Biden Farewell Address, Trump Secures END Of Israel Hamas War w/Bobby Sauce

Summary

Summary: Timcast IRL Episode - "Biden Farewell Address, Trump Secures END Of Israel Hamas War w/Bobby Sauce"

Introduction

In the January 16, 2025 episode of "Timcast IRL," host Tim Pool engages in a fiery discussion focusing on two major topics: former President Donald Trump's purported role in ending the Israel-Hamas conflict and President Joe Biden's impending farewell address. The episode features guests Bobby Sauce, Phil Labonte, Brett Dasovic, and Raymond G. Stanley Jr., who offer a mix of analysis, skepticism, and critique throughout the conversation.

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Trump’s Role in Ending the Israel-Hamas War

At the outset (00:00), Tim Pool announces significant news: Donald Trump is being credited with negotiating an end to the Israel-Hamas war. He remarks, “This man negotiated the end of the Israel Hamas war. He's getting credit from people who do not like him, and Joe Biden's trying to steal that credit.”

Key Points:

• Bipartisan Praise for Trump: Pool observes that both pro-Palestinian and pro-Israeli individuals are lauding Trump's efforts.
• Public Perception: He notes a broad base of support, including from those typically critical of Trump.
• Future Implications: Pool speculates on the longevity and effectiveness of the ceasefire agreement.

Notable Quotes:

• Tim Pool [00:00]: “Donald Trump did an amazing thing, putting pressure to get this ceasefire agreement. We're going to see how it plays out.”

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Biden’s Farewell Address

Tim Pool transitions to discussing President Biden’s farewell address, expressing doubt about its authenticity and substance.

Key Points:

• Skepticism of Sincerity (01:34): Pool suggests viewers should imagine Biden’s every word as repeating “I’m leaving,” implying the speech lacks meaningful content.
• Pre-recorded Nature (03:00): Guests, particularly Phil Labonte, argue that the address seems scripted and devoid of genuine reflection or accountability.

Notable Quotes:

• Phil Labonte [03:58]: “He's not going to say the malarkey, but he's going to take credit for every single positive thing.”
• Bobby Sauce [04:35]: “Yeah. He's just telling you he's leaving... he's just telling you that.”

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Debate on Trump vs. Biden’s Achievements

The conversation shifts to a heated debate over the respective achievements of Trump and Biden, especially regarding foreign policy and domestic management.

Key Points:

• Ceasefire Credit (05:00): Pool criticizes Biden for taking undue credit for actions attributed to Trump, including the Abraham Accords.
• Economic Policies (06:27): Discussion on Trump's influence on oil production and Biden’s responses with executive orders aimed at boosting energy.
• Biden’s Success Claims (07:03): Guests argue that Biden’s claims of significant achievements are exaggerated or false.

Notable Quotes:

• Tim Pool [05:00]: “Trump negotiated the end of the Afghanistan war and then Joe Biden destroys it all.”
• Bobby Sauce [07:20]: “It has nothing going on upstairs. He didn't negotiate any deal. He's soggy. He's got a soggy brain.”

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State-Level Issues: California Wildfires and Governance

A substantial portion of the episode critiques California’s handling of wildfires and broader governance issues under Governor Gavin Newsom.

Key Points:

• Mismanagement (06:27): Guests blame Newsom for inadequate responses to wildfires, citing understaffed and ill-equipped fire departments.
• Sanctuary State Policies: Criticism of California’s immigration policies as overstepping federal authority.
• Economic Impact: Discussion on high taxes and the economic strain on residents exacerbated by natural disasters.

Notable Quotes:

• Tim Pool [42:40]: “Donald Trump’s got a lot more problem than that.”
• Phil Labonte [43:32]: “They didn't punish the wealthy. Just made the wealthy pay the by play by the rules. Everybody else had to.”

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TikTok Ban and Chinese Influence Operations

The latter half of the episode delves into the controversial topic of TikTok’s potential shutdown in the U.S., sparking a robust debate among the hosts.

Key Points:

• National Security Concerns (59:50): Tim Pool argues that TikTok, owned by ByteDance (a Chinese company), poses a threat due to potential Chinese influence over American youth.
• Legislative Details (75:26): Discussion on the specifics of the bill targeting TikTok and similar platforms from adversarial nations.
• Arguments Against the Ban:
  • Bobby Sauce’s Counterpoints: Questions the logic of singling out TikTok, pointing out that other platforms also manipulate content feeds.
  • Precedent Concerns: Fears of dangerous precedents if only specific platforms are targeted based on foreign ownership.

Notable Quotes:

• Tim Pool [63:00]: “China do not have free speech in America. They should divest. And if they don't, they can't operate on US Servers.”
• Bobby Sauce [75:26]: “The bill is exceptionally vague and could cover a multitude of other websites that TikTok is not the only one of.”

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Regulation, Free Speech, and Moral Boundaries

The discussion broadens to encompass themes of government regulation, free speech, and the moral implications of banning certain products or platforms.

Key Points:

• Comparison to Banning Substances (118:26): Guests debate whether banning harmful substances like plastics or drugs parallels the potential TikTok ban.
• Principle vs. Practicality (125:07): Bobby Sauce emphasizes the importance of allowing free distribution of ideas rather than relying solely on government bans.
• Moral Responsibility: Tim Pool argues for government intervention to protect citizens from harmful influences, likening it to parental guidance.

Notable Quotes:

• Bobby Sauce [125:07]: “So could you solve the problem through information as opposed to through banning?”
• Tim Pool [126:03]: “Good luck finding food not wrapped in plastic.”

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Conclusion

As the episode wraps up, Tim Pool encourages listeners to join the Timcast community, emphasizing the importance of membership support for ongoing operations and future discussions. The conversation concludes with final remarks on the complexities of balancing national security, free speech, and effective governance.

Final Remarks:

• Call to Action (109:39): Tim Pool urges listeners to become members to support the channel’s mission.
• Ongoing Debates (117:03): The hosts indicate that many of these critical issues will continue to be explored in future episodes.

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Notable Quotes Compilation:

• Tim Pool [05:00]: “Trump negotiated the end of the Afghanistan war and then Joe Biden destroys it all.”
• Phil Labonte [03:58]: “He's not going to say the malarkey, but he's going to take credit for every single positive thing.”
• Bobby Sauce [07:20]: “It has nothing going on upstairs. He didn't negotiate any deal. He's soggy. He's got a soggy brain.”
• Tim Pool [63:00]: “China do not have free speech in America. They should divest. And if they don't, they can't operate on US Servers.”
• Bobby Sauce [75:26]: “The bill is exceptionally vague and could cover a multitude of other websites that TikTok is not the only one of.”

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This episode of "Timcast IRL" offers a critical examination of recent political developments, highlighting the ongoing tension between former President Trump and President Biden, concerns over state governance, and the broader implications of foreign influence in American digital platforms. The lively debate among the hosts underscores the complexities of these issues and the polarized perspectives surrounding them.

Transcript

[Tim Pool]

It is a huge day for Donald Trump. This man negotiated the end of the Israel Hamas war. He's getting credit from people who do not like him, and Joe Biden's trying to steal that credit. But I am seeing people who love Palestine and are critical of Israel, and I see people who love Israel and are critical of Hamas, and they're all basically saying, donald Trump did an amazing thing, putting pressure to get this ceasefire agreement. We're going to see how it plays out. Will be very interesting, but it's huge, huge news. In the meantime, we got started a little bit early because at 8 o'clock, Joe Biden will be giving his farewell address to the nation. I know many of you may be. Well, you may not like this man and you may not want to hear what he says, but I want you to do this. If you don't like Joe Biden, as you watch him give this speech, just imagine every word out of his mouth or every sentence is simply, I'm leaving, I'm leaving, I'm leaving, I'm leaving. And it doesn't matter what else he says. He's just telling you he's leaving. And in about four and a half days, oh, boy, we're gonna have President Donald J. Trump, and hopefully we'll get confirmations on everybody else. Before we get started, my friends, head over to cast brew.com and buy some coffee. Look at all this beautiful coffee. We got Phil dressed like Santa Claus. Look at that one. Let's go. We got Ian's graphene dream that I. He sold 1250 bags. I think what's happening is every time I say, Ian sells coffee like crazy, everybody rushes to buy it because they're like, it must be the best coffee in the world. But all you're doing is making Ian rich. You don't know what he will do with that power. You cannot trust him with it.

[Phil Labonte]

He's gonna buy graphene.

[Tim Pool]

He's gonna buy graphene. Also, you can head over to boonieshq.com and pick up the new 28th Amendment skateboard. Nothing else matters. Look at this doodle of that chicken. Okay, if you're not watching live, you're missing out, because this picture of this chicken is the greatest doodle of a chicken ever made. And it's a picture of Roberto Jr. Rest in peace, RIP and so go. Boonieshq.com, we got a bunch of different graphics and fun boards and stickers. We got step on SNEK and find out stickers. Look how cool that is. You can also go to timcast.com, click join us, become a member. We're gonna have that members only show coming up for you tonight at 10pm not so family friendly, but always funny. Now here's the most important thing. When you become a member, you get access to the Discord community. And this is over 20,000 individuals. You're gonna make friends, you're gonna network with people. We just had someone call me the other day and said that they're working on new projects together. If you wanna meet to find a passion, your mission and make friends. Timcast.com Discord where it's at and you get to call into the show, talk to us and our guests. So smash that like button. Share the show with everyone you know. Joining us tonight to talk about this and so much more is Bobby Sauce.

[Bobby Sauce]

Thank you for having me, sir.

[Tim Pool]

Who are you? What do you do?

[Bobby Sauce]

Political comedian, joke maker, video creator, slayer of political demons.

[Tim Pool]

That's easy enough. Yeah, Raymond G's hanging out.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

What's up, friends? Raymond G. Stanley Jr. I work here. I do stuff. American, mean American marine veteran. That's all I got. I look forward to Joe Bumbling and his talking and being hanging out with Bobby Sass.

[Tim Pool]

Brett's hanging out.

[Brett Dasovic]

So like you took that direction so well. He'd have done that. I've been like, what do you want me to do?

[Tim Pool]

So. So those who couldn't see. I don't know. Yes, right. Yeah, he knows hand signs and then he slid over. Guys.

[Brett Dasovic]

Yes, Brett here. Normally, Monday through Friday at 3pm I am hosting Pop Culture Crisis with Mary. Tonight, however, let's talk politics.

[Phil Labonte]

Hello, everybody. My name is Phil labonte. I'm the lead singer of the heavy metal band all that Remains. I'm an anti communist and a counter revolutionary. Let's go.

[Tim Pool]

Here we are. So, ladies and gentlemen, right now we are currently waiting for the. You know, I hate to call him the president at this point. The lame duck. Let's call him the lame duck. It's kind of sad considering it was one term and he's been a lame duck for the whole year. But he's going to pop in at any moment. So before we get started, because we did start a little bit early because we didn't want to cut off his speech with introductions. I'm curious, do you they're taking bets on things that he's going to. He's going to say. Some people are. I think there's a poly market for whether he says malarkey.

[Phil Labonte]

I don't think he's going to say the malarkey, but he's going to take credit for every single positive thing. He's going to say it's all his fault. He did it all. Everything. Everything that's in any way or any. Everything that can be cast in a negative light, he's going to blame on Donald Trump. It was all Donald Trump's fault. He's. And so, like, even watching this, like, we'll get some yucks out of it, but there's no point in actually paying close attention because he's not going to say anything interesting. He's not going to talk about any of his failures or anything. He's not going to talk about Afghanistan and if he does talk about Afghanistan or anything, he's going to say how great of a job he did. So it's all going to be just fluff and garbage.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

Bobby, you were saying it's going to be like nine minutes.

[Bobby Sauce]

I'm thinking it's going to be nine minutes and I'm thinking the one guaranteed statement is going to be it's not hyperbole. It's not hyperbole.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

He's going to say, no joke.

[Bobby Sauce]

That's what he's going to say for sure.

[Tim Pool]

What's. I wonder if there's a polymarket on whether or not he falls asleep mid speech after. Cart him out.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, that's why it'll be nine minutes. He's just soggy. He has nothing going on upstairs. He didn't negotiate any deal. He's soggy. He's got a soggy brain. It's going to be eight minutes. That's all they can get out of him.

[Tim Pool]

That's crazy too, because we're obviously going to talk about the ceasefire deal. This is huge news. It's remarkable for me to see people who hate Donald Trump posting on X how happy they are with Trump. And there's this clip we got from Don Lemon's show where this woman is like, I don't like Trump, but my sources are saying Trump did this and Don Lemon just goes off. He's furious. No, Donald Trump can't be the one ending wars and making the world a safer place. But Joe Biden took credit for it. Of course. I mean, it was his diplomacy.

[Phil Labonte]

So I'm like, Abraham Accords were him too?

[Tim Pool]

Yes. Did he took credit for that?

[Phil Labonte]

I'm not sure, but I'm confident they were because of Joe Biden.

[Tim Pool]

The Abraham Accords?

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure that he did those.

[Tim Pool]

You think?

[Phil Labonte]

No, I don't, but I think that's what he's going to say. No.

[Tim Pool]

Oh, right, right, right. I'm wondering if Joe Biden comes out with his farewell address taking credit for the Israel Hamas ceasefire.

[Brett Dasovic]

I mean, all of those are kind of definitely. All of those are kind of great litmus tests for how, like, for how much people actually pay attention to what's going on. Because they kind of did the same thing. Not just with. Because Trump negotiated the, you know, the pullout of Afghanistan and then of course, they botched it after the fact. But if you knew the people who actually paid attention to politics, they would have known beforehand that he was the one who actually negotiated it and then they moved it up. So whether they know Trump's relation to what happened with the Abraham Accords, the Israel, Palestine, this. Now that's a good way to check to see if people are actually paying attention or just looking at headlines.

[Tim Pool]

Most people, unfortunately.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah. Well, they've been taking credit for the oil production, which a lot of that came into play because of all the different changes that Trump made when, when he was in office. And they're like, we're outputting more oil now than we were under him. And it's like, yeah. Because these things take time to drill, refine and all the rest.

[Tim Pool]

And he banned Keystone and fracking on public lands, which is going to shock production for the next several years. Trump is going to go in on day one. They're talking about 100 executive orders and a lot of it's going to be about oil. It's going to be like, get the energy flowing.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

But you know, when I think about it, maybe, maybe Trump needs a shadow president. Right. Because here's what happens. Donald Trump negotiates the, the, the end of the Afghanistan war and then Joe Biden destroys it all. And when it goes south, Democrats all say, well, it's Trump who negotiated. This is his fault. And it's like, Trump didn't negotiate you abandoning Bagram Air force base at 3 in the morning, my fellow. Oh, here we go.

[Joe Biden]

Hey, Joe, it's pre recorded to you tonight. Of course, bro. Biden, before I begin, let me speak to important news from earlier today. Oh, here comes, here comes nonstop negotiation. My administration. By my administration. My administration. Cease fire. Hostage deal has been reached by Israel and Hamas.

[Tim Pool]

Can you get it up?

[Joe Biden]

The elements of which I laid out in great detail in May of this year. This plan was developed and negotiated by my team.

[Tim Pool]

Wow.

[Joe Biden]

And will be largely implemented by the incoming administration. That's why I told my team to keep the incoming administration fully informed because that's how it should be, working together as Americans. This will be my final address to you from the American people, from the Oval Office, from this desk as president.

[Bobby Sauce]

Wonder if it's the fake.

[Joe Biden]

And I've been thinking a lot about who we are and maybe more importantly, who we should be. Long ago, in New York harbor, an ironworker installed beam after beam, day after day. He was joined by steel workers, stonemasons, engineers. They built not just a single structure, but a beacon of freedom. The very idea of America was so big, we felt the entire world needed to see the Statue of Liberty, a gift from France after our Civil War. Like the very idea of America, it was built not by one person, but by many people from every background and from around the world, like America, the Statue of Liberty is not standing still. Her foot literally steps forward atop a broken chain of human bondage. She's on the march, and she literally moves. She has built the sway back and forth to withstand the fury of stormy weather, to stand the test of time, because storms are always coming. She sways a few inches, but she never falls into the current below. An engineering marvel, the Statue of Liberty is also an enduring symbol of the soul of our nation. A soul shaped by forces that bring us together and by forces that pull us apart. And yet, through good times and tough times, we withstood it all. A nation of pioneers and explorers, of dreamers and doers, of ancestors native to this land, of ancestors who came by force. A nation of immigrants came to build a better life.

[Bobby Sauce]

Dude. Sucks.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah.

[Joe Biden]

A nation holding the torch of the most powerful idea ever in the history of the world. That all of us, all of us are created equal. That all of us deserve to be treated with dignity, justice and fairness.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

You can tell it's written by leftists.

[Joe Biden]

That democracy must defend and be defined and be imposed, moved in every way possible. Our rights, our freedoms, our dreams. But we know the idea of America. Our institution, our people, our values that uphold it are constantly being tested. Ongoing debates about power and the exercise of power. But whether we lead by the example of our power or the power of our example, whether we show the courage to stand up to the abuse of power, or we yield to it. After 50 years at the center of all of this, I know that believing in the idea of America means respecting the institution as governed. A free society, the presidency looks like that. The Congress, the courts, a free and independent press. Institutions that are rooted, not. They just not reflect the timeless words, but they echo the words of the Declaration of Independence. We hold these Truths to be self evident, rooted in the timeless words of the Constitution. Constitution. We, the people. Our system of separation of powers, checks and balances. It may not be perfect, but it's maintained our democracy for nearly 250 years. Longer than any other nation in history that's ever tried such a bold experiment. In the past four years, our democracy has held strong. And every day I've kept my commitment to be president for all, all Americans through one of the toughest periods in our nation's history. I've had a great partner and Vice president, Kamala Harris.

[Tim Pool]

That's a lie.

[Joe Biden]

It's been the honor of my life to see the resilience of essential workers getting us through a once in a century pandemic. The heroism of service members, the first responders keeping us safe.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

This is pre recorded for sure.

[Joe Biden]

The determination of advocates standing up for for our rights and our freedom.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah. There's like no incentive for it to.

[Joe Biden]

Instead of losing their jobs, at least no. To an economic crisis we inherited.

[Bobby Sauce]

That's a real window.

[Joe Biden]

Millions of entrepreneurs and companies creating new businesses and industries. Hiring American workers using American products. Together we've launched a new era of American possibilities.

[Tim Pool]

That's a lie.

[Joe Biden]

One of the greatest modernizations of infrastructure in our entire history. Structure from new roads, bridges, clean water, affordable high speed Internet for every American.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Didn't they fail?

[Joe Biden]

We invented the semiconductors. Yeah, it's falling on the tip of my little finger. California now is bringing those chip factories, those jobs back to America where they belong. Creating thousands of jobs.

[Bobby Sauce]

How did they do that?

[Joe Biden]

Finally giving Medicare the power to negotiate lower prescription drug prices for millions of seniors. And finally doing something to protect our children and our families by passing the most significant gun safety law in 30 years and bringing violent crime to a 50 year low. Meeting our sacred obligation to over 1 million veterans. So far we're exposed to toxic materials and to their families. Providing medical care and education benefits and more for their families. You know it will take time to feel the full impact of all we've done together.

[Tim Pool]

Here he goes.

[Joe Biden]

Yeah, but the seeds are planted and they'll grow and they'll bloom for decades to come.

[Tim Pool]

Bro, you salted the earth.

[Joe Biden]

At home. We created nearly 17 million new jobs. More than any other single administration. In a single term. More people have health care than ever before.

[Tim Pool]

I feel bad for the people.

[Joe Biden]

And overseas we strengthen NATO. Ukraine is still free and we pulled ahead of our competition with China and so much more. I'm so proud of how much we've accomplished together for the American people.

[Bobby Sauce]

Didn't he say he was going to cure cancer?

[Joe Biden]

And I wish the incoming administration success because I want America's success. That's why I upheld my duty to ensure a peaceful orderly transition of power. To ensure we lead by the power of our example. I have no doubt that America's in a position to continue to succeed. That's why my farewell address tonight. I want to warn the country of some things that give me great concern. This is a dangerous concentration and that's a dangerous concentration of power. Conscious in the hands of a very few ultra wealthy people. The dangerous consequences. Alex Soros perhaps if their abuse of power is left unchecked.

[Bobby Sauce]

He's not rich.

[Joe Biden]

Today an oligarchy is taking shape in America of extreme wealth, power and influence. Literally threatens our entire democracy. Basic rights, freedom and a fair shot for everyone.

[Phil Labonte]

It's not a surprise but it's such great garbage.

[Joe Biden]

We see the consequences all across America. And we've seen it before. More than a century ago. But the American people stood up to the robber barons back then.

[Tim Pool]

Oh the robber.

[Joe Biden]

And busted the trust.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Joe Biden]

They didn't punish the wealthy. Just made the wealthy pay the by play by the rules. Everybody else had to. So many wealthy workers want rights to earn their fair share.

[Phil Labonte]

Democrats are dealt into the deal for the better part of the past.

[Joe Biden]

Help put us on definitely 20 to building the largest middle class. The most prosperous century any nation in the world has ever seen. We've got to do that again.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Joe Biden]

The last four years that is exactly what we've done.

[Tim Pool]

That's a lie.

[Joe Biden]

People should be able to make as much as they can. But pay play by the same rules. Pay their fair share because you're my son. So much is at stake.

[Phil Labonte]

The top 50% of right now pay.

[Joe Biden]

All of the existential threat of climate has never been clear at all.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Joe Biden]

Just look across the country.

[Bobby Sauce]

I think 10% pays California, North Carolina. Yeah.

[Joe Biden]

That's why I signed. The most significant climate and clean energy.

[Tim Pool]

Ever in the history of the world.

[Bobby Sauce]

The rest of the world.

[Tim Pool]

Trying to model you guys.

[Joe Biden]

It's working. Creating jobs and industries of the future. Now we've proven we don't have to choose between protecting the environment and growing the economy. We're doing both.

[Tim Pool]

That's a lie.

[Joe Biden]

Are we though powerful forces want to wield their unchecked influence to eliminate the steps we've taken to tackle the climate crisis. To serve their own interests for power and profit. We must not be bullied into sacrificing the future. The future of our children and our Grandchildren must keep pushing forward forward and push faster. There's no time to waste. It's also clear that American leadership in technology is unparalleled an unparalleled source of innovation that can transform lives. We see the same dangers the concentration of technology, power and wealth. Elon Musk you know his farewell address President Eisenhower but not Google spoke of the dangers of the military industrial complex Facebook he warned his stand about and I quote potential for the disastrous rise.

[Phil Labonte]

Why misplaced military contractor six days six.

[Joe Biden]

Decades later because he's saving us potential rise Tech industrial complex garbage lies. It could pose real dangers for our country as well.

[Bobby Sauce]

The next three days we're going to.

[Joe Biden]

Do our cancer moon Americans are being.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Buried Starlink literally under an avalanche of.

[Joe Biden]

Misinformation disinformation I mean enabling the abuse of power he might the free press is crumbling. Hitters are disappearing.

[Bobby Sauce]

I'm just waiting for the social media.

[Joe Biden]

Is giving up on fact checking she's.

[Bobby Sauce]

Getting pardoned the last right over the.

[Joe Biden]

Weekend the truth is smothered by lies.

[Tim Pool]

When no one's paying attention toll for.

[Joe Biden]

Power and for profit. He's a brave little man hold the social platforms accountable.

[Bobby Sauce]

It's like dude.

[Joe Biden]

To protect our children sure about that Our families and their very democracy from the abuse of power. Meanwhile, artificial intelligence is the most consequential technology of our time. Perhaps of all time.

[Bobby Sauce]

He doesn't know real intelligence.

[Joe Biden]

Nothing offers more profound possibilities and risk for our economy and our security, our society, for humanity. Artificial intelligence even has the potential to help us answer my call to and cancer as we know it. But unless safeguards are in place, AI could spawn new threats to our rights, our way of life, to our privacy.

[Bobby Sauce]

I did that.

[Joe Biden]

How we work and how we protect our nation.

[Tim Pool]

Yes.

[Joe Biden]

We must make sure AI is safe and trustworthy and good for all humankind. This guy's cooked in the age of AI it's more important than ever that the people must govern like if Trump and as the land of liberty America, not China must lead the world in the development of AI that seems like.

[Bobby Sauce]

A normal thing to say you know.

[Joe Biden]

In the years ahead it'll help to be it's going to be up to the president. He's fading the presidency, the Congress, the courts, the free press and the American people to confront these powerful forces bro, when I'm 80 we must reform the.

[Tim Pool]

Taxpayer slumped over at the poker not.

[Joe Biden]

By giving the biggest tax cuts to billionaire but by making I don't want.

[Tim Pool]

To think about it go away.

[Joe Biden]

We need to get dark money that's that hidden funding behind too many campaigns. Contributions. We need to get it out of politics.

[Bobby Sauce]

There's no honor in this.

[Joe Biden]

We need to enact an 18 year time limit. Term limit. Time and term. For the strongest ethics and the strongest ethics reforms for our Supreme Court. We need to ban members of Congress from trading stock while they're in the Congress. We need to amend the Constitution to make clear that no president, no president is immune from crimes that he or she commits while in office.

[Tim Pool]

He just said to amend the Constitution.

[Joe Biden]

The president's power is not limit. It's not absolute immunity.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah.

[Joe Biden]

And in a democracy, there's another danger to the concentration of power and wealth. It erodes a sense of unity and common purpose. It causes distrust and division. Participating in our democracy becomes exhausting and even disillusioning. And people don't feel like they have a fair shot. We have to stay engaged in the process. I know it's frustrating. A fair shot is what makes America America. Everyone's entitled to a fair shot. Not a guarantee, just a fair shot. An even playing field. Going as far as your hard work and talent can take you. We can never lose that essential truth. Remain who we are is there. I've always believed somehow took a whole thing I've told other world leaders. America can be defined by one word.

[Tim Pool]

Like how come the silent possibilities are always like a Pixar animation?

[Joe Biden]

Only in America, Biden is believe anything is possible.

[Tim Pool]

And he's not going like a kid with a story.

[Joe Biden]

Modest beginnings in Scranton, Pennsylvania. Why do they claim on Delaware Facial expressions sitting behind.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe Biden]

This desk in the Oval Office.

[Bobby Sauce]

Why the face?

[Tim Pool]

Like I understand the idea, the emotion.

[Joe Biden]

It's all around us.

[Tim Pool]

Biden's not doing that.

[Joe Biden]

Upstairs, the residents I walk by. A painting of the Statue of Liberty is very droll.

[Tim Pool]

Sign language should be like there's civil.

[Joe Biden]

Work climbing on the yawning the whole time. The statue that holds the torch. Have you ever seen the story?

[Tim Pool]

I'm actually offended by this.

[Bobby Sauce]

Awesome.

[Joe Biden]

There's a story of a veteran son of an immigrant whose job was to climb that torch, polish the amber panes so rays of light could reach out as far as possible. He was known as the keeper of the flame.

[Tim Pool]

Was he?

[Joe Biden]

He once said of the Statue of Liberty, quote speaks a silent universal language.

[Tim Pool]

Beat nine minutes.

[Joe Biden]

One of hope that anyone who seeks and speaks freedom can understand. Yes. We sway back and forth to withstand the fury of the storm, to stand the test of time. If you could read it A constant trouble.

[Bobby Sauce]

You need a sign.

[Joe Biden]

Constant Struggle. Short distance between peril and possibility. The America of our dreams.

[Tim Pool]

Serious? I'm sorry. It's up to us.

[Joe Biden]

Our dreams come true.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Joe Biden]

Let me close.

[Bobby Sauce]

Maybe she's one of those fake sign language.

[Joe Biden]

I stated my gratitude to so many people.

[Bobby Sauce]

They weren't qualified at all.

[Joe Biden]

And the members of my administration, as well as public service and first responders across the country and around the world, thank you for stepping up to serve. To our service members and your families.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Will have a sign language person.

[Joe Biden]

It's been the highest honor of my life to lead you as commander in chief.

[Bobby Sauce]

I hope it's an explosion. And our incredible partner and just no sign language.

[Joe Biden]

Historic Vice President. She and Doug have become like family. And to me, family's everything.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Except for your grandchild.

[Joe Biden]

My deepest appreciation.

[Bobby Sauce]

No Christmas sign.

[Joe Biden]

Amazing. First lady was with me in the Oval today. For our entire family. You're the love of my life. And the life's of my.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Love lifes of my.

[Joe Biden]

My eternal thanks to you, the American people. After 50 years of public service.

[Tim Pool]

Joe loves me.

[Joe Biden]

I give you my word. I still believe in the idea for which this nation stands. Think about what you think about nation. Where the strengths of our institutions and the character of our people matter and must endure. Now it's your turn to stand guard. May you all be the keeper of the flame.

[Tim Pool]

Okay, what's the pay?

[Joe Biden]

May you keep the faith. I love America. You love it too. God bless you all. May God protect your troops. Please thank you for this.

[Phil Labonte]

Great Republicans that are a threat to the very soul of our nation.

[Tim Pool]

Joe. Yeah, right.

[Bobby Sauce]

He didn't say not hyperbole though.

[Tim Pool]

Wait, wait. He's still just sitting there blinking. So apparently according to Trump war room, that was. That was pre recorded. And that's what I was looking at. Like right when it started, I looked down and checking my phone. I was not just checking emails. Actually, there's this post from. Let me pull this up. This is from Trump war room where they say that the official livestream accidentally caught his handlers queuing it up. I couldn't find this. And they're not queuing it up. They're opening like. This is kind of. Wow. Like, what is it? What is this for real? Trump war room is not just some like, random account that's posting nonsense.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Isn't it a real one?

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, yeah, it's real. And so you can see they're loading graphics and they said that I didn't see this on the official live stream, so I don't know where they got this from, but you can see all of these files and you can see 20, 25 Biden Oval Office, slate. I wonder if it's not that they're playing. It's not a video, that's an image. I wonder if they were queuing up the, the prompter for him or something like that. Oh, I, I do believe that was a pre recorded message. Yeah, 100%.

[Brett Dasovic]

Oh yeah, yeah.

[Bobby Sauce]

There's no incentive for it not to be prerecorded. There's no reason that they would want.

[Phil Labonte]

He was asleep two hours ago.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, for sure.

[Phil Labonte]

He was out at like 6:30.

[Bobby Sauce]

That's a good call.

[Brett Dasovic]

What was the most egregious part of it, do you think?

[Tim Pool]

The opening. Yeah, let me pull that, Let me pull that clip up. Holy crap, dude, look at this. Tim Cass News has got it. In his final address of the nation, Joe Biden shamelessly takes credit from Donald Trump for orchestrating the hostage cease fire negotiation by administration.

[Joe Biden]

By my administration. A ceasefire and a hostage deal has been reached by Israel and Hamas, the elements of which I laid out in great detail in May of this year. This plan was developed and negotiated by my team and will be largely implemented by the incoming administration. That's why I told my team to keep the incoming administration fully informed, because that's how it should be.

[Tim Pool]

All right, ladies and gentlemen, uh, well, let's start from the beginning. In this clip that we just played, Joe Biden takes credit for what is the Israel, Hamas cease fire. People on the left, people on the right, pro Israel, anti Israel. They're all celebrating Donald Trump. Dave Smith said before the news was announced that if Trump does pull this off and there's no major concessions to Israel, he will enter his his second term as a heroic president. And if he also negotiates the end of the Ukraine war, put him on Mount Rushmore.

[Phil Labonte]

Yep.

[Tim Pool]

There have been other people who hate Donald Trump and I see them tweeting, this is incredible. Donald Trump pulled this off. Actually quite amazing. Now Joe Biden has taken credit. The first thing I want to show you guys, let's see if I can not. Not that one. Here we go. This is a White House statement from Joe Biden. He said today, after many months of intensive diplomacy by the US along with Egypt and Qatar, Israel and Israel and Hamas have reached a ceasefire and hostage deal. This deal will halt the fighting in Gaza, surge much needed humanitarian assistance to Palestinian civilians, and reunite the hostages with their families after more than 15 months in captivity. I lit at the precise contours of this plan. May 31, 2024, after which it was endorsed unanimously. Unanimously by the UN Security Council. It is a result of not only the extreme pressure that Hamas has been under and the changed regional equation for a ceasefire in Lebanon and weakening of Iran, but also of dogged and painstaking American diplomacy. My diplomacy never ceased in their efforts to get this done. You see how he frames this. I laid out the precise contours of this plan. You know what he's saying? Yeah, Trump did it. And he's going, yeah, but it's just like what I proposed. So he's trying to take credit for it. He take credit for it directly. But let's just watch this clip and you can see this is a statement. Donald Trump was directly involved. It's his ceasefire.

[Don Lemon]

Well, this is what I say.

[Tim Pool]

You got to turn that volume down. Yeah, we had to crank the volume because of the.

[Phil Labonte]

You can't talk that Biden was talking about this.

[Don Lemon]

According to diplomats who were involved firsthand in the negotiation, President Biden refused to put any pressure on Netanyahu and ultimately they gave up that any deal would happen. It was. And Don, you and I talked about Barisan Trump. I have no love and I don't want to give Trump any credits, but I am in the business of telling the truth.

[Joe Biden]

Same good for you.

[Don Lemon]

Donald Trump intervention has been monumental in making the cease fire deal possible. And just to make people understand, President Biden not only refused on multiple occasions to put any pressure on the Prime Minister of Israel to do any deal, people who were involved in the negotiation, including Israeli negotiators, told me firsthand that very often they felt that he was more than backing the negotiating team, the Israeli negotiating team. He was backing the prime minister agenda and his desire to stay in office. The Israeli media and Israeli ministers, including Ben Ver today confirmed that it was President Trump. Israeli media also confirmed that Netanyahu already gave up on the hostages. He was willing to sacrifice the hostages for his political desire to stay in power. However, Donald Trump happened to be a transactional president, happened to be a transactional man. He wanted to come to the White House with a win. And that was always his approach.

[Bobby Sauce]

Let me ask you this then. So why didn't, why did they not wait until he took office, which is just going to be in about a week.

[Don Lemon]

Because he didn't want to deal with, with this issue as he get into office. He want this table.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, you can get it done.

[Bobby Sauce]

Why exactly? I think Donald Trump would like to have started off. We know Donald Trump the day of his inauguration or on the day to announce a ceasefire. The fact that it happened on Biden's watch, I think that leads many people to question whether it was. And look, I'm not saying that you're wrong.

[Tim Pool]

Let me just, Let me just try something for you, Donny boy. Could it be that Trump actually cares? The hostages get released.

[Bobby Sauce]

Right. Exactly.

[Brett Dasovic]

When you have more days, when you are a political demon and you can't imagine doing something selflessly and not for political motivations, they can't imagine that somebody would do it just because it's the right thing to do.

[Bobby Sauce]

That's right.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Like I was saying yesterday, it's kind of the, the officially kind of close to the same deal that Biden has been doing for months, or their administration has been doing for months. But Trump said, yo, Netanyahu, this is.

[Tim Pool]

What we're going to do.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Are you going to suck it up? You're going to like it?

[Phil Labonte]

I've heard, I've heard reports that Netanyahu, like, has been, has been either not, not against getting the, the hostages back, but it's not been trying very hard or whatever.

[Tim Pool]

No, he doesn't. He doesn't. I mean, that's basically what she was saying, that Nat now didn't care. He wrote them off and was willing to let them die. And then Donald. See, here's the thing. Brett hit the nail on the head with the hammer. These people are projecting. Don Lemon was telling you what he would do, not what Trump would do. He would let them suffer so that as soon as he came in, he could declare how great he was. Trump says, I don't want that on my record. You get those people free now.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah. Plus, it doesn't hurt that, like, you have the leverage of a guy that's coming in in five days. That's like, I'm going to rain hellfire down upon you. Yes. And it changes the leverage of the conversation a little bit.

[Tim Pool]

Well, so there's this viral tweet here. Second City bureaucrat says Israel's are reporting that Trump blew Bibi's back out. And there's this post. I'm not saying this is true, but it's a viral post and it says there was no deal. Lol. The great and huge Donald Trump took Netanyahu's hand, bent it behind his back, bent it a little more, a little more, then pushed his head on the table and whispered in his ear that he would kick him into balls in a moment. It's a shame Biden didn't realize this a long time ago.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

It's fair that's fair.

[Tim Pool]

I mean, I'm just going to. I'm just going to pretend that that's the case.

[Phil Labonte]

Look, remember, the United States has always had the United States. Just because as much as, like, Donald Trump is doing, is going to do great things and has done great things just by the force of his personality. The reason that people listen is because he's the President of the United States. That means that it's the United States power, soft power and military power that actually does the job. So Biden could have done this at any point. If he had the balls and people believed that he would follow through. He could have called up Bibi and said, look, this is going to happen. And there's any number of different levers of power that the United States has had at its disposal for the entire time that Joe Biden has been president. And Joe Biden is too inept or too much of a coward to actually do it. So it's great that Donald Trump did this. It's awesome. But it's not like Donald Trump, the man is what made this happen. It's Donald Trump threatening to use the power that the United States of America has. And it's all. And the fact that Joe Biden hasn't done it is all because he's a terrible president.

[Tim Pool]

I think a lot of the foreign policy we see, or I should say a lot of the actions we see overseas, particularly under the Obama administration, they wanted to happen the spread of isis, the deep state. Obama wanted ISIS to dismantle Bashar Al Assad's government in Syria. So they go, oopsie. It just happens when it comes to the war with Israel and Hamas, Joe Biden and the Democrats want it to happen. Donald Trump, take a look at Ukraine. The war start. The war is escalating. It's coming up to the point of war and civil war under Obama. Trump gets in, nothing stops. ISIS crushed. Then Joe Biden gets in war everywhere. I'm sorry, but I see a pattern. When these warmongers, there's a reason we call them that get in power. War just happens all over the place. And then when Trump gets to power, it doesn't. And in fact, it's stopping. I think the only reason Joe Biden, it didn't happen is because Joe Biden intentionally didn't want it to. And the only reason he's taking credit for it now is because he has no choice, because Trump said, I'm the president, I'm going to be in five days and I am going to destroy you. And they're like, okay, okay, we'll stop.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, isn't. This isn't the solution to every conflict, every war, every disagreement, communication and agreement between two powerful people? And if you, whether or not you believe Putin, in his interview with Tucker Carlson, he's like, he's not even calling me. He's not even trying to talk to me. It's probably pretty reasonable to believe that most, if not all conflicts could be solved through negotiation and discussion and communication. If he's not doing it, it's no wonder that this took this song.

[Tim Pool]

I don't completely agree. I think you're large. I think it's largely true because there's a reason people go to war. They want something. But I do think there are a lot of circumstances where he ain't convincing anybody of nothing. Like the Taliban. I mean, Trump negotiated with them, but it was under threat, saying, we're going to back off, but if you go anywhere near these areas, we will come back and we will wipe you off the map. And the only reason they're able to come in is because Joe Biden, like, intentionally does these things. We'll put, I'll put it like this. Bagram Air Force Base, abandoned in the middle of the night with no warning to the Afghan security forces. That was on purpose. That's impossible to be an accident. You don't accidentally abandon an Air force.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Base without telling them.

[Tim Pool]

Right. And then letting locals ransack and loot the base and steal weapons. That, that I believe. And, and this is surface level stuff because I don't got clearance or anything like that. They want the chaos in the Middle east to justify further action. We can go and blow up countries, remove governments, and they can use all the chaos as their justification for it. Trump says no, but look, Vladimir Putin wants something from Crimea. He wants Sevastopol. He wants that. That area. I don't think communication guarantees it ends. Trump puts the weight of nuclear bombs behind his words, and those are the kind of wars that might actually stop the fighting.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, the point of that is that, yes, I don't disagree, but I guess the point of what I'm trying to say is that ultimately it comes down to negotiation. It's like I'm twisting your arm. You're twisting my arm. It's a negotiation that solves it. Ultimately, I lose a power position. I lose the upper hand, whatever. It gets negotiated out. So at the very least, if it couldn't be solved purely on negotiation, then isn't it reasonable to say that you should probably be calling this dude regularly? You should probably at the very least be in communication regularly to figure out what the deal is. But if you just never call him, it's no surprise that it would never end.

[Brett Dasovic]

That was also a problem as well, because they would get mad whenever Trump would say, yeah, I talked to Putin. Talk to these guys and then say, why are you talking to him? Because they don't understand what diplomacy actually is. One of the most interesting things she said in that interview is calling him a transactional president, meaning, like, that is actually the point of diplomacy when you actually have leverage, which is that he will open lines of communication, communication with them. But also they have to take worry that if he actually puts a threat out there that he would enact it where they don't have to worry about that with the current administration.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, transactional, meaning deal making. Yeah. That's the solution maker.

[Brett Dasovic]

Which is funny because that concept should be seen as a benefit to everyone.

[Tim Pool]

Right.

[Brett Dasovic]

Like, you can't simultaneously call him like an unhinged dictator and then also call him somebody who wants to go to the table and negotiate.

[Phil Labonte]

One of the things about Donald Trump is Donald Trump wants, like, Donald Trump wants wins and Donald Trump wants victories. He'll make deals. He will. I've long said that if the Democrats had embraced him in, at the very beginning of his, his candidacy or is his presidency in 2017, if they'd embraced him and said, we love this guy and patted him on the back and said, let's go win for America, if they had done that, he would have played ball and he would have been an asset to the Democrat Party, he would have probably not have had. He probably would have destroyed the MAGA coalition that, that, that grew around him in, in his, during his first term, and he would have essentially become a Democrat. That's because he wants people to like him and he wants to win. So if it's not a situation of, oh, I have these deep, deeply held convictions that I want to see happen, all he wants is good things for the country.

[Brett Dasovic]

That was also. That was actually evident in the first term. Do you remember when he said he sent invitations to the. All the members of the National Black Caucus and asked them to come in for a meeting and they all just refused to go in there. He wanted to deal. He wanted to play ball with everyone from day one, but they couldn't do that because they had back themselves into the corner of calling him a bunch of names that didn't actually pan out.

[Tim Pool]

If you look at what, what Biden was saying, he was basically saying that thing Trump did. I did. All the good stuff that Trump is about to do, actually, that was me.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Yep.

[Tim Pool]

That was the point.

[Phil Labonte]

All the stuff I did and all the things that are coming, I planted the seeds, literally. Just. Just vacuuming up as much credit as he possibly could.

[Brett Dasovic]

I think the worst part of all of that was the talk about the. When he was talking about climate change and he was talking about, you know, securing a future for your kids and your, in your grandchildren, while not addressing the fact that the, the debt just keeps piling and the national debt just keeps and growing and growing. They've sold out your children's future. They've sold out your grandchildren's future long, long ago. So to tie that to climate change, which is just another way to tax you anyways, is insane to me.

[Tim Pool]

Oh, I love it, too, because just to reiterate what we said the other day, we played this clip where Bernie Sanders is like, oh, borough, climate change is coming. And it's like California enacts tons of regulations due to climate change. They tax people at the highest rate in the state, and then they fail to manage their problems, and they get these wildfires and then blame it on climate change. So basically, what they're telling us is climate change mitigation does not work. Right? Well, because California is doing all this mitigation, Right. Didn't do anything for you. Okay, well, then stop. What's the point? You're wasting money.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, it's like, you don't. People are saying like, oh, it's, it's a, it's a natural disaster. It's like, you don't have to do a thing to make a thing happen. Like, for example, if I decrease the amount of the laws that happened, if you broke into somebody's house and then I turned off all the streetlights, and then I made it illegal for you to lock your door. Your house is about to get robbed. So that's exactly what happened there. And they're like, no, it's the wind. It's. It's the exact thing that we want to throw more money at and squander more money at. It's absolutely perfect.

[Tim Pool]

Let's pull up this story from the Post Millennial. Speaking of Kevin Newsom faces recall effort over leadership failures amid LA wildfires. To be fair, the man is under constant threat of recall. They almost recalled him already. So I can't say that I'm surprised that after this unmitigated disaster, and that's literal, he's facing another recall effort. Now, the dude leading the effort, this is Randy Economy. I believe he's led an effort prior and was already in the process of preparing to recall Gavin Newsom. But I'm for it. This guy should be removed from the governorship immediately. The mayor of LA should be removed immediately. And if they don't do it in California, I believe the federal government needs, needs to intervene in whatever, meet whatever way they have to get a handle on what's going on. I do not know how this country operates with rogue states in this way. And it's not just about the wildfires, but it largely is. It's also about the free health care for illegal immigrants, violation of federal law. This California and New York, they're both operating as rogue states in defiance of constitutional rights. I don't know how we can be in a partnership at the federal level with Congress, the Senate and the, and the presidential elections with states that are in violation of federal law.

[Brett Dasovic]

Is that in relation to sanctuary cities?

[Tim Pool]

So what California does sanctuary state, not just cities. They effectively allow people to cross the border and mass numbers refuse to cooperate with federal government to deport them, effectively shield and protect these people, then you've got abject mismanagement. But there is a, there's a litany of circumstances in which California has been defiant and in violation of federal law and abusing our federal system, notably how they use illegal immigrants to get to gain more congressional seats and more electoral college votes. Then you've got the issue of them promising free health care to noncitizens. So right now you're paying the highest taxes in the country in California. And then your house burns down because there was no water and there are no firefighters. And don't worry, the 23 year old illegal immigrants got free health care and.

[Brett Dasovic]

They'Ve got $700 coming your way.

[Phil Labonte]

And the rest of the United States, seven of the United States is going to have to help to pay for the rebuilding. The rest of the United States is going to have to help pay for the infrastructure. That's what repairs. It's insane.

[Tim Pool]

No money. If California wants money, it comes with federal oversight committees going into California and assuming control of all of the garbage they're operating. And you know what? Trump can appoint the person who does it.

[Phil Labonte]

Nationalize California.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

I had an issue, I had an issue with that at first, like giving them. They have to do this, do that or whatever in order to get federal funding. But if we don't do that, then there's gonna, it's gonna make it worse. It's gonna hurt our economy, it's gonna Hurt our state.

[Tim Pool]

It's gonna hurt another fire.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Yeah, yeah. So, okay, I'm all on board now. Let's go.

[Tim Pool]

If, if homie comes up to me and he's like, who's homie? Homie, my buddy. If he comes up, I'm walking down the street and I see home and he's shaking and he's like, oh, that homie. I need, I, I need some money. And I'll be like, bro, you're a drug addict. Yeah, okay, I, I, if I give you money, you're gonna do drugs? No, I need money for, for my rent. Otherwise I'll be homeless. And then he points to his house, his landlord's right there saying, you can pay the rent right now and he can stay here. I'm going to be like, do you know why he needs rent money from me? Because he's using his money for drugs. If I enable him by giving him this money, it's not going to make his life better, it's going to make his life worse. He's going to take the money, take the freebie, and he's not going to solve his problems. If we go to California and say, we're going to give you aid to cover the cost like Biden already did, basically Gavin Newsom says, okay, we're done. I don't gotta do anything. Right? The money, the money problem solved. They won't fix the problem. There will be more fires, more disaster, more dei. The only thing that we can do because these people do need help is to say, we're gonna write you a check, but we are going to send an oversight to manage how your government is operating because they, they mismanage this well.

[Bobby Sauce]

And the conditions are much like you would get conditions from your parents when you're in high school. If you follow the, if you get straight A's, then you get permission to do this or whatever. So it's like, it' not like the, the strings that they're attaching benefit them. The strings they're attaching are for their own good. These are precautions and benefits that will help them objectively and prevent them from being their own worst enemy, which is exactly what a parent does to a teenage kid. It's the exact same thing. It shouldn't have to be that way, but unfortunately it is.

[Phil Labonte]

I'm, I mean, yeah, help out North Carolina.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Let's go North Carolina, who are like, it was a good state.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah. Like I said the other night, like, they, they have been dragging their feet taking care of, of North Carolina for eight, you know, what, three and three, four months now.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

It's been so long.

[Phil Labonte]

When was it? It was September. Was it or was it in. Yeah, it was September that the, the, the hurricane went through. They've been dragging their feet since then, but they're all hop skippity on, on California because it's millionaires that lost their homes. And these millionaires were all donators to the Democrat party to Joe Biden's. You know, it's not possible.

[Brett Dasovic]

I just heard from Joe Biden. People are, that's.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, right.

[Brett Dasovic]

Yeah.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

I think fires are bigger and more flamboyant, you know, no pun intended, than, than floods.

[Phil Labonte]

It's a, it's a Democrat controlled state, has been a Democrat controlled state for, you know, decades now. And these people largely donated to Democrats for, for reelection. So that's why they're so hop skippity on it.

[Bobby Sauce]

I think it's the voice, I think it's their voice. Because celebrities can change and persuade people to do tremendous things. So it's like if you have a bunch of Hollywood types that say that this, that we should try to kick Gavin Newsome out, the loudness of that is far more significant than any volume that could ever come out of.

[Tim Pool]

So, so let me play this clip for you guys from Jimmy Kimmel.

[Phil Labonte]

Oh, thank you.

[Tim Pool]

Very good to see you. I heard you had to evacuate your home.

[Phil Labonte]

Yes, yes.

[Tim Pool]

Like most people, I had to. I got lucky. You know, the winds moved but you know, the fire was coming and all that stuff. So I feel lucky.

[Phil Labonte]

Are you guys back?

[Tim Pool]

And I think everybody did a great job.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Sure.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah. I'm like the Internet, you know. Right, I know it's right.

[Phil Labonte]

Can you say that when it's not even done?

[Bobby Sauce]

Exactly.

[Tim Pool]

Why did you just fly a helicopter into the ocean and then just. I don't know, because it was 100 knot winds. You want to do that? You want to do that at night, you lunatic. I don't know. Maybe we could put water in the fire hydrants. That's just, that's just an idea.

[Brett Dasovic]

Smart. I could start.

[Tim Pool]

Bill Burr, the man who admitted he doesn't actually read the news.

[Bobby Sauce]

How are you?

[Phil Labonte]

This was definitely mismanaged.

[Bobby Sauce]

That's a big word we're hearing now. Mismanaged. Like some idiot on the Internet knows how to manage the worst fire in.

[Tim Pool]

L. A sitting there in his underwear. I mean, I'm, I'm wearing a hoodie, but I would start with putting, putting water in the fire hydrant.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Having a reservoirs field, that's not that hard.

[Tim Pool]

I would, I would Hire firefighters, sure. These are. You may not be aware, but firefighters are people who you hire to fight the fires. I would have enough of them.

[Bobby Sauce]

It's your classic example of what an idiot. What do you pay attention to the news, you loser. So much cooler to just sit at home and do absolutely nothing and just run away when they tell me, or put on my diaper in my face when they tell me.

[Phil Labonte]

I mean, you know what?

[Tim Pool]

Looking at the footage on the Internet, I have determined that this here was mismanaged.

[Bobby Sauce]

So this is the thing.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

This guy's so dumb.

[Tim Pool]

First, I want to stress that when we looked up the ratings for Jimmy Kimmel and I saw that his key demo ratings was it was 221,000. You know, we're about just on the live show. At two and a half times that I felt bad, you know, punching down on a little guy.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

That's what they say, don't punch down.

[Tim Pool]

Right. Yeah. You know, I. Sorry about that, Jimmy. I know you're an up and coming young star with your tiny little show. I'm actually gloating because I'm so happy to see the failures of these networks because what Bill Burr is doing, and he is a funny guy. Okay. When he was on Joe Rogan talking about how people need to wear masks outside, he was still very funny because he made fun of rollerblading Knuckles Dragon. That was really good. That was really. And it's for you, Brett. Yeah, he was like. He. He said, it's like everybody rollerbladed. There was one homophobic joke, and 100 million people threw their rollerblades in the ocean. That's actually really good. But he says in that. And then. And then Joe, he says something like, joe, you wouldn't do it. You'll get the body for it. Your knuckles will be dragging as you go. He's a funny guy. But the problem I have with this, he actually. Everything he's saying is presented in a very comedic way, which makes you want to laugh. The problem is it's not a joke. He's not saying, here's a bit I've prepared. He's literally saying, the Internet is wrong. The fire was managed properly when it literally was not.

[Phil Labonte]

I mean, I think it's pretty clear that they didn't have water.

[Tim Pool]

So water and the fire hydrant.

[Phil Labonte]

Like, how can you say, oh, it was managed properly. And if you want to specify that it's not the fault or the blame doesn't fall on the firefighters. Absolutely, 100%. I'm right there with you. The blame does fall on the governor and it falls on the, you know, the mayor of la, the people that have decided to not pick up the deadfall in the forest and, and, and not clean, essentially clean the forest. So that way this, this stuff doesn't happen. Like that is part of what their job is by being the stewards of California. Right? Like California is a desert. Everyone knows it. They don't get a lot of rain normally. Like they're going to have forest fires. There's a lot of brush. Like that stuff's gonna happen. And if you're elected to public office, it is your job to do whatever you can do to mitigate the, the, the risk and make sure that if, when there is forest fires, because they're going to happen to some degree when there is a forest fire, that there's water in the fire hydrants.

[Bobby Sauce]

And the chief, the fire chief said herself that they were understaffed and ill equipped to handle it. So it's just like your own people from the inside are literally saying it.

[Phil Labonte]

And California has Silicon Valley, it has, it has the all of Hollywood, which granted Hollywood's not doing what it was doing 20 years ago, but they still make boatloads of money. The tax base in California is not a problem. They have the fifth biggest economy on earth. There is not a problem with money. It is not a problem with. They can't find the money. You go and you ask Tim Cook and Tim Cook will write a check and donate it and say, you know what? Okay, here, this will be a great write off and this will be a great PR stunt. Here's a bunch of money for the firefighters in LA or in Southern California. That's something that Apple would do just for chuckles. And you have multiple gigantic companies. There's, there was a time where Apple had more cash than the federal government. That was a real thing. So it's not like the tax base isn't there. It's not like the money isn't there to do these things. It's mismanagement because you had single party rule. So nobody was pushing back on anyone else. Nobody said, hey, check that out. Yeah, exactly like, exactly. It's an echo chamber. And nobody was saying, look, we need to make sure these things are going, are being taken care of.

[Brett Dasovic]

Checks and balances.

[Phil Labonte]

None.

[Brett Dasovic]

They build a light rail to nowhere.

[Phil Labonte]

That, I mean that's, that is a. God, that's.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Wait, they did? Well, yeah, you got one section done.

[Brett Dasovic]

It's just an example of just government mismanagement and their inability to actually hold checks and balances to show that the projects that are getting such heavy funding are actually being completed. Right.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

I also, real quick, the president or the LA mayor is not the mayor of the Palisade. Palisades. And there's other counties who are their mayors. We know what's holding those folks accountable. We're just focusing on the, on the LA mayor. So yeah, you know, each, each town, each, each area has their own mayor. So we should just call them all out.

[Brett Dasovic]

Maybe the question, the question that he should have asked Bill Burr, and this is, of course the problem with these types of shows is it's not a new show, it's a comedy show. And they blend the two however poorly they do, because they're not actually funny, is to say, well, if not having water isn't mismanagement, what would you have considered the threshold for actual mismanagement? Or do you just let appeal to authority win and just say, oh, they must be doing fine?

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, that's, it's a perfect example of you just saying, like, oh, the, you know, the adults are in charge, they're going to take care of this issue. So it's like if you have that type of attitude that you, that means that you believe everything that they tell you every single time, no matter what. It's learned helplessness and paying attention is actually stupid and you're dumb for thinking about it. And oh, God forbid you sit at home and research these things and care about like, do you think Bill Burr did any research? Of course not. Like, he did the research and then came to the conclusion that everything was fine. He did none at all.

[Phil Labonte]

Just want to point out the California high speed rail project was initiated in 1996 and they have zero trains. Zero trains.

[Tim Pool]

The reason why Karen Bass is getting flack is because it's LAFD that is fighting the wildfires.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

So LA is an interesting place because people, people, when people say L. A, they're referring to LA county, which incorporates all of that stuff. But LA as a city is actually. We talked about this last week, whatever. LA as a city is actually quite small. But that's where like the downtown county is huge.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

The county's massive. So when people say la, they're referring to the county.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Okay.

[Bobby Sauce]

It's the most populous county, I think in America. I'm pretty sure.

[Phil Labonte]

Maybe, I don't know.

[Bobby Sauce]

I'm pretty sure it is. That's the largest fire department, has the largest police department of any county in the entire country.

[Phil Labonte]

I know the fire department had eight. We had an 800 million dollar budget.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Phil Labonte]

So, like, we can. Like, there's people that were talking about the DEI initiatives and. And the cuts that. It's like dollars that got cut. And yes, that's a. That's a sizable cut, but when you have a budget of $800 million, it's probably not enough to actually make the difference. The. The problem is the people. The problem was mismanagement, not that they didn't have the funds.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, so actually, I think I'm wrong. I just looked it up and it's. It's listed in Wikipedia. You know, we love Wikipedia as it's part of la, so. Oh, actually, yeah, it is. It is part of la. Interesting. And the honorary mayor of. So there's no real mayor, there's an honorary mayor. You guys know the honorary. Where.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Where are you talking about?

[Tim Pool]

Specific Palisades.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Okay. Eugene Levy.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, that's correct.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

You know who that is, right?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Yeah, he's an actor dude.

[Tim Pool]

I know all about dad from American Pie.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Oh, he's only honorary mayor. I thought he was.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Oh, I got lied to. Sorry.

[Tim Pool]

He should have been prepared for this.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Yeah.

[Bobby Sauce]

About to cook this dude on Instagram.

[Tim Pool]

Real.

[Brett Dasovic]

I was about to go after, like, oh, man, that seems like all fun and games. And then the place burns down.

[Tim Pool]

This is actually really interesting. I didn't realize this is what L. A was, so I knew that Santa Monica and, like, Beverly Hills were not L. A. I didn't realize L. A was this ridiculous spattering of nonsense.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Wait, what?

[Tim Pool]

I know. So this is the blue Line. I think it's the blue line train, they call it. I don't care. It's been a long time since I lived in there, and it goes down to Long beach, but I didn't realize.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

And Doug Stewart's the mayor of Malibu and all that. You know, there's a bunch of people.

[Phil Labonte]

LA County.

[Tim Pool]

Oh, no, this is LA City. Oh, okay. LA county is like this huge, massive city.

[Phil Labonte]

That's hilarious.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Right there to the left. I love Ventura.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah. So the Palisades are right here.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

I got you guys.

[Joe Biden]

And then.

[Tim Pool]

So Santa Monica has its own place. I don't know what this is. What is this, the Veterans Administration? I didn't know that. I knew West Hollywood and Beverly Hills were separate.

[Bobby Sauce]

Of course.

[Tim Pool]

Culver City and all that stuff. Inglewood.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Ladies and gentlemen, we're getting to the facts here of the LA Fire Department. Who's in charge here in Tipcast?

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, the whole. The whole. Oh, What? Look at this. I did not know it was San Fernando's Tiny. Very. Yeah, it's very weird.

[Bobby Sauce]

And in every single part of that.

[Tim Pool]

No, I lived there for sure and I didn't have no idea.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Yeah, I lived in thousand of Camarillo for eight years. I had zero. Well, I don't. I wasn't down in LA area.

[Tim Pool]

A Thousand Oaks is not.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

No, it's beautiful.

[Bobby Sauce]

I know.

[Tim Pool]

It is great.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Adventura County. Yeah, man, I had a condo in Camarillo. Let's go. So cars. Let's go.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, so we're not. I don't think we can really rag on Eugene Levy for this one.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Okay. Eugene, you gotta.

[Bobby Sauce]

I think we should though. I think we should.

[Tim Pool]

What was.

[Brett Dasovic]

I'm going to make all the actors think twice about taking those types of appointments.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Yeah, honorary positions too.

[Tim Pool]

Actually that would be funny to tweet like, where was Eugene Levy this whole time? Honorary mayor. Yeah. Anyway, well, I say goodbye to Gavin Newsom. But it won't get recalled because most people just sit around, don't care.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Dude, we almost had Elder.

[Brett Dasovic]

Yeah, there was the recall just two years ago.

[Bobby Sauce]

Right.

[Brett Dasovic]

Or last year.

[Phil Labonte]

Out of a beautiful.

[Tim Pool]

Indeed that would be based.

[Phil Labonte]

It is pretty. Pretty remarkable that, that, you know, there was a recall election. He survived. This happens. And there isn't a.

[Bobby Sauce]

All.

[Phil Labonte]

There isn't actual like significant voices calling for him for another recall. He just barely survived the recall, if I understand correctly. Barely survived. And he's. He's clearly shown again that he is incompetent and he's still there. The idea that if this guy actually runs for president in four years, which. That was the talk. If he actually runs and is. Is nominated, you know, woe is the United States. If he even gets to the point where he's. He's nominated.

[Tim Pool]

You imagine what would happen if every single fire hydrant in the country was empty under his watch as president. That's what would happen. Well, all right.

[Bobby Sauce]

If you make it illegal to show identification in a state, how could you trust that any possible thing could happen? And that's why I think that the celebrities represent in a lot of ways a threat, but what could ultimately be a benefit, because if the celebrities were all to say that he should leave in the court of public opinion, I think that would be more effective at getting him out than any recall probably could. Because by then the attention dies down. If this guy's getting ripped every single day by every major celebrity, that would be the one chance, I think, to get him out. That really is there.

[Brett Dasovic]

The problem though, right, is the people who are going to stand up for him are the ones who are shielded from the repercussions of his actions because of the tax bracket they fall in. So it's a unique situation.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, if there was ever a time.

[Brett Dasovic]

Yeah, well, I mean there was, there was back and forth when Karen Bass was up for election with celebrities going back and forth between her and Rick Caruso and they, a lot of people had their opinions on who would be the best case for them there. So.

[Bobby Sauce]

All right, celebrities do something.

[Tim Pool]

Let's jump to this next story from Reuters. Tick tock prepares to shut down app in U. S on Sunday. Sources say good bye.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

I'm okay with it.

[Bobby Sauce]

Not good.

[Tim Pool]

I was, I think it's great.

[Brett Dasovic]

I was thinking that it's going to, I assumed it was going to be one of those things where the, the phone just wouldn't update and then it would slowly become unusable. But it will eventually it will actually be removed.

[Tim Pool]

TikTok is doing this intentionally and they don't have to. What the, what the. One of two things has to happen. They divest from their Chinese partner or they remove the apps from the app store and the app still exists and can be downloaded off their website for anybody who wants to use it. However, the rumor is that TikTok decided to shut down entirely to spite its users, tricking them into getting mad at Congress for having passed this bill.

[Phil Labonte]

I also heard that Donald Trump is now touting the idea of trying to save TikTok.

[Brett Dasovic]

Yeah, he wants to, he wants to, he wants to do it in executive order to put a 60 to 90 day hold on the ban, which I.

[Tim Pool]

Don'T know that he has the authority to do because Congress has already passed and it's already been signed. But I also completely disagree. So in 2020 the concern was that TikTok was the most censorious platform for the right and it was propping up weird woke garbage ideology people like Dylan Mulvaney. So then Republicans came out and said, why are we allowing a foreign country to have influence over our younger generation? That's, that's a security threat. We should force them to divest and if they don't then they can't operate on US Servers. The Democrats were like, how dare you? Gen Z said how dare you? We love TikTok. And China said oh, they're coming for us. So a couple of years later China basically says ease up on the censorship of conservatives, make Trump look good. And all of a sudden a bunch of right wing personalities started getting traction on the platform and immediately changed their opinions. All of a sudden the right was. Now, wait there. I don't know if we should ban this. But it was too late. After October 7, when there was what appeared to be an artificial boost in anti Israel, pro Palestine content, Democrats and Republicans came together and said, it's time to stop TikTok from being able to control what people think in this country. Now, the reason I say that is not because I'm biased one way or the other on Israel Palestine. There's a lot of legitimate criticism from the pro Palestine side and anti Israel. The issue was when October 7th happened, the majority of the content, it was largely pro Israel, anti Hamas. And then over a period of a couple days on the weekend, it flipped completely. That is not indicative of natural trends among people. It's indicative of an algorithmic switch. This triggered Democrats and Republicans to be like, we got to shut this down. But when Republicans started getting traction and Donald Trump personally started getting traction, all of a sudden he was like, nah, maybe we don't want to do this anymore. I say shut them down. Foreign. Foreign governments do not have free speech in America. They should divest. And if they don't want to, this is a trick. TikTok does not have to shut down. They are doing it so that American users go, oh, no, Trump is taking away TikTok from us. Not true.

[Phil Labonte]

I also think that the part of the reason why they want to shut down, as opposed to, you know, sell it off or whatever, is because the servers and the app itself is compromised. And whoever were to purchase it would see what they were doing and also see the algorithm and probably see the algorithm I assume that they've been using, and that would implicate the. The Chinese Communist Party in. In espionage.

[Bobby Sauce]

I think there's a lot of. There's a lot of other far more serious risks to the American people, the mind of the American people than TikTok. I think that them. I think that China, for example, purchasing farmland in strategic positions around the United States is a far greater threat.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Different subject, though.

[Bobby Sauce]

And they. But they also. They also own the entire slate of Hollywood. They control it's. They basically say, you can't put this in this movie, or we won't show it in the Chinese market, the largest movie marketplace in the. In the world. Then on top of all that, they have a lot of influence in a multitude of other different aspects of American society, including sports. The Daily Wire did a great, like, six or something part series about how they're infiltrated into all these other parts of culture. So to think that TikTok specifically represents some type, type of existential threat. I don't think is really true. And if you want to say that, okay, they don't have the right to free speech or they can't collect this data, well then make a rule that this type of data can't be collected by the issue, by any, by any.

[Tim Pool]

Social media issue is that they put Dylan Mulvaney on the front page. That's the issue.

[Bobby Sauce]

Is that proof though? Can you prove that that's the case.

[Tim Pool]

That TikTok's algorithm puts. That's a fact.

[Bobby Sauce]

Can you prove that they put their thumb on the scale that that is the case because of them?

[Tim Pool]

Yes.

[Bobby Sauce]

How?

[Tim Pool]

By going on TikTok, scraping the data and looking at what appears and what doesn't. And actually we actually do rather simple experiments on tracking this data. You'd have to replicate what we do probably a hundred times, but I think it's fair to say it's easily done by any AI. You take a look at Dylan Mulvaney's earliest videos, which we did, and they have nothing to do with being trans. They are Gay Safari.

[Joe Biden]

Yes.

[Tim Pool]

And what Dylan Mulvaney was doing was basically poking the algorithm to figure out what kind of video would go viral. When Dylan Mulvaney came out as it's Gay Safari wasn't really getting a lot of traction. Then did the I'm nine binary, good amount of views. Then the next video, I'm now trans, double the views. Then, hey guys, I'm trans. Not so many views. So days of girlhood, boom, Instant algorithmic success. You can look at almost any creator on various platforms. YouTube is, it's true the same thing. Look at their early look at Mr. Beast's early content and you can see how it's not that they're intentionally like sitting down and saying, how can we exploit the algorithm? They're making content and then content that works, they decide, hey, people like that, I'll keep doing it. So you can see on TikTok, that woke weird gender garbage and ideologies that break the minds of young people have been massively dominant on the platform. And it was only when the right said we are being censored that TikTok switched it and gave conservatives a little bit.

[Bobby Sauce]

But is that grounds for banning? But couldn't you say that every other mainstream news outlet in America, including Facebook, including Instagram, including Google, including YouTube, every single other platform does the exact same thing?

[Tim Pool]

Well, I can. So why did they Facebook in the United States?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

They're Americans.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, but TikTok has TikTok has established.

[Tim Pool]

Corporate, like corporate China can divest from it and we got no problem. They can run their algorithm exactly as, as, as YouTube X and Facebook do. We can complain. We can make claims of government collusion, send investigative journalists and file lawsuits and FOIA requests. Turns out X and Twitter. I don't want to blame X because X is new. Twitter and Facebook were operating portals to allow the feds to go in to take down posts or to flag them. And we don't know what TikTok does because all that's happening in China. So China divest, TikTok stays, we're fine. The problem right now is I'm not arguing for banning TikTok. I'm arguing China divest. I don't know why you would actually argue that China should be allowed to own it.

[Bobby Sauce]

I just don't understand what is the grounds that require. I don't understand what forcing them to divest changes about this algorithm or changes about what they're doing there. It doesn't then then couldn't, couldn't theoretically China remain invested in it. But you have to reveal X, Y and Z because does China is China not invested in a multitude of other different aspects of America?

[Tim Pool]

US just named Tencent as a military company. It looks like the moves are happening in more than on more than just TikTok. And while the bill that was passed specifically isolates ByteDance and TikTok, it does go into mention any other company that is being operated in a similar way by Russia, North Korea, China or Iran.

[Bobby Sauce]

But the bill, but that bill is exceptionally vague and could cover a multitude of other different websites that TikTok is not the only one of. It's not a ban specifically on TikTok. It's actually a very bad at all but it, but it is, it has a, has a lot of very vague language that could affect American businesses, American websites that have nothing to do with TikTok in the, in the details of the bill because it doesn't just specifically ban TikTok. It offers a lot of different privileges. Privileges that could jeopardize that could. It's like do, do we want the government to have more power? I thought that's what we were against. I thought we were against giving them more power and more sensorious, more censorious power and more thought distribution. Censorship isn't that bad. Shouldn't we say that any platform can't do X and all of them have to be able to follow those exact same rules? And if TikTok follows these rules, who, why should we Be forced, why should they be forced to divest? Shouldn't they be forced to divest from the farmland? Shouldn't they be forced to divest from Hollywood?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

For yes.

[Tim Pool]

So then no one disagrees with that? Okay, so then, so why are we allowed.

[Bobby Sauce]

We should force every.

[Tim Pool]

So why are we allowing a foreign corporation to have such a strong control over the economy? United States, how do you imagine this? Imagine China being able to convince an American to argue for Chinese interests on a live show to 50,000 people right now.

[Bobby Sauce]

Rand Paul said, you have the right to hear the wrong information. Who are we to say that they don't have the right, that you don't have the right to hear the information that's incorrect. And the other thing too, to go back.

[Tim Pool]

Foreign adversaries operate. If you go, I'll put it this way. If you went to the founding fathers and said, do you believe that free speech extends to all peoples? They would say, of course. Do you think it extends to our adversaries to leaflet in our country? No, of course not. Absolutely not.

[Bobby Sauce]

There's a lot of, there's a lot of psychological subversion that's happening on any multitude of digital distribution platforms that is going anti to our own issue with.

[Tim Pool]

That argument against American platforms.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, I take, and I take issue with that argument. The idea that, oh, there are other people that might do it so we should allow TikTok to do it. I don't think that's really a solid argument. I think that like, like, fair enough, like there are other platforms that may. Fine. That doesn't mean that, that we should just say, well, because other people can do it. TikTok should.

[Bobby Sauce]

So is the crux of the argument that TikTok shouldn't be able to psychologically subvert Americans that choose to download TikTok and choose to watch those videos.

[Tim Pool]

China, no, it should not be allowed to operate a massive influe program and economic control on our younger generation. Yeah, but if they, TikTok divests from China, then it's an American company, it can do it at once.

[Bobby Sauce]

But that is that to say that they don't have any other influence from China?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

They will have influence, but then don't have recourse.

[Bobby Sauce]

But then don't you have to divest.

[Tim Pool]

Hollywood from China because China's entanglement people.

[Bobby Sauce]

More people watch, more people watch media produced from Hollywood than talk anymore. Some of all television shows, all HBO.

[Phil Labonte]

And also no, like, no, first of all, no, I, I do think that there are more people that are, that are actually watching Tick tock. And on a platform like that than. And then are watching video, movies and stuff. Because this is the new medium. This is the new medium. People don't sit down and watch movies nearly as much as they used to. A lot more people are on TikTok, first of all. And second of all, TikTok shapes the information that you're getting.

[Tim Pool]

They all do.

[Bobby Sauce]

Everything shapes information that you're getting.

[Tim Pool]

Except we can file lawsuits against American companies and the Supreme Court can protect us.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, but, but TikTok is, is incorporated in the United States and could be sued in the same way.

[Tim Pool]

Only as far as American interests can press. Like we can't go to China and ask them to release their servers and release data.

[Bobby Sauce]

But if, here's what I'm trying to understand is like, if a thing is wrong and it's like, okay, there has to be a law in place that universally applies that says that this thing is wrong. Okay, well then what is the thing that is wrong that we are supposedly solving? That the ban. That the ban solves on its own.

[Tim Pool]

See, this is, this is like, that's like a liberal argument.

[Bobby Sauce]

But.

[Tim Pool]

No, but it is. It's a literal philosophical liberal argument that, all right, there must be an underlying straight identifiable principle that affects all things that we can identify as either good or bad. But that's, I think that's, you know, right now I would put it like, for me, I came to a realization on this one. We would describe it as probably a post liberal principle where actually there is no happy medium, there is no middle ground where we can definitively say one such thing is right or wrong. Let me try and, let me try and get specific because otherwise it's hard to understand. The argument that we've often brought up on this show is should parents have the final say on medical issues for their children? Yes or no.

[Bobby Sauce]

Should parents have the final say on medical issues for their children?

[Tim Pool]

Yes.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yes.

[Tim Pool]

So a parent who wants to give their 10 year old a sex change should have the final say on that? No, I guess it doesn't universally apply. Okay, so when conservatives and liberals both argued the exact same principle, parents can decide what is best for their children. Conservatives said, you can't force my kids to get vaccinated, but I will force you to stop if you try to give a kid a sex change. Democrats were inverted. You should be. If Democrats argued if the doctor prescribes a sex change, the parents should be barred from preventing it and the children should not even tell them. However, the government should be able to mandate vaccination. So the principle of parental rights and medicine does not universally apply to morality or ideology in this regard. I would say, based on the bill that we have, there is no universal principle of what we're gonna identify as being right or wrong. The issue is a foreign adversary has control over a large swath of the American people's psyche by feeding them specific information and convincing them to argue in the financial and security interests of China instead of the United States. Like, the idea that someone would come here and literally be like, china should be allowed to operate a mass media program in the United States to 112 million people blows my mind. Like, it should be a simple, like, we don't allow them to do that. Like, the argument is only they must divest and operate under U.S. law. And then we can subpoena their servers, pull their data, and if they're harboring outside of the country, we can charge them and shut them down in the United States. Right now, all we're saying is, TikTok, divest from ByteDance and keep doing your thing.

[Bobby Sauce]

I still don't understand specifically what is the thing that they need to do that is solved as a result of them divesting? If it's like, okay, then you have to, you have to be able to have our, your servers have to be able to be subpoenaed. Then couldn't that just be the universal practice of all.

[Tim Pool]

I don't want Chinese interests to have a control over parts of our economy, be it farmland, be it TikTok, be it Hollywood. And we can start by, with TikTok and other platforms they try to introduce. And it's going to be a game of Whack a mole. But I do think it's important that we do it.

[Bobby Sauce]

What if the information was correct?

[Tim Pool]

Who cares? Who cares?

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, if you're blocking them, because if you're blocking this country or insert any other country, if you're blocking the information from coming in, that could potentially be correct, then we don't have the ability to see the correct information.

[Tim Pool]

That's, that's. If you can sue country like North Korea and we have no means to.

[Phil Labonte]

Do shows like, it's also assuming that the only place you could get the correct information is that one specific app. The, the, the apps. Yeah. Okay. So I, I, I would, it could be especially in. Well, I, I think that's kind of unlikely.

[Tim Pool]

I can, I can end this debate right now.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Do it.

[Bobby Sauce]

Do it.

[Tim Pool]

How many followers do you have on YouTube?

[Bobby Sauce]

5,100.

[Tim Pool]

How many followers you have on Twitter, 5.

[Bobby Sauce]

5,000 something. 5,500.

[Tim Pool]

How many followers you have on tick tock?

[Bobby Sauce]

155,000. That doesn't solve any. I make video content. Video content does not trend vertical.

[Tim Pool]

You're arguing for the platform where you have a following.

[Bobby Sauce]

Oh, no, it has nothing to. No, that. Okay, that is not true. And it's. It's. It's a false equivalency. It's a false equivalency to suggest that my opinion is biased simply because my content works there. For you to presume that that's the case is incorrect. There's nothing to lead you.

[Tim Pool]

I made an assumption.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, you can make an assumption, but it's. It's a false assumption.

[Tim Pool]

That's how many followers I have on Tick Tock.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, that doesn't matter, but that is.

[Tim Pool]

Does.

[Bobby Sauce]

That's irresistible.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

False equivalent.

[Tim Pool]

I feel like basically you're saying that.

[Bobby Sauce]

You're saying I'm only arguing because I want to benefit myself. Yes. Okay, well, you could presume that, but that's not the case.

[Tim Pool]

Like, I had no followers. I don't. I don't think you read the bill. I don't think you know what's in the law.

[Bobby Sauce]

I can't recite it back and forth right now. It's been. It's been a long time since it came out.

[Tim Pool]

You're arguing for your platform.

[Bobby Sauce]

I'm not arguing for my platform, though. I have more followers. I have more followers on Instagram than I do on Tick Tock.

[Tim Pool]

All right, fair point.

[Bobby Sauce]

And I don't. So I don't.

[Tim Pool]

We have almost no files on Tick Tock because Tick Tock banned us, like, five times.

[Bobby Sauce]

Right. And I don't like the censorious nature of Tick Tock. What I. What I understand is that giving the government more authority to do X and specifically to limit the distribution of thought, because this thought is wrong and. Or it comes from this place, therefore it can't be correct, is a dangerous precedent and an additional power and an additional authority that we're already giving to a government that largely mismanages just about every possible thing. So it's like, okay, they. So it's like, okay, they can ban this from China. Well, now, couldn't they theoretically ban information from whatever else? Doesn't it open the door?

[Tim Pool]

It's not a bad. There's no ban.

[Phil Labonte]

And what they. What can't they do?

[Tim Pool]

There's no Ben. There's no Ben.

[Phil Labonte]

What can't they do? Like, honestly, at the end of the day, if the government wants to do something, they can do it. And there's. And the only thing stopping them is. Are the. Is if the American people get loud enough and make enough of a stink.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yep.

[Phil Labonte]

And that's it. Because the Constitution is just a piece of paper. And the government has gone around every single law, that's every single liberty the American people have that's protected by the Bill of Rights. The government has found a way around it.

[Bobby Sauce]

So we should. So we should give them more power so they could do more?

[Phil Labonte]

No, there's no. You're not giving them power. How does they already have it?

[Bobby Sauce]

So then why do they make the bill at all? Why don't they just do it? Why do they have to vote on it if they already have?

[Tim Pool]

The power is exercised.

[Phil Labonte]

That's how. Yeah.

[Bobby Sauce]

So it's just a social procedure.

[Tim Pool]

Let me tell you guys.

[Phil Labonte]

Well, I mean, what. What. What is it that. What is it that they can't do? Well, what do you think that they then.

[Bobby Sauce]

Couldn't they have already. Couldn't they have already forced them to sell it?

[Phil Labonte]

This is two years is them doing. Yeah, but.

[Bobby Sauce]

But if they have ultimate power and they could have done it anyways, then why even have the bill? Why even have the show? Why don't you do it?

[Tim Pool]

The power is derived through congressional action.

[Phil Labonte]

And it's a dog. Everything's a dog and pony show.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Bobby, are you. Are you friends with Fang Fang? I'm just kidding.

[Phil Labonte]

I mean, let me.

[Tim Pool]

Let me tell you guys a story that is completely unrelated to any of these platforms. There was once a social media platform that allowed people to post videos singing songs. The. It was marketed largely to young people on various social media platforms showing young people singing songs. Okay, this is a. This is a fictional story, by the way.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Oh, gotcha.

[Tim Pool]

And all the kids love to sing songs. And so when they sent it for the platform, they decided to try it out and see if this platform was right for them. For many of these young people, they saw overnight, they gained thousands of followers. It was amazing. In one instance, a prominent journalist decided to visit a production studio in Hollywood, and he met up with another production specialist who showed this cool new app where you can sing songs. And she had 300,000 followers. Whoa. And she played this app and said, let's do a video. And when she did the video, she got tons of comments that said, wow. Bang. Hi. Cool. Amazing. So good. And the journalist said, isn't it strange that all the comments are saying nonsense words and not actually responding to you in any way? How do you have so Many followers on this platform. You don't have any followers anywhere else and you have no large body of work. Shrug, says the production specialist. The idea at the time, again, fictional story, was that a foreign entity had produced a social media platform, marketed it to high school kids, and then gave them fake followers to trick them into advocating for this platform instead of other social media platforms. Then later on, when there was upset over what the platform had been engaged in politically, a bunch of people with fake followers started defending it publicly. Again, a fictional story. I just made up.

[Bobby Sauce]

To, again, these. This is to presume that. That there is some inherent bias. That. That is. That can. Then that position can only be held by a person who seeks to personally benefit as a result. So if I deleted my TikTok right now, would that mean that I. That that point no longer exists?

[Tim Pool]

I made the point that I have a TikTok followers. Yeah, but it's the inverse.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, but it's.

[Tim Pool]

We. We have nothing to lose from. From TikTok because they banned us. So here we are, we have. We don't care if they get banned.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, you don't care.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

So I don't think China so much.

[Bobby Sauce]

I'm not defending China. I'm defending the limited, the limitation of the distribution of thought.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Okay.

[Bobby Sauce]

And the fact that China so happens to own some piece. Okay, well, what is it that we don't want them to be able to do? We have to be able to. We have to be able to. We have to be able to review your servers. Okay, fine. Write that in. Every social media company has to be able to be sued for libel, whatever, because the servers. Fine. We have to. It has to have. It can't collect this personal data. Okay, write that in every social media algorithm. What do you mean, no algorithm?

[Tim Pool]

No algorithm?

[Bobby Sauce]

What does that mean, no algorithm? Every social media application has an algorithm.

[Tim Pool]

No, that means you post reverse chronological only.

[Bobby Sauce]

But that's the whole magic of the whole thing, right?

[Tim Pool]

That Chinese interest can determine what you can and can't see.

[Bobby Sauce]

Every social media platform can determine what you see and don't see.

[Tim Pool]

Every television. Some are American and some are Chinese.

[Bobby Sauce]

Every radio station. Yeah, but that's. That's just.

[Tim Pool]

But that's not free speech. Go to Rumble. You got Parlor Rumble Getter X. There's tons of places you can post where the minds.

[Bobby Sauce]

I think.

[Tim Pool]

I think mines.com.

[Bobby Sauce]

I think there's a reasonable case to be made that your argument about me only arguing for TikTok would be inverse. That you already have a huge platform on YouTube. You already point you already have it. So you arguing against TikTok, which is a place where people that are smaller creators are actually able to gain prominence. You don't care because Rumble. Rumble is not. You're never going to get the gas on Rumble that you're going to get on.

[Tim Pool]

Why do you get it on TikTok?

[Bobby Sauce]

You get it on TikTok because it's an interest based. As the interest based algorithm.

[Tim Pool]

The SEC audited TikTok's user base.

[Bobby Sauce]

Hold on. Listen.

[Tim Pool]

The answer is no.

[Bobby Sauce]

Fine. The difference between TikTok and every other social media application is TikTok is an interest based algorithm, which means that you don't have to have a. It's not a subscription based algorithm which is like Instagram, which is like Rumble, like Instagram, like YouTube, like literally every.

[Tim Pool]

Other thing, including Instagram is not follower based. It's interest generated.

[Bobby Sauce]

That's. That is. I think that is more than not more than not true.

[Tim Pool]

Because my feed on Instagram is. Nobody I follow. It's all random.

[Bobby Sauce]

They only did that because TikTok has an interest based graph. That's. That's encouraging them to do that because they have to. Because TikTok is based on interest, which means that you can discover new people. You can have a thousand followers on TikTok and you can have a video get 15 million views. The probability of that happening on any other platform basically does not exist because.

[Tim Pool]

Therefore I posit that those numbers are not real and that you are being manipulated into defending a platform based on fake numbers.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

I got 7 million. And what proof do you have that.

[Bobby Sauce]

The numbers are fake anyways? Couldn't any. Can any number on any platform be determined as fake?

[Tim Pool]

So for American companies that are publicly traded, they are under regulation through the FTC and the SEC if they're public traded to not do that.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay, so we have the same rules on them. Then say you have to say you have to be regulated so that you show the views are real. So that's what I'm saying.

[Tim Pool]

But it still comes down to why should we allow Chinese interests to determine what American young people see?

[Bobby Sauce]

Because it doesn't determine what American young people. People have free will. They don't determine.

[Tim Pool]

You just said it was an interest based algorithm.

[Bobby Sauce]

It's an interest based algorithm. Which means if I watch videos about Pringles moderation policies. Every platform has content moderation policies.

[Tim Pool]

Does TikTok have content moderation policies? Sure. Every single platform Chinese interest determining what you are allowed to see.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, but they could determine what you're allowed to see on television, on radio, in movies, in movie theaters.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

China, bro, I'm so sorry. I don't mean erupt.

[Bobby Sauce]

It's not about China. It's about our China. But that's just. Now it's China.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

It's always been China.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, but that doesn't mean that sooner or later it's China and then it's conservatives and then it's people that believe in free speech and then it's conspiracy theories.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

It's not a slippery slope.

[Bobby Sauce]

I believe it is a.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Sorry. They're China giving America. I apologize.

[Bobby Sauce]

Giving addition man giving additional power to reduce.

[Tim Pool]

I actually think it's a problem. I think the US government should ban foreign influence operations from any adversarial nation that can be proved and proven in court in an adversarial way. Like this bill gives TikTok the right to file a lawsuit to counter the claims which they've appeared to have lost. The Supreme Court refused to issue a decision on decision day, meaning they may take up an injunction, but likely will not. This is TikTok losing the argument. They had the argument, they lost it. Now, I do agree that there is a risk in that, that they'll say, oh, Russia's doing influence operations and they'll falsely accuse people of these things. But this bill doesn't do that. This bill only refers to platforms with more than 1 million monthly active users that allows users to. It's got four stipulations to determine what is a covered company. Ultimately, I do not believe in this absolute libertarian position that in a time of conflict, a nation should allow its enemies to exploit it. There is this liberal universal principle concept of, hey, look, China's gonna run a program in this country. We are obviously in a trade conflict and we've got tensions over Taiwan. War could break out at any minute. But we should let them do this. My view is no. Sometimes a people have to assert strong authority. It has to exist.

[Bobby Sauce]

But are we. Are we anti fact checker?

[Tim Pool]

What is that?

[Bobby Sauce]

Personally, do you like fact. Do you like fact checking?

[Tim Pool]

But what does that. What does that mean?

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay, so if.

[Tim Pool]

What does that. What does that mean?

[Bobby Sauce]

If we are anti fact checker, meaning that there is some authoritary, some authority that suggests that this information is correct or wrong or you can see it or you cannot see it. Isn't it safe to say that that's exactly what's occurring here? If you're saying that this information that China is pushing out is wrong, then who determines that it's wrong about the.

[Phil Labonte]

It's not about the information.

[Tim Pool]

You know what, that's what he's saying.

[Bobby Sauce]

Is that the information gets like Dylan Mulvaney gets pushed to the top of.

[Tim Pool]

The shows their kids.

[Bobby Sauce]

What.

[Tim Pool]

You know what douyin shows kids in China?

[Bobby Sauce]

I'll be honest, I don't know what douyin is.

[Tim Pool]

I mean, I'll start by saying this. If you don't know what douyin is, you shouldn't be arguing this at all.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay, well, I am arguing it, so.

[Tim Pool]

Okay, well, douyin is Chinese. TikTok. Okay, so. So yin on in China shows kids math, science, astronomy, etc.

[Bobby Sauce]

Fine.

[Tim Pool]

What do you think happens to a generation of Americans that are raised on TikTok's gender woke algorithm?

[Bobby Sauce]

These people are using these applications with their own free will and then tick.

[Tim Pool]

But no one's forcing them. But no one appears on the what appears for people and what does not.

[Bobby Sauce]

So you're saying, you're saying that we have to block information that we deem to be no influence.

[Tim Pool]

They have to divest from China.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, but I don't even see how that solves it. I don't see how them divesting from China changes the influence that they have over the algorithm.

[Tim Pool]

Means that we will have legal recourse in the United States and make it.

[Bobby Sauce]

Legal recourse and don't force them to divest. What do they have to divest from if you have the legal recourse?

[Tim Pool]

Americans have a right to their opinions. Chinese people do not have a right to assert opinions over Americans. It's that simple.

[Bobby Sauce]

But they already are in a multitude of other.

[Tim Pool]

And we want it all to stop. Okay, this is one of the ways.

[Bobby Sauce]

But isn't the, Isn't the farmland around military installations far more threatening than somebody.

[Tim Pool]

Again, not. Hold on, let me tell you why it's not 112 million people on a platform, arguably, assuming it's true.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

Affects an entire generation into engaging in behaviors that will destroy a country from the inside out. Farmland being owned is bad. We can seize that with a finger snap. But you can't seize back the minds of 12 year olds who for 10 years use a platform that told them to cut their fucking balls off.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, but.

[Tim Pool]

So you don't want that.

[Bobby Sauce]

But you're saying. But again. So then if, if Facebook says this, then what? You can stop. You can stop Facebook.

[Tim Pool]

We did. If Facebook literally did it, congratulations, we all won. Trump got in, Zuckerberg bent the knee and said, we're removing the restrictions.

[Bobby Sauce]

Right. So, okay, if X decides to do this. Then what?

[Tim Pool]

Decides to do what?

[Bobby Sauce]

If X. If. If it comes out that X is X is not a publicly traded.

[Tim Pool]

Twitter did it. Yeah, but I literally sat down with the CEO and the head of legal for Twitter and explained to them that they had a biased rule set that was favoring people who are suffering a DSM 5 mental disorder.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

And then Elon Musk bought it and ripped it to shreds. Why we win.

[Phil Labonte]

Why should the United States allow TikTok, which run by China to operate in the United States when China doesn't allow Facebook or Google or any number of other American companies to operate in China without having strict censorship laws?

[Bobby Sauce]

Is that the. Is that the metric?

[Phil Labonte]

I know, but why, why should we. But I don't.

[Tim Pool]

Yes. Automatic reciprocity.

[Bobby Sauce]

I just don't know. Well, it's a communist. They're communists. It's communist state. It seems to me to compare what they do to their people as a metric do that.

[Phil Labonte]

They want to control what people see.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, that's bad.

[Tim Pool]

Why would we allow information controls.

[Bobby Sauce]

Bad.

[Tim Pool]

Would we allow communists to control a large economic driver in the United States and information driver?

[Bobby Sauce]

Because. Because the moral hazard of restricting thought distribution is a problem and is a power and is an additional power that you're granting to an already bloated government that mismanages everything. So you're saying that they are now.

[Phil Labonte]

Is not afforded the protections of the United States Constitution, sir, again, it's thought.

[Bobby Sauce]

Again, it's. It's thought distribution.

[Tim Pool]

Look, I'll just make this like the simple if you can do the argum. TikTok has successfully convinced Americans to argue for constitutional protections on Chinese interests.

[Bobby Sauce]

You could say that any social media.

[Tim Pool]

Platform I'm in favor of. I'm in favor of banning all trade from China. I'm in favor of Donald Trump pay them back for 30% tariff on all goods made in China, no matter what. I'm in favor of severing diplomatic ties with China. I don't care. China has no rights in this country. China should not be manufacturing American goods, selling them back to us made by slave labor and gutting. Gutting our culture and our economy and so that they would have any interest in our media space that targets young people. That is, in my opinion, an act of war, sir.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

And I agree with the farmland. That's a bunch of bullshit. Bullish.

[Tim Pool]

But owning land is minimal because. Right. There's one guy, it's more influential. One federal agent with a piece of paper and no weapon can take that land in two seconds.

[Bobby Sauce]

Sure.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

We could do it ourselves if we wanted to. But having Chinese control the mines of use. I mean, I give zero. Absolutely.

[Bobby Sauce]

But that's a. That's a stretch to just be like they are controlling the minds of. Because people choose to go on this platform and consume information with their own free will. The. If the content that I watch on Tick Tock doesn't suggest. And even if it did, even if it said to say. To say that my free will is determined by the algorithm and I. And I don't have agency choose what I want to watch or not want to. You. I could also not have an account at all. Sure.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

No saying you don't.

[Tim Pool]

You know, if, if what you were saying was true, would never buy an ad.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Not sir. But Bobby, you don't. You know, you have your own. You have your own agency.

[Tim Pool]

If what you were saying was true, Coca Cola would never buy another advertisement again.

[Bobby Sauce]

Explain that. Explain that to me.

[Tim Pool]

Do you know how much it costs to run videos in front of people on the Internet?

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, I have a. I have an elaborate understanding of it in fact.

[Tim Pool]

So China.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

Has a multibillion dollar interest in determining what videos you get to see because advertising works.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay. But that means advertising is just presenting an idea to a person that they can choose to purchase.

[Tim Pool]

Selling an idea.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay, so then we ban the selling of ideas that we deem wrong.

[Tim Pool]

We just say China shouldn't have the ability to do that in this country at scale.

[Bobby Sauce]

And then what country is next?

[Tim Pool]

Iran, Russia and North Korea.

[Bobby Sauce]

And then what? And then what comes after that?

[Tim Pool]

Whoever declares war on us.

[Bobby Sauce]

People that are anti government, perhaps.

[Tim Pool]

That's not a.

[Bobby Sauce]

People that are anti establishment, not a country. Yeah, but this. Isn't this how all these things work? It's like, oh, there's not an income tax. It's only going to be on the rich. And then the rich is a million.

[Tim Pool]

Oops in every direction. Yeah. So you can choose to allow China to send Dylan Mulvaney to children or you can say no, China, you can't do that. Pick one.

[Bobby Sauce]

I don't know that Dylan Mulvaney on a, on a social media application to human persons that have agency that determine that. You're saying like, like these people are too stupid to understand the information that's being presented to them and thus daddy government must ban it. You admittedly, you're giving more power to a straw man, to a bureaucracy that is limiting thought distribution.

[Tim Pool]

Indeed I am not. That's a straw man argument. How? Well, I never said anyone was too stupid. I said Influence operations work. That's why Coca Cola buys ads. If you think Coke isn't successfully running advertisements and those ads appear because they don't know what to spend their money on. I got a bridge to sell you. So the issue is when China, for instance, wants to run. Oh, they run Xinhua in the United States as well. And to a certain degree you want to run a company like that, fine. We're talking about the scale of what TikTok is and the stranglehold they have over a large amount of young people. The slippery slope goes in every direction. If we say we will do nothing, we are saying the Chinese Communist Party can effectively control what 112 million people in the US get to see and they're going to send them things that are bad for US interests. If we say we want China to divest, the argument is sooner or later the US will ban other countries. Yup. And there is no such thing as a happy medium. The slippery slope goes in every direction. I elect that China not be allowed to run influence operations at this scale.

[Bobby Sauce]

I think if you had a very specific outline of what are the things that any thought distribution platform has to follow and all American companies included would have to adhere to these specific guidelines and, and Tick Tock has to adhere to those same guidelines, then fine. But to specifically isolate Tick Tock or China or whatever. And I think that, look, I don't know.

[Tim Pool]

The issue is Americans have a right to their opinions and the Chinese people don't have a right to opinions. In America, the Chinese Communists. Right. So if you're an American, ideas are ideas.

[Bobby Sauce]

I don't know.

[Tim Pool]

If you're an American and you're a leftist, you are allowed to say you're a leftist and promote leftist ideas. If you're conservative of same thing. If you are Chinese, you have no right to distribute those ideas in this country.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

That's why English people, British people, all these, excuse me, all these foreigners try to tell us how to run our country. Their words mean nothing to us.

[Tim Pool]

But it's.

[Bobby Sauce]

But they can do it.

[Tim Pool]

Right?

[Bobby Sauce]

Right.

[Tim Pool]

They're not running one of the largest social media platforms with no accountability, no transparency. Yeah. To all of our young people.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

They're in a much more.

[Tim Pool]

Simultaneously send their children math and science. Science, yeah.

[Bobby Sauce]

So force them.

[Tim Pool]

Clearly an act of war.

[Bobby Sauce]

I don't think so differently. How?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Like they give their kids two hours a day or whatever. They do math and. But they let the American people like do whatever the F's going on around there.

[Tim Pool]

Come on.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay, then write into the law that any social media application that gives government soon for more than two hours.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Big government daddy, like you said, I'm.

[Bobby Sauce]

All against the government having more authority to censor ideas is.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

That's giving government more authority. By telling government daddy that you can't. You have to give the kids two hours a day.

[Bobby Sauce]

I don't want that. That's what you're saying. I don't want that.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

I'm saying that's what China does. And you're saying, yeah, who cares what China.

[Bobby Sauce]

I don't, I don't care.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

We don't care. Okay.

[Bobby Sauce]

I don't care what they do with their people. That's. I mean, I care, you know, what.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

They do with our people.

[Tim Pool]

So. So once again, this is a liberal principle of, okay, we will let our enemies. We will let our enemies use tactics against us that we ourselves do not use. Use. I don't agree with that. I take more of a post liberal approach where you have to have some assessment that foreign adversaries are seeking to destroy you through subversive means. And we set limiting guidelines on how these things are to operate in this country. And so that being said, TikTok as a business can survive, the jobs can exist, the servers can exist so long as China is not owning a portion of it. There's ways they can loophole around that. But I think this is a simple way to say we as the United States do not allow foreign adversaries to influence at scale our people.

[Bobby Sauce]

I think that that is a reasonable position to have. However, China already has a multitude of other influential ties into all other aspects of American culture.

[Phil Labonte]

All of those.

[Bobby Sauce]

How is that a fallacy?

[Tim Pool]

Because we're not arguing farmland or Hollywood. We're arguing one thing.

[Bobby Sauce]

What about the NBA?

[Phil Labonte]

Same.

[Tim Pool]

We all argue on that. Okay, fallacy is when I say X and you say Y. We're not talking about why. You are right about why. Let's figure out whether this ban in a bill right now should be implemented. If the argument is why don't we ban them from owning farmland. Agreed, we'll do that.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Amen.

[Tim Pool]

Tomorrow.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay. I don't know. I just think that. I think that the. Look, I didn't read the bill. I didn't read the bill because I didn't know that we would speak specifically talking about it except for seven months ago. No, I read it seven months ago when it first came out. And to me it appeared to have a lot of vagaries that could affect all types of other websites and other unnamed countries and ultimately not True thoughts does it just specifically says chinatoc it.

[Tim Pool]

Has North Korea, Russia, Iran and China.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Okay, Iran or Iran, I call it Iran Iran.

[Bobby Sauce]

And if that was, and if that was passed, wouldn't a modification to include some other thought process or country be a lot simpler?

[Tim Pool]

The reference, the reference in the bill refers to another, a separate bill that pertains to acquiring materials from adversaries, acquiring or distributing. And it lists four adversarial countries. The TikTok bill says a covered entity is one of those that is part of the adversaries listed in 18 USC blah blah, blah, blah blah. If Congress wants to amend any one of these bills, notably the root bill which identifies adversarial nations, to add another adversarial nation, that would actually affect any other bill attached to it. So it wouldn't just affect this one bill, but also Congress does have the authority, the power and nay the privilege to determine who our adversaries are. That's what Congress is supposed to do. And I believe as a country you need a governing body should be Congress determine who our enemies are and to declare war when need be. In this instance, saying foreign adversaries shouldn't be running on an app like this. So what does it specifically say? ByteDance TikTok their subsidiaries, entities controlled or owned by them or it specifically says foreign controlled, foreign controlled of these four nations, blah blah, that has a website or app. What does it say? A website, desktop, desktop application, mobile application, augmented or immersive technology that 1. Permits a user to create an account or profile to generate, share and view text, video Images, Real Time Communications 2. Has more than 1 million active monthly active users with respect to at least 2 of the 3 months preceding the date on which the determination of the President 3. Enables one or more users to generate or distribute content that can be viewed by other users on the website, desktop, application, mobile, et cetera, et cetera and then four enables one or more users to view content generated by other users. So there's exclusions listed in it. They get TikTok got 165 days to file a challenge, which they did, and it appears that they've lost. The federal courts upheld upheld this and the Supreme Court largely seemed like they didn't see why China would have first First Amendment rights in the United States. And there's nothing barring Congress from saying foreign adversaries can't operate this way. If the President makes a determination under this code as it pertains to a website following these four criteria, they can issue a report to Congress for which Congress can then make a declaration that this other website operating like TikTok in a similar fashion would also be forced to divest from one of these four nations. At that point, they would get 90 days to file action to challenge that. So it's not a ban. The only thing that would happen is if this goes through on Sunday, TikTok will be forced to remove. Well, not TikTok. Apple and Google would be forced to remove TikTok from the app Store. The apps could still appear on their websites. You go to TikTok US and click download, it'll go right to your phone. But not on the iPhone, because iPhone's problem, not anyone else's. But you could still get on Android instead. TikTok said, no, screw you guys. We are going to shut our company down to spite this law. They could just divest. Why not? And now it says something to me that a company says, we won't divest from China. Why not? I thought it was about just doing business. Right. You just want to run business. Why wouldn't you divest from China? And then they say, and we would rather shut the whole thing down than do so. Sounds to me like this is a weapon against the American people and American children and not anything else.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, that's a. It's a. It's a negotiation position to assign. To assign the meaning of it. It's like you would have more leverage by getting the people to speak up about it, which would be what would happen as a result of you doing that. So it puts you in a better negotiating position in the public to do that.

[Tim Pool]

The reason TikTok is shutting down is, according to the rumors. Okay. Because, you know, for illegal reasons, they want to. They want to offend as many TikTok users as possible. With the blame being on the US government.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, that's right. That seems reasonable.

[Tim Pool]

No, it's not. Because TikTok wasn't banned.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, they. You again, you don't have to make something happen in order to make something happen. If you effectively strip every right that you have, and then who does it go to? It goes to Microsoft. Microsoft's never done anything bad to the American people, so I can solve it. Yeah, but again, like I said, if you can sue them in the United States, I don't know.

[Tim Pool]

I don't want to keep foyer.

[Bobby Sauce]

I don't want to keep looping around months. Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

Like, it's just simple. There's accountability for American companies. It's hard to get, but it's possible. And we did it with Twitter and Facebook.

[Bobby Sauce]

I just think, I just think. I just think limiting thought distribution, blaming it on specifically this one thing right.

[Tim Pool]

Now is we're not banning Tick tock.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, okay. I just think it's a. I just think it's a risky precedent for limiting.

[Tim Pool]

It doesn't limit. It doesn't limit thought to say, divest from China. For what reason do you think they should not divest from China?

[Bobby Sauce]

It's not about them divesting from China. It's a. Yeah, well, that's all this bill does. That's like saying. That's like saying the income tax. That's all the income tax did. It's just a tax on the rich and it's temporary just to raise. Raise funds.

[Tim Pool]

No, I'm saying. Why are you, why are you arguing China should be able to own this company?

[Bobby Sauce]

I'm not earning. I'm not arguing that China should be able to own this company. I'm saying that there's nothing as, there's nothing as permanent as a temporary government program. There's a lot of things that they said would be a thing that ultimately I asked you, but I'm just saying a lot.

[Tim Pool]

Give me One reason why TikTok should not divest from China.

[Bobby Sauce]

Again, I'm not saying that, that TikTok should not divest from China. I'm saying that to give them the power to force any company to divest from any country specifically because of psychological subversion or whatever they want to blame right now is a strange precedent.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

What if we.

[Bobby Sauce]

That could all Palestinian. But you could say that.

[Tim Pool]

I'm going to, I'm going to pause real quick. And they already have the power. Right. In World War II, we had the U.S. office of Censorship, which literally ran controls over all information in the country and all news outlets. A lot of us would find that offensive by today's standards. This is much, much, much, much lighter than that. It is simply saying we don't want China to own a massive media company in the United States.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

What's one reason why that that should be allowed?

[Bobby Sauce]

Because thought should be allowed to be distributed and you should be able to hear the wrong thing.

[Tim Pool]

We. I did.

[Bobby Sauce]

Because people have agency.

[Tim Pool]

One more time.

[Bobby Sauce]

People have agency. You don't have to download TikTok. You don't have to watch the videos.

[Tim Pool]

Can still exist if they divest from China.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, but I don't know.

[Tim Pool]

For what reason should they not have to do that for?

[Bobby Sauce]

Because. And because then you're saying that any company should have to divest from any other company.

[Tim Pool]

Even Though that bill, one of four countries.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, for now, until it's 10 countries, till it's 50 countries, till it's a thought, till it's an ideology. Anybody that's anti government is not allowed to post on these platforms. I'm just saying you're just giving more power.

[Tim Pool]

You're just giving more power in every direction.

[Bobby Sauce]

Fine. But you're giving more power to a government that mismanages a lot of things. Things that I think does a really bad job. If the only information that was true in the entire world only existed on Tick Tock, we wouldn't be able to get it.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah. So that. So it's not, probably not an argument for why one country. Well, should not be allowed to run this company.

[Bobby Sauce]

It's not about the one country. It's about. It's about the principle as a whole for any country, for any thought. And we'd be limited.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Well, Tick Tock's not the only place in the world that has the right accurate information, which is.

[Bobby Sauce]

But what if it did?

[Tim Pool]

Well, what if.

[Bobby Sauce]

What if.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

What if I was like 5, 10, and 500 pounds of muscle?

[Bobby Sauce]

Look, a lot of. Look, I don't want, I don't want to go. We don't have to go down this road. But I'm just saying, like, a lot of the, A lot of the Israel Hamas conflict, a lot of that content.

[Tim Pool]

Was really, really circulating on TikTok not before October 31st.

[Bobby Sauce]

Fine. But, but, but nobody seemed to have, Nobody seemed to have a problem with TikTok until the information was circulating specifically there. And then it's like, oh, now we have to, now we have to get.

[Phil Labonte]

When was the, the first time. So the banning Tick Tock was proposed was before.

[Tim Pool]

Well, well, before.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Bobby Sauce]

So.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

And Trump after.

[Tim Pool]

So, so what happened when Trump, When Trump.

[Bobby Sauce]

When Trump originally initially initiated it, when he was in office.

[Phil Labonte]

Yes, but there was a proposal to ban tick tock before October 7th.

[Tim Pool]

That's from Republicans.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah. And Donald Trump is against. That's right.

[Bobby Sauce]

Right. And so why?

[Tim Pool]

Because.

[Bobby Sauce]

Is he wrong?

[Tim Pool]

Yes, he is. Because after October 7, there was very limited content pro Israel or pro Palestine. However, seemingly over the course of a single weekend, pro Palestine content skyrocketed to like 168 million impressions or something.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay.

[Tim Pool]

Researchers felt, as I did and many other of my friends who work in media, that it was indicative of an algorithmic switch. We don't know because we have no access to that information. But it would appear that China made a decision that in the United States, young people should favor Palestine. I don't know or care who they should favor, but I don't think China should be able to make that decision for us. We have X, we have Rumble, we have Gab, we have other platforms. These things are hard to break through. We went to war over Twitter and Facebook and Meta and we won that war. I don't think a foreign country should determine what young people think about foreign policy. I think it should be our duty as Americans to resist the mainstream corporate garbage narratives among ourselves and not have China. China's interest is not helping the Palestinians. China's interest is causing internal conflict. So the Americans rip each other to shreds and then our young people become morons and our country falls apart.

[Phil Labonte]

And that's the thing that foreign entities want more than anything else. They're not interested in actually having people like having the majority of America have one particular opinion. They're interested in the strike rife. The, the, the less unified the United States is and the more the, the US is at each, at each other's throats, the better it is for foreign interests.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah.

[Bobby Sauce]

And I, I, I don't.

[Phil Labonte]

Chaos is the point.

[Bobby Sauce]

I don't disagree with that. But I would wager that there's a multitude of other companies and industries and media conglomerates in the United States that operate in the United States that already do the same thing, of which none of these laws really apply. And nothing stops them from doing that.

[Phil Labonte]

There are Russia today is right.

[Tim Pool]

Just like that's.

[Bobby Sauce]

It should be able to.

[Tim Pool]

So, So I think what would help you out.

[Bobby Sauce]

I liked rt. I thought it had some good.

[Tim Pool]

If you understood how U.S. regulation worked, depending on scale. Right. Might help you understand. So for instance, Tik Tok has an estimated 112 million users.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay.

[Tim Pool]

A small app with 10,000 downloads that's from Russia is of no concern to us. It makes, no. It doesn't matter.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay.

[Tim Pool]

So when it comes to regulation and laws, typically there's a requirement on how much, how many employees you have and how much money you generate. A lot of the laws pertaining to big tech and things around censorship, Section 230 liabilities have to do with scale. So some of the bills that were passed that we ended up debating over the past few years say the platform must exceed 100 million users. And that's a massive threshold.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yep.

[Tim Pool]

TikTok is being targeted because of scale. We, we absolutely isolate large single companies. Take a look at how the US Government went after Microsoft. There's a ton of other companies that did the exact same thing Bill Gates did with Internet Explorer or. Yeah, I think it was Internet Explorer. And we don't care because they don't have a monopoly. TikTok has a, has a large footprint and has enough power to make young people in this country mentally ill. That is a bad thing. If VK or some other app has a few thousand users, we don't care. Now if they get to that point where they're so large they're actually disruptive to the economy. I'll give you another really important point. Point. China controls TikTok with 112 million people on it. Many of these people make a living. TikTok choosing to shut down is causing economic damage to probably several hundred thousand people. And that's TikTok choosing to do it, not the US government. TikTok has a choice to divest from China or be off. The app stores still operate. Instead they said to those 300,000 small businesses that rely on TikTok, you, we will burn you to the ground before we divest from China. That sounds to me like a weapon.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, it sounds like exactly what I said before, which is that it changes the court of public opinion. It's a, it's a negotiating strategy. They're not saying fuck you to those businesses.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, they are. Well, that's, you don't need to shut them down.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well then if I say, if I say you need to do this and if you don't hop on one leg and bark like a dog, then, then I'm not gonna, then I'm not gonna make this thing happen. And you're like, I don't want to do that.

[Tim Pool]

I would consider that a good, I would say a better analogy would be like the king torching the peasants fields and then blaming the neighboring country saying they did it.

[Phil Labonte]

One of the fundamental arguments you're making is that there's a slippery slope argument. But the evolve. You've already acknowledged that RT is, is, is not allowed in the United States and it's specifically because it is Russian propaganda or it's state sponsored propaganda.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay.

[Phil Labonte]

We don't have, we don't allow North Korea to have a channel here in the US that's state propaganda. We don't allow other countries to have state sponsored propaganda broadcast in the United States.

[Tim Pool]

We do. It just depends on. Yeah, fair enough.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Okay.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

BBC, Al Jazeera press, Press one, Shinhua again. And also what about press one's Iran? What about China again?

[Phil Labonte]

No, I don't think the, the, the, they don't, I don't think that the. You can, you can broadcast in like.

[Tim Pool]

They'Re not on tv. Yeah, well, yeah, but. But I think the press won and their reporters are all over the.

[Phil Labonte]

So the. But the point is there are plenty of. Of platforms that are banned by the United States. So why is. And, and so the argument that it's a slippery slope. It's not a slippery slope. It's just. It's like there are some that are and there are some that aren't, and that. That depends on how much of a threat the United States decides.

[Tim Pool]

That's a good point. We do got to go to Super Chats. But it is a good point that, that when RT was getting banned, there was no major hubbub or fervor over it.

[Phil Labonte]

No one cared. And it wasn't until.

[Tim Pool]

It wasn't until people's platform was threatened, they started defending TikTok.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, and I think it's fine that. I think it's fine that the United States says these particular platforms or these particular channels, we think that what they're trying to do is actually a threat to national security. And we're not going to allow them to, to, you know, broadcast here.

[Tim Pool]

We got to go to Super Chats because we're way late. So smash that, like, button. Share the show, Become a [e-mail] Ladies and gentlemen, if you believe in what we do and you want to change the world alongside us, we need you as members because it's how we operate. So the way I often describe it, January is usually our biggest month for members. I have no idea why, but I will also tell you that January is the worst month for everyone in advertising. So marketing departments don't have finalized budgets. So every YouTuber sees a massive tanking of revenue in January. One of the reasons we started the member program when we did was because we were like, we need to know every month that there's like a baseline and it fluctuates a little bit, goes up, it goes down. Sometimes we got a big guest, you guys sign up, we get a bunch of new members. But it basically allows us to say we can hire X many people to do this many things. When we rely solely on advertising, it's like, January hits and you're like, all right, everybody, we're shutting everything down. The only guests we're going to have are going to live next door. So you guys, as members, make it possible for us to operate early year in Q1 and then throughout Q2 when things start improving and stabilizing. It's great. But membership is what makes it all possible. You get Access to the Discord server. You're going to make friends. There's over 20,000 people hanging out. We really do appreciate all your support. Let's read what you got to say. All right. Robert De La Cruz says what? Me again? You are number one. Good. Good job, sir.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Shout out, Robert.

[Tim Pool]

All right. Adaptive outdoorsman podcast says hey. Says hey, Tim and company. If you're looking for inspiration, perseverance, and hope, give a listen to the podcast about disability and healing in the outdoors. Keep up the good work. Thanks, Sean. Right on. Did you want. Did you plug that back in?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

I did.

[Tim Pool]

I said can.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Oh, yeah, yeah, done.

[Tim Pool]

And then YouTube crashed on me.

[Phil Labonte]

Oh, no.

[Tim Pool]

All right, let's. Let's try getting our super chats back. Here we go. Oh, let's see, we got. Here we are. Richard Devine says Thanks for the 28th Amendment Board p. S. Is it true that eight mansions that burned down were owned by Ukraine generals? I have no idea.

[Brett Dasovic]

I read that. I'm not sure if that was true. At least. I at least saw that headline.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Why are Ukraine generals in the Palisades?

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, why?

[Bobby Sauce]

Come on.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

I'm just saying, it's like China and tick tock.

[Tim Pool]

Anyways, let's talk about that again. No, no, no.

[Bobby Sauce]

The.

[Tim Pool]

The super chats are not forgiving to the defense of TikTok. I will say Paulie Puree posted a series of frog emojis and said, Tim is right. Free speech is for US Citizens, not for countries outside the USA like China.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Usa. Usa. Usa.

[Tim Pool]

All right, let's read this one. The text vet says he doesn't want to give the US government more power because they might exploit. But he's defending the CCP having more power by the merger of corporation and state. Make it make sense.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay.

[Brett Dasovic]

One of the big points that Riley Moore was making on Friday was talking about just the. You know, it's. It's also got to do with spycraft and with intelligence operations and data leakage and stuff like that. Like there's more to it than that, but for another day.

[Bobby Sauce]

To me, it's just more. It's about. It's about giving the government power to limit people's ability to hear information. Well, okay.

[Tim Pool]

Do you think RT should be unbanned and restored?

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah. Yeah. Why? Yeah, I don't think we should be in the business of limiting information. I think the more information, the better you have. Like Rand Paul said, you have the right to hear the wrong thing.

[Phil Labonte]

It's not that it's limiting information. It's limiting the. The. The one Outlet. If there's information that is on RT that goes through another. Another. Their app or whatever, it can get to the American people, correlate the information.

[Tim Pool]

My issue is that Tick Tock is a dominant platform that has no accountability to the United States and it limits information. So, you know, with tick tock having 112 million users and banning certain ideas, it's a massive, powerful platform that we can't do anything about. We have no control over, and it limits information.

[Bobby Sauce]

Google bans ideas, Facebook bans ideas. YouTube bans ideas.

[Brett Dasovic]

But there's legal recourse to get involved.

[Bobby Sauce]

Involved in. And put the legal recourse in for Tick Tock.

[Tim Pool]

We did no more Chinese interest.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Yeah, like there, there, there's.

[Tim Pool]

There's literally not a single argument.

[Bobby Sauce]

Nobody in China owns any Facebook stock. Nobody in China owns.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Cares about Chinese folks.

[Bobby Sauce]

If the does. Does none. Does none of the Chinese government own any?

[Tim Pool]

If they do, we will put a stop to it. But for now, we want to deal with Tick Tock. Okay, well, all right. The TextBet says subversion.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

That's a fun combo.

[Bobby Sauce]

They have book ownership, whatever.

[Tim Pool]

Subversion and exploitation, along with propaganda and psychological exploitation is not open free will. That's why these practices are illegal in business agreements. Stop defending child exploitation.

[Bobby Sauce]

Sorry, wait, that's me. I'm defending child.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

My bad. Definitely, Raymond. My bad.

[Bobby Sauce]

Wait, is that what they're saying? I'm defending child expectation?

[Tim Pool]

Talking about you?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

No, they're definitely talking about me, but I was just trying to make it better for.

[Tim Pool]

You were making a point.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, how. How am I defending child?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

I don't know, bro.

[Bobby Sauce]

Oh, because of the thought. They're explaining the thought.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Super chats.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay. Yeah, I mean, that's a. I think that's a stretch. I think it's about ideas, but okay.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Expectations on Facebook and everything. Instagram. So I don't know what that comes from.

[Bobby Sauce]

Right again. And then you're determining this is exploitation. This is not whatever. It's information.

[Tim Pool]

BATM Media says if you give California money, they are just going to waste it on. Why?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

What?

[Tim Pool]

I can't read it. All right. You know, Eric says, why so many China bootlickers in the chat? I thought we voted these people out two months ago.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Amen.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah. Donald Trump is wrong about a lot of things.

[Bobby Sauce]

I mean, it's like Trump has successfully negotiated all these things. He's so great. All these things he's right about. I would be curious to hear what is his position as to why it shouldn't be banned.

[Tim Pool]

He said it's because he saw tremendous growth among the youth. One but one with 36 points. So maybe we should hold off on the ban and have a negotiated side settlement.

[Bobby Sauce]

I would bet it's a lot deeper than that. That's probably the. Okay, well, well, he. It's like, it's like I always hear this about Trump. It's like he's a. It's like he's playing 500 dimensional upside down chess, but he's also so dumb that all he has is this one position. It's like he can't really be both things. So I would wager that there's a lot more to it. He just does what he always does, which is simplify a point to a very small digestible nugget. And if we were to get him to long form, elaborate as to why he holds that position, I bet it wouldn't just be, well, I did well there. Maybe it would, and we don't know. But I would rather.

[Tim Pool]

Donald Trump is good at some things. He's not good at some things.

[Bobby Sauce]

Sure.

[Tim Pool]

He's right about some things. He's wrong about some things, as we all are. He's great on foreign policy. He proved that in his first term.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

He sees tremendous benefit from TikTok helping him out. So he says, okay, I'll kick you back. Right.

[Bobby Sauce]

What's just for him? He's just, he's just doing it just to protect himself. And he's already in, I think, can't win again.

[Tim Pool]

I think Donald Trump's motivations are not just about himself, but he sees TikTok as having turned around from what the problem was perceived initially by conservatives.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

So now he's saying, okay, negotiated settlement. They gave us part of what we wanted. Let's talk about it.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, that's fine.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

Well, the bill was passed. Supreme Court said they're not going to issue a decision on it. It is constitutional and China should be forced to divest.

[Bobby Sauce]

Hey, I'm still against it.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

No doubt. I'm still right.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, that's fine. Hey, we're, this is why we're here. Right. This is what it's all about.

[Tim Pool]

Sir says Coca Cola had actual Coke in it at one point. People bought it. Bought out of free will. Then why do we make Coca Cola remove Coke from the recipe? Because it's determined to be detrimental. Same thing here, just tech versus food. Well, I mean like tartrazine is in food and that's detrimental and we should get rid of that.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yes. So is so oxycontin, but we could buy that so is every. There's a billion things that would fall under that category.

[Brett Dasovic]

Well, there's like a.

[Tim Pool]

Certainly. And I believe in banning things.

[Brett Dasovic]

Did you see that?

[Bobby Sauce]

I know that. I don't think we should be in the business of banning things.

[Tim Pool]

I think we should. Should.

[Brett Dasovic]

But did you see that Coke gave Trump an inaugural. Diet Coke. Presidential Diet Coke.

[Tim Pool]

A single.

[Brett Dasovic]

Like, it's like. Did you see that?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

I did see the picture.

[Tim Pool]

Do you think that people should be allowed to sell heroin to children?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Oh, there we go.

[Bobby Sauce]

Do I, I think that heroin should be legal.

[Tim Pool]

Do you think someone should be able to sell it to a child?

[Bobby Sauce]

I think, I think saying that it's to be sold to a child is different than should it be able to be sold in general.

[Tim Pool]

Okay, so including children and adults, should someone be able to openly sell heroin.

[Bobby Sauce]

Heroin, not to children. I would agree with that. I would agree with the children thing. Not having to be able to sell heroin to children.

[Tim Pool]

Can they. So some restrictions on goods being sold. This is a moral line that you have a good.

[Bobby Sauce]

A good. Again, a good being sold to children. A, A narcotic. I think that probably all drugs should.

[Tim Pool]

Be legal, but not sold to children.

[Bobby Sauce]

I think that, I think that there's an argument to say that no, they should not be able to be sold to children.

[Tim Pool]

But why is that?

[Bobby Sauce]

But a willing adult, perhaps.

[Tim Pool]

Why not a child? Child.

[Bobby Sauce]

I mean, do I really need to explain why drugs shouldn't be sold to children?

[Tim Pool]

Yes.

[Bobby Sauce]

Why. Why do I need to explain that? Because I don't believe self evident, though.

[Tim Pool]

I, I don't know if you have a real moral position on the issue because you said some things should be legal and I'm asking you if there's a moral limiting factor and if it, if, if you do have one, what is it?

[Bobby Sauce]

I, I don't know. I, Maybe I'm not smart enough to process that. But it's like. Let's say that, let's say that you use the same argument as it goes to Tick Tock. Well then, okay, then you can't be 18 to be on Tick Tock, which I'm agreed. Which I'm pretty sure is already the law. I'm pretty sure that's already the rule.

[Tim Pool]

No, you can be 13, I think.

[Brett Dasovic]

Okay, so then forceable anyways.

[Tim Pool]

Unenforceable. But I don't think. I don't. It's not US Law, though. That's terms of service.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay, fine. Well make it.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, we should ban social media for anyone under 18. I agree.

[Bobby Sauce]

I don't Think so, yeah.

[Tim Pool]

The reason why I don't want to ban.

[Bobby Sauce]

I don't want to ban the distribution of ideas to anyone.

[Tim Pool]

Do you know what phthalates are?

[Bobby Sauce]

I don't like banding. I don't like the principle of banding.

[Phil Labonte]

Wait a minute.

[Tim Pool]

If you know what that.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

No.

[Tim Pool]

Or pcbs.

[Bobby Sauce]

Pcbs, yeah. I've heard both of those terms, but I don't know.

[Tim Pool]

So these. These are chemicals that leech out of plastics into our food and water that are called. They're called endocrine disruptors. And they cause physical. What's called abnormality.

[Bobby Sauce]

Sure.

[Tim Pool]

And they can cause mental problems. They can cause. It's endocrine disruptors. So it's hormonal imbalance issues. Some people think that it's one of the reasons why we see a spike in gender dysphoria because many of the young millennials and younger that were born today go to an antique store. It's really fascinating. And you'll see that everything is tin or glass. And then around the late 70s, 80s, we started putting all our food in plastics. Phthalates, PCBs, begin leaching into food. I believe that we should ban plastics for food because it is poisonous. Just like we said, we gotta take lead out of gasoline. It's going up in the air. And it was actually correlated with an increase in crime. The reason why I think someone shouldn't be legally allowed to sell drugs to children is that it can create a psychological and physiological dependency that does not affect an adult in the same way as can social media. So there are certain things that can destroy a society that we regulate against. I think the government should. I think good parents tell their children they can't have certain things. And good leaders stop countries and people from consuming poison. Because it is not the job of the plumber to do research on why the PCBs are poisoning him or his children. We do rely. I'm not a libertarian. I think there's a reason for an fda. I think it's largely corrupt. I would like to see it cleaned up. RFK Jr. Fantastic. But this is why the US government says, guys, we're not gonna allow the use of plastics for these goods. Many people may get mad. It may be expensive, but the problem is we literally have an entire generation of people who are poisoned with endocrine disruption. Shut her down.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah. And I think that the. I think that the child variable is the part of it that muddies the water of the discussion. If you say, okay, it shouldn't affect children, okay, then if the discussion is about people that are willing and consenting adults, I think that simplifies the argument one way or the other. If we take that piece out of.

[Tim Pool]

It, like take like, no, children should be able to get access to Tick tock.

[Bobby Sauce]

No, no, what I'm saying is for the point, for the, for the sake of the, for the sake of the discussion, to eliminate it. If it's like, okay, we both agree that kids shouldn't have social media till 18, then we agree on that and then we argue the merits of, of the argument. Aside from that, assuming that all people are willing and consenting adults, I don't think that we should bend social media for children. I don't think that that's something that the government should be in the business doing. What about plastic? About? I don't think that plastic should be banned. I think that you should. I think if you were determined that this thing causes this specific issue, then you could ban the use of that thing.

[Tim Pool]

Perhaps it does cause the issue. We know it does. And it's mass produced and it's in everything. It's in everything.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay, so the government, so the government does a garbage job at doing lots of stuff. Pretty much all things.

[Tim Pool]

Oh, but hold on. I'm talking about your morals. Like, if we know that plastics are leaching into our food and causing problems in a lot of people, should we or should we not ban it?

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, it deter, it's, it has to be determined. Is it unanimously determined by every single scientist in the entire world that that is true?

[Tim Pool]

Yes.

[Bobby Sauce]

Every scientist in the entire world says that that's the case.

[Tim Pool]

I mean, you're making a straw man argument.

[Bobby Sauce]

No, I'm just asking.

[Tim Pool]

I don't academically accepted that. Phthalates pcbs.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, it was academically. It was academically accepted that that thing did the thing that it did.

[Tim Pool]

Do you think?

[Bobby Sauce]

Right. Wasn't that academically accepted? Well, the thing that we can't talk about, the mysterious thing and then the mysterious potion.

[Tim Pool]

Do you think? I don't know.

[Bobby Sauce]

You said it, I didn't.

[Tim Pool]

You think, do you think, do you think thalidomide should be allowed to be ingested by pregnant women?

[Bobby Sauce]

I don't know what fluid is. Look, look, I'm a joke maker. I, I, I, I understand the limitations of my intelligence. I'm, I'm, I'm talking about the principle as a whole. I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm just talking about it from my perspective. I don't know all these specific drugs. I, I don't know as it relates to these things.

[Tim Pool]

That's why I asked.

[Bobby Sauce]

All I know is what I. What's that?

[Tim Pool]

That's why I asked you moral, simple questions. Understand?

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay.

[Tim Pool]

Where you draw the line morally. Like.

[Bobby Sauce]

Like with what? Okay.

[Tim Pool]

Well that's why I asked about plastics. Right? So we have products that are universally used that people don't realize kill them. And a lot of people figured it out and they purchase reusable glass bottles to avoid ingesting foods that come from plastic. Though no matter what we still largely do, we can't escape it. We try our best. I think that if a lot of people could see direct impact of say like eating lead paint chips, they'd probably smack it out of a kid's hand and say stop doing that at but unfortunately there are a lot of people who are doing their best to raise their kids and so they elected to have governmental institutions to try and do that work for us because we decentralize. We can't do it perfectly. Now our government is largely corrupt and government itself largely is not a good function of things. That's why RFK Jr. Is now going into the FDA, which is fantastic because we won those battles. The price for freedom is eternal vigilance. I do think a father tells their kid stop eating Ho Hos and ding dongs, run three laps and do push ups. Nowadays liberals say what an abusive father. How could he make the kids do that? No, a good father was stern and told their kid what they had to do. And a good leader tells his people there are certain things that will kill you and kill us and so we regulate these things.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, but shouldn't does that mean that we should ban cigarettes and ban alcohol?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Tim likes what do you think about cigarettes? I heard yeah Segment today about that.

[Tim Pool]

Well, I very much hate cigarettes but I largely agree that people should be able to free to choose so long as they're over the age of 18.

[Bobby Sauce]

Probably a lot more poisonous than plastic.

[Tim Pool]

Over the age of 18. Choosing to. Huh?

[Bobby Sauce]

What?

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

I I just said I don't know. No, I says I don't know.

[Bobby Sauce]

Okay. Over the presumption is that cigarette smoking is more dangerous.

[Tim Pool]

Over the agenda disruptors probably choosing to smoke a cigarette that you know, causes harm to you and is addictive.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

Is one thing. Everyone in the country having no choice but to breathe in leading or be forced to take some kind of medication or to consume plastics without their knowledge is totally different.

[Bobby Sauce]

So the knowledge is the issue, not the poison.

[Tim Pool]

The knowledge ubiquity and monopoly and scale people aren't forced to smoke. They can choose to, but people are forced to consume from plastic.

[Bobby Sauce]

Why?

[Tim Pool]

Because every product is in plastic. Every single. Some things are sold in glass bottles, but largely they're not inside. Right. So scale has occurred. And now everyone is ingesting these chemicals which are causing sickness. Had the FDA just banned red dye 3 because the average person doesn't know what it is. Tartrazine, for instance. RFK Jr brought up. Most people don't know that yellow 5 is this coal tar byproduct that's put in all of their foods for literally no reason. And they don't realize that it causes. It causes physical health effects.

[Bobby Sauce]

I would say the information. I would say that the information is more important than. Than the out. The outright ban. The outright ban is not as important as the information. Right. So couldn't you solve the problem through information as opposed to through banning?

[Tim Pool]

The issue is scale. If you were forced to smoke cigarettes, I'd have a problem with it.

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, but you're not forced to use plastic.

[Tim Pool]

Good luck finding food not wrapped in plastic.

[Bobby Sauce]

But that doesn't mean that you're forced to.

[Tim Pool]

So the issue.

[Bobby Sauce]

You could. But you could, you could go to the farmer's market and buy vegetables and that's what no one's. Yeah, but no one's stopping you from doing that. So to say that you're forced to do it.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

People who don't have money, they have.

[Tim Pool]

The issue is scale. The issue is that the average poor person is eating garbage macaroni and cheese with no vitamins. And we are trying to balance the issues of freedom and liberty. But again, I will state, I am not a liberal who believes in universal principles. Those don't exist. Some things should be banned, some things should not. Sometimes parents should have final say in whether they're. Whether they have medical. Determine the medical issues of their children. Sometimes they should not. That's it.

[Bobby Sauce]

Well, I think that. I think that there's sugar morally determinant. That's why I, I think that sugar is in a lot of things. Right. And I was doing some research last night about, about the drugs. The top, top of the top 10 drugs in America, prescription drugs. Five of them are for diabetes. And they're. Sugar. Yeah. And sugar is in absolutely every single thing. And there's a lot of sugar and things that people don't even realize that there's sugar in it. So what did they do? They have to write on the back that there's sugar in it. Did it change it? I don't know. Do people know that sugar is bad? Yes. Do they consume it anyways? Fine. If, if there was no plastic and plastic was to be banned, then the cost of food would be so high. Is it better that that person has no food at all? All that's the debate. It's like I just don't, I just don't believe, generally speaking in the banning of things as the solution to things. The government decree to ban is not necessarily the solution. I was having this discussion with somebody the other day about GMO vegetables and it was like if there was to. If you were to ban GMO in the United States, which I probably think is good. I think the initial thought is banning GMO is good. Well, if a. If a g. If GMO vegetables allows there to be. Be a lot bigger bananas that could feed a whole family and you can buy these bananas for considerably cheaper than a person that is in poverty can afford to eat bananas and have it with their whole family. If without it then they would have maybe no banana at all. Is it better to ban. I don't know.

[Tim Pool]

Let's. Let's carry this over to the members only show and have a big libertarian debate. Head over to timcast.com where we are going to take your calls as members and talk about things that are not so family friendly. So we'll add swearing to the argument. You can follow me on X and Instagram at Timcast. Make sure you subscribe to this channel. And Bobby, you want to try anything out?

[Bobby Sauce]

Yeah, go to follow bobby.com to follow me on everywhere including TikTok until it's banned. Don't get subverted and follow me at take naps on Instagram.

[Raymond G. Stanley Jr.]

Raymond G. Stanley Jr. Thank you Bobby. It's a very fun time. Yes, I had a freaking blast. I'll say effing next time. So yeah, guys, Remy G. Stanley Jr. On X& wherever you want to look at me, me. Mr. Brett.

[Brett Dasovic]

I did find it funny that of all the headlines this is going on, I saw somebody say that Bob Dylan joined Tick Tock today. So you're just a little bit late, bro. That's why Bob Dylan sucks. As I've always said, if you want to follow me, I'm on Instagram and Twix at Brett Dasovic, please check out Pop Culture Crisis. We are live Monday through Friday at 3:00pm Eastern Standard Time. See you there guys.

[Phil Labonte]

I agree with Brett about Bob Dylan. I am Phil that remains on Twix where you can subscribe to my page. I am Phil that remains official on Instagram. The band is all that remains. January 3:31, our new record Antifragile is is going to be released Go to Spotify Pre save it. You can go and check out some of the new singles. Forever Cold, let you go, no Tomorrow and Divine. They're available on YouTube, Amazon Music, Apple Music, Spotify, Pandora and Deezer. And don't forget the left lane is for crime.

[Tim Pool]

We will see you all [e-mail] in about a minute. Thanks for hanging out.