Cafeteria wars

Summary

Summary of "Cafeteria Wars" Episode of Today, Explained

Today, Explained by Vox delves into the evolving landscape of American school lunches in the episode titled "Cafeteria Wars," released on January 22, 2025. Hosted by Noel King and Myles Bryan, the episode explores the historical context, current challenges, and ongoing efforts to revolutionize school meal programs across the United States.

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Introduction: The Battle Against Processed Foods

The episode opens with a nostalgic reflection on school lunches, highlighting the pervasive issue of processed foods in American schools. Noel King and Myles Bryan reminisce about their own experiences with school meals, noting the prevalence of processed options like chicken nuggets.

Noel King [00:24]:
"If I had to eat school lunch, that was a pretty good option."

Myles Bryan underscores the current societal disdain for processed foods, emphasizing a growing movement to purify school lunches.

Myles Bryan [00:34]:
"We are collectively very down on processed food right now."

Red Rabbit’s Mission: Serving Fresh and Unprocessed Meals

The podcast features an interview with Reese Powell, CEO of Red Rabbit, one of the largest Black-owned school food companies committed to social justice. Red Rabbit strives to eliminate ultra-processed foods from school menus, replacing them with fresh, healthy options.

Reese Powell [01:57]:
"So Red Rabbit is one of the largest black owned school food companies, but we're really a social justice company."

Powell elaborates on the challenges of adhering to federal regulations that favor processed foods, such as the requirement for Child Nutrition (CN) labels, which are absent in fresh produce.

Reese Powell [02:18]:
"If you're an operator, the process of buying chicken, then giving the CN label to the regulators to prove to them that you bought the chicken is a very straightforward one."

Despite these hurdles, Red Rabbit perseveres in its mission to provide wholesome meals within the USDA’s budget constraints of approximately $4 per lunch per child.

The History of School Lunches in America

Jane Black, a seasoned food journalist, provides a comprehensive history of the U.S. school lunch program. Originating during the Great Depression, the program aimed to alleviate child hunger and stabilize agricultural prices by purchasing surplus produce from struggling farmers.

Jane Black [05:15]:
"The National School Lunch Act is signed by President Harry Truman in 1946, stating that no nation is any healthier than its children or more prosperous than its farmers."

Black highlights that the USDA’s control over the program underscored agriculture’s dominant role, rather than education or health departments.

Jane Black [07:38]:
"The program was controlled and directed by the U.S. Department of Agriculture, rather than say the Department of Education or the Department of Health and Human Services."

Reagan-Era Cuts: The Shift to Processed Foods

The episode chronicles the significant budget cuts during President Ronald Reagan’s administration in the 1980s, which led to a drastic shift in school lunch practices. Faced with reduced funding, schools eliminated on-site cooking staff and facilities, opting instead for cheaper, processed food options from large food corporations.

Jane Black [10:18]:
"The easiest way for them to cut costs is to get rid of the staff that are cooking. They have salaries and pensions, so we'll replace them with processed foods."

This transition marked a pivotal moment where convenience and cost-efficiency overshadowed nutritional quality, setting the stage for the pervasive use of packaged meals in schools.

Michelle Obama’s Advocacy: Championing Healthy School Lunches

Michelle Obama played a pivotal role in revitalizing the conversation around school nutrition during her tenure as First Lady. Her initiative, "Let's Move!", aimed to promote healthy eating and physical activity among children, with a significant focus on improving school lunches.

Jane Black [14:09]:
"Michelle Obama is gonna focus on healthy eating and healthy kids, and so a part of that is school lunch."

One of the most controversial moments was the revelation that under the existing regulations, an eighth of a cup of tomato paste on a slice of pizza could count as half a vegetable serving. Obama publicly criticized this loophole, sparking widespread debate.

Jane Black [17:17]:
"Remember when Congress declared that the sauce on a slice of pizza should count as a vegetable in school lunches?"

Despite her efforts, Obama faced substantial pushback from various stakeholders, including political opponents and segments of the school food industry, who resisted changes that threatened established commercial interests.

Current Challenges and the RFK Jr. Movement

Fast forward to 2025, the movement to eliminate processed foods from school lunches gains momentum with support from prominent figures like Robert F. Kennedy Jr. (RFK Jr.), who advocates for stringent regulations on processed foods in educational settings.

However, Jane Black points out that transforming school lunches is emblematic of broader challenges in the food industry, where entrenched interests resist reforms that prioritize health over profits.

Jane Black [19:04]:
"There is a lot of energy behind the ideas that he [RFK Jr.] is putting out there, but translating that energy into real change is a big question."

The efforts to overhaul school lunch programs mirror the complexities faced in other areas of food regulation, highlighting the systemic barriers to implementing widespread nutritional reforms.

On-Site Visits and Student Perspectives: Idea Charter School

To provide a ground-level view, Noel King and Myles Bryan visit Idea Charter School in Northeast D.C., where Red Rabbit serves unprocessed meals. Chef Darian Devar prepares dishes like spaghetti with whole wheat pasta and mixed vegetables, attempting to entice students with healthier options.

Darian Devar [03:50]:
"Today we have spaghetti with whole wheat pasta, and we have mixed veggies... the kids absolutely love it."

Interactions with students reveal mixed feelings. While some appreciate the improved quality, others express hesitancy towards healthier options, reflecting lingering preferences for familiar processed foods.

Wesley Park [21:11]:
"It's all right... I'm probably just complaining because I'm a teenager. But, yeah, what do I know?"

Conversely, Jamar Jackson shares a more favorable view compared to past experiences.

Jamar Jackson [21:39]:
"It's much better than old lunches. At least that's what I like about it."

These firsthand accounts underscore the ongoing struggle to balance nutritional value with student preferences and acceptance.

Conclusion: The Long Haul Ahead

As the episode draws to a close, Jane Black emphasizes the significant investment required to sustain and expand healthy school lunch programs. Transitioning from processed to fresh foods necessitates substantial financial resources, infrastructure development, and widespread behavioral change.

Jane Black [20:26]:
"Pulling ultra processed foods out of school lunch means overhauling the entire menu, hiring thousands, and building thousands of school kitchens. That costs a lot of money."

The future of American school lunches hinges on the ability to mobilize resources, overcome resistance from established food industries, and maintain the momentum of advocacy movements led by figures like RFK Jr.

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Today, Explained effectively captures the intricate dynamics of school lunch programs, blending historical insights with contemporary challenges and personal narratives. The episode underscores that while the vision for healthier school meals is clear, the path to achieving it remains fraught with obstacles that require concerted efforts from all stakeholders.

Transcript

[Noel King]

It's Today Explained. I'm Noel King with Myles Bryan, senior.

[Myles Bryan]

Reporter and producer for the program. Hello.

[Noel King]

Hi. You went to public school, right, Miles?

[Myles Bryan]

Yes. Go South High Tigers.

[Noel King]

What do you remember about school lunch?

[Myles Bryan]

Ooh, I remember sad lasagna shrink wrapped in little containers. I remember avoiding it.

[Noel King]

Do you remember the nugs, the chicken nuggets?

[Myles Bryan]

Yeah. If I had to eat school lunch, that was a pretty good option.

[Noel King]

I actually liked them. But in addition to being very tasty, those nugs were very processed. And at the moment, America has got processed foods in its crosshairs.

[Myles Bryan]

It's true. We are collectively very down on processed food right now. None more so than Health and Human Services Secretary nominee Robert fluoride Kennedy Jr.

[Robert F. Kennedy Jr.]

I'll get processed food out of school lunch immediately. About half the school lunch program goes to processed food.

[Noel King]

Can the man who once saved a dead bear cub for a snack fix school lunches?

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[Jane Black]

The guy in front of me in the pharmacy line is halfway through an incredibly detailed 17 minute story about his gout. A story likely more painful than the gout itself.

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[Noel King]

You're listening to Today Explained. I'm Noel King and last week Miles Bryan and I went to Idea Charter school in Northeast D.C. okay, Miles, the challenge for American school lunches is to get the ultra processed foods out. And the challenger is.

[Reese Powell]

My name is Reese Powell.

[Myles Bryan]

Reece Powell. He's the CEO of a company called Red Rabbit.

[Reese Powell]

So Red Rabbit is one of the largest black owned school food companies, but we're really a social justice company.

[Myles Bryan]

Red Rabbit's mission is to serve kids, you know, basically the opposite of chicken nuggets. Fresh, healthy, unprocessed.

[Reese Powell]

Our chefs prepare meals using whole, real ingredients.

[Noel King]

Very nice.

[Myles Bryan]

Sure, that all sounds good, but that doesn't mean it's easy. Take chicken for an example.

[Reese Powell]

If you want to serve chicken and you use a processed chicken, it comes with a CN navel, a CN label.

[Myles Bryan]

That's a child nutrition label. It shows how a food fits into the federal rules around what goes on the plate. You see them a lot on prepackaged.

[Reese Powell]

School foods, the school food regulations, like the CN label, because then they can flow through into the school food regulations. And so if you're an operator, the process of buying chicken, then giving the CN label to the regulators to prove to them that you bought the chicken is a very straightforward one. We don't use processed chicken. We use Real chicken. Real chicken doesn't come with a CN label. Neither does any real produce come with a packaging label. And so the process of us explaining to the regulators that we are following the rules and we are doing what's necessary for the children to have a healthy meal is a little bit more complex, a little more complicated, because the system isn't designed for you to serve whole, natural, real chicken.

[Myles Bryan]

Cerise Powell and Red Rabbit, they have to go the extra mile to make their fresh chicken work. For the usda, which runs the school lunch program, they got to replicate that process with all their food, and they got to do it all within the budget the federal government provides, which is about $4 per lunch per kid.

[Noel King]

And even if you can solve for all of those challenges, you still have to cook the food, which requires a real chef. In this case, in Northeast D.C. that is Darian Devar. Wow. Chef. May I come behind the line? I've never. Okay.

[Jane Black]

Ooh.

[Darian Devar]

All right. Can you guys hear me? So today we have spaghetti with whole wheat pasta, and we have mixed veggies. That's green beans, sauteed peppers, peppers, and onions. A fresh garden salad. We also have parmesan cheese and something that I love dearly, which is the brown butter ricotta. It complements very well with the pasta, and the kids absolutely love it.

[Noel King]

Let me ask you about these green beans, because I am dipping in the past. But you do remember the green beans? I do. You remember they were colorless? They were colorless, yes.

[Jane Black]

Flavorless.

[Noel King]

What's the word? Very, very slimy and slimy. Yeah, exactly. I do. You got peppers in there. You got onions in there. You got spices in there, too.

[Darian Devar]

Absolutely. Spices, Garlic, seaweed. You got seasoning in there.

[Noel King]

There was not a chicken nugget in.

[Myles Bryan]

Sight in Northeast D.C. yeah, that meal looked beautiful. But as the father of a young daughter, Noelle, I have to tell you something. The only thing that really matters here is are the kids gonna eat it?

[Noel King]

Fair.

[Jane Black]

How's it going?

[Darian Devar]

Parmesan cheese or ricotta?

[Noel King]

Parmesan.

[Darian Devar]

You're not e. I want the pasta.

[Noel King]

I can't get the pasta. Are the kids gonna wanna eat their vegetables? We're gonna leave you in suspense for a bit, because here's the thing. School lunch has a history. It is a rich history. It is a vivid history. It is classic Americana, and it's the.

[Myles Bryan]

Purview of Jane Black. She's a longtime food journalist who writes the newsletter Consumed, and she's sort of an expert on school lunch. We went to her House in D.C.

[Jane Black]

The history of School Lunch is, I think, a really interesting case study. When you look at the promises that make America healthy again and RFK Jr are making what they're promising to do, which is take out all of these additives and use simple ingredients, it should be really easy, right? This idea that you just buy food and you cook it and you give it to kids. It should be simple. But it has never been simple. And it's not only because of the money, although that is a big piece of it. It's also for historical reasons. School lunch is this weird little world, this complex upside down and backwards world that is shaped by rules that were made for specific reasons at the time, but that when you're trying to change things, make it very difficult to untangle and do something that just seems like common sense. And that's kind of why I love school lunch, because I love these wacky little places where you really have to get in there and understand where the rubber's hitting the road, what the problems are. But to somebody just looking in from the outside, you're thinking, why can't they just do that?

[Noel King]

Where is, where do we start if we're going to tell a history of school lunch in the United States? Where does it come from, the idea that if a kid goes to school, the school's going to feed them?

[Jane Black]

So there have always been hungry children in America, and the school lunch program is unofficially born during the Depression. And they were these ad hoc programs at different schools where children were in need. The government helped out by providing money for this, but they also helped out by buying food from farmers because in the Depression, they were struggling to sell the products that they needed. So the government would buy these things in order to stabilize prices so that farmers also can make a living and take that food and give it to schools. The program becomes formalized in 1946. It's called the National School Lunch Act. It's signed by President Harry Truman. And he says this famous line when he famous to school food nerds like me when he signs the bill, that.

[Myles Bryan]

Is, no nation is any healthier than its children or more prosperous than its farmers.

[Jane Black]

And so I think that's such an important line because this program was never really only about children and nutrition. The program always had two masters. And the fact that the program was controlled and Directed by the U.S. department of Agriculture, rather than say the Department of Education or the Department of Health and Human Services, shows who was really driving this program. It was agriculture.

[Noel King]

I had always wondered that how ag became so involved and it's because owit always was involved in this thing from the very beginning. What's on the plate back in the earliest days.

[Jane Black]

You know, what's funny is it's not that different than the way we picture school lunch right now. You know, it's 1950s food.

[Robert F. Kennedy Jr.]

Lunches are planned by a local school manager whose menus have taste, appeal, and day to day variety. A good lunch provides from a third to one half of the students daily need.

[Jane Black]

It's chicken, it's scoops of mashed potatoes, you know, that you take out with the ice cream scoop.

[Robert F. Kennedy Jr.]

Meats and other foods rich in protein, a combination of fruits and vegetables, bread, butter, milk.

[Jane Black]

In poorer schools, they may have not had a hot lunch. They may have had a sandwich and an apple. But I think that what you need to know about school lunch at the beginning was that it was cooked in the schools. Okay? So it's not processed food. A TV dinner that's brought in and just reheated and given to kids. There are lunch ladies, they're cooking, cooking it, and they're making it fresh, and they're serving it to the kids.

[Robert F. Kennedy Jr.]

A nutritious lunch helps a child stay alert. It helps teenagers make that final spurt of growth that develops them into healthy grownups.

[Jane Black]

My husband, who grew up in West Virginia, always tells stories about when he was in elementary school that you could smell the bread baking. Ooh. And you know, what a lovely memory.

[Noel King]

A lovely memory.

[Jane Black]

Yes. He's not that old, right?

[Noel King]

No, he wouldn't.

[Jane Black]

He wouldn't be.

[Noel King]

You're saying, like, within our lifetime, this is. This is something that was done on site. And then so the food is what we'd expect it to be. No real surprises. But then a change did come, and it was at a point in American history when a lot of things were changing. What happened?

[Jane Black]

Okay, so Reagan is elected. Ronald Reagan is elected president, and the.

[Robert F. Kennedy Jr.]

Federal budget is out of control.

[Jane Black]

He comes in planning to slash budgets everywhere that he can.

[Robert F. Kennedy Jr.]

It will propose budget cuts in virtually.

[Jane Black]

Every department of government, and school lunch is no exception. And so they cut the budgets. And the way that I often describe it to people is that schools are kind of a lot like families. When a ton of your income disappears, what do you do? You cut back, right? You have to cut costs. And at this point in the 80s, the easiest way for them to do that is to get rid of the staff that are cooking. They have salaries. They also at that point had pensions that people didn't really want to pay anymore. So we'll get rid of the lunch ladies. And we won't have to maintain all this equipment. We won't have to have stoves and refrigerators and walk ins. We'll just get these suddenly available big food companies to make all the food, package it and bring it in. That doesn't mean there was no cooking going on. But increasingly you see pre prepar and processed foods coming into schools because they're cheaper.

[Noel King]

So we move from the bread is baking in the kitchen in West Virginia to what?

[Jane Black]

Well, I remember from the 80s, you know, there were tater tots, which I loved. There were sloppy joes. And then Friday was pizza day.

[Noel King]

Pizza day.

[Jane Black]

Yes, pizza day. And it was not a triangle. It was a square.

[Noel King]

It was a square.

[Jane Black]

And it had, you know, tomato sauce. And then I always remember it was like the shredded cheese that was kind of spackled on, like it had never moved. But we loved it.

[Noel King]

It picked up one edge and you could tear the whole thing off.

[Jane Black]

Exactly, exactly. And so, you know, that's what there was.

[Noel King]

I can't believe I'm actually going to consume a school hamburger.

[Jane Black]

What do you want these beef hearts on the floor? It doesn't look very clean. Just do your job, heart boy. And that's what kids got used to seeing not only at school, but increasingly throughout society. We all start eating a lot more processed foods and a lot more fast food, et cetera, et cetera.

[Noel King]

Coming up, Jane Black comes back to tell us what happened when we tried to make the kids eat some vegetables.

[Myles Bryan]

And what is a vegetable anyway?

[Noel King]

Mmm.

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[Noel King]

It's today explained Miles. Bryan and I are back with Jane Black.

[Myles Bryan]

She writes the Consumed newsletter and has covered school lunch for many years.

[Noel King]

So when we left off, American kids were getting mostly processed foods in their school lunch. And then one woman risked it all.

[Jane Black]

The person who comes along and raises a ton of awareness about what's happening in school food is Michelle Obama. And so when Obama is elected in 2008, Michelle Obama, like many first ladies before her, sort of chooses an issue, right? You know, Nancy Reagan had just say no to drugs, say no to drugs and say yes to life. And Laura Bush was very focused on literacy.

[Myles Bryan]

Start by reading this book, one of.

[Noel King]

My favorite books, Duck for President.

[Jane Black]

And Michelle Obama is gonna focus on healthy eating and healthy kids. And so a part of that is school lunch. And so you've got her, you know, dancing with Elmo. So how do you guys feel about getting kids pumped up and excited about eating healthy food?

[Noel King]

Oh, well, it's wonderful.

[Jane Black]

Emma loves happy food. You've got her bringing chefs to the White House. On the newly planted garden on the south lawn. Do you know what Swiss chard is? It's like a green. It's like a collard. It's like a lettuce. She's out there talking about how important school lunch is to children, especially children who are hungry and getting some of their most important calories of the day, and how it is essential to make those meals as healthy as possible.

[Noel King]

How does her advocacy go over?

[Jane Black]

So it really depends who you talk to. Michelle Obama was a hero to so many liberals. On the other hand, you then have the opposition, the Republicans, who are not into this at all.

[Noel King]

And there is no sign this morning that congressional Republicans are being swayed by first lady Michelle Obama.

[Myles Bryan]

The decisions about the lunchroom should be.

[Jane Black]

Made there, should be made with the.

[Myles Bryan]

Parents in the school district, not some.

[Jane Black]

Bureaucrat in Washington, D.C. i mean, to them, what Michelle Obama is doing is the ultimate nanny state. She's saying, here's what you can eat. I'm going to tell you what to eat. You know, parents shouldn't have control. Kids shouldn't have control. It was very much portrayed as if she was stepping on parents toes and telling them what they were allowed to feed their kids. The other piece of it that I think is worth mentioning is that there was a big pushback, partially from people in the school food world who were saying, hey, not so fast. If we give kids quinoa and, you know, roasted vegetables, are they gonna eat them? You know, they like pizza.

[Noel King]

And pizza, which kids and all of us do love, kind of becomes a bit of a flashpoint here. Remind us of this embarrassing chapter.

[Jane Black]

Yes, this was quite a moment. So one of the things that Michelle Obama and her team discover when they dive into the school food nutrition rules is that one eighth of a cup of tomato paste, that's about two tablespoons. And conveniently, the amount that is on a piece of pizza counts in school lunch world as half a vegetable, which is weird. And they're able to say, hey, wait a minute, look at this, something is wrong here. Pizza is a vegetable. Do you see how crazy this has become?

[Noel King]

And she wrote an Op ed for the New York Times. It was somewhat snarky saying, you know, remember when Congress declared that the sauce on a slice of pizza should count as a vegetable in school lunches?

[Darian Devar]

Common sense, it's not a vegetable.

[Jane Black]

What's next? Our Twinkies going to be considered a vegetable? What was really crazy was that she lost that battle. You know, the school lunch people, the food companies, the pizza makers, get to members of Congress and they're like, wait a minute, you are not going to say that pizza doesn't count as a vegetable. And they, they refuse to let it happen. I mean, just to complicate the story just a little bit, I did talk to some nutritionists, and I think this is really interesting. They didn't really object to the fact that an eighth of a cup of tomato paste does give you some nutrients. In fact, they told me it is about the equivalent of half an orange in terms of vitamins and nutrients. What's crazy, though, is just how quickly this was shut down. And I think it shows how powerful interests really have a hold on the school lunch program and how difficult it is to make common sense changes.

[Noel King]

So let me ask you, lastly, you've laid out how school lunch in a lot of ways illustrates what American priorities have been for a century, right since the Depression. And we see how lunch becomes something that is good for kids, but also convenient for business. In 2025, people like RFK and the MAHA movement that has aligned behind him, they are starting to look very differently at not just school lunch, but at the way we eat. And it feels like we really are having a moment. And I wonder, first, whether we are really having a moment, and second, if we are, if this moment has real.

[Jane Black]

Potential, real promise, I think we are having a moment. I think there is a lot of energy behind the ideas that he is putting out there, this new frame he's putting out there about companies and powerful interests taking advantage of us. And that appeals both to Democrats and to Republicans who feel it happening in this country. How you translate that energy into real change, I think is a big question. And I think that's why school lunch is a really good thing to talk about it, because it gives us this example. These things that seem like they should be simple are actually not that simple. You know, and with school lunch, in order to really change it, in order to pull ultra processed foods out of school lunch, I mean, that's making over the entire menu. That's hiring thousands and thousands of people to cook in schools, that's building thousands and thousands of School kitchens. That costs a lot of money. So people have to put their money where their mouth is. And I think if the same thing, when you look at a lot of the other areas that the Maha movement is talking about. Right. It's just not as easy. They're talking about regulating ingredients that they put in foods. So, again, a lot of these are good ideas, but putting them into practice, it's a long haul.

[Noel King]

Jane Black. The newsletter is consumed. Check it out. The long haul that Jane spoke of begins in a place like Idea Charter School in Washington, where Red Rabbit is serving unprocessed meals and where Miles and I set out to ask, will the.

[Myles Bryan]

Youths eat real food?

[Noel King]

Good, good, good, good. What is her name?

[Wesley Park]

Wesley Park.

[Noel King]

Pleasure to meet you, Wesley Park. Par.

[Wesley Park]

Which are recording for.

[Noel King]

We are doing a story about school lunch.

[Wesley Park]

Oh, well.

[Noel King]

Yeah.

[Wesley Park]

Well, the one around here is some dog.

[Myles Bryan]

Oh, no.

[Noel King]

It looks so good.

[Wesley Park]

It's all right. It's the best you can get with government money.

[Noel King]

How old are you?

[Wesley Park]

18.

[Noel King]

18. I remember being 18. They were giving us chicken nuggets, canned corn, canned green.

[Jane Black]

This stuff is all fresh.

[Wesley Park]

Yeah, yeah, you're right. I'm probably just complaining to complain because I'm a teenager. But, yeah, what do I know?

[Myles Bryan]

What about you, sir? Yes, what do you think?

[Jamar Jackson]

It's good, but I'm not gonna eat my vegetables. Yeah, no, no, it's much better than old lunches. At least that's what I like about it.

[Jane Black]

What were the old ones like?

[Jamar Jackson]

It was terrible. It didn't even look good.

[Noel King]

What did it look like?

[Jamar Jackson]

Sometimes it looked like sludge. And I wouldn't touch it. I'm pretty sure I went the whole school year without eating the lunch. Back then.

[Noel King]

Yeah, back then it was good to me. Now I feel like it's more healthy, but some certain days it's good. It has its off days. How important is healthy to you guys? Like, how important is it to. Do you feel like to be eating not unprocessed foods and vegetables, things like that? It's good. We gotta watch our figures. No, but sometimes we just be eating anything.

[Myles Bryan]

Okay, here we go. First impressions.

[Noel King]

All right, we got spaghetti, whole wheat. We got meat sauce. It's good. There's spices in it. It's garlic, basil, rosemary. That is really good.

[Myles Bryan]

Very nice. Whole wheat's a nice touch.

[Noel King]

The whole wheat's a nice touch. Thank you to Idea Charter school in Northeast D.C. wesley Parr, Jamar Jackson, Latia Gregory and Kiera Roundtree. Thanks, kids. Today's show was produced by me, Miles Bryant.

[Myles Bryan]

Jolie Myers is our editor. Laura Bullard fact checked the show. Patrick Boyd and Andrea Christenstader are our engineers. It's today explained.

[Wesley Park]

I'm a historian. I'd like to explore mostly. I usually like learn about the Gilded Age and learn more and more about Appalachia.

[Noel King]

Mostly college next year, possibly don't play around College.

[Wesley Park]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Myles Bryan]

So you Gilded Age and Appalachia, those are your interests?

[Wesley Park]

Yeah.

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