To The Contrary with Charlie Sykes

Episode: Susan Glasser: TrumpSchmerz – October 9, 2025

Overview

This episode of To The Contrary with Charlie Sykes features New Yorker staff writer Susan Glasser in a bracing discussion about America under Trump’s second term. Sykes and Glasser explore whether the current spiral of norm-breaking, violence, and political retribution represents a historical inflection point or a new normal. The conversation weaves together chilling current events—mass ICE raids, the arraignment of James Comey, government shutdown—with deep reflections on democratic backsliding, public desensitization, and the limits of resilience for Americans, institutions, and journalists themselves.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Is This an Inflection Point or Just More of the Same?

[02:58-03:52]

• Sykes and Glasser debate whether recent events are historic “Rubicon moments” or simply another slide in the 10-year saga of Trumpism.
• There’s a sense among observers that escalation is occurring and that irreversible changes may be afoot.

Charlie Sykes: "Things feel...like it's escalating. It feels like we're heading towards something that might be irreversible. What do you think?" (03:19)

Glasser’s View:

• “This is a dark moment and it feels like a dark moment.” (03:52)
• Trump’s inflammatory rhetoric is translating into concrete action and structural changes.
• The developments are "shocking, but not unanticipated," as they follow through on campaign promises of mass deportations and prosecution of opponents.

2. The Violence—and the Spectacle—of State Power

[05:48-07:11]

• Sykes recounts a priest being shot in the head with a pepper ball by ICE agents in Chicago. Both note the apparent “glee” in MAGA circles at these acts.

Sykes: "It's almost as if there's a...glee or...it's like MAGA porn." (06:20)
Glasser: “Of course the revolution will be televised. To Trump, a man of visuals, it wouldn't even exist if it weren't being filmed.” (07:11)

• The public broadcasting of these raids is seen as fulfilling campaign promises and as spectacle for Trump’s base, with little fear of consequences.

3. Where Are the Constraints? The Supreme Court, Laws, and Originalism

[07:11-12:13]

• The Supreme Court opens a term where it must decide whether to check Trump’s broad assertions of power.
• Issues include "retaliatory tariffs" and ending birthright citizenship; the justices' response will be historic.

Glasser: “John Roberts has to stop bobbing and weaving and ducking, and he's gonna tell us whether he's gonna be the handmaiden to Donald Trump or not.” (08:09)

• Sykes reflects on the irony that “originalists” are enabling unchecked executive power, contrary to foundational American ideals.

4. On the “Non-MAGA Majority” and American Character

[12:13-15:35]

• Sykes questions whether the American experiment is ending—not just through Trump’s will, but through public acquiescence.

Sykes: “If the American people accept what’s happening...the American experiment is over.” (11:49)

• Glasser discusses overseas doubts about America (“You mean it's not all Americans?” – the Australian host) and emphasizes:
  • The tragedy is not external, but in the hollowing out of institutions and confidence at home.
  • There’s some comfort in rare acts of judicial pushback, like an Oregon judge’s statement:

    “We have constitutional law in America, not martial law.” (14:39)

5. Revenge, Retribution, and the Arraignment of James Comey

[15:35-17:00]

• Comey’s prosecution—pushed publicly by Trump and facilitated by loyalist appointments—signals the weaponization of the law.
• Sykes queries if this is just the "down payment" for broad retribution.

Glasser: “He told us so.” (17:00)

• The hosts compare this period to the “phony war” at WWII’s outset—a lull before the real onslaught.

6. The Bondi Senate Spectacle—New Norms of Contempt

[21:12-23:32]

• Pam Bondi, Trump’s Attorney General, gives what both hosts describe as an unprecedented, hostile, combative Senate performance.
• The “age of the unthinkable become real,” with contempt for congressional norms now public and unchecked.

Glasser: “It wasn't even the content of her non-answers as much as it was the tone and the style...basic factual questions became occasions for just absolute kind of Trumpian rants.” (21:57)

7. The Epstein File Scandal and GOP Fissures

[24:31-29:23]

• Bondi refuses to answer questions about the Epstein files; Speaker Johnson is depicted as expending “an awful lot of political capital” to block their release.
• Glasser sees this as a sign of intra-Republican Party fissures, with some prosecutors resigning rather than carry out partisan prosecutions, and a GOP co-leader supporting a discharge petition.

Glasser: “There are signs of fissures... there are prosecutors who have quit rather than carry out the orders to indict James Comey....They had to bring in people from North Carolina.” (27:41)

8. The Government Shutdown – Breaking Old Patterns

[29:23-33:26]

• The current government shutdown comes up only half an hour into the show—a sign of the wider chaos.
• Glasser notes the “incentive structure for both parties to make a deal” is gone; Trump doesn’t care about traditional Hill strategies.
• Trump’s approach: threaten to terminate federal workers, own the chaos.

Glasser: “These bad, disruptive, dysfunctional things now just take on their own internal logic.” (30:37)
“Trump started saying... my strategy is to tell Democrats that I will execute even more of the federal workers and fire them outright if you keep going with this.” (32:07)

9. The Limits of “Normal Politics”

[33:26-34:07]

• Sykes critiques the continued reliance on normal politicking (“horse race punditry,” “who’s winning, who’s losing”) when the moment demands recognizing a fundamentally changed and more dangerous landscape.

Sykes: “If you're playing chess with somebody and they stand up and punch you in the face...the answer is not to get better at chess....you are not playing the same game.” (34:02)

10. Coping as Journalists and Citizens—TrumpSchmerz

[34:07-41:32]

• Sykes asks how Glasser and her husband (NYT’s Peter Baker) maintain sanity.
• Glasser describes their “dorky” escapism: working on a new book about Vladimir Putin and five American presidents. Writing and reporting as therapy.
• Both agree on the paradox that work—engagement with the world and history—offers the only real solace.

Glasser: “It is a form of giving oneself back agency, right? For a writer, at least, it is agency to be able to write in a moment like this and to work through it.” (39:08)

• Glasser shares a new German word from a friend: “TrumpSchmerz”—the persistent worry about Trump and his impact.

Glasser: “She came back with a word...TrumpRegnerumSchlamasselSchmerz. Thank God you could shorten it to TrumpSchmerz...that kind of worry about Trump running the country...” (41:07)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "Stop the boat, I want to get off."
  — Susan Glasser, opening satire about feeling trapped in turbulent times. (02:53)

• "The revolution will be televised...it wouldn't even exist if it weren't being filmed."
  — Susan Glasser on the spectacle of violence and state power. (07:11)

• "We have constitutional law in America, not martial law."
  — Quoting a Trump-appointed federal judge in Oregon, defending judicial norms. (14:39)

• "Inconceivable in our own lifetime. It's the age of the unthinkable become real."
  — Glasser summarizes the existential shock of the current political moment. (21:12)

• “TrumpSchmerz” – ‘Trump worry’, a new German-derived word for this era’s persistent anxiety. (41:07)

Important Segment Timestamps

• [02:58] – Are we at an inflection point?
• [05:48] – Discussion of ICE violence and its televised spectacle
• [09:47] – Supreme Court’s looming decisions, originalism, and checks on power
• [15:35] – Arraignment of James Comey and Trumpian retribution
• [21:12] – Pam Bondi’s combative Senate performance
• [24:31] – Epstein files; GOP cracks and internal resistance
• [29:23] – Government shutdown and altered patterns in party incentives
• [33:26] – The futility of normal punditry in abnormal times
• [34:07] – How journalists cope with trauma and stress, “TrumpSchmerz”

Final Reflection

The episode closes with both Sykes and Glasser recognizing the value of their craft as a means to reclaim agency and process tumultuous times. In Glasser’s words: “for a writer, at least, it is agency to be able to write in a moment like this and to work through it.” (39:08) The public, they remind us, are “not the crazy ones” for feeling overwhelmed, but must grapple with their own roles and collective agency in confronting America’s most distressing era in memory.