Can corruption drive voter turnout?

Summary

Today, Explained – "Can corruption drive voter turnout?"

Date: June 6, 2026
Main Theme:
This episode explores how corruption—both structural (like gerrymandering) and personal (most notably, Donald Trump’s conduct)—is driving political engagement and voter turnout in the run-up to the 2026 midterms. Set in Virginia’s highly competitive 1st Congressional District, the episode weaves together conversations with activists, volunteers, and candidates about the emotional, practical, and strategic dimensions of fighting for democracy when the democratic system itself feels under siege.

---

Episode Overview

• Setting: Ashland, Virginia, a politically strategic and competitive district for the 2026 midterms.
• Key Question: Does highlighting corruption actually motivate voter engagement and turnout, especially in an era defined by polarized gerrymandering and rising apathy?
• Players: Candidates, grassroots volunteers, and the Democratic base in Virginia’s 1st, with broader implications for national political strategy.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Gerrymandering: Democracy or Hypocrisy?

[01:46–09:47]

• Virginia’s 1st District is a rare genuine battleground. Control of congressional redistricting maps is seen as a direct lever of power by both parties.
• Gerrymandering and Activist Cynicism: Many Democratic volunteers, like Katie Sitterson, initially opposed gerrymandering, but became reluctantly supportive when it was reframed as a necessary evil to counter Republican tactics.
  • Quote:
    "For such a long time the message was drilled, right? Gerrymandering is not a good thing. We don't like it, and then all of a sudden we're going out and volunteering and telling people, vote for this."
    — Katie Sitterson (05:45)
• The party line: Virginia’s gerrymandering was a direct response to maneuvers in red states, but this move left many grassroots volunteers struggling with the ethical cost of “saving democracy by breaking its rules.”

2. Grassroots Fatigue and Disillusion

[07:08–09:47]

• After courts struck down the newly enacted Democratic maps (approved by referendum), volunteers like Sitterson felt a sharp blow to morale.
  • Quote:
    "It's like, you know, the air out of your sails. Right? Like, you're just like... It's just another thing, you know, and so it's tough."
    — Katie Sitterson (07:39)
• Core issue: When a group feels like their democratic input, even in the form of a referendum, is nullified, efforts to sustain engagement become much harder.
  • Quote:
    "We even voted and we said... used our voice and it still didn't work."
    — Katie Sitterson (08:05)

3. From Political Theory to Lived Experience

[08:26–09:47]

• Sitterson’s personal journey: From apathy and Republican support, to protest and full involvement due to a growing sense that democracy’s crisis is immediate and personal.
• Closeness to the process breeds cynicism:
  • Quote:
    "The closer I get to it, I'm like, what is going on?"
    — Katie Sitterson (09:32)

4. Candidate Perspective: The System Doesn’t Work for Us

[10:13–12:53]

• Tim Sawinski, Democratic candidate, frames his candidacy as a response to endemic flaws in the system.
  • Quote:
    "You really can't do what I do and think that this system works for everyday people. It doesn't."
    — Tim Sawinski (10:57)
• Gerrymandering, in his view, is an “imperfect way to fight back” against a coordinated assault on voting and representation—ethically fraught but necessary.
  • "The alternative is to say, all right, we gave up. We’re not gonna fight back. This was an imperfect way to fight back to preserve our democracy." (12:15)

5. Can You Fight Corruption with Corruption?

[12:53–13:43]

• Both Sawinski and Sitterson grapple with the hypocrisy of defending democracy by engaging in undemocratic tactics.
  • "How far do you go with trying to save democracy if the things you’re doing are eroding it?"
    — Katie Sitterson (13:00)

6. Corruption As Catalyst: From Apathy to Action

[14:13–16:56]

• Among both activists and the general public, anger about corruption and self-enrichment in politics is a universal language—often more galvanizing than abstract process issues like gerrymandering.
  • Quote:
    "When we talk about insider trading by congressional members, people hate that more than what Donald Trump does."
    — Tim Sawinski (14:44)
• Fusion of affordability issues and corruption: The cost of living and the sense that "they're getting rich while we're struggling" is a potent motivator crossing partisan lines.
  • "People know a raw deal when they’re in front of it."
    — Tim Sawinski (15:18)
  • "That makes me angry. And I don't know how you wouldn't have a problem with that... It should anger everybody."
    — Katie Sitterson (16:33)

7. Testing the Message on the Ground

[21:30–25:47]

• At an Indivisible Virginia candidate forum, the podcast checks in with a range of activists.
• Many cite Donald Trump’s “second term” as a turning point:
  • "Trump. Trump the second term."
    — Indivisible Protester (22:54)
  • "He started firing people and dismantling the government.”
    — Indivisible Protester (23:10)
• Corruption is now far more “blatant and out there,” increasing engagement among established Democrats—but, as some admit, it’s less clear if it actually persuades new voters.
  • "Corruption is that much more apparent... it's so clear."
    — Indivisible Protester (25:20, 25:38)

8. Hope or Burnout: Closing Thoughts

[27:11–28:25]

• Lauren Natali, event coordinator, captures the campaign’s emotional tension:
  • "We passed that redistricting referendum and it was a hard sell. Our side does not like gerrymandering. We like fairness. We like rule of law." (25:47)
  • Yet volunteers are urged not to abandon hope:
    "We’ve built the networks. We’ve learned the tools. Now let’s keep up the push through the midterms." (26:24)
• Candidates and supporters emphasize ethics (mandatory town halls, banning congressional insider trading) and grassroots engagement as antidotes to cynicism.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Timestamp | Speaker | Quote | |-----------|-------------------------|-------| | 05:45 | Katie Sitterson | "We don't like [gerrymandering], and then all of a sudden we're going out and volunteering and telling people, vote for this...that was a huge challenge." | | 07:39 | Katie Sitterson | "It's like, you know, the air out of your sails. Right? Like, you're just like... It's tough." | | 09:32 | Katie Sitterson | "The closer I get to it, I'm like, what is going on?" | | 10:57 | Tim Sawinski | "You really can't do what I do and think that this system works for everyday people. It doesn't." | | 12:15 | Tim Sawinski | "The alternative is to say, all right, we gave up. We're not gonna fight back. Like, this was an imperfect way to fight back to preserve our democracy..." | | 13:00 | Katie Sitterson | "How far do you go with trying to save democracy if the things you’re doing are eroding it?" | | 14:44 | Tim Sawinski | "When we talk about insider trading by congressional members, people hate that more than what Donald Trump does." | | 15:18 | Tim Sawinski | "People know a raw deal when they're in front of it." | | 16:33 | Katie Sitterson | "That makes me angry. And I don't know how you wouldn't have a problem with that. ... It should anger everybody." | | 22:54 | RVA Indivisible Protester| "Trump. Trump the second term."| | 23:10 | RVA Indivisible Protester| "He started firing people and dismantling the government, for starters."| | 25:20 | RVA Indivisible Protester| "His corruption is that much more apparent and his complete disregard of the well being of the American public."| | 25:47 | Lauren Natali | "We passed that redistricting referendum and it was a hard sell. Our side does not like gerrymandering. We like fairness. We like rule of law."|

---

Important Segment Timestamps

• 01:46–03:25 — Ashland, VA set up: Why this district matters in the national fight over gerrymandering.
• 05:45–07:51 — Katie Sitterson on the moral conflict and morale impact of the redistricting fight.
• 09:32–10:13 — Sitterson’s personal political awakening and growing disillusionment with democracy’s fairness.
• 10:13–12:53 — Tim Sawinski’s critique of the system and rationale for fighting gerrymandering with gerrymandering.
• 14:13–16:56 — The "corruption plus affordability" message tested: why this combo cuts through to voters more than the abstract threat to democracy.
• 21:30–25:47 — Indivisible VA forum: How the base is processing disillusionment, and whether the new, more explicit wave of corruption is stirring turnout motivation.
• 25:47–26:24 — Lauren Natali’s summary to volunteers: learning from the referendum and urging continued engagement.
• 27:11–28:25 — Episode wrap-up: Host summarizes core takeaways on voter agency, the corruption message, and the affordability link.

---

Episode Takeaways

• Gerrymandering, while unpopular among Democrats, was embraced as a defensive tactic, raising hard questions about hypocrisy and the limits of procedural purity.
• The persistent sense of powerlessness and burnout among volunteers and activists stems from both structural manipulation (maps) and institutional impotence (referendums overturned).
• Corruption, especially when linked to economic hardship and cost of living, is a uniquely powerful motivator across the political spectrum, more so than theoretical threats to democracy.
• While anger and fatigue are palpable among Democratic activists, so is resolve—and the midterm outcome may well hinge on whether that cynicism turns into turnout or apathy.

---

The episode closes with a hopeful but sober note: the tools of democracy are imperfect, but giving up isn't an option for those who still believe in collective action and accountability.

Transcript

[Host/Interviewer]

So the 2026 midterms is shaping up to be an all out brawl, but the biggest fight may not be between Democrats and Republicans, but over the congressional maps itself. The Texas House formally voted to advance

[Tim Sawinski]

a bill that redraws the state's congressional map.

[Katie Sitterson]

In California, state lawmakers approved a new congressional map.

[Host/Interviewer]

Just got a major decision from the Supreme Court on redistricting. Now I get it. Gerrymandering could be one of those political words that puts people to sleep, or it can be hard to determine what the tangible impact is on everyday people. So today we're in Virginia to get a temperature check on the fairness of our democratic system, but also to put human faces to this academic problem and see what people actually think about gerrymandering.

[Red Bull Summer All Day Play Advertiser]

Ready to soundtrack your summer with Red Bull Summer All Day Play? You choose a playlist that fits your summer vibe the best. Are you a festival fanatic, a deep end dj, a road dog, or a trail mixer? Just add a song to your chosen playlist and put your summer on track. Red Bull Summer All Day Play. Red Bull gives you wings. Visit red bull.com brightsummerahead to learn more. See you this summer.

[Lauren Natali]

So good, so good, so good.

[Nordstrom Rack Advertiser]

Everything you want for summer is at Nordstrom Rack stores now and up to 60% off. Stock up and save on the brands you love like Vince Sam, edelman frame and free people. Join the NordicLub to unlock exclusive discounts. Shop new arrivals first and more. Plus buy online and pick up at your favorite Rack store for free. Great brands, great prices. That's

[Host/Interviewer]

so I'm in Ashland, Virginia, a small town just outside of Richmond, which is known for its historic train station, its central place in the story of the Civil War, and Secretariat, the Triple Crown winning horse. Ashland calls itself the center of the universe, and that checks out because it's the center of the political universe, at least when it comes to the 2026 midterms. That's because Ashland sits in Virginia's 1st congressional district, which is one of only about 35 or so congressional districts that are actually competitive. That makes Virginia particularly important when it comes to the question of gerrymandering. Now remember, Donald Trump started this gerrymandering fight in the midterms, encouraging Republicans to draw more and more safe red seats so that Republicans have a chance of holding the House. Now Democrats fought back, particularly in places like Virginia, where they tried to draw a new congressional map that could basically counter what what Republicans were doing in other states.

[Katie Sitterson]

In Virginia, voters are heading to the

[Tim Sawinski]

polls Tuesday to weigh in on A

[Katie Sitterson]

ballot measure that could reshape the state's congressional map. A it's Democrats pushing for a referendum.

[Host/Interviewer]

We can now call that Virginia voters have voted in favor of a referendum. The court struck down that new map, but it's really thrown this whole area into flux. So I wanted to check in with some of the candidates and volunteers who've been at the center of this fight, starting with Katie Sitterson, a volunteer from indivisible Virginia who's been going all across the 1st congressional district talking to people about what they feel and also volunteering for candidates. Now Katie's gone on her own journey with gerrymandering. So I wanted to ask her how she thinks about the maps, but also what's she hearing from people when she's out there.

[Katie Sitterson]

I used to not be very involved in politics. I have three kids and that was my focus, taking up all of my time for the longest time. And so last February is the first protest I ever went to. I was always a Republican, so. And until the 2016 is the first time, I did not vote Republican.

[Host/Interviewer]

So if I can add it up, it seems like Donald Trump kind of pushed you towards engagement and pushed you out of the Republican Party.

[Katie Sitterson]

Yes.

[Host/Interviewer]

Well, what have you done now that you've gotten yourself into the political game?

[Katie Sitterson]

I've been to probably 20 or more protests. I've also planned protests. I also co started what we call a weekly action rva. We just started sending out a weekly publication to people so that we give them three ways that they can defend democracy.

[Host/Interviewer]

I'm going to put a question in front of you that I've asked a lot of Democratic politicians and people like that, too. You know, democracy was a huge topic in the 2024 election, but it didn't seem like it motivated people enough to reject Donald Trump. Now you're still focusing on that kind of in the years after because of what kind of has come out of the White House. What is it about democracy and defending democracy that maybe didn't motivate people in 2024 that you might think is different now?

[Katie Sitterson]

Maybe people didn't, you know, like they, they didn't think it was really at risk or it wasn't a big deal, or people are making too big of a deal of it, or you're exaggerating now we're in it. And can you see all the things that are happening and the corruption and. I don't know. I don't know if I have a good answer.

[Host/Interviewer]

No, I think it's a fair point. Like Some people maybe thought it was an issue in their heads, but now it might be a little more tangible.

[Katie Sitterson]

I think it should be.

[Host/Interviewer]

I mean, we're also here, of course, because Virginia has been at the center of this gerrymandering fight. I wanted to ask you about this. You're someone who lives in Virginia's first District, which is not only competitive, but was thrown into flux by some of these new maps and the removal of the new maps. Can you just tell me what this last year and a half has been like for you as someone involved in the Congressional race and volunteering?

[Katie Sitterson]

It's interesting, right, because I feel like for such a long time the message was drilled, right? Gerrymandering is not a good thing. We don't like it, and then all of a sudden we're going out and volunteering and telling people, vote for this. Right. And so it's kind of an uphill battle to convince people now, not that you're convincing them now, gerrymandering is okay, but then you're trying to explain in this particular situation with these factors, this is what we're doing and this is why. And that was a, I feel that was a huge challenge.

[Host/Interviewer]

Well, let me ask about your own journey on that question. I mean, are you, were you someone who kind of thought of gerrymandering as a no. No. And has now been convinced to say in maybe some instances?

[Katie Sitterson]

So, yeah, I definitely don't support gerrymandering. But then I think it was the fact, like the conditions. Right. Well, we're not. This wasn't an idea that we just dreamed up. This was a response to what had already been done. And also it was a vote for the people. So it wasn't just decided on. We're giving the people a vote. Those factors made me feel more comfortable to be able to support it.

[Host/Interviewer]

So if I hear you right, it kind of sounds like you're saying you felt like your hands were tied. You felt like in the context of the situation, this was something Democrats needed to embrace.

[Katie Sitterson]

Yes.

[Host/Interviewer]

All right. So now that the court has thrown those maps out, what was the impact then? What did you think when it became clear that what the people had decided when it comes to these maps weren't going to be the maps in November?

[Katie Sitterson]

It was hugely just a huge blow to everyone. Because when you work so hard for a long, extended period of time and you feel like you're in your heart, like you're trying to do the right thing, you really are trying to save democracy and do the right thing, could

[Host/Interviewer]

you Feel that morale hit? Like, what did it feel like?

[Katie Sitterson]

Yeah, like everyone is just. It's like, you know, the air out of your sails. Right? Like, you're just like. It's just another thing, you know, and so it's tough. It's tough.

[Host/Interviewer]

Has this had any impact, do you think, on engagement from volunteers, enthusiasm from volunteers? Like, does that morale hit have a kind of cascading effect, or is it just a moment? People are kind of bummed. Do you think they'll get back to it?

[Katie Sitterson]

That's the other thing is people start to feel like, what does it matter? Like, I tried. And we're doing all these things, and we even voted and we said, you know, used our voice and it still didn't work.

[Host/Interviewer]

Confirms that kind of negative feeling. People already have that lack of agency. They already did.

[Katie Sitterson]

So then what do I have left to, like, try to get these people, you know, back in it?

[Host/Interviewer]

I mean, I was gonna ask you about this because, you know, gerrymandering can be such a heady issue. You know, people think about it from its big impact nationally, but necessarily not from people on the ground, or it's tangible impact for you. Like, how has this experience shaped how you think about our democracy and its fairness?

[Katie Sitterson]

People know if they're not being heard and they're not being listened to.

[Host/Interviewer]

And then do you think that's how folks feel now? Yeah, I guess. A different way for me to ask maybe that same question is in the last year and a half, as you've gotten closer to the democratic process, has it made you feel like the system is more fair, less fair?

[Katie Sitterson]

I want to say that being closer to it gives me more hope. It makes me feel. I don't know if that's true. Yeah, I feel like that's terrible to say.

[Host/Interviewer]

It's not. It's kind of why I'm asking you, because I, you know, as someone pretty close to it, I'm not sure about its fairness. So I guess I wanted to see from your perspective as you've seen this with fresh eyes, like, does it make you feel better or worse about the system we've set up?

[Katie Sitterson]

Okay, so the Katie, before she ever went to protest, the Katie that used to vote Republican was like, all in democracy. Like, I had no idea, like, what's really going on and what. You know. And so now the closer I get to, I'm like, what is going on? Right.

[Host/Interviewer]

I appreciate learning more about this community, but I also want to meet the candidate that you're volunteering for. We're about to Go meet him, right?

[Katie Sitterson]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Host/Interviewer]

Okay. Just around the corner, I think.

[Katie Sitterson]

Yep. Around the corner. Yep.

[Host/Interviewer]

Hi, how are you? It's nice to meet you. Nice to meet you. I think we're gonna head in here so we can sound stuff. Hello. We're back. Thank you all so much again. Sure, no problem. I would love for you to introduce yourself.

[Tim Sawinski]

I'm Tim Sawinski. I'm one of the candidates running in Congressional District 1 in Virginia.

[Host/Interviewer]

Katie told me about how she got involved in politics, how the last year and a half has made her much more activated and just focused in terms of flipping these seats. When did you decide to get in the race? Why did you decide to get in the race?

[Tim Sawinski]

I've been working in politics in some form or another for the last 15 years. My first way into this was I was an intern for the Obama for America campaign in 2008. And I thought government work, that's the key to solutions. Worked in the U.S. senate, worked on campaigns, and then I didn't like what I saw, so I became a community organizer in education, economic fairness. I do environmental justice now. And you really can't do what I do and think that this system works for everyday people. It doesn't.

[Host/Interviewer]

What do you mean?

[Tim Sawinski]

I mean that people get left out in the cold. Unless you can write the biggest check or you have the most money, you don't feel like you have a fair shot in the system.

[Host/Interviewer]

It sounds like for both of you, the activism is based in frustration or frustration with status quo, frustration with how the current system is set up. And it seems as if, like a frustration with people's lack of agency and being able to express how they feel. How much of that would you tie to this question of gerrymandering, the congressional maps and just how congressional districts are drawn up?

[Tim Sawinski]

Look, the gerrymandering is a major problem, but it's not like Democrats drew first blood with this one. Donald Trump doesn't think he should be held accountable by anybody, so he's trying to change the rules because he doesn't like the game. The Democrats tried to respond in Virginia and they tried to respond in California, but, you know, unfortunately, it was too little too late in Virginia.

[Host/Interviewer]

Now, Katie mentioned how she was someone who didn't like gerrymandering, how she thought that it writes the rules in a way that disenfranchise people, that minimize folks, agency and political process. As we're talking about. Like, how do you square that reality with the embrace of a hyper gerrymander map by Virginia Democrats? I mean, is it good enough to just say, donald Trump made us do it.

[Tim Sawinski]

The alternative is to say, all right, we gave up. We're not gonna fight back. Like, this was an imperfect way to fight back to preserve our democracy and have some semblance of accountability for this administration, which is actively trying to attack our democracy. They're showing us that they want to undermine our democratic process right now. And we spent months pushing for that redistricting vote. I had to change up my campaign strategy. I was going to move, and it was all worth it, even though it'd make it harder for me as a grassroots candidate to win, because we gotta do something in this moment. It's up to all of us to preserve some semblance of decency, dignity, and democracy in this country. That was the imperfect response, Katie.

[Host/Interviewer]

It does kind of sound like you all are saying we save democracy by further making the system undemocratic, though.

[Katie Sitterson]

That is a fair, fair point to make. Right? Like, how far do you go with trying to save democracy if the things you're doing are eroding it? It's complicated to say, okay, well, we're gonna fight back and we're gonna draw the maps in a way that sort of minimizes some people's voices, but we're doing it for the greater good. But then the conversation I'd have with people is, well, how do you feel about what was already done? Right. Like you should. If you're angry at what's happening here in Virginia and the gerrymanding, gerrymandering that we're advocating for, were you equally as angry about these other things that Donald Trump did?

[Host/Interviewer]

Trump did in Texas, what he tried to do. Indiana, Yeah.

[Tim Sawinski]

I just kind of push back on these constant questions of Virginia being a hypocrite. What they did in Texas, they didn't give the people a chance to vote on it. What they did in Florida, they're not giving people a chance to vote on it. What they're doing in Louisiana, they definitely didn't give a chance to vote on it. Virginians chose this. And, yes, the maps are a problem, and they're always gonna be a problem when there's gonna be backroom deals making maps that strategically disadvantage one party over the other. But again, I go back to politics is fundamentally flawed, and it needs to be. We need to add some remedies to these.

[Host/Interviewer]

One of the things we talked about is gerrymandering may not be a more tangible concern for people, but you brought up some of the other ones. Cost of living and such. I was wondering where this issue of corruption landed on the priority list when you all. I know it's a priority for y' all as folks who are engaged and. But when you talk to other folk, other people, is Donald Trump's open grift. Is that something that, that motivates action, or is that something that's just kind of baked in the cost at this point?

[Tim Sawinski]

From my experience with everyday people, Republican, Democrat, left, right, everyone between. It's all about affordability and corruption. Now, talking about Donald Trump's corruption is harder to get through. But when we talk about insider trading by congressional members, people hate that are

[Host/Interviewer]

more than what Donald Trump does.

[Tim Sawinski]

There's a difference. You have to acknowledge where people are at most, people are not paying attention to politics. They're just trying to get by. They're just trying to live happy lives. They're trying to make enough money. And to talk about the nuances of like, well, he's enriching himself with stocks.

[Katie Sitterson]

Right.

[Host/Interviewer]

That's.

[Tim Sawinski]

That's so far beyond what's right in front of people. What's right in front of people is gas prices. What's right in front of people is the cost of groceries going up. So, yeah, it's hard to talk to people about how they're enriching themselves with wealth versus income and all of the nuances of our economy. And Bitcoin. Right, Crypto. Exactly. And. But people know a raw deal when they're in front of it.

[Host/Interviewer]

But I guess I was interested in what you were saying, that it does seem that congressional stock trading is a motivating thing. Like, what is the connection between affordability and corruption?

[Tim Sawinski]

It's a couple of things. It's when you see that they're enriching themselves, you don't have to know the nuances of the stock market or insider trading. You just see that they're getting wealthier, while at the same time, everybody else is getting. It's harder to live. Life shouldn't be this unaffordable. And if you say like, yes, it's because of them, but also at the same time, they're enriching themselves, that drives people crazy. And that doesn't matter who they voted. And for them, it doesn't matter who they voted for in the last election,

[Host/Interviewer]

is that the right way to think about this? Not just corruption on one side, affordability on the other side, but the combo of people seeing that their lives are getting more expensive as Donald Trump is grifting along the way.

[Katie Sitterson]

I think so. I mean, you have a person who's Putting up gold statues and decking out the White House, you know?

[Host/Interviewer]

Yeah, yeah. Ballrooms.

[Katie Sitterson]

Yeah. Like, I just. I don't know. It's hard. I just speak for myself. Like, that makes me angry. And I don't know how you wouldn't have a problem with that. Like anybody. It doesn't matter which president it is and which, you know, what letters in front of his name. It should anger everybody. Like, why is that fair? That's not how. That's not how the office was set up.

[Host/Interviewer]

You know, the reason we're here, beyond the question of the maps, is also, you know, just Virginia. One's unique place is one of the few competitive districts. The numbers and history would tell us that midterms are not won and lost from persuasion necessarily, at least when it comes to November, but for which party is more motivated by, you know, where the enthusiasm is and who's kind of how folks are feeling about the president. We're going to this candidate forum tonight. Tell me what we should expect.

[Katie Sitterson]

Yeah. So we have five candidates who are gonna be there to take questions, and then candidates will have to face them and give their best shot and answer.

[Host/Interviewer]

Well, I appreciate yalls time. Thank you for laying this out. And I'm curious to see what we're gonna hear at this town hall. So I'm excited.

[Katie Sitterson]

Yeah.

[Tim Sawinski]

Yeah. Thank you.

[Host/Interviewer]

Support for the show comes from Quint. Summer is here, and that means it's time to update your wardrobe. So if you've been looking for pieces that feel lighter, more breathable, but still put together, look no further than Quint's this season. Quint has European linen shirts and pants that can be perfect for your warm weather. Updates your rotation. And the best part is that they start at just $34. They also have soft and easy to wear tees, plus comfortable, lightweight cotton sweaters and shirts for those cooler summer nights. I got a couple, and I love them. Plus, everything at Quint's is priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. So I got a couple pieces from Quint's and I already love them all. The first one was a tan blazer that works well for winter and summer. I actually wore it on TV the other day, and my mom told me I looked great. And for the record, she doesn't always say that. The other couple things I got from Quint were these collared shirts that can work under a jacket, but they can also work as a jacket itself, particularly in summer months. Elevate your summer wardrobe with Quint. You can go to quince.com estad for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too. That's Q U I n c e.com estad a s t E A D for free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com ESTEB.

[Select Quote Advertiser]

Support for the show today comes from Select Quote it's never a bad time to start taking your financial future more seriously, and one thing that often gets overlooked in the mix is term life insurance. You know what I mean? But figuring out coverage can feel complicated. How much do you need, what does it cost and where do you even start? But Select Quote wants to make things easier and more affordable. For over 40 years, like me, Select Quote has helped more than 2 million Americans secure over $700 billion in coverage. I haven't done that, but I've been around for more than 40 years as of late. Actually sounds like I should get some life insurance. Their goal is simple. Help you find a term life insurance policy that fits your needs and budget. They do the shopping for you so you can save time and money. And in many cases, Select Quote can give you same day coverage up to $2 million, no doctor's visit required. You can get the right life insurance for you for less and save more than [e-mail] explained. You can save more than 50% on term life [e-mail] explained today to get started. That's SelectQuote.com explained.

[Rippling Advertiser]

Support for Today Explained comes from Rippling. Lots of apps call themselves all in one platforms. Despite that, Rippling says you're probably still using more one of them to run your business. Rippling says they can help you simplify once and for all. Rippling is a united platform for global hr, payroll, IT and finance. With Rippling, they say workflows that normally bounce between several tools and departments actually just do happen in one place automatically. Let's say you have an employee getting promoted. Rippling says you can use their platform to update their payroll taxes, manage any new app permissions, ship them a laptop, issue a new corporate card, assign trainings. You can run all of your hr, IT and finance operations as one. Or pick and choose what your business needs. So if you or your company want to run the backbone of your business on one unified platform with people at the center, you can go to rippling.com explain and sign up today. That's R-I P P L-I-N-G.com explain to sign up.

[Host/Interviewer]

So we're at the Libby Mill Library just outside of Richmond and we're about to meet back up with Katie and Tim. Now, of course, I want to follow up on some of the themes that they told us earlier. But this is a particularly special event. It is a candidate forum held by Indivisible Virginia, where most of the Democratic candidates running for Virginia's 1st congressional district will be here taking questions. So, of course, I want to ask about some of the themes that came up throughout the day. Now, do these activists and volunteers feel just as jaded as Katie does because of the way the maps have put this region into flux, or are they thinking about affordability and Trump's corruption, like Tim told me? Let's find out. Now, this is one of the few congressional districts that's actually competitive, so what these folks think here really matters. I really want to ask them what's driving Democratic enthusiasm right now. Do you mind if, like, I ask y' all some questions while we wait? Okay, cool. Thank you. Part of the reason we're here, as I said, is because of the way gerrymandering has really changed Virginia one, and it's obviously one of the few competitive districts in the country. Did you organize for the referendum?

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

Are you talking about the vote for yes?

[Host/Interviewer]

Yes, the vote for yes.

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

Oh, we were very active.

[Select Quote Advertiser]

Okay.

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

I'm mostly. I work as a protester with RBA Indivisible. And we had signs out, and, you know, we were doing a whole lot to encourage.

[Host/Interviewer]

Are you someone who's always been kind of politically engaged in this way? Were you doing kind of protest actions years ago or things like that? Not what changed what, I wonder what?

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

Trump. Trump the second term.

[Host/Interviewer]

Trump the second term?

[Katie Sitterson]

Yeah.

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

When he started dismantling first term democracy,

[Host/Interviewer]

you said you were out there in the first term, you were out there in the second term.

[Rippling Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Host/Interviewer]

Can I ask, like, what was it about this second term specifically that became the more motivating for you?

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

And he started firing people and dismantling the government, for starters.

[Host/Interviewer]

You know, he's talking about those early doge actions, like, which, you know, that.

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

That, for starters, got me to my first no Kings protest.

[Host/Interviewer]

Okay. You started in no Kings.

[Katie Sitterson]

Yeah.

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

And then I got connected with RDA Indivisible.

[Host/Interviewer]

Okay.

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

And had, you know, learned how to protest and participate with them on a regular basis.

[Host/Interviewer]

Okay. One thing we were talking about earlier today was just what issues come up the most? And so some people were mentioning, obviously, affordability and cost of living, but there was a big talk about corruption and feeling as if this government, those two things, those topics of the list of

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

what we talk about with the people I hang out with, affordability and corruption.

[Host/Interviewer]

I was wondering about that second piece specifically. I mean, you could argue Donald Trump has been corrupt for a long time.

[Rippling Advertiser]

Oh, yeah.

[Host/Interviewer]

Why didn't you. For him, what do you think it is about now that feels like that issue maybe is resonating more?

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

Because. Good question. It's much more blatant and out there, you know, and him disregarding the Constitution at every turn and doing what he wants without the approval of Congress, you know, starting wars, for example.

[Host/Interviewer]

Is there something you think is more explicit about the second time around that's made the corruption issue rise in terms of importance?

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

I think the amount of power he's got and the amount of control over money, because that is powerful. An awful lot of people.

[Host/Interviewer]

When you all talk about things like corruption, do you think you're persuading new voters or do you think you're mostly motivating fellow Democrats?

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

Oh, fellow Democrats.

[Host/Interviewer]

Okay.

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

New voters, if they don't know, they're questioning, but they're not questioning me.

[Host/Interviewer]

Do you think that enthusiasm is going to pick up? Like, do you have, you feel confident that when it comes toward November that you're going to see in a motivated Democratic base?

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

Yeah.

[Host/Interviewer]

And that's just because I have to

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

think that or I wouldn't be able to step out for a president that makes sense.

[Host/Interviewer]

I'm saying, like, I guess I'm asking what might motivate Democrats this time around that maybe they weren't motivated by in 2024?

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

Well, because his, his corruption is that much more apparent and his, his complete disregard of the well being of the American public. And he promised to lower prices. No, he didn't care.

[Host/Interviewer]

Yeah. You're saying you can now make an argument based on his own actions. So that makes sense.

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

I mean, it's so clear. It's so clear.

[Host/Interviewer]

Thank you so much. We really appreciate your time. We appreciate it.

[RVA Indivisible Protester]

Keep going.

[Host/Interviewer]

Thank you.

[Lauren Natali]

Thank you. Candidates for coming to the front. Very much appreciated. Hello, everyone. My name is Lauren Natali. I am the event coordinator for RVA Indivisible. And we have a very full program this evening. I'm here to describe that to you. We passed that redistricting referendum and it was a hard sell. Our side does not like gerrymandering. We like fairness. We like rule of law. I know I had to convince myself, my husband, my parents and most of my friends one at a time to vote yes. And we won what looked at times to be an impossible race. We can't let this stop us. We've shown what we're capable of. We've built the networks. We've learned the tools. Now let's keep up the push through the midterms. One of the current Democratic primary candidates for Virginia's first will replace Rob Whitman in Washington. We've invited them here to meet RVA Indivisible this evening. This is our opportunity to get to know their policies and positions. And hopefully each of you can pick one that inspires you enough to volunteer for them.

[Tim Sawinski]

My name is Salaam Bhatti.

[Host/Interviewer]

I'm a public interest lawyer. But before all that, I was a child of immigrants. I still am a child of immigrants.

[Katie Sitterson]

Thank you all for being here. I always think that joy is the best resistance we have. Hope is not a dirty word, and it feels a lot better when we all have that together.

[Lauren Natali]

I am unapologetically progressive, another grassroots Democrat

[Host/Interviewer]

who doesn't take any corporate money.

[Tim Sawinski]

We need mandatory ethics, things that like of mandatory town halls, ban insider trading, making sure people have to answer to us, not big donors.

[Host/Interviewer]

I have spent my career working and talking with Republicans because you might be shocked to know that a majority of people in my service were Republicans.

[Katie Sitterson]

We'll go ahead and take some questions from them.

[Host/Interviewer]

So we're wrapping up our day just outside of Richmond, Virginia, in the 1st Congressional District and have three big takeaways from spending our time here. The first is, of course, about the maps. Not only did the change in congressional district sow confusion among the electorate, wasting valuable time and energy from volunteers and candidates, but it also reinforced a feeling of powerlessness among the electorate. Folks feel as if they just don't have agency in our democratic system and that democracy is on life support. The second big takeaway I had is about the message of corruption. Democrats are talking more and more about this issue, and the reason why is that it cuts across a unique slice of the electorate. This is something that they don't think just motivates their base, but can reach out to independents and Republicans who voted for Trump on a more economic front. That's the third thing that I found really interesting. Democrats aren't just talking about corruption for corruption's sake. They're combining it with their message of affordability. And I think that sweet spot is what they're going to focus on in November. Their argument is that prices are rising for most Americans. At the same time, Donald Trump has put a for sale sign in front of the White House, and they think that issue specifically can not only motivate Democrats to come out in the midterms, but can pick off enough independents and Republicans that they could even be successful in places like Virginia's first. America actually is on YouTube every week with an interesting interview in politics or culture. You can also listen to America actually wherever you get your podcast or in the Today Explained Feedback. Now, the best way to support the show is by becoming a VOX member. Members get bonus content and we are deeply appreciative of all that they do for us. Go to Vox.commembers to join. That's Vox.commembers to join. See you next week. En Cue the music.