260. Shahab Elmi: Powerhouse entrepreneur breaks down the mindset behind Cymbiotika, prioritizing wellness as a luxury, finding the small wins, and the $$$ behind it all

Summary

Trading Secrets, Episode 260: Shahab Elmi – The Mindset Behind Cymbiotika, Wellness as a Luxury, and the $$$ Behind It All

Podcast: Trading Secrets
Host: Jason Tartick (with guest co-host David, “Curious Canadian”)
Guest: Shahab Elmi, Founder & CEO of Cymbiotika
Release Date: October 27, 2025

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Overview

In this episode of Trading Secrets, host Jason Tartick dives into the business and mindset behind Cymbiotika, one of the fastest-growing wellness supplement brands in the US, with its powerhouse entrepreneur CEO, Shahab Elmi. Together, they discuss moving beyond profit, wellness as a new form of luxury, generational shifts in health priorities, tough business decisions, key product quality differences, investing in personal health, and how foundational relationships power sustainable growth.

This conversation seamlessly blends finance, personal development, entrepreneurship, and concrete tips for savvy consumers interested in the future of wellness.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Personal Health as True Wealth

[05:18 – 07:32]

• Shahab shares a recent health scare: His appendix burst, leading to a week in the hospital, losing 24 pounds and facing potential sepsis.
  • "When you're in that bed, no one's thinking about Ferraris or Lamborghinis or Bugattis. Everyone's concerned. I just want to be back to what you were before. Just normal." – Shahab [05:51]
• He emphasizes that health is the real form of wealth, vastly more important than money or status symbols.
  • "It's a corny and cliche, but health is wealth. The real wealth in this world is health." – Shahab [06:58]
• The generational shift: younger people are smarter, more informed about health, and make more intentional choices.

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2. The Wellness Industry Boom and Cymbiotika’s Origins

[07:33 – 12:00]

• The US health and wellness market is now a $2.21 trillion industry, with millennials and Gen Z embracing different spending patterns—Gen Z focuses more on health.
• Gen Z's changing habits: Alcohol consumption has dropped sharply; today’s consumers seek moderation and longevity.
  • "This generation is smarter, they have more data...they’re realizing health matters." – Shahab [08:52]
• Cymbiotika wasn’t built around profit—it began from a desire to help people, especially after losing family members to cancer.
• Product focus: unwavering commitment to quality, never sacrificing ingredients for margin.

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3. Investing in Quality over Profits and “Good Money” vs “Quick Money” Investors

[12:01 – 18:48]

• Why Cymbiotika refuses to cut raw material costs:
  • "The second you give that directive [to cut costs], what you’re telling them is quality down...We’ve never done that. We’ll never do it. Not as long as I’m around." – Shahab [10:18]
• Explosive growth: From their first packet in Jan 2019, they’ve now sold more than 100 million packets, projecting 250 million next year—without paying celebrities for endorsements.
• Instead, authentic relationships result in celebrity investors like The Weeknd, Mark Wahlberg, Daymond John, and others—all are users, not just faces.
  • "That’s not marketing. Those guys need to have kids and grandkids and great grandkids, and they realize they’re smart. This generation of rock stars are different." – Shahab [11:36]
• Investor philosophy:
  • Institutional investors didn't want in because Cymbiotika refused to cut corners for profit; instead, they chose investors who share their ethos and use the product.
  • "The folks who invest in our company aren’t institutional investors. It’s people who are passionate."[15:49]
• Key business KPI: They were profitable year one—positive cash flow from the beginning, only recently taking on select investors.

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4. Consumer Secrets: How to Choose (and Avoid) Supplements

[20:44 – 25:39]

Top three consumer tips for navigating supplements:

1. Preservatives: Avoid products with potassium sorbate (cheap, synthetic, poor for gut health).
   "If you’re using potassium sorbate, don’t buy it." – Shahab [21:18]
2. Underdosing: Many brands underdose ingredients like creatine. Clinical effectiveness needs 4–5 grams; many supply less, so it’s ineffective. "It says creatine, and it sounds fantastic, but when you take it, you’re taking less than the clinical dose, which means it doesn’t do anything." – Shahab [22:06]
3. Premixed with water: Some ingredients, once mixed with water, quickly lose efficacy (e.g., creatine, NAD, Vitamin C). Many pre-mixed products on shelves are thus largely ineffective by the time they’re consumed. "After 24–48 hours it’s really not that effective anymore...just take a little time to research." – Shahab [23:51]

• The supplement industry has little regulation, so consumers must be vigilant; even small improvements can have big results.

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5. Practical Approaches to Health and Realistic “Wins”

[26:12 – 32:02]

• It’s unrealistic to achieve perfect health or emulate extreme influencers. Instead, focus on incremental improvements:
  • "Find ways to find small wins like Poppy has, like Coconut Cult has. Those companies have done a great job doing it." – Shahab [28:42]
• Gut health: Central to overall well-being; avoid overly “perfect” habits (LED lights, no WiFi) and be pragmatic.
• Don’t shoot for perfection—focus on daily, winnable upgrades in diet and lifestyle.

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6. Luxury Redefined: Valuing Health over Materialism

[33:44 – 37:43]

• The real luxury is longevity and health, not cars or watches.
  • "The day that we recognize that as luxury...‘Longevity is the new luxury.’" – Shahab [31:18]
  • "The ability to be around for your family at optimal health into your 70s and 80s and 90s. That’s the stuff, man."[31:40]
• Cymbiotika’s tagline and expansion into experiences and brick-and-mortar (Fontainebleau Hotel in Vegas) reflects this new luxury mindset.

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7. The Price of Wellness—and Why It’s Worth It

[33:44 – 38:22]

• Many consumers balk at spending $80–$100/month on high-quality supplements but will spend far more on fleeting luxuries.
  • "We spent 100 some odd bucks...No problem. We frown on that for our health. Why? That’s...crazy." – Shahab [35:08]
• Product absorption: Cymbiotika uses liposomal delivery for much higher absorption vs. cheap competitors.
  • "Depending on where you read, our absorption rates are about 90% or so." – Shahab [36:50]

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8. Business Growth, Company Culture, and Leadership

[29:31 – 44:44]

• $40M revenue stats from 2022 are outdated—Cymbiotika approaches $200 million in revenue for 2025.
• Culture: Team believes in the mission; no remote work because the shared purpose is palpable (Shahab calls it “magic”).
• Leadership reflection:
  • "The intention leads to the result. If you’re trying to go for the result and reverse-engineer your intention, never works that way, man." – Shahab [19:36]

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9. Effort, Self-Investment, and Choosing the Right People

[42:21 – 44:44]

• Shahab’s only “black and white” non-negotiable: effort.
  • "If your effort level is half-ass, I have zero interest in being with you...Effort level is all that matters to me." – Shahab [42:32]
• Health is a sign of commitment and self-respect—if you can’t take care of yourself, you can’t be trusted to care for business or others.

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10. The Power of Foundational Relationships

[47:03 – 52:56]

• Shahab’s most important role: being a good husband, father, son, CEO—in that order.
  • "The most important decision you’ll ever make in your life...is your spouse. That decision will define everything else for you." – Shahab [50:51]
• Shahab and wife Durana built 5 companies from scratch, starting with nothing; their bond enabled them to take risks and achieve mutual success.
  • "There’s so much power and belief in the fact that the person next to you...will be with you no matter what. That gave me confidence to go for it." – Shahab [49:05]
• The right supporting partner allows creators and leaders to enter the “flow state,” critical for sustained achievement.

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11. What’s Next for Cymbiotika

[53:56 – 55:36]

• Massive national retail expansion—Cymbiotika to be in all Target stores (1,900+) starting October.
• New products: NAD, upgraded creatine, innovative menopause supplement, new flavors and formulas.
  • "We have products like NAD coming, our new creatine is coming, we have a menopause product coming that the world has never seen for women going through menopause." – Shahab [54:20]
• The mission remains the same: force the whole industry to improve by raising the bar.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On quality vs. profit:
  "The second you sell your soul to the devil, man, you never give it back."[15:44]

• On health as wealth:
  "What’s the point of having a hundred billion dollars if you don’t make it to 50? It’s useless." – Shahab [07:28]

• On relationships and “flow state”:
  "The most important decision you’ll ever make in your life is your spouse. If you get that one right, every single building block in your life...will fall into place." – Shahab [50:51]

• Final Trading Secret (from Persian poet Rumi):
  "Close your eyes, fall in love, and stay there." – Shahab [55:41]

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Timestamps for Essential Segments

• [05:18] Health scare re-centers perspective
• [08:14] Gen Z spending shifts, origins of Cymbiotika
• [10:18] Product development with uncompromising quality
• [11:52] Celebrity investors, not celebrity shills
• [14:31] Institutional investors’ pushback vs. aligned investors
• [18:10] Early profitability, bootstrapped growth
• [20:44] Three essential consumer supplement tips
• [26:12] Gut health, pragmatism, incremental improvement
• [31:11] Redefining luxury: “Longevity is the new luxury”
• [35:08] Attitudes toward spending on health vs. luxuries
• [42:21] Black-and-white non-negotiable: effort
• [47:03] Building with (and choosing) the right partner
• [53:56] What’s next for Cymbiotika

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Episode Tone and Takeaways

Throughout the conversation, Shahab comes across as direct, passionate, and deeply practical. He balances a driven entrepreneur’s mindset with an authentic, no-BS commitment to product quality and personal wellness. The episode is rich with tactical advice (both for consumers and startup founders), memorable stories, and actionable wisdom on aligning money, impact, and relationships.

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For Listeners: Actionable Insights

• Prioritize health as your foundational asset; don’t undervalue investments in your well-being.
• Use ingredient labels, clinical doses, and research to make informed supplement choices.
• Build and grow with partners (in business and life) who share your mission and ethics.
• Focus on consistent, small improvements instead of chasing perfection.
• Redefine luxury around what lasts—health and time with loved ones, not status symbols.

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Find Cymbiotika: Cymbiotika.com
Follow Jason Tartick: @jason_tartick

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"Don’t chase the dollar. The foundation will always make sense when you believe in the long-term value and impact—that’ll be greater than any gross margin or profit margin." – Jason Tartick (Recap)

Transcript

[A]

Foreign. Welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets. I'm your host Jason Tarik and I do have the curious Canadian here with me for the pre market trading segment. I'm gonna tell you a little bit about what you can expect in this episode. Actually, I might change it up. I, I might even have David tell you what you can expect in this episode because I know he was a big fan of it. But before I do that, I do want to give you a quick money tip. Last Thursday, mortgage rates hit one year all time lows. The average 30 year mortgage rate was 6.19%. Average 15 year was 5.44%. So if you haven't refinanced, make sure that you consider doing so. The other thing you gotta know is that markets right now are trading at all time highs. The Dow Jones, the NASDA, like the S&P 500 are ripping. So if you have debt that is over 7%, 7, 8%, accelerate the pay down of that. But if not any money sitting around, make sure you are dollar cost averaging into the market because it is trading at all time highs, the market is at all time highs and you have to be making sure you're making money on your money so your money is not losing value over time. Enough of the finance tips. Quick little update. I'm really excited for this week. We got Halloween upon us. My brother's birthday is the 30th, my dad's is the 29th. And this year, David, I am going to the Heidi Klum Halloween party. So we'll see what I'm wearing. If you have any ideas, let me know. But David, why don't you tease this episode for our viewers?

[B]

Yeah, I'm going to tease the episode. You know, very humble of you to not give yourself a little belated birthday shout out. Friday, October 24th. My boy Jason. Happy belated birthday. And you know what? For the people, people at home, let's not give Jason a gift. Let's give you guys the gift of trading secrets. I got some merch that's laying around here that we've meaning to give out and we're going to give it out in honor of your birthday. And so I'm, I'm going to ask the people, does that mean you're going.

[A]

To ship it too? You got to ship it.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, we'll figure it out. I got the work credit card there, so. No, we, we will ship it out to our, to our listeners. Whoever is going to give a five star review, give Jason a shout out and happy birthday. And maybe just something that you love about the pod, why you listen in particular. And let's celebrate that together. So go to the reviews. Five stars. Happy birthday, Jason. Something you love about the pod that keeps you coming back. We'll ship you out some Trady Secrets merch. How does that sound, Jason?

[A]

David. I love it. I love the energy. Happy belated birthday to me. I guess you're shipping it out. Put the comments in there. Five stars. And David, you're in charge of actually hitting the ship button. The only thing I got to say is we haven't been on the ones and twos before a podcast and quite some time, and we've had a lot of action on this episode, right in this entire podcast lately. We've had Caitlin Collins on. We've had Chris Voss, head FBI negotiator. We've had Harry Josie. Now we have Shahab, the CEO of Symbiotica. We're hitting a lot of different avenues. And then pop culture. There's a lot happening. Dancing with the Stars. We have some Dancing with the Stars pros and celebrities coming on here shortly. So buckle up, maybe even hosts. It's coming and we just are hitting a lot. So I'm also, I want to hear from the viewers. I want to hear from the money mafia in the comments or DMs to David and I or even emails, what direction you want us to go. You want to keep us in this pass. You like the change of pace? Tell us what you want. David, any comments on that before you give us a brief tease?

[B]

No, we always love it. And, and like, like I've said before, it's sometimes it's these business episodes with CEOs and founders that I'm like, I don't know this person. I haven't really. I'm not too familiar with the brand and I'm just locked in. I'm hooked. It's to the core and the root of what we do. I, I love the mix up. I just truly love the mix up of guests that we've had in this month, the last four guests. I mean, what other podcast is getting guests like that that cover so many things, that peak the interest, hopefully, of so many different listeners in our audience.

[A]

If holiday season is coming. And what I'll say is if you are looking for any tips when it comes to communication, connection with people at work, connection with people, let's say just in your family, with your loved ones, working on a business, this episode hits every one of it. It was deep, it was intense. We talked business in numbers, but we talk life, so stay tuned to the recap. David, if you're good with it, let's ring in the bell on Trade Secrets, the main episode. You good with it?

[B]

Let's do it.

[C]

All right.

[A]

Let's ring in the opening bell and make sure you stay tuned to the recap. Welcome back to another episode of Trading Secrets. Today we are joined by a powerhouse entrepreneur, Shahab Elmi, the absolute legend. He is the founder and CEO of Symbiotica, a disruptor in the wellness that has grown into one of the fastest rising supplement brands in the United States. Symbiotica is redefining what it means to build a business that thrives financially but is making an impact culturally. Today, we are going to pull the curtain back on scaling a brand. Of course we're going to talk wellness. The money moves behind entrepreneurship and how to balance business growth and personal life. My man, thank you so much for being on Trading Secrets.

[C]

It's such a pleasure, man. I would have missed it.

[A]

Guys, I'll tell you this. When he says I wouldn't miss it, this is a man of words. And action. We were just talking about this behind the podcast. You had a life threatening situation that literally happened weeks ago and even up until this podcast. Tell us a little bit about it.

[C]

Yeah, it's not fantastic for a wellness guy to talk about. My appendix burst a couple of weeks ago and rushed to the hospital. I was there for six or seven days and it was dicey for a little bit. I will tell you, Jason, you know what it does?

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

It reaffirms what we talk about, you and I, about health.

[A]

Yep.

[C]

When you're in a hospital bed And I lost 24 pounds, no food, no water.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

Worried about sepsis setting in. All you want to do is be normal again. When you're in that bed, no one's thinking about Ferraris or Lamborghinis or Bugattis. Everyone's concerned. I just want to be back to what you were before. Yeah. Just normal.

[A]

You got a million problems until health.

[C]

Is number one, and all of a sudden it's the only problem you have. Well, I'll tell you, this is not what was me, man.

[A]

Like, yeah.

[C]

What I'm going through is super minor compared to what millions of people go through every day. Millions and millions of people go through every day with cancer and other things. So this is. It's not the end of the world for me, but it's a reminder that if we don't have health, man, nothing matters, especially in the world. Of social media. I have all these friends are so successful and they're posting all these crazy things online. Yep. We get engulfed in thinking about those kind of things and it's okay to do so. Like I'm sure I'm a capitalist, man.

[A]

It's great.

[C]

Go make your money. Go be successful. Electric Rolex. I'm a big watch guy. Go buy all this stuff. It's fine. The moment your health is taken from you, you don't give a about any of it.

[A]

Anything.

[C]

I'm responsible for so many people in my life, most importantly my wife and kids, my parents, my mother in law.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And when you're in that bed, you can't take care of anyone at all. You could barely take care of yourself.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

So health, you know, it's just a corny. It's a corny and cliche. But health is wealth. The real wealth in this world is health.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

We learned in Covid. I think the youth are, the youth are way more advanced and way more knowledgeable today than they ever were about health.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And they're pushing back on stuff. My, my daughters talk against, you know, Red 40 and other things out there. Preserves like potassium sorbate and some of things. They're more knowledgeable. Yeah. But if we don't take our health seriously, man, what, what else matters? What's the point of having a hundred billion dollars if you don't make it to 50?

[A]

It's 100. Correct.

[C]

It's useless.

[A]

And like you said, once your health is a jeopardy, nothing else matters.

[C]

Nothing else matters.

[A]

Now we're talking about this intersection of kind of money, wealth and health. And we know right now that of wealth and money behind the health industry. So I did, I read a little survey earlier today. It said that in 2024 is a $2.21 trillion market right now US Health and Wellness and it has a compound annual growth of about five plus percent going into 2034. So there's a massive market. Right. Do we nail that? And I also saw that there's a generational shift right now. So in millennials our number one spending pattern is about 30% in retail. We just, we make up 30% of US retail and gen Z its health and wellness. So my question to you is with Symbiotica, you're the CEO, you've worked your way up. You guys started this company in 2018. How did you get started in this space?

[C]

So can I can I have one more data point to. Of course there's a direct inverse correlation of drinking alcohol by the way, full disclosure, I. I drink.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

I'm not one of those guys, like, don't drink.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[C]

It's about drinking in moderation and having this generation today is consuming about 90% less alcohol than prior generations.

[A]

Damn. 90% plummeted.

[C]

They're talking about $45 billion down to. Depending on where you read 3, 4, 5 billion dollars of alcohol is plummeted. So there's a number of people have realized, like, alcohol kind of sucks.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Now look, I enjoy a beer. I enjoy some scotch, maybe a dirty martini.

[A]

That's fine talking my language, but on.

[C]

A granular level, there's a direct correlation to this. This generation just smarter, they have more data. When I was growing up, I'm old man, I'm 46.

[A]

Right.

[C]

So we had computer labs in our high schools where like the first time you saw a computer, some people were like 14 or 15 years old.

[A]

Sure.

[C]

And they were connected to really sole Internet. Everyone, everyone's got one of these. They got chat GPT. They have all the access to data in the world. And they're smart and they're realizing like, health matters.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

We started this company for that reason. And I'll tell you, Jason, the ironic part is this is our fifth company. When I say ours, I brought a big leadership team from my other. We had four other companies with some exits. It was fantastic. This business was never built around profit. We built it genuinely to help people. I lost my grandfather, leukemia. My business partner lost his father to cancer. My wife just lost, who's also our business partner, lost her father this past year to multiple of the diseases. We built this company because we want to slow these things down. And when you have to have that approach, amazing, magical things happen because, you know, so for those out there who are following the business world, the most important measures, KPI's gross margins. That's probably number one.

[A]

Of course.

[C]

And then cogs, cost of goods sold. These two things drive the levers of the CPG consumer package. Good world.

[A]

Sure.

[C]

What I'm proud of, we've never built a product. I'm. I'm the head of the product committee in our department. I'm head of. I run our company.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

We've never given a directive to our folks that said build a glutathione or magnesium or vitamin C that cost X to build. The second you give that directive, what you're telling them is quality down. You either have to cut some stuff out of it that's really, really good or replace organic stuff with synthetic crap. Those are the only two mechanisms to drive costs down. We've never done that. We'll never do it. Not as long as I'm around. And what is. But what it's done, though, is built a group of products that the world has never seen. We sold our very first packet January 1, 2019. Okay, okay. We sold our hundred millionth packet a few months ago. This calendar year alone, Jason will do 100 million packets. Next year, we'll do quarter billion packets. Wow. And that's not because our marketing is slick. We don't have a single. So we've never paid a single celebrity to go pitch our products.

[A]

Interesting.

[C]

But our celebrities post our products.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Pesopaluma Gunna. Marshmallow.

[A]

We heard. The weekend's investor, right?

[C]

The weekend's investor. We have massive multinational conglomerate names. The biggest names in the world. They. Because they live the lifestyle. These guys. By the way, rock stars have changed.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Rock stars in the old days were about drugs and alcohol till you die.

[A]

Sure.

[C]

Rock stars today, like the Weeknd, like Peso, like Ghana. These folks, Marshmallow John Summit.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

These guys are all investors. We never came to them. We just saw that they were organic users of our products. They realized their talents, what they've earned. They want that longevity with this. Now, what's the point of being a rock star until you're 35? Rest in peace, Kurt Cobain.

[A]

Sure.

[C]

That's not the plan. The plan is to be have those type of talents forever and ever and ever. Those guys need to have kids and grandkids and great grandkids, and they realize they're smart. This generation of rock stars are different. They're ahead of the curve.

[A]

It's crazy. I mean, it is unbelievable to see the way things are changing, the generational shifts. And then I'm really interested in the side of you investing fully in quality and not letting gross margin or cost of goods impacted all the product that you're selling. So I want to get into that for a second. This episode of Training Secrets is brought to you by booking.com I've got to say, if you're looking to grow your vacation rental business, this is the place to be. Booking.com is one of the most downloaded travel apps in the world. And for good reason. Since 2010, they have helped over 1.8 billion vacation rental guests find places to stay. That's billion with a B. But here's the thing. Most vacation rental hosts don't even realize they can list their properties on booking.com and if you're not on the platform, your rental is basically invisible to millions of Booking.com travelers worldwide. After all, they can't book what they can't see, right? But once you start listing on booking.com, your property gets seen by a massive global audience of unique travelers. That means more visibility, more bookings, and more opportunity to accelerate the growth of your rental business. And it couldn't be easier. You can register your property in as little as 15 minutes. And nearly half of hosts get their first booking within a week. So if you, if your vacation rental isn't listed on booking.com, it could be invisible to millions of travelers searching the platform. Don't miss out on consistent bookings and global reach. Head over to booking.com and start your listing today. Get seen, get booked on booking.com I will say I'm blown away by the number of 100 million packets. I mean, that's just unbelievable. I, for everyone at home, I travel with this stuff. And I'm not just saying at glutathione, I take about once every like two, three days. Because like this, this helps with detoxing.

[C]

Right? Especially when you travel.

[A]

When you're traveling, that's why I always take. Yeah, terrible. Yeah. It's not like coast to coast, don't even know what time zone. Vitamin C, magnesium, I take before bed. And so I, I just, I rip this stuff left and right. I haven't take the longevity mushroom, so I'm gonna have to get into that. But what I'm curious about is from a business perspective, especially everyone listening this, we see a lot of industries come on this podcast and it's very rare that you hear someone say, I don't care what the cost is, I don't care what the profit is. We're going to make question to you is in a space like this, knowing that you are doing that, how did you, how was that message heard by investors? Because investors we know want a return. So they're investing in your product in 2018. You tell them it's all quality. That's the focal point. We don't care about profitability. How did you get people on board?

[C]

So institutional investors hate it.

[A]

Right, Right, right.

[C]

Institutional investors, big groups, I won't mention names, sure hate it. Because what they want is unfortunately, the supplement health wellness business has been a fight to the bottom for a very long time. You go to China, no offense to China, you go to get synthetic product at 10 cents to the dollar and create a vitamin C that's 9.99 for a 30 day supply the harmful chemicals and the forever products in that are way worse for you not taking it like potassium sorbate, for example.

[A]

Sure.

[C]

The food babe, which was I respect a lot. She did a great expose on this last week about some of the chemicals used in supplementation that are terrible for you. Terrible.

[A]

So you could have a net negative taking like a vitamin C product like that. You will.

[C]

Yes. For those out there, go watch the food babe and watch some of the things she's covered. She's fantastic. She's a founder of Chuvani, one of our competitors, ironically. Yeah, But I have so much respect for her. She does. She. She does the right things all the time. She's consistent. The key is, what's your objective here? Are you trying to help people or just make money? I don't think these two things are. Are competitive. They're not mutually exclusive. I think if you really want to help people, you can make a ton of money, but you got to be disciplined about it. We've never caved, man, and we will never freaking cave. You know, I have a lot of buddies in the health space and we talk about this stuff all the time.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

The second you sell your soul to the devil, man, you never give it back.

[A]

So true.

[C]

And so the, the folks who invest in our company aren't institutional investors. Is people who are passionate. David Grubman, you know Dave Grubman, of course.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Dave Grumman not only is a dear friend, a brother of mine. You want to see a guy leading, leading a wellness charge, go look up Dave Grubman.

[A]

It's true.

[C]

Go look up Mark Wahlberg.

[A]

Oh, my God. 5:00am Every day.

[C]

4:00Am, I think.

[A]

4:00Am Something like that.

[C]

These guys, Dave Grubbin, Mark Wahlberg and the such. Damon John.

[A]

Oh, yeah, another one.

[C]

Damon. And there's so many of them. They are living the life and they have influence. It's not for them. It's not marketing. They don't need it. You're thinking those three guys need money.

[A]

No.

[C]

You see Dave Grubman's house?

[A]

No.

[C]

You see how much Walber just sold his. His Bel Air home for Beverly Hills home.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Damon Johnson had like four or five massive exits, including fubu. They live this life and they give a. Interesting. And so having them part of our ecosystem matters because they really care.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

And so when we have them, we don't need the big banks. Yeah, most of these. Most. Look, I'm not criticizing, like, I've done this before. My other companies, we've gone through some of these big Folks. So I'm guilty of this as well.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

You go sign, sign a deal. You get a bunch of money from massive private equity firms and big banks. And there's rules and regulations there. They want X, they have covenants that say in order to do business with us, you have to have X percentage gross margin.

[A]

Right.

[C]

Your cogs have to be at Y and your EBITDA has to be as EBITDA's net profits for those that are left over.

[A]

Yep.

[C]

Earnings before interest, appreciation. And when we go institutional guys, you have to have that.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

But Daymond, John, Mark Wahlberg, David Grundman, those guys, the Weeknd gunna. Those are just guys.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

They believe in what you're doing. They have all the money in the world. They can support you too. We chose that route and said, you know what? We're not changing who we are. And if you don't want to play with us, then okay, no problem. You have to watch the scoreboard. In two or three or four years when the exit happens, you won't be a part of it. I love problem.

[A]

Get those strategic partners, not those banking partners. For anyone that might be confused about anything that we're talking about finance. Stay tuned to the recap. We'll talk about all these. We'll break down the that will be coming. But you just mentioned scorecard. You mentioned like the idea of bringing on the right investors. We talked numbers on this podcast. 100 million plus packets soldier today. 100 million will be sold this year alone. Talk to me about the numbers of profitability like for, for like 2018 for investors. How long did it take for you guys to become profitable? When you look into 2025, what's your goal for revenue this year?

[C]

We were able to positive from year one. So 2019 was our first full calendar year. Wow. It was a positive. Wow. And it was positive for a cents. So we took no investor money until this past year. We did a very small private VIP safe round with those individuals I mentioned and many other fantastic people.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Moshelizi, John Shahidi, you know, guys names, people you're friends with.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And we hand chosen by. By design. It wasn't just about money. It was about what they represented. And I think for entrepreneurs out there who want to get investment money, the people you find are more important than money.

[A]

True.

[C]

By multiples.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Unless. Unless you're prepared to, you know, bend your morals and ethics. And we're not prepared to do that.

[A]

Right.

[C]

When you deal with Jason, it's one thing if you're selling your Widget.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

We're dealing with people's health, man.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Not only their health, their spouse's health, their kids health, their parents health. When you. When you sign up for that world, it's different.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

So when you're all in on that, man, it matters.

[A]

It does.

[C]

Take it seriously, by the way. We have an office. We don't do remote stuff. We have an office.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

We don't have a schedule that says you got to be in at 8, leave at 5. We have to beg some of our folks to leave. I call people on the weekends, I see them on camera, come in the office and tell them to please go home, get out of here. Why are they there? Why do they work so hard?

[A]

They care.

[C]

They give a shit. Because they know they're dealing with people's health.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And they know it's genuine. It's not. Now we're trying to make profit. Of course we're trying to make profit. Of course we crush it. We kick the shit out of everyone, but that's not why we do it. Yeah. The intention matters.

[A]

I love it.

[C]

The intention leads to the result. If you're trying to go for the result and reverse engineers, your intention never works that way, man. Then tension matters and then result will come.

[A]

I love it. I mean, this is powerful stuff you're saying. And I also think this is extremely relevant because we know what's happening within the industry, within the wellness space. A lot of money is coming into these areas. But not everyone takes the pride in what you guys do when it comes to quality and how you operate your business and the impact you're making. So one thing we talk about here, trading secrets, is earners, spenders, savers, and consumers. So for the consumers out there, you already brought up an example of a company out there that actually your net net is negative. Yesterday I was. Or last week I was Amazon headquarters. I'm sitting there with Rob Gronkowski. I'm eating a protein bar. He's like, why you eating that? I'm like, dude, it's a protein bar. I'm on the go. It's healthy. It's like, read the ingredients. I start reading the ingredients. He's like, you can't even pronounce those. Those aren't healthy. That's not right. So he knows. So I think my question is for my listeners that are here right now, let's just say they're. They have health and wellness on the forefront, but they're not experts. They don't know all the ins and outs. Give them Some training secrets from a consumer perspective. Things to be aware of from your competitors that they shouldn't be consuming and why they should be consuming your product, and things to look out for.

[C]

Y. So three things. Right. By the way, I didn't have these questions ahead of time, so.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. I'm just rightful. Everyone knows at this point, I always bring 250 episodes in. I bring a list of the questions, and then the conversations flow. I don't even look at it.

[C]

I sent a note to our gal Hands. I'm like, do we have questions? She goes, no. Jason said. I'm like, all right. I actually like this.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

This organic one. Be careful the preservatives. So, like, okay, so preservatives are simple. In order to make something. Something last, you got to put something into it, right?

[A]

Sure.

[C]

Otherwise, like this, this thing is fantastic. This Vita Coca is amazing, by the way. I love it. To make this thing last, you got to put something into it.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

Potassium sorbert is one of the ones that most supplement companies used as a preservative. Preservative. It creates a bunch of problems and mainly with your gut and your bowel and. And even worse than that, it's really, really cheap and synthetic. So to keep an eye on preservatives. If you're using potassium sorbate, don't buy it.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

The second thing is under dose.

[A]

Real quick on that. It would say it right in the ingredients, right?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, you would just go right to the ingredients, and it would say right.

[C]

There, this is fine.

[A]

Okay, good.

[C]

And after I said, holy. We've had the opportunity to use. In the past, it was like 10 cents to the dollar. We just want to use it.

[B]

Wow.

[C]

Because we know the repercussions, and it's cheap. The second thing is dosage amount. So, for example, creatine is hot, right? There's no. No bigger product. Creatine.

[A]

Right now I take your creatine too.

[C]

Everyone takes creatine for men and women. It's really important.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Most of the clinicals, if you read, are between 4 and 5 grams. Okay. So the clinical studies that say they're effective are between four and five. Our current one has four, and new ones gonna have five. There's companies out there to sell two or three. So it says creatine, and it sounds fantastic, but when you take it, you're taking less than the clinical dose, which means it doesn't do anything interesting. You will feel good about it, but it's not doing anything.

[A]

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[C]

Third thing is water and it sounds crazy. Water is kind of the death of efficacy around supplementation. Some things mixed with water have a very specific shelf life of efficacy. So they only work for a certain amount of time after you mix it with water, for example Creatine monohydrate.

[A]

Yep.

[C]

Or nad.

[A]

Yep.

[C]

Mixed with water, they, they don't go bad. Like not gonna get sick using them.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

But to have them, the full effect lasts about 24 to 48 hours. Which means if you buy a product that was pre mixed for you.

[A]

Sure.

[C]

Like one of these.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Not this one. This is fantastic.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah.

[C]

After 2440 hours it's really not that effective anymore. So you're getting something that's not really working but you think you're, you're doing great because it says nad or creatine on it.

[A]

This is fascinating.

[C]

The supplementation business. Unfortunately, like I'm not a big regulation guy because I think too much government is a problem.

[A]

Sure, sure.

[C]

But the, those, the wellness supplement space has almost no regulation. So people can throw out stuff there that's, that doesn't stick. But they use it all the time.

[A]

Interesting.

[C]

So just, just take a little bit time to research.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And like we've never had so much access to information but we don't utilize it as we should.

[A]

Exactly. Wait. Now my brain's moving 100 miles an hour. I said vitamin water. But there are so many different water type canned beverages if you will, supplements that are out there that are sitting on shelves of your Kroger's, your Publix, Your Whole Foods. And you just know from inventory process from the day that was manufactured to shelving to probably consumptions like 30, 45 days, maybe even less. But that those vitamins then must be diluted in that water over that period of time.

[C]

It depends on the vitamin.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

Like a nad and a creatine and vitamin C are completely different.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

So just take a little all you got. Because we were so blessed with chat. GPT.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Everyone's got it. Just. Just take three seconds to research.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

And said how long the efficacy of X with water.

[A]

Interesting.

[C]

And I'll tell you right off the bat. And I don't want to. I'm trying to be very careful here, Jason, because we've never been the kind of company that bad mouths competitors, of course. Start.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

It doesn't matter.

[A]

You don't need to when you're this good.

[C]

Well, we just focus on, like, improving what we do is far more important to me than badmouthing what they do wrong.

[A]

That makes sense.

[C]

The energy output is the same.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

But that. What you get out of it is far different.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And so I'd rather just focus on video work.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

I like it.

[A]

I mean, it's fascinating stuff. Potassium sorbet. I think the milligrams is really important when you're looking at, like, the measurements of creatine and the water solubility. And just stay away from preservatives. So those are what. I'm taking away. One thing that you've said, literally from the second we sat down, explaining what happened with your appendix to your recovery, to your last statement. I've heard a lot of gut health. Talk to me a little bit about the importance of gut health and then in particular, where symbiotica plays a role in that.

[C]

It might be everything, but we're also like.

[A]

That's another thing, too. You see, Poppy, you know, that's another canned beverage sold for some billion. And that's a gut health thing. So obviously it's hot talk. Yeah.

[C]

Poppy crushed it. Like, Poppy did something really interesting. It's going to go down in history is if you look at Harvard Business Journal, does these reviews of brands and companies. Poppy does such a phenomenal job with a really complex product. Sodas.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And by the way, if you. I'm one of the. I'm the belief system. If you're trying to improve your health, find incremental ways of improving things.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

My business partner, my brother's name is Sherbeen. He's. He's on the spectrum of perfect.

[A]

Yeah. I've listened to him on podcast before.

[C]

He grounds and he gets. He comes to our office. He shows up in the office once every couple of months and shuts off all the LED lights, which is all of our lights. And I yell at him like, this is a 120 people working here.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

But he doesn't like led. He doesn't like WI fi. So he's on the perfect scale. Okay.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

The rest of us can't function on that scale because we have real lives. We got to run a business. We have kids. We have real world obstacles to overcome. So my belief around health isn't. Don't be serving. It's impossible.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Unless you have a shahab to help run your company. So you could be sharing.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Which you probably don't have. Then you can't live that lifestyle for sure. You can't be in Hawaii planting cacao. And to be healthy enough to be able to live his lifestyle, the rest of us have to find. How do we improve just a little bit every day.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Get some little wins. And the little wins come from whatever you can find. And so, like, I think this is one of the biggest push and pulls is people are shooting for perfection and so far off, they give up. In my world, I'm like, just find the little wins.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

That's what Poppy did. Poppy said you guys like Diet Coke. Diet Coke's pretty brag. Diet cola. It's a big brand. Don't do that. Let me find alternatives for you that are 50, 60, 70, 80% better. Is it perfect? No. But is it going to improve your life dramatically because you've gone away from the worst possible outcome? Absolutely.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Coconut Cult. Are you familiar with them?

[A]

Of course.

[C]

Yeah. Noah's good buddy of mine, we're doing a symbolic coconut called flavor.

[A]

That's so cool.

[C]

They've solved a really big, complex problem, is where their products have a little bit of sugar. It's okay. But is it bad as having super dairy probiotics?

[A]

Right.

[C]

Oh, that's the worst possible thing to put in your body. So companies like Coconut Cult and Poppy have found solutions that incrementally improve your life. So just find small wins. I think we're so obsessed with saying, like, we get. We find people that are dramatically overweight.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Have diabetes and want them to have a six pack next week.

[A]

Yeah. That's.

[C]

That's not normal. It's not going to happen.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Find ways to find small wins like Poppy has, like Coconut Coal has. Those companies have done a great job doing it.

[A]

Interesting. It's fascinating to hear a little bit about that. Yeah. Small wins build momentum, and then you can move in that right direction under the. The scope of momentum in business. I read this. You can tell me if it's right or wrong, fact or fiction. The article specifically said, under your leadership, Symbiotica has soared their growth, expanding its product line revenues. We know that. One account specifically cited a 530% revenue growth under your leadership. And the net worth of the business as of 2024, well over $40 million. You could tell me if those are right or wrong. But what I'm more interested in, we talk about small wins, building momentum. What is it about your leadership, what is it about your business strategy that you're seeing, at least in this account, citing 500% revenue growth, 40 million plus 20, 24 million packets a year.

[C]

Those, those revenue numbers are really low.

[A]

Really?

[C]

Okay. We'll do nearly 200 million revenue this year.

[A]

Let's go. Damn.

[C]

But I'm not a big account needs to go to. Those are way off.

[A]

We.

[C]

We did $40 million in top line revenue in 2022.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

That thing's way off. But I, I will tell you, I'm not a big. My leadership is phenomenal type of guy. Our team is incredible. And I know this sounds corny, man. Jason, I challenge you to one thing. Next time you're down here, come to my. Come to our office.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Walk around the office. My wife built it, and there was a palpable energy you feel. And I'm going to use the word. I'm a businessman, so I'm a finance guy. One plus one equals two guy. But I've learned something of late that's hard for me to digest. And that's the word magic. So if you come by our office, you'll feel the magic. That's very hard to put into numbers. There's something special happening, and I can't articulate it, man. And I can't. You know, sometimes I miss. With investor groups and they want modeling. I provide the modeling. Go show me the formula for this modeling. I can't do it. Because something special is happening around wellness. People have opened their eyes, both eyes, probably the third eye, too, and are starting to realize this is the most important thing that we. That we have the most important asset. And we've been bamboozled the rest of our lives. I'm a big car guy, big watch guy, but these brands, we've been kind of tricked to thinking that's the stuff. That's not the stuff, man.

[A]

Interesting.

[C]

That stuff is your ability to stay healthy and happy with your family for a very, very long time. That's the stuff. The day that we recognize that as luxury, in fact, we're opening our first symbolic. A wellness bar.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Fontainebleau Hotel in Vegas. Oh, wow. If you're in town, let's go. And the tagline of the clothing, the hats is. Is longevity is a new luxury.

[A]

I love that.

[C]

And the second we decide, by the way, I'm the biggest Ferrari fan. I've been collecting for 15, 20 years. No offense to Ferrari. I love you guys. Don't cut me off my list because after saying this, that's not luxury. The ability to be around for your family at optimal health into your 70s and 80s and 90s. That's the stuff, man.

[A]

That's a line right there.

[C]

That's the stuff, man.

[A]

That's a mic drop.

[C]

And we're starting to figure that out, people. I'm told you this generation is smarter. The quicker we get to that endpoint, the better humanity will get.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Because all this other stuff, man, the marketing companies are phenomenal, man. They've done a great job of making us think. Your Rolex, this one.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[C]

Or the shoes we wear. That's like, stuff we should be looking at.

[A]

It's not.

[C]

When we're down below six feet under, those things won't matter.

[A]

Right.

[C]

But our kids will cry, our wives will cry, our parents will cry, our friends will cry. No one from those brands will be sitting at headquarters saying, oh, man, we lost that Jason Shahab, guys.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Without them, we can't proceed.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

But our families will. Yeah, I love that.

[A]

I mean, mic drop moments here. That is some really, really, really powerful stuff you're talking about.

[C]

Hold on. Ferrari, don't cut me off the list. Yeah.

[A]

Ferrari. Don't.

[C]

Come on. My allocations, please. Thank you.

[A]

Rolex and everything else. So what do you got? What is that, a Patek over there? What are you doing?

[C]

I only wear Patek.

[A]

Patek.

[C]

No bacon. Don't cut me off.

[A]

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[B]

It's like that.

[C]

All right.

[A]

But one thing I want to talk about luxury. Let's talk about value and price point. So one of the things that people we talk a lot about on this podcast is the idea of consuming. Now again, I take your anti inflammatory. You have like the vitamin supplements. I take that on the road with me. I take the metabolism one again, glutathione. Because I do socially I do a lot of social stuff.

[C]

Boom.

[A]

Glutathione. But people are listening right now. Your average United States consumer. It's a little expensive. Like for the price of luxury. You have to pay about I like on your website here. It's about $88 for the glutathione which I'd highly suggest vitamin C is. I think it's like $62. If you guys need a discount code, go to the show notes I got you. But my question to that is people listening right now. Sell them right now.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

Why, why is it luxury? Why does it make Sense to spend $88 on one of your products as opposed to let's say 20, 22 dollars to a competitor that might not have what you guys have sell us on? It's twofold.

[C]

Okay. Because I don't do a. Yeah, but twofold. Okay. So before I came, I just got my. The pick line pulled out of my arm.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

So I had a drink for about two and a half, three weeks.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

So my buddy drove me here. I said Leo, let's. Let's go find the bar before I see Jason.

[A]

Let's go.

[C]

We have two drinks. The tab right down the street at or bar. Fantastic place. Tab was 190. Okay. For four drinks plus tip.

[A]

Crazy.

[C]

So there were what the great drinks are fantastic. I love the drinks.

[A]

Right.

[C]

We spent 100 some odd bucks to almost $100 with tip. No problem. We frown on that. You just, you pause on that number. But we don't pause. Our average order value is $100. $102 a month customers spend with us. We don't pause on that. For our health. Yeah, that's some Jason.

[A]

Yeah, it is.

[C]

My wife, God bless her, by the way. I've been married 26 years. My wife is the greatest, most beautiful human being on the planet. The smartest person I know. We just celebrated our 26th anniversary while I was in the hospital. Cedar cyanide, August 10th.

[A]

Congratulations.

[C]

And she's a champ at shopping. Like the world quadruple gold medalist at shopping.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

She never pauses on $102, man. Are you kidding me? That's easy work for her. But we talk about it with wellness like it's some extraordinary feat.

[A]

So true.

[C]

Then when it comes to this other stuff you mentioned, our competitors sell. Sell capsules on pills for 10 bucks. You can get 30 day vitamins. Season supply for $10. What I'll tell you is use those products and go to the bathroom right afterwards. Nothing. A graphic. But you'll see that your body got rid of most of it just in.

[A]

The color in your urine.

[C]

The colors changed? Yeah. And ask yourself why? Because those are. These are synthetic products that your body has no clue what it is.

[A]

Get out of here.

[C]

We use liposomal products. So you know. Do you know what liposomes are, Jason?

[A]

No, I don't.

[C]

Okay. And this is just an easy version for me. I asked our scientist. I'm like, this is the explanation he gave me. Yeah. Essentially, they take vitamins and supplements, encapsulate into a food, into a fat.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

So your body is tricked into thinking you're having an orange, not a vitamin C. Wow. So the absorption rate skyrocket. So depending on where you read, our absorption rates are about 90% or so, depending on what data you read.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

But you have our vitamin C C, the one you have right there.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Go to the restroom 20 minutes from now, you'll see this is your same urine.

[A]

It's the same. I could. I could vouch I have that every single day.

[C]

Because your body's absorbed it.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

So absorption matters. You could have a trillion grams of vitamin C, but if you're not absorbing it, you're having nothing.

[A]

What's the purpose?

[C]

You're having nothing. In fact.

[A]

Fascinating.

[C]

There's an argument to be made. Depending on how synthetic that is and where it comes from, it's a net negative to your system.

[A]

Damn.

[C]

So twofold. One, we never frown upon drinking, partying.

[A]

So true.

[C]

Buying clothes, that stuff is okay?

[A]

Yeah. $100 shirt. We don't think twice.

[C]

It's no big deal.

[A]

200 bar tab. No dinner.

[C]

You and I are down from Beverly Hills right now.

[A]

Yes.

[C]

The studio is.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Go to Saks or Neiman's.

[A]

Sure.

[C]

You're gonna walk out with 1500 bucks, two grand easy, and not even sleep. I even. Not even sweat. But then we're conversating on 102 average order value. Which is what? Auto value is over. The most important commodity you have.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

That's your health.

[A]

It's interesting.

[C]

Isn't it crazy?

[A]

It is. It's. It's asinine, actually. It's ass backwards, but it's cr. Crazy. The other thing, too, is the reason I think about, like, why do I actually pack my bag, my travel bag with Symbiotica? It's because when I'm taking this stuff, I feel better. And when I feel better, I think smarter. And when I think smarter, I make better decisions. I'm a better friend. I'm a better business leader. I'm a better everything. And so the idea that, like, for some reason we spend all this money on this, that does nothing for it doesn't do anything for our mind, our heart, our health. Anything is just. It really is ass backwards. One thing I want to ask you while I have you in the room, I did listen to your brother's podcast with Skinny Confidential. Shout out to them. It was a great episode.

[C]

Oh, they're the best, by the way.

[A]

So great.

[C]

Dear friends of ours. Yeah, Best. They're the best. Michael and Lauren best.

[A]

Yeah. And of course, dear media. Unbelievable network. So shout out to them this. The podcast was great, though. I could see why you and your brother have been able to build this company to where it is. It's. I mean, both brilliant humans and your wife. I heard him talk about so many things on that podcast. Like, again, you said he'll stay away from LED lights. He's careful with WI fi. I hit. I heard him even talking about, like. Like between him and Lauren, Copper tongue scraper and the impact that copper can have on your body, like, for the good. So he's got some crazy hacks. You already said perfection. You're the CEO of Sabatica. Obviously, health and wellness is important to you. Do you have any, like, life hacks that you live by or anything for listeners? Dude, when they were talking, I'm like, yo, you guys are the.

[C]

Lauren is great. Lauren's phenomenal. Yeah, she's the best. I love her. Yeah, of course, if you want a good follow, go follow Lauren. Yeah, she's one of the few famous people who does it right. And Michael, her husband as well.

[A]

Yep.

[C]

Like, I Think we got to be realist, man. We're in a crazy world in this studio alone. We got wi fi, all these cameras, these lights, both of our cell phones.

[A]

Arms look good though.

[C]

It's the most tricep friendly. What is this?

[A]

Dude, this guy was in a hospital for three years. I got to, I got to get my. Do you have symbiotica to grow these things or what?

[C]

Good Lord. We should do a full tricep episode. God bless you. I feel so much better about myself. I hope wife is watching woman. This is what you get every day, all day. 26 years worth of tricep. No, but you know, the reality is real life is tough, man. This is my only issue with a lot of occult health influencers, including my brother Sherving, who I think is one of the greatest, maybe the greatest in the world. Gotta be pragmatic. So if we really want to talk that way. You can't use an iPhone because they put up wi fi and 5G should never use an iPhone. Phone should never drive a car because they put up issues, especially extra cars. You shouldn't be around the Internet or TV because all TV now is over ip. So that you're using Internet to push. Push over Internet signals to either over the top. Ott. Over the top. Yeah.

[A]

Ott. Yeah.

[C]

Or they're using satellite. All those things shouldn't be used. So that's not going to happen.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

So pragmatically we're in a world that technology is overwhelmed us. So you got to find incremental wins. Like Lauren and Michael are great at this. Like they live the life of entrepreneurs. Dear media has is freaking incredible. Michael's, Michael and Lauren both have built a platform that's the best in the world by multiples. They're the biggest brands. But then they still practice things around that world that can help nullify some of it.

[A]

Sure.

[C]

So my advice to everyone is we're not perfect, man. You're not going to be perfect.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Just find a win every day.

[A]

Day.

[C]

Just find something.

[A]

Find one.

[C]

When don't eat the farm fish. Eat the wild fish. You're going to have steak. Make sure it's free range, grass fed steak. If you're going to have eggs, make sure it's organic. Free, free range eggs. Find small wins. Don't worry about this LED stuff, like the copper stuff. It is what it is, man. Like when shaving comes to our office, for example, we have this debate. I'm like, there's 127 of us in our office, okay? Only With a nullify WI fi. So run 127 landlines to every single laptop and computer. Then people walk around with the laptops to go outside or the conference room. Then we'll have other lines connecting them to one side of the office to another. It's a 30,000 square foot office. It's not practical.

[A]

No, it's not practical.

[C]

So we are where we are now.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Find small wins with this crazy, crazy matrix that we're part of. I like that it's going to get crazier with AI so just, you know, just find ways to plug in, man. And I think a lot of people far Gary Breca is, he's done a really good job with this. Other folks have done a phenomenal job. You see Dana White, he's changed his. Look at his. Look at Dana White's body, man.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[C]

Look at Dana White's physique today from.

[A]

Four or five years crazy jacked night and day. This is his 50s, jacked night and day.

[C]

And he lives the craziest, he lives the crazy lifestyle than you do. Yeah, he's traveling just as much as you are. But he's jacked at 50 some years old. Everything is possible but we should find incremental wins and seize those opportunities.

[A]

I like it. You are definitely more of a gray area. Find your small wins but also be practical. Your brother, black and white. Do you have any type of black and white non negotiables when it comes it comes to health? Like you will never ever do this.

[C]

I'm a 5, 8 bald guy that scored the hottest wife in the world.

[A]

You gotta be running a massive 200 million dollar business.

[C]

You gotta be comfortable in the grade to find that man. No, my thing is my black and white is not around health. My black and white is around effort. I think if you're, if your effort level is half ass, I have zero interest in being with you, conversate with you or be friends with you or being business partners with you. Effort level is all that matters to me. I've won in every level in my life. I've conquered and won and defeated everyone on my at my level. Everything I've ever done, I've never been the most talented, never been the most blessed, never had the biggest pocketbook, you name it. But I've always worked the hardest. And if you can't work hard for your own well being, for your own health. When I run into people, I can tell they're unhealthy. I'm like how could I do business with you. How could I be friends with you? You don't even care about yourself. I'm not judging. I'm not a pointer. Like I said, I'm a five eight, five eight balls guy.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

I have no, I have no reason to point anyone. But if you can't take the time and effort to take care of your own self, your well being, then what confidence do I have that you're going to be a good business partner to me? Damn if you don't have effort at the highest level. God rest, rest in peace, Kobe Bryant.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

The greatest of all time, greatest competitor of all time. If you don't have that level of maniacal commitment to whatever. And by the way, when I say this, sometimes people correlate to money. I don't give a about money. It's not about money. It's about your commitment to excellence in whatever you do in life. You know, my number one job is to me, be the greatest husband. My number two greatest job, the greatest father. Number three greatest job, greatest son. Number four is the best CEO. Wow. These are my four objectives.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

Every single day when I wake up, Jason, I focus on these four opportunities and no one will outwork me in these four, these are the four most important things to me. And if you can't dedicate your own, your own well being to those principles, then why the effort? I do business with you.

[A]

You.

[C]

Why would I trust my well being and my five, my family's bill being with you if you can't even focus on those four?

[A]

We've all set health goals, lose weight, exercise more, eat better. But without a plan, they often fade. That's where Prolon comes in. Prolon is a five day fasting mimicking diet that gives you a science backed structured approach to stay on track and see real results. Prolon offers an injection free way to lose weight and burn fat while protecting lean muscle and maintaining results. In just five days, it'll activate, activate fasting pathways to support metabolic health and rejuvenate cells. All while letting you enjoy some real food. Prolon is a plant based nutrition program featuring soups, snacks and beverages designed to nourish the body while keeping it in a fasting state, triggering cellular rejuvenation and renewal. Developed over decades at USC's Longevity Institute and backed by top U.S. medical centers, Prolon has been shown to support biological age reduction, metabolic health, skin appearance, fat loss and energy. For a limited time, Prolon is offering my listeners 15 off plus a 40 bonus gift when you subscribe to their 5 day program just visit prolonlife.com trading secrets that's P-R-O-L-O-N-L-I-F-E.com trading secrets to claim your 15 discount and your bonus gift. That's prolonlife.com tradingsecrets wow. It's so well said. A trading secret that I think is like no other. It makes so much sense. I never thought about that. I never thought about the fact that like you said, within like moderation you don't have to be a perfectionist. But if you're doing business or hiring or working with people that aren't willing to take care of themselves and put themselves in a good position from a health perspective, how are they ever going to contribute to your health and wealth? You can't. One thing you had said, I think number one on that list was be a great husband. Right? That was number 1 1. And I'm curious, especially for people that are listening this, it is very hard to work with your significant other and continue to have like such personal success in your relationship and knowing that that's number one on your list, how do you balance that? How do you operate a 200 plus million dollar revenue generating company working with your wife and your brother? Family ties. Wife ties.

[C]

Still be my blood brother but we been, we've been friends since.

[A]

Okay. I thought you guys were actual brothers. Okay, so it's like a brother. Okay, but how do you.

[C]

I wish.

[A]

So that's like family.

[C]

I wish cuz he's six four three. I wish we had that.

[A]

If we had that genetic bake up.

[C]

In our family, I wouldn't be 5 8. But yes, bro, if you had tries.

[A]

Like that, 6 foot 3, it would.

[C]

Be awesome to have those genetic ties. But anyways, I love it.

[A]

But do you have any trading secrets to managing that?

[C]

Managing Honestly, we're just. My wife and I were talking about this today.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

The biggest blessing I have in my life life is that this is our fifth company together, my wife and I. Fifth. Fifth. Wow.

[A]

Is our fifth company or the other four?

[C]

We had a chain of cell phone stores, we had a clothing cricket.

[A]

Right, right.

[C]

We had a music business called Dash Radio. Yeah, we've done it all.

[A]

See I asked these questions, I know the answers but.

[C]

But I'll tell you, it's not easy man because you know the time spent together so much that the, you know, there's five. I just read recently Johns Hoppins in some surveys, five stages of marriage and we're finally stage four which is the best part of, of It. But that part is where the little nuances of your course start getting to you a little bit. And it's tough, man. But my wife and I met when we had nothing. That's a. That's been a big help. Wow. We built everything together. We had absolutely nothing, man.

[A]

Paint that picture when you say nothing.

[C]

We had nothing. So our first apartment was in Santa Monica. There was five of us in two bedroom. My wife and I slept in one bedroom. There's a guy that slept on the couch and then. And two gals in the other bedroom. And so we came up with nothing. We had nothing. And forget the world we have now with the life we live. This wasn't even a fantasy, man. Are you kidding me? This was even like a possibility. We didn't even talk about this particular life, but we just stuck together. And there's so much power and belief in the fact that the person next to you. I'm gonna get really corny. I really believe in this. I think like there's so much power in a world when the darkest hours. No darkest possible hours. You know there's a person next to you that will be with you no matter what.

[A]

That's deep.

[C]

You want to feel powerful, look at the darkest of times and look over your shoulder and say the person next to you is going to be with you no matter what you feel. Like Superman. Forget these triceps clips we're getting.

[A]

That is so true.

[C]

Thousand times bigger than that. The power my wife gave me knowing that she was with me no matter what. She loved me when we had nothing. That piece, that gave me confidence to go for it. And many times we talked about, you know, her name is Durana.

[A]

I call her D. Yeah.

[C]

So D. We might lose it all. Meant nothing to her. As long as I have you, we're good. The power you get when you hear that as a man. Not. You know, I'm not as a man. Woman thing these days.

[A]

No, but.

[C]

But as a man. I can only speak as a man.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

As a man. When your wife tells you you're smoking hot dying piece of them. God damn, my wife is hot.

[A]

You're really filling that number one bucket. Be a great husband. What a stud.

[C]

Google my wife.

[A]

I've seen her. I've researcher. She's beautiful.

[C]

45 years old.

[A]

She's absolutely beautiful.

[C]

She's won every single business award.

[A]

Oh, she's incredible.

[C]

J.P. morgan's business woman.

[A]

Yeah. I was more excited to interview her.

[C]

In two 50 most influential business women in America.

[B]

America.

[C]

In fact, she's Getting Durana Elmi Day instead of San Francisco in a couple days. August 27th will be referenced as Dorona Elmy Day going forward.

[A]

No way.

[C]

Yes. We're flying there tomorrow. Actually on Wednesday, the mayor and DA the Cindy governor, recognizing her as the. The woman. August 27th will be drawn. I'll be there forever. But my point is, when that woman looks at you and says, you go for it. Whatever happens, I'm with you. That's power, man. Man. The most important decision you'll ever make in your life for those listening out there, is your spouse. He. Whatever she, he, she is. That decision will define everything else for you.

[A]

It is so true.

[C]

You know why, Jason? If you get that one wrong, very difficult to overcome.

[A]

Very difficult.

[C]

You get that one right, every single building block in your life, financially and otherwise, will fall into place. I have learned smooth after that, man.

[A]

I've learned that the hard way. I've been in relationships where my significant other. I. I felt like I was walking on so many eggshells that if I did one little thing wrong, the relationship could be.

[C]

How could you be bullish in life that way?

[A]

You can't.

[C]

There's no way it could be free, man.

[A]

It was the worst. You talk about health, you know, you take so many supplements to put herself in a better situation. But if you're not putting your foundation in a good situation to win, you'll never be able to do that if.

[C]

Your soul is not free.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Those who watch any sports, boxing, basketball, golf, whatever. Yeah, yeah. The best athletes are the ones who are free. They're just. They're called the flow state. You're from the flow state.

[A]

Oh, of course.

[C]

They're flowing.

[A]

They're flowing.

[C]

You can't be in the flow state. Flow state if your spouse doesn't give you that.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Like the success of every human being, male or woman.

[A]

Yep.

[C]

Much of has to do with how the spouse supports them. Because you feel like you're in that flow state and you can do no wrong. And if you do, it doesn't matter because they're there.

[A]

It's unstoppable.

[C]

It's on, man.

[A]

And when you think about, like, anyone that goes, I don't know, I've noticed this at least anyone that we watch on a television show accepting award. Or maybe it's in your local community, communities. Or maybe it's. It's d in a couple days when they get up there. It's almost always first thing thinking their significant other. And I don't think you can achieve outlying success I don't think she could have achieved that outlying success without your sport, and vice versa. And these worlds that we talk about, especially on this podcast, obviously, we talk a lot about your business. We talk about the finances. We talk about personal and professional. But the impact that they all have, not working as silos, but as one to your foundation for the. For the full growth, from living in an apartment with yourself, from three others, four others, whatever that number was, and being broke, to having a company valued at, you know, potentially 1 billion plus. There's just nothing like that. That's unbelievable, bro.

[C]

Really, well said. First of all, my wife, all wives, all spouses, they give you the freedom to be you.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And that thing is so undervalued, man. It's the most powerful thing ever.

[A]

It's unbelievable.

[C]

And I've been blessed to have mine for almost 27, 26 and a half years now. And I encourage everyone else to. I know it's. We're in a weird time, we. Where less marriages are happening, less couples. Don't. Don't be. Don't be traumatized by all the stories you've heard. I'm corny, but I really believe that God's made one person for every one of us. There's 8 billion people out there, man.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

But somehow every single Sunday, you go to some church, and so people are finding the right one for them.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And that. That tells you there's magic out there. The magic is real.

[A]

I love it. Real deep talks here. You're trading secrets in all areas of life. How you got to where you are, the business Symbiotica, and all the things. I think we got to wrap with this. You guys have so many SKS coming out. 100 million PL Symbiotica packets now. This is the one I haven't taken. Golden Mind, Brain Health.

[C]

Oh, you'll love that.

[A]

And the longevity mushrooms. These are the two.

[C]

I gotta check both right now. Okay, I'll do it right after this. You're gonna feel good after both of those combined.

[A]

Well, it won't keep me up too late, though. All right, good. So I'm gonna rip them right now while I'm doing this. Tell us. And people that are listening, they're now connected to you and your life and your family and your business. What's next for Symbiotica? Where do you see it going?

[C]

So our expansion is vast, so we'll be in every Target store in the country in October. Damn, what a great partner, man. If. If you guys are in the CPG space and you're looking for a partner. Sprouts and Target are probably the two best ones. Target's been phenomenal. What a blessing. We're gonna be all 1988 stores come October and then we have some big ones lined up after that. We have products like NAD coming.

[A]

Sweet.

[C]

Our new creatine is coming. We have a menopause product coming that the world has never seen for women going through menopause. And a lot of most women go through this and pre menopause, perimenopause and menopause. Boss hair products was too late for me. But for the rest of you guys, we're ready, man. Ready for that next jump. And you know, we're really blessed to be a part of this movement. We take it really seriously. This is not a game for us. It's not a money making opportunity. We're doing this to help people. And we're ruffling feathers because we've changed industry. We forced our competitors to change their games and move their games up.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And it's being the best, biggest busting part of Symbotic.

[A]

It's pretty cool. From the hair to the feet, the nails, the skin, everything in between, you guys are doing it. I'll also say this. I've had people that listen to the show, they know I've had massive sleeping issues. I do take the magnesium every night before bed and it's helped a lot. And I know that cuz my aura ring gives me all the information on it. So that's been a game changer. So your company. That's why I'm so excited to have you on. Literally. I travel with it everywhere I go. It's changed my life and you guys are making an impact. It's really cool to hear how from day one, even when there wasn't a dollar coming in, that was always your strategy, looking ahead. So it's pretty cool. You gave a lot of trading secrets here, but we always got to wrap with one. One that's unique to you, that we can only learn from you. You're not a professor, not a TikTok tutorial. Just something specific to your life. One trading secret. What can you leave us with?

[C]

You put me on the spot.

[A]

Put you on the spot. And I didn't prep either. I wanted the real everything. Give me.

[C]

I'm Persian and one of our famous philosopher poets. His name is Rumi. He was roomy. He said, close your eyes, fall in love and stay there. Cheers. Wow.

[A]

I love that you are just dropping bombs on this episode. I always like to Say what my trading secret was that I learned, and I think my trading secret I learned from you is don't chase the dollar. The foundation will always make sense when you believe in the long term value and impact that'll be greater than any type of gross margin, profit margin. And you know, I think one of the things I definitely will never forget is the idea of friends and people that you work with and people you look up to and people you want to connect with. How can they invest back into you if they can't invest into themselves when you're, when you're looking at that perspective person. And the last thing I'll say is I think we landed on it. But the foundation's everything. Like, you can't be where you are without your wife today. She can't be where she is without you. And that to me is so much greater than any type of amount of revenue you're doing or, or any type of company that you sell or nice Patek watch or even your triceps. So, my man, thank you so much for being on this episode. Train Secrets. Where can everyone find all things symbiotica and you?

[C]

Symbol.com.

[A]

Okay, that's it. Symbiotica.com. thank you for being on this episode of Trade Secrets. Ding, ding. D Dang. We talked in the intro. Hopefully enjoyed that episode. We are now in the recap. I got the one, the only, the curious Canadian with me. Boy, were there some unbelievable lines dropped in this one. You know, before you and I even started the recap, you told me this was a great episode. So curious Canadian, what are you thinking?

[B]

Yeah, great episode. Like I said, back to the roots. We got the founder of Symbiotica on. And I will say this, I had never heard of the company until I went and visited you in Nashville. Nashville. And I opened your fridge and I opened your covers and that thing was loaded with Symbiotica. And I tried some stuff and let me tell you, it's. It must work as well. And the one thing I will take away from this episode is this guy cares about quality of the most important asset that we had, which is health. And you can even tell because he shouts out one of his biggest competitors in Truvani out of pure respect for quality that, that they put into their product. It shows that is all he cares about is health for, for people who use the product and people that he cares about. And that in an essence was like there was a purity to this podcast. I would say purity and passion. A purity for what he's Doing and undying passion for wanting to get. Get his product in front of people for absolutely the right reasons. And it was great. I thought it was an inspiring story and, man, were there a lot of, like, little life takeaways too, that, that I'll get into too, so. So that. That's what I'll say. Seems like you guys had some great chemistry too, and kind of really fed off one another. He seemed like he had a lot of respect for you as well.

[A]

Yeah, I really, like. The second I met him, I instantly connected with him. You know, when you could just tell, like, energies, you're like, yeah, I really like that guy's energy in connection to the taste. I remember which one you had. It was the Irish Sea moss. That was more of like a lemony taste, which might not be your forte, but I will tell you, they got a flavor for everyone. The vitamin C. I. I actually love that one one. And the glutathione detox and protect. I just rip that stuff all day. But what I'll tell you is his energy is strong. He's impressive. I mean, you heard about what he went through in his own health journey. You hear about his connection to his wife. You hear about his appreciation for others and, and what those people are doing for his life, and it truly is just remarkable.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, I couldn't agree more. You're. I'm. I'm living proof of that. One of the biggest takeaways that he said, said it was the most decision, most important decision you'll ever make in your life is your spouse. And I loved how we taught. But how. I've heard that before, Jason, but when he said that you need, you know, that you pick the right spouse. When you're in a flow state with your spouse, I just thought that term of flow state, and they give you the freedom to be you. That's how you stay inspired and motivated and want to get better for yourself, which in turn is going to make you a better husband and a better father and a better son and more successful and more passionate about what you're doing. So that was just an incredible way of kind of articulating that most important thing. And you obviously gave some really, you know, interesting insight into your past and where you are and how you felt. And I thought that resonated with you as well. But, you know, it was. It was little pieces of advice like that, and also little pieces of advice as he talked about health in general, like, find a win. Every day. Find something, whether it's what you eat what you use, you know, how you treat your body, body. All those things I thought was a really interesting takeaway. And I just, I also loved his approach on giving us tangible advice with the, the three different things that he says. Careful preservatives, potassium sorbate. I put down a protein bar today because it had potassium sorbate in it under dosing on certain things that we think we're putting in our body but not, we're not actually putting effective doses in. And the, the, the, the checking the water, the how premix pre mixed products will lose effectiveness with water. All these things that I'm just like learning and writing down. It's like if I want to be healthy, like let's take all the advice we can get. So again like talk about like from XXYZ to a advice like man, he was hitting, he was hitting all over the place.

[A]

I'll tell you what, it's like a full time. I also liked how really was because it's like a full time job eating healthy, you know what I mean? Especially when you're on the go and to be able to like look at the ingredient of every single little thing is like so hard in this world. But I do like the idea of like hey, here tangible tips. Here are things to look out for. But also like, you know what? You're not going to win every bite, you're not going to win every meal, you're not going to win every moment. Like I like that idea of find a way win every day. Obviously you saw the way I connected to what he was talking about just with his partner. Like how he talked about, about like, you know, he would not be here today without his wife. His wife in so many ways brings out the best version of him. And it's that version of him that's allowed him to accomplish.

[B]

I, I gotta go back to the advice that he gave us really quick because he was talking about the water and the death of his efficient efficiency and how pre mixed products lose effectiveness with water. Blah blah, blah.

[A]

Was it, was it, was was it efficacy or efficacy? Yeah, efficacy.

[B]

There you go.

[A]

Yeah, we have, we haven't had one of those lines for David in a while.

[B]

Pretty good.

[A]

You like crushed it.

[B]

But here's a question that I have and this is more a curious Canadian question. He said, you know, just use Chat GPT really quick to see the, you know, the effectiveness of XYZ when it's in water. In my head, I have never used Chat gbt. I know I'm a dinosaur. I got to get to use it, blah, blah, blah. Can you ask chat GBT questions that I would like? I would type that in group A, Google. So what's the difference of asking? This is just totally off topic.

[A]

Let's test it. What was his exact question again? What's the efficacy of what it was.

[B]

Like, what's the efficacy of XYZ when put into water? And he just said, yeah, throw it to jbt. And in me I'm like, Chad, you can, you can just ask chat GBT a question like that and it's going to give you an answer like David.

[A]

We'Re going to, we're going to detour. We're going to detour from this podcast or two seconds because you don't understand, dude. ChatGPT does everything. Ask a question like that. You could say, what is the efficacy of vitamins when mixed with water? I have to write a two page paper on it. I also have to give a presentation on it. Write a two page paper for me and then give me the bullet points for a presentation that I could put in one slide. David, you could do anything on this thing. It's insane by the way. And it just told me everything, everything about water soluble, the impact of light, heater, air, fat soluble, vitamins A, D ek, they don't dissolve in water. Well, stability and timing, addictiveness and sorry, additives and absorption. Real world efficacy. Like they just gave me all that in two seconds.

[B]

All right, so really quick and not to put you on the spot, what am I asking Google and what am I asking Chad? GPT like, all right, how do you separate those things? Like what am I if I put it this way, am I. If I'm looking for a stat, it's Google. If I'm looking for like an answer, it's chat GP gbt.

[A]

Honestly, the I, I gotta be real. The only time I use Google now is if it's like a person, place, location or like flight. If it's like I have to cons make a consumption. Like I gotta go to Google flights. I gotta go to like, I gotta go like buy something on somewhere other than that. Like anything with statistic all it's all gonna go to chat GBT first.

[B]

I gotta do it. I got my. Take my, my next recap. Jason. I gotta find. I gotta use chat GBT one time this, this week.

[A]

And just how it goes, dude, there are times people will say something to me, right? And I could write to Chat GPT. Hey, this was the situation. This is what was just said to me. I'm feeling this way about it. Do you like what are some other things I should be thinking about?

[B]

That's weird though. I don't like that. Because you're asking a robot to, to feel feelings and emotions and how to absorb things. I don't, I don't like that.

[A]

But. No, but it's based to interpretation. You then can interpret the advice and be like, I disagree with that. I don't like with it. But like I could use it. Like I could be anything. Like time management. Like, hey, I got to be at the airport at JFK at this time. I have to do this. I have to do this. I have to do this. I have to do this. I'm leaving at 1pm this is my address. Map it all out. Builds my whole itinerary.

[B]

How often do you use it a day? How many pops do you, you use a day?

[A]

Daily?

[C]

Daily.

[A]

Yeah, I use this probably. I probably give it 50 plus prompts a day.

[B]

That's.

[A]

I don't use, I don't use Google anymore.

[B]

Oh my God. All right, I gotta do one. I gotta do one.

[A]

I want you to do five. It's a. Dude, you, you download an app, you put your email in. It's free. There's a search bar are. And you just write five prompts. It could be anything. What? Flower shower to my wife. How many seconds are in? I don't know.

[B]

Yeah, okay.

[A]

Until like whatever. Just anything. Okay, give it a go. All right, back to Symbiotica. Anything else you got for me?

[B]

I hope, I hope someone resonates with me out there. I'm scared of that stuff. Just like you can be scared of investing. I'm scared of asking a robot about feelings.

[A]

Anyways, dude, listen, let's not get, let's not lose tuck with this. It's terrifying. Like, I mean I'm going on a lot of these. You know, I was at Fox and Friends, I've been on cnn. I'm now Bloomberg. I'm doing some of News Nation. So every outlet. But all I'm talking about right now is the speed at which humans are being replaced by AI and the impact that's having on entry level jobs. Like if you think about when humans or workers, you first get your experience when you're 21 to 25. Companies are now no longer investing in those positions because they're investing in AI high and it's creating this massive ripple effect and it's like the machine has gone too fast at such a fast rate that it's the adoption, the race to adoption. And, like, we don't know what's going on. That's what's crazy. Like, the speed at which this is happening is. Is insanity.

[B]

I was actually not to age myself, but I was talking to my kids on my hockey team today about, like, high school experiences and stuff, and it was like, guys, I didn't have the Internet. Internet when I was in high school. Like, it wasn't like the Internet existed, but it wasn't, like, a thing that we used. I graduated in 2004, so all my millennials out there, like, you know how that is. Yeah, but. But we didn't use it. It's not like you're bringing laptops to school in high school.

[A]

Oh, okay, okay, okay. That's true. But we. I didn't.

[B]

I. I didn't have a cell phone until I was 18, until after I graduated high school.

[A]

We weren't really, like. I remember I had a Palm Pilot. It's the most Jason Tardic thing ever.

[B]

This is my stylist.

[A]

But. But we definitely didn't have, like, smartphones or flip. No, but we had the Internet, dude.

[B]

We had barely. We. We barely had. Actually, I know. It's true. We did. I had. I was a big MSN guy. MSN messenger guy. But it's not like you used it in class. Like, there wasn't a computer in your class.

[A]

Yeah, okay. But anyway, so what are the kid. Are you saying the kids in your high school, they value. Is computers?

[B]

Well, I was saying. I was just gonna say, like, how hard is it to be a teacher now? Like, how. How can you actually separate what's real and what's fake? I would make all my kids write everything by hand. You just got to go throw it back to the old school.

[C]

Oh, wow.

[A]

I like it. Cursive and all.

[B]

All right, now. Now that I'm on a curious rant here, he talked a lot about how this generation is smarter, how drinking rates are way down, how people are really starting to understand what's important value, their health. He talked. One. One example he used was how rock stars have changed that. Rock stars used to be about drugs and alcohol, and, you know, he brought up Kurt Cobain, but now they have a business mindset, and they want longevity. Talked about a lot of the. A lot of the investors that he have. In your curious. In your circle, you're around a lot of these social events you're at. You know, you have parties and super bowl parties and F1 parties and this and that. Do you feel that, too, when you're around. Around Celebrities and, and maybe some people that are, you know, in that world. Is it, are they parties or are they, are they more business meetups or is there a little bit of, a little bit of both? Like give, give us a behind the scenes thing at, you know, one of these exclusive parties that you're at. Like, are people getting, are people getting up? Like, what are we doing here?

[A]

Yeah, like, I was just at a gala that there was a lot of like high profile people that there and people like, from what I was looking at, were boozing pretty good. Like the bars were ripping, the drinks were flowing, like people were boozing. I do think that a lot of the Gen Z's, I, you know, I have a couple Gen Z's that, that work for me. I, we, we manage a few. I, you know, you go out and you're out with a few, a lot of Gen Z's, like, I don't know, I get mixed opinions. So some of them are like, nah, I'm not into drinking. Others just, just like they'll be like, oh, we rip. So I think it's all over. I will say this whole like, I think where Gen Z's are changing is like they do it, they do things less because they're quote unquote supposed to and more because it's either better for them or they want to. So like you're seeing they're not staying in jobs long. You're seeing like their credit scores in the last year have dropped the most that they've dropped since 2020. Youth unemployment is pretty low. Their finances as a whole are struggling a little bit. So I think you're starting to see like, it's more of like this like, feels like a European vibe. We're like, no, I'm going to do what I want. Like, I don't really want to do that. Which is, I guess there's a, there's a connection to say that's healthy. Like there is like happiness like you.

[B]

Know, back to my, my kids like a coach. I'm on the bus today, we're driving up to Boston. My kids are talking about their 401k k accounts. Their kids are, their kids are. The kids are talking about investing on their phones and that, that's what got brought up. I was like, coach, do you invest? I was like, guys, source subject. Like, don't ask me about crypto either. But no, they, they also were just saying. And I was like, that's how it came up. I was like, I love that you guys are doing this. It's so important. Even if you think that it's minimal. Like, when I was in high school, like, I don't. I wouldn't even know. I would have had to go to, like, a financial advisor and, like, get a. I don't even know how to do a transaction back then. So I, I just thought that was really cool.

[A]

All right, I'm changing what you got to do. You're gonna ask chat GPT5 finance questions. One of the biggest things that's going to change financial literacy is the chat. It will do it for you.

[B]

No, yeah.

[A]

Like, like, it will do it. Like, this is. You could literally put in. This is how much I make.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

A weekly. You know, this is my mortgage. Create a budget for me.

[B]

Okay, well, two seconds.

[A]

Seconds.

[B]

I will do that. I will do that. All right, well, I'm going on a rant. The last thing I'm going to say is this. We could get off here. We could rattle numbers off that, that, that he has experienced with Symbiotica. You know, you. You threw out the 530 revenue growth, the $40 million valuation. He said, that's incredibly low. $200 million revenue growth just on its own. You know, he talked about selling a 2009. They sold their first packet. They sold 100 million packets. They're going to sell 200 for the millionaire impact. It's. The guy's the best. Like, because he didn't care.

[C]

He.

[B]

He was so eager to share numbers. Not to brag about them or put his company a big light just so he could then get it out of the way almost to explain the impact of it. Two quotes that I'm going to leave and I'm going to shut up was. I loved his. I loved his attitude about who he surrounds himself with. And he was basically like, if your effort is half ass in life, he has no interest in associating with you. I just think that that was a power station statement. And then what does it get any deeper of a trading secret? After he shared like 20 trading secrets to say, close your eyes, fall in love and stay there. I was like, dude, yes, you are. That. That was trading secret. I was like, that was awesome. So I loved it. I loved it.

[A]

I mean, what did you think? I want to ask you about this one. What did you think about where you talked about, like, if you're not making your best effort to, like, take care of yourself and be healthy, how could you ever contribute to my mission of my company? And, like, how could I hire you?

[B]

I. I love that. Like, even his first example when he's talking about his appendix bursting which was absolutely nuts, he was like when you're in that hospital bed, he's like, you're not thinking about Lambos and Rolexes and, and in Ferraris you're thinking about how you just want to feel normal, man. You just want to feel normal. And health is wealth. You hear it? It's so cliche. And I love the examples you used about like we'll go spend, we'll go shopping, we'll go to, you know, we'll go do drop, you know, $1,500, $2,000 at Nordstrom and you know, $102 for a month for our health is like something that we, we, we don't do. And that just shows how powerful marketing and, and kind of the machine is a little bit for what we've been really prioritizing for our lives. And it's, it's time that we get that back. And his mission and he's talking about the generations of people that are doing now. It's, it's pretty inspiring, man. It really is pretty inspiring. So I, again, I really, really liked the episode. Episode.

[A]

Great episode. Great leader. A couple corrections. I, I believe I'm just thinking off top my head. I believe it was around. We talked about 40 million in revenue. I said I think 200 million valuation. He's like, no, that's, it's way, way higher than that. So just a couple touch ups there. But in general, very inspirational. You could tell that this guy, it's no wonder why he's leading a company that is growing at the rate he is and it's creating such positive impact. It was a fun episode. It was a good one. One David for anything before we wrap.

[B]

No, it, listen, we missed the Harry Jowy recap last, last week. It happens. But that's why you get me on the intro and the recap and we probably ran a little long here but we're just, we're just, we're in our flow state.

[A]

Flow state.

[B]

You're not my spouse but if you were, you'd be supporting me, I'd be supporting you. We give the freedom to be each other on the recap and we're in our flow state and that's our flow.

[A]

State and David is going to be flowing. When you guys put in a five star review and say happy birthday because he is going to have to package that thing up and send it your way, please give us five stars, let us know what you're liking and you will be on the list to win that. Thank you for tuning into another episode of Trading Secrets, one you couldn't afford to miss.

[C]

This is the story of the One as head of maintenance at a concert hall, he knows the show must always go on. That's why he works behind the scenes.

[B]

Ensuring every light is working, the H.

[C]

VAC is humming, and his facility shines with Granger's supplies and solutions for every challenge he faces. Plus 24. 7 conference customer support. His venue never misses a beat. Call quickgranger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done.