Today, Explained: Should Women Be in Combat? Vox Podcast Episode Released on May 22, 2025

Introduction

In the May 22, 2025 episode of Today, Explained, Vox hosts Noel King and Kurt Sonner delve into the contentious debate over the role of women in combat within the U.S. military. The episode scrutinizes the policies and perspectives of Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth, who has recently reignited discussions on gender integration in combat roles.

Background on the Debate

The episode sets the stage by highlighting Secretary Pete Hegseth's controversial tenure, marked by his outspoken stance against what he terms "wokeness" in the military. From the outset, Hegseth has positioned himself against various progressive measures, including those supporting women in combat roles.

Hegseth’s Stance and Policies

Noel King introduces Hegseth's position, noting his explicit challenges to women's participation in combat:

• Hegseth on Women in Combat (00:22):

  "We're done with that shit."

• Challenging Quotas (00:36):

  "These commanders meet quotas to have a certain number of female infantry officers or infantry enlisted, and that disparages those women."

Hegseth argues that enforcing gender quotas undermines military effectiveness and standards.

Revising Physical Fitness Standards

A significant portion of the episode focuses on Hegseth’s initiative to revise the Army’s physical fitness standards to be gender-neutral.

• Hegseth’s Directive (04:22):

  "We're ensuring that any combat position across any of the services and the services are evaluating that has the same standard for men and women."

The new directives mandate that women in combat roles must meet the same physical standards as their male counterparts, eliminating previous gender-based adjustments.

Historical Context and Military Integration

The discussion provides historical context, referencing the 2015 directive by then-Secretary Ash Carter that opened all military roles to women, provided they meet the necessary standards.

• Impact of 2015 Directive (05:04):

  "As long as they qualify and meet the standards, women will now be able to contribute to our mission in ways they could not before."

This shift allowed women to participate in roles such as driving tanks, firing mortars, and leading infantry units.

Experiences of Women in Combat: The Story of Emily Van Ass

A pivotal segment of the episode features Emily Van Ass, one of the first women to graduate from Ranger School and serve in combat roles.

• Emily’s Journey (17:40):

  "I was among the first women to graduate from the Army's elite Ranger School."

Emily recounts the challenges she faced, including skepticism from male counterparts and the physical and mental rigors of Ranger School.

• Facing Gender Bias (18:26):

  "There was half of this population of objective graders that just kind of hated my guts for even showing up."

Despite these obstacles, Emily emphasizes that she met the same physical standards as her male peers:

• Equal Standards (20:57):

  "I ran five miles in 40 minutes. I did 49 push-ups, 59 sit-ups, six pull-ups. I rucked 12 miles in three hours with a 45-pound ruck."

Her unwavering commitment challenges the notion that women cannot meet the demanding requirements of combat roles.

Impact on Women in the Military

The episode explores the broader implications of Hegseth’s policies on female service members:

• Elimination of Support Structures (09:42):

  "The Pentagon and the military branches have eliminated barrier analysis groups... working on issues for women and various minority groups."

This move has led to concerns about the diminishing support and recognition for women’s contributions in the military.

• Physical Equipment Challenges (10:31):

  "Body armor designed for a small male body caused discomfort and injuries for many women."

Such issues highlight the ongoing struggle to accommodate women’s specific needs within combat roles.

Reactions and Perspectives

The hosts and interviewees provide critical perspectives on Hegseth’s approach:

• Defining Lethality (23:36):

  "Lethality extends far beyond physical fitness... It’s tactical skills, decision making, leadership, grit."

The conversation underscores that military effectiveness is multifaceted and not solely dependent on physical prowess.

• Response to Hegseth’s Views (25:28):

  Emily expresses frustration: "It makes me irate, to be honest. It’s just a complete discountment of all of the accomplishments of the women that came before us."

There is a collective sentiment among female service members that Hegseth's policies undermine their hard-earned achievements and capabilities.

Conclusion

The episode concludes by reflecting on the ongoing struggle for gender equality in the military. It emphasizes the resilience of women like Emily Van Ass, who continue to break barriers despite institutional resistance. The discussion leaves listeners contemplating the true meaning of military lethality and the indispensable role that women play in achieving it.

Notable Quotes

• Pete Hegseth (00:08):

  "No more pronouns. No more climate change obsession. No more emergency vaccine mandates. No more dudes in dresses. We're done with that shit."

• Emily Van Ass (18:33):

  "Back in 2016 and 2017, it was so new to have women in Ranger school. I had dark times at that school."

• Emily Van Ass (25:13):

  "It makes me irate, to be honest. It’s just a complete discountment of all of the accomplishments of the women that came before us."

This comprehensive exploration in Today, Explained provides a nuanced understanding of the complexities surrounding the role of women in combat, the policies shaping their participation, and the personal stories that humanize this pivotal issue.