← To My Sisters
To My Sisters
Navigating Female Friendships in Christ: Discipleship, Holiness & Pride ft. Megan Ashley
01:11:08
Loading summary
Transcript321 lines
- [00:00]
Advertiser
They say opposites attract. That's why the sleep number smart bed is the best bed for couples. You can each choose what's right for you whenever you like. You like a bed that feels firm but they want soft. Sleep number does that. You want to sleep cooler while they like to feel warm. Sleep number does that too. Why choose a sleep number smart bed so you can choose your ideal comfort on either side. And now it's the lowest price of the season. On the top selling i8 smart bed. Your best savings plus special financing limited time. Shop a sleep number store near you. See store or sleepnumber.com for details.
- [00:40]
Megan Ashley
The ending of a marriage and a friendship is a significant amount of loss.
- [00:46]
Courtney
How can you do one thing to hurt me? And I'm like, don't ever talk.
- [00:49]
Renee
I gotta go.
- [00:49]
Megan Ashley
Yeah, it's goofy.
- [00:51]
Courtney
I haven't heard that word.
- [00:53]
Megan Ashley
I'm 34 or I'm a control freak.
- [00:57]
Courtney
Guys.
- [00:58]
Renee
I can't lie to you. I have been a control freak.
- [01:00]
Courtney
The amount of allegation is like, firstly, get your mind out the gutter.
- [01:03]
Megan Ashley
They're in a inappropriate sexual relationship. The allegations that you guys get, I received them too with my friendship with Jackie.
- [01:10]
Courtney
Okay, you guys are friends now, but wait till you get married. Wait till you have kids. Wait till you. What are we waiting on?
- [01:16]
Renee
Sometimes we are the problem as well.
- [01:17]
Courtney
That if something becomes inconvenient, it must not be God.
- [01:20]
Renee
Friendships are literally built on authenticity.
- [01:22]
Megan Ashley
I'm a challenge for all the people who want to talk about their friendship. Maybe if you would start rejoicing in their friendship or maybe if you start praying and covering their friendship, God will send you what you actually want. Maybe you should do that. A lot of us ain't got peace because we ain't going to the peacemaker or the peace giver. We going to everybody else. I can have an intimate relationship with a woman and it be holy.
- [01:44]
Renee
Yeah.
- [01:45]
Courtney
Can you say it again, please?
- [01:50]
Renee
Hello and welcome to the To My Sisters podcast. I'm Renee.
- [01:53]
Courtney
I'm Courtney.
- [01:54]
Megan Ashley
And I'm Megan Ashley.
- [01:55]
Courtney
And we are your online sisters and hosts of the To My Sisters podcast.
- [01:59]
Jackie
Now we are all about promoting the wellness, growth and development of a community of sisters across the world.
- [02:04]
Courtney
And in today's episode, we are joined by the host of the In Totality podcast, A voice for our generation at the moment and genuinely a woman who loves God and is seeking her. Megan Ashley, welcome. Welcome to the team My Sisters podcast. Welcome to the sisterhood.
- [02:24]
Renee
Yes, we are so happy to have you.
- [02:26]
Courtney
We very much. Honestly, you are A highly requested guest.
- [02:30]
Megan Ashley
Highly.
- [02:31]
Courtney
The girls want to hear. The girls want to hear from you. And it is an honor to have you here.
- [02:35]
Megan Ashley
Honor to be here. Thank you. Thank you.
- [02:37]
Courtney
Our pleasure is all ours. Today we are going to be diving into friendships, having seasons, and how seasons change within friendship, but also with the friendship itself. Right? We have to embrace new relationships, new people coming into our adult lives, and whatever God is going to use them for, but also the loss of certain friendships as well. And you had a podcast before you started in totality, and that was birthed out of a friendship.
- [03:05]
Megan Ashley
Right?
- [03:06]
Courtney
You did it with your friend. And we are two best friends doing this podcast together. So we know the pain and the loss that can sometimes come with losing a friend and losing. Or having to say goodbye to something you were doing with your friend. And I think we wanted to start off this conversation one with, how did you embrace a loss and the end of a season?
- [03:28]
Megan Ashley
So at the time that podcast was ended, it had already kind of ended way before the public had knew it was ended. And I think I was. Because I was already in a. A season and a transition of loss already because I was newly divorced. And so I think I was already in that space. So the kindness of the Lord is. Is that he was preparing me and cultivating certain things in me before it got public so that I could really be able to, you know, I guess, weather all the things that were gonna, you know, transpire after that. But, yeah, I don't know. I think. I think the Lord, in his kindness, just had me in a. In a place where I was already experiencing loss, so I was already grieving something that was extremely sacred. You know, with a marriage, no matter why it ended, it was still a marriage. It was still a covenant, it was still sacred. And so I was already grieving that. But I think as women, I think that something unique about us is that because we're always changing, I feel like we're in a constant cycle of grief because we're always grieving what we like. We get into a place where we're comfortable. It's like, okay, I know myself.
- [05:00]
Renee
Yeah.
- [05:00]
Megan Ashley
Then all of a sudden, everything changes again. And then you have to get to know yourself again, and you have to let go of the person that you were before. And so as women, I just feel like we're kind of in this flow, this ebb and flow of grieving, at least for me. Like, the Lord has prepared me for grief for quite some time. My son, my middle son was diagnosed with autism, and I think that that was one of my first thoughts, thrust into grief because I had to grieve the idea of what I thought my son was going to be. He's non verbal. And so when you get pregnant with a child you're not expecting, you're not thinking or imagining that.
- [05:38]
Renee
Yeah.
- [05:38]
Megan Ashley
And so I was kind of thrusted into this, this process of grief. And I think I've kind of been used to it, you know, because every mile, every time he gets older, he doesn't hit a milestone he's supposed to hit, technically. And so you just kind of get in this, used to learning how to live with grief. And so, you know, the situation that happened with the other podcast, I think God and his kindness had already prepared me for a grief of that magnitude.
- [06:11]
Courtney
So, so, so deep, so profound. And there's something you said about, was it God preparing you for a transition by preparing you to grieve? And what are the lessons that God taught you that helped you grieve?
- [06:26]
Megan Ashley
Yeah, I think like, you know, the Bible says, Paul says that we want to, we want to know him in the power of his resurrection and in his suffering. And I think we just want to know in the power of his resurrection, but we don't want to know him in the power of his suffering. Right. And so I think that we just have to come to terms that in this life you will suffer, in this life you will grieve. You're, you know, this is just what it is. And especially for those who are in Christ, I think we need to just be okay with that and to know that in any type of suffering or any type of grief, you are becoming more like him. Right? We are being now we're able to identify with Him. And that's the whole goal is so that when the Father looks at us, he sees his Son right in us. And so I think the lessons were, at the end of the day, baby girl, we're just gonna grief. You're gonna suffer. It's not always, it's not all the time. But if you can be content with knowing that in this life, you'll have many trials. But rejoice, right, Find joy that this is just temporary. Romans 8, right? The sufferings of this present time won't compare to the glory that will be revealed to us. So this is temporary. This life is temporary. And if you can just white knuckle to Christ and your relationship with him and white knuckle to this book that is the bread of life, you'll be able to, you'll be able to make It. But I think the lesson is just like, God is good. He's faithful. He's not going to change, and you're going to experience some hard stuff. And it is what it is. He's still not going to change. Right. He's still good. Regardless of what the situation is, he's still faithful. And his word is his word. And if he knows the plans that he has for you, Right. And if there are plans to prosper you and not to harm you, you have to hold on to that. And so whatever I'm suffering, Lord, you're allowing this to refine me, to cultivate patience and endurance and. And resilience in me. You're not allowing this to destroy me, because you didn't create me for destruction. You created me for good works.
- [08:44]
Courtney
Come on.
- [08:45]
Megan Ashley
And you just have to keep saying that to yourself over and over again and repeat the truth.
- [08:50]
Renee
That's so beautiful.
- [08:51]
Courtney
So beautiful and so good.
- [08:53]
Renee
I think one of the challenges of navigating a season of grief, especially for women, is the emotions. Right. It's such a roller coaster to go through a process of loss. And I think what's beautiful about holding on to the Lord is his steadfastness, especially when we're not steadfast. But talk to us a little bit about that process of managing your emotions, of lamenting to the Lord and actually finding a space to be able to feel comfortable, to go through that roller coaster with the Lord.
- [09:24]
Courtney
That's such a good question.
- [09:25]
Megan Ashley
I feel like for me, when it comes to emotions, I have a very interesting relationship with my emotions. I think when. Well, in 2019, I was diagnosed with bipolar depression. And so with bipolar depression, it's like things that normally happen. Right. Well, I'll just. I'll try to give this example. I'll bring it back around. I'll try to give this example. My son has autism. And so in his. In his diagnosis, he has a sensory disorder. Right? Right. And so things that happen, touch, feel, sight, smell, they're magnified. Right. So where we can. We can have this conversation. This light is on. You have all these lights. We can drown all this stuff out. But for him, everything is happening at one time.
- [10:12]
Renee
Right?
- [10:12]
Megan Ashley
Right. So it's intensified. And so that's the best way I can explain having bipolar depression is that something can happen and it magnifies it. It's like something can for other people, may not be that big of a deal, but for you, it's just like it increases this feeling. For. For me, at least, it increases this feeling. And so Things that I feel, I feel them intensely, right? So that's how you can go from being super depressed or being super manic, right? You feel something happens and you're super, super depressed or something happens and you're like high energy. It's these extremes. And so I've. I've had to learn. I mean, when I was diagnosed in 2019, I was on. I tried four different medications. And in those four different medications, you have to be on them for three months at a time before they can take you off of them to try something else. And even in that, it may not work, right? So I tried all the things to try to manage these extreme emotions I was having or these intense feelings that I was happening that was happening to me that would get me, like, so caught up in my mind. I would just, like, meditate on these things and think hard on all. You know, someone said something that might have sounded funny to me. I'm like, what do they mean by that? And it would, like, it would make me hyper. Paranoid? Yeah, yeah, hyper. Like, you know, well, why did they look at me like that? Or why did you know? So it's just like this paranoia thing that happens. But in 2020, I felt really strong to, like, get off of that medication because it was just the side effects were so bad. Every one of them that I tried, it was so bad. And so I was like, all right, God, like, we're just going to have to try to do this, me and you, right? Well, I don't think that was my original intent, but in my mind, I was just like, all right, like, hopefully the Lord has me because I cannot do this stuff anymore, this medication. And then I tried other things. Weed, crystals, sage. I did all of that stuff leading up to 2023, like, trying to cope and manage all of these things. But when the Lord radically changed my life in 2023 on the porch and I talk about all the time, I really do need to get like a merch line that's like post porch, pre porch gossip gospel or something like that, because I talk about this porch experience all the time or this encounter that I had with the Lord. But I remember the Lord told me that he was requiring my life in totality and that he would be with me and in my emotions. When it came to my emotions, I knew that this was going to be the only way I was going to manage it, right? And so in reading the Word, I realized that I could cast down every thought that tries to exalt itself above Christ, right? Can cast down Every imagination, because I have the power through the Holy Spirit. The same power that raised Christ from the dead is the same power that lives on the inside of me. So if that same power can raise Christ from the dead, I can cast these thoughts down. I can demolish anything that tries to exalt itself above the knowledge of Christ. Like I have the power to do that. I think the enemy wants us to think that we don't have the power, but we do have the power to do it right? And so I started to do that. But how do you know? What's your voice? Satan's voice and God's voice. How do you know? You have to know this. So you have to know the consistent nature of God and how he speaks. And so when a thought would start to come in my head or at something that would happen and then a thought would come in my head like, oh, they hate you. I would be like, wait a minute.
- [14:02]
Renee
What verses it says here? What verses it says here?
- [14:06]
Megan Ashley
Okay, that doesn't sound like God. So if it doesn't sound like God, I'm not entertaining it. If it doesn't sound like God, I cannot entertain it. Where before I didn't have the discipline, nor did I knew I had the power to not entertain certain thoughts.
- [14:20]
Courtney
That's good.
- [14:21]
Megan Ashley
And so I think in that it started to regulate some of my emotions and it started to bring balance to my emotions. Just like the medicine that I was on. That's what it would try to do. It would try to bring your emotions even. So if you're manic, it brings you here. If you're depressed, it brings you up. But this is what the Word did for me. It brought me to a balancing point or a foundation of where he was. So if I'm up here and I'm super manic, I would remind myself of scripture or I would just pray and ask the Lord to help me. That was a big thing that changed my life in my emotions. And I mean, and I still struggle. And I. I still struggle. You know, I'm not at all completely refined, but just the simple practice of pausing and saying, God, I need your help.
- [15:13]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [15:13]
Megan Ashley
And when I can't think of a scripture, when I can't, you know, I don't have the energy to pray these like long drawn out lamented prayers. The most powerful prayer you can pray is just, lord, help me, help me. I am feeling this way. I am sad, I am scared, I am paranoid, I feel unloved, I feel unworthy, I feel unliked. And I don't know how to deal with this. Right now I just need your help. And I feel like that's that balancing thing. Just that simple prayer or calling out to him or. All right, I'm feeling lonely. Okay. His word says he'll never leave me or forsake me. Okay, Lord, you're with me. Just little things like that. I think that that helps bring yourself to a balancing point. Now, I do want to say, just so that I'm responsible, see a doctor. I don't want to be that type of person. That's like, all you need is Jesus. Yes, he is all you need, but he works in. In other ways.
- [16:14]
Renee
Right.
- [16:15]
Megan Ashley
And so if there is a medication that is helpful for you, then you need to be on that. If there is, like, I'm in therapy. I think therapy is helpful, you know, so go get check. A medical professional needs to know what's going on with you. But this is. This is my source, my lifeline. So that's just.
- [16:32]
Courtney
That is so good. And that is grown woman talk.
- [16:35]
Jackie
Right.
- [16:35]
Courtney
Like learning how to use prayer and meditating on the word to really anchor you, like really ground you. I think that brings the stability that a lot of us are looking for when it comes to our emotional regulation. And thank you so much for your vulnerability and your transparency, especially around mental health, because I think that's something people think magically goes away when you embrace Jesus. Right. And it's like, oh, you know, had depression before. Psych. It's gone. It's like, no, it doesn't work like that. Right. Deliverance or suffering, well, is a process. And it looks different for every single person. And as somebody who has people in my life who have different mental health conditions, that's very encouraging. But I think what you were describing before, around.
- [17:18]
Megan Ashley
How can I just say really quick? Paul says, Paul talks about the thorn in the flesh. And something my mom always points out is that we don't know what that thorn was.
- [17:26]
Renee
Exactly.
- [17:26]
Megan Ashley
Right. And so for some people, it may be your mental health.
- [17:29]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [17:30]
Megan Ashley
I think that we have to get rid of this idea that once we come in Christ, we are perfect.
- [17:35]
Renee
Exactly.
- [17:36]
Megan Ashley
We are not going to be perfect until we are in the new Jerusalem, until we are dwelling with the Lord forever and ever in eternity. So we are never going to be perfect. We are all going to have to. In this life. You will face trials. So if Paul didn't get his thorn removed out of his side when he asked the Lord three times to remove it, and we don't know what that thorn is, that we just have to embrace that there are some things. Right. That the enemy might send to destroy us. But it's that very thing that causes you to get on your knees and causes you to have an intimate relationship with the Lord, which is producing and refining something good in you. Right. And so I want to encourage people that just because you come to Christ does not mean that your life is perfect. It does not mean that you won't suffer.
- [18:22]
Renee
Yeah.
- [18:23]
Megan Ashley
It doesn't mean that you won't have mental health issues or that your body will automatically be healed. Jesus didn't heal everybody when he was on Earth. He didn't heal everyone. Right. And so. And that's okay.
- [18:38]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [18:39]
Megan Ashley
He will use it for his glory no matter what it is. So I just want to insert that.
- [18:43]
Courtney
So people, that's the encouragement if somebody needs it 100%. And I really love that you brought that up, because I think there is something that we can bring together from what you said, which is in a lot of the prosperity teaching, we've been exposed to Jesus. There's this idea that if something becomes inconvenient, it must not be God. Right.
- [19:02]
Renee
Oh, my goodness.
- [19:02]
Courtney
And this idea that God can't refine you through the inconveniences he's sending your way. Right. And I think we lose perspective of that because even in friendship, we're living in an age where if the friendship. Friendship ain't perfect, I'm cutting you off. I'm burning the bridge. That's the end of this thing. Forgetting that God can actually refine you through that inconvenience. Right. And I love that you kind of described your mental health journey, because I can imagine that made friendship with you not difficult, but complex.
- [19:29]
Megan Ashley
Oh, yeah. It makes my life complex. It makes relationships complex. But what I. What I think, as I get older, I think I'm. I'm realizing that I think that the Lord. And I'm literally processing this in real time. But I really think that. I think that the enemy attacks me most relationally than anything else in my life. It's relationally that he attacks me. And so anytime, like I've noticed, I've started to notice that anytime I'm getting ready to do anything of any significance, that a relationship always gets attacked or there's friction always in a relationship. And the. And the convenient thing would be to walk away. The convenient thing would be to cut off. But when I think about the Lord and his nature, like, he didn't do that to us. He remains. He's consistent. He loves, he endures. No Matter how much we treat, how badly we treat him. And, like, let's keep it a buck. We keep it like, we're not the greatest to the Lord. We're not consistent. We're not good friends. You know what I mean? And so I think that we require perfection in our friendships. And we haven't even met the standard in our friendship with the Lord.
- [20:49]
Renee
Yeah, that's so good.
- [20:50]
Megan Ashley
Right? And so, yeah, I just. I look at David and Jonathan and how inconvenient it must have been for Jonathan to be friends with David. Yet he loved him as if he loved himself. And they were close. You know what I mean? But if your dad is beefing with your best. Like, your dad is literally trying to kill your best friend, and you help him escape, and you love him, him, and you embrace him and you support him and you're loyal to him, like, that's what friendship is, no matter what the circumstances. Now, I'm not saying toxicity is to be tolerated all the time, but the Lord does give us, in Matthew, he does give us ways on how to deal with that, how to. How to. How to address offense with a friend, how to. How to process that. But it is not a cutoff immediately. There. There are ways, especially for those who are in Christ. Right. If you're in the world, I can't. That's your business. I guess you run by your own rules.
- [21:55]
Courtney
I don't know.
- [21:56]
Megan Ashley
But for those who say that they are Christians, and that's the thing that I guess grieves me is that I see so many women who say, you know, they'd be quick to say, I'm a Proverbs 31 woman.
- [22:06]
Courtney
Right.
- [22:06]
Megan Ashley
Yet we are, like, ghosting people and cutting people off. And we're jealous and we're mean, mean. We're envious. And, you know, and I just think that if we would pick this up more and then we would consider the Lord more and how he's been a friend to us and comparing. Not that we're trying to be perfect, but the Lord does say, be holy, as I am holy. Right? So we should follow that example and we should be a little bit more gracious because we're all human and we're all struggling in our own ways. Right. But friendship is. I don't know. I just think it's so important and key to our Christian walk. Like, we need community. We need healthy friendships and healthy relationships.
- [22:49]
Courtney
Absolutely. And I guess it even touches on just this word that's been on my spirit a lot recently. Reconciliation. Like, a lot of Us don't do everything we can to reconcile with those who have hurt us in some way. And community is messy. Yeah, community is messy. There is going to be a need to reconcile and heal a relationship and have those awkward conversations. And we're very worried about, like, just our generation's intolerance for that work when we receive the reconciliation of Christ. And like, how can you. How is God a friend of his enemies and yet us, as in we were once an enemy to God and yet he did everything he could to become our friend since the beginning. Since the beginning. And gain our friendship back.
- [23:33]
Megan Ashley
Yeah.
- [23:33]
Courtney
And if we can receive such a divine reconciliation, how can I not extend that to you? Like, how can you do one thing to hurt me? And I'm like, don't ever talk.
- [23:42]
Renee
I gotta go.
- [23:42]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [23:45]
Renee
No, I really love that. And I think what's also interesting is we often see our friends as the principal offenders.
- [23:51]
Courtney
Right.
- [23:52]
Renee
It's very, very rare, especially in conversations around self awareness. And a lot of women that are part of our community are so big on self awareness. But I often find the difficulty in understanding that sometimes we are the problem as well, and that there's a deep work that we have to do individually to prove ourselves to be good friends as well. So I think there's also that responsibility that we have as women to be friendly as opposed to simply, you know, extending grace to women when we feel we've been offended or, you know, seeing our friends as purely the enemy. I think there's also a bit of reconciliation that we have to do in that sometimes we are the enemy. So, yeah, I would love to also hear, I guess, from both of you guys actually, what does that process of character development actually look like in terms of becoming a better friend to people? Becoming a better friend to women.
- [24:42]
Megan Ashley
Yeah.
- [24:42]
Renee
Especially the women in your life.
- [24:44]
Courtney
That is so good.
- [24:45]
Megan Ashley
I think. I think that when it comes to friendship, like you said, especially that reconciliation part is so key. But I think something that you said about sometimes you're the problem. I think even in maturing, it's the process of humility. Like, I think we need to lean into as much as possible as humility. Because one of the biggest things that I think that we all can struggle with and it looks differently, and I know this is, for me, the Lord is really. When I say, I prayed one prayer before, before we did the Acts 2:42 conference, I remember for. There was a. A time that I just kept feeling the need to pray and ask the Lord, like, I really want you to search my Heart. And I pray that every time. But I was like, just. I was like, God, even if it's the smallest amount, this is where I made my mistake. Even if it's the smallest amount, expose it to me. And so I have been going through this, like, this exposure of pride like I've never experienced before in my life.
- [26:04]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [26:04]
Megan Ashley
And, like, I really didn't think I was that much of a prideful person. But I am learning that I'm so prideful. And the Lord was also showing me that, like, man, I'm exposing all my stuff maybe because I'm sleepy. So I just. I'm just, like, super vulnerable. But I feel like the Lord was showing me recently. Like, you. You get so upset when. When stuff happens. When. Where. If it's conflict or if some. If. Even if it's like a schedule, whatever. Like, I try. I try to do my best to do things in a certain way where there is very. There isn't a lot of room for mistake or offense or conflict or friction. Like, I really try to. In my mind, I'm like, I wanna. I wanna do all the things right so that there is no hardship. And what the Lord was showing me is that that was pride. That's pride. You're trying to do things out of your own strength because you don't wanna go through any hard stuff because that means that you might actually need me. What if I want you to need me? All the. What if. What if you realize that you need me all the time? Right. And so, like, lit. Like, the Lord has just been like, little things that would happen in my day, and I would be sensing. That's pride. That's pride. You're being prideful. You're being prideful. And so there's this great humbling that we have to lean into. Like, we have to lean into humility. And to really be like. Not by might nor by power, but by the spirit. I. There are things that we think is so easy that we can do on our own. And they're not easy. They're big things. Forgiveness is a big thing that you can't do on your own. You need the Lord to do it. Reconciliation with a friend is too big for you. You need the Lord to do it. Loving your neighbor is too big for you to do. I think we were. I was at a conference with Jackie and we were talking about this, and she. She said that, and I was like, absolutely. Like, that's too big for us to do on our own. We need the Lord to do it. And by trying to go through all the avenues to make sure everything is fine so that it does. You know what I'm saying? So that there is no conflict or that there is no situation or there is no friendship breakup or whatever is like, it's just pride. And I think that's one thing that the Lord has really been, like, shredding inside of me. It's just like this pride thing. It's like, no, like, it's okay. And it's also okay, like, lean into humility. It's also okay to be like, maybe I'm the problem.
- [28:54]
Courtney
Yep.
- [28:55]
Megan Ashley
I'm not even going to point out the fact that you're the problem. I'm feeling this. And it could be me. Yeah, it may not even be you. It could totally be me, you know, and just. Yeah. I just think, like, for. In. For friendships, you have to be vulnerable and humble. Like, humble yourself and be vulnerable. And I think that the Lord can do a greater work when we. When we do that.
- [29:20]
Courtney
Yes.
- [29:21]
Megan Ashley
You know what I mean?
- [29:22]
Courtney
So good. Oh, I feel a little bit dragged.
- [29:24]
Renee
Yeah. Cdp.
- [29:25]
Courtney
What about you, Renee? When I tell you the Lord has been confronting me on that thing. Pride.
- [29:31]
Renee
Yeah.
- [29:31]
Courtney
Like, even the smallest ounce of it. And I think, again, it's a mercy. Right. Because God resists the proud. So if you want me to walk with you into this next season you're praying about and all the things that you want to do, you don't want me to resist, you better get rid of that. Pride can't come with us on this journey. And that has led to a whole heap of self awareness that isn't stemming from, oh, God, I just want to be a better person, but I genuinely want to be more like you. And so this conflict that's come up in our relationship or this, you know, thing that I feel was so awkward and I don't want to be confrontational. What are you using it to do? Right. And I think sometimes that humility and that dependence on God leads you to make whatever decision you need to make, which could be, you know, you don't have great boundaries or you. You have too many boundaries, actually, and you're being quite selfish with your time and your resources and your energy. It looks very different for everyone. And I think we're living in a very prescriptive generation, especially with how much content is out there. It's a lot of, you should do this and everything. Relationships are meant to look like this. Friendships are meant to look like this. And if it doesn't look like that, cut it off, end it you're in something toxic, unhealthy. They're narcissistic. All these words that we weaponize.
- [30:40]
Megan Ashley
Everyone around. Everyone's narcissist.
- [30:43]
Courtney
Everyone's a narcissist.
- [30:44]
Megan Ashley
Everyone's a narcissist.
- [30:48]
Courtney
Your parents, everyone, narcissist. Get them out of here.
- [30:51]
Megan Ashley
The big end, getting rid of your parents is crazy. I've seen a lot of downticks.
- [30:55]
Courtney
Sucks.
- [30:55]
Megan Ashley
It's like, get rid of your parents.
- [30:56]
Courtney
Get rid of your parents.
- [30:59]
Renee
My parents will contact me.
- [31:02]
Courtney
And yet the word says, honor your father and mother so that your days will be long.
- [31:05]
Megan Ashley
It doesn't say, if they get on your nerves, there we go. Then you can let.
- [31:09]
Courtney
If they're worthy of respect, all of.
- [31:11]
Megan Ashley
That, just honor them.
- [31:13]
Courtney
And it's all about that unique journey you're going on with God. Because for some people, God may tell you, you know, do it, Abraham, leave your father's house. You need to go somewhere. But for others, he may. You may be a hagar. And he tells you, go back to your master's house. You know, so it's a whole bunch of my relationship, and my walk with God covers everything. And under that covering is my friendships with people is my friendships and my relationships with the women in my life. Which means my instruction around how I'm navigating this friendship with you or this new person or whoever, I need to get it from God. He needs to tell me what I need to do. But can I be humble enough to stay close to him, to hear an instruction from him about this friendship? Or am I going to go based on what I think? And I think a lot of us move based on what we think. Yeah, we don't.
- [32:00]
Megan Ashley
We don't invite the Lord.
- [32:01]
Courtney
We don't invite him into it. We don't go and inquire. We don't go and inquire of God enough.
- [32:06]
Megan Ashley
I think when the Bible says, consider, consider the Lord in all your ways. And so, like, that means even with decisions that you make, don't exclude him from anything.
- [32:14]
Courtney
Exactly.
- [32:16]
Megan Ashley
From the friendship, from the job, from the chill, how to raise your children, from. How to navigate through parent, parental, you know, friction, whatever it is. If it says, consider him in all your ways, then consider him. If you. If you going through something with your homegirl, ask the Lord, because guess what? He knows her better than you do that part.
- [32:39]
Renee
Oh, that part.
- [32:40]
Megan Ashley
That part. And he knows you better than you do that part. And so it's like, I'm gonna go to the one who created the both of us, and who knows the both of us intimately. Who knows us specifically, who created us. Who knows both of us before we were in our mother. I'm gonna go to him. I'm not going to go to the other friend. I'm not going to go to the group chat where the other person isn't in. I'm not gonna go to Instagram. I'm not gonna go to TikTok. I'm not going to go to Threads. I'm gonna go to the one who created the both of us. And that's where I'm gonna get my. My. My blueprint.
- [33:20]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [33:20]
Megan Ashley
On how I'm supposed to navigate through this situation. That's where I'm gonna get my instructions. That's where I'm gonna get my piece.
- [33:28]
Courtney
So good.
- [33:28]
Megan Ashley
A lot of us ain't got peace because we ain't going to the peacemaker or the peace giver. We going to everybody else. If you would go to him, thank.
- [33:38]
Courtney
You for coming today.
- [33:40]
Renee
Thank you for that.
- [33:41]
Megan Ashley
If we would go. If we would go to him, then maybe we would have a little bit more peace about how you stress yourself out to the point where your body is physically sick over situations that if you would just go to him, the peace that surpasses all understanding, you would have it there. Now, the difficulty may still be there, but at least you would have peace.
- [34:03]
Courtney
Yes. In it.
- [34:04]
Megan Ashley
So absolutely.
- [34:06]
Courtney
That's. So, yeah. That's top tier. Absolutely. Because we don't go to God enough to navigate the hard things we're facing sometimes. Right.
- [34:13]
Renee
We just love to rely on ourselves.
- [34:15]
Courtney
And it's so stressful and it ruins friendships. Because that's how your ego gets involved. That is.
- [34:21]
Megan Ashley
But it's also goofy. It's goofy.
- [34:23]
Courtney
I haven't heard that word in quite honest.
- [34:26]
Megan Ashley
I'm 34 for God was here in the beginning. I've only been here 34 years. Why would I think that? I know that's not. Why would I think that I know. Why do we think that we know?
- [34:40]
Courtney
Pride.
- [34:41]
Megan Ashley
We ain't been here that long. You know what I'm saying? We just haven't existed longer than him.
- [34:46]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [34:47]
Megan Ashley
Like, I constantly feel like the Lord just be like, I now I get why God went off on job. Because it's like, where were you? Hey, bruh? Like, where was you at You.
- [34:58]
Renee
I can't know.
- [34:59]
Megan Ashley
He's tripping and walling out. You weren't there. Like, I actually know what I'm doing. Like, relax. It's almost insulting. It is insulting. It's insulting to him to Think that you have a better plan than him. To think that you know more than him. That is insulting to a God who created everything, who is perfect. Perfect in all of his ways. He's perfect. And so I just think it's goofy that we would, like, literally skip him in making any decision like that is just silly to me. When he knows the days ahead. Ahead of you.
- [35:35]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [35:36]
Megan Ashley
Like he knows our. Our. Our beginning from our end. Our end from our. Like, he knows it all. So why would I not consider him?
- [35:43]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [35:43]
Megan Ashley
Why would I not ask, like, God, like, you know them. What am I supposed to do?
- [35:48]
Jackie
What.
- [35:49]
Megan Ashley
What can I say to them? That way will land, right. Because you know their heart.
- [35:54]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [35:54]
Megan Ashley
You know the space that they're in today. Give me the words that I will say that that won't offend them, but it will land so that they also know that I love them. What if.
- [36:03]
Courtney
What if we pray that and even prepare their heart?
- [36:05]
Megan Ashley
Yeah.
- [36:05]
Renee
Yeah, prepare their heart.
- [36:06]
Megan Ashley
Lay it on their heart. Before I even get there. He can do it. He actually can do it. But we just be like, ah, he's too busy.
- [36:16]
Unknown
To get people excited. About Boost Mobile's new nationwide 5G network, we're offering unlimited talk, text and data for $25 a month. Even if you have a baby.
- [36:25]
Jackie
Even if your baby has a baby.
- [36:26]
Unknown
Even if you grow old and wrinkly and you start repeating yourself, Even if.
- [36:30]
Megan Ashley
You start repeating yourself, even if you're.
- [36:31]
Unknown
On your deathbed and you need to.
- [36:32]
Megan Ashley
Make one last call or text.
- [36:34]
Unknown
Right? Or text the long lost son you abandoned at birth, you'll still get unlimited.
- [36:37]
Megan Ashley
Talk, text and Data for just $25.
- [36:39]
Jackie
A month with Boost Mobile Forever.
- [36:41]
Unknown
After 30 gigabytes, customers may experience slower speeds. Customers will pay $25 a month as long as they remain active on the Boost unlimited plan forever.
- [36:47]
Advertiser
They say opposites attract. That's why the sleep number smart bed is the best bed for couples. You can each choose what's right for you whenever you like. You like a bed that feels firm, but they want soft. Sleep number does that. You want to sleep cooler while they like to feel warm. Sleep number does that too. Why choose a sleep number smart bed? So you can choose your ideal comfort on either side. And now it's the lowest price of the season on the top. Selling i8 smart bed. Your best savings plus special financing limited time. Shop a sleep number store near you. See store or sleepnumber.com for details.
- [37:28]
Courtney
I have a better way.
- [37:29]
Megan Ashley
I'm not gonna bother you.
- [37:31]
Jackie
It's like X amount of years. I know how to speak to her.
- [37:35]
Megan Ashley
No, you actually don't know her.
- [37:37]
Jackie
Yeah.
- [37:37]
Courtney
How about you?
- [37:38]
Renee
Oh, goodness. Yeah, this triggered me quite a bit because for me, it is a form of pride. But more so, one thing that I really struggled with is the lack of vulnerability, especially in my friendships, just getting to a place. And funnily enough, Courtney has actually pulled me up on this in the past. Yeah, she tried. She did that prayer of, like, lord, let Renee receive this. Whatever you need to get to her. But I really struggled with being vulnerable with my friends. And I was definitely the classic caricature of that person that was like, oh, you know, I'm the strong friend, and.
- [38:14]
Jackie
People are always relying on me, But.
- [38:15]
Renee
I don't really feel comfortable, you know, relying on other people. And I really do feel like, well, Courtney was one of the vessels. But I really do feel like God spoke to me on that area and said, well, have you really been transparent to me? Have you really been vulnerable to me? Have you really utilized the power of confession to actually confess how you're feeling about a particular situation? And even as it pertains to emotional regulation, being in so many instances or experiences where I've not really felt empowered to articulate my emotions meant that I then found it very difficult to create relationships or spaces within relationships where I felt like I could comfortably say, this is how I honestly feel about this situation. And I'm a massive reader. I love, like, watching, reading, all that kind of stuff. So I got to a point where it was very easy for me to intellectualize things and process things intellectually, but not emotionally. Not actually spend time lamenting if I felt sad, not really giving myself space to feel the discomfort because I felt like it was almost a burden or a waste of time, but really going on that journey with the Lord and actually realizing, oh, wait, you say that your burden, your yoke, be light. It's easy. So why am I holding on to this false responsibility of having to have everything figured out when that's actually not my job? That's not my job. And I love what you were saying earlier around the peace that comes with knowing that, yo, this is actually not my responsibility. This is not my job. You are lord of Lords. You are actually lord of my life. Yeah, like, everything. That includes my emotions. That includes my discomforts. That includes the thoughts in my head. That includes everything you are lord of. There is nothing that is outside of your sovereignty. There is nothing that will surprise you about me. And I think also that battling with the perceptions that people often have of me in relationships or in friendships. Right. This idea of Renee being this stoic, very well regulated, very calm kind of Persona when internally. Oh, just needed help. I'm drowning, you know, and getting to that place where I felt comfortable enough to articulate to the Lord, but then also articulate into who the Lord sent me. So that's why I value friendship so much more now. Because I realized that friendships are also spaces for vulnerability. They're actually spaces where I can show up as me in every single different facet that I operate in. And that's actually okay. And that I can be accepted in those spaces because I've also been accepted by God.
- [40:54]
Courtney
Yeah, that's so good.
- [40:55]
Renee
And that in of itself makes me a better friend because I then become much more authentic. And friendships are literally built on authenticity.
- [41:03]
Megan Ashley
Yeah.
- [41:04]
Renee
And vulnerability.
- [41:05]
Megan Ashley
Yeah.
- [41:05]
Renee
You have to let go of the conceptions that you have of yourself. You have to let go of a lot of things and let go of control. And then even talking about the whole pride thing. Oh, I'm a control freak.
- [41:16]
Courtney
Yes.
- [41:17]
Renee
I can't lie to you. I have been a control freak. Where it becomes easy for you to want to dictate everything in your life, but often that's a trauma response that needs to be dealt with.
- [41:26]
Megan Ashley
Right.
- [41:27]
Renee
The desire to want to control everything comes from directly when you've experience a lack of control, when you've been let down. But hey, there's somebody that won't let you down.
- [41:37]
Megan Ashley
Yeah.
- [41:38]
Renee
You know?
- [41:38]
Megan Ashley
Yeah. That's been my season this year a lot because of the trauma and the loss that I experienced significantly in 2022 or 2023, that's that the amount of significant loss, the ending of a marriage and a friendship is a significant amount of loss. And I think that the trauma response was, I'm just going to try to do everything as best that I can to prevent that from ever happening again. And then the Lord is just like, megan, you're not the one to prevent it. You know what I mean? It's not your job to try to prevent that. Do as best you can. Be at peace with all people. Right. To try to be at peace with everyone. But it's like you just have to lean and trust me. You know what I mean? Like, let me actually be lord over your life. So relinquish your control. Give it to me. Right. Cast your cares on me, says the Lord, for I care for you. Do you really believe the problem is, is that your control identifies in unbelief. Right. So your pride is identifying an Unbelief.
- [42:55]
Courtney
There we go.
- [42:56]
Megan Ashley
Your trauma response is identifying unbelief. Your control is identifying an unbelief. You're like, that's what I've really been learning. It's like the Lord is like, yeah. You don't believe. You don't believe me in that area. You don't believe me in that area. That's. That's why you're struggling, because you actually don't believe that I care for you.
- [43:16]
Courtney
Yes.
- [43:17]
Megan Ashley
You believe that I'm a caring God, but I don't care for you.
- [43:19]
Courtney
Exactly.
- [43:20]
Megan Ashley
You believe that I am a. I am. I will vindicate as a. As God. I will vindicate, but I won't vindicate you. And in that, it's pride. Because you think you're so special that God's going to change his consistent nature for you.
- [43:34]
Courtney
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [43:36]
Megan Ashley
We think it's us being humble and.
- [43:38]
Courtney
It'S you being prideful.
- [43:40]
Megan Ashley
That's what the Lord has been showing me. Oh, you. So you. You think you're so humble. No. You're prideful.
- [43:44]
Renee
Yeah.
- [43:45]
Megan Ashley
You think too much on yourself.
- [43:47]
Renee
Yeah.
- [43:48]
Courtney
Yes.
- [43:49]
Megan Ashley
And so what I am learning right now is, is that I have to replace my thoughts of me and think of him. Right. So when. When Philippians says in Philippians 4, think. Think on things that are lovely, things that are pure, things that are praiseworthy. Who fits that description better than Christ?
- [44:06]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [44:08]
Megan Ashley
What fits that description better than Christ? And so I have to regulate my thoughts, which helps regulate my emotions. And think on Him.
- [44:18]
Courtney
Yes.
- [44:20]
Megan Ashley
And if. And then on thinking on him, I can. The pride gets destroyed. That control gets destroyed. That trauma response is. Is weakened. Do you know what I'm saying? I think that we have to, like, be mindful of that and stop allowing yourself to have this false humility, because really what it is, is pride. Yeah, that's pride. God is not going to change himself for you. He's not. So either get with the program or keep being triggered, running them up. You know what I mean? It's like, get with it. He loves you. It's applied to you, too. And the Bible says that we don't serve a high priest that is unable to empathize with us. He empathizes with us because he's experienced.
- [45:08]
Advertiser
He.
- [45:08]
Megan Ashley
We have a God who came down in the flesh in the form of his son and experienced all things so that he could identify with us. Your feelings and your emotions and your friend. Trauma and all the things is not far off. His friend betrayed him. He understands.
- [45:25]
Courtney
Yep. Yep.
- [45:26]
Megan Ashley
His friend betrayed him. Judas was still his friend. Regardless of if he knew he was going to do it or not, it was still his friend. He still did ministry with him. He still walked with him, slept in tents with him. Right. And his friend betrayed him. He gets it. His parents, his. Or his. His mother and his brothers, they didn't agree with what he was doing when he was in ministry. He gets it. Yeah, he gets it. He didn't have any place to sleep. I'm complaining if the. If the pillows are too flat in the hotel yet. My savior didn't have a place to rest his head half the time.
- [46:05]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [46:05]
Megan Ashley
Do you know what I mean? He gets it. He gets it. Ministry was hard. It was demanding. He had to walk. Like all the things that I'm experiencing. God was like, yeah. Jesus was like, yeah, me too. Like, what you talking about?
- [46:18]
Courtney
Right, Right.
- [46:19]
Megan Ashley
Yeah. And that my. My situation was worse. I get it. It's okay. You'll survive.
- [46:25]
Courtney
So good. So it's like you were actually in my mind, because even when you were saying earlier about whenever something's coming up, and it's like the biggest attack comes from a relational standpoint. Always immediately, I thought, Judas, and it's oftentimes that is going to be our biggest place of betrayal, our biggest place of pain. The people who are closest to us, walked with us, know us, and we assumed they would never hurt me because they love me so much. And then God finds a way for them to prove that they are fallible, they aren't God. And actually he can love you better. Right. But also simultaneously uses that betrayal or that pain to come through and refine who you are.
- [47:02]
Megan Ashley
Absolutely.
- [47:02]
Courtney
I think there's something from this conversation here as well, because we've been talking a lot about. About loss, but. And I love that you brought up that scripture, cast your cares on me because I care for you. A lot of what we've experienced in friendship is also embracing something. Right. It's not just that we're losing something. When God takes you into a new season of friendship, there's something for you to embrace there as well, which is care. Right. Somebody actually caring for you and loving you and revealing God's heart through them to you as well. I wanted us to talk about that, how there can be opportunities within new friendships or within friendships for God to really care for you. And what does care and also discipleship within friendship actually look like? And how do we embrace it?
- [47:45]
Megan Ashley
Yeah, it's. It's interesting, number one, I think how you can. How you can manage the loss of something Especially going into. So that you can be in a place to experience something new. I think why it's so devastating when we lose something significant or lose someone significant is because we place them in a position that only God is supposed to be in. And I learned this from my mom. She told me when I was a baby that the Lord asked her to place me in a coffin. In her mind, said, I want you to imagine Megan dead, and I'm her only child, and I'm this little baby. I don't know, maybe. I don't know if I was a toddler or not baby, but she was like, picture. God told her to picture me in a coffin. And then he asked her, can you still serve me? And I think that that's something that we need to ask ourselves. If this relationship fails, can you still serve him? If that marriage doesn't work out, that relationship doesn't work out. If that job doesn't work out, this podcast doesn't work out, will you still serve me? And I think if we can get ourselves in a place where God, you hold this place in my life, that no, nothing else belongs there. So if I lose. If I lose it all, I still find you to be worthy of all praise, all glory, all honor. I'll still serve you. I think that that will help. Right? So for me, when I lost the marriage and I lost the friendship, I really realized that he was the only one that deserved the position that I had placed them.
- [49:24]
Courtney
Yeah. Yeah.
- [49:25]
Megan Ashley
And so I became so in love with who he was and so condition. Like, I. I got so disciplined in spending time with him and having an intimate relationship with him, so that when the Lord did bring friendships in my life that were from him, I could steward them much better. And. But I would also have the discipline to never put someone in a place where God belongs, if that makes sense. Yeah. I have Jay and Jordan here, and we've known each other for over five years. When we were going through. When I was going through the transition of May of 2023 on the porch, we all spent so much time together in God's word. Like, just sitting in my office talking about God doing devotionals. Like, we all had the same devotional book. So, like, we would read it at different times, and we would be like, all right, what y'all think? What God say to you? What you would. You know, we would all talk about it, whether we would text each other or we would all be together in my office or at my house somewhere, and we would talk about it, and it's Interesting, because we have this, especially the three of us, we have this. This brother, sister relationship. But it's friendship, but it's also discipleship. And then because I'm the oldest one and I'm a mom, there's like this mothering that. That I have with them as well, especially more with Jordan. But there's, like, this mothering aspect. And so I've found this beautiful blend of community and discipleship and how it shows up in different forms, even with my friendship with Jackie. Like, it's. It's friendship, but there's so much discipleship that comes into it. I've been a mom longer than her, so I've been able to kind of, like, share things with her about motherhood or about how I raise my kids that have been beneficial to her. And she's been in ministry longer than me in the sense of a consistent ministry. And so, you know, she's been able to show me things and disciple me with those things. So I just think the first step is to really have a place with the Lord that is consistent and disciplined and intimate. And then as he brings in people into your life that are supposed to be there to help cultivate and. And, you know, just breathe life into that. The community that breathes life into it. That you would hold it at a different standard because of where you are with Him. Like, number one, he. No one has his place. You know what I'm saying? So I'm seeking him for everything. I'm praying for my. The people in my life. Like, I'm going to him for all things. And. Yeah, I just think that if we would manage that better, we would be able to really see how discipleship is just woven through community just in general. Like, it just is, because you have a gift that I don't have. You have something that I don't have. I have something that you may not have. And in community, we get to share with each other, and that is discipleship. And that is the iron that sharpens iron. Right? That's like. I think that's what the Lord wants. That's what we see in the Book of Acts.
- [52:40]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [52:40]
Megan Ashley
You know what I mean? They. They had all things in common.
- [52:43]
Renee
They.
- [52:43]
Megan Ashley
They. They just did life. They prayed all the time. They. They read scripture, they were devoted to scriptures, they were devoted to prayer. They were devoted to one another. You know, and so that's discipleship, you know, that's. So it doesn't always have to be a mentor, mentee, or elder in this. I think that that's fine. Right you will have the Paul and Timothy, but you'll have the Barnabas and Paul's. Right, right. And you'll have. Well, they fell out. But that's example. But the songs and the pause.
- [53:14]
Unknown
Yeah.
- [53:15]
Megan Ashley
You know what I'm saying? And you know, it won't always be Elijah, Elisha, you know, sometimes it is the David and Jonathan.
- [53:22]
Renee
Yeah.
- [53:23]
Courtney
100.
- [53:24]
Megan Ashley
I mean, like Ruth and.
- [53:27]
Courtney
Yeah. And there's something about that. He sent them out two by two. Right. It's like you're not. You're not going into this life thing, journey thing alone. Like just discipleship does really start with, who are you walking with? And are you going to be refined by them? Like you said, iron sharpens iron. I think what we've noticed with our friendship is the more we spend time with each other, the more we become like each other.
- [53:50]
Megan Ashley
Yeah.
- [53:51]
Courtney
And so your hope is this person better look like Christ. You know, Paul was saying, imitate me as I imitate Christ. If you're imitating something else, and I become like you. Scary problems. So it's really that, who are you walking with? And can that person help you look more like Jesus? That essentially is what discipleship is. And if we're going to spend so much intimate, devoted time. I love that word devotion, because you think of it more in a romantic sense or, you know, the spiritual. But really and truly, your friends, especially if you are single, you're going to be spending a lot of time with your people.
- [54:23]
Megan Ashley
And I don't think our culture or our generation knows how to have. And it's funny because I have an episode that comes out. Well, I don't know when this episode is coming out, but as we're talking today, I have an episode coming out with Jackie. And we talk about how our generation, our culture, does not understand they pervert intimate friendships.
- [54:47]
Renee
Absolutely.
- [54:47]
Courtney
Oh, you better grow there.
- [54:49]
Megan Ashley
You know what I mean? Like, you can't possibly be intimate in a friend. You can't have holy intimacy in friendship. Or it has to be something else.
- [54:58]
Courtney
Right? Yeah.
- [55:00]
Megan Ashley
But when we look at David and Jonathan, they were intimate friends. And people try to even pervert that and make it seem like Jonathan and David were something else. And they weren't, you know, they. They were. There is an intimacy that you can have.
- [55:13]
Courtney
Yes.
- [55:14]
Megan Ashley
We see that even with God and Abraham, there was an intimacy. He. He goes to Abraham, he's like, so this is what we're thinking. We're thinking about doing all these. Yeah. You know, they're like, there is an intimacy there. So I think, yeah, I think that, like, we just need to. We need to grow up and we need to be more mature to know that we can have holy intimacy in friendships. Yes. I can have an intimate relationship with a woman and it be holy.
- [55:44]
Renee
Yeah.
- [55:44]
Courtney
Can you say it again, please? Because the amount of allegations. Oh, my gosh, we also live together. Right. The amount of allegation is like, firstly, get your mind out the gut and allow the law to touch it.
- [55:55]
Megan Ashley
But that's insane.
- [55:56]
Courtney
How can you not think that there's.
- [55:58]
Megan Ashley
Get your mind.
- [56:00]
Courtney
Yeah. And God to touch it. Yeah. Please, please relocate it and let God sanctify it. Because there's too much going on. Like, we must live in such a hypersexualized, perverted generation for you to not be able to have a friendship with someone of the same sex as you and it not be perceived as something else. And I think it damages people because even when we look in the. In the realms of even brotherhood, how men stop themselves from having intimate friendship, you know, in this and the safety of brotherhood without it coming across as something that it's not. And it's like because of that fear, because of that perversion, we withhold ourselves from experiencing something that is holy and.
- [56:41]
Megan Ashley
That is precious and what it really is is a projection. So maybe you should ask the Lord to reveal what's going on with you.
- [56:46]
Courtney
To take the mind out of the.
- [56:48]
Megan Ashley
I can't fathom the idea that we can't have holy intimacy with our friends. I can't. I can't imagine seeing two people be close and intimate and share a closeness. And for the first thought in my mind to say they're in a inappropriate sexual relationship. The allegations that you guys get, I receive them too, with my friendship with Jackie. And one thing that we. We've talked about on this episode that's getting ready to come out is it's because we're honest. If people would. If we would stop being honest, you wouldn't have much to say. Yeah, but because she's honest about where she comes from, because I'm honest about the things that I've experienced. You people weaponize that honesty and that vulnerability, and then they try to project their perversion onto you and say, you. Because of where you come from, you can't possibly, possibly have holy intimacy with a woman. But the thing is, because we have Christ, it is actually possible to have holy intimacy with a woman. Because in Christ, we are new creatures. All things old things are passed away. Behold, we are new creatures in Christ. So without Christ, maybe. Maybe you can't have an intimate relationship with the same sex without Christ, but with Christ you can. With the power of the Holy Spirit, you can. I think people have got to like, that is a projection. It is. It is. It is mean.
- [58:18]
Courtney
Yeah. And it's very.
- [58:19]
Megan Ashley
It's discouraging and it's insulting.
- [58:22]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [58:23]
Megan Ashley
Especially for those who have Christian like, for you women who are Christian women, for us who are Christian women, it's like, you think I'm a liar and that's insulting to my integrity. You think that I sit up here and talk about the things of God and then cut the cameras off and go live a different type of way? That's insulting. Yeah, it's insulting.
- [58:45]
Courtney
And it goes to show how much people no longer believe in integrity.
- [58:48]
Megan Ashley
Yeah.
- [58:49]
Renee
I was literally going to say it reminds me of your point where you said, it highlights that there's an unbelief there. There is a lack of belief that we can have holy, intimate friendships, and I think also a lack of belief that these things can last. Because the other charge that we get is this is due to break up very, very soon. Or this is because we rebuke that.
- [59:08]
Courtney
In the name of Jesus to say.
- [59:10]
Renee
Our recurring prayer points. But that's where we invite the Lord into our friendships.
- [59:14]
Megan Ashley
Right.
- [59:15]
Renee
But I think when we think about some of the narratives that the world poses to us around relationships, it's that relationships break up, relationships are fickle, relationships will not last. And especially around female friendships in particular, it's that these things are due to break up, especially because of the intimacy. And actually seeing intimacy as not something that's beautiful, that's holy, that special, but actually something that's perverse and distorted that will lead to breakdown, loss, and all of these different things. So it's actually so encouraging to hear that, hey, through Christ, all things are possible, including endurance. Endurance is literally one of the hallmark features of the relationship that God even has with us as his creations and his people. But in our relationships, endurance is one of the hallmark features that Christ is present.
- [60:00]
Courtney
Absolutely, Abs. And I love that you said that. That's our constant prayer. Because even with, like yourself and Jackie, there are certain duos or friendships or even marriages, people that get raised up in a generation for people to look to as an example. And those are the ones that will receive the most attacks. And I think what people don't realize is even those kind of allegations are the way that attacks can come. Right. It's like you said, discouraging. It is when people are constantly projecting over you. Okay, you guys Are friends now. But wait till you get married. Wait till you have kids. Wait till you. What are we waiting on?
- [60:33]
Megan Ashley
Destruction. Right.
- [60:35]
Renee
Waiting for the devil to show up.
- [60:38]
Megan Ashley
Instead. Instead of being encouraging and says. Instead of saying, you know, he who began a good work will be faithful to complete it. Why not speak that?
- [60:48]
Courtney
Because they don't know it. Because they don't know it. They don't believe it either.
- [60:55]
Renee
They're not fluent.
- [60:58]
Megan Ashley
That's the end of that discussion.
- [61:00]
Courtney
They don't know it. They don't believe it as well. It's not coming from people who have experienced it.
- [61:05]
Megan Ashley
Yeah.
- [61:05]
Courtney
And sometimes it's coming from people who want it but don't believe they can.
- [61:08]
Megan Ashley
Have it or don't have it.
- [61:10]
Courtney
Exactly.
- [61:11]
Megan Ashley
Again, it's a projection. I want that. I don't have it. So I hope you don't have it either.
- [61:15]
Courtney
Exactly. Exactly.
- [61:16]
Megan Ashley
I want you to share in my misery. You know what I mean? And I think like, yeah, instead you should rejoice.
- [61:23]
Courtney
Exactly.
- [61:23]
Megan Ashley
You should rejoice. Because I think maybe if you. Maybe if you start rejoicing, I'm a challenge for all the people who want to talk about their friendship. Maybe if you would start rejoicing in their friendship or maybe if you start praying and covering their friendship, God will send you what you actually want. Maybe you should do that instead of criticizing and insulting and projecting. You should pray and cover and rejoice and then watch the Lord bring you something. And the reason why you're so mad is because your. Your character can't sustain what they have.
- [61:54]
Courtney
Oh, wow.
- [61:55]
Megan Ashley
Let the Lord develop your character so what you really want, so that you can actually receive what you're really desiring. Because he does give us the desires of our hearts, but he's also a good and faithful God and he will make sure our character is in place so that we can receive it and steward it well. So maybe we should do that first.
- [62:13]
Courtney
Amen. That was that mothering that came out.
- [62:16]
Renee
Yes.
- [62:16]
Courtney
Thank you. Amen.
- [62:17]
Megan Ashley
Yeah, I don't like when people do that. That's mean.
- [62:19]
Courtney
Yeah, it is very and so mean. The same for you. The same for you and the friendships that you're experiencing. And I love that you said, well, I don't love it, but that people can hold your past or where you've. You're coming from against you. It's terrible. And I. I genuinely think it's. Instead of it making any of us prideful or anyone prideful, it really is God. We're going to you because the arrows are flying and they really can't prosper. Right? So we're coming to you in that place of humility. We're asking you to cover this more than our characters can even withhold this friendship. Ultimately, if you want us to be together, keep us together in holiness, in friendship, and really just bowing back to God and taking this back to him. Because this isn't our pride point. This isn't what we're going into. Hey, we've been friends for 16 years, and you guys will never have. We're trying to do this with fear and trembling every day, right?
- [63:09]
Megan Ashley
I would encourage you guys to. To. Because I've been in partnerships, friendship partnerships. Is that one thing that was really significant, Significantly different with Jackie and I when we went into doing Acts 2:42 conference and partnering in that way, then past relationships and partnerships is that Jackie and she really led on this because I'm not as bold and courageous or confident as she is in the things of the Lord, but she really made it an effort and a discipline to pray. Like, we prayed together and still prayed together so much that if. If she was having an off day, we would pray. If I was having an off moment, we would pray. If things would come up and say we were irritated about something or say someone, you know, was dragging one of us online, we would pray for that person instantly. Instead of just talking about our frustrations with, oh, this person made a video about me, or this person said this about me or this, da, da, da, da, da. Instead of just talking about that, we would pause. All right, let's pray. We're going to pray for this person. We're going to pray right now. We're going to pray for our. Like, if there was tension between us, we would pray. Like, it's this constant. If you want a solid friendship and especially working together, because that's a whole nother thing that people do not understand. It's hard enough just to have a friendship. It's even harder when you got to work together, right? So it's like this. Hey, you got your armor on. You got your. You got. You put your belt on. You got your sandals, you got your helmet, you got your breastplate. All right, let's pray. All right, and here we go. Making sure each other is equipped and ready. And you know what I'm saying? Like, I don't just wake up, especially in a partnership like this. When you're doing stuff together, don't just wake up and be like, all right, I got my armor on. I've prayed, but check in on your friend. How you doing? How's your heart? You got your armor on today? How can I pray for you? How can I support you? What's God speaking to you right now? You know, like, really? I think that. I think we've got to lean into that again, that vulnerability and that humility to even ask those questions, which is still, again, I've learned this from Jackie because I'm not the greatest at it. I want to be better at that and being like, okay, like, what do you need? How can I be praying for you right now? Or, you know, I think that that will really solidify just in relationships in general. Not just friendships, but in relationships in general, but especially having a partnership where you're doing business together. Like, pray with each other all the time. All the time. Don't stop praying with each other and for each other. That would just be my encouragement for you.
- [65:57]
Courtney
Amen. Thank you so much. Yeah, thank you. Oh, this episode has been something else. Wow. Thank you genuinely for your vulnerability and honesty and for your advice for your poor. Thank you so much. So we tend to do two things to end our episodes, the first of which is we leave a little tidbit with the sisters, our little, you know, epistle to them if they want. A letter from Megan, starting with to my sisters. And before we head into just saying a prayer for you. Thank you for your advice to us, but, yeah, we just want to cover you. You're doing amazing things, amazing things, and it's public and people can be mean, you know, and a whole bunch of other stuff. And so, yeah, we just want to cover you and just root for you as well as sisters in Christ and encourage you through prayer. So, yeah, Megan, Ashley, to my sisters, what you gotta say?
- [66:51]
Megan Ashley
Oh, man, I hate being put on the spot, even though it's nothing. Told me not to do this, but I just didn't think about it. I would say, I guess, to my sisters, love the Lord your God, with all your heart, all your mind, all your soul. Love him, love his word, know him, know his consistent nature, know how he speaks so that you can discern what is your voice, what is the enemy's voice, what is the Lord's voice? And remain. I think that's my biggest thing right now, is to remain in Christ, no matter the situation, no matter the circumstance, no matter the suffering, remain in him. And yeah, your Lord, the Lord, your God, loves you and loves you intimately and intensely and is serious about you. And so in return, be serious about him and watch him do marvelous things in your life. So that's it?
- [67:56]
Courtney
Amen to that. Man, that was beautiful. It hits different when it's rooted in the word.
- [68:01]
Renee
I know, right?
- [68:02]
Courtney
It's different.
- [68:03]
Renee
That's how it's supposed to be to be fair.
- [68:05]
Megan Ashley
Yeah.
- [68:05]
Courtney
Best friend, release a prayer.
- [68:07]
Megan Ashley
All right.
- [68:07]
Renee
I guess. All heads bowed and eyes closed.
- [68:17]
Jackie
Heavenly Father, we thank you for the life of our dear sister, Megan Ashley. Father, we thank you that she has been a voice in the wilderness. And Father, we even just thank you for her obedience. God, we thank you that you have been sharp in laying on her heart.
- [68:34]
Renee
That which is on your heart.
- [68:36]
Jackie
Father, we just pray that even as she steps into this next season of her life, this next season of doing the work that you've called her to do. Father, we pray that there would be a clarity in her vision and that there would be a pep in her step. Father, we pray for further endurance to be one that would be able to carry the hearts of many. Oh, God. And Father, we even just pray that even as her heart has been desiring more intimacy with you, more time with you, more space with you, Father, even as it says in your word that.
- [69:05]
Renee
Deep calls onto deep.
- [69:06]
Jackie
Father, we just pray that that depth, that desire for depth would be met. And, Father, we just pray that even as she is coming to you in totality, Father, we even just pray over that platform, we pray over our dear sister. We pray that even as she surrenders to you in totality, that she would be able to lead many others to. To you in totality as well. And, Father, we just pray against all attacks of the enemy, especially as it pertains to her mind and her emotions. Father, we pray that you would cover her so that she would be able to stand firm. And, Father, even like the priests of old that were given the task of containing and keeping the fire, Father, we just pray that the fire that burns on the inside of her chest for you would never go out. And, Father, we just pray that you would even continue to stoke the embers that she may be able to not just keep the fire on inside of her, but also stoke the fires of many others to be led to you. And, Father, we just pray that even as her platform grows and even as she enters new spaces that you have ordained for her and new places that you have called her into. Father, we just pray that your spirit would go before her. Oh, God. And, Father, even as it says in your word that the doors that you have opened cannot be closed by men, Father, we just pray that she would step into those rooms that you have called her into with A boldness, knowing that she has been sent. And Father, we just pray even as she hears your voice, Father, we pray for deeper encounters with you. Father, we just pray that even as she has, in her secret place, been asking and inquiring of your presence, the manifest presence of the Lord, Father, I pray that you would meet her there. And Father, we just bless her, we send her away with a blessing, catapulting her into her calling, deeper and deeper her. And Father, we just pray that you would protect her, protect her family, protect the people around her, protect her community and protect her relationships. And Father, we thank you. We thank you for the work that you are doing on the inside of her that permeates on the outside that would continue to do work for a whole generation. In Jesus name we pray.
- [71:08]
Megan Ashley
Amen.
- [71:09]
Advertiser
Amen.
- [71:10]
Courtney
Wow. Well, sisters, we hope you enjoyed this episode. Thank you so much, Megan, for coming.
- [71:15]
Megan Ashley
Thank you guys for having me. Oh, I'm glad that you do this.
- [71:18]
Jackie
Yeah.
- [71:19]
Megan Ashley
What is it?
- [71:20]
Jackie
Not the.
- [71:21]
Megan Ashley
Oh, my gosh. It's like. What is it?
- [71:24]
Courtney
Many forms. Many forms.
- [71:26]
Renee
Yeah, the Gen Z1.
- [71:28]
Courtney
Millennial one. That's so millennial. That's a g. We love to see it, but love all around, honestly. Thank you. We are really grateful. Really, really grateful. And safe travel, travels back to America, and hopefully the next Acts 240 will be there.
- [71:51]
Megan Ashley
Yes. Next time. The next time I'm in London, it's not snowing or raining. What is going on? Last time I was here, two years ago, it snowed.
- [72:00]
Renee
Yeah. You have to come during the three days of summer. The three days.
- [72:05]
Megan Ashley
Next time I'm coming. It's summertime.
- [72:06]
Courtney
Yeah.
- [72:06]
Renee
Please, please, please.
- [72:07]
Courtney
But yeah, sisters, we hope you enjoyed this conversation. And yeah, be sure to follow Megan everywhere. We will put her socials down in the description in the podcast show notes and just check out in totality. If you love this podcast, you'll love that podcast, honestly. And make sure you follow us o my sisterhood, literally everywhere. Follow my bestie, Enee Kapuku and you can follow me dboarting. Sign up to the mailing list on our website to my sisters.com youm already know, get plugged in. No long term. I mean, rate the podcast five stars though, as per usual, Please. So, yeah, sisters, we love you dearly. Go with God, go with grace. We love you so much. And as always, keep glowing and growing.
- [73:03]
Unknown
Some things you wouldn't mind being stuck with, like a huge inheritance, but a phone that has to be plugged in just right so it charges is not one of those things. Switch to Verizon and we'll pay off your old phone up to $800 via prepaid MasterCard for a new one on us. Just trade in any phone from our top brands with Select Unlimited plans $829.99 purchase with new smartphone line on select unlimited plans. Minimum $90 per month with autopay plus taxes and fees for 36 months required. Let's $830 trade in promo credit applied over 36 months. Trading terms apply. Payoff Phone requires smartphone purchase and port in with new smartphone line on select plan. Let's provide most recent bill showing payoff amount of eligible phone. Additional terms apply.