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Trading Secrets
217. Daria Berenato: WWE Superstar breaks down the business behind professional wrestling and MMA, building the Sonya Deville persona, and monetizing outside of the franchise in real estate
00:53:29
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- [00:00]
Jason Tardick
Foreign.
- [00:12]
Daria Baronado
Welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets. I'm your host Jason Tardick and welcome to the pre market trading segment. I'm just going to tell you a little bit about our guest today. One quick financial update and something going on in my personal life before we ring in the bell. Now before you do anything, please, please go check us out on YouTube. Just put in Jason Tardick. You could see the whole episode there. Make sure you follow us on Instagram and wherever you're listening to this right now, please just hit that subscribe button. It helps us out tremendously if you give us five stars as well and just let us know, you know, who you think we should have on or a theme we should cover. That would be great as well. But let's get into this episode. We have the one and only Daria Baronado on now. She is known as Sonya deville in the wwe. But it's so fascinating to hear about the, the acting, the, the actual physical intensity, how she got to where she is, the money behind the industry. And there's one thing about this WWE Superstar that no other WWE Superstar has come out and done before. And you're going to hear all about it on this episode. Lot of Trading secrets here. Now, one quick financial tip I want to give you. Make sure that you are paying very close attention to the credit cards you have, the annual fees you have, and the benefits. This is a great time to do it. If you're paying an annual fee, make sure that you know when your credit card renews so you can make a decision if that credit card is best for you or not. And make sure you understand the benefits that come with it. Because in today's day and age with how competitive the credit card marketplace is, for those people that pay on time, they're handsomely rewarded in benefits. And the benefits, if all used, will typically outweigh the actual cost. For example, I have the American Express Platinum card. The annual fee is $695. That is a lot. But the benefits that I get in that I use on an annual basis are well over two times that annual fee. So it makes sense to do so now if you're a traveler like me. Here are some of the best credit cards. The Chase Sapphire Preferred, the Amex Platinum, the Capital One Venture, the Chase Sapphire Reserve, American Express Gold Card and and World of Hyatt Credit Card. Those are the top six from all the research I've done. If you are a traveler, but depending on where you spend your money, there's going to be the Right. Credit card for you. And I always recommend going to the points guy. And yes, you better believe it. The points guy will be on this podcast very shortly. Quick update from my personal life. I am doing this intro in Buffalo, New York right now. I was here for the Buffalo Bills game this past week, weekend. It was such a blast to be here. It's playoff time. This is what we live for and this is what I have lived for for years. The Buffalo Bills have never won, but it's been such a pleasure being here and we talk a lot about business on this podcast. Right? I have been here with Geico now at Games and now Pepcid complete. So it is so cool when you can merge in work and also your love and passion in life. And that has just been fantastic. And just a little update from my personal life. We just recorded the jta. It's just intense and there's a lot, I feel like there's a lot happening in my life and there's a lot of been learning about lately and it's just interesting, you know. All I got to say, a big piece of advice I have out there is just trust your gut, trust your intuition. If something looks like 1, 1, and it's very obvious it equals 2, but maybe like your heart is telling you no, the one plus one might equal three, actually. But your head and your gut are like, no, one plus one must equal two. Trust your gut. Trust your gut. That note, enough of the gut talk. Let's ring in the bell with one of the coolest episodes. One of the most interesting people that I think you're gonna learn a lot from. Sonya deville.
- [04:05]
Jason Tardick
Welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets. Today we are joined by professional wrestler, mixed martial artist, and former WWE Women's Tag team champion, where she performs under the ring. Sonya deville. Daria Baronado. Daria rose to prominence as a Contestant in the 2015 season of WWE Tough Enough. Following her elimination, she signed a contract with the WWE, where she then performed under the WWE's development brand, NXT, before moving to the main roster. She has spent the better part of her last eight years making her mark in WWE's Raw and Slow Smackdown brands. One of her biggest moments might have been in 2015, but she came out as the WWE's first openly gay female wrestler in an episode of Tough Enough, and she is now married to her wife, Toni, earlier this year. Daria, thank you so much for being on Trading Secrets.
- [05:02]
Sonya Deville
Wow, that was a very impressive intro. Thanks for having me on.
- [05:07]
Jason Tardick
Absolutely. And this is, you know A little near and dear to my heart because I have a big WWE fan.
- [05:13]
Sonya Deville
Are you?
- [05:13]
Jason Tardick
Oh, big time since day one.
- [05:15]
Sonya Deville
I love way.
- [05:17]
Jason Tardick
Oh yeah, I love it. And I had. I had the Bella Twins on yes. And it's been. It's been so much fun just following everything and still staying tied to it. So congratulations on all your success.
- [05:28]
Sonya Deville
Thank you. Have you been to a show in recent years?
- [05:31]
Jason Tardick
So I run a talent management agency and I do content creation myself. So I partnered with that for WrestleMania in Tampa, and then I was out WrestleMania in LA.
- [05:41]
Sonya Deville
Oh, cool. All right, well, we'll have to get you out to another show soon.
- [05:45]
Jason Tardick
Absolutely. And then we've also had Titus O'Neal on this podcast now.
- [05:49]
Sonya Deville
He's great.
- [05:50]
Jason Tardick
He's the best. He's the best.
- [05:52]
Sonya Deville
He's the best.
- [05:52]
Jason Tardick
We went into a lot of his childhood and a lot of his traumas that led him to the wwe. But where with your episode is going to be like a little different. Right. So I think first and foremost, we definitely never had anyone with MMA background. And so you began training at, it looks like the age of 16. And so I'm curious what. Listen to one of your other podcasts and you talked a little bit about the training process and how you were involved in sports and soccer and lacrosse, but you wanted something that could go above and beyond high school and that you could see a career. I'm not sure that many 16 year olds out there are like, you know, what is going to be mma? So I'm curious, why did you think MMA would be the answer for long term professional growth?
- [06:40]
Sonya Deville
Yeah, I don't know if I was, like, naive or just like I knew something before I knew something, but I. I don't know, I saw a path in it. It was. This was obviously pre Ronda Rousey, but there was girls in MMA making waves to a degree. Prior to them being allowed in the ufc, they were fighting in Elite FC and Strikeforce. And I, I was like, fascinated by it. I was like, oh, my God. I always loved being active. I loved being an athlete. But the sports I was playing, I was like, mediocre at subpar at best. So I was like, okay, I'm not going to college for these things. I'm not going to pursue professional sports in this way. But I still want. I wanted to be active. And so I was like, oh, women's mma, I could fight. I'm a fighter. And I just felt like there was something to be made out of it. I always was a hustler and I always was very career driven and, you know, passion driven. I was in high school, hating school and wanting to graduate so I can, like, move on to the real world. And that's kind of just always where my mind was at. And so when I saw, like, Gina Carano fighting and Chris Cyborg and they were just these badass females just, you know, taking names and traveling all over the world, training, and I kind of followed them through. Back then, it was just Facebook, really, and just like followed their journey. And I was like, I want. I think I can do this. I want to do this.
- [07:55]
Jason Tardick
Yeah, that's pretty cool. Now we know the NMA world, at least we've explored it a little bit on this podcast, that the prize pools are increasing substantially. But in general, the prize pools are relatively small when you compare to other professional sports at pay per views with that magnitude. So in a career from, you know, it looks like you had three fights and you're two in one. Like, can you make money early on in mma or are you spending more than you're making because of coaching? Like, what do the financials look like early on in the sport?
- [08:25]
Sonya Deville
No, you're broke until you make it. And it's like, even now, it's like it's getting better, but it's like, unless you like the Ronda rouseys, the Conor McGregor's are making the money. The people that understand the value in like, branding and really making a name for yourself, obviously you have to be an incredible athlete and you have to be good at what you're doing. But they also understood the other side of the coin, which was like, you need a brand, you need people to want to come see you fight. Not just because you're a good technical fighter, but also there's an entertainment value and an entertainment factor, which is so fascinating because you see that in MMA now. But of course, that's always been the case in wwe. And so there's so many crossovers that make sense for, I think, pretty much everything. You know, with content creation. Like, there's gotta be something about you that draws me to your page, not just giving me great information. I want to. Want to watch you. And so I think, yeah, money is getting better. But when you're starting out in MMA and you're an amateur, there's is no money to be made. I mean, I was, I got like, I think $400 for my first fight, a couple hundred bucks for the second one. You get like a small percentage of ticket sales depending on the promoter. So I was bartending the entire time. It's not a career until you really, you know, make it big. And a lot of people still in the UFC work another job. So, yeah, I think it's. It's one of those things if you're the top 10% and you're killing it, you're killing it, but it's a little bit of feast or famine.
- [09:47]
Jason Tardick
Yeah, I mean, it is interesting to hear about the dichotomy between entertainment like in WWE versus the actual. I guess. I guess you would call it the sport of. Of. Of mma. And what's interesting is WWE has been so ahead of its time as branding individuals to become entertainers. And I think athletes have been so behind their time, only focusing on their sport, and. And now you're actually starting to see this crazy switch where individuals will brand from college to professional sports and they're becoming bigger than the actual sport they're playing. Or you're seeing people that were fourth liners that never got any time, but have this crazy personality that's entertaining, make more money than some of the starters with brand opportunities. Question I have for you as a former WWE Tag Team champion and all the success you've had. When you were fighting an MMA and you saw 400 bucks, you're getting paid, what was your vision? Then? We see where you've gone, we see what you're doing, and we have a good idea of your trajectory. But, like, where was your professional vision that how were you going to make money in a sport that you were making 400 bucks? What was the thought process?
- [10:55]
Sonya Deville
So, two things. I was out in LA training mma, and I've always wanted to be an actress. So I was like, I want to be an actress, and I want to be an MMA fighter. So my goal with MMA was to get to the ufc, to be a woman in the ufc, to be the Ronda Rousey, to be the next Ronda Rousey, and to just take over. I was like, I'm gonna make a name for myself. But simultaneously, I was pursuing this path of hosting and television and film. And so it didn't matter to me kind of what took off first. I was always wanting to do both. And so I was like, I'm gonna bartend, and I'm gonna hustle until something works out. And, you know, I. I have a really strong sense of, like, faith, and I think everything happens for a reason, and I have a really strong belief in that. And I think if you put in the right work and you're doing, like, the tangible, everyday things that are leading to your bigger Goal. Things will come, right? So it's like, I never said no to anything in L. You know how it is in la. I was, like, bartending. I'd meet this person, they'd be like, oh, do you want to come on this podcast? Do you want to try hosting on this? And, like, one thing just led to another, and next thing you know, I was hosting on AfterBuzz TV, which is owned by Maria Menounos, former E News host. And so I became great friends with her and her husband. And they called me one day and they were like, what do you think about wwe? And I was like, oh, like fake fighting? And they were like, no, no, no, it's not like that. You gotta check it out. And I was like, all right, let me see what it's all about. And so I did my research. I didn't grow up watching wrestling, and I fell in love. And I was like, oh, my gosh. Nobody told me that the two passions I already had were, you know, culminating in this world that I had no idea about. And so when I watched WWE and a couple episodes, total divas and everything, I was like, oh, that's where I want to be.
- [12:39]
Jason Tardick
I love it. It's wild how just one opportunity leads to the next. Leads to the next. It's. There is no blueprint in today's world. It's like a definition of a mosaic. You. You go fighting mma, you go two in one. I heard the story on a podcast. You told about your last story. You're put to sleep, knocked out. All of a sudden, it's you getting knocked out on an MMA floor in la. That leads you to become a podcast host, which then leads you to become connected with people for E News, which gets you then on Toughen Up. So Toughen up is the reality show or competitive show. I should. We should call it.
- [13:11]
Sonya Deville
I have to correct you. I was never knocked out.
- [13:14]
Jason Tardick
You were on your podcast. I heard you said you were put to sleep.
- [13:18]
Sonya Deville
I think you're combining two stories. So I was. I was put to sleep when I was 16, and I first started in my. In my gym, in a competition, and then I came back later that night and won first place against the kid that put me to sleep.
- [13:31]
Jason Tardick
Hell, yeah.
- [13:32]
Sonya Deville
So that's a good one. But then my. My last fight was a split decision loss.
- [13:37]
Jason Tardick
Okay.
- [13:38]
Sonya Deville
I only lost in MMA was split decision loss. I. I have to. I have to protect my. My ego there.
- [13:45]
Jason Tardick
Protect the ego. Get the facts correct. All right, I'm glad you fact checked me there, but go ahead. But it's, it's, it's that, it's that experience that leads you to, of all things, hosting, which then, of all things, leads you to WWE's Tough Enough show, which I think is so interesting in today's world. I think people that get stuck in their careers get so focused on, like, Ladder, and it's not Ladder, it's going to be a mosaic. But Tough Enough calls you. What's the casting process look like for something like that?
- [14:10]
Sonya Deville
So Maria and Kevin call me and they're like, would you do this thing? Tough Enough? And I'm like, oh, it's a competition show. Like, hell yeah. Like, that's right up my alley. And they had asked Maria to do it, and Maria was like, I don't want to wrestle. Like, no, I don't want to get beat up. I don't want to do all this, but I have the perfect girl. And so she convinced them to do a Zoom interview with me. And so I did the Zoom interview and they were very honest with me on the phone. They were like, listen, we have like 11,000 people that tried out for this. We'll give you a call if we think it fits, but we're not going to force it, whatever. And I was like, no, totally, I understand. And so I didn't think anything of it and I didn't think I was gonna get a call. And so then weeks went by and finally I get a phone call and they're like, hey, they loved your interview and they'd love to fly you out for the physical portion of the tryout. And I was like, oh, fly me where? And they were like, we're gonna fly you to Orlando. And I was like, broke, living in la, supporting myself on bartender tips, really? And I was like, oh, you're just gonna fly me to Orlando. And so I had my MMA coaches, like, put me through, like, crazy hell week training to prep me for whatever this tryout had to bring. And yeah, I, I got there, I did a. I think it's like a four day tryout. It consists of, like, running the ropes, learning how to take a back bump, a lot of cardio inducive things. They, they really just want to see.
- [15:28]
Jason Tardick
Like, what's a back bump?
- [15:30]
Sonya Deville
Oh, it's purposely falling on your back and smacking the mat as hard as you can. So it's everything unnatural to the human body. Like, you know, in mma, you try not to fall over or get knocked down. But ob. There's a certain amount of choreography that goes into wwe. It's more Like, I always tell people, I'm like, you have to be, like a gymnast. You have to be a fighter. You have to be an actor. You have to be a live performer. There's so much that goes into it that you can't appreciate unless you watch it and you go to a show. Yeah. So I'm doing all this crazy stuff, and luckily I was in great shape, so that was great. I killed it. But then we got to the other portion of the trial, which was like the interview portion, and then we had to cut a promo, which, in acting would be like a monologue, but, like, you just have to, like, off the cuff, like, come up with a promo and act like you're a character already in the wwe. And so all of that was, like, very new to me in the sense of, like, being a WWE Superstar. And my knowledge of the world was so new. And so I was like, oh, my gosh. And then, yeah, I went through the trial and they were like, you got on the show. It was 13 people out of 11,000.
- [16:39]
Jason Tardick
Unbelievable.
- [16:41]
Daria Baronado
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- [17:46]
Jason Tardick
Let's back up to 13 people out of 11,000. There are people listening to this podcast that will be stepping into interviews where they're going against four people. There will be people that are stepping into dates in which they get nervous. 11,000 people. And you do that interview. What do you think you did during that interview to differentiate where they said, we want to go and take you through the physical test, because 13 out of 11,000 are quite the odds, I think.
- [18:10]
Sonya Deville
I was just so obliviously organic. I was just me. And I really didn't understand the magnitude of what I was doing in the moment. I was 20 years old, super passionate, super motivated, and I just was like, I have nothing to give you but me. And there was times, like, throughout the tryout, where I was, like, looking around at the other girls, and a lot of them were like, bikini models, swimsuit models. I didn't fit in by any means. I was this Jersey girl that moved herself to LA to try to make it as a fighter. I was rough around the edges and I. I really didn't think I was going to get on the show, but I knew I was a good athlete. I knew I had something different to offer. And I was like, well, if these differences are what they're looking for, then hell yeah, I'm going to get this. But it's just like, what cup of tea do they want? And it ended up being in a time where they were trying to really legitimize the women's division and bring in more athletes and more legit fighters and. And go in that direction. So I guess timing is everything. But with anything you do, like, you got to just blindly believe in yourself, because no one's going to believe in you until you believe in you. So it's like one of those things where ignorance is bliss sometimes.
- [19:23]
Jason Tardick
I love it. I know through hosting auditions or castings or even through reality TV auditions, there were some obscure questions that I was asked. Some I'll never forget. In that process, can you remember, like, just a ridiculous question or something that was an outlier that stuck with you?
- [19:40]
Sonya Deville
Well, yeah. Triple H, no big deal. Asked me if I was in a relationship, which seemingly is like a very easy, normal question on a reality show. But I wasn't out at the time. I was still in the closet. And I had a longtime girlfriend back in la. And so I, like, froze. And if you go back and watch the clip, I laugh at myself now. Cause I'm like, oh, my God. I was so, like, did not know what to say and did not expect that question. And so I got nervous and I was like, yeah, I have a girlfriend, whatever. And I just, like, stuttered for five seconds. And then he was like, did you just come out? And I was like, nobody knows this yet. And then it ended up being a clip that went viral for years to come and kind of followed me through the beginning of my career. And it ended up being a great Thing, I was very nervous at first, and I was like, what the hell did I just do? Was that a mistake? Like, I really was unsure of myself at that point. I was 20 years old and only open to, like, my mom and my dad. So that was very scary. But it turned out to be a great thing. And I think it was a voice for a lot of people that were going through the same thing at the time.
- [20:43]
Jason Tardick
So, yeah, it's amazing. I think it's just another example of, like, when you can break your walls down and showcase vulnerability. The amount of connection it could create and opportunity and empowerment is huge. It's exciting. And I'm.
- [20:57]
Sonya Deville
Which I'm like, so not good at. So kind of just. I had no choice. I either was going to lie or tell the truth. So, yeah, it just happened. So weird.
- [21:08]
Jason Tardick
I guess when Triple H is staring you down, you just tell them the truth. It's simple to do. I would do the same.
- [21:13]
Sonya Deville
And then I'm thinking, like, if I lie right now on national television, then I go home to my girlfriend. She's like, why'd you say you were single? Because the question was like, are you in a relationship? So I either had to say it or not say it.
- [21:22]
Jason Tardick
Yeah, I love it. Okay. I think about wwe and I also, in my head, I just kind of compare it to, like, a weird dotted line to Broadway. The one thing I think about Broadway that is so impressive is not only are these people acting, not only are they dancing at the highest level, not are they singing at the highest level, they're doing it live on stage. It's like the culmination of all three, in which one individual within space of art or entertainment can make a whole career out of one of those. I find that the same in wwe. There's entertainment, like you said, there's acting, there's your promo. There's also the physical element of all those. The acting, the. The mic work, the promos, the actual fighting, which for you was the hardest.
- [22:06]
Sonya Deville
So that's a tough question. So when I first got there, the physicality came fairly natural. I felt like having the fight background and the experience in sports in general definitely helped. It helped with footwork. It helped with, like, you know, just knowing how to move your body in ways that looked athletic or physically. You know, how physical.
- [22:27]
Jason Tardick
And I'm sorry to interrupt, but my friend just. I don't want you to go down the line to me to forget this. Cause it's so important. And everyone thinks wwe and the biggest word they'll say is fake. But they're like, there's. There's some going on. I've been to matches where like literally a guy, I'll never forget this. I was live. There's LA WrestleMania cage match. The guy is just gushing blood everywhere. They did something with tv. Guy comes in and they staple his head so he finishes the match. And they didn't show that on tv. How physical is it actually compared to the conception that people just use the word fake?
- [23:03]
Sonya Deville
I tell everyone I. I am like the perfect example. I did not come from wrestling, I did not grow up watching wrestling. And now I've been here for 10 years and it's a dream come true. And it's the greatest industry in the world. I have been more injured in pro wrestling than my six years of training and fighting mixed martial arts. Not to say you can't get severely injured in both. Of course you can. But with mma, it's like the most common injuries are going to be, you know, black eyes, bloody noses, you know, bumps and bruises. Right. For the most part in pro wrestling, a common injury is, you know, torn acl or do you do a moonsault off the top and you land short and you land on your neck and you hurt your neck. A lot of spine, a lot of like. There's so much physicality that goes into it, obviously. We spend so much time and effort practicing it and getting it down so that we do it in a way that we cannot get injured. But I tore my ACL last year. Have been stitched on this eyebrow and this eyebrow from being cut open. Never in mma, only in professional wrestling. So I always tell the haters out there, I'm like, trust me, I've done both. WWE is a very, very physical sport.
- [24:16]
Jason Tardick
Interesting. Okay, so that. So the physical breakdown came natural for you, which was the hardest.
- [24:22]
Sonya Deville
So the promo at first was difficult. Yes. I had acting experience and I always knew I could get there, but it was. Finding a character was difficult for me because it was like, I just, I was just so simple minded. I was like, I am who I am. Like, I'm. I'm an MMA fighter. I'm a badass. And I didn't know how to like, translate that to the audience or what to show them more than what I was. I was like, I just am what I am. Yeah, I think it was just a little bit simple minded. And so it took years of like, really developing my character. Who do I want to be? Because the cool thing about WWE is you don't have to be who you are in real Life. You can be whoever you want to be, whoever you think the fans are going to connect with, whoever you think the audience can gravitate towards and understand or hate and boo. So it's like you kind of get to, like, create, which became my favorite part and now is probably one of my favorite things in wrestling.
- [25:16]
Jason Tardick
Awesome. So cool. Well, you finish 11th in tough enough to go on tough enough and to finish 11th. Is there any type of payment for something like that?
- [25:24]
Sonya Deville
You get paid while you're on the show weekly. I don't remember exactly what it was. I want to say like a thousand bucks a week or something while you're there, but then, like, once you're gone, you're gone. So I went, like, I. I flew home the day, got eliminated, and then I went back to training wrestling the next day. I had called WWE and said, where can I train professional wrestling in la? And they were like, they gave me a school. I went to the school, and that's where I trained every single day. While I was like, blowing up WWE's email, like, hire me. Hire me. But they had told me as soon as I got eliminated, like, we're gonna hire you. But I didn't believe them. I was like, no way. I was like, I'm gonna fly back home. I'm going to go back to bartending and go back to reality, and the dream is going to be over. The thing that I just fell in love with is going to be over. And so I was adamant about staying on top of learning how to wrestle and staying on top of them to hire me. And sure enough, like, three months later.
- [26:18]
Jason Tardick
I got the call for those training schools. Is WWE put them in or do you have to pay for them? And if so, you have to pay for them. Like, what is a training school for?
- [26:27]
Sonya Deville
We have. The wwe, has the WWE Performance Center. So once you're with wwe, under their umbrella, you go to nxt, which is our developmental brand, and you train at the Performance center in Orlando. And that's the only place that you train when you're in wwe. Unless, like, your friend has a ring or, you know, someone with a ring, you can go get in some extra reps, that's fine, too. But if you're not in wwe, there's just independent wrestling schools all over the country of, you know, people wrestling on different circuits. And so they knew Brian Kendrick, who had worked for WWE previously. He had a school in la, so they were friendly with him. So they kind of like sent me there. I think they. They may have paid for it for the first couple weeks, like, because. Because they knew they were going to hire me. So then they called me back and they were like, okay, fly to Orlando. I actually had to do another tryout. They made me do another whole tryout even though I had already tried out for tough enough.
- [27:19]
Jason Tardick
Wow, okay, so you do tough enough, you train for a little bit, you then do another tryout and then you get signed as a wwe and X T, you're not signed as a Superstar. You have to actually work up to get the title Superstar. Correct.
- [27:33]
Sonya Deville
So you're a Superstar. You're just. You're on NXT in the developmental brand, trying to make it one day to Monday Night Raw or Smackdown. But now NXT has evolved. This was back 10 years ago. NXT has now evolved to like being a brand of its own. NXT debuting on CW Monday Night Raw is going to Netflix January and smackdown's going to usa. So all three shows are on major, major platforms and millions are watching around the world. So yeah, back when I was there, it was a little bit different. It was a little bit more of like strictly developmental. You go there to learn how to wrestle and then from there you either get fired or you move up to raw or smackdown.
- [28:16]
Jason Tardick
Okay, so you were making 400 bucks fighting in MMA, you get side with NXT. How does it compare?
- [28:23]
Sonya Deville
Well, it was a steady paycheck. It was my first salary job, so I was like so excited. I thought I was rich. I was like going from bartending, making like a hundred dollars in tips a night to a steady paycheck. To me was like the end all, be all. I thought. I like made it so I would have signed any contract they gave me. Yeah, I was pretty stoked you're spending money, right?
- [28:45]
Daria Baronado
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- [29:46]
Jason Tardick
Contracts work like a salary? Like, you get an annual, like, payment, or is it. You get paid per show? Like, what's the structure of.
- [29:53]
Sonya Deville
Yeah, it's annual.
- [29:54]
Jason Tardick
Okay. So you get locked in for a year.
- [29:57]
Sonya Deville
Yeah.
- [29:58]
Jason Tardick
Okay. And then, then you'll have the option, like a renewal option or a promotion option, something like that.
- [30:03]
Sonya Deville
Yeah, I mean, they can cut you within that contract. They can give you a raise. They can do whatever they want. You can do whatever.
- [30:11]
Jason Tardick
Okay, the, the notes I have here is that April 17, you're signed as an superstar, and then in November 2017. So that's literally like five, six months later, you're signed to the WWE brand. That feels like a very, very fast track.
- [30:28]
Sonya Deville
No.
- [30:29]
Jason Tardick
Is that incorrect?
- [30:30]
Sonya Deville
Yeah. So I signed with NXT in September of 2015.
- [30:35]
Jason Tardick
Okay.
- [30:36]
Sonya Deville
And then November of 2017, I debuted on Monday Night Raw.
- [30:41]
Jason Tardick
Okay. So within that two year time period, what specifically are Triple H and the executives of WWE looking for? Or what even analytics connected to, like your Q rating or anything like that? Are they saying, okay, she's good enough, let's bring her up? What does that look like?
- [31:01]
Sonya Deville
I think it's different for everyone because I think timing is the biggest thing in wwe. It's like, what do they need? Do they need a good guy? Do they need a bad guy? Are they looking, you know, like, what? What are they looking for? I was definitely coming up in a time where it was normal to be in developmental for four or five years. So I didn't know how long I was going to be down there. And when I got the call, like, you're going to debut on Monday Night Raw, I was like, what? Like, I was shocked because I was still very novice compared to, you know, all there is to learn in wrestling. I mean, I still feel green. I still feel like I have so much to learn. It's just like a forever evolving business. But I got the call and I was like, wait, what me? But it was at a time where they were really focusing in on, like, legitimizing the women's division. And I think they liked that I had the fight background and I, you know, I knew how to move and throw punches. And so, yeah, I came up in a group with my best friend Mandy and my good friend Paige, and I was. That was it.
- [32:00]
Jason Tardick
Okay. What I'm interested in is when you get that call. If I look at like the minimum contract in the NHL, it's like 750k and I have a buddy who used to be a backup goalie and goalie in the ahl, so whenever he got called to just be like, literally third straight, he wouldn't even have to have a sweat. It was a big day for him because that day, that game, he's paid off that 750k minimum. When you go from NXT to WWE Raw, do they give you a big bump in pay? Is it just for that episode? Does your whole contract change? How does that look?
- [32:33]
Sonya Deville
You get signed on a new contract, It's a main roster contract is what it was considered. And yeah, it's a significant bump. So that day you get the call, you're not only excited to debut on tv, but you're like, oh, my life's about to change to a degree. Crazy.
- [32:47]
Jason Tardick
And I've heard in the, you know, Logan Paul has talked about it in depth, and there's been a lot of wrestlers that have talked about it. It's. It's almost like it's tough to break into the culture because it's such a hard business. Did you find when you went from NXT to WWE Monday Night Raw, like, in the locker room, they're a little tougher on you. It's tough to break in. Are the nerves higher from a career navigation standpoint? Was that a big shock?
- [33:13]
Sonya Deville
I feel like I've always been a people person and I can kind of get along with just about everybody in the locker room at the time. It's so different because, like, when I went, when I got in the locker room, it was like Nikki and Bri Bella, the Bella twins, were still there. Paige was there. Like, a lot of the old school girls were still there. But then you had a lot of fresh faces too, that I knew from my time in nxt because we were down there together. So, like, it was kind of a mix of, like, the old and the new. And, I mean, everyone was great. As cliche as it sounds, it was like a lot of unity because the girls were like, banding together at this point in time specifically to create what then went on to be the women's evolution. We were all kind of like, we're over women having 30 second matches. We're over, you know, we're over the BS and we were all kind of fighting for the same thing. So it kind of, like, unified us in the sense of we all want to be bigger, we all want to be better, and we all want the respect and attention that women deserve. So I felt like there was a lot of unity. I didn't. I didn't think it was tough. It is a specific culture, but I came to NXT when I was 20, so I kind of grew up in it. You know, I'm going to be 31 in, like, two weeks, so, like, I've been here for a decade, so I kind of feel like I came up in the culture. So when you're introduced to the culture in nxt, it kind of preps you for what's to come on Raw and smackdown.
- [34:31]
Daria Baronado
Then you.
- [34:32]
Jason Tardick
You also earn your stripes. Not only a decade into business, but becoming a tag team champion, being featured on big pay per view events. When you get that, it seems like everyone is fighting. I mean, at least trying to, like, read the situation. Everyone's fighting for the Royal rumble, for the WrestleMania, for the championship spotlight. Is that because there's such significance in when that happens for your brand? Or is there also bonuses and incentives? Like, you see some NFL players that got scored that last touchdown of the year because they get paid more? Talk to me about that.
- [35:04]
Sonya Deville
So I think with wwe, the way you. You get to the top of the pay scale is if you put butts and seats, that's how you move up. So whatever you think within your creative wheelhouse, within your creative mind, like, what can you do? What do you have to offer to get you to the top of the card? Because you're at the top of the card, you're at the top of the pay scale, your brand grows. Like, it all goes together. Whatever your thing is, you just need to find it and try to be the best at it and hope that that gets you to the top of the card. I always use the Miz is an example because he's so good at talking, right? He's so good on the mic. And when he grabs the mic, it's like you hate him because he's a bad guy most of the time, but, like, you want to hear what he has to say still. And he's done such a good job of making an amazing career out of that. But then you see guys in the ring that are doing double backflips off the top rope, and you're like, oh, my God. And you're captivated by that. So, like, whatever your thing is, it's your. It's your job along the journey of being a WWE Superstar, to like, figure that out and find it and get to the top of the card, meaning sell tickets.
- [36:09]
Jason Tardick
That's one of the crazy things about the industry. Unlike any industry in the world, it doesn't matter if you're the most liked or the most hated, whether you're the booed the loudest or cheered on the loudest. Those that are considered, I believe you guys refer to it as the heel. The person who is actually booed the most could be considered the most successful individual and brand in the franchise. That's correct, right?
- [36:33]
Sonya Deville
Yeah. Yeah.
- [36:34]
Jason Tardick
Now, does that knowing that, like, being the bad guy actually can help your business? Does it still mentally work against you when you have the entire crowd, like, literally speaking poorly of you and hating you? Like, do. Do the athletes, do the entertainers in the sport? Do they hate that?
- [36:52]
Sonya Deville
No. I mean, I can't speak for everybody, but I've been a bad guy my entire career here, and I love it. I, like, take. You take pride in it because we're so. Can I think we're so used to it that we know that when we're getting loud booze, like, we just killed it, like we did exactly what we were supposed to do. Because it's like, if. If I go out there with you and you're a good guy and I'm a bad guy and I don't get booed, you might not get cheered. That like, the more they, the more they can love you.
- [37:21]
Jason Tardick
Okay?
- [37:22]
Sonya Deville
They don't hate me. If they're lukewarm on me and they watch you beat me up, they might be lukewarm on you. Like, you know what I mean? They don't know who to pick. But if they, if they know they have to hate me, and maybe you're newer to the scene by default, they're going to like you because they want to see me get my ass kicked. So it's like once you get that emotion out of the crowd, whether it's yay or boo, you're like, oh, my God, it's working. I did it.
- [37:49]
Jason Tardick
That is so fascinating. I mean, it's just an interesting thing to get like to that. Your job is to have them work either as for you as you can or against you as you can. One question I got for you that is, I think, applicable to anybody within their job. How do you magnify that so you, you clearly have to do something extra, something out of the ordinary. What do you do to amplify the emotions of people, whether it's good or bad? At a next level perspective, it's really.
- [38:19]
Sonya Deville
Been a lot of using real life experience, which I know people do a lot in acting. So I guess it's similar to that where, like, I'll be sitting here some days when I'm, like, thinking about my character pitching a new idea, and I'm like, what do people hate? And it just. Certain mannerisms or ways I say things that I know is so demeaning or demoralizing. I'll just note those things. And even the phrases I say, it's something I say a lot that I got from real life was anytime someone says, let me explain something to you, like, it's demeaning. Like, you're like, yeah. You're, like, telling them they're stupid. Like, let. So I always say, like, let me make something perfectly clear so you can understand it. And it's like, just that one sentence pisses them off because it's. No one likes being talked down to like that. So little things like that. It's really fun for me because you get to, like, pull from real life and create and just, like, I assume, you know, you would in television and film. Yeah.
- [39:19]
Jason Tardick
Wild how, like, you probably have a list of icks, like, all the things that people like, ick. You're like, okay, I gotta nail that tonight.
- [39:26]
Sonya Deville
I got.
- [39:26]
Jason Tardick
Literally, people talk to me about this, though. Like, there's been extensive talk about the whole idea of. Of course, there's. There's scripts, there's plans, there's ideas of what you're supposed to do and how you're supposed to do it. How much can you just improv? Can you just use your creativity and, like, go off the script, do what you're supposed to do or. Or, like, do something outrageous to get the fans going? Like, do you do that often? Is that. Is that the norm or is that irregular?
- [39:51]
Sonya Deville
Yeah, it's. It's changed over the years depending on, you know, who's in charge of your creative at the moment. But, like, Triple H is big on, like, trusting your gut and, like, trusting you to do what you feel is right. And, like, there's certain moments on live television, like, you said, it's live, where only you can feel what would work in that moment. So it's like, you might have something on paper, but something else might happen in the moment. And if something comes to you, listen, you can improv as much as you want, as long as it works. It's when it doesn't work that it might be like, why'd you go out there and say that you're supposed to Say this, you know what I mean? If you have confidence in the moment and you trust yourself and you know it's gonna work, then do it. And you do have that creative liberty.
- [40:33]
Jason Tardick
That's pretty cool.
- [40:34]
Sonya Deville
And that's the fun part too because you, you can't control a live audience. They're gonna do what they do. And there's certain things that you kind of just have to be in the moment for to react naturally and organically off of.
- [40:46]
Jason Tardick
It's a, it's a wild business. It's so cool. The psychology of it.
- [40:50]
Daria Baronado
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- [41:58]
Jason Tardick
And Trading Secrets I see a lot about financials and stuff monetizing outside of the ring. We see Logan Paul do it with prime billion dollar plus company according to many valuations. What are some ways that you can monetize outside just the WWE contract?
- [42:13]
Sonya Deville
I think there's so many different ways. I mean obvious, the obvious way is what you said, building your brand and branding opportunities which a lot of that is offered with WWE as well. With all the brand partnerships that we have doing commercials. I mean there's constantly brand deals. We have a huge deal with C4. So if you get selected to be one of those athletes that's a really cool opportunity. And then obviously television and film with the likes of John Cena and the Rock making that transition obviously in a huge way. I love real estate which is completely unrelated to anything that I, that I Built within wwe. But you know, we're making money right now and eventually one day when I'm 80 years old, I don't want to be getting tossed on my head. I don't think so. And I like real estate because I can control it and it's something that, you know, just over time will help me out.
- [43:00]
Jason Tardick
Give us a small. Because of course, this is a business podcast, entrepreneurship podcast. I'll be happy for just a little longer. Give me a small taste of some of the real estate stuff. Are you doing okay?
- [43:09]
Sonya Deville
I just got done flipping and selling a flip in northern New Jersey. A short term rental in Disney. Two commercial buildings in North Jersey. One of them is three apartments in a storefront. One is two office spaces. And then obviously my primary. And then another long term rental in South Florida.
- [43:32]
Jason Tardick
Amazing. Rocking and rolling. Using that cash flow from the sports payment. Set you up for the long term. You gotta love it. We had a rod on the podcast. He talked about his first contract. The first thing he did was buy an apartment building. It's that type of stuff that creates. Right? Just genius. Okay, I got another question for you. When we dive into careers and industries, one thing people see are the lights. They see the success, they see your million plus followers and they see all the good that comes with it. But with that spotlight, there's also a lot of negative and there's a lot of things that happen behind the scenes that sometimes can be even terrifying. Now, we don't have to get into the details of it by any means, but I saw an article about you having to deal with a stalker who tried to kidnap you, who had this eight month plot, who was a fan. I couldn't believe what I was reading. I couldn't believe it. And so what I was thinking is like, how do I actually make this relevant to the podcast? And what's relevant to the podcast here is there is so much shit that happens behind the lights of what people see just on their TV screen. And I'm curious, how is that something you deal with in the entertainment field and overcome and how big of a challenge has it been for you?
- [44:45]
Sonya Deville
Well, it's one of those things that you never. I laugh because I'm. It's just so ridiculous. And it's still kind of unbelievable that it even happened. What was it, like three or four years ago now? But yeah, it's crazy. I mean, you never think you're gonna be in a situation like that. It's still weird to me looking at the flip side of it. It's still Weird to me if I go to the grocery store and someone that, you know, my local Trader Joe's, there's a guy that works at Trader Joe's, and he's a huge fan. And so he always, like, comes and gives me, like, new trading cards that I have that came out. He's really sweet. But, like, even when that happens, I'm like, oh, wait, really? Like, I'm still surprised when people recognize me. So then to go to the negative side of the coin, when someone watches you on TV and then feels somehow entitled to invade your personal privacy, sending threatening messages to then take it to the next step and break into your home, obviously it's something that nobody can prepare for, whether you're in the spotlight or not in the spotlight. But, yeah, I hate to say you take the good with the bad with a situation like that, because that's obviously something you wouldn't wish on anybody. But it's like, it's just all part of it. I don't love the social media aspect of things. If I had it my way, I would probably not have social media, to be completely honest. I have it because I understand the value of it, and I do like connecting with the fans that are great and lovely, and so I don't also want to take that away from them because of a couple bad eggs. But, yeah, it can be such a toxic place to be sometimes, especially when, you know you're on live TV in front of millions, and, I mean, you could stutter on one word, and it's like, trending all night, and it's like. It's the same way they highlight your victories, they also isolate and highlight your flaws. So it's. I think it's just part of the game. And I've. I've definitely gotten used to it. I don't know that I'll ever be fully okay with it, but it's just part of it.
- [46:38]
Jason Tardick
I commend you for having such a positive sentiment. When something like that happens, you. I don't know that I could be as positive as you.
- [46:44]
Sonya Deville
Yeah, it's like. It is what it is like happens. And just. It's just my. I guess it's just my overall mentality on life is like, good stuff happens and bad stuff happens, and that's kind of always been, like, the pattern. And I think it might be for everybody, but it's like, you're gonna have your ups and you're gonna have your downs, and I'm grateful that I wasn't hurt. Nobody around me was hurt or I Cared about, was hurt. Like, we're good, we're. We're good and life is okay. And so we're moving on. And I'm blessed with, like, so many amazing things. So if that was something that I had to go through, I'm glad it was me and not my loved ones or anyone that I cared about. So, yeah, we move on.
- [47:23]
Jason Tardick
It's a definition, I think, of glass half full or half empty, you know, So I commend you for having such positive.
- [47:29]
Sonya Deville
You know, like, what I think about too is I say I was lucky. And people might take that wrong, but I. I was very lucky because he was stalking me. I. Unbeknownst to me, he was sending me messages for four years. I didn't even know about it. And then he was saying he was going to come in my house and kidnapp me and kill me and all these things, and then he. He did it and then he got caught. So he's in jail, luckily. Where celebrities and people in general struggle with stalkers for years. And because of the way the laws are and because of the way some certain regulations are, you can't even get them arrested because if they don't cross a certain line, you can't get them in trouble. And it's like that, to me, is a more horroring experience than what I went through. Like, yes, it was horrible, but it's like, at least it's taken care of and he's in prison for a long time. Whereas, like, certain celebrities I know are, you know, being stalked for years and years and people are putting weird things in their mailbox or, you know, knocking on their door in the middle of the night or all these things. And it's like, I couldn't imagine having to deal with that consistently.
- [48:32]
Jason Tardick
Yeah, I mean, there's so much room for improvement in that space and holding people accountable in that space. And I think maybe the last takeaway that I'm having is, thankfully, right, you weren't harmed and it all worked out. And through your experience, you put someone who could be extremely dangerous to society and who knows what else you would have done to someone else in prison for a long time. So, again, it's such a great way to look at it, but you share in it. It's been so interesting to learn about your career track from the mma days. From 16 years old, fighting your way to the top as the tag team champion and continuing to fight through some of the adversities, like stalker to ACL injuries and everything in between. I got a quick rapid fire for you and then we'll get you trading secret. So your trading secret will be something that we can't learn from a professor. We can't learn how to TikTok tutorial or anything on social media. Only through what you've been through. So the quick rapid fires, of course can WWE related. And I want you to think about the first wrestler that comes to mind. I promise I won't trap you too hard, but we'll start with a softball. Who is the most entertaining wrestler that you've ever been in the ring with or worked with?
- [49:40]
Sonya Deville
I'm going to go Asuka. Because when she's screaming in Japanese, it's fascinating. And she's one of the best wrestlers that I've ever worked with.
- [49:46]
Jason Tardick
It's amazing to watch her too. Okay, who do you think is the toughest?
- [49:51]
Sonya Deville
Oh, that's a good one.
- [49:53]
Jason Tardick
It could also be someone that you have a fight that you've just seen the way they fight or you see what they do and how they entertain. The toughest.
- [49:59]
Sonya Deville
I'm going to go my. My current tag team partner, member of my faction, Shayna Baszler.
- [50:06]
Jason Tardick
Okay, that's a good one. Who hits the hardest? Like when you actually. Of course it's fake, but when you heal that, you're like, damn, that hurt me. I like that. Great answer. Who do you think is the funniest behind the scenes as the best sense of humor, could literally be a stand up comic.
- [50:22]
Sonya Deville
Oh, Chelsea Green Hands.
- [50:24]
Jason Tardick
Oh, she is. I connected with Chelsea. She's hilarious.
- [50:27]
Sonya Deville
Incredible.
- [50:28]
Jason Tardick
She's unbelievable on stage too. She's great. All right. Who is like someone in the organization that you would want to date, like your best friend. You're like, this person is just such a good person. I would stamp my approval on that person because they're just that great.
- [50:45]
Sonya Deville
Oh, God. None of. None of us. We're all. None of the above. We're all crazy.
- [50:53]
Jason Tardick
Okay, there you go. Honestly, I have more, but I think that's a great way to end it. None of us. Perfect. All right, let's wrap up with your trading secret. So something that someone can learn only through what you've been through from your days of 16. Put the MMA gloves on to wherever you are today. It could be financial, it could be career based, entrepreneurial, but a trading secret that we can only get from you.
- [51:15]
Sonya Deville
Okay. My tried and true always be you. Because everyone else has already taken. And I'm going to elaborate on that because it's so important to me and it's. I think it's the reason why I am where I am today. Like, you can't waste any time trying to fit in a box you're not going to fit in. Like, we were all created so individually, so different for a particular reason. And just because you haven't found your why yet or your thing yet or the thing that you're the master of yet, like, don't give up trying because there's something out there for every single one of us. And it took me years of going through different sports careers and jobs to find what my thing is and my why in life in general. So keep looking because there's something for everyone.
- [51:59]
Jason Tardick
I love that. And I think even through your journey, we know that there are certain systems that try and sit you right in a square. But you quickly said, no, school's not for me. I'm gonna go find something else. And there are so many people that are listening to this. They're in the 30s, the 40s, or 50s that are still in that box. So I think you're a perfect example of don't be in the box other people put you in. Find your own box, do it your way and no other way. We get one shot, we get one leg. So, Aria, thank you so much for being on this episode of Trade Secrets. Where can everyone find everything you have going on?
- [52:32]
Sonya Deville
Well, thank you so much for having me, Jason. I've been a fan of your podcast for a long time. I love your talk about business and everything financial related. It's so cool. You can find me on instagram @sonya DeVille, WWE. Same on Twitter, same on TikTok and yeah. And every Monday on Monday Night Raw.
- [52:50]
Jason Tardick
Every Monday on Monday Night Raw. And whether you're tweeting or you're there live, you're doing anything, you can be loud cheering for her. You could be loud cheering against her. Justy one of the two. And don't be in the middle. That's what we learned here. Tara, thank you so much for being on this episode of Trading Secrets and we look forward to watching Ring.
- [53:08]
Sonya Deville
Thanks, Jason.
- [53:29]
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- [54:30]
Daria Baronado
We're talking a little entrepreneur entrepreneurship here.
- [54:32]
Jason Tardick
With Love is Blind.
- [54:32]
Daria Baronado
So let's talk about how you could.
- [54:34]
Jason Tardick
Start your own business.
- [54:35]
Daria Baronado
If you are selling anything online, literally anything, you have to be using Shopify. Think about Shopify as the brand that all the large corporations could use and now the small businesses can get the legitimacy behind the massive corporation, whether you sell one unit or you sell one million units. So if you're growing into your business, your commerce platform better be ready to sell wherever your customers are scrolling or strolling on the web, in your store, on the feed, wherever it may be. And let me tell you, Shopify is what we use and Shopify is what you should use so you can sign up for your $1 per month trial period. Just go to shopify.com secrets why not start today? Go sell something online. Go to shopify.com/secrets to upgrade your selling today. Shopify.com/secrets.