to do all this stuff.

[James]

You don't have mad scientists that are.

[Sigurd]

Like, in the lab, so they have a full team.

[James]

What if we gave our customers cancer?

[Sigurd]

Yeah. No, so don't, don't, don't wear waterproof jeans.

[Lawrence]

Do not wear waterproof. Yeah, if someone coaches you some waterproof jeans, politely decline two years.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. So, so, so, so, so a lot of these fashion houses do a lot of, like, experiments as well. Sure. You can piggyback on that sometimes.

[James]

Right, right, right.

[Sigurd]

And that's why.

[James]

That's a nice little hack.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. But I think you. That's also why you see a lot of times a lot of brands doing the same stuff.

[Lawrence]

Sure.

[Sigurd]

Right.

[James]

So the factories are like, do the factories tell you, like, oh, you know, XYZ guy over here? Like, they did it because you might know if Loewe does it. Right. Or Balency does it, but you might not know that. Like, like, I don't know, insert contemporary brand, parallel brand to you guys over here.

[Sigurd]

Like, we, like, was it.

[James]

Was there a factory that make fireman class? It's like, yo, do I got a idea for you to like all the brands that all of a sudden we're just doing fireman jackets?

[Sigurd]

No, no, I think that's, that's just Tumblr, I guess, or like, okay, like.

[James]

Pinterest, like, what, the one reference photo that goes around.

[Lawrence]

Yeah, Tumblr just hit Denmark.

[Sigurd]

No, but like, no, it's like, I think it's more like the factories. Like at least the factories we work with in laundry houses. More like we got this new technology.

[Lawrence]

You know, and they're selling it to all the clients. They're not like sharing secrets or anything.

[Sigurd]

No, but that's. No, but that's like they have showrooms and then you can see what they can do. But like, we always try to push it. Like, we never do like the thing they can do and like one on, one by like one off. Like, you always try to push it in some direction.

[James]

Oh, you're doing it with denim. Let's do it with corduroy, right?

[Sigurd]

Yeah. And like. And like. Okay, how can we do this, like, effect in some, like some way different than like. But for example, like, we did a, we, we had a, a denim for SS25. Like, we called it like the punch out jeans because they had this like laser punch out effect. And that was this like, whatever random, random women's wear brand that had this floral pattern and we just took the same pattern and then we did the, the punch out.

[James]

Nice.

[Sigurd]

So it's actually, it's. It's flowers, but it just looks like a random pattern patent. So we took their. Like, like, they probably don't know this.

[Lawrence]

But like, you know, they do now.

[Sigurd]

But like, sometimes you also just takes what's available and then you. You mix and freak it. Yeah, exactly.

[James]

Exactly.

[Lawrence]

Sick.

[James]

A big moment for you guys, I think recently was you're nominated for the LVMH prize. Were you butthurt at all about not winning it?

[Sigurd]

No.

[Lawrence]

Did you, did you think you were gonna win? Like, what did you feel in your heart?

[Sigurd]

I don't know. I don't know. Like, you, you. I think there's always some part of you that, like, I could do this. Yeah. No, but like, I've. Every time I'm in these, like when I'm in these prices, it's not, I'm not. I'm more sad that I lose. Not that I don't. Didn't win. It's more like.

[Lawrence]

Right. Yeah, you don't want, you don't necessarily want like the money or the prize, but. But you don't want to be like, seen as a loser. Yeah, yeah, I get that.

[Sigurd]

Right.

[Lawrence]

Would you rather not be nominated then in that case, or is that an honor? Is it an honor just to be nominated?

[Sigurd]

So, So I, I think this can come out as a little bit like, I don't know, what, what, how do you say, pretentious? No, not pretentious, but like, like, you're not, like, happy for what you get.

[James]

Yeah.

[Lawrence]

Okay. Ingredients.

[James]

You take it for granted.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Okay. This is the something you can cut out. Sure. All the asking.

[James]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Sigurd]

No, but, like, yeah, it sounds like a bit that I took it for granted, but, like, those three days, like, we went to the semi finals, like, was mentally exhausting for me. Sure. Like, it was, you know, so. So.

[James]

Well, that's kind of playing the game, right?

[Sigurd]

Yeah. With all that circus, you know, like. Like, and. And you have all these, like, you know, an event tour was there and, like. Oh. And she was like, oh, this is a beautiful jacket. It's so soft and that's cool. And she was. She was quite cool. Like, I was like, that's nice to hear. Where's the hot coffee? Where's the, like, all this. Like, this. The shouting and like. Like, not the shouting, but, you know, like, this. No, but the arrogance spectrum, like the Devil versus Prada.

[James]

Were you shook it all when Anna Wintour was reviewing your clothes?

[Sigurd]

No, but the thing is, you're standing here for three days, and there's so many coming by, and you're just saying the same thing over and over again. Like, you know, yeah, we're gonna have a.

[James]

We're gonna have a pop of color in there next season. Don't worry.

[Sigurd]

And I was standing there together with Jonathan. Like, we're both in, like, the. The guy I talked about earlier. We both in, like, late 30s, and we're both like, we too old. Like, it feels like you're back in school, you're sending this, like. Like, your collection. Something. Right.

[James]

Were the other designers, like, a lot younger? Because it was the emerging brands. Right. And you guys are. At this point, we're nine years old. Yeah.

[Sigurd]

And. And. But pretty. I think the rule is you have to be below. What do you say? Below. Under 40.

[Lawrence]

Okay.

[James]

Age.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

Oh, okay.

[Sigurd]

That's the thing. And. And. Yeah, And. And. But the best part was, like, you have someone coming, like, we in the showroom, and like, a guy from his, like, head of production for. For, like, Prade something. Something. Right. Like outerwear or something. And he's just looking. It's like, oh, you did this before? Like, yeah, like, I can see. And. And. And these guys. And then you had all the influences. Like, so we had. We had, like, Jaden Smith. Okay. And he's the rapper. Yeah. I don't know. Like. Yeah, so he's.

[James]

He's the Karate Kid.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, he's. He's there. And, like, he's like a. Like, Ambassador of the prize, Right, Man.

[James]

What was his ass fit looking like?

[Sigurd]

No, I don't know.

[Lawrence]

A white Batman suit?

[James]

Tom Brown castle on his head?

[Sigurd]

No, but, like. Yeah, but he was. He was, you know. Yeah, he was nice, I guess. Like, that's. He was. But then he was like, like, oh, tell me about the collection. I was like, yeah, I was like, so we have this, and he's like. He takes out, like, a striped shirt. Blue striped shirt. Because we had a collection that represented, like, the best of him again. Yeah, like, some. Like, some greatest hits, like, some crazy. Crazy stuff. Like, you know, like, the laser stuff and, like, some from some. We had, like, stuff that's made from, like, Margiela fabrics that coming out next year, actually, like.

[James]

Oh, so you did find a use for that Margiela fabric that's coming out next year? Okay.

[Lawrence]

Hell yeah.

[Sigurd]

Fun Anniversary collection.

[Lawrence]

Sick.

[James]

So it says Margiela on it. Can you do that legally?

[Sigurd]

I guess so.

[James]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

But, like, if they. If they.

[James]

If they and Asagi blessed it.

[Sigurd]

But yeah, if they send the season desist, like, it just gets us more. That's true.

[James]

On your Supreme. On your supreme.

[Sigurd]

So, like, like, we use the, like, trash, like liftovers. Yeah, they don't want us to use them, but, like, what, are we gonna burn it? You know, and, like, honestly, it's kind.

[James]

Of loser behavior to sue you over using their garbage.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, but I think I. I think it's actually legal. They sold the fabric at one point or one of the factories that. And I bought it fair and square.

[James]

Yeah.

[Lawrence]

Yeah. Legally.

[Sigurd]

So. Yeah. So we had these products in the showroom, and, like. And he just picks out the something like, oh, this is amazing. This is beautiful. And it's just a blue striped shirt. I was like, dude, it's a blue stripe shirt. But he has to be that guy. Yeah, it's like, you know, I mean.

[James]

In the same way that you were giving the same spiel over three days, he was probably saying the same, too.

[Sigurd]

Exactly.

[James]

Oh, this is amazing.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. You know, and. And. And. And in all fairness, like, our stuff is very boring at WMH price.

[James]

Oh, shut the up.

[Sigurd]

No, no, but, like, sound like conceptual, like, something everyone is like. And everyone is doing an amazing job and, like, but they all have these, like. Like, I did this, like, for five days in my bedroom, I said. And, you know, like, they. They did all this, you know, like, having these crazy concepts and stuff. Yeah, this is amazing. But, like, we were just standing there.

[James]

Like, blue striped shirt.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. You know, like. Like, no, but the End of the day, we just want to do very, very good product. Right.

[Lawrence]

Right.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. I'm not saying that we're not designing anything, but like it's, it's just get, you know.

[James]

Right.

[Lawrence]

And it's gonna be hard being a menswear brand too, like, because it's like.

[Sigurd]

Less, you know, and, and then I think, I think we probably, you know, like, like have. Have like a bigger turnover like than all of these brands combined.

[Hugo]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

You know, like.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

I'm not saying that to like frustrate or anything. It's more like we felt a bit too established.

[James]

I'll say this from where we're sitting, I couldn't name you a LV Mage prize winner.

[Lawrence]

Yeah. What happened to all these winners, dude?

[Sigurd]

I don't know.

[Lawrence]

What do you get? You get 75 GS. What do you get?

[Sigurd]

300,000. €300,000.

[Lawrence]

What would you find with the money?

[Sigurd]

I don't know. 300.

[Lawrence]

Were you thinking of what you're gonna do with the money?

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[Lawrence]

What were you gonna do?

[James]

Go to Crete, Go to a Cree concert, VIP backstage pass, hire Scott stepped of sing at my daughter's birthday party?

[Sigurd]

I don't know. Like, but, but, but, but, but it's like so, so when they called me and I was like, yeah, you didn't make it to the final.

[Lawrence]

I was like, oh, you're like relieved.

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

100. But of course I get back to my job. No, but there was the. I'm not trying to be like. But it's more like I felt to some extent like sad because you like, like up with me. But then again, like w. You know, like I'm happy I don't have to go to that final because like it just it for me, mentally exhausting, like the circus around it, like all these things and, and, and all those three days I just felt like I actually just want to be back at the office, like working like.

[James]

Yes.

[Sigurd]

You know.

[Lawrence]

Well, now you got.

[James]

I got a 10 year anniversary coming up.

[Hugo]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

No, but some, some designers are extremely good at staining and talking all day. Sure.

[Lawrence]

You know, and some designers need to win that prize to keep going where, like, you guys have a robust business.

[Sigurd]

We don't need it. Like, I would love winning it. Winning it. But like, it's like we don't need it. Like, it's like, totally.

[James]

You know what? You gave us a little taste, little nugget of your plans for the 10th anniversary next year. What else can we expect? What are some plans for the big birthday? We're Doing big birthday boy.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, we. We. So in the main collection, like we have like the spring, summer 26. We're doing a collab with the reproduction of found.

[James]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

Like Japanese brand.

[James]

So spring 26, that's the anniversary of.

[Sigurd]

No, so like. So like full year of anniversary. Okay. No, it's not my birthday month.

[James]

It's my birthday over here.

[Sigurd]

The thing is everything, everything has just been come like, yo, we have like, like anniversary next year and like what are we going to do? And like everything just like a lot of ideas and then ended up just going with everything.

[Lawrence]

Yeah, we'll do all that.

[Sigurd]

No, like we want to have a party and we want to have like all these things. But like. Yeah, we have a collab reproduction found which was also like. It's in the collection photos for S26. Then we're working on. I just had to clear this the other day. But we're working on some collabs with New Balance.

[Lawrence]

Oh, spicy. That's gonna be a banger.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, so like that's big. Yeah, huge. Dude, shout out to Mike from. From New balance.

[Lawrence]

There's probably 80, 000 mics.

[Sigurd]

No. Yeah, but he cleared that. It's okay to talk about it.

[Lawrence]

Okay.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. So we're gonna do something for next year. We're gonna do something made in uk.

[Lawrence]

Nice.

[James]

Are you gonna go to Flimby? Yeah, it's a bit far. No, it's a bit far, man.

[Lawrence]

Yeah, it's a bit. It's a bit boring.

[James]

It's a far flung. Not sick. You should go to bo.

[Lawrence]

No, no, it's fine.

[James]

But go to the bar we go into. What is it the Bullcock or something like.

[Sigurd]

Wow. Okay.

[Lawrence]

Yeah, yeah, get busy on the touch tunes. Yeah. And play darts.

[Sigurd]

Get some hk.

[James]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. It's one gay bar in Flimby. There's no one there. Yeah.

[Lawrence]

Completely empty.

[Sigurd]

No, but do you have.

[James]

What. Can you tell us any details? Is there a model? Is there going to be apparel?

[Sigurd]

No, it's. It's. Yeah, it's just a shoe. But I'm. We're working on. Everything changes every week. But we. We're doing something made in us that's coming later. That. That's that's all like. Like in the like line now.

[James]

So it's a full year.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, the US is like very long.

[Lawrence]

So the New Balance relationship is coming soon and coming strong.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, yeah.

[Lawrence]

Sick.

[Sigurd]

So. So yeah, we're going to do the made new cave thing.

[James]

Do any seating for those or.

[Lawrence]

No.

[Sigurd]

So the thing is, the thing is we're going to do it for some like, residual fabrics. We're not allowed to call it that, like legally, like, but like. Yeah, so like some forgotten fabrics.

[James]

Right.

[Sigurd]

And, and so, so the made in UK thing is going to be on very limited numbers.

[James]

We'll, we'll hit our UK guys.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

Okay. So that's so a sneaker.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

So that's a new balance.

[Sigurd]

A few new balances, yes. Then we're going to do, we're going to do a space in Dover street, street market in London with the shoes as well. And like just. Yeah, it's just everything is going to collide. What else are we going to do? Yeah. And then we're going to have a small collection as well. Like with like.

[Lawrence]

It's exciting.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. What's in this collection? Like the, the Magella stuff. That's going to be. I don't even know. I can't remember.

[James]

For your 11th birthday, you'll get a cease and desist.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

Can I see a question after an hour and a half talking together other. Is it weird that you're a hardcore metal guy, but your brand heavily borrows aesthetics and vibes from the corporate world?

[Sigurd]

No, but that's, that's, I think that's the, the full point, right?

[James]

I don't know.

[Lawrence]

The juxtaposition.

[James]

Tell me.

[Sigurd]

No, yeah, it's like I, I, I, I love, I do love suiting. Like, for me, that's, that's the, I wouldn't say the epiphany, but it, like, it's, it's some like in menswear. It's like that's, it's very hard product to make. It's, it's, it's, it's a very, like, you need a very good factory. Like they, they, you need skillful workers and all these things. And I think for me it needs, yeah, you said juxtapose. It needs a say, like a like attention. Yeah, it needs attention. It needs a contrast somehow. Like, and for me, I put it in where like, you know, I always. I don't like Finance Bros. I don't like all these. So like I play golf from time to time and every time I play golf, I always put on my like, like most brutal, like metal tea, something. Right. Like, so it looks.

[James]

They must love you at the clubhouse.

[Sigurd]

Yeah. So they see like, okay, this guy, like, he hates Jesus. Yeah.

[Lawrence]

God.

[James]

This guy doesn't. With God.

[Sigurd]

Your God is dead. No, but, but you know what I mean. Like, it's, it's, it's. I like the contrast of doing something, you know, like, Like I don't like the corporate world, but I, I do like suits, and I, I, I like to tap into it and then somehow having this, this, like, contrast within, within the aesthetic. Right. We're just like these small little, you know, tweaks.

[Lawrence]

Punk rock.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

The shirt that I got flowed to me. I mean, it was a kind of like a banker stripe, blue and white textile, but then cut in like a pretty forgiving, like, baggy shirt. Which is like, how. I don't know, like, we have been wearing our shirts for a minute now. So it was kind of that, like, contrast juxtaposition of the two entities. Do you think that. I don't know.

[Lawrence]

So it's a buttoned up shirt, but it's not a buttoned up look.

[James]

There you go.

[Sigurd]

No, it's like, it's like taking ownership of like, a, like a product and, you know, like, where you making it.

[James]

Your own punk rock.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, yeah.

[Lawrence]

Taking it back.

[James]

Would you ever. Have you ever worked in a. As a corpo dorco?

[Sigurd]

In an office? Yeah, no, I do have an office.

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

But, like, as a. I always, like, I worked in, like, restaurants and like, I, I worked in a gallery once.

[James]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

That felt corporate.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

Like selling, Selling expensive art. Sure.

[Lawrence]

To rich idiots.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

To money launderers. What's the worst job you ever had?

[Sigurd]

The worst job? Oh, I was a phone salesman. Oh, where are we selling, like, this insurance stuff?

[Lawrence]

Oh, brutal.

[Sigurd]

No, like this. And like, and, And.

[James]

God, no wonder you're depressed.

[Sigurd]

No. So I was there for, like, like five days. No, this is like, I was like, I don't know, 18, 17. I was, I was studying and then, and then, like, you, you, you. It's like. And I. So, like, they always have these, like, points, like, how much does Lawrence sell this week? How much did James and mine was like, minus.

[Lawrence]

Like, people are canceling the orders when.

[Sigurd]

They talk to you.

[James]

Losing money.

[Sigurd]

No, because you just call people that already has. Has this insurance and you want to sell them more. More.

[James]

Okay. And then we're like, you don't need more insurance.

[Sigurd]

No, and then you're like, you know, and then they. You called them like, oh, now. Now I got you. You're like, I actually want to cancel my subscription. Oh, yeah, hang up.

[James]

Hang up.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, it's like after a few days, I was, like, close to killing myself. And I was like, yeah, I'm not. Yeah.

[James]

Were you wearing, Were you wearing suit, shirt and ties to the office? No, no.

[Sigurd]

Like, okay, no, like, you could Wear whatever.

[James]

Death metal season.

[Lawrence]

Yeah. It's not a zoom call, you know.

[James]

What's the most hardcore thing about you now?

[Lawrence]

Yeah, father.

[James]

As you get a little older, as you become, you know, more of a napper, healthier, porridge porridge enthusiast.

[Lawrence]

What's hardcore about you still?

[Sigurd]

I like to go to hardcore shows. Okay, right.

[Lawrence]

Did you get in the pit?

[Sigurd]

Yeah. Okay, like, not, not that slam dance stuff. Like, I hate that stuff. But like, it's, it's. If it's a proper, like just a pit. I like that. I, I, you know, what do I do? That's hardcore.

[James]

Yeah, bro. It's badass. I don't know.

[Sigurd]

For me, it's, it's, it's. Yeah, I just get drunk, listen to. To hardcore stuff. There you go. Run around on my bike, riding, graffiti, you know, like, it's just still really. Yeah, yeah. Time. Time to time.

[James]

Oh, yeah. All right.

[Lawrence]

That's cool.

[James]

Bad boy.

[Lawrence]

It's metal.

[Sigurd]

Always have a mark on me.

[James]

I always keep that.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

What's your tag? MF Pen, dude.

[Sigurd]

Oh, he gets you.

[James]

Hugo Edwards. Yo, I heard. I got that story from Hugo where he had to accept an award on your behalf and you gave them the wrong name on purpose.

[Sigurd]

No, I don't know. No, I don't know. Like, this was the other day.

[James]

What happened?

[Sigurd]

No, so they called up my daughter's name.

[Lawrence]

What?

[James]

That so weird.

[Sigurd]

He told, he told me yesterday.

[Lawrence]

The award.

[Sigurd]

No, it's like this like the Danish fashion Prize. Something it's called like vessel and vet.

[James]

What?

[Sigurd]

But they like, it's the, the only, like, sure, I guess. Like Designers award prize in Denmark. And we got nominated and you win like, like 100 grand.

[Lawrence]

Oh, nice. Oh, yeah.

[Sigurd]

But then I was in Berlin and. And then, then like at like, who were like, you need to get on. Like, they're gonna announce the. The nominees stuff you have to get on stage. It's like, oh, sure. And like he just told me. It's like. Yeah, they called you. I was like, why?

[James]

How the did they find that out?

[Sigurd]

No.

[James]

Right. Surveillance stage.

[Lawrence]

That's crazy. That makes no sense.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, but he did a good job standing.

[James]

All right.

[Lawrence]

Standing in for your daughter who just won 100 grand, apparently.

[James]

Shout out to your daughter and here's.

[Lawrence]

A young girl nominated.

[Sigurd]

Didn't win. Yeah, it's nominated.

[Lawrence]

Yeah, he didn't win. Another.

[Sigurd]

Another L. Another loose. No, no, like, it's, it's in the. It's in.

[James]

Right here's a young girl named. And it's just Hugo. All right. Real Quick. I know that we talked a lot about numbers, sales growth, lack of marking, etc, Personally, what do you like to spend your money on?

[Sigurd]

Like food. Yeah.

[James]

How many times a week do you eat out?

[Sigurd]

It depends. But like, like during summer it's like maybe like three, three days a week. Not bad.

[Lawrence]

Good city to do that in.

[James]

Are you doing. You like hitting burger stands and, and glizzy stands? Are you doing like the 15 course sit down for four hours, your ass falls asleep, you're paying a thousand dollars in coming.

[Sigurd]

There's a lot of like, like what do you call it? Like not relaxed dinners but like, you know, like sheer style casual, you know, like. Yeah, so that. But I also, I cook a lot. I cook every day.

[James]

Oh, nice.

[Sigurd]

Like, not every day like. But I'm. I'm the one who cooks in our house. But yeah, so. And then that's a lot of records.

[James]

Yeah. What's your collection looking like these days?

[Sigurd]

Yeah, like the size. Yeah. You want to know about my size?

[Lawrence]

Yeah. How many vinyls do you own?

[James]

Don't include. Make sure to include the girth.

[Sigurd]

I don't know, like I think like a few meters. I don't, I don't know how to.

[James]

All right, like how many, how many dozens of records? Are we talking thousands? Are we talking. What are we talking about?

[Sigurd]

No, like I, I like to get rid of records as well.

[Lawrence]

Okay, okay.

[Sigurd]

Like I, I like because like you.

[Lawrence]

You get one in, one out.

[Sigurd]

No, like five in, one out.

[James]

Are you like, Are you like digging in the crates for like rare gems?

[Sigurd]

Sometimes. Okay, sometimes. But I, it's like, it's like sometimes just like takes forever and then sometimes if you start one box you feel like you have to go through all of them and it's easier just like I, it, you know. Yeah. But yeah, like I like, you know, lately I found it like record the other day and a Steve Reich record was like, like first press and stuff like that was insane. But yeah, I like to have good stuff rather than have a lot of stuff.

[Lawrence]

Stuff that's quantity. Not. No, quality, not quantity.

[Sigurd]

But also the thing with, the thing with records, like you, you. If you have too many, like it's just get like you end up not listening to having.

[Lawrence]

Yeah. Just dusty.

[Sigurd]

Yeah, exactly. Also because you can't find them because you so many, you know, you should advertise them. Yeah. I think that's what I spend my money on.

[James]

It's music and food.

[Sigurd]

Music and food. Yeah.

[James]

Major food groups. Sigurd, before we get out of here and get started on our evening out in C with our spirit guide over here, do you have any constructive criticism you would like to give us now that we spent an hour and a half potting together?

[Sigurd]

Like criticism on this interview?

[Lawrence]

Constructive criticism generally.

[James]

Long time friends, one time collaborators.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

What can we change? Lawrence is not wearing enough MF pen.

[Lawrence]

I wore. I have my MF Pen TF jeans, but I wore them on the plane.

[Sigurd]

Because they're the most comfortable jeans.

[Lawrence]

I'm just saying.

[James]

Do you have an MFN trench on yesterday?

[Lawrence]

No. That's early.

[James]

Oh, sorry.

[Sigurd]

Oh, damn.

[James]

I wore that trench at that.

[Lawrence]

Did you? I don't.

[Sigurd]

No, no.

[James]

That photo shoot.

[Lawrence]

Oh, okay.

[James]

Yeah, yeah, my bad, my bad.

[Sigurd]

I know. I don't. I don't think so.

[James]

No. Nothing.

[Sigurd]

No, we're perfect. No, I. No. No way in.

[Lawrence]

No way, shape or form. But you're just like.

[Sigurd]

I, I, I think we had one night out in New York. Oh, yeah. That was a.

[Lawrence]

You had fun.

[James]

Big one.

[Lawrence]

That was a big one.

[James]

That was a big one. We went to places we became. We became three tequilas. We went to places we would go with a gun.

[Sigurd]

She'll go have photos from that night that's never gonna see light. I hope.

[James]

I hope those right now.

[Lawrence]

Yeah.

[Sigurd]

No. You know the hidden folder on iPhone?

[Lawrence]

Okay, let's still delete them. Yes.

[James]

Whoever leaked his daughter's name to the war show, please don't hack Hugo's phone and delete those photos as well. All right, Sigurd, we want to thank you for coming on to the only podcast.

[Lawrence]

Where did the kids follow you?

[James]

What do you want to plug?

[Lawrence]

What's the address for this?

[James]

It's October right now. Or September.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

I don't know.

[Lawrence]

Yeah. When? We don't know when this. We're in the future right now.

[James]

Yo. Come to the store and, like, touch this, right?

[Lawrence]

If you're in Copenhagen, stop by.

[Sigurd]

Yeah.

[James]

Fall collection out now.

[Lawrence]

Follow on Instagram before you send a thirsty DM at. @. You know, follow MF Pen on Instagram.

[James]

Don't expect to collab post or, or get dressed or seating or anything. No, that's it, right?

[Lawrence]

You're not good at self promotion, dog.

[Sigurd]

Oh, you want me to.

[Lawrence]

What else? What do we miss?

[Sigurd]

I don't know. Like, like, go buy some.

[James]

Go buy some MF Pen.

[Sigurd]

All right, this is. This is intense right now.

[James]

Stay tuned for.

[Lawrence]

At the end.

[James]

Stay tuned for year ten. Stay tuned for the next ten years. Right?

[Sigurd]

Yes.

[James]

Thank you.

[Sigurd]

Thank you.

[Lawrence]

Thanks, buddy.

[Sigurd]

Chef One love.

[James]

Take us the fuck out.

[Hugo]

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