IRAN STRIKE FAILED Claims LEAKED Intel Report, Trump Admin DENIES Report w/ Batya Ungar-Sargon

Summary

Timcast IRL Podcast Summary
Episode: IRAN STRIKE FAILED Claims LEAKED Intel Report, Trump Admin DENIES Report w/ Batya Ungar-Sargon
Release Date: June 25, 2025
Host: Tim Pool
Guest: Batya Ungar-Sargon

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Introduction and Advertisements (00:00 - 05:58)

The episode begins with a series of advertisements promoting T-Mobile's latest iPhone offer, Progressive Insurance, and other sponsors. These segments are interspersed with light-hearted interactions between Tim Pool and guests, setting a relaxed tone before delving into the main discussion.

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Leaked Intel Report on Iranian Strikes (05:58 - 12:38)

Tim Pool opens the discussion by addressing a leaked Pentagon intelligence report suggesting that recent U.S. airstrikes on Iranian nuclear sites were unsuccessful, resulting in only a temporary setback of Iran's nuclear program. He states:

"A leaked intel report suggests that the Iranian strikes failed after 14 bunker busters were dropped. The facility was only set back a few months in terms of nuclear enrichment and weapons development." [11:19]

However, the Trump administration vehemently denies these claims, asserting that the strikes "totally obliterated" the targets. Tim Pool expresses concern that public acceptance of the failure could embolden hawkish factions to escalate military actions:

"My fear is if the argument comes out and it is publicly accepted that the strikes failed, then you are going to see the warmongers come out in full force saying, well, now we have no choice. We have to scale these things up." [12:38]

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Impact of Social Media and AI Censorship (12:38 - 30:00)

The conversation shifts to the influence of social media platforms and artificial intelligence on public opinion, particularly regarding Israel. Tim Pool introduces Venice AI as an uncensored alternative to mainstream AI services, criticizing platforms like ChatGPT for potential censorship and data exploitation:

"Meta retargets us based on our browsing and engagement history. Why do we assume AI is going to be any different?" [05:58]

Batya Ungar-Sargon and other guests discuss how social media algorithms and bot campaigns are skewing public sentiment against Israel. They highlight how misinformation and coordinated online harassment are shaping perceptions, especially among younger demographics.

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Anti-Israel Sentiment and Political Shifts (30:00 - 55:00)

Batya Ungar-Sargon delves into the growing anti-Israel sentiment within both the far-left and far-right spectrums. She argues that:

"A lot of these posts are just smarmy and snide. Meanwhile, a lot of these posts are just smarmy and snide... prominent personalities on the conservative side who have recently come out as Israel is not doing us any favors are getting millions upon millions of views." [25:56]

The discussion also covers the impact of this sentiment on political landscapes, particularly in New York's Democratic primary. Libby Emmons notes the rise of socialist candidates like Zoran Mamdani, pointing out his anti-Israel stance and its influence on his leading poll numbers:

"Zoran Mamdani is winning by nine points with 43.1 to Cuomo's 34%. Looks like the anti-Israel Democratic socialist is going to win." [76:02]

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Republican Party Dynamics and MAGA Influence (55:00 - 75:00)

Tim Pool and guests explore the internal dynamics of the Republican Party, focusing on figures like Congressman Thomas Massie and the influence of MAGA ideology. Elad Eliyahu contends that:

"Thomas Massie is a grandstander that votes with the Democrats, especially at a time like this. It's frankly ridiculous. He's anti MAGA agenda." [44:03]

The conversation highlights the tension between traditional Republican values and the emerging MAGA-driven agenda, questioning the future direction of the party and its support for Israel.

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Effects of Socialism on Support for Israel (75:00 - 95:00)

The panel discusses the correlation between rising socialist sentiments in the United States and declining support for Israel. Batya Ungar-Sargon asserts:

"Fighting socialism and socialists in our country will correlate aggressively with support for Israel." [46:58]

Tim Pool challenges this by arguing that the relationship is more nuanced, suggesting that combating socialism alone may not directly restore support for Israel. The debate underscores the complexity of ideological influences on foreign policy perspectives.

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Marriage Trends and Societal Shifts (95:00 - 100:00)

The discussion briefly veers into societal changes, particularly shifts in marriage trends among American women. An article from the Wall Street Journal is referenced, highlighting:

"American women are giving up on marriage. Major demographic shifts have put men and women on divergent paths. That's left more women resigned to being single." [93:15]

Tim Pool and Batya Ungar-Sargon debate the implications of these trends, tying them to broader themes of economic stability, gender roles, and societal expectations.

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Conclusion and Final Thoughts (100:00 - End)

As the episode wraps up, the guests reflect on the interconnectedness of political ideologies, foreign policy, and societal changes. Tim Pool emphasizes the need for nuanced understanding and strategic communication to address misinformation and its impact on public opinion.

"The issue is, what are our risk assessments? What is the risk that if we intervene with B2 bombers and drop 14 bunker busters on a foreign country, that we drag other nations into the war and trigger the arms race itself?" [62:14]

Batya Ungar-Sargon concludes with optimism about changing domestic conversations and international perceptions regarding U.S. foreign policy:

"I think we've changed the conversation domestically and I think we've changed the conversation internationally." [70:35]

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Notable Quotes

• Tim Pool [12:38]:
  "My fear is if the argument comes out and it is publicly accepted that the strikes failed, then you are going to see the warmongers come out in full force saying, well, now we have no choice. We have to scale these things up."

• Batya Ungar-Sargon [25:56]:
  "A lot of these posts are just smarmy and snide... those are bot campaigns."

• Elad Eliyahu [44:03]:
  "Thomas Massie is a grandstander that votes with the Democrats, especially at a time like this. It's frankly ridiculous. He's anti MAGA agenda."

• Batya Ungar-Sargon [46:58]:
  "Fighting socialism and socialists in our country will correlate aggressively with support for Israel."

• Tim Pool [93:09]:
  "Hard times make strong men. Strong men make good times. Good times make white liberal women. And white liberal women make hard times."

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Key Takeaways

• Leaked Intel Report: Claims that recent U.S. strikes on Iranian nuclear sites failed, a point denied by the Trump administration.
• Social Media Influence: AI censorship and bot campaigns are shaping and skewing public sentiment against Israel, especially among younger demographics.
• Political Shifts: Rising anti-Israel sentiment within both far-left and far-right groups is influencing electoral outcomes, exemplified by New York's Democratic primary.
• Republican Party Tensions: Internal conflicts within the GOP, particularly regarding MAGA ideology and support for Israel.
• Socialism's Impact: A growing correlation between socialist sentiments in the U.S. and declining support for Israel, though this relationship is debated.
• Societal Changes: Shifts in marriage trends reflect broader economic and cultural transformations affecting gender roles and societal expectations.

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This summary encapsulates the primary discussions and viewpoints expressed during the episode, providing a comprehensive overview for those who haven't listened. Notable quotes and timestamps enhance the understanding of key arguments and insights shared by Tim Pool and his guests.

Transcript

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[Libby Emmons]

I feel like I have to give.

[Tim Pool]

You something in return for karma. That's okay.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I don't really have much in my purse. Oh, let's see. Hand sanitizer.

[Tim Pool]

It's lavender. I'm good. Seriously.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Let me check this pocket.

[Libby Emmons]

Oh, mints.

[Tim Pool]

Really, I'm fine. Oh, I have raisins. I'm a mom.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Wait, wait one sec.

[Tim Pool]

I've got cupcakes in the car.

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And the more you cover, the more you can save. Amica. Empathy is our best policy. A leaked intel report suggests that the Iranian strikes failed after 14 bunker busters were dropped. The facility was only set back a few months in terms of nuclear enrichment and weapons development. Now, the White House and the Trump administration are denying this claim, saying this is totally wrong. The question is, why does this assessment exist? And it sounds like from the Trump administration it does exist. They're just saying they disagree with it. They feel that it is an incorrect assessment. My fear in this is if the argument comes out and it is publicly accepted that the strikes failed, then you are going to see the warmongers come out in full force saying, well, now we have no choice. We have to scale these things up. In the meantime, however, it looks like the cease fire is holding, which is good news. And Donald Trump this morning had one of the best lines of A president ever when he just said, you got two countries they've been fighting for so long they don't know what the they are doing. And he dropped that F bomb. And so we appreciate it. I appreciate that. So we're talking about that. We got a bunch more before we get started, my friends. We got a great sponsor for you guys. It's Venice AI. This is interesting. It's a, it's a new AI. It's uncensored. Check this out, Chad. GPT has the former director of the NSA sitting on their board right now. Edward Snowden called this a willful, calculated betrayal of the rights of every person on earth. I don't want to say your Amazon device listens to us. I even had to do that because if I say it, it's going to trigger recommending products based on conversations. Meta retargets us based on our browsing and engagement history. Why do we assume AI is going to be any different? It took us all far too long to truly understand what social media companies were doing with our data last decade. Are we really going to make that same mistake again? OpenAI has hinted they might start requiring their users to provide a government issued id. Would you feel comfortable having to give your ID to Chat GPT to be able to use it? I mean, you know, if you're signing up for it and you're paying, then they've got your information. As it is, Venice utilizes leading open source AI models to deliver text code and image generation to your web browser. No downloads, no installations or anything private and permissionless. They don't spy on you or censor the AI. Messages are encrypted and your conversation history is stored only in your browser. AI can be extremely valuable, but we shouldn't need to give up our privacy to use it. And, and you know, full disclosure, I usually use. We use ChatGPT on this show as well. But I'm going to give Venice a shot because, yeah, I kind of don't like how creepy it can be when, well, let's just say these companies, they know when you go to the bathroom. I don't know, maybe I shouldn't say that, but hey, so let's, let's do this. I'm going to ask Venice, why are you a better AI? And, and it works. Hey, look at that. So they've got their pro plan and unlocks the full platform and features including PDF, uploads, summaries or insights. The ability to turn off safe mode for unhindered image generation. The ability to change how Venice interacts with you by modifying the system prompt. Limitless text, high image limits. I mean, that's another big factor in a lot of these different AI services. They limit what you can ask it. You know, the other day when the bombs dropped on Iran, I asked ChatGPT to give me a summary and an image and it refused, saying, you have it's. I said I can't help you with that. Said why? And it said, you have asked an inflammatory and false, you know, question and we will not. I'm not kidding. It actually said something like that. And of course it was true news. So Venice says I'm better because I don't censor my responses. I have a wide range of knowledge. I'm designed to be engaging and pleasant or like that. Respecting privacy doesn't have any ethical restrictions. So it can provide more raw and unfiltered perspectives. So, you know, not woke can handle difficult topics consistent in responses, can generate in multiple languages and provide details. It's got a big, huge list actually. So give it a shot. Go to Venice AI. I think you can actually use Venice AI slash Tim and you'll get 20 off your pro plan. Check it out. We think it's pretty cool. Don't forget to also check out cast brew.com and buy coffee. We got all the great flavors. Appalachian Nights, Ian's Graphene Dream. We've got Phil's Two Weeks till Christmas Even though get it, it's been six, seven months now. But you know, and don't forget of course to smash that like button. Share the show with everyone you know. Joining us tonight to talk about this and so much more is Batya Anger Sargon.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Hi, Tim.

[Tim Pool]

Who are you? What do you do?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I'm a journalist. I'm an author. I'm the author of two books. One is called Bad How Woke Media Is Undermining Democracy. The other one is called Second how the Elites Betrayed America's Working Men and Women. I'm known as the MAGA lefty and I'm really honored to be here. Thanks for having me.

[Tim Pool]

Right on. Well, glad to have you. We got Elad hanging out.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Good evening, everybody. I am Elad Eliyahu, the White House correspondent here at Tim Cast. Hey, Libby.

[Libby Emmons]

Hey, Elad. I'm Libby Emmons. I'm glad to be here hanging out with everybody.

[Phil Labonte]

Hello everybody. My name is Phil Labonte. I'm the lead singer of the heavy metal band all that Remains. I'm an anti communist and counter revolutionary. Let's get into it.

[Tim Pool]

Here's the news from the Daily Mail. White House furious at top secret leak on Iran nuclear site bombing as Trump faces impeachment calls. Additionally, the impeachment failed, but we'll get to that in a bit. A leaked intel assessment claiming Trump strike on Iran did not destroy Tehran's nuclear program is flat out wrong, the White House has claimed. The report, conducted by the Defense Intelligence Agency and leaked by cnn, claims Saturday's airstrike on three Iranian nuclear sites only set the country's program back by months. Instead of completely destroying it. Trump claims the strikes completely and totally obliterated the statement, echoed by White House Press Secretary Carolyn Levitt, who dismissed the assessment as a clear attempt to demean President Trump. Everyone knows what happens when you drop 14 30,000 pound bombs perfectly on their targets. Total obliteration. Now I don't, I don't, I don't know if I have the post actually pulled up, but I think, I think the statements from the White House basically lay out that this assessment actually exists. It's a real assessment. So the question then is why was it leaked? Who leaked it and is Trump correct? Now here's what I want to say about all of these stories. Trump is the source. He is the primary source as the commander in chief. So it is strange to me that CNN would run a story saying some Randall, random low level guy like leaked this report to us and we believe this over the actual president and the administration. That being said, I understand administrations can lie, but for any layperson, you're going to be looking at random anonymous guy versus the President's administration. I don't know why in this instance you would doubt the primary source versus random anonymous source. You have no idea who it even is.

[Libby Emmons]

Well, the thing too is this was, this assessment was there were seven sources that were, there were like three sources and people were briefed on the report, but the report wasn't leaked to cnn. CNN did not see the report. So they only heard about the pieces of the report that these sources wanted them to hear about.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I've become so cynical of political motivations behind leaks that it's, it makes, it's, it's hard to believe what people, what's actually true and what is just being used as an angle. A lot of these people in the administration, I mean everybody involved in politics, a lot of these people who become sources for journalists seem to have an ax to grind.

[Libby Emmons]

Yeah, and people are out for Tulsi Gabbard. They want her out. Like they've been messing with her whole intelligence situation for a while. They had the flip flopping FBI reports about potential terror cells in the US they were going after Joe Kent by leaking some stuff. I mean there are I think elements in the media and out there, I don't know who they are, who really want Tulsi Gabbard out of her position.

[Phil Labonte]

Is it, is it realistic to think that they're going to be able to influence the President to remove Tulsi? I mean he, he is, you know, it's not like he's afraid of firing people. It's not like he's afraid of making changes on the fly.

[Libby Emmons]

But I don't think he'd fire Tulsi Gabbard.

[Tim Pool]

But I don't know if this is some low level person apparently leaked this.

[Libby Emmons]

That's what Caroline leave it said.

[Tim Pool]

Right. And so my question is why? And my concern is they're going to claim, ah, well, if the strikes didn't work, we got to go in, don't we?

[Phil Labonte]

Well, I mean look, at the end of the day you don't. Just because these strikes didn't work doesn't mean it calls for an invasion. Maybe it calls for a whole nother sortie of the exact same strikes.

[Libby Emmons]

We also don't know that the 14, 30, 30,000 pound ordinances did not destroy it. Yeah, we don't know that. We know that CNN had three people, low level people apparently at the White House tell them that they saw a draft, an early version of a draft report. Right, like who of people who didn't check it out. They're just looking at images, they're just looking at graphics.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I don't think this is going to have a big impact to me. You look at who is sharing this online and the joy and the glee.

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[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

They have that. They can smear something on this incredible moment for the President. It's cnn, it's liberal journalists, it's Democrats, and of course it came from low level members of the deep state. This is not gonna have an actual foreign policy impact. This was just like rage bait for people who cannot stand the fact that the president pulled off something incredible this week. They cannot stand the fact that what he did was something that neither side could have pulled off. This whole peace through strength thing where you protect the American people without losing a single soldier. So I think that this is really just like this. This is like a cultural artifact of the moment more than it is actually even like journalism or designed to have actually a foreign policy impact.

[Tim Pool]

I would, I would also just intentionally try to impugn the honor of Natasha Bertrand.

[Libby Emmons]

Very easily done.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah. Because she's been involved in a bunch of these stories accusing Trump of being, you know, Russian or whatever. And, you know, that was all. So I was not surprised when I pulled up the CNN story saying, actually the Iranian sites are totally fine. Oh. And I'm like, oh, look, it's Natasha Bertrand. Yeah.

[Phil Labonte]

I mean, unsurprising motivated reasoning is definitely not out of the question. You know.

[Libby Emmons]

Yeah, she's the one who penned that political report in the first place with the 51. Oh, yeah, she penned the political report. And that that report still has not been corrected or updated. And the other thing about that report that cannot ever be forgotten is that it was Antony Blinken with the Biden campaign who contacted one of, like, main guy, the main intel officer who worked on that report and said, hey, don't you think this kind of has the hallmarks of Russian disinformation? And the guy was like, yeah, it totally does. And then he got 50 of his friends and they put the letter together. And the letter didn't say also. I mean, when you look at the letter, the letter did not say that the Hunter Biden laptop is Russian disinformation. It said it had all the hallmarks of Russian disinformation. And then everybody ran with it. Jen Psaki, Russian disinfo they all did that. None of them have taken their tweets down. And literally everyone who reported on that like it was true and refused to report on the Hunter Biden laptop story because you have to Remember, they all came out and said they would not report on it. And here's why. Npr, cbs, New York Times, all the rest of them, they all ended up with egg on their faces. And it was all Natasha Bertrand's fault.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Okay, so speaking of egg on the face, here's my question. So we saw Trump basically, you know, metaphorically give the middle finger both to the like, neocon regime change side of the influencer sphere and to the anti Israel isolationist side and do his own thing, which kind of split the difference and said, look, we're going to protect our people, but we're not going to war, we're not doing regime change. After the peace deal was signed or whatever, the ceasefire came into effect. Suddenly you had both the isolationists and the neocons coming out and being like, thank God he pulled it off. Thank God I wasn't wrong. We were worried. We were worried. We didn't abandon him, we weren't against him. We were, thank God, thank God they're all trying to act like they hadn't actually done what they had done, which is like completely come out against his agenda. What do you guys think of that?

[Tim Pool]

His agenda? In which regard?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Like, okay, the isolationists wanted him to do nothing and then I wanted him to do nothing you want him to do. I also was not, I was not in favor initially of the strikes. I was too worried about our service members in the area. Thank God nothing happened to them. But they wanted him to tell the Israelis, you're on your own. Like not even give them refueling assistance and intelligence assistance. And then the neocons wanted like full on regime change, you know.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

And when boots on the ground and when it became clear that wasn't gonna happen, like they started to get agitated and be like, oh my gosh, I can't believe we're gonna leave this hanging. Like, this is our one opportunity, blah, blah, blah. But now that the dust has settled, both sides are trying to be like, I'm not unhappy. I was never angry. Me. What me. I'm thrilled with how this, this is how I would have wanted. You know, like there's this weird, like, I think. Cause they realized that like 80% of Republicans were like, oh no, this is exactly what we want. Like, this is the peace through strength that we voted for. Think people are going to have this feeling of like, there's going to be like a lingering, like, like a patina of betrayal on the people who turned on him and who came out against him, or you think they'll just get immediately reabsorbed into.

[Tim Pool]

I think it gets reabsorbed. But it really does depend on if this holds, and I hope it does. You know, I was talking to Dave Smith earlier, and he's very, very Israel. Critical of Israel very much. Doesn't want to be involved in these. In these foreign wars and all that. And he had a reasonable take. Hey, if this cease fire holds, then I'm happy. Like, I'm happy to be wrong. Like, nobody wants to be. No sane person wants to be. Like, I'd rather be right. It's like, oh, you want the entire region to destabilize now so you can say, told you so.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

So did he redact his apology for voting for Trump?

[Tim Pool]

He's. Dave sort of did.

[Phil Labonte]

Did he?

[Tim Pool]

He said, you know, everybody's saying, here's what he did. He's. I asked him, do you voted for Trump? He said, yes. I said, you regret it? And he goes, everybody's mad because I said I regretted it. But, you know, what I'm saying now is I vote for the guy. And where we are is where we are. And so I think not remembering literally every word that he said, the general idea was Trump didn't do the worst thing that everyone thought was gonna happen. Everybody thought this was the moment of great betrayal. It seems like Trump was trying to take the minimalist approach. The neocons are screaming, but they're going to get a nuke. The anti interventions are saying, don't get involved at all. And he's like, we'll bomb those sites and then we're done. That's why he got super pissed this morning and said, you know, they don't f. They're doing because he doesn't want. I told him, dave, I hope Trump takes away from this. You cannot win this. You're going to piss off tons of people no matter what you do. So I hope Trump's takeaway from this was don't listen to the regime change people. Don't listen to the people saying, literally, do nothing. You did the minimum. And now everyone can. Everyone can be happy with their vanilla pudding. To answer the question about Dave, I think Dave is kind of happy with his vanilla pudding. You know what I mean? Like, okay, I was pissed, but now I'm not so mad because we may get away from this without this being as bad as I thought, which actually means Trump is a pretty good president.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

So there's this quote from J.D. vance. He gave this great talk at the Quincy Institute, I think it's called, in 2014, 2024, in May. So I guess it was kind of right before he became. Was that.

[Libby Emmons]

Yeah, he became the convention in August, in, yeah, July, I think.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

And he, it's, it's a really great talk. And he explains like, basically from his point of view, like what a foreign policy designed to protect the interests of the middle class would look like. And he said it is obvious that our foreign policy should be designed around the recognition that the moral intuitions that matter are the moral intuitions of the American citizens. And I think that is so accurate and so true and just inherently a moral correct way to see what a nation's foreign policy should look like. It should reflect the moral intuitions of the citizenry. It happens to be. A lot of people in the isolationist camp do not want to admit it, but the moral intuitions of the American people, the majority of the American people, if not the vast majority of the American people, are very closely aligned with Israel. Like that is, you stop a normie American. And their moral intuitions are pretty aligned with the idea of having a strong, pretty independent sovereign ally in the region who fights people who hate us. And I think that's kind of where the isolationists went a little too far is in doubting A, that Trump knew his base and B, that he could pull off something like this and C, in doubting that the base should have their desires enacted in their form.

[Tim Pool]

But I think this is changing. I think Israel's support is gone in 10 or 20 years.

[Libby Emmons]

Why do you think that?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yeah, why do you think that?

[Tim Pool]

Let's, let's, let's use this story as a launching point. It does seem like a hard sell because we do have a lot. We normally we line all the stories up and we have a lot to talk about with the war, but we got the story from Fox News. Chicago Tribune warns New York to avoid socialist mayoral candidate after mistake. Brandon Johnson. That's right. Ladies and gentlemen, New York is having a Democratic primary and this Zoran Mamdani is, I believe he's a democratic socialist.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Yes. Correct.

[Tim Pool]

Yes. He's also. I don't want to, I don't speak out of turn, but my, I, my understanding is he's anti Israel.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Very fair to say.

[Tim Pool]

Okay, fair, Fair to say. Is it fair to. But would you characterize it more strongly than that? A lot?

[Elad Eliyahu]

No, I think anti Israel is fair. I think he. What's become a big deal in New York and around Israel specifically is that within many of the anti Israel protests in the city, they chant to globalize the so called intifada yeah, Some people view that as a tepid call for violence against Jews. He came out in support, as I understand of the phrase. He wouldn't condemn it. And he thinks he's, I think he said something along the lines of there being like legitimate usage of the phrase and it depends how you interpret it.

[Tim Pool]

So before we get into all the nuances of what's going on in New York, the fact that this guy is now in, you know, his polls are improving. The prediction markets have him heavily favored to win the primary. This is an example of the political motivation on the ground. Young people skew anti Israel. We are seeing. Pew has research that came out showing that among Democrats and Republicans, Republicans 18 to 49 are now 50% anti Israel, critical of Israel.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Democrats are like, anti Israel is very different. I mean, we're, well, let me pull it up. Like we're, you know, I think, I think, this is what I think. I think young people on the left have always hated Israel and on the right, I think young people are sick of funding other countries, which is legitimate. Like, I'm sick of, I don't, I think funding for Israel, it's kind of like, I think it's real quickly like ran its course, you know, like they're.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Not anti Israel, they're socialists and Israel is right wing coded and as a result they hate Israel.

[Tim Pool]

It's so just to clarify, negative unfavorable view of Israel. Percent and so in 2022, 18 to 49 year olds were 35%. 2025, they're now 15%. That's Republicans. Among Democrats, 18 to 49 went 62 unfavorable to 71 unfavorable.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

So yeah, but you don't think that when the war in Gaza ends, like, that'll, that'll, that'll, I mean, that's reflect.

[Tim Pool]

I don't think so.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Of a very.

[Tim Pool]

I think, I think Israel has some of the piss poorest PR I've ever seen. For China's got better pr. I'm has pretty good pr. It's, it's pretty good. Look what they do with Tik Tok. And they get, they get, who's that James Charles or whatever that guy's name is saying, like, oh no, they're taking my TikTok from me. But Trump saved me. I'm like, they know how to run a psyop. It's funny because you got these people who think Israel controls the world and.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I'm like, for all the stereotypes about.

[Tim Pool]

Being sneaky Jews, they can't seem to muster up any degree of support among young people. So right now, based on the split between Democrats and Republicans, the principal voting blocs in this country being. That's just it, majority negative. Half of Republican in 18 to 49 are negative. To be fair, 50 plus, a large voting bloc are very positive. Only 23 are unfavorable. Democrats 50 plus are 66%. We're looking at a majority among all U.S. adults, 53%. Unfavorable view of Israel. This trend is growing. I don't think even when the war ends that's going to change. And, and, and, and I'll give you a really good reason, TikTok being one of them. After October 7, we went over this with Axios. We, we pulled up the Axios data 800 million times. So I'm not going to pull it up right now. But we saw that the, the, the, the content that was getting the most views, there was a small amount of posts talking about how Israel had been victimized. That got a large amount of play. Pro Palestine small. A week later, A week later, it inverted 10x. Now all of a sudden, anti Israel were getting way more views to like hundreds of thousands more, millions more than pro Israel sentiment, which was indicative of an algorithmic change because it makes no sense that over a weekend it just flips. Now this could be the result of TikTok internally saying we want people to hate Israel and clicking a button. Or it could be that Islamic nations said to their cyber armies, we want 100 guys each running a thousand, you know, 100 accounts each going on TikTok and posting anti Israel sentiment to force the algorithmic switch. Either way, within a week, the sentiment inverted. Israel's not done anything to combat this. And the sentiment is only getting worse. Prominent conservative personalities are getting millions of views when they're critical of Israel. And whether you want to call it legitimate or not does not matter. Young people, you see that video of the woman who gets pulled over for the dui? The cop walks up to her and then she's drunk and she goes, well, she allegedly is drunk. And she goes, did you know there's a genocide in Palestine? And the cops like, what? It's so wired into the minds of these young people because they're getting spam blasted with it that she blurts it out to a random cop at a stop. Israel does not have any. Let me tell you, the people that I see on social media that are pro Israel are. There's an overlap between the Desantis people and them. And everyone finds them insufferable not literally every single person who's pro Israel. Some of them totally fine, I'm friends a lot of them. But a lot of these posts are just smarmy and snide. Meanwhile, I can. I don't have to name anybody you guys can. But there's a ton of prominent personalities on the conservative side who have recently come out as Israel is not doing us any favors to Israel is secretly controlling this country and they're evil and they're getting millions upon millions of views. Their subscriber bases are growing. They're making tons of money. I don't see a reason why that trend would change.

[Libby Emmons]

Well, it used to. This is a another place where the far right and the far left converge. Right is on hating Israel and also being pro Jew and pro Israel used to be a leftist position. And like us other leftist positions, the left has totally abandoned it.

[Tim Pool]

Hi Zoe Saldana. Welcome to T Mobile. Here's your new iPhone 16 Pro on us. Thanks. And here's my old phone to trade in. You don't need a trade in. When you switch to T Mobile, we'll give you a new iPhone 16 Pro. Plus we'll help you pay off your old Phone up to 800 bucks and you still get to keep it. There's always a trade in. Not right now. @ T Mobile. I feel like I have to give you something in return for karma. That's okay.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I don't really have much in my purse. Oh, let's see. Hand sanitizer.

[Tim Pool]

It's lavender. I'm good. Seriously.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Let me check this pocket.

[Tim Pool]

Oh, mints. Really, I'm fine.

[Libby Emmons]

Oh, I have raisins.

[Tim Pool]

I'm a mom.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Wait, wait one sec.

[Tim Pool]

I've got cupcakes in the car.

[Phil Labonte]

It's our best iPhone offer ever. Switch to T Mobile, get a new iPhone 16 Pro with Apple Intelligence on us. No trade in needed. We'll even pay off your phone up to 800 bucks with 24 monthly bill credits.

[Elad Eliyahu]

New line $100 plus a month on.

[Tim Pool]

Experience beyond Finance Agreement $999.99 and qualifying hoarded for well qualified plus tax and $10 connection charge.

[Phil Labonte]

Payout via virtual prepaid card.

[Tim Pool]

Allow 15 days credits end and balance due if you pay off earlier.

[Unknown]

Cancel CT mobile.com drivers who switch and save with Progressive could save hundreds. With that kind of money you could go big time on a fancy water bottle with ultra titanium alloy metal. You're not sure why you need all that. I mean it just holds water. But you're getting it anyway because if you're hiking near an active volcano and you accidentally drop the bottle into molten lava, your water will still be icy cold. Switch to progressive and you could save big time for water bottles. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates not available in all states.

[Libby Emmons]

Potential savings will vary along with, you know, free speech and workers rights and all kinds of other stuff.

[Elad Eliyahu]

How much of this do you think is a function of them hating Israel or downstream from the base of the Democrat Party becoming leftists? And as a result of Israel, why.

[Tim Pool]

Are they becoming leftist?

[Elad Eliyahu]

That's where the base of the party is.

[Tim Pool]

Why?

[Elad Eliyahu]

I mean, that's a good question. But as far as. I don't think it's because of Israel that they're becoming leftist though.

[Tim Pool]

And I think it's down, but they're intertwined. So when you say the base of the party is leftist and they hate Israel, the function of what is causing that is the exact same thing.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Well, I guess I wanted to focus on the framework of why the left hates Israel. And I mentioned earlier, it's because it's right wing coded, but also because it's white coded and the left does think. Wait, so if I could finish. That's right, the left views Israel as white oppressors oppressing brown people. And that's why they are trying. That's why they try to have affinity for black people. That's how they try to appeal to black people by saying, hey, look, guys are oppressed by white people here.

[Tim Pool]

So like, I get all that. So that's why I can say that makes no sense.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Which, which part isn't.

[Tim Pool]

If you were actually to apply critical theory and you actually were trying to say that we're on the side of the oppressed, you'd be pro Israel.

[Elad Eliyahu]

It depends on your narrative and framework. I mean, I don't disagree with you.

[Tim Pool]

On principle, but if you were actually looking at. So the issue is these people who claimed on the side of the oppressors are on the side of the second largest religion in the world which has domination in the region surrounding one small nation, the only Jewish state on the planet. And they say the one small ethnic minority surrounded by 2 billion Muslims is the oppressor.

[Libby Emmons]

But that's because you're like, I think.

[Tim Pool]

They'Re, I think Americans reject. Our point is. The point is they believe these things not because there's a logic behind them, but because they are told to believe them by psyops and PR campaigns and people. So here's what I genuinely think about a lot of the anti Israel sentiment they're bots. Not all of them.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Pakistan.

[Tim Pool]

I mean, not all of them. But you know what I love? You know what I love? Okay, I've explained this and I, I shouldn't even caveat this the way bots work. Not all accounts are bots. You're allowed to. Not like Israel. But there are a lot of bots. It's a distinction here. When someone is running a bot campaign, these are limited, low functioning AI auto poster bots. They can only respond in certain ways to certain things. What tends to happen is someone will say, we want, let's just say pancakes and waffles. We'll isolate it. We want somebody who hates waffles to be spam blasted until they genuinely believe everybody likes pancakes. Why do, why does the left believe they're on the right side of history? Because they open their social media app and they see a video. A thousand protesters in the street and it looks like this massive gathering. It looks like the whole world is watching and it's a thousand people in a city of 13 million. But in their minds, they can't comprehend that. So what the bots do is they'll see a lot. Go on, go on X and say, you know, I had a waffle today was pretty good. And then they'll say, oh man, we're the pancake company. Put his account, list it under pro waffle. Anytime he posts anything about breakfast, attack him and say he's a waffle shilling Shabbos waffle, whatever. But here's the thing. A minute later, Elad then posts, I actually don't like waffles at all. I think they're gross. But you know what? That waffle was okay, I'm gonna stick to pancakes. The people who set up these campaigns don't realize there's nuance in his position. And he was only passively supporting it one time. From then on, every time Elad posts waffles are bad, he gets attacked by people saying waffles are bad. And you're like, whoa, wait, hold on. So here's the real world example. I will post the US should not be funding Israel and what do I get? 300 responses saying, why are you supporting Israel? Well, hold on there a minute. That doesn't make sense. These people are not real. Their images are AI generated are cartoon avatars. And I know they're fake and they're not. Not a real person. It's not even a person typing the message. They'll say, aha. Did Netanyahu. I swear to God, I'll say, I am sick of the US being involved in Middle Eastern wars. We shouldn't be funding Israel. Israel should take care of themselves. And I'll get a message saying, did Netanyahu pay you to say that? And I'm like, what?

[Phil Labonte]

I get messages like that. Like, because you met with Netanyahu, it's like, oh, what did Tim tell you? You're not allowed to say this. Blah, blah, blah, nuts.

[Tim Pool]

Can't make a distinction between nuance. So they, So I post an Israeli flag as a troll. They put me in the pro Israel camp because they can't understand that I'm screwing with them. And now anytime I say anything critical of Israel, I get, I get, I get blasted by both pro and anti Israel every time because they're bot campaigns. So here's what happens if you're. There have been people that have been affected by this. There's a person who's like a fitness Instructor and their YouTube channel is a bunch of fitness videos. Not very big. Here's how we do push ups, whatever, I don't know. One day, October 7th happens and they make a video saying, you know, I've been getting a lot of message from people asking me what my thoughts are on what's going on in Israel. And to be honest, like, I don't really know a whole lot about it, but I know that's deeply affected a lot of you, and I know I have a lot of fans that are deeply concerned about this. So I thought I'd make a video addressing it. They go from getting 10,000 views to 50,000.

[Libby Emmons]

And so then they just talk about it all the time.

[Tim Pool]

They come back to their channel and they go, Whoa, I got 50,000 views for talking about Israel. Then they look at the comments. The comments say, this is a really great video. You're amazing. Can you make more? They do. Then he makes a video where he's like, you know, I don't really know if it's a genocide or what you'd call it, but I know that it's deeply passionate. Then the comments are all saying, genocide, genocide, genocide, genocide, genocide. So then he makes a video saying, I think it might be a genocide. And then all of a sudden he gets a million views. So, not that every single time this happens, it's bots. But my point is there are psyop campaigns that, that do this. There are a lot of people that are critical of Israel. I've met them, they exist. But Israel isn't doing anything to counter any of it. Any of it. So my prediction is 10 years from now the 49 year olds are going to, are going to be 59 and they'll be out of that demo. Eight year olds now are growing up with young women getting pulled over by cops and saying, did you know there's a genocide in Palestine? It is the branding. Listen, listen, I don't care what she says. What, what if she's, what if, what if the cop pulled her over and trolled the window and she was like, if you need a cash settlement and you want to get paid, whatever that song is, if you have a structured settlement, you need cash.

[Libby Emmons]

Now I'd be like seven, seven cards for kids, right?

[Tim Pool]

I'd be like, that's branding. The fact that this drunk lady allegedly can just blurt it out means she doesn't know anything about anything. But in her brain, that's something she's memorized. So what happens when a kid grows up watching TikTok and Instagram shorts and YouTube shorts and that's all they see? And Israel does nothing in terms of any kind of PR. Okay, 10, 10 years from now that 53, minus 53 will be minus 60. And that's when Congress says we vote to defund Israel.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

But I think, okay, first of all, I think that there is a kind of like the current thing aspect to it. You know, like the left does tend to move from one thing to the next.

[Tim Pool]

Agreed.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

It just happens to be that this is a global thing and the war is still ongoing for reasons we can talk about, none of them good. So, like, it is a thing that has, you know, like legitimate criticism attached to it that is global and happened to have been the current thing. And also I think Israel is making a lot of friends in the Middle east, like it's becoming much less dependent on US Largesse. We're going to end up in a situation possibly, I don't think so. I think these numbers will improve for Israel, but we're going to end up in a situation where the US for its own strategic purposes, wants to be giving that money more than Israel wants to be taking it because it has local friends, possibly Saudi Arabia, currently the uae, et cetera, who are more than happy to enter into that kind of relationship and have that kind of intelligence sharing, et cetera. So I don't look at this as a pro Israel person and feel like terror. I feel like, you know, I have a lot of trust in the American people, the moral intuitions of the American people, the greatest people on planet Earth, and they will arrive at the right situation. But I don't, I don't think that this is like, the. The current geopolitical situation that Israel is in is. Is significant. It's not.

[Tim Pool]

Perception is reality. And right now, on social media, if, like, name a prominent conservative with a big following that's grown substantially, that is pro Israel, that. That is advocating for strikes on Iran in favor of Israel. I mean, literally the inverse of what we see with prominent conservatives who have massive followings get 12 million views.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

But didn't we just see the last two weeks that this. Their influence is, like, null and void? Like, it doesn't matter how many Twitter polls they put up and when. Like, actually, the American people supported what President Trump did. And.

[Tim Pool]

Well, I mean, the poll, the real.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Polls show that he. What he did was wildly popular. So.

[Tim Pool]

What polls?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Well, 76% of GOP voters approved of it. 65.

[Tim Pool]

That same poll you just cited says the overall American public, it's minus 11.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

But 80% of Americans oppose Iran getting.

[Tim Pool]

A nuclear deal, but they don't support military strikes.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

They don't support Trump, they don't support anything he does, but they. 80%.

[Tim Pool]

The average person. Trump's approval rating is actually really good right now.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yeah, but the average Democrat who's part of this 80% who wants Iran not to have a nuclear weapon is going to oppose whatever Trump does to make their wishes come true, because they're going to oppose whatever Trump does. Period.

[Tim Pool]

Well, not. Not just that, but the disapproval that Trump has in the GOP for the strikes in Iran is slightly higher than his general disapproval in the party, suggesting more Republicans.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Didn't we just see that the influencers have no influence, like, all of these?

[Tim Pool]

What does that mean?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Influencers were not able to influence, like, Trump's actions.

[Tim Pool]

Or maybe they did. That's why we didn't invade.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Oh, come on. You don't think that.

[Tim Pool]

What do you mean? Trump met with Steve Bannon? Why did Trump meet with Steve Bannon?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

They had a whole. So the Trump administration, unlike Israel, handled their PR really well. Like, they were reaching out to influencers to be like, we hear you. You know what I mean?

[Tim Pool]

Wouldn't that suggest that there was.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

They weren't actually listening to him.

[Libby Emmons]

That was a delayed lunch like Bannon had. They had a previous.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Trump would never have done regime change. It's, like, against everything he believes in.

[Tim Pool]

I think that if the entirety of his base was screaming for a regime change, he'd do it.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

No, he. Troops on the ground. He was calling people in 2004.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I think regime change in troops on the ground. There's a difference. It doesn't have to.

[Tim Pool]

Let me rephrase that. I think if the entirety of Trump's base said, we want escalation, we want more action, Trump would have said, okay.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

He would have thought about it, but he should have. I mean, that's how democracy is supposed to work, right? The fact is the majority of his base didn't want it, despite the fact that all of the influencers were pushing Trump not to get involved, not to drop these bombs, not to assist Israel. But they were irrelevant in this story. Isn't that not what we just saw, like the irrelevant.

[Tim Pool]

I think the influencers had influence. I think the reason Trump's frustrated and wants a cease fire and he wants limited interaction is because he knows that he's got these intelligence reports saying, do it or you have to. But then he's got his base screaming, we don't want this. And he's stuck between them.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I think the, I don't think that.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Their influencers are, I think, are in a bit of a bubble. Although we like to say mainstream media is completely lost their influence. I think Fox News probably has more viewers than Twitter does have active followers on certain times. Twitter is just completely filled with foreign influence campaigns. And it seems as though a lot of people who had a lot of different jobs have all of a sudden become Middle Eastern experts. I know people who used to be comedians who had not many people show up to their shows seem to get millions of impressions right now on Twitter as a result of this, as a result of their commentary on stuff they actually know next to nothing about. I do agree with you though, that Israel, in the future, they're losing support from Democrats. But that's the reason why I think it's going to become a partisan issue. And I think one of the biggest threats to Israel is one of the biggest threats to America as well. And what is that? It's socialism and socialists in our country. So I think the support for Israel drops when socialism becomes popular in our country. So Israel and really America do have the same biggest threat. And that's.

[Tim Pool]

Let's just, let's, let's just conclude this. Would y' all agree that there is a large amount of individuals on social media that are profiting off of being anti Israel?

[Unknown]

Of course, drivers who switch and save with progressive could save hundreds. With that kind of money, you could go big time on a fancy water bottle with ultra titanium alloy metal. You're not sure why you need. I mean, it just holds water, but you're getting it anyway. Because if you're hiking near an active volcano and you accidentally drop the bottle into molten lava, your water will still be icy cold. Switch to progressive and you could save big time for water bottles. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates not available in all states. Potential savings will vary. Drivers who switch and save with progressive could save hundreds. With that kind of money, you could go big time on a fancy water bottle with ultra titanium alloy metal. You're not sure why you need all that. I mean, it just holds water, but you're getting it anyway. Because if you're hiking near an active volcano and you accidentally drop the bottle into molten lava, your water will still be icy cold. Switch to progressive and you could save big time for water bottles. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates not available in all states. Potential savings will vary.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yeah, but I don't think they're having any impact for any influence. Despite being called influencer.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I think they're getting a lot of likes from Pakistan.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yeah, or from like 2 billion Muslims who are desperate for like.

[Elad Eliyahu]

So what is an American version of these social media?

[Tim Pool]

How does the left recruit for these protests? How do they have so many young people showing up? And why does some random woman getting pulled over a cop say, how many.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

People do you think have protested against Israel in America since the beginning of the Gaza thing? Like what's a number you think would.

[Tim Pool]

100,000.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

You think that's a lot? I think that's very little.

[Tim Pool]

Protests. It's probably like low mid years over.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

The course of two years. I think that's very little.

[Tim Pool]

I would call that low mid.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

And when you compare it to what's going on in like Canada or the UK where you have like millions of people.

[Tim Pool]

But this is not the question I'm asking. I'm asking about a trend direction. Why are people who don't know anything about the region all of a sudden violent and fervent over it?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

No, I totally agree with your analysis of people being captured by the algorithm.

[Tim Pool]

And so what is, and then what is anyone, be it aipac, Israel or the US or pro Israel groups doing to combat this, but I don't know.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

That something has to be done. That's what I'm trying to say is like, I don't really care that there's a bunch of like, like people who've been captured by the algorithm making money off of this content and being viewed by a bunch of people in Pakistan or what have you. Like, I don't know that this is like a crisis.

[Tim Pool]

So why do you think over three years sentiment has shifted 11 points negatively for Israel.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

We've had a violent war.

[Tim Pool]

Well, a war has two parties in it. Couldn't that have shifted negatively for the Palestinians?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

So again, I think you have to the why. You have to separate why it's happening on the left and why it's happening on the right. It's happening on the left because as Alad said, the center of gravity of the Democratic Party is turned against Israel.

[Tim Pool]

Why the right?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

That's a totally different question. So why are young conservatives? And I think a lot of this has to do.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I think it's overstated on the right. Completely overstated. And I think it's because many people who are not truly MAGA appropriate maga. So for example, a lot of these isolationists or libertarian types aren't true, truly maga. And President Trump even says of people like Thomas Massey, Congressman Thomas Massie, who's been.

[Libby Emmons]

You just interrupted Bhatia, though, so like I can interrupt you. That was literally what I was thinking.

[Tim Pool]

So I don't know any.

[Elad Eliyahu]

So thanks for letting me know.

[Tim Pool]

Actually, I know one.

[Elad Eliyahu]

So my point here, specifically, President Trump put out this truth where he said Congressman Thomas Massie of Kentucky is not maga, even though he likes to say he is. I think that's true of many libertarian who aren't truly maga. About what part?

[Tim Pool]

He's wrong about Thomas Massie.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I don't think that he's not maga.

[Tim Pool]

Well, you can call whoever you want not maga, but he's wrong about Thomas Massie in terms of Massey's support and his principles.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Well, I think he's spot on that Thomas Massie is a grandstander that votes with the Democrats, especially at a time like this. It's frankly ridiculous. He's anti MAGA agenda. How is that wrong? He's.

[Tim Pool]

He's posturing against the one being principal. I missed the word in like half an hour.

[Phil Labonte]

What are you talking about?

[Elad Eliyahu]

All right, so interrupt me mid sentence.

[Tim Pool]

Thomas Massey's record speaks for itself.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Yeah. He's voting against the one big beautiful.

[Tim Pool]

Bill and he voted against Covid funding during Trump.

[Elad Eliyahu]

So I think he's anti maga. He's anti MAGA agenda because he's voting against the one big beautiful bill. And I think that's clear cut and obvious. I don't know how it.

[Tim Pool]

He is wrong about when he calls Thomas Massie weak and a loser and a grandstander. Trump can call anybody who wants not maga. It's his brand.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Is Thomas Massie wrong for voting against the one big beautiful bill?

[Tim Pool]

Yes.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Okay. There we go.

[Tim Pool]

Indeed. And I, and I like Thomas Massie. I think he's one of. I think he's the best member of Congress we have right now, even though I disagree with him. Rand Paul also said he would vote against the big beautiful bill. However, he did concede. If it came down to him as a deciding vote, he would vote in favor of it. And I tremendously respect that because I think Rand Paul and Thomas Massie are two of the most principled people we have in Congress. I wish we had more people like them. I wish everybody was like them even when they're wrong.

[Elad Eliyahu]

So I think Congress is where you go to, frankly, compromise. You know, if you want to get anything done in Congress, you're going to have to compromise. And that's why President Trump calls him a grandstander.

[Libby Emmons]

I think if Massey is doing what his constituents want, then he's doing the right thing.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Okay. I think it's anti maga.

[Libby Emmons]

It doesn't matter, though. I mean, the only, well, it's only.

[Elad Eliyahu]

President Trump thinks it's anti Maga.

[Phil Labonte]

How much you want to go after?

[Tim Pool]

A lot is correct. Trump decides what's MAGA or not. He does. It's his brand, it's his slogan, it's his agenda. And if he says Massey's not maga, then Massey's not maga.

[Libby Emmons]

There should be like a little Cosmo quizzer for like, Massey is weak, ineffective.

[Elad Eliyahu]

And votes no on virtually everything put before him, no matter how good it may be. So, I mean, I think Donald Trump is really spot on here.

[Tim Pool]

And he says that he wants to.

[Libby Emmons]

His guys put together a super PAC to get Massey out.

[Tim Pool]

I don't think it'll work.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Well, I think it's a message to these Republicans who aren't falling in line with the MAGA agenda. And I think it's important for Republicans to fall in line with the MAGA agenda because Donald Trump won the majority of the votes in the past election. Right. I thought he had. What was this, this mandate, Right. Well, apparently Thomas Massey disagrees or his constituents disagree.

[Libby Emmons]

I mean, he's the one who's voting.

[Tim Pool]

So let's just, let's just, let's just. We'll put a bow on this. Let's, let's, we'll put a ball on the subject. Where did I, did I just close that poll? So my question is, what re final thoughts on this so we can move on? But what, what, what changes the course of this polling? What will happen where people go? Actually, I was wrong. I don't dislike Israel. I like Israel. What will change?

[Elad Eliyahu]

Fighting back against socialism in our country or the next.

[Libby Emmons]

Or the next Israel fighting socialism?

[Elad Eliyahu]

I think fighting against the ideology of socialism and democratic socialism in our country will correlate aggressively with support for Israel in our country.

[Tim Pool]

Why so?

[Elad Eliyahu]

Yes, because people in our country, who are these young people who are anti Israel are leftists who believe that Israel is right wing coded and white coded and that's why they hate Israel.

[Tim Pool]

I, you're, you're missing the big picture of someone told them that and if.

[Elad Eliyahu]

They stop being socialists, well, they'll stop.

[Tim Pool]

So as I guess the issue I take with your answer is a broad question. There's a broad answer that's vague and nebulous, targeting a very specific issue. So you're not, I feel like you're not answering the question, fight socialism and people will like Israel seems to be a non sequitur.

[Elad Eliyahu]

No, I'm saying they're strongly correlated.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, but you've not explained how. I don't feel like you've answered the.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Question because lefties and socialists view Israel as a country that is quote unquote.

[Tim Pool]

White right wing, which leaves a gap.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Why? Because they're told that the propaganda narrative.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Is that because they have a college degree. So the number one predictor for whether you'll be a Democrat is whether you go to college, whether you've been indoctrinated through income universities. You get this woke indoctrination where there's no like right versus wrong the way like normal people think about the world. There's just who has more power and who has less. And then they superimpose some racial category or some gender category, what have you. And whoever is a white person, like a lot is saying is evil and bad and whoever is the person of color is oppressed and therefore inherently virtuous. And they side with them inherently. This is like every humanity.

[Tim Pool]

So why do high school students also agree?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Because it's that that curriculum is dripping down every teacher.

[Elad Eliyahu]

That's a critical race theory in our.

[Phil Labonte]

Left because the left has infested the schools of education that teach the teachers. So all of the curriculum that the teachers learn is all leftist. So they're all. So the teachers that are teaching high school as well as college, these people all went to the same colleges of education that have a leftist indoctrination built.

[Tim Pool]

Right into this curriculum. Okay, so now the reason why I reject what you've said is your argument could actually be summarized by fighting socialism entails altering the curriculum of various schools from the bottom up. Through various universities, then altering social media algorithms to stop the spread of these ideas, which in a grand scale can be applied in certain ways where someone could accuse Israel of being bad. After we do that, we'll run a campaign that would start to convince people that Israel's actually not right coded. And the arguments that they've been using on critical theory don't apply to Israel properly. And now they're.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

You see, because Tim, we're saying this is a symptom of another problem. Like this is not a problem.

[Tim Pool]

So my question is, what specific thing happens that changes the sentiment transplant?

[Elad Eliyahu]

I think socialism becoming unpopular in our country.

[Tim Pool]

You keep saying the same thing over and over again.

[Libby Emmons]

What about, what about like the next.

[Tim Pool]

Well, let me tell you this. I think, I think that hot topic Israel will gain support if we all buy bitcoin. If we all just bought bitcoin, people would support Israel.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Wait, is that. Are you joking?

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, I mean, basically because he's not giving an answer. Fight socialism. People like Israel. Why? They're not related.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I think they're completely related. And I think the most prominent anti Israel people are democratic socialists and far.

[Tim Pool]

Left people in Congress. I don't think you have answers for this.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I have a different answer. Oh, go ahead.

[Tim Pool]

Well, what's your answer?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Oh, well, my answer is that like support for Israel is like many other things that have become like marginalized by left wing indoctrination. It's a normie value. It's the kind of thing that like regular people who don't have fancy degrees inherently are drawn to. Like the idea that marriage is a really good idea or there's a difference between boys and girls.

[Tim Pool]

You know, you think support for Israel is like marriage.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yeah. In the mind of like, if you would look at the polling, like a regular middle class American who does not has not been influenced either by woke university curriculum or by, you know, online whatever on the far right. Like it's the kind of thing that Christians in America feel very attached to, for example, the Holy Land, like that.

[Libby Emmons]

Whole Ted Cruz thing.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

And the problem with this country right now is actually not ideological so much as it is the class divide. It's not. The problem is not so much that, you know, a certain subsector of Americans go to college and get a college degree and have like terrible ideas. It's that those are the people who have access to the American dream and that normie people, like regular people, working class people, people who don't have access to that stream of education and those knowledge industry jobs have been In a large way, economically disenfranchised in this country.

[Tim Pool]

Right. So Republicans that you fix for that.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Is what Trump is doing right now, which is you create an economy that instead of being an upward funnel of wealth, is actually a downward funnel of wealth through things like tariffs and.

[Tim Pool]

Right. And so why then do key demo Republicans support Israel less by 15% over three years?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

You mean young people?

[Tim Pool]

Well, 49 year olds aren't young.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yeah, well, like I said, I think this is a reflection of the war which has been going on for three years still.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Also almost 2/3 of Republicans.

[Tim Pool]

Again, my point being it takes two to tango in a war. So the argument that I've made is that Israel is failing at PR is correct.

[Phil Labonte]

Where's that Hasbro?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yeah, of course it's failing at. But also the war is going to end at some point and there's going to be a new, like, next big thing. People are going to move on from this. It's not going to be when there's no war in Gaza.

[Tim Pool]

What changes that sentiment when there's going to be no, like, the default position isn't going to be support for Israel. People are just going to be like, the war's over and I hate Israel.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

No, it's going to be like, the war's over and I don't think about Israel, which is a fine thing for like an American.

[Libby Emmons]

It's like nobody thinks about Sudan. There was a, there was an attack on a hospital in Sudan and the World Health Organization was really upset about it and it killed like 40 people and it was the only hospital in the area that killed a bunch of kids.

[Tim Pool]

Let's jump to this next story which doesn't deviate too much, but we have this from Reuters from this morning and it is an outdated story, but there is a component of it. Explosions ring out in Tehran despite Trump's order to Israel to stop the strikes.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Notice the passive tense in ring out. That's going to come back ring out.

[Tim Pool]

Well, we have this video which is one of the best videos of President Trump ever. I, I, oh, absolutely. So I'll set it up. Basically, this morning, Trump says Iran and Israel both violated the ceasefire. He then followed up with this. Do you believe that Iran is still committed to peace? Yeah, I do. They violated it, but Israel violated. Hi, Zoe Saldana. Welcome to T Mobile. Here's your new iPhone 16 Pro on us. Thanks. And here's my old phone to trade in. You don't need to trade in when you switch to T Mobile. We'll give you a new iPhone 16.16Pro plus we'll help you pay off your old Phone up to 800 bucks and you still get to keep it. There's always a trade in. Not right now. @ T Mobile.

[Libby Emmons]

I feel like I have to give.

[Tim Pool]

You something in return for karma. That's okay.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I don't really have much in my purse. Oh, let's see. Hand sanitizer.

[Tim Pool]

It's lavender. I'm good. Seriously, Let me check this pocket. Oh, mints. Really, I'm fine.

[Libby Emmons]

Oh, I have raisins.

[Tim Pool]

I'm a mom.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Wait, wait one sec.

[Tim Pool]

I've got cupcakes in the car.

[Phil Labonte]

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[Elad Eliyahu]

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[Tim Pool]

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[Phil Labonte]

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[Tim Pool]

Allow 15 days credits and balance due if you pay off early or cancel.

[Unknown]

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[Tim Pool]

Are you questioning if Israel is committing? Israel? As soon as we made the deal, they came out and they dropped a load of bombers, the likes of which I've never seen before. The biggest load that we've seen. I'm not happy with Israel. You know, when I say, okay, now you have 12 hours. You don't go out in the first hour and just drop everything you have on them. So I'm not happy with them. I'm not happy with Iran either. But I'm really unhappy if Israel is going out this morning because the one rocket that didn't land, that was shot.

[Phil Labonte]

Perhaps by mistake, that didn't land.

[Tim Pool]

I'm not happy if you about that. You know what we have? We basically have two countries that have been fighting so long and so hard that they don't know what the fuck they're doing. Do you understand that legend? Yeah, that Was legend. Now, the reason I brought up the Reuters post is that an hour and a half after Trump said, do not drop those bombs, Israel won't do it, they're doing a plane wave. The report came out that in fact Israel still went ahead with at least one of the strikes on a radar station in Iran in defiance of Trump saying, don't do it. Trump was pissed and dropped an expletive, which is kind of shocking for a president. But I love it. I love it.

[Libby Emmons]

I loved the mafia tone of do you understand? You know, I wanted him to almost say capiche.

[Tim Pool]

I think Trump is, well, he's clearly pissed. But I was shocked and, you know, it was a coin toss for me. Will Israel defy what Donald Trump is saying? And they did. So what's the ramification of that going to be?

[Phil Labonte]

Will Trump hold a grudge and foreign aid to Israel?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Well, basically what happened was he, after that amazing, amazing moment, got Bibi Netanyahu on the phone and was like, what is going on here? We had a ceasefire. Netanyahu alleged that there were rockets shot into Israel from Iran that had to be responded to. They had to get rid of this one last rocket launcher. So he was gonna send out a much bigger barrage. And then after talking to Trump, he said, all right, we'll just send out the one. They blasted the rocket launcher. And apparently Trump was satisfied with that. That's just the recording that came out. Take that as you will. I also thought that was an amazing moment. It was to me, cuz he was on his way to NATO and it felt a lot like, you know, when your dad is driving to a wedding or something and you're fighting with your siblings in the back and like your dad's hand comes back is like, shut.

[Tim Pool]

The two hours about. It's an hour and 45 minutes after Trump said, don't do it. And actually it was, I believe it was like a full two hours. Trump posted on Truth Israel, do not drop those bombs and Israel will not drop those bombs. And they did.

[Phil Labonte]

Was their excuse that they were already in transit or the mission an hour.

[Tim Pool]

And a half later? You could turn around at any point.

[Phil Labonte]

I mean, I'm not saying that they couldn't, but the point that I'm making is they might be like, oh, well.

[Tim Pool]

We didn't, like, we tried calling the pilot with the bombs and he's not answering.

[Phil Labonte]

They're going to make up their estate, they're going to make up all kinds of excuses as to why they couldn't.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

You know, they, they both Violated it. Both Iran and Israel.

[Tim Pool]

I'm just saying, will, will Trump tolerate being made to look like a chump?

[Elad Eliyahu]

So I think actually President Trump and Prime Minister Netanyahu are on the same page and they're playing good cop, bad cop throughout this entire thing. I think there's been intelligence sharing the entire time, and they have been on the same page and have been coordinating together. And in order to get Iran to the negotiating table, Israel's the bad guy and Trump's trying to be the good guy.

[Phil Labonte]

40 chess.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I don't even, I think it's like 2D chess. It's like actually really straightforward. It's just extremely straightforward. The way he's posturing. Like, I think Trump has a lot of moral clarity when it comes to Israel, and I don't.

[Tim Pool]

That was an act.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I think the whole thing's been in.

[Tim Pool]

Acts like that anger, that F bomb.

[Elad Eliyahu]

They wrote it, not knowing about what Israel was going to do, how they were going to attack. I think the United States has been doing intelligence sharing with that with Israel throughout this entire thing. And I think Trump probably signed off on a lot of these attacks. He just wanted the plausible deniability of not being involved until he, he saw that it was a success. So the people who are like the isolationist thinkers, who are like, oh, maybe this means that Donald Trump's not going to support Israel anymore, I think are really missing the bigger picture of the isolationists. Thomas Massie, Thomas Massie types.

[Tim Pool]

I don't think Thomas.

[Elad Eliyahu]

Comedians on Twitter.

[Tim Pool]

Is Thomas Massey like an, an actual isolationist or are you just saying that as an insult?

[Phil Labonte]

He's just saying, wait.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I don't think isolationist is an insult to people who believe that the United States. It's not. I don't think it's a derogatory term. Isolationist.

[Phil Labonte]

You do everything. You do everything.

[Tim Pool]

You know, there's, there's, there's like, every time, I think it's, they describe themselves as like non interventionalists and then they're called isolationists because it's an extreme position meant to, to sports.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I don't mean it as a slur. I don't know.

[Tim Pool]

It's pointing the. Well, it's a, it's, it's a, it's a, it's a deceptive tactic to where I say something like the standard of proof required for a strike on a foreign country is high. And they say, so you're an isolationist. No, I think there's lots of people we can be bombing. I'm just saying the standard of proof you need.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

So you don't call yourself a non interventionalist either.

[Tim Pool]

I'm not. I'm anti intervention. Absolutely.

[Elad Eliyahu]

So I think the non interventionalists were hopeful that President Trump would, you know, clean his hands of the Middle East.

[Tim Pool]

I know very few people who call themselves isolationists. The people. The people who tend to be in favor of war refer to people who don't want their war isolationist. So if I said something like, I understand the precision strikes on the Houthi rebels, despite the fact Trump said he wouldn't do it, I'm kind of lukewarm on the issue. That's not isolationist. It's like, oh, okay, they were shutting down the Red Sea. Non intervention in terms of boots on the ground against regimes, if we're talking about. So. So I'll put it this way. I interviewed Seb Gorka, and he said, we understand the sentiment. You don't want the US Military to go and start bombing all these things. We're gonna draw the line at no regime change, no invasions. But if there is a rebel group, if there are the Houthi rebels, if there are terror cells, we will do precision strikes. And I go, all right, I'm not gonna bash my head on the table and scream. No. I'm gonna say, we've compromised. Isolationist is. Isolationist literally refers to cutting off trade with foreign countries? No, absolutely. It means isolation.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

But, Tim, would you support, like, knowing what we know now, let's say the cease fire holds it retrospectively. Would you support the attack on Fordo?

[Tim Pool]

No.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Even now?

[Tim Pool]

Yes.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Do you. Do you worry about Iran getting a nuclear weapon?

[Tim Pool]

60%. I think that it's certainly not been sold to the American people. That's why it's divisive. The. The. So there's questions. Certainly Dave Smith doesn't believe they were close to getting one, even though there are reports.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Do you believe they had an intention to at some point get one?

[Tim Pool]

I think it is 60%. Right. More based on the evidence. I put the probability slightly greater than chance.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

And what. And, and what is your level of opposition to them having a nuclear weapon?

[Tim Pool]

That they would give it to the Houthi rebels and other insurgent groups for dirty bombs and you be comfortable with.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Them just having one?

[Tim Pool]

If Iran had a nuclear bomb. The question is if Iran wasn't going to give fissile material to random crackpot religious extremists, which I think they would. That's the threat.

[Phil Labonte]

They could do that, though.

[Tim Pool]

Indeed they could, of course. And they May with the £900 of fissile material they have. So if Iran has a nuke, what is the threat? Honest question. It's not a gotcha. It's not a rhetorical question.

[Phil Labonte]

An arms race in the Middle east between Pakistan Arabia, Saudi Arabia has said that they would to.

[Tim Pool]

They would say all things, all the time.

[Phil Labonte]

Okay, so then we could. You can. If you're going to ask the things that are likely, and then I'm going to say, well, these are the things that people have said. Then you said, well, I don't believe them. There's no point in even having the conversation if you'd be like, well, I don't. I'm going to believe the argument that I want and not believe the things that I don't want like. Or the things that fit the Right.

[Tim Pool]

So the issue is, what are. What is our risk assessment? What is the risk that if we intervene with B2 bombers and drop 14 bunker busters on a foreign country, that we drag other nations into the war and trigger the arms race itself? Okay, so Muammar Gaddafi gave up his arms program.

[Phil Labonte]

That don't happen, though.

[Tim Pool]

Muammar Gaddafi gave up his arms program.

[Phil Labonte]

Yes.

[Tim Pool]

And he was. He was assured of certain the sanctions would be dropped, that the UN was going to basically allow him to start developing without obstruction. They did not. So what did he do? It was somewhere around, like, 2009. He said, then we're gonna keep enriching uranium. And they said, you will die now. And so what happens? We triggered an arms race. Iran becomes dead set on getting nuclear bomb because they're like, if we negotiate with you, you're gonna kill us anyway.

[Phil Labonte]

Iran's been dead set on nuclear.

[Libby Emmons]

Yeah. I mean, in 1995, the SS were. That they might have it in five years.

[Tim Pool]

The point is, when the US negotiates and then kills the guy, you affirm in the minds of those people in the region why they need to have those weapons.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

This is something I heard you say. I don't think that these are mutually exclusive. Like, it's not mutually exclusive that Trump was negotiating in good faith and also at some point became convinced that they were not and therefore greenlit the operation. Like he could have been negotiating in good faith.

[Tim Pool]

So here are the questions. Here are the questions.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Green light.

[Tim Pool]

Do you believe that Trump's strike on Fordo Nananz and is Fara succeeded?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Of course.

[Tim Pool]

And that Iran will not be able now to enrich any uranium for.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

We don't know for how long? Right. We don't know that because we don't.

[Tim Pool]

Have boots longer than a year? Yeah, at least a year or longer than that.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I think probably longer. But I'm not like I haven't seen enough. We don't have enough information.

[Elad Eliyahu]

This is at best kick what if it can down the road? The real solution has to be diplomacy because again, we could prevent them. We could keep bombing their nuclear facilities, but if they could bring them back up to date within six months to 12 months, then it's, it has to be negotiations where they're saying, we will shelve our ambitions to do it, otherwise we're going to keep bombing them. And then regime change becomes a serious conversation.

[Tim Pool]

So now let's, let's let feel safer.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

With an Iran that doesn't have a nuclear weapon.

[Tim Pool]

Right. Right. Now the argument that I should or anyone should feel safer after they just dispersed an estimated 900 pounds of uranium in God to God knows where. And that's if you want to believe the reporting, I suppose the US Officials, according to the New York Times, whether we trust them or not, sometimes they lie. Doesn't know where 400 kilograms of fissile material went. And there's concerns that even J.D. vance brought up that they enriched it to about 60%. They can weaponize that. Now with the strikes on Iran, we may have potentially emboldened those crackpot groups who may actually receive those materials. So there, there is a whole spattering of, we honestly don't know. We can believe the, the department, the defense intelligence agencies report that the strikes didn't work, and people are going to be like, well, why would I, why would I disagree with that? Or they're going to say, yep, Trump's the primary source on the guy with the real briefings. Why wouldn't, why would he lie? Well, maybe he's lying for political reasons because it didn't work. The initial reporting beforehand was that bunker busters would not be able to do it. You would. Not only was the concern that the basis was too deep underground for a single bunker buster, even if you were to get multiple bunker busters in successive in the same spots, which is possible for it was also spread out to a great degree with multiple points of entry and egress, indicating that even if we were to take out certain parts of it, they could still operate other areas or even start rebuilding the areas that were damaged, the IAEA says that there, it appears, there's a chemical spill rendering this area contaminated, which could set them back. So the argument now is we don't know how long they're set back Trump says totally obliterated. Does that mean they can't do it ever again? Well, the answer is no. They can always start rebuilding. And if we're not going to go with regime change, boots on the ground, they probably will. I don't know why they'd stop. We now know the assumption is 900 pounds of fissile material have been spread out and we don't know where they went. So, no, I don't feel safer. I don't feel any different at all. Now I will say if the cease fire holds, Trump has a tremendous victory and that he was able to bomb a foreign country targeting their nuclear sites. A key component of, like, the mission without triggering dramatic escalation is a massive and historic victory for anybody who wants to gain, who wants to take on military action. But for the regular, average person, you're going to choose what you want to believe. They didn't have a nuclear weapon. They did have nuclear facile material. They had the capabilities of arming Houthi rebels and other insurgent groups who have killed Americans and launched rockets and fought with our troops in the Middle East.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I mean, the Iranian Union has killed American citizens.

[Tim Pool]

Agreed. And the only thing that's changed with this strike right now is that we have potentially given them a justification for why they should disperse this material among psychopaths, and we don't know where it is.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I think that. What? I think that the story around the story is as important and for example, the fact that Russia refused to come to Iran's aid. Okay, like, what you're really seeing here is Trump, like, rewriting the entire, like.

[Unknown]

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[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

National global relations basically like we would have thought that the Iranians would have held up much better against the Israelis. They did not. We would have thought that China or Russia would have come immediately to their aid. They refused China, China did, they sort of did, but they didn't in a big way. And Russia saying actually we're staying out of this. I'm going to call Donald Trump and offer to mediate this cuz I have a thing going with him that's going pretty good for me and maybe I'm going to be rejoining the west and leaving this new axis of China, Iran, Russia that Trump picked off one by one like each of these, like in.

[Libby Emmons]

His big diplomatic trip, in his big.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Diplomatic trip and you know, Qatar, like getting the Iranians to shoot this sort of fake, you know, face saving barrage into Qatar to piss off the Qataris, their only sort of pseudo ally from that trip. You know, this sounds epic.

[Tim Pool]

Let's just lay down some like basic points. Do you agree with the assessment that they have gotten the 400 kg out of the nuclear facilities and we don't know where they are?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

That has been reported. I think there's a, we're in fog of war. So like I've seen reports of that. I don't think, I think a lot of stuff is unknowable at this situation, including how long it'll take for them to regroup. We just, we just don't know. But I think we've changed the conversation domestically and I think we've changed the conversation internationally.

[Tim Pool]

With the, with the probability that despite fog of war there is the probability based on the reporting that and I think just general common sense when it became clear that Trump was telling them six months out we're going to bomb your nuclear facilities. Iran probably set up contingencies for getting their uranium out because they want to keep it. That's like you're negotiating. You don't leave all your money in a bag in front of the guy who's, you know, going to take it from you. So I think there's a decent probability the uranium is gone, it's in China. Who knows, 16, 17 trucks were seen in a satellite image. That's just one satellite image.

[Phil Labonte]

Oh no, it came in too.

[Tim Pool]

That's right. And China sent cargo planes.

[Phil Labonte]

That's right.

[Tim Pool]

And so with that being said, do you think that the US striking Iran could anger Iranian backed interests of any faction who may get access to that uranium.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I think these people were like psychopaths trying to build a nuclear bomb to, you know, eviscerate Israel and to hurt America. And I don't think that this changes the calculation. They were that before, and they were probably still that.

[Tim Pool]

Do you think that Iran would have launched a nuclear weapon weapon at Israel as soon as they got it?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

That's what they said. So we could say, oh, you're lying to me. Like, you don't really want to do that. You really love me. You don't mean it. But that's what they said. They said, we want a nuclear weapon so that we can wipe Israel off the face of the planet and destroy America afterwards. Like, that's just their stated foreign policy objective. So, like, the idea that we could anger them into being even worse than, like, psychopaths who want a nuclear weapon to hurt our children and to destroy our ally, Israel, Like, I don't see that as, like, a real argument.

[Tim Pool]

I guess the question is, were they actually close to building a nuclear weapon capable of launching it?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I don't think that's a question like, we had an opportunity here. I think this is what I think happened. I think Trump initially probably didn't want to back the Israelis, but they were so successful and met with such little resistance. I mean, the absolute mastery of what they pulled off left him with this opportunity. I honestly don't think it matters if the Iranians were close, if it was going to be in six months or if it's going to be in five years. We had an opportunity to protect our children's future. Like, you take that opportunity when you get it and to do it safely.

[Tim Pool]

What risk did the US have to Iran having a nuke?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

The way that I think about it is Iran poses an existential threat to Israel. It does not pose an existential threat to the United States. It poses a strategic threat to. To our interests, and a very, very big one. And I think that, you know, diplomacy, I agree with a lot, is, like, the best way to get something like this to happen. But I think they were stringing the president along, and I think that pissed him off.

[Tim Pool]

So do you think Iran at this point will just back down and cease hostilities?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I think the Ayatollah is very weak right now. He seems to me to have been isolated during this whole thing. I think the regime is very weak. I don't believe that we should be engaged in regime change, but I think probably all of us would agree it would be wonderful if the Iranian people were able to find their way to a less brutal regime. But honestly, I think what changed was this is something now we're all aware of is like, okay, this is a conversation that we're having that we were not having before because of the Obama era appeasement strategy that seemed to have failed.

[Elad Eliyahu]

So, yeah, others, I think that was succinct. I do think that if Iran got a nuclear weapon, they would definitely consider at least letting their proxy use it against, against American troops in the region, so they have some plausible deniability against them. Also, if they were to acquire a nuclear weapon, it would sort of be the ultimate insurance policy for them. They're, you know, we wouldn't be able to inflict as much damage on them assuming that they could use the nuclear threat in response. So the same reason that, you know, we ultimately can't support Ukraine too much, we don't want them to be too successful against Russia is because we don't want to trigger a nuclear response. We don't want to give that option to sworn enemies of our country who support proxy groups in the area that attack Americans and our allies.

[Tim Pool]

I see this only as having changed the circumstances and alleviated nothing.

[Elad Eliyahu]

It's kicking the can down the road. But the military pressure, pressure should get us to a deal.

[Tim Pool]

I think it's just changed the circumstances.

[Elad Eliyahu]

It did change the circumstances.

[Tim Pool]

Right. If Iran, if Iran was intent on using a nuke to blow up a country, then wouldn't they not say, okay, plan B, let's disperse this uranium into a bunch of dirty bombs and have them detonate into a bunch of major cities?

[Elad Eliyahu]

I don't think that's in the regime's best interest right now because that would guarantee their top.

[Tim Pool]

Why would, why would nuking Israel be in their best interest?

[Elad Eliyahu]

Well, that's been their stated goal of The Ayatollah by 2040 was to completely wipe off Israel off the method.

[Tim Pool]

If they can smuggle weapons into Gaza, why not smuggle some uranium and dirty bombs now?

[Elad Eliyahu]

So I don't think they also the.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Israeli intelligence on the ground, I mean, just like, like the level of intelligence, the number of Mossad agents embedded in the highest levels of the itrg. So I think that there is going to be a lot more attention paid to that. And that intelligence is very much in our interests as Americans as well.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I just think it's dangerous for radical Muslims to get a nuclear weapon. I don't know. Call me crazy, but like Pakistan. Yeah. And I think it's a bad thing that Pakistan has A weapon. So I don't understand how that's an argument against me, really. It's a bad thing that they have.

[Tim Pool]

Oh, do we.

[Libby Emmons]

38% of votes are in, and Mamdani is leading in Brooklyn and Queens.

[Tim Pool]

He's winning New York. Yeah, let's.

[Libby Emmons]

Exactly.

[Tim Pool]

Let's get back to this story and talk about the far left taking over. Ladies and gentlemen, from Fox News, Chicago Tribune warns New York to avoid socialist mayoral candidate after mistake, Brandon Johnson. And the results are coming in for the Democrat primary in New York. Zoran Mamdani is winning by nine points with 43.1 to Cuomo's 34%. Looks like the anti Israel Democratic socialist is going to win.

[Libby Emmons]

Well, 38 stuck for a while, but yeah, it's. It's not looking good in Brooklyn and Queens and Manhattan. Cuomo has the Bronx and Staten island.

[Tim Pool]

So far, which was, you know, Manhattan went. Zoran.

[Libby Emmons]

Yeah, that's pretty crazy. Those rich people are.

[Tim Pool]

No, no, no, no. Most of the rich people fled during.

[Phil Labonte]

COVID Yeah, they live in the other.

[Libby Emmons]

Well, 200,000 of them at least went to Florida. I left, but I wasn't even rich, so.

[Tim Pool]

So is this.

[Phil Labonte]

New York's gonna get what it deserves. Did we already what it votes for, like, the. The David Freeberg from the all in podcast had a big long tweet about it, and he's like, look, we should actually hope that mom Donnie actually wins, like, the whole thing, and that he does all of the things that he's talking about doing. Because it was the point that Freeborg is making in the. In the. In the tweet was this sentiment, which is something we've been talking about all night, the leftist sentiment. The socialist sentiment is something that's actually very popular among young people in the United States. And his argument was, let this happen to New York. Let people see the terrible results of an actual socialist mayor. An actual socialist mayor.

[Libby Emmons]

We saw it in Chicago, so that.

[Phil Labonte]

Way the rest of the country can avoid this kind of terror.

[Libby Emmons]

But we saw it in Chicago.

[Phil Labonte]

Well, apparently we haven't seen it enough. So then we have to go ahead. I'll let this guy win.

[Elad Eliyahu]

And that's cutting off your nose to spite your face.

[Phil Labonte]

You live in New York, so I mean, obviously not anymore.

[Elad Eliyahu]

But no, I think it's better. Oh, I hope a socialist selected so people could have to.

[Phil Labonte]

I'm relating the tweet that Freeberg made. I'm not making the argument.

[Libby Emmons]

After, like, after college, I could not afford an apartment in New York and I had to Leave. And then after 9 11, the rents all dipped.

[Phil Labonte]

Oh, did they really?

[Libby Emmons]

They dipped for like a year. And I was able to move back and get like a cheap rent on the Lower east side. And I was able to keep my rent really low for years and years and years until I like for 20 years or something until I finally like hit market rate and I ended up out of rent stabilized apartments. So my sort of big hope if Mamdani wins is that in three years I can buy a penthouse for pennies.

[Phil Labonte]

The broad point that he was making is like he says, let's make sure one or two cities and states fall apart fast so the rest don't have to elect Mamdani.

[Libby Emmons]

The point is it'll take 25 years to get New York.

[Phil Labonte]

These policies have been shown to absolutely excoriate cities. Like, you'll have. All the wealthy people will leave to avoid the taxation that they're talking about. You're gonna lose your tax base.

[Libby Emmons]

They're gonna lose all their grocery stores. I mean, John Katsmatitis, who runs all the Grassettis and has his companies like Red Apple something or other, he runs a bunch of businesses. He was like, well, if Mamdani wins, I'll close up all the Grassettis and.

[Tim Pool]

New Jersey and I'll move, I'll leave the country.

[Libby Emmons]

No. Well, he's got a. Well, I think he could leave New York. He's got a ton of businesses. He doesn't need to keep grist also, I mean, the profit margins on grocery stores are shockingly low.

[Tim Pool]

There's this old story that's probably just an urban legend where it's like a teacher was teaching their kids about socialism, so all the kids were lefties. And he said, what we're going to do is we're going to take a test on Friday and then I'm going to average out all the scores and everyone will get the same grade. So what happened was some students studied really hard and they aced the test. Some tried their best and they got that, you know, most of it right. And then some people slacked off and it miserably. Everyone ends up getting a B. So the lazy people were like, woo, I get a B. I didn't even do anything. The people who worked their ass off were like, what was the point? I busted my ass. So the next week, and he says, we're going to do same thing again. This time everybody got a C because the hard workers gave up. They said, what was the point? I worked as hard as I could. I only got to be. What's the why should I do extra? Everybody ends up getting a circle. Now everyone's pissed. Well, now I'm not getting anything. But I'm not going to work harder than this. If the only thing I can get is a C, why would I do the effort to get an A next week? Everyone failed. The argument was. And it's. And again, it may be a real story, but the teacher was like, when people are not able to collect the fruits of their labor, they abandon the labor. What these socialists don't understand is they're literally creating a system by which individuals cannot control the fruits of their labor. When they say the people have a right, what they're saying is the committee, the institutions decide for you. Whereas capitalism is private police force. Yeah. Capitalism is the private ownership of which means the individuals can choose to collect as much as they want of their own labor. What the left doesn't like is the workers often negotiate poorly. That's their only argument. A worker has labor and he trades it, but doesn't trade it for enough. Okay, well, that was their choice. Yeah, but because of social. Brag it out of here. The argument that the government should form a body by force to come and seize things from literally everyone just means that all the grocery stores are going to close down.

[Libby Emmons]

Yeah. And this is from a city where the Democrats for years were complaining about food deserts and they're going to create them because you're going to have people, you're going to have these city run grocery stores. They're not going to know how to do it. They have absolutely no experience. I mean, that's. If he could get it through city council, which Bhatia thinks that he can't get it through city council even if he.

[Tim Pool]

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[Libby Emmons]

I feel like I have to give.

[Tim Pool]

You something in return for karma. That's okay.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I don't really have much in my purse. Oh, let's see. Hand sanitizer.

[Tim Pool]

It's lavender. I'm good. Seriously.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Let me check this pocket.

[Tim Pool]

Oh, mint. Really, I'm fine. Oh, I have raisins. I'm a mom. Wait, wait, One sec, I've got cupcakes in the car.

[Phil Labonte]

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[Elad Eliyahu]

New line 100 plus a month on.

[Tim Pool]

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[Phil Labonte]

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[Tim Pool]

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[Unknown]

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[Libby Emmons]

Potential savings will vary wins. But I think that speaking for. Well, we were talking about this before. We were talking about this before.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I think people are kind of overstating the threat this guy poses. Even if he wins, I mean, I don't think he's going to win. He might win tonight, but I mean, he's not going to, he's not going to win the election. I mean, but I, I think people are overstating a little bit.

[Tim Pool]

But it's not.

[Phil Labonte]

You are a leftist.

[Tim Pool]

It's not just Zoran.

[Elad Eliyahu]

I was saying she's a subversive leftist earlier.

[Tim Pool]

It's, it's, it's not just Zoran. It is like the Uber laws that are popping up across the country.

[Libby Emmons]

What are the Uber laws? You mean like the pro.

[Tim Pool]

You can't hire anymore?

[Libby Emmons]

That's total garbage.

[Phil Labonte]

Point.

[Tim Pool]

The point, I mean, my point is even in West Virginia, it is. You have to be a psychopath to want to run a business. I, I'm, I, you know, it's shocking the laws here. It turns out not just here, but literally everywhere. And I use West Virginia, West Virginia as an example of where it should be easy, but it's not, that's shocking to me that everything is taxed in every possible and imaginable way and they choose to enforce it as they see fit. And I mean, everywhere does this. The requirements for starting a business in general are such psychotic. And so I'm actually shocked that that Companies exist in this country. I'm not even, I'm not even exaggerating. The amount of work I have to do to run this company is so psychotic that not a day goes by I don't have a conversation with my wife where we're like, you know, this, this is really functionally impossible.

[Libby Emmons]

Running businesses is ridiculous.

[Tim Pool]

Functionally impossible. I have to work every waking hour of my life to make, to be able to do this. It's insane. And so at a certain point we ask ourselves like, just like the lesson of communism, maybe we just stop doing it. I don't get paid for the work that I do. It's because I want a company to exist. At a certain point this system is going to implode. So when I say Zoran Mamdani may not matter for New York right now, he is not just a grain of sand to make the heat, not just the snowball rolling down the hill. This is like a bunch of kids at the top of a mountain creating a 6 by 6 ball of snow and then rolling it down the hill.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

So I don't like anything he stands for. I just think he seems like a nice guy. But I think he's probably. I disagree with all of his views. I think his views on Israel are the least bad of his views. That's how bad his views are. But I think, yes, there's a way in which the Democrats that's like socialist agenda which like wants to just raise like you know, tons and tons of taxes on people and then redistribute it. I think that's bad.

[Tim Pool]

Freeze the rent. Yeah, let me tell you guys a story. Let me, let me, let me.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I also think. Okay, go ahead.

[Libby Emmons]

Once you in New York, freeze the rent with the other policies New York.

[Tim Pool]

Has abandoned, by the way, properties freeze.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

The rent on rent stabilized you get.

[Libby Emmons]

Which are already under, already like so.

[Tim Pool]

In, in New York and in California these are. And in Chicago there are because of Democrat policies to restrict how much rent can be increased. Despite the fact we were hit with massive inflation. What's happened is building owners have decided not to rent out or renovate properties because it's too expensive and the renter costs you more money. So what they've, what they've concluded is if I can only rent the apartment for $2,000, but the person who comes in will cost me 2,100 per month, I am better off not renting this apartment or paying for the renovations.

[Libby Emmons]

Well, and if you scroll down, he also wants to crack down on bad landlords.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Right.

[Libby Emmons]

So he also wants to crack down on really dumb.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

But I think that there is like, there is a level at which like so there's this bad idea, right? But the idea that like just having a purely free market is going to result in every hard working person getting like a living that they can support family on I think is also wrong.

[Elad Eliyahu]

That's a straw man.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I mean we also had a lot of people to do jobs that are really difficult and really unrewarding. And we've created a system in which it's okay to just expect them to do those jobs for very little money because they don't require like some sort of individuated, like, well, he'll fix that.

[Libby Emmons]

He wants a $30 minimum wage. The other thing too though is that in New York, right, you had a situation where you have to pay brokers fees, right? So you pay first month security and you pay a broker's fee which can sometimes be in excess of one month's rent and sometimes they'll charge you again. Oh my God, you sign a two year lease. And so what they did was they got rid of the broker's fee fees for renters and so the landlords have to pay the brokers fees now. And so all the rents have just gone up. Like there's all these unintended consequences. I mean there's all these things to try and make it fair for working people.

[Tim Pool]

Free buses, government owned grocery stores.

[Libby Emmons]

Yeah, the government and grocery stores is really bad.

[Tim Pool]

And all we have to do is tax Wall street out of business, right?

[Libby Emmons]

And they want to fight corporate exploitation like and they're talking about price gouges for grocery stores. But it costs a lot more to get food into the city.

[Tim Pool]

Here's a question for you, Bhatia. I agree there are people who do jobs that get paid very little. I want to phrase the question properly, but what are we supposed to do when the fruits of the labor of that work are not worth what that person is being paid?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

So we have artificially made it not work that through a lot of really terrible policies. So it wasn't like the free market that got us there. For example, I think you probably agree with me about this, importing millions and millions and millions of illegals to compete for low wage jobs, right? So in 1971, which was the high water mark for working class purchasing power, the percentage of the US population that was foreign born was 4%. That's not an accident that the highest working class wages and purchasing power correlated with the lowest immigration in the 90s. It was in the 70s, 1991. Today we have the stagnating working class wages. And you want to guess what the percentage of foreign born population is today?

[Tim Pool]

Super high double digits, 15%.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

So you know, we artificially made the product of that labor cheap by importing a slave caste to do it.

[Tim Pool]

There's also consideration though about kiosks and robots and AI. The value of the labor is diminishing rapidly. And these, you cannot say. The economic production of the job you do will be $7 an hour and we're gonna pay you 30. That's an impossibility.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I agree. I totally agree.

[Tim Pool]

Well, but if so if currently, because they already have robot arms that can make McDonald's cheeseburgers and kiosks where you can order from, would you just fire all those people then?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

But first of all, unemployment is very low and we've been having a lot of like, there's no correlation between automation and unemployment. Like, because we find new ways for people to.

[Tim Pool]

I don't, I don't think those, those employment numbers are functioning properly right now because of the gig economy.

[Libby Emmons]

What do you mean?

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Wouldn't that suggest that even more people are employed?

[Tim Pool]

So when you, when you drive for Uber. You know, scratch that I said Uber. When you use your car for a ride sharing, ride sharing app, the wear and tear and damage to your car and fuel actually cost you more than you're getting paid from the app.

[Phil Labonte]

Yeah.

[Tim Pool]

And people don't realize that all they're actually doing is pulling equity out of the vehicle they own. Destroying it.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

That's horrible.

[Libby Emmons]

And a lot of times you end up renting the vehicle from the ride sharing app and then you're paying a bunch of money for that too. You're almost better off just going into Hawk for a taxi medallion.

[Tim Pool]

But those people are employed. And so what we've seen in some jurisdictions, they've mandated that the ride sharing companies provide a vehicle to the driver so that it's not their cost. But what's going to happen? Tesla just rolled out some, I think. Yeah. Beta testing taxis and Waymo, of course.

[Libby Emmons]

Austin.

[Tim Pool]

Yeah, Waymo's already in what, Phoenix, Austin and California. And they're gonna be rolling out all over the place. They're limited. Oh geez. They fled the city and people pointed out that the driverless cars were on the highway. But so those Uber drivers will be unemployed. So the thing about what does it mean to be employed? I think that unemployment's undercounting a ton of people right now. Because if you stop looking for Work, you're not considered unemployment.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Unemployment is under counting unemployed people.

[Libby Emmons]

Yes, Was talking about that during the campaign too. He was saying that there were like millions of young men who just dropped off the unemployment. Yeah. And so who just are underemployed or unemployed. But you don't count them if they're not applying for unemployment. If they're not like on the unemployment rules.

[Tim Pool]

Unemployment is people who are looking for work. And if you say, I'm still live at home with my parents, they say, well, you don't count. So unemployment must be really low.

[Libby Emmons]

Low.

[Tim Pool]

But back to the point.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

But those young men are not unemployed because of automation. They're unemployed because there is a spiritual psychological crisis in masculinity in this country.

[Tim Pool]

That's true too.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Which is the result of things like offshoring of manufacturing. Feminism.

[Tim Pool]

Feminism. Yeah.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

And importing millions of people to do like low wage working class jobs, which used to give men dignity. You would start out as a drywaller and then you would move your way up and finally you become a contractor that then you make good money. Like you would provide for your family. You would get dignity out of that. And now, now those jobs are being done by illegal immigrants.

[Tim Pool]

That's true too. I also think that social. We're looking at an emergent phenomenon where the. Why all of this is happening? I saw a great mean. It said hard times make strong men. Strong men make good times. Good times make white liberal women. And white liberal women make hard times. They sure do.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Okay, can we talk about that article you posted today? I've been really wanting to weigh in on it and I didn't dare to weigh in.

[Tim Pool]

Oh, the women don't want to get married anymore.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

Yes.

[Tim Pool]

It's because men don't want to marry dudes.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

So. So pull it up. Because read the summary of it is it was the. I didn't read the article. Is it saying that women. I feel like it's saying that women don't want to. They're not getting married because men are not educated enough or not making enough money. And they're making a lot of money.

[Tim Pool]

Women can't. So from the Wall Street Journal. American women are giving up on marriage. Major demographic shifts have put men and women on divergent paths. That's left more women resigned to being single. The numbers aren't netting out. The easiest way to explain this phenomenon. Men don't want to marry one of their bros. They want to marry someone who compliments their life in a way that they cannot. Like to provide something in their life, they don't. So if there's a woman who is a girl boss and wants to hang out and likes hanging out with the dude and they get along really well and they mesh together, they maybe even hook up and she's like, I'm gonna get that promotion. I'm looking at a $30,000 a year raise if I get this. And I've been competing the guys going, that's awesome. I'm really, really feel for you. You're like, you're one of the bros. Now I'm gonna find a wife who's gonna talk to me about all the kids she wants to have and now she wants to help me start a family because I can't. And so what's happening is, that's a, that's, that's an oversimplification. But what's really happening is there's a lot of women who are going to make. I got so much crap for this. Six years ago, New York Post wrote, women are struggling to find men who make as much as they do. Let me just put it simply for all the ladies out there. If you're a 35 year old woman who makes $50,000 a year, you will not likely find a 35 year old guy who makes the same as you who's going to date you. Because a 35 year old guy making 50k a year can go to a 28 year old woman and take her out on a fancy dinner. Or a 30 year old guy making 50, 60 thousand dollars a year is going to be hooking up with 24 year olds because he's going to get on the dating app 24 year old and say, hop in my car, I got a convertible and we're going to go to the lake and then get dinner. And she's gonna be like, holy crap. So the woman the same age as him, he's like, wow, I can get a younger woman. Men want to date 22 year olds.

[Libby Emmons]

Men should be, instead of all this toxic masculinity nonsense, men should, we should go back to our society should go expecting men to be leaders and to be heads of the family and then you should marry the woman you fall in love with.

[Tim Pool]

And so once again, the issue is most women are not doing those things.

[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

I know, but that's so. I feel like this article is having not read it, but having just read the summary and the discourse online is saying that the, it's. You're saying, Tim, that men don't want these women. But I think this article is saying these are Women who make a ton of money who are like, I will only date a guy who makes as much money as me or more, even though they are very financially secure.

[Unknown]

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[Batya Ungar-Sargon]

And it's so funny to me because first of all, there is this thing in liberal culture where you have men who also want like overachiever wives. But like it used to be that like doctors would marry nurses and lawyers would marry secretaries. And so you would have this like robust middle class because you would have like one earner and a homemaker. But today those professionals marry each other. So the doctor is looking for a doctor and the lawyer is marrying a lawyer. So you have these like upper middle class over credentialed elites who are like hogging the American dream. And these women are like, if I can't find a guy like that, instead of being like what I think makes sense, which is be like the doctor and be like, hey, I'm financially secure. I can choose a mate based on how funny he is or like how good in bed he is or like how nice he is to me or.

[Tim Pool]

Like, so what they're saying is that as a 29 year old woman, she's given a.