Zibby Owens (Host) (2:34)

Check it out.

Zibby Owens (2:35)

Regretting you.

Zibby Owens (Host) (2:38)

Hi, this is Zibby Owens and you're listening to Totally Booked with Zibby, formerly Moms don't have Time to Read Books. In my daily show, I interview today's latest best selling, buzziest or underrated authors and story creators whose work I think is worth your time. As a bookstore owner, publisher, author, and obviously podcaster, I get a comprehensive look at everything that's coming out and spend my time curating the best books so you don't have to stay in the know, get insider insights and connect with guests like I do every single day. For more information, go to zibbymedia.com and follow me on Instagram. Ibby Owens Eli Rallo is the author of Does Anyone Else Feel this? Essays on Conquering the Quarter Life Crisis. Eli is the author of I Didn't Know I Needed this and an Internet creator with massive followings on TikTok and Instagram. She is the founder of Prose Hoes Literary Salon, the previous host of the Miss Congeniality Podcast, and a graduate of Columbia University's Graduate School of Journalism and the University of Michigan School of Music, Theater and Dance. When she isn't writing or tiktoking, you can find her at piano bars in the village belting out show tunes. Welcome Eli. Thank you so much for coming on to talk about Does Anyone else Feel this way? Congratulations.

Eli Rallo (3:58)

Thanks for having me.

Zibby Owens (Host) (4:00)

I really enjoyed your book. I wish I had had it when I was a little bit younger. Not that I can't use it now, but I really could have used it a little bit. A little bit during my own quarter life crisis, if you will. Why don't you tell everybody what this book is about and how you decided to write a second one after the success of your first.

Eli Rallo (4:19)

Sure. So I would say this book is a 12 essays and it really is, I would say my love letter to sort of the chaos and the camaraderie and the craziness of being in your 20s and sort of the isolation that you might experience or or encounter. It speaks a lot to friendship and those types of relationships, the relationship you have to yourself. It speaks to career and social media and societal pressures, especially for young women. And to answer your second question, I definitely always knew I was going to continue to write books. I didn't know really what that was going to look like. And this one, I had a podcast formerly called Miss Congeniality and I had done an episode about being in your 20s and it was very similar to this book just in a Row, really sort of diluted way because it was only like 45 minutes long. And it was really just me expressing my feelings and anxieties about being in my 20s and what that felt like and what it looked like. And it was really well received. And so when we were trying to figure out what the next book would be, we thought, you know, that podcast episode was a great jumping off point. I think that the media that I create in various mediums is really interconnected. So it was kind of a happy accident, but also, I think, ever intentional as well.

Zibby Owens (Host) (5:48)

Love it. Why don't you take listeners back if they hadn't read your first book or they haven't heard of you or they're not following you yet, Although I'm sure they will be after this. How you became who you are, how you started sharing publicly your story, the authenticity you bring to all of your struggles, from eating and OCD to just phobias, all the stuff. When did you decide to start putting it all out there?

Eli Rallo (6:12)

Sure. So I've been on the Internet for over five years now, which is crazy. I think it feels like the most interminable five years ever, but also like, it went by in a split second. I graduated college in 2020, started posting online, and then I went to grad school. So my audience, those who have been here since the beginning, have really watched me in a lot of different eras, as it were, from college and grad school to then post grad. I worked a 9 to 5 job for a bit and then inevitably started doing social media sort of full time. I left my 9 to 5 job for a bunch of circumstances and was like actively searching for something else. And social media was starting to pick up at the same time. So I was sort of supporting myself through that. And then I was writing a substack blog, personal essays. I had about like 5,000 subscribers. My TikTok was growing pretty rapidly. I would say that's like maybe the second most rapid growth I've ever seen because different times have caused different spikes in my following. But that I think, took me from kind of one level to the next. And my literary agents saw that and reached out to me and they were like, we think there's a book in all of this, and we know you're a writer, we know that you want to write, and sort of the rest is history with that. I worked on my first book. I didn't know I needed this with them. It came out in December 2023 and. And I am so proud of it. It was such a special debut and I don't think there ever could have been another debut in me. I received that advice from a lot of authors who have walked before me that sort of like, your first book is the only ever first book you could ever write, which I love that advice. And from there, I just kept doing social media. I actually never anticipated liking social media as much as I do. I always really was fascinated by social media, but I always tell people I think it's from the perspective of having an audience, which is why I really enjoyed it. It wasn't so much like I'm obsessed with creating content. At first, I really liked the idea of audience and community and sort of like that feedback loop and that constant discourse cycle. And then I published my first book, and at the time, I thought, I really want to be just a writer. And I kind of felt like I had to fit in a box in that way. And I kept doing social media and I kept writing, and I kept realizing the strengths of having both and how much I enjoyed being in communities. And I think that kind of allowing myself to be honest with the fact that I really enjoyed being online the same way that I really enjoy being a writer, I kind of opened a door to just sort of like the deepest, most authentic version of myself, which I always was on the Internet. But I think I. You know, I've grown a lot in the last over five years, and who's to say if I continue at this volume of balancing both. I definitely have lots of aspirations in the writing, writing and entertainment space, but I think social media is like the perfect sort of gateway drug into all of that. So it's been such a lovely time, and that's a little bit of my history.

Zibby Owens (Host) (9:15)

And so what is. What is the dream for the entertainment goals? Like, if you could have snap your fingers, have anything.

Eli Rallo (9:22)

I want to be Tina Fey.

Zibby Owens (Host) (9:23)

Okay.

Eli Rallo (9:25)

To be so upfront with you. I say this all the time, like, she's probably, like, my biggest inspiration. I just find her, I mean, not only so smart and poised, but also so talented. I mean, she's written books and I've read her books, and she's written musicals, and I love theater, and she's written for tv and she starred in TV and she's written movies, and she's sort of done it all. And I think, you know, I'm less of a comedic head than she sort of is. But when I look at her career, I'm quite inspired by the fact that she never let one medium limit her. She never let them stamp comedian on her forehead. Or screenwriter or filmmaker or actress or author. She Sort of just allowed herself to soar in so many different spaces. And I love just her story and I love her friendship with other entertainment popular faces like Amy Poehler. I just. I just really admire her work. And I have always seen myself writing for theater. I've always seen myself writing for television, film, and obviously continuing with the books. So I just feel that the sky is sort of the limit and I would really regret not trying. So that's sort of my path, I think.

Zibby Owens (Host) (10:42)

Awesome. I just rewatched Mean Girls the other day. Have you seen that lately? It's brilliant.

Eli Rallo (10:46)

It's truly brilliant. And like, at the time, just everything. Like, it's the perfect film from the perfect time, but it's so timeless. The writing is phenomenal. Like, she's just a genius. She's a genius.

Zibby Owens (Host) (10:58)

So true. I wrote it. I watched it with my 12 and 10 year olds and then the next day we all watched it together. The next day we were in the car and they started talking about another girl. And I was like, you guys, we were just over this in the gym and Mean Girls.

Eli Rallo (11:11)

Yes. Watched Mean Girls.

Zibby Owens (Host) (11:13)

You can't be mean. No, I'm kidding. They weren't really being mean. But anyway. Have you reached out to Tina Fey? Have you told her that she's a role model?

Eli Rallo (11:20)

Oh, my gosh. I haven't reached out, but I met her once briefly and obviously told her she was a huge role model. But no, I haven't, like, actually connected with her. It was very fun.

Zibby Owens (Host) (11:29)

You have to invite her to do an event on your tour.

Eli Rallo (11:32)

I know, Seriously, like, what if we just called Tina up? I love Tina. She's unreal. Like, when I met her, I was so starstruck. She's so. Oh, she's fabulous.

Zibby Owens (Host) (11:42)

I see this. In your future. You have to have your team reach out to her team and, you know, I think you can get it done. I think you can get it done. Can I read a little passage from when you were in grad school? Sure. From the book. Okay. You wrote, I often felt like I was losing my sparkle in grad school. Like, instead of finding myself, I was losing touch with myself more and more. It was sticky and emotional to hide from the reality of feeling unsure of myself. Simultaneously, it was terrifying to wonder if I'd ever be sure of myself because I'd never heard anyone try to put these uncomfortable emotions into words before. I'd never heard any other 22 year olds say, I am so proud to admit I do not know what I want out of life. I do not know who I am. I do not feel like an adult, and I don't know if I ever will. I saw endless photos of perfect lives on Instagram and job update after job update on LinkedIn. And then you go on to say how what you were seeing versus what you were feeling. Talk a little bit about that. And how did you manage to get your sparkle back?

Eli Rallo (12:39)

Sure. I think being 22 is like a death sentence. Like, I seriously do think being 22 is, like, the craziest thing in the world. And I think what makes it crazier is that nobody prepares you for that feeling. Like, when you are in high school, there's like all of this talk about higher education or if you're going to go to trade school or if you're going to go into the workforce, like, your hand is being held. And then if you do go pursue higher education, your hand is being held. Like, yes, you're in the real world. It's like a bubble college. And your hand is being held and community is being facilitated. And it's like, and this is what you're going to do now next. And this is what you're going to do next. And then it's over. And you're like, wait, what? Like, it goes from like, your hand is being held, the training wheels are on to, you're now riding a bike without training wheels. No one's ever taught you how to ride a bike. No one cares if you fall, and good luck. And it sort of is the most startling feeling. And I used to think it was so, like, I was the only person that felt that way because I think a lot of people that feel that way are like, we have to mask it and we have to pretend like this isn't how we feel. Because now we have all this freedom and we're making our own money and we're doing all of this. And I'm like, no, but that's not reality. This isn't reality. And I think it took just growing through it, honestly. But also, and the conceit of the book is sort of that there aren't answers. You'll never really feel like an adult. Like, not even the adults feel like adults. It's impossible to feel like adults because that would sort of suggest that adult is a feeling. But rather the only thing that really helps is reaching out to other people and being like, does anyone else feel this way? And I think that once I got comfortable with the people in my life to a point where we were just sort of sharing in the misery, it was so much easier. And I realized, like, there is another side. And I think that, like, what compounds this is the fact that you're being told, especially as a woman, that, like, you're in your prime. I have never felt, frankly, uglier on the inside and out than I did when I was 22. I'm 27 now. I just feel like I'm getting better. I don't. I feel like I've never looked better. I've never felt better. I feel so young. I feel so at the starting line. I feel like it's really season one of my life. And it's so isolating to be told, like, 22 is your glory days, the prime of your life. You're only getting uglier, older, fatter, like, saggier. All these things when you're, like, 22, that's baby, baby, baby. And I just. I still feel like a baby. And I just. I'm so glad to not be 22. And I wanted to write this for people who are in those periods of life. And I. The other thing that I learned in writing this was that they're going to come back. Like, you're going to have times where you're like, what is going on when you're 45? Like, in speaking to people and connecting with them, I've realized that these types of emotions don't go away. They're not actually contingent on being 22, but they'll definitely be there when you're 22. I think they kind of spark at 22. So I would say growing through it, talking to people, reaching out, and just allowing myself to live my life for me and recognizing, like, how in control I am even when things are so out of my control was really helpful. I hope that answers your question.

Zibby Owens (Host) (15:51)

It does. And let me just say from the advantage of being 49 years old, that 22 is not the peak. It really isn't. And you're. It's going to get better and better. And even 27, I mean, not to sound, you know, like, older and wiser or whatever, but I feel like my 40s were my best. So you just have so much in store. And nobody, nobody should even think that the 20s are the best because you.

Eli Rallo (16:18)

Want them to be. Like, I don't like the idea that any time would be stamped with the idea of being best.

Zibby Owens (Host) (16:24)

Yeah, true.

Eli Rallo (16:25)

It sort of creates this, like, doomsday type of thing. Like, why would you even want to, like, continue on if it's just going to get worse?

Zibby Owens (Host) (16:31)

It's just terrible. Good luck.

Eli Rallo (16:34)

Yeah. Like, okay.

Zibby Owens (Host) (16:37)

Yeah, the worst, the most depressing outlook on life pretty much ever. But it is good for because people, when they're in it, they can't necessarily see it. So a book like yours is super helpful when it's feeling like things should be all rosy and realizing that it's not always all great and everybody has insecurities and doubt. And it's no surprise really, given that everything is in flux in your 20s. I mean, nothing is set when you're older. Not that it has to be set, but I mean really, like you could be living anywhere. You could marry anyone. You could have this, you could have kids or not. You could have this job or that job. I mean, it's really like, it's crazy. Yeah. Anyway, just commiserating on that for you. Today's episode has been sponsored by Quince. Cooler days call for layers that last and Quince is my go to for quality essentials that feel cozy, look refined and won't blow your budget. Think $50 Mongolian cashmere premium denim that fits like a dream and luxe outerwear you'll wear year after year. These are the pieces that'll turn into your favorite fall uniform. I'm eyeing their wool coats. They look designer level but cost a fraction of the price. And the quality honestly just as good, if not better. Because Quince partners directly with top tier ethical factories and cuts out the middlemen. They deliver luxury quality pieces at half the price of similar brands. It's the kind of wardrobe upgrade that feels smart, stylish and effortless. I am particularly a fan of the Fisherman cashmere Mongolian sweater in brown. The light brown is already sold out. I am obsessed and it is so cozy and is a staple. Find your fall staples at quint. Go to quints.com zibby for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too. That's Q-U-I-N c e.com zibbee Z I B-B-Y to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com Zybee Today's episode is sponsored by Live It Up. If you are someone who wants real results and not watered down promises, it's time to upgrade your greens game. Most powders out there either taste like grass or overcharge you for hype. Live it up. Super Greens is different. My cabinet is now stocked with so many different products and it all tastes good. I have a hard time finding time to fit in all of my vegetables. Sometimes I don't even get to eat meals. This is the perfect solution for me and anyone else out there who's running around trying to just make life. Fit it all in and have a good time while you're doing it. Live It Up Super Greens contains more than 20 superfoods from organic vegetables and natural ingredients, all traceable nutrition designed and third party tasted and did I mention it tastes good. A survey of real Live it up customers who take their greens daily report actual benefits. 98% say it helps them feel healthier overall and 96% say say it increased their veggie intake. 95% say it improved digestion. Bottom line, Live it up delivers premium quality at a price that actually sticks. No gimmicks, no bloated margins. Live it up has become a quick and easy way for me to stay on top of my health. It's such a simple step that fits into my morning routine without any hassle. And I love that I don't have to overthink it. One scoop and I am set for the day. Honestly, I was surprised by how good it tastes. Not grassy or chalky like so many others. I actually look forward to drinking it, which makes it easier to stick with. I've noticed I feel more balance throughout the day. When I make it part of my mornings, it gives me that feel good energy I can count on without the crash right now. Get 33% off your first Live It up order when you subscribe at letsliveitup.com booked and use code booked. You can cancel anytime with a 30 day money back guarantee or to get 15% off when you purchase without a subscription. Head to letsliveitup.com booked and use code booked for 15% off your first order. These statements have not been evaluated by the FDA. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. Today's episode is sponsored by Wayfair. As you all know, I am obsessed with Wayfair. In fact, I have a new office chair waiting in my lobby for me today to make my pack feel even better. But let's talk about how the holidays are coming up because there's so much that we all can do to get ready to host for all the assorted holidays from Halloween to Thanksgiving. And actually I just picked up a few of these pumpkin white soup terrines.

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Because it always they look so pretty.

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Eli Rallo (23:02)

It's a lot of responsibility and I'm very careful with the responsibility I think I pride myself on. I haven't always been perfect. I think when you post as much as I do, like, things could trigger someone and I'm always wanting to be hyper aware of that and walk the line of being open and as honest as possible, but also recognizing like people's triggers and where they might feel some type of way about something. So I definitely do my best to be really, really careful with the responsibility. I would say I don't speak that often about my own relationship to food as it relates to like my eating disorder that I had in the past. Just because I think that's something that's so scary on the Internet is the idea that doctors aren't to be trusted and there's all of this medical misinformation. And in this like, rise of conservatism on the Internet, and all these young girls going off birth control based on no scientific evidence. And it just makes me really scared that people are going to distrust science, which I think is like part one of sort of like the right radicalizing young women the same way that they galvanized young men. I think it's like how they're getting to us. And so I try to be so upfront about the fact that when you have an eating disorder that is like a medical diagnosis, that is something that you deserve to be with medical professionals treating you. Depending on the severity of your situation and sort of what types of treatment that you'll need, you need to be seeking out professional help, whether that's a therapist or inpatient or outpatient, again, depending on the severity of your situation and even often medical help. And I think that there's a lot of people on the Internet who believe that because they've had an eating disorder or have struggled with disordered eating, that gives them the agency to speak about it in a place to give advice. And that terrifies me, frankly, because having an experience of something does not make you just automatically an expert in it, especially when it's something as precarious as eating disorders, which are. Which. Which kill people. They're not like. They're not like something we can fling around as an insult. They're not something to be taken lightly. So I always, when I do speak about it, I'm coming from a place of like, please seek out professional help. Please seek out medical help. And I think it's wonderful when people share their experience online because it can implore other people to reflect on their own experiences or even potentially go and get that medical help and professional help. But I do think we need to be so careful because I just. I just think it gets to a really muddy place with like, a lot of different nuances and circumstances. And we're talking about people's lives here. I just don't take that very lightly. It's the same way I feel about the young girls on TikTok and Instagram sharing that they've gone off birth control. I believe that you should have your individual experience of going off birth control. And I don't think birth control is perfect. But the more stories that we place into the zeitgeist about going off birth control to impressionable young audiences in a post Roe v. Wade world with no medical backing, no scientific backing, oftentimes the. The stats they're throwing off aren't proven, haven't been researched, haven't Been studied. It's, like, terrifying. Did we forget that birth control is like, the largest feminist breakthrough of our time? Did we forget that after birth control was widely available to people, the rate of women in college and working jobs doubled? I just am so cautious about that. It just really scares me. And I think that when you're talking about anything medical, including eating problems, you just have to be careful. And I would say that, like, my slight drawback in speaking about my own experiences is because I just understand how scary it can be to watch other people online kind of influence people in a direction I find to be unhelpful. And I think that in writing the chapter that mostly discusses eating disorders in the book, I also wanted to be really careful. It's definitely the most honestly I've ever spoken about it. And obviously the chapter has a trigger warning, but I think I do a good job of not glossing over it and dumbing it down, but still providing the most honest kind of analysis of my experience I could. So I think it's a huge responsibility, but something that we have to be really careful with.

Zibby Owens (Host) (27:33)

Yep, I appreciate the answer. Last question. What advice do you have for aspiring authors?

Eli Rallo (27:39)

Oh, my gosh. I write a chapter in this book that is one of my favorites about when I was in college and I wanted to be a writer. And I've wanted to be a writer since I was like, 10 years old. And about just being in my college writing classes and all of these, like, professionals would come in, whether they were authors, essayists, journalists, and they would speak to us. And it would be sort of kind of agonizing to sit there because it was like, I'm never gonna have that. I would always think to myself, like, how did you. Like, what do you mean? Like, you went here and there and this, and then that happened. And I think what getting the things that I've wanted has caused me to realize is one, there's no one path. That's frustrating, but it's also freeing. If there was one path to do it like there is for medical school or law school. And not to say that those are easier paths by any means whatsoever, but, you know, if you want to be a lawyer, here's what you do. If you want to be a doctor, here's what you do. If you want to be a published author, figure it out. Like, it's not as. There's not as much of a clear cut road. And I think that that can be frustrating, but can also be freeing because there are so many ways in. I would say on Like a actual tangible level network. Like, put yourself in spaces. Like, even if you're not in school anymore, like in New York, there are so many writing courses that you can take. I've taken a few of them. You can take writing classes online, you can network with editors, you can go to book events, you can get yourself involved in the publishing communities in your area. And you can cold email people, you can write your manuscript and you can pitch and query agents. And you can listen to podcast upon podcast upon podcast of authors explaining how they did that same thing. You know, there's a lot of resources out there, you might have to dig for them, but they do exist. My book club Prozos, we do an author interview every month and I ask every single author how they went from idea to pub, because I want people to hear how they did it. Because if you want to do it too, let me put you in the room where it happens. Let's hear how someone else did it. So that is what I would say on a tangible level. And on a not so tangible level, I would say, you just can't stop doing it. I can't really give you the reason why. I never stopped doing it because there were so many no's doors slammed in my face for years in college. I wrote incessantly, literally everything. And I applied to everything. And I submitted my writing everywhere. Every single journal, every single writing contest, every single award, every whatever it was. I wanted to be published. I was published by some, like really, really small zines and magazines. And I took like unpaid internships, which you shouldn't do, but just to get clips. Like, I kept going. I didn't know why I did it. And it was almost like I felt like if I stopped, I just couldn't stop. I was doing it anyway. Writing is not something I have to force myself to do. It's something that I've always just done. Like, if I wasn't on deadline, I would be writing. Who knows what I would do with it? Post it on the Internet, start a substack blog. Like, just don't stop. You just don't know. I had this editor at the New York Times come to my college newspaper and they give the advice to for everything you write, write it. Like the New York Times is going to read it. And they were basically saying, like, you just don't know who's going to see something. Like if you posted something on Instagram or if you posted something on Twitter. You don't know. Like, who's going to retweet that. Who knows? Someone here who knows someone there, you just don't know. So stop selling yourself short. If you want to be a vocalist, treat every audition like you're going to get the part. If you want to be anything, if you want to be a chef, treat every meal like, like bon appetit or food.com or, I don't know, the big food magazine Martha store is eat it. You know what I mean? Like, you have to treat your work like that. And of course, not every piece is going to be good enough or at that level. But if you're treating it like every single time the New York Times is going to read this, that's what I would always tell myself in college. Just makes you better. And I think I now really feel like I'm on the precipice of, like 12 years of work. And that can be like a crazy thing to look back on, all of these trying versions of yourself. But it makes so much sense now why I didn't stop. And I think that's like the dumbest thing ever. And it's like me exactly acting the same way the people that frustrated me in college act. But I understand now why they acted that way. And I'm glad that, like, a small part of me was delusional enough to listen to them.

Zibby Owens (Host) (32:00)

Amazing. All right, Eli, thank you so much. Congratulations. And I know you have so much exciting stuff in store personally and everything, and oh, my gosh. So just congrats.

Eli Rallo (32:12)

Thank you so much. I really appreciate it.

Zibby Owens (Host) (32:14)

Okay, thanks. Take care. Bye. Bye. Thank you for listening to Totally Booked with Zibby, formerly Moms don't have Time to Read Books. If you loved the show, tell a friend, leave a review. Follow me on Instagram ibbeowens and spread the word. Thanks so much. Oh, and buy the books.

Zibby Owens (32:37)

Today's episode has been sponsored by Paramount Pictures Corporation. Okay, you guys, there is a movie coming out called Regretting youg based on Colleen Hoover's best selling book of the same name. I know many of you already know about this because I sent out an invitation to a screening when they so kindly gave us some tickets and over 250 of you asked for tickets, even though at the time we only had 20, we got a lot more. Anyway, I know you're all already excited about this movie, but for those of you who don't know, let me tell you more about it. This is about Morgan Grant, played by Allison Williams, and her daughter Clara, played by McKenna Grace, as they explore what's left behind after a devastating accident reveals a shocking betrayal and forces them to confront family secrets, redefine love and rediscover each other. Regretting you as a story of growth, resilience and self discovery in the aftermath of tragedy. Also starring Dave Franco and Mason Thames. With Scott Eastwood and Willa Fitzgerald. In theaters October 24th. Are you excited? I am so excited. Director Josh Boone is the one who did the Fault in Our stars, obviously Colleen Hoover. And it's about mother, daughter, relationships, heartbreak, grief, first love, second chances. It's the perfect film to share with your best friend, mom, grandmother, high school niece. It's filled with love and tears and laughter. Everyone will love it. Honestly, I cannot wait to see this movie. Come with us to one of the screenings. Watch it along. Send me notes on Instagram. I want to hear what you say. We'll all watch it together.

Zibby Owens (Host) (34:10)

Check it out.

Zibby Owens (34:10)

Regretting you.

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Terms apply. Lounge access is subject to change. See capitalone.com for details. If you're a maintenance supervisor at a manufacturing facility and your machinery isn't working right, Grainger knows you need to understand what's wrong as soon as possible. So when a conveyor motor falters, Grainger offers diagnostic tools like calibration kits and multimeters to help you identify and fix the problem. With Grainger, you can be confident you have everything you need to keep your facility running smoothly. Call 1-800-GRAINGER clickgranger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done.