← Totally Booked with Zibby
Totally Booked with Zibby
Niki Russ Federman and Josh Russ Tupper, RUSS & DAUGHTERS: 100 Years of Appetizing
00:33:36
Loading summary
Transcript117 lines
- [00:01]
Josh Russ Tupper
This holiday season, Capital One reminds you to give yourself the gift of 1.5% cash back with the Capital One Quicksilver Card. Can I earn 1.5% cash back on birds?
- [00:10]
Nikki Russ Federman
Birds?
- [00:11]
Josh Russ Tupper
What if you sent your true love two turtledoves plus a partridge and a pear tree? Sure, but why would anyone want that? The song was very convincing. Earn 1.5% cash back on all your holiday purchases with the Capital One Quicksilver Card.
- [00:26]
Nikki Russ Federman
What's in your wallet? Terms apply. See capitalone.com for details.
- [00:31]
Josh Russ Tupper
Suffering from dry, tired, irritated eyes? Don't let dry eyes win.
- [00:36]
Nikki Russ Federman
Use Sustain Pro.
- [00:37]
Josh Russ Tupper
It hydrates, restores and protects dry eyes for up to 12 hours.
- [00:41]
Nikki Russ Federman
Sustain Pro Triple Action Dry Eye Relief Get a jump on next summer with vrbo's early booking Deals don't wait to.
- [00:48]
Ibby Owens
Claim your dream summer spot, whether that.
- [00:50]
Nikki Russ Federman
Includes a good porch swing or a poolside lounger.
- [00:54]
Ibby Owens
When you book early, you get the best places at the best prices.
- [00:57]
Nikki Russ Federman
But back to the poolside loungers.
- [00:59]
Ibby Owens
With vrbo, you don't have to reserve any loungers. They're all yours. In fact, the whole private home is yours. Book with early booking deals and you.
- [01:09]
Nikki Russ Federman
Can lounge around all summer long however.
- [01:12]
Ibby Owens
You please@vrbo.com hi, this is Zibby Owens and you're listening to Totally Booked with Zibby, formerly Moms don't have Time to Read Books in my daily show, I interview today's latest best selling, buzziest or underrated authors and story creators whose work I think is worth your time. As a bookstore owner, publisher, author and obviously podcaster, I get a comprehensive look at everything that's coming out and spend my time curating the best books so you don't have to stay in the know. Get insider insights and connect with guests like I do every single day. For more information, go to zibbymedia.com and follow me on Instagram. Ibby Owens Today's episode was a live podcast filmed at Zibby's Bookshop at Minnie Rose in New York City. If you haven't been, go check it out. It's on 73rd and Lex. This event precipitated our fabulous holiday party and kicked off the holiday season in style. Enjoy. Nikki Russ Federman and Josh Russ Tupper are co authors of Russ and 100 years of appetizing Nikki. Russ Fetterman is the fourth generation co owner of Russ and Daughters. At the age of 27, she chose to return to the shop in which she grew up. Together with her cousin Josh, she has grown Russ and daughters into what it is today while preserving its cultural and culinary legacy. Nikki has been featured in the Sturgeon Queens, the award winning documentary about Russ and daughters television shows such as Taste the nation with Padma Lakshmi and Anthony Bourdain's no reservations and publications including the New York Times, the New Yorker, Food and wine, Zagat, Vogue, and W magazine. She was inducted into the Manhattan Jewish hall of fame. I didn't know there was a Manhattan Jewish hall of Fame. Who knew anyway? And has an encyclopedic entry in the Jewish women's archive. She lives in Brooklyn with her husband Christopher and two children, Josh. Russ Tepper is the fourth generation co owner of Russ and daughters. Raised in an ashram in upstate New York, Josh was working as an engineer in Portland, Oregon when the opportunity arose to join his family business at age 26. He has been leading Russ and daughters with his cousin Nikki ever since. He has been featured in media outlets such as npr, the food Network, the travel Channel, Forbes, the Cut, Kinfolk, Lucky Peach, the New Yorker, and Vogue. He is also one of the subjects of the documentary the Sturgeon Queens called the babka baron by the New York Times. Josh has been honored by the museum of food and drink for his contributions to New York City food culture. He has taught at the Yivo center for Jewish research and Astor Center. He lives with his wife Denise and two daughters. Welcome, Nikki. Welcome, Josh. Thank you so much for being here to talk about Russ and daughters. Congratulations on this absolutely beautiful book, 100 years of appetizing A cookbook. You will find out when you open it what appetizing means, what you thought it meant, what it is, how it is, not a deli. Why don't we start there?
- [04:14]
Nikki Russ Federman
That's a good place to start. Okay, so I'm sure this is a room of New Yorkers, but even a lot of New Yorkers don't know the word appetizing or that that's the name for our food tradition.
- [04:26]
Josh Russ Tupper
Who doesn't?
- [04:28]
Nikki Russ Federman
It's okay.
- [04:28]
Josh Russ Tupper
Who doesn't know appetizing?
- [04:30]
Ibby Owens
Now you're gonna shame everybody.
- [04:31]
Nikki Russ Federman
No, no, no shame. No shame. But after today, you're not allowed to call us a deli. So appetizing. No. If you think of, for example, bagels and lox, that is appetizing. It's the same sister food tradition to delicatessen, and it comes from Jewish dietary law that prohibits eating meat and dairy together. So on the lower east side, it's not a coincidence that on Easthausen street you find one block apart, Katz's delicatessen and russen daughters because the delicatessen is where you go for smoked, cured meats. Think pastrami, corned beef. And then the appetizing store is for fish and dairy, where you're used to. Yeah, now it's, you know, it's all kind of a little blurred, but. Pickled herring and cream sauce. Right. So these kind of classic Eastern European Jewish foods that were kind of. Many of the flavors and tastes were brought over and foods were brought over from. By the waves of Eastern European Jewish immigrants, but then also adapted to what they found here in New York. And the word is kind of funny, right? Appetizing. It comes from the Yiddish word forspice, which means appetizers, because these are foods that are typically. They're already smoked, they're pickled, they're cured, they're ready to eat. So if you're coming home from a wedding or a Shiva funeral, birthday, the foods were able to be easily put out and ready to consume. What probably happened is that someone like our great grandfather, who was a Yiddish speaker, was trying to say appetizer, but instead said appetizing. And that stuck. So that's very. You know, I don't think it's been researched, but that's the sort of anecdotal story of how we got our name.
- [06:19]
Josh Russ Tupper
And it's a tradition. Born in New York.
- [06:22]
Ibby Owens
But the other thing that stuck, that your great grandfather did was establish rests and daughters. And the two of you, fourth generation, have such interesting stories. This was not what you thought you would be doing with your life, but yet here you are. Not just the book, but also Russ and daughters in general. Talk a little bit about where you were before and when you heard the call to come back.
- [06:43]
Josh Russ Tupper
Yeah, So I had never been involved in the store. My. My mother was sort of the black sheep of the family and did the. The hippie thing in the 60s and moved upstate to an ashram, where I was born. And, well, I was born. I was the only child born in a hospital, but I was. I was there till I was 10 years old. I rebelled and sent myself to boarding school in Minnesota, played some hockey, and then got a chemical engineering degree, as you do as rebelling from the astronaut world. Engineering school. And I was working as an engineer in Portland, Oregon, for five years when I heard through the grapevine, which was my mother, that Nikki's father was sort of looking for his exit strategy. Mind you, it was a few years down the road, and at that time, I was sort of thinking about the history of this side of our family and what our grandmother who was a very important figure in all of our lives. She was sort of the glue that held the family together. Real matriarch, and was one of the daughters. What she did with her life and what she did with her life was Russen daughters, whether she wanted to or not. She definitely went all in and spent her life at the store till, you know, in her 70s. She would come up from Florida and help out for the holidays. So I was sort of having this debate and I was working as an engineer and doing stuff that I couldn't explain to anyone. There was no real passion behind it, Right. So I told Mark I'd leave my career and come to New York and attempt to get into the business. And he tried to dissuade me. And he's like, it's not all Martha Stewart appearances. I was like, oh, you're on Martha Stewart. That's cool. And as I tell the story, as I thought the story went, I convinced him over the course of months that I should. I would be able to come back. I'll learn anything, whatever. But the reality, I think, was Nikki was there helping out. And then one day she was like, I'm leaving. I'm not doing this. I'm gonna go explore my own path. And at that point, Mark called me up and was like, all right, Josh, you can come back and see how it works. And then for the next five years, every day he reminded me, he's like, we'll see. Not sure if this is gonna work, but we'll see how it goes.
- [08:56]
Nikki Russ Federman
Yeah. And my story is that I, unlike Josh, I grew up in the store. I was a shop kid. And for me, Russell Daughters was a literal mom and pop because it was my mother and father. And I actually now think that it was. I mean, it was a very formative part of my education. Even though at the time I was like, just annoyed, you know, why can't we go home? And why are you sending me to Moishe to pick up a roll of quarter, like, you know, quarters?
- [09:23]
Ibby Owens
Go get it yourself.
- [09:24]
Nikki Russ Federman
But I think I absorbed from a very young age, very much like being in this shop, the sort of very almost primal human interactions and coming together that happens in. In a store. You know, it's not just about the exchange of goods and transactions. And I. I was exposed to that from a very, very young age. And I saw how all of New York, meaning, and all of humanity came through those doors. And whether they were customers, whether they were delivery people, the staff, celebrities, the old time Lower East Siders, it was all happening in this small space. And I saw how this food sort of always evoked an emotion or a story. But that being said, I was very much kind of educated and encouraged, like, go do your own thing. And I think we have an ethos in our society of, like, you should do something, quote, unquote, better than the generation before you. And so I didn't think that I was going to end up working at Russ and Daughters, but it took me about seven years of what now I think of as my wandering Jew phase, where I was trying these different life paths and nothing really felt real to me. And when I got to the bottom of the list, I started taking stock and really thinking about what Ross and Daughters means not just to me, but in a larger context. And I realized that in a way, I was kind of. I didn't need to fight this thing. That actually, I was just looking at it all wrong. And whereas before thought if I ended up doing what three generations of my family had done for work before me, that somehow I hadn't individuated, you know, I realized that I was part of a Yiddish. You say a Yiches like I was part of a lineage. And there's something really not just beautiful about that, but in this country, we don't have a lot of history. We don't preserve craft. You know, we don't preserve place as well as I think we could. And that Russell and Daughters holds a lot of meaning for a lot of people. And that I could be the steward of maintaining the, you know, 100 years of tradition and history and the things that needed to stay the same. But I also realized that just because it was 100 years old didn't mean that it was stagnant, nor should it be, and that I could move it forward and do fun things with it, like open a restaurant.
- [12:08]
Josh Russ Tupper
Easier said than done.
- [12:09]
Nikki Russ Federman
Easier said than done. But it was that kind of shift that led me to call my parents, and they'd kind of given up on me. And I said, look, I actually want to come back. My father, whose heart had sort of been broken by when I told him that this is not what I want to do, he was kind of more subdued. The second time around, he said, well, that's nice, but now your cousin's involved, so you gotta talk to Josh. But luckily, we realized pretty quickly that we saw the same things and we had the same values and that we would make a good team.
- [12:46]
Josh Russ Tupper
I didn't harass her every day like her father harassed me.
- [12:49]
Ibby Owens
Right.
- [12:50]
Nikki Russ Federman
And we're also not Married to each other. And we're not siblings. We don't have that kind of baggage, so it works.
- [12:57]
Ibby Owens
My family history went a little bit differently, but my great grandfather opened, like, a dry goods store in Philadelphia, and my grandfather took it over, and then my dad and uncles had to work in the store all the time. They hated it. That's, like, all they could do. And my dad was like, let's make this bed, Bath and Beyond. And his dad was like, absolutely not. And now it's gone. But what's interesting, actually, as an aside, you.
- [13:21]
Nikki Russ Federman
The.
- [13:21]
Ibby Owens
We were looking through photo albums recently, and the. The store address was 1311. Whatever street it was on. And my bookstore in Santa Monica is 1311 Montana Avenue. Isn't that funny? Universe working, Universe at work. So anyway, yeah, there's something about a store and a place, and I love what you just said about it not being an exchange of goods and services. It's about life and connection.
- [13:42]
Nikki Russ Federman
Right, right. And especially food for you.
- [13:45]
Ibby Owens
Right.
- [13:45]
Nikki Russ Federman
And your story, I mean, you know, so many people have some version of our story, and so it's really beautiful for us to kind of be the portal that allows people to, like, kind of think about their own family history or, you know, connect with, like, their own traditions and memories. And our food is kind of that type of legacy identity food that can. That has the power to do that.
- [14:13]
Josh Russ Tupper
And we wanted. When we made the cookbook, you know, it's a cookbook, but it's more. Right.
- [14:17]
Ibby Owens
Yes.
- [14:18]
Josh Russ Tupper
It's meant to speak to people like you and the people that have the history in the Lower east side, which is many, many Jews mostly, but it's that history and bringing a little piece of this idea of that shop, you know, the mom and pop shop, and that experience beyond the exchange of goods into your home. So we hope that this book does that.
- [14:42]
Ibby Owens
Well, the book is so great, too, because, yes, you have all the traditional recipes. You have spins on the traditional recipes, which are also clever and totally exciting to try and all of that. But you have a lot of history in here, too. And I actually. I love the dialogue that you have with all of you being like, we can't believe we've never sat around and talked about what this means to us. You're like, yeah, isn't that crazy? You talked about your mom and pop store, and your mom, I guess, is Colombian.
- [15:06]
Nikki Russ Federman
Yes.
- [15:06]
Ibby Owens
And your dad was like, well, I couldn't have a mom and pop store without the mom. I had to get somebody in here. But talk a little bit. You said in the Book. Your mom, with her Colombian accent, felt not quite accepted by the regulars and worked in the back for a while.
- [15:21]
Nikki Russ Federman
Tell me a little bit about that. My mom was a research chemist who came here to work in a lab for what she thought would be a couple years, and then met my father. And, you know, that stayed. Who was a lawyer at the time. She thought she was marrying a lawyer.
- [15:38]
Ibby Owens
Yeah, that was also really.
- [15:39]
Nikki Russ Federman
And then, you know, the pull of the family business.
- [15:42]
Ibby Owens
Like, I thought I was a good lawyer. He's selling fish.
- [15:45]
Nikki Russ Federman
Yeah. And Colombia's a very. It's a very classist society. So this was like, you know, and this was before now, you know, I think we. People who make food and are. Are celebrated. Right. There's an appreciation now that I don't. That back in the 70s, wasn't there, and people thought, like, you were a lawyer, and now you're selling, you know, herring on the. What happened to you? Right. So there was a little bit of that. But over time, she also kind of got pulled in. And so growing up, I would, you know, I remember making all the holiday, you know, gift baskets with my mom in the back, you know, and that was one of my jobs. That being said, you know. Yeah, she. She still even has a very strong accent. And she would pick up the phone and people would say, I want to speak to someone. And that really stuck with her. And I think she's kind of, you know, they're a yin and yang couple. So he's very much the, like, the extrovert. And I think it just made her a little bit more of a. Of an introvert. And, you know, it's those things stick. One of my. What I love about something we did with the book, which wasn't a plan, it just happened. Or like, in the moment was you'll see that the book ends of the book. It starts with our family's history, our immigrant story, and then it ends with these lovely black and white portraits of our. A lot of our. Not all. Not everyone, but everybody was there because we took portraits of our staff. And you see that the immigrant story continues. And that just happened because while we were doing the food photography, which is very time consuming because you have to make the recipe, then you have to make it look beautiful, then you have to set up the camera like it's a whole. And that's just one recipe. And we had to do this. So there's a lot of downtime. And so through the waiting, we just started taking pictures of our staff.
- [17:40]
Josh Russ Tupper
There's a team of Two photographers and their husbands could not stand still. So he had to do something with his downtime.
- [17:48]
Nikki Russ Federman
But it ended up being yeah, but now I think I really appreciate it because to, you know, Russ and daughters is a family business in the literal and figurative sense of the word.
- [17:58]
Josh Russ Tupper
And I mean, that time, you know, we had some immigrant employees as well, and people were wary. You know, your father would say, this is a Jewish business for Jewish people that sells Jewish foods. So we had like a Dominican guy on the counter that came out of the kitchen and he would be out there and no one would let him slice their fish. And the way he got in their good graces was he started speaking Yiddish.
- [18:25]
Nikki Russ Federman
Wow.
- [18:25]
Josh Russ Tupper
Yeah, so we'd speak Yiddish then and they'd be like, oh, okay. So it was a challenging time.
- [18:31]
Ibby Owens
Oh, my God. Today's episode has been sponsored by Quint. When it comes to holiday gifting, I want to give things people really love. Beautiful, timeless pieces they will wear for years. So that's why I'm going with quince. From Mongolian cashmere sweaters to Italian wool coats, everything is premium quality at a price that actually makes sense. Quince has something for everyone. Soft cashmere sweaters for $50 that look and feel like designer pieces. Silk tops and skirts for dressing up, perfectly cut jeans for everyday wear and outerwear that actually keeps warm. I've been wearing my new quince coat with this fur collar on social media, so you should be able to see me wearing it on Instagram. Iby Owens I love it. And of course, it would make a great gift. The Italian wool coats are also amazing standout pieces. Beautifully tailored, soft to the touch, and crafted to last for the seasons. Every piece is made with premium materials from ethical, trusted factories and priced far below what other luxury brands charge. The craftsmanship really shows in every detail. The stitching, the fit, the drape. It's elevated, timeless, and made to wear on repeat. There are just so many options. I can totally see myself giving my friends one of their beautiful options, like a sweater or one of their coats for someone really special. And as if that isn't enough, they also have stuff for home, bath, kitchen and travel. Come on, find gifts so good you'll want to keep them yourself with quince. Go to quince.com zibby for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too. That's quince.com zivi to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quinns.com zivi Today's episode is sponsored by Aura Frames. Okay, who else is looking for easy, thoughtful, fabulous gifts to give people that you love? I mean, who is not looking for that? Well, I have the answer for you. Aura Frames is the answer to every holiday gifting moment. And you'll never have to struggle again to find the perfect gift. This is so personalized because you can load this digital frame with all photos of people you love, the recipient, people they love. All you have to do to get unlimited free photos and videos is download the Aura app, connect to WI Fi, and you can preload photos before it ships. And you can keep adding photos from anywhere, anytime, and add a message before it arrives so you can share your videos all year long. And yet you're giving it right for the holidays. A gift box is included. Every frame comes beautifully packaged in a premium gift box with no price tag. So don't wait. Win the holidays now with Aura Frames for a limited time, save on the perfect gift by visiting auraframes.com to get $35 off Aura Frames bestselling carver matte frames named number one by Wirecutter by using promo code zibby at checkout. That's a U R A frames.com promo code ZIBBY Z I B B Y. This deal is exclusive to listeners and frames sell out fast, so order yours now to get it in time for the holidays. Support the show by mentioning us at checkout. Terms and conditions apply. Now goodbye while I go fill another frame for a very lucky recipient in my family.
- [22:10]
Josh Russ Tupper
This holiday season. Capital One reminds you to give yourself the gift of 1.5% cash back with the Capital One Quicksilver Card. Can I earn 1.5% cash back on birds?
- [22:20]
Nikki Russ Federman
Birds.
- [22:21]
Josh Russ Tupper
What if you sent your true love two turtledoves plus a partridge and a pear tree? Sure, but why would anyone want that? The song was very convincing. Earn 1.5% cash back on all your holiday purchases with the Capital One Quicksilver card.
- [22:35]
Nikki Russ Federman
What's in your wallet? Terms apply. See capital1.com for details.
- [22:43]
Ibby Owens
Well, I was also really interested in the book. I'm interested in how brands evolve because so many brands have not been able to adapt. And yet others, like look at Kodak, for instance, which has really suffered. I worked on that account in an ad agency like forever ago. And so I've been watching the demise of that one storied brand. And then I look at like Ralph Lauren on the corner where there's a line around the like that could that didn't have to happen. Why they're selling coffee now. So Anyway, and I look at you and how you've opened this restaurant in addition, and I'm sure you've operationalized so many things, you referenced stuff you can't see, but I'm sure makes it much more efficient. Talk about how to keep a brand alive and what, in addition to stewardship, like the two of you being stewards of the brand, what do you have to do? How can you modernize and maintain the authenticity and the history?
- [23:29]
Josh Russ Tupper
Yeah, I think for us, we have this guiding light, which is the original store and, you know, 111 years old now. So we're always looking to that to make sure we're not straying too far away from our principles and ideas.
- [23:43]
Ibby Owens
And.
- [23:44]
Josh Russ Tupper
And we're an advertising store, so we really stick to what we know. That being said, we want to evolve and we want to make things more efficient and introduce technology, but as we do that, we have to keep a hold of the historical connection. So it's a lot of debates, right? How do we do this? How do we open this restaurant that's going to be brand new and not put, like a fake patina on everything to make it. Oh, it's the old place. Like, no, we're not gonna do that. It's gonna be brand new. So it's a lot of how do we maintain the through line to our history and to the original store in look and feel? And then there's the interaction that Mickey spoke of. It's not a typical commerce, you know, interaction. It's more of like, yeah, we want to know you as a person or you as a customer and your families. And we want generations of families to shop here. So it's a challenge. We say that innovation for us is something that the customer doesn't notice. But we can, you know, we change all the systems to computers and POS's and E commerce and all of these things. But we're always trying to maintain that connection to the past.
- [25:03]
Nikki Russ Federman
This, Some of you asked, you know, how do you maintain authenticity and that history and then also change? And actually it's by trying to do both of those things at the same time. That's at least for us. That's always the creative challenge. And for us, I think businesses sometimes do one or the other.
- [25:25]
Ibby Owens
Right?
- [25:26]
Nikki Russ Federman
Like, okay, we're gonna just. We're gonna stay the same, or we're gonna, you know, creative destruction. Right. We're gonna blow this all up and create something new. And we're. I think it's a lot harder, but really interesting to try to do those Seemingly incongruous things at the same time stay the same and keep, you know, evolving. And for us it's, it's been very organic. It hasn't. We've never sat down and said, well, you know, this is our ten year plan. Just feeling wanting, Russ and daughters, to hopefully continue for another four generations, have another four generations of customers, and then just seeing what, what the sort of organic next thing is. So, for example, our restaurant was born out of people increasingly coming to our chef thinking that they wanting to sit down and they would come and walk right into our kitchen in the back because they thought that's surely where the, you know, the tables must be. And then I always, I felt this horrible dread where I had to like take them out of the kitchen and tell them that they could sit on our two bench, one of our two benches outside when it was, you know, 20 degrees outside and so, or seeing people come and you know, they'd order at the counter. I remember one time I saw this guy, he bought some pickled herring with cream sauce and onions. And then I watched him as he went into his car. He double parked in front and he was sitting behind the steering wheel and he took our bag back then a plastic bag was allowed back then he tied it around his neck like a lobster bib, you know, and he sat there eating his pickled herring and having this moment and it was so beautiful. But also I thought we really need to open. I've never, I've never worked in a restaurant. I don't know anything about restaurants, but we're gonna do this. So, you know, similarly with our bakery, we were also not trained bakers, but we just felt this sort of obligation that seeing how these iconic, you know, baked goods that we've. Our family's always relied on sort of independent bagel rollers and you know, that it was increasingly either dying out or because just so mass produced and that somebody needed to step in and preserve a real New York bagel, a real biali, you know, a Bob, all those things. And we thought, well, I guess that's on us. And that's how our bakery was started.
- [27:56]
Ibby Owens
Well, I'm very indebted to you and your whole team because recently my stepfather passed away and I hosted the reception. We hosted the reception at our home and I ordered online because you've, you're totally modernized. You can get everything delivered and you know, it's like very seamless. So I ordered like, I don't know, 40 rugala or something. And they called me, someone actually called from the website and were like, hey, no problem if this is what you want. But did you mean to order 40 boxes of rugala? And I was like, oh my gosh, no, I just wanted 40 pieces anyway so they could have easily just shipped me all of that.
- [28:35]
Josh Russ Tupper
You're an ideal customer. Ordered 40 $20 boxes of Roku.
- [28:41]
Nikki Russ Federman
I know.
- [28:41]
Ibby Owens
I was wondering why it was so expensive, but I was like, I'm gonna support this local media long term business and all of that. So anyway, yeah, I was delighted to not do it. But anyway, it just speaks to your customer service and ways of adapting. The book is very much about who the customers are too. And you can tell you really want to please them and uphold their impressions of everything. And that's not easy.
- [29:05]
Josh Russ Tupper
No, not easy. Especially not our customers. I like to say we've created the most difficult customers in the world for good reason. You know, like, we care that much about your experience and try to do everything to meet your desires that, you know, we have very challenging customers. And a customer and a family that's been shopping with Russ and daughters for four or five generations feels ownership over the brand and who we are. So, like, they're telling us how to do things.
- [29:36]
Ibby Owens
Well, it's an interesting time to be Jewish and to have a Jewish forward business. How has that affected you, especially since October 7th?
- [29:45]
Nikki Russ Federman
You know, it's actually been kind of just really meaningful to be doing this work in this time because our food is, at the end of the day, it's. It's comfort food. And when, when times are difficult, we feel like we're doing a service to. To be giving people foods that remind them of, you know, of joy and good memories and, you know, who they are and to be able to do that for generations of families and to weather, you know, after 111 years, like, we've weathered a lot of ups and downs and, you know, we just always look past it to just getting through to the, you know, so it's been challenging, but also very, very rewarding.
- [30:36]
Josh Russ Tupper
Unexpectedly, it's really sort of demonstrated to us how important a place in like, Gross and Daughters is to bring people together over food. And that's how we want our food enjoyed. You know, families coming together, friends coming together, all kinds of people coming together and enjoying food and positivity. Right. So it's made us feel good about who we are in this time.
- [31:01]
Nikki Russ Federman
That's great.
- [31:02]
Ibby Owens
And we do have Russ and daughter's black and white cookies right over there. You can all stampede and fight over them. We have Enough for everybody. But maybe that's why you came tonight. That's why I would come, but so you can sample. Sample the goodness of their products.
- [31:17]
Nikki Russ Federman
And the recipe is in the cook recipe, should you choose to want to.
- [31:21]
Ibby Owens
Make black and white. What is it like a black and white caviar?
- [31:23]
Nikki Russ Federman
Oh, the black and white latke. Black and white latke in the book. So we. I have to find it. Oh, here. There it is.
- [31:31]
Ibby Owens
Look at how cute this is.
- [31:34]
Nikki Russ Federman
And it's delicious. Caviar and creme fraiche on the latke. And in the book, we used to call it caviar lovers black and white. And then I was with a friend at the cafe and he was eating it, and he said, isn't this a black and white latke? I thought, oh, yeah, that makes a lot more sense. Because caviar lovers, black and white the servers, nobody really knew what that was. And so we even had the servers walk around with, like, a little picture in case I just know what it looked like. So this is a lot more obvious. But it didn't make it in time to be in the book.
- [32:07]
Ibby Owens
Do you, either of you, what are your favorite either dishes here or just things that you sell at Us and Daughters?
- [32:14]
Josh Russ Tupper
So that's a tough question, right? When we get asked, like, what's your favorite salmon? You know, it's a beauty contest, and every day something could be more beautiful than the other. So it's our job to taste and love everything and make sure everything is right. But we do have favorites at the cafe. One of my favorites is the kasha varnishkis, which is funny. Many of you.
- [32:39]
Nikki Russ Federman
Wait, why is it funny?
- [32:40]
Josh Russ Tupper
Because kasha varnishkis is not thought of as, oh, my God, that's the most delicious thing on the menu. And it's like my go to. And you all probably remember your grandmother's kasha and enjoyed every second of it, but it was probably not very good. However, that was not nearly as challenging as the matzo braai that we'd have to take off the menu. And then at the store, I think simplicity. I'm a real fan of simplicity. A toasted buttered biali with pastrami smoked salmon is one of my favorite bites.
- [33:14]
Ibby Owens
We are all getting hungry. How about you?
- [33:16]
Josh Russ Tupper
Why is the matzo bro off the menu?
- [33:20]
Nikki Russ Federman
This is a flashpoint. You would. You would be surprised that the most simple recipe ended up being the most, like, controversial at the cafe when we opened it. Because everyone grew up eating a different version of matzo brei. And everyone Has a memory, you know, of eating it once a year, probably. And so we have a delicious recipe, but it could never match up with people's taste memory. And so we opened this restaurant, you know, we're worried about a thousand things. I never saw it coming. That matzo braai was going to be the big, you know, challenge. But, yeah, we got to the point where we were. We instructed the servers to ask guests how they wanted the matzo braai made, which is, if you're running a restaurant, this is a terrible thing to do. So now it's. You can all get it, but you just have to ask for it. So it's like if, you know, you know, lots of bride.
- [34:19]
Ibby Owens
Look at us. We're in the know, you guys, But.
- [34:21]
Josh Russ Tupper
But it's your way to make it. It's our way.
- [34:23]
Nikki Russ Federman
Yes.
- [34:24]
Josh Russ Tupper
Don't expect to like it.
- [34:27]
Nikki Russ Federman
My favorite. Yeah, my favorite in the book is maybe surprising because we. I was just telling you about appetizing. You know, it's fish and dairy. But actually, my favorite recipe in the book is a meat dish, which is Aunt Ida's stuffed cabbage.
- [34:43]
Ibby Owens
Yes.
- [34:43]
Nikki Russ Federman
Aunt Ida was the middle of the three Russ daughters. Our grandmother was the youngest, and she was the rebel who broke away from the family and went off and did her own thing. But I, growing up, I would go and when the three daughters were still alive, and I'd go out to Long island and just sit at the table and watch these three sisters in their moo moos, you know, eating stuffed cabbage. Just. They were the, like, the golden girls had nothing on the Russ daughters. And she made this fabulous stuffed cabbage. But of course, she passed away without writing it down. And I wanted Ida to somehow figure into the book. And I. So I set out to try to recreate her stuffed cabbage. So I got ahold of her chef.
- [35:29]
Josh Russ Tupper
The chef that Nikki is.
- [35:31]
Nikki Russ Federman
So I got a hold of her son Marty, who's now in his 80s in California, and, you know, had him. You know, he was trying to remember. And then I went to the American Jewish Historical Society downtown, and they have a collection of historic cookbooks. So I was going through all these like. Like the Hadassah ladies of Rochester from 1952, you know, and finding these kind of really old school stuffed cabbage recipes and then trying to match those two things. And then I would make it. Make a version and I ship it to California. And then Marty would be on the phone with me while he was eating it, and then he would give me notes. You know, oh, you need a little bit more tang. You know, maybe do you know, a different raisin? Like, and then I would make it again. I'd ship it to him. This one. We went back and forth, you know, multiple times. My kids started out, like, loving the stuffed cabbage, and now they're like, no more stuffed cabbage. But I think the day when Marty, you know, the last shimmer that I sent him and he ate it and he said, this reminds me of my mother, I thought, okay, we got it. And that's so I'm emotionally attached to that recipe. And it's delicious, too.
- [36:41]
Ibby Owens
I just have one more question, which is, aside from buying the book, which, by the way, is the perfect. How do you modernize? You, like, answered the question I asked before you made this book, which is like the perfect answer. But aside from buying the book and going down to eat, what can we all do to make sure that Rest and Daughters is around for the next hundred years? How can we support and make sure that this tradition carries on?
- [37:04]
Nikki Russ Federman
Oh, wow. I think if is remembering. I mean, as much as, you know, we can. You can order online and we'll deliver it to you. And we ship around the country just remembering the importance of place and storefronts and coming and visiting us in person if you can, and sort of sharing this tradition, whether it's with, you know, the next generation or you're thinking of someone and you want to send them a gift. I think we live now. You can pretty much get anything you want anywhere at any time, you know, with a click.
- [37:39]
Ibby Owens
And.
- [37:39]
Nikki Russ Federman
And I think there are few things like foods and especially foods that are rooted in place that are still, you know, unique and evoke a lot. And so to just keep that in mind as you, you know, help to share it. And we hope we can wrangle one of our kids to do this. So hopefully there'll be a fifth generation.
- [38:03]
Josh Russ Tupper
Yeah. The big challenge was we see now is we're turning into a place, a reality that is less and less in person interactions. And I think Russ and Daughters promotes, we hope to continue that in person interaction. So come into the store and buy whatever, something small, but be there and share that experience and realize the importance of being in person, like having that interaction in real life.
- [38:35]
Ibby Owens
Amazing. And look at how great they're all in real life today.
- [38:37]
Nikki Russ Federman
This is amazing.
- [38:39]
Ibby Owens
So this is the prime audience. Well, thank you so much for coming on the podcast.
- [38:42]
Nikki Russ Federman
Thank you, thank you.
- [38:45]
Ibby Owens
Thank you for listening to Totally Booked with Zibi, formerly Moms don't have Time to Read Books. If you loved the show, tell a friend. Leave a review. Follow me on Instagram Ibby Owens and Spread the Word. Thanks so much. Oh, and buy the books.
- [39:07]
Josh Russ Tupper
This holiday season. Capital One reminds you to give yourself the gift of 1.5% cash back with the Capital One Quicksilver Card. Can I earn 1.5% cash back on birds? Birds? What if you sent your true love two turtledoves plus a partridge and a pear tree? Sure, but why would anyone want that? The song was very convincing. Earn 1.5% cash back on all your holiday purchases with the Capital One Quicksilver Card.
- [39:32]
Nikki Russ Federman
What's in your wallet? Terms apply. See capitalone.com for details. VRBO makes it easy to claim your.
- [39:40]
Ibby Owens
Dream summer spot with early booking deals from homes with pools to poolside loungers. When you book a vrbo, you don't.
- [39:46]
Nikki Russ Federman
Have to reserve any loungers.
- [39:48]
Ibby Owens
They're all yours.
- [39:50]
Nikki Russ Federman
Get that early Booking deal@vrbo.com VRBO makes.
- [39:54]
Ibby Owens
It easy to claim your dream summer spot with early booking deals from homes with pools to poolside loungers. When you book a vrbo, you don't.
- [40:01]
Nikki Russ Federman
Have to reserve any loungers.
- [40:03]
Ibby Owens
They're all yours.
- [40:05]
Nikki Russ Federman
Get that early booking deal@vrbo.com.