Paramount Merger Pause, Meta AI Optimism, and the Peptide Boom

Summary

Pivot Podcast Summary

Episode: Paramount Merger Pause, Meta AI Optimism, and the Peptide Boom
Hosts: Kara Swisher & Scott Galloway
Date: July 28, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this lively episode, Kara Swisher and Scott Galloway dissect several headline topics spanning media consolidation, Big Tech's PR maneuvers, and the rising trend of peptides in wellness. The main segments analyze the legal and financial gridlock stalling the Paramount–Skydance–Warner Bros. merger, Meta's awkward campaign for AI optimism, and the FDA's potential loosening of peptide regulations. Throughout, the duo bring their trademark humor, candid skepticism, and sharp business insights, rounded out by their picks for weekly wins and fails.

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Segment 1: Paramount–Skydance–Warner Bros. Merger on Ice

[08:00–23:59]

Key Points

• Legal Limbo: The merger faces a significant pause following a federal court's restraining order, pending legal challenges or until June 2027.
• Mounting Costs: Ticking fees of $650 million per quarter start in October; if the deal collapses, Paramount owes a $7 billion breakup fee.
• Paramount's Spin vs. Market Reality: Paramount touts the pause as a win, but markets disagree—shares hit a 52-week low.
• High-Profile Lawyer: Paramount brings in Beth Wilkinson, a seasoned antitrust attorney, to lead its legal battle.
• Industry Context: The real competitors aren't other studios but platforms like YouTube, Netflix, TikTok, and AI-generated content.

Notable Quotes

• Scott Galloway [11:05]:
  “This was such a Trump thing – trying to pretend this is anything but bad news. And investors understand something execs often don't: winning in court can still mean losing economically.”
• Kara Swisher [12:17]:
  “Collapse. Collapse. This tells you everything about how they assessed their chances... They chose financial hemorrhage over legal precedent.”
• Kara Swisher [14:08]:
  “It's frozen. It's really pretty much frozen... I just don't see how they get this out the door unless they have a settlement.”

Analysis & Tone

• Kara and Scott agree the legal posturing is mostly for delay; the economics are deteriorating fast.
• The drama is fueled by personalities (the Ellisons, high-profile lawyers) and political maneuvering—especially with AGs from both parties flexing muscle.
• Ultimately, the fate of the deal is tied to economic endurance (Oracle's stock and OpenAI's stability) rather than pure legal merits.

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Segment 2: White House Correspondents Dinner Meltdown

[24:11–28:53]

Key Points

• Trump's Rant: The rescheduled dinner became an hour-long attack session against Democrats, journalists, and celebrities—generally seen as a flop.
• Caitlin Collins Incident: Trump made personal jabs at CNN’s Kaitlin Collins, which Kara and Scott both find abhorrent.
• Skepticism about Event: Both hosts criticize the whole culture of the Correspondents Dinner, considering it outmoded and damaging to journalism’s reputation.

Notable Quotes

• Scott Galloway [25:51]:
  “This dude is just so fucking creepy... The air in that room was like, oh fuck God, this is just the worst thing.”
• Kara Swisher [27:08]:
  “It's gross in a way that really makes people hate journalists. And that was always my issue with it.”

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Segment 3: Meta’s AI Optimism Ad Campaign

[33:09–44:59]

Key Points

• Meta's New Narrative: Meta released an ad championing AI as a force for connection, set to David Bowie's “Five Years”—a track about the end of the world.
• Marketing Backlash: Scott, as a marketing professor, brands the campaign “so cynical”—a “sugary ad” masking the company’s real reputational issues.
• Political Timing: Both hosts detect election-year motivations as tech companies swing back to a “we care about people” message after playing realpolitik with Trump.
• Brand Perception: Scott advises that Meta should accept being disliked, focus on shareholder value, and stop trying to be loved via overproduced ads.
• Suggestions: Instead of sappy ads, Meta should lean into its strengths (vocational training, economic impact) and perhaps show humility or a sense of humor.

Memorable Banter & Quotes

• Scott Galloway [35:19]:
  “Can you tell us how connecting people fits into teen girls self-harming or you hiding evidence that one in eight British teens cite Instagram as a catalyst for their mental health?”
• Scott Galloway [41:26]:
  “The advice is the same. They should take the advice from Albert Brooks to William Hurt... ‘Keep it to yourself.’”
• Kara Swisher [44:05]:
  “You don't like us, we know, but we have some good stuff... What can we say? We're not Elon Musk. We're not Elon Musk.”

Meta Tagline Jokes

• “We're not the same Facebook that ruined Thanksgiving.” [47:49]
• “Where nuance goes to get beaten to death with a folding chair.” [56:59]
• “Meta: Fucking elections since 2006.” [45:54]

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Segment 4: U.S.–EU Clash Over Google Antitrust Fine

[45:59–49:59]

Key Points

• Trump threatens tariffs on the EU after a $1B fine on Google for antitrust violations (Digital Markets Act).
• Kara points out this saber-rattling is old hat—the EU acts because U.S. regulators don't.
• Both find the tariff threat economically counterproductive ("bad for the economy, cause inflation").

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Segment 5: Peptide Boom and FDA Regulation

[51:23–56:59]

Key Points

• Peptides (including GLP-1s) are booming across wellness communities, often via gray markets and influencers rather than formal medical channels.
• FDA panel recommends easing access to certain popular peptides, despite little data on many’s safety or effectiveness.
• Both Kara and Scott urge caution: the current landscape is largely unregulated, with many peptides sourced from abroad (especially China).
• Scott admits dabbling with wellness interventions—but only under medical supervision—and questions the hype:
  “The peptide jury is not in.” [53:57]

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Segment 6: Wins & Fails

[58:19–66:49]

Kara’s Picks

Fail:

• Michigan authorities separating Pete Buttigieg from his children over an unvetted, spurious allegation—“Such a massive, enormous, repulsive fail.” [59:41] Win:
• The joy and humanity of the “Cats: Jellicle Ball” Broadway show and the resurgence of in-person arts.

Scott’s Picks

Fail:

• White House Correspondents Dinner—should be canceled or reinvented for being out of step and brand-damaging. Win:
• Ukraine’s innovative strategy to target supply chains and e-commerce (like Wildberries, “the Amazon of Russia”) to destabilize Russia’s societal infrastructure.

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Noteworthy Moments & Banter

• On visiting the Clintons:
  “No, I went and visited Hillary Clinton and Bill Clinton at their home, but I was visiting Hillary on something I’m helping her with.” [03:13]
• On industry disruption:
  “Post-Trump, there’s a real market for smarts—experts, smarts, scientists, things like that.” [05:43]
• Meta Advertising Roast:
  Scott and Kara’s riffs on honest future Meta slogans are a highlight, skewering slogans like “Baby, I’ve changed” and “We're not Elon Musk” with glee [44:04/44:59].

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Recurring Themes & Takeaways

• Institutions Decaying: Widespread skepticism about regulatory competence and institutional trust, whether it’s mergers, the FDA, or the media.
• PR vs. Reality: Executives often misjudge market sentiment—spinning setbacks as wins doesn’t fool investors or the public.
• Political Backdrop: Everything from corporate PR to major deals is colored by the upcoming U.S. elections.
• Cultural Mood: In-person arts, genuine connection, and authenticity (or the hunger for these) are resurging as Big Tech and media struggle with trust and relevance.

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Suggested Listening

Notable Timestamps:

• 08:00–23:59: Paramount merger saga and legal/political analysis
• 24:11–28:53: WH Correspondents Dinner debacle
• 33:09–44:59: Meta ad campaign discussion and branding banter
• 51:23–56:59: Peptide “boom,” FDA, and wellness skepticism
• 58:19–66:49: Wins and fails segment

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Bottom Line

A jam-packed episode where Swisher and Galloway expertly fuse media, tech, politics, and culture—debunking corporate spin, skewering self-defeating institutions, and championing a smarter, less cynical approach to business and industry change. Filled with humor, pointed observations, and quotable one-liners, this episode is essential to keep abreast of the current crossroads in media and tech.

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[For great user-generated Meta taglines, tune in next episode.]

Transcript

[Scott Galloway]

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[Kara Swisher]

Support for this show comes from Apple News Plus. Apple News plus has everything you're into, all in one place. Over 500 top publications covering local and national news. Food, sports plus daily puzzles, audio and more curated just for you new subscribers. Try it for free for one month at News Apple Learn terms apply foreign.com

[Scott Galloway]

AI agents took over my work and I absolutely love it. Chasing deadlines, writing status reports, updating stakeholders. Agents handle the daily grind. Now I stay in the loop only when it matters. Create your own AI agent in minutes on Monday dot com. I like it when baller women have like a trophy husband. I think that's. We've been doing that shit forever.

[Unidentified Caller/Guest]

Why?

[Scott Galloway]

Why should you be the only one with a trophy husband?

[Kara Swisher]

Hi everyone, this is Pivot from New York magazine and the Vox Media podcast network. I'm Kara Swisher.

[Scott Galloway]

And I'm Scott Galloway.

[Kara Swisher]

Where are you, Scott? Los Angeles.

[Scott Galloway]

I'm still in Los Angeles where it is 70 degrees and spectacular here. I turned the camera around. I'd love you to see the Hollywood Hills here, but it's fantastic.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, actually it's nice here in New York, I have to tell you. It's lovely.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, I heard it was great.

[Kara Swisher]

Really beautiful weather. I did a lot of stuff here in New York.

[Scott Galloway]

Tell me about it.

[Kara Swisher]

I went to see Jellicle Ball cats. The first time I've ever liked cats in my life, which I do not like cats. Yes. They set it at a drag show essentially. And now it works. Cats now works perfectly.

[Scott Galloway]

Wasn't it a. Was a drag show?

[Kara Swisher]

No, it was like a bunch of people wandering around being cat like, you know, with makeup, a lot of makeup situation. They were playing cats. They were actually playing cats. But in this case it was a drag show and it makes. And you're like, ah, I see. Yes, it's like, you know, voguing and doing all the, all the stuff you've seen in the films and stuff like that and the documentaries. It was wonderful and it was beautiful. It was joyful. The crowd was packed. Now, this show is closing because of the high costs of Broadway, but I have to tell you, it was absolutely packed and absolutely people. It was such a joyful experience. It was just a lot of fun.

[Scott Galloway]

Nice. And what else? That can't be it.

[Kara Swisher]

No. I went and visited an ex president and an ex Secretary of State at their home this weekend.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, you're so coy. Cause you're so important.

[Kara Swisher]

I'm not important. I just am visiting, so I can't

[Scott Galloway]

mention who it is. I'm.

[Kara Swisher]

I went and said I'm Kara Swish

[Scott Galloway]

and I never named her.

[Kara Swisher]

I can't say why.

[Scott Galloway]

I only keep people anonymous when it's obvious who they are and it's the ultimate name drop.

[Kara Swisher]

No, I went and visited Hillary Clinton and Bill Clinton at their home, but I was visiting Hillary on something I'm helping her with.

[Scott Galloway]

Let me guess, does it run mine with podcasts?

[Unidentified Caller/Guest]

I don't know.

[Kara Swisher]

We'll see. I don't know. We'll see.

[Scott Galloway]

Can I give you and her some advice?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, please do.

[Scott Galloway]

She should pick the half dozen or dozen or three to six podcasts that she really enjoys that are a little bit unexpected and be a regular guest. She shouldn't do her own podcast. Oh, well.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, too bad. Why is that? Why is that? Mr. 500 podcasts and won't stop making them?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, yeah, but Scott Galloway needs the relevance and the money. She doesn't. She. Secretary Clinton, first off, at this point in her life, and I'm projecting, I don't know if this is true. I think she should be just doing whatever the fuck she wants and enjoying herself. And the thing is, you know, maybe

[Kara Swisher]

this is what the fuck she wants, but go ahead.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, maybe. I think she would have more flexibility, more relevance, and be less of a. I mean, there's just a lot of downside risk to her starting her own podcast with her name on it, quite frankly. And I think she can have her cake and eat it too, and have as much relevance and impact by being a guest on various podcasts. But that's just my view. I think she's going to regret it if she starts it. Not that I know her, but I think a year and a half in like, you know what this is like. I mean, you. You're a workaholic, but so is she.

[Kara Swisher]

She's a hard worker.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. Are you kidding?

[Kara Swisher]

That woman is like. That woman could like, instantly tell you, like a very detailed in triplicate explanation of almost any world event and domestic. She's really quite a brilliant person.

[Scott Galloway]

Agreed, agreed. I think it's just the format and the cadence of which she wants to demonstrate that excellence. I hope she does something. I just think she should be appearing on yours.

[Kara Swisher]

And some other people thought, yeah, yeah, well, we'll see. I think she still has a lot to say, and actually, people have not met her yet in a way that I know her and others do. And so, you know, a lot of people still have a lot to say. And she's incredible shape and so sharp

[Scott Galloway]

and she looks great and she's very vibrant.

[Kara Swisher]

Very vibrant. And so we'll see how it goes. You know, it's interesting because YouTube just signed Becky Kennedy's doctor. Very popular on social for a show. There's a whole renaissance of things happening now, again, in terms of sort of reformulating television and everything else that I think is really interesting at this moment. I think we were very early to it and have done a very nice job figuring out.

[Unidentified Guest]

Pioneers.

[Scott Galloway]

We're trailblazers.

[Kara Swisher]

Pioneers. We're trailblazers. We made it to California.

[Scott Galloway]

We're the innovators in our seventh decade. It finally happened.

[Kara Swisher]

No, but that's what I mean. I think it's just a really interesting time for substantive voices. I think post Trump, there's a real market for smarts, experts, smarts, scientists, things like that.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, the. I mean, if there's any one theme, it's that these institutions in these middle. This middleware is going away.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

And. And great talent bubbles through. I mean, that's the most positive thing I think you can say about these platforms and social media, is that people no longer need to give money to the dnc, they just give money to John Ossoff.

[Kara Swisher]

Right, Exactly. Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

And people don't need to go kiss the ass of some executive on the 45th floor of the Rockefeller center to try and get on Ms. Now. They can just, you know, they can just go live on substack. Anyway.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, it's an exciting time. It's an exciting time.

[Scott Galloway]

It is an exciting time, especially with the reinvention of that iconic piece of culture, Cats. Jesus Christ. Talk about something I'm definitely not gonna see.

[Kara Swisher]

I'm telling you, it's fantastic. I did not wanna see Cats. And it's amazing. Everyone who doesn't like cats loves this. And I'm telling you, it was joyful.

[Unidentified Guest]

It was beautiful.

[Scott Galloway]

I don't like anything cultural, though.

[Kara Swisher]

But you're Not. Come on. That's not true. That is not true.

[Scott Galloway]

The Odyssey will be the most cultural thing I've done in years.

[Kara Swisher]

That's true.

[Scott Galloway]

The Odyssey in the World Cup. That's it.

[Kara Swisher]

Y my funniest one. For the Odyssey, there's this continuing discussion of it and what it means and everything else. And all these sort of knock on effects. And one it says it's a movie about a man who finally faces consequences, which I thought was funny. Anyway, there's a lot of really interesting discussion. I love all the discussion around the Odyssey. It's all interesting in different ways. And people are having a good time talking about mythology. They're having a good time talking about literature, about the movie making itself. Some of the stuff, the stuff he did around the themes, around the arguments about the themes. I just love it. I love the whole thing.

[Scott Galloway]

People are, yeah, I'm going to see it. I'm going to see it on Thursday with my son.

[Kara Swisher]

I'm excited for what you think.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, I'm excited to see it too.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah. Because you're not part of the cultural conversation if you haven't seen it. Anyway, it's sold out here in New York at the IMAX until like late August at this point, which is really interesting. Anyway, I recommend. Highly recommend it and a lot.

[Scott Galloway]

I was either going to go see the Odyssey or I was going to go see Phantom of the Opera performed by. I'm trying to think of a politically correct term for someone who's incredibly woke. I can't go there. Anyways.

[Kara Swisher]

All right. In any case, I'm having a great time in New York. New York is very exciting. I have lots of fun things to do this week. Anyway, we've got a lot to get to today. Speaking of Hollywood, Paramount, Skydance is pausing a Warner Brothers discovery merger until legal challenges are resolved or until June 1, 2027. That's like a long time from now, folks, whichever happens first. The decision comes after a federal court granted a temporary restraining order preventing the MER from closing for at least 28 days. Paramount is calling the pause a significant win, which it is not saying it provides a direct path to a trial based on evidence, but investors do not agree. Neither does Kara Swisher. Paramount shares hit a 52 week low on the news. The delay could get costly. $650 million per quarter. Ticking fee begins in October. And if the deal falls apart entirely, paramount would owe $7 billion breakup fee. By the way, Paramount just brought on Beth Wilkinson, someone I know pretty well as its lead attorney. Very good attorney. She successfully defended micro Activision acquisition. She's also representing nexstar in its antitrust case. Beth, the company you keep, she's gonna win.

[Scott Galloway]

She'll win.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, we'll see, we'll see, we'll see what's winning at this point. At this point. So talk a little bit about what you think. I have thoughts on it, but I'd love to hear yours first.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, I don't think they have a legal leg to stand on. What they have is delay. And delay costs shareholders, employees, it's, it's effective. And they'll probably extract a pound of flesh because in order to win the deal, one of the things that Paramount Skydance offered in the purchase agreement was a ticking fee of $650 million per quarter. While this deal sits in limbo, that's roughly $7 million per weight. So these Democratic AGs who are probably sick of a Republican weaponized DOJ have said fine, what's good for the goose is good for the gander. And they'll probably be able to extract something, whether it's guarantees of certain shooting within or spinning a certain thing. They're going to. And all of a sudden less than no one is going to know who the California AG is going to be. They'll start getting a lot of time on msnow. So this is political. They'll get some awareness. They might get a pound of flesh. But I think ultimately Beth will show will bring up a bunch of expert witnesses in the form of economists who will say emerged Warner brothers. Skydance is 8% or 6% of all viewing time versus Netflix at 9 and YouTube at 13. The market has already voted. Paramount, as you referenced, hit a 52 week low after celebrating what management called a legal win. This was such a Trump thing trying to pretend this is anything but bad news. And investors understand something executives often don't and that is winning in court can still mean losing economically. So again, the real competitor here isn't Skydance or Warner Brothers. It's YouTube, Netflix, TikTok, and increasingly probably AI generated entertainment. And as usual, legacy media is fighting yesterday's war while tomorrow's competitors are scaling. But this is again, this seeds economic value and advantage from the legacy players to the new guys who aren't caught up in court right now. And YouTube can just scale.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, that's absolutely true. I don't think she's going to win at all, actually. I think they. Yes, they don't. And look at right now, the price of Warner shares, $25, the delta between the 31 and 20, as Bill Cohen actually pointed out, is quite high. It's supposed to be about 4%. It's a lot. That's a lot. Investors have decided this deal isn't happening. That's what I think is exactly.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, they want a premium. So what you're referring to is merger arbitrage. There's a whole class of investors who, when a deal is announced at say I think this announced at 31 bucks a share, whatever it is, if it's trading at 25, what is that? That's about a 22 or 23% premium.

[Kara Swisher]

They don't think the deal is happening.

[Scott Galloway]

That's right. But what merger arb guys do is they say, okay, I think it's going to close. I buy the stock now when it closes, I got my 31 and it's hard to find 20 or 2 or 23% return. But what you're saying is, to your point, the market is saying there's now approximately, if I'm doing my Math correctly, a 1 in 4 chance this deal doesn't happen.

[Kara Swisher]

That's correct.

[Scott Galloway]

And what would be interesting is what happens to the stock if it doesn't close?

[Kara Swisher]

Collapse. Collapse. Here's what I think. This is what I think. All right, let me go. This is. Someone sent me a very interesting legal documentary I thought was great. They chose financial hemorrhage over legal precedent. This tells you everything about how they assessed their chances on August 3rd. They were going to lose on the preliminary injunction. They were absolutely going to lose on that. And that would have devastated the stock. Devastated the stock. And it was. You couldn't overturn it on appeal. This called something called abuse of discretion standard. And the merger would have been over if they lost on August 3rd. So they're push this lawyer. They had a guy named Kessler in hiring Beth. It's a great hire. She's great. She's terrific. I don't really care how terrific she is. This is. They have. I think they have decided. Let me read you this. Paramount blank. They looked at August 3, hearing two PI motions, two markets, a list writer declarations, a judge who already tipped her hand and decided that no ruling was better than another bad ruling. That's a rational litigation decision and a catastrophic business signal. Peace Guy isn't just scared. They've entered a survival mode and they're trying to control the bleeding. The question is whether the patient can survive long enough to reach the operating room. And as you said, other competitors are scaling, including all these tech competitors and also Disney and others. They have all kinds of freedom to do things. They have this ticking fee that's very expensive. And at some point the savings that they were going to recognize in this deal are going to disappear. Right. That they were going to do through the coordination. And so Oracle stock is way off. This is what's paying for part of this. This is delay. You don't have to win at litigation here. You have to delay the litigation. And Beth can push for, and she's gonna try to do this in court. A shorter time span in between. You know, what's happening here. But it's frozen. It's really pretty much frozen. So she can say, let's try a scheduling. It's on July 31st. They wanna get it this fall. It's not gonna happen this fall. And the judge is gonna set this schedule. And this judge doesn't seem in any rush. Now, they've also foregone the appeal into the ninth. That's gonna take until the trial's over. So, you know, the California. And the group is gonna appeal if they lose. It just keeps dragging and dragging on. And so I don't see how they get this out the door unless they have a settlement. And so another document I got, which was really interesting, and they said these are the most likely ones. One states win at trial, permanent injunction, merger blocks, guidance walks. Paramount restructures or finds a new buyer settlement possible. Paramount offers structural remedies, divest the studio, sell cable networks. States accept or reject deal collapses economically. Also possible, ticking fees, exceed value of Warner Brothers or Skydance invokes termination clause. Merger dies without a verdict. And then if Paramount wins at trial, merger closes after more than $1 billion in ticking fees and severe reputational damage near certain appeal by state. I just don't. I gotta say, I don't know. She's a talented lady, but this is not that time is not on the side of Paramount here in that regard.

[Scott Galloway]

So again, as I often do here, I'm just sort of flying on instruments and thinking out loud. But I wonder if the fulcrum here. So economically, if this goes on long enough, it will close. Because it will close the deal if it goes on long enough. But. And there's a big but here, the data. The only way this legally doesn't close when they chase it all down and they've had a chance to actually evaluate it, is to prove it's a monopoly. And I think they're going to have a very difficult time. The AG is proving that because essentially, the combined Warner Brothers and Paramount would represent about 12% of total US TV watch time and YouTube currently stands at 13. And in terms of box office sales, a combined Paramount and Warner brothers represent roughly 25% of the domestic box office. Now, having said that, if the fees, if this becomes economically untenable because of delay and ticking fees, they might just say, throw up their arms and blame Democrats. And by the way, this is political. All 12 AGS filing cases are Democrats here. The judge has decided this was a Biden appointee. But what's good again, what's good for the goose.

[Kara Swisher]

But the Trump administration waved it through when lawyers of the Justice Department didn't want to.

[Scott Galloway]

What's good for the goose is good for the gander. This is. If you're going to weaponize the DOJ against us, whether it's cutting off fees to our greatest research universities with no legal precedent, if it's carving up TikTok like a political give back to your Republican donors, fine, you want to go that way?

[Kara Swisher]

Or waving this deal through when lawyers at the Justice Department did not want it to go through many.

[Scott Galloway]

I mean, there's a ton of examples, the FTC going after the view. I mean it's just if you're going to be ridiculous, folks, I actually like Democrats punching back at some point. I do think the merits of this case or the lack thereof will result in a judge saying, okay, this is going to close the fulcrum. I want to get your view on this. I think the thing, if this dies, I think the reason it will die is if OpenAI continues to have negative momentum. Why is that Oracle stock for a while about, I think it was nine or 12 months ago, Larry Ellison became the wealthiest man in the world because they announced a deal for something like a trillion dollars in capex commitment from OpenAI to build out, help build out their comp, their infrastructure on compute and inference. Oracle stock is dramatically off. And if OpenAI begins or the cracks continue to widen at OpenAI, Oracle has now become a public tracking stock for OpenAI. And I gotta think that dad's piggy bank, which is Oracle shares are quite frankly, that's where this check gets cashed. And if Oracle shares come under enough pressure and dad goes, you know what, all of a sudden this went from 5 or 10% of my net worth to 20 or 30%. And it's going to, quite frankly, I'm going to wake up in a suit that's uncomfortable for me at this age in terms of finance and debt. He might decide, sorry son, I can't refill your Greenlight credit card as I do because the Deliveroo and the Uber has become too expensive.

[Kara Swisher]

I'm now using the medical bill. Yeah, it's down 52% in the past year. 52%, that really is striking year to date. 39% six months, 32% one month. It's just headed down. You're right. This is what I had said. Remember I'd said this a couple with this Oracle stock thing that I was paying attention to. That's besides the point. I think that they just over indexed on their confidence. They were like, well, we got the Trump administration to roll over, we gave the EU some stuff they wanted. And then they were like, China said yes. I'm like, what's the difference? It doesn't really matter because these guys have what I thought Bonta did very smartly. And I agree with you, it's a different market. But the judge is also calling that irrelevant. The streaming market irrelevant here for this particular case. So I don't think they have a great way in with this judge. And I thought they were overly confident. They did not think Bonta would be quite so controlled because he could have done a get rid of cnn, horrible cbs. They did none of that. They did only a very specific, small, discreet lawsuit that will move will delay this just enough. They don't have to win. They really don't have to win here. They just have to delay it. And the question is, how much will the Ellisons put up with to own this? That's the thing. How much? They're rich enough to do it. It's just a question of how much they want it, right? I guess on some level. And again, delays in deal making for Warner Brothers, delays. I mean, the asset becomes less valuable. They can't make any major deals now. They can't do any major things and the other people will benef. It's not a good situation.

[Scott Galloway]

But I think we're in violent agreement here. And that is the legal merits here are important. But I would argue the legal merits all point to eventually this would close, but they can get in the way of the closing and force the Ellisons to perhaps walk away if they make getting to closing too expensive for them. And it's not only a function of the price and the expense, it's a function of how much money the Ellisons have in some. If Oracle is down another 50%, I don't think this deal closes. If it's up 20 or 30%, I think they have the staying power to weigh these guys out and hire your very Talented friend who, by the way, has a very handsome trophy husband. I just want to point that out. He's dreamy. He's dreaming.

[Kara Swisher]

She's gonna be mad at us.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, really?

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, every now and then.

[Scott Galloway]

I like it when baller women have like a trophy. A trophy husband.

[Kara Swisher]

No, he's a very talented trophy.

[Scott Galloway]

Come on, we've been doing that shit forever. Why should she be the only one with a trophy? A trophy hazmat.

[Kara Swisher]

She thinks we've gone too woke. I think. I think she does think we've gone too woke.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, well, let me word to your mother, sister. A lot of people think that. Anyways,

[Kara Swisher]

we're woke. Ish.

[Scott Galloway]

We're woke.

[Kara Swisher]

Adjacent.

[Unidentified Guest]

Woke adjacent.

[Kara Swisher]

We're woke adjacent.

[Scott Galloway]

We wear one Birkenstock.

[Kara Swisher]

We wander around. Listen, this is a devastating business problem. It's really bad. It's not good. You know, this is. Look, it's just. This is. To me. They were too arrogant. They were too arrogant.

[Unidentified Caller/Guest]

They did.

[Kara Swisher]

They didn't think this guy would come to play.

[Scott Galloway]

It's gonna. Media's obsessed with itself. They're gonna constantly report about it.

[Kara Swisher]

Come on. It's an interesting case. It is interesting. Come on. It's all the tech people. It's media, it's tech. It's Larry Ellison. The satanic looking Larry Ellison. It's so much good stuff here. Come on. It's a great story. And now that you brought in Beth Wilkinson, the star litigator, I'm in trouble.

[Scott Galloway]

I had. I had drinks with the guy who runs Warner Brothers movies or one of the co. And he's just like the loveliest guy, this guy Jesse.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, there's.

[Scott Galloway]

He's just so nice. And I'm like, what's going on there? He's like, I just show up and I do my work, you know, it's just like. I don't know, I'm just showing up, trying to find good ideas to turn into movies that people want to see.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, I just. I don't know. I don't. I think I'm going to. I'm going to go on a limb and say this deal doesn't happen. This deal doesn't happen.

[Scott Galloway]

But again, I'm gonna.

[Kara Swisher]

I. I don't. I agree with you.

[Scott Galloway]

Right.

[Kara Swisher]

I agree with you on the. On the market, but I don't think that's what it's gonna get judged on. This judge has already signaled that.

[Scott Galloway]

No, no, no, no. There's no.

[Kara Swisher]

Winning isn't winning. Winning isn't.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, but we're saying the same Thing, this isn't about the legal argument. It's about the pro. It's about the prospects. It's about Oracle stock price, which is directly linked to the prospects of OpenAI at this point. So if you want to know whether this deal's gonna close or not, tell me what the narrative is and the value of OpenAI is in six months.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, that's it. Well, we'll see. We'll see. We'll see if they've got the staying power. You Ellisons, boy, they weren't expecting this, I don't think. And also, let me just put in, throw in one last thing. Guess what's happening in November? The midterms. This family does not look good during the midterms, given all the crap they were doing at CBS and all the statements about what they were gonna do to cnn. They are gonna run into a buzzsaw of Democrats on top of this. Like, by the way. So just all. All down and to the right. So to the right. To the right.

[Scott Galloway]

I hope so.

[Kara Swisher]

I hope you're right. And they shouldn't have done the CBS mess. It brought ridiculous attention to a very small part of its business. It was stupid.

[Scott Galloway]

I think that's accurate. I think they created a mess. They created a mess where they didn't need to.

[Kara Swisher]

They could have just let it run quietly and then done all their nasty stuff later, but they didn't. They couldn't resist. Anyway. The rescheduled White House correspondents dinner took place. Jesus Christ, this thing. Speaking of media, what a story. Three months after Gunman forced the original event to be cut short, Trump opened by saying the show must go on and condemning political violence. That was good. But quickly shifted to an hour of attacks on Democrats, celebrities and journalists, many of his jokes falling flat. And even Republicans didn't think it was good. Those attacks include personal jabs at CNN's Kaitlan Collins. How dare he. Who was accepting an award for her White House coverage. Trump was also sat there as the Wall Street Journal accepted an award for its reporting on his ties to Jeffrey Epstein in that famous birthday greeting thing with the lady's vagina. You know how I feel about this correspondence dinner. I think it's just repulsive. And I had offered to pay for the scholarships because I hated it so much, but I covered it as a young reporter. I thought it was terrible 20 years ago. This was just bad. And, you know, don't come for Kaitlan Collins, my friend. I thought she acted rather well, although I suspect nobody should have been there in the first place. But that's just me.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, let's bring this back to me. I need your advice. All right, so this is a picture. I'm holding this up for our viewers on YouTube.

[Kara Swisher]

You and Caitlin.

[Scott Galloway]

This is me and Caitlin. Notice what she's doing here?

[Kara Swisher]

Smiling.

[Scott Galloway]

She's smiling.

[Kara Swisher]

She's.

[Scott Galloway]

She's. In addition to being a very talented journalist, she's also a lovely person who smiles when appropriate.

[Kara Swisher]

She smiles when appropriate. Yes, that is correct.

[Scott Galloway]

I saw this thing. I mean, the clips are everywhere and I just thought, I think about our brand, right? The US brand. There are a few things that have been worse for the brand than the White House Correspondents Dinner.

[Kara Swisher]

Never. If the worst. The worst.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, first off, what better marks America than an event with our, you know, technically our most iconic journalists and the President and a mentally ill man with guns manages to interrupt the whole thing and then we reschedule it and we have this 80 year old man making the creep. This wasn't even about insults. It's like this dude is just so fucking creepy. It's like your grandfather whose daughtering shows up and won't stop talking about his grandson's girlfriend in a very uncomfortable way. It's like, dude, just take your limp dick and just take it somewhere else. It's so. The air. I don't know if the clip, the air in that room was like, oh fuck God, this is just the worst thing. And let's go Macro. The White House Correspondents dinner is like Blockbuster holding an award show for who has the best dvd. No one gives a shit. It's like, come on. The institutions here, There's a theme across all of this. The through line. The institutions are ceding power to individuals and to individual journalists who go on social media. This thing needs to be buried. Or at a minimum, don't invite the President. This thing just was so awkward.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, exactly. Just have a nice dinner with you. I'm not a big awards person. I hate awards. I don't go to them anymore because I hate them in the first place. And now I've said, you know, I actually hate them. Why am I going? I have never been. I've only covered this as a young reporter. I never went. I've gone to the parties, but I've always found it to be this little ha, ha, laugh, laugh with the cabinet members. Whether it's Obama people or whether it's Trump people. It's gross. It's gross in a way that really makes people hate journalists. And that was always my issue with it. It's like it's fine for those Cabinet people to go. It's whatever. They get to influence journalists. But. But just dressing up. And my issue, the whole thing was, I knew he was gonna do this. Everyone knew he was gonna do this. So what's your choice? Not showing up. Which I think is the best choice. The second one is, what if walking out in a tuxedo. How dare you, sir. Makes you look idiotic and sitting there makes you look. There's no winning for the journalist.

[Scott Galloway]

You shouldn't have gone.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, but. Yes, exactly. And that's.

[Scott Galloway]

They shouldn't have gone. They should have done a nice dinner or something for the winners and.

[Kara Swisher]

And the scholarship.

[Scott Galloway]

Sit up there and have him, like, hand down an award at the Wall Street Journal. The whole thing. It's like, we have lost so much standing globally.

[Kara Swisher]

Everybody has.

[Scott Galloway]

We just look like idiots. Oh, wait. They had to reschedule it because a mentally ill person with access to firearms interrupted it. So they redid the thing, and this president had to sit there and then make a stupid, creepy comment. It's like, how could we damage the brand and just look like a more strange, weird nation?

[Kara Swisher]

I agree. And then laughing with him. And then the incoming president of it, Jackie Heinrich from fox, like, laughed and joked it up with him after he did the creepy. I mean, seriously, it's like the whole thing is like, jackie, I don't care if you're at FOX and you're conservative. That was gross. That was gross from a conservative or a liberal point of view and not just Caitlin, like, And then using Dylan Mulvaney anyway. Please don't do this anymore. When I said, don't do this anymore. After the shooting, I got so many press people like, Kara, that's really unfair. I was like, go fuck yourself. This is bullshit. We shouldn't be doing this. It should be over.

[Scott Galloway]

So, folks, just in terms of how precious broadcast journalists think they are, podcasts reach exponentially more people. Do we have an awards show giving each other little trophies?

[Kara Swisher]

There is one. Did we go, oh, wait, we can see?

[Scott Galloway]

Not awards. Never mind. I take it back.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, but we don't.

[Unidentified Caller/Guest]

It's fun.

[Kara Swisher]

Like, there's no president there. It was the Webbies. We got one at the Webbies. That was fun as fuck. That was a really good party. There was no president. There was no. There were all these cool people there. It was fun. I don't. And that's the only one I like. Cause I think it's an actually fun party, but mostly no. Right?

[Scott Galloway]

Did we gone to any.

[Kara Swisher]

There's no, we wouldn't invite the president. We're not gonna shake hands with the president. That's what we're definitely not doing. Anyway, anyway, folks, Kaitlan Collins, we love you. You did a great. Let me tell you, she acted with a lot of dignity. She's a young woman and she acted. I would have been like slapping him silly. But of course you would have been arrested then. But anyway, it's just terrible to put people in that situation. And putting themselves in that situation is not the best thing either. Anyway, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, Meta Pushes AI Opt. Support for this show comes from Deleteme. Most people's personal data is just floating around on the Internet, and in the age of AI, we're especially vulnerable to scammers using it against you. If you've searched yourself and found your home address, phone number or family member's name, you know it's unsettling. But the good news is Delete Me can help. Delete Me does all the hard work to wipe your personal information from data broker website sites. It was named the top pick for data removal services by Wirecutter. I have used Deleteme for many years now and all the recent reports have surprised me because of so much information out there about me and how careful I am with my privacy. And yet data brokers continue to assemble all manner of files about me and about family members and others that I am always shocked by when I see it. Take control of your data and keep your private life private by signing up for deletement now at a special discount for our listeners. Get 20% off your Delete Me plan when you go to JoinDeleteMe.com pivot and use the promo code Pivot at checkout. The only way to get 20% off is to go to JoinDeleteMe.com pivot and enter the code pivot at checkout. That's JoinDeleteMe.com pivot codepivot

[Unidentified Caller/Guest]

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[Kara Swisher]

Scott, we're back. Meta just launched a new campaign making the case for AI optimism with an ad showing Meta products as tools for human connection. The video is set to David Bowie's five, which is a song about the end of the world. Now, let me be fair. Bowie did say later that he wrote it in hopes people would be optimistic. Just so you know. Just so you know, I, I want to correct that. A lot of people are like, it's. It was, it was about the end of the world. But he was hoping to turn that around. But let's listen to a clip first.

[Scott Galloway]

Some people will have you believe AI will make us less connected, that it's gonna leave us behind. We couldn't disagree more. Call us optimists, call us dreamers, just as we've always done. We're betting on people. Make it stop. Jesus Christ. Seriously, make it stop.

[Kara Swisher]

Mark Zuckery shared the ad on Facebook, writing, as we enter the next wave of AI, we continue to believe the future is for everyone. The message goes, months after Meta told staff it was cutting 10% of its workforce and scrapping 6,000 open roles to offset AI spending. I would like your marketing. Let me just tell you, you. I'm just telling you this says midterms all over it. It's like, now we believe in people. Before we believed in giving Donald Trump money, but now people thoughts, Marketing Professor? Put your hat on and tell me what works and doesn't work here.

[Scott Galloway]

I know exactly what's going on here. Somebody really attractive who wears black has shown up and talk about intangible associations and emotion and they have so much fucking money. And then Mark and the CMO there has convinced themselves this was a good idea. This goes back to the notion of don't these people have friends? I mean, Mark, can you tell us how connecting people fits into teen girls self harming or you hiding evidence that one in eight British teens cite Instagram as a catalyst for their mental Health. I mean, when I sat next to the woman, you know, Dina Powell, and she wrote, she tweeted the thing and said, it's always been about connecting. People call us optimists. And the only thing I could think of was, sit down. Down. I'm an AI optimist. You're. I mean, come on.

[Kara Swisher]

Marketing professor. Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

Meta's new ad has. That's incredible. Soft focus family using AI glasses to connect more meaningfully.

[Kara Swisher]

The stalker glasses. Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. Okay. Nothing says intimacy like a 300 pair of glasses. Beam your kid's birthday party back to a server farm so Zuck can serve the moment back to you as a Nissan S. It's just. This is so cynical. They are the last people to be talking about the upside of AI. They're going to invite so much criticism. I don't know who the CMO of Meta is. You're a fucking idiot for approving this thing.

[Kara Swisher]

What would you do here? Because they have other ones. They have another video I saw about data centers. They're trying to turn that idea around, that it does help people, it creates jobs, et cetera. They're now moving, and again, that's a good one.

[Scott Galloway]

That ad is smart. PR and talent is very adroit. No ethnically ambiguous people pretending they're happy wearing these glasses. None of that shit. Just communications around what is trying to call balls and strikes. Their program around vocational training and investing in vocational training. That is a great program. That is great branding. It shouldn't be an ad. It should be their PR team, which are some of the most talented people in the world, getting that. That thing placed everywhere, but not running ads on it. This thing is so. It's going to invite so much scrutiny around. Okay, this is Jeffrey Dahmer running a Jack in the box commercial. It's just. You just don't do this. What are you thinking? Approving an ad saying that you're AI optimist and you're connecting.

[Kara Swisher]

What the hell? They also cursed in it. I don't like when they curse in it. I don't want you.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah. So I don't. I find. And I just. When Dina, she seemed like a lovely woman and she put out the ad, the first thing I thought of my. I can't do this. Cause she's friends with Kara. I thought. Sit down. You're the last people that you should be claiming that you're AI.

[Kara Swisher]

What do you do if you're trying to get back the. You know. Look, I'm telling you, this is so motivated by what's Coming in November. And the payback, what do you mean by that? Because I think they're all like, let me just tell you, there isn't a tech company that suddenly hasn't hey girled me recently. All of them, all of them, they're like, kara, we haven't talked in a while after the Trump thing. Cause I'm like, you fuckers for throwing in with Trump, you corrupt pieces of shit, essentially. And now they're like, we need to talk. Cause we believe in safety. I'm getting a lot of safety. We should have a meeting. What you've been saying has really resonated with us, what you're saying about corruption. I was like, aren't you paying the bribes? I just feel like there's an understanding that there's gonna be payback. Right now that's 1, 2. What would you do? Like at some point, like, I know people hate when I say this, but you know, how do you turn it around? Is there a world in which Mark Zuckerberg could do something to not seem like so villainous or maybe not, maybe not. I don't know. I mean I recall when Gates was villainous and then until the Epstein stuff he was non villainous. Right. So what do they have have to do to get. What would the ad that you would do here? Let's help them. Let's help them in their thing. Say they're genuinely saying we made a mistake, we want back into humanity. They can't be or they can't come in back into humanity because they're doing all this other damage.

[Scott Galloway]

I hate to say it, but it's the Rupert Murdoch brand strategy. Rupert just owns it. He's like, I am who I am. I work behind the scenes. He doesn't run ads trying to make the Murdaughs more likable. He doesn't run ads trying to say fox, we're good for America.

[Kara Swisher]

Well, there was fair and balanced, if you recall, for a minute now.

[Scott Galloway]

Okay. But they just, quite frankly, they just own it. And the reality is that the Zuckerberg brand and the Meta brand is for the most part a very strong brand. For the following reason, America has opted for shareholder value over competence and the well being of the commonwealth. We really respect and admire a company that's able to create this sort of shareholder value. Their products are amazing. I hate to admit this, I am addicted to Instagram reels. I think it is incredible. I think it's incredible.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

I like as you know, their performance, their shareholder returns, the fact that they hire a ton of talented people and create economic security for them. The fact that housing prices are up 28% in large part because Meta's making so many people wealthy. A lot of people have registered enormous shareholder gains. Do your thing. Go on background. Try and defend yourself. Fine. I think the vocational investment, I think is $150 million is absolutely genius. But having an ad where the tagline is presence reimagined, that to me feels like them saying, we already have your face, your friends, and your location. Now we'd like to own your depth perception. I mean, I don't want. They should not bring attention.

[Kara Swisher]

They have a need to be liked. They do.

[Scott Galloway]

You know, also, they shouldn't be running these ads.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, they have a need to, like, we're not villains. And I don't know what they could do. I mean, do, you know, admit to some of their big problems. Admit to it if they want to be liked. Like, that's what I mean. I think wanting to be liked is part of this. And look at, like, look at that interview Elon did with the financial. With the Economist. The Economist.

[Scott Galloway]

They feel like they're misunderstood. And if they only have a chance.

[Kara Swisher]

Shut the fuck. I kept thinking, stop talking. You are like, you know, and she's so adept. She's amazing. And I was like, stop talking. Oh, my God. Like, stop talking. At some point, I was like, wanting to get him off the stage. Cause I thought, he doesn't even know how awful he is. Right. At some point. I think in the case of Meta, I think they do want. They do understand there's a shift happening, a vibe shift, rather significant. And they're trying to figure out how to be liked again. I'm not so sure they're ever gonna be liked. I think you're right. I don't know.

[Scott Galloway]

The advisor advice. The advice is the same. They should take the advice from Albert Brooks to William Hurt. When William Hurt says, what happens when your reality exceeds your wildest dreams? And Albert Brooks says, keep it to yourself. They should just continue to perform. Continue to add shareholder value, Go on background when they feel they're being treated unfairly. But to run this, like, sugary ad of, we're here to connect people. No, you're not. That's not your aim. That's not what you're trying to do.

[Kara Swisher]

You should just put wins on the board on things. They can put wins on the board in, like, helping people get jobs, maybe giving money to, like. Well, you see, teen girls, like, we don't want their money. Right. Like, you're the ones that caused the problem or what part of the problem? Not all of it, but their economic

[Scott Galloway]

growth, economic engine, incredible products, incredible shareholder value. I personally think it would be a good move at this point for these guys to self age gate say we're not letting anyone onto the platform under the age of 60.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, I think they're gonna do that. I think they're going to, they're going

[Scott Galloway]

to do it the night before it's about to pass in Congress is when they'll do it.

[Kara Swisher]

I think they're going to move into that space. But then there's the beef with Apple and Google over that. Who decides age verification? That's another fight by the way. And Apple and Google aren't extinguishing themselves in that fight either. Anyway, it's a really, it was not a great ad. Stick with the simple ads. We're providing jobs, we care about people's. You know, we're going to help this. You know, it's interesting because Mark does switch between I want to be liked and fuck, you know, and I think fuck you is probably where he mostly lives and he has to become comfortable in that spot. But I don't think he is.

[Scott Galloway]

I felt like, okay, them spending a hundred million dollars to try and say we're likable and we're cool again is like your uncle showing up with a Ferrari to convince everyone he doesn't miss his ex. It's just, it doesn't ring true.

[Kara Swisher]

I don't know.

[Scott Galloway]

They're trying to make surveillance capitalism seem aspirational.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, I know. They should get rid of the creepy glasses or like lean into or something like, I just, it's really interesting and I think they're gonna, I think ultimately he's gonna have to live with the fact and this movie's coming out the social reckoning which I think is not gonna make him look very good. So I don't know.

[Scott Galloway]

I just hope a lot of the creators do. Like what if ads were honest? Because this would be. We're bringing people together usually to sell them creatine that they talked about within earshot of a phone. I mean that would be the real ad, right? Or to suggest, or to suggest innovative waves of self harm or how £90 and 510 is normal. That's how we're bringing people together.

[Kara Swisher]

That's not funny. That's.

[Scott Galloway]

Why am I laughing?

[Kara Swisher]

That's not funny. You know what they should do is. You don't like us. We know, but we have some good stuff. Like we're not the. We're not. What can we say? We're not Elon Musk. We're not Elon Musk.

[Scott Galloway]

We're bringing people together by elevating your aunt's conspiracy theories. I mean, I just. I can't wait for.

[Kara Swisher]

We should go in there and do a presentation, I think. We're not Elon Musk is their best argument.

[Unidentified Guest]

So just.

[Kara Swisher]

Anyway, to be fair, the song is fine. I know. People made a big thing of it. Actually, he was talking about a better future in that song too.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, wait, I got another one.

[Kara Swisher]

If you have to explain your joke, it's not funny.

[Scott Galloway]

I got another one. One, Meadow, where you found your college roommate. Now it's where you share your roommate's dad's post that Michelle Obama is secretly a linebacker. I mean, I. I. Bring me in. Put me in, Coach.

[Kara Swisher]

Let's go in there.

[Scott Galloway]

I'm ready.

[Kara Swisher]

Let's go in and help them. Let's help them. They should have a sense of humor. That is one thing Mark has not had enough of, is a sense of humor. He does not. He's not gonna laugh. I'm sorry, Dina. I tried.

[Scott Galloway]

Meta, we're gonna try and sell you something you searched about six months ago.

[Kara Swisher]

Okay, stop.

[Unidentified Caller/Guest]

All right?

[Kara Swisher]

We're moving on. This Trump administration moving on. Sorry, Mark. We apologize. Not really.

[Scott Galloway]

I got one more based on my feed. The future is AI generated. Jesus. Holding six puppies while giving away free RVs. Literally met. If you have any sense of humor, you will run my ads. You will run. I should do this on AI. Can't you create ads using AI now?

[Kara Swisher]

Maybe. Yeah. Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

I think this is genius. I should start a podcast on ads from Meta.

[Kara Swisher]

I've got one. Meta fucking elections since 2006.

[Scott Galloway]

There you go.

[Kara Swisher]

Nice. Anyway, all right, moving on. Donald Trump. We have to stop making these up. Donald Trump says administration is launching a trade investigation into European Union after it hit Google with a $1 billion antitrust fine. In a true social post, Trump accused the EU of robbing American tech companies. Trump claimed the latest fine was issued without explanation, even though the EU regulators said it stemm failure to comply with the Digital Markets act, which we've known about for a long time. Regardless, Trump said the US is not a piggy bank for Europe and is threatening to hit the EU with substantial tariffs. As usual. Go to is his tariffs because those just expired and he's trying all manner of ways to put new tariffs on. Listen, Obama released a similar thing at the time of the original Digital Markets act and the other act. So a Lot of presidents do this, but the tax tariff way, he never did anything about it. Obama complained about it, as I recall, and was defending US tech companies. But thoughts on this?

[Scott Galloway]

I'm so exhausted by all of it because I have trouble understanding it. And usually the stuff that's boring is the important stuff. So two decisions, half a billion. Fine. For self preferencing its own search. The EU has essentially become the de facto regulator for American tech because America won't do it itself. So I'm a little bit. I'm of two minds here. And that is when the primary form of tech innovation coming out of the EU is regulation, that's not a great sign. It reflects poorly on both of us. Quite frankly, I don't have a lot to say here. Carol, what are your thoughts? By the way, the new I do have the new meta tagline though. We're not the same Facebook that ruined Thanksgiving.

[Unidentified Caller/Guest]

This time we won't drink.

[Kara Swisher]

This time we promise not to drink.

[Scott Galloway]

I got a new job as an agency. I'm literally starting the new meta agency. Whether they like it or not, I'm the new meta agency.

[Kara Swisher]

Brought us in. Bring us in, Mark. Bring us in. We can help you.

[Scott Galloway]

Put us in code.

[Kara Swisher]

Put us in. Put us in. Pay us enormous amounts of money to insult you, Meta.

[Scott Galloway]

We're not just ruining Thanksgiving anymore.

[Unidentified Guest]

Yeah,

[Scott Galloway]

if you thought your drunk uncle practicing karate at Thanksgiving was creepy, wait till you see what the algorithm's gonna feed you.

[Kara Swisher]

All right, I'm gonna very quickly dispense of this and I'm gonna say one thing. Let me just tell you, Meta, you really should have a sin. You should 100% have it. That would show you understand the problem that you have. I think it would be really good.

[Scott Galloway]

But you know how you got your hey girls. You know what I get? I don't get hey girl. I get hey hey. And by the way, they don't call me. They're PR representative, They're comms person who shadows them. Hey, so and so is going to be in town. Would love to grab a drink with you. Everyone thinks that if anyone offering me a drink, I'm there.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, he is. He shows up.

[Scott Galloway]

They're a little.

[Kara Swisher]

I do not.

[Scott Galloway]

He's an alcoholic. I buy him out for drinks. I'm like the less intelligent Christopher Hitchens.

[Kara Swisher]

I'll tell you what I do when I get the hey girls, I go because I'm like, oh, okay, sure, I'm happy to re engage with you, given I was accurate. No, I wanna find shit out.

[Scott Galloway]

What are you talking about is a picture of me and Caitlin Collins.

[Kara Swisher]

I see that.

[Scott Galloway]

She's the best.

[Kara Swisher]

I love that Caitlin Collins.

[Scott Galloway]

That's my credibility right here.

[Kara Swisher]

She works hard. I really like Caitlyn Collins. All right, with the EU thing, this has been going on forever. We don't do any regulation. They may be guilty of doing too much. But too bad. Y' all knew the vines that were gonna be here. Do something about our tech industry in a way that satisfies European regulators. And if you wanna, you live by their rules. I'm sorry. And Trump can complain about it, but hitting with tariffs, his old trick is ridiculous. Tariffs are bad for the economy. They cause inflation. They're a stupid way to hit back. And it's not gonna work. So it doesn't matter. So I think it's just a wash in that regard. Remeda, you can keep making jokes all the rest of the show. All right, let's go on a quick break. When we come back, the FDA loosens restrictions on peptides. Ooh. Something Scott likes to talk about. We'll talk about what happens next.

[Scott Galloway]

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[Advertisement Voice]

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[Scott Galloway]

Happy ending, zero tears. Give it a [e-mail] Switch upfront payment

[Unidentified Guest]

of $45 for three months, $90 for six months, or $180 for a 12 month plan. Required $15 per month equivalent taxes and fees. Extra initial plan term only greater than 50 gigabytes. Me slow when network is busy. See terms. Wow, I'm so glad I took calculus in high school and not personal finance. Said nobody. Ever figuring it all out for yourself when you're fresh out of school can not only be daunting, it can literally cost you. I'm Vivian Tu, your rich bff, and on this episode of Net Worth and Chill, we're rewinding a decade to when I was first out of college and learning to care for my own finances. The hard with plenty of slip ups and face plants. But since I already made those mistakes, I get to share them with you so you don't have to. If you want to swerve all of the potholes I fell into, give the episode a listen wherever you get your podcasts or watch on YouTube.com YourRichBFF.

[Kara Swisher]

Scott we're back and talking about the latest buzzword in wellness peptides. I'm so tired of hearing about peptides from people after my show. People take them for everything from weight loss, anti aging to muscle growth. They're the MIR by the way, GLP1s are peptides. Right now people are getting on these so called gray market online through longevity clinics, even TikTok outside of the FDA approval process. But last week a panel of doctors and pharmacists, all of whom are in the tank, voted to recommend the FDA ease access to several peptides that are popular with influencers, celebrities and RFK Jr. That's in spite of government scientists warning about the lack of data showing these drugs are safe or effective. It's like nuts. The FDA isn't saying that drugs are dangerous. They're saying they don't have enough information which they should get. And maybe not a good enough reason to restrict access. But approval would benefit telehealth companies, compounding pharmacies and frankly RFK's agenda. I will say one quick thing since I didn't cover them in my show but the gray market is so dangerous and they're mostly made in China. It's a very dangerous thing to be putting in your body. And there still are very unclear studies on whether these things work and there should be, by the way, there should be studies paid for by the government which we use to fund these scientists to do these things. But just letting them out there among the people is such a mistake if we don't have and I understand slowing things down is a problem but sometimes it's for the best. And these things can be very, very dangerous in terms of where they're coming from and whether they're safe for use. Scott, go ahead. Peptides.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, peptide's an overused term. GLP1 is a peptide and my understanding is peptide is just a series of molecules that the. I agree with you that the again, it's the same through line. It's a lack of trust in our institutions. We used to trust our institutions to tell us what we should put into our body or what we shouldn't or that we had a smart FDA or a smart CDC that would help protect us. I had dinner with two actors on when was it? Thursday I think, or Saturday anyways. And they're both on this Wolverine stack Peptide and I like this stuff. I take supplements. I'm on testosterone therapy. I was doing NAD for a while. I like to be out. I do believe there's something to this stuff But I wait till there's a decent amount. I guess NAD is the most. And I also do creatine. But as someone who does a decent amount of research, the peptide jury is not in. Or these peptides, I should say, say, yeah, GLP1.

[Kara Swisher]

They are, they are. They're getting.

[Scott Galloway]

GLP1 is. It's FDA approved. I mean, most many of these GLP1s are FDA approved. And by the way, every piece of research that comes out, the externalities are positive, which is the most unique thing about that.

[Kara Swisher]

And we're getting real time data of people using them. Usually they're now done by doctors, much more so than at the beginning, but go ahead.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, by the way, the same ad agency that's helping Meta is rebranding Marlboro as a wellness star startup. Just so you know.

[Kara Swisher]

Anyway, so finish your thought. Your peptide thought.

[Scott Galloway]

I look, I, I again, I think that's this. People deciding to do their own medical research and come to their own conclusions because an influencer tells them that, you know, Leo is on this thing. And I actually, I don't know if he is or isn't.

[Kara Swisher]

Right, right. Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

And I get the point.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah.

[Scott Galloway]

I do think there's something. I have never done, all the stuff I've done, I have never done it without medical supervision, meaning I have my blood drawn all the time now and I do all these crazy analyses of it. And they'll say, you are low on these omegas. Take fish oils. Fine. I'm a fan of intervention and being thoughtful about plussing up the gaps in your nutrition or whatever it might be, especially as you get older. Older. And my view is between the ages of 20 and 50, your body's pretty goddamn good at figuring out what it needs. Unfortunately, it starts to die because the majority of us are supposed to be dead by now. So some intervention, I think, makes sense. This stuff feels cutting edge to the point of buyer beware. I don't.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, I would agree. I have a lot of people that are like, it works. I'm like, does it? Do you know, do you know there's, there are studies. I'm like, actually, no, no, there are. Like, they're, they're not, they're very inconclusive. And, and my worry about them, and they should be studied. Absolutely. Is where they're coming from and where you're getting those things. And you wouldn't like, it's sort of like getting like, here's some milk from a guy on the corner. Like, it might be good, it might be bad. And so A lot of it does come from China, especially these compounding agencies. And there are no strictures on how they are. It's like eating poop lettuce. Like you might have a good meal, you might have exploding diarrhea, and. And it's too dangerous to do it. But everybody, I get so yelled at. That's the one thing of Peptides. And I'm like, I'm sorry. I wish. It would be great if they worked the way they say. They also are ascribing far too many, like it's a solution for everything, which is all these supplements, they're not. Sometimes they're a very small little addition to your Life. Sometimes, like GLP1s, they are truly groundbreaking. But to say they do everything is just unproven and you have to stop pretending. So every person who comes up to me, I'm sorry, incorrect, but. And you shouldn't be putting things like this in your body without medical supervision or scientific proof. Sorry, I'm on the scientific proof. Anyway, that's the way it is. That's the way it is. But, you know, Meta now with more peptides. All right, Scott, one more. Hold on.

[Scott Galloway]

New tagline Facebook, where nuance goes to get beaten to death with a folding chair.

[Kara Swisher]

Oh, I feel so bad.

[Scott Galloway]

But isn't listening literally isn't this ad, Isn't essentially this ad just the broadcast embodiment of an abusive ex husband, Zuckerberg, seeing you and whispering in your ear, baby, I've changed.

[Kara Swisher]

Baby, I've changed.

[Scott Galloway]

Baby, I've changed.

[Kara Swisher]

Here's the thing. Why don't our listeners write in their taglines for Meta to help them?

[Scott Galloway]

Well, it's also, you know, it's disingenuous. As a brand guy, these ads are absolutely beautiful. But the thing is, their actual product, in terms of design, it feels like Craigslist fucked QAnon. It's like QAnon. QAnon. QAnon.

[Kara Swisher]

Let's read.

[Scott Galloway]

Baby, I changed. Baby, I've changed. I'm a new man. Baby, I've changed. Take me back. Baby, I just love you so much. You forced me to hit you. I just love you so much.

[Kara Swisher]

We should not be laughing at that.

[Scott Galloway]

Terrible.

[Kara Swisher]

You're terrible. You're terrible. We're terrible people. Anyway, I'm sure we'll get lots of letters. Anyway, why don't you all write in and tell us what you think the taglines for Meta should be and then we will read them anyway. See if you can do better than Scott, who just doesn't seem to stop all Right.

[Unidentified Guest]

Look at him.

[Kara Swisher]

The marketer in him is just energized. All right, one more quick break. We'll be back for wins and fails. Okay, Scott, let's hear some wins and fails. I think I'll go first. First fail was the story came out in the Post, which I was post some. The Post news side is doing a great job, I have to say. This is a headline. Police vetted dubious allegation only after Buttigieg was separated from children. The people. This is the. Pete Buttigieg's kids were taken away from him for a time and questioned in a really terrible way by authorities. They were investigating these allegations made and the former cabinet secretaries was separated from his four year old twins. And now the machinic attorney general is investigating how the accusation led to it. And it turns out the Post talked to the woman who did it and she seems unhinged from what I can tell from the interview and didn't really understand and basically I think made it up and nobody was checked. Like I think it started in Indiana and then he was supposed to be in Alabama. But none of the authorities before they took the kids away checked on the source of the information. I have said this again and again. Chastain and Pete should sue these people for what they did and the damage is done to their kids, like unnecessarily without any checking because of these ideas around gay parenting, which, you know, was part of it. Cause this woman essentially did not think gay people should be parents from what I can tell from this interview. And I have to say, it's just. It's mind boggling that our authority. I get it. One crazy lady's gonna make some allegations. That happens all the time in this world. Now the fact that the police and others didn't vet it is really. It's just such an incredible indictment of Michigan authorities. So I just. It's such a fail. Such a massive, enormous, repulsive fail, I have to say. And my win is I have to. This beautiful show, this Cat's Jellicle Ball, it's closing soon. I recommend people go see it. Just beautiful. It's so kind and human forward. Speaking of something that is human forward and funny and just everything Broadway's great at. And I just. Clara dressed herself up in this beautiful spangled fierce dress and this wonderful fascinator hat. And it was just a wonderful thing. So I just love when people are out at the theater and in theater, in movie theaters and things like that. And so I can't recommend these lovely, joyful, beautiful, artistic Human centered stuff that's coming out lately. And it's really. There seems to be a shift where people just want to get together or else celebrate real humanity. Not in meta ads, but in that way. So I would say get out and do something with a lot of people and have some fun. All right, that's my win. Go ahead.

[Scott Galloway]

Well, my loss is the White House correspondence dinner. It should be canceled or they should. They need to reinvent. Was the one I built to fake a truce and it couldn't hold for two hours or it hasn't been able to hold for two hours. And the tell here was during this ridiculous, ridiculous, weird, creepy rant on a respected journalist, the whole room just went so silent it felt like you could cut the air with just ick and terrible. Terrible for our brand. Anyways, we covered that. That's my loss. White House Correspondent's Dinner, whoever the governing organization is has to realize like this is over. It should be canceled or not done for a couple years. And I need to reinvent something else. My win is it's not getting very much coverage. But what's gotten a decent amount of coverage is Ukraine with their incredible supply chain and drone and AI technology has been going after oil infrastructure. What they've done, which I thought was genius, is they've gone after something that has hit Russia perhaps even harder. And that was they blew up the wild berries factory. And it ends up basically Wild berries is the Amazon of Russia. Russia. And this supposedly has caused more rage about the war than a million deaths and casualties. Because the reality is the majority of the soldiers and the fatalities that toll on families has been levied against kids and families from lack of a better term, rural Russia. And the elites don't really care. But you start fucking with their ability to sell their fashion into to people in St. Petersburg, supposedly this has just outraged all these creators and all these small business people and also has had an impact on the front lines because a lot of people were buying kind of basic military equipment and gear. And I thought it was just so interesting that they.

[Kara Swisher]

And Putin's on the run. It looks like he looks like he's hiding away too. At the same time.

[Scott Galloway]

People. Well, A, supposedly he's paranoid and B, he should be very, very. He's very scared. This is so. I thought this was so interesting. They want. What are they doing? They're saying, okay, we've shown we can kill a thousand people a day. Russians don't seem to care. The Russia's arguably Russia's core competence. It's. It's an incredibly educated populace, an incredible, incredible appreciation of culture and the arts and technology. A lot of very redeeming qualities about, about Russian culture. But their core competence, quite frankly, is they're willing to endure more suffering than any society in history. We lost 400,000 people in World War II, they lost 20 million. And they were ready to keep fighting. But what they've said is, okay, we're going to hit you where we think it hurts most for you, and that is going after your ability to order shit overnight. And I thought it was just such genius there. And I think Ukraine is not only, not only showing, I mean, they're, they're essentially, they've said, okay, we're bringing the war to you. And it's just interesting how they've decided to bring it to the Russian populace. So instant visible pain versus sanctions. Kind of year long, you know, year long impact, if you will, or years long impact. I thought it was very innovative anyways. My, my, my fail.

[Kara Swisher]

You know, this would happen. This would be like if we declared war on Canada, they would get us eventually. You know what I mean? Like, they're right, right next to each other. They've proven very strong. Although there's been some back and forth with. He fired one guy, one drone guy, and then everyone got mad about that and then he ended up firing another defense minister in Ukraine. There's a little bit of back and forth there. But can I note something else that he was doing that I thought was rather clever? So he's now going to the maga, right, to talk to people. Did you see Laura Loomer, who was so anti Ukraine and pro Putin, went there and interviewed him as suddenly his biggest follower. Like, he's so great kind of thing. I think that's also very clever. Even though he has his own issues internally with corruption and everything else, he's been very adept at also appealing to the MAGA base here, which I think is probably very smart.

[Scott Galloway]

Yeah, it's. I mean, you get mixed emotions. You're like, why? Why should anyone care what Laura Loomer thinks? But at the same time, anything that gets pressed that high highlights. Even the crazies have recognized that it's in our best interest to support Ukraine. I'm here for. Yeah, so, yeah, have at it, Laura. And next. Maybe next you can do a segment on how the greatest innovation in history is vaccines. That's the one I'm waiting for.

[Kara Swisher]

She suddenly is gonna be pro vaccine. Anyway. Those are good ones. Those are excellent ones. Oh, by the way, I have one More quick win. Everybody go see Ride or Die with Octavia Spencer and Hannah Waddingham. Oh, my God. It's.

[Scott Galloway]

What's that?

[Kara Swisher]

It's a show on Amazon.

[Advertisement Voice]

And.

[Kara Swisher]

And it's hysterical. It's two ladies. It's so ridiculously. It's such a ridiculous conceit that they run around and they're spies, but these two couldn't be the best pair. And they look so different and they're so different in general. And I have to say, it's hysterical. Ride or Die.

[Scott Galloway]

Called Ride or Die.

[Kara Swisher]

Ride or Die. And I love Hannah and I love Octavia. I think she's one of my favorite. It's Hannah from TED Lasso. And she's amazing. She's. I love her.

[Scott Galloway]

Oh, the one. The Hannah that was in Game of Thrones.

[Kara Swisher]

Yes, she was in Game of Thrones, too.

[Scott Galloway]

Yes, that's right.

[Kara Swisher]

Yeah, she's amazing. She's a tall drink of water. And Octavia is incredible, too. Just incredible. Just incredible. Go see it if you want to enjoy yourself all day long and twice on Sunday. You'd like it. Scott. Anyway, we want to hear from you. Send us your questions about business, tech or whatever's on your mind. Go to nymag.com pivot to submit a question for the show or call 85551, pivot. Elsewhere in the Kara and Scott universe, this week on on, I'm talking to actor and comedian, comedian Jeff Hiller. He's in two of the buzziest TV shows of the last year, Pluribus, where he just got an Emmy nomination for just a guest role. He's amazing in it. And Widow's Bay. He talked about why people are drawn to these shows. Let's listen to a clip.

[Scott Galloway]

These are dark worlds, but it's not like our dark world. You know, it's like we can figure it out. We can pull apart the lore and figure out this mystery, whereas we don't have that kind of control in our own life because, I mean, every time you open the New York Times, it's like, what that happened.

[Kara Swisher]

Anyway, he's a really great guy. He's sort of a character actor. And I love. There's so many great character actors in all these shows and also severance. Same thing. Just really nice to see all these shows do so well. And he's terrific. Okay, that's the show. Thanks for listening to Pivot and be sure to like and subscribe to our YouTube channel. Channel. We'll be back on Friday.

[Scott Galloway]

Today's show was produced by Lara Naiman, Zoe Marcus Taylor Griffin, Todd Wiseman and Christine Driscoll. Additional assistance from Kate Gallagher and Brad Sylvester, Ernie and her Todd entered this episode. Thanks also to Jabros, Ms. Vera and Dan Shalon. The Shot Core As Vox Media's executive producer podcast, make sure to follow Pivot on your favorite podcast platform. Thanks for listening to Pivot from Vox Media. We'll be back later in the week for another breakdown of all things tech and business. Cara have a great rest of the week.

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