Democrats Prep Trip To El Salvador To SAVE MS-13 Gang Member, Bring Terrorist To US w/ Hannah Cox

Summary

Timcast IRL: Democrats Prep Trip To El Salvador To SAVE MS-13 Gang Member, Bring Terrorist To US with Hannah Cox

Episode Release Date: April 16, 2025
Host: Tim Pool
Guest: Hannah Cox

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Overview

In this intense episode of Timcast IRL, host Tim Pool delves deep into the controversial actions of Democratic lawmakers planning a trip to El Salvador. The primary focus revolves around their intent to rescue Kilmar Abrego Garcia, a deported Maryland man alleged to be an MS-13 gang member. Joined by commentator Hannah Cox and panelists Phil Labonte, Ian Crossland, and Elad Eliyahu, the discussion unpacks the legal, political, and societal implications of such actions.

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The Kilmar Abrego Garcia Case

Tim Pool initiates the conversation by challenging the mainstream narrative that Democrats aim to save an innocent man from torture abroad. He asserts, “Democrats are trying to rescue a terrorist member of MS-13 from prison to bring to the United States” (06:23).

Hannah Cox presents a contrasting viewpoint, emphasizing the need for due process:
"Deportation is one thing, but they didn't just deport him. They sent him to a prison with no due process, where I assume he's not going to have a trial there either," (10:15).

Tim Pool elaborates on the legal complexities, highlighting that Abrego Garcia was deported under the Alien Enemies Act after being flagged as an MS-13 member by two different courts:
"He had two deportation orders and no asylum. The Supreme Court ruled that he has the authority to deport people under potentially dangerous affiliations," (19:21).

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Legal Interpretations and Universal Injunctions

A significant portion of the episode debates the role of universal injunctions issued by the judiciary, which Tim Pool argues are unconstitutional and present a “judicial coup.” He notes, “Universal injunctions are unconstitutional and Trump has almost half of all universal injunctions ever issued” (82:53).

Phil Labonte adds,
"Universal injunctions are actually an innovation that the framers never intended,” (47:07), underscoring concerns about judicial overreach.

Hannah Cox suggests legislative reforms as a solution:
"Ideally, Congress would take some action, but I think that's a pipe dream, right," (23:15), to which Phil and Tim discuss the challenges posed by a dysfunctional Congress.

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Immigration Policies and Census Impact

The panel shifts focus to the broader implications of immigration on political power dynamics. Tim Pool explains how illegal immigrants influence congressional seat allocations through the census:
"Congressional seats are apportioned based on total population size, not citizenry. So when they do the census, they don't care if you're a citizen or not," (82:05).

Elad Eliyahu emphasizes the strategic motivations behind immigration policies, linking them to Democratic gains in congressional representation:
"Democrats are using immigration to bolster their numbers and control in Congress," (82:20).

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Political Division and Possible Constitutional Crisis

The conversation intensifies as the panelists express fears of a constitutional crisis fueled by unchecked judicial actions and executive defiance. Tim Pool posits,
"We're in a constitutional crisis where universal injunctions defy the Constitution," (83:18).

Hannah Cox warns of escalating tensions leading to potential civil conflict:
"If the right and left keep escalating, we could end up in very scary places," (29:14).

Phil Labonte echoes concerns about executive overreach, advocating for conservative control to prevent further erosion of constitutional principles:
"If the left is in control of the apparatus of the state, you're gonna see things that will turn into an abolition of property rights," (77:52).

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Additional Stories: Military Defiance and Protest Movements

The episode also touches on instances of military officials defying presidential orders. Tim Pool mentions the firing of Vice Admiral Shoshana Chatfield for allegedly refusing to display Trump’s portrait, questioning the implications for military obedience and executive authority:
"These high-ranking military officials are openly defying the president," (49:30).

Furthermore, the panel discusses the rise in violent protests and terrorist acts directed towards corporations like Tesla, linking them to leftist extremism:
"We have had 50 incidents of terror attacks on Tesla pertaining to Tesla vehicles and facilities," (73:53).

Hannah Cox and Phil Labonte debate the motivations behind such acts, attributing them to a radicalized leftist ideology seeking to dismantle established systems.

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Concluding Remarks

As the episode wraps up, Tim Pool emphasizes the dire situation, asserting that regardless of the actions taken by the Trump administration, Democrats will portray them as unconstitutional and illegal. He concludes with a stark portrayal of an America confronted by internal strife and judicial overreach:
"The judiciary is acting outside the confines of the Constitution, and Trump has almost half of all universal injunctions ever issued. This is a judicial coup," (82:53).

Hannah Cox advocates for legislative reforms and restoring constitutional balance, while Phil Labonte stresses the importance of conservative control to safeguard American ideals.

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Notable Quotes

• Tim Pool (06:23):
  “Democrats are trying to rescue a terrorist member of MS-13 from prison to bring to the United States.”

• Hannah Cox (10:15):
  “Deportation is one thing, but they didn't just deport him. They sent him to a prison with no due process, where I assume he's not going to have a trial there either.”

• Phil Labonte (47:07):
  “Universal injunctions are actually an innovation that the framers never intended.”

• Tim Pool (83:18):
  “Universal injunctions are unconstitutional and Trump has almost half of all universal injunctions ever issued.”

• Hannah Cox (29:14):
  “If the right and left keep escalating, we could end up in very scary places.”

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Final Thoughts

This episode of Timcast IRL offers a critical examination of the intersection between immigration policies, judicial authority, and political power struggles in the United States. Through robust debate and insightful analysis, Tim Pool and his guests highlight the escalating tensions and potential threats to constitutional integrity, urging listeners to recognize and address the growing divide.

Transcript

[Tim Pool]

This episode is brought to you by LifeLock. It's tax season, and we're all a.

[Ian Crossland]

Bit tired of numbers, but here's one.

[Tim Pool]

You need to $16.5 billion. That's how much the IRS flagged for possible identity fraud last year. Now, here's a good number. 100 million. That's how many data points LifeLock monitors every second. If your identity is stolen, they'll fix it, guaranteed. Save up to 40% your first [e-mail] podcast terms apply. Democrats, in their infinite empathy are going on a perilous journey to save a Maryland man who has been sent to a foreign prison to be tortured and may already be dead. At least that's the narrative that the corporate press is giving. In reality, Democrats are planning a trip to fly to El Salvador to try and rescue a Salvadoran man from his own country's jail for crimes he's guilty of in his own country. And it's because he was in this country illegally. There's a deportation order, and under the Alien Enemies act, the Trump administration removed him. So, again, to clarify. You know the story. A man from El Salvador illegally entered the United States, was not granted asylum, but he was given a temporary stay. He was deported. The administration said it was an administrative error because he did have a. I believe he had two orders for removal. Two different courts determined he was a gang member in MS.13 and he was here illegally. But there was a stay over threats of safety to his life. Well, he has been deported. He is a Salvadoran citizen in El Salvador, where he will likely stay. President Nayibu Kelly says he's not going to let loose a terrorist in his own country so that the US can bring him back to the US and this has resulted in Democrat outrage. They're lying about what's going on. This has become their, their principal issue of the week. I guess their cause celebrate that we must rescue this innocent man. Let me just stress, Democrats are trying to rescue a terrorist member of Ms. 13 from prison to bring to the United States. Now, we're gonna go through the court documents and we'll break this down for you and why they're falsely framing and misrepresenting what's actually going on. And for the life of me, I can't figure out why, other than it's a cult, I guess. So I'll talk about that. But there is, there are a handful of other stories, and one that I do want to talk about that's, that's been going viral was a man who was brutally attacked in A just a reckless, just unwarranted, random hatchet strike. And while people are talking about, you know, race relations and violent crime, this story that's been largely gone unnoticed until recently with libs of Tick Tock sharing it, I think should we should. We should bring up. So we do. We definitely have a lot to bring up as it pertains to this illegal immigration story. But I do also believe that this plays into the judicial coup that we are seeing right now, which has many people worried about the fate of this country. We will get into that. Before we do, my friends, we have a great sponsor tonight. It's American Financing. So make sure you head over to american financing.net and my friends, with everything that's happening in the economy, it feels like we're walking on shaky ground. Prices are stuck at really, at a really high level and it seems like nothing is affordable anymore. It's no wonder many are relying on credit cards to cover the gaps. Credit card debt is skyrocketing and it's leaving a lot of people stressed out. If you're a homeowner, you don't have to face the uncertainty alone. Our friends over at American Financing can help you take control. They can help you access the equity in your home to help you pay down the high interest credit card debt, giving you peace of mind and real savings. On average, people just like you are saving 800 bucks a month, plus they may close your loan in as little as 10 days. Don't let the chaos of the economy get the best of you. Call American Financing now. It costs you nothing to get started and you may delay two mortgage payments giving you a cushion in this uncertain time. Call 866-890-7811. That's 866-890-7819. Or visit American financing.net Tim and shout out. Thanks for sponsoring the show. Of course. Make sure you go to cast brew.com and pick some. Pick up some delicious Cast Brew coffee. Appalachian Nights. Maybe you want some low acidity. Ian's graphene Dream, which does really well. But hey, we got a bunch more. We got Luck of the Seamus. We got focus with Mr. Bocus. Pick up, pick it up while you can. And more importantly, at timcast.com you can join our Discord server and why does this matter? The tickets are available for the Culture War live event now. I believe there's only a. There's a. There's only, I think maybe like 15 left. We're about to sell out. It's a small venue, only 60 seats, but you as members of the timcast.com discord. You can get free tickets to our events first come, first serve and submit your debate talking points. Join the show the Culture podcast is the 10th biggest live stream in the country. It averages around 400 to 500,000 views per episode. We want you guys on this. We want you a part of this. We want to give people an opportunity to join that debate and sit alongside people like me or Phil or Alex Stein and many others and debate those issues. We're hoping that we can get this every week for now. The pilot will be May 3rd and for the time being, the plan is once a month with a goal of getting it every single week. If we can secure a proper venue and get that all done, it's going to be really amazing. But don't forget to also smash that like button. Share the show with everyone you know. Joining us tonight to talk about this and so much more is Hannah Cox.

[Hannah Cox]

Good to be with you guys.

[Tim Pool]

Who are you? What do you do?

[Hannah Cox]

My name is Hannah Cox. I am a commentator and a writer and an activist and mostly I spend my days working to move state policy or turn it over if it's bad policy.

[Tim Pool]

Right on. Well, thanks for hanging out. Should be fun. A lot is here straight from the White House.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Good evening, everybody. Elad Eliyahu, White House correspondent here at Tim cast. Ian, what's up? It's nice to see you.

[Ian Crossland]

You too, man. I'm also wearing a suit if you haven't seen this yet. This is what I picked up in Miami while I was down there. Everybody. Ian Crossland up in the house. Good to be here. Good to see you.

[Tim Pool]

Hi, Phil.

[Phil Labonte]

Hello, Ian. A lot, I got to say, as the Israeli correspondent. Very nice selection of Thai color. I am Philip Bondi, the lead singer of the heavy metal band all that Remains. I'm an anti communist and counter revolutionary. Let's go.

[Tim Pool]

Here's a story from NBC News. Democratic lawmakers say they'll travel to El Salvador to push for Kilmar Abrego Garcia's release. Senator Chris Van Hollen, not Halen, said that if the Maryland man, the Maryland man whom the administration acknowledged that we deported mistakenly, wasn't back in the US by midweek, he would travel to El Salvador. My favorite response to this and Cory Booker was, I think it was Will Chamberlain who says no naive bukele has the chance to do the funniest thing ever. And Jack Bosobic responded with, I agree. I think all of the Democrats should go to the El Salvadoran prison. Yes, so it's not just Van Hollen. Also, Cory Booker and others are playing a trip to fly to save the Maryland man. I just can't even. These people are evil. The Democrats are evil. I don't care. If you are concerned about the deportation, that's fine. Just be honest. It is. A man from El Salvador, he had two deportation orders to be returned to El Salvador. He had a temporary stay. Initially, the White House said we were following through the deportation orders and they made a mistake because they, because the filing for my understanding is the filing for the stay is not stored in the same capacity. So they get a big list of people with deportation orders. They go to Portum and go, wait, that guy had a stay. And they went, okay, well, there's nothing we can do about that now. El Salvador's got him. Now what the argument is, I believe Stephen Miller's arguing this. The Alien Enemies act, once this organization was deemed a terrorist organization, supersedes the judges stay and we can remove alien invaders. And the Supreme Court agreed. Trump can remove them. They agreed. No one can force the president to engage in foreign policy actions. But in the event Abreco Garcia is able to be returned to the US Trump must facilitate that. What that means, I don't know. But Democrats have decided to die on this Hill, as it were. And is, is this the, is this the best they got? Is the only issue they have.

[Ian Crossland]

It's a big issue. I don't know if it's the best issue they got. But like, if a president can say, because we're in a state of emergency since 2001, this group of people is a foreign terrorist organization. Now because they have ties to foreign country that we're at war with or that we're going to be at war, then they can just deport them because they're a terrorist. Because they said they were a terrorist.

[Phil Labonte]

It doesn't really reflect what happened, did it?

[Ian Crossland]

He said, am I Ms. 13 is a terrorist organization, then that was their grounds to throw out a guy who had to stay.

[Tim Pool]

Thank you, Ian. Let me take you home on this one. So I appreciate your response. I think you're actually referring to the NDAA 2012 indefinite indefinite detention provision that was signed into law by Barack Obama, which stated exactly as you said, that if someone was part of Al Qaeda involved in September 11 or an enemy and waging war against the United States, they could be indefinitely renditioned in black sites anywhere in the world. So they, if they wanted it, I believe that got repealed in 2020, 24. So only last year. Now, back to the main story. We're talking about where a guy who had a deportation order was deported. You were saying, oh, the guy that.

[Ian Crossland]

Had to stay on his deportation order was deported.

[Tim Pool]

The guy with two deportation orders who was here illegally and a member of a criminal gang, Ms. 13, who was deported mistakenly, is in the custody of his own country, for which he committed crimes, is now in his own prison. And we have no authority to get him out of that prison. So. Yes.

[Ian Crossland]

So what are you going to say, Phil?

[Phil Labonte]

Well, I just thought that was my understanding. The guy that we were talking about was an illegal. Illegal alien. So the fact that he's deported is perfectly consistent with the law. Well, if you being him, being that he was associated with MS.13, that's why Trump calls him a terrorist. But that's kind of notwithstanding the fact that he's here illegally.

[Tim Pool]

Right.

[Phil Labonte]

If he's an illegal alien and he's not, you know, he's come here illegally, whatever the context, ship him home.

[Ian Crossland]

If he has a stay on his deportation, you got to wait.

[Phil Labonte]

Why?

[Ian Crossland]

Because there's a stay on his deportation.

[Tim Pool]

But what is there. Is there a context in which something may supersede a stay from a judge?

[Ian Crossland]

Always war.

[Hannah Cox]

But they'd have to prove that there.

[Tim Pool]

Had been a crime or a terrorist designation under the Alien Enemies act, for which the Supreme Court ruled that he does have the authority to deport people under potentially.

[Hannah Cox]

Here's my issue with it, though. Deportation is one thing, but they didn't just deport him. They sent him to a prison with no due process, where I assume he's not going to have a trial there either, correct?

[Tim Pool]

Oh, that's a matter for a foreign country. I mean, we're not going to invade China and try and force China to. Really.

[Hannah Cox]

Why are we putting people in prison? Why can't we just. El Salvador did so they're charging him with crimes.

[Tim Pool]

In El Salvador, if you are a member of Ms. 13, you will. You go to jail. It's a crime. And that. That's how naive started. He started rounding up all the gang members. They made it illegal and they started throwing everybody in prison. The criticism there was that innocent people were getting wrapped up in it, but that's a matter for a foreign country. Now, I do think there's concerns over when we deport people and we can. What El Salvador does after the fact is of concern. But at the same time, the question as it pertains to this is an El Salvador, a Salvadoran man is in a Salvadoran jail. For crimes in El Salvador. Next question. I guess so the concern there is if we are just deporting anybody because we can deport them and Trump is sending to El Salvador and then El Salvador is putting in prison. There's a chain there where I have concerns with it.

[Hannah Cox]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

The challenge of course, however, is the due process afforded to illegal immigrants in this country is are you here legally or not? No. Then you leave. The Supreme Court ruled that he, these people are all entitled to habeas hearings justifying whether or not they are to be held. That's the point. Okay. Are you here illegally? You are. Then we can deport you if El Salvador after the fact imprisons them. The challenge then is the foreign policy action between the US And El Salvador, not due process in the United States for which that's negotiating power between Trump and El Salvador. So I do have concerns over if people. Here's the, here's the challenge. I suppose conservatives are going to say we don't care. You came to this country illegally, that's your problem. And I believe Jack Posobic mentioned that it was a deterrent. You come to this country illegally, maybe you'll be on the plane to El Salvador. I'm not a fan of making examples of people like that in this specific capacity. The man who was here did have a stay. If it is true, as they initially argued, that he was mistakenly deported because he, I believe he had two removal orders and no asylum, the question then becomes how do you have a stand deportation without being granted asylum? What is the cause by which a judge can grant an indefinite stay on deportation? I'd argue that's unconstitutional. The a judge doesn't have the authority to give de facto citizenship to an illegal immigrant here illegally with deportation orders. So what we're actually dealing with is a constitutional crisis by which the judiciary de facto is tried to give an individual citizenship or second class citizenship, which to me is alarming. And then the only real argument becomes we was Trump acting in a heavy handed manner by sending back to El Salvador where El Salvador is going to put him in prison?

[Phil Labonte]

I don't think that they're what like you said, what El Salvador does with any of the people that go back to El Salvador, that's their, that's their problem. That's a domestic issue for that country. The United States has millions of illegal immigrants that have come in that had come in the previous four years during the Obama or during the Biden administration. President Biden himself said we want to see a surge, we want to see People surge the border for if you're seeking asylum. The administration allowed all kinds of breaking of the rules when it comes to the asylum claims. You shouldn't come to the United States through South America if you're looking for asylum because Mexico is safe and there are multiple countries that these people stop that could have stopped in. So right off the bat it's breaking the law. The idea that we have to give all these, everybody that's here that claimed asylum a hearing, I reject that because they came here under, under false pretenses by an illegal method. They're supposed to come to ports of entry and they didn't. They would just cross the border and then DHS would pick them up or the border patrol would pick them up. If they didn't come here and go to an actual port of entry, if they got picked up, beat it. I don't care. They don't, they don't all get, they.

[Hannah Cox]

Shouldn'T all get actual asylum seekers. And that hurts the actual people in line.

[Phil Labonte]

It does, but it. But that it does. But the lawlessness prior to that hurts America more. So there be times where we will send people that are actually seeking asylum away when they may have, had they gone through the actual proper channels when they would have got been granted asylum. But because they didn't see you later.

[Hannah Cox]

I'm with you up until a point. Like, and with him being from El Salvador, I think that makes this case less of a like huge deal because we are sending him back to a country where he's from. But if we're sending people who are not from that country back to this country to be put in prison indefinitely.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Hannah Cox]

Versus just simply deporting them. That's where my issue.

[Phil Labonte]

I have no idea where they go to. They just need to go back to their country of Oregon. US not saying that we should send them to El Salvador. So send them to wherever they're from.

[Tim Pool]

The issue is Venezuela has refused to take back criminal gang members from Venezuela. So trend, trend. Aragua for instance. So Trump said then we'll send them to El Salvador. They're not Americans. The due process they get is an immigration court habeas hearing. Are you here legally or not? Can we hold you? We can.

[Hannah Cox]

Deportation and see I guess my concern around that is where is the proof that they are terrorists? Where is the proof that they have actually committed crimes? And if they have, then send them. I don't care. Right. But there has to be some kind of due process in place to make sure that we're not falsely identifying People, you've got this tattoo.

[Tim Pool]

Due process.

[Hannah Cox]

Due process would be actual evidence, fact finding, presenting evidence before I judge sources.

[Tim Pool]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. What's, what's for. For what reason do we want that kind of hearing?

[Hannah Cox]

Because we don't want to put innocent people in jail indefinitely with no hope of ever getting.

[Tim Pool]

We are not El Salvador is.

[Hannah Cox]

But we're paying El Salvador to run these prisons. So by proxy we are.

[Tim Pool]

And so the, the, the, the question at hand, I suppose is right. There is a challenge in that this is our foreign policy action. This is what Trump expects to happen. But it is, it's this, it's this nebulous circumstance where Trump says they're not Americans, so they got to go. And if they can't go home because Venezuela won't take them, El Salvador will. Where do we send them if they won't be returned to? If the Venezuela will not accept these, these deportations?

[Phil Labonte]

I'm fine with Gitmo. I'm perfectly fine with Gitmo.

[Tim Pool]

Would Toronto Bay costs a lot of money for the American taxpayer and is limited in space.

[Phil Labonte]

Fair enough.

[Tim Pool]

But so this. So first they get their due process. And the due process is literally the habeas hearing in which you are a citizen or not. Are you, are you eligible? No. Okay. So we've determined that these people have removal orders. That's the basis by which Trump went to go about deporting these individuals. They had orders for removal. If we can't send them back to Venezuela, where do we send them?

[Hannah Cox]

Send them anywhere else into the Mexico, send the can. I mean get them out of our country. But do they have to go to a prison if else. It just feels very shaky to me.

[Tim Pool]

Do you think El Salvador wants to accept criminals from Venezuela freely to walk about their streets?

[Hannah Cox]

I think they want to accept our dollars and we'll do whatever we tell them to.

[Tim Pool]

Do you think El Salvador will accept criminals from Venezuela, like Trend Aragua, under the agreement that they allow them to.

[Hannah Cox]

Freely move about El Salvador to be criminals? And that's my whole point. If they are actually proven to be gang members or criminals here, I don't care if we send them to a prison in El Salvador, like, my issues go away entirely. My concern is that we are saying this guy was loosely affiliated with this gang allegedly. And we have no concrete proof of that. And then that person ends up in a jail and they have no hope to ever get out. I mean, that's dystopian.

[Tim Pool]

So it sounds like you would be okay With Trump deporting all these people to El Salvador, if El Salvador had a criminal here and determined they were their gang members or not, probably, yeah, I would. I would accept those terms.

[Hannah Cox]

Much more comfortable.

[Tim Pool]

So, I mean, then, Then, then the onus is off of the United States. You're here illegally. We can't send you home. We send you to El Salvador. El Salvador. Let's have a hearing, determine whether or not they're Ms. 13 or any other criminal gang, and then you decide through, like, you know, with. With a proper hearing.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I think it's important to note that I think this was the most questionable case that they found. And overwhelmingly, all of the case, all of the. Most of the people that were sent to El Salvador were like, very obviously trend gangsters. Stephen Miller said he had evidence, and I agree with you that I believe he should release it. The politics of this, I think, is very funny because I think what's happening on the Democrat side is that they're dropping this Muhammad guy because I guess it wasn't sympathetic. Mahmoud. I'm sorry, Khalil. They're dropping that guy. Completely wasn't sympathetic enough. And now you see, you know, all these senators. What was his name again? The senator from New Jersey?

[Tim Pool]

Holland. Oh, no. Cory Booker.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Cory Booker, who I believe is auditioning for a 2028 run. And this is the issue that they're really choosing to run on, defending these trend Aragua gangsters. But I think we should feel good knowing that we're in good hands with Stephen Miller, because I think Stephen Miller is so singularly focused in a good way, and there's somebody in the Trump administration that we know we could trust to the fullest that will do a good job.

[Tim Pool]

I have just said he.

[Ian Crossland]

He said he had evidence and didn't release it. But why would you trust him?

[Elad Eliyahu]

There's a lot of evidence that the government can't release. He was here illegally to begin with, and I think all of them should be deported. Yeah. And so there is. And I think the thing about that Stephen Miller said, too, was that there was evidence of him being a terrorist. And that superseded the stay that the judge has.

[Tim Pool]

The American. The American Enemies act supersedes. When that declaration was made, it supersedes the stay. And, and I want to stress this point. He was not granted asylum. He was denied asylum. Okay. Abrego Garcia was denied asylum. He did not apply for asylum until way later on when he decided he wanted to stay. He entered illegally. Two different courts, a lower court and appellate court, determined he was. He was a member of Ms. 13. By what constitutional grounds can a judge give de facto citizenship to an individual? That is that. That is. That is.

[Ian Crossland]

Do you know what the judge's explanation was?

[Tim Pool]

Deportation over fears that if he was returned to El Salvador, he could be killed. So on what grounds can a judge say, we are not going to finalize the adjudication, we will just put a temporary stay indefinitely to allow you to live and work in the United States as if you were a citizen. That is unconstitutional. As far as I'm. That makes no sense.

[Hannah Cox]

If that's all true, why didn't he meet the conditions to get asylum?

[Tim Pool]

Because he didn't apply when he got here.

[Hannah Cox]

He just didn't try because he got.

[Tim Pool]

The stay because he was here illegally. And I believe the. The DOJ has accused him of working with Ms. 13 and human trafficking. And so the argument they've made is that he was here doing illicit deeds and never applied for asylum because he wasn't here seeking asylum. He was here trafficking human beings. And only after a certain amount of time did he actually apply to which he was denied because he did not properly go about the law to seek asylum.

[Hannah Cox]

Got it.

[Tim Pool]

But my concern is again, a judge just rubber stamping, you can stay here forever.

[Hannah Cox]

It's a weird case.

[Tim Pool]

You can't do that.

[Hannah Cox]

Yeah, I think, I don't think. I mean, maybe the most hardcore leftists are arguing this. I looked into the case earlier today. It's a weird case. It's got a lot of weird factors on it.

[Tim Pool]

I have a question for you because I do agree we have concerns over due process and I do have concerns over an innocent person getting wrapped up in a deportation to a Salvadoran prison. Here's the issue though, and this is. And this is where we try to find an answer. During the Biden administration, we saw probably the largest influx of illegal immigrants in the United States. They say that it rivals some of the largest mass to mass migrations in human history.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

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[Tim Pool]

When these people were allowed to come in, the Biden administration took dubious asylum requests and then immediately dropped them, creating de facto second class citizens who are not subject to deportation. But we're not here legally by any means. When Trump tries to deport them, he's barred by, by judges. He is blocked every which way. If Democrats are able to make the largest human migration in history, and when the people vote to stop it, are barred from stopping it, how do we solve for this problem? What do we do?

[Hannah Cox]

Ideally, Congress would take some action, but I think that's a pipe dream, right.

[Phil Labonte]

President, do you think run right over.

[Tim Pool]

Okay. Can Congress overrule habeas could.

[Hannah Cox]

I think they could absolutely pass legislation that would overturn that procedure that they put in place. Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

20 million. Let's, let's, let's do the low estimate. 10 million people are here illegally from Joe Biden. Trump wants to get him out. Supreme Court ruled. All of them have to have a habeas hearing. That's, that's impossible. Trump will never be able to deport these people. How do we rectify the criminal actions of the Biden administration? And how do we do that?

[Phil Labonte]

Same way Lincoln would have run right over the judiciary.

[Tim Pool]

I'm serious. Well, Lincoln threatened to arrest a Supreme Court justice.

[Phil Labonte]

Well, I mean, I wouldn't say I.

[Hannah Cox]

Believe the chief, but Lincoln was never held back by the Constitution.

[Phil Labonte]

Not at all.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Not at all.

[Phil Labonte]

And to be honest with you, look, when you have a lawless administration, administration, and then the people vote, this is not, this is not a 50, 50 issue. This is a 70, 30, 80, 20 issue. The American people want the illegal aliens that came here during the Biden administration. They want them sent home. This is not something that is. Well, just by a little bit, he kind of won. This is one of the many 80, 20 issues that the president is on the right side of. So if the president, if the judiciary is in the way, then in my opinion, the executive should run straight over the judiciary. I think, I don't care. There's the the the previous executive ran roughshod over the law in just the same fashion. And this is, this is something, again, the American people want that fixes a problem created by the previous administration. I don't care.

[Tim Pool]

Real quick, just for the Just for posterity, here's a tweet from Billy Baldwin saying where was it proven that Kilmar Armando Abrego Garcia is a member of Ms. 13? Well, thanks to X, literally everybody just spam blasted him with all the documents while liberals claimed he wasn't. So you have Viva Fry, of course, with this document says after considering information provided by both parties, the court concluded that no bond was appropriate in this matter. The court first reasoned that the respondent failed to meet his burden of demonstrating that his release from custody would not pose a danger to others. As the evidence shows he is a verified member of MS.13. They then go on to cite court reference I believe three, or it looks like two. The BIA has held that absent any indication that the information there is incorrect or the result of coercion or duress, Form I 213 is inherently trustworthy. Trustworthy and admissible. There were not just two rulings, a lower court and appellate court, but subsequent courts that used that justification that he was a member of Ms. 13. In fact, I believe the only reason they dropped the charges against him is because they don't want to force an extradition from El Salvador. And I believe it is absolutely fair to say Donald Trump could bully, and I mean bully in the lightest sense. He could go to Naya Bukele and say, look, I want you to release the guy. It's a political problem for us. We'll take him back. And Nay would say, you got it. But I do think Trump's looking at it. It's more like an 8020 thing. And that yes, Trump could do that. It's going to make naive be like, yo me a favor. Like, okay, fine, but this makes me look bad. I'm going to want something in return. Like he would abide by Trump. Come on. Nobody, anybody arguing that he wouldn't listen to Trump if Trump made the request is being silly. That being said, I don't think that Trump wants to even, even nudge Naya Bukele in such a way and say, no, no, no, no. He's ms.13 guy. He's your citizen. We can't do that.

[Ian Crossland]

He doesn't want to admit that he made a mistake. If he actually did. He doesn't want to admit it looked like he did.

[Tim Pool]

I take that back I take it back. Imagine you're Naya Bukele. Donald Trump comes to you and says, for political reasons, I want you to hand over one of your citizens to me. Naya Bukele has no choice but say, I can't do that. Imagine if, if Iran or South Africa told the United States, Ian Crossland will be delivered to us now. The US Would be like, absolutely not. So I think even with their relationship, it's a rock and a hard place for Naya Bukele to be like Trump. I can't do that. I can't turn over a Salvadoran citizen to the United States.

[Hannah Cox]

Just the precedent that it would set.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah. That the US can come and just say, you will give your citizen to me.

[Ian Crossland]

If it was just a citizen that never been to the States for sure. But since it was an American living in the United States sent there, there's nuance in potential of a.

[Tim Pool]

It was what?

[Ian Crossland]

Because this guy was. I said he was an American boy. I met him was. He was living in the United States illegally. Yeah. When it was sent. So there's this.

[Elad Eliyahu]

An El Salvador situation, as opposed to.

[Ian Crossland]

El Salvador picking somebody off the street of El Salvador and being like, send them to America.

[Tim Pool]

But regardless, the precedent is a slippery sl afloat to ask a foreign leader to turn over any citizen.

[Ian Crossland]

I think we're setting up a lot of precedent right now, like you mentioned, Phil, like, this is the President. You said that he should steamroll the judiciary and that then someone brought up Abraham Lincoln arresting or threatening to arrest a Supreme Court justice, which kind of falls under the definition of steamrolling the judiciary. Use the threat of force against all of the judicial. Just ignoring them as different things.

[Phil Labonte]

Don't put my words in my mouth.

[Ian Crossland]

Steamroll the judiciary. What do you mean?

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, I meant. So when I said steamroll, I mean ignore them. I'm not saying that we should arrest judiciary. Don't make it out like I'm saying we should.

[Tim Pool]

But.

[Phil Labonte]

But throw them in jail.

[Tim Pool]

Why not? Because.

[Phil Labonte]

Because there's no reason. Because the judiciary has no enforcement. Indeed, it's the one of the handful. Like the entire executive branch. Every single part of the executive branch has an enforcement arm. That means men with guns. The judiciary has no enforcement.

[Ian Crossland]

But the judiciary's enforcement arm is supposed to be the executive branch.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah. And sometimes the judiciary makes mistakes. Or sometimes like, like now we have a politically motivated portion of the judiciary that is making decisions that have. That are upholding illegal behaviors of a previous administration. And again, this is not something where the American people are really split 50, 50 on. Oh, that's an 80, 20 situation.

[Hannah Cox]

My issue with what you said, though, the American people have been so wrong on issues in the past. Like, we cannot say override checks and balances, override the judiciary, because the American people think this is a popular thing to now we.

[Tim Pool]

Absolutely.

[Phil Labonte]

I'm comfortable.

[Tim Pool]

Risk. Absolutely should.

[Phil Labonte]

Hannah. I'm comfortable.

[Tim Pool]

Absolutely should.

[Hannah Cox]

Whatever puts that cat back in the bag the next time. The.

[Tim Pool]

What do you mean back in the bag?

[Phil Labonte]

It's not like this is you, like never. It's not unprecedented.

[Tim Pool]

What do you do if the cat's already out of the bag?

[Hannah Cox]

I think Congress needs to step up. I mean, I'm going to keep going back to this. I understand that they have been completely neutered, but that is what's supposed to be happening right now.

[Phil Labonte]

What do you do?

[Tim Pool]

Let's, let's, let's just be reasonable. You know, 10 years ago, I would have been saying the exact same thing that you did. And then they tried to arrest Donald Trump on false charges. They created a new law so that Trump could be charged, could be falsely accused of rape. They arrested his lawyers in numerous states and they started going after basically anybody who was supporting him in any fashion. I mean, they literally put, they leaked information to put some of his cohorts in prison. His associates were threatened with prison time. So the cat's been out of the bag for a long time. Congress is completely dysfunctional and can barely pass a budget. They just jam CRS through every week. And even after Matt Gaetz goes to war over continuing resolutions, they still do it. Congress is never going to, going to get anything done. And it's, and it's split down the middle. The judiciary is running roughshod over the executive branch right now with more universal injunctions than any that. I think I could be wrong, but I believe Donald Trump has more universal injunctions with their, which are unconstitutional, by the way, than any other president in this short a time frame. I believe that Trump's first and second administrations already have over one third of all universal injunctions ever issued. The judiciary is acting outside the confines of the Constitution by engaging in rulings that go beyond the scope of their, of their court cases and those present. This has been widely accepted. We have, we have two choices. Donald Trump can say the judiciary can do and say whatever, whatever they want, or he can say at this point, they are acting unconstitutionally and I must uphold my oath to the executive branch of the Constitution to ignore unconstitutional orders. Here's a question I have for you, if a district court judge in Guam ordered Donald Trump to shoot a man in the head, should he do it?

[Hannah Cox]

Absolutely not.

[Tim Pool]

Why not?

[Hannah Cox]

Because it is unethical and morally wrong.

[Tim Pool]

Just moral. There's no legal issues.

[Hannah Cox]

There's obviously legal issues.

[Tim Pool]

It's illegal, right?

[Hannah Cox]

Obviously.

[Tim Pool]

So if a judge orders Trump to do something illegal, he should refuse.

[Hannah Cox]

Yes.

[Tim Pool]

And that's where we are right now, with all the district courts. Universal injunctions defy the Constitution and have sparsely been challenged. The way the courts are supposed to work is that if a party comes and says, I am aggrieved, then the judge can issue relief to the party. Instead, what's been happening is district courts have been issuing universal rulings decreeing laws over the United States based on a single individual's complaint. Completely unconstitutional. Donald Trump's only recourse is to say there's a rogue judiciary that must be defied.

[Hannah Cox]

To what extent, though?

[Tim Pool]

Because ask the judiciary why they're violating the Constitution. Well, I think that.

[Hannah Cox]

I'm not going to argue with you about the judiciary being problematic. I spent four years doing criminal justice reform in this country. Like, absolutely. There are so many problems with their justice system, it will turn your hair. But the issue is, at the end of the day, if we keep going down this pathway, we end up with an executive that has pretty much unilateral power, because, again, Congress has neutered itself and is not going to take any action. And my concern is what comes next, because the ante will just keep rising and rising and rising. And we saw what they tried to do during COVID We saw how close they were to getting away with the vast majority of it. If we do not have a court system that's able to check some of those things and everybody disregards the laws that they don't agree with or that they think are wrong, where we end up is a very scary place.

[Tim Pool]

Do you think that if Democrats were restored to power, they would never again do a lockdown like they did in 2021?

[Hannah Cox]

I think they'd absolutely try to do it again.

[Tim Pool]

Don't get me wrong. Full disclosure. Trump is the one who initiated that. Two weeks of slow spread. That being said, Republic Red States quickly turned around and started reopening. Florida became a vacation destination for Democratic politicians like aoc. So here's what I think. If Donald Trump had lost, Democrats would be gearing up for the next lockdown, whatever it may be, climate lockdown or otherwise. The FDA under Joe Biden, his, his, his holdovers fast tracked new MRNA vaccines for Bird flu. And there was recently a falling out. I think RFK Jr is not too happy about it. I would just say if we were to right now go, guys, guys, the escalation is getting out of hand. Let's stop right now. Do you know what would happen? What do you think would happen?

[Hannah Cox]

I mean, I assume you think they would keep going and they probably would, but is the answer where do we end up? Do we end up in a civil war? Where do we end up if this keeps going?

[Phil Labonte]

Because you're talking. I mean, really, we're familiar with that phrase around here. Drink chat.

[Hannah Cox]

I mean, seriously, I just, I'll tell you where.

[Tim Pool]

Let's jump to this story from time. Can a US Citizen be deported? Trump's comments raise legal alarms. So Trump said it quite a bit, to be completely honest. He said he wants to send the worst of the worst to El Salvador. He said, quote, we have also have homegrown criminals that push people into subways that hit elderly ladies in the back of that with baseball bat when they're not looking. They are absolute monsters. Trump told reporters inside the Oval Office. I'd like to include them in the group of people to get them out of the country. This is where we are going and this is worrying. I did a poll on X and I asked, should the U.S. should U.S. criminals be housed in foreign prisons? And it was dead 5050.

[Ian Crossland]

I saw that.

[Tim Pool]

50, 50. And there are a ton of staunch MAGA people being like, no, absolutely not. That's a line we can't cross. And there are a lot of others saying the cat is already out of the bag. The actions that were taken against Trump and Trump supporters, the J6ers have shown that there's an unscrupulous enemy that seeks to destroy you in the worst imaginable ways, not to mention the moral shortcomings that we've been fighting against, like sterilizing children. This is the split that is already happening and it is terrifying because unfortunately, I don't see a. I don't see an answer for this country. The only thing we can hope for is that Trump has amassed such power with the popular vote win and, and in this year, with the termination of USAID and these and Department of Education and the slush fund from the Department of, I believe it was the Department of Energy getting rid of these resources used by Democrats to get uni party. And it's not. It wasn't just Democrats 20 years ago, but it is largely now. There's still some Republicans there that are uniparty but gutting the deep state's resource mechanism in their and their, you know, cyclical resource machine. They may not be able to wage any meaningful war and this may be the end of the conflict. Meaning the escalation might die down because Trump won. And I'm hoping that's the case. But considering we are still seeing Democrats rallying. They're arguing, I see online when you follow this stuff that April 19th will be the biggest protest we've seen. This is what they're arguing. The left is saying the 19th will be the biggest protest across the country we've seen since like the Iraq war.

[Hannah Cox]

What, what are they?

[Tim Pool]

President Trump, just in general one. And they're. I don't know, but they're using this story as their launching point saying Trump disappeared a Maryland father who was legally in the country to a foreign gulag. That's the narrative they're rolling with. And I am not being cute. Go on Reddit, read what the default news page is saying about this. That is what they are saying.

[Ian Crossland]

Well, this guy, he's given them ammo. I mean, Trump says he wants to take American citizens that are violent criminals and deport them to foreign prison. That's how you just said that out loud. This is our commander in chief saying that he wants to.

[Tim Pool]

I got a question for you insane. If you were sentenced to death and then they came to you and said, or you can go to El Salvador, which would you choose? I'd go to El Salvador.

[Ian Crossland]

Well, it depends.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I'm saying what's the choice?

[Ian Crossland]

Is it go to or go to a mega super prison in El Salvador?

[Elad Eliyahu]

These El Salvador prisons strike me as cruel and unusual punishment for US Citizens. I think if you're the worst of the worst in our country, you're better off getting capital punishment. I want to give you capital punishment here before I'm sending you off to some El Salvadorian prison with 50 beds in one room and your going to live there for the rest of your life. I'd rather not send.

[Hannah Cox]

I feel like that runs the justice system gets it wrong all the time. It politically persecutes people and they put people in jail incorrectly all the time here, even with due process. So to then say we're going to ship these people off to this kind of prison with these kinds of savages is, I think beyond the pale.

[Elad Eliyahu]

How bad of a margin of error does it need to be? Is it just one person?

[Tim Pool]

One person?

[Elad Eliyahu]

One person will make it so.

[Hannah Cox]

I'd rather, I'd always rather err on the side of letting 100.

[Elad Eliyahu]

There's unfortunately, I don't think we'd be able to get anything done in our country.

[Tim Pool]

Don't worry.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Didn't.

[Hannah Cox]

We are nowhere close to that line. Like that's my line. But we are nowhere close to it. We get.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I mean, I feel like it almost projects onto the gun. Almost projects onto the earlier story about sending the gangsters, the trend Aragua gangsters back to El Salvador because it's like worst case scenario, they they wrongfully sent an illegal migrant back. But 99 plus percent of the people who they did deport to this El Salvadorian prison were trend Aragua gangsters. And if that means we have to occasionally send one or two illegally illegal migrants incorrectly there too, or we can't send any to begin with, you won't be able to get any policy done. Because in our country, we will always get policy. You know, it's always going to fail. I feel like at some point I.

[Hannah Cox]

Do think that people who are here illegally should have due process in the habeas corpus. My line is not as stringent for them. If you get deported and if you get deported in this country for being here illegally and you are given due process and are found to be guilty and let's say you're innocent and you get deported, that's no longer really our fault. That that burden's not on us because.

[Elad Eliyahu]

There'S a margin of error, even due process isn't there, even if they do go through all of the courts.

[Hannah Cox]

That's what I'm saying. I'm saying that my line is more for citizens when I say that we should not be.

[Tim Pool]

But I also think she's saying that the line is for due process. Right. When you say, like, how many people is too many if one person is wrongly sent to a guru, like it's cruel and usual punishment, that's a violation of the eighth Amendment. That's why I say no to Trump doing.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Even if we have due process, people will still be wrongfully convicted.

[Tim Pool]

Indeed. But they'll go to American prisons with the right of appeal and, and certain safeguards and protections and human rights protections.

[Elad Eliyahu]

We shouldn't be off like offshoring our prison and crime problem in our country. Again, if Trump's talking about the worst of the worst, we should bring back some capital punishment and clear some regulation about having to inject them. Oddly.

[Tim Pool]

But I think that liberalism follow libertarianism is largely what we refer to as liberalism, but the terms have been, you know, bastardized over a long period of time. Classical liberalism today Is basically modern libertarians. I think this is a cute concept that really only exists in times of peace, because as much as the founding fathers very much entertained enlightenment principles and classical liberalism, then it mean nothing. When the revolutionary war started.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, yeah, Ben Franklin spoke as if they were at peace his entire life. He acted as if it had already worked out. And that was his. That's. That's how I try to live in a lot of ways. And it looks stupid in the middle of the heat because you're like, yo, bro, put the fires out.

[Tim Pool]

And I think when the fires are.

[Ian Crossland]

Out, things are going to be.

[Tim Pool]

I think the important thing to understand is that the revolutionary war wasn't declared. British troops came to Massachusetts and said, turn over your guns. And the men at Lexington and Concord said, yeah, right, we're not listening to you, dude. And nobody knows who fired the first shot, they say, but the war started, and it wasn't until 13 months later they signed the declaration of independence. They didn't want war. War happened. And so people have this in. In similar things for basically every war. People act like war is a thing where two sides look at each other and they're like, we're gonna fight, aren't we? All right, all in favor of war. Charge. When in reality, something happens.

[Phil Labonte]

Right. Nobody thought that the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand was going to bring the entire world into the most bloody conflict in human history.

[Tim Pool]

But he doesn't even know why they're. My point, ultimately, is this. When you argue things like, we can't do this because the executive has too much authority, I'd like to just imagine a scenario where you have two factions vying for control of a single system. One side says, by any means necessary, and that's a quote. The other side says, we can't because it would be wrong. Which side wins?

[Hannah Cox]

I mean, traditionally, throughout history, of course, the evil people win. I think America has stood out because we did. And yes, you're right. Like, did we compromise our principles at times? Did the founders sell out as soon as one of them became president? Did they abandoned many of the things that they'd said. Yes, of course, our corrupts people, absolutely. But what has made America different is that we have had a higher set of ideals that we have tried to live up to and that we have gotten closer to over time. And I think my concern right now is that on the right that's being abandoned, and not even just abandoned, but mocked, you know, silly.

[Tim Pool]

For trying. I reject that, actually. I think it was abandoned by the Democrats first. And the rights reacting.

[Hannah Cox]

Well, I don't think the Democrats were ever holding themselves to those ideals. Right. It's always been the conservative ideology, libertarian conservatism, that was striving towards those end goals.

[Tim Pool]

I completely disagree.

[Hannah Cox]

You really think the George W. Bush.

[Tim Pool]

In Iraq and Afghanistan.

[Hannah Cox]

I'm talking long before that, that you think the left has ever been striving? I mean, under what administration?

[Tim Pool]

Right now I said Democrat. Right. So obviously the left is a bunch of crackpot lunatics. The Democratic Party over the. So the Republicans, the Democrats have largely been a unit party marching in lockstep with the DC legal machine, funding their fake politicians. Donald Trump wasn't supposed to win, and then he did, and now you've got a populist uprising. Bernie Sanders wasn't supposed to win and they stopped him.

[Phil Labonte]

Well, you think that that's just to clarify. You're talking about like post World War II, right?

[Tim Pool]

Yes.

[Phil Labonte]

Okay. Just making sure.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah. Post World War II, the liberal economic order basically just took the world over. They said, we won the Great War, we have jurisdiction over anything. And they built the International Monetary Fund, the World bank, bank of International Settlements, the Swift Payment System, Israel Ian knows quite a bit about. And these are things by which they can put nations in debt to, then say it's effectively like, kneel before me and I will make you rich. And some countries say no. What we have now is if the argument is which side is upholding itself to the Constitution, it's the right. Even to this day, Donald Trump has been slammed with all of these universal injunctions and he keeps listening to them. And then in one instance, this instance with El Salvador, he says, it's an El Salvadoran man in Salvadoran custody. I'm not going to get him back. They lose their minds. Or McIntyre says, the side that wants to win will always defeat the side that wants to be left alone. And so right now, what are we looking at? Donald Trump ran for office. He announced it in 2015. They immediately lied in every which way about him to make him look like he was a far right white supremacist evil guy, despite the fact that he was a beloved celebrity by all of his people, including Oprah. And when he got in office, they accused him of treason, argued that he was a spy for a foreign enemy, and they launched investigation for investigation against him and hamstrung him for the first, basically the entire time. And it was only after he won, actually, he wasn't even the midterms. It was. It took a couple years for the Mueller report. It was only when he brought in Bill Barr did it actually get shut down. And he actually had some versatility in his, in his first term, but he was, he was locked up the whole time. Then you get in the second, in Joe Biden's first term, they falsely accuse him of crimes, they falsely accuse him of fraud, they try to put him in jail, they raid his home, they raid his child's home. They arrested his lawyer, more than one. But Jenna Ellis, all she did was draft a letter at the behest of Donald Trump to challenge a, an election proceeding, which anyone in this country has a right to do. So they charged her with two counts of rico, to which she bawled her eyes out on TV and pleaded guilty to which she shouldn't have done. And they went after several of other laws, completely unconstitutional actions, complete lies and manipulation. And Trump rolled with all of it and didn't defy any of it. And I'd been saying the whole time, Trump should go to Florida and go to his, Go to Mar a Lago and say, come and get me. I refuse to answer to these false charges. And put, put it on Ron DeSantis. Determine whether or not Ron would allow federal authorities to come and arrest the front runner for the Republican Party. Trump wins. And they are still playing this game. If Donald Trump were to stop now and say, you know, I don't want to, whatever the courts say I'll do it is over. The deep state wins. This country falls. Right now, we have 677 district court judges that are acting unconstitutionally and issuing illegal orders. One, they ruled that Trump as commander in chief, cannot determine who serves in the military. In this order, they issued universally, anyone can enlist, including bipolar paraplegics. That, that, that, that's nuts. This is an insane ruling that's completely unconstitutional. They tried to do it anyway. Trump's only course of action at this point is to say, okay, that's an illegal ruling, and we ignore it. Because if they were, if it was overt and not in the minutiae like we order Trump to steal a car, he'd say, yeah, I'm not going to do that. That's a criminal offense in this regard. Ordering the commander in chief to engage in foreign policy actions unconstitutional. Ordering him to allow individuals suffering from DSM 5 mental disorders to serve in the armed forces. In the armed forces, unconstitutional. If Trump were to obey unconstitutional universal orders by which they have no authority to issue, he would be in violation of the Constitution. So, in fact, I argue for Trump to uphold the Constitution. He has A sworn duty to defy the courts right now.

[Phil Labonte]

I mean, I got no problem with it. I'm saying just ignore them.

[Ian Crossland]

It would be like upholding aspects of the Constitution. Because I don't think there's a perfect solution if you're going to be like, okay, I'll uphold the aspect of the Constitution that says the judiciary can tell me no, then that's a problem. But you uphold the other aspects of it which say the executive has the authority.

[Phil Labonte]

But like Tim was saying, universal injunctions are actually an innovation that the framers never intended.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

With the Internet. It's weird how much access a Georgian local.

[Phil Labonte]

No, no, no. Not, not judge has. Not with the.

[Ian Crossland]

In real time also.

[Phil Labonte]

No, not with the Internet. It started, it started in the 60s.

[Tim Pool]

Well, there were a few way before then.

[Phil Labonte]

Pardon me.

[Tim Pool]

There were a few in the early 1900s.

[Phil Labonte]

Very few. But they weren't. But they weren't. I don't think they were. They were nationwide. Were there?

[Tim Pool]

Yes. Really?

[Phil Labonte]

Okay. Well, the whole, the whole federal, the whole FDR administration, when he did completely and totally things that were obviously unconstitutional that went to the Supreme Court, the Supreme Court did find any concert unconstitutional. There were no universal injunctions nationwide. Injunctions by just a district court. It's a whole. It's a wholly created idea. There's nothing in the Constitution that says one court can stop the president from acting specifically for. When it comes to foreign policy. Definitely. There's nothing that gives.

[Tim Pool]

Wow. Court.

[Phil Labonte]

That power. What's that?

[Tim Pool]

So from 2000, I just, I've pulled it up just from 2000. George W. Bush had six, of which half of them were issued by the opposing party. Obama had 12, of which 58% were by the opposing party. Donald Trump had 64 in his first term only of which 92% were issued by the opposing party. Judges appointed by the opposing party. Biden had 14. All of them were issued by Republican appointed judges. And let me get, let me get 2025 numbers.

[Phil Labonte]

Ignore them all. It's all political.

[Tim Pool]

As of 2025, Donald Trump has. In a second term, he's been. There have been 17 universal injunctions against Donald Trump.

[Phil Labonte]

Ignore that is last one of them.

[Tim Pool]

That is in three months, Donald Trump has had just about as many injunctions as Joe Biden did in four years. And that's three times as many as George W. Bush had and almost three times as many as. I'm sorry, one and a half times as many as Barack Obama for his entirety. If the 09 to 2017, if the.

[Phil Labonte]

Judiciary expects the executive or the American people to take them seriously, then they need to behave as impartial, as an impartial judiciary and not as a political army, period.

[Tim Pool]

Let's jump to the story from the New York Sun. Congresswoman claims high ranking Navy officer fired for refusing to hang picture of Trump.

[Phil Labonte]

No care.

[Tim Pool]

The Pentagon confirms that Vice Admiral Shoshana Chatfield has been removed from her role at Naito. Democrats are attacking the Trump admin for the firing of one of the highest ranking females in the military with one claiming it was because she wouldn't hang up a picture of the President. There's another story that was posted by @amusonx. We don't know, we haven't confirmed it yet but it's another one. I believe she's a colonel and there's a photo of Trump and Hagseth and JD Vance flipped backwards or the portraits where they should be are backwards. Some have argued that this is because she has not yet received the portraits portraits but the the rumor as reported by Amuse I'd say unconfirmed reporting is that she is outright refusing to show the images of Donald Trump. This is beyond constitutional crisis levels. I for you've got the judiciary issuing more injunctions against Trump than basically I think there was like 200 universal injunctions ever issued and Trump has something like 80, what is it? 81 of them so far. So he has over almost one half of all universal injunctions ever issued which are unconstitutional. This is what they refer to as a judicial coup. The judiciary is seeking to obstruct the executive branch asserting authorities they do not have. You now have stories starting to emerge where high ranking military officials are openly defying the president outright saying we will outlast him and we will defy. We will defy him.

[Phil Labonte]

I mean that is, I don't remember the specific, specific article, but there is an article in the ucmj, the Uniform Code of Military justice, that is the law for the military that says that if you are doing these type of things, conduct, conduct unbecoming insubordination, things that, that in. I forget the wording so I'm not going to try and get into it but this is actually actionable by the military legally.

[Tim Pool]

But, but let me, I have a question for you guys with this individual who was removed arguably because she would not show Trump's picture showing. I believe that shows a disdain for Trump, but whatever. And this and the support this other woman. Do you believe that there is a possibility that if Trump were to issue a lawful order they would disobey it, yes, completely.

[Hannah Cox]

Some of them, for sure.

[Tim Pool]

But I'm referring to these particular high ranking officials who refuse to show his picture.

[Hannah Cox]

I think there's a good chance.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, just lawful.

[Hannah Cox]

And I think it's fine to fire them. I mean, I don't see any. There's no gray area here. You work in the military, you serve at the pleasure of the president. That's clear cut to me.

[Tim Pool]

My concern is not that Trump can't fire them. Of course he can, and he did. My concern is that we are seeing growing cohorts of individuals in high and high ranking levels of government that are an active defiance or usurp. Usurping of power.

[Hannah Cox]

Well, that's always been the case. Right. I mean, that was true in his first administration. Absolutely. Like the deep state, the intellect, the, the.

[Tim Pool]

I would, I would argue that if we go deep on it, the deep state was in complete control and Trump was the upstart, bringing back some kind of constitutional order. In 2016, when Trump got elected, that was when an element of constitutional republicanism actually returned to the government.

[Hannah Cox]

Yeah, I think that that's, I think that's true. I wouldn't argue that. And then I think it regained a lot of power under Biden. I think the bureaucratic state's out of control. It's got to be reined in. That's why I was talking about the Reigns Act. We're trying to pass the state level and the federal level, but there's got to be something done to strip the bureaucrats of their power, I think.

[Tim Pool]

But, but to the point you were making earlier, you were saying that the escalation is making things worse, the escalation with the judiciary.

[Hannah Cox]

I think in general, to ignore the checks and balance system. I think the checks and balances are important. I think we need to reform through just the justice system. I'd like to see it raised to the ground and restructured. I mean, I could go all day about this. I hate many elements of the justice system, but we have to have it. It's a, it's a necessary evil in a actual free country, that we have a justice system, that we have those kinds of checks and balances. So I think the question needs to be what do we do to reform it? What do we do to get it back under control? What do we do to make sure that our country still has our constitutional system that it was structured to have? We have, versus just saying we're going to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

[Tim Pool]

We have, we have no constitutional means of doing what you're asking, we do.

[Hannah Cox]

We just have a bunch of weak politicians who aren't doing their jobs.

[Tim Pool]

What is the constitutional means?

[Hannah Cox]

I mean, the means is, again, Congress taking action. We need to pass laws that would reign in the bureaucracy.

[Tim Pool]

But again, I understand that, but that's, that's, that's a pipe drink dream.

[Hannah Cox]

It's not a pipe dream. And we're passing this at the state level every day right now. Why can't we pass it federally? It's inexcusable.

[Tim Pool]

Because Congress has split basically 50. 50.

[Hannah Cox]

Well, because the American people aren't doing their job. They're not holding their feet to the fire. They're not demanding it. They're not breathing down their necks like they should be. But we can get things done. And we did have a huge ruling last year with Chevron deference getting overturned. That's going to be really important for trying to rein some of this back in as well. But we need to be pursuing those kinds of activities. And I think that. But the mentality I see happening right now is like, the left is really bad and they don't follow the law and they're throwing it all down the river. So we're going to do the same thing. And that ends us in a place that's very bad. I really do think that could end us in an actual civil war. I think that could create a huge chism in our country where it maybe doesn't exist anymore. Whereas if we actually found ways to organize and work together and actually put pressure, I do it. I mean, I.

[Tim Pool]

Well, that's, that's what Trump's victory is.

[Hannah Cox]

And to some extent, that's a good thing. There's many things that I like about Trump. There's many policies I back him on, and I think if he pursues those kinds of mechanisms for reining in the judiciary, I'd back him. But to say we just throw away the checks and balances, we no longer have any check. That's not what he said. That's not what he's saying, but that's.

[Tim Pool]

Not what he's doing.

[Hannah Cox]

People are saying around him, if the.

[Tim Pool]

If, as we've already determined, and I.

[Hannah Cox]

Want to say judiciary, he has any. I don't think he has to act in this case. I was saying earlier, I think the Supreme Court's ruling on this case is very mushy. They said he had to facilitate the return legally. That doesn't mean he has to go and get this guy. It just means he has to cooperate. If they want to return him. So I actually don't think that he's legally in the wrong right now.

[Tim Pool]

We know the judiciary, Judiciary is acting outside the confines of the Constitution.

[Hannah Cox]

Often literally.

[Tim Pool]

Universal injunctions are unconstitutional and Trump has almost half of all ever issued in 250 some odd years or whatever.

[Hannah Cox]

He just doesn't have to listen to the judiciary at all the rest of his presidency.

[Tim Pool]

If the, if the courts tell Trump to do something illegal, he must defy that. If the courts are acting unconstitutionally, Trump must uphold the Constitution by stopping those actions. That's what the executive branch makes.

[Elad Eliyahu]

The question, though, who decides what's legal?

[Tim Pool]

So the issue is the judiciary has been unchecked. How should the executive branch check the judiciary?

[Hannah Cox]

I would say it would be by lobbying and organizing and working to pass laws that would rein it in.

[Tim Pool]

But that's, but, but that's Congress you're talking about. Congress, Congress. There's three branches.

[Hannah Cox]

The President has a lot of control over Congress, especially right now. I mean, he could be doing.

[Tim Pool]

Hold on. There's three branches. Each can check each other. Right. What is the executive branch mechanism for checking a rogue judiciary?

[Elad Eliyahu]

They could nominate judges. Well, now that it's full. But that's the executive's check on the judiciary, their ability.

[Tim Pool]

There's other checks.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I think that's the main one that they get to nominate judges. And people would argue that Trump nominated.

[Tim Pool]

Three Supreme Court justices.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

Trump can instruct the executive branch not to listen to any other branch. He's the head with sole executive power, and this is what executive orders are. And he can do that. And it's only by Trump playing fair or being nice, in agreement, does he do anything otherwise? So typically wave in this country is unasked question, I suppose for hundreds of years of if each of these branch are independent and equal and they check each other, then how is it that that a president can issue an executive order to federal law enforcement not to enforce the law? Isn't that the legislative branch putting a check in the executive saying, you have to do this? Would the judge then say, no, you have to do it? But the president could just say no. And that's exactly what happened with daca. Obama just said, we're no longer going to enforce the law. That's in defiance of the judiciary and the legislative branch because the executive has sole authority over its executive functions. The executive naturally is arguably. Well, actually there is no most powerful because the Supreme Court issues rulings that affect the entirety of smaller and lesser jurisdictions. In this regard, the check is quite simple. When the Courts are rogue. You do not abide by them.

[Elad Eliyahu]

But then how do you decide that as the executive? Who, who decides that if the judiciary is rogue? Does the executive decide that?

[Tim Pool]

This is a constitutional crisis in which I said it's a largely unasked questions over nearly 250 years. Right now, universal injunctions are plainly unconstitutional. The way the law is supposed to work, English common law, particularly, which we are based off of, is that a judge can issue a ruling pertaining to the parties before him. Class action lawsuits exist so that he can affect larger groups of people. But the class action is still pertaining only to those individuals party to the class action. Instead, what's happening is nearly all Democrat judges, nearly, not all, but nearly all are saying Trump wants three individuals transferred prisons because they're men in women's prisons. Now, from now on, all prisons must have, you know, anyone who's trans. What? That's a sweeping unilateral decree. Judges don't have that authority. No one is stopping them now. The problem is we can't rely on Congress. They're dysfunctional. And there's no, there's no argument of, yes, but they shouldn't be. Well, of course they shouldn't be, but they are. The only hope we have then is an executive branch with executive authorities to be like, we're not going to abide.

[Ian Crossland]

By unconstitutional actions or like, rectify Congress. You know, the Romans fell apart when they gave up on Congress, basically.

[Tim Pool]

How do you rectify Congress?

[Hannah Cox]

There's a lot of, I mean, there's a lot of laws we could work to change, especially around financing that.

[Tim Pool]

Congress is not going to do that. Congress polices itself in that regard. They give themselves raises but never bar themselves from serving multiple terms or being restricted on how they, how they campaign. That's true, but police don't police themselves, as it were.

[Hannah Cox]

Right, that's true, but that's because nobody is pressuring them. You have Trump, who has the biggest bully pulpit in the world. He has unprecedented level of support. He has a cult like following. If he were to come out and say, we are going to campaign, we are going to work to get Congress to pass this law and I'm going to work to get people to primary everybody.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Cr.

[Hannah Cox]

But nobody.

[Tim Pool]

Seriously.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Yeah, they could barely pass a cr. So like I have a two seat.

[Tim Pool]

Majority with squishy Democrats and Republicans. So both sides are.

[Elad Eliyahu]

And Tommy Thomas Massey acting like a leftist. So I don't even.

[Phil Labonte]

Easy, easy.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I don't even know how you square this. So, like, I don't, I don't think he could get out all of the Republicans on the same page. But I think the real, the key here is if the, if Congress delegates enough of their power to the executive branch, eventually they're going to have to try to claw it back and the executive will just be more powerful. I think, quote, equal branches is a myth. And throughout the United States history, we've always seen some branches take more power and become more powerful than the others in a kind of a cyclical way. Right now it seems as though the executive branch is, is growing. The power of the because of mass, not only mass media.

[Ian Crossland]

One guy can speak to a million people.

[Elad Eliyahu]

So so long as Congress is dysfunctional, they will continue to atroph. And if they have slim majorities, one way or another, their power will be, will atrophy because they won't be able to pass stuff. And that's just really what it comes down to, because if they can't exercise their power with majorities in the House or the Senate, you can't get anything done.

[Tim Pool]

And I want to jump to this story here to continue the conversation. This from the Daily Mail. Luigi Manga on a copycat unmasked as his mother reveals why he turned up at UnitedHealthcare ready to kill. Did you guys catch this story? We briefly mentioned it, but the news has now come out. Ian Stanley Wagner, 26, was arrested after he arrived at the UnitedHealthcare HQ at Minnetonka with a gun, threatening to shoot it up his mom. Apparently. They say that he had no known motives against them. We don't know what this is, so it is clear this is just somebody who was inspired by the likes of Taylor Lorenz, who said she gains a big audience by defending Luigi Mangione. And she said that women view him as morally good and handsome. What do you think this guy is thinking when he hears this on cnn? So why does Luigi Mangiana do what he did? Do what he did? Do what he did, allegedly. And why are leftists supporting him? Well, as Taylor Lorenz laid out, they view the system as largely dysfunctional with no means of rectifying any of their perceived problems. Now, don't get me wrong, I never said they were smart. No one ever accused them of being as such. Shooting a random guy who happens to be the CEO of a company who just got hired like a year prior literally changed nothing. So not only was Manjani very dumb, he's also particularly ineffective at bringing about change. Meanwhile, Donald Trump is nonviolent and bringing about tremendous change. But the reason I Bring this up in the context of the greater conversation. As you mentioned previously, your fears of civil war or, or the potentiality of one, not that you were saying was going to happen. So I would just posit this. Who in this country, which political faction has driven us to the brink of civil strife and generated the fears of a civil war? The Democrats arrested Trump's lawyers. That is unconstitutional. They claimed it's justified because they're criminals. Sure, that's what dictators do. They falsely accused him of crimes. They tried to prevent him from running for office. They argued he was ineligible, which is a lie. You look at what these, what these similar elements do in Europe. They remove Marine Le Pen and what's his name, Georgescu, Georgia Lescu or whatever. Yeah, that's pronouncing his name wrong. Yeah. In Romania they say he's just, he's ineligible. You can't run. They are actively trying to strip the rights of the people. Outside of that, at the lower tiers, they are firebombing Tesla stores, they are attacking private Tesla owners, they're shooting up cars, they are murdering people. Cheering on more if there is a risk of civil civil war or strife or whatever is going on. The escalation is purely from the political left wing, which includes liberals, it includes socialists and communists, etc.

[Elad Eliyahu]

People like Luigi Mangione make me actually consider wanting to send criminals to places like El Salvador. And on this Taylor Lorenz thing, something, something that I think she said that is extremely telling was that, oh, look, I gained a big audience as a result of my coverage of him online. People personalities are so susceptible to audience capture or perceived audience capture. One of her main is, oh, why is this an important thing to cover? And why is this an important thing to continue supporting? Because I get support online that, that is one of the reasons that she actually supports this. And I think that's a large reason why a lot of influencers online in conservative or liberal spaces support what they do support. So that's all to say, I think a lot of this stuff is astroturf. To anybody who supports Luigi Mangione clearly has something wrong with them in the head. And I think that of Taylor Lorenzo. I also think that of the people who platform Taylor Lorenz, like cnn, I.

[Tim Pool]

Hear you, but this is like, what is it like 70% the of the left support Luigi.

[Elad Eliyahu]

So I think it's leftists, not liberals, who generally support Luigi.

[Tim Pool]

I don't think that's true. If you think it's liberals, maybe not a majority of general liberals, like moderate Voters but I believe that maybe a third. I'll say look it up to fact check AOC supporters.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Yes. But Cory Booker supporters know if that's.

[Hannah Cox]

It seems like a pretty hard hard line communist type position because if you're.

[Elad Eliyahu]

A leftist, you're an eat the rich. And this goes along with like Medicare for All.

[Tim Pool]

47% of liberal individuals according to YouGov had a, had a favorable view of Luigi Mangione. 31% of very liberals. Let me, let me pull up the full report actually December.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Does it say what percentage have mental illness? Because I'd assume it was most of them.

[Hannah Cox]

Truly.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I really think it can't be overstated how sick of an individual you have to be mentally to support something like this.

[Ian Crossland]

It's the vigilante obsession with vigilantism that I think is driving it. And, and if you don't know what's actually happening at the echelons of finance where that are controlling the flow of money with the healthcare system and the food industry. If you don't know on its face it looks like pharma bad pharma, CEO worse. And I love a good vigilant. You know, there's people thinking like John Wick's a hero.

[Phil Labonte]

Wow, John Wick.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah. He goes full vigilante and starts killing just indiscriminately a bunch of people.

[Tim Pool]

So 28% of liberals are favorable or some very favorable or somewhat favorable to Luigi Maggione. 30% don't know. No. 16% of moderates are favorable, 15% of conservatives are favorable and 6% of very conservatives are favorable.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Is there a judge breakdown as well?

[Tim Pool]

Let's see. I don't, I don't know.

[Phil Labonte]

There's a, there's a whole lot of this going on.

[Tim Pool]

There's a lot. There's an age breakdown, but the age largely aligns with political ideology as well.

[Elad Eliyahu]

It seems as though women are. It's not just Luigi Mangioni, but it's, it's this type of like, I don't know, murderer where women feel very drawn to them and write letters to them in jail. Maybe you could explain to us.

[Hannah Cox]

I actually listened to a really good podcast on this recently and I'm so mad I'm blanking on what it was. But it did a great deep dive into the psyche behind this of women being attracted to criminals. And I think that's on a surface level we were actually talking about this in the green room. If you identify with a victim or you identify with like somebody in the case, you know that can cause a lot more interesting as a woman. So if somebody my age is murdered or something happens to somebody who has similar background to me, I have more interest in that case or more attachment to it. But when you get into the women actually being attracted to the murder. So past this, the passing interest in true crime that as according to the podcast listen to, I thought this was a good theory, is women being attracted to the power that men have. Like the brute force that men have and wanting to inhabit it for themselves to a degree.

[Elad Eliyahu]

He's a bad boy, he's a dangerous.

[Tim Pool]

Man, of course, but an individual level. Level.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

That's why an individual who murders lots of people has a carnal kind of power. So.

[Phil Labonte]

So you guys, most of you guys have heard of homath, right? Yeah, there's this, there's this one that he. There's one tick tock or whatever that he made and it's not really about him, but it's about the girl that he was, he was talking about. This woman was saying, I just want to meet the guy that takes his sword and puts it under my chin and lifts it up.

[Tim Pool]

Up.

[Phil Labonte]

Right. Because the point is the dude, just like the, the fantasy is he just slaughtered the village and she's the one he leaves. And instead of killing her, he picks her. And what it is is he has the power to do absolutely horrific violence and has massive power, but he chooses not to for her.

[Hannah Cox]

She has him under her thumb.

[Phil Labonte]

Well, well, I don't know about. It's. I'm not so much.

[Tim Pool]

No, she's the control.

[Phil Labonte]

But he has chosen her. So he doesn't do violence to her, he protects her. And that's what people think when women look at Luigi Mangione. He's an attractive guy that has the ability to go and commit violence.

[Tim Pool]

And this is why the over overwhelmingly young women are sexually attracted to Donald Trump, because of his.

[Hannah Cox]

Do we have data on that?

[Ian Crossland]

That phenomenon is called meekness. What you said, the meek shall inherit the earth. It's the one that's very powerful but knows how to not use it.

[Tim Pool]

Oh yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

Meek is someone that's very strong and dangerous, but they choose not to use.

[Tim Pool]

Use it.

[Phil Labonte]

No, check it out.

[Tim Pool]

That's not what exactly Phil's saying either.

[Ian Crossland]

He's saying that the guy that murders the town has the ability to kill the woman, but he chooses to quiet.

[Tim Pool]

Gentle and easily imposed upon and submissive.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah, that's not what it means.

[Ian Crossland]

You should keep reading about it.

[Tim Pool]

Well, I just pulled it up. That's what it Says. Yeah, it comes from the old Norse muk, muker, which means soft and gentle, which evolved through modern English to milk, which means courteous.

[Phil Labonte]

It can. It can be the implied to patience and endurance in the face of injury. But the. The common understanding is that you're quiet and docile.

[Ian Crossland]

That's the misnomer. Just pull it up here.

[Tim Pool]

In the Bible, meek specifically refers to what you're talking to. So.

[Phil Labonte]

Yes, the Bible.

[Tim Pool]

Well, it's a particular thing in this. No, no, no, no. That's why the Bible.

[Ian Crossland]

Strength should not inherit the earth is what they'd say in the Bible. That's what they're talking about. The strong ones that know how to not. Yeah, you know, total annihilative strength, but, you know. Know how not to exercise.

[Tim Pool]

But again, that's not what. That's not what Phil was saying.

[Ian Crossland]

Well, he's saying the guy slaughters the village, but then he chooses not to slaughter the woman.

[Phil Labonte]

I think it is.

[Tim Pool]

I.

[Ian Crossland]

You know when to protect and you know when to destroy. That's what makes someone meek.

[Phil Labonte]

The point is she likes him because of his exercising of power. A meek person has power and doesn't exercise it. That's what makes them meek.

[Ian Crossland]

Or they know when to exercise it.

[Phil Labonte]

Well, I mean, maybe, but the context that we're talking about, like, that's to call a guy that just slaughtered a whole village. Village meek is an error of use of definition.

[Ian Crossland]

If he hadn't chosen to protect the woman after he slaughtered the village, I wouldn't have called meek. But that's the aspect. That's meekness. There is that. I mean, you are on.

[Tim Pool]

I don't know. Yes. What Phil is referring to is that a man who massacres a ton of people has chosen to exert his strength over everyone else to the point where he's ended their life, and then she is spared. That's not meekness. Meekness would be. A barbarian king like Genghis Khan comes to the village and says, I will spare all of you for this beautiful woman.

[Phil Labonte]

I get where you're coming from.

[Ian Crossland]

I don't agree with you guys, by the way.

[Phil Labonte]

And it. But yeah, it doesn't matter.

[Tim Pool]

So let's. Let's do this. Luigi Mangione will be acquitted. He will be acquitted because far leftists are going to riot outside the courthouse and they're going to ch. They're gonna. They're gonna stalk the jurors and the jury is going to enter court surrounded by men with rifles, and they are going to know when they go home the juror's wife is gonna say, if you put him in prison, they're gonna kill us. And he's gonna say, I'll just say not guilty. I'll just say not guilty. And he's gonna get acquitted. That's the country we live in right now. And even if Donald Trump were to invoke the Insurrection act, to deploy law enforcement, whatever jurisdiction they're trying him in, you cannot escape 200,000 people across the country and every, you know, 10,000 people in every big city smashing windows and burning things down. When Derek Chauvin went, went to court, the defense argued, the defense had a guy on cross and said, was he justified Derek Chauvin in using a greater degree of force? And they said, yes. The continuum of force training in Minnesota allows for Chauvin to have escalated to impact weapons, not just restraint. He chose not to escalate. Even though they argued that, yet the jury still convicted him, the Fed still went after him. Why? When a jury is being brought into a courtroom surrounded by men with guns and they can see all around them, far left terrorists threatening to murder them, they're not going to cross them. So Luigi Mangione literally shoots and kills a guy, and he's being celebrated by Colbert. He's being celebrated. I should say the people on these shows, they've celebrated the Tesla terror attacks. It is going to be painfully obvious to anybody who's on the jury when they look at these polls that Overall, you have 21% of all US adults who are favorable towards Luigi Mangione. 21%. It only takes 10 crazy people. If you are known to 10 crazy people, your life is in jeopardy. But when you have Taylor Lorenz on CNN laughing it up with Daniel Sullivan, he's so handsome. This juror is going to be like, oh, my God, not guilty.

[Ian Crossland]

I don't know how Mangioni can get a fair trial. He's too public. Like, what do you do? It's the same thing with Chauvin. Like, how did you. You couldn't give that guy a fair trial.

[Tim Pool]

He's going to be found not guilty. He's not my understanding he's not taking a plea agreement. And I could be wrong. I'm just saying they offer him one. I don't know where we're currently at with this. I am saying that. I mean, tell me if Think I'm wrong. If you're in the chat, tell me if think I'm wrong. Wrong. Will. Will leftist rioters threaten the lives of jurors in the Mangione case to force them to, to rule him not guilty.

[Phil Labonte]

I still haven't, I haven't seen anything lately that makes, that leads me to believe that there is that energy that we had in 2020.

[Hannah Cox]

I think it was the lockdowns that pushed that.

[Tim Pool]

You don't think that like the firebombing over 50 different, I'm sorry, firebombing of Tesla locations, which includes over 50 different terror attacks on Tesla vehicles and facilities, doesn't show that energy is, is, is here.

[Phil Labonte]

When you say 50 different terror attacks on, on facilities and vehicles, are you talking about individual vehicles? Are you talking about individual vehicles? And by Griffin. So there were 50 different places where they were 50.

[Tim Pool]

The report is that there have been 50 incidents of terror attacks on Tesla pertaining to Tesla vehicles and facilities. I feel like that probably does include individual vehicles. I'm not entirely sure that was just the report. That's over 50.

[Hannah Cox]

I guess my question is how many people are carrying out those attacks? Because, I mean, having a few crazy people doing terrorist things doesn't mean that we're going to see what we saw.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah. If you had one stalker, would you.

[Phil Labonte]

Be terrified in 2020?

[Tim Pool]

We had if one person, one person.

[Hannah Cox]

Energy where it was in 2020. And I don't feel that it is either.

[Tim Pool]

Is that required to convince a jury to rule not guilty?

[Hannah Cox]

I don't think the pressure campaign is going to that point.

[Tim Pool]

Has there ever been a lot of.

[Hannah Cox]

People online talking trash and doing this whole thing? Like when the billionaire died, See Titanic and all the people on Tick tock were like, yeah, Titanic, send more billionaires down. Are they people who express themselves in this kind of way and is that awful? Yes. But does that mean these are actually violent people who are going to carry out violent actions and threaten people or commit illegal acts? I don't think so. I think there are a lot of pissed off people who are angry and they're angry at the elite and they're expressing that through these kinds of holes.

[Tim Pool]

2020 riots were about lockdowns, not about George.

[Hannah Cox]

Floyd.

[Tim Pool]

Floyd.

[Hannah Cox]

I agree.

[Tim Pool]

So without something as infuriating as being locked in your home for several months, I don't know that we ever get to riots that were just random wanton destruction. However, we have had protests, what, every single weekend for the past three months, escalating. We have had 50 attacks on Tesla to whatever degree that is. I know that 15 of them were serious arson and shootings because that was, that was the report back last month. That was where like the guy firebombed the Charging station. One guy shot up a Tesla dealership and we had a bunch of those instances. There was about 15 of them. I don't know about the remaining 35. That may just be on vehicles, individual vehicles, but I'm not sure if that's the case. The left right now is organizing for a, for an April 19 nationwide protest, which they're arguing and all over. Right. They're saying will be the biggest that we've seen in this country in years.

[Hannah Cox]

Or since the Iraq war, will be your bellwether. But to me, it feels like that the, the wind has been sucked out of the sails ever since Trump's election.

[Tim Pool]

I hope that's the case. That means Trump won. That means we won.

[Hannah Cox]

Very demoralized. I feel like they feel like it was such an overwhelming victory that it, I feel like it's actually gone quiet, if anything. And I mean, I'm somebody in the middle. I'm very independent. I'm not really a, a Trump fan. I've never voted for Trump. I like some things Trump does, but I don't see that kind of energy, that kind of resistance, that kind of organizing. And that's the real key. Right. That's what was so dangerous about 2020 was the organizing factor. You had actual intentionality, people who understood ground games that were behind those protests.

[Tim Pool]

I suppose it's, it's. I will say this, I hope you're right, because my argument in the election was that if Trump won the popular vote, too many people would be like, I don't want to be on the wrong side of history. And so they'd immediately back off, whatever the shenanigans was going to be. That being said, spring is only just sprung. It's been, it's, we have about, we're about a month in, it's starting to get nice out. And so the question is going to be how big do the protests get in the summer, which is riot season?

[Phil Labonte]

I think that the, the, the actual issue is less right, is less the protests and riots and more the fact that the left, it seems to have people or a fewer amount of people willing to do more than they were willing before. So there's, There were two attempts at Trump's life. You have people actually firebombing Tesla dealerships. Now, there were, there was destruction of property and stuff during the Summer of Love, but it was not targeted.

[Hannah Cox]

Yes.

[Tim Pool]

You know, the swatting's. Pardon me, swattings. This year we had 20 plus people swatted. This is our attempted attempted murder. Owen Sawyer taking a shirt off and walking backwards at gunpoint.

[Phil Labonte]

So I think that. That there. There's something to that. The fact that they're willing to go. There are fewer people that are involved, so you don't have the average normie. The people that have to go to work are going to work, as opposed to being, you know, caught up at home with nothing to do. Or the people that are motivated to have something outside of political activism or political rioting or whatever, they'll. They're not gonna be involved. But I do think that there is something to the intensity of the few people that do act.

[Hannah Cox]

The intensity levels of that. Actually, the political extremism within the fringes is. Is perhaps more volatile. And I think the left, and I think communism as a whole is an inherently violent ideology. And I think as those extremes on the left move closer and closer to true Marxism, you're going to see more and more of that. And I think to some extent that the right and the entire MAGA movement has been in response to that growth on the left. And that's, you know, horseshoe theory repeating over and over. So. And that's where my fear comes in. Because if the right says they're doing this, so we match them, and we just keep doing this. That ends up in some very scary places.

[Tim Pool]

Ultimately, yes. But if you don't match them, you get a communist revolution.

[Phil Labonte]

And this is something.

[Tim Pool]

Communists are knocking on your door, trying to break it down. And the argument is, do we push back or do we just sit back?

[Phil Labonte]

This is something that we've talked about a little bit here on the show before. Look, if there's going to be some kind of political uprising, I want it to be when the conservatives are in control of the apparatus of the state. Because if the left is in control of the apparatus of the state, you're gonna. You're gonna see things that will turn into an abolition of property rights or the, The. The significant problems that the left causes in countries around the world. Those kind of things will come here, and that will cascade globally. Because if you don't have. Have solid property rights here in the United States, that's going to be a massive problem for investment here. And there's a problem for investment here that cascades globally. So I think the. Those kind of problems are something that we need to avoid. And if that means that the revolution should happen when there's a conservative in. In charge, so they control power, then I'm okay with that.

[Tim Pool]

Let's jump to this story from CBS News. Trump cannot revoke legal status of migrants from Cuba, Haiti, Nicaragua, and Venezuela. Judge rules. Well, Joe Biden's administration unilaterally just decreed they were gonna let people come and not enforce the law. And now that Trump is saying, you gotta go back, a judge is saying he can't, which is insane. And once again, a universal injunction, which doesn't pertain to a single individual, but to any and everyone, which is 532,000 individuals. Now, let me explain for those that don't know why Democrats did this. When they bring in illegal immigrants, the census eventually happens and they will add congressional seats to their blue states, which give them more votes in Congress and more votes for the President. If we were to remove every illegal immigrant, Democrats would likely lose. I believe the number might be like 12 congressional seats and 12 electoral votes if there were no illegal immigrants. Now, we've talked about this quite a bit. Some people ask, but how does an illegal immigrant give them more votes? Congress is a Congressional seats are apportioned based on total population size, not citizenry. So when they do the census, they don't care if you're a citizen or not. You will have a congressional rep even if you're an illegal immigrant. And there are some districts that might have 50,000 illegal immigrants in them, meaning they get federal representation despite not being citizens. And that means their voice is a vote. Now, the second class citizens, but the Democrats still get extra votes. So when we look at politics in this country and the left likes to argue we are winning these elections and this proves we're more popular, blah, blah, blah, whatever. No, it's actually that they're cheating and they've been cheating the whole time. If Trump does not deport these individuals when the census comes around, if he doesn't do this, Democrats are going to bolster their numbers and they require substantially less political pressure on the American population to win elections.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, he tried to make citizens. You had to be a citizen to be counted on the census.

[Tim Pool]

No, he simply asked on the census if you were a citizen and Supreme Court barred him from doing it.

[Ian Crossland]

And I didn't like it at the time, but now I'm starting to want. I just didn't want to give more information than I had to. But now I'm starting to see maybe a potential value of it. I mean, come on, you don't count non citizens. That's so ridiculous.

[Tim Pool]

They do.

[Ian Crossland]

It shouldn't happen.

[Tim Pool]

Yep. Sorry, guys.

[Ian Crossland]

It just shouldn't happen, man.

[Tim Pool]

That means there are members of Congress that know if 20% of their district is illegal immigrants, they cannot vote against law. They cannot vote against them, and they can't vote for laws to deport.

[Ian Crossland]

Like holding Congress hostage.

[Tim Pool]

Yep.

[Ian Crossland]

It's not. It's not. Shouldn't. Non functional. I don't understand.

[Hannah Cox]

Where.

[Tim Pool]

Where does it.

[Ian Crossland]

Okay, well, why would we do that even?

[Tim Pool]

What are we doing? Judge is saying that. Who's the judge?

[Ian Crossland]

Where does he rule from? That's what I want to know.

[Tim Pool]

Who is this? It's a singular district court. Judge Indira Talwani.

[Ian Crossland]

Where the hell is that?

[Tim Pool]

That. Let's find out.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Name?

[Ian Crossland]

Judge Indira Talwani.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Where is that? What district?

[Tim Pool]

All you need to know is a woman's name.

[Ian Crossland]

All right, Indira.

[Tim Pool]

And she is for the District of Massachusetts.

[Ian Crossland]

I'm sorry.

[Phil Labonte]

Oh, boy.

[Hannah Cox]

That tracks.

[Tim Pool]

One individual judge out of 677 can issue a universal injunction on. On the entire executive branch.

[Hannah Cox]

Why can't that be challenged? Like, why can't they appeal that? Why doesn't that keep going up?

[Tim Pool]

They do appeal them, and that's the problem. This is this. Okay. When the Republicans appeal unconstitutional decrees by a rogue judiciary, they're basically saying, we recognize your authority to do this. We're going to ask your buddies if we can do something else, instead of being like, yo, you can't do that.

[Ian Crossland]

So what's unconstitutional about it?

[Tim Pool]

There is no authority granted in the Constitution of the. Of the judiciary to issue universal decrees over the entirety of the nation.

[Ian Crossland]

How has this been happening then, for so long?

[Tim Pool]

It hasn't.

[Ian Crossland]

You said since early 1900s. It's been.

[Tim Pool]

There were a few in the early 1900s that everyone kind of rolled their eyes at and said whatever.

[Ian Crossland]

Constitutional, though still. Yes.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Geez.

[Tim Pool]

But there's a lot of unconstitutional things that have happened in this country. And you choose your battles.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

I mean, and slavery was unconstitutional. Blasphemy laws were unconstitutional. They all existed. What's happened is we have seen an increase in universal injunctions since the 2010s. Trump has almost half of all of that. Them. They have decided to just start issuing universal decrees over the entirety of the nation. The reason Trump needs to say no.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

The reason I brought up Internet earlier in the episode, I said, because I feel like things are happening in real time now where somebody in Massachusetts can hear what the President said and immediately issue a response. Then the executive authority. Before. It took days for the President's.

[Tim Pool]

No, it took months.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah. For the newspaper to come out on Sunday. Maybe then you'd see it. And now, yo.

[Tim Pool]

Someone in Massachusetts would hear two months later that in Congress, they passed a law that did a certain thing that affected his business. And then he would draft a lawsuit which would take months to send back to D.C. and then it would take months to organize a court. And in the meantime, when they passed the law, nobody in Massachusetts was abiding by it because word doesn't travel. Now that it's all lightning speed, it's all light speed. A law is declared and instantly you must abide by it. Imagine living in California in the late 1800s and then some dude rides up and says he's a marshal at the u. S. Government. They just banned guns. You'd be like, what?

[Ian Crossland]

They did that in do something Tombstone. That's what set off the tombstone, the movie.

[Tim Pool]

They want to take the guns from the guys.

[Ian Crossland]

They try to take the guns in town. And then there was a shootout.

[Tim Pool]

And you're in the middle of the wild west and you're like, bro, I don't know you. Okay, you don't live here. Like, back then, a lawman would show up and they'd be like, like, I gotta be honest, bro, if you fell in that ditch and died right now, ain't nobody coming looking for you. That was the wild west. These days, everything, everything is light speed. And this is one of the reasons I think we're seeing this, this conflict escalate so rapidly.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, there's got to be now a response, like an immune response. What's the response to this?

[Tim Pool]

Trump saying no.

[Ian Crossland]

So you could immediately say no. You could allow it to exist for an hour and then it disappears. So you get a one hour injunction. But we're talking about military apparati, you know, you can't. If the Minnesota judge is trying to stop Trump from doing some military exercise, puts a stay. You can't wait an hour to be like, no. In that instance, you're like, sorry, executive authority.

[Tim Pool]

Trump just start deporting all of these people. And they're like, but we told you, you can't. He can say, oh, unfortunately for you, you issued a universal injunction, which is unconstitutional. So have a nice day.

[Phil Labonte]

Enforce it. The chief justice has made his decision now let him enforce it.

[Tim Pool]

It. Here's the issue. No matter what Trump does, Democrats will say it was illegal. So either Trump does nothing or he does something they will call illegal. Joe Biden Let either 10 or 20 million illegal immigrants into this country in violation of our laws, of our constitution. He facilitated child sex trafficking. Donald Trump is now sending criminal human traffickers, drug dealers back, and they're calling it illegal. They are lying about a man in El Salvador who was ruled by two courts to be an MS.13 gang member who had two orders for deportation. And when Trump deports him, they could, they could be honest, right? They could, they could say, hey, that guy had a stay. You can't do that, Trump. Instead, they said, he's a Maryland father who is here legally. Those are all lies. But that is literally what these members of Congress have said. He was here legally. No, he was. They lie. No matter what Trump and his administration do, they're going to be told it's. They're going to say it's unconstitutional, it's illegal, and that's the only thing you're going to hear from the corporate press. So Trump has two choices. Use his executive authority, which is he could deport these people under the executive branch. That's what he can do. Ignore universal injunctions for which there's no constitutional authority granted. And they're going to call it illegal no matter what he does.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah. I mean, and there's also something that we haven't really touched on. That, that, that really is the heart of this. This is the establishment trying to stymie the outsider. And as much as I know people are going to have a problem with calling Trump the outsider, but Trump is the guy that was elected saying, I'm going to drain the swamp. The swamp is not. Is going to fight back. And this is the swamp fighting back.

[Tim Pool]

That's the vibe I got.

[Phil Labonte]

Well, that's exactly what it is. Like, the, the, the reason they're doing these things is to stymie the power of the executive. Because. Because as of right now, Trump has put multiple things in motion that have, that will actually have a significant effect on the power of not only the, quote, unquote, deep state, the entrenched bureaucracies, but also the Democrat Party, which has been totally in cahoots with the government to fund its own programs. You saw it through the USAID stuff. It's been the NGOs that, that were all Democratic, that they were full of Democrats. The funding to multiple media outlets, the funding to npr, all of these, these, these organizations, they were all part of an apparatus meant to further leftist ideology and leftist programs. Trump is trying to disassemble that. And so what you're getting right now is the pushback against that attack attempt.

[Tim Pool]

I got it. None of this matters. Arguing minutia and law. Ian, I want you to close your eyes. I want you to imagine you're 11 years old, it's Christmas morning. You're running downstairs, you can smell fresh, fresh cinnamon buns in the oven. That Mom's making you run down to your living room. There's the Christmas tree, Sun is just coming up, there's some candles lit, and all of those presents, they're right there for you. That's Donald Trump's America. But then a Democrat comes in and kicks your tree over and he starts putting up communist fists on the wall.

[Ian Crossland]

The Democrat, My dad, man, not again. That was. That was 1992 all over again. Well, that's what it feels like.

[Tim Pool]

My main point is the America that Donald Trump is espousing is the Christmas morning white picket fence, fresh pancakes. That is not to say that he's a perfect guy. That is the. The idealized vision of what Trump supporters see when they imagine making America great again. Families, and it's not a race thing. They lie about Tucker Carlson and he had an epic response when he was like, what? The interests of black Americans are the same as all Americans. He's not. He's not talking about race. He said the illegal immigrants who are coming and displacing these communities are negatively impacting the black families the same.

[Phil Labonte]

The problem is white liberal women.

[Tim Pool]

That's what he said.

[Phil Labonte]

And it was funny.

[Tim Pool]

The left is advancing some deranged, fractured, pseudo multicultural world where everybody is isolated, people are ranked by race. Christmas is called holiday, and they take away the American tradition, the memories we have, what built this country and made it good. And they're in open defiance of the law and the Constitution on the ground. They're burning things down, killing people and committing acts of terrorism. At the corporate level, they're lying to the American people. At the legislative level, they are engaging in what I would call a coup. When they accused Trump of being a spy working for a foreign adversary, effectively of treason, that was a soft coup attempt. Now you've got a judicial coup. The worldview presented by Democrats is decay, war and destruction.

[Ian Crossland]

You mentioned the commune. I think it's gracious to call the technocratic, like, you know, brain rot communist. I think it's much more dangerous than communism. What it's like the communist ethos with technology, real id, baby, crypto, track your money kind of thing. Anyway, that thing is, I find grotesque. And it does feel like they're coming to say, we want to destroy your American way of life. We want to destroy the system. And the response is, if the person's going to do anything to destroy you and you just want to be left alone, they're eventually going to do it. So you have to step up and prevent it. You have to fight back in a sense or at least push back. But the problem is, how do you do that without actually destroying the system in the process? Because they'll. They'll win if they beat you or if you lose. They're happy to see you fail and mess up your attempt, and they're also happy to just take it from you. So it.

[Tim Pool]

It may be that every four generations, there's a great period of tumult. This is what I was talking about with libertarians. It's an ideology that I feel largely only exists in times of great peace. The idea that I can say, I shouldn't have to, I can do what I want, only exists when you're not facing a threat. Threat. Because I'll put it this way. During Occupy Wall street, the police asserted they had the right to declare frozen zones. They would look at any protester and be like, that's. That's frozen. You can't stand there. And you'd go, what? You can't just decree. I can't stand on the sidewalk. That was their authority and the act. The activists there said, authority doesn't exist. That's what they argued. They said, it's all bs. And I said, no, authority does exist. Does exist. Authority is when a man collapses in the street in front of a crowd of people, and everybody runs over to try and render aid, and a man goes out of the way. I'm a doctor. Looks at the man and then looks at you and says, you, on the ground now. Hold. Hold down on a. Pump his chest. Every. Do what I'm telling you. You say, yes, sir. 99 of people would be like, okay. A man says he's a doctor. You trust him. We trust each other. We tend to. Maybe he's lying. He's probably not. He needs your help to save a man's life. That's authority. He says, I need you to save this man's life. And you know, you must do it. That's real authority. So what we. I feel we are largely dealing with is through periods of peace, largely after World War II, you get great prosperity, and everybody kind of chills out. There's no bear threatening us. But what would happen if there was. Or maybe there is Russia, right?

[Elad Eliyahu]

Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

That's funny.

[Tim Pool]

What if you were in a campsite, Ian, and you were with Jocko, and all of a sudden a bear approached?

[Ian Crossland]

Jocko Williams.

[Tim Pool]

Think if a bear came up, would you. Would. What would you do? Would you.

[Ian Crossland]

First thing I would do is glance.

[Tim Pool]

At Jocko and you'd ask him, what do I do?

[Ian Crossland]

I would definitely want to know what his plan was. Yes.

[Tim Pool]

You have no freedom.

[Ian Crossland]

He's like a ex military, like Navy SEAL badass. Yeah, Jocko's the got got the front.

[Tim Pool]

Here's my point. He would look you in the eye and say, do what I tell you. And you would. Absolutely. Without question. In times of threatened danger, we look to great leaders who we believe can help save our lives. Because we are not the experts in all of these things. That does not say we're in a perfect period. But the point is, if a bear strolled up to your campsite and Jocko said, everyone listen to me right now. I need you to do this. And you went, hey, man, you can't tell me what to do. He'll say, okay, and then you get eaten by the bear.

[Ian Crossland]

I fully agree.

[Tim Pool]

This is libertarianism. Libertarianism. Libertarianism is fine when the country is secure in your safety bubble and you have no great threats.

[Hannah Cox]

See, I've pushed back to that. I actually think. Think back to your point you were making that if you fight the left with their own tools. Look at what happened during 9 11. This was the same mentality that took place after that event where we said, anything goes, the Constitution gets thrown out. We can't pick liberty. We have to pick safety. We have to pick strong men. We have to get rid of these rules. We have to get rid of these pesky restraints, and we're going to fight them. And what happened is exactly what the hijackers intended to happen. Where America destroyed itself in that process. We undid our Constitution, we put ourselves in debt, we lost tons of lives, and we didn't make the world any safer. But we did ruin our country. We've had tension ever since.

[Tim Pool]

So who I live in now is the aggressor.

[Hannah Cox]

The aggressor was a terrorist, but we played into their very game by doing what they wanted us to do, which in the context on our principles, in.

[Tim Pool]

The context of the United States stripping the rights of individuals and declaring wars, the aggressor were aggressors. Against us were those who exploited a terror attack. Now it's fine to say, I agree the terrorists were the aggressors. Following this, the Bush administration lied to us to invade Iraq and Afghanistan.

[Hannah Cox]

And we let them because we said, this isn't a time for libertarianism. This isn't a time for our constitutional principles. This is a time for security. And this is a time for us to trust the people in charge. And this is a time for us to put the safety of our country before our rights and what did we get for that?

[Tim Pool]

But that doesn't change the fact that in true wartime, this is why false flags exist. I'm not saying 911 was a false flag. I'm saying this is why governments throughout history have used false flags like the Gulf of Tonkin, specifically because they know that the average person is not equipped to deal with war and needs specialists to do it for them.

[Hannah Cox]

Now, this I could agree with you on. Is the average person going to be attracted to libertarianism? Do they even want to live under true freedom? That's a great debate. That's a great debate. I would say absolutely no, that most people don't want to actually have freedom. And that is probably the actual fatal flaw in libertarianism is that the vast majority of people don't truly want to be free, don't want to be adults, do want to have a parental figure looking out for them.

[Phil Labonte]

One of the things that the biggest problem I see in libertarianism is it's something that is all Americans, not all people kind of are guilty of this. But there's always talk of liberty, but there is no talk of responsibility. Every single freedom that you have comes with responsibilities attached to it. You do not get the liberties without the responsibilities. And libertarianism never talk about the responsibility.

[Tim Pool]

So let's, let's clarify what this really comes down to, though. During 9 11, when the buildings were collapsing and fires were everywhere, would you agree that if you were doing relief efforts on the ground, you would do as you were told? If they said, I need you to go over there and start moving that box and doing this?

[Hannah Cox]

I mean, yeah, if I'm a first responder, I'm going to follow the no.

[Tim Pool]

What if you just lived in New York and they said, listen, I need you to go over there and do this, we need help, help. Would you say no, get someone else to do it? Or would you be like, okay, I can.

[Hannah Cox]

Yeah, I probably would have just gotten the hell out of there. If I'm being honest. If I'm being completely honest and there's an emergency, a catastrophe happening, I'm going to find the quickest evacuation route and get out of there.

[Tim Pool]

Even if someone. So, like, let's. I understand that makes sense in the event, but I'm saying in, in, in the, in the response after the buildings have collapsed, if someone said, you, ma'am, come here, I need your help, you'd say, no.

[Hannah Cox]

I mean, yeah, but that's partly, let's be clear, I'm a woman, so my instincts are not to come. When somebody Asked me for help because they're probably trying to lure me into a trap. Traps.

[Tim Pool]

So I find that actually surprising. I'd imagine most people.

[Hannah Cox]

Most women, actually. And that's why women get killed. Because they're too nice to help? No, because they're too nice. They offer to help.

[Tim Pool]

They.

[Hannah Cox]

They follow somebody. They go where they're asked to go. They. They get.

[Tim Pool]

I'm not talking about walking through a dark alley. I'm saying no.

[Hannah Cox]

I know buildings have collapsed, but I'm.

[Tim Pool]

Saying standing there on the ground.

[Hannah Cox]

And they say, deadly for women oftentimes. And so I have trained myself to not adapt to that. If somebody. If a man approaches me in a parking. I'm like, no, get away.

[Tim Pool]

Clarify. In the aftermath of 911 with people who are dying and someone said, ma'am, please help me, you'd say no?

[Hannah Cox]

Yeah. Most likely. If I felt like my life was in danger and that anyone else. And they're calling you over and saying, come over and do this.

[Tim Pool]

This is a woman thing, would you.

[Ian Crossland]

Guys say, no, I would have helped that day. I'm not saying work at ground zero.

[Tim Pool]

I'm not saying they're telling you to, like, go, Go jump into a fall.

[Ian Crossland]

I have a fantasy about saving a little kid from the middle of the street. In fact, I did that in New York City one time. There was a burning house and I walked out into the street and stopped traffic.

[Tim Pool]

Traffic. I'm not saying. I'm not telling you to run into a burning building. I'm saying it's the aftermath. The buildings are down and someone says, please help me.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, yeah, and there's a dude on the ground bleeding.

[Tim Pool]

100.

[Hannah Cox]

Yeah, I think this might be a male female divide. Honestly, I would.

[Tim Pool]

I mean, that's makes sense. So in the context of the Jocko thing with the bear, I'd liken what you're describing with 911 to two scenarios. One, a bear comes and mauls a bunch of people to death. So then Jocko says, guys, bears are attacking us. We need to take precautions and set things up. And we go, makes sense. Like, we should listen on how to prevent bear attacks. The second scenario is a guy in a bear costume that Jocko hired shows up and then goes, rawr. And then kills somebody. Says, oh boy, you better listen to me. Evil people exist and evil people do do these things. But in the context of human civilization, we typically would respond to our leaders in times of war and conflict with tell me what to do and I will do do it. That's why conscription exists.

[Phil Labonte]

So we brought up a false flag.

[Ian Crossland]

This is all about false flags and getting people you're saying to get all about false flags. It's all about when this conversation started.

[Tim Pool]

You the conversation. Libertarianism.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, oh yeah.

[Tim Pool]

Only exists in times of peace.

[Ian Crossland]

It's a luxury.

[Tim Pool]

It is a. It is a luxury item.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Libertarianism doesn't exist in our country at all. It's an. It's idealistic and people who are libertarians don't need to deal with the real world policies that exists and, and really don't deal with the politics a serious manner. You just get to be very principle based online, but they're never in power in government to have to compromise their value. So they have some influence in some of the Republican party. But it's a fairy tale. And libertarians online, it's all a fairy tale.

[Tim Pool]

We got to go to chats. We're gonna go to your chats. Before we do, my friends, make sure you smash that like button. Share the show with everyone you know and check out fast growing trees.com Timcast Shout out to our second sponsor. We really do appreciate it. Fast growing trees is awesome. Awesome. They deliver trace to you. You can get plants like all these different kinds of plants ready to go. Did you know the fast growing trees, the biggest online nursery in the US with thousands of different plants and over 2 million happy customers. They have all the plants your yard needs like fruit trees, privacy trees, flowering trees, shrubs and more. And maybe you need fruit trees because the civil war is coming and maybe you want to plant your own food so you don't die. I'm half kidding. Only half. Fast growing trees makes it easy to get the yard of your dreams. Order online and get your plants delivered directly to your door in just a few days. Days without ever leaving home. Plus they're alive and thrive guarantee ensures your plants arrive happy and healthy. Super difficult and annoying to shop for plants in person. To be quite honest, I would never be able to do it. And so for me personally, we've actually been trying to figure out which fruit trees we do want to plant here. Yes.

[Ian Crossland]

What do you got in mind?

[Tim Pool]

I don't know, man. We got to figure it out for the climate and you know, be great to plant them over by the chicken coop.

[Hannah Cox]

Lemon trees are beautiful.

[Ian Crossland]

The first one I was thinking of lemon.

[Tim Pool]

I love lemons. But fast, fast growing trees, my friend. So they got a resource center. It's got plenty of advice from their plant experts to help you learn more about your yard's needs. Maybe we can talk to them about that, you'll know what plants and trees will thrive in your area. And in fact, they did hit us up like, which plants do you want? And we are, like, really excited. We can get some fruit trees, man. It'd be great. This spring they have the best deals. You can get 15 off their first purchase when using the code TIMCAST. That's an additional 15 off at fast growing trees.com using the code TIMCAST at checkout again, fast growingtrees.com code TIMCAST. I hope that's on top of the 20 they're already offering on the link. When you go there, maybe there's two codes you can use. Otherwise, I guess use a 20 off one, but shout out. We really do appreciate it. All right, let's get to your chats, my friends, and read what y'all have to say. We'll start over here with some rumble rants. Evan for us says all Trump needs to do to stop this pro terrorist sentiment is just say, quote, this, this mangy guy is quite violent, but he's also quite handsome some. And the left will immediately drop him.

[Phil Labonte]

Yep.

[Ian Crossland]

Like, wow, they would.

[Hannah Cox]

So many people would, mate.

[Tim Pool]

Yep. If, if he did an interview where he said, you know, these insurance companies, I get it, people don't like them. So, you know, I don't think it's good. But, you know, someone had to do something. And so maybe we'll take a look at that. We'll take a look at that. Then they're going to be like, oh, why is he defending that guy? Allison was telling me, my wife, that she was watching this video of a woman who moved to Sweden to escape Trump's America. America. And she was talking about how she initially wasn't sure about some of the things they do in the country, but then she started to come to terms and understand and appreciate them. And she was mentioning things that Trump was doing, like she fled America and went to Sweden. And then they have, they have certain policies in place. I can't remember which ones. I think some pertaining to, like politics in schools and stuff. And she started praising all of these things and also was like, but it was weird because she was describing things Trump was doing, like, what are you, what are you running from? There you go.

[Phil Labonte]

It's the Orange Man. That's what she didn't like. The Orange Man.

[Tim Pool]

All right. Indeed. Yugan says, I don't care if they are a school teacher. They broke the law in coming here. Send them all to prison in El Salvador for all I care.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Yeah, sounds about right.

[Tim Pool]

I Mean, look, don't come to the United States.

[Phil Labonte]

I don't want to. I'm. I don't necessarily want them to go to prison in s. In El Salvador. I just want to send them part right. Send them somewhere else. Get them out of the United States. Send them back to where they came from. Just send them elsewhere. Not here. You're not supposed to be here. Send them by.

[Tim Pool]

Shane H. Wilder, beating us all to the punch, saying, I want to take a moment to wish Phil a happy birthday and offer my felicitations to him and Sarah. On. Expecting a little Labonte, that is.

[Phil Labonte]

Thank you very much.

[Ian Crossland]

You said Today is your 50th birthday.

[Phil Labonte]

Today is my 50th.

[Ian Crossland]

Your fifth son's heartbeat for the first time.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah. Today. Today is my 50th birthday. I tweeted this earlier. Today is my 50th birthday. And. And today, Sarah and I went and listened to our son's heartbeat for the very first time. And it was. It was moving. It was cool.

[Tim Pool]

You know what's really cool is that our kids are going to be friends.

[Phil Labonte]

They're gonna hang out, man. They're gonna hang.

[Tim Pool]

When. When you posted the thing on. It was, like, on Instagram, right?

[Phil Labonte]

Yep.

[Tim Pool]

And I showed Allison, and then she. She smiled. And then I was like, our kids are gonna be friends.

[Hannah Cox]

Wait, you just had a girl, right? Yeah.

[Phil Labonte]

Again.

[Hannah Cox]

Boyfriend, Girlfriend?

[Ian Crossland]

They're going to be married. How many parents go through that, where they're like, our kids are going to be married one day?

[Tim Pool]

Well, I mean, what's going to end up happening now is when they're both, like, in their late teens, someone's going to show them this episode, and they're going to be like, o. That's weird.

[Phil Labonte]

Pepper and Theodore.

[Tim Pool]

Is that his name?

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

Oh, wow.

[Ian Crossland]

Nice.

[Tim Pool]

All right. David Bricken says, who is this? What have you done with the real Ilad?

[Elad Eliyahu]

What. What's different? The suit.

[Ian Crossland]

Have you been humbled since you've been working at the. At the White House?

[Elad Eliyahu]

It's a great experience and great privilege for Caroline Levitt to have her new media initiative, and it's a good learning experience. The White House Correspondence association is very upset with. With what's going on there, but we can talk.

[Tim Pool]

Oh, good.

[Elad Eliyahu]

At another time.

[Tim Pool]

Oh, their tears. They bring me joy. The salt is an electrolyte elites. I went to a big news conference in Morocco. Show called News Exchange, and I was sitting on the stage talking about, like, new media and stuff, and everyone's wearing suits, and I'm just like, this and it was probably like several thousand people in this big room. And I said, you should all be fired. I was like, you lack the technical skills and the understanding of the modern media environment to actually report the news at the speeds that are required of it. And I was like, and if you run a newsroom and your people don't understand mobile technology and social media, fire them now because you can hire some 24 year olds at half the cost who are twice as good. They did not like me saying that. It's probably why they don't like me.

[Elad Eliyahu]

But you spoke truth, honestly.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah.

[Elad Eliyahu]

It's extremely true.

[Tim Pool]

Indeed. Let's grab some more chats from y'all. Jump Daddy says only service should guarantee citizenship. Mandatory inactive reserve every time you register to vote. Joining the military without reporting to any unit until war is declared. I asked on X, should only people who give public service be allowed to vote? And it was 80% no. I said only military veteran veterans, 80% no. And then I said, what about only net taxpayers? And that one's like 70%. Yes. However, most of the people who did respond didn't understand what a net taxpayer was. One person was like, I paid 200 bucks in taxes, so I get to vote. No, you don't. I think you have to pay something like 35,000 for the year before you're a net taxpayer. Is that what it is?

[Elad Eliyahu]

I think most people are net drags.

[Tim Pool]

They are. Are indeed. Only the top 20% actually pay taxpayers taxes. So that means you do pay taxes, but you get more than you're paying. So you are taking, you are, you're stealing. Actually, did you guys know that Waluigi is a libertarian? No, I'm not kidding. Yeah, there was a viral meme. Oh no, that's from. I think it's Mario Party or something like this. I don't know what it's from, but Walu Waluigi said a tax office. You mean an office for stealing my money or something like that?

[Hannah Cox]

Oh, you mean like the Mario Brothers.

[Tim Pool]

Yes.

[Hannah Cox]

I thought you meant the murderer.

[Phil Labonte]

No, Waluigi.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah, Waluigi's like bizarro world anti Luigi guy.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah. Waluigi Mangioni would be like this really peaceful, church going, man, loves his neighbors.

[Phil Labonte]

Libertarians can't deny the fact that there are a lot of people that are libertarians. Not saying all, but there are a lot of people that are libertarians because they have terrible opinions or they have terrible things they want to do and they just want it to be legal. So yeah.

[Hannah Cox]

Yes, I believe there's no denying that.

[Tim Pool]

The Libertarian Party exists for one reason. It's a consortium of people who want something disgusting to be legal. And I'm not kidding. The Mises Caucus is like, the largest faction that's the actual Libertarian Party, because the rest of them are just like, I can tell that you want to do something gross.

[Elad Eliyahu]

A Trojan horse for the left. So it feels. And I wanted to say, in the Mario world, Bowser is the true communist. Because when you land on the Bowser space and get a bowser revolution in, everybody's coins get split up equally.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh, brutal.

[Elad Eliyahu]

You guys.

[Tim Pool]

I don't know.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Party.

[Tim Pool]

No. The economics of. I got to be honest, there's some kind of weird economic system in the Mario world. Basically, the. The. The economics of the Mario world is that you run around and there's money just floating in the air.

[Phil Labonte]

The wall and coins show up. Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

You punch bricks to get paid, and then upon collecting 100, you just get to live twice.

[Phil Labonte]

You're.

[Elad Eliyahu]

You're not understanding, Tim. You're mining. They mine the coins, and it happens in reality there. Yeah. You hit bricks in real life, and then other minerals come out, and, you know, you look for rare earth minerals that we're struggling with now because of China, you know?

[Tim Pool]

Do you know what the actual story of Mario is?

[Elad Eliyahu]

No.

[Tim Pool]

When King Koopa, which is his actual name, invaded the mushroom kingdom, he transformed a bunch of the mushroom people into bricks. Indeed. Really?

[Ian Crossland]

All the bricks. Are those all mushroom people?

[Tim Pool]

Yeah.

[Phil Labonte]

Oh, brutal.

[Ian Crossland]

And Mario's just smashing them.

[Tim Pool]

I think what actually happened was they just made something up for the structure of the game. Like, they made the game, and Mario can punch bricks and they explode, and they're like, it's the mushroom people turn into bricks and giving Mario items. I guess. Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

I wonder what those coins represent. Are they from heaven that you get if.

[Tim Pool]

If you go on chat GPT and ask it to make a picture of someone punching bricks, half the time it will refuse because it keeps trying to draw Mario. I said, draw a picture of Donald Trump with a red hat on punching bricks. And it kept saying, this violates copyright infringement. I always thought he. And it. And it half renders the image, and it was Trump with a Mario hat on and white gloves. But I did finally get him to make one where it's just Trump at a brick wall punching it, and bricks are going flying.

[Ian Crossland]

I thought he always headbutted the bricks. And it was years later that I realized having his arm up like this.

[Tim Pool]

And, you know, when he throws fireballs, his hand goes up like this. Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

It's like he's.

[Tim Pool]

Because when I was. When I was little, everybody thought he was spitting them.

[Ian Crossland]

Yep.

[Tim Pool]

Because they come out where his mouth is, but his hand goes up like this. He's throwing them. All right, Michael. What's a cicirelli? Is that he said it. Hello, people. Thanks. Thanks crew for all the hard work. Also got my boonies boards of the weekend. And I'm very hyped about it. Having just discovered Andy Anderson. I know I'm old and worked and stopped skating in the 2000s. Be a friend. Tell friend something nice. Very cool. Glad to hear Andy Anderson is in fact one of the best. He's a very good pro skateboarder and I'm a big fan. And we got some. We're doing some new boonies graphics and I figured we'll just make a molan labe one.

[Phil Labonte]

Yay.

[Tim Pool]

I know. I was like, can we be as provocative as we can, but also as based as possible? I was like, we need to come up with like a good mollen lab board.

[Ian Crossland]

Provocatively based.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah. Because we. The 20th Amendment sold out. Oh, I'm loving this so much. There was there. Skateboarding is largely dead, but there's this online room like rumor mill publication called shredder. And they rub wrote about me, I don't know why. And said that despite the tariffs, boonies boards are still 55 bucks, which is true because we make them in America. And then you get comments from people being like, he ain't selling none of those. I am. I am. I gotta tell you guys, we have sold hundreds of thousands. In fact, our best month was like a hundred thousand dollars in board sales. The 20th Amendment skateboard, which is chickens being necessary to the security of a free state. The right of the people to keep barren breed chickens shall not be infringed. Changed. We sold those out like two or three times over. And that's because people. Because chickens are awesome.

[Hannah Cox]

People like chickens.

[Tim Pool]

Indeed. And then I was like, we have the right to arm bears, which sold out several times over. And step on snuck and find out is our top seller. And we. We've sold. We sell those out like crazy. So I'm glad people are getting skateboards. I hope people are riding skateboards. It's also totally acceptable if you hang them up because they're cool as well. But it's going really well in this end. And I'm actually. We were. You know, it's not. It's not the most profitable business. I would argue we do make good amount of Money. It costs more money to run but I'm hoping that the way things are going it's going to be good. And I will announce as soon as we wrap this show the park is being completely redone.

[Ian Crossland]

How so?

[Tim Pool]

The construction crew is already here.

[Ian Crossland]

Oh really? What are you doing?

[Tim Pool]

They're redoing the whole skate park.

[Ian Crossland]

You have a plan. Obviously a plan. You have a.

[Tim Pool]

Designed by Cody McIntyre himself. It is going to be one and Julie Julia, Julia Bruckler and Cody both designed this and it is going to be one of the best little. It's a smallish but it's going to be a really great.

[Hannah Cox]

I mean I thought it was really cool coming in so I can't even imagine next level. I was really impressed.

[Tim Pool]

It's going to be bigly done bigly. All right. Hitman Zarelli says if El Salvador does the he. Haha. I'm just gonna say it 1 trillion as a thank you also congratulations Phil. Saw your Instagram post. Just wanting. Just waiting for. For Ian now.

[Phil Labonte]

Well come on buddy.

[Tim Pool]

That, that, that, that Jack's post was funny. I agree with the Democrats. I believe they should all go to the El Salvador in prison. That's a good one. All of them. Riley Moore went. Riley Moore went and toured the. The prison and you know we, we've been actually trying to get a sit down with the president of El Salvador because we are huge fans of naive Bukele.

[Ian Crossland]

President B.

[Tim Pool]

President B man. First of all just on the technological front with bitcoin masterfully done. Yeah he increased the, the, the. The GDP or the net worth of his citizenry massively. I think they all got like 20 bucks worth of bitcoin and bitcoin's obviously only gone up, it's fluctuated but they kept buying and they have their reserve which is fantastic.

[Ian Crossland]

I think he's a really good example. And I'm sorry to interrupt because it sound like you had a little bit more to say there or more.

[Tim Pool]

I was going to say that he cleaned up the streets. Yeah.

[Ian Crossland]

He's an example of use authoritarianism in a good way. From that right now looking at it, it looks like he's done some good things for society but he used a.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Very hard knock on him. Is that he constitutional rights or humanitarian rights? Not all people got due process in El Salvador for the people that he arrested but he justifies it by saying that the ends justify the means. And they were the worst. They had the highest murder rate among the Americas and now have among the lowest.

[Tim Pool]

They in fact are one of the safest countries in the world. Now, I think his perspective would be.

[Ian Crossland]

Invaluable for an American audience to understand the mind of someone that had to become authoritarian to a system gone wrong.

[Tim Pool]

Like Abraham Lincoln, kind of similar to Abe. So Nayib Bukele was dealing with criminal factions, gangs with international power, guns, etc, operating in his country and subjugating his people. And he said, we're at war. It's easy to say we should uphold all of these things and blah, blah, blah. And then insurgents come and bomb your house, kill you in your sleep, like they do with the cartels. And people try to run for office. When you are. When you are at war. And I'm not saying we're at war. I'm saying the El Salvador was. Was in, in some state of war with these narco gangs in Mexico, what do they do? We're going to run for office, and then we're going to show you. And then the mayor's found strung up, hanging from a street light. Light. Naya Bukele says we have no choice. We're going to crush these gangs, lock them up, and save our country. And then he did. And it is it. We lament any innocent people who get wrapped up in a conflict, but it's. The unfortunate reality is there are certain circumstances where it's easy to say and hard to do in a country where criminal gangs will murder you for trying to legislatively stop them. And they're subjugating millions of people. People. We can choose to do nothing or we can choose to save our country. Sorry, it's. It is, I believe, infinitely naive to be like, no, no, no, no. We should just ask the gangs nicely. And then you wake up and there's a gun pointed to your head, and they say, nice knowing you. How many mayors were killed in Mexico in the past year? I don't know. Some young woman ran for office.

[Phil Labonte]

36.

[Tim Pool]

36. There was a young woman. She was in her 20s. She ran in a small town, and she said she was going to stop the gangs. A day later, she was dead. And there. People have been like, well, but we have no choice. You know, we can't. We can't violate people's rights. And it's like, indeed, we don't want to. Welcome to. Welcome to conflict. I wonder if there's no easy reality.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I wonder if Riley caught up with the Maryland men over there in El Salvador.

[Tim Pool]

I wonder why it is that Catalonia just never seems to be able to get independence.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Yeah, I don't. I don't know enough about their independence, but yeah.

[Tim Pool]

Are you familiar with Catalonia at all? Familiar, really?

[Hannah Cox]

Nope.

[Tim Pool]

So we're one of the only on my radar at all, if not the only ever anarchist state and where that last couple years before they were crushed, the Spanish, Spanish, Spanish came in and said, we're going to take over. And they were like, hold on, we're going to have a committee meeting to determine whether or not you're allowed to. And they said, okay, ban bang. And then they would. Now they own it and they protest sometimes, but the state is like, good luck.

[Phil Labonte]

Napoleon said, I saw the crown of France laying on the ground, so I picked it up with my sword. The point is I picked it up with my sword like you. The idea, like the idea that libertarians have is great, but it's similar to the idea that communists have, like right. On the surface it's great, great. But someone that disagrees, that is willing to exercise force, will take power. So you don't get the, the anarchist society.

[Hannah Cox]

But to be fair, not all libertarians are anarchists. I'm an anarchist.

[Phil Labonte]

No, no, you're. You're 100. Right.

[Hannah Cox]

I think you have to differentiate there. I would agree with you. If you get into full anarchy with libertarians, it's very. Has a lot in common with communism. Yeah, a whole lot in common. So.

[Tim Pool]

But you know, the question then becomes for anybody who's seeking to secure a country or a people, people is you look at El Salvador and the criticisms that naive Bukele got, but he did it. Crime is done. People are living in peace.

[Hannah Cox]

Yeah. I think that you have to have a national defense, you have to have a strong military, you have to have a policing system, you have to have borders system. You have.

[Tim Pool]

Was Abraham. Was Abraham Lincoln wrong to suspend habeas corpus in a corridor from DC to pa?

[Hannah Cox]

I don't know the details of that. To get super in the weeds with it. I think Abraham Lincoln certainly violated the Constitution at times. I, I think the biggest issue I have with Abraham Lincoln is that states should be allowed to leave. That was always the agreement. Is that what I don't.

[Tim Pool]

It's not in the Constitution.

[Hannah Cox]

It's not, it's not necessarily in the Constitution, but I feel like that is how we were supposed to proceed and I think we'd be better off now as a nation if states could leave.

[Tim Pool]

Ulysses S. Grant wrote a great letter after the war and he said that it is the right of all peoples to challenge who rules over them. But if you lose, then you will be ruled over. By your super superiors. And he went on to say that we of this nation sacrificed our blood and treasure to admit you to this, to this nation, and you sought to steal that from us. Notably with Texas and Mexico, it was a great conflict between the u. S. Texas breaks away, obviously, Mexico's like, hey, what. What the hell, man? You can't do that. Then Texas wants to join the United States. And they're like, this is a huge risk to us if you do because you were previously Mexican territory. Texas joins, and then later is like, now we out. And they're like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. We sacrificed so much so you can make this move, and now you're gonna turn on us. That's why they said, you can't just leave. We've paid everything for this. And so there's a difficult question. Abraham Lincoln arrested about a third of the Maryland legislature. Was he right to do that?

[Hannah Cox]

No, he was right to do it. I mean, you could, I guess, argue that the ends justify the means in your book, and you can make a case for that. And of course, when you are in times of war, War, it's very childish, I think, to suggest that people are going to always follow the rules or play by the constitution or stay principled. Obviously, that never happens in times of actual war. But was that absolutely necessary for him to do? Was he right in the means or the end goal that he was trying to pursue? I don't think so. I think the country, again, would function better if, in order to join as a state, we have contracts. Sure. Like what you're seeing with Texas. We have contracts. We have clawbacks. We have maybe fees and penalties you have to pay to leave.

[Tim Pool]

But.

[Hannah Cox]

But should we be forced to coexist? Should I, in Georgia have to coexist long term with people in California? Does that actually make sense for us to be a united country with people whose views are that vastly different, Whose cultures are that. That different? Does that actually. Is that plausible over time? It probably is not.

[Tim Pool]

The questions I wonder about that is, I wonder what would have happened in World War I and 2 if the United States was actually two different countries.

[Phil Labonte]

Countries it like. It wouldn't have been. It wouldn't have been the United States if. Or at least the would be.

[Tim Pool]

It would have been. It would have been the confederate states and the union.

[Phil Labonte]

Well, there's. There's. There's a possibility that it wouldn't have even been that because there are. There were other superpowers in the world at the time. After the Civil war, it's possible that the Spanish come over France come over there. There's all kinds of, of unknowns that would have presented himself. The idea that well there, if the, if the, the. If the south had won and it was the Confederate and the United States and they would have been independent countries and remained so there. There's, there's no reason to believe that, you know, history would have been totally different.

[Hannah Cox]

And I don't think countries have a right to exist forever. I think that people should be able to overthrow their governments, they should be able to create new structures, they should be able to get rid of things that don't work anymore and seek out better arrangements. So I don't even like that whole mentality that because this country exists as it is right now now, that that must be preserved at all costs.

[Tim Pool]

I think the, the interesting thing about politics and political philosophy is that there is no, it's not a zero sum game. There's no end result. There's no reality by which any political, political ideology achieves its nexus. Libertarianism, in the way you describe it will ultimately lead to the destruction of a civilization. The same way as fascism or communism or any other system would. Liberal democracies allow for evil to arise and then destroy it from within. Libertarian societies would break apart and then allow outside aggressors who are authoritarian to come in and crush them. Fascistic regimes, authoritarian regimes ultimately crumble from.

[Phil Labonte]

Within from not always the, the, the fascism that Pinochet had that actually kind of dissolved by people being elected. I believe he stepped, he. He left office because the, the. The actual country was very successful under his, his fascism. He was brutal and he did. He killed a lot of people. But after his, after he left like he, the people remained. It went to a democracy. If I understand it seems like fascism.

[Ian Crossland]

Is the most stable form of government. Not the best necessarily, but the most stable.

[Tim Pool]

It's also the shortest live of all governments.

[Ian Crossland]

We've kind of been in since the Federal Reserve. We've sort of been in this fascist system.

[Tim Pool]

We have not.

[Phil Labonte]

No, we.

[Elad Eliyahu]

What is fascism? Fascism.

[Tim Pool]

Fascism is a system of authoritarian rule with strong traditional moral foundations.

[Elad Eliyahu]

And I'd say mostly state run. There's also state authoritarian.

[Ian Crossland]

Yeah. And a lot of modern fascism incorporates the corporations. So it's the state and the corporations lucrative merger of the state.

[Tim Pool]

No, that's actually just a philosophical interpretation.

[Ian Crossland]

That was Mussolini's take on the actual.

[Tim Pool]

Function of fascism was nationalistic pride, traditional morals and authoritarian state run economies, economics. And so it's one of the shortest lived forms of government. Nazism Overlapped quite a bit, which is also one of the shortest forms of government.

[Phil Labonte]

Nazism. But nazism is like all. All fascist. All Nazism is fascist, but like not all fascism is nazism. The principal difference is not nearly as bad as Nazism.

[Tim Pool]

Principal difference between the communists and the fascists was progressive moral ideology versus traditional moral ideology. Yeah, but we're gonna go to that uncensored call and show my friend. So smash that like button. Share the show with everyone you know. Subscribe if you haven't already. Tell your friends about the show. If you do like it. We're gonna go to rumble.com timcast irl for that uncensored calling show. You gotta sign up, use promo code TIM10. And you not only get access to the uncensored calling show, you get the Green Room podcast every day, Monday through Friday, except for. So not every day, just the weekdays. And that's up on rumble.com timcast IRL in the playlist section. Don't miss our episodes behind the scenes. We're gearing up for the show and we've got documentaries coming out. We've got two feature length already on our page and we've got one coming out in June, potentially another coming out in the fall. We're covering border crisis and human trafficking and we're covering transhumanism and still more to come. So smash that like button. Share the show with everyone you know. You can follow me on X and Instagram at Timcast. Hannah, do you want to shout anything out?

[Hannah Cox]

Yeah. Well, thanks for having me. It's been great to be here. People can find me at Hannah Decocks on those platforms. Hannah Cox on YouTube. I need to get on Rumble. Guys, guys, I've got to make that happen. So follow in your footsteps, Tim.

[Tim Pool]

Do it. Right on.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Hey, everybody, My name is Aad Elaho. I'm the White House correspondent here at Tim Cast. You could find me at Alad Elaho on Instagram and Twitter. I wanted to say again, Phil, congratulations on hopefully inshah the child to be and 50 years old. Yeah, that's crazy because you look very young and handsome, you two. For guys who are like 40, 50, you guys are young looking because you.

[Ian Crossland]

Don'T want to talk about Israel, Palestine, which we should have got into all episodes.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I don't like how you just dropped it in there earlier too much. I don't want to make everything about Israel. No, also about Israel at the White House because I don't want to be accused of that by people like you.

[Ian Crossland]

Okay, you did the right thing.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Go ahead.

[Ian Crossland]

Hey, I'm Ian Crossland. Catch me on the Internet.

[Phil Labonte]

Philly I am Phil that remains on Twix. I'm Phil that remains official on Instagram. The band is all that remains. A new record dropped on January 31st first. It's entitled Anti Fragile. You can check it out on all the streaming platforms and on YouTube. Don't forget the left lane is for crime.

[Tim Pool]

We will see you all [e-mail] Timcast IRL in about 30 seconds. Thanks for hanging out. SA.