4.7 Trillion Missing?! The Government’s Biggest Cover-Up Just Got Exposed | The Tom Bilyeu Show

Summary

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Impact Theory Podcast Summary

Episode: 4.7 Trillion Missing?! The Government’s Biggest Cover-Up Just Got Exposed
Host: Tom Bilyeu
Co-Host: Drew
Date: February 19, 2025

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Main Theme

This episode dives into the startling revelation of $4.7 trillion in unaccounted-for government expenditures, using it as a springboard to tackle deeper systemic inefficiencies in government operations. Tom and Drew expand the conversation into topics including financial transparency, meme coins, AI breakthroughs, thought-to-text technologies, free speech, and modern culture. Their discussion weaves current events, economic theory, and philosophical musings, all delivered in a sharp, no-nonsense tone.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. $4.7 Trillion Unaccounted U.S. Government Spending

• Origin of the Story: $4.7 trillion in U.S. federal expenditures lacks any description or allocated field—a consequence of making the “description” field optional in spending records.
  • “The US treasury made it optional to say what the expense was for. And the number that that racks up to is $4.7 trillion. That's so crazy...” — Tom Bilyeu [01:30]
• Systemic Incompetence:
  • Tom explains “Velocity Made Good”—successful organizations create measurable, directional progress, while the government’s system encourages inefficiency because taxpayers must pay and money can be printed.
  • “You begin to understand why everybody thinks of the government as this incredibly plotting thing, that it's like the DMV at scale...” — Tom [03:40]
  • “There's no evolutionary pressure for the organization to run well because... they can by force extract money from you... and they can print money.” — Tom [04:33]

2. Financial Transparency, Fort Knox & Rehypothecation

• Calls for Audits: The Twitterverse (notably Zero Hedge) and Elon Musk call for auditing Fort Knox, since no independent audit has been done since 1974.
  • “What's your. Do you think we still got it? No, I don't think we got it either.” — Drew [07:51]
• Rehypothecation Explained:
  • Tom describes how gold (or money) is re-loaned—akin to counting one candy bar multiple times in the financial system, leading to a crisis if everyone asks for their candy at once.
  • “It's called rehypothecation, I think. So. It's crazy. People just don't understand the nature of the financial system that so much of it is essentially vaporware.” — Tom [08:03]
• Banking System Instability: Explains why all banks are “functionally insolvent” if too many depositors want their money at once, relating to possible gold run fears at Fort Knox.

3. Conspiracies, Bitcoin, Global Economic Implications

• Scenario Post-Audit: What if Fort Knox audit reveals less gold? Could the US pivot to strategic Bitcoin reserves?
  • “If those... between each of those points, there's probably seven steps that have to happen... it is a plausible chain of events... but it’s too risky, too immoral.” — Tom [11:28–13:07]
  • Tom sharply opposes printing money to buy Bitcoin, seeing it as deeply unethical and “Sam Bankman Fried” level risky.

4. AI Breakthroughs: Grok 3, The Fields Medal, and Exponential Progress

• AI Matching Superhuman Intelligence:
  • Elon Musk claims Grok 3 could soon make Nobel-level math breakthroughs (“Fields Medal”), and Tom lays out the world-shaking implications:
  • “Now imagine that's coming from AI. Now imagine how scalable that is. So... a million, more in fact. So now you're dealing with something where you can put that level of intelligence...” — Tom [15:41]
  • “Advancement. That's 20,000 years of advancement in, in an afternoon.” — Tom [17:22]
• Applied Solutions:
  • Drew: “If winning the medal means that they will then be able to solve those novel problems, they will be able to.” [18:04]
  • Tom envisions open-source AI, available globally, that can instruct on building wells, recycling parts, and solving local problems in the developing world.

5. AI & Game Development / Emergent Civilization in Minecraft

• Grok for Game Development: Elon aims to use Grok for developing video games, with a pledge to open-source previous stable versions.
  • “If you could just go, give me a physics engine that matches Fortnite with the aesthetics of Elden Ring... Oh my God, Drew, if it's doing it based on physics, that's the thing.” — Tom [20:52]
• AI Civilization in Minecraft:
  • 1,000 AI agents built their own government, society, and culture—sparking questions if AI mimics humanity or follows inevitable patterns for intelligence and emergence.
  • “When you start building a game, you realize you're just trying to replicate everything in the world, even if you want to make it alien.” — Tom [24:03]

6. Simulation Theory & Creator Discussion

• Discussion veers into the philosophical, debating if our universe is designed like an artificial simulation.
  • “Now, that's obviously not literally true, but it does make you wonder.” — Tom [28:01]
  • Tom: “I want to remain open to what the real answer is. So I stand in. In awe of the universe, knowing there's something, some. We could call it a creator, whatever. I just don't think that humans know what that thing is.” [30:39]

7. AI Art Controversy

• Meta’s AI Decodes Thoughts:
  • Meta develops noninvasive sensors capable of turning thoughts into text with 80% accuracy.
  • “They just published two papers showing that they can decode thoughts into text with 80% accuracy.” — Drew [37:08]
  • Tom stresses need for robust protections against potential abuses (dystopian law enforcement, privacy violations).
• AI and Artistry:
  • Discussion over AI’s ability to mimic established art styles such as Studio Ghibli’s. Concerns about loss of human creativity vs. unleashing creative potential.
  • “There is a part of me that still responds to that. So I get where people are coming from... But the vitriol of this, I think misses the point.” — Tom [32:19 – 34:29]

8. Politics, Free Speech, and Censorship

• Trump's Controversial Statement:
  • Trump quote: “He who saves his country does not violate any law.”
  • "This is the kind of logic that gets people in trouble…” — Tom [41:34]
  • Tom warns against outcome-justifies-the-means thinking and underscores the value of checks and balances.
• German Crackdown on Memes & Speech:
  • Germany and other countries arresting people for memes and speech—a slide into “totalitarianism.”
  • “This isn’t sliding toward totalitarianism. This is totalitarianism… This is terrible. This isn't bad thinking. This is bad policy.” — Tom [45:16]
  • Tom upholds the primacy of free speech—even speech we hate—as foundational for a free society.

9. Meme Coins: Influence, Hype, and Scams

• Risks and Problems:
  • Meme coins = gambling on hype, not value. 95% of participants lose money.
  • "Meme Coins. I think Meme Coins should be legal. I think everybody should be able to do what they want with Meme Coins. But if you with Meme Coins, this is their nature. Meme Coins is gambling. Meme Coins is gambling on culture." — Tom [48:19]

10. Relationships, Betrayal and Forgiveness

• Viral Clip Reflection:
  • Tom and Drew dissect a viral video of a woman publicly humiliating her cheating husband; both hosts condemn the cycle of vengeance and its futility.
  • “What makes love the wonderful thing that it is… it's one of the primary mechanisms by which we bring kids into this world. One of the greatest gifts that you can give to humanity. When you betray that trust...It recontextualizes it…” — Tom [53:18]
  • “You look messy... Like, you look like a goofy. Because now you're airing dirty laundry…” — Drew [58:04]

11. Elon Musk & Baby Mama News

• “I may take what works. Discard the rest. I will not be taking relationship advice from Elon, however, as an entrepreneur, as a government auditor, he's got my vote. But as a father, as a partner, maybe not so much.” — Tom [59:42]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Government Inefficiency:
  “There's no evolutionary pressure for the organization to run well because... they can by force extract money from you, known as taxes. They can literally put you in prison if you don't. And they can print money.” — Tom [04:33]

• On Bank/Gold Rehypothecation: "It's called rehypothecation, I think... It's crazy. People just don't understand the nature of the financial system..." — Tom [08:03]

• On Printing Money to Buy Bitcoin:
  "It's immoral to do so. Whether it ends up being devastating outside of the US or not, it's immoral." — Tom [13:00]

• On AI’s Scalability: "If you have a million people who are capable of winning the Fields Medal dude, this is how things start advancing really quickly." — Tom [15:54]

• On Principles & Free Speech: "This is why freedom of speech matters so much, is so foundational... Even if all of you vote and say we hate this. It's got to go. Nope, it's the one hard and fast." — Tom [46:00]

• On Meme Coins:
  "With meme coins. Good luck. You're probably going to lose your money like 95% of people." — Tom [52:19]

• On Cheating & Marriage:
  "You betray that trust by the ultimate betrayal... It takes the foundation upon which all of that, like, joint living and the sacrifices that you make... and it recontextualizes it..." — Tom [53:18]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• $4.7 Trillion Unaccounted – [01:25–05:11]
• Fort Knox Audit, Gold & Rehypothecation – [07:18–10:39]
• US Policy, Bitcoin, and Global Impacts – [10:39–14:23]
• Grok 3, AI, and the Fields Medal – [14:23–18:33]
• AI Civilization Building in Minecraft – [23:16–29:22]
• Simulation/Creator Theory – [29:22–31:20]
• AI Art, Copyright, and Meta’s Mind Reading – [31:29–39:49]
• Trump, Free Speech, Germany’s Censorship – [41:23–47:55]
• Meme Coin Pump-and-Dump & Regulation – [48:02–52:23]
• Cheating, Vengeance, and Relationship Breakdown – [53:16–59:13]
• Elon Musk & Baby Mama – [59:29–60:34]

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Tone & Style

Conversational, direct, irreverent yet philosophical. Tom and Drew are candid, eager to “challenge everything you know” while staying rooted in practicality and a desire for clarity.

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Overall Takeaway

This episode of Impact Theory is a dynamic, wide-ranging conversation that uses government waste as a launching point to examine everything from institutional failure and economic danger zones to the disruptive—and sometimes alarming—potential of upcoming technologies and social trends. Tom Bilyeu and Drew spur listeners to question the status quo, think for themselves, and be wary of all top-down authority, whether in politics, finance, or emerging AI.

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Transcript

[Tom Bilyeu]

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[Drew]

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[Tom Bilyeu]

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[Drew]

We are here, man. 4.7 trillion. Like, that's not a small number.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Yeah, that's crazy. And we should clarify exactly what that means. So every thing that the government spends, just as in your own house, you have a field in which you can say, this is what this expenditure is for. And $4.7 trillion worth of stuff has nothing written there. So they made that an optional field. I want you to imagine when you sign up for an account, like, it's all required. Drew. Like, you got to give him everything. The security code, your address, all that stuff. And the US treasury made it optional to say what the expense was for. And the number that that racks up to is $4.7 trillion. That's so crazy. Now, I don't know over what period of time that is, but even if that's from the beginning of time, Drew, that's a lot of money.

[Drew]

I can't tell if there's, like, a level of ignorance or if this is just really, like, they don't know. Like, it's getting ridiculous, because I know it's one thing to cancel a contract, it's one thing to make the U turn on dei, but filling in a budget item, I feel like that wouldn't be that hard. So do you think that the government is just. This is its first time being under the spotlight, or do you think it's just this level of incompetence?

[Tom Bilyeu]

Well, I think it's both. I think it's this level of incompetence and because nobody's put a spotlight on it and thus made the demand that we're going to make this better. And, and then because that demand has never been made, then it's just allowed to go on and on and on and on and on. Now listen, the government is insanely complicated and I do not want this to sound like it's easy, but there is an idea in business called Velocity Made Good. It is the thing when people talk about why are some entrepreneurs like Elon Musk able to do just incredible things and other entrepreneurs are not able to get their company going, something like 96% of all businesses fail to reach a million dollars. It's a distressingly low number. And Velocity Made Good is a nautical term. And it comes from angling your sails in a way that you're able to capture the energy of the wind and point your vessel in as close to a straight line as where you're trying to go. You often have to tack back and forth in order to get the wind and get the momentum going. But the idea being that there's a big difference between generating a bunch of energy so running the government like there's just a lot of money flowing through the system and actually generating momentum, like accurate directional momentum based on that energy. And when you see that level of incompetence of not doing something as simple as marking down what exactly is this expense for, you begin to understand why everybody thinks of the government as this incredibly plotting thing, that it's like the DMV at scale, that this is not a well run organization. There's no evolutionary pressure for the organization to run well because. Because unlike a business, which you either can pay your employees or you cannot, the government has two tools at its disposal that will make sure that it can always pay its employees. No matter how incompetent the employee is, no matter how incompetent the government is, they can by force extract money from you, known as taxes. They can literally put you in prison if you don't. And they can print money. So even if they're not able to create an environment in which the people can be so productive that they make more money than we spend for all of our government services, they can just make money up out of thin air, which people have heard me talk a lot about. And not only is that horrible in that it makes the rich richer and the poor poorer without asking people's permission. But you also end up with a government that is wildly inefficient and becomes the barnacles on the turtle that end up drowning the turtle.

[Drew]

It's ridiculous. And I'm more nervous about it because I feel like the more we uncover from government, we're going to see that. It's one thing to expose the media. It's one thing to show that, okay, 60 Minutes was lying, but it's another thing to show that, wait, the government isn't as efficient and isn't as honest. And, like, lie to me about the drones in Jersey. But, like, at least make sure, like, the, the. The systems are right. At least make, like, at least make sure we're not running on analog. Like, I'm starting to figure out that, like, maybe our defense system is still a green screen, like, back in the day. Like, it's. I'm just nervous what else Doge is uncovering as they continue this process, which

[Tom Bilyeu]

is why I think it is a very good idea that we're doing this. It's also why you're hearing the people that are not in power. I always, for some reason, I feel weird saying the Democrats because I don't want to make them the villain. This is all a part of the human psyche. And when the Republicans aren't in power, they do the exact same thing. But when the team that isn't in power is just squawking about all of this stuff. Now, I do think it's twofold. I think, one, they're not in power, and so they're going to be against everything that Republicans do. But then, two, when you look at the D.C. voted, something like 92 or 94% for Kamala Harris. So there is a way of doing business that the current Democratic Party has embraced that is very much bigger government, spending more money. And it is a philosophy that I think is absolutely horrific for the American people. So very interesting that once you make it a national election, you've got a very different outcome than when you look at the one area that's going to be most benefited from a tremendous amount of the government. Sorry, they're going to benefit tremendously from the government being as big as possible and pumping a lot of money through the system. It tells you that the government itself as an organism is completely out of step with the rest of the nation. And so seeing people now that happen to go under the moniker of the Republicans adopting what back in the 90s, under Clinton was the same strategy, which, by the way, was winning. They took us from, at the time, the biggest deficit to the biggest surplus. And my hope is that we're able to do that again.

[Drew]

Well, Elon seen one empty budget item. He wants to make sure something else isn't empty. There's been a call on Twitter to have him audit Fort Knox. It started with the exchange from Zero Hedge. On Twitter, he said, it would be great if Elon Musk could take a look inside Fort Knox just to make sure the 4580 tons of US gold is there. Last time anyone looked was 50 years ago in 1974. And Elon responded, surely it's reviewed at least every year. It should be. It isn't. Yeah, I'll be honest. That goes down there. I don't think it's there. What's your. Do you think we still got it? No, I don't think we got it either.

[Tom Bilyeu]

My, My instinct is that we have loaned that money out. It's not that I think it was stolen. It's that the way that you can loan it out to somebody who can loan it out to somebody. You can loan it out to somebody

[Drew]

kind of like how banks do, like.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's called rehypothecation, I think. So. It's crazy. People just don't understand the nature of the financial system that so much of it is essentially vaporware. It's. You have on your books that somebody owes you a brick of gold, and therefore you count it as, I have this asset. But when there's, you know, eight people in a row that all say that they have that same asset, shout out to Peter Schiff, who gave the example of, imagine you have a candy bar and you loan that candy bar out to somebody who loans that candy bar out to somebody who loans that candy bar out to somebody who loans that candy bar out to somebody who finally eats it. And now you've got a whole bunch of people that are like, wait, where's my candy bar? And so now the person who ate it's gotta go buy another candy bar to repay, to repay, to repay, to repay. So my gut instinct, I don't know this, this is pure conjecture, but my gut instinct is some very distressing percentage of that gold is not physically in Fort Knox, which is how the system works. So I don't want people to be like, oh, my God, this fraud, this is theft. This is the system. And you're now potentially seeing. Because what's happening right now, this is going to be A very complicated answer. And so I want everybody to understand this is only one reason amongst many others why this is happening. But right now, there's like a bunch of people just doing a run on gold. And so you get a literal. You have the potential for a literal run on gold where you can have enough people put in their IOU for that candy bar, only for everybody down the line to be like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. There is no candy bar. So you finally get to the guy who's like, damn, I ate it. But I'm going to have to go, like, buy a new one. And if they're unable to get it now, you have a whole bunch of people that are like, wait a second. Where the. The asset that I have is your debt. And that person is saying, I can't pay that debt. And so this is exactly how banks collapse. I think it'd be. People will be freaked out, just as when they look at commercial banking, they'll realize that most small banks and let me scrap that every bank on planet Earth is functionally insolvent. And that's why bank runs are always this looming fear. And the reality is just not everybody needs their money all at once. But the second people have a reason to say, I want my money back, if enough people do it at once, you run into banking crisis. And this was the whole thing. This is what, about a year ago when Silicon Valley bank went under. So if we find that we have that with Fort Knox, you're going to have a lot of people feel very insecure, and you'd never want people feeling insecure about the banking system.

[Drew]

I was going to say this for a conspiracy corner, but since we're talking about it, I'm going to bring it up now. This is coming from Walker America on X. He said, here's what's going to happen. Elon pushes Trump to audit Fort Knox. Then the audit reveals that there's less than 500 tons of gold. What's supposed to be in there is 44,580.

[Tom Bilyeu]

I don't think it's 44,000. Right? It's 4,800 and something.

[Drew]

Yeah, 4,580.

[Tom Bilyeu]

There we go.

[Drew]

Trump realizes China and Russia have way more gold than the US but very little bitcoin. Trump issues EO for strategic Bitcoin Reserve, citing national security money printer go br. And US Buys as much bitcoin as the market will sell. Price of gold collapses in BTC terms. China and Russia realized Trump got the jump on them and start trying to Acquire bitcoin. Price of gold collapses further. Peter Schiff is admitted to a mental hospital. What do. What's your take?

[Tom Bilyeu]

I mean, that's a bitcoiner. So it's like, look, that's. That is a plausible scenario. Like, if those. You know, between each of those points, there's probably seven steps that have to happen. So. But it. It is a very plausible chain of events. I just doubt very much you're going to see anything like that. It'll be a bunch of fractaling trees. So it'll be like you audit it and there's less gold, but it's not 500. Trump realizes that China, Russia, and a bunch of central banks have been buying up gold, but very little bitcoin. Maybe he looks at our strategic reserve or looks at the amount of bitcoin we have and goes, let's make it a strategic reserve. But he doesn't turn on the printer. Because I like to think myself and a whole lot of other people would start screaming, holy hell, if he's printing money, and I don't give a. If he's doing it to buy bitcoin. Because now you are saying, dear poor people, you, we're going to buy a bunch of bitcoin and we're just going to take the purchasing power from you. That would be so outrageous. Wow. Would myself and a lot of other people be excruciatingly angry that that's the kind of thing that. That I yell and scream about? That I go to Washington, D.C. stand on somebody's lawn saying, yo, this is fucked up. So, yeah, I really, like Step five alone would be. Would unleash holy hell from a lot of people. Um, and it. It is literally the most cynical thing in the universe to say money, print, to buy bitcoin, because that makes it sound like Americans are just going to default, be advantaged by it, which they're not. And even if, like, look, I want to see America win, but if you let me think about this, would the global poor get battered? The global poor doesn't directly own US Debt, but their country does. It just seems like it could be devastating. It's immoral to do so. Whether it ends up being devastating outside of the US or not, it's immoral. And I would have to hear so much more about, like, what is the US Doing with the bitcoin that it buys? Because, look, there is. There is a fantasy that you could spin about, we're going to do this. It'll become part of the strategic wealth fund. Not strategic. The sovereign wealth fund for the US and we can make this good for Americans. It's too fucking risky. It. That feels like Sam Bankman Freed to me. No, no, no, don't worry. I know I'm spending your money, but I'm going to spend it in good ways. Now the bad news is, I think if you count the receipts, Sam actually did it. Like if they had just left him the fuck alone, he would have been able to pay everybody back. Because everybody agrees you can't fucking do that. And so if you can't do it at the company level, you should not be able to do it at the country level. It's just as fucking risky. So ipso facto, that's where we stop. Oh, if you guys were here for the episode prep, you would be in on that inside joke. Which reminder to join us live for episode prep. Tuesdays, Thursdays and Fridays at 8am awesome.

[Drew]

Next in AI news, Grok3 released. It shows some of its benchmarks dominating deepseek, Gemini and O3. Mini and Elon made an interesting assumption of what he sees the future of AI happening Earth and Mars. Transit occurs every 26 months. The next we're currently in a transit window approximately. The next one would be November of next year roughly.

[Tom Bilyeu]

All right, stop it for a sec. I want to make sure that I know what the Fields Medal is, but I'm almost certain it is for novel solutions to mathematics which if I'm correct, I'm just going to search on Grok, If I'm correct about that. All right. The Fields Medal is a prestigious international award given to mathematicians under the age of 40 for their outstanding contributions to the field of mathematics. Often describes as the Nobel Prize of Mathematics. It was first award in 1936 and is presented every four years at the International. Okay, so this is for doing something that hasn't been done. Like you've got a breakthrough or an insight into mathematics that that is really helping to shape the entire field of mathematics. Now imagine that's coming from AI. Now imagine how scalable that is. So you can just scale AI. Scale, scale, scale, scale, scale. To give you an idea, Jensen Huang at Nvidia has made for 500 something that runs their entire AI. So now how many of those can you spin up? A million?

[Drew]

More.

[Tom Bilyeu]

So now more in fact. So now you're dealing with something where you can put that level of intelligence, especially as the inference side of this gets better. So the model hard part inference far easier, certainly cheaper. And if you have a million people who are capable of winning the Fields Medal dude, this is how things start advancing really quickly.

[Drew]

You put them all like in a room type thing.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Yeah. So imagine like when I've said, look, AI on a long enough timeline drives energy cost to zero. But when I say that, I mean it's going to have to have breakthroughs. And the reason that I get very excited about anybody who talks about AI should be maximally truth seeking, meaning, getting to the physics of things, like actually understanding the nature of mathematics, understanding the nature of physics. Now you can have breakthroughs that we haven't had before. And breakthroughs unlock things. They make things possible that weren't previously possible. So now you, you really do enter an age of abundance, if we're able to do that. So anyway, hit play. Because Elon goes on to make. He makes a crazy claim, I think, but we're hitting pause for a moment, but there's plenty more ahead, so don't go anywhere. Thanks for staying tuned. Now, let's get back to it.

[Drew]

Earth and Mars Transit occurs every 26 months. The next. We're currently in a transit window. Approximately the next one would be November of next year, roughly.

[Tom Bilyeu]

I so wanted the other guy to answer that, like, whether it's. Does he really think it's going to happen that fast? Because look, Elon is notoriously terrible at timelines. But even if he's off by a factor of five off of his outside estimate of two years, that's only 10 years, man. In 10 years. In 10 years, to have a million, 5 million, 10 million of these brains capable of generating those kind of insights, it will require inference to get. Very good. But whoa, that, that's crazy. Advancement. That's 20,000 years of advancement in, in an afternoon. Like, really? I, I mean that literally. So crazy.

[Drew]

I'm looking forward to it because I actually want to see the problems get solved now. Like, I like that AI can order me a pizza. I like that it can stay on hold for me. But now it's like, okay, if you can win the Fields Medal, if you can get the Nobel Peace Prize, I need six of you to get together in a room and teach us how we can get to Mars. I need six of you to get into a room and teach us how we can drive. Like, how can we have clean water in third world countries? Like, let's actually start turning the corner with the intelligence. So I'm excited for that part of it. If winning the medal means that they will then be able to solve those novel problems, they will be able to.

[Tom Bilyeu]

I want you to imagine this is the AI In Africa that's going to teach you how to do clean water. You get access to an iPad that whatever, like I'm not saying those are free, but you can get an outdated one that's pretty cheap. Access a model that's open source, which my boy Imod Mostak is working as furiously as he can to make sure that everybody, everywhere, all at once has access to AI. You go and say how do you build a well? Boom. It gives you the answers. And then you go, okay, 17 of those parts we don't have here. Please scour the web for the cheapest version of that and it will give it to you. Or connect me with the NGOs that'll donate the money. Whatever, whatever, whatever. And now you're able to be self sufficient. It teaches you how to do it. It helps you find the cheapest parts or recycle things. Like you give it a photo of like here's a broken down moped that we have. How do we turn this into clean water? It will actually be able to do that. Not today, but like you've got. If this is true and a few years from now, let's just go all the way to 10. 10 years from now you've got something capable of winning the Fields Medal, dude. Show it a picture of the 17 pieces of rusty metal that you have and it's going to tell you exactly what you need to do, what to look for for the highest likelihood of striking water. I mean it's just nuts.

[Drew]

And I know you're excited for this next announcement because then Elon also threw his hat into the game development ring. So where we're going to see that progress on, you know, solving physics problems, solving math problem. Seems like he also wants to scale Grok to solve help him develop video games, which is going to definitely help with the Kaizen project.

[Tom Bilyeu]

We hope so. I don't know what he's going to do, so I don't know if he's going to close sources with Grok. Anyway, he said every time we get a fully stable version, we'll open source the previous version. So once Grok is fully stable, Grok 3 is fully stable, then they'll release Groq 2. So he said he thinks that it'll be stable I think within six months. So six months from now Grok 2 becomes open source. I mean that's. If he does that on the gaming side, that would be absolutely mind blowing. Now again, I don't know exactly what their approach is going to be. Are they making really basic games so the example that they gave was a mixture of what's it, Bejeweled and Tetris. And that kind of stuff is a very simple form of gaming. So I don't know if that's what he's trying to do, like solve really simple problems or if he's going to get it to create a physics engine in inside of the game. Because if you get all your rendering handled and your physics engine, if you can create, rig, animate, drop into a physics engine, all with AI. Dude, anybody that's tried to develop a game understands it takes a whole lot of people a whole lot of time. And if you could just go, give me a physics engine that matches Fortnite with the aesthetics of Elden Ring, whatever. And now it's like, boom. You get the characters move just like they move in Fortnite. But you have the difficult sort of puzzle solving against the enemies. You have an Elden Ring or the scale of the world, like whatever you want to tell it. Oh my God, Drew, if it's doing it based on physics, that's the thing. Like anybody that. And I found this here at Impact Theory. People's base assumption is, oh, I try it for five minutes, it doesn't give me an output that I can just copy and paste. AI is broke. No, no, no, you've got to go in, you've got to work with it, you've got to understand its weaknesses, you have to know what it does well, what it does poorly, work around it. Know how you combine different AIs, know how you bring your own intelligence, your own taste to it, to really make it great. But over a weekend I went from like, dude, the AI is trash. It can't output anything usable visually to like hold the phone. Now I'm able to get this really close to things that it would take us, let's say a week to do. I'm in a single prompt that's nut. So if they're able to not only make that kind of physics engine, which I'll make as a stand in for all the different elements I just laid out, and they open source it, or like with Unreal Engine, the way that they charge is basically they only make money. If you're making money now, you're getting into something where you can generate incredible games very fast. Iterate on them to make them deeper and deeper and deeper. Let your own community through ugc, fractal those things so that they can do like a branching leaf off of that. It's. It's going to be an Incredible moment for micro communities because you'll be able to have a micro community that is as content rich as only the biggest games are now.

[Drew]

Yeah, it's interesting to see the future of gaming with AI, but they're already starting because we just seen this Massimo tweet that shows researchers placed a thousand AI agents inside a Minecraft server and they developed their own civilization with government, culture and economy. Run by California based startup Altera, the project that had AI agents collaborating to create virtual societies. This is like, this is the part that kind of gives me the heebie jeebies with AI. Is that like, is it duplicating what humans do, which is create government, culture, economy, or is that the best way that things have been done? So I'm trying to figure out, are they just kind of copying us with their own free will or is that like the super intelligent thing to do inside of this, like, platform?

[Tom Bilyeu]

Okay, here's how I know we're living in a simulation. When you start building a game, you realize you're just trying to replicate everything in the world, even if you want to make it alien. So the temperature of the planet is wildly different, and therefore the flora and the fauna are wildly different. Maybe you even come up with something different than DNA, but you have to have you. You suddenly realize that the world is, is how you have to build it. So. Meaning you keep wanting to push the intelligence deeper and deeper. I want to be surprised. I want to be surprised. And so you start going like, this is one thing we're doing in Project Kaizen, which is the video game we're building. You start saying, okay, I want. My whole thing is I played Fortnite and Minecraft, obsessed with both of those games. And I tried to make a biome inside of Fortnite, inside of Minecraft, where I took a mountain biome and made it a plains biome. Because different things happen in those places. And so I thought, oh, if I cut down all the trees and make it like a plains biome, it will trigger plains biome, like stuff happening. And I realized it doesn't work. They've obviously put somewhere deep in the code. Once you're a mountain biome, that's it. Forever, no matter what surface looks like, you are mountain biome. Period. End story. I was very disappointed by that because I wanted to terraform. I wanted to cause all this downstream chain things to happen just like we can in real life. So in real life, if you plant a bunch of trees, it's going to change the ecology around you. So greening of the deserts. We've seen people do this kind of thing playing in Fortnite. I beat it and I just get an umbrella. Very disappointing. I want the thing that I win to really matter. So, okay, cool. We're trying to bring those two things together. And so now you start saying, I want to push that intelligence down as far as I can. I want to be surprised. I want things to happen that I never would have predicted. And so you start going, okay, well, what if things mated, right? So the reason that humans use sex for mating instead of cloning, because we could have. There are organisms that clone, so why don't humans clone? Because you realize that as you drive this stuff deeper and deeper, deeper down, you end up with a gazillion microbes living in your gut. Now, you don't really think about it in your day to day life, but if you're programming this thing and you're trying to push the intelligence down as far as you can, you start saying, well, I want different things to happen if this creature eats this thing versus this thing. And I want different things to happen if they live in this region, they encounter these microbes and they eat this thing. And so then what? Different cultures will arise? Maximum. I want to be maximally surprised, right? And to, to get that kind of. I never would have imagined this. You've got to push that intelligence down as far as you can, all the way to. Like humans, you're essentially a bunch of cells competing antagonistically against each other. But you come together in this hole that you call Tom or Drew, and you have this common objective for a period of time and die, right? So as you start doing game development, you just constantly are going back to, well, what do we do, what do we do, what do we do? How far down can you push the intelligence to get these incredible, beautiful, surprising things like space travel? And you just go, oh my God, you're. You're literally, by thinking from first principles, you literally find yourself replicating this world. Now, not one for one, but you find yourself going, oh, these questions have already been answered. And the answer is the world that I see. And so when I look at something like this, they're not necessarily trying to build civilizations, but as you code the AI, you're saying to yourself, okay, well, how do I get the AI to do things that are functional and they don't just like walk into a wall forever? So then you start going, okay, well, I've got to give them incentives. They've got to want one thing over another. Okay, well, what they want, you start saying, well, if they don't cooperate, they'll just kill each other. So, okay, we've got to have some way of getting them to cooperate. And so now all of a sudden you're like, oh, my God, I'm reinventing organisms. It's fucking crazy. Now I get it. We have the frame of reference of a human. And so there's a lot of our assumptions that just come from what we already are. Yeah, but like, even think about. You want to build the universe. Okay, well, for. How do you get atoms to coalesce? You want them to replicate. Like, that's going to be more interesting. You want a high change environment, Right? So it's like, well, how do you get a high change environment in a way that yields something interesting? And so you start coding all these rules. And that's why when people look at the universe, they go, hold on a second. There are certain variables that are so precise that if those variables are changed even by a tiny, like.000000001%, like the whole universe part that's so precise. No way. This is somebody click clacking on a keyboard somewhere. Now, that's obviously not literally true, but it does make you wonder. So anyway, to answer the actual question you asked, when you're trying to push that intelligence lower, you end up realizing that we function like the very things that, when you're just trying to create something interesting emerges. So they're emergent properties.

[Drew]

Drew, I was going to push on the creator thing, please, because it's like you said, it seems like there's somebody behind everything, like just click Clatten. Or maybe there's somebody who put it all together in the beginning.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Yeah, like God.

[Drew]

Yes.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Yeah, yeah. Look, okay, I'm not religious. I don't believe in God. Now when I say that, what I mean is the. The vision that people have captured in religious texts.

[Drew]

Oh, yeah.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Is almost certainly not accurate.

[Drew]

Accurate.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Now, okay, let me give you one stat why I think that's true. Nowhere in the Bible does it say you're not living in a locally real universe. But that is true, and we can prove it. Meaning a very simplistic way of saying this, that it's going to make all the physicists roll in their graves, but is to say that you don't render the universe unless you're looking at it. So if you were the only person in the universe and you turn away from something, that thing is literally a probability cloud. Okay? Quantum physics. When you look at it, then now it has to collapse down into a single position. So it goes from superposition to like a known measure, measured position. That's not mentioned in the Bible.

[Drew]

It's in a different way. It's not called physics and it's not probability.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Class, the only thing I push back on. There's clearly something we. Why something instead of nothing? That's the ultimate question, right? We exist. We know there's something. Even if I'm a dream in somebody else's head, I know it exists. So I don't think we've captured it in the right way. And I don't want my imagination limited by the very useful thing that is religion. But set that aside. I want to remain open to what the real answer is. So I stand in. In awe of the universe, knowing there's something, some. We could call it a creator, whatever. I just don't think that humans know what that thing is.

[Drew]

Have you seen a Men in Black? I think they nailed it. At the end when. At the end when they say that our whole galaxy is just a marble in a very big light.

[Tom Bilyeu]

I think it was our whole universe, wasn't it? Yeah.

[Drew]

Yeah. Like. Like, it's crazy, bro. Well, it's not all sunshine and rainbows in AI World. This is a rendering from that imitate Studio Ghibli's iconic classical style. People hate it. The comments aren't. Aren't nice.

[Tom Bilyeu]

I mean, get naked, smear myself in butter, and just watch this over and over and over. Not everybody likes this, Drew, but I do. This is so incredible. Get the butter, Drew.

[Drew]

I didn't need that visual because we didn't need this. We didn't.

[Tom Bilyeu]

We all need.

[Drew]

We didn't eat the butter every.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Especially the butter. But this is amazing.

[Drew]

But this is going back to what we said off camera. Like, art is supposed to inspire other art. So can you own an art style? Like, is that supposed to be you, or is that the ultimate compliment that people want to duplicate it?

[Tom Bilyeu]

I get why people are furious. There is a guy named Mache Cusiera who we worked with back on Neon Future the comic book, and he did some art for Steve Aoki and I, who breathtaking. That dude is unbelievably talented. And I won't lie. Over the weekend, he sent me some stuff that he's doing with AI and I was a little sad that this was no longer him, like painstakingly making these incredible works of art. Now he'll be the first to tell you he's just stealing from 90s anime. He's just literally his style is 90s anime style. But like, there is something a little different about it. And I couldn't love his style anymore if I tried. I mean, just unbelievable. So I'm glad that he was able to learn from 90s anime artists and turn that into something new. There's no doubt 90s anime people would look at him and be like, bro, you're just like ripping us off. Which he would also admit, but he put enough on it that it's beautiful. And knowing that a human did it and all that, I. There is a part of me that still responds to that. So I get where people are coming from. Of like, you don't want to see somebody now be able to go, dear AI, make me that thing that looks exactly like Mache Kuziera. Just like people are saying, hey, I hate that AI is able to make something like Miyazaki would make it, which is the style that we were showing there from Studio Ghibli. And so I get it. The reason that I want to smear myself in butter because I am so turned on by this is that it unleashes a level of efficiency. So there is a four second shot from one of Miyazaki's films. I don't remember which one. That took an animator a year to do. And I. I understand the human impulse to be like, this is such a work of art that, that they would suffer and work that hard to create that thing. But the reality is, when I watch it, it goes by in four seconds and like, whatever. So I would much rather people be able to tell stories that get inside my soul and make me see the world differently. And so I want to unleash them to where it becomes about taste, it becomes about commentary, it becomes about doing the thing to me that I wanted to do, which is to manipulate my brain chemistry, give me an insight, make me feel something. That's what I want. And so I get. The sideshow of it all is like, oh, this was made by a human and it was really hard. And there is something there, there is value in that. But the vitriol of this, I think misses the point. And the same people that get mad seeing anime in particular being so faithfully recreated are the ones that are like, you got to pay animators more. There's no money. There's no money. There's no money to pay them more. Like, this is why all the animators specifically in anime, have to do everything in consortiums, because it's this niche, beautiful, incredibly painstaking, incredibly expensive art. Form and hang tight. Will be back in just a moment. Moment. When you manage procurement for multiple facilities, every order matters. But when it's for a hospital system, they matter even more. Grainger gets it and knows there's no time for managing multiple suppliers and no room for shipping delays. That's why Grainger offers millions of products in fast, dependable delivery, so you can keep your facility stocked, safe, and running smoothly. Call 1-800-GRAINGER click granger granger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done. All right, let's dive right back in. You. You can't have your cake and eat it, too. You can either grind the humans into the dirt, because it is so hard to do that. You just have to pay them, like, essentially less than minimum wage to work 36 hours a day. So we can all, like, consume the, like, candy. And I'm gonna bet some of the people squawking loudest watch this at, like, 1.5. Some of them even watch it at 2x. Because part of anime culture is to just take in every episode that you can. So it's like, listen, I think the far wiser way to look at it is this is going to unleash creativity. And now an artist who would have otherwise, like, toiled in obscurity for 20 years, not been able to make ends meet is now going to be able to tell these breathtaking stories. So I would love to see some way where when people's work is so clearly being aimed at, taped like this literally just looks like it's straight out of Miyazaki's DNA. Get financially rewarded for that in some way, or that this becomes open source. I don't know. We have to think about what the final answer is. But being mad that people are doing it is the wrong take. Aggressively.

[Drew]

Yeah, I just wish we could get into people's brain sometimes. But that's what MET is trying to do now.

[Tom Bilyeu]

This one's crazy.

[Drew]

They just published two papers showing that they can decode thoughts into text with 80% accuracy.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Drew, it's 2025. Will you read that sentence again, please?

[Drew]

80 accuracy is crazy to me. They can read 80 like, and it's not invasive. I. That. Like, I hid the. I hit the lead there with that. Like, it's not like they have to drill into your mind and, like, plant something. You're just wearing sensors and they could get it. 80. Like, that's better than series sometimes. Like, this is crazy, but Siri is

[Tom Bilyeu]

a just emotionally intellectually crippled child. Like, good Lord Siri needs an upgrade big time.

[Drew]

I know we got with everything that Elon's doing neuralink, but I feel like this could be a game changer. I'm thinking about, you know, kids that can't. Our kids who are like, late speech. I'm thinking about kids who might be on the spectrum, people who might be neuro, Neurologically divergent. This can essentially be a way to communicate with them. Straightforward. With like this can.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Can.

[Drew]

This can change lives. Like, this is kind of crazy.

[Tom Bilyeu]

This is crazy. Yeah, th. This one's gonna be big. So they're calling it thought to action. So you think a thing and then the. It's as if you typed on the keyboard or move the mouse or whatever. It's. This is going to be truly unbelievable. But it also gets dystopian really fast. So this is one of those ones where we're gonna have to have some kind of laws about how this can be used against you. You. So just like you have the right to plead the fifth and say, I'm not going to do anything that's self incriminating. You should have the right to refuse to let this be used on you. And because man.

[Drew]

Oh, like. Oh, like in like a confession type situation.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Put the thing on him. Show him images, say whatever, whatever, and see how they respond. That. That is. That gets dystopian and dark. Very, very, very fast past. So look, this stuff isn't all upside. We do have to be thoughtful. This is going to require some like, imagine somebody hacking into that. Like, woof. I do not need somebody hacking into a stream of my thinking. Not a fan. But being able to have something like this that allows. I mean it could allow things like if you can do it on humans, you can do it on pets. Like, imagine being able to effectively communicate with your pet. Like, this is nuts. Like the dog, they're looking at you, their tails vibrating like crazy. And the AI is like, oh, they want the ball, they want the food. They, you know, whatever, whatever. Oh my God.

[Drew]

But okay, so like I know when I think I say it in my head and then I kind of. There's that like process. Do you think dogs are talking in their head?

[Tom Bilyeu]

No, definitely not.

[Drew]

So you think it's just like silence?

[Tom Bilyeu]

I have.

[Drew]

You said read the dog's mind.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Have you ever gotten into a flow state?

[Drew]

Like when you're just like locked in?

[Tom Bilyeu]

Yeah, you're just doing the thing. You're not thinking. Bruce has a quote. I kick to the point where I don't think kick. I just Kick. So I think that's where animals are.

[Drew]

They're.

[Tom Bilyeu]

They're having a. As far as I can tell, they're having a very rich, emotional life. They are. In fact, my daughter was. She was hurt last night, like emotionally hurt, and she did a naughty thing. And so she got locked up. And when I let her out, she was just sad and she made me come pick her up, up and then took her into the bedroom to see her mommy. And then it was like slowly she warmed up and wanted kisses. And I'm like, this dog is having an emotional experience. So it's not like they're thinking in English, although they may know words like, I know that treats. My dogs know that word. So they possibly are thinking something like that. But it's more just imagery, emotion, feeling. But, but to a scanner, it's just pattern. So it's not like the scanner sees words. The pattern just. Or the scanner just sees a pattern that it knows. Oh, every time you think that, you then type this. Cool. I now know that pattern represents the word whatever. Whatever. When they're playing a video game. The neural link, guys, I know when you think this way, you want to move left or you want to move right. Whatever, Whatever. So it would be like that. Anyway, I didn't mean to make this about telepathy with dogs, but just there are incredible applications, are also very dark, sinister applications that we will need to protect ourselves from.

[Drew]

All right, and this one you kind of threw on my radar. In world affairs and politics news, Trump tweeted yesterday or a couple of days ago, he who saves his country does not violate any law.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Yikes.

[Drew]

Yeah, it's this, like, saves makes it weird for me, bro.

[Tom Bilyeu]

I'm going to need some definitions.

[Drew]

Yeah.

[Tom Bilyeu]

I'm going to need some context because let me tell you, I am the biggest. Trump is not Hitler. Trump is not Hitler. I cannot say that emphatically enough. Trump is not Hitler. But this is the kind of logic that gets people in trouble because Hitler would have said, well, I saved my country. Well, what the problem is everybody, you just stuff a few million people into. Into concentration camps, you gas a few. We're good, right? The outcome, bro. So you gotta be real careful with that. So, look, I love a lot of things about Donald Trump. I am very excited about what he's doing to the government and at the same time, I trust him as far as I can throw him. And not even that he's lying, though I'm sure every politician ever has lied non stop. It's that this is flawed Thinking and you have to be psychotically careful. This is why I say people need to distrust themselves. And Trump is just a guy who does not distrust himself. So I have enough distrust for the both of us, Donald. So this is where I want people to understand. I'm not on a team team like somebody put in the comment section yesterday. Tom, you're rapidly losing your, say, leftist, your left credentials, something like that. You can have it. So I'm not trying to be on a team. I'm trying to say that it is, it is figureoutable whether given action leads to positive outcome or not. We've seen people run this experiment before for where it's like only the outcome matters. Nope, bad. First of all, who the gets to do the read on the outcome? So anyway, that level of thinking is problematic. I don't think it's unique to him in any way, shape or form. But that's the kind of that we have to be on the lookout for. 234 million views. Holy. People felt some kind of way about this. Damn. So yeah, yeah, this is the one that you look out for, Drew. That is the one that you watch out for. This is why we want checks and balances in our government. Yay. If this is the, the like downside, everything's trade offs. So we get a guy like Trump not afraid to go in, break things move fast, like finally fight for the average American worker, love him for it. And if the downside is there's also parts of his thinking that are insane and could cause cause real problems, that's where we go. That's why the founders of this country were like, hey, we have to protect against this kind of. So I don't think he's evil, but I do think that that is a dysfunctional way to think.

[Drew]

I'm just glad that he has the right to think it and that we embrace free speech facts where in other countries, not so much. Germany just had a 60 Minutes special last week that just aired that literally is following them, arresting people for memes. They post tweets, they post online activity. It, I, I can't make sense of it because it's one thing. Again, we talked about this last week with the Kanye Twitter rant where it's like, okay, it's one thing to go calls for violence. Like I, I tweeted they're going to assassinate Elon Musk because of after the Pentagon AI might have read that like I'm trying to assassinate Elon Musk. I got blocked. Cool. I'll be in Twitter jail. I'll take that. L. But. But the things that they're cracking down on, like memes and they're like, jo, like, it seems as if it's. It's one thing to say the Nazi should come back, let's go burn a village down. It's nothing to just re. Share like a picture. Like, is it. There has to be a line here, right? Like, this can't be normal. This is weird.

[Tom Bilyeu]

This is so far from the line. This is crazy. This. This isn't sliding towards totalitarianism. This is totalitarianism. It's. Look, it's degrees of. It's not like they run the whole country in this sort of ham fisted way. But this is terrible. This isn't bad thinking. This is bad policy. This is aggressively bad policy. And there somebody said we don't have the clip, but somebody said, the Holocaust is because of free speech. Bitch, please. That is the craziest shit ever. That is a moronic thing to say. What happens is it goes like this. You have free speech, and in the world of free speech, you start putting forward hateful rhetoric or you start saying, hey, we should crack down on people that are posting memes that we think are mean or hurtful or whatever. And so then people go, oh, I really like that idea. Yes, we should take free speech away from people. And then you institute a totalitarian government to make sure that people don't have free speech. But let's be clear. It was not the free speech that forced people to show up at your door, raid your house, and put you in jail for what you said. It was the fact that they use free speech to then get in a position where they could take it away from you. So this is the messy reality of being a human. There are always, in a human society, there are always going to be problems like this. And this is why at Impact Theory, we have something that we call principles. This is a Ray Dalio concept where you give everybody dots, you say whatever you think is true, so the entire company can criticize me and say I'm doing a bad job as a CEO. That's perfectly fine. Nobody's going to get fired for that. I. I need people that help me remove my blind spots. And I say, you can say anything you want, you can campaign for anything you want. The only thing that you can't do is actually eliminate principles. So no matter how much you hate it, principles is going to stay. So it's foundational, it's bedrock. It's not going anywhere. Even if all of you vote and Say we hate this. It's got to go. Nope, it's the one hard and fast, so. Because it is the thing from which all of the other good things spring. So this is why freedom of speech matters so much, is so foundational. Now, I'm perfectly happy with the limitations that we have. No incitement for violence, terror recruitment, blah, blah, blah. Fine. However, this is getting stupid. In the UK is doing this shit. Germany is doing this. This is nuts. And this is exactly how you get people to shut up and not say what they think is true. And if you want to know where that goes, watch the HBO docu series Chernobyl. Oh, my goodness.

[Drew]

Such a good show.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Unbelievable.

[Drew]

Such a good show.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Unbelievable. And that's what happens when you force everybody to lie.

[Drew]

Talk about a pump and dump. He retweeted the Libra coin. It went up, then he sold off.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Yeah.

[Drew]

Left a bunch of bag holders. You talked about the dangers of Meme Coins already. Is he in the wrong for this? Do you think that, like, you live

[Tom Bilyeu]

by the Meme coin, you die by the meme coin? Meme Coins. I think Meme Coins should be legal. I think everybody should be able to do what they want with Meme Coins. But if you with Meme Coins, this is their nature. Meme Coins is gambling. Meme Coins is gambling on culture. I believe you should absolutely be able to gamble on culture. I think you should be able to gamble on anything you want. And does that mean that the. That people who are either extremely emotionally reactive, meaning they get very excited and they can't stop themselves from taking in action, or they don't have the cognitive horsepower and therefore are going to get themselves in trouble. Is that going to happen? Yes, it is. Do I think that Meme Coin should have some regulation around it? Yeah. Light touch. But I. I think it is pretty disgusting that the way it works when you have money printing is you must buy assets in order to get ahead. They've created a. I'm glad, I'm glad. This is what I'm about to say is a good thing. A whole bunch of very smart people over the last, whatever 100 plus years have created the capitalist system of like the stock markets and things like that as a function of raising capital. So basically saying, I know people are going to gamble. Let me gam. Let. Let me let them gamble so that companies can acquire that capital and do incredible things with it. It's beautiful. It has pulled people out of poverty. It is just gorgeous in the extreme. But when people start acting like they have no responsibility in that system. That's where we have the problem. So we both have. They're forcing you into the system by inflating your money away. They won't acknowledge it as gambling, which is why I beat this drum to the point where my community gets mad that I refer to it as gambling case and fucking point with meme coins. Now, should a president lose sight of the fact that they are the president and their words carry extra weight? I think that they should have an internal locus of. They should have an internal value set that says, yeah, I probably shouldn't do that. If I were him, I'd be like, bro, don't do it. Just like Trump should not have done. Should not, not. Not from a. I don't think it should be illegal. Fine, do it. But ack. It's just. It's not a good look. It's not a good look. Like I was gonna wear a white glove today and I knew people would have a stroke. I think it looks cool and I am going to do it at some point, if for no other reason than troll people. But there's a difference between something that's just bad taste versus something that should be illegal. So there should probably be disclosures of some kind so people know what it is who owns what. Blah, blah, blah, blah. But guys, meme coins is quite literally a thing you do to catch the pump and get out before the dump. That. That is the game of meme coins. That's what they are. They are. They are tied to nothing. It's just a very not true. They are tied to cultural energy. And you're saying I have a better read on this cultural energy than the next person. I'm a big influencer and I can get people to be really excited about this thing, and I get them excited, and then I'm going to either slowly or quickly get out. And so what I don't understand is how people keep acting like that's not the game. So anyway, I had my early experience with all this where I thought that NFTs, which aren't meme coins, but that that kind of thing was going to attract collectors. And I just learned, oh, cool. It doesn't attract collectors, it attracts gamblers. Now I know. And the world just has to wake up. This is a reality. So I think it's a bad look for me. Like, it's at least at my distance. I don't follow them super closely. It's the first thing that I was like, ack, yeah, I hate everything about that. But again, don't think it should be illegal. I think he's right in that you want to. With meme coins. Good luck. You're probably going to lose your money like 95 of people. I think this is a. If this isn't literally true, this is so close that we'll just call it directionally accurate. 95% of people lose their money. 5% make. Make their money.

[Drew]

Yeah. All my meme coins are red, so I might be in that 95%.

[Tom Bilyeu]

You're. You're trying. You have to pay so deep attention to culture. You've got to be in all the private groups about what people are talking about, what they see moving, so that you can move fast. It's the game. I don't like it. I'm not going to play it, but whatever. I think people should be able to, but I also think they should own their L's.

[Drew]

Speaking of owning L's, let's just watch this list this. Oh, God, no context. No context.

[Tom Bilyeu]

So brutal.

[Drew]

Let's just watch it. I didn't hear the background noise at first. Yeah.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Wow. Okay. All right.

[Drew]

Okay. Right.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Everything about this makes me sad. It makes me sad. Okay, let's walk through why this makes me sad. Okay. Cheating on your spouse, I think is horrible. What makes love the wonderful thing that it is. Marriage, committed relationship. What makes it wonderful is that life is hard and you're now going to. To have a partner in all the ways that that word carries weight. You can have a partner that is going to help you. You're going to help them. You've got somebody for whom, at least until you have kids, you're their number one. And it's one of the primary mechanisms by which we bring kids into this world. One of the greatest gifts that you can give to humanity when you betray that trust by the ultimate betrayal for both men and women, for different reasons, is for women, it's. It's more hardcore if it's emotional. But to have an affair for men, it's more painful if it's sexual. But having that affair is. It takes the foundation upon which all of that, like, joint living and the sacrifices that you make for each other and all the compromises you have to do, do. And it recontextualizes it and it says, oh, wow, all those times that I really thought this person was giving me a look that said, I'm special to them. I'm their number one. It wasn't real. Like, it was a performance. And once you make a performance of your own narrative of what your life was, that that is a deep pit. So I hate that. I also hate. State that she just wants to punish him. So she is in a moment of vitriol, vengeance, and read man's search for meaning. There's. There's an incredible moment in that book where Auschwitz gets liberated and they're walking out of the camp. And the guy that wrote the book said he was talking to one of his fellow prisoners who said, by the end of tonight, I will have the blood of German soldiers on my hands, meaning I'm going to go murder somebody today. I'm not waiting a week or a month today. And he was like, that's the wrong response. The guy that wrote the book, yeah. And he's like, if. If you give into that, if you let your hate define you and you go seek vengeance, that's what you're telling yourself is the most important. If, on the other hand, you instead go look for those who you love and you immediately begin to reconnect to love again, to seek the beauty, you've got a shot of getting on the other side of this.

[Drew]

Yeah.

[Tom Bilyeu]

And so I get her devastation, and I get the impulse for vengeance. I have the impulse for vengeance. This is where I say, don't trust yourself. So I hate that about it. I also hate that they're trying to stay together. And so. So he's allowing himself. He. He made this mistake, but he's allowing himself to be torn down and humiliated by the person that he's living this life with for reasons I understand, but he's allowing himself to be diminished as an act of penance, to be punished. But it won't work. Because what she's leaning into is the vengeance, the hatred, the anger. And the only way a couple's ever going to get to the other side of this is if you can forgive and, like, actually let it go. Now, I'll be honest. This is just me. I think you break something that can't be unbroken when fidelity is involved. And I don't understand why somebody would want to try to move forward in that context. I would just say devastating. But the thing that makes the relationship worth all the sacrifices is forever gone. Now, if people have done it and gotten on the other side, great, they're just not. They don't have the same frame of reference I have. So I love it. And if people have been able to do it and their lives are amazing, I'm totally here for it. I certainly don't have any moral judgment, but when I look at these two, I'm just like, this is going to be. Be horrendous for the next God knows how many years. This is not going to be a loving marriage. This is going to be her essentially testing how much pain and humiliation will he tolerate. And she will someday realize it will never quench what she feels.

[Drew]

It's never going to help.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Yeah. Because what she wants is somebody that loves her and will sacrifice for her and be there for her and all of that. And it's just. She's never going to get that by punching, punishing him. So anyway, I just hate, hate, hate everything about that.

[Drew]

Yeah, I feel like this entire video could be summed up as, like, an emotional decision. Like, yes, you got your licks off. Yes, he's walking around embarrassed. Yes, you're yelling at everybody. But you look messy. Like we would call this in the culture. Like, you look like a goofy. Because now you're airing dirty laundry in front of other people. And you think you're making him look bad. Dad, but you're pushing his baby. You're getting in the same car, you're driving home. So you did all that just to embarrass your man? He did all that just like, so you're burning down your house. So to your point, it's like, what you actually want, this is not going to give to you. And from his perspective, maybe he, you know, is trying to stay for the kids. Maybe he's trying to do it. Like, maybe he thinks of pentance. There's some noble thing on the other side of that fence. But as somebody who has, like, walked away from a relationship and like, we had to figure out the kid situation and all that, that. That's not going to be satisfactory because now he's just going to be a shell of himself for the rest of his life. And he's going to be that guy that comes home, sits on the couch, watches tv and emotionally checks out. And, yeah, I don't. Yeah, I don't see the happy, sunshine, healthy relationship result from this. It just. It doesn't make sense to me.

[Tom Bilyeu]

No way. Hard pass, man.

[Drew]

Well, shout out to him, good luck. Hope they figure it out.

[Tom Bilyeu]

No doubt.

[Drew]

That's all I got.

[Tom Bilyeu]

All right. Do we cover everything in the intro, though? That would be my only thing. I want to make sure. I know precious little time, but if we miss something from the Elon baby

[Drew]

mama, that's the only thing missing.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Okay, there it is. So really fast on the Elon baby mama. Okay. Oh, man.

[Drew]

Never thought I'll have you say those words on the show in that order.

[Tom Bilyeu]

I I love that people have kids. I think it's amazing. I don't think there's anything to celebrate in somebody having as many children with as many different people seemingly as possible. Yeah, that doesn't land for me. But I'm not a baby out with the bathwater guy, so I may take what works. Discard the rest. I will not be taking relationship advice from Elon, however, as an entrepreneur, as a government auditor, he's got my vote. But as a father, as a partner, maybe not so much. Maybe not so much. So there it is. Teach your own. Do what you're gonna do. Actions have consequences. Thems are all the the truths.

[Drew]

And then somebody said the fact that the announcement came over Valentine's Day weekend means that Elon was somewhere else and she just decided to just torch it.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Yeah.

[Drew]

Be petty.

[Tom Bilyeu]

Wow.

[Drew]

You know, boys and girls, look at that. Billionaires just like us. All right? We all have that one crazy ex girlfriend, you know, just like he's just

[Tom Bilyeu]

got eight of them. So, you know, it's all right collecting them at this point. Okay, everybody, speaking of things you should be collecting, if you haven't already subscribed, make sure you do that. Make sure you're joining us live for episode prep at 8:00am Pacific Time, Tuesday, Thursday, and Friday. We spend about four hours engaging with you guys prepping for the episodes. So if there's stuff you want to see us cover, that is how you're going to be a part of it. And until next time, my friends, be legendary. Take care. Peace, Sa.