Guantanamo’s other history

Summary

Today, Explained: Episode Summary – "Guantanamo’s Other History"

Released Date: February 10, 2025
Hosts: Sean Rameswaram and Noel King
Network: Vox Media Podcast Network

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Introduction

In the February 10, 2025 episode of Today, Explained, Vox delves into the controversial and historically significant use of Guantanamo Bay as a detention center for migrants under the Trump administration. Hosts Noel King and Nick Miroff explore the administration’s aggressive immigration enforcement policies, the implementation of sending migrants to Guantanamo Bay, and the historical precedents that shape this current event.

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Trump Administration’s Immigration Enforcement Policy

Aggressive Enforcement Tactics

Noel King opens the discussion by highlighting President Trump's vow to deport 30,000 migrants to Guantanamo Bay, a plan now in motion. Secretary of Homeland Security Kristi Noem is quoted on CNN, stating, “[00:02] … these individuals are the worst of the worst that we pulled off of our streets.”

Nick Miroff provides context on the nature of these detainees. “[00:19] … murderers? Rapists? … child pedophiles, those that were out there trafficking children, trafficking drugs, and were pulled off of our streets.” However, he notes the challenge in verifying these claims due to the government’s secrecy around the identities and charges of the detainees.

Current State of Enforcement

At [02:17], King questions Miroff on the current state of Trump’s immigration policy, to which Miroff responds, “[02:26] Well, I'd say the state of it is very aggressive.” He elaborates on the intensified efforts compared to Trump's first term, emphasizing a broader federal crackdown involving multiple agencies beyond ICE.

Miroff details the operational capacity of ICE, noting at [04:57] that ICE is funded to detain about 40,000 people, primarily in privately run jails and county facilities. Despite the Trump administration’s push, ICE has not received significant increases in funding, personnel, or detention capacity, leading to reliance on expanding existing facilities and exploring options like military bases and repurposing soft-sided border facilities.

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Deployment to Guantanamo Bay

Implementation of the Policy

At [07:02], Miroff reveals that approximately 30 detainees have been sent to Guantanamo Bay, primarily Venezuelan suspected gang members. This deployment includes construction efforts to expand the holding capacity, signaling a potential increase towards the pledged 30,000 migrants.

King probes into the legal and operational specifics, asking whether detainees are to be held indefinitely or deported swiftly. Miroff clarifies that Guantanamo Bay serves as a staging area rather than a punitive facility, intended to hold migrants until deportation can be arranged. However, he expresses concerns about the lack of accompanying infrastructure such as legal aid, which could hinder the deportation process ([09:09]).

Symbolism and Intimidation

The use of Guantanamo Bay, a site infamous for its role in post-9/11 detention, serves a dual purpose. Miroff explains at [10:16], “This is the Trump administration's attempt to scare people and to potentially make the decision to leave the country. It’s a sign of the president's toughness and commitment to his supporters.” The symbolic gesture reinforces the administration's hardline stance on immigration, equating migrants with an invading force and leveraging the notorious reputation of Guantanamo to instill fear and assert control.

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Historical Context of Guantanamo Bay as a Migrant Detention Site

Origins in the 1970s

The episode transitions into a historical analysis with Jeffrey Kahn, an anthropology professor at UC Davis, who recounts the origins of Guantanamo Bay’s role in migrant detention. At [16:01], Kahn explains that in the 1970s, Haitian asylum seekers fleeing dictator Jean Claude Duvalier were inadvertently sent to Guantanamo Bay. Unlike their compatriots in South Florida who gained legal assistance, those at Guantanamo faced indefinite detention without adequate legal support.

Expansion During the 1990s

Kahn continues, detailing the Mariel Boatlift of 1980 and subsequent influxes in the early 1990s, where both Haitian and Cuban migrants were detained en masse. “[24:26] ... so you had this period in 1994 and 1995 where you had tens of thousands of Haitians and tens of thousands of Cubans at Guantanamo at the same time.” The facility became a makeshift tent city, symbolizing the United States' attempts to manage overwhelming migration flows without expanding domestic detention infrastructure.

Humanitarian Concerns

Kahn highlights the traumatic experiences of migrants held in these camps, including poor living conditions, lack of legal counsel, and prolonged uncertainty about their futures. “[20:29] … they really felt that they’re out in the middle of nowhere, they’re isolated, they’re told that they may have to stay here forever.” The historical misuse of Guantanamo Bay underscores recurring patterns of marginalization and inadequate treatment of migrant populations.

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Comparative Analysis and Current Implications

First-Time Use for Migrants

Jeffrey Kahn emphasizes that the current use of Guantanamo Bay for migrants is unprecedented. “[26:01] No immigrants have ever been sent to Guantanamo from the United States. This is the first time that has ever happened.” Unlike past instances where detainees were primarily asylum seekers from specific regions, the Trump administration’s policy represents a novel and controversial application of the facility’s purpose.

Political Theater and Public Perception

Kahn argues that the decision to use Guantanamo Bay serves as political theater, reinforcing the administration's narrative of an immigration crisis akin to an invasion. “[26:01] … the Trump administration has been hammering this idea that the crisis at the border is an invasion … the use of Guantanamo in this way is intended to cement the public imagination, this equation between immigrants and an invading army of criminal aliens.” This tactic aims to legitimize aggressive deportation measures and galvanize the administration’s support base by portraying a tough stance on immigration.

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Conclusion

The episode concludes by reiterating the significance of the Trump administration’s decision to utilize Guantanamo Bay for migrant detention. Both Nick Miroff and Jeffrey Kahn underscore the symbolic power of this move, its historical echoes, and the potential humanitarian and legal ramifications. The use of such a notorious detention site not only addresses immediate detention capacity issues but also sends a broader message about the administration’s approach to immigration enforcement.

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Notable Quotes

• Kristi Noem on CNN ([00:02]): “… these individuals are the worst of the worst that we pulled off of our streets.”
• Nick Miroff ([00:19]): “… murderers? Rapists? … child pedophiles, those that were out there trafficking children, trafficking drugs, and were pulled off of our streets.”
• Nick Miroff ([10:16]): “This is the Trump administration's attempt to scare people and to potentially make the decision to leave the country. It’s a sign of the president's toughness and commitment to his supporters.”
• Jeffrey Kahn ([26:01]): “No immigrants have ever been sent to Guantanamo from the United States. This is the first time that has ever happened.”

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Produced by Victoria Chamberlain, edited by Amina El Saadi, with fact-checking by Laura Bullard and Amanda Llewellyn. Engineering by Andrea Christensdottir and Patrick Boyd.

Transcript

[Noel King]

President Trump promised to send 30,000 migrants to Guantanamo Bay, and his administration is now doing it. Here's Secretary of Homeland Security Kristi Noem on CNN this weekend after making a trip herself to Gitmo. These individuals are the worst of the worst that we pulled off of our streets.

[Nick Miroff]

Who are they?

[Noel King]

Murderers? Rapists? When I was there, I was able to watch one of the flights landing and them unload about 15 different of these criminals. Those were mainly child pedophiles, those that were out there trafficking children, trafficking drug, and were pulled off of our streets. Now, it's impossible to fact check that statement at the moment because the government hasn't released the names of four dozen or so men who've been sent there so far. Coming up on TODAY Explained, what we do know about Trump's big moves on immigration.

[Claire White]

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[Nick Miroff]

This is today Explained. I'm Nick Miroff. I cover the Department of Homeland Security for the Washington Post.

[Noel King]

What is the state, Nick, of the Trump administration's immigration enforcement policy, which promised big things right now, today?

[Nick Miroff]

Well, I'd say the state of it is very aggressive.

[Claire White]

7,500 violent illegals have been captured by.

[Jeffrey Kahn]

ICE in the last nine days.

[Claire White]

God bless them.

[Noel King]

Multiple communities across Chicago are feeling the impacts of what ICE is calling targeted operations.

[Nick Miroff]

And they were like knee deep in front of my door and they were asking me if I was American or if I was legal. More aggressive than Trump's first term. And he took office, you know, back then in 2017, promising millions of deportations. But we didn't see the kind of approach that we're seeing now where not only the Department of Homeland Security, but all these other federal agencies have been enlisted in this broader effort to increase arrests, increase deportations, and carry out, you know, what the president sees, I think, as one of his biggest, if not most important, campaign promise.

[Noel King]

All right, so President Trump has directed that migrants be sent to Guantanamo Bay. What did his order say exactly? What are the specifics here?

[Nick Miroff]

Well, the order is basically to the Department of Defense and the Department of Homeland Security, and it says, you know, use, use the Guantanamo Bay facility to expand holding capacity for dangerous criminals, but then also for whatever purposes you see fit. And that's kind of the key here. They seem to be looking at it both as a place where they can, they can send in particular, you know, Venezuelan suspected gang members who they have a hard time detaining and who have been really a focus of a lot of the government's, the Trump administration's messaging around the, you know, worst of the worst criminals. Well, some of them are so bad, we don't even trust the countries to hold them because we don't want them coming back. So we're going to send them out to Guantanamo. But then they also are looking for capacity. This will double our capacity immediately.

[Jeffrey Kahn]

Right.

[Nick Miroff]

And tough. That's a tough, that's a tough place.

[Jeffrey Kahn]

To get out of.

[Nick Miroff]

They do not have the space in the United States and their existing network of facilities to suddenly increase by thousands and thousands of people. And so that's going to be, you know, that's the thing I'm really looking for. Do they plan to really bring up to 30,000 people, as president Trump said, to this site off outside the United States?

[Noel King]

Is it accurate that we don't have facilities inside the continental United States for that many people? What do you know about that?

[Nick Miroff]

Well, it's not, it's not quite accurate in that sense. It's that. So ICE is funded to be able to detain about 40,000 people at any given time in its network of detention facilities. And those consist of mostly privately run jails, but then also county jails that rent, you know, beds out to ICE for relatively short term detentions. We're talking usually about a few weeks for the duration of the amount of time it takes ICE to get somebody ready, you know, to be deported and to get them on a plane and back to their home country. And so the thing to Keep in mind here is that President Trump has launched this incredibly aggressive enforcement operation with the kind of existing infrastructure of ice. It's just an unforced error that we even have to be doing this now. We need Congress to provide full funding for the complete and total restoration of our sovereign borders, as well as financial support to remove record numbers of illegal aliens. ICE hasn't gotten new money, it hasn't gotten a huge increase in officers, and it certainly hasn't gotten a big increase in the number of beds it has available. And so while its current network is maxed out, it can look to expand by adding more beds in county jails. We know that it's already talking to private contractors about expanding what they're able to offer. And then they've also looked at military bases in the United States where they could potentially hold people. And I'd actually add one more option that they're looking at. And this really kind of underscores the all of the above approach, which is that there are what they call soft sided facilities along the border, basically tent camps that they have used in previous years to deal with surges and border crossings. And so they've been using them as kind of processing centers for migrants coming into the country. And I think that they're going to be looking to see if they can repurpose some of those to hold people who they're trying to send out.

[Noel King]

What is going on at Guantanamo Bay right now? Has anyone arrived? There are things being built?

[Nick Miroff]

Yeah. So so far They've sent about 30 detainees there on a series of flights and they are being held in the holding facility for the military detainees. But then also for some of these other migrants, they're essentially being kept in kind of a separate legal distinction. But separately, they are eyeing this broad area where they would potentially build an outdoor holding facility. We know that there have been, that there have been dozens of, of kind of, you know, tents set up for workers there. They appear to be staging, you know, other construction materials in preparation for, for the, you know, the expansion of this camp. And so the question is going to be, you know, how many people are they going to really try to send there? And then, you know, are U.S. federal courts going to allow that?

[Noel King]

What do we know about the, the men, and I'm assuming they're all men who have arrived so far. Are they? I mean, President Trump says we're gonna send the worst of the worst. There are these men criminals. What are they accused of other than being in the US Illegally?

[Nick Miroff]

Well, that's the thing we don't know anything about them. I mean, the government hasn't released their names. It doesn't said what they're charged with, with they've been or been convicted. We just have sort of broad outlines and know that they're primarily have been Venezuelan males who are accused by the government of being trend gang members. That's a Venezuelan prison gang whose members have showed up in the United States and have been linked to crimes over the past few years as part of this broader historic wave of Venezuelan migration. Whether or not they really are trending gang members, no one can assess at this point, unless the government starts to tell us more or we see actual information released about, about, you know, why they were sent there and who they are. And in the absence of that, you know, we just, we just really don't.

[Noel King]

Know, as the Trump administration said, what the plan is for people when they get there. Like, is the idea that we detain them indefinitely? Is the idea that we deport them as quickly as we can? What?

[Nick Miroff]

Yeah, this is. So I think the idea is that this is some. Supposed to be some sort of staging facility, right. It's not. People aren't being detained there in a, you know, a criminal penal context as a punishment. They're being there because their home countries wouldn't take them back or because the Department of Homeland Security doesn't have the capacity to detain people that it. That it needs to detain until they can be deported. So kind of a like a way station, holding facility, that type of thing. But if you don't have all of the other infrastructure elements that go along with deportations, including legal counsel and court access and consular access and all those types of things, then that could potentially slow. Slows down the whole deportation process.

[Noel King]

Let me ask you lastly, this particular move has gotten the Trump administration a lot of attention, probably possibly because of the way the American public conceives of Guantanamo Bay, right? What we've known since 9, 11. How does sending people there fit into the administration's larger plans for illegal immigration?

[Nick Miroff]

Well, I think a big part of it is fear and intimidation, right? This is the Trump administration's attempt to scare people and to potentially make the decision to leave the country. It's a sign of the president's toughness and commitment to his supporters that he wants to use this notorious facility to handle criminal immigrants, the kinds of folks that he campaigned against in his run for president. And so it creates a climate of intimidation around his mass deportation effort. And then I think in the short term, it solves a capacity problem in terms of giving him a place potentially where they can put thousands of people if they don't have space for them here in the United States because they don't have facilities that can meet the detention standards that they need. The big one to me is the kind of fear factor and the symbolism of it and the impression that it creates for his his supporters.

[Noel King]

Nick Miroff covers immigration for the Washington Post. Coming up, the last time the US Held migrants at Guantanamo Bay.

[Claire White]

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[Noel King]

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[Nick Miroff]

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[Noel King]

You are listening to Today Explained. I'm Noel King with Jeffrey Kahn, who has been to Guantanamo Bay. Jeff is a professor of anthropology at UC Davis, and he studies how border policing in the US Evolved, and he says it began to evolve at Guantanamo bay in the 1970s with an influx of Haitian refugees to the United States.

[Jeffrey Kahn]

The history of Guantanamo as a site for detaining asylum seekers has a really fascinating and also tragic history that goes back to the 1970s. So in 1972, Haitian asylum seekers start fleeing the dictatorship of Jean Claude Duvalier in Haiti and arriving on the shores of South Florida not allowed to work.

[Noel King]

The men mostly wait wait until authorities decide to jail them, deport them, or give them political asylum.

[Jeffrey Kahn]

Others actually end up at the US Naval Station at Guantanamo Bay, and that's largely by accident. But what happens is the Haitians who end up at Guantanamo are sent back to Haiti. Now at the same time, the folks who are ending up in South Florida, the U.S. immigration Naturalization Service is also trying to send them back to Haiti, but they get access to attorneys.

[Nick Miroff]

I think that we can show in almost every case that these Haitians were actively opposed to the Duvalier government, but I'm not sure that we ought to have that burden of proof.

[Jeffrey Kahn]

And a large number of those Haitians, close to all of them, actually end up getting some sort of legal status eventually in the United States. In 1980, there's the Mariel boat lift. Over 125,000 Cubans arrive in the United States. U.S. marines are now on duty at Key west to keep order among the restless refugees. Many of those who have arrived in the States tell horror stories of being beaten by pro Castro Cubans and secret police. During that next year, about 20,000 Haitians arrive in the United States as well. And when President Reagan comes into office, he attempts to deal with this issue of asylum seekers arriving directly on US Soil.

[Nick Miroff]

Our objective is only to establish a.

[Jeffrey Kahn]

Reasonable, fair, orderly and secure system of immigration into this country and not to discriminate in any way against particular nations or people. So from 1981 to 1989, Haitians who are stopped at sea are ostensibly screened for asylum characteristics on Coast Guard cutters. And only six out of 21,461 who are screened get to come to the US to pursue their asylum claims. Then, in 1991, the first democratically elected president of Haiti, Jean Bertrand Aristide, is overthrown, and thousands of Haitians take to the sea in an attempt to reach the United States to seek refuge. So the US Government says, all right, what are we going to do now? We have thousands of Haitians piling up on these Coast Guard vessels in the northern Caribbean. Should we bring them to the United States? Well, if we do, then they're going to get access to US Courts, and we're going to have to deal with the US Court system scrutinizing how we're handling these claims. The other option is, well, let's send them to Guantanamo. And so that's what they do. And so they end up opening up a camp at Guantanamo Bay to detain and to screen for asylum characteristics. The Haitians that they stopped at sea at its peak in the 1991, 1992 period, you have over 12,000 Haitians being detained in these camps. So it's a vast tent city. It's crowded, it's miserable, and it's also confusing, right? The Haitians who are there are not exactly sure what their fate is going to be. They're not exactly sure how these immigration screenings operate. They don't have access to attorneys to inform them about the particularities of U.S. immigration and refugee law. And there's a feeling like they're in a state of limbo and they're not in control of their destiny.

[Nick Miroff]

Biggest problem right now in the camp with the kids is they're frustrated. They've been here a Long time and they're ready to go home, actually ready to go anywhere at this point.

[Jeffrey Kahn]

It's not an ideal situation to be in. You know, maybe you've spent a couple weeks at sea, maybe shorter, depends. But you've gone through some sort of a difficult voyage. The Coast Guard picks you up, takes you to Guantanamo. Sometimes it may take a while for you to get to Guantanamo. So you're crowded onto these, the deck of a Coast Guard cutter, exposed to the elements. And then when you arrive, you have to undergo what's called a credible fear screening to find out if you have a credible fear of persecution, which is supposed to be lower than the well founded fear of persecution standard that governs asylum claims within the United States. Now what happens at the time is the United States was hoping to resettle some of these Haitian asylum seekers who had passed their credible fear interviews in third countries other than the United States. But those third countries, according to the government, had asked that the Haitians be screened to determine whether or not they were HIV positive. So what the government does is they screen Haitians who have been shown to meet this credible fear standard for hiv, and then if they test positive, they're not brought to the United States and they're put in a separate HIV camp on the base. And according to the Haitians who were there, told that they may be required to stay there indefinitely later on, what happens is the government plans to hold full blown asylum hearings for these HIV positive Haitians at the base without attorneys. So the folks in the HIV camp faced pretty rough conditions. The camp itself was in a remote part of the base which now houses a lot of the war on Terror detention facilities. But at the time it was sequestered from the populated areas of the base. And the Haitians really felt that, right, they're out in the middle of nowhere, they're isolated, they're told that they may have to stay here forever and the conditions are poor. They had to take sheets of plastic and put them up on the windows of the shelters in which they lived to keep the rain out. They complained of infestations of rats, they complained of abuses on the part of the military. When they formed protests, they were met with a draconian response, including pre dawn raids by hundreds of military police with police dogs. And this prolonged sense of limbo ended up creating really difficult conditions and a very traumatic experience for the Haitians who were held there. And so when I've conducted interviews with folks who were held in the HIV camp and you know, it almost always brings them to tears when they remember their experiences being held in this HIV prison camp at Guantanamo. At the time that the HIV camp was shut down, the US Was not sending any Haitians to Guantanamo any longer. Now, when Clinton came into office, Guantanamo was reopened again, and Haitians were sent to Guantanamo in 1994.

[Nick Miroff]

And we are discussing what our response should be. There has been a significant increase in Haitian refugees.

[Jeffrey Kahn]

Cubans started taking to the sea in makeshift rafts, and the US Decided to send them to Guantanamo as well. And so you had this period in 1994 and 1995 where you had tens of thousands of Haitians and tens of thousands of Cubans at Guantanamo at the same time. So since 1991, effectively, there has been a migrant detention operation at Guantanamo. In 2002, the creation of the migrant operations center paved the way for small numbers of asylum seekers to be held at the base. And there's a specific process that governs the detention there. And the idea is to send a message to people fleeing their home countries in the Caribbean that if they attempt to reach the United States by sea, they will be picked up. And in very rare circumstances, if they pass their credible fear interview, they'll be sent to Guantanamo, but they will never reach the United States.

[Noel King]

Hey, so, Jeff, is Donald Trump actually doing anything that we weren't already doing? Like this has made so much news why.

[Jeffrey Kahn]

No immigrants have ever been sent to Guantanamo from the United States. This is the first time that has ever happened. Right. This is from my perspective, in large part political theater. The Trump administration has been hammering this idea that the crisis at the border is an invasion, and an invasion requires a military response. And so what better way to equate immigrants with an invading army than to send them to Guantanamo, which is this place that in the public imagination is associated with the war on terror, with a war footing, kind of exceptional reaction, exceptional powers. The use of Guantanamo to detain immigrants currently in the United States is doing a lot of symbolic work for the Trump administration. The messaging, in some ways, is very old, but the use of Guantanamo in this way is intended to cement the public imagination, this equation between immigrants and an invading army of criminal aliens.

[Noel King]

Jeffrey Kahn, UC Davis, Anthropology, spent time at Guantanamo Bay interviewing Haitian migrants in the early aughts. Victoria Chamberlain produced today's show. Amina El Saadi edited, Laura Bullard and Amanda Llewellyn checked the fact. Andrea Christensdottir and Patrick Boyd are our engineers. And I'm Noel King. It's today explained.