Going to Mars

Summary

Today, Explained: "Going to Mars"

Release Date: August 8, 2025
Hosts: Sean Rameswaram and Noel King
Producer: Vox Media Podcast Network

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Introduction

In the "Going to Mars" episode of Today, Explained, hosts Sean Rameswaram and Noel King delve into the multifaceted topic of humanity's ambition to reach and potentially inhabit Mars. The discussion spans current initiatives, historical perspectives, cultural impacts, and the challenges that lie ahead.

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The Current Push to Mars

The conversation kicks off with the resurgence of enthusiasm around Mars exploration, particularly under the administration of former President Donald Trump and the influence of SpaceX CEO Elon Musk.

• Political Momentum:
  Sean Rameswaram highlights, "Mars is definitely on the menu there's more of a push now than there was before to actually give government funding to Mars initiatives to send humans to the red planet." (03:01)

• Trump’s Influence:
  David Barron explains Trump's role, stating, "He was a Mars guy... he had that directive to send people back to the Moon and then potentially onto Mars." (05:00)

• SpaceX’s Ambitions:
  The synergy between Trump's policies and Musk's vision is evident, with Barron noting, "Elon Musk has been pushing the sole purpose of SpaceX to start a human settlement on Mars.” (06:07)

However, these ambitions face significant financial constraints. The proposed NASA budget includes a "24% cut, the most significant in NASA’s history," yet paradoxically offers additional funds for human exploration programs. Barron comments, "A billion dollars is a very, very small investment when it's going to probably be one of the costliest endeavors that humanity ever does." (07:37)

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Historical Fascination with Mars

The episode takes listeners back to the late 19th and early 20th centuries when Mars captivated the public imagination.

• Early Observations and Beliefs:
  Lauren Grush recounts how, in 1877, "Giovanni Schiaparelli made a detailed map of Mars and saw what he thought were oceans and continents, as well as a network of thin, exceptionally straight lines." (16:32)

• Percival Lowell’s Canal Theory:
  Grush explains Lowell’s hypothesis that these lines were "irrigation canals used by Martians to survive on a planet running out of water." (16:25)

• Public and Scientific Debate:
  The astronomical community was divided between the "Canalists" and the "Anti-Canalists," leading to widespread public belief in Martian civilizations until the mid-20th century.

• Cultural Impact:
  Notable figures like Alexander Graham Bell and Nikola Tesla promoted the existence of Martians, embedding the concept deeply into popular culture. Grush notes, "The Martians were just everywhere in popular culture," with mentions in vaudeville, Broadway, and even recordings like "A Signal from Mars." (20:15)

• Decline of the Martian Myth:
  By the 1960s, NASA’s Mariner spacecraft provided close-up images of Mars, dispelling the illusion of canals and intelligent life, revealing a barren world instead.

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Cultural and Psychological Implications

Lauren Grush offers insights into why Mars has remained a persistent symbol in human culture and what it represents for our collective psyche.

• Hope and Utopia:
  Grush states, "There is a dream of Mars as this techno utopia, this place that will be better than Earth, that will be more egalitarian." (23:10)

• Cautionary Lessons:
  Reflecting on the early 20th-century Mars craze, Grush warns, "We tend to project onto Mars what we hope is there, not what's really there," emphasizing the importance of realistic aspirations. (24:10)

• Inspiration for Innovation:
  Despite the challenges, the historical enthusiasm for Mars spurred innovations in rocketry and space exploration, a trend that continues today.

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Challenges and Future Prospects

The episode addresses the significant hurdles humanity faces in making Mars colonization a reality.

• Financial Constraints:
  With NASA's budget facing substantial cuts, prioritizing human missions over robotic ones poses a dilemma. Barron remarks, "How does that work when it comes to, say, NASA?" (06:46)

• Technological and Logistical Hurdles:
  The complexity and cost of sending humans to Mars remain daunting. As Rameswaram puts it, "Get us to Mars with 24% less of your budget." (07:09)

• Global Competition vs. Collaboration:
  Grush believes competition, particularly with China, might drive the US to prioritize Mars exploration over unified global efforts. She notes, "What will inspire the United States to get to Mars more than anything is competition. It's because the Chinese want to get there." (23:35)

• Public Support and Priorities:
  While there is favorable public opinion towards Mars missions, polls indicate that initiatives like asteroid monitoring take precedence over human colonization efforts. Barron states, "Sending humans back to the moon and onto Mars often is at the bottom of the list in terms of priorities." (10:40)

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Conclusion

"Going to Mars" encapsulates the enduring human fascination with the Red Planet, juxtaposed with the practical realities of space exploration. The episode underscores the delicate balance between ambition and feasibility, urging listeners to reflect on whether our dreams of Mars are driven by genuine potential or mere projection of our desires for a better world.

As the hosts tease future discussions, they leave audiences contemplating the next steps in humanity's quest to reach Mars, highlighting that "if we're going to get there, we might as well start now." (24:40)

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Key Quotes

• Sean Rameswaram (03:01):
  "Mars is definitely on the menu there's more of a push now than there was before to actually give government funding to Mars initiatives to send humans to the red planet."

• David Barron (05:00):
  "He was a Mars guy... he had that directive to send people back to the Moon and then potentially onto Mars."

• Lauren Grush (16:32):
  "Percival Lowell, who was... venerable author and astronomer, believed the canals were irrigation systems built by Martians."

• David Barron (07:37):
  "A billion dollars is a very, very small investment when it's going to probably be one of the costliest endeavors that humanity ever does."

• Lauren Grush (23:35):
  "What will inspire the United States to get to Mars more than anything is competition. It's because the Chinese want to get there."

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Further Reading & Resources

• Lauren Grush's Book:
  The Six: The True Story of an Alien Craze that Captured Turn of the Century America
  Release Date: August 26th
  Launch Event: Boulder, Colorado Library Party

• Produced by:
  Avishai Artsy, in collaboration with Vox's Future Perfect team
  Edited by: Jolie Myers
  Fact-Checked by: Laura Bullard
  Mixed by: Patrick Boyd

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Stay tuned for next week's episode, where Sean and Noel will explore what it will take to make the journey to Mars a reality.

Transcript

[Sean Ramasvooram]

My name's Sean Ramasvooram for TODAY explained. I'm outside the Air and Space museum in Washington D.C. with one question. Do you think we should go to Mars?

[Lauren Grush]

I don't think you should live in Mars, no. I don't know why just Mars. I think as earthlings we are a.

[David Barron]

Nosy group of people and I really.

[Lauren Grush]

Don'T think that we have any business going to Mars.

[David Barron]

Our knowledge about the solar system and the universe will grow substantially. I think maybe we should just leave Mars alone, just sit with Earth.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Like so many innovations are gonna come out of it because so many different companies are gonna be fighting to get that first ticket to Mars. So I feel like we should.

[Lauren Grush]

But at the same time we should solve some problems here first.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

I think we need to expand what we know, what we see.

[Lauren Grush]

Honestly, for our own benefit.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

We should go way beyond today Explained from Vox is taking a summer sojourn on Mars. Join Us.

[David Barron]

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[Lauren Grush]

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[Sean Ramasvooram]

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[Lauren Grush]

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[David Barron]

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[Sean Ramasvooram]

Today explained here with Lauren Grush, who has a very cool job of being a space reporter for Bloomberg. Lauren, we've spoken about Mars on this show before, but it feels like there's extra enthusiasm around Mars now.

[Lauren Grush]

I mean, can you imagine how awesome.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

It will be to lead humanity into space to have American astronauts plant the.

[Lauren Grush]

American flag on the planet Mars and even far beyond for the first time?

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Are we going to Mars?

[David Barron]

Mars is definitely on the menu there's more of a push now than there was before to actually give government funding to Mars initiatives to send humans to the red planet.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

And where is that renewed push coming from? Is it the sitting President of the United States?

[David Barron]

Yes. For those who've been paying attention to Trump's speeches, he's definitely made quite a few mentions of Mars and sending humans to Mars within his term.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

And you're talking about the fact that he mentioned it in his second inaugural address, that indoor one.

[Lauren Grush]

And we will pursue our manifest destiny into the stars, launching American astronauts to plant the Stars and Stripes on the planet Mars.

[David Barron]

Right. And not just his inaugural address, but also his winning speech. He had talked about Elon and SpaceX when he accepted winning the election.

[Lauren Grush]

Oh, let me tell you, we have a new star. A star is born, Elon.

[David Barron]

So space was searching, certainly a theme of those early speeches and talks, more so than I've seen from other presidents.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

And I wanna talk to you about what Trump's trying to do and how much Elon factors in. But before I do, we should give credit to prior presidents. This wasn't the first to mention Mars.

[David Barron]

Oh, absolutely not. For instance, back in 1989, President George H.W. bush called for a return to the.

[Lauren Grush]

Moon, followed by a journey into tomorrow, a journey to another planet, a manned mission to Mars.

[David Barron]

George W. Bush had proposed the Constellation program, which was to send humans back to the moon.

[Lauren Grush]

With the experience and knowledge gained on the moon, we will then be ready to take the next steps of space exploration, human missions to Mars and to worlds beyond.

[David Barron]

You know, most recently under President Obama, he also called for a journey to Mars.

[Lauren Grush]

In the mid-2030s, I believe we can.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Send humans to orbit Mars and return.

[Lauren Grush]

Them safely to Earth, and a landing on Mars will follow, and I expect to be around to see it.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

So what separates Trump from his predecessors, if anything?

[David Barron]

During Trump's first term, there was an event at the White House where astronauts from the Apollo 11 mission were there to celebrate the 50th anniversary of landing on the moon.

[Lauren Grush]

And.

[David Barron]

And at the time, Trump mentioned that we were going back to the moon, but he also asked, any way of.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Going directly without landing on the moon.

[Lauren Grush]

Is that a possibility?

[David Barron]

And then during his first administration, there was also a very fun tweet where he had basically been watching one of the NASA executives on Fox. And then he tweeted out that for.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

All the money that we are spending, NASA should not be talking about going to the moon. We did that 50 years ago. They should be focusing on the much Bigger things we are doing, including Mars, of which the Moon is a part, Defense and science, which confounded a bunch.

[David Barron]

Of people because he had actually signed that directive to send people back to the Moon. So I'd say there were early signs that Trump was a Mars guy. And then I think it kind of got sent into overdrive when he and SpaceX CEO Elon Musk had that budding friendship during the election and the first part of his term, Elon. And so that kind of got a push because as most people who follow Elon Musk know, the sole purpose of him creating SpaceX has been to start a human settlement on Mars.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Right. But the great irony of these two guys spearheading a program that sincerely intends to get us to Mars is, is that these two guys also trying to cut funding left and right from every department of the federal government. So how does that work when it comes to, say, NASA?

[David Barron]

Yeah, so when it comes to the proposed budget for NASA, yes, it does look pretty bleak. The White House has proposed cutting the budget by around 24%, which if enacted as is, would be the most significant budget cut that NASA has pretty much had in its entire history.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

So get us to Mars with 24% less of your budget.

[David Barron]

Right. The key though, is how they plan to allocate the money that they have proposed. So the majority of the cuts that are being proposed to NASA's budget at the moment mostly target robotic science missions, things that don't actually require humans to be on board. Those are getting most of the targeted cuts. However, there has been proposed increases for the human exploration programs that would be sending humans back to the moon and then potentially onto Mars, the so called Moon to Mars program. And so the budget included $7 billion to continue initiatives to send humans back to the moon, what's known as the Artemis Program. And then there's an extra $1 billion that's being proposed to help jumpstart Mars exploration with humans. And so there's been a discussion of creating a commercial Mars landing competition and using existing contracts to develop a lander that could potentially land humans on Mars.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Yeah, it's kind of funny to think about a billion dollars for Mars when ice just got like an extra $75 billion. How serious is this president all told at this point?

[David Barron]

Well, I think he's also mentioned it himself. You know, it's not his top priority.

[Lauren Grush]

No, there's a lot of interest in going to Mars. Is it number one on my hit list? No, it's not really, but it is something that would be, you Know, it would be a great achievement. It would be a great thing if we could do it.

[David Barron]

And so I think that's a good indication of where his mind is at. And that's usually where most presidents are at when it comes to space policy. But, yeah, I think a billion dollars is a very, very small investment when it's going to probably be one of the costliest endeavors that humanity ever does and the most complex feat that we ever achieve. When it comes to how people view the priorities for space exploration, I think there is definitely a positive view of things like NASA. You know, there's been polls that show that people favorably want to send humans back to the moon and onto Mars. However, I think there might be some debate in terms of what NASA's priorities should be in terms of how it's spending its money. So Pew Research polls often ask Americans what they think, you know, the space agency's priorities should be. And usually at the top of the list is monitoring the space around Earth for asteroids to make sure that they don't hit Earth, which I totally understand. I don't want to do that either.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Everyone saw Armageddon.

[David Barron]

Yeah, exactly.

[Lauren Grush]

It's what we call a global killer.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

The end of mankind and then sending.

[David Barron]

Humans back to the moon and to Mars often is at the bottom of the list in terms of priorities.

[Lauren Grush]

Huh.

[David Barron]

So I think it's something that people think would be cool and, you know, aren't necessarily opposed to. But whether or not that should be the highest priority for NASA and taxpayer money doesn't always reach the top of the list.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Lauren Grush, [e-mail], you can also pick up her book, the Six, about America's first women astronauts. It's being made into a movie. No big deal. Mars might not be our top priority, but it has been our obsession for well over a century. How we got there when Today explained touches down. Support for today's show comes from Select Quote. If the news these days makes you want to hide under your bed, do you listen to our show from under your bed? Let Noelle know. Noelle.com. anyway, you're probably not alone if that's happening. But honestly, there are better ways to protect yourself than with an old box spring. Wow. Oh, they brought it back to the bed. That makes sense. Like term life insurance from Select Quote. Oh, this isn't about beds. This is about term life insurance from select quote. For over 40 years, selectquote says they've been one of the most trusted brokers in insurance and that they've helped more than 2 million Americans secure over $700 billion in coverage. Those are some numbers for you. You can get the right life insurance for you for less and save more than [e-mail] explain. You can save more than 50% on term life [e-mail] explain today to get started that is SelectQuote.com explained. Put us in a box. Go ahead. That just gives us something to break out of because the next generation 2025 GMC terrain elevation is raising the standard of what comes standard as far as expectations go, why meet them when you can shatter them? What we choose to challenge we challenge completely. We are professional grade. Visit gmc.com to learn more.

[David Barron]

Organizador de viajes de expedia Vivies paratenertu propio opinions obre la arena.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Vivimos para d' artencontrad un lugar con Alberca y playa.

[Lauren Grush]

Expedia Vivimos paraviajar. Mars ain't the kind of place to raise your kids.

[David Barron]

Way up to Martians we are not the same. I am a Martian.

[Lauren Grush]

My name is David Barron and I am the author of the book the the True Story of an Alien Craze that Captured turn of the Century America.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Okay, so you are the person to ask why we care so much about Mars.

[Lauren Grush]

Oh, yeah. I mean, as a culture, Mars has really kind of seeped into our collective psyche. There's something special about Mars. There's a sense of kind of mystery and romance, and part of it just has to do with the physical reality of Mars. But it's more than that. And the more than that goes back a little more than a century ago, when the public truly believed that Mars was inhabited by intelligent beings. Before Martians were staples of science fiction, they were believed to be science fact. You could open the New York Times in 1906 and read in all seriousness.

[David Barron]

The only logical result that can be reached from these fundamental, these demonstrated and demonstrable facts is that there is conscious, intelligent, organic life on Mars. The New York Times, December 9, 1906.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

The New York Times.

[Lauren Grush]

Oh, and the Wall street journal in 1907. The wall street journal in 1907. The wall street Journal at the end of the year said the biggest news of the year was the proof afforded.

[David Barron]

By the astronomical observations of the year that conscious, intelligent human life exists upon the planet Mars.

[Lauren Grush]

The Wal.

[David Barron]

December 28, 1907.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Wow. Hard to believe. Where did it come from? Where did the science fact that there were indeed Martians come from?

[Lauren Grush]

Well, it really all started in 1877, you have to cast your mind back in time. In the 19th century, all we knew about Mars was what we could see through earthbound telescopes. But in 1877, when Mars came especially close to Earth, an Italian astronomer named Giovanni Schiaparelli decided he was going to make a detailed map of Mars. And so, night after night, he studied the planet and he saw what he thought were oceans and continents. But he also saw this network of thin, exceptionally straight lines that he imagined were probably waterways of some kind.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

They may disappear wholly or be nebulous or indistinct, or be so strongly marked as a pen line.

[Lauren Grush]

What could all this mean? Well, in 1894, an American astronomer came along who said, yes, indeed, they were canals. Not navigation canals, but irrigation canals that the Martians were using to survive on a planet that was running out of water, that all of Mars moisture was locked up in the polar ice caps at the north and South Poles. And for the Martians to survive, they had created this global network of irrigation canals. And that's where what these lines supposedly were. And they would come and go with the seasons. They tended to appear in the spring and summer, and they would fade in the fall and winter. And when Percival Lowell, who was the American astronomer who believed they were irrigation canals, his theory was you're not actually seeing the water coming down from the poles, you're seeing the greening up of the vegetation along these irrigation canals. And so that's why they would green up in the spring and summer. You'd see them appear, and then they would fade in the fall and winter when the leaves presumably died off.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

A solution of their character suggests itself at once, to wit, that they are.

[Lauren Grush]

Oases in the middle of that desert.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

The canals are constructed for the express purpose of fertilizing the oases.

[Lauren Grush]

But this was also a time when people were really looking for kind of a hope in outer space. Life on Earth. In the late 19th century, at least in the west, there was a lot of reason for despair. There was anarchism in Europe, there were heads of state being assassinated. The idea was that the Martians were these advanced beings who were what we hopefully will become in the future. And the fact that they had this global network of irrigation canals meant that they had pulled together as a planet, that they must have evolved beyond war, beyond divisive politics, because it looked like.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

They were cooperating across a planet.

[Lauren Grush]

Exactly, yeah. So there was a real desire to believe in the Martians. Hmm.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Was there anyone out there saying, guys, just because we see some canals it doesn't mean there's Martians. Was there any?

[Lauren Grush]

Oh, absolutely. There was a big debate in the astronomical community. In fact, the astronomical community divided into the Canalists and the anti Canalists.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Wow.

[Lauren Grush]

There were these two warring camps. Percival Lowell, who was not only, I mean he was a self made astronomer, he was an extraordinarily wealthy and articulate human being. He came from a very prominent family in Massachusetts. And so he was able to write articles for the Atlantic Monthly promoting his ideas. The evidence of handicraft, if such it be, points to a highly intelligent mind behind it.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Certainly what we see hints at the.

[Lauren Grush]

Existence of beings who are in advance of, not behind us in the race of life. The Atlantic Monthly, August 1895. He was out there giving lectures about the Martians. And so he was able to convince the public, even if there were a lot of astronomers he couldn't convince.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

When was like peak Martian, when was peak obsession with Mars? In this era?

[Lauren Grush]

That was 1908 and 1909. By 1908 the idea was so widespread, you had pastors in church sermonizing about the Martians and expressing there are congregations that we should emulate the Martians. We should look to our neighboring planet for the kind of society that we should be.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

We see there often space marching by our side. A neighbor world which shows at a.

[Lauren Grush]

Glance by impressive signs that it is.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Morally unified and civilized beyond the dreams of our reformers.

[Lauren Grush]

Alexander Graham Bell, who of course invented the telephone. But he was convinced that the Martians were real. He saw no question that Mars was inhabited by intelligent beings. Nikola Tesla, a great inventor who came up with our modern system of generating and distributing electrical power. He actually was convinced that he picked up radio signals from Mars. And when he announced that to the world at the beginning of 1901, it just set off an absolute craze. Martians invaded popular culture. They showed up on the vaudeville and Broadway stages. There was a popular show called A Yankee Circus on Mars. You had a Martian that became a comic character in the newspapers. They showed up in Tin Pan Alley songs. In fact, I have an original wax cylinder recording of a song called A Signal from Mars, a musical piece from back then. The Martians were just everywhere in popular culture.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

How did it fall apart?

[Lauren Grush]

So astronomers by the 1910s had pretty well convinced themselves that this whole canal theory was bunk. But the idea had so taken hold in the brains of the public that the idea of canals on Mars persisted until the 1950s and 60s. In 1938, you know, there was the famous War of the Worlds Radio broadcast by Orson Welles Ladies and gentlemen, I have a grave announcement to make. Incredible as it may seem, both the observations of science and the evidence of our eyes lead to the inescapable assumption that those strange beings who landed in the Jersey farmlands tonight are the vanguard of an invading army from the planet Mars. And there were people who actually believed, listening to the radio, that the Martians were invading. Why did people believe that in 1938? Because only a generation or two before there really was belief in the Martians. And I actually found a letter to Orson Welles that was written by one of those listeners who was fooled, who was angry about it. And what she wrote was, has not.

[David Barron]

Science proved that there's life on Mars? Through their observations, canals are supposed to have been discerned which prove that there is a possibility of there being on a higher level than ours in scientific development.

[Lauren Grush]

And that was 1938. The idea that there was something strange there persisted well into the 1960s when NASA sent its first Mariner spacecraft flying by Mars to take the first close up pictures of the surface. And there was not only no sign of a civilization, there was no sign of straight lines, it just looked like a dead world.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

The picture suggests that Mars has never.

[Lauren Grush]

Had an ocean or substantial atmosphere.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

Thinking back to what you said earlier, earlier when people were first enchanted by this idea of Martians in the early 20th century, it was this idea that we could all work together that really captured imaginations and it's still a nice idea. Do you think there's still a chance that we could get together as a human race to unite in an effort to get to Mars? To unite with common cause? It doesn't look that likely when you look around, see fights about every last thing.

[Lauren Grush]

No. And in fact, I think what will inspire the United States to get to Mars more than anything is competition. It's because the Chinese want to get there. But there is still this dream of Mars as this techno utopia, this place that will be better than Earth, that will be more egalitarian, where we can start over again. And I think the lesson of the Mars craze of 100 years ago, there are two lessons. On the one hand, it's a cautionary tale. We tend to project onto Mars what we hope is there, not what's really there. So 100 years ago we believed in the Martians because we wanted to believe that there was a better world next door. Today, I think a lot of the talk about Mars is that we're going to create this sort of this utopia next door. That's going to be so difficult. I mean, technically difficult. And as you said, getting humans together to make this possible, Lord knows if that's ever going to happen. On the other hand, a lot of good came out of that craziness of 100 years ago. It was the excitement about Mars and the imagination that spurred the next generations to say, well, maybe we can actually go there and how would we do it? And they built the rockets and they had the enthusiasm to actually go there. And I think the same is true today. And if we're going to get there, we might as well start now.

[Sean Ramasvooram]

David Barron, his book once again is called the the True Story of an Alien Craze that Captured Turn of the Century America. It drops on August 26th, and if you happen to be in Boulder, Colorado that day, there'll be a party celebrating it at the library. Avishai Artsy produced today's show, which was made in collaboration with Vox's Future Perfect team. Jolie Myers edited. Laura Bullard checked the Facts, Patrick Boyd mixed and we'll talk about what it's going to take to get get us to Mars next week on today. Explained.