Podcast Summary: Acontece que no es poco | El exterminio de los gorriones chinos

Podcast: Todo Concostrina (SER Podcast)
Host: Nieves Concostrina
Date: June 29, 2022

Overview of the Episode

In this captivating history episode, Nieves Concostrina explores the bizarre and tragic “extermination of the Chinese sparrows,” a catastrophic campaign led by Mao Zedong in the late 1950s as part of the Great Leap Forward. With her characteristic wit and sharp analysis, Nieves discusses how misguided policies, mass mobilization, and ignorance led to one of history’s most devastating ecological disasters and contributed to a massive human tragedy in China.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Setting the Scene: Dictatorships and Historical Lies

• Nieves and Carlos reflect on how studying history reveals both incredible knowledge and shocking surprises, especially the excesses and lies told under dictatorships.
• They draw a parallel between Franco’s Spain and Mao’s China, noting that dictators' deceptions have real, devastating consequences.
  • Quote: “Conocer la historia sirve... para desmontar sus mentiras, para destapar sus excesos. Da igual que sea [...] en la España de Franco, en la China de Mao. Hoy toca la China de Mao.” (Carlos, 01:01)

2. Mao’s Great Leap Forward and Its Fatal Logic

• Nieves explains the chain of events that, beginning in 1958, drove China into chaos under Mao's program, the “Gran Salto Adelante”—meant to catapult China into being an industrial powerhouse but leading instead to disaster.
• The campaign relied on mobilizing masses to substitute for actual machinery, including melting domestic metal items to support steel production and neglecting agriculture for industry, resulting in food shortages.
  • Quote: “El plan solo funcionaba en su cabeza, porque China no tenía tejido industrial ni tenía maquinaria. Pero dijo Mao, una masa de obreros puede suplir perfectamente la maquinaria. Será por chinos. Somos mil millones.” (Nieves, 04:09–05:28)

3. The Birth of the Sparrow Extermination Campaign

• Facing agricultural collapse, Mao blamed pests for poor harvests: rats, insects, and especially sparrows (gorriones), accused of eating precious grain.
• Governments ordered mass extermination of these perceived pests, activating the blind obedience of the masses—often under duress.
  • Quote: “La ignorancia es la madre del atrevimiento y la masa no piensa, todos los chinos se lanzaron a acabar con ellos. Muchos porque no les quedaba otra. Esa era la orden. Y la mayoría convencidos de lo que hacían.” (Nieves, 07:58)

4. Methods and Madness: How Sparrows Were Exterminated

• Nieves details the absurd and cruel measures taken to eliminate sparrows: climbing trees to destroy nests, arming citizens, and—most dramatically—mass coordinated drumming ("tamborradas") to terrify sparrows, preventing them from landing until they died of exhaustion. Other animals died as collateral damage due to poison use.
  • Quote: “Tamborradas insoportables… Consistía en estar tocando tambores por los campos ininterrumpidamente, estresando a los pájaros impidiendo que pudieran posarse, que volaran sin descanso hasta que se desplomaban agotados.” (Nieves, 09:19)

5. Catastrophic Consequences: Ecological and Human Disaster

• The mass-killing of sparrows backfired: with a natural pest-controller gone, swarms of insects (especially locusts) devastated what little crops remained.
• Coupled with drought and agricultural mismanagement, the result was a famine of unprecedented scale.
  • Quote: “Los gorriones no solo comen grano, también comen insectos. Eran un plaguicida natural. Así que los insectos nos están comiendo a nosotros…” (Nieves, 09:53)
• Official estimates admit to at least 23 million deaths, with scholarly estimates pointing to 43–46 million, and accounts of cannibalism during the famine.
  • Quote: “Chen Guz se llamaba. 43 millones de chinos en el mejor de los casos. 46 millones en el peor.” (Nieves, 10:56)
  • Quote: “No solo por aquella hambruna histórica, sino porque se comieron entre ellos. Hubo muchos episodios de canibalismo.” (Nieves, 12:45)

6. Attempts at Reversal and Erasure of Memory

• Eventually, the Chinese leadership realized their ecological blunder and quietly imported sparrows from the Soviet Union to restore some balance.
• The regime went to great lengths to hide the true scope of the disaster, erasing much of this dark chapter from public memory.
  • Quote: “Tuvieron hasta que importar gorriones de otros lugares, de la Unión Soviética mismamente... Lo que intentaban era recuperar la especie y que no se enterara el mundo de la gran cagada...” (Nieves, 11:21)
• Nieves notes the dangers when a population is denied honest historical memory—a phenomenon not exclusive to China.
  • Quote: “Cuando te ocultan tu historia, te roban tu memoria. Y claro, te conviertes en una masa ignorante.” (Nieves, 12:59)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• The Danger of the Mob:
  “La masa es muy peligrosa. Cuando los individuos la forman, ahí es que anulan su sentido común individual y la lían.” (Nieves, 02:21)

• Historical Amnesia:
  “Las nuevas generaciones no saben que existió o los datos que tienen son falsos. De la misma forma que desconocen que en junio del 89 el gobierno chino ordenó aplastar a 2.000 estudiantes con tanques en la plaza de Tiananmen.” (Nieves, 12:45)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 01:01 — Intro: The utility and surprises of studying history
• 03:00 — Context: Mao’s leadership crisis and the “Revolución Cultural”
• 04:09 — How the Great Leap Forward began and its central delusion
• 06:36 — Industrial production at the expense of agriculture, failed steel campaign
• 07:58 — Why sparrows were targeted and how mass mobilization was manipulated
• 09:19 — Methods and scale of the sparrow extermination campaign
• 10:55 — The famine: death toll and humanitarian tragedy
• 11:21 — Attempts to recover the sparrow population and cover up the disaster
• 12:45-13:12 — On historical memory and the perils of forgetting

Tone and Language

Nieves Concostrina’s signature style shines throughout: sardonic, incisive, occasionally irreverent, but always focused on illuminating overlooked corners of history with clarity and wit. Her storytelling makes a grim chapter highly engaging, provoking both wry amusement and sober reflection.

This episode is both a cautionary tale of environmental hubris and a sharp critique of authoritarian power, illustrating how ignorance and propaganda can have catastrophic—even genocidal—consequences.