Tony Mantour (2:06)

Welcome to why Not Me? Embracing Autism and Mental Health Worldwide. Hosted by Tony Mantour. Broadcasting from the heart of Music City, usa, Nashville, Tennessee. Join us as our guests share their raw, powerful stories. Some will spark laughter. Others will move you to tears. These real life journeys inspire, connect and remind you that you're never alone. We're igniting a global movement to empower everyone to make a lasting difference by fostering deep awareness, unwavering acceptance, and profound understanding of autism and mental health. Tune in, be inspired, and join us in transforming the world one story at a time. Hi, I'm Tony Mantour. Welcome to why Not Embracing Autism and Mental Health Worldwide. Joining us today is Sarah Hartley. She is the visionary behind SLH Creative Group and a fierce advocate for the neurodivergent community. She's an author, a storyteller, a guide, and a champion for those whose minds dance to a different rhythm. She channels her lived experience into books that are both a rallying cry and a roadmap. She will give us insight to her Purposely Me series, which is a collection of engaging, heart centered, social emotional books for kids navigating anxiety, adhd, dyslexia, and other neurodiverse experiences. Whether she's coaching individuals, consulting with organizations, or penning her next book, she hopes to inspire everyone when it comes to living authentically and thriving on our own terms. She has a great story to tell. So before we dive into our episode, we'll be back with an uninterrupted show right after a word from our sponsors.

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Tony Mantour (4:35)

Thanks for joining us today.

Sarah Hartley (4:37)

Oh, thank you for having me. It's a pleasure to be here.

Tony Mantour (4:40)

Yes, my pleasure as well. If you would give us a little information on what you're doing.

Sarah Hartley (4:44)

I'm Sarah Hartley. I am a mom of two neurodivergent boys. I'm a healthcare executive and I've written 14. Now, a couple weeks ago it would have been 13, but 14 children's books centered around neurodiversity and difficult topics for children. And I'm also an ADHD and neurodiversity certified coach. Coach.

Tony Mantour (5:06)

That's really good. Let's start with the coaching side first. What led you to get involved with coaching?

Sarah Hartley (5:13)

Honestly, it was my son's journey and everything that we have gone through to really understand his ADHD diagnosis. He's now almost nine and a lot of this started around even 18 months old of where there were specific things that we saw of where he might have needed some early intervention. And so that really took me on a journey of understanding my own ADHD a bit more and really just wanting to be able to provide information to parents and children out there within my children's books so that it becomes more of that credible source and have those true parenting strategies that will ultimately help for us to calm ourselves, to help mirror that and calm our children as well. And so within each of the books that I written in the back, there are discussion questions, there are different calming strategies used throughout. And so I wanted to ensure that what I was articulating to those that will read these, that it was as accurate as possible because I am touching on very sensitive subjects.

Tony Mantour (6:21)

You say you touch on some sensitive subjects. Can you expand on that?

Sarah Hartley (6:25)

One is around bullying, death, divorce. There's another. Given the appropriateness level of the age group, it being more elementary school kids, there is one on drills as well. And so I know that one really hits close to home in Colorado. And, you know, a few weeks ago we had the shooting at Evergreen High School. And so even just the anxiety that comes with children doing fire drills and tornado drills and now active shooter drills, there's a tremendous amount of anxiety from that. And so other topics are anxiety, dyslexia, adhd, autism. So it really runs the full gamut of various things that can be neurodiverse, but really are all centered around mental health.

Tony Mantour (7:07)

Yeah, those are all great topics. What kind of feedback are you getting when you put something new like this out? You never know what to expect. You can get positive, you can get negative. You just never know what to expect. So how's the feedback? I'm assuming it's good.

Sarah Hartley (7:25)

So far, we've only shown these books to therapists, OTs, and different members of school organizations. So whether it's been a principal or a social emotional coordinator or teachers themselves or teachers that are within the gifted program to get that feedback, that was really step one, even before I was paired with an illustrator. So we've already run through that process. The first book will actually launch in November, and then we'll have one a month coming out after that. So stay tuned. They're coming very soon. But one of the most critical pieces of feedback I received from actually a therapist is she said, I see myself in this book, but I see my daughter in the other book. And so I think it's really important that while this is directed for children, there's still this element of where an adult can say, oh, wow, I see myself there. And an adult can feel a little bit less alone in their own brains as well.

Tony Mantour (8:20)

As I understand it, then, you have written this mainly for children, even though adults may see themselves in it. This is written so children can focus on things that may affect them.

Sarah Hartley (8:32)

Absolutely. So they are children's books. They're written in lyrical format. The illustrations really bring to life the raw emotions of the characters. It's a classroom of students, and so you're hearing from a different child who's going to be shown throughout the entire series where they are integrated into each other's lives. Given that there are specific neurodiversities that these topics are touching on, I'm ensuring that the font is open dyslexic font, so that those who have dyslexia have an easier time reading this. And while of course it's centered around children, there is an element that I believe there might be an older group that may find this just as appealing. When I think about the ADHD brain, it's not always the inability to focus, but sometimes determining, you know, what to focus on because there are so many things. And so sometimes when it comes to self help books or things that might not have as much of a attention grab to really fully get ingrained in the book, that might be where an adult says, oh, wow, this was very digestible and yet very, very helpful. And the questions at the end were very thought provoking and really allowed me to take a step back and look at myself and what really was causing maybe some of my triggers or noticing some of those differences and really having that moment of, oh, wow, that that might be me, that that character sounds a lot like me. So, you know, it's for children, but I think it really can appeal to all ages.

Tony Mantour (9:58)

Yeah, I can see why. You know, I have heard so many stories of where a parent would take their son or daughter to a doctor, trying to find answers to their questions. When they started getting the answers to their questions, then they started realizing, hey, I have the same issues they're having. This could be me. So with that said, are you getting the feedback that you thought you might get from all this?

Sarah Hartley (10:27)

Some just elements of language used that maybe modify this or make sure there's a glossary of terms so that you're able to truly resonate with all elementary students. My son, my oldest son, and even my younger one as well. They're both highly gifted and so they're in the gifted and talented program. Their vocabulary is much larger than say, the average nine year old. My oldest is actually eight, but he's in fourth grade. He started kindergarten at four years old. He'll be nine actually in a few weeks. What he understood and knew within the book and the vocabulary I initially was using was maybe not as friendly or user friendly for, you know, all children that are elementary school age. So there was a, you know, a bit of those revisions to go back and say, okay, I really need to think about how this might land. And then would it be beneficial to layer in some of those words? And so my oldest son really was instrumental in one, inspiring most of these books. And also he's walked through all of them with me as well and said, oh, mom, I think you should maybe change it to this. Or I don't think we're going to understand what that means. We're going to need a definition for that one. But I also want for a parent to be able to walk through it or a teacher and have that conversation that will continue throughout the book. So it gives a teaching moment as well of, oh, maybe I'm not sure what ADHD means or what is an intervention. You know, things like that where you can really take a moment and pause and have some of those additional conversations with your children.

Tony Mantour (11:56)

Well, sounds like all the comments you got were very constructive. How long did this take you to put together?

Sarah Hartley (12:02)

It's taken quite some time. It's been a labor of love as it's not my day job and so is definitely a passion project of mine. It was probably in 2021 that I had the first idea and I was really at a low point and breaking point. I had just been diagnosed with Lyme disease. My oldest had just been diagnosed with ADHD and sensory processing disorder and highly gifted. And so with all that information, I was having that moment in the shower of what is my purpose? Why am I here? And that really sparked my creativity for the first book. And then they grew a bit from there and I'd put it down or maybe come back to it. And it wasn't until last summer, July of 24, that I was able to meet with a book coach. And that really took it from seven books to really developing this full theme. And now what are gonna be 14 books and making sure that all of those elements really tie and also, again, having those readers on the front end to help with that sensitivity aspect. One thing I learned as well, you alluded to earlier around autism and understanding that there can be a bit of controversy of are you person first or are you diagnosis first? And many people want to lead with person first. You know, I am Sarah. I'm not leading by my diagnosis. So that was something that we walked through and played around with to decide, you know, what direction we would go. And we ultimately went with person first. So that, you know, that ultimately ought to. Is not defining who you are, but it is a part of who you are. And so that could be one later that might spark some controversy or just spark some conversations which I think are all healthy. And I don't know that that everybody is in on one side or the other. So I think that gives a nice platform to just continue some of those conversations.

Tony Mantour (13:46)

Yeah, that makes perfect sense. Did this lead you to create a group? I see on your website it says SLH group. Is that you or do you have other people that are involved in what you're doing?

Sarah Hartley (14:00)

I am primarily the group. There are definitely other consultants that are coming in and giving those opinions. They are also giving quotes around what they found informative within the books, what they found really powerful. And so that will also be part of even the front and back cover where you'll see some of those quotes from certified professionals. But yes, you know, my hope is to one day be able to expand this further where there are more of these conversations happening, but a lot of them in the school system and allowing for children to ultimately feel less alone in what that diagnosis that they have might be. So maybe they're paired with another child who has some similarities. Maybe they both like Legos, but they also have autism, or maybe, you know, they both have parents that have cancer. You know, there's a lot of those hard topics that we do not touch on. And when I was in school, I didn't have that kind of support. I didn't know that I had ADHD until I was 25 years old, which is apparently, as I've learned more an interesting timeframe in life to learn that most people, it's either when they're very young or usually when they're, you know, hitting their 40s and they become moms, especially for women. And so for me, I could have gone back to that child and said, you know, hey, it's okay, of why you're feeling this different in your own brain.

Tony Mantour (15:20)

And this might be why you just touched upon expansion. What are your goals, let's say over the next three to five years, to build a bigger platform in order to help more people.

Sarah Hartley (15:33)

I ultimately would really love to have a full running platform within the school system that allows for some, maybe it's virtual connection, but that we leverage the books for a essentially curriculum and have use each one of those almost. You could even think of it like a Book club, in essence, where you have these hard topics that you're having conversations about. You know, they read together the book as a group, there's a counselor who is helping to guide them, and then ultimately they have some sort of commonality that allows for them to feel a little bit less alone. In my opinion, we have a mental health crisis that is, that's what's happening within our schools. And I think there's a lot that we have to do to ensure that our children are not having any of those mental health capabilities that are going to lead to gun violence. You know, I always have that moment of what was going on in that child's mind. Did they have support? Did they have some sort of neurodivergency or mental health thing that was going on that we missed and what could we have done if that child had a friend and that friend said, hey, I feel that way too. And then there's this moment of connection and that somehow allows for us to no longer have to worry. This morning, you know, I hugged my child goodbye and it's not every day, but this morning I had that moment of I'm going to make sure this is a big hug and a good goodbye because I don't know if something could happen in your school today.

Tony Mantour (17:03)

Yeah, it's a scary time. There's no doubt about that. When you're dealing with serious mental illness, that's a whole complete different situation than adhd, bipolar or autism, even though sometimes they all can overlap each other. So because of that, it can fall under that mental health umbrella with the mental illness. Okay, this is kind of a two part question. When you say school system, are you thinking local schools or are you thinking maybe nationwide? The second part of this question is, are you concerned because you're touching on subjects that could possibly be a little overwhelming for some of them. The school system now sometimes have these people that look at a book and if they don't particularly like it, all of a sudd sudden banned. And it might be just because it has ADHD or whatever word that person may not like. Does that concern you at all?

Sarah Hartley (18:05)

Absolutely. You know, I had moments throughout the entire last year of pause thinking as I heard of other books being banned in other states and areas and had this moment of what I'm actually doing and all the time I'm spending, is that pointless? And so, you know, that's where my own self doubt creeps in and I have to have that. And I think my book coach really was wonderful in that reminder of here for A reason this is your purpose and you have to continue to get that message out. But I would start locally. Being in Colorado, it depends on the school. But I am very fortunate that while we are in Jefferson County Public Schools, my children are going to what I find to be one of the best schools in the county. They have a gifted and talented program where it's a school within a school. And so, you know, whether it's their library, music, art, pe, the classes are all intermingled with general education. And so there are many kids there, of course, who have a lot of neurodiversity with large gifted classes. And so they are very heavy, social, emotional based. And they even follow the. This program called Leader in Me. It's based on the highly. The seven habits of highly effective people for children. And so they work through those habits every month. There's a different one throughout the year. And so it's something that there are specific schools that this will resonate with. And that's a great place to start. I also think after. After, you know, having a tragedy, as we did with Evergreen High School and in being the home of Columbine as well, Colorado might look at this a bit differently and say, okay, I see where this is going to be powerful and what can eventually lead for those who are NeuroDiverse or have ADHD or autism or sensory processing disorder, all of that can lead to anxiety and depression in their teen years, especially when the hormones begin. And so if we can start earlier, as I felt like my child benefited so much from early intervention intervention starting that at two and a half years old, and I had really wished he had gotten into it sooner. I think the earlier that we start with building that foundation that they're accepted for all of their differences, that's going to grow into something along the way. And so I imagine in certain areas I will get pushback. I think there's others that will embrace it and eventually it will catch on. Of course, my ultimate goal is for this to be national.

Tony Mantour (20:29)

Are you going to be selling this book nationwide? Is it going to be for anyone that would like to have it?

Sarah Hartley (20:35)

Absolutely. So it will. It will be, you know, direct to consumer. There will also be an avenue for schools. But, you know, someone may only want to buy the book on ADHD and they may not want the full set. And because of that, you know, I want to make that very flexible where there might be some group packagings that make sense together of, you know, now we have ones that are around, you know, certain confidence or resilience that really pair well together and others that you can just buy a single book. And I will also have an ebook available as well. A few teacher friends have said, you know, with our students we like to put it up on their mimeo boards so that they're able to show it in a large format so all the kids in the entire classroom can see. Makes it a lot easier. I've gone in and been a parent reader and, and done the mystery book reader with my son's class before and it is difficult because you have 30 kids crowded around you and they all want to see the illustrations and they're, you know, fighting with each other. You need to sit down or I want to sit in the front. And so being able to have it on a large screen in the classroom I think is going to be really important. I've also noticed that my son will bring home a few pages of a book and a lot of them do have to do with differences and there are. They are social, emotionally heavy and there's questions in the back and then for homework they'll have to bring that back in. So that's where I could see this going long term term as well. Of it could be a handout that's sent home with children and then they have to actually do some of those discussion questions in the back.

Tony Mantour (22:02)

Yeah, great idea. Where will they be able to get it?

Sarah Hartley (22:05)

Right now all of the information that I'm putting out there for updates and calming strategies and my aligned parenting method, all of that is found either on my website or Instagram. It's Sarah Lewish Hartley.com S A R A L E W I S and then aralishartly is my Instagram handle.

Tony Mantour (22:27)

That's good for them to know. Now do you see it eventually getting to Amazon and other bookstores around the country?

Sarah Hartley (22:33)

Yes, potentially. I've learned a lot about Amazon and how that works. So it's an interesting animal. But yes, absolutely, we will make it as easily accessible as possible.

Tony Mantour (22:42)

Of course they can get it from your website, which is actually a more direct path anyways.

Sarah Hartley (22:47)

Absolutely. And that's what we're working through right now. The logistics around being able to take the everything from print to the direct to consumer and get that out there for everyone.

Tony Mantour (22:57)

Yeah, that's great. Now what would you like to tell our listeners that you think is very important that they know about what you're doing and your plans for the future?

Sarah Hartley (23:09)

There are two things that I'd really love for listeners to grasp onto. The first is a philosophy that I've developed around echo parenting. And you said it yourself earlier when you mentioned a lot of parents will understand that they might have ADHD or autism them after their child has been diagnosed. So echo parenting is really understanding and learning that you're on this parallel journey with your child, and you're really learning alongside of them. And their behaviors are really a reflection of what you may need to heal with your inner child. And I think the hardest part about having a child who's neurodivergent is being neurodivergent yourself and trying to maintain that calm presence. Because what I've learned is when your child is melting down, you have to also stay calm. And if you're not calm, it's going. Going to exacerbate what's happening with your child, and they may explode further. And so the aligned parenting method that I have developed is really a way to walk through and understand that awareness within your body, figure out and label what those emotions are that you're having, then identify the triggers, what's causing that. There's always that root cause, whether that is you're hungry or maybe you've had a long day or it's hot outside or it's crowded, you're overwhelmed with sensory overload. And then you use and leverage a grounding technique that works for you. And lastly, whether you're doing this alongside your child or just doing it for yourself to calm down, there's a big element of nurturing where you can allow yourself grace and say, it's okay, you know, I'm feeling overwhelmed, and give yourself compassion. Or you do the same with your child and you really try to empathize with them. Becoming curious and empathy. When those things happen, you're not able to be angry at the same time.

Tony Mantour (24:51)

Yeah, great points. Now, you mentioned you went into the schools and did some reading. Reading. I'm assuming you read one of your books.

Sarah Hartley (25:00)

I did.

Tony Mantour (25:01)

What was their reaction? First, what did you pick to read? And second, how did they respond to it?

Sarah Hartley (25:08)

The first one I picked was Purposefully Calm. It's the Purposefully Me series. So all titles will be Purposefully Brave, purposefully resilient. I chose Purposefully Calm. I wanted to do Purposefully Brave. But that one, the character looks a lot like my son. And he was the one that pushed back and said, you know, mom, they're gonna know that's me. I don't want to do that. Said, okay, buddy. I totally get that. So Purposefully Calm is a lot about sensory processing disorder. But I read this too. It was last year. For third grade, it was the third grade gifted class. So they have a lot of those overwhelming sensory things that come into play. And so that one was about managing your anger. And they had. There was a, you know, centralized conflict, this try to understand of what the purpose was. And then that went into, you know, the conflict resolution and. And actually went and showed different columning strategies that they could do. And so they were all very receptive to it. I was hoping there were some that I know that can run hot. You know, there are always kids who. We all know those kids that we were in class with that maybe run hot a bit. And so, you know, that's where I wanted for them to really have that moment of, okay, this resonates with me. And so I didn't have a lot of time to stay and get the feedback. But I did speak with my son afterward, and he said that he really enjoyed the book and he felt like everyone else in the class it as well. And I've talked to a few of his friends since, and they said that it resonated with them.

Tony Mantour (26:34)

Good. You mentioned you're a health care executive. What does that entail?

Sarah Hartley (26:39)

I am in healthcare marketing and technology, so I work with health systems and help patients find the right doctor and right care. I do work with many psychiatrist companies and psychologists.

Tony Mantour (26:50)

So my question to you, and this is why I asked, what you do when you do your job and you're dealing with psychologists, doctors, etcetera, etcetera. You can get their perspectives on things. You've written a series of books that gives your perspective on neurodiversity and the way that others might see it. So with all the professionals that you've talked with, then you start talking with the kids, getting their perspective on things. So my question is, what have you learned out of this whole process?

Sarah Hartley (27:21)

Oh, there's so much. All of it is a very difficult process. If you think, oh, I'm gonna write a book. It is especially children's book, being the illustrations, that is a different layer that's added in. It can be tough. And then being able to find those individuals who can help lend that credibility and having them truly understand and buy in. And one of the therapists who's read these specializes in neurodiversity, so, you know, holds a lot of credit there of helping and understanding, you know, will this be something that resonates? And so I think it's just important that, you know, whatever it is you're doing that is not your expertise. It's maybe for me, it was driven by my own emotions, my own healing process. It was very cathartic for me to write. I am in most of these books, especially the one about adhd, what this child is feeling. And that was me. So you know what I'm sharing, it's more about deep emotions and how you truly are feeling, being trapped in that neurodiverse mind, but also showing that it's not a curse. It is is this beautiful thing where you have so many strengths that sometimes it just gets overcrowded or people are focusing more on what you need to work on versus really highlighting what you do so well. And so that's where you know a lot of it. It's not too in the weeds or technical into the diagnosis, but there's these moments of understanding of these might be some quirks or characteristics of someone who has, has ADHD or autism. And so it's hopefully something that will resonate a lot, but learned a lot along the way of, you know, I hopefully thought, oh, I'm, I'm just. This is my creative outlet. Not realizing the full business portion that's behind all of it.

Tony Mantour (29:12)

Yes, unfortunately, the business side can take a lot of joy out of the project. During this, you mentioned emotions while writing this. A lot of memories went into to it. Memories of your son, of course, memories of your life. So my question to you is, how did your emotions run during this whole process?

Sarah Hartley (29:33)

It was eye opening for me. I do find while it brings and bubbles up emotions to the surface, it's also very healing at the same time. And another element of this that I didn't know would be part of writing a book was developing an author platform and putting all of that out onto social media. And there's a moment of where I had to get over what other people might think and always ground myself back in. This is my mission, this is my purpose and I'm here to help someone. And even through social media, from the people that have responded or reached out and said that that really helped them and they saw themselves in whatever it was that I was discussing that to me, if it doesn't do anything else, you know, I've at least helped, you know, some people. And so I think that's my ultimate goal of what I have to go back to and know that because I'm continuing to talk about it, it's helping me in my own healing process. So if I would have just written the books, I maybe wouldn't have had this continuation of talking about it basically every day as I'm posting things and I'm having conversations and just being very authentic and open and honest about my own experience. And that's the only thing that I know is my experience. And I know the experience I've had alongside my children. You know, I don't really know other people's and how they felt in those moments, but I'm hoping that the depth of the connection that I'm sharing will resonate with someone.

Tony Mantour (31:01)

Yeah. Good. And I believe that it will resonate. This has been great, great conversation, great information. I really appreciate you taking the time to join us today.

Sarah Hartley (31:12)

Oh, thank you so much for having me.

Tony Mantour (31:14)

Oh, it's been my pleasure. Thanks again. Thanks for taking time out of your busy schedule to listen to our show today. We hope you enjoyed it as much as we enjoyed bringing it to you. If you know someone who has a story to share, tell them to contact us at WhyNotMe World. One last thing, spread the word about why not me. Our conversations are inspiring guests that show you are not alone in this world.

Sarah Hartley (31:59)

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