229. Haley Sacks: Combining her love of entertainment with finance! Mrs. Dow Jones on everything YOU need to know about all aspects of money, enjoying your life, and being consistent

Summary

Podcast Summary: Trading Secrets Episode 229 – Haley Sacks: Combining Her Love of Entertainment with Finance

Introduction

In Episode 229 of Trading Secrets, host Jason Tartick welcomes financial expert and entrepreneur Haley Sacks, widely known as Mrs. Dow Jones, to discuss the intersection of entertainment and finance. The episode delves into Haley's unique journey from the entertainment industry to becoming a prominent financial educator, her strategies for financial literacy, and practical advice for listeners navigating today's volatile financial landscape.

Haley Sacks’ Journey: From Entertainment to Finance

Haley Sacks began her professional career in the entertainment sector, earning a degree in film and working as a page for the legendary David Letterman. Reflecting on her early career, Haley humorously recounts her youthful ambitions and initial struggles:

• [02:17] Haley: “I was skipping Jim to buy bags on eBay with a fake username that then got blocked...”

Despite her passion for pop culture and entertainment, Haley found herself earning minimal wages and recognizing the lack of financial literacy in her life. This realization propelled her transition into finance, driven by the desire to fill the content gap she observed.

• [04:02] Haley: “My biggest financial flaw was just illiteracy. I really lacked the confidence...”

Establishing Mrs. Dow Jones: Building a Financial Brand

After working various jobs, including a stint at Saturday Night Live as a creative social producer, Haley faced a pivotal moment when her job was laid off. This period marked her deep dive into self-education in finance, leading to the creation of her brand, Mrs. Dow Jones. Haley emphasizes the importance of consistency and dedication in building her financial education platform:

• [13:00] Haley: “A year of working, like every day. Did not miss a day. Did not miss a post. Grinding, grinding, grinding.”

Her commitment to daily content creation and leveraging her early experience in entertainment has been instrumental in her success and ability to engage a broad audience.

Financial Strategies and Advice

Throughout the episode, Haley shares actionable financial advice, breaking down complex concepts into relatable terms for her audience.

1. Four-Step Financial Model

   Haley advocates for a simplified, four-step approach to personal finance:

   • [16:32] Haley:
     1. Get Your 401(k) Match: “That's free money.”
     2. Save an Emergency Fund: “Three to six months in a high-yield savings account.”
     3. Pay Off High-Interest Debt: “Any debt above 7% should be tackled first.”
     4. Max Out Tax-Advantaged Accounts: “Utilize Roth IRAs and 401(k)s before investing in taxable brokerages.”

   This model prioritizes financial security and efficient debt management before moving on to more flexible investment strategies.

2. Budgeting Tips

   Haley redefines budgeting as creating a "spending plan," making it less restrictive and more about allocating funds to desired expenses:

   • [22:14] Haley: “If you reframe it and just think about a spending plan, you can actually put more money towards the things that you like.”

   She emphasizes automation in savings to ensure consistent progress towards financial goals.

3. Investment Advice

   Addressing current market volatility, Haley advises against trying to time the market and instead focuses on long-term, consistent investment strategies:

   • [25:30] Haley: “Retirement is a number, not an age.”
   • [27:00] Haley: “You do not want an average life, but you want average returns, 8 to 10%.”

   She recommends low-cost index funds such as VOO (S&P 500) and QQQ (Technology Index) while maintaining a diversified portfolio with a portion in global stocks and bonds for stability.

4. Handling Debt

   Haley supports the avalanche method for debt repayment, prioritizing the highest interest rates to minimize costs:

   • [21:25] Haley: “I'm all about paying off your highest interest rate debt first.”

5. Generational Wealth and Parenting

   For parents aiming to build generational wealth, Haley offers strategies for saving and investing for children’s futures:

   • [19:17] Haley: “Growing generational wealth doesn't require a large principal. Consistency is key.”

   She outlines options like custodial brokerage accounts, custodial Roth IRAs, and 529 plans, emphasizing the importance of starting early with manageable contributions.

Navigating Economic Volatility

Haley discusses the impact of current economic factors such as tariffs and potential recessions on personal finances. She categorizes investors into two types during downturns:

• [45:05] Haley:
  • Type A: Panics and sells investments.
  • Type B: Sees opportunities to buy assets at lower prices.

Her stance encourages listeners to remain calm, continue consistent investing (e.g., dollar-cost averaging), and avoid reactionary decisions based on market fluctuations.

Personal Investment Experiences

Haley shares her own investment successes and failures, highlighting the importance of due diligence and risk management:

• Worst Investment: Investing impulsively in Laird Superfoods without understanding the fundamentals, resulting in significant losses.

• Best Investment: Investing in herself and her business, emphasizing the high returns from personal development and building a strong support team.

• [33:04] Haley: “I'm not a stock picker. I understand Wall Street, and I follow strategies that have worked for high-net-worth individuals.”

Credit and Financial Tools

Haley provides practical tips on managing credit and utilizing financial tools:

• Credit Management: Advocates for keeping oldest credit cards to maintain credit history and improve credit scores.

  • [40:06] Haley: “I have one credit card since 2016. Put a small subscription on it to keep it active.”

• Financial Tools: Recommends her own product, Money Book 2.0, a Google Sheets-based budgeting template that ensures data security and provides a comprehensive financial plan.

Notable Quotes

• Haley Sacks:

  • [04:02] “My biggest financial flaw was just illiteracy. I really lacked the confidence...”
  • [16:32] “Start by getting your 401(k) match. That's free money.”
  • [22:14] “Reframe budgeting as a spending plan to allocate more funds towards what you love.”
  • [25:30] “Retirement is a number, not an age.”
  • [27:00] “Do not want an average life, but average returns, 8 to 10%.”

• Jason Tartick:

  • [14:54] “I want to ask you this before I go into financial tips...”
  • [33:16] “That was my worst one...”

Conclusion and Final Advice

Haley concludes the episode by emphasizing the importance of financial literacy, consistent investment strategies, and the value of investing in oneself. She encourages listeners to take proactive steps in managing their finances, stay informed, and seek reliable sources of financial advice.

• [53:04] Haley: “Negotiate your medical bills. It can significantly reduce your expenses.”

Where to Find Haley Sacks

Listeners interested in Haley’s financial resources and tools can visit financeschool.com to access the Money Book, debt payoff planner, and other financial tools. Haley is also active on all major social media platforms under the handle MrsDowJones.

Final Trading Secret

• Negotiate Your Medical Bills: Haley shares her personal experience of reducing a $15,000 hospital bill to $4,000 by obtaining an itemized bill and negotiating with the healthcare provider. This actionable advice encourages listeners to take control of their medical expenses through diligent review and negotiation.

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This summary captures the key points, discussions, insights, and conclusions from Episode 229 of Trading Secrets, providing a comprehensive overview for those who haven't listened to the episode.

Transcript

[A]

Foreign. Welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets. Today we are joined by financial expert, entrepreneur, and known to many as Mrs. Dow Jones, Haley Sachs. Upon entering the professional world, Haley took note of the content gap in and personal finance sector and decided to combine her interest in finances and her background in entertainment to make finance cool. Since then, Sachs has been helping a new generation of earners get fluent in finance. In short, she's making dollars make sense with the side of humor and pop culture. To her millions of followers on social media, Haley has been featured in finance publications such as Bloomberg, Fortune, Wall Street Journal, the New York Times, cnbc, Forbes, Market Watch, Entrepreneur, Barron's, Yahoo Finance, and more. Haley, thank what you've been on Trading.

[B]

Secrets, and now I'm on Trading Secret.

[A]

And now you're on Trading Secrets. It's an honor to have you here.

[B]

Gosh, an honor to be here.

[A]

Congratulations on all your success. Everything. As I'm reading your intro, I'm like, this is everything I believe in. It's everything that I. I have so much passion for. And I love having people like yourself on because it also gives different perspectives. Like, same advice, same idea, different takes. And for me, it's like, whatever will click with someone. That's a win. So I'm excited about this.

[B]

But that's what I always say is like, it's just about finding the right teacher.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Same with, like, working out. Like, you have to find the right trainer that will motivate you. I think it's the same with financials. You just need to find the right person who can really get you going.

[A]

Totally. I think one thing that's really cool. And listen, if you're here to take notes, trust me, I'm gonna get into the financial tips. We're gonna ask, but a little bit on the career side. I find it interesting that your background is actually in entertainment. You studied, I believe, film in college.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And that's like, quite the detour into finance. So walk me through, like, what that detour was and why.

[B]

Oh, my gosh. I always say, like, you know, there those financial gurus who are like, I had a lemonade stand when I was little and I, I was turning the profit and I, you know, Warren Buffett bought his first stock when he was 11. I'm like, cool. Like, I was skipping Jim to buy bags on ebay with a fake username that then got blocked.

[A]

I love it.

[B]

And was like, fully obsessed with looking rich, had no idea how to be rich, and was like, oh, I'm going to Hollywood.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I Chose the major that has the least earning potential, probably, besides, like, an English major. Film. And then my first job out of college was I was a page for David Letterman, which is. I say, like, you know, Kenneth, the page from 30 Rock.

[A]

Wait, tell me. Oh, oh, oh, the character. Yes. That's cool.

[B]

Yeah, but that's like a. That's where they set the good pages. The David Letterman pages were, like, a little bit, you know.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

We were from the other side of the tracks.

[A]

Okay, gotcha.

[B]

Yes. Yes.

[A]

How was it like working with him? So legend, by the way, right? I mean, like, legend. Icon.

[B]

Yeah, legend. And you sort of understand the gravitas of fame when you're in that environment, because there would be some guests that would come in and you could hear a pin drop. Like, they took up the room, just their energy. I'm obsessed with pop culture, with celebrities, so it was really amazing.

[A]

What do you think? Like, we're going off a detour here, but, like, for Dave Letterman, in a job like that right out of school, how much can you make in a position like that?

[B]

How much can I make in a position like that?

[A]

Yeah. Like, would you get paid?

[B]

No, I'm saying literally, like, I was getting paid hourly about, like, $11.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

And then after taxes, it's about, you know, $7. So I'm making literally nothing. But I did get free pizza on Fridays.

[A]

That's cool.

[B]

That was cool because we had a double show day, and I was babysitting, and I lived in a shitty Lower east side apartment.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And my parents. I was really fortunate to help me pay rent. Just, like thousand dollars a month from.

[A]

Them when like, 11 bucks an hour. Obviously, mom, dad are helping out with Ren. You just mentioned that you teach finance now. You do a great job of it. At any point were you in debt? Like, did you have credit card issues? Did you have any financial flaws? Early on?

[B]

My biggest financial flaw was just illiteracy. I really lacked the confidence, Jason. Like, I didn't believe that I was capable of earning money, of being rich. I thought that it was this other world, this other language that was not for me, but that someday, magically, I was gonna get that big check that was just gonna set me up for life. But, like, until then, I could just sort of, you know, rock and roll and eyeball it and, you know, who cares? And what you don't realize when you're living like that is you're actually, like, you're. You're hurting yourself. Like, you think that you're. You think that that Is the better scenario than just facing your finances head on, knowing how much you can spend? Like, I think in my head, I thought, this is way more cool. This is way more fun.

[A]

Sure.

[B]

But I've gotten so much peace from having financial security and from understanding my own income, expenses, all those things.

[A]

Yeah. The full circle is really fascinating. You go to Letterman, from Letterman. Where do you go?

[B]

Okay, so Letterman making zero money.

[A]

Zero money.

[B]

Also so bad at my job because they. And I met my best friend Pat there, and we were both pretty bad because it was a very old school institution. And so they had all of these antiquated practices that I didn't really believe in.

[A]

Give me, like, one.

[B]

Oh, my gosh. Like, we would have to go into Times Square and find people for the audience.

[A]

Interesting.

[B]

And the stipulations around what you were looking for, I found to be, like, a little off. I'm not gonna say what they were.

[A]

Okay. Is that more of a production thing or is that. Do you think that's like a Dave Letterman thing? I think it's both interesting.

[B]

I think he's a legend. I'm not.

[A]

Well, no one's perfect, right?

[B]

No one's perfect. But I think it was. There were some weird things. So anyways, was not the workplace for me, but, you know, definitely not. And then after that, I worked at a Pilates studio at the front desk. I was a babysitter for a kid on the Upper east side named Winthrop.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

I was doing standup comedy.

[A]

Wow. Really?

[B]

Yeah, I was out every night in the Lower east side. I was. You know, Ali Wong was performing at that time a lot downtown. Like, I was with all of these people who are now, like, have Netflix specials with them every night. They're performing amazing. And really trying to make it writing, writing screenplay, writing a TV show, you know, just trying to break through in any way. And also had a YouTube channel called. That never took off, called First World Problem Solutions.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Where I would give solutions to first world problems. And then I saw a job listing for Lorne Michaels, who started snl, was hiring creative social producers, which seemed like the dream job. And so I sent in that YouTube channel and I got that job. And that was where things sort of took a turn financially because I really wanted to do an amazing job in that role. And until then, I had just been sort of scraping by, getting away with just, you know. Oh, like, eyeballing it, whatever. I was never in debt, but I was definitely, you know, had no clue about my finances, was not thinking about my future, just, you Know, living fast and loose.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And then I. That first day, you know, when you have a full time job. It's my first real full time job.

[A]

Sure.

[B]

What, what kind do you want? A 401K. What do you want invested in? Do you want health insurance? Do you want an fsa? Like, what's going on?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I was like, okay, cool. This is not English. Could not understand any of this. Less. But I do want.

[A]

How long ago was this, by the way?

[B]

That was like when I was 24.

[A]

Okay, got it.

[B]

Okay, so I was young and what.

[A]

Is it real quick? The creative director in SNL doing this writing, what did that pay at the time?

[B]

That was like 47,000. So again, nothing.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Still grinding it out. Entertainment.

[B]

Yeah, I mean entertainment. And that was also, I was realizing too, I think some subconsciously that following that track would leave me at the whim of someone else's decision of how much I could make. And I furiously wanted to have that control myself. At that point, my goal was not as much making money as it was breaking through into Hollywood, figuring out, you know, how I could be seen as a writer, like, things like that. But I think also deep down I was sort of feeling that as well.

[A]

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[B]

I know.

[A]

Where was that breakthrough from entertainment to finance? Like, what exactly happened?

[B]

Okay, so that night, like after the first, literally the first day at that job.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I went home and I did what any self respecting millennial, I will admit, I am a millennial, even though I'm a zillennial owning it. And I did what any self respecting millennial will do. And I went on YouTube to try and learn. Okay, what is 401k? What is all these things? And I was so bored. And I, you know, I have a dad who has worked on Wall street for 40 years. So I knew enough about growing wealth that I knew that it was not. You don't save your way to rich.

[A]

Right.

[B]

I knew Wall street had a lot to do with it. And so all of the content for women was very like, here's how to meal prep. Skip your gel manicure. Make sure you're saving.

[A]

I got you in the morning.

[B]

Yeah, exactly. And it was then the content for men was more about investing, but it was so bo. Boring.

[A]

True.

[B]

And so. And I didn't really see anyone that I wanted to be. You know, it's so important, I think, to like have a role model or like have someone that you're aspiring to be. And so I tried to become that.

[A]

And that's a, that's an interesting take right there. Like, if you're searching for something and you're in an industry where you don't see exactly what it is you want to be, that can create an opportunity.

[B]

Totally. That's your goal, that's your niche.

[A]

And how long ago was this?

[B]

That was like that. Like 25, 24, 25. And so I worked there for another six months and then we all got laid off. And so, okay, so I had that night, whatever, where I was like, okay, there's something here. So then I just started to make content, like teaching myself. I was like, okay, I wanna learn about this. So started to learn and became obsessed. And it really, I just took to it. I was suddenly at brunch. I wasn't talking about Bella Thorne. I was talking about the end of brick and mortar. Like, I was, you know, felt so smart and was so empowered and also interested. And I also felt like I'd been lied to because I love celebrity gossip. And I was like, business gossip is just as good, juicy. Like, we are missing out here. Like, why am I on the Daily Mail when I could be on cnbc? Like, this is good stuff. And so I went, I went very deep into that and then got laid off, which was heartbreaking. But I was like, okay, I can either go and like gravel for a job at Comedy Central, which I will make again, 47 maybe if I'm lucky, like $55,000.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Or I can try and do this. And so I got part time job writing videos for like rappers at the.

[A]

Like, your resume's wild.

[B]

It's really crazy. I know. At Fuse, you know, like, okay, so I was working at Fuse in Times Square and I would like write videos for like all these music people. Have them do like crazy stunts, whatever, write it all. And then at night and during the day and around that was building Mrs. Dow Jones.

[A]

And that's a wild day and night.

[B]

It was a wild day and night. But I was just so excited to like, it was starting. Ooh, sorry. It was starting to grow and I was so excited because it felt like I had found this audience of people who felt the same way as me, where they had this insecurity or maybe like desire to learn, but they hadn't really found the right teacher.

[A]

Sure.

[B]

And that maybe, you know, using humor and pop culture and all these tricks that I could break through to them and we could all get rich together.

[A]

And so how long did it take for you? So you start doing this, you're writing videos and ideas for rappers and then you're doing Mrs. Dow Jones at like, how long did it take for Mrs. Dow Jones to become full time?

[B]

A year of working, like every day. Did not miss a day. Did not miss a post. Grinding, grinding, grinding.

[A]

And do you post every day?

[B]

Every day.

[A]

Every single day, yeah. And do you write your scripts up.

[B]

Before you post everything? I'm like so meticulous. Like, it's not a joke.

[A]

Interesting though how your work in, you know, your early 20s actually came to pay off totally as you're writing your scripts today and those scripts that you're writing are making the video so different, which is led to all your success.

[B]

I mean, we'll talk about like the format I feel like is different now too. Like short video versus long form. Like, I feel like that all is.

[A]

The algorithm and everything is just changing by the absolute second.

[B]

It's really crazy.

[A]

It's, it is wild.

[B]

It's humbling. Why are they doing this to us?

[A]

I don't know, but they're keeping us guessing. I think it's like the casino effect where they're like, we need to just like, everyone's got to hit a jackpot. Like everybody now. And like when you hit the jackpot, you go back and then when someone hits the jackpot, everyone's watching and they're like, well, I want to hit the jackpot. So they stick around. I think there's like this gambling effect going on with the algorithm, like an addiction style.

[B]

Oh, I'm full.

[A]

Right.

[B]

That's so true.

[A]

That's like what they're doing and how they're doing it. But it's all right. I want to ask you. So you're up. So they're up to so much.

[B]

They're up to no good.

[A]

Like, we'll get there.

[B]

We're going to figure it out. I think we could.

[A]

You know what, actually, let me ask you this before I go into financial tips. You always. Part of your strategy is in the beginning of every video, you will say who you are and what you do. Like a statement. Why talk to me about that?

[B]

Oh, I always say, Mrs. Al Jones is a finance expert. And I. Then I'll show behind me, like, press that I got or like something that shows that I have authority.

[A]

Because you're establishing authority and credibility within five seconds.

[B]

Because. Yes, because there's so many fakes on social media and there's so many people giving horrible financial advice. And so it's a way to say, hey, I'm credible. You can trust me. All of these places have affirmed that I know that I'm doing great work, that I can help you. And so, yeah, that's why I do it.

[A]

Okay. Before I get into financial advice, how long you're making 50,000 SNL, how long did it take you to clear that 50,000 as Mrs. Dow Jones?

[B]

Oh, I mean, okay, so I was in, so New York Times, which, you know, really solidified. Okay, I'm going to go full time with this. Whatever. And then. Probably took me a year. Okay, well, a year to get there. And then. A year to. A year. Yeah, a year. But it was, it was. You know, the brand deals at the beginning are so, so. And you think they're so big.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And you're so excited. And they have probably nothing to do with your brand. Like, I'm like, okay, I did, like, my first brand deal was like a clothing brand. Like, I don't sell clothing.

[A]

How do I tie this one in?

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

Right in this one up.

[B]

And I felt very cool, by the way. I was like, oh, my God, it's happening. I am. It's really happening.

[A]

But of your products and everything that you have, do you make more money off brand work or off the products that you. That you sell?

[B]

I honestly am pretty much equal.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And so I have a. A budgeting template called the Money Book 2.0. We just released it, and it's really amazing because it's in Google sheets and so all of your data is safe? Like, it's not. Yeah, it's not like an app where you're. Oh, I'm using plaid. I'm connecting everything. You own it. I don't see anything. It's all on you.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And you can automatically upload all of your transactions and it sorts all them for you and gives you a full financial plan. Which is also crazy. Like, tells you. Because I really believe in being a financial dominatrix. Like, I think that there is way too much choice when you're starting your financial journey. I don't think it's necessary. I think there are about four steps that everyone should do. So let's just do those four. Start there. After that, get creative. Finances, personal. You go, girl.

[A]

What is the four steps?

[B]

First of all, we're saving an emergency fund. Well, first thing would be we're getting our 401k match if that's offered, because that's free money. Free money saving a three to six month emergency fund in a high yield savings account. Then we are paying off our high interest rate debt, which is any debt above 7%. And I have a free debt planner, free debt payoff planner that will organize those interest rates for you. So if you're curious, like, where is my interest rate? Download the planner, it will tell you. And then after that is max out your tax advantaged accounts. Because I don't know why people would contribute to brokerages that are taxable when you can have tax advantages. So I'm like, do those. And then. Okay, we're.

[A]

Then get cute, but not those four things.

[B]

Yeah, get cute after.

[A]

It's like when you're building the home. Like, get your foundation in place before you start worrying about heated floors. Right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, come on, let's make it simple.

[B]

And we love a heated floor, though.

[A]

We love a heated floor. We gotta get there. We gotta get there.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

All right, let's go all the way back. I got a lot of listeners right now that have newborns, so I want to.

[B]

Generational.

[A]

Generational wealth. Parents right now, they want to know what to do, how to save for their kid. What accounts, what advice do you have? Evan, you should be listening to this. You have a newborn. What advice do you have for. For moms and dads out there that are trying to put their child in the best position financially?

[B]

Well, I would say first of all, put your oxygen mask on first, because kids can. Your kids can take out loans for school, but you cannot take out loans for retirement. And the biggest burden financially to a child is having a parent who they need to take care of because then it creates a generational cycle where they, that's the norm. And then their kids have to take care of them because they're giving their retirement money to you. And so the best thing that you can do is put your oxygen mask on first.

[A]

That's a great piece of advice.

[B]

And then, and then if you want to open accounts for them, you have to figure out what kind of account you want to do. So there's basically three main ways to invest for children. You can do a custodial brokerage account, which is a taxable, just straightforward brokerage account. You could do a custodial Roth IRA, which is like a regular Roth IRA, but it's for kids. Or you could do a 529 plan, which is money that you can use for education costs. But actually now there's a lot more flexibility with them. You can roll $35,000 of the 529 plan into a Roth IRA for the child if they decide not to go to school, if they get a scholarship, things like that. So those are a great account. And so figure out which of those you want to do. And then what's amazing with growing generational wealth is you don't need that much principal.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like for my goddaughter, for example, Zia, when she was born, I put $1,000 in an account for her. I put $100 every month and I put $500 every year on her birthday and I plan to do that until she's 18 and then I will stop. And if she gets a normal market return, 8 to 10%, that's all we're looking for. We don't do get rich quick. By the time she's 65, she will have like over $6 billion.

[A]

It's unbelievable. Yeah, and that's a very, that's very doable, right? With those dollars amount we're not talking about put 100 grand in here and then 10 grand every year. Like a very, very. Consistency, consistency. So be consistent. We have the accounts that you believe in. Scaling your business requires the right expertise at the right time. And there's a solution for you. It's called upwork. You can find specialized freelancers in market, marketing, development, design and more experts who are ready to help you take your business to the next level. Hiring shouldn't be such a big hassle or drain on your budget. And if in fact it is, check out upwork. It's a one stop shop to find someone to hire someone and then pay the top freelance individuals that you're looking for based on the work you're looking for. So you'll save time and you'll be keeping costs in check. All you have to do is visit upwork.com right now and then just post your job for free. That is upwork dot. And then you'll post your job that you want for free, like building a website or coming up with a logo. And then they will connect you with top talent ready to help you grow your business. That is upwork.com upwork.com to find the best talent as you scale your business. Now what about, I like the idea of this whole put your oxygen mask on. You talk a little bit about high interest rate debt. There's a million models. Everyone's got an idea of how to pay high interest rate debt down if it's over 7%. If anyone's listening is right now and they got debt over 7%, they do step one and they do step two. Which model do you subscribe to? To accelerating the pay down of bad debt.

[B]

I am all about paying off your highest interest rate debt first. I know that there are some financial experts who say, start with the smallest one so you get a win. Yeah, But I want to get your debt paid off the cheapest and fastest way possible.

[A]

I agree with you.

[B]

So I'm like, let's not waste time.

[A]

Honey avalanche model.

[B]

Yeah, go for it. Yeah, that's what we do.

[A]

Knock it out. Okay. Budgeting, it's, you know, we're living in a crazy time right now, right? Inflation, it was crazy. Now it's around 2,3%. You got cost of groceries are up like 25% since 2020. The price of things have gotten out of control. So everyone wants the budget. But the word budget makes people want to cringe. They hear and they're like, oh, it's a curse word. So how do you make it fun? And like, what tips can you give someone right now for budgeting?

[B]

Well, I think the first thing with budgeting, and I was that person too, who was like, you budgeting? Like never. Like that sounds like my life will be ruined. Like, guess I'm going on a budget. It means the fund's done. Like, I was that person. But then what I realized is like, if you reframe it and just think about a spending plan, you can actually put more money towards the things that you like. You just have to be discerning about cutting out the things that don't matter to you. Cause you can afford anything, but you can't Afford everything.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And I also think that what budgeting teaches you is patience. I still have tendencies to buy things that make me look rich. I like a Jean jacket that has a Prada on it. I will buy a Louis Vuitton travel bag. It's like I have that girl inside of me, she is trying to get out. We've done a good job job of pushing her down, taming her down a little bit. No, no, she'll like these are Chanel flats. Like we are that girl sometimes. But what I do is that's been amazing is I have automated deposits towards a high yield savings account for non monthly expenses. So like if I'm saving towards a trip, if I'm saving for a new phone, if I'm saving for Chanel flats, whatever it is, then I'm putting $100, $200 a month, whatever towards that.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And I'm building up to buy it. So I instead of buying the bag and saying where's the money? I know where the money is. And then I'm buying the thing.

[A]

Okay, got, I think that's a great, I mean that's so it's controlled. It's like you know how you want to spend your money, you know that you like the Chanel flats, but you're putting a system in place to say I recognize it, I see it, I'm going to make sure that I'm doing it the right way when it's time to get it.

[B]

And I think the biggest thing with budgeting too is really just focusing on what I call your action money, which is the money at the end of the month that you didn't spend, that you earned and didn't spend, that's left over for you to take action with. And at the beginning of your financial journey, that action money is going to go towards your emergency fund, right? And your 401k match. And then it will go towards that high interest rate debt once you get to that step and then it will go to your tax advantaged accounts and then eventually your extra money will go towards your, you know, your whatever you want to buy your home or more stocks or whatever it is. But I think, you know, there's a lot of rules, hard and fast financial rules. This is how much you should spend on rent. This is how much should be about your wants, your needs, whatever. But I think that if you can get your action money to 50 to 20% and you're, you know, under 45, that's really good. If you're over that age and you want to retire when you're 60, 65, you do have to kick it up a little bit and be more aggressive because you don't have as much time in the market.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And that's just the truth. But you know, I think instead of getting so in the weeds, just focusing on having that delta.

[A]

Okay. The delta makes sense. The action money is cool. I like it. 15 to 20%. You had mentioned retirement. That's what that, you know, there's investing your own assets, your after tax dollars, or even your pre tax dollars. But then there's retirement planning. What advice do you have for people that are looking to retire at a specific age? Like let's say 60, 65. And then also with that, like people are like, where do I put my retirement money? How do I invest it? What advice do you have for them?

[B]

Well, I'd say first of all, it's great that they know their age.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But also know how much you need to retire.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Like what kind of retirement do you want to have? Are you trying to be like private jetting from your ski chalet to your like London townhouse or are you like, okay, cool. Like I want to like, you know, live a little bit smaller but be able to get there quicker.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I think it's important to know that retirement is a number, not an age. I have a retirement calculator free again that we can link as well. So knowing that number is really important. And then I would say just, you know, working backwards from there with those tax advantaged accounts. So maxing out those first maxing out your Roth IRA if you have 12 hyper it. If not you can do a backdoor Roth.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

If not, you can do an IRA doing your 401k and just going from there.

[A]

Okay. I love it. Now people get, they go through the four step model. They then have their action money, then they're matching their 401k, they're saving for retirement. They're in a good spot. So now they can get those heated floors. They get cute with investing. What type of like can you give us a little, we talked a little bit about the show. Insight as to like how do you invest your money, what it looks like. And then with that money today, it's a, it's a wild world out there. Markets like just this week, markets getting absolutely smoked. Like where do people put their money?

[B]

Oh my gosh, right now it's so crazy.

[A]

It's like we're living in a wild time right now.

[B]

We are.

[A]

It is, it is crazy. I do want to get your perspective on that. But before I do, like, where would you tell people to invest their money when they're trying to make money on their money?

[B]

The biggest thing that I say about investing is, and I live by this credo is you do not want an average life, you do not want an average relationship, but you want average returns, you want 8 to 10%. And once you just live that swallow that. That's your truth.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Then you don't fall for get rich quick schemes because you're like, no, I'm good. I'm actually going to take, you know, just drive the speed limit on the highway and.

[A]

And I'll get there.

[B]

And I'm going to get there. Exactly. And so that is the biggest thing I think, especially right now if you're on financial TikTok, which I am. It is a wild world. People are fully acting as though they know how to time the market. They know when the market will bottom. If it was Warren Buffett talking to me who reads 800 pages a day and has been investing for like, you know, 70 years, yeah, I would believe him. But anyone else? No, like it's, it's not about timing the markets, about time in the market and about staying consistent and not getting swayed by the news because really the financial media just wants clicks.

[A]

Right.

[B]

You know, and this is a. They're probably making so much money, they're.

[A]

Killing it right now.

[B]

They really are.

[A]

Absolutely killing.

[B]

It's great to be Rupert Murdoch.

[A]

8 to 10% though. Where do you suggest people get it? You say, did you have a mutual fund? Do you have S and P index? Like, what do you think?

[B]

I love a low cost index fund. I'm really into Voo, which tracks S&P 500. I love me some QQQ, which, you know, gotta get that QQQ, that's a technology index. And then I do like to also have one bond index fund too, which, I mean, I'm 33, so I'm riskier with my portfolio. As you get older, you, you know, add more bonds into your portfolio, less stock so that you have more stability. But I would do like 10% in that. And then I would also add a global stock fund because right now at the beginning of 2024, the US stock market is down compared to the global stock market. And we have been a leader forever, but who knows if that will continue. And don't you want to be hedged?

[A]

Sure.

[B]

So I think it's good to have a little bit of global exposure as well. And that's something that I've recently been committed to.

[A]

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[B]

But I'm not a financial advisor and if you take this advice, it's on your own terms.

[A]

It's on your own terms. If you lose anybody, don't be crying to Mrs. Dow Jones over here. All right? You said get rich.

[B]

Do you give, do you give advice to that degree?

[A]

Yeah, yeah, 100%. I think every portfolio wise. I think that's exactly what you said. The only thing is, I think you have to understand, you're like when you go to a casino, I say you got the one friend who will just sit there and not gamble at all. But he'll take the free drinks, right? And let's say a drink is 10 to 15 bucks. He has five drinks, you know, he made let's say 70 bucks because he didn't pay for the drinks. You have the other friend that takes a thousand bucks and puts it on red. That person has the ability to lose a thousand bucks or have 2,000 within minutes. And that's risk tolerance. And I think to build your portfolio, you really have to understand, like, who are you in that player at the casino? And then you can build the portfolio accordingly. But to your point, like, when you make these high risk plays, there is a lot of downside too. And we've seen successful investors slow and steady, looking at the Northern Star as opposed to worrying about tomorrow. Right. And they're so, like, how many people have lost their ass with these NFTs with all these different meme coins.

[B]

Melania Coin.

[A]

Yeah. Right. Like, what's up with bitcoin? Everything like that.

[B]

For Jason Coin.

[A]

Jason Coin. That's not happening. But do you like to use. What's your take on cryptocurrency?

[B]

Look, I think for me, it's not something that I am invested in to a big degree. Like, I have a small percentage of my portfolio in it that honestly was from about four years ago.

[A]

Good.

[B]

So, yeah, good timing. I haven't bought more.

[A]

What percentage of your portfolio?

[B]

Oh my gosh, like under 5%. Because I'm, I really like. Yeah, yeah. I'm. I take risks with under 5%. Like.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I will tell you about my worst investment too. But it's like I have a little bit of money that I just play with.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But it's never gone well, Jason. Okay, well, I wouldn't say I'm a stock picker. I would say I'm very good at, like, you know, I know the rules and I. And they work.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so. And I understand Wall street. And I also have a dad who's a financial advisor and works with really, really high net worth individuals and he does the same thing for them. So I'm like, okay, like, if they are buying S and P, if they are buying like qqq, if they're doing all this stuff, if it's good enough for them. Billionaire.

[A]

Yeah, it is good enough for me.

[B]

Perfectly set.

[A]

All right. What was the worst investment you made?

[B]

Okay, the worst investment I made. And then I want to know yours.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Was during the pandemic. I was living with my parents and I was doing about two hours of Tracy Anderson a day, which I don't recommend. And so I was always dehydrated. But you couldn't go to the grocery store and get coconut water, which is what I always go to for, like, electrolytes, whatever. And so I bought dehydrated coconut water powder from Laird Superfoods. Laird, the surfer. And I was like, oh, my God, this is genius. And I bought the whole line. All of his Non Dairy creamers. Everything that he got, I was like, laird pilled.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so I put about. And then I was like, wait, Laird is public. I can own Laird Superfood. Sick. Like, this is going to the moon. Like, people don't even understand, like, what's about to happen with this stock. Like, meanwhile, didn't look at the fundamentals. Had no idea what kind of debt they had. Didn't understand, like, who was on their leadership committee. Like, had truly no understanding of the company at all. Was fully doing it based on instinct and impulse.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And of course, now that a thousand dollars is worth $90.

[A]

Okay, so a thousand dollar loss, though, that's not bad.

[B]

It's not bad, but it was worse than best. But I wanted it to be so much. Jason.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You thought it was gonna be like the retirement plan, million bucks tomorrow.

[B]

Oh, my gosh.

[A]

Get rich fast. Doesn't work.

[B]

It really doesn't.

[A]

My worst was, it was in 2020. This is everything. And everything I tell people not to do is by the time you hear news, it's already too late. Like, the price is already baked into the stock. When you hear the news, like, when you're seeing something, even those clicks, the financial.

[B]

You should listen to your cousin who's like whispering.

[A]

They're whispering. It's too late. And I didn't know anything about the whole NFT space, but I knew that it was like booming and I had a NFT master. It's like, you got to go with this publicly traded company. They just ipoed. It's, you know, none of the financials made sense. None of the fundamental and nothing made sense. But he was like, you got to do it. Trust me, it's going to change your life. And I put, like, I didn't do a thousand. I did like, I did like, I think I did like 20 or 25,000. Lost every penny of it. Every penny of it. And that was what I said. I said, like, listen, this is the advice you give. Like, do not just jump into something. Understand it. Don't get the business. And I just, I just. And it went to. So that was my, that was my worst one. What was your best one? What do you think? The best return you ever got in invest.

[B]

But I will also say just on that, that every, like, good investor that I know has had that moment.

[A]

Yeah, you need that wake up call because it rings your bell. And you know how many momentum things I've heard since then, got to jump on this, got to jump on that. And then I'll do my, my Due diligence. And I'll realize, like, that's a terrible move. And as a result of that, I didn't invest in it. And all those companies popped and flopped.

[B]

There you go.

[A]

So that was a good. It was an expensive lesson, but probably saved me in the long run.

[B]

Totally saved you. And I'm the same way where it's like, if you tell me the stove is hot, I don't believe you. I need to touch it.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, Exactly. That's perfectly so. All right, how about your best in class investment or one that you're most proud of, like your Oscar of investing.

[B]

My Oscar of investing. I would say probably in myself.

[A]

I was.

[B]

Yeah, you knew I was gonna say it.

[A]

That that is my. Because the return on your business is huge material.

[B]

Yeah. Like, I have a really great team around me. I have invested in like executive coaches to learn how to be a better leader. I've invested in people to help structure my business. I've invested in, like, you know, I've put a lot of money into myself as a CEO because I. Being a creative, being a content creator is a completely different job than growing your business. And that's been something that I've seen a big return on because you're only as good as your team.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And if you can't keep your team, then you have no business.

[A]

Yeah. 100. I love that. I think it's a great answer, especially with the earnings potentials in so many business right now. Invest in yourself. You'll see the returns. I've asked. I've asked.

[B]

But also invest in the stock market too. Like.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Don't forget about that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But anyone, I think, like, of any industry, whether it's an athlete, comedian, whatever, that's found massive success. When I ask that question, it's almost always themselves, you know, because that's just. That's your brand. And no matter where you're working, even if it's for large corporate, you have a brand within that corporation. And investing in that will pay massive dividends within the company or outside the company.

[B]

Such a coin.

[A]

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[B]

Well, I would say that there is like a money mise en place like in when you cook. Like when you see people on Instagram who are chefs, they always have their little bowls with the celery cut and the carrot and they have it all ready to go and they can put it in the pot and whatever. And so I always think about that with money where it's like you have to have all the right ingredients and places to organize everything. And so I think everyone should have a checking account.

[A]

Is there a certain bank that you like? Do you think there's a good bank, bad bank or anything like that?

[B]

I mean I think the biggest thing with checking accounts is that people have Stockholm syndrome with them and fully have the same checking account that they got when they were like, you know, got their first job and they don't realize that they are paying fees.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And it is much more expensive to acquire a customer than it is to keep a customer.

[A]

That is so true.

[B]

So like 5 to 10 minute phone call to your bank could release you from those fees. And it's pretty simple.

[A]

How about credit? Do you credit card? Do you have like a credit card?

[B]

I love a credit card. Of course, like you have to be able to spend within reason and know your Own limits with it. It's not free money. I really, I mean, I love American Express. I have a really old card from my bank. Because you never close your first credit card because that, it's, it's a.

[A]

Is that a credit tip?

[B]

It is a credit tip. Okay. This is a great credit tip. So you know your part of your credit score is based on your credit history. And so a lot of people when they want to like improve their finances will be like, okay, I'm gonna cancel that credit card that I've had since I was 18 that I got at the college fair.

[A]

This colle fairs.

[B]

They really got you like, you get.

[A]

A free pack of gum if you.

[B]

Get like a pen.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, get a pen. A credit card. We're going to stick it to you for 10 years.

[B]

Thank you. How did that.

[A]

Like, that's so predatory. So predatory the fact they did that.

[B]

Okay, I know. We really got to rethink those college. Maybe there's an opportunity there for us.

[A]

Yeah, there is.

[B]

There is. We're building.

[A]

We should, we should go like next to all of them and like protest out there.

[B]

Speakers.

[A]

Don't do it.

[B]

Don't do it for like undercover.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like a little van outside with an earpiece.

[A]

But, but, but those you say keep them.

[B]

Okay. So the oldest card that you have, if it is a no fee card.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Put a small subscription on it, $15, whatever subscription a month and keep it active because closing it will hurt your credit score.

[A]

Tell people how to.

[B]

Oh, and if it is a.

[A]

But like how. Why would it close it? Why would closing it hurt the credit score?

[B]

Because it would decrease your credit history. So I've had one credit card since 2016.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And all my other credit cards I got 20, 20, 20, 23, whatever. If I close the 2016 one and they're looking at me as a lender, I don't have as much history, I don't have as much clout to them as like, oh, she's trustworthy to give money to.

[A]

You know, like examples you get. Yeah, yeah. Like, it's like being the senior and.

[B]

Yeah. You want to get your cloud up, Jason. And as long as the car is no fee. It's so stress off your back.

[A]

Yeah, that's true.

[B]

You know, like, so just, just keep it. Like I have that, you know, stupid dingy card that is in my wallet.

[A]

Collecting dust.

[B]

Yeah, collecting dust.

[A]

And it increases. And your overall like your, your total credit that.

[B]

Exactly right. So there's.

[A]

Your usage rate is low too.

[B]

Totally. Yes.

[A]

You got it all you got the credit tips, the investment tips, the budgeting tips.

[B]

What do you, what are your favorite credit cards?

[A]

I mean, I think it all depends. You have to align it with your spending and then I think you have to align it with just what you do on a day to day basis. And I think I use the Amex Delta Reserve because of.

[B]

Are you big Delta guy?

[A]

Big Delta guy, Huge delta guys. So for me, that's what it worked. But when I in college and my biggest expenses were gas and restaurants, I used the best cash back. It was a Discover Cashback. That's still a great card, right? Yeah, exactly. So. And I think it changes. I think there's a flavor of the month with credit cards. But I, I, I think you should use credit cards and you could be rewarded heavily for using them appropriately.

[B]

And building your credit score is invaluable.

[A]

Yeah. And I think from an apps perspective, I mean, I got to check out the money book 2.0.

[B]

I'm gonna give it to you.

[A]

I want to love it, but I.

[B]

Think really amazing because you need a financial home base.

[A]

Yeah. You need, yeah.

[B]

And whatever works for you. Like that's like, if you have time.

[A]

To be like crunch numbers all the time, they don't. You need tools to do it for you.

[B]

But I do think putting on a little bit of sweat equity to your money home base is a good thing because for me at least when I did the apps and it was like, bleep, bloop, bloop. And then it was like, here's how much you could spend at the movies. I was like, cool, do you never. And threw the phone down. Yeah. Bye. And so I think there's a little bit that comes with having to go through it that's really good. And what's great too is once you have a money system, it really should just take you like 10 or 15 minutes to review every month.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, True.

[A]

Yeah. And think about the impact that has.

[B]

It's a huge impact.

[A]

Yeah. Let me get you this. You hear all this financial advice out there. Financial TikTok. What's the worst piece of advice you saw out there that people are like looking at and thinking through?

[B]

Oh my gosh, there's so much.

[A]

You're like, where do I start?

[B]

Yeah. There's so much bad advice. Like there's so much bad real estate investing advice. Like take this loan and then you can buy all these rental properties and then you're going to be so rich. Like, like no. So risky. I've seen so many people being like, cash out your 401k and invest with me. I will get you 40%. And it's like, okay, really bad.

[A]

So bad.

[B]

I would just say getting rich should be boring. And so if you're listening to anyone who makes it seem easy and fast and exciting, then they probably are the ones who are getting rich from you.

[A]

That's brilliant advice. Brilliant advice. Let's talk about current state. I've seen recessions on the horizon. I've seen your content talking about what's going on. Tariffs are impacting the current market. If someone said right now to Mrs. Dow Jones, give me your update on the status of the economy. Give me a state of the union. What do I do in this market? Do I buy real estate? Do I not? Do I invest? Do I not? What's happening? What's your take on the current economy?

[B]

I think that like all of the recession news has put people into a personal recession where they are like so stressed out and feel like they are making that this is their one moment to get rich in their lifetime and that they need to like jump or. Yeah. Do so much stuff and like that making decisions from that place never leads to anything good. I will say that there's two types of people. When the market is down, type A will get really scared, sell everything.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Panic. And will never get to ride the high up again. And then there's person B. And this is rich people who know that the market historically has always come back, have a long time horizon, are not being impacted by the news and are instead looking for opportunities to buy assets at lower prices. Because I mean, I love a sale. Assets are on sale.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I would say for me to really want to buy real estate, the rates would have to be lower for me.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

But I think that if you're buying it for where it's in your financial plan and you're like, I'm having a kid and this is my dream to own a house and whatever. Great, do it now.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

There's no reason not to. But in terms of like, like getting in on the investment, I don't think there's any urgency yet.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And I really just hold.

[A]

If you, you think hold right now.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Well, you're. I think what I'm hearing too is you're saying you can never time anything perfect. Understand how you react in these environments because a lot of people either panic or something and then maybe your advice would be just hold a little bit.

[B]

Hold. But no, it's actually just be consistent.

[A]

Be consistent.

[B]

Like do dollar cost averaging Because I think that there is so much pressure on timing the market. And really what I was saying with real estate is like, if there's another like recession as 2% mortgage rate moment. Yeah, yeah, I might jump on it. Yeah, I might jump on that. But like, who knows if that's, I can't predict the future. I don't know if that's gonna happen again. And so it's not something that I am holding my breath for.

[A]

Okay, all right, hold, wait.

[B]

See, it will just be consistent, stay calm. And I would also say like, like, you know, this is a very interesting time economically because with other market downturns and recessions, they can't really be pinpointed as much to like a man made problem.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

Like this is really facilitated by tariffs which are jerking us all around. And the stock market.

[A]

What's your take on the tariff situation?

[B]

I mean, as Warren Buffett said, someone has to pay them. It's not the tooth fairy. So who's gonna pay them? Sure, okay, us. Does it make things more expensive? Of course. But I also want to see if the tariffs, like, I'm just sort of sick of being. We are having tariffs. We're not having tariffs. We're doing 200%. No, we're doing no%.

[A]

The touch and go, it's like, make a decision, let's go make a decision.

[B]

And it's so destabilizing of the stock market because the stock market loves stability. Like, like people always say Jimmy Carter was like, he has, people would say, oh, he's a bad president, he didn't do anything. But actually a good president doesn't do much. Like they keep things the same.

[A]

Consistent.

[B]

Yeah. And so. And that's how you keep the economy consistent too. And so. But I also understand that for many people there's so much job insecurity and fear of layoffs and fear of how they're going to take care of their family. And with these rising prices, it's so overwhelming. And I would say the best thing that you can do is make sure that you have that emergency fund. Three to six month emergency fund. More if you're taking care of more people because you need to put your own oxygen mask on first and make sure that you're going to be okay. Because look, I don't have a crystal ball. I don't know what's going to happen. But I do want you to be prepared.

[A]

Great advice. Because it is a, it is a, it's a touch and go time. It's a volatile time. Who Knows what's going to happen every time I look at my app that's moving 2% one way or the other. Like, it is a crazy world out there. All right, well, we got so much financial advice, so many trading secrets. Talk to me real quickly about, like, the Dow Jones brand from here. Mrs. Dow Jones, where do you go? How do you build the empire? What does it look like, five years, 10 years? Like, what's the plan?

[B]

I would say just reaching more people and then, you know, also finding more ways to make it easy to manage your money. I've seen so much success with the money book, and it really came from designing a product that I felt like I needed where I was. Like, I need something that can actually show me what I should do differently next month. Exactly. The places that I do need to think about. And so I see a lot of potential in that. And, you know, I think also trying just to break in more to the mainstream media because I think money needs to be part of the conversation. So getting a seat at the table with people who maybe wouldn't talk about money and making them talk about money, that would be pretty cool. And you're so good at that. I feel like you get people to open up so much to you.

[A]

Yeah. I mean, it's. It's fun. I think you gotta.

[B]

You're really a great people to, like.

[A]

You know, open up. You have to be open. Right. Like, that's true. Like, you gotta show your cards a little bit. But I think the one thing that you're doing so well, too, is making money fun. And I think just even the example I've saw in your content about connecting the recession to Blake Lively, like, it's. It's a trending topic. It's real, and then people connect with it, and they want to be part of it.

[B]

She is in a recession. But again, that is. People are very like, you are anti. Anti Blake.

[A]

Yeah. It becomes like, yeah, yeah.

[B]

And I'm like, no, no, I'm not anti Blake. But, like, just objectively, like, she's in a recession. Like, people are. She is now. Her star has dimmed.

[A]

Yep. And she is.

[B]

Yeah. I'm not saying which side I'm on.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Again, I am bi.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

But I'm. But. But she's in a recession.

[A]

Exactly. And I think. And then now people understand what a recession is, and that's. People have to talk about money. They have to understand money. We weren't taught this stuff. It's so important. And I also think, you know, all the financial experts on and they, come on, they get very technical. Like I' like a hedge fund or private equity guy. You're making this very easy. It's, it's, it's digestible. And I think what you're doing is awesome.

[B]

Well, consumer finance is also so different.

[A]

Yeah, totally, totally. But I think you get so many of these people that are trying to teach through the lens of they're still working at their hedge. Hedge fund.

[B]

That's impossible.

[A]

Not understandable. It doesn't make it warm. It. It's a turn off.

[B]

Exactly. Doesn't make it warm. That's a good way of putting.

[A]

Right. So whatever these products that are coming, I'm excited.

[B]

I'm going to come back.

[A]

We're going to keep an eye on.

[B]

What's your goal?

[A]

The larger goal would be to be able to get financial literacy taught in the school system. Yeah, like we just. It is unbelievable to me. That's not a mandated requirement.

[B]

Totally.

[A]

Just the basics. That would be like the biggest win of all time.

[B]

I'll help you.

[A]

But I also think. Yeah, let's go, let's, let's go run the charge here. The other thing too is I'm, I'm big on financial transparency. I think the financial transparency gives us information so that people can navigate themselves in a better way. Right. And if we're not talking about what we're making and how we're doing it, then the people at the top are really profiting off that. So just understand different industries, what they're doing, how they're doing it, and take advice from people that are giving good advice. So see what happens. The agency's good. The podcast is good. The book stuff's good. Speaking stuff's fun. I enjoy every bit of it. And it's fun to always talk to someone in the space too.

[B]

I would say one other thing that I'm working towards is working less.

[A]

Oh, yeah, I need to do that.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Cuz I'm in the.

[A]

What's your screen time right now?

[B]

Oh, like I work. Work all the time, every day.

[A]

Like, what do you think it is?

[B]

Oh, 24 hours.

[A]

Yeah, I was going to say, I looked at mine the other day. It was 17.

[B]

17 for sure.

[A]

So bad. So bad.

[B]

17 is so.

[A]

Oh, yeah, yeah. All right. Work less but still make an impact.

[B]

But yeah, make money, but be able to, like, enjoy your life. Take care of yourself.

[A]

Yeah, I love it. All right, Haley, you got to give us a trading secret. So it's specific to you, your experience. It could be a financial one, it could be Financial transparency if you want. It could be just any life advice. But you can't get it on a tik tok tutorial. You can only get it from what you've done and how you've done it. What could leave us with.

[B]

I would say negotiate your medical bills.

[A]

That's a good one.

[B]

I went to the hospital for. I broke my foot.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And I had the biggest hospital bill ever.

[A]

Like how much was it?

[B]

Like 15k.

[A]

15K for a broken foot?

[B]

No, like it was crazy. I was there for you. No, it was like I was there for so long. But it was their fault that I was there for so long cuz they were not like taking care of me. And then you actually go through the bill and they, they have ibuprofen, $2,000. Like it's like all these things that are. If you get the line items of your receipt, it is, they've really jacked up the prices and they will bring it down. And so I also tell this to all my friends who are having babies because they always leave the hospital and.

[A]

They'Re like just getting absolutely corrupt.

[B]

Yeah. It's insane. And so I'm always like get an itemized bill from the hospital. Cause just by doing that, that will drive down the bill and then also call them them and offer to pay in full for a discounted price. Negotiate the prices down so you'll get.

[A]

The itemized and then you'll call them and then you'll try and negotiate it down.

[B]

Yeah. But even just by getting the itemized they'll be like whoops, sorry, didn't mean to charge you that 5K. And it's like okay, like we, that is real money. Like we do need to know where that's going.

[A]

So in this example you're 15k. What did you get it down to?

[B]

I think I got it down to like 4k. Wow, that was good.

[A]

That's unbelievable.

[B]

And then I got. Yeah, then insurance helped but I, but it was because it was egregious what they were charging me.

[A]

Wow, that is a great training secret. We've never had it.

[B]

Yeah, you gotta do negotiate your medical bills is a big go.

[A]

Shate your medical bills. You gotta, you gotta learn every line item, call em, negotiate it, do it. All people are gonna need a notepad for this episode. There's a lot of advice you gave Hayley. Where can everyone find everything you have going on?

[B]

Go to financeschool.com to get the money book and also to get like all the free products that I mentioned. Like the debt payoff planner. I have an emergency fund calculator. I have a lot of tools that will help you implement what we talked about in the episode that are completely free. And then I am Mrs. Dow Jones. M R S D O W J O N E S on all platforms.

[A]

Well, unbelievable story from, I mean, working with David Letterman to where you are today. It is so wild how the pieces came together, but also inspiration for so many people that are still trying to figure it out.

[B]

Yeah. Follow your heart.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And that was like the biggest thing. Just like keeping going. I think about that all the time with young people. I'm like, just keep going, keep going. Yeah.

[A]

It's another trading secret.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Mrs. Dow Jones, thank you so much for being on this episode of Training Secrets. Me. Hello, it is Ryan. And I was on a flight the other day playing one of my favorite social spin slot games on jumbacasino.com. i looked over the person sitting next to me and you know what they were doing? They were also playing Jumba Casino. Coincidence? I think not. Everybody's loving having fun with it. Chumba Casino is home to hundreds of casino style games that you can play for free, anytime, anywhere, even at 30,000ft. So sign up [e-mail] to claim your free welcome bonus. That's chumbacasino.com and live the Chumba life. No purchase necessary.

[B]

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