Project 2025’s next chapter

Summary

Today, Explained: Project 2025’s Next Chapter
Released April 7, 2025 | Host: Noel King & Russell Contreras | Contributor: Dov Kent, Senior Director, Diaspora Alliance

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Introduction

In the April 7, 2025 episode of Today, Explained, hosts Noel King and Russell Contreras delve into the intricacies of Project Esther, a strategic blueprint by the Heritage Foundation aimed at combating antisemitism. The discussion unpacks the origins, methodologies, and implications of Project Esther, especially in the context of the Trump administration's recent actions against pro-Palestinian protesters. Featuring insights from Dov Kent of the Diaspora Alliance, the episode critically examines the intersection of political agendas, antisemitism, and civil liberties in the United States.

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Background on Project Esther

Russell Contreras explains that Project Esther is a national strategy developed by the Heritage Foundation as an addendum to their broader Project 2025 initiative. Released in October 2024, just a year after the initial Project 2025, Project Esther is a concise 33-page document compared to Project 2025’s extensive 900+ pages.

[00:35] Noel King: "So where is this allegation coming from? On TODAY Explained it might be coming from the same people who wrote Project 2025."

Contreras describes Project Esther as a blueprint for the Trump administration to rebrand pro-Palestinian protesters as Hamas supporters without providing substantial evidence.

[03:13] Unnamed Expert: "We have several laws at our disposal that may help to exploit Hamas support network and Hamas support organization vulnerabilities, such as the Foreign Agents Registration Act."

The document attributes the rise in antisemitism to a fabricated "Hamas support network," laying the foundation for stringent measures against perceived supporters.

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Trump Administration’s Implementation

The episode highlights the Trump administration's utilization of Project Esther’s recommendations to target and detain individuals associated with pro-Palestinian activities. Notably, the administration has labeled protesters Mahmoud Khalil and Rumayisa Ozturk as Hamas supporters without presenting concrete evidence.

[00:00] Noel King: "The Trump administration is justifying the arrest and detention of protester Mahmoud Khalil and Rumayisa Ozturk, who wrote an op ed in a student newspaper by calling them Hamas supporters."

Contreras emphasizes that Project Esther serves as a playbook for these actions, aligning with broader goals to dismantle civil society institutions such as universities and nonprofits under the guise of combating antisemitism.

[04:43] Unnamed Official: "If you told us all these things when you applied for a visa, we would deny your visa... If you actually end up doing that once you're in this country on such a visa, we will revoke it."
[20:19] Dov Kent: "We cannot terrorize or incarcerate or deport or fire or infiltrate our way out of antisemitism."

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Criticism and Responses from the Jewish Community

Dov Kent, Senior Director at the Diaspora Alliance, provides a critical perspective on Project Esther, arguing that its strategies are not only ineffective but also counterproductive. Kent asserts that the administration's measures exacerbate antisemitism by portraying Jews as authoritarian suppressors.

[20:19] Dov Kent: "Deporting international students doesn't combat antisemitism. Public firings don't combat antisemitism... These actions actively stoke antisemitism by making Jews the face of authoritarian crackdowns."

Kent further criticizes the lack of genuine Jewish involvement in Project Esther, noting that the plan appears to be predominantly driven by Christian nationalist organizations with minimal input from Jewish voices.

[04:19] Russell Contreras: "The document clearly states that we're doing this because we have concluded there's been Jewish complacency... It looks like this was written by Christians, white Christians."

The Jewish community's response is divided. While some groups like the Nexus Project advocate for tackling antisemitism without infringing on free speech, others, such as the Combat Antisemitism Movement, endorse Project Esther's approaches.

[09:33] Russ Contreras: "Combat Antisemitism Movement... endorse the Trump administration's deportation of those students who are on foreign visas."

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Theological and Political Underpinnings

The episode explores the theological motivations behind Christian conservatives' strong support for Israel, linking it to eschatological beliefs about the Second Coming of Christ.

[05:23] Russell Contreras: "A lot of Christian white Christians believe there needs to be a strong Israel for the second coming of Christ."
[05:43] Dov Kent: "Now this goes into history now. Now you have Israel literally being the centerpiece of God's cosmic clock."

This alliance between Christian conservatives in the U.S. and conservative Israeli governments strengthens their collaborative efforts in shaping policies that target pro-Palestinian activism.

[06:12] Russ Contreras: "The Prime Minister comes to the United States, he'll often visit with white Christian groups who are very supportive."

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Implications for Civil Liberties and Antisemitism

Dov Kent argues that Project Esther’s stringent measures undermine constitutional protections and civil liberties, leading to broader societal harms. He contends that such policies not only fail to reduce antisemitism but also foster an environment ripe for antisemitic conspiracy theories.

[24:18] Dov Kent: "The Trump administration's initial attacks on students and higher education... actively stoke antisemitism by making Jews the face of authoritarian crackdowns."
[24:12] Noel King: "What does all of this mean for Jews in the United States?"
[24:18] Dov Kent: "The immediate and long term impact of Project Esther ironically is an increase in antisemitism across the country."

Kent also highlights the administration’s failure to address antisemitism stemming from the far right, focusing instead on conflating left-leaning pro-Palestinian groups with terrorist organizations.

[24:12] Dov Kent: "Project Esther has literally nothing to say about the fire hose of antisemitism and conspiracy theories coming out of the far right in this country."

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Conclusion: The Future of Antisemitism and Civil Society

The episode concludes with a stark warning about the long-term consequences of Project Esther’s policies. Dov Kent emphasizes that undermining civil liberties and targeting specific groups under the guise of combating antisemitism will ultimately weaken protections for all minorities and foster a more hostile environment.

[26:18] Dov Kent: "The erosion of those rights makes all communities less safe, including Jews, and any work to carve out exceptions... undermines the universal protection that actually makes us all safe."

Noel King and Russell Contreras underscore the importance of vigilance and informed discourse in addressing antisemitism effectively without compromising democratic values.

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Key Takeaways

• Project Esther is a Heritage Foundation initiative aimed at combating antisemitism by targeting pro-Palestinian activists, branding them as Hamas supporters without substantial evidence.
• The Trump administration has implemented Project Esther’s recommendations, leading to the detention and deportation of activists, which critics argue exacerbates antisemitism.
• Jewish community responses are mixed, with some supporting stringent measures and others advocating for approaches that protect free speech and civil liberties.
• Christian nationalist motivations underpin much of the support for Project Esther, linking theological beliefs with political agendas.
• Civil liberties are at risk, as Project Esther’s strategies may undermine constitutional protections and foster an environment conducive to antisemitic conspiracy theories.

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Notable Quotes

• Russell Contreras on Project Esther’s alignment with Project 2025:

  "Project Esther could be seen as an addendum."
  [05:19]

• Dov Kent on the ineffectiveness of authoritarian measures:

  "We cannot terrorize or incarcerate or deport or fire or infiltrate our way out of antisemitism."
  [20:19]

• Unnamed Official on visa regulations:

  "If you told us all these things when you applied for a visa, we would deny your visa."
  [03:51]

• Dov Kent on the rise of antisemitism due to Project Esther:

  "The immediate and long term impact of Project Esther ironically is an increase in antisemitism across the country."
  [24:18]

---

For a deeper understanding of Project Esther and its impacts, listeners are encouraged to visit the show notes for additional resources and links.

Transcript

[Noel King]

The Trump administration is justifying the arrest and detention of protester Mahmoud Khalil and Rumayisa Ozturk, who wrote an op ed in a student newspaper by calling them Hamas supporters. But when asked for evidence, the administration doesn't offer any. Here's a DHS official on npr.

[Russell Contreras]

How did he support Hamas? Exactly what did he do? Well, I think you can see it on tv, right? This is somebody that we've invited and allowed the student to come into the country. And he put himself in the middle of the process of basically pro Palestinian activity.

[Noel King]

So where is this allegation coming from? On TODAY Explained it might be coming from the same people who wrote Project 2025. Project Esther largely flew under the radar until now.

[Russell Contreras]

So they didn't actually say whether they took cues from Project Esther. What they said is, well, it's always been a core principle. It just so happens those core principles can be found in Project Esther.

[Noel King]

Hey there. A little bit of news before we start today's news show. News you can use. You can now listen to TODAY Explained without listening to any ads. In order to do this, you just need to become a VOX member. When you become a member, you're going to be supporting the work that we do on today explained. And you'll also get unlimited access to Vox.com just go to Vox.com members to sign up. Scientists find weird kinds of life all.

[Dov Kent]

The time, and normally they can run experiments.

[Noel King]

If I hypothesize life can live in bleach, well, I can get bleach and see if life lives in it.

[Dov Kent]

But what if the weird thing about.

[Noel King]

The life they find is that it lives for millions of years? Time? I don't have any control over that. I can literally do nothing with time. This week on Unexplainable Intra terrestrials, Aliens on Earth, deep beneath the seafloor Follow Unexplainable for new episodes every Wednesday.

[Nisha Chital]

This is TODAY Explained.

[Noel King]

I'm Noel King with Russell Contreras. He's a senior reporter at Axios who wrote that the Trump administration's actions to combat anti Semitism by calling people Hamas supporters stems from a specific playbook. Russ, what's the playbook?

[Russell Contreras]

Well, there is a playbook that was created by the Heritage foundation called Project Esther. Many listeners may remember the Heritage foundation for their project 2025.

[Noel King]

Yes.

[Russell Contreras]

And so Project Esther could be seen as an addendum.

[Unnamed Expert]

Project Esther, a national strategy to Combat antisemitism.

[Russell Contreras]

It's a blueprint for the administration. It was released around October of last year before the election Not a lot of press. It calls for an administration to rebrand pro Palestinian protesters as Hamas supporters.

[Unnamed Expert]

The Hamas support network and its nihilist supporters indoctrinate the gullible into supporting Hamas and hating Israel to create the street mayhem that serves their ends.

[Russell Contreras]

It also calls for the administration to go any funders, nonprofits, progressive leaning groups who are supporting protesters.

[Unnamed Expert]

We have several laws at our disposal that may help to exploit Hamas support network and Hamas support organization vulnerabilities, such as the Foreign Agents Registration Act.

[Russell Contreras]

Project Esther lays out a plan for administration to implement that. And that's what happened when the Trump administration came in. The plan was right there.

[Unnamed Official]

And if you tell us when you apply for your visa, and by the way, I intend to come to your country as a student and rile up all kinds of anti Jewish students, anti Semitic activities. I intend to shut down your universities. If you told us all these things when you applied for a visa, we would deny your visa. I hope we would. If you actually end up doing that once you're in this country on such a visa, we will revoke it.

[Noel King]

Okay, so Project Esther comes from the Heritage Foundation. Who wrote it? Exactly.

[Russell Contreras]

It looks like it was a coalition of Heritage foundation authors. The document clearly states that we're doing this because we have concluded there's been Jewish complacency. That means Jewish American groups, American Jews have not done enough to fight antisemitism.

[Unnamed Expert]

Some may be in such disbelief that they cannot even acknowledge the threat. More likely, many simply do not know what to do and are waiting for leadership to guide them.

[Russell Contreras]

So therefore, this is going to be a larger effort and it does not need to be Jewish led. Oh, who is the we? That's the clear. It doesn't look like it had a lot of Jewish American input. It looks like this. We is a lot of Christians, white Christians, conservative Christians. They've taken a step to say, look, we're concerned about antisemitism. This is not just a Jewish fight. This is our fight too. And we feel we have to speak out against antisemitism. Here's our plan.

[Noel King]

Why are these Christian conservatives so invested in fighting anti Semitism?

[Russell Contreras]

Well, it goes to the worldview of Christian conservatives. If you've ever been to evangelical church. I grew up in Houston, Texas, so I know this very well. The idea of Israel is very central to their being. A lot of Christian white Christians believe there needs to be a strong Israel for the second coming of Christ.

[Dov Kent]

Now this goes into history now. Now you have Israel literally being the centerpiece of God's.

[Unnamed Official]

Cosmic clock.

[Dov Kent]

That's why Christians are so fixated on Israel.

[Russell Contreras]

On the other side, you've got conservative led governments in Israel that have made coalitions with conservative Christians in the United States because they see them as important allies for a lot of their fights as they go into this Israeli Palestinian conflict. So there's always been a relationship.

[Noel King]

I'm a great champion of devout Christians because devout Christians are the greatest champion.

[Dov Kent]

Of the state of Israel.

[Russell Contreras]

When the Prime Minister comes to the United States, he'll often visit with white Christian groups who are very supportive. There are trips, visits. So when they see protests on college campuses by pro Palestinian demonstrators, they see this as antithetical to the worldview and they must speak out.

[Noel King]

All right, so Project 2025 was 900 some odd pages. I read many of them, but I didn't read all. Project Esther is only about 33 pages. It's very easy to get through. Both of the projects are kind of built on thesis statements. What is the thesis statement of Project Esther?

[Russell Contreras]

Project Esther believes there has not been enough efforts to fight anti Semitism and there needs to be attacked on multiple fronts. It then says it is the objective for the administration or anybody who would take this project to rebrand pro Palestinian protesters as part of the Hamas support network. It then outlines some things to say this is needed. These steps are needed to put colleges back in their place and address students who are harassing Jewish students. They believe, in their view that pro Palestinian demonstrations are a threat in general to Jewish students, that they make Jewish students uncomfortable. Now, to be very clear in my reporting, there have been many cases of Jewish students feeling uncomfortable at these protests. There have been many anti Semitic things said to students. But this takes it a step further that suggests that all protests are likely anti Semitic and all protests need to be dealt with accordingly.

[Noel King]

What is this thing, the Hamas support network, is that a real organization?

[Russell Contreras]

No, it doesn't seem to be a real organization. It seems to be how they're portraying it. Those who are part of the student protest say, this is outrageous. This is a grassroots effort. These are students who are protesting who believe they see an injustice. It has nothing to do with a network. This is a group of students and activists who are speaking out about the images they see going on in the Middle east and want to say something and do something.

[Noel King]

Does it say anything about right leaning antisemitism?

[Russell Contreras]

It almost says nothing about right leaning antisemitism. It mentions social media posts, but says nothing about Elon Musk or say, right wing influencers. Paddling antisemitic theories. It says nothing about white replacement theory. This is, of course, a theory promoted by anti Semites, but goes a step further. They say, you know, Jewish people and people of color are conspiring to take white people out of positions of power. That theory has anti Semitic roots. It says nothing, that it's solely an attack on the left.

[Noel King]

The Jewish community in the United States is very large and runs the political gamut. There are progressive Jews, there are centrist Jews, there are very conservative Jews in this country. How are Jewish groups responding to Project Esther and to what the administration is doing now?

[Russell Contreras]

Well, when this project came out, there was a lot of suspicion from Jewish groups, even those in Israel, saying, look, wait a minute, we appreciate the fighting of antisemitism, but yet any kind of task force should have more Jewish voices, and possibly it should be Jewish led. The group, the Nexus Project, gave an alternative view to how to fight antisemitism, almost a response to Project Esther. They believe that universities should not clamp down on free speech. They should not go after those on student visas or those with green card holders, but that they should tackle legitimate concerns about antisemitism head on. That means saying things that are clearly anti Semitic, doing things that are clearly discriminated against, Jewish students and take proactive measures for that. They do not believe that any attack on free speech is the right answer and in fact, could hurt Jewish students. So there is a division on the other side. There is one group called Combat Antisemitism Movement, which in many ways is endorsing the Project Esther campaign. In fact, one of their directors at the group's Interfaith Outreach Engagement Director said, look, we support the Trump administration's deportation of those students who are on foreign visas, who are on visas, who are speaking out these protests. We endorse it. And in fact, we endorse a lot of the ideas.

[Noel King]

Russell Contreras is a senior reporter at Axios. When we return, many American Jews are deeply concerned about Project Esther, and we're going to hear why.

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[Nisha Chital]

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[Noel King]

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[Dov Kent]

The.

[Unnamed Host]

Nintendo Switch 2 is basically guaranteed to be the most interesting gadget of 2025, and we learned a lot of new stuff about it this last week or so. Some of the games that are coming out, some of the specs of the new device, and the fact that it's going to cost $449.99. Except maybe it's not, because the other thing going on right now is tariffs. And tariffs threaten to change just about everything about tech. What it is, how it's made, where it comes from, and crucially, how much we have to pay for it. So that's what we're talking about on the Vergecast all week. Wherever you get podcasts.

[Russell Contreras]

This is Today Explained.

[Noel King]

Dov Go ahead, give me your full name and tell me what you do.

[Dov Kent]

My name is Dov Kent and I am the US Senior Director of Diaspora Alliance. Diaspora alliance confronts antisemitism and its distortion and we believe that antisemitism corrodes democracy by fueling conspiracy theories and bigotry and misdirecting people's anger, fear and understanding of power. And at the same time, fabricated or reckless accusations of antisemitism are used to thwart and malign struggles for human rights, justice and equality and make it harder to challenge antisemitism when it arises. Both of these are true at the same time, and they reinforce each other.

[Noel King]

One thing that we've learned, many of us have learned over the last 18 months or so, is that there are different definitions of antisemitism. How do you and the Diaspora alliance define it?

[Dov Kent]

Well, what I'll say is that there's actually not a lot of difference in how most Jews or scholars define the basics of antisemitism. What people disagree on is how and when that is applied to Israel. And so a lot of the fights over the definitions are actually proxy fights for people's politics about Israel and Palestine.

[Noel King]

Okay, so you kind of nailed it there. The really important thing, there's a spectrum of beliefs, even within the Jewish community about how questioning Israel relates to antisemitism. Where do you personally fall on this spectrum?

[Dov Kent]

Yeah, I think that whether speech or conduct about Zionism in Israel is anti Semitic should be based on the standards for speech or conduct that apply to anti Semitic behavior in general, but that as a general rule, criticism of Zionism in Israel, opposition to Israel's policies, non violent political action directed at the state of Israel or its policies are not as such, inherently anti Semitic.

[Noel King]

All right, let's get into the topic at hand, which is Project Esther. Do you remember when you first heard about Project Esther?

[Dov Kent]

Yes, very soon after it came out. It was published on the one year anniversary of October, October 7th. So it was published on October 7th, 2024. And right away, my colleagues and I were very alarmed by this plan. Right. When Project Esther was rolled out, most Jewish institutions that you might imagine might be aligned with this had actually nothing to say because they'd never heard of it. There are basically no Jews involved in this plan to supposedly dismantle antisemitism. The Heritage foundation as the core author, and other allied organizations, many of them Christian nationalist organizations. And I will say that throughout the plan, they misused Jewish text. They refer to Jewish groups with the wrong terms. They call Jewish positions on antisemitism inexplicable. In an interview actually with a member of the Heritage foundation, they said something along the lines of, if Jews were doing their job countering antisemitism, we wouldn't be in the position we're in now. So the plan really derides Jews throughout it.

[Noel King]

Project Esther is named after figure, Queen Esther. What's Queen Esther's story?

[Dov Kent]

The Book of Esther. It's a text that Jews Read once a year on the holiday of Purim. In the story, Queen Esther makes an intervention with the king in which a mortal decree that the king's advisor had made against the Jewish people is instead turned against the advisor, so the victims become the heroes. But within the story is also the idea that those lines are not so binary and that what is good and what is evil may change. The story of Esther has been repurposed by far right Christian political movements. There's a phrase from the text that Esther was put into a position of power for such a time as this. And that phrase has been used by extremist groups like Moms for Liberty, protesters at the U.S. capitol on January 6th. The Esther Call to the Mall that brought hundreds of evangelical women to D.C. to protest reproductive rights.

[Russell Contreras]

But who knows, Esther? Who knows? But perhaps you were born for such a time as this.

[Dov Kent]

Queen Esther is invoked for this idea of spiritual warfare that must be waged against evil in the world, this battle against demonic forces that Christian nationalists believe they are in. So it makes sense that the Heritage foundation would invoke this Christian nationalist frame for a kind of warfare against liberal civil society.

[Noel King]

We heard in the first half of the show about the actions that Project Esther recommends to fight antisemitism. Your reaction on reading it is what exactly do you think what they are suggesting will work? Would work?

[Dov Kent]

No. Next question? No. Just kidding. We cannot terrorize or incarcerate or deport or fire or infiltrate our way out of anti Semitism. That's just not how it works. And we certainly can't dismantle constitutional protections as a way to combat antisemitism when we know that Jewish safety in the US Depends on constitutional democracy and minority protections. So deporting international students doesn't combat antisemitism. Public firings don't combat antisemitism. Withholding funds from research institutions doesn't combat antisemitism. Arresting activists doesn't combat antisemitism. And there is no city or country in the world where these kinds of actions have been applied that have seen any increase in Jewish safety or decrease in antisemitic ideas or behaviors.

[Noel King]

We've seen the Trump administration come out and, for example, insist that Mahmoud Khalil is a supporter of Hamas. When asked for proof. When asked for evidence, the administration hasn't been able to provide anything. Now, Project Esther names a quote, hamas supporter support network as the root of a lot of anti Semitism. We heard in the first half of the show that this is not like a real organization. So what is the goal of saying Mahmoud Khalil and people like him are part of the Hamas support network.

[Dov Kent]

Yes. So agreeing with your earlier guest that this phrase Hamas support network was just made up by the Heritage foundation and its allies as a smear for any organization that supports Palestinian rights and humanity. This is part of an effort to completely conflate support for Palestinian rights and humanity with support for Hamas. Project Esther's scope extends well beyond these groups to target a wide spectrum of liberal donors, foundations and organizations that also do not in any way support Hamas. The plan even names anti capitalist groups claiming that they align with America's overseas enemies. And all of this just sets the stage for guilt by association and exposes the true intent of Project Esther, which is dismantling civil society institutions such as universities and non profit organizations as a way to get rid of any domestic opposition to the administration, all under the guise of protecting Jews. And there's another important note here. What they're doing with the term Hamas support network is trying to create in the minds of Americans a whole class of people who are associated with terrorism and violence and therefore do not deserve the protections of US Law, including immigration law. So when the administration starts to detain and deport people through illegal means, as they are currently doing, they are banking that Americans won't protest. And it's directly connected to what they're doing in sending immigrants to prison in El Salvador under the false premise that they're all connected to a violent gang. And one other thing I'll say is that Project Esther has literally nothing to say about the fire hose of antisemitism and conspiracy theories coming out of the far right in this country, which are the leading drivers of anti Semitic violence in the US According to any and every serious study. So the sole target of this is pro Palestinian groups and beyond, who they accuse of being not just anti Semitic, but also anti American.

[Noel King]

What does all of this mean for Jews in the United States?

[Dov Kent]

Well, the Trump administration's initial attacks on students and higher education that we are seeing as the very clear rollout of Project Esther don't just not work against antisemitism. They actively stoke antisemitism by making Jews the face of authoritarian crackdowns. People are losing their jobs, they're losing funding for critical scientific research, they're losing their freedoms, supposedly in our name. And this feeds into anti Semitic conspiracy theories about shadowy outside Jewish power and makes Jews the one to blame for the longtime Christian nationalist goal of dismantling higher education. So the immediate and long term impact of Project Esther ironically is an increase in antisemitism across the country on top of the incredible harm being done to international students, educators, researchers and all of us who benefit from free speech and academic inquiry. This is an effective strategy by the right because they're executing the policies they want to anyway, but they're doing so in the name of fighting antisemitism. The erosion of those rights makes all communities less safe, including Jews, and any work to carve out exceptions, whoever they target or claim to protect, undermine the universal protection that actually makes us all safe. I'll also say that it is abundantly clear that the Trump administration is not truly working on behalf of Jewish safety. Trump's right hand man Elon Musk is working to dismantle the federal government while repopularizing the Nazi salute, running a platform rife with anti Semitic conspiracies and encouraging German politicians to abandon their post Holocaust commitment to keeping far right extremists out of power. The administration is filled with appointees who have long histories of spreading anti Semitic conspiracy theories. They've defunded the Office of Civil Rights for Universities, which is the very body that is tasked with reviewing and enforcing rules against antisemitism and other forms of discrimination on campus. It's also clear that no one in this administration cares about bigotry or discrimination of any kind unless it's an invented and inverted anti white or anti Christian discrimination. And American Jews can see that this administration is not truly fighting for our safety.

[Noel King]

Dove Kent is a senior director with the Diaspora Alliance. If you're interested in this and you want to read Project Esther, you can find the link in our show Notes Today. Amanda Llewellyn produced Jolie Myers edited Laura Bullard and Victoria Chamberlain check the fact and Patrick Boyd is our engineer. I'm Noel King. It's Today Explained.

[Dov Kent]

Support for the show.

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