Chicago Bears LEAVE CHICAGO w/ Matthew Williams

Summary

Podcast Summary: Timcast IRL – "Chicago Bears LEAVE CHICAGO" w/ Matthew Williamson

Date: June 6, 2026
Host: Tim Pool (Timcast Media)
Guests: Matthew Williamson (writer, podcast host), Ian Crossland, Phil Labonte, Brandon Miner, Carter Banks

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Tim Pool and his panel, joined by writer and editor Matthew Williamson, unpack the seismic news that the Chicago Bears have officially left Chicago for Hammond, Indiana. While the headline centers on a sports story, the group quickly expands the conversation to grapple with themes of cultural decay, tradition, immigration, municipal economics, populism, and the larger implications for American identity and local governance. The dialogue is passionate, unapologetic, and rooted in both nostalgia and sharp political and social analysis from an ideological independent-right perspective.

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Main Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Chicago Bears’ Move: A Loss of Tradition

• Announcement & Emotional Impact:
  The Bears' board voted to move the team from Soldier Field in Chicago to a proposed massive new domed stadium in Hammond, Indiana, ending over a century of tradition (13:29–16:01).
• Symbolism Beyond Sports:
  Tim and others stress this is not “just about sports.” For Tim, this move is “a story about the American tradition… how we have failed and given up our traditions” (06:00).
  Quote: “When you look at this as a sports story, it’s not. This is a story about the American tradition… it’s about what our great-grandparents, our grandparents, and our parents built for us, and it’s about how we have failed and given up our traditions.” – Tim Cast (08:08)
• Local vs. State Politics:
  The panel notes Indiana’s aggressive offer: 40 years with no taxes, over $1 billion in stadium funding, $700 million for infrastructure, compared to Illinois’ unwillingness to subsidize a new stadium (54:00–54:17).

2. Economic and Political Analysis

• Hyper-Capitalism vs. Cultural Investment:
  Ian argues the move is "hyper-capitalism" — maximizing revenue with little regard for civic tradition (14:15). Tim counters it’s a municipal, not purely market, failure: "I am asking for government subsidy... to allocate public funds to something the people of Chicago want and care about” (15:12–16:07).
• Subsidies, Tax Base, and Municipal Priorities:
  The city’s refusal to invest in the Bears is linked to shifting demographics and priorities. Illinois spends $2.5 billion annually on migrant support but won’t spend a comparable sum on community tradition (39:17–39:54).
• Missed Economic Opportunity:
  Losing the Bears means handing billions in future economic activity — Super Bowls, fan tourism, events — to Indiana. “Illinois is gonna lose an insane amount of money by giving this up.” – Tim Cast (23:11).

3. Cultural Cohesion, Immigration & Changing Voter Base

• Replacement Migration Theme:
  Tim frames the Bears' move in the context of “replacement migration,” suggesting newcomers (especially those brought in by open border policies) don’t value legacy locals’ traditions and thus don’t vote to fund or retain them (13:29–14:15).
  Quote: “When you bring in these newcomers, they say, ‘I don’t know what the Bears are and I don’t care that you built them.’” – Tim Cast (10:48)
• Community Disintegration:
  There’s widespread agreement that as local communities are fractured, both by internal disinterest (youth drift, "sportsball" mockery, video games) and by demographic change, traditions like major sports teams become more vulnerable.

4. Sports as Communal Glue & Bread and Circus

• Inter-Generational Identity:
  Brandon, deeply emotional about the loss, describes football as “embedded in your DNA” in Chicago (51:15). The panel agrees that teams and shared rituals bind families and communities together across generations, and their loss is a marker of societal erosion.
• Critique of Modern Consumerism:
  Ian and others discuss how the "bread and circus" dynamic (sports/entertainment to pacify the public) is no different than video games or other modern distractions—yet the cultural binding force is more important than the entertainment value (49:36–51:06).
• Urban Planning & American Decline:
  The movement of teams, closure of stadiums, and rise of city “corruption” are symptoms: “When the community becomes fractured and incapable of rising up…the government’s not going to do what you want to do." – Tim Cast (55:01)

5. Municipal Bureaucracy, Development Bottlenecks & The Problem with Building

• Barriers to Construction:
  Matthew Williamson explains how NGOs, activists, and historical societies use bureaucracy and regulation (environmental, archeological, heritage) to block projects, and that this dynamic repeatedly hampered the Bears’ attempts to stay in Illinois (67:53–69:21).
• Broader Implications:
  The panel discusses Tim’s own attempts to build civic infrastructure (a coffee shop in Martinsburg, WV) and the inertia/atomization that makes it tough to create or revive communities on the Right.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “We are the only pro illiteracy podcast online because that keeps us a job.”
  – Matthew Williamson (04:52) [introducing his work with 'Do You Even Read' & 'Digital Archipelago']

• “I warned of this… when Joe Biden brings in 200 Haitians… next year when they go to vote, the 200 Haitians outvote them: ‘we want a migrant welcome center.’… The government jamming people who don’t respect our culture into our communities and stripping us of what we value.”
  – Tim Cast (13:29)

• “I’m just going to say it right now. I’m from the south side of Chicago. I never went to Indiana. Well, you know why we go to Indiana? Cigarettes.” – Tim Cast (11:33)

• “If you went to the ’90s and you said we are going to move the Chicago Bears out of the city, not even a joke, there would have been riots.”
  – Tim Cast (25:05)

• “What we have seen from liberal policies has been short term gains for long term losses every step of the way. This is a tremendous long term loss.”
  – Tim Cast (25:09)

• “Imagine hosting a Super Bowl in Chicago… the amount of money generated from that…”
  – Tim Cast (32:50)

• “It’s a fight between the people of Illinois, the city of Chicago, and the way that the NFL is growing in the modern day age. And it’s a battle that unfortunately we have lost. And I don’t think there’s any way to recover from.”
  – Brandon Miner (39:17)

• “Bread and circus… they pacify their citizens with bread and circus. Sports kind of feels like the circus.”
  – Ian Crossland (49:36)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:21] – Tim opens with passionate monologue on the Bears’ move and why it matters.
• [04:52] – Guest Matthew Williamson introduces himself and his approach to political literacy.
• [06:00–10:48] – Emotional reactions, reflections on what the Bears mean to Chicago.
• [13:29–16:05] – Debate on whether economics or demographics drive the Bears' move; replacement migration argument emerges.
• [23:11–25:23] – Breakdown of the financial and branding implications for Illinois vs. Indiana.
• [32:50–34:58] – The economic windfall of hosting a Super Bowl, and the lost opportunity for Chicago.
• [39:17–39:54] – Comparison of stadium cost vs. billions spent annually on newcomers.
• [54:00–54:17] – Details of Hammond, Indiana’s extraordinary stadium incentives.
• [67:53–69:21] – Discussion of bureaucratic hurdles to major civic projects, both sports and non-sports.
• [74:27–75:55] – Commentary on Americana, civic engagement, and the “death of small town America.”
• [106:15–110:20] – End segment: Panel addresses the status of “wokeism,” cultural change, and class warfare.

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Additional Highlights

• Fan Culture: Brandon and others describe the unique, nearly religious intensity of Chicago Bears fandom, referencing SNL’s “Da Bears” sketches and the generational pain of teams losing or underperforming (34:58–36:15; 47:47–48:57).
• Comparison to Other Franchise Moves: Ian brings up the loss of the Cleveland Browns, showing parallels in other cities (37:33).
• Sports as a “Community Identity”:
  — “It is part of a community identity, that’s absolutely true… you already know what teams you’re rooting for based on what your family was part of.” – Matthew Williamson (50:59)
• Policy Solutions (Half-Serious):
  Tim jokes about mandatory baseball, apple pie, and using federal authorities to “save” teams — as gestures to restoring tradition (76:23–77:59).
• Modern Sports:
  Panel discusses rule changes, safety, and the rise of “enhanced games,” acknowledging the spectacle and brutality of sports (83:03–88:29).
• Civic Engagement and Local Power:
  The show leans into advocating for more local involvement—knowing your city council and where your taxes go (74:27–75:55).

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Tone & Style

• Conversational, irreverent, emotionally charged, and sarcastic at points.
• The hosts are openly critical of Democratic and “woke” policies but include nuanced debates over capitalism, subsidies, and civic priorities. There’s humor, especially when discussing sports superstitions, bread & circus, and “mandatory baseball.”

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Summary Takeaway

This episode is simultaneously a lament for the loss of Chicago’s greatest sports tradition and an indictment of broader American political and cultural trends. The move of the Bears serves as a prism through which issues of demographics, government spending, community dissolution, civic pride, and economic competition are examined. The panel calls for Americans—especially on the political right—to re-engage with their local communities and protect what traditions remain before, in their view, "there’s nothing left to save."

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For Listeners:

If you’re interested in the intersection of culture, politics, local governance, and the shared rituals that make communities strong, this episode serves as both a rallying cry and a mournful eulogy for what’s perceived as a fading era of American civic life.

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[End of Summary]

Transcript

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[Ian Crossland]

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[Matthew Williamson]

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of $45 for 3 month plan equivalent to $15 per month required intro rate first 3 months only plan options available. Taxes and fees extra. See full terms@mint mobile.com this may be the most shockingly offensive story I've ever covered. And if there is anything that would drive me to rioting, it's not politics, it's this. Chicago Bears are gone. No more Chicago Bears. That's it. They're the Hammond Indiana Bears. Now Chicago, my hometown, has given up one of its most important traditions. And now, to all the liberals watching, I'm going to complain about immigrants. I'm going to complain about the economy. I'm going to complain about that's not democracy in Chicago. And that's what we're going to talk about as to how you lose one of the most iconic things your city has. The Chicago Bears. Can you believe it? I can't believe it. I can't. I.

[Brandon Miner]

Seriously, it's.

[Tim Cast]

It's not. We knew it was going to happen. Cuz they've been talking about either moving them to Arlington Heights or Indiana. At least if it was Arlington Heights, a suburb of Chicago, it's Illinois and just kind of the Chicago suburb Bears. But when you cross that state line, you want to play games. And then everyone's like, what about the Giants? What about the commander? Get out of here. Get out of here. Chicago Bears. So that's the most important thing that I could talk about today. Despite the fact that right now ballots were stolen in the California election. More accusations, accusations of cheating. A ballot dump came in with zero votes for Spencer Pratt. I know all of that is important, but they took away my Bears. I will riot. Mark my words. Everybody's pissed about it. Everybody from Chicago. You know what I'm gonna say if it turns out they did it on a Friday of all days, the stupidest day to do it. They probably put out the news about the Chicago Bears leaving Chicago on a Friday because I want to bury the story. But I'm gonna tell you this, my friends, it's the weekend and people have the weekend. I wouldn't be surprised if they riot over this. Well, I'd be half surprised. I guess we're gonna talk about that and a whole bunch of other stuff before we do. We got a great shout out for you. It is Red, White and Laser Garage made patriotic gifts and custom engraving. American made patriot proud. Right from the Tim Cast Discord community to your ears. As part of our community spotlight, we're putting out on Fridays we'd like to give a shout out to Red, White and Laser, a business owned by one of our Discord members. Red, White and Laser specializes in custom laser engraved products featuring patriotic themes, personalized designs and handcrafted pieces that celebrate faith, family and freedom. Whether you're looking for a unique gift, custom decor or one of a kind creation, they can outbring your ideas to life. They're currently offering 25% off. So if you'd like to support a fellow member of the community, check them out at red, white and laser.com it's laser with an S. Red, white and laser.com shout out to the discord community for Tim [e-mail] Joe join us my friends. Be a part of the movement. We do shoutouts for the companies made by our community on Fridays that can be you. And we sell coffee. Delicious coffee like Ian's Graphene Dream. Low acidity coffee. So if the coffee hurts your tum tum, you can drink low acidity coffee and you'll feel real good we also got pool brand water, pool water drinkable from the glass bottle or aluminum bottle, as well as cold brew concentrate and a whole bunch of other special whole bean and ground coffees available just for you, my friends. Don't forget to smash that like button. Share the show with everyone you know. Joining us tonight to talk about this and everything else is Matthew Williamson. Who are you? What do you do?

[Matthew Williamson]

Well, thanks for having me on. Greatly appreciate it. I am a writer and an editor. I am the host of two programs known as do youo Even Read in the digital archipelago. So many people in politics, they tell you so often, go read this, go read Theory, no one actually reads. And so myself and my co host, Dimes, we do a very good job at trying to cover all the. All of the sort of political literature out there that, you know, people tell you to read. We actually do it. We like to tell people all the time that we're like the only pro illiteracy podcast online because that kind of keeps us a job. But you'll find me quite often, in the words of. In the Blaze with Frontier magazine. I've been in IM 1776, the Mars Review of Books, and more often than not, I'm usually a guest on Orrin McIntyre's program. So thanks for having me on.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah. When you first came in, you know, Kellen had shared the news about the Bears leaving Chicago, and I just saw you, like, you hulked out. You started smashing things and we had to calm you down. We were like, stop, stop.

[Ian Crossland]

And you were like, forced the suit jacket back on.

[Matthew Williamson]

I know it was real rough, but at the same time, I'm forcing myself to kind of react because it's like, man, this is a really bad time to announce that I'm a Green Bay fan.

[Brandon Miner]

Oh, no.

[Phil Labonte]

Oh, no.

[Tim Cast]

I know.

[Matthew Williamson]

I'm in hospital with the Hammer.

[Ian Crossland]

Relax.

[Tim Cast]

No, Green Bay's fine. You know, they're like our neighbors.

[Matthew Williamson]

It's a good rivalry.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah. So it's. You know what it is? It's like, like you and your brother will get into a fight, you'll get real mad, but then if someone else threatens your brother, you're like, you turn immediately like, no, no, no, no, no, no. So it's like with Green Bay, you know, we'll, we'll. Well, smack talk. But.

[Matthew Williamson]

But if the Vikings say something, you and I. Yeah.

[Tim Cast]

No way. It's war, baby. All right, we got the boys hanging out, everybody.

[Ian Crossland]

Ian crossing up in it. What's going on, guys?

[Phil Labonte]

What's up, everybody? I'm Phil Bonte sing for all that remains.

[Ian Crossland]

What's up, everyone? Carter here in Brando behind me.

[Tim Cast]

Let's get into the news. We got this from WTHR NBC. Welcome to Indiana Bears board votes to move the team from Chicago to Indiana. Uh, I w. I would like to just say. Excuse me. Congratulations to Indiana. You've won. Indiana's just been doing better than Illinois for a long time. We all know it. And don't get me wrong, you had those. Those state senators that are, you know, they. They. They didn't want to redistrict, and, well, they got what was coming to them. Indiana just has generally been better for a lot of reasons in terms of freedom and gun rights and buying cigarettes. I guess as long as I've been around, everybody in Chicago knows it. And now they've taken from us, our Bears. They have done it. And, well, I say good match. Good match. My anger is now with Indiana for actually securing the Bears. The Indiana Bears, they're not. You can't use the word Chicago anymore. I forbid it. Chicago failed. We failed. And I know a lot of you might be saying there's gonna be a mix, right? A lot of people care about sports. They care about our iconic teams, our traditions. They care about watching football, and I respect that. But there are a lot of people are probably saying, like, I don't care about sports ball. Who cares? This is not about sportsball. You know, and I hate that word, too. It's like people make fun of sports. I like sports. I'm not a big football or basketball watcher, but I respect it. And it's physical feats. They're very important. Get out there, get exercise. But there are a lot of people you need to understand when you look at this as a sports story, it's not. This is a story about the American tradition. It's a story about what our great grandparents, our grandparents and our parents built for us. And it's about how we have failed and we have given up our traditions. Now, you may be saying, ah, but the Bears. You know, listen, I'm gonna. I'm gonna tell you honestly, I am biased. I am from Chicago. What the Bears mean is, to someone from Chicago, it's iconic. It's the signs, it's the flags. It's Soldier Field. It's growing up and having this be a part of your life as something that was built to be shared. And we have good memories of and we cheer for it. And I know you guys feel that way about your hometown teams as well, be it small or big. When I see this story, I ask myself how it is that a city gave up on securing one of its most iconic traditions. How is it that when it came to a vote, the. The. The mayor, the governor, the system in place, said, we don't care about our sports team. Now, again, let's remove sports team from the equation and talk about life, liberty, the pursuit of happiness, the traditions and the things that are all around us. When your governors, when your mayors, when your politicians come to a vote and they ask the people, hey, I want to get reelected, what do you care about? When the people say, we don't care about our traditions? It's not just sports, it's jurisprudence. It's the Fifth Amendment, it's the First Amendment, the Second Amendment. All of these things eroding all around us now exemplified right in the faces of your average person. Seeing an iconic sports team be stripped away from. From our hometown. And many of you may say, tim, who cares? It's sports. What I say is this. We have brought in people not from this country. Many of them welcomed with open arms, and I respect that. But many of them illegally, and they were brought in under the COVID of night by Biden and by many of these Democrats, illicitly flown on planes, dropped to the tune of millions of individuals. Some of these people get amnesty. Some of these people are protected by the likes of Barack Obama. These people have kids. These people get citizenship. But. But they are not here following the moral and cultural traditions that were built by our families and our fathers and mothers for us. And with all due respect to these people, I understand why they vote for what they do. But when the question comes to a city, what shall we allocate for production in the budget? We have this much money from taxes and from income. What should we spend? A country, a people, they say we vote for our traditions. But when you bring in these newcomers, they say, I don't know what the Bears are and I don't care that you built them. So when the vote comes around, the politicians say, we don't need money for the Bears. We don't need money for our traditions, for our icons, for what the city means anymore, because it is now majority newcomers. And therein lies the big problem. Let me stop ranting on this. You can tell I'm pissed off about it. But we've got a statement here From George H. McCaskey and President Kevin Warren saying, yesterday the Chicago Bears board of directors met and voted to advance our stadium development project in Hammond, Indiana, with the exact site to be selected. We believe A world class stadium project in Hammond will transform the region connecting northwest Indiana to the south side of Chicago, through the loop and across neighborhoods in the suburbs stretching north of the city. It will bring Chicago land together and deliver new opportunities to its residents and businesses. I'm just going to say it right now. I'm from the south side of Chicago. I never went to Indiana. Well, you know why we go to Indiana? Cigarettes. That's what people go to Indiana for. They drive the half an hour to Indiana to buy cheap cigarettes and then illegally bring them over to sell Lucy's at, at keggers in warehouses. So when they're like, Indiana is of course part of the Chicagoland area. That means nothing to the people who grew up in that, in this city. So let me just end my rant furiously just by saying this is exactly exemplifying and I hope it reaches the ears of people, the eyes of people who aren't really paying attention to politics. You may live in New York, you may live in California, you may live in Texas, and you may have seen, maybe, maybe you saw the Redskins get turned into the commanders when they vote to strip you of your traditions and iconography and what your culture is and was and what you grew up and what you love. And I hope people outside of Chicago can recognize what it means when you have decades of jokes, of media, of movies, of stories about your iconic team and then one day they vote to take it away. Your history does not matter to these people. And that's what we are watching be stripped from us. For me, I care about the first Amendment, the second Amendment, I care about baseball and apple pie. And now it's come to the faces of regular people when the city can't even maintain its own iconic Chinese traditions. I am going to smash something right now.

[Phil Labonte]

Look, I mean this kind of thing, the, the, the changing of American society is something that we've been seeing, you know, happen. It was slowly happening I think in the early aughts into, into the teens. And then with the George Floyd riots in, in 2020 with the whole BLM and, and stuff like that. All of the, all of the massive changes to, you know, the statues that had to be taken down, all of the phrases that became, you know, you're not allowed to say them anymore. This kind of stuff is directly because the populations of the United, the populations of different, different areas in the United States have, have sign substantively changed. Right? Like, so America is not populated with as many Americans, people that value America, that value our history, that value our culture. There are just fewer Americans, particularly in. In cities.

[Tim Cast]

I literally warned of this when I was talking about Springfield, Ohio, and them eating the dogs and eating the cats when I said, you have. You have 100 people and they have a baseball field that was built by Granddad. And they go to their town hall meeting and say, hey, what should we spend our town's budget on this year? And everyone agrees. We love our baseball field. We love what Granddad built for us. And they all clap and cheer and say, our kids are going to play baseball, too. And then Joe Biden brings in 200 Haitians. And next year when they go to vote and they say, should we maintain the baseball field, all of the people from that town say yes. And the 200 Haitians outvote them, saying, we want a migrant welcome center. I'm not blaming them for wanting a migrant welcome center. I understand why they do. I am blaming the government for jamming people who don't respect our culture and traditions into our communities and stripping us of what we value.

[Ian Crossland]

You might be right that the illegal

[Phil Labonte]

immigrants caused the British, not just the. Not joking.

[Ian Crossland]

That might be something to do with it, but I'm desensitized because my Cleveland Browns got taken from me in the 90s and went to Baltimore. It's hyper capitalism. These guys are chasing cheaper taxes in a cheap stadium.

[Phil Labonte]

No, I disagree.

[Ian Crossland]

It's the Federal Reserve. I blame the Federal Reserve.

[Phil Labonte]

It's been happening for 100 years. I totally disagree. I don't think that there's the issue.

[Tim Cast]

The issue right now is they're going to cheaper, better state story is that the state Soldier Field is small. It's from. It's from an older era. And they want to be able to do more events. They want to be able to have larger audience, like more people in the stands. They want to be able to make more money. And so they went to the city and said, what can we do? And this. He said, we won't do anything for you. So they said, well, something has to be done. So the Bears started entertaining other sites. Arlington Heights and Hammond, Indiana. The city could absolutely allocate the funds to a bigger and better stadium and expansion and move it and keep it in Chicago. And they decided not to do it.

[Phil Labonte]

And the motivation.

[Tim Cast]

That's just it. And sorry, sorry.

[Ian Crossland]

Just real quick, they were like, you

[Tim Cast]

know, and real quick. To your point about capitalism, yes, I agree. And what we are asking for. What I am asking for is not capitalism. I am asking for government subsidy. I am saying of the things we spend money on. And we look in New York City and they're dumping tens of millions of dollars on hotels for illegal immigran. I am just asking that they give tax subsidies and allocate public funds to something the people of Chicago want and care about. Instead, they built migrant camps on the south side. And the black community was outraged, saying, we are being replaced. They take our money and they build things we don't want and they refuse to build the things that we do. That's what pisses me off.

[Ian Crossland]

It may be that they did the math and they're like, if we put 1.2 billion into a stadium, we're going to recoup it over 19 years with inflation. Like, what's the value here? The people in North Indian are still going to take the L up into Chicago, go and hang out all night.

[Phil Labonte]

It doesn't.

[Tim Cast]

But because the issue is not money, and that's the point.

[Ian Crossland]

I think this is all about money.

[Phil Labonte]

It's not.

[Ian Crossland]

You said subsidies. Right.

[Tim Cast]

The issue for me and what I am mad about is that when we as a collective decide to pool our money towards government, which includes infrastructure projects, it should include things like iconic traditions that also generate revenue and are important for the morale of a people and a city. The issue is, when it comes to the question of allocating funds for this, your voter base is no longer Chicago and it is no longer America. You now have people saying, we don't. Look, we're going to vote for you, but we don't care about this. So Pritzker and Johnson and whoever else is running is taking into consideration, if I decide to allocate a billion dollars or whatever, some ridiculous number towards making sure the Chicago Bears stay, the Chicago Bears, will I get votes? The answer is no. Because you have young people who don't care about this country and our traditions, and you have people who aren't from this country who don't care about our country and our traditions.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, it is about. It is. It is about the changing of what the population is. Because. Because the. The people of Chicago, they don't care about things that are American anymore.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, geez. I mean, that's a grand generalization. You might be right about some of them, but we've got to look at the books to know what the. The economic projections of this are before we make a decision. It's all about economics. Okay?

[Phil Labonte]

You just.

[Ian Crossland]

You just.

[Phil Labonte]

Ian, you just said. You just said that we have to look to know. Then you made the assertion that, you know, you can't, and those things are Mutually exclusive.

[Matthew Williamson]

Well, I mean, can we pull this up? I mean, what did Hammond offer them? What was it 40 years before they really start doing any kind of taxation? And I mean, on top of this, we've seen throughout all types of major companies and institutions in America. Let's go back maybe 10, 15 years ago when Amazon was trying to move to get another headquarters or another facility opened up. You had countless mayors doing advertisements giving the sweetest deal humanly possible to have them go there. There were like a dozen mayors that were all doing the Alexa, hey, where's the next, you know, headquarters two going to be? And it would say their respective city. A lot of this is going to have to do about the leverage that the taint the team and the board are going to use to what kind of, you know, pot that's sweet enough for them to stay in the town. And if Hammond is going to undercut the city of Chicago, yeah, it's a pretty bad sign for the city of Chicago because the Senate passed it right in the morning. So the House said no and now they're deciding to walk. Whether or not this is the end and all be all is a whole other story. But it really does go to show, to Ian's point, that this has a lot to do with what kind of deal they can get.

[Tim Cast]

Yes. And there's, I don't know. Did you guys watch the Dave Rubin Jubilee?

[Phil Labonte]

No.

[Ian Crossland]

No, no.

[Tim Cast]

So he's, he's having a debate with Parker, this Parker get a job guy. He loves to debate random people. He has like call ins from people who have no idea what they're talking about and he's just insults them. So he sits down in front of Dave Rubin and he says, can you tell me one metric by which Donald Trump has made this country better? I mean like gdp, inflation, unemployment. And then Dave Rubin says something to the effect of, well, the big beautiful bill just passed. I mean, we are still waiting for the repercussions. And then Parker asked him the same question again. Yes, but can you give me a metric? And he talks really fast. Can you metric by like Donald Trump has made things better, like inflation, gdp, like something. And Dave Rubin says wait. And then everyone laughs at him. See, this is the problem I see with what you're saying. This is the problem with the modern era. My response to this young feller would have been quite simply, well, immigration. One of the most in terms of metrics that Donald Trump has improved things was on immigration, where the American people in 2024 saw immigration as the second most pressing issue and voted for Donald Trump with a mandate to enforce our immigration laws, which he reduced that number dramatically. So in terms of what the people asked for, now, if your argument is the structure of governance is good, when graph go up, I'd say you are a child who fundamentally misunderstands what it means to be a nation and a people. And that is when I look at the Bears, I look at our traditions and what, what unit unites a people and its culture? When people share cultural values, they hold hands, they hug, they get along. When people from Chicago say, this is our team, they get mad. When someone insults their team, they say, yeah, well, the Bears, like, you can't talk about my Bears that way. But in Chicago, everybody's like, let's go Bears. And they're high fiving. These are the things that unify us and are incredibly important, which means we should spend money on them, even if the return may not be there. To the point of Parker, when he says, what about immigration, inflation or otherwise, the issue of tariffs come up. And I say the tariffs are a good thing. To which the response is, and I say this, but Parker said the tariffs are bad. You know, they cause problems. I believe the tariffs, the universal tariffs have been bad internally for the US Economy and have been good for American culture. And it's something that must be done. We must spend money to improve. This is a strange reality we live in where the mentality among the liberals in this country is we, we should just have every, like, we don't got to spend money to improve things. Things should just generally improve magically by word. When we decide to fix a road, we look at the thousand dollars we have and say, guys, we, we're gonna lose $1,000 when we spend this money, but we'll have a nice road. They go, no, we don't spend money on those things. We should spend money on other things. The point is this. It costs us money to keep the Bears. And why do we spend that money? Because what we get is intangible. It is culture. It is cultural cohesion. It is the tradition that keeps the city united. And they are losing it and they're giving it up. And if you make the argument that the bears should only only subsist upon their own revenue, then sure, libertarian. Every road should have a toll on it. You can't drive on any busy road because you have to pay the money. If the road can't sustain itself through income, the road can't exist.

[Ian Crossland]

Well, I think there are public projects that we should subsidize at a loss. There are like roads, but not sports teams. No, no. If the sports team's not bringing in revenue because people aren't going there because they suck too bad. Well, whatever.

[Tim Cast]

The issue was at all, they bring

[Ian Crossland]

in money for tourism and ticket sales.

[Tim Cast]

The issue was not that the Bears don't generate money. The issue is that they want a bigger stadium, more money, More money. And the city doesn't want to spend money on it. And Hammond does. And the city of Chicago should spend whatever they needed to to keep the Bears.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, I don't. That's like.

[Tim Cast]

That's. That's.

[Ian Crossland]

That's stealing people's money to pay for your sports team. Dude, that's tax. I think you commanding taxation on people to pay for a football team.

[Tim Cast]

Yes. The people of Chicago who love the Chicago Bears are not voting for this anymore. See, this is what you misunderstand. I literally said the thesis is we brought in people who don't want to spend money on the Bears. So when the vote comes up, they vote against spending money on the Bears. So the city doesn't do it. My point is we should not flood our cities and country with people who don't share our values. Otherwise they will vote against our values and we don't have the Bears.

[Ian Crossland]

But I do think that this is purely a capitalistic move by a capitalistic company in. In a capitalistic league.

[Tim Cast]

What is. What does that mean?

[Ian Crossland]

NFL is all about making money. The whole thing is about them making money. They're gonna spend the money anyway, but

[Brandon Miner]

it's gonna be on the stuff that is no longer cared about by the people of Chicago.

[Tim Cast]

Let's talk about the laughter. They're spend the money they're gonna spend in Indiana. Now Illinois is losing tax revenue. Illinois is gonna lose an insane amount of money by giving this up. The issue is that the Bears are profitable. The Bears are profitable, iconic and beloved. And moving to Indiana means Indiana is going to generate all of that revenue from everybody who buys.

[Ian Crossland]

But it's right next to Chicago. They're not moving to Detroit or Illinois.

[Tim Cast]

Illinois is losing the money. That's the point. Illinois could make money on this. The opportunity don't care.

[Ian Crossland]

Got to do the opportunity cost of what that stadium would have cost the city and the land, the loss of the land. And there's no loss of land.

[Tim Cast]

They buy the land. They were asking for tax subsidies, the Bears. So this is laugher curve. This is laugher curve territory. This is. We'd rather charge you more money and not give you. This is AOC and Amazon in New York City. This is. We would rather you leave. And in the long term, we lose insane amounts of money than spend a little bit.

[Ian Crossland]

Today we brought up the Giants who have a stadium in New Jersey and they're still the New York Giants. People still go to New York to see the Giants and they take the train across the river to Jersey. And New Jersey makes the money and New York makes money too, and they still have the branding.

[Tim Cast]

How is New York making money on.

[Ian Crossland]

People go to New York to see the Giants and they take the train across the river.

[Phil Labonte]

If you're, if you're going to.

[Ian Crossland]

If people go to New York City to take the train to Jersey, they get a hotel. No, they go to Jersey to watch the game. They come back to New York.

[Tim Cast]

Who's flying to New York and then riding to Jersey?

[Ian Crossland]

Jersey's like 40 minutes away from New York.

[Tim Cast]

You fly to Newark, you go to

[Ian Crossland]

Jersey to go to New York. It's fun time to go to New York. It's a fun time to go to Chicago. You could take the train down to. And yet it's like what, 40 minutes away from the city, 40 minutes away from downtown.

[Tim Cast]

I don't know what you're arguing.

[Ian Crossland]

It's. They're not going to Arizona. They're not losing their team. It's right next door. There's just a cheaper, bigger stadium next door. Same thing with the Giants did, man,

[Phil Labonte]

it's still losing the Chicago Bears. Chicago said that they can't use the name Chicago Bears anymore, which is something we were talking about.

[Tim Cast]

Who said that?

[Phil Labonte]

Chicago.

[Tim Cast]

Who said they can't use the name? I mean, I'm saying that, Brandon was

[Phil Labonte]

saying it, Brando was saying that, but

[Tim Cast]

they probably still will. And it's offensive. But the point is this. What we have seen from liberal policies has been short term gains for long term losses every step of the way. This is a tremendous long term loss.

[Ian Crossland]

There's some stadiums that are egregiously over. Like, what are they doing? A city blows so much money on an arena and you're like, what? And then they have to corporatize it and get the name at&T Stadium because they can't even afford it.

[Tim Cast]

So let's take a look at New York, Amazon and Ocasio Cortez. Amazon wanted to open a warehouse in New York. It was gonna hire, I think it was like 10,000 people, some massive number. It was projected to generate billions of dollars per year in tax revenue. Billions. Billions. I think, I think actually it was going to be a billion per year about in tax revenue and so. Or some insane number when it's all compounded. Some insane number. So what New York City said was, we're going to give you a tax break. We're going to give you a tax break. Of, I think it was like 3 billion. I can't remember the hard numbers to bring the factory here. The argument from New York was, you bring your factory, we'll reduce your taxes. We make money. No Amazon factory, no money. Amazon factory with reduced taxes, we make money. Standard tax rate. Amazon doesn't want to come to New York, so they cut a deal saying, we all make money if we do this. They needed that money from the Amazon facility to fix the crumbling infrastructure. Their trains are falling apart. The L train was shuttered constantly, probably still is. AOC joined protests in the financial district to stop Amazon from bringing these jobs and this tax revenue in. And she succeeded. Amazon said, we're not going to go to New York. Then New York lost billions that they could have generated. For an activist ideological nonsense, this is what is happening. I'm going to put it simply. There is a question posed to the people of Chicago. Do you want to spend money to have the Chicago Bears? Unfortunately, most of the people in Chicago don't vote based on this anymore. If you went to the 90s and you said, we are going to move the Chicago Bears out of the city, not even a joke. There would have been riots, they would have burned vehicles in the street, they would have crashed things into walls. Today there's not enough core Chicagoans who care about their traditions to be bothered by it. So when someone says, listen, for $100 million, we keep this investment with the Bears. We're going to generate, you know, 200 million over the next three or four years. So if we spend this now, we're going to lose that money, but it's good because we'll make money in the future. Liberal policy has always been, well, I don't care about investing for the future. Just spend the money on, on comfort and luxury.

[Ian Crossland]

Now, I do believe in this instance that they're still assuming there's going to be tons of traction because of the people are going to see the Bears right across the border and then they're going to come to the city. They're going to take, like they even said, the L. They're going to take the L into the.

[Tim Cast]

There's no L to Hammond.

[Ian Crossland]

Well, they're apparently. They said there's a train from the Loop down to Hammond that you can Take.

[Tim Cast]

So maybe is there a train that goes anywhere near there, like 90? You can take the Red Line south and then take a bus or something. If you're.

[Ian Crossland]

Isn't there one called the line?

[Tim Cast]

Yeah, Chicago Transit, The L, the, the L train in the subway system. I think you take the Red Line deep, like to 95th and hop a bus. Maybe that could drive you to Hammond or something.

[Phil Labonte]

If you're gonna go, if you're gonna go, go from out of town to go just to see a, a football game. Are you going to stay in the city where it's more expensive? Are you going to stay, you know, outside of Hammond where it's less expensive to see?

[Ian Crossland]

Depends. You know, if you're a kid, if you're just, if you're just.

[Phil Labonte]

If you're just going to see the game.

[Tim Cast]

Right.

[Phil Labonte]

Because most of the people that are going to see the game, they're just going to see the game.

[Ian Crossland]

Probably just pop in for the game and leave. Yeah.

[Phil Labonte]

If, if, if you're, if you're like from out of town but you're not looking, you're looking like maybe, you know, a couple hour drive, you're not going to stay in the city. You're going to be like, oh, I'll go see the game and I'll get a, you know, a Hampton Inn, you know, down the street from the, the, the stadium. You're not going to go to the city because the city's going to be way more expensive. It's going to be cheaper to stay

[Ian Crossland]

outside of the part of their calculation is we're not losing all of the foot traffic from the games.

[Phil Labonte]

If it's right, people are going to go. People that are living in the sub suburbs of Chicago and living in Chicago, they're going to leave the city to go to Hammond.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah. So it's a Metro train. It's the, the Lakeshore Corridor commuter train from downtown that brings you to Hammond. And I looked up the directions. This is hilarious. It says to take the Lakeshore Corridor from downtown Chicago to get to Indiana and then you have to walk four or five miles.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, my God.

[Phil Labonte]

The point that I'm making is get a ride, bro.

[Ian Crossland]

Set up shuttles.

[Tim Cast]

Probably it stops.

[Phil Labonte]

They will be a destination in Chicago. Right. If it's in Chicago, then people are like, well, we got to go to Chicago.

[Ian Crossland]

But if you know anyone, if you're Chicago, if you're the Bears play.

[Tim Cast]

Yes.

[Ian Crossland]

People that specifically go just to see the Bears play. It's like something you do.

[Tim Cast]

I just want to stress this it used to be for me and Brandon. We hop on the orange line. Or we could take what, like the 52. Like that goes downtown, right? Yeah. And you're there. You're at. You're there.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, I love Wrigley Field, dude. I mean, it's in.

[Tim Cast]

And Wrigley Field, you hop up. We would hop on the orange line to the. To. I think.

[Phil Labonte]

What.

[Tim Cast]

You could take the red line to Wrigley, right? To. Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

Andersonville.

[Tim Cast]

You take the orange line, you transfer it. Roosevelt to the red line. The red line takes you up to Edison.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah.

[Brandon Miner]

And then you're.

[Tim Cast]

You're at Wrigley.

[Ian Crossland]

What an area, dude. I mean, that for soldier.

[Tim Cast]

Soldier Field. We hop on the orange line. Drops us off right there. We walk right over now with Hammond, Indiana. It's a metro train. It's a ride downtown and then hop on the metro. Bet you're going south up in. And then down the stadium.

[Ian Crossland]

Must be amazing that they want to build, like, super high tank.

[Tim Cast]

You know what, man? I mean, who am I? I mean, I left Chicago. Who am I? You know what I mean?

[Ian Crossland]

It's a. They want to build a dome.

[Brandon Miner]

They want a whole super.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

Brandon on the mic for this. They want to host Super Bowls. Yeah. Brandon's got. He's been chopping. Brandon knows more about this, I think, than anybody.

[Tim Cast]

He's like, I'm from Chicago, too. This is.

[Brandon Miner]

This sucks. Hi, I'm Brandon. Hi. I don't know where the hell the camera is on this side. Hi. There it is. So I don't think they're going to lose. The Chicago Bears name, for one. I think they. They. They own that. The franchise owns that. I don't think they're going to be able to take that away. I think that might just be a hearsay thing. They want this stadium because they want to build a dome and they want to be able to host a Super Bowl. You cannot host a Super bowl in the NFL if you don't have a dome, because you have to be fair play no matter what. Right? So that's part of it. The other thing is, is they're getting these people that you're talking about that just don't casually go see games. We're talking about some of the most hardcore fans in the NFL. You saw this with the Oakland Raiders, all right? They got pushed out. Their fans were pissed. It was detrimental to that city and everything moved out of that. It was. It was. We're. We're getting rid of every. Everything in Oakland. It was the same situation. These guys are being pushed out of Chicago. Some of the most hardcore fans here are actually going to be pissed about this. We're talking about people who show up at 5am park in the parking lot at Soldier Field and start tailgating. And they don't stop until the game is over. And then after the game is over, regardless of who they play, they walk out. Channing Green Bay sucks. This is the Chicago Bears team that I have known my entire, no offense, I have known my entire life. And for me, as a Chicagoan, as an ex Chicago taxpayer for God knows how many years, I think this is one of the most unacceptable things that they have ever done in this city. I think it is going to kill a lot of money, like Tim says,

[Phil Labonte]

a lot of business.

[Brandon Miner]

They're generating money from parking, they're generating money from concessions, they're generating money from people who do come down for these games. You say, have you ever seen somebody come down for a Bears game from another city? Yes. Everyone in the Midwest, the Vikings fans will come down to support the Vikings at Soldier Field. Even if they're not there to see the Bears. The packers fans will come down to rival the Bears fans in that stadium for a Packers game because that's how close the rivalries are in the Midwest or in the NFC it is.

[Tim Cast]

Imagine hosting a Super bowl in Chicago, right? I mean, the amount of money generated from that.

[Ian Crossland]

But they still will if they do it a 40 minute, no, Illinois will

[Brandon Miner]

not see a dime from that.

[Ian Crossland]

So many people will stay in Chicago and then drive to the super bowl if they're in the super bowl, because I'd rather would want to go to Chicago.

[Phil Labonte]

People that want to go to people that are going there just to see the super bowl, they're going to stay around the, the stadium. They're going to stay where it's less expensive because you've got, if you're flying in, if it. If you're talking about someone that's going to go and be like, well, we'll go and make a weekend out of it, we'll go hang in Chicago, that's one thing. But if you're like, I got tickets to the super bowl and I don't make a ton of money, I'm just going to go to the Super Bowl. You're going to find a Holiday Inn or you're going to find whatever, someplace close to the thing that's not in

[Tim Cast]

Chicago and they're going to build, I'll give you this, but let me just say they're going to Build the amenities around the stadium. That's the point. People will say, hey, let's go check out Chicago for the weekend while we are. Some people will do that. But I'm not talking about the ancillary tourist revenue that Chicago may or may not get because they can get that for a regular Bears game whenever. Hosting big events at a big stadium at the super bowl level means that all the small businesses around that in Chicago are making money. The lives of Chicagoans who are in and around these neighborhoods and areas will see dramatic improvement. More money coming in that's going to Indiana. My ultimate point is, of course the area will see economic, economic boon to a certain degree if a Super bowl is held in general. But this is the people of Chicago. Short term, short term gain, long term loss. We can hold on to our money now. And the question is, what are they spending? The money they could have spent, what are they spending it on anyway? It's going to be something stupid. They're going to be, look, they were trying to build gigantic migrant camps on the south side of Chicago. That's what they want to use the money for instead of maintaining Chicago's traditions. And I want to stress this too, to Brandon's point. I think the Bears, like, is there any more rabid of a fan base? There's there, there's a handful of teams that have like merciless fan bases. And the Bears, you, you got to understand SNL's the Bears because of how much people love the Bears. That iconic comedy bit where they all talk like weird Chicago guys. And by the way, no one talks like that. It's iconic because of how much people love the Bears.

[Ian Crossland]

I will say my parents are both

[Brandon Miner]

from Chicago and my, they've been in

[Ian Crossland]

Texas for 20 years. They're still watching for the Bears.

[Tim Cast]

Are they like screaming like they called you, like, oh, yeah, I'm sure I'm

[Ian Crossland]

going to hear about this.

[Brandon Miner]

It's, I mean it's, it's history too, right? You've got, you've got Mike Ditka, you know, the coach next to John Madden is one of the biggest coaches of all time in the game. You got George Hallis and Hallis Hall. That all goes away now. Hallis hall goes away. I can't see them going and practicing in Chicago just to go play the season in Indiana. They're gonna, they're also gonna probably move practice facilities. They do their camps down in Bourbon A. I don't know if that's gonna be a thing anymore. Maybe they don't even do their camps and their training camps in Illinois anymore. Maybe that moves to Indiana. So now you've got all those people going to Indiana to go see the training camps, which people do. There are a lot of hardcore fans for this team. They're some of the best fans in football. And even though the team has been losing systematically every single year since the day I was born, they have now gotten to a competent level in the NFL after this last incredible season that they had. They pushed almost all the way. That's. We've been dying to see that for a long time.

[Tim Cast]

If there's so much effect. Thunderpaw in the. In the Discord chat said, according to AI Super Bowl's estimated. They're estimated to generate 500 million to 1 billion in economic activity for the city that hosts it.

[Brandon Miner]

And you're talking about five to ten grand a ticket for the nosebleeds. I mean, these guys, if you're coming in and spending that much money to go to a Super bowl, nine times out of 10, you're not from that city, you're coming in, you're a celebrity, whatever. So, yeah, it doesn't matter if you stay in Chicago or in Indiana, you're going to shell out money to stay because you just paid 10 grand for a ticket.

[Tim Cast]

I just want to, I want to, I want to surface level all of this stuff, right? We talk about elections. We've got like the story about California and ballots are being burned, which will pull in a second. Pull up in a second. But this is the real world, Normie. Ramifications of everything we talk about on this show, about loss of culture, traditional bad policies over taxation, open borders. One day you're sitting in your lounge chair with your buddies and you. And you're the kind of guy who says, I don't really care about politics all that much. You know, I, I just want to hang out, my friend. Like, I work hard every day. I respect it. You go to work, you come home, you say, look, man, I trust you guys take care of it. Me, I'm just a working class guy and I watch the game. And then one day you come home and you turn the TV on and say, I just want to watch the Bears. I want to see him win this time around. And they go, you don't have the Bears anymore. The Bears left. They're the Hammond Bears now. And you're sitting there being like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, hold on, hold on a minute. And that's what happens when you sit by and you're not paying attention to what's going on in the world around you. And I'm not saying, I'm not saying that derisively. I'm saying with respect, I understand why people say I work hard all day. I don't want to focus on the troubles of the world. It gets me down. I want to hang out my friends and I want to watch the Bears. And then one day you wake up and the Bears are gone.

[Ian Crossland]

I got a taste of in 1990, I don't know what year it was. 7. The Cleveland Browns. I'm in Ohio and they get sold. They decide, we're going to Baltimore. No more Cleveland Browns. Now they have the Baltimore Ravens. And it's the same exact team with the same players. And I realized, and it was a bitter pill to swallow, the NFL and pretty much all these professional sports leagues are purely about capitalism. All they want to do is make money. They exist to make money. They will go where the money.

[Phil Labonte]

Yes, yes.

[Ian Crossland]

I don't want to hyper politicize it. There may be aspects of weirdness with politics and people not understanding football, but it's a business. They're making money. They're making more money in Hammond.

[Phil Labonte]

Nobody's saying that. Nobody's trying to make the argument that the NFL is not looking to make money. Like nobody's making that argument. The re. We're talking about the move. Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

Like the Bears did it to make

[Phil Labonte]

money because the people of Chicago don't care enough to make a stink to say, no, stay.

[Brandon Miner]

You realize what it would have cost the Illinois taxpayers to build a stadium in Chicago like they wanted to do anywhere in Illinois?

[Ian Crossland]

I don't want to know the numbers.

[Brandon Miner]

Pritzker wanted to put it on the back of the taxpayers. We're talking anywhere from just shy of $1 to $2 billion that the taxpayers would have had to have shelled out in Illinois in order to build the stadium. Now there are a lot of people that would say, hell yeah, take my money. I want to keep the Bears. Even though that number is outrageous. There are a majority of people in Illinois that are like, okay, to hell with this. Screw you. We love the Bears, but you can't tax us for this. This is, this is a thing that you guys want. So that's where the real controversy comes in. It's a fight between the people of Illinois, the city of Chicago, and the way that the NFL is growing in the modern day age. And it's a battle that unfortunately we have lost. And I don't think there's any way to recover from.

[Tim Cast]

So Every year, Illinois spends $2.5 billion on refugees, migrants and the undocumented for support, aid, health care, et cetera. The largest share comes comes to over $1.6 billion. So in 2024, they spent 1.6 billion for health benefits for non citizens. You know what? Maybe we could have spent that on one time. One time a stadium for our iconic sports team, for the traditions and culture of the city and for an economic benefit years down the road. Instead, they said, let's spend $2.5 billion on people who don't live here.

[Ian Crossland]

Well, it's not like it's one or the other. And you can. I don't know what you're gonna do with all those.

[Tim Cast]

Well, there is a budget. There's a finite amount of money. And my point is, when it came time. This is exactly what I was saying about Springfield and Haitian migrants. When it came time to vote and Pritzker was, was posed this question and Johnson was posed this question. We've got $3 billion in the budget to spend on. The Bears want to. The migrants want 2.5. They say give the migrants the money. They have more political influence now than the people of the city and their traditions. That's what I am complaining about. That's why I am mad when we lose these things. That's why I do not like it when they open the borders and bring people in who don't care. Listen, if you want to bring in a finite amount of people, immigrants, into a city and in a controlled manner, and we welcome these newcomers and it's good for economic activity, all of that. Yes, but when you bring in more people than the culture can bear, you lose your history, your traditions. And I will stress this, it's the Bears today, it's the fifth Amendment tomorrow. We are already seeing court cases where judges are letting criminal, illegal immigrants who beat their wives go. We are already seeing instances where judges are saying screw your rights. We are already seeing the governor of New York shut churches down, stripping you of your rights. When there is not a moral and strong tradition of a people to defend what is good and pure and makes the country work, you lose it. And I highlight the bears not because I think sports are the most important thing. I think sports are the most visible thing to the average person to recognize our traditions. But after the Bears go, the next thing that's going to go is your first Amendment right, your second amendment right. Sooner or later they're going to put police in your house and your third amendment right is gone.

[Ian Crossland]

You're indicating That a lot of the financial hardship of the people of Chicago is because of illegal immigration, which is true, but it's also because the Federal Reserve system and fiat currency inflation.

[Tim Cast]

I'm making a point highlighting a very specific budget line item that people are pissed off about in the 2024 election. The second biggest issue was illegal immigration and they wanted Trump to enforce against it. Illinois is a sanctuary state and they give 2.5 billion per year for what they call migrant care. Okay, well, if the people are voting against this, they have an option to spend that money on other things than non citizens. But let me just stress this. Why should I give my money to people who don't live here? If you ask me, Tim, you've got some money. Would you like to spend it on something? You have an option of a pizza restaurant, a Chicago Bears stadium or a casino. Right. I say, well, these are questions posed to me, asking me to spend money in the city on things that might benefit me. Along comes Pritzker and everybody else, and they say, actually the weight of electoral policy now gives more political power to people who aren't from here. And they say, we're going to take your money and give it to them instead. Now I'm not even getting to buy anything that I might like. They say, do you want to buy something with your money in the public coffer? Yes. Well, too bad we gave it away to illegal immigrants. That's worse.

[Brandon Miner]

And think about this. We've seen this. We've seen Pritzker do this in Brighton park where he opened up an immigrant camp there. This Brighton park is a largely Latino area. This is an area that was built on immigration. Their people rejected that migrant camp being put into their neighborhood. They pushed it out of that neighborhood. We are talking about Latin Americans. All right? We saw the African American communities. We don't want them here. We don't want this here. This is our community. These are people that are taxpayers as well. And they don't want this in their neighborhoods more than anybody else does. The Polish people out there. There's a massive Polish community in Chicago. They don't want it either. We're talking about almost like New York, a city that was built by a lot of immigration. A lot of people that came here, became Americans, were working their asses off to put this all together. And they're rejecting these camps and these things that are being put in Chicago that they're paying for.

[Ian Crossland]

I wonder if part of this is also like a lack of interest in sports over the last decade. People are getting Insulated into video games and computers and stuff.

[Phil Labonte]

Well, I mean, I don't know that they're getting insulated into video games and computers.

[Ian Crossland]

Watch the guy. I haven't watched sports enough.

[Brandon Miner]

Chicago has some of the most die hard fan bases.

[Phil Labonte]

All of the point that I was

[Ian Crossland]

making is Even still like 17 people in.

[Phil Labonte]

The point that I was making in the very beginning is because the people that are in Chicago are different. There's less interest in sports. Right? Like people are not born. They're not American the way that they, the way they used to be. They're not, they're not born here. They don't value the same things. So yes, there is less interest in sports, but it's not because. It's not because the, the, it's not because of video games or anything. It's because the makeup of the population is different. We don't have magic soil in the US you come to the US you don't automatically start valuing the things that, that Americans value.

[Ian Crossland]

Well, I think it could be both because I think like I'd rather watch esports than soccer.

[Brandon Miner]

Well, Chicago, Chicago has a history of dynasties, all right. Take a look at the Chicago Bulls, for example. They haven't won A championship since 1998, Michael Jordan era, right? They still have one of the highest fan attendances in the NBA. They have not won in how many years? Almost 30. Like we're talking about people that are die hard for these teams. Die hard Chicago fans that the last thing they want to see is something like this happen.

[Ian Crossland]

I know it. I was asked with me in the 80s for Cleveland, dude, the Cavs were amazing. Brad Dougherty, I mean, Mark Price. And then we had the, the, the Browns. And then the Browns, Bernie, what's his name, the quarterback, Ernest Byner, fumbles on the one yard line to the Broncos. They go to the AFC championship. And then that gets taken away from me like I was so hardcore sports, but then I got into video games and like, I just don't care as much.

[Tim Cast]

Well, see, you're talking about playing sports. This is another, this is another point about lost cultural traditions. And I agree. The decentralization of, you know, media consumption. Parents did not instill these values with their kids. Dads would sit. This is why I said it was amazing that Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey were bringing so much attention to sports. A lot of people were like, oh, it's so annoying that Taylor Swift is at these football games. And I was like, stop, There's a dad sitting in his living room right now watching Sports. And his 14 year old daughter came in and said, can I watch the game with you, dad? And he was like, yeah, absolutely. We want more of that. I think it's a problem that parents didn't tell their kids, nah, nah, you're coming with me. We're gonna watch sports, then we're go throw the football outside. That that was like the old school, you know, the greatest generation with the boomer kids. But the boomer parents with the millennials didn't play catch. At least not as, not as much. So there you. Here you come. Gen X or Ian. You did not have that. I'm going to make this a part of your life and build something like you're going to hold these traditions. So you drifted.

[Ian Crossland]

I did. I played baseball in fifth grade. I played soccer from third grade to fifth grade, I'm saying.

[Tim Cast]

But you gave it up.

[Ian Crossland]

I just, yeah, I became less interested in it because video games took my attention. It was more interesting. It's more convenient. I can participate without breaking my legs. I tore an MCL playing flag football. I realized like it's just, you either

[Brandon Miner]

love it or you don't. It's really, it comes down to that when you love something like a sport, when you love athletics in any capacity, it doesn't matter how old you are, you wish you could still do it. You still try to do it when you can. If you don't love it, you're not going to keep that interest forever. It's going to, it's going to be fleeting and you're going to move on to something else that you are enjoying. Sports for Chicago is one of those things that we are not going to move on from. It doesn't matter if there's one sports fan left and we're surrounded in Illinois by immigrants, that one person is still going to be a die hard loyal Chicago.

[Ian Crossland]

It's hard not to become obsessed with sports when you're in Chicago. I was, I lived there for three years. 2013, 2010. No, no, 2003-6. When Moises Salou, you know, to catching Hartman.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah,

[Brandon Miner]

that's such a big deal. That's a perfect example. The whole Bartman situation, people were pissed.

[Tim Cast]

We got. I got to stress this. The Cubs are just like epic losers consistently, but they're beloved. More than so many plus years without a championship.

[Brandon Miner]

One of the most die hard fan bases in the game. I mean, I can't put this anymore.

[Ian Crossland]

I think it's because the stadiums are all in the city. I mean, so you guys are making a Great point.

[Tim Cast]

Yes.

[Ian Crossland]

The culture of Chicago is a sports city because you got Wrigley Field. I never went.

[Tim Cast]

Crosstown Classic just happened, and it's like we're not even there, and we're watching it.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah, we were. We were out there hanging out, and I couldn't take my attention off the game because I'm like, oh, my God. Crosstown Classic is here. Let's cancel everything that we have to do in Chicago and go to the next three games.

[Ian Crossland]

Sox first.

[Tim Cast]

Everybody knows the Bears.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah. Cheers, the show.

[Brandon Miner]

Everybody gets one of the most. One of the original teams in the NFL. And it's. It's sad that the Cleveland thing, because football was invented right down the street

[Ian Crossland]

in what, Canton, Ohio. Yeah.

[Brandon Miner]

Cleveland Browns fans are also some of the most hardcore fans, even though their team is notorious, even bad.

[Ian Crossland]

They got LeBron somehow. Oh, first overall, they got LeBron. And it was like, I don't even

[Brandon Miner]

want to talk about Le Bomb. Let's not even get into lebum.

[Ian Crossland]

I mean, for a Cleveland fan, that was like, oh, we actually have a hope. Hope and a dream now. Like, there's a chance we might actually win something, because for 50 years, we. We get so close and then fail. I say we. You know, I really felt like I was part of it. I watched Ernest Byner fumble on the one yard line in the AFC Championship as a kid. On my knees in the living room, like, the hope drained out of me.

[Brandon Miner]

I watched my grandmother wait for 90 years for the Cubs to win, and she died before they were able to see it. And I got to watch them win in 2016. It was one of the most amazing things ever. I got to watch the entire Bulls dynasty, all six championships, even though I was too little to know what I had.

[Phil Labonte]

My dad was a. I would not

[Brandon Miner]

trade it for the world. He had one of the best sports upbringings in the country, in my opinion.

[Phil Labonte]

My dad. My dad was a Patriots fan, and he died right before Tom Brady.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah.

[Brandon Miner]

And it's brutal. It's heart wrenching. And you're watch. Watching that game, knowing that they're. They're there with you somewhere, you know, in some capacity. I wish you could be here to see this. But you can feel them there. And you know that that is a major, major special event in your life, watching that go down.

[Ian Crossland]

Here's my concern about sports and watching sports. I like playing them is bread and circus. It was a big part of the Roman Empire as they just pacify their. Their citizens with bread and circus. They give them the circus, sports Kind of feels like the circus and they want people, like, drunk.

[Phil Labonte]

What do you think video games are?

[Ian Crossland]

Well, it's. At least it's interactive.

[Tim Cast]

No, no, no.

[Brandon Miner]

You could sit there and get drunk while you're staring at the absolute.

[Phil Labonte]

It's the exact same thing.

[Tim Cast]

Exactly.

[Phil Labonte]

It is the exact same thing.

[Ian Crossland]

When I watch esports, I'm actually learning and then I play the game and I'm better at the game because I watch the pros.

[Phil Labonte]

Exact same thing.

[Tim Cast]

Watching football entered.

[Phil Labonte]

Not the same is entered. The point of Bread and circus was give people entertainment and give them food. Video games are entertainment just like sports are entertaining, interactive.

[Tim Cast]

It doesn't matter.

[Phil Labonte]

It doesn't matter.

[Tim Cast]

That's not true anymore at all. That's not.

[Ian Crossland]

Watching football is not interactive compared to playing an esport or. But I'm watching esport. Train on it by watching it and then play it. And you're better at it.

[Tim Cast]

What do you think Michael Jordan did?

[Ian Crossland]

Probably all he did was famously, he

[Tim Cast]

would watch videos and watch himself.

[Ian Crossland]

Tyson would watch endless hundreds of hours of boxing.

[Tim Cast]

And right now with sports, you've got fantasy leagues where people are watching and they're tracking scores and they're playing games.

[Ian Crossland]

If you're going to be an athlete, you definitely watch sports. But if you're not going to be an athlete, it's sort of like.

[Phil Labonte]

It's absolutely.

[Tim Cast]

Dude, listen.

[Matthew Williamson]

It's a part of like they were mentioning. It is part of a community identity. That's absolutely true. I mean, if you're anywhere in the Midwest, you already know what teams you're rooting for based on what your family was part of. That's just the way that it is. My dad's side of the family is from Green Bay, Wisconsin by birth. I have been a Green Bay fan ever since.

[Brandon Miner]

It's embedded in your DNA.

[Matthew Williamson]

So it's basically. It's something you've been socialized with. But I mean, everything that this discussion has been over. As entertaining as it has been to tie like replacement migration, Chicago Bears. Your point originally, Ian, I think, is still. One of the more important things to look at here is that the Chicago Bears, the board and that entity corporately took advantage of the leverage that they could use from the taxpayers from Hammond and Chicago and the city of Chicago and the alderman and the state House therein, did not make the appropriate choice to keep it.

[Tim Cast]

I like how you frame it. The shitty of Chicago.

[Matthew Williamson]

My bad.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah, no, no, I agree.

[Matthew Williamson]

I have. I've been. I've been there once. But nevertheless, I really enjoyed my Time when I was there.

[Tim Cast]

But after. This is just. This is.

[Matthew Williamson]

I mean it's an embarrassment I think.

[Tim Cast]

What's, what's Soldier Field going to do now? What is that going to be?

[Ian Crossland]

They. Maybe they'll get.

[Tim Cast]

It's going to be a flea market. It's going to be a flea market. It's going to be like a bunch of like migrant shops going to turn

[Brandon Miner]

into a super mall. Yeah, it's one of those things where I thought they were going to put the fire there. But now the Chicago Fire are apparently also looking for a stadium or something from what I heard in the grapevine. So I don't even think they're doing that.

[Tim Cast]

The Chicago Fire were always in the suburbs anyway.

[Brandon Miner]

Well, they had, they built Toyota park in our old neighborhood for them and then they moved and they started playing at Soldier Field anyway and now.

[Tim Cast]

Oh really?

[Brandon Miner]

Concerts and stuff at Toyota.

[Tim Cast]

I mean that was, that, that was, was like Burbank though, wasn't it? Or no, no, no.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah, yeah, it was right where we used to skate. That old truck stop across Harlem Bridge over by Argo.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah, that was always the suburbs. Yep. So we always kind of just looked at them weird, you know.

[Ian Crossland]

Who's the Fire? What team is that?

[Brandon Miner]

They're our MLS soccer team.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, they might put another team at Soldier Field. Sometimes they'll do that. They'll move one.

[Brandon Miner]

Well, they do like they do all kinds of stuff. They'll let high school really come depend

[Matthew Williamson]

like either they'll have a high school team or some of districts might use it. But I mean most of the time even in smaller cities the older stadium is usually demolished or it's repurposed into something completely divorced from what sports were in the first place. I mean earlier in like the 2010s, the City of El Paso, they decided to build a new baseball stadium I think it was like for AAA ball. They finally have the El Paso Chihuahuas which was a very fitting name for. With them to name. But the old stadium that they had closer to the northeast side had been completely demolished. It has not been used for anything therein. And now the, you know, former parking lot that's used for is now for like you know, a county fair or something like that or whatever rolls into town every now and then. Yeah, it's a major loss of tax revenue. It's a huge blow to the identity of the city of Chicago. But your original point still does stand. They're using the leverage of what kind of benefits they can get off tax write offs and subsidies and It's a failure, I think, on Chicago's part to maintain one of the most important things to the city's identity outside of the things that really matter with regards to its history, its architecture, the people that built that city. And so now that they're going to lose that one thing and you know, the NFL has appreciated and generated millions of eyes on it. The super bowl is basically the largest American. It's like our, the height of our liturgical calendar for the United States. So everyone tunes in.

[Tim Cast]

So Hammond offered zero taxes for 40 years, 1 billion in funding for the from Indiana for the stadium and 700 million towards Indiana infrastructure. Arlington offered 500 to 200 million dollars annual tax bill, nothing for the stadium and nothing for infrastructure costs. That's insane.

[Matthew Williamson]

So for two generations, no taxes. That's, that is insane.

[Brandon Miner]

But the sad part about this is good.

[Tim Cast]

I'm, I'm, I, I, I, I like Indiana. I get it. Indiana was smart. They said, wow, we can have the Bears.

[Brandon Miner]

Soldier Field has been around for 102 years.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, it's ancient.

[Brandon Miner]

Yes. It was one of the first stadiums built in the NFL.

[Tim Cast]

That's crazy.

[Brandon Miner]

It has been around for 102 years. Did then, now they did do a revamp project on it where they basically landed a spaceship in the middle of the. We saw that. We were down there skating. It was crazy to watch that. It allowed for more people to come in and be in attendance for the games. Now it's not good enough anymore because of the tax spread. And unfortunately, we are going to lose a very, very big piece of history. If let's do anything to that stadium.

[Tim Cast]

Let's just talk about like the bigger picture, I guess, and everything because you know, Ian, you're mentioning you lost your team and I, I feel for you too. There's, there's a reason why I left Chicago. It's deeply corrupt. 120 years now of what? Uniparty rule from the Democrats. Republicans can never win anything. And it's one big mafia system. You know that no matter what happens, the government's not going to do what you want to do. They're going to do whatever they want to do. They're going to extract money for their own, for their own benefit. It's just, it becomes impossible to live in these, these corrupt places. And what I will say is the reason why it becomes corrupt, the reason why you get one party rule with, with no accountability is that the community becomes fractured. It becomes very large. And then you have a bunch of different neighborhoods that don't completely See eye to eye. And then you get someone who says, I will lie to as many people as possible to get institutional power and cater nothing to the people.

[Ian Crossland]

Do you think if we could allocate our taxes individually, like all of us, like on an app, to whatever we wanted, that the localities, the cities would do better? Or is the centralization of tax purposes?

[Tim Cast]

No. Yeah, that's an interesting idea. And I think. I don't know that it would be correct, but I'm interested to try because I can guarantee you this. A lot of people in Chicago would be like, I'll put all my tax dollars towards. Towards the Bears and the Bears would have the money. And I guarantee you the people of Chicago can outspend the people of Hammond, Indiana. And Indiana is a state.

[Brandon Miner]

I don't even live there anymore and I would pay money to keep them there.

[Ian Crossland]

It feels like we're not far off from the ability of a piece of technology.

[Tim Cast]

Like, they'll never let you do that, though, because they want to buy bombs

[Ian Crossland]

and guns and like, it's, it's. It's risky to give the people the power. You know, they've kind of, since the Civil War, figured out how to centralize power in the United States.

[Brandon Miner]

I don't know.

[Ian Crossland]

It's kind of like ask for forgiveness rather than permission. Like make the app and just start doing it and just start. But I don't know, you might get into trouble with the law. Like, hey, you can't decide where your taxes are going. That's my job.

[Phil Labonte]

Usually the. The government is going to be deciding

[Brandon Miner]

where they'll put a stop to that real quick.

[Phil Labonte]

And anyways, your taxes are just going to pay down the debt.

[Tim Cast]

So Ben did.

[Phil Labonte]

Ben Inflation.

[Tim Cast]

Ben Devine, who covers Chicago NFL actually, what's. His.

[Ian Crossland]

What's.

[Tim Cast]

What is this? He said most plugged in Chicago Bears analyst. He says it's the best stadium deal ever offered it like, in the history of the NFL. Sounds 40 years, no taxes and a billion dollars.

[Brandon Miner]

An impossible deal to turn down, man. Especially when you have nothing coming back. Full ownership.

[Tim Cast]

Now imagine this. Why is it the people of Indiana are willing to foot the bill for that? I don't know.

[Ian Crossland]

Do they?

[Tim Cast]

Because Indiana is a red state.

[Ian Crossland]

Do they have another team, too? Do they have another team into.

[Brandon Miner]

They have it in what?

[Tim Cast]

I think. I think Indiana.

[Brandon Miner]

They have the Indiana fever. They have Caitlin Clark for them.

[Ian Crossland]

They're going all in.

[Matthew Williamson]

They're like the Indians in baseball or.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah, well, Cleveland has the Indians. Yeah. I mean, they're not without teams, obviously. They still have the Cavs and everything, but, you know, and they have the Browns.

[Ian Crossland]

They lost the Browns for about a decade, and then they became the Ravens. And then because they changed their name, they were able to get the Browns again. It was a completely new team with a new admin. Fifteen years later, 12 years later, it

[Tim Cast]

was, Bro, Illinois shut this down. I mean, I'm just reading Ben's analysis of this. They've been trying. The Bears want to stay in the Chicagoland. They want to stay in Illinois. So they tried to go to Arlington when the city would not accommodate them. They said, we can go to the suburbs, and the state would not accommodate them. Indiana said, we'll roll out the red carpet for you. So they said, okay, I guess we're out. I don't. I don't necessarily blame the Bears a little bit, but I look at it like, bro, if you've got a room full of people screaming at you, get the F out. At a certain point, you're like, okay, I'm leaving, I guess, you know.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah.

[Brandon Miner]

I just don't know if Virginia would have let this happen. I like George, but I don't know if. I don't know if he's making the right call here. If this is something old lady McCaskey would have wanted, but I can't speak to that because I never actually knew her. I just know that I think she was Chicago at heart, and I. I don't think she would have wanted to see this.

[Ian Crossland]

That's the old owner.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah, she was the owner for a long time. Got handed over to George. She passed away a few years ago.

[Tim Cast]

You know, for my real quick, the Bears had been trying to build for five years in Arlington Heights, and they were getting blocked. So it's not even a question of, like, they weren't offering the same incentives. They tried, man.

[Brandon Miner]

They tried as much as they could to stay.

[Tim Cast]

So anyway, this is a perfect example of why replacement migration is dangerous to the American people. I'm only half joking when I say it like that. It's exactly what I explained a year ago. Or was it two years ago? We're talking about Ohio. I said, when Biden brings in 5,000 Haitian migrants and puts them in a small town, they will outvote that small town spending and their cultural alignment. They will vote against it. And then you'll be staring. You know, it's like, you know, the movie up. What a great example. This old man has a house, and it's in a beautiful field. One by one, the land is being bought up by big corporations to build big skyscrapers, and he refuses to sell until eventually the government forces him. So instead of handing over the deed, he launches a bunch of balloons and flies away, which still, he lost his land, but at least he escaped. His house.

[Ian Crossland]

My grandma. Her house that my dad grew up in, that we spent our childhood in, was right across the street from, like, city hall. And in 2005 or something, they wanted to buy her house and evict her. And she's like, when I'm dead, you can have it. Which is probably stupid of her. So they end up giving her, like, 60 grand for the house or some stupid amount of money. But it would have been nice to see her make a stand and be like, I'm not. I will never sell.

[Brandon Miner]

Well, what was that guy that was getting harassed about his house that. That blew up his house with himself in it?

[Phil Labonte]

That was one of the. Call the people in the discord here.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah. Yeah, that's a pretty extreme example right there of. You're not getting my. Like, I don't care. I'll take it with me.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, that's. You know, that's a bad thing, though.

[Tim Cast]

Sure.

[Brandon Miner]

But, I mean, it's pretty hard. It's a pretty hardcore stance. I'm not.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, I mean, he really was trying really hard to get some kind of help. Like, he was calling it here. He had a website. He was. He was. He was really trying hard, and it's. It's really sad that he ended up,

[Ian Crossland]

you know, the city.

[Tim Cast]

Have they scheduled a riot?

[Ian Crossland]

I don't know.

[Matthew Williamson]

I mean, you're gonna have to. You're gonna have to check. I'm sure something's gonna happen.

[Brandon Miner]

I'm waiting on the.

[Tim Cast]

To be fair, like, when the. When the Sox won the World Series back, and what was like, 06, 26.

[Brandon Miner]

Was it 06, or was that Frank Thomas?

[Ian Crossland]

Was he on the team?

[Tim Cast]

I think it was 06. I don't think it was 2010.

[Brandon Miner]

I'll look it up.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah, look it up. I just remember it was nuts. Like, on. On Archer, like, near Archer and Halstead, some dude, like, there are people in the street just, like, jumping up and down and screaming. And then some thousand, five thousand five, some dude was just speeding down the road towards the people, but the people refused to move because they were just screaming. So then the car swerved and crashed into a pole, and the guy jumped out and started screaming and cheering with them. It was just, like, the utmost of retardation, I got to point out, because

[Ian Crossland]

I said that, like, staring Being a sports fan was kind of like the circus. You go and you just stare at a wall. But really, if you're a sports fan and you're at the game and you're screaming, the players can hear you. And it changes their psychology and it changes the way they play, which is why there is such thing as home field advantage. I was at a baseball game once, and the guy hit the ball, and I went, yeah, like, really loud. And the guy in the field, like, froze, and the ball went by him. I was like, oh, I have power

[Brandon Miner]

as a fan in Seattle.

[Tim Cast]

Haven't you watched the Simpsons?

[Ian Crossland]

I have watched the Simpsons.

[Tim Cast]

You know. You know what I'm talking about, right, Phil?

[Phil Labonte]

No, I don't.

[Tim Cast]

So Daryl Strawberry is on the field, and Bart's yelling, daryl. And Marge is like, stop, Stop. You're being mean. And then Lisa, he's like, oh, come on, Mom. These players are hardened to this. And Lisa's like, yeah, they have nerves of steel. And then Daryl Strawberry starts crying, and he wipes a tear away.

[Ian Crossland]

So in addition to screaming, that they can hear. I believe that we have collective consciousness and that people can feel your thoughts, that there's a low frequency that's impacting reality. When I was watching The Cavs lose 3 to 1 game, 3 to 1 against the Golden State warriors in the championship, I made a video to LeBron James to wake up. It's on YouTube. If you look at Ian Cross and LeBron James, where I, I yelled to wake up at him through the video, and it echoes in the room when I said, Jesus, I, I, for some reason, our poor guest, I said, Jesus. And there was this reverberation in the room. And then they came back and won four games in a row. So there is something proves it. And I would watch the games religiously. I focused on the entire field.

[Brandon Miner]

Did they win that series?

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, they came.

[Tim Cast]

What was it?

[Ian Crossland]

Three games.

[Tim Cast]

Remember that commercial in Chicago? It was like, the guy says, if you eat the hot dog with mustard, they'll win, but if someone puts ketchup on it, they'll lose. And, yeah, I can't remember the commercial was. But, yeah, what Ian's talking about, we call sports superstition.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, but I think it's like, because

[Tim Cast]

the joke was, some guy would take a hot dog and get the ketchup, they'll stop. If you put ketchup on that hot dog, they're going to lose the game. Maybe.

[Ian Crossland]

But I think it's your thoughts, because your voice is high frequency. Your thoughts are lower frequency. But it's still a frequency.

[Tim Cast]

I agree.

[Ian Crossland]

I can.

[Brandon Miner]

Superstition is superstitious.

[Matthew Williamson]

Like. No, no, everyone's got their tradition or talisman for making sure that their, you know, favorite team wins. But right. You know, when you mentioned like they've been trying to build for five years, I mean, I think people really don't realize how much power people have by working with various groups to stop things from happening. I mean, think about all the oil pipelines that have been protested for numerous years or even things that you want to build in your local town. Environmental review or investigating for archaeology. These are the number one ways that you can stop the development for anything. And the left is the master of this. For instance, if you want to build in the city state of Oklahoma, you have to not only go through the usual process for environmental review per things like the National Environmental policy act of 67, but on top of that, you also have to go through the Oklahoma Archeological Society. And if they find an archeologist that has a tribal background, good luck ever getting that built, because they're going to immediately assume that, okay, we have something here that's for the tribe and then your project move forward, make it up. The same thing happens with what's happening in Arlington Heights. It's the same thing that we see across the country, that there are going to be leftist groups, NGOs, environmental activists that are either on the dole or get paid off by somebody else. And they're gonna stop any kind of construction for what you want as a citizen from happening.

[Tim Cast]

This is what happened to us in Martinsburg with the coffee shop and why we were years just jammed up. Because they have a historical society which no matter what you do, they'll spin it around and make it impossible to do anything. And so let's just say we, we worked out a solution. The shop should be opening very, very soon. It's. But the remarkable thing is how long it's taken up to this point, even with a lot of the work being done. So I'll give you an example. First floor of the building. It's just the first floor. It's a building like any other building. There's a side entrance that goes upstairs. Right now, Mamba Collectibles is operating. I recommend you guys go there for all your sports collectible needs and trading card games. Pokemon Magic, Yu Gi. Okay. On the third floor, you go in the side door, there's stairs. Second floor is collectibles. Third floor is collectible trading cards. Card stuff. When we were trying to build the coffee shop, they Said, because there's a door on the first floor on exit that opens up to where the stairs are. First, second, and third floor count as one unit, and you have to build wheelchair access for the second and third floors. And we were like, hey, okay, we got an elevator in the building. And they said, okay, well, that's an historic elevator. In fact, it's one of the. In our building, we have one of the first elevators, if not the first elevator ever built in the country. It's. It's not the craziest thing in the world to say because we're on the east coast, so there's population density here. So it's. It's an old elevator from the early, like, turn of the century, 18 to 1900s. So they said it's got to be put up to code for modern elevator uses or whatever. Well, the Historical Society says, absolutely not. This is a historic elevator. You can't do that. So then our argument was, but we don't use the second floor for business. The first floor is the coffee shop. Nope, doesn't matter. So they forced us to connect a non business portion to the non, open to the public, simply by some fake metric they made up some. Some. Well, you know, because the door is there. And that was one of the things that jammed us up for like a year and a half. You. In order to get the approval, okay, so we're gonna put in a wheelchair like machine where it like goes like. And brings up the stairs because you can't use the elevator, right? Then they said, oh, you know, but the building itself. So you have to meet with the Historical Society, and they only meet once a month. So you go, you meet them once a month and you say, here's the plan. And they go, you know what? This is a little too big. Why don't you. Why don't you reduce it.

[Ian Crossland]

It.

[Tim Cast]

We'll see you next month. You come back next month and say, I did what you asked. You know what? We changed our mind. You should go back to the original design, redesign it. Come back in a month. And that's what they kept. They kept doing to us. Is this like, it's all fake?

[Ian Crossland]

Hyper bureaucracy I don't call it. But is this why in Malibu they're having a hard time rebuilding?

[Tim Cast]

You mean Palisades?

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah.

[Tim Cast]

Well, probably Malibu too. Oh, yes, and Maui as well. The government creates fake reasons why you can't rebuild your homes.

[Brandon Miner]

They kick your can down the road as long as they possibly can. And I mean, imagine being the bears in this situation. You've spent the last five years trying to buy another house in the city that you love. And you are being blocked from purchasing this house for five years between the state and the city because they don't want you there. They actually don't want you there. It's really what it comes down to. Otherwise, why would they have made such problems through litigation and everything like that? Why would there be such pushback for so long if they really wanted this team to stay there? That's the question.

[Ian Crossland]

Is it that they like from, in your opinion? I guess. Is it like that the historical society in Oklahoma, you were saying, the archeological societies and things that they truly just want people not to build, or is it that they're deeply concerned about?

[Matthew Williamson]

Well, there's. I mean, it's both. And it's really gonna depend on who you meet. But I mean, when I. For some of the stuff that I've worked on in the past, you know, I was always told, like, if you're gonna find an archaeologist for whatever project that this town, let's say the town wants to build a community center or they want to renovate their fireplace, it's like, oh, hey, according to like your town plans, you've got, you know, an old cemetery that's maybe like 200ft from the location. You know, because of the regulations that are in place, you have to contact the archaeological society in part because there's funding that's coming from state or federal sources. And from there I was always told, like, if you're going to get an archaeologist to go look at this, make sure they don't have tribal affiliation because there's a good chance it might get clogged up because of either ulterior motives or interests. Because, I mean, this is a very state specific example. But I mean, you also have to work with the various tribes and they have their own intergovernmental agencies. They also give out grants. They compete with the state and the federal government. But I mean, it's the same thing that's going to apply with almost any state or any federally funded project or anything that's going to use the taxpayer dollar. They're going to have to coordinate with, you know, their historical society. Is there a heritage foundation perhaps in Arlington Heights that wants to go against this specific thing? I mean, this is why there's a whole lot of tools that, you know, the whole not in my backyardism NIMBYism takes place. But I mean, it's also a very effective tool if you are an activist trying to stop something getting built, whether it's a pipeline or a stadium.

[Tim Cast]

We take it all for granted. And I think that's the struggle is that throughout history, I think one of the histories of the United States, if you watch everything, is how much was taken for granted by the incoming generations. The assumption that what was here was always going to be here and was just for us. And I think when you look at how things have gotten to this point, what with us giving away our manufacturing base is another really great example. It's because people just assumed that it will always be this way. And as things slowly eroded, they said, well, certainly it won't keep getting worse. And it just keeps getting worse until someone stands up and changes it.

[Ian Crossland]

You mentioned in 2019, when we were hanging out, when we were on the east coast at that theater, we went to lunch one day and you're like, we should build a city. And I was like, it just seemed impossible in my mind. I was like, how that seems. Because I was in that state of mind. Like, it's always new. Cities don't make sense.

[Tim Cast]

Right? Cities have always been.

[Ian Crossland]

But I think we should build a new city. I just don't know what it would take. I don't know. I mean, it's seven years later.

[Tim Cast]

We tried, and I put a good amount of energy into it. We. I had been going to prominent individuals asking them to invest in the Martinsburg strip when we were building the coffee shop, saying, all of these. These businesses are going out. They're going out of business. The city is in distress, and there's an economic opportunity. We could create an anti Times Square in Martinsburg, West Virginia, by having, you know, like, Cousin T's Diner, Papa Jack's Pizza Shack. And I talked to Square about it and said you could probably put up a Square convenience store where you have a bunch of products from all the customer, like all of your companies that are listed on Square. And I was advocating this, asking people to get involved. Some people did move to the neighborhood and they mentioned, like, hey, we're moving here. We love it. West Virginia's great. Nobody of their own volition would do it.

[Phil Labonte]

It.

[Tim Cast]

We were the only ones. And I know people might say, well, Tim, you have to be the leader. And maybe that's the case. But I'll say this when I make the pitch. Let us come together as a community and build something that can't happen unless people choose to do it. And I remember, I have the story I talked about with Chicago when I was a teenager. There was these. These guys that had a. Like a small warehouse that was probably like a thousand square feet. And they built a mini ramp in it, skateboard ramp. They each spent 100 bucks a month to pay the rent. And sometimes they would let us come and skate it. But it's like if someone has a key and they can open the door, you're allowed to come in and hang out. But I wasn't one of those key holders. So I went to my friend, said, guys, why don't we do this? Why don't we all put money down so that we can build our own? And what did everybody say? Let me know when you do and then I'll think about it. And I'm like, yeah, well we can't build something unless we come together to build something. So it never happened. But other people had their own. So with this anti Times Square, I said, think about the businesses that exist on Square. You've got all of these pro America, pro family values, pro free speech, pro Constitution, all of these things, all these businesses. And they all put the money, their money where their mouth is. So I went to a bunch of prominent individuals who had either the means, the connections, or otherwise, and they all just said, eh, well you do it and let me know what happens. So we've been working on setting up this coffee shop and nobody wanted, nobody

[Ian Crossland]

would do it because like building a city, I guess historically a lot of it sparks up around a business like a company or an industry.

[Phil Labonte]

That's what Musk did with Starbase. Starbase.

[Ian Crossland]

So you need a, you need something that was employing enough people that it would justify a thousand people moving to it.

[Tim Cast]

That's the natural phenomenon of a city, right? So there's a bunch of farms and then a guy sends, sets up a marketplace because he knows the farmers need spare parts and tools periodically. And he also knows that the farmers will actually drop off their goods at the market.

[Ian Crossland]

Market.

[Tim Cast]

And so if you're a farmer that's handling grains or whatever, but you want milk instead of having to drive to the other farm and trade, the market guy right there in the middle. But then someone says, people keep coming by this market and buying stuff. I'm going to set up a blacksmith shop right next door because then they can pick up tools for me while they're at the market. One by one, businesses pop up. Then someone says, you need a hotel here when people are traveling, you need a saloon for people to hang out. And now you've got your town center and it grows. Then residential areas start popping up around it because people need to live and work in the Same area. That's the natural way to do it. I think it's fair to say we could choose to just do it right. If people said, I'm going to go to Martinsburg, West Virginia, and I'm going to rent out this storefront, start a business, we could do it. I think the challenge is the right is not motivated the way the left is. The left does this kind of stuff. I mean, they'll show up with hammers and baseball bats and Molotov cocktails and threaten the locals into doing what they want to do. They will build these things. The right won't.

[Ian Crossland]

It's. It's a comfortable environment. I understand why people aren't, like, spurred to do it, because you're making a lot of money on the Internet. You can live wherever you want. For the most part, there's even knowing that, like, the antidote to communism is community and building a strong community.

[Tim Cast]

It's still like, it sounds funny, right? The antidote to communism is community. And that's. That's. That. That's astute, Ian, because communism works when the community is fragmented and incapable of rising up to stop the tyranny. So communism thrives off of shattering local communities and decentralizing everybody and making sure they can't organize.

[Matthew Williamson]

Well, it goes back to what you said about taking things for granted. I mean, the average American has no idea who their city council rep is, let alone their county commissioner, which you should know, because if you want to know where the budget for your respective town or county gets allocated at, it's at those meetings. These are all public. These all have names and addresses. And the average person really doesn't care. I mean, like, where my father lives, you know, he was complaining that around the corner where he's on the corner of the street, and he's like, man, there's a lot of overhanging branches and trees. He said, I don't know who to talk to about this. And I'm like, do you even know who your county commissioner is to call? Because they're the ones that fund and take care of how the roads are. And he's like, well, no. And I said, well, here's his number. And I mean, it really just takes the basic forms of civic engagement. And the average American is so politically illiterate. I mean, yes, a lot of important things happen in Washington, whether it's the federal budget, National Defense Authorization act, whatever you may have. But a lot of your problems do happen either in your respective state house or more importantly, at your city council and your county commissioners meeting.

[Ian Crossland]

There's another phenomenon like the renters lifestyle. How convenient it is. Like Spotify, for instance. I can move anywhere and live in any house anywhere and still work on the Internet. Like I don't need to settle down and plant roots anywhere because it's so convenient to rent. I've been, even my, my business friends are like, don't buy rent right now. Rent. And it's like, like, where's the community? You know, if I'm just looking out the door all the time, like where my next step of the journey is gonna gonna be, how can I ever settle down and build it? Or why would I ever settle down and build a community except that I know it's the right thing to do, but like, it's not the convenient thing to do.

[Brandon Miner]

And that's I think, a major factor in what's contributed to the death of small town America. To your point, like there's not enough of the right people involved in keeping these kinds of things going. To Phyllis point, people don't care about, you know, what's the word I'm looking for? Extending or passing down, you know, that Americana to the next generation anymore. They just don't care.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Brandon Miner]

Is what it's come. Is what it's come to. So this, the causality of this is that the small towns of America are dying.

[Tim Cast]

Mandatory baseball.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, I'd love that.

[Tim Cast]

I jokingly said Trump should send to the military to stop this from happening. But I'm like half joking if like, if Donald Trump was like, we're going to be sending in federal authorities to oversee this and make sure the Bears dad be like, well, okay, I guess

[Brandon Miner]

National Guard is at Soldier Field right now.

[Ian Crossland]

They have Navy and Army forcing the

[Tim Cast]

Bears to stay and play.

[Brandon Miner]

Not allowed to leave.

[Ian Crossland]

They don't have an NFL. Navy and army of college teams, but they don't have an NFL team. That'd be interesting. Probably not a good idea if the government made an NFL team. I'm.

[Tim Cast]

When I run for president, I'm going to campaign on. It'll be mandatory for all public schools to attend at least two baseball games per year as a field trip. And baseball will be gym class. So you don't just have the stupid gym class where the kids go outside and they're like, okay, we're going to play four square and dodgeball. No, you'll play baseball.

[Ian Crossland]

What about softball? Because I didn't like getting hit by those idiot pitchers.

[Tim Cast]

Softballs for girls softball. Well, big softball.

[Ian Crossland]

Some of those pitchers were where they were like when Amateurs. And they would throw so hard at.

[Tim Cast]

And I'd be like, I would say I'm actually fine with going t ball. Softball. Baseball. Like, you know, a little five year old kid's not going to kickballs pretty well. We have, we had little league back in the day.

[Brandon Miner]

I used to play at Kelly.

[Tim Cast]

Mandatory Little league.

[Brandon Miner]

League, yeah. It was one of the greatest experiences of my life being involved in a sports.

[Tim Cast]

Mandatory.

[Ian Crossland]

Mandatory. We throw the football after the show.

[Matthew Williamson]

I mean it just goes back to what you're asking.

[Tim Cast]

We've been throwing the football here.

[Matthew Williamson]

It's fun about community because again, you can have everyone in there, but if not everyone's going to speak the same language. Not everyone's going to trust one another. You can't really have these Mandatory English.

[Ian Crossland]

Also mandatory throwing.

[Matthew Williamson]

Just a mandatory immigration moratorium.

[Phil Labonte]

There you go.

[Matthew Williamson]

Now you're talking American pie in baseball.

[Phil Labonte]

That's right. Moratorium for at least 10 years.

[Tim Cast]

Mandatory that every school bake apple pie at least four times a year. Once a quarter there's an apple pie bake off and all the kids have apple pie. And baseball is mandatory. Sorry, football. I love your football, but football is optional. Baseball is mandatory.

[Ian Crossland]

But gluten is optional also for the apple pie. Gluten free is. Would be.

[Tim Cast]

Well, it's a bake off they choose.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

Okay, that's even better.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah. So you could do like a, you could, you could do like an almond crust. It's pretty good when done right.

[Ian Crossland]

Throwing like you can track back the human evolution to when our, our brain matter just skyrocketed in intelligence. When we learned how to throw because we learned to kill with rocks. And like it, it fixes your brain throwing things.

[Matthew Williamson]

I love how you went from the softball to this in like 10 seconds.

[Tim Cast]

All of human warfare has just been figuring out how to throw rocks better. First we literally threw a rock rock. Then we tied up. We put a rock in a little sack with a string and flung it around and threw the rock. Then we sharpened the rock and put it on the end of a piece of wood and used stored energy from another piece of wood to fling that rock at high speeds. Today we've taken core components of the densest piece of rock, loaded a bunch of other rocks behind it to fire it at high velocities and cause your brain to explode.

[Ian Crossland]

Also you've got rocks that explode into a bunch of other rocks that explode on impact.

[Tim Cast]

It's all just throwing rocks. Did you guys know that I think it was World War I or 2. They designed hand Grenades to be like baseballs.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Tim Cast]

Because every single young man learned how to throw a baseball.

[Brandon Miner]

Yep.

[Tim Cast]

So they were like make it a baseball. They'll throw curves, man.

[Brandon Miner]

That is why they were originally rounded and not like egg shaped shaped is because they fit the model of an American baseball. And everyone was good at throwing baseball.

[Tim Cast]

So how could you be bad at throwing modern ones?

[Brandon Miner]

Not football bombs.

[Tim Cast]

No, they should throw me.

[Ian Crossland]

I think they would do more modern ones.

[Phil Labonte]

Are spheres now too as well anymore Pitcher had them.

[Tim Cast]

The modern edge of spheres.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

Really?

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah. They don't use the pineapple style anymore.

[Matthew Williamson]

Yeah.

[Tim Cast]

Why not? The pineapple style was intended to create. Intended to create shrapnel.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah. Well, they're all intended the they. The modern ones have those same kind of scoring on the inside. So that way they're pieces.

[Tim Cast]

But it's a smooth ball wind better. Less wind resistance maybe.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, well, mostly to just make sure that there are a bunch of pieces that go so it doesn't blow.

[Tim Cast]

My name is Munchop says no soccer. Agreed. Soccer is banned. Soccer was pretty. Me and Rando, we went back to Illinois for like the fourth. Was it last year or the year before? And our baseball fields have soccer goals in them.

[Ian Crossland]

What do you guys think about renaming it football and then changing football into like kick handball.

[Brandon Miner]

I don't have to wait.

[Tim Cast]

No, no, he's got a good point. We should force everyone in the world to change the name of soccer, of football to something else. And around the world football will be American football.

[Brandon Miner]

Good luck.

[Tim Cast]

Change the name to get on everyone

[Ian Crossland]

else in the world.

[Matthew Williamson]

Good luck.

[Brandon Miner]

Stab you by force. Soccer.

[Ian Crossland]

What would be a better name for football than football? Because you don't Football.

[Phil Labonte]

We don't need to change it.

[Ian Crossland]

You throw it. Handball. But handball is already a game.

[Tim Cast]

No, no. Football is football. Throw ball soccer. Around the world should be renamed soccer.

[Phil Labonte]

Oh, good luck.

[Ian Crossland]

That's from. What is it? The what? You know where the term soccer comes from? It's like social. Do you know, you don't know where the word term soccer it was.

[Tim Cast]

It was coined to insult people who play a dumb game.

[Ian Crossland]

No, I meant like the society.

[Phil Labonte]

I'm googling this now.

[Ian Crossland]

Let's see what it is.

[Tim Cast]

Soccer is fine term.

[Phil Labonte]

Soccer originated in the 19th century England as a shorthand form of association football. It derives from the Oxford ur slang trend where students at universities like Oxford and Cambridge added er to the end of words. Association became a soccer, which was later shortened to soccer.

[Ian Crossland]

They had soccer, football and association football. So they turned association football.

[Phil Labonte]

You didn't know. No. Because football.

[Brandon Miner]

Cambridge were involved in this.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Brandon Miner]

Well, it's amazing that they want to stab people for saying the word soccer over there. When Oxford and Cambridge were involved in inventing this word. That's just me.

[Ian Crossland]

I think it was to delineate between the two versions of soccer, like, original football that they had, and one was association football, which was maybe like the pro version.

[Brandon Miner]

No.

[Tim Cast]

Cricket. You get caught playing cricket, that's a paddling with the paddle, with the cricket ball.

[Ian Crossland]

Cricket battle itself. I think football is my favorite sport.

[Tim Cast]

I think it'll just stay in American football.

[Matthew Williamson]

It'll be fine.

[Tim Cast]

Not soccer.

[Ian Crossland]

No. Soccer was too exhausting to play. It was a lot.

[Tim Cast]

I like baseball.

[Ian Crossland]

Foosball?

[Tim Cast]

No, baseball.

[Phil Labonte]

Baseball's fun to watch.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah, baseball, like, when we go to, like, a baseball game, we went. Where do we go? Like, we went to go see the

[Brandon Miner]

White Sox and the Nats the end of the last season.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was so much fun to watch.

[Ian Crossland]

I like it because it's not high contact and it's a lot of burst. Burst athleticism, like, chilling out, relaxing, and then burst.

[Tim Cast]

Football's okay, but it's not the same. Baseball's way better. Baseball is like tactics, you know, and

[Brandon Miner]

they all have their own special. Or. I think hockey has its own thing, too. If you go to a hockey game, it's a way different environment, but there's still that. That electricity around the arena, watching your team play, watching your team make a huge play, you know, scoring a goal.

[Tim Cast]

Hockey is just Canadian ice soccer.

[Phil Labonte]

The cool thing about, like, football and hockey and to some extent basketball, they're more, they, they're, they more rely on the team working together. Whereas with baseball, it's really about the pitcher and the hitter.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah, One guy can change the whole game.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, you know, it's, it's about two

[Matthew Williamson]

guys at the, at the pitch is the best part of base.

[Tim Cast]

Yep.

[Ian Crossland]

Are you guys glad they're getting rid of umpires or they seem to be relying more?

[Tim Cast]

Oh, thank you, God, man.

[Ian Crossland]

With you, I, I. The umpire making a bad call, like, completely ruined the sport, in my opinion.

[Tim Cast]

Rigged, dude. Yeah, Just get the robots in there.

[Brandon Miner]

I have to say, I wasn't sure about the pitch clock thing at first, but that has actually turned out to help the game kind of flow better. Usually, you know, pitchers used to be able to go for a sandwich in between pitches because they could literally stand there for 20 minutes and there was nothing stopping them, you know, or they could step off the plate. Okay, cool. We have to Wait another five minutes,

[Tim Cast]

you know, But I'm just sick of watching bad calls. Like when we, when we went to that, that Sox Nets game, there were a handful of bad calls, and we were just like, what, actually getting rid of the umpire?

[Ian Crossland]

Well, they're, they're talking about machines.

[Brandon Miner]

They're going to have AI start doing it.

[Ian Crossland]

So the first job lost AI is an umpire, hopefully.

[Phil Labonte]

I don't know about that.

[Ian Crossland]

At the, at the, the games, at the enhanced games, you were saying that football, like, the kickoffs are changing. Like, it's kind of. They're kind of neutering.

[Brandon Miner]

They have. There's a lot of changes that have been implemented in the last, like, 10 years, specifically when it comes to a lot of these things, kickoff returns and whatever. And there's always the question of, you know, okay, are we making our players as safe as possible during all of these, these contact situations? Now you've got. Got a guy running 25 miles an hour, full speed across the field to a guy who's standing still, looking upward at the ball, and the second he catches the ball, he's in play to be hit. So that guy, if he times it right, can hit him at 25 miles an hour while he's not even paying attention and basically end his career. So they started this thing where, okay, now you got to kick the ball from here. No one's allowed to move until the ball lands in the receiver's hands. Then you guys can move. This gives this guy time to kind of see what's coming. He doesn't get hit, like, by a truck, you know, of a human being coming at him 25 miles an hour. So it's a lot to do with player safety, the whole CTD thing, which they think is a myth, but I don't think it is.

[Ian Crossland]

What's ctd?

[Brandon Miner]

That's a brain injuries from concussions and things like that. A lot of wrestlers have had it, a lot of football players have had it, and it's just from getting smacked in the head too many times over a course of your.

[Ian Crossland]

So you think it's a good thing that they're changing the sport?

[Brandon Miner]

Some of this stuff, yeah, it's, it's. It is for the health of the players. While we're not used to it, and we've been seeing, you know, a lot of. Of it used to just be gridiron war. You know, football, like George Carlin said, football is played on a gridiron. You know, like baseball, we have to go inside when it rains. You know, it's One of those situations. Football is one of the most hardcore things you could watch. So when you start seeing changes made like that about player safety, the more hardcore fans are gonna be like, that shit's stupid. Take his head off. You know, like, is it because people

[Ian Crossland]

are getting bigger and faster and stronger?

[Brandon Miner]

Well, this is our modern day gladiators, right? Like, this is back in Rome. You would go see people cut each other's heads off. That's the. It was, you know, barbarian stuff. Like, this is as close as we get to that. So the animal in us still wants to see someone get their head torn off. Even if like, oh, man, that's so. I feel so bad for his family. Everyone's still gonna be like, holy shit, did you see that hit? Like, that's. That's what we want.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, I would struggle with that. Watching a guy laid out on the field, especially he's on the other team.

[Brandon Miner]

No, and they don't glorify that anymore. They used to, you know, leave the camera hovering on the guy that. That's dead on the field. You know, they don't do that anymore. Now it's like, okay, we're going to take this off of here. There's respect for these players. And I do think that that's a very serious thing and it does need to be honored. And I do agree with a lot of these policies that are being put in place to keep these guys safe, because I've watched. I've watched Bears players, great players. Johnny Knox, career ending, injury, getting hit too bad. One of the best wide receivers in the NFL that we had. Dude, done never plays again. We had a tight end. His name is spacing me right now, but his leg literally folded up in half when he went into the end zone. Never played again. The reconstructive surgery this guy needed was insane. He was one of the greatest tight ends we had. It's sad to watch a career come to an end over something like that. So I do support a lot of the things that are going into play. It's just a lot of people are not used to it at first and comes with a lot of hot, you know, sighs and boos and hisses. But eventually a lot of hot takes. Yeah, yeah. But it's necessary.

[Ian Crossland]

What do you guys think about enhanced sports in general? Like, regarding the enhanced games? We went to Vegas a couple weeks ago, Brandon. Me too.

[Tim Cast]

I think. I think it's great if people want to do it. I think the challenge with the enhanced games is that a lot of aged out athletes trying to Maintain. Yeah, they would have broken more world records if there were young people willing to juice up. But why would a young person juice up at their prime when they can actually win big records?

[Phil Labonte]

Baseball was best when people were juicing and smashing.

[Tim Cast]

Oh, Mark McGuire, dude. Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

The era of Barry Bonds.

[Phil Labonte]

They were just. Everybody loves to watch smash home runs all day long. That's. That's the thing that people love baseball.

[Ian Crossland]

So was it just that it was unfair? Because, like, some. Most players didn't. Because they thought they weren't supposed to.

[Phil Labonte]

I don't know. I don't think most players. Players didn't.

[Brandon Miner]

I think.

[Tim Cast]

I guess the argument is if some start, everyone would have to be competitive and then it gets real messed up.

[Brandon Miner]

Well, look at the guy that there was. The one guy that won there that wasn't on performance enhancing drugs that won an event.

[Ian Crossland]

Yes.

[Brandon Miner]

He went there.

[Tim Cast]

Stupid. Actually, was there two people? There was a woman and a guy that.

[Brandon Miner]

I'm like, you went to the enhanced games knowing you were going against people,

[Tim Cast]

but they let him in on purpose. Because that's the point. To see if they could do it.

[Brandon Miner]

See if they could do it.

[Tim Cast]

So it's cool that they can still represent, experiment.

[Ian Crossland]

And they were doing more than drugs. They were like. It was. Their regiments were enhanced to.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

Kind of got.

[Tim Cast]

They're on Adderall.

[Ian Crossland]

Really?

[Tim Cast]

Yeah. Adderall, Modafinil. You know what that does? No, you don't need sleep.

[Phil Labonte]

Really?

[Tim Cast]

Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, that's intense.

[Tim Cast]

Human growth hormone, testosterone. But these guys were older, you know what I mean? They're like in their late 20s, early 30s, where it's like, okay, your career is winding down in athletics.

[Ian Crossland]

First they're going to get a robot that's a bat boy and then they're going to let him hit, and then they're going to let him pitch. And they're going to be like, we don't need human pitchers anymore. The robot can throw.

[Tim Cast]

Exactly.

[Brandon Miner]

And then we're living in Futurama. Basically.

[Tim Cast]

What happens when you've got a dude with one arm and he's. And he's got cybernetic, like, full functioning arm. And they're like, whoa, that's cheating. You can't do. Remember Pistorius before he got accused? Did he get convicted of murdering his girlfriend or whatever?

[Matthew Williamson]

Yes.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah. Well, before he did that, he was running on those spring feet. And they argue to give an advantage because it was a mechanical enhancement, he argued he has to use substantially more power and specific muscles to move because runners have. With the lower Muscle groups disperse the energy in their leg more evenly. But there was a big dispute over whether or not those fake legs would give him spring and make him go faster.

[Brandon Miner]

Look at, look at Antonio Alfonseca. You guys remember him? He's a six fingered pitcher. The guy could throw balls that no one else could throw because he had an extra finger on his hand.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah, that's not fair.

[Brandon Miner]

Now, interesting. Some would argue that it's completely fair because it was a natural thing. He didn't, he didn't take drugs to grow an extra finger and be good at pitching. He was born this way.

[Tim Cast]

What if he did?

[Brandon Miner]

I mean, what if he. Was that a possible.

[Tim Cast]

Here's a pill, it'll make you grow another finger.

[Brandon Miner]

I mean, if they could prove it.

[Tim Cast]

Sure.

[Brandon Miner]

Unfair. Absolutely unfair. But if it's like a natural thing, like you can't shun the guy from sports just because like he's got an extra finger. You know, this lays heavily into like the whole gender sports thing of should a man be able to, to go into a woman's sport and claim that he's a woman and win the entire thing. That's not a natural enhancement, in my opinion. So I think there's a plain line to be drawn in between those two things.

[Ian Crossland]

If a kid gets growth hormone juiced up when he's 12 or 13, maybe just dietarily and he becomes 7 foot 2, he's got, I mean, that's why

[Brandon Miner]

we have drug tests.

[Tim Cast]

But yeah, we're just grow 10, 10 foot tall monsters that live for 30 years and they can just play basketball where they walk up and just place the ball in the, in the hoop.

[Ian Crossland]

I wonder if Yao Ming was a chimera. If a Chinese experiment. I don't think you want.

[Tim Cast]

I think chimera is the wrong word. It's not the word you're looking for.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, chimera is a human. Well, they say human animal. Humans are animals.

[Brandon Miner]

Are you looking for a homunculus?

[Tim Cast]

That is not what Chimera, human animal hybrid.

[Ian Crossland]

What is it?

[Tim Cast]

Chimera means two sets of DNA in one organism. Okay, so there are human chimeras like you. Like you. You might see like one eye, like so people, some people with heterochromia eyes are different colors because they have different DNA sets. There are people who like in the womb twins are forming, but then stop and then part of the body just becomes. So there are, there are a lot of stories where a guy has like different DNA in an organ or something because of some kind of weird, you know, deformity in the. In the. In the womb.

[Ian Crossland]

So a human animal hybrid could be a chimera. But not all chimeras are human animal hybrids.

[Tim Cast]

That's the science fiction version.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah.

[Tim Cast]

Chimerism is just two different sets of DNA. And so sci fi says, what if it was like, a dog and like a giraffe? And then you're like, okay, well, I

[Phil Labonte]

guess what if it's a heavy metal band from Cleveland?

[Tim Cast]

Huh?

[Ian Crossland]

Okay, so this is a distinction from what's called a mosaic. So people can be mosaics, too, which arise from mutations of a single zygote.

[Tim Cast]

There you go. That's.

[Ian Crossland]

The chimeras have multiple zygotes.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah, yeah, there you go.

[Matthew Williamson]

It's funny, you mentioned about American power earlier, trying to change the name of everything. We already implemented a halftime show for the FIFA World cup finale. Like, they're. I think it's like a 40 or 35 minute, you know, halftime show. So, like, they're getting the end of good treatment.

[Phil Labonte]

Good.

[Tim Cast]

And then. And then what we do is next time we're gonna. We're gonna introduce some rule changes. Be like, it's, you know, light rule change. Some. Some hand is going to be allowed, like, use of your hands. Okay. And then like a week later, they'll be like, we're actually adding another rule. We're gonna. We're gonna mark the field and the.

[Ian Crossland]

The.

[Tim Cast]

We're gonna elevate the goal, actually. And then just like, like six months later, after, like, a dozen rule changes, are playing football.

[Ian Crossland]

We'll be like, okay, the World Cup. Rename it football now.

[Tim Cast]

No, it's football. It's always been football. Thank you and have a nice day. Yeah, it would be funny if, like, we set up the World cup and it's actually just a football, American football. And we're like, oh, you said football. Oh, you meant that football.

[Ian Crossland]

Football.

[Tim Cast]

No, I'm saying we. We. We make them play NFL football and then go, oh, we thought when you were saying it was football, like, oh,

[Brandon Miner]

because we play American dumb. And we go, wait, oh, that's what you meant. Whoops. We don't do that here. Sorry.

[Tim Cast]

Why would you.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, no, fine, fine. We'll call it football.

[Tim Cast]

So you'll have, like, we raised the goal. Do you think any. What do you think would happen if you took these soccer guys from, like, these other countries and said, okay, play football.

[Ian Crossland]

Be like that south park episode where the Red Wings played the kids in that game.

[Tim Cast]

Remember that? No, no.

[Matthew Williamson]

Isn't there one team right now that currently has One of their kickers, he's a former soccer player. Professionally.

[Tim Cast]

Makes sense.

[Brandon Miner]

There's a lot of.

[Tim Cast]

Remember when that lady tried to kick and then she couldn't do it?

[Brandon Miner]

The crazy thing about that. There is a thing happening right now where they're realizing that some of the best kickers in the world are people that don't actually play sports. Like there's like they're, they're hiring kickers that. Yeah. Ex soccer players, people that are doctors and stuff like that. But just this guy decided to go out and kick a football for 10 straight years and not better than anybody that went to college for it.

[Phil Labonte]

Remember thinking about Brandon Aubrey, College Cowboys.

[Tim Cast]

There's a college team that put a female kicker in play to be progressive.

[Ian Crossland]

Yes.

[Tim Cast]

And then she just whiffed it real bad, costing them the game. And then the dudes were crying over it.

[Ian Crossland]

Brutal.

[Brandon Miner]

Caleb Haney thing was nuts.

[Tim Cast]

It was that it or what? The whole.

[Brandon Miner]

The kicker in Chicago that hit the field goal post three times before.

[Matthew Williamson]

Oh, yeah.

[Brandon Miner]

To go to the playoffs. I can't remember. It was two or three times that dude got death threats. Him and his wife got death threats within a week. Now the causality of this was this was a kicker who practiced by kicking a football at a pole in the middle of the field and trying to hit the pole. That was one of his muscle memory. The whole thing was. You're telling me this guy was actually kicking a ball at these polls as practice and you put him in a playoff situation and he hits the pole three times. I was watching that game from work and screaming in the workplace because I was by myself because I could not. There's no way he does it again. There's no way he hits the pole again. He hit the pole again.

[Ian Crossland]

What like the Brandon Aubrey, you mentioned this, this guy from Dallas Cowboys.

[Tim Cast]

Cowboys, yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

What was his career before he became a kicker?

[Brandon Miner]

Aubrey? I don't know what the hell he

[Ian Crossland]

was doing, but he was a non athlete.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah. He did not. I don't believe he got in by conventional means.

[Ian Crossland]

That's pretty cool, man.

[Brandon Miner]

Let me check actually because I'm kind of curious.

[Ian Crossland]

Multi sport athlete place.

[Tim Cast]

Oh, I think, I think I found the video. Is this one it?

[Matthew Williamson]

That is, yeah. Leilani Armenta and she's going to kick

[Tim Cast]

off and maybe even do some field goals tonight for the Jackson State Tigers. Of course, she was on the Jackson State women's soccer team and because of injuries this week during practice, she's going

[Ian Crossland]

to get her shot tonight too.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah. What an impressive young Lady a chance for her.

[Matthew Williamson]

And I'm sure she's pretty nervous at

[Tim Cast]

this point, but they have her out there and sweat football. Wow. That was like 18 yards. Do you see that? And here's the story of the day.

[Brandon Miner]

Worst kicks I've ever seen.

[Ian Crossland]

That wasn't even a squib. That was just a bad.

[Brandon Miner]

No, that was no.

[Tim Cast]

Oh, no.

[Ian Crossland]

Oops.

[Brandon Miner]

Borderline onside kick.

[Tim Cast]

So, yeah, this was a story from Newsweek. This R.E.M. 2023 college football team's first female player widely mocked after kicking. I feel bad for. What was she thinking? You're injured and you're going to try and kick. You're going to make yourself look bad. You're making everybody look bad.

[Ian Crossland]

Had.

[Tim Cast]

Man.

[Brandon Miner]

I feel like a lot of that was nerves too. That looked like she was just panicking and just.

[Tim Cast]

I guarantee there are at least 25 guys on the team who could kick better.

[Ian Crossland]

Wow.

[Brandon Miner]

What a boot.

[Tim Cast]

Did her dad sponsor the game? I can't think of another reason why she's on the pitch.

[Brandon Miner]

And yes, Brandon Aubrey was a professional soccer player and software engineer before he started kicking in the NFL. Professionally, he was a.

[Tim Cast]

So what?

[Brandon Miner]

He used to play soccer and he was a engineer.

[Tim Cast]

He played soccer.

[Brandon Miner]

Of course. He was a software engineer.

[Phil Labonte]

There are actually several current and recent NFL kickers that began their careers as professional and collegiate soccer players. So there's a bunch of people.

[Brandon Miner]

There's an uptick in it because you're realizing these guys kick balls better than the guys that we've trained to kick footballs their whole lives.

[Tim Cast]

Kick balls.

[Brandon Miner]

Yes. The balls.

[Phil Labonte]

The show. Ow. My balls.

[Tim Cast]

Most notably, it's like power slap step

[Phil Labonte]

that we watched a lot. Our bass player really likes that show.

[Tim Cast]

It's Rochambeau. It's like, first I smack you as hard as I can and if you survive, you can smack me after. It's like, what? Who goes first?

[Phil Labonte]

Some dudes don't get a chance. I. There's a coin toss, I guess.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah. But I'm willing to bet if you track power slap, majority of the winners are the guys who went first because even if the other guy stays up, he's injury smacked like it's going to be disorienting.

[Phil Labonte]

There's a. I've seen a bunch of the. The matches where they like, I think it's only three slaps each and like they'll both make it through.

[Tim Cast]

I mean, I just.

[Brandon Miner]

Dumb.

[Phil Labonte]

I think it's dumb too.

[Brandon Miner]

Power slap. The person who strikes first wins approximately 53 of all matches.

[Tim Cast]

That's it. Really? Wow. They must set those matchups intentionally to be like the stronger guy has to go second.

[Brandon Miner]

Maybe. I don't know.

[Tim Cast]

Because you're getting smacked in the face.

[Phil Labonte]

It's hard to take a smack, man. Like that.

[Tim Cast]

Did you see that?

[Brandon Miner]

You ever see the pillow fight ones?

[Phil Labonte]

No.

[Brandon Miner]

It's just two guys that go out and it's extreme pillow fighting and.

[Tim Cast]

Wait, what?

[Brandon Miner]

Basically look it up. It's one of the craziest things I've ever seen. They take pics. They literally take pillows and wad them up at the end and they go after each other and try to knock each other out with pillows.

[Matthew Williamson]

This just sounds like an esp.

[Phil Labonte]

Something that you see on the Ocho.

[Matthew Williamson]

Yeah.

[Brandon Miner]

Basically MMA with pillows.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, nice one shot. These guys are good.

[Brandon Miner]

This is cool.

[Tim Cast]

But I'm liking for Turbo is he's

[Brandon Miner]

cutting off Simon from jumping around a shot.

[Phil Labonte]

I love it.

[Tim Cast]

What is this supposed to accomplish? Is he sponsored by Dr. Pepper?

[Brandon Miner]

Look at how many people are in the stance

[Matthew Williamson]

sponsored by.

[Tim Cast]

Do they actually get knocked out though? I have seen people get knocked out. For Kenta to finally get gold, she.

[Ian Crossland]

How heavy are the pillows?

[Tim Cast]

Not that heavy.

[Phil Labonte]

Obviously.

[Ian Crossland]

He used friction to his advantage.

[Phil Labonte]

I assume it's score based blocking every shot.

[Tim Cast]

You probably get points.

[Brandon Miner]

60, that's maybe the difference.

[Tim Cast]

Follow my take.

[Matthew Williamson]

360.

[Tim Cast]

If you hit the 360, you hit the hand and your hand hits your. Someone's got to get something action here. Great.

[Phil Labonte]

360.

[Ian Crossland]

Go for the legs. That's a three pointer.

[Tim Cast]

Three pointer.

[Brandon Miner]

Get used to it. Cuz if the govern, the mayor of Chicago have anything to do with it, this is going to be the only thing you're going to have to watch.

[Tim Cast]

I don't know.

[Ian Crossland]

I kind of like this.

[Tim Cast]

Like it's point based. I'd like to see someone get knocked out fencing.

[Brandon Miner]

I mean you might search for a knockout. I'm sure someone's been smacked hard enough.

[Ian Crossland]

Rocks in their back. I don't even want terrible.

[Tim Cast]

They put barbs wire on it.

[Phil Labonte]

I imagine there is an official weight. Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

The pillows, I want to see the weigh in where they're like testing the softness of the pillow. Too firm.

[Tim Cast]

There's a ton of knockouts. Like there's, there's. There's a ton actually.

[Phil Labonte]

Really?

[Tim Cast]

How long has this thing been around for?

[Brandon Miner]

I think I first saw this four or five years ago. So it's been.

[Matthew Williamson]

There you go. 20, 21.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

I prefer it for that slap bike challenge thing. Yeah. That's just brutal.

[Tim Cast]

This is way better Than slap, dude.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, slap kind of sucks for me anyway.

[Tim Cast]

Okay, we don't need this weird music.

[Phil Labonte]

Where's the knockouts?

[Tim Cast]

I want to see a knockout, though. There's a bunch of shorts of knockouts,

[Ian Crossland]

but I want to see downs. They count. Those probably.

[Tim Cast]

Is she wearing a blue lives matter?

[Matthew Williamson]

It looked like it.

[Tim Cast]

Pants.

[Phil Labonte]

Oh, boy.

[Tim Cast]

Thin blue line.

[Brandon Miner]

Ooh, that one got him, like, oh, boom.

[Tim Cast]

He got. He got pillow.

[Ian Crossland]

They're getting heavier.

[Tim Cast]

Is the. There's got to be a better than this.

[Phil Labonte]

This is ridiculous.

[Tim Cast]

I searched for PFC knockouts.

[Brandon Miner]

I. Yeah, these are, like, I want. These are TKOs. These aren't Kos.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Tim Cast]

This is dumb.

[Phil Labonte]

Does someone actually get knocked out? I. I don't think that. That anyone has.

[Tim Cast]

It's like on Tick Tock, they got it. But where's the YouTube?

[Phil Labonte]

There's the octagon.

[Brandon Miner]

Now we might need to test this.

[Tim Cast]

Professional pillow. Fighter gets knocked out with a pillow.

[Brandon Miner]

You just take turns cracking Andy in the face of the pillow and see how many to knock them out.

[Tim Cast]

This is just someone reacting to it. Where's the actual knockout, bro?

[Brandon Miner]

Where's the juice? Yeah, give me some juice, dude.

[Ian Crossland]

If someone gets knocked out by a pillow, that's the funny.

[Tim Cast]

Who cares about tko? It's like, I Google searched it. It's all just like tko. Well, duh. That's all the game is.

[Ian Crossland]

Spinning backhand. Yeah, yeah, I've noticed.

[Brandon Miner]

That's the go to move.

[Tim Cast]

This is annoying.

[Brandon Miner]

Number one isn't a legitimate knockout.

[Tim Cast]

I guess there's like, I don't want to pull up a Tick Tock video. It's annoying. It gives you the business.

[Brandon Miner]

Oh, please. I've had a message with my friends.

[Tim Cast]

This is not a knockout.

[Phil Labonte]

This is terrible.

[Tim Cast]

I don't think there are knockouts in the pillow fighting.

[Phil Labonte]

I don't think so either.

[Tim Cast]

The guy got knocked out of the ring. It's not a knockout.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah, you'd have to be real.

[Ian Crossland]

Technically, it was.

[Brandon Miner]

I would take that. At this point, seeing someone get smacked so hard they went out of the ring, that would be funny.

[Ian Crossland]

I got knocked out of the ring.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah, I got knocked out of the ring. That's not. Ain't nobody getting knocked out.

[Phil Labonte]

I can't believe there are people that are watching this.

[Ian Crossland]

They're just trading blows.

[Tim Cast]

Is there.

[Brandon Miner]

It's worse than that, Phil. People paid money to watch this.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, right.

[Matthew Williamson]

Someone sponsored this.

[Ian Crossland]

If anyone's like, we're just sitting and not watching. Its top 10 hits of 2021 is the name.

[Brandon Miner]

Is that guy wearing a Tigger cosplay back there.

[Matthew Williamson]

What?

[Phil Labonte]

Probably.

[Tim Cast]

Oh, that's caught up. It's on espn, dude.

[Ian Crossland]

Ref had to step in.

[Tim Cast]

This is like a big thing. How do we know they're just allowing

[Ian Crossland]

the hit their faces?

[Phil Labonte]

That's because you don't get knocked out with a pillow steel.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, give it to me. I'll show you how hard I am.

[Tim Cast]

Okay, well this isn't pillow fighting, but it came up and it's entertaining.

[Phil Labonte]

This is way better.

[Ian Crossland]

Yes.

[Matthew Williamson]

Oh, what is sca, right?

[Brandon Miner]

Ah, yes. Yes.

[Ian Crossland]

That. That's painful.

[Phil Labonte]

This is. This is definitely.

[Brandon Miner]

This is the Barbary that I was referring to earlier that was so obsessed with it. But this is still entertaining to bring

[Tim Cast]

back medieval sword fighting.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, there's some great video games.

[Brandon Miner]

This is why Medieval Times is still around. And here we go. The weapon of time.

[Matthew Williamson]

I mean you can go to any SCA chapter and do this right now if you wanted to. What's that Sea the Society for Creative Anachronism. And this is where guys with a lot of money to blow will dress up exactly like that and beat the tar out of each other. Hard Is like oh yeah.

[Brandon Miner]

Is it something where a poor guy like me can walk up, become a fighter and then slowly ascend to the rank of gladiator and take over? You know, overthrow a small community of.

[Matthew Williamson]

I mean I met. I met guys that literally would smith

[Ian Crossland]

their own middle ages. This is when he would pull out his dagger and put it through the eye visor of the other guy to the head.

[Matthew Williamson]

Yeah. Oh, he knocked him out, dude.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, that's sharp. Look at that arena to the face.

[Phil Labonte]

Very Highlander esque. He's like no, I'm done.

[Tim Cast]

Nights fight bro.

[Ian Crossland]

Relentless.

[Phil Labonte]

Bloody facing everything. Oh, that guy down getting dragged out.

[Ian Crossland]

That's tough cuz he's got a metal mask on. You couldn't see how busted his face was.

[Matthew Williamson]

You'll find out when you pull it off.

[Tim Cast]

The a bunch of it body language armored mma.

[Matthew Williamson]

His arm from coming down and raining on his points.

[Ian Crossland]

But it's just everything like, like got to do some.

[Phil Labonte]

Got a stick. Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

Action back on your way.

[Tim Cast]

Just coming back.

[Phil Labonte]

Side control.

[Brandon Miner]

Throwing each other around, taking down. At what point do you.

[Tim Cast]

Are you susceptible to taking the tip

[Ian Crossland]

of one of those swords in the gut, you know, shield punches. I wonder if there's any like gets going.

[Phil Labonte]

They don't give advantage of it. Cuz the brun he. He comes right back when he gets in.

[Matthew Williamson]

Awesome to see but he's got to watch that takedown. Well that you're definitely signing away the

[Ian Crossland]

mat after the ground.

[Brandon Miner]

They're not fully covered by this armor.

[Tim Cast]

Who's coming up with.

[Phil Labonte]

With.

[Tim Cast]

With less energy.

[Phil Labonte]

The armor looks like they're just covering

[Ian Crossland]

the person who was delivering the hits. Like, they got plate. It's mainly just looking out on the ground, man. Is it like half plate or something?

[Tim Cast]

Let's just watch guys sword fight and plate armor from now on.

[Phil Labonte]

I mean.

[Tim Cast]

All right, everybody want to get your questions here from the discord. So get those question ends. We'll pull them up for everybody else. Smash the like button, share the show and all that good stuff. Sinaski, he's got a question. He says, tim, over the last few years, we've seen the slow shift of business demonstrating that wokeism di policies just aren't a thing anymore. The bears being the prime example today. But even earlier this week, with Victoria's Secret shares surging nearly 50% after moving back to sexy and hot models, is it a true sign of positive change or is it a false signal simply due to Trump policy changes? I think they lost a ton of money. I think Bud Light proved it. So a lot of these companies are retreating. But WOKE isn't dead. When you conquer a nation, its people are still there. You have to subjugate them. So the woke must be subjugated and kept out of media and entertainment institutions and corporations and, you know. Yeah, I don't know what you guys think.

[Ian Crossland]

Re education. When you conquer a nation, you re educate the populace. They're lying dormant right now.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, I mean, I. I wouldn't say lying dormant. I think that there are things that. That they will stop pushing. Right. So in this context, you're talking about the Victoria Secret stuff. Like, I don't imagine that the body positivity movement or body positivity part of woke is going to be a thing anymore, particularly with things like OIC and Manjaro. You have the option to not be overweight anymore. And I don't think that was ever real. There was no never. People that actually thought that people that were overweight was a good thing. It's unhealthy. They were trying to make all these arguments. It was untrue. But I think that the LGBT lobby lost a lot of power because of the trans part of the. The LGBT groups and stuff. But there are still going to be people that are going to be like, well, you know, there's still systemic racism and all. All those other types of things. I think those things are. Are deeply ingrained in a lot of people. And so I don't think it's going away. It might change a little bit and it has lost, you know, social currency, but it will come back when Democrats are back in power. The Democrats haven't significantly moved away from all of these narratives. Like they'll, they'll tone down the rhetoric. Now it's not, obviously it's not as bad as it was in 20, 20, 21, but they're the, the people are still running on these things. You still hear people talking about, you know, the, the, the class warfare stuff. You still, you still see the left Vic scapegoating certain groups of people and stuff like that. So it hasn't gone away. It will change some, but it's going to come back.

[Matthew Williamson]

Well, and I mean, we live in a very much bifurcated kind of environment. We often describe things as like two realities or two Americas. But I mean, fundamentally, you still see those anti racist messagings at the end of every, you know, end zone. With the NFL, you still have that. The Oscars have their requirements to even be nominated to meet their various DEI and diversity goals. This is why Nolan's the Odyssey is the absolute fire show that it is in terms of representation of one of the most important myths and historical events to Western culture. And at the same time, these battles are still going on, even right now. We can take a look at the things that people like James Talarico are saying. That is the Democratic candidate for the Senate right now. I mean, you know, he has said it in multiple times, even abusing the pulpit, saying, you know, he thinks about trans kids while having a beard of a girlfriend, where all these things that are taking place, I mean, yeah, there's some cultural victories or mores where they're like, oh, they're reversing something. But when you have people on Twitter who are prominent progressive activists saying, well, woke point one, woke 1.0 had some problems, that's not going away anytime soon because those institutions haven't been captured, they haven't been defunded and there hasn't been a proper punishment. Yeah, the Bud Light thing is probably the first major success that we've seen against this sort of stuff. But when people like Benny Johnson and Oren McIntyre can't even get Jimmy Kimmel canceled for openly lying about Charlie Kirk's assassination, then the right still has a long way to go. And I think woke has not gone away. It may be in hiding, but we know that when people run as Democrats, like I'm John Normalson or whatever, like this Graham Platner guy that you guys were talking about yesterday. It doesn't matter how normal he tries to look on the outside, he's going to vote to the left of Mao every single time. No matter what problematic thing you may have with him.

[Ian Crossland]

It seems like wokeism derives from classism, which is like the Marxist Marxism is. But have there been instances historiologically, if you guys know of like class warfare? Before Marx, was he the first guy

[Phil Labonte]

that kind of the whole, the whole French Revolution?

[Tim Cast]

Yeah, it was a lot of class war.

[Ian Crossland]

India, the caste system is like a class, like a, a victory of a class war.

[Phil Labonte]

What we consider like modern socialism. Like the seeds were planted in the French Revolution. Right. Like so the Jacobins and, and Rousseau. All those ideas or all the ideas that Marx kind of put into the Communist Manifesto. They were all, they were all very popular with the, with the French left during the French Revolution. Like people up. People love to blame the Jews and say that communism came from the Jews. It didn't come from the Jews, it came from the French during the French Revolution like that's where all the seeds were planted. That's where the ideas really started to gain popular.

[Matthew Williamson]

And you've got a lot of other things to look at there. I mean with the French Revolution there's a great book by Jack Goldstone called Revolution and Rebellion in the early modern era. The pressures for the French Revolution are heavily predicated on poor resources of mismanagement. The fact that the royalty is trying to create ways in which the titles of nobility for you to have access to land or wealth are increasingly diminished. You have an overproduction of areas for people that are trying to develop an understanding of say like law Degrees are a really good example of this. There were an over surplus of lawyers plus a famine and also infant mortality was down. So people were living longer. You had a perfect demographic and an economic time bomb that was large part due to revolution. And I mean we can sort of look at this based on purchasing power. We can examine this based off the demographics and eventually the management of that system. In this case the royalty. We saw how it was from the beginning of the revolution towards the end. Like class warfare does, yes, happen, but it's also heavily going to be predicated on the external pressures that a lot of like materialist analysis works off of. But it's older than Marxism. We can even look at the glorious revolution in England in the 1600s. We can look throughout all of history that typically in periods of imperial rule, you're either bringing in other people to diminish the labor power that's there or otherwise. But it also comes not as an exclusively. I don't think it's exclusively materialist because again, usually when you're bringing in a new policy or new identity to either replace scab labor or whatever, I mean it also comes with religion, ethnicity, it comes with a sense of cultural values. And it's the same thing that we're seeing already now. Like we saw this during what a lot of people call peak woke. But like when Allison Brie is saying like this movie's not made for you, she's being very accurate. It isn't made for me and mine is made to indoctrinate the next level of children and for the people that they already have as the next, you know, consumer base. They've already talked about this for years. Whether it's ditching the gamers or ditching the pre existing audience.

[Tim Cast]

Ugly filters.

[Matthew Williamson]

Yeah, the ugly filter. And like we know that the left idolizes the ugly over the good and the true and the beautiful. But outside of that, they also have the means to enforce it because the right doesn't have control over, you know, the various means in which you enforce the diversity quotas. Happen all the time.

[Tim Cast]

Time, let's grab this question. We got this from Igregor. He says question for the panel. If when you get married your wife's parents become your mother in law and father in law and her siblings become your brother in law and sister in law, does this mean that your wife is now your sister in law? No, she's your wife.

[Brandon Miner]

My own grandpa interest.

[Tim Cast]

The answer is no. But I got the joke. You're trying to make just a wife, you know. All right, what do we got here? Volunteering for change says New York state legislature passes bill removing gender specific terms from custody laws. What are your thoughts? Probably a good thing. Accidentally remove the bias, I guess from family courts.

[Matthew Williamson]

They changed mother to gestating parent.

[Tim Cast]

Oh, right. Yeah, that doesn't work.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, no, and they'll still end up, you know, putting all of the onus on the man.

[Matthew Williamson]

Yeah, the family court system is changing anti male.

[Phil Labonte]

Changing the verbiage doesn't change the material conditions.

[Tim Cast]

Well, okay, yeah, make them fight in the amma. What is that?

[Phil Labonte]

MMA something mma, ama, Mixed martial arts.

[Tim Cast]

Armored mixed martial arts. Oh right. Yeah, there we go.

[Phil Labonte]

Look, it's, it's fun to watch. It's cool, you know.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh yeah, the, the shield to the face. I mean the edges of those shield just battering.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah. The real prehistoric man in me loves to just sit and mindlessly drone over it.

[Tim Cast]

But, but wrath asks question have we entered the bargaining phase with the woke? Similar how treaties are signed after wars?

[Ian Crossland]

Maybe. I don't know.

[Tim Cast]

I would. I think we just crushed them.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah.

[Phil Labonte]

I don't think the, I don't think that they're, they're comfortable giving up anything. I think that, I think that they, yeah, they, they don't. They're not comfortable giving up. There, there are things that they will stop pushing the things that, you know, turn off the, the middle of America. Like I said, like trans stuff is, is something that's really not popular. A lot of the, a lot of gays and les upset with the, with the trans lobby because there are people that are no longer, you know, that have a negative view of gays and lesbians now because of the trans lobbying, because of the activists. So they'll, they'll stop pushing things that are, that are obviously unpopular with the American people. But I mean your, your average, you know, white urban liberal is woman is still all in on. On things like, you know, anti racism and all that stuff. They still believe, you know, there are people that still believe that, you know, black men are hunted in the streets by police even though stat basically, you see that that just was never true. That it was always just a line to get people to open their wallets.

[Brandon Miner]

They haven't left the restaurant. They're just hiding out in the unisex bathroom.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, I guess so.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah.

[Brandon Miner]

I'll be back.

[Phil Labonte]

They're in the they room.

[Matthew Williamson]

Yeah. I mean to implied bargaining implies that there's been some kind of victory. I mean the President is in the White House, but the Republican Party that he's the avatar of won't even pass the most important piece of election integrity legislation that this country's ever seen that it desperately needs. Otherwise. Otherwise we're going to keep seeing this mail in ballot crap like we're witnessing in Los Angeles. It really does go to show that like yeah, an election is great, but you shouldn't be using this as a pressure release valve. And the average person obviously thinks that. I mean considering what we're. It's 2026, so we're now 11 years since Oberfell v. Hodges, the legalization of gay marriage in the country. And I mean that really, I think for a lot of people realize that the court has always been the supreme legislator over our congressmen, despite them having the power of the purse. And so all of our cultural war battles have been predicated on court victories. The left has especially been operating on Legal battles for forever, at least since the 1960s. And so, yeah, there's nothing for us to bargain with because the left knows that they can either wait out this administration or wait out the demographic time bomb in this country, and then they can implement their victory. I mean, until they are absolutely crushed and kept out of power forever, there is no bargaining on either side to happen because it's. The war is still on.

[Tim Cast]

My name is Munchop says Tim. You talk about wanting to build a city, but what industry would you use to coalesce around? For example, Austin grew. A huge amount of the tech industry moved in. Then an avalanche of new industries following entertainment. What would your idea be for a high money industry? The Tim Cast Corporation brings a lot of economic activity to this area that probably wouldn't exist. We may be one of, like, the highest grossing businesses in the town that we're in, actually, probably. I think it's fair to say we are. So that produces. That brings revenue in. The people who work here then rent around the area. They go to restaurants around the area that activity is coming in. Then I tell other people in similar positions to center their businesses here. You could probably negotiate with the state because West Virginia is a smaller state, population wise, and they'll cut you a tax deal. If you say you want to bring your business here, they'll get you some kind of deal. Then you get a bunch of media businesses and you get their market products. The idea for the anti Times Square was a cultural center, that is tourism. People would come to Martinsburg to shop at the stores because they know they can see all of the great products from the. From the people online they like. So a cultural center like Times Square. What does Times Square offer? Times Square, you know, Right, Yeah. What say you, Ian? You want to build the city, right?

[Ian Crossland]

What are you going to do, industry wise? Yeah, honestly, it would be a big, big. A big uptake. But I think we should make graphene. I think that we should start collecting trash.

[Tim Cast]

That was obvious.

[Brandon Miner]

I was gonna suggest American steel, which is still popular and highly sought after, but now graphene after.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, you could import trash. Start importing trash and flashing it into graphene and mass. But they're doing it already elsewhere. It doesn't mean that we can't do it here.

[Brandon Miner]

Chicago's been importing trash for years.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, dude, you just turn that carbon into graphene, man, and export it. Import, export. People will be sitting there in laboratories with clay pots and what are those things called? Arc welders. Just turning their. Their black carbon trash into graphene.

[Matthew Williamson]

I mean, what's the closest waterway here?

[Tim Cast]

From right now we have the Shenandoah, the Potomac.

[Matthew Williamson]

Okay. So I mean, I'm thinking about water industry, things that we desperately need to be built in house. I would, if I'm going to build a town, if I want to build around here, I would be coordinating with both the federal government and the HHS specifically, but not hhs, but, you know, Health and Human Services, but also with the state government. I would start thinking about building pharmaceuticals, especially antibiotics. We're almost heavily reliant exclusively on the Chinese to do it. And considering that all of their, you know, student visas that they come over either come in with agroterrorism and biological terrorism, probably be best for the most important thing of the modern medical industry, antibiotics to be built by Americans here at home.

[Tim Cast]

Not just a Walmart, just a Walmart data center.

[Matthew Williamson]

That'll come next.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, Walmart can sell the pharmaceuticals.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah. And they do.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah. It'll be, it should be data centers, I think.

[Matthew Williamson]

Well, I mean, that, that's been such in the works for so many years. Like, I know that a lot of people are now getting upset or there, there's been, you know, allegations of the Chinese also paying, you know, people to agitate against it, which, I mean, hey, if Hassan biker's going to jail, no complaints here. But at the same time, a lot of these things have been put in place in previous administration. Like a lot of projects that are happening to revitalize power plants or to make room for data centers. These things aren't going to be built until 2029-2033. And even then, there's still a lot of groundwork that needs to be done. So we're talking about steel insulation, making sure that the construction companies have everything that they need. So there's a lot there that of course, kind of hampers us because our industrial base has been so hollowed out. And it already makes it harder if you're getting any sort of tax subsidy or a grant to do so because there's like, like the BABA requirements. Buy American, build American. And like, unless you're actually a company or a factory or manufacturer that's producing steel or the various forms of widgets, whatever you need to build or insulation, wiring, et cetera, that does put a hamper on a lot of domestic building and manufacturing. And I mean, the thing is, is though, on a national security level, you absolutely need that to come back. It's just now, whether or not this administration or any government on a state level or Local wants to provide either maybe the necessity or the. The subsidies or whatever to make it happen. But these things are just a question of, you know, national security needs for the United States, period.

[Tim Cast]

Thinking for Life says, do you think if the left did gain power again, they would use flock cams to track down conservatives who fight their manipulation?

[Phil Labonte]

Sure.

[Tim Cast]

Similarly, how ICE uses them to track illegals and suspected illegals, which ICE assets to submit on the tip form. Yes, of course. Absolutely.

[Phil Labonte]

Every.

[Tim Cast]

Yeah, they track your license plates, and then they create a database of where people are and what they do.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, it's like, where are the.

[Ian Crossland]

What are the cameras? Where. How do they track.

[Tim Cast]

Where are they coming from? They'll be, like, on the side of the road. And when you drive past it, it registers your license plate and your car.

[Ian Crossland]

And, man, that's the problem with essential

[Brandon Miner]

formula patterns on where you've been and where you're going regularly. So they know where to trap you.

[Ian Crossland]

It is deeply concerning about, like, cheering on a technocratic, you know, incision, because whoever gets control of it is like, good God, who's coming next? Who's going to be in charge next?

[Brandon Miner]

Who gets the Palantir next?

[Ian Crossland]

I had a dream about the guy who runs Palantir, Alex Karp, last night that I was hanging out with him. He was super cool, and he wanted to call me Testosterone Tilly or something. What the hell? He's like, I don't want to put your real name in my phone. We'll just call you, like, Testosterone Terry or something.

[Brandon Miner]

That's what I would have used.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, he was.

[Phil Labonte]

He was loopy. And that's the dream.

[Brandon Miner]

It's the first thing when it came to my mind. Shout out to Alex, car.

[Ian Crossland]

Get on the show, bro.

[Tim Cast]

Come on. All right, let's grab one more. While we're at it. It munch up, says, no way. Time Square is the New York Stock Exchange. Right there. That's incorrect. The New York Stock Exchange is not in Time Square.

[Ian Crossland]

It's downtown.

[Tim Cast]

It's downtown on Wall street, which is where the wall was. The financial district. Time Square again, this. Yeah. The New York Stock Exchange is in the Financial District near Battery Park. Times Square is miles away.

[Ian Crossland]

Times Square is really just a opposite end. It was a crossroads of Broadway and what, 42nd street, or 6th is Broadway? 6th Avenue. No, Broadway is its own street. It's a diagonal street that cuts across everything and 6th Avenue and 42nd street, and that's Time Square, basically.

[Tim Cast]

And what was there was the Times building, the. The news. But. So there's Thompson Reuters, that's up there right now. But it's a bunch of just random media stuff. Times Square literally makes money for being Times Square. No one goes there to go to Thompson Reuters building. I mean like you do if you have to go there. But the people who come there and buy food, it's cuz Bubba Gump Shrimp is there and it's like 10 blocks

[Ian Crossland]

away from Central Park. So it's kind of a nice, nice, nice business area.

[Matthew Williamson]

It's a tourist, you know. Mecca.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, you would avoid that at all

[Brandon Miner]

costs if you live there.

[Phil Labonte]

Yep.

[Ian Crossland]

Usually smells good. Smells like roasted peanuts.

[Tim Cast]

People walk very slow.

[Phil Labonte]

Times Square, it's not.

[Brandon Miner]

Smells like bum piss and disappointment really.

[Ian Crossland]

I always smell the dudes grilling the peanuts at their stalls.

[Phil Labonte]

I mean smell. New York just smells.

[Brandon Miner]

Bless you for being able to pick that aroma out of the air over there.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Tim Cast]

All right, everybody, that about does it for today. Thank you so much for hanging out. Smash the like button. Share the show with everyone. You know, it's been fun. It's been great to have you good sir. Guys, you can follow me on X and Instagram Cast. Join [e-mail] for the Discord community. Would you like to shout anything out before we go, sir?

[Matthew Williamson]

Yeah. Thank you so much for having me on. You can find me on Twitter rudentialist. I'm also there on Substack as well. Every Tuesday evening at 8pm Eastern. Myself and my co host Gio Panacetti host a show called the Digital Archipelago. We like to describe it as we're on Twitter so you don't have to be covering the news. Various cultural artifacts that inform us on what were going on in today's world. But also where are the arts and culture really happening? Alongside that, once a month I host a show and a program called do youo Even Read? Everyone tells us that we need to read theory, understand what's going on in the world. Well, we're probably the only show on the Internet that actually takes the time to read the books that take place. If not, you can always find my works on Substack. I've been published in Frontier magazine with the Blaze and numerous other places. So as always, Tim, thank you so much for having me on.

[Tim Cast]

Right on.

[Ian Crossland]

Great show, guys.

[Tim Cast]

Ian Crossland.

[Ian Crossland]

Follow me on the Internet IanCrosslin everywhere. Go to my YouTube channel and Twitch. Sign up and subscribe so that you can watch me go live. Live and join in. Join my Discord community. Join the Tis the Tin Cast Discord community as well. Go to Casper.com. pick up the graphine dream. Follow me on X and Instagram.

[Phil Labonte]

Phil Labonte I am Phil that Remains on Twix. The band is all that remains. You can check out our music at Apple Music, Amazon Music, Pandora, Spotify, YouTube and Deezer. Next Sunday, a week from tomorrow or a week from this Sunday, we will be playing at Warp tour in Washington D.C. you can get your tickets@Warp Tour.com. don't forget the left lane is for Chrome.

[Ian Crossland]

Brian I'm Carter Banks. You can follow me at Carter Banks and at Carter Banks official everywhere else. Wow, that went by really fast. Great conversation. Brand. I'm glad you were here. Up Bears talk about sports all day dude.

[Brandon Miner]

Yeah, no, absolutely. And thank you guys for letting a pissed off ex Chicago native voices grievances on the show. My name is Brandon Miner. You can follow me at Brando Boonies on Insta and on X. Don't forget to check out the Skateboard podcast and check out pcc, both shows which I appear on randomly. And thanks for letting me hang out.

[Tim Cast]

Out. Let's go. We'll be back with clips throughout the weekend, then of course on Monday. Thanks for hanging out. We'll see you all next time.