235. Robert J. O’Neill: From killing Osama Bin Laden to his ventures post-military, the unbelievable BTS of Navy SEAL training, realities behind the mental role in operations, and the financial realities of it all!

Summary

Podcast Summary: Trading Secrets Episode 235 – Robert J. O’Neill

Podcast Information:

• Title: Trading Secrets
• Host: Jason Tartick, Audioboom Studios
• Episode: 235
• Guest: Robert J. O’Neill – Former Navy SEAL, Entrepreneur, Author, Speaker, and Podcast Host
• Release Date: May 19, 2025

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1. Introduction and Guest Background

Timestamp: 00:00 – 01:24

Jason Tartick welcomes Robert J. O’Neill, highlighting his illustrious military career as one of the most decorated Navy SEALs. Robert's notable missions include participating in the rescue operation Red Wings, the rescue of Captain Richard Phillips from Somali pirates, and leading Operation Neptune Spear, the mission that resulted in the death of Osama Bin Laden.

Notable Quote:

"Robert is one of the most highly decorated combat veterans of our time... he took part in the rescue operation Red Wings which extracted the lone survivor Marcus Luttrell."
— Jason Tartick [00:30]

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2. Early Life and SEAL Training

Timestamp: 01:24 – 09:45

Robert shares his Montana upbringing, emphasizing that his decision to join the Navy SEALs was unconventional. Initially perceived as not fitting the typical "tough guy" mold, Robert credits his father’s belief and persistent practice in basketball, particularly mastering free throws, for instilling discipline and muscle memory essential in SEAL training.

Notable Quote:

"If you want to be good at something, do it 10,000 times. You want to be great, do it 100,000 times."
— Robert J. O’Neill [03:46]

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3. The Rigors of SEAL Training and Hell Week

Timestamp: 09:45 – 17:04

Robert delves into the intense SEAL training process, particularly Hell Week, describing it as a grueling period where candidates undergo sleep deprivation, extreme physical challenges, and relentless teamwork exercises. The focus is on mental resilience, emphasizing short-term goals to push through enduring physical and mental pain.

Notable Quote:

"Hell Week is, it starts on Sunday afternoon and you don't sleep until Friday afternoon, early evening... it's cold and miserable the entire time."
— Robert J. O’Neill [12:11]

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4. Mission to Kill Osama Bin Laden

Timestamp: 17:04 – 40:35

Robert recounts the planning and execution of the Operation Neptune Spear mission. He describes the meticulous preparation, the psychological readiness, and the relentless pursuit that led to locating Bin Laden in Pakistan. The narrative includes the emotional complexity of the mission, balancing duty with the human aspects of killing a person who, despite being an enemy, had a family.

Notable Quote:

"There wasn't fear at all. We knew what we're doing and why we were here... 'Your life just changed. Get to work.'"
— Robert J. O’Neill [38:03]

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5. Coping Mechanisms and Mental Health

Timestamp: 25:49 – 43:34

Robert discusses the psychological toll of combat, including PTSD and the internal conflicts faced after taking lives. He emphasizes the importance of camaraderie, open communication with fellow veterans, and transitioning skills to civilian life. Robert also touches on his struggles post-service, highlighting financial hardships despite his heroic acts.

Notable Quote:

"When you think about it, you're going to be talking about your family... 'Never quit.'"
— Robert J. O’Neill [39:14]

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6. Transition to Civilian Life

Timestamp: 43:34 – 55:00

Upon leaving the Navy, Robert faced significant financial and personal challenges. Without retirement benefits or substantial savings, he turned to public speaking, authoring books, and entrepreneurship to sustain himself. He founded the Special Operators Transition Foundation to help veterans integrate into the private sector and launched a veteran-owned cannabis company to address PTSD and anxiety.

Notable Quote:

"Public speaking just... talking about our success as a high performance team... It was easier than I thought."
— Robert J. O’Neill [44:57]

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7. Views on Government and Politics

Timestamp: 55:00 – 59:09

Robert expresses skepticism toward government transparency and accountability, suggesting that significant actions and decisions are often made behind closed doors. He voices concerns about martial law, governmental overreach, and the influence of intelligence agencies on national policies.

Notable Quote:

"Look into how LBJ got to where he was... John F. Kennedy said, I'm going to smash the CIA to a thousand pieces."
— Robert J. O’Neill [57:13]

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8. Final Thoughts and Takeaways

Timestamp: 59:41 – End

The episode concludes with Robert emphasizing resilience and the importance of never quitting. He encourages listeners to take risks, seize opportunities, and persist through challenges. Robert also shares resources for those interested in his foundation and cannabis ventures, reinforcing his message of empowerment and support for veterans.

Notable Quote:

"Never quit. You're never out of the fight, no matter what."
— Robert J. O’Neill [59:41]

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Key Insights and Lessons:

1. Discipline and Muscle Memory: Repetition in training, whether in free throws or combat tactics, builds the foundation for excellence.
2. Mental Resilience: Focusing on short-term goals and maintaining calmness under pressure are crucial for overcoming extreme challenges.
3. Importance of Teamwork: Success in high-stakes missions relies heavily on trust, communication, and mutual support within the team.
4. Transition Challenges: Veterans often face significant hurdles when shifting to civilian life, highlighting the need for robust support systems.
5. Entrepreneurial Spirit: Leveraging military-honed skills such as leadership, discipline, and strategic thinking can lead to successful ventures post-service.
6. Advocacy for Mental Health: Addressing PTSD and other mental health issues is essential for the well-being of veterans.
7. Government Accountability: There is a perceived need for greater transparency and oversight within governmental and intelligence operations.

Conclusion:

Episode 235 of Trading Secrets offers an in-depth look into the life of Robert J. O’Neill, blending his heroic military exploits with the personal and financial struggles faced after service. Through his story, listeners gain valuable lessons on resilience, leadership, and the importance of never quitting—both in high-stakes environments and everyday challenges.

For More Information:

• Robert’s Website: robertjoneill.com
• Special Operators Transition Foundation: sotf.org
• Operator Canna (Cannabis Company): operatorcanna.com

Notable Final Quote:

"Take the shot. Apply for that job. Try to get the role. Write a book, write a play. Take the shot."
— Robert J. O’Neill [55:14]

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End of Summary

Transcript

[Jason Tardik]

Foreign welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets. Today we are joined by former Navy SEAL entrepreneur, New York Times best selling author, speaker and podcast host, Robert J. O' Neill. Robert is one of the most highly decorated combat veterans of our time. He served at Seal Team 2, Seal Team 4 in eight years at the legendary Seal Team 6, having taken part in leading over 400 combat missions around the world. He is decorated 53 times with honors. More notably, Robert took part in the rescue operation Red Wings which extracted the lone survivor Marcus Luttrell. He was then led jumper for the rescue operation that saved Captain Richard Phillips and some from the Somalia pirates. And he was a team leader for operation Neptune Spear, the mission to kill Osama Bin Laden. Today we are going to talk about his life as a Navy seal, his transition into corporate America which includes becoming an author, public speaker, podcast host and even starting his own veteran owned cannabis company. Robert, like truly from all the guests we have, I say it a lot, you've done it all. But like you truly have done it all. Thank you for being on Trading Secrets.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

We appreciate it. I appreciate it. This is exciting.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, this is awesome. Let's go back to the early days. So you know you're growing, growing up and it was, it was in Montana, right?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Montana.

[Jason Tardik]

Montana. So you're growing up there. And I think about my early days growing up in Buffalo, New York. I grew up with Rob Gronkowski and we knew at the early, just trust me, the same guy today, so many.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So many images just then of what you guys wrote.

[Jason Tardik]

We had a great time. He's the same guy today that he was back then. Nothing's changed. But I say that because we knew from like literally the day he like he was 4 years old, we're like this, this kid's going to be the guy. Like he's gonna be the guy also had the fortune of playing with Patrick Kane in hockey growing up. We knew he would be and he becomes one of the best H players ever do exist. I'm curious when I, when I see everything you've done, were you, were you that guy? Were you the guy in school and stuff like, oh, that's, that's the Navy seal. That's the sniper.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

No, no, I was actually the guy that when I told people I joined the Navy that I, they would tell me I wasn't going to make it. I think the only guy who believed in me was my dad. My family told me I'd make it, but I think behind my back they admitted later they weren't sure just because it was never my thing. I was, I wasn't a tough guy. I didn't have really a killer mentality. But what I had from growing up there is my dad and I played basketball quite a bit.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And I got, we got really good at shooting free throws because we had a deal that when we would work out before you leave the gym, you got to make 20 in a row. One of us has to make 20 in a row.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And that can take three minutes, it can take an hour.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But it's like, start on a make, make 20 in a row. And the deal we had was it's 20 in a row at the beginning of the season to leave. And it's 24 steak at the derby, which is the best steakhouse in Butte, Montana. But then that goes up in increments of 5. So it's always 20 to leave, then 25 to steak. Then you make that 30 and it goes up. And he got to the point it was nothing for us to make 70 free throws in a row. Yeah, he made 91 one day, which. 91, which is the family record for a week.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Because a week later I made 105. Wow. And what that got me, though, and I didn't realize at the time, that taught me muscle memory. Do everything like you do anything. If you want to be good at something, do it 10,000 times. You want to be great, do it 100,000 times. And so later on in life, when I became a sniper, when I became a close quarters battle instructor, everything from the squeeze, the follow through of a sniper rifle to how are you going to get to your pistol? Not necessarily pull it and shoot, but if you're wearing a jacket, like you're doing a personal protection practice, moving your jacket with your thumb. Put your thumb to your solar plexus. Move it. You're, you know, you're right there. So the muscle memory and just the, the continual training do. Do it the same every time. You're going to learn eventually instead of the instant gratification.

[Jason Tardik]

So you're saying everything from being the team leader of Operation Neptune's where you kill Osama bin Laden, to training to become a Navy SEAL in Hell Week. Your. Your testament is free throws.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Free throws just to get good at something. And I learned short term goals as opposed to long term goals. And that advice came to me from an instructor because I didn't know how to swim when I joined the Navy. Yeah, it was just kind of wild. It was a fluke. I joined because of a girl I got Dumped by a girl. And it was just time to leave town. You know, everyone that age 18, 19, you have a bad relationship. I gotta leave town. I had two buddies. I grew up with, Ben and Jim, who always wanted to be Marines. They were two years older. They joined the Marine Corps, and every time they came home, it's a Marine, like, uniform, stud, haircut, Marine. So when it was time for me to leave town, the easiest way is to join the Marine Corps. You'll be on a bus, Parris Island. It's going to suck, but it's going to be awesome. Yeah, I went to join the Marine Corps. The Marine recruiter was not in the office. The Navy guy was. And the only reason I went in there is my two Marine buddies told me a joke at the time that the Marine Corps is actually part of the department of the Navy. It's just the men's department. And I walked in there like, hey, if. Where's the Marine? If anyone know, you would, because he's in the Navy. And he goes, why do you want the Marines? Like, why don't I be a sniper? I hunt. And he said, look no further. We have snipers in the Navy. You need to be a SEAL first. No big deal. And then we'll send you to sniper school. And that was it. I didn't know how to swim, but I went to SEAL training. And the short term, long term goal was from an instructor. First day we were there, he said, I know you've probably read the books and seen the movies. Regardless of what you've been told, this course is not impossible. People graduate. Look at me. I'm living proof. So I will never ask you to do anything impossible. But I will make you do something very hard, but followed immediately by something very hard, followed by something very hard, day after day after day for eight straight months. And that sounds like a lot to get from now to there. But don't think about eight months from now. Do it like this. Wake up in the morning on time. Make your bed the right way, and then brush your teeth. You just started your day with three wins. Pretty good. Make it to the 4am workout on time. And as I'm beating you, don't think about the pain. Concentrate on your next goal in life, which is breakfast. After breakfast, it's lunch. After lunch, your next goal is dinner. After you finish dinner, do everything you need to do to get back inside that perfectly made bed. And because you took the time for yourself in the morning to make your bed the right way, regardless of how bad today was, Tomorrow's a clean slate. It's a fresh start. And when you. And what he said was, when you feel like quitting, which you will, don't quit. Right. Never quit right now. Quit tomorrow. And if you can keep quitting tomorrow, you can do anything.

[Jason Tardik]

Is the idea behind that. If you quit right now, this moment, that's a. That's a reaction, not a response. And if you take the time, it's then a response.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Don't. Don't react. Do respond. A reaction is emotion. It's like the. It's okay to. To write that nasty email. Don't hit send for 24 hours. It still bothers you. It might be worth it.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But quitting right now is a. Like, pain is temporary. Pride lasts a lifetime.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay, Genius. And it's. I can't wait to get into Hell Week. We will get into Hell Week. Before we do get into Hell Week, I did hear you say something or I read something about. I believe it's called the dyfare program. Is that what you signed up for? And can you tell, especially finance podcasts, can you tell a little bit about compensation and then also what that program means?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Well, it sounded like a lot because it was a $2,500 bonus to me as a dude working at McDonald's.

[Jason Tardik]

Huge.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

That's a big paycheck.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I can put gas in my Buick Skyler, but it gave me. It was a guarantee. I had a buddy tell me he went to the army before I went to the Navy and said, get it in writing. Which is great advice for anything.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Like, even if someone says, we'll do business over handshakes, like, cool, sign the paper, I'll shake your hand.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So he said, because he tried to be a Ranger, and they didn't give it to him because he didn't sign it.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So the Dye Fair program guaranteed me a chance to take a test to get into SEAL training.

[Jason Tardik]

Gotcha.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And then.

[Jason Tardik]

Because not everyone's guaranteed a chance. Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

What the recruiter will tell you if you believe it or not. They'll lie to you to get you in interest. They'll tell you when you get there, you can volunteer, but, you know, get it in writing.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So that guaranteed me a shot at it. And so, yeah, so when I. But it also gave me five months to prepare, which is good because I still. I was going to college at Montana Tech. I still had my ID so I can get into the pool and try to learn how to swim real quick. So I had five Months to learn and then I left. So that was basically it, 2500 bucks if you make it through.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay, so 2500 bucks. Are you paid it all, a stipend like while you're training or going through the process?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Well, yeah, when they start paying you at boot camp, it's not very much.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And then when SEAL training is odd though, it's not, it's not like. It's not like boot camp where you're all in the same room and they wake you up every morning. It's Monday through Friday and you need to be where they want you. They're not going to come get you. You better be there with a full headcount. Everyone there accounted for and then ready to work on the dime.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay, so once you go into the SEAL training, then how long is that process? Nine months.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So that's nine months for the basic underwater demolition SEAL training.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

They're not really teaching you much. They're just beating you.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It's three phases, all physical for the first 11 weeks. Nine weeks of diving, combat diving, open and closed circuit, and 11 weeks of land warfare. So explosives and small arms.

[Jason Tardik]

Damn. Okay. In that nine months, the percentage of people that start versus the percentage of people that complete the training.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

20%.

[Jason Tardik]

Make it 20%.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

That's a big number. Like my class was big with. We started with about 217. We graduated 33 originals.

[Jason Tardik]

Interesting.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Class before me was seven.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But now my, my joke with people is my class was so hard, we graduated two and they us fight it up.

[Jason Tardik]

I like that.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

That's.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, exactly. I love it. So I mean, 20 to 33%, if you don't make it through and you do fail out, do you have a chance to do it again?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah, yeah. Depending on your attitude. Really? Because some guys, like the younger guys are the ones who quit because they're like, well, the fleet. Because if you, if you don't make it, you're probably going to the fleet, to a ship. And it's so bad in training, you're like, well, I'm, I'll just quit and go to the fleet. How bad can that be? That's worse. People in the fleet work harder than we do because it's non stop around the clock. Not as hard physically, but it's a really tough taxing job. Yeah, the older guys who come back from the fleet, they make. Cause they're like, I'm not going back to a ship.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. They're like, hell no.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

All right, so if they like you, they'll let you back.

[Jason Tardik]

I think there's something about Navy SEAL training that it. Like, there's so many people, no matter who's listening to this right now, whatever job they are, they're struggling in a relationship, they're struggling financially. There's so many parallels at just a magnified level. And so I want to kind of dive into it a little bit. But when you saw the people quit, whether it was in their eyes and their physical ability, their mental ability, what was the common consistency behind the people that were quitting and the people that made it? And, like, what are some pieces of advice based on the people that made it that people back home listening right now can take into their life?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Loudmouth and tough guys just didn't make it interesting. And that's. Those are the. And when you show up, because everyone you know, you can never tell what anyone's feeling inside.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And so loudmouth, you think are tough guys, but they're afraid. It's. It's the guys that eventually made it were the guys who just kind of get it. Like, I'm gonna do this. I'll do that. I might not win everything. You know, like, you have the 1 percenters, like the LeBron James and the, you know, Michael Jordans that are just 1%, but most of the guys are just normal dudes that are going to get through it. You learn quickly that it's a mind game. If your mind quits, your body is going to follow. If you're. Once your mind goes, you're never going to talk it back in, but you can convince your body through your mind to do anything. You can stay up that extra few hours. You can do that extra work, run the extra mile if you want to keep your mind in it, and your body's going to get beat down. And people don't quit just because it sucks. But they quit because I'm tired of the shin splints. I'm tired of my busted knee and my broken ankle. I'm tired of the pain. I'm just one after another after another. They're trying to see who will just keep pushing through. It. Even got to a point when we were on the mountain to rescue Latrell awake for three days. I remember saying to my guys, this is why training is so hard, because if we wanted to quit right now, where are we going to go? We're in the Cornwall Valley.

[Jason Tardik]

You're done?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, that's it. Unbelievable. All right, so you go through it all. I mean, you talked real quickly. I don't want to. I don't want to pass this. You talked about the 1 percenters. When you talk about these 1 percenters, the Michael Jordans of LeBron's, we all know them in sports and athletes and maybe even CEOs or business leaders. We don't get to see them behind the scenes. As far as the people that serve our country, like define the 1 percenter.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

You know, well, with us we're, you know, work hard, play hard. Those are the dudes that can go out till midnight, one in the morning, smoke couple cigarettes, run five minute miles at four like that. Just studs that you can knock out 36 pull ups in a row. Okay? Just, they're, they're just, they're just a 1%.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Studs. The guy that can, you know, they can do Muay Thai all damn day and then get on the floor, do Jiu Jitsu, then do CQB for hours.

[Jason Tardik]

Just freaks the nature.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

The rest of us are normal dudes.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay, just.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But just like I said, the guys that get it can keep a solid attitude. Don't get too emotional, don't get too excited about anything. And, and even with quitting and SEAL training, get to a point where if someone's like I'm just going to quit, it's like I can't talk you out of it. Yeah, your mind's made up and I'm.

[Jason Tardik]

Not going to try it makes perfect sense. There's a famous funny TikTok trend that goes viral about how often do dudes think about the Roman Empire. And most of this listening audience is female, about 75%. So they have fun with it, making jokes about it. I would also say that connects to like Hell Week. Like a lot of like my buddies and I will talk about who's the person that can make it, what does it look like, et cetera. Can the people that don't have a clue that are listening right now, they don't even know what Hell Week is. Tell them what it is and tell them like some of the biggest challenges and just paint the picture.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Well, Hell Week is, it starts on Sunday afternoon and you don't sleep until Friday afternoon, early evening. And you're in what's called a boat crew, seven dudes and you're carrying a boat on your head everywhere you go. Big heavy boat and you're running together and that's basically to teach a teamwork in a really hard way. But you're running the whole time. You run a few marathons during the week. You're wet and cold and miserable the entire time. To the point you're so saturated from salt water, sand being wet that by Wednesday, every part of your body that's touching cloth starts to bleed. It's really weird.

[Jason Tardik]

Wow.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And like the short term goal is the next meal. The long term goal for me was get it to Wednesday when the sun comes up because hopefully I'll be so delirious, I'll just push myself through it.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And we decided because you're only with seven dudes, there's a whole class there, but you're only seeing these guys.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And we decided, okay, if you're having a bad time, just tell one of us and maybe we're having a good time. If you're having a good time, tell one of us and maybe we're having a bad time. We'll talk our way out of it. And so you're learning to be a team. You don't go anywhere without anybody else. But. But on Thursday night, we were rowing around Coronado. It's called around the world. It's a long, long row. You're rowing these boats. And we're going past north island, which is a jet base. And I said, hey guys, is that an aircraft carrier right in front of us? And they're like, no. I said, okay, if there's no aircraft carrier right there, I'm assuming that's not a fire breathing dragon on the flight deck. And they go, no. I'm like, okay, I'm having a really good time right now. So if anyone needs help, tell me, they'll carry you or whatever. And followed by immediate lows. But you're learning that you can push yourself through anything. You're learning that your teammates can help you or you can help them. And it almost instills it doesn't matter who you know, if we succeed, it doesn't matter who gets the credit. The team did it.

[Jason Tardik]

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[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah, it. Well, it would go through my mind coming from Montana. Like they would ask me if I just got off a submarine because I don't tan. So even for me, like if there's a 4am workout, I got to be up up at 3 just to put on sunscreen. Then we all got to run to the workout. And. And the workouts are so weird because you work out in the spot. It's an outdoor concrete slab called a grinder where you do a thousand push ups a day, a thousand sit ups a day, a thousand flutter kicks, 500 pull ups. But you know water and also courses. But it's a mile from that to the chow hall. So every single day, regardless of anything, you're running six miles just to eat on top of the 14 miles you're running every single day. And it's one after another. They tie your hands behind your back, your feet together, throwing in the pool for an hour, teaching you what it's like to not be able to wait.

[Jason Tardik]

What?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah, it's called drown proofing. Yeah, I don't know who came up with that name.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But yeah, they throw you in there and they, at first they teach you that Boyle's law works like compression and whatever. If you exhale, you can sink, go to the bottom, come up, inhale, exhale, and you're calming down. Then they have you float for 10 minutes. Floating, tied up. Figure it out. Then swim a couple hundred meters and they'll throw a mask. Gotta grab it with your teeth. And you don't know what you're doing. But what they're teaching you is that panicking is not going to help help. So stay calm. That's it. And people freak out because you're not realizing they're watching you.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And if you start to drown, which happens, they'll come get you and they'll do cpr.

[Jason Tardik]

They're not gonna let you die.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

No.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, but you don't know that but you don't know.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But they're. And you just gotta just calm down. Like, like right now, if you're worried about something that you're worried doesn't have anything to do with, you're wasting your energy. Just drop that bag of bricks.

[Jason Tardik]

It makes perfect sense.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But that, I mean, it's getting tied up in a pool. It's kind of like, all right, what is this? But everyone's doing it.

[Jason Tardik]

You heard that? And I was like, what the hell? I've heard stories about like, even, like, like, you'll have to piss on yourself, you have to shit your pants, like, things like that.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It's a weird mind game because when you, like, you do the, say you do your two mile ocean swim dress, you run a mile to the chow hall. And they don't like, they. You can eat anything. They want you to be putting calories in your body. So like, okay, I want four double cheeseburgers. But we have a four mile run after this, so maybe I shouldn't. But it's not, it's not uncommon that if you got to pee, you got to pee.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

If you got to drop a deuce, maybe go in the ocean so no one will see it. Do your four mile run and keep.

[Jason Tardik]

Keep it up, but just keep going.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah, it's, it's, you know, it's nasty. But we like training to be harder than combat. Because you've probably heard it before, the more you sweat in training, the less you bleed. And we, you know, we. It's just again, it's just one of those things where we can. You'd be surprised if you can push yourself through your mind to do another.

[Jason Tardik]

Thing that you talked about from a mind perspective. And quitting was this theory of sympathetical quitting. I think you called it.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah. And that goes back to the tough guy thing where he's so tough. Oh, he just quit. I'm not that tough. I better quit too. And you watch, guys. It's not uncommon to have the loudmouth quit and 20 guys follow him.

[Jason Tardik]

It makes sense.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And at first you're kind of like, guys, what are you doing? Then you're like, you know, whatever, I don't want you in combat.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Because I don't need you quitting when the bullets are flying this way.

[Jason Tardik]

Makes perfect sense. And I. You think about how many people in life just look left or right to that person and then they quit in whatever it is because they see their leader, their peer pressure or something like that.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Well, it's almost too. Where it feels like Anything, Anything violent that happens a lot of times, people just die of shame.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

They're just afraid. It's so easy just to put your head down and let it happen.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Like actively participate in saving your own life sometimes. And it turns out, I mean, you're with your team, you're with your swim buddy, and if you're by yourself, they're gonna hammer you.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But you learn a lot about, you know, it's a lot of internal stuff that you learn. It is.

[Jason Tardik]

All right, so you see the Marines with growing up, you then say, hey, I'm gonna go be a Marine. You become a Navy seal, you get through SEAL training. You're now like, at the highest point of anyone that's serving. Like, you are the guy. When you finish SEAL training, are you rewarded by the government in any other way? Obviously, pride is massive, but is there an additional compensation? Benefits?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Retirement for being at the government when it reenlists? They will. They will offer you re enlistment up to your 16th year, because at 16, they figured they got you to 20.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So no more. But they got up to I think maybe 70,000, which is good for an enlisted guy.

[Jason Tardik]

Yes.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

That looks nice. I actually had a dude one time, he reenlisted for $45,000 pre 9 11. And he said, real quick though.

[Jason Tardik]

Reenlisting is like, you've served your time and now you're reenlisting.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I'm going to give you four more years.

[Jason Tardik]

Got it?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah. And they'll give you a bonus for doing that because they want to keep you in because they just dumped a lot of money into you to train you, of course. But I had one dude that reenlisted for $45,000. This is before the iPhone. He goes, I got a weird thing. I'm going to put it all into Apple like, you're an idiot.

[Jason Tardik]

Stop.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Not that bad.

[Jason Tardik]

Oh, damn. All right, so if you.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

He's over there sipping a Martini's mansion, laughing at me.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, Right. But. But like Navy seals then are getting. You're technically getting paid similar to people in the Army, Marines, etc.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

They'll. Yeah, you have a base pay that every rank has.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And then they'll pay us additional pay for diving, jumping, combat pay, hazardous duty, save pay if you get to a tier one unit, which it's good when you're there because everyone's making the same amount of money, but you don't realize that you're really, really underpaid.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay, interesting. It is fascinating, but obviously so much pride a Legacy that will live on forever, quite frankly. One thing I heard you say is that snipers will kill more people. I think he said assaulters will kill more famous, famous people. How. How profound is that? Just, it's.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It's one of those things I was saying as a joke, and I just figured it would work because our snipers were getting some. Like they. When we would go, especially to Iraq before we'd go to a. Because you're going in urban environments, going into buildings, snipers get up high and they're just looking out for you. And they, they always spot the bad guys. Really, really good dudes. And they just. They blast people that are trying to get us. They'd save us. Same with the Rangers. We'd always hear them go hot. You know, it's going to be a good night. But I just had that because I was a sniper going to Seal Team 6. But I want to be in the room. I want to be on the hostage rescue. I want to go after the tier one targets. But. But I was even saying too, even though Delta Force is going to get bin Laden, maybe I'll get to meet the guy because I'm an assault or at Seal Team 6.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But it's not gonna be us. There's no way.

[Jason Tardik]

Interesting.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But if you just make yourself available, wherever you are, be there.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. And if you put yourself out there, it might come to fruition. You speak it into existence. Obviously you did. We'll get into that. But you're part of Seal Team 6. Of course. The mission to kill Osama bin Laden before that, over 400 combats. I mean, was there anything within your legacy and length of combats that. That even came close? Guys were doing as far as the bin Laden mission and was. Or any of them as risky as the bin Laden?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

There were a lot more. There were a lot more risky missions that we did.

[Jason Tardik]

Interesting.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And with the missions that we did before, though, it. It was really good. Not, I hate to say training, because we're in combat and we're getting shootouts, but we were learning from it because you'll. You'll learn a lot more from failure than you do from success. And so we would. Because a lot of our tactics, Al Qaeda was. They would monitor them, they would look us up on the Internet. They would find our tactics and they would adjust to what they thought we do. We'd have to readjust. So we're constantly changing our training, making sure our guys are prepared. We go and we learn little things like if you see movies and something Happens and people start screaming, go, go, go. Yeah. And yelling a shooter, blah, blah, blah. We learn. Shut up. If I see you turn a corner and point up, you don't need to yell stairway. I'll assume it's either stairway or you ran into a 14 foot terrorist.

[Jason Tardik]

Interesting.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And if you're putting a bomb on the door, you don't need to yell fire in the hole. I'm assuming you're going to blow it up.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, that's it.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

You might as well go, here we are, here we come. Just shut up. Keep it simple, too. Like when someone, they asked me about the bin Laden raid, some compound that big, how did 23 you guys clear it? That's not a lot of guys. And I was like, well, if the guy in front of me went left, I went right and we just kept doing that space. Keep it simple.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, Keep it simple.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah. So. So we would learn from it to the point where we got, I mean, we got really good. And we would just learn from targets. And then we would always. Every day I went to work at Seal Team 6, I would wake up excited because I get to go to work with people who are better than me. And instead of undermining someone that's successful, I would ask them, like, if someone outshot me on a competition, I, I wouldn't try to cheat their score. I would say, hey, what time do you wake up and what's your workout? What do you eat in the morning? Why did you move this pouch to that side? What, what are you. What's your thinking process and making the team better? You know, it's just, it's exciting and we learn from everything.

[Jason Tardik]

When you're doing your work as a sniper, I have read that majority of the work is actually surveying. It's like. Right. A lot of it's just surveying the area as opposed to shooting. Is that the case?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

A lot of it is watching.

[Jason Tardik]

Watching.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Boring.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Before we went, right before 9 11, we were in Kosovo. We do three day missions in the mountains watching towns. And it's just, it's so monotonous. It's so boring. You're looking through the same scope. And that's where I learned to count. Just start counting one to a thousand. Thousand to one to what?

[Jason Tardik]

Keep yourself entertained.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah, because you're looking. But I want to keep my mind on something interesting instead of just like, you know, fading out and falling asleep.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And that helped. But even with snipers, a traditional sniper shot, pulling the trigger, simple. Holding it where someone tells you to hold it is simple. The spotter's got the hard job. So a spotter will lay right behind you with a spotting scope over your shoulder. And his job is to tell you where the target is, sort of guess the distance. The further you get out, your distance needs to be spot on. So whether you're lazing it or doing mil dot counts or whatever. And then the sniper can. Or the spotter can actually see the vapor trail, the bullet. So he's got to correct for the shooter.

[Jason Tardik]

Interesting.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So all I'll say is, like, you know, two left, up three. And then the sniper just holds and pulls, and spotter's got to be right.

[Jason Tardik]

And the spotter. Well, you just something I want to backtrack to you. You said, like, what is this guy eating? And was this guy working out? I would never connect nutrition and weightlifting to potential success of a shooter, a sniper. So, like, what are the things that go into making those people the best of the best in their business? Those people you like, what is it?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I think, well, the nutrition is with anything. Like, you're. You're gonna. And I'm guilty. You know, instead of eating a fast food in the morning, having. Having a protein shake or something like that, because everything from. With shooting, like, your heart rate might go down. What are you, like, what is making you better than me? And I want to copy you. That's basically it.

[Jason Tardik]

And so do you. Like they say most. The most successful CEOs in this country actually have super low cortisol levels. And they're just not like, impacted by stress. Do you connection into that?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I think so. I get. I still. I give myself my own advice every day.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And I'll flip out about the dumbest stuff, but I have to take a deep breath and a step back and realize that stress is a choice. Like, I can be stressed out or I can just not. But it takes a minute for me to do that. Like, even today with something with traffic, I'm yelling. I'm like, all right, that's not going to speed her up or speed him up or whatever. Chill out.

[Jason Tardik]

So, like, the concept of, like, anxiety and stress, you're just like, no, you control that.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah. You can't control. Can.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But you can also let it spin out of control. It's like, like panic is contagious. If. If someone panics, we all, like, look at. Why did we run out of toilet paper in 2020?

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It's not. Toilet paper is not a survival mechanism. It's just nice to have.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But someone bought it all. Someone else saw Them. So we bought it. And it's panic. Yeah, that and, like, look at an airport if someone from zone five tries to board with Zone one. Chaos.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. And it's true.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But you know what else is contagious that I learned is calm. Because no one can tell what you're thinking. Thinking. And if you could portray calm, people will see you and be calm, and that makes everyone calm.

[Jason Tardik]

That makes a lot.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But again, like, it sounds good in theory.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I'll be screaming at someone.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, yeah, let's talk.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Let's.

[Jason Tardik]

Let's actually take that into practice. Right? So so many people here will deal with crazy days or bosses or they get screwed over on a deal, whatever. They go nuts, they freak out. And your line of work, like, your. Your pinnacle of what is probably the most frustrating, scary, lonely, sad, fearful, is probably knowing that you're doing something that is, like, actually human's life in your mind. How do you. How do you deal with that as it connects to your career? Like, what are some of the things you do to process that?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Well, at the time, you're doing what everyone else is doing. And so if everyone's special, no one's special. When I was at SEAL Team 6, the only people I knew were SEALs, SEALs families, and bartenders. So it was like, in your life.

[Jason Tardik]

Those are the only humans you know?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I know. You know, I know guys who would make headlines. Not necessarily their name, but the mission they run. I know guys that would save lives. And then I'd see him in the gym, and it was just normal. So killing people was normal. The problem is later, seven, eight years later, when you're thinking, like, one of my things, there's a guy I think about every day, that I killed him in his room in front of his wife, and I killed his brother in the living room. I came in there, and I think about him, and I think, all right, why did I kill him? Well, he went for his gun. Why did he go for his gun? Well, because I was in his room at 2 in the morning. His worst nightmare. Why was I in his room? Well, because President Bush decided he didn't like Saddam Hussein because he tried to do something to his dad. So we invaded Iraq. And then I start thinking, well, what if I would have met that dude somewhere else? Like Paris, over coffee? Was he funny? I don't know. I went for a gun. He's obviously a bad guy, but that's the stuff that goes through your head.

[Jason Tardik]

Sure.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And so right now, I mean, I've been to combat a ton, but I'll be the first guy to say war is not the best thing. Maybe we should take another route.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Because it seems like the people that want to send us to war never go to war, don't have family members go to war, but they sure make a lot of money off.

[Jason Tardik]

And then eight years later when those things come to fruition, like, what are some coping mechanisms you've dealt with?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Well, talking with guys that were there. And I like to think we never hit the wrong target. I've been fortunate because I never killed the wrong person.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And I mean, I know these are bad guys, but it's almost like it. Can we just take a second here?

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Maybe this is something.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Am I an asshole for being in your house right now?

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But at the time, it's like we're trying to see who can get more kills.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

We went. We were at a point in Iraq where if we only killed 11 guys in a night, we're like, we just wasted our time. That wasn't even worse. Wow.

[Jason Tardik]

What were you like when you were killing in Iraq? What were you looking for? Al Qaeda.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

What Al Qaeda was. So there's a Sunni, Shia split. They don't like each other. And Sunni is Al Qaeda. And so the easiest place to fight Americans was in Iraq. So they come from Jordan, Egypt, Anything Sunni? Sunnis, the majority of Muslims, we run into Shia too. But that's in the Shia part of town, like Maqtatah, al Sadr. But what the Sunnis were doing, and this is why it's tough with the civilians, they would come into Sunni parts and make the Sunni families let them stay with them. So these are bad guys and they're not friendly to them. And here's where you're dealing with the people in a combat zone that just want to get on with their lives. They deal with Al Qaeda all day and then they have to deal with us at night. And they got a tightrope it because they're either going to go to Abu Ghraib or they're going to get their head cut off. So what we would do is we would. We figured out how to talk to the people. And what we learned was don't interrogate, but talk to, like, the youngest kid in the house, pull them aside, and, like, I would keep an interpreter behind the kid and I would say, who finally, like, dust them off? Finally the man of the house. Who are these dudes? Like, who don't you know? I don't know those three. And like, they can't see Him, I don't know those three guys. It's like, boom, that's Al Qaeda.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay, gotcha. And so. And you're doing your due diligence through negotiation, which people do every day in their jobs. And your idea here is like, we're trying to separate the good from the evil so we could take it down.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Most people are good people.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Al Qaeda's are. They're not good people. And these guys don't want them in there. So we figured if we can start killing Al Qaeda, the Sunni will be on our team, which they were. And it worked. During 07, it was called the, the Awakening. Winning.

[Jason Tardik]

Right.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And we were fighting Al Qaeda, who deserved to be fought. And we, you know, we were winning over people too. It was, it was something to watch. But, you know, again, you get politicians and lawyers involved, it gets all screwed up.

[Jason Tardik]

It gets all screwed up. Legendary Seal Team 6, obviously you are a massive part of that, but I want to ask about Seal Team 2, Seal Team 4. See, just exactly like, how are those teams orchestrated? Like how, like you hear these names, you hear these titles, like, how do you. How is it you that gets called?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It was again, keeping things simple at first. There was Seal Team 1 and Seal Team 2. So the odd number is in Coronado, even in Virginia. Okay, that was the first teams. So now the even numbers are all in Virginia. 2, 4, 8, 10, 3, 1, 3, 5, 7. But at. When Seal Team 6 was commissioned, that was in 1980, there was 1, 2. And then Richard Marcinko commissioned 6 because he knew the Russians would say, okay, we know about SEAL Team 1, 2, and 6. Where the hell are 3, 4, and 5? Just a psychological aspect of it. But 6 is the, is the tier one unit, and you need to do another selection course to get there. And that is the Hostage Rescue National Mission Force. So we're going to get the Hostage Rescue at sea. We're going to get the Bin Ladri.

[Jason Tardik]

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[Robert J. O'Neill]

You know, it was once you calm down.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I was really worried about my sense of humor, because these guys are funny.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Like, I can do the physical stuff, and I'm. Yeah. But like, even, like, we. Selection is really hard, and we thought we were. So we call it close quarters battle cqb, which is the. The SWAT team entrance. You do. And you got to get really good at that because our. For us, combat came down to an entry point, like a door or a cave entrance, a ship hatch. And once we got through with the hardest selection course in the world, I like, we're good. And then I got to my squadron, and the first run, they're just gone. I'm like, the hell those guys go? They're just clearing the house without me. Wow. So tactics, speed, and humor.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And the humor.

[Jason Tardik]

The humor is interesting. You wouldn't expect that.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

You can't lose your sense of humor, because if morale takes a dump, the whole team's gonna fall.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And keeping it simple, one of our models is nobody wants to work for a dick.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I had a dude tell me that nobody ever worked for me. They work with me. Prime example. Because the difference between officers and enlisted, the officers are technically in charge, and the enlisted are lower, but they kind of run the team. We were in Iraq, that 07 deployment, and we would hit a house full of terrorists, but then we'd find intelligence, go to another house, call, follow on targets, hit another one, another, another. Now we're sweaty, it's hot, even though it's night, and I want to hit another one. I would keep my maps. Like a quarterback.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And my boss, who's an officer, my commander was Right here. And I said, all right, here's the deal. We're in building one one right now. I want to hit two, and I go, you know what? Shit, sir, you're in charge. And he said. He said, he's a good leader. He said, oh, make no mistake, I'm not in charge. I'm responsible. You're in charge. Don't fuck me. Oh. He's like, that's. That's a good leader right there.

[Jason Tardik]

Ah, the amount of life lessons you learn in a roller coaster, you learn in the hardware. Yeah, it's like the hardest way of always. One thing I heard and I read about was about. And I think the exact quote you used before you got into the monologue was you said, the woman who found bin Laden told you that I don't know what's inside, but there will be a stairwell, and then you're going to run into Khalid bin Laden's son. But before we go there, when I stopped at the woman who found bin Laden.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah.

[Jason Tardik]

How many times were you guys on missions or do you know of missions that were deployed in which you thought bin Laden was found? Wasn't that was the first time?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah, we thought. We thought he was a ghost. He's gone. We're never going to find him. My last deployment, a few months before the bin Laden raids ended at about February of 11. And I was actually on the base in Jalalabad, Afghanistan, the CIA base where the bin Laden team was. I didn't even know they were there. Yeah, I didn't know they were tracking him. And I didn't know this particular one woman. Her only job in life was to find him, and she was there.

[Jason Tardik]

And how did she find him?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

At some point, they intercepted some phone calls from one of his old couriers to his mom in Kuwait. And what they were. She asked where he was, and he said, I'm working with the people I used to work for. And they just knew that she was. Her son was attached to bin Laden. So this guy was so smart. He would drive around places like Karachi, Pakistan. Someone would drive. And he's on his phone, and they can't quite find him because he's moving, moving. So they had a. Like, he would make a call, they intercept. You got to find him. And we're talking in Karachi, like, bazaars and people everywhere. You got to find one car. You don't know what it looks like with a guy on a phone. That's going to take years. They finally got him, and then they got to track him back where he's going. And the way they would do that is get a local and follow him to a spot where you lose him and then keep someone there. And then if you see him again, follow him there and then keep them there. Keep them there. And they did that for years until finally the guy took a right down a dead end road. Okay, he went to that house. That's something. Now they started watching that and then they got to watch the house. And they were. The bin Laden's were really good at their operational security. Like they didn't. They burn all their trash. They grew their own food. Nobody gets in. They call them the Pacer. They would see one dude that would walk around and the smart people would see like his shadow. And based on whatever he's this tall, that matches. He never stops to do menial work with other people. He's really important. That's someone, it's either a major drug dealer or that's an Al Qaeda leader. And she was the one that knew it. And she turned out to be 100% right on every single person in that house.

[Jason Tardik]

Unbelievable. When, when she did say that she thought he was there, did she give a percentage of likely? She knew 100%.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

We would finish training, like we would work with helicopters all day long, all night long, working our problems, working our contingencies. Then we'd go back to the hotel. Someone had made a two scale model of his house. We'd talk about everything, keep talking. And when we were done, she would say, okay, guys, Osama bin Laden right now is on the third floor of this house. I don't understand why we're not going. Sleep well. Same thing every night. Guys, we gotta go. He's gonna leave.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. Some of the greatest evils that we've ever seen in the history of the world. Some people also, but in this classification is like genius. Would you put like a bin Laden? Would you space that? Like he's like you're saying IQ genius, Charismatic.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Millions of people love them because when you go into combat, you gotta figure everyone thinks they're the good guy. And so he had followers that literally would blow themselves up for him. Because he told them if they Marty themselves, they go to paradise. And. No, but they know it and you have to see it to believe it. I tell people like when you go to Thanksgiving dinner and that one crazy aunt who's completely religious and out of her mind. Yeah, they. And she knows she's right. They're worse. They know they're right and they're killing themselves over this.

[Jason Tardik]

Unbelievable.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So yeah, he was a genius.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay, let me get into this though with Din Laden. So you're, you're, you're called to action. It's go time. You've practiced a hundred times over when you're getting ready. And, and I'm trying to make parallels of the craziest examples ever to exist in the world to like anybody at home that's getting ready for, for maybe a big day. But you're getting ready. Are you like let's kill this motherfucker? Are you like I might die today? Are you like shitting your pants? Like what is, what is going through your brain?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

There wasn't fear at all. No. But we expected it to be a one way mission.

[Jason Tardik]

But how do you not have fear in a moment that really creates.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It's not gonna matter the way we're gonna die. We won't know. Cause it's a 90 minute flight in on helicopters that we don't know if they work. And they, this is, we're not at war with this country. First World Air Defense, 90 minutes to fly in. There's going to be a gunfight as soon as we land. If anyone's going to blow his whole house up and kill everyone inside, it's Bin Laden. We're going to run out of fuel. We don't have places to refuel on the way in. So we might end up dying fighting Pakistani police, We might end up in a Pakistani prison. That'd be a slow death. We were so convinced that we weren't coming home that the guy that actually was with me on the last set of stairs wasn't planned that way, it just worked out that way. He said, don't take this the wrong way because I'm going 100%. I just need to say it out loud. If we know we're going to die, why are we going? Which is fair. And what we said to each other was we're not going for the fame or the, we're never getting the reward, but we are going after bin Laden for the first Americans to fight Al Qaeda toe to toe to the death. And those are the passengers on United 93. We're going after bin Laden for the single mom who dropped her kids off at elementary school on a beautiful Tuesday morning and an hour later she jumped to her death out of a skyscraper because that's a better alternative than whatever is going on inside. And like she looked down and made a choice and maybe grabbed her a stranger's hand and her last gesture of human decency was holding her skirt together. As she killed herself. They were never supposed to be in the fight. We're supposed to be in the fight. And that's why we're going. That's the conversation we had with each other.

[Jason Tardik]

Wow.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And it was. I mean, even before we left, it wasn't handshake, it was a hug. And like, time to go, boys.

[Jason Tardik]

And you in. In your head, there was a big likelihood that you weren't coming back.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Well, I even ran into. They called her Maya in the movie. I ran into her at. On the way to the helicopter and she was outside. She came over with us. She's in Jalalabad. And. And she was pacing. And I said, hey, why are you nervous? And she goes, are you kidding me? Why aren't you nervous? And I said, because I do this every night, man. I fly somewhere, I with people. I come home.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And I was walking away. And I go, of course. You need to be right on this one. So I understand why you're pacing. I'll see you in a few hours.

[Jason Tardik]

All right. Give me of all this experience, which is so wild. What is like one takeaway to keep your composure in times of mayhem. Breathing, mental, telling yourself, get rid of the noise.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

You know, if. Again, if some. If you can't affect something with worrying, let it go. The whole what someone else says about you is none of your business. Breathe.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Slow down. Slow is smooth, smooth is fast. If you want to be fast, slow down.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, I like that. And I think the big thing I'm taking away is like reconditioning your thinking. Right. If you're thinking like, if we know we're going to die, why are we going? Just that reposition of this is why we're going. Think about how your attitude shifts, your energy shifts. Like every motivation shift shifts. Just reframing.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

We even had like the Braveheart talk where because we told guys, you can pull yourself off anytime, you don't have to go. We have alternates.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And you can go and you can live for 50 years. However, on your deathbed, would you give every single day for one shot at this guy?

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And the answer better be yes. And it was for everyone.

[Jason Tardik]

I love it.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And then going into. It's like we didn't get dressed up for nothing. Like Braveheart said, we're going to kill this guy.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. 100. And then you do it. You guys get in there and you tell the story about how you get up there and all of a sudden you're three feet from bin Laden and one of your seals says, are you good? And you're like, now what do we do?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

What do we do now?

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, what do we do now?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah. After I shot him three times, his wife Amal, he was like pushing, sort of pushing her toward me, and I was moving her because I was in the room alone. But I know other guys are coming in and we are the good guys, so I don't want her to get hurt. And I actually looked down and I saw his two year old son Hussein standing there. And this is the humanity of it. As a father, I was thinking, this kid's got nothing to do with this.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So I've moved them back and then I turn around, he's. I can hear bin Laden take his last breath. And a guy comes up to me, goes, are you good? And I said, what do we do now? And he, he smiled and he said, well, now we find the computers that. You do this every night, Hundreds of times. Come on.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. Wake up.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I go, yeah, you're right. I'm back. Holy. And he goes, yeah, you just killed Osama bin Laden. Your life just changed. Get to work.

[Jason Tardik]

And it was just like, get to work.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah, well, pull me back into it. Okay. Because we're supposed to be dead. And I was like, well, now we can leave.

[Jason Tardik]

Once. Yeah, once you were in, like, once you guys were exiting, was there any risk at that point or were you guys in the clear?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

A whole bunch of risk. Because the locals, because this is a resort town, this isn't a war zone. The locals were kind of coming out because we crashed a helicopter.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It's loud on a Sunday night. There was a dude outside tweeting about that. And the locals were. We brought a dude with us though. And no kidding, I still don't know who he was. Yeah, I think he was a targeting officer or something. But he spoke fluent Urdu.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So he didn't know, actually. And he was yelling at the people, go home. This is an ISI exercise. No big deal. And so. And then. But we had to blow up a helicopter and bring another one in to get out. So it was busy. Plus, we didn't have our Air Force guys with us. They're our experts at calling an aircraft. I mean, we know how to do it. We're not as good as them. Like, the most dangerous guy you never heard is a combat controller in the Air Force.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But we didn't bring him. We just us. So we had to call one in. They came in and then we. We hopped on a big helicopter to leave. We had. We flew in on stealth helicopters. But this is a Chinook, which is a size bigger than a school bus. It's got two rotors. And we got to fly that out. So that's a. That can get shot down. And then we got 90 minutes to fly out and think about it. But worrying about a missile is not going to stop it. So occupy your mind another way.

[Jason Tardik]

You've talked about this publicly over and over, wrote an amazing book, have a podcast, all the things. I mean, have you ever had concern about your identity being out there, given that? And I mean, how do you manage that? Like, I mean, well, wait, Joker, we joke around in the Bachelor franchise. Don't say anything. We're going to get a lawsuit. You like? How do you deal with that 24 7?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Well, I mean, it's okay. The way it worked for me was even in the house, guys that were on the second and first floor. So. Okay. My nickname was Nisro N sro stood for Navy SEAL Rob o' Neill. They just called me Nisro.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And. And I'm known for telling stories and keeping morale high, jokes and shit. And every single SEAL that as soon as they found out bin Laden was dead, they would ask who got him and they'd say, nisro. And they'd be like, we're never going to hear the end of this. But every SEAL asked that. And so when we're flying back, other seals in Virginia beach heard it, and a buddy from Coronado called them, don't tell anybody, but dudes would be out and at a bar, the bartender who got it, both don't say anything. But. So by the time we landed back in Virginia beach, everyone in the SEAL community knew I did it. I had guys from the White House call down and congratulations, and up in New York, so my name's out there already. And, you know, I try to keep it that way for a while. That's. You can't get that toothpaste back in the tube. And it's better to acknowledge a threat than to put your head in the sand and think it doesn't exist. So, I mean, it's there. And, you know, I. I have security stuff I do. You know, guns, dogs, cameras. But the unfortunate thing is they need to be right once. But an important lesson is to think like, I'm a target, but so is every American. And there's sleeper cells here now. And not to scare everyone, but would it be easier for Al Qaeda to come find me a hard target? Or would it be easier to go to Times Square?

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

What Are they going to. Do they want a big, beautiful target? Not me. If they get me, great. But they're going to get in a fight to. Yeah, it's not fun, believe me. I mean, it's one of those things where it's.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It's like.

[Jason Tardik]

Has there been, like, any attempts?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

There's been a couple foiled, but I don't know how serious it could be. I don't know.

[Jason Tardik]

All right, so your life changes the second you pull that trigger. I have so many more questions I want to ask, but I do want to bring it back to the podcast. When do you start to see your life change publicly and then even financially with some of the. With the accolades?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I started my process of. I wanted to get out after the raid. It was just too. There was. It was too high profile.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And then August 6, 2011, extortion. 17 was shot down. We lost 31Americans, 17 guys from SEAL Team 6. And that's when I was like, okay, I gotta get out. I've got daughters. I want to see them get married. It's time. Like, a bullet needs to be right once. That's the unfortunate truth. So I started the process of getting out, but I'm getting out before 20 years. So I don't have retirement, I don't have healthcare, I don't have a savings. So I got to figure it out. I actually extended for six months so I could go back overseas because we lost so many guys that went back to war to backfill, and then I had till August to figure out it out. And I didn't know what to do at the time. I didn't know that, like, effective communication stress management is something people want to hire. But I didn't know I had that. Like, I know guys now that would rather go to combat than fill out a resume because combat makes sense. This doesn't. I don't know what shoes to wear with a tie. But once, like, I started a foundation called Special Operators Transition foundation, and we introduced veterans to the private sector. And I have yet to have a CEO not say, that's the best employee I've ever had. Oh, I'm sure. Because, like, you come in with these attributes and we'll teach you the job.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. And you'll get it done.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So it was. It was easier than I thought. Not easy. But I got into public speaking just. And I wasn't even telling the bin Laden story. I was just talking about our success as a high performance team.

[Jason Tardik]

And it just resonated financial transparency here. Like, we talk I'm just kind of like bewildered by this. But like that day that you killed bin Laden financially, like how much money did you have in your name?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Paycheck to paycheck. So maybe 2,500 every two weeks.

[Jason Tardik]

So like maybe a $2,500 in your.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Bank account maybe depending on how many hair dids the girls got my daughters, I mean I didn't know how much it cost to go to get a pedicure until my daughter started doing it.

[Jason Tardik]

But like the guy, I mean, it's the guy who literally is a Navy SEAL who gets called upon and kills bin Laden, is broke.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah. I mean these are normal dudes, Navy seals. When we rescued Kathy and Phillips, it was Good Friday, April 10, which is my birthday in 2009. I was at my daughter's Easter tea party at her preschool.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And then I got a call that a guy by the name of Captain Phillips had been taken by Somali pirates. They called my team to go get them. I had to kiss my daughter goodbye. Fifteen hours and 46 minutes later, I had a full headcount in the Indian Ocean and we rescued Richard Phillips from Somali pirates.

[Jason Tardik]

And we were still broken.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Dudes are mowing their own lawn, can't afford the mortgage. They get a call, they gotta go.

[Jason Tardik]

To me, that feels like a serious, serious problem.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Problem. We don't realize it is though. It's like everyone's struggling so we're just together. Misery loves company. Yeah.

[Jason Tardik]

And then you're, you know, again, the guy that kills bin Laden is still trying to find ways to work and make money even after that, like just grinding out, just trying to make a couple.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Well, I think about to the, the family side of it. I'm a, I'm a girl, dad.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Four daughters. My youngest daughter at the time was four. Maybe for the bin Laden. I couldn't even tell anyone we were going. I just got back from war.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And I, I couldn't tell her we're leaving, whatever. And my little girl went up. I don't know what at that age you put into a, a little pink carry on, but she came downstairs and she put it by the door, said, well when you come back, we're going on a trip. My little 4 year old is like, I'm gonna die next week. There's a toll that these guys, men and women, I think we're just the guys that went there. There's so many women behind the scenes that of course, and they, they're the smart ones. I, I always tell people I was smart enough to carry a sledgehammer and a gun. Just point me in the direction. We'll figure it out.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. Oh my gosh. Just absolutely crazy. I recently had a buddy's wedding and they had a photo and I'm not kidding, there was literally a line all night outside this photo booth. Everyone loved it. Now what is one thing you see at every wedding or major event that you didn't see 10 years ago? It's a photo booth. Yes. Like literally they are everywhere and people are always in line for them. Turns out owning a photo booth business is actually one of the fastest growing ways to make great money. And photo booth supply company makes it so easy. Even if you've never owned a business before, Weddings, parties, corporate events, photo booths are a must have for every party. And with photo booth supply company you get the hottest photo booths step by step guides and expert one on one coaching to help you get it up and running fast. And get this photo booth supply company top earners make over six figures a year. Whether you're looking for a side hustle or ready to build a full time business, now it's the time to start. The summer is the busiest season. For a limited time, photo booth supply company will give you their quick start program for free. Loaded with all the resources you need to launch your business and make money this season. Curious how much you could make by running your own photo booth business? Check out the free profit [e-mail] secrets that's startphotobooth.com secrets start photobooth.com secrets so you decide to hang them up after that. But you don't even hit your full retirement. It's still like the. And your identity's at risk. There's death threats and there's still nothing that the government is doing to like not even like a little, hey, little money out the of to do something like you did. That's crazy.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

They gave the last White House Secret Service detail. I have to pay for my own security.

[Jason Tardik]

Well, I mean just. Yeah, especially when you start to get to politics, you start to get into like a little bit of insider trading and like what's going like it's crazy that like you're still paying for your. I mean that's. That. That is asinine. Have you fought that at all? Have you done anything in that?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Not fought it. I've brought it up. I'm headed to D.C. soon just to talk about PTSD, all kinds of, of brain traumatic brain injury stuff with Congress. Just, you know, I'm not Worried about myself. I'll figure it out.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah. The politics of it. It's. It's. It's. It's tough to go paycheck to paycheck. And you watch politicians who can pick stocks better than Warren Buffett.

[Jason Tardik]

That's what I'm saying. Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It's almost like they're really good at this.

[Jason Tardik]

Or.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Or do they know something we don't?

[Jason Tardik]

Or do they know something that we don't? When you're about, like, as far as CIA, you said that you, like, your identity was protected. Like, you only knew a handful of people. Like. Like is like. Is that, like, you don't have any friends? Like, people can't know what you're doing. Everything's a secret what you're doing.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

The missions were secret, but it was just our community.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Because we knew. A lot of us still knew each other from SEAL training in 1996.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And that's just what we know. We know we travel all the time. We're on the road all the time, and our families just know each other.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So it just was like, you know, it's like, even, like, we know some motorcycle gangs because we'll ride with them on Sunday. So, you know, but it's basically the same crew everywhere we go. And that's just all we knew.

[Jason Tardik]

Understood.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

All right.

[Jason Tardik]

That was in 2011. Fast forward 2025. Now an author, podcast host, public speaker. You own your own cannabis company. An entrepreneur that took two years to get licensed.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yes.

[Jason Tardik]

Have you started to see some financial success with some of your entrepreneurial.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah. What I. The biggest lesson I learned was what my fair share in taxes is.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Because in the Navy, they're just withholding it. You don't realize it.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And then once you get out, you're like, I gotta check every quarter who's getting this. That's why I get pissed off, because I've been to Liberia.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And when I went there in 2003, there was a civil war in cannibalism.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And to find out that millions of our tax dollars went over there so they could understand their voting rights rights.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It's like, dude, they're wearing life vests on land, shooting each other. They don't care about their voting rights, who's keeping that money.

[Jason Tardik]

Right. But.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah. I mean. Yeah.

[Jason Tardik]

Interesting.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

But I learned, you know, you. You. You can get paid for what you're worth. And a lot of. A lot of my foundation came from public speaking. Like, when. When I was told that public speakers get paid, they told me how much? I had to say, hey, is this why I call a crime? No one pays that much money. Oh, this is just the private sector. And people pay for shit here.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. As if.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah. The government's not going to pay you.

[Jason Tardik]

Is it fair to say with public speaking, you made more in public speaking than you made your entire time serving?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

In the first six months.

[Jason Tardik]

In the first six months. Unbelievable. I mean. Well, I'm glad you're in the private sector now. You deserve.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

You know what's funny to the difference between being in the military and the private sector? I went out to my very first speech. I was in Florida. I'd never spoken publicly.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I didn't have any training. And I got to go. It's like 2,000 people. And I called my agent. I was like, hey, I'm a little nervous. I've been shot at, but I don't know if I'm going to faint out there. And she goes, hey, here's the key. Have three glasses of red wine right now. Not two, not four. Three. You'll be fine. And so I went out there and there happened. It was the Airline Pilots association. And so they were captains. Airline captains, yeah. And they were Marines. And so I got immediately heckled for being Navy. And I'm like, this is a safe crowd.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, you're good. You're good.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Okay, I can do it.

[Jason Tardik]

How wild is that? For anybody out there that gets nervous about speaking, even Robert J. O' Neill, who had to literally think his life was gone, killing Osama bin Laden, had to take three glasses of wine. You're making yourself so relatable, it's unbelievable. I want to give you the opportunity to talk about your foundation and your. Your new cannabis company, and where, if people, they're interested, how they can get involved with both and your book, so the platform's yours. And, like, just tell us all the things we could start with your cannabis.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah. Check out operator canna.com.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And everything I do is the operator. Because I'm not just saying that I'm the operator. I'm describing the life of the operator. And the operator is in anybody. The operator is the dude who doesn't get thanked for cleaning up the trash in Manhattan at 2 in the morning. But he's cleaning it up. He's got a family, too. He has to leave them. Doesn't make much money. The single mom's the best one.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Because she is making the family run, and that's the core to anything successful. She's an operator. So as an operator I will tell you what I think, you tell me what you think and if I'm wrong, I'll admit it. And I'd like to get your input. So the operator Canna is just. We got a couple's different strains, Indica, Sativa and Hybrid. And it's because of the post traumatic stress, the anxiety, a lot of sleep problem. I had a lot of problems sleeping and you know, with alcohol I wasn't getting good sleep and I'd get in a little bit of trouble sometimes with cannabis. It helps me sleep, chills me out a little bit, gets rid of the noise. So we're starting to sell it in Manhattan. We're looking to move with that. That's my primary right now. Just because it's a different way and it's a good way to help even TBI anxiety and stress. The Psychedelics Veterans Exploring Treatment Solutions vetsolutions.org okay and that's the group that sends veterans to Mexico to do, to do psychedelics and or plant based medicine. So that's ibogaine, we were talking about that before, which is a 5,000 year old brute from Gabon. And it just gets you into your brain stuff that you've compartmentalized or shut down. It shows it to you again, you deal with it, you come out of it. And this stuff cures addiction, it's cured, it's cured. Alcoholism, fertility problems. It cured and that's why we don't have it here legally because it cures and it's a wonderful, wonderful plant.

[Jason Tardik]

Another issue in this country, preventative vetting and cures.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

So with that and then my foundation, Special operators transition foundation sotf.org and that's the one where we take veterans and put them in the private sector. And it started out as a I want to help veterans get another job, but now it's like I want to help the economy because these are really solid people and men and women, because there are female special operators traders that no one knows about, we have them.

[Jason Tardik]

Makes a lot of sense. I also, it feels like anyone that comes on the show has a book and we just had to find gentlemen who had a book. I asked him the same question. I always ask this. So there's a million books out there. Obviously this is yours. What is like the trading secret of why someone should pick this up? Like what is the big thing? That's like this is the book you need to read and here's why.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It's proof that it doesn't matter what you look like or where you're from, you can do anything. Don't put yourself in a bubble. Bubble. That you think just because someone's from a different part of the country, they're better than you, you can do whatever. That's. That's it. Because I didn't know how to swim, joined the Navy on a whim, on accident, and just made myself available. I mentioned it before. One of my favorite quotes is, wherever you are, be there.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And, and just make yourself available. And stuff can happen. And I, you know, I went from a bad relationship into the Navy on accident. I mean, even the little things, like, I tell my daughters now that because I try to join the Marine Corps, the butterfly effect is it doesn't matter if it's a good or bad decision in 20, 30 years, the impact it has is amazing. I tell my daughters, if that Marine recruiter wasn't at Arby's at 11:30 on a Wednesday, you wouldn't be alive.

[Jason Tardik]

How crazy.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Because I'd be in North Carolina, not Virginia.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. How crazy.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It's just that. So. And again, take the shot. Take the shot. Apply for that job. Try to get the role. Write a book, write a play. Take the shot. And if you fail, you're going to learn. Because you learn from failure. The frustration is the learning process.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. And again, it's a very minor comparison to what you said on the, on the ground. But like, like in 50 years from now, when you're on your deathbed, like, you're going to be like, why didn't I take that shot?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

That's good, too. Is, is when you're on your deathbed, what are you going to be asking yourself?

[Jason Tardik]

You're not.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

You're going to be talking about your family. You're going to be thinking about them.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Plus if you get buried with your money, the government's going to take some of it.

[Jason Tardik]

That's true. At the end of the day, all right, that's the operator firing the shots that killed Osama bin Laden. In my years as a SEAL team warrior before I rap it's current, it's something I have been wondering about endlessly. I'm a bit, a big. I'm a big true crime guy. And the assassination attempt of Donald Trump, I feel like it, like, came, went. No one says a word.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Yeah.

[Jason Tardik]

And I'm wondering from your perspective, I'd be remiss if I didn't ask. What's your take on what happened? You know, what do you just, you know, when you looked at, like, the surrounding area of it, with your brain and your skill Set. Where are things that you saw wrong? Like, just what's the overall take from Robert J. O' Neill?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Inside job, basically. What happened, happened to.

[Jason Tardik]

Like, you just said that so confidently.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Well, yeah, exactly. What happened to Kennedy, happened to Trump, except they missed. You know, you kill. Kill Kennedy, you kill Lee Harvey Oswald. Problem solved. This kid missed. Then they killed him. He was supposed to hit Trump, kill him, it's over. You don't get that. John. John F. Kennedy said, I'm going to smash the CIA to a thousand pieces because of what they did in. In the Bay of Pigs. Because he said, we're not invading. So they went ahead and let the Cubans go ago, thinking, hey, we need air support. And Kennedy said, no, I told you, we're not doing that. I don't like what the agency is doing. And you heard Chuck Schumer say, don't cross the intelligence agencies. They will seven ways from Sunday. They'll crush you. Trump is the doge. He's going to go see what they're up to because the. And I want to be careful because the agency is like a shadow government that they. They're not elected and they have a lot of power. I think it was an inside job. I mean, there's no question or. Okay, it's an inside job.

[Jason Tardik]

Give me the odds. The odds in your brain, like, it's someone who.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

90, 10.

[Jason Tardik]

90, 10.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It's 90. Inside job. 10. Incompetence.

[Jason Tardik]

Interesting. And JFK.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Inside job.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[C]

You look.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Look into Dulles.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Look into how LBJ got to where he was. Look at the surgeons that said that is a. He got hit in the front. How they. His brain's gone. Little things like, look at that. How many rows of seats were in that car? Kennedy was.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, there's three.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Everyone thinks there's two.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Did one of those dudes shoot him? Yeah, I first. I mean, a lot of conspiracies.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. My last question for you is, you've been behind closed doors. You've seen so much of what the public finds out way down the road. And you've seen the public only probably see a small percentage of what the reality of the situation was based on, like, what we know today as, like, American citizens. When we think about all things, like the craziness of, like, these drones and aliens and all this shit, like, what percentage do you think, based on the doors and the meetings you've been in, we know versus what's actually happening? Right.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Well, the issue, I think, is a little bit of narcissism, where people get in these backdoor rooms that I've been in at the Capitol.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And they just think the American public is too stupid to know it.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Well, there's going to be martial law. They'll flip out. It's like, okay, so you're going to lock them down in their houses for two years?

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And just give them money. You print. This is not good. So the stuff we don't know, it's. It's almost an arrogance where here's like when people, as a combat leader, when people say, well, it's a need to know basis and you don't need to know. I would call bullshit. It's like I want you to to know what we're doing and why all the time.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Because you're going to be more efficient that way. Why would I hide something from you?

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

And they just like doing it. It's a power thing. Narcissists and sociopaths are just attracted to Washington D.C. not a lot of successful businessmen go into politics. And then when they get that power, it's the dude that got beat up in fifth grade, now he's a congressman that's worth $80 million. Making being worth $80 million working on a $220,000 a year. I don't know how many years you'd have to work to save that money. Yeah, it's a lot.

[Jason Tardik]

Well, that's some of the problem. When we talk money and I hear what you know, like the fact that you're literally on the ground killing bin Laden and you have no money to your name. Like, it's just there's a lot of things that are asked backward. Give me a number though. Percentage wise, what do you think the American public knows versus what is actually happening? Like 50%?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

A little higher than 50%, I think. Yeah. Probably 60.

[Jason Tardik]

Okay. So it's probably about 30, 40%.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

There's other stuff. I mean, you got to figure, what have we explored 5% of the ocean?

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

There's some, you see some of the fish that they're finding in Mariana's Truck Trench.

[Jason Tardik]

There's.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Down there.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I was just scary enough on the surface.

[Jason Tardik]

That's true. All right, good stuff. Well, we got your Trading secret from the book. We've got a great episode here. We gotta end with just Robert o' Neill's Trading Secret. All things life, the things you've been through. Can't get this from a textbook. Can't get it from a professor. You can't certainly get it from a tick tock. Tutorial just based on what you've gone through. What is one life, financial, professional, personal training secret you can leave us with?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Never quit.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

You're never out of the fight, no matter what. What? Again? Take the shot.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, that's.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

I. I'm trying to. I feel like I'm repeating myself because to me, it's so basic. Yeah, that's it. Try again. Do it again. Wake up and do it again.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. I think I always like to say what my trading secret is. And I think my trading secret is the. The idea of the quitting. Just the concept of, like, wait till tomorrow. And then if tomorrow, you're gonna quit tomorrow. Because there's so many times. It could be anything. It could be just like what you're doing or around a relationship or a friendship or a couple concept or a project. You're just like, it, I'm done. But just like, just keep going. And like, how many times you thought in your training you were going to quit? Every day you didn't quit, you end up being the guy and in the history books forever that killed Osama bin laden. Freaking unbelievable. Mr. O' Neal, where can everyone find everything you got going on right now?

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Robertjoneal.com okay. O N E I L L I'm rebuilding it right now, but the what's available is my personalized and signed book books. Because I will put your name whatever you want and within reason, in the inscription, put something there. The best example I have is some dude bought his friend that he worked with a birthday present he had me sign. Jeff, you kill it. Selling mattresses like I kill bin Laden.

[Jason Tardik]

I love it. That is a lot of fun. Where can people get that? RobertJo Neil.com RobertJo Neil.com okay, awesome. We're gonna buy one of those and we're gonna give one away. So pay attention to our social to Trading Secrets podcast. We're gonna buy one for our listener listeners. And Robert, thank you so much for coming on and trading all these secrets.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

Awesome. Great to be here. Thank you.

[Jason Tardik]

Ding, ding, ding. We are closing the bell to the Robert o' Neal episode. Oh, my. David. Lot of action. Maybe the most action we've ever had on this podcast. There's so much to cover in such a short period of time, especially with the timing of American manhunt. Osama bin Laden being premiered documentary on Netflix this past week. I watched it.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It.

[Jason Tardik]

This interview was intense. And this interview was so intense that, like, I think both of our shirts especially. Yeah, but I showed you the picture. Especially his shirt too, man. Was just like covered in sweat. Like, it was an intense, intense episode. If you haven't checked out the YouTube, make sure you do. But David, curious Canadian, what are you thinking?

[C]

His shirt was soaked. I need to see live footage of inside the house, the compound of that he shot Osama bin Laden in to see what his, his current sweat status was then. Because a million times, a trillion times more intense than a Jason Tardick interview. But what timing for this. I actually watched that Netflix documentary not even knowing that we were going to release this podcast this week. So the timing was great to get the little bit of insights and areas of his life that I had no clue about and then compiling with all the things that I watched in the documentary were. It's a truly fascinating. It's a. One of the most fascinating things that maybe happened in our lifetime, starting with, you know, 9, 11, all the way through to the capturing or, sorry, the killing of Osama bin Laden. And it's just to get the details of this, this far down the road of it have it taking place 25 years almost. I mean, riveting, exciting, crazy, Some sad stuff in there there. But, oh, my God, does this guy have a resume? I had no clue. Before I kick it to you, I had no clue that he was also part of the Captain Phillips rescue and the lone survivor rescue. Like, those two alone could. You could make a, you, you could, you know, make a career off of. But all three nuts. This guy, nuts.

[Jason Tardik]

It's like what this guy has done in one lifetime. David. I'm just like, I try to take away some of his principles to like, as far as. Just like some of the stuff he learned in Navy SEAL training and just the, the mental wherewithal and all these things so I could like, slowly apply them to my life. But when you hear what this man has done, you're just like, I need to do more important things.

[C]

Well, no, not just. Not even that. It's. It's not that you need to do important things. You are doing important things. I'm doing important things. Everyone is doing relatively important things in their life. His and how he stumbled on it. He didn't even know he was on the path to do important things. And I think that's one of my biggest takeaways from his episode is he basically said like, you know, try everything. Like, you'll never know how it turns out, those type of things. Despite, though, my biggest takeaway from the entire thing, all the stories, all the hell week, all the Navy SEALS training, has nothing to do with that. This guy has no business. We should not have access to this guy to bring him onto the podcast.

[Jason Tardik]

Well, this guy. It's interesting you say that. Let me jump in here because, you know, this is the big debate, and there's a lot of articles about this, and there's a lot of talk about this. Your standard protocol when you serve as a SEAL and on special missions like this and all the things is. Is to not speak about it.

[Robert J. O'Neill]

It.

[Jason Tardik]

I think that's like standard protocol. And you'll see in the documentary on Netflix, if you watch it, you'll see some of the people from Navy Seal Team 6, their faces are blurred out because, like, that is kind of. That's what you're supposed to technically, by, like, principle, I guess, and history do. And I think. David, real quick. I think what I've heard buzz is that. That Rob o' Neal has gotten ostracized from a little bit from some of his peers and his group because he has gone out there and spoke a lot about this. But from my vantage point, like, you heard me in this episode, when a man of this caliber has served the way he has and has done for his country, what he has, the idea that he could just be, like, left broke and on your own and not be able to use any of this experience and storytelling for empowerment and inspiration and education is, in my opinion, ludicrous. So I think it's. I commend him for saying, hey, like, if I'm kind of stuck between a rock and a hard place here, I'm going to use the experience that I've had to leverage it appropriately to take care of me and my family, because I for so long took care of my country and put my family's entire future from the perspective of parenting and guidance and everything at risk for majority of their life.

[C]

It's a good take and it's good perspective. And I'm glad that you caught me before I went on a rant, because I was probably going. Gonna go on a pretty electric rant there. But it is a good cat. It is a good catch 22. It is the ultimate sacrifice of. Of. Of, you know, signing up to serve your country. And he did serve his country in every way that he was asked to. And through that, you're not doing it for fame and you're not doing it for fortune. You're doing it for the purpose of what the military serves in terms of protecting the country. So you're right. Like, you sign up for that. So I guess you like, in my opinion, it's like, how does this guy not have a statue? How is this guy not, like, talked about amongst, you know, presidents and things like that, like, with the importance of.

[Jason Tardik]

Of.

[C]

Of roles that he's played in some of the most, you know, pivotal moments in the history of the military and the country safety. And here he is on our podcast, and here he is talking about how he doesn't get a pension. And here he is talking about how he is almost treated like a. In a corporate America salesperson who doesn't meet their Q1 numbers and they're like, you know, kicked out of the company. And he's finding ways to make revenue and he's finding ways to make a living. That to me was the overall, like, once you peel back all the like, like the really, like, edgier seat stuff. When I got off, when I, When I. The episode hit end, I was just like, this guy's like, he's still grinding to, To. To make it. To make it all work. To say he made more than six months of, of speaking than he did in a life, his whole life of serving the country. I guess it goes back to what you signed up for, though. I guess it goes back to what, say you're not signing up for the military, for fame or fortune. That's why I think. I think on all these holidays and moments, we do get to honor troops and military. We. We, you know, even more so, like, you gotta, you have to, like, it's the ultimate sacrifice, even if you're legendary status.

[Jason Tardik]

I mean, I. Yeah, I agree. And there's so many things I think, to take away from this episode. I know you're talking about, like, some of your big takeaways, but to me, this episode almost felt like a book. Like when we were talking about Navy SEAL training. So much to take away. When we were talking about, like, like the actual sniper versus the guy who's like, doing the lookout and stuff. And how he talked about how, like, the smallest things control your heart rate, how you eat what you do, how you're breathing. And the impact of that was fascinating to me. But the one thing, you know, that they'll just, I think, be burned in my brain forever is when I'm watching the documentary and then hearing the story and he's talking about how they get on the chopper and when they're on the chopper, once they pass in Afghanistan, they're clear when they're flying. But once they go into Pakistan for this mission, they are now in enemy territory, and they could easily get shot down. And so what he started to do was count, and he started to go, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, just to, like, keep his mind active. And he got to, like, 547 and he stopped and he said, no. Freedom itself was attacked this morning by a faceless coward, and freedom will be defended. Freedom itself was attacked this morning by a faceless cower. And freedom will be defended. Which is part of George W. Bush's speech after 9, 11. And he's like, I just kept repeating that to myself over and over and over because that was my reminder of why I'm here, what I'm doing, and the impact that we're going to have. And when they're telling the story and he's telling it here and on the documentary, and they're leaving, like, mission complete. And they're leaving. They have 90 minutes to get after a helicopter literally just completely crashed.

[C]

Crazy.

[Jason Tardik]

Twitter's going crazy about it. They're trying to literally not let one person see. Twitter's going crazy. They have the person that's on the ground for them that's trying to keep the civilians at. At bay, and they now have to get out of Pakistan knowing that they can get shot down at any moment, even after mission was complete. It's just cr. I mean, I'm watching this. This documentary, and I'm listening back to this episode, and my heart is pumping out of my chest. I just can't imagine living it.

[C]

It's. It is. And. And on the. And on the documentary, they said that. So what he didn't talk about in the episode and. And what they talked about in the documentaries, they got built because they practiced for so long this mission. Kind of like he was talking about the free throws, like, repetition, repetition. They built the most insane structure to replicate the compound ground. And because they knew what the exterior was like, they didn't know what the interior is like. And so they had these, like, maneuverable ways to change walls. And they basically went through every single way it could have been set up. And they practice hundreds and thousands of times. They went in there, they executed the mission, and then they had to get all the data. They. He said on the documentary that they were on the ground for way longer than they ever anticipated.

[Jason Tardik]

45 minutes. And they're supposed to be there for 30 to 32 minutes. For 45 minutes. Yeah.

[C]

And then when you hear him talk about the second chopper that comes in was the size of a school bus, it's just like, I. I can't even imagine. I can't even fathom that that all happened. And the craziest part about the doc is, is when they talk about the lengths that they went and the different strategies they use over 10 years to track down Osama bin Laden. Just an absolute surreal opportunity. We get to have him on the podcast. While this is the number two trend, showing all of Netflix people, when I like, we've been doing the podcast for four years, my wife, I turned to her today and showed her the video of who we were podcasting, and she saw his face because we just watched the doc. She was on the edge of her seat, excited to listen to it. So if you have listened to it or have seen the doc, listen to this. If you're listening to this and haven't seen the doc, either way, you're going to get 10x more out of it. And they're both phenomenal. Phenomenal.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, I mean, perfectly, perfectly said. An absolute honor to be able to interview someone at this capacity and to learn so much about the inner workings. David. I mean, I feel like I don't want to miss kind of some of the Navy SEAL training. I feel like we have to talk a little bit about that. Like, either, you know, just being tied up and thrown into water and just be like, don't die. Like, literally, that's their. And you have to find a way not to die. Tied up, hands behind their back, legs tied, thrown into water, learning how to bob until they don't die. And just the one other thing I want to say that just blew me away too was this concept of, like, how he said the strongest guy or the one that always acted toughest was always the first one out. And how every day he wanted to quit, every day he planned on quitting, but he was just like, I'll quit tomorrow morning. That's one for sure. Or I'll. Like, when you're having a really hard day, things just aren't going your way. When you're really struggling, just being like, you know, just being able to be like, I'll get through today. I'll get through today. I'll get through today. Just get through today. Just get through the next hour.

[C]

You know, I, I love that, that concept of small goals he talked about. He said he really got good at small goals instead of. Instead of long goals, because small goals were that exact mindset. To get through hell Week, you can't think about the end of hell week. You got to think about getting. Cross that finish line through this task, running and getting this food. I thought that was incredible. I also thought, I mean, I could talk about all the things that I couldn't do in hell week, which is pretty much all of them. I do love what he talked about, about how calm is contagious, how I loved that. And the one thing, and I've caught myself doing this multiple times today is he said stress is a choice. And the way that he talked about it was so true. And I found myself starting to stress about things, and I was like, I'm choos using to build this up in my brain that it's something that it probably isn't. And especially if it's something that I can't control, it's gone. If I can't control it, I ain't stressing about it. If I can control it, do something about it so that you're not thinking about it and stressing about it. Right? Like, that's. You know, that I think those two things. Calm is contagious, and stress is a choice. And then the last thing I'll say is I just.

[Jason Tardik]

And panic is contagious. Like the ops, Remember we talked about panic? It's like one person panics about something. We all panic, you know? So I think it's interesting to hear that, yeah, calm is contagious, but so is panic. And, like, we have a decision, and that's why it's important to surround yourself around the right people. Right.

[C]

I loved his analogy where he's like, yeah, you ever seen an airplane board? Like, someone zone five tries panic, and then when you think about, like, panic and calmness being contagious, it's like, think of, like, a chaotic boarding situation and, like, the airline attendant who's, like, calm, and it's like that. That person's, like, keeping this going. Or airline attendant who's, like, panicking and yelling at people. It's like, this is. This just got off the rails. So I thought, those are great. I mean, he says, wherever you are, be there and make yourself available. Those are great. Like, those are great. Relative. Doesn't matter who's listening. In your job, in your opportunity, in your life, like, make yourself available, and wherever you are, just be there there. Just focus on being there, being present. I thought, those are amazing, amazing takeaways.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. Can't say enough good things about this episode. I feel honored that we had the opportunity to, you know, interview Rob. I was sitting there today. I. I binged the documentary, and on episode three, the last episode, I'm sitting there just sobbing in tears, you know, and after that, to be like, wow, we got to sit down with someone who had the largest role in killing this person who is like just pure evil in every form. I don't know, it was like a little bone chilling, little surreal moment. And for anyone out there that serves or anyone that knows, anyone that serves, thank God we have those people. Thank God that we have them to give us the freedoms to do what we do day in and day out. So truly a whole different ball game this episode, man. Whole different ball game.

[C]

A whole different ball game is right. And the last thing I'll say too is like seeing the human being element behind the shooter was really, really interesting too, about his family, his family life, his four daughters, and even the reflections that he's having seven to eight years later about, you know, know, killing became normal. And now he's time has passed. Reflecting on, you know, the situations that he found himself in and people that he's killed and, and, you know, maybe asking himself, how did they view me? Was I the bad guy? Was he the bad guy? Really, really bone chilling stuff. And, you know, just to hear about where he's at and how he thinks about things and, you know, he was parts of the most confidential missions ever and he still has his own questions about, you know, know, big picture stuff. So some, some crazy, some crazy sound bites, some crazy experiences, some crazy stories, but like you said, what, at the end of the day, 400 guests we've had on. What a surreal, surreal guest to have on the podcast at the timing of, of, of when he came on, and.

[Jason Tardik]

Even the elements of the ptsd, you know, like, like you said, just about all the moving factors of that, that, the impact that has on those that serve and the attention that we all need to give it right, and the resources that are necessary for that attention, just intense. I will say that's probably one of the harder questions I've ever had to ask of 200 plus episodes. That was a hard one. Just like asking him about the idea of killing someone and how does that sit? And that was, I don't know, it's just a wild moment.

[C]

Wild moment, wild moment. Seems like a really good guy. And you know, again, a, a complete catch 22 situation of someone who, you know, on one hand I think I, my gut says this guy should be treated like royalty. And then on the other hand, you talk about how he could be ostracized from like, you know, the SEAL community and understanding what they sign up for and how they do things and how they protect. It's just, it's a really, It's a catch 22 episode. Everyone who's going to listen to this is going to. Everyone who's going to listen to this is going to have their views and opinions and. And it's going to hit them in different ways. So crazy, crazy world we live in, like you said.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah, well, yeah, I agree. It's a catch 22. You're going to have a lot of different opinions out there. I do think the one opinion we can all share here is thank God that people were put on this plan specifically in the United States, like Rob o' Neill, to protect us and to serve us and to put our freedoms in our country at the forefront of their interests. And thank God we have people like that to do what he has done and the way he's served and all.

[C]

Of it and all of the military and intelligence to be able to be so dedicated to set these soldiers up for success. There's, you know, they are prepared, they are dialed in. So overall, great episode. Surreal episode.

[Jason Tardik]

Surreal.

[C]

Hopefully everyone enjoyed it.

[Jason Tardik]

Yeah. And I would just end with this. If you haven't seen American manhunt, Osama bin Laden, go check it out. Like, they show you the war rooms of, like, the decisions that Barack Obama had to make during his presidency and the thought process and the way people voted on it and you know them, like live footage of them watching the mission happen and. Oh, just. Just an absolutely unbelievable documentary. Check it out. Rob, thank you for being on the podcast. David, great little recap here. An intense episode. Educational, informational, and certainly an inspiring one. And David, you got anything else?

[C]

No, I don't. We're good to go.

[Jason Tardik]

We're good to go. Thank you for tuning into another episode of Trade Secrets, one you can afford to miss.