Indigo, Cotton, and Exploitation: The history of Sydney Sweeney's Jeans | TMT 154

Summary

Too Many Tabs with Pearlmania500

Episode: Indigo, Cotton, and Exploitation: The History of Sydney Sweeney's Jeans (TMT 154)

Date: November 16, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this episode, the husband-and-wife duo behind Too Many Tabs delve deep into the unexpected and dark history behind Sydney Sweeney's much-criticized jeans advertisement. What starts as a heated reaction to internet discourse and media interviews quickly evolves into a fascinating, biting, and highly political journey through the history of jeans: from modern controversies around celebrity, whiteness, and social media, all the way back to the imperialist, exploitative roots of denim, indigo dye, and cotton. Maintaining their comedic and irreverent tone, the hosts break down how an apparently innocuous jeans ad sits atop centuries of exploitation, colonialism, and cultural baggage.

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Key Discussion Segments & Insights

1. Sydney Sweeney, Media Controversy & The Jeans Ad

(starts ~01:00, in-depth ~04:06, 11:02, 12:41)

• The episode springs from Sydney Sweeney’s current pop culture presence: a string of box office flops (Americana, Eden, Christie), her GQ interview, and specifically, her now-infamous American Eagle jeans ad.
• Discussion about why Sweeney gets so much attention:
  • “Sydney Sweeney only has a job because they've removed nudity and sex from every other form of entertainment that is mass marketed... Once something like Euphoria came out... she was the one that was the most naked.” – Mrs. P (04:20)
• Analysis of media treatment and Sweeney’s own ambiguity:
  • The GQ interviewer is described as fawning and unable to challenge Sweeney's evasive, almost “Taylor Swift-like” answers about public criticism.
  • “She acknowledges... that she knows what she's doing and people will one day find out that she knows what she's doing and she lets her art speak for itself.” – Podcast Co-host 2 (12:08)
• Memorable Quote:
  • “Jeans are uncontroversial. Jeans are awesome.” – GQ Interviewer, mocking how the issue is being sidestepped (13:28)

2. White Supremacy, Twitter, and Notions of “Good Genes”

(07:29–09:44)

• The hosts outline how “good genes” puns in Sweeney’s ad became a far-right meme and dog whistle on Twitter/X, making her a symbol of whiteness and purity.
• The spread of white supremacist attitudes post-2024 election and Elon Musk’s Twitter/X policies are tied in, with open references to recruitment and the “Overton window” of normalized hate.
  • “Sydney Sweeney is now the face of white racism on Twitter and to the point where there are so many dudes who are constantly posting about her or just posting images of her.” – Mrs. P (07:29)
• Memorable Moment: Discussion of Elon Musk doing a Nazi salute and direct accusations about him supercharging white supremacist messaging (08:41).

3. How Jeans Became a Political Battleground

(16:44, 20:45, 22:11 onward)

• The hosts reject the idea that “jeans aren't controversial,” emphasizing that nearly everything about their history—color, design, fabric—is riddled with exploitation and politics.
• Quote: “Everything is political. All art is political. Everything involves politics. To create anything, someone has to get hurt.” – Podcast Co-host 2 (22:23)

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Deep Dives: The History Behind Jeans

A. Indigo: The Color of Royalty and Colonialism

(22:54–32:15, resumes 34:15)

• True blue jeans are indigo, not simply blue.
• Indigo dye was once more valuable than gold and restricted to royalty (24:55).
• Sourced historically from India, East Asia, and Egypt via a labor-intensive process.
• The East India Company exploited Indian peasants, creating debts and violent abuses; the “blue gold” of indigo fueled brutal colonial economies (37:00+).
• The Indigo Revolt (1859): Indian peasants, forced to grow indigo instead of food and kept in poverty by high-interest loans, rose up in a bloody but crucial uprising—eventually inspiring Gandhi and global anti-colonial resistance (46:36–51:34).
  • Quote: “Not a chest of indigo reached England without it being stained with human blood.” – Cited by Mrs. P (50:36)

B. Jeans: From Genoa to Levi Strauss

(56:09–65:15)

• European adoption: Genoa, Italy produced sturdy blue cloth for laborers—'bleu de Gênes' in French gave us the English term ‘jeans’ (59:02–60:29).
• The classic design: Jacob Davis & Levi Strauss invented reinforced denim pants with metal rivets for California miners (61:39–62:54). They hold up a current pair of Levi's, explaining the function and symbolic legacy of rivets.
• Reminders that innovation and business success were rarely about the miners themselves—but the suppliers.
  • Quote: “Nobody really made that much money from the actual gold... The people who got super rich from the Gold Rush... were selling the equipment.” – Mrs. P (66:28–67:59)

C. Cotton: The Fabric of Slavery

(71:33–83:00)

• Cotton is likely the most fraught material in American and global history, second only to oil in its economic importance.
• Origins in India (72:16), but self-described “late-stage” European and American industrialization was built atop chattel slavery:
  • “If you touch cotton, it was touched by someone who had never touched freedom.” – Mrs. P (76:38)
• British, French, and American cotton industries worked hand in glove with the slave trade; later, American plantations switched seamlessly to exploiting prison labor post-Emancipation, as codified in the 13th Amendment.
  • Quote: “Once [slavery] was abolished, the prison system in the southern states was built around cotton plantations. Literally, they built prisons next to cotton plantations and then used the prison inmates, mainly black Americans, to pick cotton.” – Podcast Co-host 2 (81:06)
• Child labor in British mills (77:01–77:43), forced Indian farmers via British colonial policy, and continuing exploitation are all tied to the cotton in every pair of jeans.

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Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• “Sydney Sweeney only has a job because they've removed nudity and sex from every other form of entertainment that is mass marketed... Once something like Euphoria came out... she was the one that was the most naked.” – Mrs. P (04:20)
• “Jeans are uncontroversial. Jeans are awesome.” – GQ Interviewer (13:28, quoted critically)
• “Not a chest of indigo reached England without it being stained with human blood.” – Quoting a contemporary source (50:36)
• “If you touch cotton, it was touched by someone who had never touched freedom.” – Mrs. P (76:38)
• “Everything is political. All art is political. To create anything, someone has to get hurt.” – Podcast Co-host 2 (22:23)
• “Once [slavery] was abolished, the prison system in the southern states was built around cotton plantations. Literally, they built prisons next to cotton plantations and then used the prison inmates, mainly black Americans, to pick cotton.” – Podcast Co-host 2 (81:06)
• [On pre-ripped jeans] “Buying ripped pre ripped jeans is not only stupid, it spits in the face of the people who came before.” – Mrs. P (65:00)

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Memorable Moments

• Hosts joke about “relatable” shopping at Costco, Boscov's, and Kohl's, contrasting their lives with celebrity marketing (19:57, 63:06).
• The ongoing refrain: “Blue jeans are not controversial,” said repeatedly with mounting evidence to the contrary (multiple points, notably 71:25–72:56).
• Mrs. P’s pointed claim: “God gave me talent instead of tits.” (75:47)
• Reflection on multi-generational struggle: “It sucks to plant the tree for your grandkids to have shade when you're so fucking hot right now, but eventually it has to be done.” – Mrs. P (52:20)
• Absurdist asides: including whether Sydney Sweeney is Jeff Bezos’s “third,” and Bob the Drag Queen following them on TikTok (44:46, 47:57).

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Episode Structure & Flow

0:00–01:18

Podcast opens; ads; playful intro; Mrs. P highlights that she was “mad” this week.

01:19–22:11

Initial Sydney Sweeney/GQ/jeans ad discussion; the cultural moment; introduction to controversy.

22:12–34:15

The real history lesson begins. Deep dive into indigo, color, and colonialism.

34:15–51:34

Indigo Revolt in India, colonial exploitation, and the roots of resistance. British colonialism’s impact on indigo and the connection to anti-colonial protest.

51:34–65:15

Design and dissemination of jeans; Genoa to Levi Strauss, the gold rush, market economy evolution.

71:25–83:00

Cotton’s history; slavery; vertical integration; lingering exploitation even after abolition.

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Final Thoughts

The episode dissects how “uncontroversial” jeans are, uncovering a web of race, class, gender, and exploitation. Beginning with present-day pop culture and Twitter memes, the hosts demonstrate the way even an everyday garment is shot through with history—indigo linking to colonial revolt, “denim” from global trade, and cotton’s connection to slavery and ongoing oppression. They simultaneously lampoon celebrity vacuity (“I did a jeans ad—jeans are uncontroversial!”) and call out how “relatable” consumer life today is chained to the past.

Recommended for listeners who want:

• A comedic yet unflinching look at pop culture’s deeper roots
• Accessible history connecting fashion to grand themes of empire, resistance, and class struggle
• “Tab rabbit holes” that somehow stretch from Sydney Sweeney’s GQ interview to the 13th Amendment

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For next episode:
Expect the same blend of biting pop culture analysis, irreverent jokes, and deep historical rabbit holes—all with the goal of revealing just how many “tabs” lie behind even the most innocent-seeming topics.

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Remember:
“Everything is political. All art is political. To create anything, someone has to get hurt.” (22:23)
And, “Blue jeans are not controversial.” (Ironically...)

Transcript

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[Podcast Co-host 1]

Okay, only 10 more presents to wrap. You're almost at the finish line. But first, there, the last one. Enjoy a Coca Cola for a pause that refreshes.

[Mrs. P]

Wait, what was that? Sydney Sweeney.

[Podcast Co-host 1]

Can't wait to see what the board says.

[Mrs. P]

You want to know what we have on the board about you and controversy and genes and the history of so many things in this world? Girl, you're not ready. Because we opened how many tabs?

[Podcast Co-host 1]

Too many tabs.

[Mrs. P]

Dick Shady is dead. Remember to smile. Welcome to Too Many Tabs, a podcast where a husband and wife duo sit next to each other at a table, and like always, one of us, the wife, has done research on something that she got a little into because she got mad.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah, I got upset.

[Mrs. P]

You got mad this week I got real mad. Yep. And then you handed me a coffee for some reason, and I'm ready for it. Yeah, I'm here. It should be tea, because in reality, this is all piping hot tea. About sick Sydney Sweeney.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Well, no. Started with Sydney Sweeney.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

But it went somewhere completely different because I opened too many tabs.

[Mrs. P]

Yes, 100. I understand that completely.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

There is a GQ interview.

[Mrs. P]

GQ, the magazine. I understand that. I just wanted to make sure they.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

See, they don't have paper magazine. Well, they do, but nobody reads those.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Now they just have to post clips of their YouTube interviews.

[Mrs. P]

GQ stand for Gentlemen's Quarterly.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, I actually just. I was like, wow, I wonder what GQ stands.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Nailed it.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, man, I hate that. Everything is just initials. Yeah, it's bad. All right, so.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So she does. Does this GQ interview.

[Mrs. P]

So a woman. A woman actress is speaking to Gentlemen's Quarterly.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And I think we all know why Gentlemen's Quarterly said, let me get that Sydney Sweeney over here.

[Mrs. P]

Because gentlemen care about Sydney Sweeney for some reason.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Well, they care about Sydney Sweeney's body.

[Mrs. P]

Ah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Not her body of work, though, because recently we all just realized she's a huge box office floor flop.

[Mrs. P]

She Is.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah. She had this movie, Americana that came out and Halsey was in that. Poor Halsey. She didn't deserve a flop.

[Mrs. P]

Halsey was in a movie with her.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I'm sorry. It was like her first movie, and then it flopped because Sydney Sweeney sucks.

[Mrs. P]

That's not your fault. Halsey. Halsey. I like your music a lot.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Just so you know, I. There's a. I have a. I have a pretty good backlog of Halsey music. I play. I go through all the H's.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Halsey, Haley Williams, Whitney Houston.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

That's okay.

[Mrs. P]

That's an H. Houston.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

It's in the end. Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Well, yeah, because Americana had a $9 million budget and made less than 500,000 at the box office.

[Mrs. P]

Jesus.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And then there was this movie called Eden. I actually had to look this up because I didn't know she had another movie came out called Eden, and it cost 35 million to make and it only had a 2.5 million return.

[Mrs. P]

35 million to make a movie no one's heard of.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah. Who.

[Mrs. P]

Okay. Somebody dropped the ball.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And then three. Three. Three times are out.

[Podcast Co-host 1]

Right.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

This movie, Christie just came out.

[Mrs. P]

I've heard about.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

This is why she's doing the GQ interview is because she's on a press tour, guys.

[Mrs. P]

She's a pressure for this movie. And I've been seeing that. She's getting roasted to all hell about this one.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Because there's been a few things like this movie is bombed so badly.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

That everyone's pointing out at this point. Because those you guys don't know. Obviously, we're gonna be talking about Sydney Sweeney and the jeans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

If you're looking. If you're watching on YouTube.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

We have blue denim jeans hanging up behind us.

[Mrs. P]

Yes.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

That we haven't talked about.

[Mrs. P]

We haven't mentioned them yet. But we. We do have a series of jeans behind us hanging on the wall.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And it's because Sydney Sweeney's had some controversy. And the thing is, is I tell you this about Sydney Sweeney. Sydney Sweeney's entire. Some people are like, oh, my God, it's because, you know, of her body. People only care about her body. No, no, I'll actually argue different, Mrs. B. I'll argue that Sydney Sweeney only has a job because they've removed nudity and sex from every other form of entertainment that is mass marketed. It used to be if you watched a movie in the 80s or even in the 90s.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

There was just. There was gratuitous sex. There was gratuitous nudity. It was sprinkled in a lot. And then what happened? We hit the early 2000s. There even was still some.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Around 2010 with Netflix and the rise of streamers.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

They have did analytical data, and they just started removing all of the sex scenes from things. You got to go back now. And so once something like Euphoria came out on HBO Max. I think it's still called HBO Max now. It was HBO Go then. It was HBO now.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Let's not get into this.

[Mrs. P]

It was Max. It has. It's. The streaming service has so many dead names. Anyway, she was in Euphoria, where famously, she got naked.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah. And.

[Mrs. P]

And that was like. The naked show. Yeah, it was like. We had Game of Thrones. Game of Thrones went away.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Then they rolled out Euphoria, and then they brought. I don't. We haven't watched House of Dragon. I don't know if there's boobs in House of Dragon.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Listen.

[Mrs. P]

Maybe.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

But my question is, I thought that with Netflix, it was like, oh, Netflix and chill. Which means we put on Netflix and then we do sexy stuff. Yeah, but you're telling me they're not doing sexy stuff.

[Mrs. P]

Nobody's doing sexy stuff because everyone is second and third screening everything. Who is? No one. But that's the thing is, like, back in the day, it's. You would put on a movie, and in the movie, there would be sex.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

They've removed sex. Like, where everything is slowly turning into Bollywood. Like, in this idea of, like, oh, we have two characters. Oh, my God. They're about to. They're about to fuck. And they're like music production.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Specifically the. The TV show about high school students.

[Mrs. P]

Yes, 100%. That's what's fucking crazy. And so out of that movie. I mean, out of that show, Sydney Sweeney was the one that was the most naked. Yep. Right. I think. I don't know. You watch the show? You watch it? I did.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

There was some. There was other people who were naked, but I think.

[Mrs. P]

But they weren't blonde.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

They weren't blonde, and they didn't have.

[Mrs. P]

Big boobs and that. And so she was blonde with big boobs. And then they sprinkled it around and a bunch of different stuff. And then now we have a whole generation of weird Twitter men who believe that she is the height of sexy.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

But they aren't following her to any of these products because. Because in all of these other movies that you're mentioning, I'm gonna go ahead and assume fully clothed, probably that's what I'M saying.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Who knows? I haven't seen it. No.

[Mrs. P]

I don't even know what she sounds like.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Christie. This movie.

[Mrs. P]

Yes.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Which is about a female boxer who I believe is a lesbian. And, like, the story is about how she didn't come out because of, like, the.

[Mrs. P]

It's a story. It's a story about a lesbian boxer who was in a domestic violence situation before she came out.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Got it.

[Mrs. P]

Like, it's like. It's a very specific.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I don't want to say this sounds a little woke.

[Mrs. P]

It's a woke movie.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And if there's one thing we learned about Cindy Sweeney. Not woke.

[Mrs. P]

She is the face of not well. Yeah. That's what's been crazy. Is that over time. Because of the jeans ad. Which we'll talk about a little bit more in a second.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Referencing these goddamn jeans behind.

[Mrs. P]

I am. But because Sydney Sweeney said she had good genes and the president and a bunch of other people got involved. Sydney Sweeney is now the face of white racism on Twitter and to the point where there are so many dudes who are constantly posting about her or just posting images of her.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

It's weird because, like, I don't have a Twitter because I care about my sanity.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And my serenity. And so I don't look at that website. But everything I know about that website from you and other people talking about it is. It's just scrolling pornography. Correct.

[Mrs. P]

No. Twitter is now actually worse than what 4chan used to be.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I don't.

[Mrs. P]

Twitter is a. I know. You don't know because you used to go outside and go to parties and have fun and do all these different.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Things about what 4chan is in reference to this.

[Mrs. P]

Okay. Good. That's good. That's why you. You're the perfect person to explain this to. 4chan. Was. Is. Was a website that. And a message board.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay.

[Mrs. P]

Where sad people congregated.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And it had a very large amount of Nazis and white supremacists who showed up there to do recruitment drives.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay.

[Mrs. P]

That mentality was then writ large. It exploded across Twitter when Elon Musk bought it and removed all content. Moderation.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Got it.

[Mrs. P]

And also, Elon Musk himself is a Nazi. Here's an image of him doing the Nazi salute. There we go. We also talked about it on the Elon Musk racist grandpa episode, which I'm sure we'll put a link to down in the description. These. This stuff happened over and over and over again. And so he has supercharged the white supremacist talking points all across Twitter.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And Then on top of that, after the election of 2024, you have all the libs going to Blue sky or threads or just leaving Twitter completely, so the only people are left. The idea of the Overton window, of what's acceptable on Twitter, it is 1939 in Germany or worse somehow. And so on that site in particular, Sydney Sweeney is being worshiped as the.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Face they didn't go see. Her movie cost 15 million to make, and it's estimated it's only going to pull in 1.25 million over this weekend. It is the 10th worst domestic opening of all time.

[Mrs. P]

Because these are Nazis. They don't want to listen to a woman talk that. I mean, they also claim that they care about women's sports all the time. It's a women's sports movie. They are just psychopaths. All they do is they make up lies about giving a shit about women's sports, caring about the safety of women, all this different shit. Because they just want to attack trans people. And they want to attack trans people so that way they can convince white women to vote for a fucking man who was best friends with a pedophile who we now have. An email just came out about an email I'm getting the board. An email just dropped where Epstein himself said that Donald Trump knew exactly what he was doing and hung out in his house with one of the victims for hours. And this email was to Jerlaine Maxwell. The email is from 2011. I don't know if you know this. It's 2025. This email is 14 years old. The email is old enough to be one of the victims.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

You feel better?

[Mrs. P]

I do a little bit.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. Take a sip of coffee.

[Mrs. P]

Okay. Oh, can I tell you something?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Dick Cheney is still dead. Hey.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Snap, snap, snap, snap, snap.

[Mrs. P]

And they didn't lower the flags for him. I noticed that they didn't let me try it.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Charlie Kirk got the flags lowered. And he's a podcast. He was a podcaster.

[Mrs. P]

Wow. Go ahead, tell us about Sydney Sweeney.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Well, no, I have to play you this clip first.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So I'm going to put the clip up here for everybody listening, but I'm going to play it for you here. And we'll see. We'll. We'll see how this all started for me. Okay.

[Mrs. P]

Gotcha. Gotcha. This is the gq.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes.

[Podcast Co-host 1]

As time goes on, people will see that I'm way more aware of things that people think. Can you say a little bit more? I mean, if I say it, then I like to let the art speak. For itself.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

The preface is, I let my art speak for itself. I know what I'm doing.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

You know what I mean? That's what she's saying, correct?

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, that's 100% what she said. And this is. This is in relation to the jeans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Ad, specifically right here. Yes. She's. She's talking about this other movie she did that was a flop. It was like a romcom.

[Mrs. P]

Got it.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Because everybody thought that she was sleeping with her co star who was engaged to somebody else.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. Which is misogyny, which we'll say on that part is misogyny and unfair to her on that little.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah, yeah, sure.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Sure, sure, sure. I think they did break up the fiance and the guy after the movie.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, I'm sure they did. Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So. But the thing is, she acknowledges in part of this interview that she's. She knows what she's doing, and people will one day find out that she knows what she's doing and she lets her art speak for itself.

[Mrs. P]

And also, in that little clip that you played for me, it also seemed that she was like, I. I much like Taylor Swift.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

I. I'm not acknowledging it, but I see everything.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Much like the way that we acknowledge your comments here on this podcast on the afterparty, our Patreon exclusive podcast where Mrs. P. And I react to your comments that you've left down below.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

So make sure that you go follow us over@Pearl Mania500.net and join our. Our paid member tier to get access to that, and you'll hear us reply to your very comments on this episode.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So wait, let me play you one more clip.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And then we'll take a break and come back and we'll figure out why I got so mad.

[Mrs. P]

Got it. I think we'll all know. I feel like with you, you wear it. You wear your heart on your sleeve or on your jeans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 1]

We're sort of talking around this American Eagle ad right now, and maybe we should just talk about it. So were you surprised by the reaction? I did a Gene ad. I mean, the reaction definitely was a surprise, but it was. I love jeans. All I wear are jeans. I'm literally in jeans and a T shirt, like, every day of my life. Jeans are uncontroversial. Jeans are awesome. I like your jeans. You look great in your jeans. I think I know how you're gonna answer this, but I'm gonna ask anyway. I mean, the president tweeted about the jeans ad or tweeted truth, socialed about the jeans. Ad and that just seems to me like a very crazy moment for anyone and I wondered what that was like. It was surreal. It was surreal.

[Mrs. P]

It was surreal. And you know what else is gonna be surreal? This sponsor right after this fall always feels like a reset with back to school football season and the days just gamble getting so much shorter. Finding time to cook can be tough. That's why we love factor. Factor offers a wide selection of chef prepared dietitian approved meals including premium seafood choices like salmon shrimp at no extra cost. And Mrs. P. Yes. Can we please preach a little bit of how much we love our factor.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Shout out Factor saving the day every day. What's. What are we going to have for lunch? A factor meal? Oh no, we got too busy today. We are we going to make for dinner? Factory meal.

[Mrs. P]

It's literally so quick. They're so fast. I also really love it's queso fundito.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah, you love a queso.

[Mrs. P]

I put that. I put it inside the chips. I eat them up. I love my gouda.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

The shrimp cavapati. Is that the one you like?

[Mrs. P]

Cavatappi. Cavatappi. There's so many different things. The Nona's Sunday beef. I do eat it. It's like a Sunday lasagna thing. It's so good. And all of them with gluten free options and also fitting to directly inside of all the different dietary goals that you're trying to meet. Because factor is here to help you support your wellness goals including a variety of GLP1 friendly meals and new Mediterranean diet options packed with protein or savor global flavors with new meals inspired by Chinese, Thai and Indian cuisine. More choices, better nutrition. That's why 97% of customers say that factor helped them live a healthier life. And and we are here to say that directly with them. Eat smart@factor meals.com Too many 50 off and use code too many 50 off to get 50% off your first box plus free breakfast for one year. That's code too many 50 off@factor meals.com for 50% off your first box plus FREE breakfast for one year.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Get delicious ready to eat meals delivered with factor offer only valid for new factor customers with code and qualifying auto renewing subscription purchase.

[Mrs. P]

And we're back. And now for my hot take on Shut up.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

This is my hot take because this is what pissed me off.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

All right. Are you ready? No, I'm ready. She's not wearing jeans in this interview.

[Mrs. P]

She is not. She's not.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

She said I always wear jeans. She has no pants. On in this interview, I think she's.

[Mrs. P]

Wearing a mini skirt. Right. It's like a leather miniskirt. Yeah. Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. So if it was cowboy boots. Rock and roll. But here's the thing. This is. Okay, so she doesn't acknowledge it. She says in the other part that she. She knows what she's doing, but she's like, no, no, no. I mean, it was just. I did an ad for jeans. That was her response. Right. They're like, did you understand the controversy? Do you. Do you see why people were upset? She's like, I just did a jeans ad. Like, but you also admit, you know, you admit you understand and that this is, quote, your art. That the jeans ad is your art.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And that you're expressing yourself through your art of jeans ads. Okay. But then this is what really happened. The interviewer who would not hold. Who had no spine. She was the Schumer of interviewers.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Who could not go up against her in any way. There was no pushback whatsoever. Just girlish giggles every time and just let her slide and slither away from every question. The interviewer says jeans aren't controversial.

[Mrs. P]

That. Yes, the interviewer did say jeans aren't controversial. And the one thing real fast. Yeah. Because I have a feeling where you're gonna go. The thing is about the actual Sydney Sweeney ad that a lot of people are leaving out is what she is talking about here is there is an ad from American Eagle, and in it, she said it's like, Sydney Sweeney has good genes. She has a whole thing about, like, hair color and eye color, all these different things. It is a reference to a different company's jeans ad.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes. Calvin Klein's.

[Mrs. P]

The Calvin Klein's ad that had a minor in it.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Brooke Shields.

[Mrs. P]

Brooke Shields. That was a sexualized child.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes.

[Mrs. P]

That they also had a reference to genetics in there. And it was a jeans playthrough thing.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And so they all went into this knowing we're doing a reference to jeans, the fabric, and jeans, as in genetics.

[Podcast Co-host 1]

Yes.

[Mrs. P]

And it was completely a play on words. And they were going through the whole idea that Sydney Sweeney has blonde hair, blue eyes, and big boobs because of her jeans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes.

[Mrs. P]

But you. She's like, maybe it's because of my. Maybe it was the shoes. Right. Like the old Michael Jordan thing of. Is it the shoes? Is. That's why Michael Jordan is able to dunk. That's the play they were doing.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And her saying things like, I let my art stand for itself. I let the work stand for itself. Is Very similar to. I don't know if you remember this. I think it was three weeks ago, the President of the United States posted an AI video of himself in a jet fighter shitting all over Americans all across the country. He was pouring literal shit out of the bottom of a F16 fighter while danger Zone played in the background. And then the speaker of the House was asked about it. He said, well, he's the greatest communicator in the history of social media and he's just making a point. And then never explained the point. Yeah, and in the case of this, she never explained the point. I just didn't add for jeans. Yeah, there's. Baby, no, you didn't.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

You didn't add what. Where you were trying to financially capitalize on the exploitation of Brook Shield as a minor, which her mother did just fine. Thanks. And then you wanted to also bring in this blue jeans idea, spelled G E N E. Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

G E N E S. Yes, yes.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Blue jeans.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So like. And it's like the blue blooded of it all. It's all this eugenic shit.

[Mrs. P]

Can I tell you, here's. Here's the thing. Here's. If I was going to do a jeans ad. Ready? Yeah. This is a jeans ad. Hi. I wear jeans. They make my ass look great. Bam.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Nailed it. Nailed it. Where'd you get those Boscovs?

[Mrs. P]

I got these at Costco.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah, I got them.

[Mrs. P]

I got these at Costco 11 years ago. I had to. I looked at it. I actually looked into them because I was like, oh, my God, these are Calvin Klein jeans. Which is crazy. But I bought them because they were at Costco and they were 35 at the time.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

We buy clothes at grocery stores.

[Mrs. P]

High five. Come on. Because we're. Do you know what we are? Relatable, relatable, relatable people. You hear that? You hear that, Andrew Scholz? Do you hear that? Theo von you bags of.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

No, no. We are not yelling at them today, all right? We're yelling at the girly pups.

[Mrs. P]

We're yelling at Sydney Sweeney.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So here's the thing. I got. I was upset by this GQ article.

[Mrs. P]

You're mad specifically at Sydney Sweeney.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

But then I. I not mad at Sydney Sweeney because I. I don't respect her enough to have actual emotions based on her shitty behavior. You know what I mean? But so then the journalist. I was like, you spineless hack. Like, you're gonna sit here and fangirl and not. You have this opportunity. You're. She. Her team has clearly allowed you to ask a Few hard hitting questions, and then you. You go back in your shell like a snail. That's mean to snail. Snails are delightful.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. Sales are also delicious. That the yum yum, yum escargot. But also on top of that. Yeah. It's very clear that Sydney Sweeney's PR people were like, just be. Play dumb.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And play dumb. But also you can allude that you're not dumb.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

That's what. That's what the interview was.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, I'm just a little baby, but I'm a smart baby.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Secretly 27. Like, she says that at a certain point.

[Mrs. P]

She does.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

She's like, I'm only 27. I'm gonna make mistakes. And then she goes, well, I actually am 28. Yesterday was my birthday, so, like it again, it implies I'm a little baby, But I'm getting. I'm gonna grow into it.

[Mrs. P]

I'm both a baby and a mommy because I got big boobies.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah. That's the lady from Love Island.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, is that.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I'm a mama.

[Mrs. P]

I'm a mama.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I'm a mommy.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, God. Oh, God.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Here's what happened. Here's what happened. I got mad at the interviewer for being a spineless hack.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 1]

Right.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And I'm like. Because when she said that blue jeans aren't controversial, I said, bitch. What? Like, of all the things to say when it comes to fabrics and clothing and fashion, these things are inherently controversial. And so I wanted to prove my point that jeans. Blue jeans are controversial. And so I ended up writing an entire episode about the controversy that is blue jeans.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So I could yell those facts at.

[Mrs. P]

You got it.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

To prove the point.

[Mrs. P]

So. So this is the history of blue jeans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Somewhat. Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Okay, let's. There. Go ahead and get us started on the history.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Because nothing exists without controversy.

[Mrs. P]

No.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Everything, like, everything is political.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. Everything is political. All art is political. All. Everything. Everything involves politics. To create anything.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Someone has to get hurt.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

That's. Okay, listen.

[Mrs. P]

That's just how it goes.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Blue jeans transcend gender, age, class, and the history of blue jeans encompasses the struggle of all. Okay. Okay, so we're gonna start it. I'm gonna. I'm gonna pick apart the idea of blue jeans, and we're gonna start with the color blue. Because it's first.

[Mrs. P]

Just the color.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah, well, it's not blue. It's indigo. And that's important.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. Because we have to discuss that. Number one, indigo is a different color than blue. Just sing the Rainbow song for Ms. Rachel.

[Mrs. P]

Okay, I can. I Love a rainbow. So real fast, we do have some colors behind us here on the wall.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And I do want to point out some of them real fast.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

So because we have some jeans here, we have behind us our jeans. Now, we typically lean towards more of the 90s faded gene. We like a faded gene. It makes us feel like grunge might come back at any point in time. Because we're exilenials is the true, true term for us because of the year we were born. But on the blue behind us here, there's like a light blue here.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And then there's a dark blue.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

What is indigo?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Indigo would be this darker blue, but with purple mixed in. It has a purple.

[Mrs. P]

It has a little bit of a purple added on top of it.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Okay. So it's. It's. It's a navy with a little purple teal.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And then this is probably more of a navy. A light navy blue.

[Mrs. P]

Got it. So if I. So actually if I took the purple light that's all the way over there and aimed it at this, we would.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Probably closer to get in.

[Mrs. P]

So it's a rich blue.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes, Purpley rich blue.

[Mrs. P]

Purpley rich blue. Got it. Because can I tell you, for a very long time, when you get into things, like, to me, you will always sit here and be like, no, that's actually a mauve. I'm like, no, it's not. That's blue. I. Now, when you put them together on a spectrum, I can understand them, but I have to see the spectrum together.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

On their own, they all immediately break down. You know what I mean?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Oh, yeah.

[Mrs. P]

It would be. It's. It's much like when I look at white people, like, I just look at them and go, yeah, they're white people. And then you're like, no, but that one in the middle is German. I go, I couldn't tell you.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I would never see that unless you.

[Mrs. P]

Stack them next to each other. Right. If I see a Spaniard, a Frenchman, a German, a Polish person, I can see a difference. But if I just see one that's a white guy. Yeah, that's it.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Just a bunch of white guys.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. Like, if I see Sydney Sweeney, I go, fetal alcohol syndrome.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Whoa, whoa. Sad eyes. Indigo used to be a rare commodity. Okay. Indigo was so exclusive that only royalty and aristocracy could afford it.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. So the dye itself was so expensive, it was imported with incredible difficulty from far off colonies, which earned this indigo the status symbol of tea, coffee, silk, and even gold. Okay.

[Mrs. P]

Okay, gotcha.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

This is a trading component this is something we are fighting about.

[Mrs. P]

The reason empires existed.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Were for spices, tea and blue.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And the. And the specific color. Indigo.

[Mrs. P]

Yes.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Which is a type of blue.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay, so. So more than 5,000 years ago, people in India, East Asia and Egypt use blue dye derived from. And I'm going to say this wrong.

[Mrs. P]

Go ahead.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Indigo ferra tinct. Toria plant to dye their clothes. That is the name of the plant.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

But you can see here, it says indigo in the front. Yeah. So indigo's name is, you know, it comes from the. The simple slang of the Indian or from India.

[Mrs. P]

Got it.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay.

[Mrs. P]

So there's a lot that you just said in there. Yeah, so there's a lot. So there's a couple things that I know about the color blue. I think we referenced this a while ago on our. Our pettiest pink episode.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

About dyes and about color and all these different things. Because we now live in a world of synthetic color. We can, like, we can eat things that are blue. Like blue raspberry. Like, that's not real. That's completely. That was invented by like, I think in the same lab as gushers.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Listen, the 90s were wild. They were just like, have you tried new color?

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. No. But like, the thing is, is. Is blue in particular. Why. The reason it was reserved for royalty is because it was so expensive. It's. At this point, the only thing we have close to understanding this is the poop. Coffee.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

When the monkeys eat the coffee.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. It's like these lemurs that eat these specific coffee beans, then poop them out. And it's like this $5,000 cup of coffee or whatever it is. Like, because everything is instantaneous for us now. Like, if I want anything, I just open my phone and I go, okay, Boom. Same day shipping. Right. Like that. It just shows up at the door. We aren't used to the fact of the men died. Yeah, men died. So your color, like, so this one piece of clothing or cloak could be like that. Fifteen men died on a boat.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And that, that, that. That shipment didn't even make it. The color blue, especially like the reason why the Israeli flag is that color is because the Jews in the eastern Mediterranean had a specific way of creating their own synthetic blue dye. And that was a big thing that they traded. It's same thing with Egypt. Like, and there was lapis. Was that lapis luzi?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I don't know.

[Mrs. P]

There's a special, like, mineral that was used heavily. There's all these other different things that people use. But Indigo is the brightest.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Indigo is, like the sexiest blue.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

It's rich.

[Mrs. P]

It's very rich.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And you're like, that's rich.

[Mrs. P]

It's very rich. And like, we now think of many things of, like, perfect purple as being the royal color.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

But, like, way. But in the ancient days.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

It was this color blue.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And the. When we think of the purple of royals, it is because this indigo has a purpley tint.

[Mrs. P]

Yes.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

If you use enough of it, it almost sheens purple.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. And so. But it's that slide over time, too. Of like.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Oh.

[Mrs. P]

Because they're using a ton of indigo. And then slide like one he really likes is the purple.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah. You know what would really complement his red hair color? Some purple.

[Mrs. P]

My royal red hair.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So where did I leave off? Okay, now that we know where the indigo is coming from.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Coming from India, it's coming from tropical zones. It can be grown at this time in Africa and China as well.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

It's all. It's all weather.

[Mrs. P]

But there. But there's a. There's a fact, almost a factory level of it in India also. It's interesting that, like, indigo India, it's like, right there. You could hear. Once you mention it, you're like, oh, there's so many things that we find out later just means. Of that one place.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Oh, my God. Yeah. So the other thing about this indigo is it's an incredibly demanding process to create it. Okay. So to start, you have to harvest the leaves from the plant, the indigo fera plant, and then they're soaked in water to let the indican, which is the amino acid contained in the leaves, release the glucose. Glucose is sugar. So they. You have to soak the leaves to release the glucose, and then they ferment it with other plant enzymes. And as a result, the water turns yellow after several days. The product of this fermentation process is called indoxyl and is left out to dry in the air. And as it oxidizes, it coagulates into blue indigo. Then this alkaline solution would be mixed with. Oh, no. Then it is mixed with an alkaline solution apologize, which is usually like baking soda. And the resulting sludge is then pressed into cakes and dried. The hard cakes would be shipped, and then when they get to, like, London, ground into a fine powder, and that's where you get the dark blue pigment.

[Mrs. P]

Gotcha. And then that powder would then be pushed and made into, like, paint or whatever.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Or put into, like, big vats.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. And a dye. Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And I was when I picture it. Well, Mr. Third, you got to put a clip in. There's this one scene in one of the best movies ever made ever after. You ever heard of it, Drew Barrymore film where the mom has to go work in, like, the fabric section of the. Like, she has to, like, go clean fabrics or dye fabrics, and they're stirring these giant vats of what looks like indigo.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And then she gets pushed into it by the mean stepdaughter.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And then she turns blue. Anyway, that's burned in my memory.

[Mrs. P]

That's. That's burned in your memory and. Yeah. And the thing is, too, is, like, when you're mixing these types of things, you just have to picture literally people with giant spoons.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah. Like across giant.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. And all of these things, there's. There's a game, Assassin's Creed, Odyssey.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay.

[Mrs. P]

Where there's one of the places that you go to and like, the guy, the character even complains about, like, how badly an area smells because they're making dye.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And some of the things I've seen, like, there's other versions of this, like, indigo is a flower, right?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Oh, well, yeah, it's a flower, but.

[Mrs. P]

It'S a flower that is getting processed through all these different things. So there's a smell to it. And other versions of it to make certain types of blues and other things, they had to crush up snails.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Like, there's all these different things. And these processes are like, again, to get a fabric to a certain color. Back then, at least before the synthetics are created, it was. You're looking at months long process just to get the powder before even making. To the dye, before it even goes onto the fabric. We haven't even covered the fabric.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I'm still in indigo.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. So the indigo is coming from India.

[Mrs. P]

Yep.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

With this process, and it's going to Europe. And I'm sure nothing terrible or controversial would happen getting something from India that is highly valued to Europe.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. And we'll hear more about that when we get back right after this non.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Controversial nature of the Europeans trying to steal expensive things from other countries.

[Mrs. P]

It's called trade. Okay. And it's a trade system. We'll get into British imperialism, international trade, and the history of India, because blue jeans are uncontroversial. Right. Gq.

[Podcast Host]

I've got Dan Morgan here on the pod. Say hi, Dan.

[Dan Morgan]

Hey, how's it going today?

[Podcast Host]

It's going good, man. Tell us who you are and what you do.

[Dan Morgan]

I'm Dan Morgan. I'm an attorney And a managing partner. Partner at Morgan and Morgan, which is America's largest injury law firm.

[Podcast Host]

That's pretty awesome. I think I saw a billboard of yours recently that said 20 billion won. 20 billion is an insane number.

[Dan Morgan]

Yeah, 20 billion recovered. It's actually, I think somewhere north. Probably closer to 22, 23 after this year. And each year we get bigger and badder and our army grows. So the number will hopefully keep getting bigger and bigger as time goes on. Awesome.

[Podcast Host]

So how does someone get in contact with Morgan and Morgan? What would I do if I got into an accident?

[Dan Morgan]

Probably the easiest way is dialing pound law. That's £529 from your cell phone. We are always open. Our call center is always waiting to take your call. 24. 7, 365.

[Mrs. P]

Wow.

[Podcast Host]

Dan Morgan from Morgan & Morgan, America's largest injury law firm. Thanks for coming by the show.

[Dan Morgan]

Thanks for having me. Visit forthepeople.com for an office near you.

[Podcast Co-host 1]

Okay, only 10 more presents to wrap. You're almost at the finish line. But first, there, the last one. Enjoy a Coca Cola for a pause that refreshes.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway. As winter approaches, make sure you set aside some time for self care. Now through December 2nd. Get great savings on personal care essentials when you shop in store or online. Buy two participating self care items and save $3. Shop for items like Tresemme Shampoo, Dove Shampoo, Dove Men's Care Body Wash, Dove Body Wash and Axe shower gel. And save $3 when you buy two or more items. Offer ends December 2nd. Restrictions apply. Offers may vary. Visit albertsons or safeway.com for more details.

[Mrs. P]

I have a feeling that you're about to start telling me about the British Raj.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I might. I might hold. Let me put my coffee down. Also, should we acknowledge the coffee on the table?

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, we probably. I mean, you could if you want to.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Here's what happened.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. This weekend. This is a complete sidebar. Has nothing to do with this episode at all.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

This weekend, as you know, I went to the city.

[Mrs. P]

I know.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I had a lovely time in the city.

[Mrs. P]

I went to Washington, D.C. for an event.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And then you. I was like, I'm gonna be gone for like two days. You're like, fine, I'm gonna go stay in a nice hotel on Sunday and have dinner with my friend. And I said, I can't argue that.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

You can't.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And I also went and got a facial too.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. So I had dinner with a dear friend of mine who I haven't seen in a long, long time. And she works for Rival Brothers Coffee.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So she brought me all these coffees, and she let me know that some of the people that work at Rival listen to our podcast.

[Mrs. P]

Oh.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And I said, oh, my God, that's so funny. I should put all the coffee out while we drink our coffee on the podcast.

[Mrs. P]

So this is why you made me a coffee?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes. And then she was like. She gave me one of those. Like, why would that be funny? And I was like, because of the Mark Baron coffee of it all. Do you know what I'm talking about?

[Mrs. P]

No.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Mark Marin, who invented podcasting.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Thanks, Mark. But also, you owe us some apologies about the Rogans of it all.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, thanks. Thanks for this presidency, Mark Marin.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Don't blame Mark for that.

[Mrs. P]

I will, because I. I made a video being like, hey, buddy, have me on your show. And he immediately announced his retirement. Yeah. He immediately was like, I'm done. I was like, I would love to come on your show. I've been doing stand up for a very long time also. And he literally. It was like a week later, he's like, I'm done with podcasting forever.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

No. So on his. One of his, like, farewell episodes, in his opening monologues, he always does. He talks about how when he first started his pod, he didn't want to do ads because he's like, you know, we all have the punk rock spirit. We all have faded blue jeans.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And he was like, I don't want to do ads. Like, I'm just doing this thing. But this one coffee company reached out to him and was like, can we run a coffee ad? And he was like, yeah. And then they send him free coffee. And how long has that podcast been around?

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. He said, yeah, he had, like, 15 years.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Fifteen years he's been getting coffee for free. And I. So I'm laughing about that. And then I said, listen, I'm gonna put the coffee up for Rival Bros. Yeah. Philadelphia Base, born and raised.

[Mrs. P]

Hey, look at that. And you got a lot of flavors here and everything else. And they didn't pay us for this.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

No, that was not paid. I was just. I just like their coffee.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

My friend gave me a bunch of coffee.

[Mrs. P]

This one's called Revolver Medium Light Roast, for when you wake up and you want to put one in your mouth. Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

This one's called Whistle and cuss Everything.

[Mrs. P]

Whistling Cuss. I like that one. This one's called Palooka. Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

All right. That's fine.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I think that's decaf. Okay, now, okay, let's get back to India.

[Mrs. P]

Let's get it. Let's go back to the controversy. Okay. Let's plug coffee and then talk about the history of colonialism in India. Yeah, are such a show.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

All right, listen. Okay, okay. The indigo revolt of 1859.

[Mrs. P]

Indigo. The indigo Revolt.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

That's what I want to talk to you about.

[Mrs. P]

They had a whole revolt that was just based around this.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes.

[Mrs. P]

Okay, go ahead.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. So the East India Company.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, bad guys, bad guys.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

We should get a bad guy. But we should.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, bad guys.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

No, nothing good ever came out.

[Mrs. P]

Any company. Was it West India Company. East India, where they were like the bad guys from like Pirates of the Caribbean. Like, like they've just. If you're watching a thing and then someone goes, oh, from the East India Company, just know that's the villain.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

That's the villain.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, my God.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay, okay. So the East India Company believed that indigo was one of its most profitable commodities. And it was so that they referred to it as blue gold.

[Mrs. P]

Of course.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah. Now, indigo planting in Bengal dated back to 1777.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

As demand grew, so did the expansion of indigo plantations in Bengal.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

The indigo planters left no stone unturned to make money. They mercilessly pursued the peasants to plant indigo instead. Instead of food crops, they provided loans called de don, at a very high interest, and the profits were shared between the planters. So that would be what we would call like a plantation owner.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So the planters, the zamadars and the East India Company only got. So the farmers, the workers and the peasants didn't get any of the profit. Okay.

[Mrs. P]

And they're doing high interest loans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes.

[Mrs. P]

That are a combination of like payday and long term loans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes.

[Mrs. P]

I wonder if there are 50 years. Let's find out later.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And I did want to just clarify Zamadars, because I didn't know what that was when I said zamadars are the Indian feudal lords.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. The local nobility.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah. They're the class equivalent to lords or barons. And they were. They were, they were. It was like a hereditary thing. You were kind of born into it. And it came with the right to collect taxes on behalf of the imperial courts and for military purposes.

[Mrs. P]

Yes. So they were basically the local large mega landlord.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

That's really the thing is. Is like, I think people always be like, oh, nobility. And these. They are all just landlords. All royalty is landlords, Lords.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

In the name.

[Mrs. P]

It's in the name.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

That we never like, oh, no. The lessees versus lesser. No, no, they're landlords. Eventually you give a guy so much money, you give a guy so much rent that he can pay military to beat you up to get more rent. Yes. Eventually they make laws where you don't even get anything for the rent anymore, but you're still paying them rent. They just call it taxes. Eventually.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

But yeah, the British really broke up these local feudal and nobles and all these different things. They were all. When the British came in, they realized they could divide and conquer all of India.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And this is how eventually the Raj takes over and they get a mandate over the entire area. If you look up the history of the East India Company and the British over in India, it's all about pitting people against each other, making sure they don't have alliances. And it's the same, actually very similar to what the Romans did as they spread into places like Gaul and other spots where you have these small groups of families, none of which realize they have a common enemy.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

That wouldn't happen here in America.

[Mrs. P]

No, not at all.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

They wouldn't do that to us, right?

[Mrs. P]

No, no, not at all. No one would ever pit trans people against women, against immigrants, against Puerto Ricans, against Cubans, against. You know, nobody would pit any of these disparate groups against each other while.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Never notice each other and just focused upwards on the billionaires. That would be bad.

[Mrs. P]

Don't talk about our zamadars that way.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. So the conditions for the farmers are incredibly cruel. Okay. Once a farmer took out a loan, he remained in debt for his entire life and all debt would be passed on to his successors.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, okay. 50 year mortgage.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

50 year mortgage.

[Mrs. P]

That's a great idea, right? 50 year mortgage coming to a place near you.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

The farmers would only be paid 2.5% of market price. And the farmers could not make profit growing indigo. Jesus Christ. They also had the farmers, all farmers in Bengal had to pay a penalty known as. Known as Taiwan. It's like Taiwan, but with no I Taiwan for refusing the plant indigo. So basically if you said, no, I want to plant vegetables. So I food for the people of Bengal, you had to pay a special tax and it was an unaffordable amount, so nobody could really afford to pay the Taiwan.

[Mrs. P]

This is very similar to what in Afghanistan and other places when the drug, like when the opiate cartels came in. Like you've seen that, like this is in the color blue.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes.

[Mrs. P]

Is drugs.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes.

[Mrs. P]

This is the same, this is like the same tactics that we, we hear about from, about cartels and the CIA and others.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So the farmers are totally unprotected from the brutal indigo planters who resorted to mortgages or destruction of property if they were unwilling to obey them. All government rulings favored the planters. National Indigo started making huge losses. Ramidars at a certain point.

[Mrs. P]

Can I tell you something?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

This sounds exactly like data centers.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

How it.

[Mrs. P]

Like, almost directly, you have a. You have landlords who want to sell. Yeah, they want that. They want land. There's Amazon just built a bunch of data centers. I think it was in Indiana or Nebraska. And they were like, these were empty corn fields, and now they're data centers. I'm like, they weren't empty.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

They were filled with corn.

[Mrs. P]

They were full of corn. We want corn and porn. But the thing is, you're getting.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

They're getting rid of porn.

[Mrs. P]

I know. This is why Sydney Sweeney is gaining power. The but the thing is, is like, they want to keep taking this quote unquote useless land and turning it into data centers because they think the data is digital gold.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

They think that having these AI data centers, but also just the collection of server power and all these other different things. And they look at it and like, again, they're not looking at empty land like in Wyoming or all these other different places where it's non arable land. They always want to go to places where people are and they're like, oh, no, but we're creating jobs. It's like, yeah, for the. For the six weeks it takes to put this thing up.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

You created jobs. And then you have 10 people whose job it is is to badge in every day and go, all right, that temperature sensor broke. It's actually not too hot.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Call the H Vac guy.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

This is again me telling you, if you want job security, H Vac, H Vac job of the future, we got to keep the data centers cold.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. Keep the data centers cold so that way Jeff Bake Bezos can buy another wife.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Also, I think. Okay, wait, listen, listen. Sub idea that I had.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. Remember when we did the Jeff Bezos, nobody likes him at his wedding thing about he has no friends?

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. How he bought Venice.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Who was at his wedding. Sydney Sweeney was at his wedding. And then after that, he invested, like, millions of dollars in Sydney Sweeney's new lingerie line. She's going to announce soon or whatever.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And so then I've decided this is allegedly and just an opinion and a silly Billy idea.

[Mrs. P]

Hold on, let me hit the button.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Allegedly.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Is that. I Think that maybe Sydney's the third. I think. I think they. They had that foam party on the yacht, in my opinion. I think that. Because, again, why. She is fearless about being hated. Like, she has stinker movies. Nobody's hiring her for anything.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

She still goes out into the world, and it's like.

[Podcast Co-host 1]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And.

[Mrs. P]

And she's selling that weird bath water soap.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah, that happened too.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. There's all that weird shit. Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

But, like, there's. There's this. What is it? Like, confidence she has in her inability to fail right now.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And I'm like, only because you got a million. Million backing.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

You got a billionaire behind you.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Allegedly. I'm working that button today.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Natural Indigo started making huge.

[Mrs. P]

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. You just spun back. Okay, fine. Yeah, I did take your side back. But. But I just want to say real fast. Yeah. This is the exact way that. That the indigo farmers were being treated is exactly how towns that are next to data centers, look at Memphis, look at others, is exactly. This is the exact same shit.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

It's just. It went from physical and manual to digital.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

It's the same thing, y'.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

All.

[Mrs. P]

We are. We are living the same world over and over and over again.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Is a comedy history podcast, and you're bringing me down.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, I'm sorry. Hey, wait, hold on. I got a button here. We're living the same world over and over and over again.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Oh, my God. I don't even. I can't even hype it up because I'm about to tell you some more terrible stuff. Okay, so they passed. Okay, The. There's starts to be losses in the total profit of Natural Indigo. Okay, okay. They passed the losses to the farmers.

[Mrs. P]

Of course they did.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Because they were just collecting more Taiwan.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Got it.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

So they. So they raised. They raised the tax. Yes, got it.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

To make up for. You know, they raise your electric prices to make up for the cost of the data center. So this drove farmers deeper into poverty as they had to sell their homes and other possessions just to pay off the Taiwan.

[Mrs. P]

You mean the eternal mortgage?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah, they had to.

[Mrs. P]

They had to sell because they couldn't afford the eternal mortgage.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

You're gonna love this next sentence.

[Mrs. P]

I know, I.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

It drove me nuts.

[Mrs. P]

Okay, go ahead. Hit me with.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Many of the farmers became so poor that they abandoned their homeland to become laborers on sugar cane plantations in Trinidad. Do you have any fucking idea how bad it's got to be to go to a sugar cane plantation? Historically, the most evil, exploitative, and dangerous type of plantation that ever fucking existed.

[Mrs. P]

There is. I heard about abolitionist from the Philadelphia region.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And he became an abolitionist in the 1700s. He was a Quaker. He was a Quaker. He's actually the man who convinced Ben Franklin to become. To be more anti slavery even though Franklin himself owned slaves. But he's the one who pushed him in that direction. I can't remember his name off the top of my head. He was a dwarf who lived in a cave. But his story of going to and witnessing how slaves were treated specifically in the Caribbean around sugar cane plantations was so horrifying that it was it like, like the, the things I've read, like the hints I've read.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Kept me up at night. And it was Benjamin Lay which we actually brought up in the episode Bob.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

The Drag Queen story Report.

[Mrs. P]

Bob the Drag Queen story report for.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

The Harriet Tubman Live in Concert Harry.

[Mrs. P]

Thumb Live in Concert book. Also, I had a little update on that. I haven't. I haven't flexed it yet, but Bob the Drag Queen and I are mutuals on TikTok and I need to figure out what to do with that information.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Listen, mostly we just hold hands and go, oh my God.

[Mrs. P]

I know there's every now and every now and then I see. I see a follow back and I go, what? And then I get nervous. I don't want to lose. I want them to keep following me. But I also want to say hi. But I also like.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Don't be weird.

[Mrs. P]

Don't be weird.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. So they decide they're going to go work on sugar cane plantations because that's a better option.

[Mrs. P]

Sugar cane. By the way, they're still bad.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah, they're terrible.

[Mrs. P]

Sugar cane to this day is terrible. And. And uses a lot of prison labor as well.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes. Also a lot of sugar refining isn't vegan. I found out.

[Mrs. P]

Oh.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Because the. They use bone dust to. To clean the sugar. I don't know how it works. Whatever.

[Mrs. P]

You're just ruining. How many?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I don't know. Okay. Out of the severe oppression unleashed onto the farmers, this resulted in a revolt. The revolt. Revolt is called the Indigo Revolt. The farmers burnt down indigo factories, attack British planters and zamadars. The revolt was suppressed by forces of police and military because obviously they had the backing of the British government.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

A large number of peasants were tortured and killed. In spite of this, the result. The revolt was popular among the whole of Bengal.

[Mrs. P]

Of course.

[Podcast Co-host 1]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Of course it was popular. This is. Yeah. Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. So then there's this guy who is a playwright and I'm Going to get this name wrong. And I apologize in advance. It's Dina Banhu Bantu Bandu Mitra. He wrote a play about what was happening in Bengal. Right. And it was a very accurate account of what was happening in Bengal. This play he wrote.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And he had the play translated and performed in England.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And we know plays were huge in England at the time.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Everybody would go to the plays. Like every normal person on the street would go to see plays constantly. Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

That was television. That was Instagram reels.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

I mean, that's a little late.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Well, no, this is a little late. So the. When it was translated and then performed in England, the public realized they became aware of the ruthless method, methods of the British government to procure the dye. And then suddenly the citizens of England are protesting this dye.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And they're like, we're not. You have to stop this. And it actually. They demanded a commission report from the government. They were like, like people were incensed when they realized what was happening to get indigo. And I pulled a quote. It says not a chest of indigo reached England without it being stained with human blood.

[Mrs. P]

Damn.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

In 1916, Mahatma Gandhi visited Bengal and became aware and understood the conditions of the farmers. Because it's still happening at that point in 1917. This all started in the 1800s.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And he demanded that the colonial government stop the practice. Instead, the British arrested him. Hundreds of thousands of people in India joined his protest. It was a peaceful protest. Shaking the British government. They finally conceded and abolished Taiwan. This is not in 19. This is hundreds of years. They just then abolished Taiwan and gave more control over the land to the farmers. And this became actually was the big jump off point. Point for the idea of non violent movements to help gain independence from British occupation. This like this Bengal blue indigo issue.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And the Taiwan paid.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Is what really started this.

[Mrs. P]

So a couple things in there. So the first thing that the play itself is very similar to Uncle Tom's Cabin.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And the idea of there was there's this thing that happens, especially among white people. There's a thing that we do where we know. But unless it's popular enough for everyone to not be able to claim that, we can pretend we don't. So I'm thinking a lot about like what happened. Like what's been happening in Gaza. Yeah. Right. Or Black lives matter in 2020 with the murder of George Floyd that we saw in front of everybody. It has to reach this critical breaking point of. Enough people can't pretend they don't know anymore.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And that's one of those things. But also this is another thing that's very similar in that you're talking about because I think the Indigo revolt starts with 1857, I think you said. And so we get to 1917, so 1859, 1859 to 1917 and a little more before they finally get rid of this, this specific tax. That's 60 years. When we talked about in our episode about the seven day work week and we talked about like getting weekends and 40 hours and all those different things that was around the same amount of time. Like these things take forever to get through. And it, it's like that's one of those things you need to keep in mind for everyone out there as we, as we sit slog of every day of terrible fucking information coming through and being like, why? It's not instantaneous. It's not instantaneous. It is generational. The actions that you can start today can and may and will be felt by your grandchildren. It sucks to plant the tree for your grandkids to have shade when you're so fucking hot right now, but eventually it has to be done. And this system was already before that revolt happened. Was already in place for 150 years. Yeah. And it's, it's very similar in that you'll get these moments where these extreme things happen. And what sucks also is in our history classes that we learn things, we only ever learn about inflection points.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

We only ever learn about the moments that catalyst finally took, took form and then boom, the whole thing fucking switches. Right? Like on a dime. Like, oh my God. And then it was done and it was like, okay, but we're leaving out. Oh, there were 60 years between that and when you're a kid, you can't really picture 60 years. But now at 41, you got 20 left. Oh my God, my bones. Yeah, you know what I mean?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Like old bones. Speaking of your old bones.

[Mrs. P]

Yes.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Let's take a break.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And we'll come back and we're gonna talk about design. Oh, we're gonna talk about the design of jeans.

[Mrs. P]

We're gonna move from color to fabric.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Design, it's different.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, I don't like how that feels.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Folks.

[Mrs. P]

Stop saying I'll see a doctor later until you almost go blind. You need to check out zocdoc. Zocdoc is a free app and website where you can search and compare high quality in network doctors and click to instantly book an appointment filter for doctors who take Your insurance treat particular conditions and are located nearby for the easiest experience you'll ever have. You can even filter by rating to make sure you're booking with the best. And I use ZocDoc for so many different things. I've had a lot of smaller medical issues this year. Some skin stuff, some other things. And trying to make sure that I find the right specialists and the right doctors to go take care of those things have been a priority for me. And it's been really good to go to Zocdoc.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Right, Mrs. P. Yeah, absolutely. Makes it really easy.

[Mrs. P]

Really, really easy. You can book through Zocdoc yourself and you can be seen within just 24 to 72 hours. And that's a really quick turnaround. Stop putting off those doctor's appointments and go to Zocdoc.com tabs to find and instantly book a top rated Doctor today. That's z o c-o c.com tabs zocdoc.com tabs Sydney Sweeney's a talentless hack, and Dick Cheney is still dead. And this episode is actually about Genesis. I know we've talked about a lot. I wanted to remind you guys what this episode's truly about.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

It's about the fact that blue jeans aren't controversial. Yeah, okay. Blue jeans aren't controversial.

[Mrs. P]

No controversy here. No controversy. She just laid out 200 years of horror for just the color of.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Let's talk about design. Design. We needed a Tim Gunn. Make it work. Okay. So. In the 17th century, the indigo enthusiasts of the time found what they were looking for in the American colonies.

[Mrs. P]

Oh.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Settlers there had managed to cultivate a direct relative of the indigo plant that. That didn't have to just be grown in India. This could be grown in the disgusting climate of South Carolina.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, it's.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

It's described as humid. And I'm like, ew. Yeah, gross.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, it's a. It's a thick. Them down.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

It's a thick. It's thick. I remember one time we call it muggy up here.

[Mrs. P]

I remember one time I was in South Carolina and a man turned to me and just went, air so thick you could just open your mouth and eat it. I was like, jesus Christ. What?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

What?

[Mrs. P]

And then he dabbed his forehead with it with a.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

A towel.

[Mrs. P]

No.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

He had like a little shoulder towel. He just dabbed his forehead and went, oh. And then walked away. I was like, I didn't. I was. I was eating a sandwich. I was just sitting there eating a sandwich. I was ruin my sandwich.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. So. Pardon Me. This plant is called Amorpha fructosa. I don't know. It's also called bastard indigo.

[Mrs. P]

Bastard indigo. Okay, so in that you gotta marry.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Your plants, folks, before you have them. So the. This bastard indigo gets discovered in South Carolina. It's not only discovered as much as people take indigo plants there, and then they're trying to, like, again. This is in the 17th century. This is what cut into the. The margins. Back in Bengal, remember when I was like, oh, they're cutting into the margins.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Zandabars are getting mad.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. Because they're not making as much money.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

It's because of this. The American colonies in South Carolina.

[Mrs. P]

It's kind of like the way email destroyed regular mail.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I still send letters.

[Mrs. P]

I know.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

During the 18th century. Let's skip ahead a little.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

The trade Republic of Genoa, which is now Italy, became the largest buyer of bastard indigo dye. Okay.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Genoa had become famous because they had created this sturdy, deep blue cotton cloth, ideally suited for making tough work clothes for fishermen, seamen, dock workers and miners.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, okay. So it's a thick, thick, durable cloth.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Thick, durable.

[Mrs. P]

And Genoa is. If you guys look at a map of Italy. Jen. I like to think of Genoa as, like, reverse Venice, because if you look at Italy, it makes, like, a T. It's a boot with, like, a T at the top. Venice is on the right side. When you're looking at the map, Genoa was on the left. It's a port city. There's a lot of imports coming there. Salami, there's a lot of fishermen. There's a lot of workers. You need clothes that aren't going to rip and tear really easily while you're moving crates.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So here's the thing. Genoa, Italy.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

But at the time, French was widely spoken throughout Europe.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. It's called language franca language. Franco. It was in French originally, was Latin.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And it moved to French was specifically the court language. Because you knew, if I'm going to visit Russia or I'm visiting Germany or I'm visiting Italy or I'm visiting London, everyone agreed. All of our smart people will speak French. So we can all. Now it's English. No, now it's English for the most part, everywhere you go. Because the English and the British Empire and America has been so culturally dominant, eventually it will be whatever. Whatever dialect of Chinese.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

President Xi decides. But like that let us know.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I need to get my duolingo up.

[Mrs. P]

But listen, we got. We gotta. We gotta teach. We gotta fill this baby jeans with a lot of Chinese. But What I'm saying is, is the. The what if. What a sentence.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

That was a crazy thing.

[Mrs. P]

Crazy sentence. But they. But. But in general, though, like, it's. It shifts over time. It was Latin because that was the court language of everybody. But French is like an offshoot of that.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So everybody's speaking French at the time.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And so the cloth that they created was called blue Dijon, which is the blue of Genoa in French. And this is where the English derivative jeans come. The blue of jeans. Blue jeans.

[Mrs. P]

You got me. You boomed me.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

You actually boomed me with that blush. Jeans. That's what this is. This is blue jeans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

It's blue jeans.

[Mrs. P]

Blushing. Yeah, Blue jeans. Blue Je Jean. I think he's saying blue Jean.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah, Blue jeans.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, my God.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, my God. So Sydney Sweeney's career is taking a nosedive into white supremacy because of a pun about Genoa, Italy.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

No, it's also because she's talentless.

[Mrs. P]

Well, no, I know. I understand that. I understand that. But I'm just looking at the butterfly effect. Stupid.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Mrs. P]

It's literally a stupid Englishman.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah. Heard somebody with hoagie mouth, okay.

[Mrs. P]

Some importer was like, what are these called? And they're like, blue de jean. He's like, blue jeans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Write it down.

[Mrs. P]

Write down blue jeans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Got it.

[Mrs. P]

You got Ellis island, bitch.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So the increasing industrialization of Europe and America, with its factories, mines, shipbuilding, docks, we've all seen law production.

[Mrs. P]

People moving crates meant people moving crates.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Numbers of workers suddenly needed sturdy workwear. Okay, now let's go to the other side of the country. San Francisco.

[Mrs. P]

Oh.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

1853. California. Levi Strauss.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, okay, I know that guy.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

The man himself, Levi Strauss. Started a dry goods business in San Francisco. Yeah, he sold lots of products, one of which was a very sturdy imported cotton fabric called denim. Okay. One of his customers, one of his best customers, was a man named Jacob W. Davis, who produced rugged items like tents, horse blankets, and wagon covers. Okay? So Jacob W. Davis is commissioned by a gold mining company. They're like, we're hiring you to create special trousers which are strong enough to withstand the hard work of gold mining.

[Mrs. P]

Gotcha.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So Davis reaches out to his buddy Levi Strauss, because he knows he has this fabric called denim. And Levi Strauss and Davis create a pair of work pants that has metal rivets. And it's. The metal rivets are incredibly important because no other pants were held together with these metal rivets at the time.

[Mrs. P]

So I gotta. I picked up a pair of pants. I gotta. I got. I got a Pair right here. I got a pair right here. These are Levi jeans recently purchased at Kohl's. Oh, I. I up and got some.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Kohl's cash on the back end for those.

[Mrs. P]

You did. You ended up saving money in the long run. I ended up actually spending way too much because again, I want the same jeans I already have.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah, they're exactly the same for the audio.

[Mrs. P]

Listen, I'm a. I'm in dad mode now. If I find a shoe that fits, a jean that feels right, and a color I like, I try to get two or three of them.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And I was at Kohl's the other day. I was walking around with the baby.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yep.

[Mrs. P]

And listen, if Kohl's is evil, don't ever tell us. I need.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Do you guys not put that in the comments?

[Mrs. P]

I. I have.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I've lost enough.

[Mrs. P]

I think we have so few places that we can like, semi ethically feel comfortable walking around. All right, so I'm walking around Kohl's. I walk past the jean section that everything's on sale. I go to the back wall and I go, oh, my God, these are the jeans I like. 505 regular Levi's. Stretch. It's a little bit of stretch because I don't want to know where these pounds are going. And it's got the Levi on the back. It's got the big stamp. I got up to the register thinking I thought I was getting the 30, 40 pair. $70 for these jeans. Thanks. Thanks. Trump tariff. I'm sure all these. Oh, the inflation's going down. Everything's getting so much. 70. These are Soviet prices. Okay. So young people don't know. Back in the day, they used to illegally import jeans. Russians and Soviet citizens would come to America, they'd go to New York and they would fill their suitcases with jeans to try to sneak them through.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Blue jeans, baby.

[Mrs. P]

This was Johnny Blue jeans, But so.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Turn it around a bit.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, there's these rivets.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

These rivets are what I'm talking about in the pockets. And they used to kind of go down the pant leg and be on the buttons of the back, too. Yeah, there used to be a lot more rivets on them. Also my. Behind me, I have the overalls. These are also Levi Strauss, and overalls were a big deal. Coveralls, same thing. These rivets here. Yeah, this is. The riveting is very important to hold the denim together properly.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. Against the. I mean, and think about when you're. When we're talking about mining Swinging a pickaxe, being on your knees, pan, you know, panhandling the water, all those different things, moving, constant. And the areas that are going to rip the most are going to be the crotch especially. And the knees. Yeah, the knees. The reason why, when you see somebody with like ripped jeans, especially from like the 80s and 90s, the ripped jeans were cool. Because it meant you fucking lived. Like, buying ripped pre ripped jeans is not only stupid, it spits in the face of the people who came before.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

You didn't write the music of ripped jeans for this.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, no, not for you to go pre buy this and then pull an Ed Hardy T shirt over it.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I have pre ripped jeans. And anyway.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, and I know, and it's. I'm gonna cite it in our divorce.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay, great.

[Mrs. P]

So $70.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

1890S.

[Mrs. P]

We used to be a proper country.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

No, not 1897. In 1873, Jacob and Levi make this perfect pair of work jeans, work trousers, blue jeans. And they get a patent for it. They get. They're patented.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. Because these are the first, like official blue jeans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Blue jeans. Eventually, in the 19th century, Wrangler and Lee would come around and try, but they, they had to fundamentally make different jeans.

[Mrs. P]

They didn't try. All right. I was a Lee jeans kid. I used to go to Boscov's and I went right to the Lee jeans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

You used to go to Boscov's? You would go there right now if we weren't recording.

[Mrs. P]

That's very true. That's the other. That's the other place I feel happy.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Real fast, though. One thing I do want to point out about this and the reason why this story, especially around the jeans and Levi's, specifically the thing to keep in mind about the California gold rush, nobody really made that much money from the actual gold. They made money selling to the people who wanted to get the gold. There were guys who ran ahead who were like, oh, there's a gold rush. And they bought 50 pickaxes and then sold them at a premium. They knew that there was a huge market and they would gouge the shit out of the people in the area. Think about very similar to the way when you go to a stadium for a concert and you're like, this beer. Anywhere else would be a $5 beer, but at this concert it's $18 because you can't get another beer. And it's the same exact idea with pickaxes, wheelbarrows, jeans. All these different things came together for those reasons. And so the people who got super rich from the Gold Rush. The true ones was never the guys who own the actual mines. It was never the guys who actually found any gold. It was always the people who were selling the equipment. The same way. When you look at stuff like crypto. Crypto. Yeah, it's the guys who own the exchanges. Yeah, it's the guys who own the data centers. These are going to be the guys.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Who own the illegal gambling that children can do because they're in places that aren't in.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, exactly. The reason why Jeff Bezos is rich is because he set up a logistics system so people could become sellers on Amazon. Yeah, that's. That's how all this shit works. You want to own the casino? Figure out how to own the casino. Don't be the guy who's maintaining the slots.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

If you're super good at casinos, historically a thing in which people just give you money for. For nothing.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And then your casino goes bankrupt because you're so bad at business, then become.

[Mrs. P]

The president because your best friend's a pedophile and you have a really weird blackmail file.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Oh, my God. Allegedly. All right, so in 1897, a man named Joe. Johan. Johan von Bayer from Germany, develops a synthetic indigo, and he won the Nobel Prize for chemistry in 1905.

[Mrs. P]

Oh.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

The synthetic indigo could be produced in a lab with consistent quality at a price that was competitive with natural indigo. Okay, so in 1897.

[Mrs. P]

So. So now we're really crushing the Bengal indigo market. Completely.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

And then. So then when Mahatma Gandhi goes there in 1970, like, why the fuck are we still doing this?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes, exactly that.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, yeah. Okay. Got it. He's like, we don't. There's no need for this suffering.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

They're making it in labs. Got it. Don't need this.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. Much like synthetic diamonds.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes.

[Mrs. P]

We don't need blood diamonds.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Well, I don't know why people prefer. They're like, I know. I like it that children get hurt.

[Mrs. P]

I like a little suffering on my finger.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

That's how I know it's real.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

But listen, let's take a break, okay?

[Mrs. P]

And when we come right back, we'll have even more suffering.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

We're going to talk about fabric.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, that's going to be suffering. Introducing family freedom from T Mobile. We'll pay off four phones up to 3, 200 and give you four free phones, all on America's largest 5G network. Visit t mobile.com familyfreedom. Up to 800 per line via virtual prepaid card. Typically takes 15 days. Free phone via 24 monthly bill credits with finance agreement. Example Apple iPhone 16128 gigs 829.99 eligible trade in. Example iPhone 11 Pro for well qualified credits end and balance due. If you pay off early or cancel Contact us.

[Podcast Host]

I've got Dan Morgan here on the pod. Say hi, Dan.

[Dan Morgan]

Hey, how's it going today?

[Podcast Host]

It's going good, man. Tell us who you are and what you do.

[Dan Morgan]

I'm Dan Morgan. I'm an attorney and a managing partner at Morgan and Morgan, which is America's largest injury law firm.

[Podcast Host]

That's pretty awesome. I think I saw a billboard of yours recently that said 20 billion won. 20 million is an insane number.

[Dan Morgan]

Yeah, 20 billion recovered. It's actually, I think somewhere north, probably closer to 22, 23 after this year. And each year we get bigger and badder and our army grows. So the number will hopefully keep getting bigger and bigger as time goes on.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Awesome.

[Podcast Host]

So how does someone get in contact with Morgan and Morgan? What would I do if I got into an accident?

[Dan Morgan]

Probably the easiest way is dialing pound law. That's £529 from your cell phone. We are always open. Our call center is always waiting to take your call. 24, 7, 365.

[Mrs. P]

Wow.

[Podcast Host]

Dan Morgan from Morgan and Morgan, America's largest injury law firm. Thanks for coming by the show.

[Dan Morgan]

Thanks for having me. Visit forthepeople.com for an office near you.

[Ryan Seacrest]

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[Mrs. P]

So, Mrs. P, to be clear, we've now covered the color, we've covered the design, and now we're covering the actual fabric itself.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

The fabric.

[Mrs. P]

And that fabric is made of what?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Cotton?

[Mrs. P]

Oh, no. There's no controversy there.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

There's never been a controversy about cotton about right now. Now to go back, we have to understand that at a certain point, cotton was important to Americans as oil is to us now. Okay. Do anything. You know, you have a face right now like you're worried. I'm not worried that it could be a controversial thing to talk about. It's not the history of cotton that went into making pants.

[Mrs. P]

It's not so much that I'm worried. It's that.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Oh, okay.

[Mrs. P]

It's that. I know. Yeah. Okay. Because, like, there's so much there. There's so much there. All right, tell us about cotton.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. So it's a crop grown that grows native throughout subtropical and tropical regions of Asia, Africa, and the Americas. It needs a warm, arid climate to be grown successfully. India is currently the largest producer of cotton and. And was for over 5000 years. India was also the world's largest producer and exporter of cotton products into Europe, Africa, and Asia. The reputation of quality and beauty of these textiles led the European merchants and traders realizing that they could capitalize off of cotton and amass great, great wealth.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. So we have to remember the cotton trade started in India because it grows just like we were saying that the indigo plant could grow in South Carolina. The cotton could be grown in India first. So then there's this guy who goes in search of India in 1492 because he hears that the Indian cottons that he had seen in Genoa were so wonderful. His name is Christopher Columbus.

[Mrs. P]

Ah, the child rapist.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes. He had mistakenly ended up in America, though.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So a lot of people don't like. Okay. A lot of people think that there was this whole idea that. That people used to believe the Earth was flat. They didn't. They thought the Earth was smaller. And Columbus thought going the route that he was going to take would get him to India faster.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Than going around the Horn of Africa. We also didn't have the Suez Canal back then. So they're like, there's a lot of different things that have happened. I cannot stress to you guys how much of our life exists because of people trying to get to India.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

To get spices, to get color, to get fabrics, all these different things. Yeah. Also, Columbus was doing that because he thought that if they could corner this trade by skipping around the. Is the Islamic caliphate that had formed, that they could then raise enough money to get a big enough army to reconquer Jerusalem.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Ah.

[Mrs. P]

There's a whole, like, weird, like, Catholic, Christian, apocalyptic feel this entire time with Columbus. That's insane. And on top of that, he had a weird thing where he still wanted to believe and still tried to force people to believe that he actually had reached India specifically because he had a deal that if he reached India, he was, like, a duke.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yep.

[Mrs. P]

But if he hadn't reached India, it was someone else's land, and he was so fucking brutal that both the Catholic Church and the Spanish Empire threw him into jail because he was moving sex slaves between islands. He was a monster. Christopher Columbus is a monster. And the only reason there's statues of him is because Woodrow Wilson and other people wanted to keep Italian Americans on side during World War I to give them pride in something, but they didn't have anything else because they just created Italian unification. And Italy wasn't a state until, like, the 1910s, and that created fascism. And there's a whole. I'm on the whole thing. We're doing a whole thing now. I'm on a whole.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Musa, I told you that blue jeans are not controversial. You need to stop finding controversy in these blue jeans.

[Mrs. P]

I did a jeans ad.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

People can I express myself through my art, and my art is writing podcasts that are comedy history podcasts. So in the late 18th century, why.

[Mrs. P]

Do you have so many more layers than Sydney Sweeney if Sydney's you?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Because I have talent. God gave me talent instead of tits.

[Mrs. P]

You have courage. You got a butt, though. I'm gonna give you that. All right. Y' all can't see it, but I've seen it.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay, so the 18th century saw a peak in prices for raw cotton due to failures of the East India Trading Company. Because they're having internal conflicts at this point. The. The cotton from across the Atlantic became globally dominant for a number of decades.

[Mrs. P]

So American cotton.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

American cotton is dominant.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Many cotton mills had links with slavery indirectly and directly. Some own plantations and slave ships.

[Mrs. P]

And by many. Most.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Most, like 99.9%.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, like, it's. It's.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

It's.

[Mrs. P]

There's a point where, like, if you touch cotton, it was touched by someone who had never touched freedom.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Like, that's just how I want to be clear.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I'm talking about the cotton mills. So the place where we're processing the cotton and turning it into fabric.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

The cotton mills would own the plantations and the ships. And so we always think of things vertical integration. It's vertical integration. We talked about it in last week's episode.

[Mrs. P]

Yes, 100%.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So I was going through, and there's one specific mill. Quarry Bank Mill, controversially relied upon orphan children as free labor.

[Mrs. P]

Look at that.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So the quarry.

[Mrs. P]

You know what? That sounds like a great place to hold a wedding.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah. Well, I think this is in London.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, this is in London.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

These are London orphans.

[Mrs. P]

Oh, got it. Jesus Christ. They're using street urchins.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Please, sir, can I have some more work? The Cotton.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah. So that over in America, we have brutal, brutal exploitation.

[Mrs. P]

We're using chattel, human chattel. Slavery in America, that's then being put on boats that are being full of sailors who are being underpaid and probably getting scurvy.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

That are then being shipped to London, where then the unprocessed cotton is being put into mills that are being run by orphans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

That's what I'm saying. Not controversial.

[Mrs. P]

Not controversial at all. Just British.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Just British.

[Mrs. P]

Just British.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

At this time, cotton joined sugar, coffee, cocoa, tobacco as commodities that relied on enslaved people for labor. The use of lands captured and colonized.

[Mrs. P]

Hey, real quick, just give us five stars on Apple podcast. I don't know what to say here. Yeah, I should throw in a joke.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

No, you, we.

[Mrs. P]

I really can't.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

No, there's. There's no joke.

[Mrs. P]

There is none.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

In the West Indies, where slave plantations already existed for sugar. For the British and French, the increase, increased need for raw cotton in the late 1700s led to a quarter of a million Africans forcibly transported to the islands to grow and pick cotton that began to be grown there for the manufacturers. Okay. In 1834, the British Empire abolished slavery, but they still relied on cotton picked by enslaved people from the southern states of America.

[Mrs. P]

Yes.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So the British were like, no, we're washing our hands, slavery is bad, but at the same time, we're still giving all of the money to the southern states.

[Mrs. P]

America was its loophole.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yes.

[Mrs. P]

America was. Its, its weird little like, yeah, it would. The way the Cayman Islands are a tax loophole. Or Switzerland.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

America, they're like, no, no, the British, we don't do no slavery no more because people don't like hearing about it here in London. Anyway. Gonna go visit me cousin in South Carolina. Gonna go hang out a little bit in Georgia. Gonna go swing through Texas real fast. Yeah, that's, that's, that's basically what they.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Did the entire time as slavery was abolished in America via the Civil War. Yeah.

[Mrs. P]

Because we had to shoot it out of them.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay, hold on real quick. Let's not jump ahead.

[Mrs. P]

Okay.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Britain looked again to India, now a colony to supply raw cotton. The expansion of the railways allowed cotton merchants to connect with and small scale farmers in rural India who until then could not be reached. So it became again, an important region for Britain. So Britain is like, we're abolishing slavery and we're just going to get cotton from America, but also we can start exploiting India again.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. The industrialization, they were able to build trains to reach the areas where Cotton was being grown so they could bring it in cheaper.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Famously, whenever you're building trains and the tracks that were not causing controversial exploitation.

[Mrs. P]

Of human guy, there's no controversy around trains. Okay. Leave my train boys alone. Me and Thomas the Tank, I have absolutely no problems whatsoever.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Literally the whole show has a guy called Fat Conductor. They'll be like, ah, the fat conductor came over.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. And Sir Topham hat.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So. Hey, bleep that.

[Mrs. P]

What?

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So, yeah.

[Mrs. P]

We actually still don't know what you said last episode that we bleeped.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

We should go back and watch and see what I said.

[Mrs. P]

I should check the Raw. All right, go ahead.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Okay. The Civil War in the United States of America is a critical part of the story of cotton because it is the moment slavery comes to an end. Right, Right.

[Mrs. P]

Technically.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

So new systems of labor became important when it came to getting cotton in. Although the exploitation of African Americans. Okay, I phrased this wrong. The exploitation of African Americans didn't end with slavery. Once it was abolished, the prison system in the southern states was built around cotton plantations. Literally, they built prisons next to cotton plantations and then used the prison inmates, mainly black Americans, to pick cotton.

[Mrs. P]

Yes. And it was written into the 13th amendment that abolished slavery. Yes, the 13th amendment. The United States section one reads as follows. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof parties shall have been duly convicted shall exist within the United States or any place subject to their jurisdiction. So they just created the black codes and Jim Crow and a bunch of other different things. So people who had recently been freed suddenly were convicted of loitering, convicted of made up crimes, and then thrown into jails that were literally on the same plantations that their family had been enslaved for years. Yes, this was the process of it. The prison industrial complex, which is still happening today. Still happening.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

People go that are in prison go work at Wendy's for like five cents an hour. Yeah, they make them go do all kinds of things for. For a penny an hour. Because it's still. It's still. They make slavery.

[Mrs. P]

They make them do in chain gangs and then we do road work. And actually, when I was in Oklahoma, I saw a group of prisoners working at the Route 66 museum fixing a walkway. And you know what? They were wearing blue jeans because they give them workwear to wear. And that work wear is blue jeans.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

And blue jeans are not controversial.

[Mrs. P]

Blue jeans. Jeans are uncontroversial.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

But yeah, that's everything. I started opening too many tabs about.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah, you opened a lot of tabs and you went from Sydney Sweeney's face all the way to the 13th Amendment.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

I went from her boobs to the 13th Amendment.

[Mrs. P]

Well, you know, Mrs. P. I have to say this has been probably one of the more tabbed episodes that we've done in a while.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Yeah, I felt you got tabbed up.

[Mrs. P]

I felt every click the whole way through. And I hope you listeners felt every click as well, and you viewers out there. So please make sure you give us all those reviews across everything. We appreciate everything that you guys do as you reach out as you like.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Comment.

[Mrs. P]

Subscribe.

[Podcast Co-host 2]

Subscribe. Five stars. Go. Come visit us on Patreon. We make all kinds of exclusive content.

[Mrs. P]

Yeah. And any comments that you have down there? Not any. But the best comments, the ones that really stick out to us, we will react to in about a month on the after party. Thank you guys so much. And thank you to Mr. Third for all of your editing on this week's episode. And we will see you guys next week for another episode of Too Many Frauds and Too Many Scammers that We Wish Weren't Real. Too many cons and too many spammers. And we're starting to feel like we've got too many tabs of bandits. Too many tabs. Remember to smile.