292. Sistersnacking Spills the Real Recipe for Food Fame & Fortune

Summary

Trading Secrets – Episode 292 Summary

Sistersnacking Spills the Real Recipe for Food Fame & Fortune

Podcast: Trading Secrets
Host: Jason Tartick (Audioboom Studios)
Guests: Carly and Madison (Sistersnacking)
Release Date: April 20, 2026

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Episode Overview

Jason Tartick hosts Carly and Madison from the viral food creator brand, Sistersnacking—a media platform run by four sisters with a passion for food reviews, recipes, and restaurant guides. The episode delves deep into their journey from passion project to seven-figure business, sharing the intricacies of working with family, brand partnerships, splitting business roles, monetization strategies, and their perspectives on the evolving creator economy. With “trading secrets” at its core, the conversation balances insider advice with entertaining food tales.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Rapid Fire Food Recs & Viral Picks

[02:28–07:33]

• Best Pizza:
  • Madison: “Sally’s Pizza in New Haven… In New York I would pick Ceres—sourdough pizza—and maybe Chrissy’s in Greenpoint.” [03:10]
  • Carly: “Huge Lindustry girl.” [03:15]
  • Carly (CT): “Colony Grill, but only the Stamford location. The bar pie every time.” [03:18]
• Best Dessert Ever:
  • Carly: “The cheesecake from Trepanque in Florence… Osteria della Trepanca.” [03:53]
  • Madison/Carly: “The chocolate pie from 4 Charles. Warm chocolate dessert for me. Also tiramisu at E. Cavalini in Brooklyn.” [04:11, 04:25]
• Most Viral Snack Worth the Hype:
  • Both: “Mario’s Irish soda bread.” [04:47]
  • Madison: “Froyo… you can kind of pick your quantity. That’s my new snack.” [05:07]
• Their Most Impactful Videos:
  • Madison: “First, skirt steak… skirt steak, $29 steak frites, unlimited fries. Our first real viral video.” [05:42]
  • Carly: “Pop Up Bagels… we were their first ever collab schmear, Cacio e pepe butter.” [06:25]
  • Most Impactful: “The Hive in Hoboken—their cinnamon rolls. Blueberry pancake cinnamon roll. Blake Lively tried it, then Ryan Reynolds, and then massive lines.” [07:02]

Family as Business Partners: Roles & Dynamics

[07:47–11:56]

• Business Roles:
  • Carly: CEO, Chief Legal Officer, CMO. “I have a couple hats.” [07:57]
  • Madison: “Sarah is CFO. Our youngest sister is Chief Vibe Officer, for the vibes!” [08:13, 08:20]
• On Working as Siblings:
  • Madison: “At first it was big on growth… Now that we're like a full blown operation, we have management and things like that, we had to start dividing and conquering.” [08:54]
  • Carly: “Play to your strengths. Look at what each person is good at and what each can thrive in…” [10:13]
  • Advice for Partnerships: “Stay in your lane, wear multiple hats, all have a piece, and work at full speed—together.” [11:09–11:20]

From Hobby to Business: Timeline & Turning Points

[13:06–16:01]

• Timeline:
  • Carly: “Started posting in 2015—just Instagram… gained maybe 20,000 followers in five years.” [14:00]
  • Early brand deals were rare: “First deal was maybe $125… another was maybe $1,000… after five, six years.” [14:37, 14:45, 14:51]
  • “Years of making content for free product.” [14:57]
• Breakthrough:
  • Madison: “Video, video, video. Consistency and having a voice. ‘Iconic or Overrated’ series in 2021-2022 really exploded things.” [15:19]
  • Carly & Madison: “Katz’s is iconic. Peter Luger’s is overrated… after years some restaurants take their eyes off the ball.” [16:06–16:17]

Navigating Influence: Ethics, Credibility, & Positive Focus

[16:26–19:15]

• “If we are sharing it, it is because it’s good… We don’t just share everything.” [17:37]
• “If we only find two restaurants in ten worth sharing, that’s all we’ll share.” [17:55]
• “We try to highlight more positive [reviews] because… there’s too much of an audience to be bashing.” [16:48–16:53]
• City guides: “In New York, we’re the go-to for opinions, but in other cities, we do the best research we can and share highlights—not everything is 10/10.” [18:04–19:00]

Monetization & Revenue Streams

[23:52–28:47] Timestamps:

• Brand Partnerships: Main revenue source; examples include Amazon, Bravo, WWE. [24:15–24:44]
• Corporate Food Crawls: “We lead food crawls for companies, not ticketed to the public, five-figure deals. MasterCard is launching a ticketed one but only for card holders.” [26:01, 26:29]
• Substack/Guides: “No paywall on recipes, but city/restaurant guides are $20 each. They sell steadily.” [27:01, 27:31]
• Advertising & Website: Monetized site with ads and sponsored content.
• Personal Brand Deals: Their own pages create additional revenue streams, e.g., “We wear clothes, we do things outside food, brands come direct to us.” [23:23]

The Creator Economy & Sustainability

[44:12–48:30]

• Carly (Seven-Figure Milestone): “Last year, I think Forbes, like we just scratched the seven figure.” [43:27]
• Madison on Consulting & Law: “Billing as a lawyer doesn’t come close to the money you make making one video for a brand.” [43:45]
• Jason’s View: “All we’re seeing is growth… Creator economy is growing 22% annually… all companies are in now.” [44:18–45:26]
• Carly’s Perspective on Longevity: “Virality does not equal consistency or an influencer brand… it takes longevity, consistency, recognition… only a handful will last.” [46:10–46:57]
• Madison on Oversaturation: “So many people are picking up their phones. Creators like us need to rethink strategy.” [45:46]
• Jason’s Analogy: “Impressions are like the people outside a store doing fireworks… but if you don’t have a great product, people don’t return. Your store is your platform.” [47:11–47:50]

Food Content Creation: Realities & Myths

[39:35–41:49]

• What’s Not Glamorous:
  • “Editing on my phone at home; sticky fingers from cakes; schlepping around the city with tripod and camera.” [39:56, 40:01, 41:01]
  • “I’m a new pumping mom—pumping in bathrooms, bouncing between cabs, subways, trains.” [40:33]
• But Still Rewarding: “We have the best time… I wouldn’t trade it for anything.” [41:03]

Brand Partnerships: Handling Requests & PR

[31:47–39:35]

• Wildest Brand/Collab Requests: “A Monopoly ice cream pop-up… Also, when a restaurant wants a reel, a TikTok, a substack, five stories for one meal. No, thank you.” [31:59–32:35]
• Industry Ethics: “We never guarantee any content and always insist on paying for food. We want nothing, then there’s no expectation.” [35:44–36:23]
• PR Industry Dynamics: “Friends in Nashville paying $15,000 a month for PR for a restaurant. Maybe we should start a PR firm!” [38:52–39:25]

Vision for the Future

[52:27–54:36]

• Cookbook, more food crawls, expanding interview series, being a platform/resource for launches and other creators. [53:01–53:49]
• Not interested in opening their own restaurant, but continuing to build their brand and income streams.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Business Roles:
  “I have a couple hats that I wear. I’m a lawyer, so I am our chief legal officer. But I am also our kind of brand marketing officer.” —Carly [07:57]

• On Building As Sisters:
  “Play to your strengths… Let each person thrive on their own without guidance; then you can all be increasing the value of the company at the same time.” —Carly [10:13]

• On Money & Growth:
  “Billing as a lawyer doesn’t come close to the money you make making one video for a brand.” —Carly [43:45]

• On Authenticity in Reviews:
  “If we are sharing it, people are listening because it’s good… We don’t just share everything.” —Carly [17:37]

• On Content Strategy:
  “Virality creates buzz, but you have to have the store—the great product—so people return. That’s what creates longevity.” —Jason [47:11]

• On the Creator Economy:
  “There’s only a handful of people that are going to withstand the test of time and keep getting brand deals and making a business and a career out of this for a while.” —Carly [46:57]

• On Glamour/Reality:
  “It’s not glamorous… schlepping around, editing, sticky fingers. But we love what we do.” —Carly & Madison [39:56–41:49]

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Trading Secrets & Advice

[55:06–57:31]

• From Madison (and Mom):
  "Every day, our mom texts us: 'Today is going to be a…' We reply, 'Great day.' It's about starting every day with a positive mindset." [55:06–56:18]

• From Carly:
  “If you want to get into influencing, start today, start now… You’ll find yourself throughout it. Start scared. Good content always wins.” [56:52–57:23]

  • Madison adds: “That’s Bobby Flay. Good content always wins.” [57:23]

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Important Timestamps

• 02:28 – Rapid Fire Food Recs
• 07:47 – Breaking Down Sisters’ Business Roles
• 13:06 – Full-time Transition & Early Brand Deals
• 16:26 – Approach to Restaurant Critiques
• 23:52 – Deep Dive: Revenue Streams
• 39:56 – What’s Not Glamorous in Food Content
• 43:27 – Financial Milestones & Seven Figures
• 44:12 – Will the Creator Economy Burst?
• 52:41 – The Next 3-5 Years for Sistersnacking
• 55:06 – 'Trading Secret' Closers

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Where to Find Sistersnacking

• Instagram, TikTok, Substack, YouTube: @sistersnacking
• Personal Pages: Maddie Snacks, Carly Shaft
• Website: sistersnacking.com

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Tone: Lively, transparent, full of tangible tactical tips and honest reflections. The sisters are engaging, candid, and motivate with both humility and humor—making this a must-listen (or must-read!) for aspiring creators, foodies, and savvy entrepreneurs alike.

Transcript

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to play social casino void where prohibited. Visit spin quest.com for more details. Welcome back. Another episode of Trading Secrets. Today we are joined by sisters turn creators who made a love for food into one of the Internet's best food creators, Sister Snacking. Originally created to document their favorite dining spots and recipes. Inspired by diners drive ins and dives, the four sisters turned their love for food into a viral social media brand, earning accolades such as 30 under 30 content award nominations and more. Today, their platform influences millions online, trying new foods and restaurants and exploring new cities. But behind the viral videos is also a very fast growing business full of brand partnerships, monetizing content, substack recipes. Your online site even had ads popping up when I was on there. And you guys are building a modern media brand in the creator economy. So, Carly, Madison, thank you guys for being on Trading Secrets.

[Madison]

Thank for having us.

[Jason]

All right, well, I'm sure everyone listening to this has seen your videos. At this point, if they haven't, go check them out. They're fun, they're exciting, educational. Sometimes you guys have celebrities or reality stars. I mean, there's so much action. What I was thinking, though, is every time I talk food at all in any capacity on this podcast, it always takes me too long to get the best questions out. And people want to know from the experts some of your favorite spots. So we're going to do things a little different. Start off with a little rapid fire. You've done hundreds and hundreds of videos, so this should be pretty, pretty easy. You guys ready?

[Carly]

Let's run.

[Jason]

Okay. All the restaurants and places you've been to in New York. Where is the best pizza across the globe.

[Carly]

Best way anywhere.

[Madison]

Anywhere.

[Carly]

Just New York.

[Jason]

It could be anywhere.

[Carly]

You can't open that door. We got to stick with New York.

[Jason]

You want to stay with New York.

[Carly]

We have to.

[Jason]

Okay. I mean, it's on brand, but we could. We could sit with New York. We'll stay with New York for this one. For the pizza. Also in New York.

[Carly]

If we.

[Madison]

If we think of something beyond New York, we'll. We'll throw it in there.

[Jason]

I like it. Throw it in there. All right. Best pizza in New York. Who wants to go first?

[Madison]

I'll hit you with two. And I do think the best pizza is in New York and in New Haven.

[Jason]

Okay.

[Madison]

So actually, I'm sorry. Sally's Pizza in New Haven. Only the New Haven location. That one's amazing. In New York, I would pick Ceres.

[Jason]

Okay.

[Madison]

Sourdough pizza. And maybe Chrissy's in Greenpoint.

[Carly]

I would also go with Lindustry.

[Jason]

Okay.

[Carly]

Huge Linda street girl.

[Jason]

All right, there we go. Those are your recommendations.

[Carly]

And if we're talking Connecticut, I have to shout out, I love Colony Grill, but only the Stanford location. The bar pie every time.

[Jason]

And actually, do you think it changes location? Location?

[Carly]

Yes. And I've been to multiple locations. These Stanford OG Colony Grill is the best one.

[Jason]

Do you agree with that?

[Madison]

I don't know. I've actually tried, like, a bunch of them now, and there's one opening up in our hometown. So we will. We'll have to see.

[Carly]

We'll have to see.

[Jason]

Okay. This one. I need you to go global here. Best dessert you ever had. Best dessert, any restaurant. The first thing that comes to mind. Best dessert.

[Carly]

The cheesecake from Trepanque in Florence.

[Jason]

Wow. I'm going to Italy in June. I'm going to check this out.

[Carly]

Going to Florence. Osteria della Trepanca is the full best

[Jason]

cheesecake of all time.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Jason]

Okay.

[Madison]

Any sort of chocolate souffle. What do we have?

[Carly]

Wait, how am I forgetting the chocolate pie from 4Charles.

[Madison]

The chocolate pie from poor Charles. But I like a warm chocolate dessert. And why can I not think of any at this moment?

[Carly]

I'm thinking of the chocolate souffle at a tavern where I'm getting married.

[Jason]

Oh, let's go.

[Madison]

All right, I'm going to get back to you in dessert.

[Jason]

Okay, back to me in dessert.

[Carly]

Can I keep going?

[Jason]

You can keep going.

[Carly]

Give me one more tiramisu from E. Cavalini in Brooklyn.

[Jason]

Okay, those are. Those are two good ones. You're on fire with this rapid fire. Okay, let's go. Obviously, you guys will cover when things go viral. You'll go try it out and check it out. What's, like, the most viral snack that you've tried that. You're like, this has lived up to the hype.

[Madison]

Okay, well, I think we kind of started this one, but Mario's Irish soda bread.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Jason]

And it's that good?

[Carly]

Yeah, it is.

[Jason]

Do you guys in agreement on this one?

[Madison]

Yeah. Okay, it is set.

[Carly]

A snack is a scone.

[Madison]

A scone is a snack.

[Jason]

Yeah, we'll call it a snack.

[Madison]

There's like a tablespoon of kerrygold butter. Wait, that's. That's a snack?

[Jason]

Yeah, that actually might be an argument right there. Is it a snack? Is a scone a snack?

[Carly]

You guys tell us. I don't know what you guys are doing in your free time. We are snacking on a scone loaded with butter and jam.

[Madison]

So it's our snack or like the new snack of the moment. Froyo.

[Jason]

Froyo.

[Madison]

Like you can kind of pick your, your, your quantity. So it can be a snack size, it can be a dessert size, meal size, whatever you want. But a good little snack, you get a froyo. Add some of that cookie dough on top.

[Jason]

I like it. Okay, last one I got for you is. We've seen Gary Vee talk a lot about the impact of video and how like one video can just sell out an item across the entire planet. When you look at all the videos that you've made, what is the best video that you think had the best impact for either that one item or that one restaurant?

[Madison]

We can go in chronological order. First skirt steak, which is around the corner. Like our first viral video. We didn't even post on reels because reels wasn't a thing. It was their skirt steak. $29 steak frites, like unlimited french fries. So that we like. That was like our first real viral video that took off. We were in Forbes and we just started seeing massive growth from that. Then you're going to say papa.

[Carly]

Then you have pop up bagels, which we went to in Connecticut. Our sister Sarah made bagels in their shop when they had one location.

[Jason]

Wow.

[Carly]

They weren't even coming to New York. And that blew up. And then they came to New York. We blew it up in New York. And now they're all over the world.

[Madison]

Fun fact. We were their first ever collab schmear, Cacio e pepe butter, which they do bring back sometimes.

[Jason]

And that was your. That was their first.

[Madison]

Their first. Yeah.

[Carly]

You know how they do collab shmears every week?

[Jason]

Yeah, we were there. You started that. Oh, my God. That is fun fact.

[Madison]

But they're really like Adam, who runs it, is Amazing. He's good at what he does. And they. They're. They just opened in Nashville last week.

[Jason]

Yeah, I know. I saw that.

[Carly]

Oh, you got to go.

[Jason]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. It's the best. We, We. We on the agency side. Sometimes we'll do houses and they'll send a bunch of stuff. Like, they're the best over there, the easiest to work with. All right. Little rapid fire was fun. Let's go back in time.

[Carly]

We didn't say the most impactful one.

[Jason]

Oh, yeah, most impactful.

[Carly]

The hive in Hoboken. Their cinnamon rolls. That was.

[Madison]

Yeah, we had a blueberry pancake cinnamon roll with the hive in Hoboken. They have a location in Jersey City now. They're opening up in New York City. And it went really viral because Blake Lively tried it, and then she came back and had Ryan Reynolds try it, and they had massive lines, and it was just like this whole craze, and now cinnamon rolls are just everywhere. I'm not taking credit for cinnamon rolls. Yeah, but cinnamon rolls are just. People are obsessed with them.

[Jason]

And you're doing, like. I just saw the last three videos. You guys just did a cinnamon roll review, I think. Oh.

[Madison]

Sarah went to a place in Maine that. Oh, yeah, that was just, like, named one of the best restaurants in America,

[Jason]

and that was it. Unbelievable. All right, cool. That was a fun rapid fire. But let's go back in time. So as far as roles, we have four sisters here. You guys are all. Is it full time now, Sister?

[Carly]

Three of us are full time.

[Jason]

Okay. And who. My understanding is you're the CEO, Right. And you're. I think in one podcast I listen to, you are called the chief legal officer.

[Carly]

I have a couple hats that I wear.

[Madison]

I'm.

[Carly]

I'm a lawyer, so I am our chief legal officer.

[Jason]

Yep.

[Carly]

But we, you know, we have a manager and a team that helps do that as well. But I am also our chief, kind of like brand marketing officer.

[Madison]

You're cmo.

[Jason]

Cmo.

[Madison]

And then our sister Sarah is cfo.

[Jason]

Okay.

[Madison]

And then our younger sister is here for the vibes. She's working on.

[Jason]

She Vibe officer.

[Madison]

She just moved to the city and has, like, a full time job, so she comes and joins us sometimes, but she's. She's just, like, ramping up, getting used to it.

[Jason]

I love it. I love it. But I would say it's really hard to build a business partnership with a business partner. It's really hard to do it with family. And you guys are all doing it. How do you. Even when you sit down and say, we're going to do this. How do you have the conversations of, like, equity and splitting it up or salaries or distribution? I think there are maybe siblings that are listening to this that could learn from you guys, like, what advice would you have and how do you guys do that?

[Madison]

It took time. I would say it has been a steady progression. I think it was very clear early on that sister snacking kind of was a passion project of my own, because food was just something so innate in me that I. I was so passionate about, I craved, I wanted to try, I wanted everything to be kind of related back to food. So in college, I did that. In my first few careers, I was working in food. And so it did kind of like, come from my heart and soul. And then I was able to, like, bring my sisters into it. And slowly we started to see, like, there's business here, there's opportunity. And I think, like, I mean, Carly kind of went, got, you know, became a lawyer while we were doing sister snacking. Our other sister, she worked at icm and then she was like a talent agent there. So she has, like, that kind of background. And there was like a merger and she was laid off, and she was kind of like, I'm just going to start doing this full time. So she was the first one who was able to really, like, lean into it and be like, all right, let's just see what happens. So back to your original question. At first it was big on growth, and now that we're like a full blown operation, we have management and things like that, we had to start dividing and conquering because not every person can do everything.

[Carly]

Of course, at the beginning, it was a little bit of just kind of all hands on deck, just all kind of making videos, trying to get that next viral moment before we were like, really running a business. So when you're in that growth phase, it was a little different. And then we kind of sat down and looked at what we built and realized that it doesn't make sense for us all to be doing everything together. It makes so much more sense to delegate. And it took time to kind of figure out where our natural roles lied. I think we all have different strengths. And I think you said there probably are siblings watching that might have questions about how to do it. And I think the biggest piece of advice is like, play to your strengths. Look at what each person is good at and what each person can thrive in on their own without guidance, because then you can sit back and work on your own things and all be increasing the value of the company at the same time.

[Jason]

So it's like, understand your strengths, stay in your lane, wear multiple hats, all kind of have a piece of the company and then work in your different directions full speed to make it work together.

[Madison]

Yeah. I think there has had to be, like, from me, kind of like, here's where I see each person's task kind of fitting in and saying, this is how I see my role. Let's all give each other our own tasks and say, what is it that you want to focus on? And we kind of like, just figured out, like, where each thing we work on. What, like buckets. Buckets under. Whether it's finance, whether it's more marketing, whether it's more strategic.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Madison]

And so that's kind of where we've landed. But we've been at this for what, 11, almost 11 years now.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Madison]

And I think the past two years, we've really, like, hunker down and figure that out.

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[Jason]

one of the interesting things that I was reading is that you guys have been at it for 11 years, but what the last thing I read was 2022 is when you guys went full time. Is that correct?

[Carly]

Yeah, that's when Sarah went full time and and then you were early 2023

[Madison]

and it's 2022, so end of.

[Carly]

Yeah, yeah. And then I was right after I graduated.

[Jason]

What I think is interesting about this is like, if you look to 2022, that's now four years ago, which is insane. I don't know what's going on. First I was like, oh, that's a year ago. That's four years ago. It's crazy. But when you think about what's happened for your business and financially and professionally in your growth the last four years, I feel like it's all kind of just been absolute trajectory since 2022. I want to give people perspective, though, so they're not just seeing the highlight reel the many years before that, let's call it seven years now before that. How well were you guys doing when it comes to financials and social media?

[Carly]

Well, just to really start at the beginning, we started posting on just Instagram in 2015 and then just did that and gained how many followers on 20 or 20,000. And that was. That was five years of just posting like a photo or like, like, I

[Madison]

mean, you threw on the sepia filter and you put an emoji and that was your.

[Carly]

That was your post.

[Jason]

Life was so much easier.

[Madison]

Life was so easy.

[Carly]

Yeah. You didn't even have to say where you were eating. I post a photo of Mac and cheese and it was just like, that's the vibe.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Carly]

And then in Covid, we were all home. We started cooking and making little funny family TikTok videos.

[Madison]

Well, in Covid, I think we had our first deal was like a seafood company. It was maybe like, what, $125?

[Carly]

Yeah. When was the chocolate?

[Madison]

Oh, the chocolate one? No, that was when I lived in the city.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Madison]

That was maybe maybe a thousand. Like maybe.

[Jason]

And those are for perspective, though, you're talking about you're now at this for five, six years and that was your first brand deal.

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Carly]

Oh, but don't forget how many products were sent to us. And Madison was like, I'm going to make a video of this or post something about this. And that was years of doing that. Just, you know, company. It was very early days of influencer marketing. It did not exist.

[Jason]

So what do you think the biggest change has been from now to then,

[Carly]

video content on reels.

[Madison]

It's a mix of consistency and having a voice and having an opinion. One thing that really accelerated our growth, I think it was 2021, 2022. We started. We started a series called Iconic or Overrated, where I think we Got nominated for, like, a webby for it. I forget who else it was.

[Carly]

Drew o'. Follow. I love her. Well, anyways, you know her.

[Jason]

Yeah, Yeah. I was gonna say gross.

[Carly]

Men.

[Jason]

Good person to like, you know, if you're gonna win.

[Madison]

But this series was all about going to old school New York City restaurants. You know, Peter Luger's, like, the oldest bar, which is Ira Inn, Grand Central Oyster Bar. And saying if we thought they were truly iconic still or overrated.

[Jason]

Real quick, while if anyone hasn't seen that segment, what is one restaurant that you said is still iconic?

[Madison]

Katz's.

[Jason]

Oh, yeah. And what is one restaurant you said is overrated?

[Carly]

Peter Luger's.

[Jason]

Why?

[Madison]

It's not flavorful and missed just the meat.

[Carly]

Missed the mark.

[Jason]

Wow.

[Carly]

I'll get away Burger.

[Madison]

And it was like, meatloaf didn't do it for you. But it didn't change. I don't know.

[Carly]

I think. I think that was to kind of look at how these, like, these heavily known institutions are still turning a huge profit. But at the end of the day, like, after years, I think restaurants take their eye off the ball. And we kind of wanted to look at it and be like, which. Which places are committed to keeping the consistency high.

[Madison]

Like, it's hard, though, because we were really early on then and we knew those places, if we said something, it's not going to change their business trajectory. I think now we're a lot more careful with our voice. And, you know, most of the times, if we don't like something, we're kind of keeping it to ourselves. Like, we're really trying to highlight more positive because it just feels like there's too much of an audience to be bashing on a restaurant.

[Carly]

Do you think it could break their restaurant?

[Jason]

Do you feel, though, there's also a sense of credibility that has to be maintained because then if they're like, if everything's good, then they're just like, how do I. But, like, you know, like, Emeril or like these big chefs or like a Simon Cowell. You know, he's a jerk. But it's like when he talked, you listen because you knew when he said it was good, you're like, well, it must be really good. Do you battle with that?

[Carly]

I. Yes, but I think, and hopefully our audience knows that if we are sharing it, it is because it's good. Okay, so maybe I'm looking at it like the other way. Like, if we are sharing it, people are listening as opposed to, like, if we're just sharing the junk and sharing Everything.

[Jason]

Got it. So you're gonna. You might go to. You might go to 10 restaurants. And if you don't, if you only find that two are good, you're not sharing those other eight.

[Carly]

Try not to.

[Madison]

We'll go to a city also. We Nashville, the food scene. I went last year, year before, but it's getting good. And, you know, we'll do, like, 48 hours in a city, and we really try and highlight, like, a lot of places. And we spent a long time trying to pick them. Do you ever do the lunch at Locust?

[Jason]

I haven't done the lunch. I've been to Locust. Not the lunch. Is that the thing?

[Madison]

Yes.

[Jason]

Oh, wow.

[Carly]

What's the difference when you went, oh,

[Madison]

my God, they have this milk bread

[Jason]

there and kind of sounds like lunch at Locust. The.

[Madison]

No, it's only on, like, Thursday. I don't know. To my point is that when we go to a new city, I think, like, New York is kind of our bread and butter where, like, people are really looking for our opinions or, like, our recommendations. But on a new city, like, there is going to be touristy places that you go to, like, Peg, like pork or. I went to.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Madison]

And I thought it was, like, solid. And, you know, based on our research, that's where we wanted to try. So, like, sometimes not everything's going to be, like, a 10 out of 10.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Madison]

But it will help guide someone to say, like, if you want to try X, Y and Z. Like, this is based on our research, what we found to be, like, delicious and amazing and what we like. But there's so many other options. But New York, it's a tough scene. Yeah.

[Carly]

New York is hard. To someone who's visiting, it's intimidating. It's hard to crack. And I think that's what we do a good job at, like, helping break it down for people.

[Jason]

Yeah. Because there are so many of those tourist traps and there are so many of those names you think you gotta go to, but sometimes their food is. It's not so great.

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[Jason]

So you started in. It started 11 years ago, but in 2022 things started to really take off. What does takeoff look like? Like, how did you know that 22, 22, 2023 is like, okay, we have to be in this all time. And like how has the business grown from 2022 when you guys went fully focused and really got into this?

[Carly]

It still feels like it's like this steady climb that all of a sudden we turned around and we were like, hey, look at how, look at how far away we are from where, you know, like I feel like it was never one aha moment.

[Madison]

It was more so that my brain was so consumed with what I wanted to be doing with Sister Stacking that I felt like my day to day job was getting in the way almost and I was missing out on a lot of opportunities that you know, you know, this influencer life. There's a lunch, there's a breakfast, there's a workout class, there's all these events and there's networking that goes on with those.

[Carly]

And do you remember when you worked at Shake Shack and there was that special dinner? Were you still working there at the time?

[Madison]

I worked at Shake.

[Carly]

She worked at Shake Shack.

[Madison]

I did digital partnerships.

[Jason]

Oh, interesting. Okay, you guys all have partnership. So you worked at Shake Shack doing digital partnership and you once worked at CAA and doing icm. Right. So you guys all have agency experience.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Jason]

So does that when you guys are structuring partnerships, is that it's got to be helpful.

[Carly]

Yeah. In the beginning, before we had a manager, we were doing it all ourselves. We knew how to negotiate and it honestly, I feel like we were late to the game to bring on A manager. Because we were like, why would we give them 15, 20, like, we can do this. Maybe they're not taking our, our rates as seriously, but we can do this.

[Jason]

Have you seen a big difference in having management in your income?

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Madison]

And it's funny, when we were getting signed on, Carly and I both like modestly posted on our own pages and they were like, we want to add you on to the contract. You know, Carly and your Instagram. We're like, no, this is like fun. We're not like, it's so small. Like, we're not gonna.

[Carly]

I like went viral on TikTok in the pandemic for something so silly. And so I like, low key, had like a hundred thousand followers on TikTok and would just post like very random shit. And then. Yeah, so Matt, we go ahead.

[Madison]

It didn't even cross our minds. And now the way our management has really fostered even like our personal pages because sister snacking is all food, food, food. But then each one of us are our own people and we have lives. We wear clothes.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Carly]

We're leaving money on the table with the brands that want to work with us. But we're so food focused that they're like, we have nothing to do with food. And then they kind of. There's a trickle down to like our personal pages. Maddie snacks.

[Jason]

It's like when you look at a business, when you have more lines of business, you're creating more revenue streams. So you guys have your own personal pages, right? Then you have sister snacking and you can do so, like if the budget doesn't work for sister snacking, you can do it on your own page. So it creates that income.

[Carly]

Exactly.

[Jason]

Is that interesting? Takes that. This was a question. So people submitted to me was, what are your income sources? Right. So of course everyone will know that you're a food creator, you do brand partnerships. But then, you know, I did hear that you guys have a substack. And there's so many different ways in this space that all different creators come on. They tell us about things we didn't. We're like, oh, I didn't think about that. When you look at revenue sources, where do they come from?

[Madison]

The big, big one for us is brand partnerships. Sister stacking has kind of become a place for like current happenings, whether it's like a new show is coming out. We did things like with Amazon for. With Blake Lively. We did a food crawl for another simple favor. We've done things with. What is it? Bravo. Braun Strowman.

[Carly]

Braun Strowman. The wrestler, he has a food show that came out on, like the USA now.

[Jason]

Huge.

[Carly]

His hand.

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Carly]

It's like this big. And I was like, yeah. So, like, we took him on a tiny food crawl, by the way. We fed him small things. We gave him burger sliders, we gave him like mini mochi donuts. It was the funniest thing.

[Madison]

So the brand partnerships, a lot of them are going to be like, there's an event happening in New York. How can we help promote it? Okay, let's go to Sister Stacking and let's have them post about it before and get some buzz and generate, you know, excitement around it. So brand partnerships, we actually have been doing. We do some food crawls with, like, companies.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Madison]

Which has been fun.

[Jason]

What would a food crawl look like? And then how is that? Like, what is the payment of somebody? Like, how do you make money off of food crawl?

[Carly]

So we, we had a rate from last year and we looked at just kind of the hourly time that we spent planning it, doing the outreach for it. And like, think about the connections we have that are our own that we lean on to make those crawls happen, you know, so it's like cutting the line at what we did. Danny and Coops to get sandwiches, Mary O's, who's only open on Thursday, Friday, Saturday, like those places that we have a relationship with. So that's like baked into it. And then our time to lead a crawl for, you know, 40 people. So those are fun that we get tapped every once in a while.

[Madison]

And those like five figures or something

[Jason]

we'll do in those situations. Then the, the revenue would come from ticket sales, right?

[Madison]

No, no, no.

[Carly]

These are like companies that want to throw a food crawl for, like, their associates or it's all corporate.

[Jason]

Food crawl.

[Madison]

Yes.

[Jason]

Like an Amazon would hire you guys and employees.

[Carly]

Exactly.

[Jason]

See that, that's why I asked. Question. That's a brilliant way to make revenue. You're not charging tickets, you're not dealing with that. You're getting corporate sponsorship. That's so cool.

[Carly]

We are actually doing a food crawl that is like, ticketed, but this is with a partnership that we have with MasterCard. Okay, so that's going to be happening. What?

[Madison]

I guess it will be coming out.

[Carly]

It'll be happening too. But I think it's only for like, MasterCard card holders. So it's one of those, like, experiences that they'll list on their website that you can buy a ticket for. But yeah, we, we love bringing people on crawls and eating food with them. They're. It's a great way to show someone, like, a little bit of New York. And.

[Madison]

Yeah, so we do those. We do. You said substack. We have, like, our website where a lot of, like, the substack. It's coming from recipes. So I do all of our recipe content, too. And so we. We don't put a paywall on our recipe content, but we'll put a paywall on guides. So we make guides. I spent, like, what, three weeks in Japan, and Carly spent, like, two weeks in Japan. So we have, like, a really detailed Japan itinerary. So we'll sell these guys that we, like, work with a designer.

[Jason]

How much does a guide cost?

[Madison]

20 bucks. It's a digital guide.

[Jason]

Yeah. Very reasonable.

[Madison]

But it's like, 40 pages. Like, I. Blood, sweat and tears.

[Carly]

I was. Oh, my God. Madison spent it'? Yeah.

[Jason]

How many of those do you sell?

[Madison]

I feel like every day we'll get like, oh, someone bought a guide. Someone bought a guide. Like, it's like, here and there. It depends on what we're pushing it. Like, I've for years have been saying, I need to make the New York City guide and have.

[Carly]

It's just.

[Madison]

It's sitting there.

[Carly]

It won't have to be hard.

[Madison]

Made a really great. One of her projects was, oh, I

[Carly]

made a master index of every restaurant we've ever been to and posted about.

[Jason]

My God.

[Carly]

So every time.

[Jason]

Large is that.

[Carly]

Oh, it's huge. It's got thousands of lines on it. It's no frills. It's an XL sheet that you can, like, sort by city or by neighborhood or by cuisine. I think by price point. That took me and the help of an intern so long, and now we just keep up. Every time we post, we add the line to the guide.

[Madison]

So our sister Sarah keeps up with it very well. Like, she's like, every week she uploads them. And, like, sometimes we'll have videos where there's, like, 10 places in it and it's. Here's a video.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Madison]

On this place. You can go and see. All right. It was featured in our favorite restaurants of last year. It was featured in, like, top Indian restaurants we tried recently. Or, like, it was.

[Carly]

My point was, like, somebody now you can kind of Google, like, sister snacking cats is and, like, it might pop up. Sometimes I do that. But if you go in the guide command F and look for whatever restaurant, like, if you're going to orash and you want to know what did scissors snacking say about it? You can find every time we've ever posted a video that has Oresh in it.

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[Jason]

How much have you spent at restaurants?

[Carly]

Money.

[Jason]

If you had to guess over all the years, how much you think we spent the restaurants. What do you think the total is?

[Madison]

What's our expenses every year? I mean we don't always expense and

[Jason]

now I assume that a lot of restaurants will comp too. But in general, if you had to take a guess how much sister stacking has spent at restaurants over the 11 years, what do you think it is? Just a shot in the dark.

[Carly]

Yeah. Like a million.

[Madison]

Like I'm.

[Jason]

It's got to be over a million.

[Carly]

I was gonna say a million dollars. Yeah. I didn't know if that was crazy. No, but because I'm thinking like, like a sick, you know, big meal six top. We could do a couple. Yeah. Yeah.

[Madison]

That sounds. We love.

[Carly]

Oh my God.

[Madison]

We're a food family.

[Jason]

That's it. If you have, if you, if you're in New York City for people that don't live in New York City or rarely visit that are watching this and you go to New York City for a family of four, let's say, let's say four friends and they're drinking and it's a Nice place. It's a nice place in New York. What do you think that bill's gonna be? Four people drinking. Nice place.

[Madison]

700. I was going to say 657.

[Jason]

Yeah. 800 ish. That's how I get.

[Carly]

We're all drinking.

[Jason]

The price of food and the price of drinks out here has gotten so expensive.

[Madison]

It's crazy. You can have water.

[Jason]

Yeah. You just drink your tap water. I love it.

[Carly]

No. Do you guys ever go to dinner and, like, not drink with your friends? And you're like, it's free.

[Jason]

Dry January.

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Dry January.

[Jason]

We're like, wait a second. This bill is nothing. It's ridiculous.

[Carly]

It's like, got to buy the still water. It's crazy.

[Jason]

It's like, wait a second. All right, what is the most, like, in the food space, the food creator space, what's the most ridiculous brand deal or brand request that someone's been like, are you willing to do this? And you're like, wait, what?

[Carly]

We get tapped for the ridiculous things that are coming to New York. So I'm thinking, like, there was like, a Monopoly ice cream. Like, Monopoly was popping up in an ice cream shop, and there was like. It was Monopoly ice cream cones. Like, but we did that, and we posted about it. I mean, if we want to talk crazy, it's when a restaurant's like, hi, I want to collab with you. I will give you one appetizer, one entree, and one drink and one dessert. And in exchange, you'll make a real A TikTok, a substag, and five stories.

[Madison]

Oh, and give me all the content.

[Carly]

No. Just like. No.

[Jason]

It feels.

[Carly]

Thank you.

[Jason]

Yeah. I mean, that's. That is ridiculous. Yeah. Did you have anything as far as ridiculous questions before go. Next question.

[Madison]

No, I mean, our sister just went last week to Kansas City to promote the reminders of him movie, so they flew.

[Carly]

That's just cool. That's cool. Yeah.

[Madison]

Okay.

[Jason]

That is really cool. Well, that's a crazy request. I mean, you think?

[Carly]

I think what's interesting about this crazy can be anything.

[Madison]

I did get to go on the first ever Hellman's mayo brand trip.

[Jason]

Wow. First ever. Wow. What's. What are those factors? Oh, no way. Really?

[Carly]

That's why I went.

[Jason]

I had no idea.

[Madison]

Like, to a Titans game.

[Jason]

Was it. I mean, did you, like, take a tour of the facility or was it just a brand trip?

[Madison]

No, we. I mean, we got in, like, a special room, one of the rooms, and then they had that dessert cart.

[Jason]

Oh, wow.

[Madison]

Have you ever been Titans? Yeah.

[Jason]

Oh, the dessert cart's incredible. Now I know what you're talking about. Yeah, they got the gold. All this stuff. It's nuts.

[Carly]

And there's mayo in it.

[Jason]

No, no, that's where I got throat.

[Carly]

Sorry.

[Jason]

I was like, did mayo. I was like, no.

[Madison]

They were working with Will Levitt.

[Jason]

Will Levitt? Yeah. Yeah.

[Madison]

Now he's not on anymore, but he was like their official spokesman and he came out with a Mayo cologne.

[Jason]

He's a. He's a quarterback, but he's not. No, I was. He started. It didn't go great. Yeah, it was something else. But. Okay, this is one. I'm. I'm interested because there was a food influencer who went to this bakery on TikTok and she asked to. I think she was negotiating for herself to be paid. And then they're like, sorry, we don't pay, but we'll compute this pistachio. Whatever it was, it was pistachio something. She took it and she did a really negative review on it. And the bakery snapped back. They're like, that's not fake pistachio. Everything we source is straight from Italy. They did, like, the whole breakdown and their.

[Carly]

Who was.

[Jason]

Their clip went viral. I don't remember the name of it.

[Madison]

I saw the restaurant's response.

[Jason]

Yeah, yeah. So she shows up and she's dragging the restaurant, and then the restaurant's like, everything you said is inaccurate. Like these are. They source it and they show it. And everyone, of course, supports the restaurant. Restaurant. Restaurant has like a half million followers now, all from this event. Now, one of the things I thought about this situation was the way she dragged that restaurant was wrong. Her facts were incorrect. And also she was very, very unlikable in this video, however, the concept of going to a restaurant and having a platform and using your platform to promote them and having some kind of expectation return. Very fair concept. Very. In, like, where I have found, like, you know, if there's a. Not talking openly in this, but there's a finance company, it's three posts or two posts, and media and usage. We're going to talk six figures, like, but it feels like at the B to C level, when you're. When you're a business platform like you guys are, but you're working with, like small mom and pop shop restaurants, it's kind of a. It's a. It's touch and go. You got to be careful because you don't know if these restaurants are going to say, because four posts for you guys. That's a lot of money. That's That's. That's well into five figures. Well, maybe six figures at this point. And so when these restaurants are saying we need three posts and usage and all that, do you feel like you have to be a little bit careful because if you answer the wrong way, they're going to make this next viral clip of you?

[Carly]

Yes. And that's why we are, like, so cognizant now that. Not now. Just like, at where we are at our level, that we actually are so open, we want the opposite. We want nothing from them so that they can expect nothing from us. And it works always in our favor. When we genuinely love a place, we make a relationship with them after. We want the food ourselves that we pay for. And we always want to pay. And we don't just say that we mean it. We always want to pay. Like, we don't ever ask for a free meal, if anything. We ask for a reservation if you can't get in, but that's it.

[Jason]

Hold right there. What's the hardest reservation to get into in New York or the one. The hardest one that you've had a chance at?

[Madison]

The 86.

[Carly]

The 86 right now. Well, this isn't a reservation, but to

[Madison]

Carly's point, you know, I think at this point, we've made so many relationships. Like, I'm thinking about today, we were actually out in Queens because the owner of Utopia Bagels just opened a pizza spot. And so we have a relationship with them. We want to go film in the back. Like, yeah, he's given us a bunch of pies. Like, we're filming them. And there's kind of like that, you know, just exchange and we'll. We don't ever guarantee anything if we're having something or filming somewhere because we might not like it. And so if that happens, like, we just say, listen, we're going to see, like, what makes sense for our content. We'll fit it in. And I think even, like, posting about it in stories is helpful for these new business owners, too.

[Jason]

Yeah, I like the idea, though. Expect nothing, and then you don't have to provide anything. Yeah, we'll come buy it and we'll try it.

[Carly]

I'm sure you can imagine our.

[Jason]

Or you have a relationship and they'll be like, yeah, take it. It's not like you're asking for it.

[Carly]

Yeah, yeah, I'm sure you can imagine. And people watching can envision what our inbox looks like with restaurants emailing us, being like, I'd love for you to come in. I'm offering PR companies That work, that have restaurants as clients are saying, we'd love to set you up with this meal. X, Y and Z. We every time, if we're saying, okay, we'd love a reservation next week if possible. As you know, we never guarantee any content in exchange. No need. Like, we're happy to pay for the meal. Sometimes restaurants just want to comp us because they might get a chance. I don't know, like, they just want to make sure we have a good experience. But every time we're saying, just so you know, we never guarantee any content and we're happy to pay.

[Jason]

So I just invested in a restaurant, it's called Lion's Den. We like to have you guys come out, see what you think. And I will tell you if you want to rip it apart. Rip it apart hasn't even opened yet. And it's just restaurants are just such a tough investment. But one of the things, and maybe this is something for you guys in the business here future. They hired a PR company and I asked them how much you know, and I'm not involved with that, but I'm asylum investor and I always say, like, come knock on my door when you want. Like, I know the space well. Like, I'll give free insight. No one's knocking on my door. And I saw one of the guys at the bar who runs it and he said, yeah, we got a PR company. How much you think they charge for a month to work with a PR company for the restaurant?

[Carly]

Do you have the answer?

[Jason]

I got the answer.

[Carly]

Oh, I.

[Madison]

5 to 10.

[Carly]

I was going to say 10. Yeah.

[Jason]

Nashville, Tennessee is not New York L. A. $15,000. Now we work with PR companies all the time and we work with LA based and New York City based. It'll be like. Yeah, I was gonna say like 5 to 8, depending on like who the person is. 15,000, like what the hell they guarantee. That's what I said. That's what I said. So I was just thinking, like, with all your connections in the space, you guys might be able to start a restaurant focused PR company.

[Carly]

Seriously though, you're like, we have the bandwidth for that.

[Jason]

Like, we don't have, I don't know, I don't know any more projects.

[Carly]

Thank you for the thought stuff.

[Jason]

Yeah, I got you here for when you do it. Come back on, we'll pitch it.

[Carly]

Love that seed.

[Jason]

What about this though? I think majority of people listening, they see Food Creator, they hear what you guys are doing and they're like, this is the most glamorous dream job in the world. You go to restaurants, you eat the best meals, you get to showcase the best meals, and that's your job. What's one thing that looks glamorous? Or what's one thing that people listening might not know about? The food creator spot. That's not so glamorous.

[Carly]

Sitting home editing on, like, on my phone and being like, tess, grab the dog.

[Madison]

And you're.

[Carly]

Or you can't do the voiceover because. Too loud. Sticky fingers. Oh, yeah. Cover Just cakes and stuff.

[Jason]

Do you eat everything that you put out there?

[Madison]

We can't eat every single thing.

[Carly]

Not every drop or bite. But, yeah, we. We try it all.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Madison]

Yeah, we like to share. We were at pizza place today, and we ran into a guy we knew

[Carly]

when he gave him pizza. Yeah.

[Madison]

But I think what. I mean, it's also, like, hard. Just, like, kind of bopping around the city. Like I was saying, I'm in the suburbs, slapping. We're schlepping.

[Ad Host]

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[Madison]

I'm a new pumping mom, so I have milk. Like, I have nowhere to do it. Like, I'm. We're. It's not glamorous because, like, we don't have, like, a home base.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Madison]

Harley's in Brooklyn.

[Jason]

You're in the bathroom.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Madison]

Like, it's just.

[Carly]

It's just literally.

[Madison]

Yeah. We're just kind of running around. We've been in, like, three cabs today.

[Carly]

Oh, yeah. We have been in a lot of cars.

[Madison]

Two subway rides. I've taken the train. Like, there's a lot of clunking around. I would say.

[Carly]

Yeah. With the camera and the tripod. But I.

[Jason]

Do you record everything yourself or do you bring.

[Carly]

Yes and no. We have a team for those. We were talking earlier about the snacking crawls with other people when we're in it. And it's not like, a restaurant situation, we have someone film us with, like, mics and kind of just do it really nice so that it's just a better professional quality video when it's like that. But when we're just sitting at a restaurant, me and her, we have our own cameras that we film with. But I mean, just to say back to your point, when you said, like, it looks so glamorous, I think we can both admit, like, we love what we do. We have so much fun, and I wouldn't trade it for anything. So, like, there are downsides, but I. But it is such. It's so amazing. Like, we have the best time.

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[Jason]

Maybe the answer to that is like, it is glam. Majority of it is glamorous.

[Carly]

Well, it's glamorous. I would say it's like foodie. Foodie fun.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Carly]

Glamorous.

[Madison]

You get like work with my hair.

[Jason]

Yeah. Getting your glam makeup. Foodie fun.

[Madison]

We're with our sisters and best friends.

[Jason]

Yeah. It's a dream.

[Madison]

Carly's fiance is also in the space. So then the three of us sometimes

[Carly]

are just like running around.

[Jason]

Yeah. Eating and what is. So we talk finances and, and career trajectory here. When you look at the crystal ball, like do you have a financial goal of how much you want to make a year? Professional goal like that we want to get to at some point. Where do you guys look in the future as it look like?

[Madison]

Well, I think last year, I think Forbes, like we. We just scratched the seven figure.

[Jason]

Let's go. Congratulations.

[Carly]

Thank you.

[Madison]

And then we have our own businesses too. Carly's lawyer. We have our own pages.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Madison]

So I think we're just.

[Jason]

You do like entertainment law, right?

[Carly]

I do. I do contracts for other influencers.

[Jason]

Yeah, that's great.

[Carly]

But I have to say, I mean, like me and Madison were actually just talking about this. Billing as a lawyer doesn't come close to the money you make. Making one video for a brand isn't

[Jason]

That a crazy statement though, like when you think about that. And what do you like an hourly rate for an attorney in the city is 2 to 7,000.

[Carly]

Oh, yeah, my rate is like a little. Is under 400. Can I ask you a question?

[Jason]

Of course, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Madison]

Do you think that this influencer creator market is going to burst the bubble?

[Jason]

It's the hardest question to ask right now. I don't think so.

[Carly]

I don't either.

[Jason]

So I, I get studying, like I could tell you is owning an agency, right. And we, we broker a lot of deals through people that are managed and we manage people exclusively and then we manage people not exclusively and then we work with brands direct, so we kind of do it all. We do events, we have podcasts with Jesse Pegula and Matty Keys, top tennis players. So we kind of have our foot in all the different areas. All we're seeing is growth. And then when I read case studies, it says that the creator economy is growing at a 22% annual growth rate every year. And I think the companies that were lagging like in the, in 2020, you know, I started doing this 2018. So you guys have done it longer, but we've both been around in the teens, which is a lot. You know, 2018, 15, 16, that's a, that's a lot. That's OG.

[Madison]

Mm.

[Jason]

It's, it's just growing every year. And those companies that were like, nah, I'm not getting into that. All the companies are in now. I think what we're gonna see is more efficiency with it. I think there's a lot of middlemen. I think there's a lot of processes to get deals that come to fruition and like, you know, who casts for what. I think there's gonna be like a

[Carly]

lot of more efficiency, streamlining it all.

[Jason]

Yeah, yeah. I honestly, like, as someone who owns an agency, I think the best value we're going to be able to bring to our brand, our people, is going to be creativity management and business operations. Because I think like one day, like in five years from now, it's going to be like a portal. You just like you put in your profile and they come to you. I don't know, I could be wrong, but I think the space is going to keep growing.

[Madison]

I think the only thing from a creator side is the saturation of it all and how many people are just picking their phone up and recording. And now that you've seen such a shift in high quality production to more authentic throwing up the phone and just spewing Whatever comes to mind. So it's kind of like creators like us that have been around for a while need to rethink strategy almost.

[Jason]

Yeah, I agree with that.

[Carly]

But there's a difference, and I think we've all seen it, like, on our phones. The difference between someone who picks up their phone spews something, whether it's hilarious or controversial or whatever it is. One video that, like, gets the whole world talking does not translate into an influencer brand.

[Jason]

Correct.

[Carly]

Like, it doesn't. And it takes consistency and it takes recognition and, like, so many different factors that take. That gets a fan base to be like, this person, like, speaks to me or gets me or, like, I want to continue to follow their whatever it is. And I think while that is so true on saturation, that's. That doesn't equal longevity.

[Madison]

Sure.

[Carly]

So, like, I think there's only a handful of people that are going to withstand the test of time and keep getting brand deals and making a business and a career out of this for, you know, for a while.

[Jason]

Yeah, I. I think the idea of virality, right? You know, the people that are trying to go viral all the time, where they do, like, rage bait stuff, or they'll like, you guys are foodies. They'll, you know, let's just say they put a piece of chicken and they're cooking it, and then they throw in like, you know, Dr. Pepper and Cake and four things, and it's like rage baits making you watch. It's like crazy virality pranks or stuff. Virality creates a buzz. Buzz creates impressions. But impressions are like the people outside the store opening that are, like doing fireworks or twirling your sign.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Jason]

They create a tension. But then if you go in the store, you don't have really good product in the store, and, like, it's well done and it makes you come back, you're not going to the store.

[Carly]

Right.

[Jason]

And I think there are a lot of people that are doing this, but that doesn't create any form of longevity. Like, you have to have the store. And when people walk into sister snacking store, they know what they're getting.

[Madison]

Right.

[Jason]

And that's what creates longevity. And I think one of the things is, you're right. There is oversupply, there's oversaturation. The reason there is, though, is because there's a massive supply of money right now. All this money's flowing in. You're on Forbes and it says you guys are doing seven figures. So people are saying, I got to start doing it. So the reason there's more saturation is because there's more dollars supporting that. So that's actually not a bad thing when you think about it like that. Yeah, but what will happen? I don't know. I mean, no one knows, but I think it's. It looks promising.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Jason]

From my perspective.

[Carly]

I think it's so interesting, though. I actually just spoke at my. For my alma mater, Syracuse. They're starting a. Did you.

[Jason]

Yeah, I lived in Armory Square for one year.

[Carly]

Shut your mouth. I was living in Armory.

[Jason]

Oh, God. I mean, I was 21. It was a year after graduate college, and I was one year and done.

[Carly]

Okay, there you go. What for?

[Jason]

I was. It was. So I graduated in 2010. Bank mortgage crisis. And back then, what you want to do is get into banks, into banking programs, and then they would, like, put you on the career ladder.

[Madison]

Yeah.

[Jason]

But a lot of the banks weren't investing in those anymore because the mortgage crisis. So there was a. A bank called KeyBank, which is a regional bank, and they had one of these management programs still. And I got into it and I don't know, like, I didn't know where it was going to be. It was in Syracuse. So after the year, their headquarters, you

[Carly]

go to any games?

[Jason]

Oh, yeah, of course. It's the best.

[Carly]

Nothing else to do there.

[Jason]

Yeah, it's a great.

[Carly]

But what's so interesting is they are finally. It's. How many years has this been? They just now are making an influencer, like, creator major.

[Jason]

What?

[Carly]

It's a combination. I was in the communication school and it's bringing. It's a dual major between the business school and the communication school.

[Jason]

That's. Yeah, yeah.

[Carly]

So schools. It was amazing. I love it there.

[Madison]

So side of influencer, too. Correct.

[Carly]

But there was never a major for that specifically. But influencing is so niche to, like, learn about.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Carly]

Like old established managers and agents, they were like, what is this?

[Jason]

Then when. Now it's just like a money grab. Now they're all just like, yeah.

[Carly]

Now they're like, I need to be in on it.

[Jason]

What the hell they're doing.

[Carly]

I think it's so interesting to think about teaching someone how to be an influencer. And like, I think at the end of the day, you have to have like a panache. You have to, like, have something that you're born with.

[Madison]

You have to have something that you're authentically passionate about or.

[Carly]

Or just. Or like, be funny or something good at makeup. Like anything that's like. So you. And something that kind of can't be

[Jason]

taught a little bit 100.

[Carly]

That, like, you're comfortable, like, putting a phone up and just, like, doing it.

[Jason]

Doing it. And.

[Carly]

But, I mean, there are physical skills, like editing and, like, post, like, little baby skills, but there's something you have to be born with to. To really have something. And I think that's so interesting. People are, like, teaching it.

[Jason]

That's why with this podcast, we're like, 300 episodes for years in. And when I talk about why I start this podcast, it was because when I was a kid, I remember being, like, six years old, always being like, mom, how much does that cost? Like, I would see a boat. I'd be like, what do we have to do to get the boat? And, like, I was just always curious about that. And I don't know why. Adorable gatekeeping thing. Like, what? You know, I wanted the pizza at the hockey rink. It was $4. I was like, all right. I always want to try to figure out the numbers. Like, dad, can I get $4 on? Or what do I have to do for. I don't know. I was always doing that. So that's kind of what started the podcast.

[Carly]

And I think was he like, jason, you have to do three laps around the ring, and then you can come

[Jason]

and 20 minutes, sit in the corner, and that'll give me four bucks. You ask me for three, go ask your mom for one. But then that's. And I think food, obviously, passion. I think people out there, when you're trying to figure out what it is, like, go back to your childhood self, like, what are the things that you're just, like, curious about as a kid that you're running around doing, there's probably. There's possibly a brand there. But I also found that even the best people in the world, like, the best creators that are out there, from micro to macro, the really good ones. And you guys, you know this. You. You have to be your own visionary. Like, even. Yeah, people can edit, but people don't know how to edit the way you like it. People, you know what a good video is. You're two. You're. You're four eyes and four sisters. Like, you guys can see it. You're like, okay, this is a good video. There's. That. You can't teach that, right? Like, you can't teach. That's just, like, from repertoire and knowing your brand.

[Madison]

I can make a video and be like, that's gonna go viral.

[Jason]

Oh, instant.

[Carly]

Like, I will finally go to that.

[Jason]

Yeah, I will know right away. Like, great, right? And that's the hook. The Camera work, the funniness, the timing, all of it. So, yeah, I think there's. There is a science to it a little bit, you know.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Jason]

Yeah. All right. Well, this has been fun to. Awesome to talk to you guys. I can't wait to hear about what's next. Maybe it's the PR agency. I mean, what. I mean, we talked about finances a little bit. Yeah. Broke seven figures. But, like, where do you want, like, what does the dream look like?

[Carly]

Three to five years is a mix, I think, first. Yeah, it's a mix because, I mean, as Madison said, we have our own personal brands that we're growing as well, which is really fun, but it all,

[Madison]

like, feeds into each other. I think Carly is really good and focused on our interview series, and we'll have to take you on a food

[Carly]

phone next time you're here. Next time you're here, or if we come to Nashville.

[Jason]

Yeah. Oh, my God, that would be so much fun.

[Carly]

So fun.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Madison]

And like I was saying, I'm really big on recipes, so, like, I think a cookbook could be. Cookbook would be so good in my future.

[Jason]

Would you open a restaurant?

[Madison]

No, I think.

[Carly]

I think we're just aware of. Of restaurant life, but I think there's

[Madison]

a world in which, like, I don't know, bringing people together around our food. I think the food crawls we do are very interesting and unique. It is time consuming, but I think we keep trying to be a resource for all things food. We also want to be a resource now for people and brands to come to us. Kind of like promote something almost not as like a paid partnership, but like, you know, you. You're on your second book. No. You've done two.

[Jason]

Two books. Yeah.

[Madison]

Like, a lot of people will come to us and say, I have a new cookbook coming out. Can we go on a food crawl? Let's plug the book.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Madison]

So instead of the podcast.

[Jason]

Yeah. It's more so like a content promote, like. Or I thought was really cool is when you talked about the WWE Superstar or an actor actress, when they have a new movie coming out. That's. You would think they're trying to promote the movie, but you can do that in a very subtle way.

[Carly]

So subtle.

[Jason]

Taking advantage of your platform. But yeah, it's still where they're bringing value to you. You're bringing value to them.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Jason]

That's a cool thing to do.

[Madison]

And I mean, listen, Everybody eats everybody. 95% of people love to eat. Like. Like, they enjoy it. Maybe some don't, but there is A tie in with everyone.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Madison]

Which has been cool to see.

[Jason]

They call, I think in the influencer, like, creator side, they'll call it tam. Right. Which is total addressable market. Your total addressable market. Food is higher planet.

[Carly]

Yeah.

[Jason]

It's like every person has to eat.

[Carly]

Yeah, There you go.

[Jason]

There is no niche when every single human walking has to eat. Well, it's so cool to learn about kind of the strategy and how far you guys have come, the amount of years you've done it. Forbes 30 under 30. You're getting nominated for Webby Awards. You've built such an unbelievable community. So it's exciting to. To hear from you guys how you did it. But we gotta wrap with a trading secret. So it's something we can't learn from a textbook or a professor at SU at their influencer management program. Now we can only learn from you guys. So what can we. What can you guys wrap with?

[Carly]

You go first.

[Madison]

Well, I. I've said this before, and it's something from actually our mom, so. Shout out, Susie. Our mom is really big on a positive attitude, and so it's actually funny to this day. And our older sister's 33 and.

[Carly]

What?

[Madison]

I'm 30. 31. You're 31. Carla's gonna be 30 soon. Like, every day she texts us and says, today is going to be a. And we tell her, great day. Every morning.

[Jason]

No way.

[Madison]

Every morning my mom is staying in my house watching my child today, and

[Carly]

she still texts me, did you leave the door? Did you leave to come to the city? And she said, chase gonna be out?

[Madison]

Or she. No, I. I texted while she was in downstairs. Like, she was in my house.

[Jason]

Every day.

[Carly]

Every day. Do you want to say?

[Madison]

And so the point of this is that she is instilled this, like, positive mindset. So every day you want.

[Jason]

Oh, my God.

[Madison]

So every day you want to start off with some positivity. And if you. It's hard because every day you're not going to feel positive. But if you have this in the back of your head, have some positivity. Same as, like, you make your bed every day. Like, there's something you're starting off on the right foot.

[Jason]

I love it. So when she says that, you guys have to fill in the words.

[Madison]

We say the same thing.

[Jason]

We all say, so today is going to be a blank day. And then does someone say, like, do you always say great?

[Carly]

We always say great. Wow, that's cool.

[Jason]

All right. That's a good trading secret. That's a good one. Shout out to your mom.

[Carly]

All right. Oh, I mean that if we could conjoin, I'll. I'll say that as well. But I will say for specifically what we're talking about today, I think if you want to get into posting, if you want to get into influencing, start today, start now.

[Madison]

I heard people say start yesterday.

[Carly]

Start yesterday. Exactly. I think the sooner you start, the more you will get used to and find your groove and find your niche and find your audience. And you're waiting to become whatever. You're waiting to become perfect. You're waiting to become this version of yourself. But just like, start scared. Just start now.

[Jason]

Start.

[Carly]

Because you'll find yourself throughout it. And I just think. Post now, start posting.

[Jason]

Yeah. And the last thing scared.

[Madison]

Good content always wins.

[Carly]

Oh, yeah, that's. That's Bobby Flay. Good content always wins.

[Jason]

Is that what he says? Yeah, that's his thing. And you guys have worked.

[Madison]

That's true.

[Jason]

Yeah, that's a good way to wrap.

[Carly]

He's a good friend.

[Jason]

All right. That's a good friend to have. That's pretty cool. Well, guys, thank you so much for being on Trade Secrets. Where can everyone find everything you guys are putting out?

[Carly]

Sister snacking.

[Jason]

Sister snack. That's the website name. That's the.

[Carly]

That's the Instagram, TikTok substack.

[Madison]

All the above. All of it.

[Carly]

YouTube. And then I'm Maddie Snacks, Carly Shaft.

[Madison]

Yeah. For some personal behind the scenes.

[Carly]

Yeah. If you want to see what our lives look like behind the food, I like it. With different. More food.

[Jason]

I guess we have families, engagements, all the good stuff. Well, thank you guys so much for your on tearing secrets.

[Carly]

Appreciate it. Thanks for having us, Jason.

[Madison]

Thank.

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