Loading summary
Transcript217 lines
- [00:00]
Shekhar Natarajan
I actually I come from slums in India. I was very fortunate to go to one of the top schools.
- [00:12]
Ishita Raj
You just follow the beat of your heart and you follow what you think draws you.
- [00:24]
Shekhar Natarajan
I always believe there is no. There's nothing called an accident.
- [00:29]
Ishita Raj
Yeah, it's written.
- [00:30]
Shekhar Natarajan
It's always written in preordinate. Contractually.
- [00:37]
Ishita Raj
The very fortunate can happen overnight. It kind of happened overnight for me with Panchnama.
- [00:46]
Shekhar Natarajan
If he starts thinking fake is real and he loses all his cognitive ability to understand and like process things, what world am I going to leave my son in?
- [01:01]
Ishita Raj
Measuring something and feeling something are two completely different things. The very fortunate can happen overnight. It kind of happened overnight for me with Panchnama.
- [01:21]
Shekhar Natarajan
You did not have a godfather. You did not have anyone in the industry. It takes a lot of conviction and self belief. Where did that come from?
- [01:29]
Ishita Raj
You just follow the beat of your heart and you follow what you think draws you.
- [01:35]
Shekhar Natarajan
Today's guest represents the rare actor who entered Bollywood without a film legacy, without a safety net to become a cult voice of an entire generation's conversation around love and relationship became part of the 100 crore club blockbuster.
- [01:52]
Ishita Raj
I have signed the film and a month later we are shooting. Everything was moving so fast it was difficult to cross. You become a little shy to tell people what do you want to be? I want to be an actress that looks vain. So I stopped saying it.
- [02:04]
Shekhar Natarajan
Most people in life like when they think they are late they usually quit. So what's that like conviction and passion.
- [02:11]
Ishita Raj
There's something inside you that needs to keep telling you that this is it. Mostly it should come from within to keep yourself going.
- [02:19]
Shekhar Natarajan
If he starts thinking fake is real being created by these AI, what world am I going to leave my son?
- [02:24]
Ishita Raj
I feel AI is built for speed, scale, efficiency, accuracy. But measuring something and feeling something are two completely different things. I got tags of me sitting in. My friend.
- [02:42]
Shekhar Natarajan
Please welcome Ishita Raj. There are some carriers which are launched, some are inherited. Then there are journeys built quietly, consistently and entirely on self belief. Today's guest represents the rare actor who entered Bollywood without a film legacy, without a safety net and earned her place purely through her persistence. Beginning her journey as a model before stepping into cinema. She made her debut with Pyar ka Panchnama. A film that went on to become a cult voice of an entire generation's conversation around love and relationship. She returned stronger with Pyarka Panchnama too and later became part of the hundred crore club blockbuster Sonu KE Titu ki Sweetie. A movement that transformed the recognition into nationwide impact. Over more than a decade in the industry, she has evolved from a newcomer finding space to an artist choosing reinvention, balancing glamour with discipline, and now stepping into a whole new chapter beyond acting into storytelling. On tomorrow Today with Shekhar Natarajan, we explore craft, identity, reinvention, and what no algorithm can replace. We welcome an actor who built a journey on one decision at a time. Please welcome Ishita Raj,
- [04:36]
Ishita Raj
Foreign.
- [04:42]
Shekhar Natarajan
Welcome to tomorrow today with Shekhar Natarajan. I have a incredible guest in the studio today, Ishita Raj. And. And as you all know, like, she's a celebrity Hollywood Bollywood actress, like one, hopefully one day a Hollywood actress too. But. And I have, I'm gonna actually, like, spend a little bit of time talking about her, her passion, unpacking, like, you know, what makes her who she is, and also the role of technology and other things as we evolve into the future. Welcome to the show, Ishita.
- [05:15]
Ishita Raj
Thank you. Thank you.
- [05:17]
Shekhar Natarajan
So let's start with a very basic question first. Like, you know, like, when I started my career about 25 years ago, I actually, I come from slums in India. I was very fortunate to go to one of the top schools. And after graduating to the top school, I somehow miraculously landed in Coke, Coca Cola, and my first job. The first six months, I sucked. I was horrible. I could have been fired every day, by the way. And I was praying I shouldn't get fired. But when you look at the. The Bollywood industry, usually the star, the star kids and their kids and their grandchildren, they usually make it into the film industry. And you did not have a godfather. You did not have anyone in the industry. It takes a lot of conviction and self belief, where did that come from?
- [06:13]
Ishita Raj
You know, when you're so young, you don't understand these terms like self belief and conviction. You just follow the beat of your heart and you follow what you think draws you. This drew me if I could understand anything, I think so back in school, if I could understand anything that I. That interested me. You know, we gotta choose a lot of careers. And when you're young, you know, as kids, you have every semester you have a changing career. One once you have to. You want to become a doctor, stylist, designer, so much so. But if I have a memory of wanting to be anything, I want to be an actor.
- [06:58]
Shekhar Natarajan
So when did that come? Like, what time did it?
- [07:00]
Ishita Raj
Like, you know, I, I modeled like very briefly, like, not even brief. It was like hardly one or two. Boomer cake. My dad, his. His agent, my dad is into business and Unka Ek, you know, client was a model. His name was Ashish. I remember. So my mom was an enthusiast. Mom. And so he must have come to the office and mom was there and they had a chat. So mom was like, yeah, I want to make my daughters also. Do I have an elder sister also. So we got a little portfolio done and I did get one or two ads but that was again very passe. You know, we, we just did it like I, I did not even have any idea. So mom, we used to have co curricular activities. So I remember I used to go for my swimming classes, I used to go skating classes. I'm a national skater. I've skated during school time. You know, if there's any sport that you've religiously pursued. And we used to have early morning practices, me and my sister. That was skating, Roller skating. So, so this was also. But that was very brief. But after that I think so I, that fascinated me also. I think so Everybody in India would agree, you know, most of the kids want to be. Are fascinated seeing actors and they're more, they get inspired by actors. You see films, you see so much of tv. Yeah. So a part of me, you know, secretly wanted it. But when you grow up, it becomes. You become a little shy to tell people what do you want to be? I want to be an actress that looks vain. So I stopped saying it. My family knew that I had interest in it but. And I was really interested in dancing also. So I used to participate in all the BSF our school used to have. So I used to always participate in dancing. So yeah, so maybe there that creative, that urge to become an actor. I think so. And not that you notice it, not that it's so apparent that, you know, this is the goal that I want to follow. I, it was latent, I, I thought it fascinated me but because I'm from a hardcore Delhi business family, we had no means to get there. Nobody in my family remotely was into acting. So I didn't know how to reach. So it was just a far fetched dream which I was shy to talk about. I was like that.
- [09:35]
Shekhar Natarajan
But it takes a lot of courage to pursue something like that because to really be introduced into the industry you always need a serious backing. Right. So even you yourself confessed and I think it was an honest confession on your side where you mentioned that, hey, like, you know, I'm late to the industry. Like, you know, given the fact that like, you know, I, I'm coming in by your own kind of, you know, definition, what late Means. But you know, if I, if I sort of like unpack, like, like most people in life, like when they think they are late, they usually quit. But somewhere something in you had the fuel to say like, you know, I'm going to keep pursuing this. So what's that like? Like is there a childhood incident or is it like your tenacity that you got from your father, mother, like your grandparents or your uncle. Like where did that come from? Like the conviction and the passion to, to pursue and persevere?
- [10:37]
Ishita Raj
I think. So it just starts. Yeah, you could rightly say that it can come from somewhere but mostly it should come from within to keep yourself going. Because you can hear so many people talking and you can be inspired. You inspiration can make you start, it can make you follow it. But to be walking alone and fighting those battles, you need. There's some something inside you that needs to keep telling you that this is it. So I think that is the case with me. What fueled me to keep pursuing it. I. I've understood about. What I've understood about Mumbai is some people, it can happen, they're very fortunate. Can happen overnight. It kind of happened overnight for me with Panchnama because again I was not from the industry. My first film became a huge cult blockbuster which very grateful for, wasn't expected but again that happened. So I've seen that also and then I've seen things lag and then you know, but because maybe the start was like that just the belief that it happened to me. Like I said, I was shy to talk about it but it really did happen. I mean I don't know if the manifestations work or the urge work or the passion work or maybe so much of want work. Whatever worked, it happened. I got, I got a lead in a full commercial Bollywood film that happened to be quite a hit. So when you see dreams realize in front of you, then you start believing in them. And when you start believing in them, there's something inside you that makes you pursue it.
- [12:22]
Shekhar Natarajan
Got it. So how did Panchnama happen to you? Tell me the backstory.
- [12:27]
Ishita Raj
I was, It's a. I was shortlisted for one of the, for one of TV shows in Mumbai and I was from Delhi. I had not even come to Mumbai ever in my life. My dad strictly told me. So I started modeling a little in Delhi and I was like, okay, and just another hobby you're doing, you're having fun. Okay, just have fun. Don't ever ask me that. I want to go here, I want to go to Mumbai because I'M not going to let you sit. I'm not going to send you to Mumbai. And I know this new. There's no. It's a lost battle arguing with my dad and I didn't want to do it. Like you know, I'm from that school of thinking that just, you know, I think so your parents need to be there. They need to be in sync with you. And even if they're not convinced, just their support makes your life a lot easier. So I didn't want to do anything going against them. Anyway, so film in Delhi. I started a little modeling. I because there's not too much auditions that happen. But there was some TV show audition that happened in Delhi and I got shortlisted there. So I got a call from Mumbai that I have to come here for the final round off audition which will confirm who's the lead actor. So I'd come for that. Unfortunately that didn't happen. But I was here for three days. In that span of three days I accidentally bumped into a casting director who was then casting for Panchnama. And so while I was there he asked me, he said this is another audition. Are you interested in films? I said yeah, why not? So he said okay.
- [14:13]
Shekhar Natarajan
It was a different film than this one.
- [14:14]
Ishita Raj
Yeah, that was a TV show serial or ye film thing. You know, make hay while sun shines. Do as much productive. Make it as productive as it can be.
- [14:28]
Shekhar Natarajan
How did you show up at that door?
- [14:31]
Ishita Raj
I was, you know it is such a cliche but it has really happened with me. I was in Bandra with a friend who I was on a having coffee and that casting director knew my friend. He'd come to meet him. So he. So because we were hanging out so he also called him and yeah, can you imagine? And so all three of us were sitting and then he just asked what do you do? Where are you from? In fact he even gave me a little slight lecture that Snuh Mumbai, you have to shift here. There's so many people coming. Everything. You can get anything from Delhi. It cannot happen because the meeting there, auditions, you need to be present here. So I kind of had a loss of heart. I was like listen, until I have something. He said. I said have something unless and until you come here. So just se normal conversation. And I was there for about an hour, then went back. So in the morning that casting director called my friend that. Is your friend still in town? He said yeah, she's leaving today evening. He said okay, just ask her to come to this address. The address was Kumarji's office, Panorama Studios. Yeah.
- [15:43]
Shekhar Natarajan
Wow. It's like, you know, there's. I always believe there is no, there's nothing called an accident in life. Yeah, it's written, it's always written and pre ordered and contractual actually.
- [16:00]
Ishita Raj
I think. So you understand these things only by lived experiences? Yes. You know, and we keep hearing this because it becomes so you don't really understand the depth of what it means. And some people, whatever they say, they say out of experience, Elders, they say out of experiences. We take it like another Sunisa Naimbaat Achahanti KE likha de King. But you know, I understood this again with this is actually true. There's so many girls and guys coming from all part of the world, good looking, talented, what not, and really hard working great actors. From, from film schools or. You will be at the right time, you will be at the, you will meet the person, it'll just come all in place.
- [17:01]
Shekhar Natarajan
So yeah, it's, it's very similar to the experience I had. Slightly different actually though I had to go to United States to take care of my brother. My brother had like bipolar and he basically fell down, broke his left arm and he's out of school. Like you know, he was going to, he was doing his master's degree in psychology and he got out of school and he was working odd jobs and other things and he called me one day and said like as I said I was, I'm from slums. So I literally said okay, I'll go there. And I chose the university because I wanted to stay very close to my brother and I did not have funding. Like literally 3:30, 4:00 clock is the time when the registrar office expects you to pay like around like 10:30, 11:00'. Clock. I overheard a couple of my friends talking about this guy showing up at the professor's office who had a lot of funding. So then I'm glad that I did that meeting appointment. And like the admin thought I am that guy he was supposed to meet. So I believe that there is nothing. And you know, when you, when I look back at the entire chain of events that happened in my life, had I not studied in that university, had I not done what I did, my life would have been very different. Yeah, so, but coming back to the question of Panchanama, you know, it became a cult success about relationships and like, you know, like, and it was a generational film. Right. So what did it make you feel when that happened? Like you were like aspiring to be an artist and here is an accident in Your life, you just show up and audition and then you got into it, then you acted.
- [19:26]
Ishita Raj
It was not really accidental because I was into it. Not that I was pursuing something else or I was studying designing or. Or I was, you know, doing something or I was in. Into corporate. And then that's an accident. My intent was always there. It was intentional. But. And this happened. But again, while I was modeling, I gave myself. Let me try for six. For six months, a year. And it happens. And it happened during that time. So.
- [20:01]
Shekhar Natarajan
Got it.
- [20:02]
Ishita Raj
Yeah. Coming to your question.
- [20:03]
Shekhar Natarajan
Yeah. So the success, like, you know, when you had that early success, the first movie, Right. What did it make you feel at that time?
- [20:12]
Ishita Raj
To be really honest, now that I look back, you know, you don't understand the weight of it. You don't understand you. Because it happened, everything happened so much in a clique, so much. You know, I was the last one to be locked in the cast. So I've signed the film and a month later we are shooting. I remember I meire khafte keinune ki baad. We were doing the preps. I read the entire script on Boys Apartment was the first schedule we were shooting. So I remember because I did not have any work in Boys Apartment. But still we were called because we were all newcomers. Not all, but I definitely was a newcomer. And so that I should understand the working of a set, the working of a film. So everybody, we all used to hang around so that we should be. We should be familiar with the environment. Because this was my first time on a film set ever in my life. So script be Katham Kareem Kareer. So everything was moving so fast. It was difficult to. Not difficult to process. But I mean, you all know what's happening. You know, I'm doing a film and then you are, you know, every. You've got your own doubts. It's. You've, you've. You've got your inhibitions. It's a different script. When you read the script also it was so interesting, but because has not been seen before, that language that we used, it was very colloquial. It was very Today it was very conversational. It was not very, very lyrical or poetic. Not very dialogue, dialogy, language. So you have your inhibitions. Will it work or will it not? But the film became such a huge blockbuster. So I don't know processing, you know, what's happening. But realization has taken time. So usvaktna realized, wow, the film has worked. It was like that. It was a reaction. But to understand that Reaction maybe now when you look back, you didn't understand the weight of it. Yeah. But yeah, you. I'm still gratified and so thankful to everyone whoever made this happen loves her and for giving me a first break. Because a lot of things have changed after Panchanama where everything has changed because of Panchanama. Because I entered the industry with a film that did well. So I, you know, you, you skim through a lot of rounds of struggle and auditions and people which really helps you. So there are a lot of things to thank God for.
- [23:06]
Shekhar Natarajan
Then there was a second edition of that movie. Like the sequel to the movie.
- [23:11]
Ishita Raj
Yeah.
- [23:12]
Shekhar Natarajan
And. And basically like I, like I saw some interviews where the director was actually going gaga over you and he said like, you know, you were irreplaceable in that movie and he wanted you back in that movie. Like what do you, like, what do you think happened on the set?
- [23:28]
Ishita Raj
No, this was Sonu. I feel Panchnama had all of us and Sonu, it's not about irreplaceable because you worked with the same team. So Lavsa knew all the beats of each one of us. So he thought in Sonu, that role that I played of Pihu, he thought of me. And I remember we had this conversation. I was in the office and he said film or. And this is a part. And then I was like, it's with the same people. And this part is maybe not that I didn't understand Kibushad because I. It was just a one liner narrative that I, I just understood the gist of the story. But he said I see you in it and I know you will. So then you just go by someone else's conviction. So I was like, and it's because it's with the same people. Now it just feels like home. So that's how Swanu happened.
- [24:34]
Shekhar Natarajan
And so this, the, the three films, like what is the time span of that like duration of all these three films?
- [24:40]
Ishita Raj
It was spaced out. It was like I think so panchnama 2 was maybe 2, 2, 2 and a half years later and sonu was again releasing was 3 years apart.
- [24:54]
Shekhar Natarajan
Got it. And what happened in between those time frames?
- [24:57]
Ishita Raj
I did few films which did not do that well. I didn't film Meditaya Gangster which maybe did not do land that well.
- [25:06]
Shekhar Natarajan
And they were all a certain genre
- [25:07]
Ishita Raj
or like yes, it was a meditate. Gangster was a very Mirzapur that that genre. So drastic, raw, rooted, gang war, college students. But I think every film comes with its own destiny.
- [25:34]
Shekhar Natarajan
Got it. But Sonu was like a hundred crore movie.
- [25:39]
Ishita Raj
Yeah. Sonu was out of the. Out of the park hit.
- [25:44]
Shekhar Natarajan
Yeah.
- [25:45]
Ishita Raj
Sonu was so. So Panchanama. Now it's a. It was a franchisee. And now to outdo Panchnama was again a challenge. So. Coming with the same actors and should not enter the same space also because it's not a Panchnama, it's something else. A lot of people still mistake it to be panchnama 3. But it's a completely different. This is bromance. Those were. How can relationships go sour when girls can go bad, you know? Yeah. But still sometimes confuses it. Same actors. Kartik, Sunny, Nishrat. Aye. But again Sonu was a different league altogether. It was not league but a different film altogether. And bromance. Not many films are made in our industry. Which is. We have films and friendship. But friendship. But just on. On bromance. So I felt that was again very. It was a fresh story. It was. It was again. You know, we've made a lot of films. And also I think so when you work with the same people, You don't have to work. You don't have to work on your chemistry. Even between two guys. Chemistry is not always between your heroine and your hero. It is between two characters. Those characters can be you and I. Those characters can be a girl and a guy. A character can be a Dadu and a Pota or two brothers, two friends. Could be anywhere. Unsaid comfort, unsaid ease. Even. And even off the camera we all have had our share of fights with each other. And because I think we all have grown together, you know, those fights have also like learned marque. Then again, we all are eating together. So it was like that. So if I remember, you know, I've not made much effort in any of these films. They've just flowed like water. So I felt, you know, the story obviously had to be first. The hero of the film. Love sir is a great, you know, great. He writes, his stories are unique. And definitely. I mean he's got two franchise now. Sonu. But Sonu still is in talks. A lot of people who are wanting Sonu. And even he's contemplating for a while to make Sonogiri 2 part 2. But story was, I feel the hero of the film. And then just the ease of all of us working together and the same team. Not just the actors, you know, the technicians. The DOP was same, you know, your. Your ads, your dop, your hitesh background score. Music composer to Bosco. You. You you give 100 crore film effortlessly.
- [29:11]
Shekhar Natarajan
So take us back into your childhood days a little bit like, because I think like if I'm a, if I'm a, if I'm an aspiring artist and I want to join the film and, and you know, you're making it sound very simple, you know, I'm sure it's
- [29:34]
Ishita Raj
not, you know, it's not simple at all.
- [29:37]
Shekhar Natarajan
It's very complicated. It's very, takes a lot of like conviction, a lot of hard work. So how do you prepare yourself like you know, to even. And what are those? And I don't think like, you know, we always like think that there is divinity and other things, but also there are people who show up in your life. Like love Ranjan who just showed up in your life and he gave you a break and then he gave you another break. And then he gave you another break. So partly to, due to the fact that like you know, you're a great artist, but how do you explain the intervention of what I call angels in your life? And then, and the other part is the preparation. Like is there any, any kind of advice to young artists, aspiring artists who
- [30:25]
Ishita Raj
are coming in, you know, like you just said before that everything is written so the intervention of angels coming to your life and what timing to how do you have to prepare. Everything is so interdependent without even you realizing it. So all you, I feel since you mentioned and you made me think about it, so now I'm thinking there is no a particular rule or a process to do it. Every person you talk to who will be sitting here will be having kind of the similar stories with a different experience altogether or maybe a different story with similar experiences. So there is no set plan, there is no by the book rule ever. So. Experience opportunities. Somebody must have just been swallowed on the road. Not even wanting to be an actor has been forced to come to become an actor and become blockbuster overnight. So after you become an actor, you know that struggle or maybe not that could have been similar, but experiences. So I feel the, what work has to be gone into preparation is preparation. See there's a, there's a preparation before you want to be something and this is a preparation after you become something. So preparation before is just awareness that what you really want to do it is not that, oh my friend is doing that. That seems interesting. Let's, let's do it. And then you realize, no, this is not happening for me. So it's first of all understanding yourself and finding what you really love, which could be even and maybe I realized this is what I want. Or maybe this is what I don't want. So first understanding what is your calling. Because you'll really be working if it's not your calling. If you do anything in life as a part of a job or as a part of. It's my. I. I have to do it because I need to make money or interest. You will really be working it out. You like, you'll be really working as a responsibility. Keep me in a calm. A lot of people are doing that also. But if you start taking your job or your work as your passion, you will not even count hours. You will not even see or track time. Even after work hours. You just keep thinking about it. That's when innovation happens, intervention happens, inventions happen. Is because when you start living what you love doing. So that's the preparation I feel which is really hard. It's very easy to say. But it takes almost a lifetime for people to understand what they really want. A lot of people who must be 60 right now must be having great life, successful life, lot of money. But might not be as happy as it's. It's a part of the job that they're doing business. I'm working in a company, I'm working in a firm. I'm. You know, as long as you start, as long as you don't enjoy it, you'll always be working. But once you start enjoying it, you will not even feel that you're working someone. You're working for someone. You'll be working just for the fun of it, for the love of it. So I think that's the preparation also. Understanding if you want to be an actor, which I. Mine was very ambiguous but because muje dancing. So you know, just indulge yourself into like a lot of people in Mumbai, they want to be an actor. So just work yourself out, you know, whatever things that will make you become better at your job, do that, you know, because any skill or any talent is never wasted. Even if you don't become an actor. I'm talking purely in terms of actor. It could be any profession. It could be a sportsman. It could be a into business. But if talking about actors, since I'm an actor, dance or your. Your speech skills or the throw of your voice, you don't understand that the modulation of your voice. Nobody talks about it. It's not taught in any school. It's not taught in any. You don't really talk with your friends or your parents. But there are a lot of things modulating your voice. The throw of Your voice talking from your throat, talking, talking from your stomach. There's a lot of these tools that should be made aware to an actor to be a more present actor. So if you are really clear since beginning that I want to be an actor, I think that that could be a preparation work.
- [35:35]
Shekhar Natarajan
Got it.
- [35:35]
Ishita Raj
You know, just.
- [35:36]
Shekhar Natarajan
And who was your icon when you were growing up? Like, only one. You cannot pick five.
- [35:43]
Ishita Raj
They cannot be one. There's so many, there's so many actors.
- [35:47]
Shekhar Natarajan
You just get you in trouble for saying.
- [35:53]
Ishita Raj
Expressions, expressions. But just that, I don't know. Shiradevi used to just the ease. She used to make those faces and look that pretty and be funny. I feel that was I, I loved watching that, that. And even today, your idols don't have to be Bachman Vale. I, I. You see Alia in Gully Boy, she was so good. I remember both of them. They're having a fight. She's sitting in the bathroom and it's, it's the breakup scene. And when he says that I want to break up with you. And just with the nervousness, she hangs up the phone. So, yeah, there's sometimes you see that magic from another actor on screen that inspires you. So that inspiration you can take every day.
- [36:54]
Shekhar Natarajan
Got it. So let's switch topics. So you started largely in rom com sort of space and then like you transition now into like the princess, the warrior. Right? So, so tell me, what drew you to Rajnandini?
- [37:20]
Ishita Raj
You know, this is one project that's really close to my heart. It's not released yet, but it's a period series. And so when I heard the story, I remember I called the director and I asked him to I want to meet you. And I just said, how will you achieve this story? Because the story is so, so good. I'm really telling you, you give, you give this script to. I mean, this is, it just has to be facilitated. Right? I felt this story with a bigger budget and you know, this was a hit in hand. It was so good, at least to me. It really drew me, fascinated me. Dusra, you know, as an actor, you really want to work with Sanjalila Bhansali sir and Muje Laga and so Shahid, who's a director, I spoke to him coming back to that first and then I'll tell you this, that I really like the script. But how will you achieve it? And because this is, this is the bracket of your budget and this looks like a huge. The investment only would be really too much because in a period film you need to show Wars. This film had two. How are you going to meet it? And I remember he took mock actors, like his friends and his theater actors. And without telling me, he said, okay, I'll come back to you with an answer. Give me two days. I said, okay. And he has gone to indie studios with his team and one day footage of 18 hours. And he's cut a footage, like properly. He's made a trailer of two and a half minutes. And day after he came to my place, he met me and he just showed me. I said, what is it? He said, just you. And I said, is it this? So he actually shot a trailer just to show this is what I can do with no lights, with no resources, with no team, with no actors. Also, I can do it. So if somebody shows faith in me, I'm sure we can do really big things together. But that was the conviction, you know, sometimes you just want to take a leap of faith. I was like, let's do it also, You know. And you don't know when will that time come that you'll live this world? I thought, this is it, you know, period. You want to do a period as an actor. It just. It's so visually beautiful and fascinating, even as a viewer and just to be living that world. We've shot for the series for 100 days. We shot for a month and a half in Karjat and a month and a half in Kargil. So that was a long series and it was a lot of blood and sweat put into the series. But I still feel the experience was beautiful.
- [40:29]
Shekhar Natarajan
Got it. So you enjoyed every bit of it. But you must have gone through some phase of transformation, right? Like, it's a. Like you got to change your mind. You got to think differently. You got to like, you know, orient your brain into the character. Like, how do you prepare yourself into the character?
- [40:43]
Ishita Raj
So we had 10 days of preparation where I had to learn horse riding, I had to do sword fighting. So obviously we had those preparations. We had few scene readings and. But normal preparation. The minute you go on set and the minute I got ready for the first time in that lehenga, in that. In just that period, look you. And 100 days, 95 days shoot, you know, subtle transition, which you don't realize that. So we. We shot ND Studio, the first schedule and all the shoot was because it was in the May of. In the month of May, so it was really hot. And we had a night shoot of a month and a half. So I remember I felt cut off from the Entire world with those actors. We were staying in any studio. And 6pm Used to be our shift time. And we used to pack up at 6am 5:36. 6am Dead Mina night shoot, though. 45 to 50 days. Night shoot. When the world is sleeping, you're up and you're shooting in these palaces. So all the palace and inside shots have been shot there. And they made really beautiful sets. And just to be everybody, it was a costume drama. So everybody's dressed like a senapati and a queen. And just the language we spoke, I really cannot tell you for the longest time, you know, when you snapped out of it and when you came. I remember and I came to Mumbai, you know, this entire thing. I took a day's time to come back to reality. I was so used to my Mehls and, you know, just that costume and long hair and just the way of talking. You really sink in that world and making it your own felt completely. It was a different feeling. So it took time, but initially, because obviously it's so new to you. So I felt at least a week or five days. But after you start, it's on repeat, it's on loop. It was night shoot every day. Suddenly you change into not just playing the character you feel like you are Rajnandani. I don't know if I want to share this on record or on set set, but there was a hitch that happened during the shoot. And I would. Okay, I'll just tell you without giving giving in much details. So I felt like, mira Kingdom, Empire Kingdom. And now we're in trouble. And there was a hitch that happened and the shoot stopped. And I felt like, what can I do? I need to save this. And I took an extra leap just however I could help. And I did it to make the shoot start and happen. And that has never happened to me ever. But it happened to me during shooting this. I did put in my own money just to start the film or just there were some contingencies. But you don't think. But because we got so involved, I got so involved and consumed that it was not problem. Let's see what we can work it out or help. It was like, I need to save this. I need to save our people from dying. Not dying, but falling. It should not stop.
- [44:42]
Shekhar Natarajan
So my experience is not like all the things you have gone through, but like, I used to be in corporate for 23 years prior to, like me starting my own company. And mostly, like, you know, I led large operations in very large companies. Coke, PepsiCo. If you've been to Walt Disney Company. I'm the inventor of the magic band which you wear and walk in the studio and the theme parks and others. And I built a grocery business so modern day. So 2013 may like my team created that delivery model.
- [45:22]
Ishita Raj
So are you into like technique?
- [45:24]
Shekhar Natarajan
I am.
- [45:25]
Ishita Raj
You're a technical guy?
- [45:27]
Shekhar Natarajan
Yeah, I'm like, I'm sort of like jack of all trades. Like I'm a business guy, but I'm a. I'm a techie and I'm an operations guy. But like I also have about 200 odd patents inventions, so to say. But like when I started this company, the reason why I wanted to share this with you is very similar. Because I think like everyone kind of goes through that experience at one point in their life or the other. So when I started this company like pale to like, you know, I used to have like 20, 30, 40,000 people working for me. Like in some large companies I had like about 88,000 people working for me. 88,000. And like I used to like let people go because they were not performing. I never used to feel, okay, I'm letting people go because I thought corporate, you know, like hr, right. But when I started my own company, I started with only like 10 people. And then we started growing up to 60, 70. Every time there's a decision about like letting go people or something could go wrong to them, about them in their lives, I start reflecting on all the lives and their dependent lives. And their dependent lives. Right? You think? Right. Basically like, you know, they are dependent on his fathers depend on this girl. You begin to like empathize. And you, you. You condition yourself as a family. Right.
- [47:08]
Ishita Raj
You know, I've never spoken about this on camera, but this is not made up. I can, I cannot, I can just tell you. But I never knew that feeling could ever exist. Just to. There was a patch when just tickets had to be done. The entire set had to be moved to something and some payments were blocked. I have done the tickets for the entire set and it was not. I was doing it as a help or as a favor. I just felt they're all my people. So you and you don't realize you're doing a part of your job. You're acting. You're playing a character. But when that character became you, when you forgot the difference between a Rajanandani and Ishita and you felt like you are the person I am Rajanandani. Feeling. If you ask me, I cannot point one time there was a moment, it just didn't you become the character through time and very less. And especially maybe because the kind of films I've done, it is not spaced out for a longer span. Maximum 45 days. 50 days. 40 days. 45 days. You wrap the film. This probably happens when you. I don't know, when you live with the character for a longer time or you. Maybe. I've done films that were so today that was so modern, like generational films. So apovo shift because you were a part of it.
- [48:57]
Shekhar Natarajan
Yeah.
- [48:58]
Ishita Raj
You are a part of the generation. You are a part of this language and you are a part of this system and relationships. You did not even know the difference
- [49:15]
Shekhar Natarajan
between you and the character.
- [49:17]
Ishita Raj
Yeah, that. I don't know. It was.
- [49:20]
Shekhar Natarajan
It happens. And like, you know, so for everyone who wants to be successful in life, and I think this is a very important thing and, And I'm gonna like, really, like, you know, I want to put the thought out there and I. I wanted to manifest. I think you put in a lot of effort in this, in this movie on the series, and I think it's going to be super successful. That's what my, like, ask of God is.
- [49:47]
Ishita Raj
Thank you.
- [49:48]
Shekhar Natarajan
So. But I think, like, to be really successful and to be. To be able to do something really great, you have to feel like an owner. Rental gadi liaoba. Rental gadigoto. Basically. Ownership mentality that is very critical. And I think that's what like, you were. You were experiencing.
- [50:28]
Ishita Raj
Yeah.
- [50:29]
Shekhar Natarajan
Being a part owner, being basically, like passionate about what you're trying to do, transitioning yourself into the character so much that it felt like, you know, this has to be successful.
- [50:37]
Ishita Raj
Yeah.
- [50:38]
Shekhar Natarajan
And, you know, you were starting to live that whole thing. It's. It's incredible. So now let's basically talk about the fitness journey. Right. So, you know, tell me more about the evolution of you, the fitness. You know, there's so much like, we accept actors like, you know, like, fair and Lovely cream.
- [51:04]
Ishita Raj
Hai.
- [51:04]
Shekhar Natarajan
Fair hair. Lovely hair. Like, you know, the way we condition. Like, what is an ideal actor? An ideal. This thing.
- [51:14]
Ishita Raj
We.
- [51:14]
Shekhar Natarajan
We have this sort of like mental models, you know, as a society. So are you falling into trap for that or basically, like, how do you, like, how do you think about, like, wellness? Is it like, very different than the wellness of, like, how people are projected as an actor? Or is it like, does it mean something different to you?
- [51:34]
Ishita Raj
Wellness is never a trap. Wellness is acceptance. And the minute you start respecting your body, cleansing your body, treating it like it's a temple, it should be irrespective of the job you are in. Just because you're an actor, that's why you're supposed to look good. And looking good is. Does not mean that you have to look good. You have to feel good. For feeling good, you need to feel healthy. And it can be from any part of the job, any part of the field, any part of the world you are from. You could be. You could be a corporate guy, you could be a business guy, you could be an actor, you could be a sportsman. Because at the end of the day, you got to live with yourself. Not with your job, not with your position in your company. You. And to be enjoying life at any age, you need to be fit. It is as simple as that.
- [52:30]
Shekhar Natarajan
Got it.
- [52:31]
Ishita Raj
So it is just to correct you, sir. It is not a trap. It is. It is just respecting and accepting. You could. And it's the choices you make. So, you know, my choices in life as it is healthy, not that I'm saying I'm really fit. I still feel every day that I'm unfit and I'm not feeling. And you know, but just taking care is what I call is fitness. It is not having Ki Hamesha. You need to have six pack. You need to be in crash Titan all the time. You need to limit yourself and starve yourself. And that is, again, not fitness.
- [53:10]
Shekhar Natarajan
But is there like being an actor, does it put like extra onus on you to be extra fit?
- [53:18]
Ishita Raj
Yes, there is, you know, that leeway that you. It's. It's. I don't feel that too much of a pressure anyway, because I don't. I'm really thankful to God I don't put on weight. Like, I can be off the gym for five months and I still will not be able to put on. I will not put on weight. And I can eat everything. I am really. I eat. I have a sweet tooth. And so actually, but there is a. Like, if I feel I've misbehaved for a while and now I'm feeling. I'm not feeling into my clothes, then you feel I need to, you know, behave myself. So then I would. I know, because I know you've understood your body and you've done all the combinations of working out, lifting weights, Pilates, yoga, you know what works for you. I know what works for me. So if I have a span of one month, I know what is the regime I need to follow, what's the kind of diet I need to follow, and I know how to handle it. So that is. You feel a little more responsible that you have work coming and you now you need to be, you know, you need to have a more toner body. So then you have to be a little more working towards it. That I feel is there, especially in a job of an actor. But again, that's a personal choice. You know, Every actor is very fit. You see the girls, you see the guys. Everybody is too much into fitness. Every, every girl, every actress today has got a great body. So again, which is good to see because when you see so much and you said she's so fit, so you want to be equally as fit as that. And then you work towards it, which is healthy competition.
- [55:14]
Shekhar Natarajan
And so the, the concept of strength was different at the age 20 than it is now for you. Has it evolved or has it been the same for you?
- [55:24]
Ishita Raj
Strength as in.
- [55:25]
Shekhar Natarajan
Strength as in basically like the way you think about yourself as a person, the way you project yourself. You're not an actor at the age 20. Now you're an actor. Like, has there been a difference in the way you think about yourself?
- [55:37]
Ishita Raj
Yeah, because you understand life a little more, you've faced life a little more and, but again, nor is an actor everybody. It's called evolution. You evolve as a person. You do so much of faux pas in life, you do so much of glitches in life, then you know that you know how to handle when you fall. It's like falling once will not shatter, you will not break. Your world will not be like, oh my God. This is the biggest problem I've had in life. Which probably would be your thought process in schooling. It's a massive topic of discussion and all five friends are on conference talking about it. You, you evolve from it. You, you understand your problems changes your mindset changes your worries, changes your level of issues. That changes. Which is, Yeah, you feel, you feel a little bit. Disciplined. That can be subjective. I feel you, you responsibilities, disciplines, responsibility and responsibility like Jitna, aap, carefree, chilled out hoteo Jitna. You know, you've done your share of fun, friends, masti, all of that. Then you, you see life a little more seriously by not taking yourself seriously. I feel that happens with time, with age. It just, it's a, it's a part of the process.
- [57:30]
Shekhar Natarajan
So the reason why I bring about like, you know, this whole concept of wellness also is as you know, you've been probably using AI quite a bit. Or do you use AI like artificial intelligence for any of the things that you're doing today or.
- [57:46]
Ishita Raj
Not really.
- [57:47]
Shekhar Natarajan
Not really.
- [57:47]
Ishita Raj
Okay. I mean, I mean some of it, yeah. Yes.
- [57:50]
Shekhar Natarajan
But, but if you look at like all the images that are created in like, you know, A.I. they're perfect.
- [57:56]
Ishita Raj
Yeah, that I don't know. That I don't know how to do.
- [58:06]
Shekhar Natarajan
Though the word suggests it's artificial, it strives for perfection. Perfect. So but you're a real person, right? And then there is like something that is generated fake. So does real still win in this world or like, you know, the fake will overtake the world when like AI becomes like mainstay?
- [58:33]
Ishita Raj
I hope not, because, you know, I feel AI is built for speed, scale, efficiency, accuracy for measuring something. But measuring something and feeling something are two completely different things. You can create something as perfect as, as it looks. But to feel connected, you need to have just to feel something. You need to have a connect, which probably this would not, no matter how blemish free, how flawless a picture could look. But you will not feel it till the time you feel the connect. That connection comes from emotion. That is what is missing in an AI. And as much as you understand that, you would not let the fake supersede the real because it's as simple as that. Somebody is faking love. There is no difference that you can tell. There's no rule book. But somebody can say I love you and you would say okay, and somebody really means I love you. It's the same words, same three words said, but just the latter would hit differently to you. It'll move something different in you. It is the connect. So efficiency AI Also the trust. You know, like I said, efficiency AI can be trust in a human. I mean we would really trust an image and then we would like we know it's an AI and we would trust that this is great and flawless and that's when it'll probably take over the real thing. But that trust in humans does not come purely by efficiency. It comes by, like I said, by context, by what feels real. So you would only trust something or believe in something or go for it when it feels real. No matter how perfect it looks, you can have still an imperfect image and still like it more. So I don't think so that fake can take the real because it's about feelings. And feelings is what is missing in AI. They can work on commands and give you something perfect, but they cannot make you feel something perfect.
- [61:03]
Shekhar Natarajan
Well, they're making movies now with AI it's very sad.
- [61:07]
Ishita Raj
It's very sad. I mean, we. They say they're making movies, but I have not seen one. I don't know if there is a movie that's out you're quite a few of them. Quite a few. I've not seen any.
- [61:19]
Shekhar Natarajan
Some of them actually have won, like, awards.
- [61:23]
Ishita Raj
Have you seen.
- [61:24]
Shekhar Natarajan
Oh, absolutely. I make one all the time. Yeah, all the time, actually. So.
- [61:29]
Ishita Raj
But how is it?
- [61:31]
Shekhar Natarajan
It's as real as it can get. Literally. Literally. And so.
- [61:37]
Ishita Raj
But that's a very sad situation.
- [61:39]
Shekhar Natarajan
It is a sad situation. And I think, like, see, that's the whole, like.
- [61:43]
Ishita Raj
Because I'll tell you, AI can look as real, but at the end of the day, it's working on designed choices and the commands. That is put by a person. Right. As compared to a person reacting on it. Every person will have a different reaction to the same line. If you're working with a real actor, if you're working with an AI, he will give you. You'll write a command, this is what I want. I want. I want breakdown. I want sadness. And they would. And that's the template that they have for sadness. Whereas every person in the room will react differently to sadness. Some people will go quiet, some people will shout, some people will become stoic. You know, you understand sadness approach. That's what a real actor can do. Rather template commands, They would work around that. So, you know, I feel that magic will be missing. You can have a great visual. You can connect to the emotions. Happy, sad argument. But. I hope Nai. But you have to put in emotions. And if AI comes with also that value of empathy, more than accuracy, speed, accuracy, efficiency, logic, if it comes with the characteristics and traits like empathy, compassion, compassion, love, humility. Humility, then I feel AI will not just be, you know, it will not be accepted, it will be welcomed. Because that is when you feel like you have a. It's not a tool anymore, it's a partner. Then it's. It's like a responsible partner because it's giving you the same reactions. It's just not giving you accurate outcomes. It's also giving you not the best outcomes, but it's giving you the right outcomes also. Yeah.
- [63:59]
Shekhar Natarajan
So Ye Mera company, actually, that's exactly what I'm trying to build. So, like, the company that I'm building is called Angelic Intelligence.
- [64:12]
Ishita Raj
Oh, wow.
- [64:13]
Shekhar Natarajan
So as. As I mentioned, my life is a series of accidents and a lot of angels showing up.
- [64:19]
Ishita Raj
You building a company?
- [64:20]
Shekhar Natarajan
Yeah.
- [64:21]
Ishita Raj
Which is A.I.
- [64:21]
Shekhar Natarajan
it's A.I. it's an A.I. company.
- [64:23]
Ishita Raj
Oh.
- [64:24]
Shekhar Natarajan
It's. It's called like. So the parent company is called Orchestro. And. And basically, like, you know, as we started building Orchestra as a company, we found exactly to the point that you made like, AI is focused on efficiency and optimization. And my question was, what about human dignity? How do I actually, actually capture what makes a good human in the technology? What makes a human a human? And so that's what we've been trying to replicate in the technology. And so your thought into the universe is going to manifest very soon.
- [65:02]
Ishita Raj
Oh my God. Did you just find like a creative producer who can actually be. Did I pinpoint the right beats? What was required?
- [65:12]
Shekhar Natarajan
So see the. So that beats problem that you mentioned, right? Like, so I. A lot of things when I was growing up, I couldn't, I couldn't afford, you know, whether it is playing cricket or. I used to play really well. And my father used to like deliver telegrams for 175 rupees a month. Okay, so that's my background. So. And I just said, okay, like, you know, I'll discard all my passion and put it into the, into the box, forget it. And I'll just focus on my life. And, and then like, life took its own, like choice and turns and other things. And when all these AI tools started coming out, I said, like, how do I express my creative self out? I can paint. Like, you know, obviously I'll share some of my paintings that I have, so I can paint really well. But I also wanted to understand music. So Suno AI software, a lot of them actually now. And so I go like, compose my own music and I just post it on Spotify.
- [66:34]
Ishita Raj
AI is deceit. You're wrapping outcomes in deceit and selling it. This is my problem.
- [66:45]
Shekhar Natarajan
Where I think the difference will come is exactly what you pointed. The creative will create something that never existed. And that is where the edge is for a, for an artist in the future. The, the ability to create because AI is still reading patterns and it is mixing and matching. It's a DJ jaisayo. But like, you know, it is not able to comprehend and create something new.
- [67:15]
Ishita Raj
But having said that, since we're having this discussion, I really want to voice out something. No matter how optimized outcomes AI is giving and how easy they've made the world look and things and tasks look like a robot. But I feel it is very scary. It is.
- [67:35]
Shekhar Natarajan
Tell me more.
- [67:36]
Ishita Raj
It is very scary. I mean, what scares you? What should not get? Like, what should not scare you about AI? I'll talk about my personal experience. You see half the videos on Internet now or you see half the reels? Sometimes just say, I saw a reel of a ship. Some people were just sailing a ship in the sea and There was a dolphin that came and jumped in the ship. And it was a huge, huge ship. So she jumped in the. And. And there everybody is caressing the dolphin and playing dolphin or a shark. And it visually looked really nice. So now you don't believe anything, you know, level of trust or belief. I was at a. I was with a friend at a lounge and some people might have clicked pictures or ekto pictures. And later, three, four months back, I got tags of me sitting with my friend and we're kissing. He's my friend. We never kissed. People have just made an AI out of it. Having said that, it doesn't look as scary. When you see that you don't get worked up. Means in itana that will really put you in a state of panic. You know, you'll take two minutes to understand when was I like zoned out? Did I miss this? But obviously faces, they've been tweaked. But just watch shows, random videos, two actors and they're talking and then start kissing. Obviously, you know, it's AI but just that source of entertainment just to do that. And people are making this if entertainment. Just some people want to take pleasure in this, but we entertainment, you don't take it seriously. I mean, my dignity is not in the hands of people.
- [70:19]
Shekhar Natarajan
So I.
- [70:20]
Ishita Raj
That's how I think.
- [70:21]
Shekhar Natarajan
No, no, like, you know, so, you know, we all like, don't think about all these things till it starts hitting you home. Okay. So the two things that hit me home recently is one, like, you know, I'm a late bloomer and my, my son was born into 2020. He's five years old and like that guy looked exactly like my father.
- [70:48]
Ishita Raj
Father.
- [70:50]
Shekhar Natarajan
Okay. And I said. Basically Million Angels, Digital Valley, right? I have much limited time left in my life to leave for this guy. The only way I could do it is using technology. And then the second thing. So I, I was like, obviously very drawn into this. Like, what world am I going to leave my son? Like, you know, he's five years old, 20 years from now if he starts thinking fake is real and he loses all his cognitive ability to understand and like process things that we like, you know, are trained to do today.
- [71:36]
Ishita Raj
Since you're from San Francisco, you would know in Vegas and a lot more places you have your digital Ubers. Your. The car is actually driven without drivers. You have Uber deliveries or zomato deliveries, which are robots. So yahata. If you're using it as a tool to make your life simpler as. As compared to a manpower working for you, having a Machine working to do your daily chores. I feel it's helpful. But if you start replacing mankind with machines, then it could be destruction. Because if machines start thinking like humans and robot Rajnikanth emotions puts the world on fire. You know, it's a movie which was ahead of its time. But you never know. I mean, as long as it looks great and makes your work easier. I think so there has to be a limitation. It cannot just go left astray. Like in Abit. We are talking about it and I can tell you this. Like there was a picture, an AI Banadiya. Because we live in a world now. We're not trusting anything. So then you take a leap of faith. This is obviously fake and a lot of people would not even react to it. But this is the problem. A lot of people are not reacting to a lot of things and ignoring it. People have started ignoring things that you see. So whatever you see, listen until it hits you, you have stopped believing in whatever you see.
- [73:26]
Shekhar Natarajan
Yeah. Unless. And until you. It hits you, by the way, like till then you basically ignore it. Like you know, when the problem is home, then you begin to realize that this is very problematic. Like you know, so abhi, recently you must have heard about this. Like Elon Musk has a company called Grok and Grok started basically undressing people. Like you can actually put like images and it will undress people.
- [73:52]
Ishita Raj
Huh?
- [73:53]
Shekhar Natarajan
And undress, undress people, right? Like you know, like you know, nude pictures of anyone and you can prompt it and you can get a nude picture and all that stuff. So. And all that like they could do is they said like we are sorry. Right? Like imagine like you know, I'm a 13 year old and my picture is there. I cannot like ever bother of you. Right? Like and basically you can never take it out. You know, that's. That's the. That's the end. So would you want your son to live in that world? Would you want your daughter to live in that world? I say software Joe create Ho Chu. Basically virtue. Prescription.
- [74:45]
Ishita Raj
Really
- [74:48]
Shekhar Natarajan
Adam Bean. Yeah, basically who I. And in fact if you go like read.
- [74:55]
Ishita Raj
That's what I'm saying. That emotion that's missing from accuracy. Accuracy cannot. Logic cannot give you outcomes. Greater outcomes in life. What value scan. So AI is totally missing values. It's just making you act on commands and prompts.
- [75:13]
Shekhar Natarajan
But people who are creating it don't care. So if you go like look at like the recent interview from Sam Altman who actually is the creator of OpenAI, which is ChatGPT. Like very nonchalant. Interesting. Like comments recently like recent. AI may destroy humanity. I'm not like exactly like phrasing it like the way he said it, but you know, you get the drift of it. But great companies will be created along the way. So he doesn't think humanity should survive. He thinks like he's more concerned about creating a great company. That's his mindset. More recently he said something very interesting. He said every day 15,000 people die of suicide. Okay, so 10% of the people use ChatGPT. And he said like maybe we should have given them some advice not to commit that. Like right.
- [76:25]
Ishita Raj
Unaffected.
- [76:26]
Shekhar Natarajan
Very like, you know, it's like this very apathy. Like apathy, empathy, characters who are actually creating the next intelligence layer.
- [76:36]
Ishita Raj
But sir, if I may say you have given one example. You know, within your vicinity, within your own circle, there's so many people who you see, there's no parameter for good and bad. There's no parameter for ethical and non ethical. It's your own conscious and people around you. There's so many people who would be not having that consciousness of right and wrong. Yeah, Unka, right could be your right, your right could be their wrong or their wrong could be just entertainment for them. So in a world full of 7.2 billion, 8, 8.2 billion now, you cannot now school everybody for values and ethics. People now stay in a world when they want constant and immediate entertainment. They don't have a bandwidth to sit for three hours to even watch a film. Now that's longer. Three hours initially has now been cut to two and a half hours to now two hours now even shorter films one and a half hour, it seems to be lengthier. And now short films, vertical movies because attention span, that is a scary bit because you don't know when to stop. You have technologies that you can now what is this fun? What is this level of entertainment that you have to just undress somebody. So now people, kids who are in school, like young kids who are just formative years classmates, undress and having a good laugh, fun Lagra Aga. But you don't understand what are you forming their mindsets as. So there is no stop to it. Which is why I say my own
- [78:26]
Shekhar Natarajan
nephew went through a similar trauma. Like you know, he was trying to stop a fight with a few kids and he got bullied so bad, so bad that he went into depression and my sister in law had to fight to actually take down all of the, the posts and the messages and everything. All the toxic things that were created by kids Age, you know,
- [79:01]
Ishita Raj
no matter how easy the outcomes have become, it has killed the creativity of people. I mean, you ask us, cool kid to write something, Make it more stronger, make it more emotional, make it this. For prompts which are templates or chat GPT civil seed of thought idea, he can probably tweak it around. But that originality of even giving a vain answer, which could be funny. Dramatics exercise each one of you. Yeah, no, no, you have to feel like an animal and behave like an animal. So choose your own animal and nobody will tell. We have to guess. So obviously you know mannerism. So there was an actor who was just lying. He actually. Exactly. So he was just lying dead so nobody could understand. Then he said, and he said, I'm a crocodile and I'm just in the water dead and I'm just waiting for my prey to come. But you understand level of creativity, level of thought that we are not even asking our brains to think.
- [80:33]
Shekhar Natarajan
And the answers are also not like something that you can trust. If you were to ask Gemini, which is a Google tool, like about six months ago, it would say it is okay to put glue on a pizza. It went so viral. And because it's so viral and is so available in the world, it actually assumed that is the reality. Gemini started recommending to people.
- [81:19]
Ishita Raj
Because it data processing can never be, can never substitute wisdom. It is data processing. They can give you the data of the world. They can give you, they can give you database, they can give you counts, numbers, trps, followers. It can give you thoughts, it can give you options. But it cannot give you wisdom. It cannot give you logic. It cannot give you. It can give you the best answer. It cannot give you a real answer.
- [81:54]
Shekhar Natarajan
It would not give you the best answer, by the way, I'll tell you why. So we were doing a recent show like, you know, like the previous one that I did with Sonu Sood and with a cast of crew is was a show on longevity. And we'll get to that point also because I want to take on it. So it was about longevity and we said like, what is the implication of longevity in the society? And then basically we started like exploring what are the implications of that. And it actually we started generating some content about like what would it mean? And Both Claude and ChatGPT generated an answer saying after age 45, 20% of women will have Alzheimer's. Like, why would they have it? Had I not known and I not been curious, I would just accept it
- [82:55]
Ishita Raj
as a fact that post 50 years,
- [82:59]
Shekhar Natarajan
100 years, like 45 years. It says after 45 years 20% of
- [83:04]
Ishita Raj
women will have no, but what span are they talking about? If anybody will live 300 days.
- [83:10]
Shekhar Natarajan
So that, that is what it was missing. So it took like data from three different sources and just simply summarized to me and said after 45 years women, 20% of women will have Alzheimer's. So what the answer should have been is after 20, 45 years through the lifespan, 20% have a probability of having Alzheimer's.
- [83:34]
Ishita Raj
Probability cannot be possibility.
- [83:36]
Shekhar Natarajan
And it is not like Shuri, this is what the problem is like, you know, like when you start like, you know, mixing and matching.
- [83:44]
Ishita Raj
Yeah, But today we can have this discussion is because we have seen AI right now. Now imagine a 10 year old has a phone. Now there's hardly anybody who doesn't have a phone. And I'm sure this is not debatable, but every tenure, 90% of the tenure would be having a phone. So now they don't know right and wrong. They just know how to be real. And this is real for them because they are fed into it so restrictively developed. Oga having given the tools that will make their life easier. Logical they would have accessibility, but accessibility will. Will it give them the acumen to understand real or fake right and wrong? I'm pretty sure a tenure grown into years later, who's gradually will be a 30 year old, you know, his way of thinking will be very different, will be very different from this conversation we're having today also is because real, which we know is so fake, but because formative years. This is what world is. This is what the world looks like. My world is just not my street in my colony. This is a fragment, a miniscule element of the world that I'm a part of. Or which is already so fake, which they think already is real. Yeah. So wow, this is interesting. That's why I say it's scary.
- [86:06]
Shekhar Natarajan
It is scary. So this and it's also scary for many other reasons. And the. We had like a design philosophy. Like, you know, I had the good fortune of working for a lot of good companies. One question that we always asked when we design systems like Jasabi, Swiggy, Abdeghrain, that is something that my team pioneered in 2013, like the whole crowdsource delivery model. And at that time, so when we started doing that, we used to fundamentally ask one question. Every company I worked Am I designing a system for a, for the current generation or am I generating like you know, designing something for a five year old who will be a 25 year old, 20 years from now and what will that look like and how do I design that? That thinking is largely absent in artificial intelligence.
- [87:06]
Ishita Raj
Yeah.
- [87:06]
Shekhar Natarajan
So we are only designing for instant gratification. Yes, efficiency for today, like you know, short term goals.
- [87:13]
Ishita Raj
And I'll tell you why it's easily being accepted also because it started with something extremely productive. A book, my show, a Spotify Swiggy, a Zomato, an Uber. Now these are the tools that are imperative that are really a bane. There is no downsides. This is called progression. And living in a progressive society. And from where to where this is absolutely 100% there is no brainer, there is no debate about it, that this is not technological growth which is really helping us. So because we've had these means make my trip. You know, you don't have travel agents now. You don't have to go online. It's just on your fingertip. Everybody can. Life has become a lot more easier with these tools because this has happened. So now we are replacing mankind with AI. So as long as technology you are is working for you, it's great. The minute you start working for technology that can be disastrous. That can be a calamity which I think so I don't know if people are understanding. I mean a lot of us are but yeah, I don't know how to stop that or where to stop. There has to be a somewhere. But I feel a lot of people are aware no matter how much we are progressing, a lot more people are becoming more rooted and accepting, more traditional. Going back to the traditions and roots. Chota's example just by the way you eat now gym, gym, gym, gym gym was the new fad fitness. But now people start understanding the importance of yoga, of breath work, of waking up and doing pranayam of because lifting weights and building your body a certain way. Now people are understanding cannot be as healthy as also cleansing your body from within. Pumping muscles are different and cleansing your body is different. Just the breath work which will clear your respiratory system which will be more greater for your hormonal imbalance and how your VAT pit cuff works or Ayurveda. A lot more people are understanding allopathic medication is not the only solution to life and to problems in life. Is not the only solution. But you have Giloy Koju, you have naturopathy. If I fall sick as much as I remember, I don't take allopathic medicines. Like I would trust more natural remedies which I always do. If I I had sinus, I developed sinus I'm from. I'm a Delhi girl, so I'm from a hot and dry climate. I came to Mumbai. It's humid here. So I don't know when I developed a slight sinus problem. And I took, as anybody would an antibiotic course antibiotic or to a point when you know you can't breathe because you're so choked. And I was an autumn. Everybody who has sinus would understand what's autumn and the importance of autumn in everybody's life. Because people are living an otrain. It's a nasal drop. And your nose is fully blocked. And you need it like you need it as you need air. And you put autoimmune just to clear out so that you can start breathing. So. There's no end. There is no solution to sinus and allopathy. I understood. You just have to be on. Nothing will clear. And because I'm very far from naturally chain of thought it. I feel you need to. You need to amend yourself or you need to work on yourself naturally as much as you can. So I took. Homeopathy is a slow process. It's a slow burner. But allopathy does not eradicate the problem from your system. It suppresses it. K so exactly. Bigger problems. What is the bypass? If you have a heart cartilage blockage, allopathy will cut you out and create an artificial system of artificial arteries. They'll put in pipes artificial system. That's called a bypass because natural process bypass ban or you have a span of 5, 10, 15 years. It is not clearing your original arteries because there's no. There is no science right now developed in there, but just Ayurveda naturopathy I feel clears your system out naturally. It makes your body mend itself naturally. And our herbs, our science is so strong we just need to rely on it personally because I totally rely on it. I will not take. I really have SOS and I have to be at work and I really need to get immediate results. I would rather lie or medicines. No matter how many medicines you take. So I would lie in bed for three, two days and be fine. It goes. So yeah.
- [93:30]
Shekhar Natarajan
So let's talk a little bit about your family and your. Your. Your relationship with your siblings and other things. So tell me more about that.
- [93:39]
Ishita Raj
I've had a great childhood. I've got a great family, I think so whatever I am, it is because of your family behind you. I have an elder sister. I have a younger brother. And both can be. You're a sword, you know. You know your bow and arrow. It's like I can hit the target because I, I know I have got my, I've got my armor there. So yes, they're my friends. They. I chill with them. We have got a great relationship, very close to them.
- [94:12]
Shekhar Natarajan
And like, you know, coming to your, you know, you being an actor, like, you're always under the scanner, you know, even if you were to even like, to your point, go out to a dinner, your next day you're on the news saying that like, you know, you're out dating someone and doing this and doing that. Like, does it put like unnecessary pressure on you? And like, how do you deal with all those circumstances?
- [94:36]
Ishita Raj
You don't deal with it at all.
- [94:37]
Shekhar Natarajan
You just like ignore it.
- [94:39]
Ishita Raj
Yeah. Because now you. I don't know how it works for other people. I'm telling you about how it works. You need to have a little disconnected mindset and awareness. You know, what is the truth. You live by your truth. Not for validation and not to please people. It used to affect you. It used to affect me. Till the time you really give importance to it and trying to prove everyone if you're right. You don't have to prove everyone. It's okay. It is. If it's not bothering. Till the time it's not bothering you and people around you who matter. It should not bother. It should not. You should not give it too much importance. So, you know, there are news and you live in a society which is a little fabricated. You live in a society where, you know, this is. You are exposed to news and rumors and speculations which are untrue or true. So it's importance. You don't have to give to every little thing because if you start giving importance to everything around you, it'll be exhausting.
- [95:39]
Shekhar Natarajan
And, and so let's. So I, I know that like, you know, you are probably everyone aspires to be with you and like every. I'm sure that is the case, but.
- [95:54]
Ishita Raj
No, please tell me. I'm sure you, You've also done through your data processing. Not that I'm aware of.
- [96:01]
Shekhar Natarajan
I don't know, like, you know, you should know better.
- [96:03]
Ishita Raj
So, so.
- [96:05]
Shekhar Natarajan
But I'm sure like, you know, like, so the, and in the, in the world of like, you know, media and like, you know, the way people consume media, they like sensationalism. Right. So I'm sure, like it does, you know, it's very easy to say it doesn't affect me, but it does affect you and it does.
- [96:26]
Ishita Raj
What affects you?
- [96:27]
Shekhar Natarajan
Like, you know, the disinformation, intuition, Disinformation. Okay, right. So, so how do you, like, you know, even if you bring someone into your life, how do you stay private? Like how do you deal with that scenario? Like
- [96:45]
Ishita Raj
how do you stay private?
- [96:47]
Shekhar Natarajan
Or do you need to stay private?
- [96:49]
Ishita Raj
You should stay private. I feel this is my personal opinion on. They say now you travel and you don't tell. So it's the same phenomenon. It's like you, it's the same phenomena that you should not talk about it all the time. You know, it is there. So a lot of times when you're purely talking, because you mentioned that even work, even relationships, there are a lot of times you are figuring it out, you are. Or you mention your happiness while somebody is feeling deprived, you know, that energy goes around. I don't know if it really can affect. But I personally, till the time it matters, keep it private. And for your own understanding relationships, a lot of times not every relationship will be the one where you are settling for it. So why talk about, you know, 10 people will be talking, misinterpreting, not giving it as much respect. So even friendships. So I don't think so everything should be shared with everyone. Because not everything or not all your information that you hold dearly will be dealt as carefully or as respectfully by other people. They will not care, they will mock it or however. I'm not saying. But staying private, I feel is better. Till the time you're also sure about things work wise. Also let the work happen and let the work speak for itself rather than you bragging and talking and telling every next person that this, this, this, this, this, then people will just go behind your back. But you cannot go back to that person and justify. No, no, actually it was supposed to start happen, it got delayed and now it's a delay of six months. So let it happen. Let your work speak for itself rather than you talking too much about it.
- [99:13]
Shekhar Natarajan
So I have two more topics to cover and then we are off.
- [99:15]
Ishita Raj
Okay.
- [99:17]
Shekhar Natarajan
The first one I have for you is longevity. And the second one I have for is empowerment. Longevity.
- [99:23]
Ishita Raj
I like these topics. Longevity, AI life, medicine.
- [99:32]
Shekhar Natarajan
What people are saying right now, Ishita, is that David Sinclair, he's a very renowned professor at Harvard and he thinks he if you take a pill which will be available in the next five to 10 years, you can live as long as 250 years. Right? And then there's also a lot of scientific breakthrough, alpha fold and other things which are coming out which is really trying to decipher the proteins in the body, how to remake Them and everything like that. So I, I believe in the, the promise of medicine. Right.
- [100:10]
Ishita Raj
So.
- [100:11]
Shekhar Natarajan
And traditionally, if you look at like, you know, life expectancy, the life expectancy was. Has actually improved quite a bit from 1900s to 2000s. So as a woman, it's like it's so difficult to be a woman in a society. Like expectations are very different. You're a mother, you're like, you know, someone's, someone's spouse. You are basically like, you know, your daughter to someone expectations. So like, you know, how do you even tell a woman that living longer is good? Because, you know, like.
- [101:05]
Ishita Raj
So you're saying how much you would want to live a life like that under permissions and, and like, you know,
- [101:12]
Shekhar Natarajan
live up to 300 years. Right. You know, like, if you were to live up to 300 years, would you want to live that life?
- [101:17]
Ishita Raj
Ah, you know, I would want to live a life given that everybody is going to live that long. I don't want to live if my friends are dying young. I don't want to live when my parents will not be there. I mean, you are aware of Kichalo parents is still. But even parents. Yeah, even family. I need my siblings, I need my friends. I need people I grew up with. I need the people I'm growing up with. So when you have your people, then you, you can get dirty. You can get, you can be a part of the same, you know, crime partners. You can have the same jokes, you can have the same fun. I. It'll be tiring for me to. If you talking individually. Where you can when. Because then you're a part of the same thing. You're a part of the same evolution. You're the part of the same 30, 40 years of figuring life out. Then another 20 years of detoxing what you've learned already, unlearning it. Then another 30 years of after you've understood life and now complete shift in living a different life. And then after those hundred years, another finding another way of living life which we don't. Which we don't know, which we are unaware of. It's completely imaginative. But talking of imagination, if I have to think of it, it's not that it's not a bad thought. And we can shift to a world where everyone is living 100 years. Yes, we have more time on Earth and I think so we'll have different ways of living, different ways of figuring. We might figure if we've understood and cracked life and we've understood cracked a pill, I'm sure we'll have more developments. We'll, you know, we might just explore the world more. We'll have more species, we might just find more species, more islands, more life around and we can cohabitat with them. So it can be an interesting ride.
- [103:36]
Shekhar Natarajan
It could be. And it is also like something that the society is not like being prepared for. So this could happen in the next 10 years. So we should. Which, which means that the way you think about planning your finances, the way you think about like thinking about craft, the way you think about relationships, the way you think about marriage, the way you think about like children, the way you think about like, wow. All those things, wow.
- [103:58]
Ishita Raj
I am enjoying this. I'm just enjoying the thought. I hope this is also not an AI thought.
- [104:04]
Shekhar Natarajan
No, it is not.
- [104:05]
Ishita Raj
Now it's so difficult to believe what is real and true.
- [104:07]
Shekhar Natarajan
No, that is good.
- [104:08]
Ishita Raj
But if this is gonna happen in 10 imagine I want it to happen during the life our lifespan. Because you know, I'll tell you how no matter how exhausting and surprising and overwhelming this sounds, but if you take out history every changing time has not been taught, has not been warned. It comes and then everybody adapts through. Like my dad tells me that mobile phones came when he was way younger. I saw phones very early in school. So now this is a shift that we can have a walkie talkie which will be mobile phones later called and everything cannot. You don't have to be near the landline, you can be tracked anywhere. Then we got Google Maps which was, I remember I was in London navigation tomtomolte. But now we have navigation. We don't have to ask people on the road, do you see the shift? So please tell me any shift that has happened that the older generation has not seen, have they been tutored or prepared for it, which the younger generation either your kids teach you, your friends teach you, people teach you, colleagues teach you, society teaches you. You are preparing yourself for everything AI has happened. Now we did not even know about codes in AI and anything that can be Photoshop professional Photoshop photographers use for cleaning the picture up. And now a 10 year old can clean his picture up because it's not Photoshop or Adobe Kitney apps beauty filters. So has anybody been taught about it like you say you have still in the West? Not. Not in a country where you have cars driven without drivers. Could anybody imagine, like my grandfather would say, that cars came in front of us. Now we have cars being driven by no one. You know, we had a film Mr. India where everything was moved and the Person was not visible. And that was a. It was a fantasy. It was a fiction film that looked entertainment. It is happening. Who knew, 30, 40 years apart, this will happen and people will accept it like a norm. It is not a headline in the newspaper tomorrow. This is gonna happen. So be prepared for it. The society adapts to it. So when you say 10 years, it's going to happen, and what will be the outcome? I'm telling you, everybody's going to adapt to it. Naturally, you want to adapt to it. Like how we've adapted social media, how we've adapted phones, how we've adapted AI robots. And it'll be surprising. It'll be a. A little jitter in the beginning that, oh, okay, this is happening. But because we live under so much of pressure of just knowing. If my friend knows, you would want to know, what is this? What is the app you're using? What is the tool that you use? What is Chat GPT? I'm sure if today somebody is using Chat GPT or he will immediately download. So everybody is adapting to the progressive times and accepting it. The only ones which will not understand it is people who are really far from it. People who are, I don't know, like 90 years old, who've not seen a world, evolved. So. And maybe they. It doesn't matter to them that if you have flying cars, because they don't care. Because after an age in life, you don't care about competing, about success, about soaring, about excelling in validation. You meet a point in life when you're, you know, life matters. What you make out of life doesn't matter.
- [108:33]
Shekhar Natarajan
Got it.
- [108:34]
Ishita Raj
So I feel everybody's gonna adapt. So if we, in 10 years, if we're gonna have a life span of 200 years, I'm sure everybody's gonna adapt to it. And. And nobody's gonna obviously die. Some people will choose, some people might not to take that pill and live longer. But I'll have a polling around. I'm gonna definitely make my parents have it. And yeah, if my friends and everybody's having, I'm gonna pop a pill. I'm gonna be living 200 years. Why not? Why not? It's gonna be a rap.
- [109:08]
Shekhar Natarajan
There are a lot of deeper society problems which get created because of that. But, you know, we can unpack it in the next one. But last question, women's empowerment. What does it mean to you?
- [109:20]
Ishita Raj
Women empowerment? I feel, you know, power just comes from freedom. It comes from. I. According to me, it comes from freedom of thought, freedom of doing what you Want, that's when you can feel powerful of accepting or owning something. You want to own a career, you want to do something when you're not under pressure. That's when you can feel in control of yourself. You can feel like you can take control. Taking control gets you power. So just that freedom of who you can be who you want to be and you can.
- [110:10]
Shekhar Natarajan
How do you empower others?
- [110:13]
Ishita Raj
How do I empower others?
- [110:15]
Shekhar Natarajan
Other like, you know, people who are like you or like, you know, people who are like in living in the slums and like, you know, people who need another chance. How do you empower them?
- [110:28]
Ishita Raj
By giving them means, by creating a world where women, specifically, since you mentioned women, empowerment, when they cannot feel lesser, when they cannot feel deprived, when they cannot feel obligated to take permission to be who they are.
- [110:50]
Shekhar Natarajan
Have you done that?
- [110:51]
Ishita Raj
No. I come from a place and very secure environment. My father and my mother have given really all the wings to all three of us, my sister, my brother and I, to be exactly who we are. I remember, you know, in school because I was a younger one, so my sister sometimes she did not step out for films or just with friends so often. And my friends, we had a. We were a group of five girls and we used to make a lot of plans. After school we'll go for coffee and Delhi had this joint called Big Chill and we'd be chilling. So I used to get out too much and my mom used to like, you know, see your sister, she's responsible and I used to get a bashing every next day that you're not responsible. I don't like this and this and that. And I remember my dad just told my mum that she's got a different set of friends. Her friends don't step out, so she's not getting out. My friends are making plans. Not that I'm actively making all of my girlfriends step out. So because my friends are making plans and we are getting out, obviously it has to be in control and I have to be in check. But just. Even if they're sisters, we have a different way of looking at life. We are different. We have different ways of just reacting different things in life, having a different lifestyle, even if we are from the same house and same school, just experiencing different things differently. So. So my parents have been extremely supportive and I also want to say I am whatever I am today. When you say, how did you. That time that you kept, you didn't stop and you didn't quit and you used it as a fuel. I was not that strong. I could not have done it. I have a very strong. You need to have anchor. And I want to say this to everybody. You need to have a very strong anchor. No matter. We think we are soloists, but nobody is a soloists here. You need an anchor coming from your grandparents, from your parents, from your siblings, whoever. But we need that push. No matter we think we're so independent, we still need an anchor who can just reassure us we can do it. You have one person like that doing to you incapacity of parents anyhow. Any relation you would want to. You would take that leap and go for it.
- [113:21]
Shekhar Natarajan
So with that, like, you know, I know that we covered quite a bit of range and base. I wish you really amazing success with all the things that you're working on, and I'm sure you're going to be super successful in whatever you try.
- [113:36]
Ishita Raj
Yes.
- [113:37]
Shekhar Natarajan
So with that, Ishita, like, you know, we really thank you for your time here on the show. Thank you for spending the two hours with us. It's been amazing. I didn't even.
- [113:48]
Ishita Raj
It's been two hours.
- [113:48]
Shekhar Natarajan
Yeah, it's almost been two hours now.
- [113:50]
Ishita Raj
Really?
- [113:50]
Shekhar Natarajan
Yeah.
- [113:51]
Ishita Raj
I just feel a little bit of
- [113:52]
Shekhar Natarajan
like, you know, with like five minutes of coffee break here and there. But it's been a fascinating conversation and really enjoyed it and I'm sure the viewers are also going to enjoy it.
- [114:02]
Ishita Raj
Likewise. Likewise. It was a fun chat. I enjoyed it thoroughly.
- [114:07]
Shekhar Natarajan
Thank you so.