Another Day in Canadian

Summary

Tom Brown's Body: Episode 9 - "Another Day in Canadian"

In this gripping episode of Tom Brown's Body, hosted by Skip Hollandsworth from Texas Monthly, the mystery surrounding the disappearance and subsequent death of Tom Brown takes a dramatic turn. The episode delves into a town hall meeting orchestrated by private investigator Philip Klein, unveiling explosive new theories that have sent shockwaves through the small town of Canadian, Texas.

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1. Introduction and Recap

Skip Hollandsworth opens the episode by providing a succinct recap of the baffling case of Tom Brown, a high school senior who vanished on the night before Thanksgiving in 2016. Tom's disappearance sparked rampant speculation ranging from voluntary departure to grim possibilities of foul play involving local law enforcement and acquaintances.

[00:39] Skip Hollandsworth: "It's late October 2021, and 200 people are packed into a meeting hall in the small town of Canadian, Texas to hear the latest news regarding Tom Brown, who mysteriously disappeared nearly five years earlier."

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2. The Town Hall Meeting

a. Philip Klein's Presentation

Philip Klein, a prominent private investigator hired by Tom’s mother, Penny, convenes a town hall meeting with the promise of unveiling new information about Tom's case. Skepticism fills the air as attendees recall past false leads and controversial statements from Klein.

[07:03] Philip Klein: "We're gonna tell you about the manner of death. It's impossible, but we're gonna show you the manner of death tonight... And it's not theory, folks. Oh, that's theory. Oh, no, it's fact."

b. Introduction of Tom's Family

Klein introduces Tom's immediate family—his mother Penny, stepfather Chris Meek, and brother Tucker Brown—emphasizing their innocence and victimhood in the ordeal.

[06:05] Philip Klein: "Penny, would you please stand up? This is Penny Meek... Chris is the stepfather... Third is my friend Tucker Brown, that's Tom's brother."

c. New Evidence Presented

Contrary to expectations, Klein shifts focus from the previously speculated parking lot incident to a startling account from a new witness, Chris Jones—a former teammate convicted of armed robbery.

[07:07] Philip Klein: "I want you to hear what this boy says and then compare it to what I just told you, which is fact."

Jones recounts an alleged encounter where Sheriff Nathan Lewis threatens him, linking the sheriff and Deputy Pine Gregory to a local gambling ring exerting control over the football team’s performance. He claims to have witnessed Tom tied to a chair with Deputy Gregory holding a gun.

[09:44] Chris Jones: "I take off the goggles and it hits his mic and there's Tom sitting in front of us... but you'll see that there's Tom sitting in front of."

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3. Audience Reaction

Klein's revelations are met with outrage and disbelief. The audience's frustration boils over as mistrust towards local authorities deepens.

[12:23] Audience Member: "You need to get out of Canadian."

Despite the backlash, Klein remains steadfast, asserting the validity of his findings and the integrity of his investigation team.

[12:26] Philip Klein: "I'm here to figure out how an 18-year-old died... We are the only people that have found anything."

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4. Aftermath: State Attorney General's Interview with Rachel Kading

In response to the escalating tensions, Rachel Kading, the lead investigator from the Texas Attorney General's office, grants an exclusive interview to Skip Hollandsworth.

a. Kading’s Response to New Theories

Kading firmly dismisses Klein's claims, labeling Chris Jones as an unreliable witness with a history of inconsistent testimonies.

[16:14] Rachel Kading: "Chris Jones has told multiple stories over the years. He is a very unreliable witness."

She also refutes the notion of any evidence supporting the parking lot shooting theory.

[16:19] Rachel Kading: "There is no evidence that he [Tom] went to the football parking lot."

b. Polygraph Results on the Family

Kading reveals that lie detector tests indicated deception from Penny and her husband regarding Tom's phone's whereabouts, raising further suspicions about their involvement.

[20:50] Rachel Kading: "In one of the batteries of questions, it was about the possibility that Tom was deceased... the question was, do you know the current location of his body?"

Both Penny and Chris were deceptive in their responses, contradicting their statements of ignorance about the phone's existence post-disappearance.

c. Discussion on the Grand Jury

Kading discusses the internal deliberations about convening an investigational grand jury, which ultimately stalled due to ethical concerns over potential unfounded indictments.

[24:05] Rachel Kading: "If you do not feel that the indictment is going to lead to a conviction at trial, you are really shorting the case."

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5. Family's Perspective

The Brown-Meek family expresses immense frustration and despair over the ongoing investigation and public scrutiny. Tucker Brown reflects on the deep-rooted ties to Canadian, emphasizing the impossibility of abandoning their hometown despite the turmoil.

[28:10] Tucker Brown: "This has been our home for four generations... It's kind of hard to pick up and leave that."

Penny remains resolute in seeking justice and closure, highlighting the family's enduring hope for answers.

[28:38] Philip Klein: "I'm just going to keep teaching school and doing whatever I can to bring answers for Thomas."

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6. Ongoing Investigation and Community Divisions

The episode underscores the persistent divisions within Canadian, with the community split between believing in a murder, suicide, or accidental death scenario. The town grapples with lingering mistrust towards law enforcement and the unresolved nature of Tom's case.

[29:02] Tucker Brown: "Every day I think we may not know anything. Ever."

Sergeant Rachel Kading maintains hope for new evidence or witness revelations, affirming the Attorney General's office remains open to resolving the case.

[29:46] Rachel Kading: "The door is always open at our office for any information... We hope for that every day."

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7. Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Skip Hollingsworth concludes the episode by painting a vivid picture of Canadian's landmarks, emblematic of the town's haunting uncertainty and the enduring quest for truth.

[31:55] Skip Hollandsworth: "I stared at one of the signs... there is a killer among us. Please pray that Tom's killer is found and brought to justice."

The episode wraps up with a somber reminder of the unresolved nature of Tom Brown's death, leaving listeners contemplating the pervasive mystery and the profound impact on the Canadian community.

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Notable Quotes:

• Philip Klein [05:15]: "Let me tell you this. I want all of you to think, what if it was your child? Would you want someone like me investigating it?"

• Chris Jones [09:44]: "We made him a sting inside his car."

• Rachel Kading [16:40]: "I don't think we can go there. We have theories."

• Tucker Brown [28:10]: "This has been our home for four generations... It's kind of hard to pick up and leave that."

• Rachel Kading [29:46]: "We hope for that every day."

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Tom Brown's Body continues to unravel the intricate layers of a case that has left a community divided and yearning for closure. Episode 9, "Another Day in Canadian," serves as a pivotal moment in the narrative, highlighting the tension between emerging theories and official investigations, and the unyielding pursuit of truth amidst pervasive doubt.

Transcript

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Texas has a lot of ground to cover, and at Texas Monthly, we do just that. If there's a story to be told in Texas, and there always is, you'll read about it in Texas Monthly. 50 years of stories for all y'.

All.

[Philip Klein]

Texas Monthly.

I think we're fixing to get the signal. We're good. Getting the signal. Okay, stand by. Just a minute. Everybody good? Everybody shaking? Good. Okay, ready?

[Skip Hollingsworth]

It's late October 2021, and 200 people are packed into a meeting hall in the small town of Canadian, Texas to hear the latest news regarding Tom Brown, who mysteriously disappeared nearly five years earlier.

[Philip Klein]

All right. Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. My name is Philip Klein. I'm the senior investig from a company called Klein Investigations and Consulting and Texas Professional Bodyguards, LLC out of Nederland, Texas.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

You'll recall that Klein is the outspoken private investigator who works for Tom's mother, Penny. And the buzz around the room is that Klein has organized this town hall meeting to deliver new bombshell information about what really happened to Tom.

[Philip Klein]

And it's very important that you guys listen to what I say tonight. I think they were panicked as they knew we were going to release some information that's never been released about the Tom Brown case today, including a possible manner of death. We have kept that very silent, and we're going to kind of go through it tonight.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Of course, this is not the first time Cline has made such promises. There have been plenty of bombshell revelations in this complicated and tragic story. I'm Skip Hollingsworth from Texas Monthly, and this is Tom Brown's body. Episode 9 Another Day in Canadian. If you've forgotten some of the details of this story, let me give you a brief recap. On the night before Thanksgiving 2016, Tom went cruising around town with his friends. Just before midnight, he said goodbye. He drove away in his Dodge Durango, apparently headed home. The next morning, his Durango was found on the outskirts of town, next to the water treatment plant. But despite numerous searches, there was no sign of Tom. Tom's disappearance became the mystery of the Texas Panhandle. Rumors flew that he had run away or that he had been kidnapped and sold to a sex trafficking ring. It was said he had been murdered, stuffed into a wood chipper by a notorious methamphetamine dealer, or he had been murdered by one of the friends who had gone cruising with him. There were dark, ugly stories that the county's young sheriff, Nathan Lewis, was involved in Tom's disappearance, or even that members of Tom's family knew far more about what had Happened than they were letting on. But none of the physical evidence seemed to make any sense. In February 2017, three months after Tom had vanished, his backpack was found sitting upright off lake Marvin road a few miles north of town. Eight months later, in October 2017, his iPhone was found during a search of lake Marvin road that had been organized by Philip Klein. Incredibly, the phone was in perfect condition. It showed no signs of damage from rain or ice storms, which meant it had to have been planted shortly before the search began in early 2018, the state's attorney general's office in Austin took over the investigation. Almost a year later, Tom's skull and a few of his bones were found at the end of Lake Marvin road. But because so little was left of his remains, an autopsy could not determine the cause of death. The investigation seemed to be stalled for good. Then, in the late summer of 2020, just as we were wrapping the podcast, there were rumors that the attorney general investigators wanted the local district attorney to call a grand jury. Yet those rumors went nowhere in the months that followed. Every time I called my sources, I was told that the grand jury had been delayed. I began to wonder if anyone would ever learn the truth about what had happened to Tom. In the meantime, Philip Klein let everyone know he was still pursuing leads. At one point, he said he had received information that Tom had been accidentally shot by another teenager in the parking lot of the high school football stadium and that the teenager's father, as well as sheriff Lewis, had helped hide Tom's body to avoid a scandal. This past fall, word spread through Canadian that Klein would be calling a town hall meeting. Just about everyone assumed he would announce the names of the teenager and the father who were involved in the parking lot shooting. Indeed, as the meeting began, Klein teased that he was ready to reveal everything.

[Philip Klein]

And we're gonna tell you about the manner of death. It's impossible, but we're gonna show you the manner of death tonight that we. And it's not theory, folks. It's fact, okay? All this damn conjecture I get all the time. Oh, that's theory. Oh, no, it's fact.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Fact. At the meeting, Tom's family sat in the front row. Before going any further, Cline made a point of introducing them.

[Philip Klein]

Penny, would you please stand up? This is Penny Meek. For those of you that do not know Penny, Penny is the mother of Thomas Brown. Chris Meek. Chris. Chris is the stepfather and, you know, probably one of the nicest men I think I've ever met in my life that has been so cordial. Third is my friend Tucker Brown, that's Tom's brother. I've asked them to come sit up here tonight because I want you all to look into the white of their eyes.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Klein knew that there were plenty of people in the audience who were suspicious of Penny, who was a longtime elementary school teacher and Canadian. But as Klein told the crowd all he had done to find out what had happened to Tom, he insisted over and over that he had found nothing, not a single piece of evidence implicating Penny, Chris, or Tucker.

[Philip Klein]

Where I want the public to see that these people had nothing to do with the disappearance of Tom. I want you to see these folks not as people of that are what we call in the business antagonists. They are anything but that. These people are true victims.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Finally, he came to the part of his presentation about new evidence. I noticed people inching forward in their seats.

[Philip Klein]

Here you go, folks.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Fact.

[Philip Klein]

Not Phillip Klein. Fact.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

To absolutely everyone's surprise, Klein didn't say a word about the theory of the parking lot killing. He declared that he and his team of investigators had been talking to another witness who had a whole new story to tell about Tom's death.

[Philip Klein]

I want you to hear what this boy says and then compare it to what I just told you, which is fact.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

The witness's name was Chris Jones. You might remember him from an earlier episode of the podcast. In the fall of 2016, Tom was still playing football for the Canadian High Wildcats. Chris was one of his teammates. He was a talented running back who had just moved to Canadian from a nearby town. But Chris was also a troubled kid. He got into fights and was eventually kicked out of high school after that 2016 season. A couple years later, he was convicted of armed robbery and sentenced to 30 years in prison.

[Rachel Kading]

Hold on real quick.

[Philip Klein]

So Nathan's the one that asked you to come and play there?

[Chris Jones]

He's the one who told me. He's the one who told me that I have to go play football for Canadian.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Okay.

[Philip Klein]

All right.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Klein said that one of his top investigators, Caroline Gere, who also happened to be Klein's daughter, began talking to Chris after he was sent to prison. Chris told her that Sheriff Lewis had come to see him before the 2016 football season began. According to Chris, Lewis told him that he wanted him to transfer to Canadian and play football for the Wildcats. Lewis also said the consequences would be dire if he didn't transfer. Here's Chris talking long distance to Caroline Geer on a prison telephone. This call is hard to hear, but. But you'll get the gist.

[Chris Jones]

I'm not Going to go to school in Canadian, you know, I lived there, but I refused to go to school. That's why I came to school in need. And it was like, well, if you don't do that, he's going to kill me.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

What Chris is saying is that Lewis had told the teenager he'd be killed if he didn't move to town and play for the Canadian Wildcats. Chris went on to tell Gere that Sheriff Lewis was working for a local gambling ring that wanted Chris to play well in certain games and deliberately throw other games so they could collect big on their bets. Chris had just joined the team, and he said that after the Wildcats lost a game that the Gamblers expected them to win, Lewis picked him up and took him to the walking bridge, a local landmark.

[Chris Jones]

Nobody continued. You can't hear nothing. And he threw the gun on me and he was like, I'm going to kill you. And when he caught the gun back, I just dropped down.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Chris said that Sheriff Lewis let him go, but he made it clear that Chris would be shot the next time. He didn't follow orders. Chris then claimed that in the early evening hours of Thanksgiving day, less than 24 hours after Tom had disappeared, Lewis came to see him again. That weekend, the Wildcats were in the state football playoffs, and Chris said that Lewis told him the Gamblers were banking on a Wildcat victory.

[Chris Jones]

He's like, I need to show you something. I need to show you something that's going to encourage you to play better, to win the state championship. I'm like, what you got to show me? He's like, well, you got.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Chris said Lewis wanted to show him something that would encourage him to play better.

[Chris Jones]

He pushed me back in the car park and he was right here peeling his goggles and I put him on.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

He said Lewis put him in the back of a police car and handed him a pair of goggles.

[Chris Jones]

We're going, like, towards the key yard, and about 30 minutes later, you know, he pulls up and he hits dark and he was like, are you ready? I'm like, man, like, what's going on? And I take off the goblet, so I take off the gobblers and it hits his mic and there's Tom sitting in front of us. But there's that There's Tom sitting in front of.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Chris went on to say that in the light he could see Tom still alive, sitting in front of them in a chair. Chris said that next to Tom, he saw Pine Gregory, the sheriff's deputy, with a hat on his head and a gun in his hand.

[Philip Klein]

And then he took the goblins off.

[Rachel Kading]

Are you telling me that Thomas was.

[Philip Klein]

Sitting at his friend?

[Chris Jones]

Yeah. Well, when he took the golgle off, we made him a sting inside his car.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Chris said he never saw Tom again. So had Sheriff Lewis and Deputy Pine. Gregory murdered Tom to please a local gambling ring. At the town hall meeting in October, that's exactly what Klein speculated.

[Philip Klein]

Chris Jones is an integral part in the Tom Brown case. He's been interviewed how many times?

[Rachel Kading]

Five. By me.

[Philip Klein]

Five times. And his story hasn't changed?

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Once.

[Philip Klein]

And his point is? You know what? I got nothing to lose. I'm gonna tell the truth. That's what he's told that lady right there.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Many in the audience were stunned and angered that Cline expected them to believe such an incredible story. Tom hadn't been on the football team for more than a month at that point, and he wasn't even close to Chris in any way. But kidnapping Tom was supposed to inspire Chris to play harder and win a playoff football game. Furious with Klein, some members of the audience let loose. You need to get out of Canadian.

[Rachel Kading]

Stop throwing splatter at a board or at a wall.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Okay?

[Philip Klein]

Okay.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

But Klein was not backing down.

[Philip Klein]

I see it. I hear it. I hear your pain. I hear your anger. I'm sorry I have to show you corruption in your city. I'm sorry if you're angry with me. If you're angry with my crew, I'm sorry. But we're not here, like I said earlier, to make you feel good. We're here to figure out how an 18 year old died. And let me tell y' all something. Let me tell you this. I want all of you to think, what if it was your child? Would you want someone like me investigating it? We're the only people that have found anything. Why? Because we get out on the street and we're busting our ass. We don't sit in an office. We don't get down to the poke and run and have coffee. We get out there with our water bottles and we get our butts out there in the streets and we find out what's going on.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

There's a lot of ground to cover in Texas. And at Texas Monthly, we've been doing just that for 50. The advocated and the hotly debated. All that smoked, brewed, shaken or put into a taco. The heroes, trailblazers and bum steers. Whether we're digging into our past or chronicling the present. If there's a story to be told in Texas, and there always is, you'll read about it in Texas Monthly. 50 years of stories for all y'.

All. The day after the meeting, everyone of course, was talking about Klein's latest story.

[Chris Samples]

Welcome into the program. It is Thursday, October 21st. Well, last night, Coach Klein investigations. Philip Klein, the private investigator hired by.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Panhandle radio host Chris Samples, spent his entire three hour morning show lambasting the private investigator.

[Chris Samples]

Try to get your brain around this one. This one is the latest shared by Philip Klein and his team of investigators. Last night, Sheriff Lewis and Deputy Pine Gregory pick Chris Jones, who's now in prison, up and they take him blindfolded on a 30 minute drive. When they get out to wherever they were, they removed the blindfold and Jones testifies that he sees out in front of the car the day after Tom Brown went missing. Tom Brown tied to a chair in front of the cop car and former Deputy Pine Gregory has a gun to Tom Brown's head. Is that not the most bizarre thing?

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Officials from the state Attorney General's office were so disturbed by Klein's comments that they finally agreed to allow their lead investigator in the case, Sergeant Rachel Kading, to sit down with me for an interview. During the two years I've followed this story, I've asked Kading for interviews at least a dozen times. But this is the first interview she's ever given to anyone about Tom's disappearance and death. You've agreed to sit down. Why is that?

[Rachel Kading]

I think that collectively as a group at the AG's office, we just felt that it was important to put out some facts. There's been a lot of stories, there's been a lot of discrepancies. There's been just a lot of conjecture in the case and it harmed it. Honestly.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

I asked Kading about one of Klein's stories that Tom possibly had been shot in the football stadium parking lot. Did you come across any evidence suggesting something like that might have happened?

[Rachel Kading]

No.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Is there any evidence that Tom went up to the football parking lot?

[Rachel Kading]

There is no evidence that he went to the football parking lot.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

I then asked Kading about Klein's newest theory, that Chris Jones had seen Tom tied to a chair while Deputy Sheriff held a gun to his head.

[Rachel Kading]

No, absolutely no evidence. And as a matter of fact, Chris Jones has told multiple stories over the years. He is a very unreliable witness.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

What were other stories Chris Jones told you or others about what happened that night?

[Rachel Kading]

I mean, the one that sticks out is he told the sheriff's office at some point that two Hispanic people in town were responsible for this Death and that it was connected to the Mexican mafia or to a cartel, that these two individuals found out that he may know something about it, that they basically kidnapped him, strapped him to a chair, that they shot him up with drugs and told him that if he ever told anybody that they would kill him.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

And you found yourself investigating to see if that story was true?

[Rachel Kading]

Yes, we looked into every story.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

And not true. So I asked Kading what did she think happened on Thanksgiving Eve, 2016.

[Rachel Kading]

I don't think we can go there. We have theories.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

You have a theory?

[Rachel Kading]

Yes.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

But you're not gonna go public with it?

[Rachel Kading]

No. It's irresponsible to do so.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

The Attorney General's office, however, did release a 249 page report that Kading had compiled about the case, which perhaps offered a few hints about what she was thinking. In your report, that comes out scattered throughout the report seem to be several questions about Tom's own family. That they might not be telling everything they knew about what happened that night, correct? That's correct, yes. In fact, her written report mentioned the lie detector test that Penny and her husband Chris agreed to take in 2018, not long after Kading got involved in the case. But in a lie detector test that Penny agreed to give, you wrote that she showed signs of deception on questions regarding Tom Brown's location. What do you mean by that?

[Rachel Kading]

So I don't know if the general public is really familiar with how polygraphs work, but there's usually a battery of questions. So in one of the batteries of questions, it was about the possibility that Tom was deceased. And one of the questions was, do you know the current location of his body?

[Skip Hollingsworth]

And her answer was registered by the lie detector examiner as deceptive.

[Rachel Kading]

Yes.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Chris Meek, her husband, was asked the same set of questions, correct?

[Rachel Kading]

Correct.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

And what was the result of his answers?

[Rachel Kading]

He showed deception.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Your report also says that Chris Whereabouts on November 24, the early morning hours of Thanksgiving Day, were unknown or uncorroborated. Did you ever find out where Chris was?

[Rachel Kading]

We were told that he was home all night.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

And did you find any evidence that suggested he was not home all night? Kading said nothing. She did not answer the question. Maybe there was something about Chris activities that night that she didn't want to give away. During our interview, Kading said that there was another issue involving the family that troubled her. It had to do with Tom's iPhone. You might remember that only weeks after that fateful Thanksgiving eve, Penny had asked a couple of Tom's friends if they knew the password to Tom's phone, which was then still believed to be missing. Why? Kading wanted to know, would Penny ask for the phone's password? Unless she had the phone in her possession all along. And if she did have her son's phone, how exactly did she get it? Had Penny taken the phone from Tom the night he disappeared? And did she, months later, plant the phone by Lake Marvin road, where it was found? Kading decided to have the polygraph examiner ask Penny and Chris about the phone. Well explained. The lie detector test showed signs of deception on the question regarding possession. What was the question?

[Rachel Kading]

Asked them if they possessed Tom's phone after his disappearance.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

And they said no.

[Rachel Kading]

Yes.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

And that came across as deception on the examiner's report?

[Rachel Kading]

Yes, I believe only on Penny's, not on Chris's.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

When I talked to Penny about all this a year ago, she told me it was the sheriff's department that had asked her to find the passcode. Kading says that's not true.

[Rachel Kading]

There's no evidence that the sheriff's office asked her for the passcode.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Kading also asked Tom's brother Tucker, if he, too, would take a lie detector test. Tucker was asked by you to take a lie detector test. Is that correct?

[Rachel Kading]

That's correct.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

And he did not take one. Is that correct?

[Rachel Kading]

He did not. We were told that he would not be taking one.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

When I had talked to Tucker more than a year ago, he had told me the reason he wouldn't sit for a polygraph examination was because such tests are very unreliable. In fact, lie detector test results aren't permitted in court as evidence. Tucker said he was already so distraught over Tom's death that he was worried his answers would come across as evasive. If a grand jury had been called, Kading possibly could have gotten more answers out of Tom's family. During our interview, she did confirm rumors that she had spoken with the county's district attorney, Franklin mcdonough, about the possibility of convening a grand jury to look into Tom's death.

[Rachel Kading]

When we kind of came to the end of the case, and we really weren't sure still what had happened, but we knew that people were lying. Somebody has to be lying in this case. We discussed having an investigational grand jury, and that process is you bring in all witnesses, they testify under oath. Our hope at that time was that if we did this, maybe the truth would come out or we would discover new evidence or we would discover there were more witnesses. There were other people we could talk to.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Choosing her words carefully, she explained to me why there had been so much uncertainty around calling a grand jury.

[Rachel Kading]

Basically, the discussion was that even though this was going to be an investigational grand jury, that multiple indictments were likely and that it was not felt that that was the ethical thing to do at this time. If you go through a grand jury and you have an indictment, but you don't have enough to convict somebody at trial, it's just not ethical to do that. So it was decided that we would not do the grand jury for that reason and we would just continue to work on the case.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Well, wait a second. You had multiple indictments that could be made? You were certain of that?

[Rachel Kading]

I mean, I can't say with 100% certainty that there would be indictments, but it was the feeling of myself, other members of the investigative team, and the district attorney's office that there would be multiple indictments.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

And how many people are we talking about being indicted? Can't answer that.

[Rachel Kading]

No.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

And what would they be indicted for?

[Rachel Kading]

I won't answer that either.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

And why wouldn't you let people see what you had, even if it didn't lead to a conviction in a trial? What's unethical about that?

[Rachel Kading]

What's unethical about it is that if you do not feel that the indictment is going to lead to a conviction at trial, you are really shorting the case. So let's just say a hypothetical. So you get somebody indicted for a homicide, and then you go to trial for that homicide, and you are not able to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that that person is responsible for that homicide. You can never try that person again. You're done. That's it. So you can go get indictments, which are very easy to get, but to not have the trial evidence, it's unethical and it doesn't serve the victim. And that's our focus. Our focus is Thomas Brown.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

So the District attorney and the state Attorney General's office actually considered indictments of multiple people. But who did they believe Tom had been killed by more than one person? Or did they believe something else had happened to Tom? Maybe something that was covered up by members of his family? You might remember from earlier episodes of the podcast that I spoke to various people about Tom's personal struggles. In the months before his death. He unexpectedly had quit the football team and broken up with his girlfriend. He had told a few close friends he was afraid that people in Canadian would hear that he sometimes liked wearing adult diapers. I also learned that a couple of hours before Tom disappeared on Thanksgiving Eve, he did a Google search on his phone for suicide hotlines. Penny did tell me that Kading had told her that she suspected the family had found Tom's body after he killed himself, and that out of a sense of shame, they had moved his body, hoping no one would find him. Penny told Kading that she was mistaken. And when I went to see Penny in October, the day after Klein's meeting, she remained adamant that she, Chris and Tucker had not moved Tom's body.

[Philip Klein]

And so I guess people, people are always going to think what they want to think in every circumstance. Everybody's going to have an opinion. If that's the opinion you want to have of me, then I guess so be it. I'm not going to argue with you to try to change your opinion. Because I know at the end of the day or when I have to look at myself in the mirror at the nighttime or when I get up in the morning, I didn't do anything to my son. Tucker did not do anything to Thomas. My husband did not do anything to Thomas. That's just ludicrous.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Penny insisted to me that she still has no idea how Tom died or how his body ended up off Lake Marvin Road. I asked her if she has ever been to the spot where Tom's remains were found.

[Philip Klein]

I don't even know where it is, to be honest. I don't know where it is. So how can you accuse me of doing something to my son when I don't even know where he was? You know, at the end of the day, I know the truth about that. I don't know the truth about what happened to Thomas, but I know the truth about where I was. I know the truth about where Chris was. I know the truth about where he was.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

During our conversation, Penny was sitting with Tucker at the dining room table. Chris was at work. I asked Penny how she was doing living in a town where everyone talks about her. Do you feel like people want you to quit and leave town so people will forget so Canadian can get past the Tom Brown episode?

[Philip Klein]

Yes, I think they would be very happy.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

I asked her how Chris was feeling as he said, you know what? I'm tired of the public scrutiny. Let's get out of Canadian.

[Philip Klein]

Oh yeah, we talk about it.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

What's your answer at this point?

[Philip Klein]

I don't know.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Tucker jumped in.

[Tucker Brown]

I mean, this has been our home for four gener. I mean, am I the fifth? Yeah, I'm the fifth generation person from Canadian. I mean, this has been our home for 100 years. It's kind of hard to pick up and leave that.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

It sure is. Well, what do you want to do next with your life other than have reporters like me come up and show up at your dining room table?

[Philip Klein]

I don't know. I'm probably just going to keep doing what I'm doing. Just going to keep teaching school and doing whatever I can to bring answers for Thomas.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

There was a moment last night when I thought this story will never come to an end. Has that occurred to you?

[Philip Klein]

Yes.

[Tucker Brown]

Every day.

[Philip Klein]

Yeah.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Meaning what?

[Tucker Brown]

Every day I think we may not know anything. Ever.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

There's got to be an answer. How can this case go unsolved?

[Philip Klein]

Dad, I have no idea.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

When I talked to Kading, it was clear she didn't know whether the case would ever be solved either. So up in Canadian as we speak right now, half that town thinks he was murdered. Part of the town thinks he committed suicide. Part of the town thinks it could be an accidental death. Do you see any hope that new evidence is going to emerge that somebody's going to talk?

[Rachel Kading]

I always hope that that will happen, and I'll never lose that hope. It could be five years from today. It could be the 10 year anniversary. It could be the 20 year anniversary. Every victim is important and this case is no different than that. So the door is always open at our office for any information, for. For anything that will bring resolution to this case. We hope for that every day.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Well, good luck on that. I think you're gonna need it.

[Rachel Kading]

Probably, yeah.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

As for Penny, she says she's not giving up on her investigation either. She still employs Philip Klein to look for evidence that Tom was murdered. This past Thanksgiving eve, on the fifth anniversary of Tom's disappearance, Penny, Chris Tucker and a few friends gathered outside the District Attorney's office. They held signs that read justice for Thomas Brown. Penny told me she was still hoping to persuade the District Attorney to convene a grand jury and force witnesses to testify under oath. I was simply bewildered. If Penny and her family seemed to be the target of the Attorney General's investigation, why would they want a grand jury to be convened? Were they convinced that another storyline might emerge? At the least, Penny told me she would like to give her son a proper burial. But because the investigation into Tom's death has not been officially closed, the Attorney General's office says it's obligated to maintain possession of Tom's remains. There's nothing you can do, right?

[Philip Klein]

I mean, our hands are tied, but there's no. I mean, what am I going to do? Go down? Am I going to go find Rachel in Austin and say, you know what? Give me those damn remains. I mean, what am I going to do? She's not. It's not going to happen. I'm just wasting my time.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Before I left Canadian, I drove by some of the town's landmarks. There was a junior high school football game going on at the stadium. Over at the walking bridge, I watched a freight train hurtle down the tracks. I headed to Main street and stopped at an empty lot. I stared at one of the signs that had been put up there soon after Tom disappeared. On the sign were two sentences, there is a killer among us. Please pray that Tom's killer is found and brought to justice. And at the bottom of the sign was Tom's photo. He was wearing glasses, his brown hair was brushed over his forehead, and he was giving the camera a gentle SM.

[Philip Klein]

With no.

[Skip Hollingsworth]

Heart. Tom Brown's Body is a Texas Monthly production executive producer is Megan Kreit, produced and engineered by Brian Standifer, who also wrote the music. Additional production on this episode by Harper Carlton and Patrick Michaels. J.K. nichol is our editor and Paul Knight is our fact checker. Our theme music is no Hard Feelings by the Avett Brothers. I'm your writer and host, Skip Hollingsworth. If you like the show, please leave us a review on Apple Podcasts. Oh, yes, and whenever the next bombshell drops in Canadian, I'll be back with another episode.