Put Up or Shut Up

Summary

Trained to Kill: The Dog Trainer, the Heiress, and the Bodyguard
Episode: Put Up or Shut Up
Host/Author: CBS News (Peter Van Sant)
Release Date: May 7, 2025

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Introduction

Trained to Kill: The Dog Trainer, the Heiress, and the Bodyguard is a gripping six-episode podcast series by CBS News that delves into a dark and complex love triangle involving Mark Stover, Linda Updike, and Michael Ochs. In the fifth episode, titled "Put Up or Shut Up," host Peter Van Sant unravels the events leading up to Mark Stover's mysterious disappearance and subsequent murder, as well as the intricate investigation that followed.

Background: The Triangle Formed

Mark Stover, renowned as the dog whisperer of the Pacific Northwest, was not only a talented dog trainer but also a charismatic individual who caught the attention of Linda Updike, a wealthy blonde heiress. Their relationship blossomed into a business partnership and marriage, drawing public and media interest.

However, Linda revealed a darker side of Mark. As their marriage began to deteriorate, Mark's obsession became apparent. When Linda attempted to leave the marriage, Mark’s behavior escalated to obsessive stalking, leading her to seek the protection of Michiel Ochs, a security expert who soon became Linda's new love interest and bodyguard.

The Fateful Night: October 28, 2009

The episode zeroes in on the night of October 28, 2009—a pivotal moment that changed the lives of those involved.

Confrontation at Mark's House

In the early hours of that morning, Michael Ochs was observed on surveillance footage driving to Mark Stover's house in Anacortes. When questioned, Michael firmly denied any intent to kill Mark.

Michael Ochs [01:11]: "I most certainly did not."

Upon arrival, Michael was instructed by Mark to park a quarter mile away at a church parking lot. This strange directive set the stage for a bizarre and tense encounter.

The Altercation

Michael described being escorted into Mark's house, where he was confronted with demands to produce missing wedding photographs. The situation quickly escalated when Mark, accompanied by his trained attack dog, Ding, grew agitated.

Michael Ochs [02:22]: "It certainly did sound bizarre, and I certainly was frightened."

As tensions peaked, Mark allegedly turned and pulled a gun, shooting Michael in the chest. However, Michael claimed he was wearing a bulletproof vest, which allowed him to survive the shot. Utilizing his security expertise, Michael retaliated by grabbing Mark’s gun and shooting him, claiming self-defense.

Michael Ochs [04:28]: "He started a gunfight and I won."

After the altercation, as Michael exited the house, Ding attacked him, prompting Michael to shoot the dog.

Detective Dan Luvera’s Investigation

Detective Dan Luvera of the Skagit County Sheriff's Office, who dedicated nearly 2,500 hours to investigating Mark’s killing, presented a starkly different narrative.

Detective Dan Luvera [05:04]: "This is not a case of self defense. This is a case of cold blooded murder."

Challenging Michael’s Story

Detective Luvera meticulously dismantled Michael's account by highlighting inconsistencies:

• Alibi Discrepancies: Surveillance footage placed Michael at a Walmart store three hours before the alleged confrontation, purchasing items such as anchor lines, camo clothing, and bolt cutters—items more suited for concealment and disposal of evidence than a peaceful meeting.

  Detective Dan Luvera [08:47]: "We have him on surveillance tape at a local Walmart store here in Mount Vernon at approximately 5:30 in the morning."

• Mocking the Story: The purchases suggested premeditation rather than a spontaneous act of self-defense.

  Detective Dan Luvera [09:24]: "I believe that he bought those items to dispose of Mark's body."

Reconstructing the Crime Scene

Using the crime scene at Mark’s home, Luvera illustrated how the physical evidence did not align with Michael’s narrative:

• Blood Evidence: Blood splatters were found in the hallway, contradicting Michael’s claim that the shooting happened in the bathroom.

• Shell Casings: Spent shell casings indicated multiple gunshots, suggesting a prolonged attack rather than a brief encounter.

  Detective Dan Luvera [11:15]: "Spent shell casings were found outside."

Jennifer Thompson’s Testimony

Jennifer Thompson, Michael’s ex-wife, played a crucial role in unveiling the truth. During questioning, she revealed alarming details about Michael's plans.

Jennifer Thompson [19:23]: "They would basically use Linda as sort of bait to lure the ex spouse toward her."

She disclosed that Michael and possibly others had orchestrated a plan to eliminate Mark Stover, indicating premeditation.

Jennifer Thompson [25:37]: "Wally Updike wanted to hire Michael Oakes to take out the ex husband that was stalking his daughter Linda."

The Conspiracy Deepens: Wally Updike’s Involvement

Further investigations suggested that Wally Updike, Linda’s father and a multimillionaire business tycoon, might have been involved. Jennifer hinted at a deeper conspiracy:

Jennifer Thompson [25:50]: "Wally Updike wanted to hire Michael Oakes to take out the ex husband that was stalking his daughter Linda."

Both Linda and Michael denied any involvement or manipulation by Wally, but Detective Luvera remained suspicious.

Detective Dan Luvera [27:07]: "I believe that she knows more than what she's saying and what she's telling."

Linda Updike’s Possible Complicity

Linda Updike, shielded by legal representation, maintained her innocence and denied any knowledge of the conspiracy.

Linda Updike [29:42]: "It's not something I wanted to have. Any involvement with Mark again. I wanted no harm or anything to happen to Mark."

Despite her denials, the evidence pointed towards a coordinated effort to eliminate Mark, with Linda potentially complicit through her familial ties and resources.

Conclusion: The Hunter and the Hunted

The episode "Put Up or Shut Up" meticulously outlines the unraveling of a seemingly straightforward self-defense claim into a labyrinth of deceit, premeditation, and possible familial conspiracy. Detective Luvera's relentless investigation challenges the initial narrative presented by Michael Ochs, revealing a deeper, more sinister plot that implicates powerful individuals seeking to protect their interests.

The culmination of interviews, surveillance evidence, and testimonies paints a picture of Michael Ochs not as a victim, but as a calculated participant in Mark Stover's murder, possibly orchestrated with the backing of Linda Updike's influential father.

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Notable Quotes:

• Michael Ochs [01:11]: "I most certainly did not."
• Detective Dan Luvera [05:04]: "This is not a case of self defense. This is a case of cold blooded murder."
• Jennifer Thompson [19:23]: "They would basically use Linda as sort of bait to lure the ex spouse toward her."
• Jennifer Thompson [25:37]: "Wally Updike wanted to hire Michael Oakes to take out the ex husband that was stalking his daughter Linda."
• Detective Dan Luvera [27:07]: "I believe that she knows more than what she's saying and what she's telling."

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Final Thoughts

Put Up or Shut Up serves as a compelling examination of how appearances can be deceiving and how those closest to the truth may hold the keys to unlocking it. As the investigation deepens, listeners are left questioning the true motives and alliances of the individuals involved, setting the stage for further revelations in the subsequent episodes of this enthralling series.

Transcript

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[Michael Ochs]

I most certainly did not.

[Peter van Sant]

In the wee hours of October 28, 2009, Michael Ochs was seen on Linda Updike's surveillance footage getting in his SUV and leaving. Why were you going to Stover's house at 2:30 in the morning?

[Michael Ochs]

I was driving there to be there at a prearranged time, a time set and demanded by Mark Stover himself.

[Peter van Sant]

And what did he say the purpose of this visit was going to be?

[Michael Ochs]

It was put up or shut up time. I was supposed to have obtained the wedding pictures that up till then I could not find, and I was supposed to deliver them to him or else.

[Peter van Sant]

And the else is what?

[Michael Ochs]

My children were frequently mentioned as the else. So I sent my children to stay with my my parents in it didn't go well.

[Peter van Sant]

As Michael told it, Mark instructed him to park about a quarter mile away from his house, at the same church where they had met four days before. Why didn't Jesus say, no, I'm not going to park there. I'm going to drive up to your home. This is this really sounds bizarre.

[Michael Ochs]

It certainly did sound bizarre, and I certainly was frightened. But we're back to that same situation. Either it's everything or it's nothing and if it's nothing, it means that I have to scoop up my children and honestly flee to a foreign country or something because there just was no safety inside any area that Mark Stover could find us.

[Peter van Sant]

Michael said he did as he was told, walked to Mark's and was greeted at the front door by Mark, along with his specially trained attack dog, Ding. From there, Michael described Mark leading him through the living room, down the hallway and oddly into the bathroom. That's where he claimed Mark confronted him once again with his never ending obsession with those wedding photos.

[Michael Ochs]

And I went to his house and told him that I couldn't get the pictures that I'd gone through her safe and they weren't in her safe and they weren't in her house. And I presumed that she had destroyed them.

[Peter van Sant]

And what did Mark Stover say to that?

[Michael Ochs]

He didn't say much.

[Peter van Sant]

Instead, Michael claimed Mark suddenly turned around and walked away.

[Michael Ochs]

He was so agitated or erratic that he had. He broke off in mid conversation.

[Peter van Sant]

Michael said when Mark returned, he raised a gun he was holding in his left hand.

[Michael Ochs]

The long and the short of it was moments later I was shot in the chest.

[Peter van Sant]

But Michael had prepared for this moment as a self described security expert. Michael said he was wearing a bulletproof vest that allowed him to safely take the hit to the chest. He said he then quickly lunged at Mark, grabbed the gun and returned fire.

[Michael Ochs]

He started a gunfight and I won.

[Peter van Sant]

But the fight wasn't completely over. As Michael exited the house, he said Mark's dog Ding attacked.

[Michael Ochs]

The dog came at me and I had to shoot the dog. And I stopped shooting as soon as it stopped trying to bite me.

[Peter van Sant]

So what are you telling me? You shot Mark Stover in self defense?

[Michael Ochs]

Absolutely.

[Peter van Sant]

But detectives on the case soon came to a very different conclusion about what happened that morning.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

This is not a case of self defense. This is a case of cold blooded murder.

[Peter van Sant]

I'm Peter van Sant from 48 Hours. This is trained to kill the dog Trainer, the Heiress and The Bodyguard episode 5 put up or Shut Up.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

I want the truth from Michael Oakes as to what really occurred on that day. October 28, 2009 this is Detective Dan.

[Peter van Sant]

Luvera with the Skagit County Sheriff's Office. Now retired, Luvara said He spent nearly 2,500 hours investigating Mark Stover's killing.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

We were a small department and we only have five detectives.

[Peter van Sant]

Luvera thought major parts of Michael's story simply weren't true. That included the meetings over the months that Michael described having with Mark Stover. Michael Oaks Claims he met with Mark Stover at the Northgate Shopping Mall in Seattle. Do you believe that meeting occurred?

[Detective Dan Luvera]

No, not at all.

[Peter van Sant]

He claims he met with Mark Stover at a church parking lot in Anacortes. Do you believe that happened?

[Detective Dan Luvera]

No, not at all.

[Peter van Sant]

He claims Mark Stover comes out of a Costco in Kennewick, Washington and basically has a threatening conversation. Do you believe that happened?

[Detective Dan Luvera]

No.

[Peter van Sant]

You think this is all made up?

[Detective Dan Luvera]

I do.

[Peter van Sant]

I first met Detective Luvera at Mark's house back in 2010. He was a sharp detective who was meticulous and tried not to leave any stone unturned.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

And we're almost a year to the day when this murder occurred.

[Peter van Sant]

It was dusk as we started the interview. Soon it would be dark, just as it was when Michael said he arrived. That morning, Luvera brought a big flashlight to show us the crime scene.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

Michael Ochs says he walked right up the front way steps here.

[Peter van Sant]

First we went through what Michael Oakes said happened.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

He knocks on the door. Mark Stover answers the door. Mark lets him in.

[Peter van Sant]

Luvera and I went inside. Mark's place was like a high end cabin with dark wood floors and exposed oak beams. He said Michael claimed that Mark brought him into that bathroom and then left before coming back with a gun.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

Mark Stover comes around the corner where.

[Peter van Sant]

I'm standing right now.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

Where you're standing right there, right now. He says Mark Stover came around the corner, fired one shot.

[Peter van Sant]

Boom.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

Right into Michael Ochs ballistic vest.

[Peter van Sant]

It's then Michael said he grabbed the gun from Mark's left hand and fired back at point blank range, killing him.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

The whole thing doesn't make sense.

[Peter van Sant]

After he told me Michael's version, Luvera then broke down for me why the evidence doesn't match Michael's story. First, he said investigators discovered that on October 28, 2009, Michael didn't drive directly to Anacortes from Linda's house. Luvara said Michael drove west for nearly three hours before he made a pit stop.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

We have him on surveillance tape at a local Walmart store here in Mount Vernon at approximately 5:30 in the morning.

[Peter van Sant]

What did he buy?

[Detective Dan Luvera]

Michael Ochs bought anchor line, anchor weights. He bought camo pants, camo sweatshirt and a backpack.

[Peter van Sant]

Camouflage.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

Camouflage.

[Peter van Sant]

Kind of an odd eclectic bunch of stuff, isn't it?

[Detective Dan Luvera]

Yes.

[Peter van Sant]

Luvera believed Michael bought those items not to have a talk with Mark Stover, but to hide evidence of a murder.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

I believe that he bought those items to dispose of Mark's body.

[Peter van Sant]

Interestingly, Luvera said Michael also purchased a pair of Soccer shin guards.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

The reason he bought those is that he knew Mark Stover had his dog Ding, and that Ding was trained as a protection dog.

[Peter van Sant]

Luvera said after his Walmart shopping, Michael headed to Anacortes.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

Michael Oakes car arrives in the area of Mark Stower's house sometime between 6:30 and 7am in the morning. It would still be dark.

[Peter van Sant]

Louvera then demonstrated for us what he thought actually happened at Mark's house that morning.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

I think he came up the right hand side of this driveway right here. You can see the tree lines, fence lines. He could have easy concealment. It's dark out. I think as he's in the area of the kennels right here, the dogs are barking. They sense someone or something on the property. Mark was probably alerted to the dogs barking at the kennel since something was wrong.

[Peter van Sant]

Louvera thought a worried Mark then let Ding out of the house to confront whoever or whatever was out there in the darkness.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

And I think the dog was shot right away. Ding starts to yelp. Mark hears Ding yelping. Mark comes out, probably on the carport, he door, porch there, or maybe out in the driveway where Michael Ochs encounters Mark Stover.

[Peter van Sant]

It's during that encounter that Lovera believes Michael Ochs first shot Mark Stover. Spent shell casings were found outside.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

I believe Mark Stover was probably shot just right in this area where we're standing right here. It's the first time, I think he was shot several times. And the first time he was shot, he probably started to retreat back to his residence.

[Peter van Sant]

Luvera believed Mark only made it as far as the hallway just inside the door leading from the carport. And Michael likely fired again and finished Mark off with one final shot.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

There was blood splatters on the wall here, on the wall here.

[Peter van Sant]

When you come into Mark's house through the carport door, immediately on your right is that bathroom. This is where in Michael's dramatic telling, he said Mark shot him in the chest. A bullet stopped by a bulletproof vest. Michael said he wrestled the gun away from Mark and shot him dead. But Lovera is skeptical.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

It's too unbelievable that he could get shot in the vest, lunge at Stover, grab his hand, twist it and shoot Stover and take him down. He's going to back up or he's going to grab his chest as a normal reaction of somebody being shot. But he doesn't say that. He says he immediately goes into a defensive mode and grabs Mark Stover's hand and gun twists, shoots, fires. Mark Stover falls.

[Peter van Sant]

Luvera believed Michael cleaned up the bloody scene at Mark's house with bleach and put on Mark's trademark hat just in case anyone saw him leave in Mark's station wagon. Investigators suspected the driver seen speeding down the driveway was Michael with Mark's body in the back and that Michael then moved Mark's body from the station wagon to his suv. Later, Luvera said Michael's plan worked, fooling employee Stephanie Poore.

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[Peter van Sant]

What made you think it was Mark?

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[Peter van Sant]

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[Peter van Sant]

After Michael left Mark's house at around 10 that morning, he was seen stopping at a store where for some reason he bought a pair of bolt cutters. And then a couple of hours later, just before noon, that's when Tammy Gilden made that call to report a trespasser.

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[Peter van Sant]

She told me it seemed like the man was moving what looked like a body.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

That was huge. They had no idea what was going on. They just happened to see two vehicles parked behind the Grange.

[Peter van Sant]

Then at around 12:30, we now know that Michael was pulled over in Anacortes, Washington by that Skagit county sheriff's deputy. Knowing what we know today, what was in Oak's vehicle when he was pulled over?

[Detective Dan Luvera]

Mark Stoer's body, it was in the back? Yes.

[Peter van Sant]

Luvera said from there, Michael left Anacortes to go meet with his ex wife, Jennifer Thompson. She already told us how they met at a Starbucks, went to the beach, and how before long, she realized Michael had a body with him that day. Investigators said Michael left Jennifer at about 4pm returned the bolt cutters to that store and drove back east over the Cascade Mountains to Linda's house.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

It's a rugged two lane highway that leads through very rural areas of Okanagan and Skagit County.

[Peter van Sant]

Surveillance video showed Michael arriving at Linda's at about 11:30 that night. He parked his SUV. I asked Michael about the evidence they found inside that vehicle. Mark Stover's blood is in your vehicle. How did it get there?

[Michael Ochs]

Well, it got there because. Because he was there.

[Peter van Sant]

Michael then left again. Where he went and what he did is unknown. He returned about 30 minutes later. It was the end of a very long day. A long day that police later learned may have been months in the making.

[Jennifer Thompson]

This is the statement of Jennifer L. Thompson. The date is now 10:32,009. The time is now 2,200 hours.

[Peter van Sant]

Two days after Mark's disappearance, the Skagit County Sheriff's investigators question Michael's second wife, Jennifer Thompson. There is some noise in the background since they are recording at her home. This is Chief Will Reichart. I'm just going to ask you to go over some of the things that we had already talked about so that it's on the record. The first thing they wanted on the record was concerning a call Jennifer claimed Michael received back when they were still.

[Jennifer Thompson]

Married about May 2008. He told me that there was a potential job coming up that he was interested in taking about a woman and an ex spouse that was harassing her.

[Peter van Sant]

If true, that woman could only have been Linda Updike. Jennifer said Michael then revealed details of a sinister plan.

[Jennifer Thompson]

They would basically use Linda as sort of bait to lure the ex spouse toward her.

[Peter van Sant]

Once Mark Stover was fooled into threatening Linda, Jennifer claimed the plan was to violently end that threat.

[Jennifer Thompson]

They would take him out.

[Peter van Sant]

Okay. And by taking him out, you understood that to be they would kill him.

[Jennifer Thompson]

Right.

[Peter van Sant]

And you mentioned that. That didn't really sit too well with you.

[Jennifer Thompson]

No.

[Peter van Sant]

It bothered you that he was contemplating doing something like this?

[Jennifer Thompson]

Yeah, we had, you know, mortgage, family house, kids kind of thing. And as I said, this isn't good. It's a good thing for you to be doing. And we had a big fight about it, big argument.

[Peter van Sant]

Jennifer claimed that it was after this bitter argument, their marriage quickly fell apart.

[Jennifer Thompson]

Eventually, I left the home in July of 2008 for separation.

[Peter van Sant]

One month later, she said Michael told her that he wanted a divorce.

[Jennifer Thompson]

In January of 2009, our divorce became final and we pretty much stopped contact.

[Peter van Sant]

But then In October of 2009, Jennifer reached out to Michael. She wanted to give him one last chance to reconcile.

[Jennifer Thompson]

We still had this intensity together. And so it was just the email of, are you sure? Are you sure? Her instead of me.

[Peter van Sant]

Jennifer said. After a few emails between them, Michael wrote that he'd soon be on the west side of the mountains and suggested they meet. This was October 24, which is the same day Michael said he met Mark Stover at that church in Anacortes.

[Jennifer Thompson]

They just said he was here on a job, a side job. And I knew what that meant, but I didn't ask for specifics.

[Peter van Sant]

Did he say that that job was going to be particularly dangerous, or did he?

[Jennifer Thompson]

He did. When he was leaving here, he said he was going on and that there was risk involved, possible injury to himself, that it was fairly dangerous.

[Peter van Sant]

Michael told me that he showed up to that October 24th meeting without the wedding photos and that Mark demanded Michael return later in the week. The following day, Michael messaged Jennifer.

[Jennifer Thompson]

He texted me and said, job failed. I'm okay. No pay, though.

[Peter van Sant]

Three days after that October 25th message, on the same day Mark was killed, Michael and Jennifer met again. The day that they met at that Starbucks, when Michael mentioned that he was afraid of getting arrested, he was really.

[Jennifer Thompson]

Concerned about getting pulled over with the things in his vehicle. He wanted to get them home and get them sterilized. And he said, if anyone sees this now, I'm going in right away.

[Peter van Sant]

By going in, meaning he would be arrested right away, he thought if somebody saw what was in his vehicle. But there was one final interaction with police that convinced Jennifer that Michael was the hunter in all of this.

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[Peter van Sant]

A month after Jennifer was questioned, the detectives came back to her house. They wanted Jennifer to listen to a cd. She told me her reaction after hearing the anonymous tipster's voice telling the 911 operator about a drug deal involving Mark Stover. There's going to be a van transporting some drugs from the Anacortes area.

[Jennifer Thompson]

My first thought was, what an idiot.

[Peter van Sant]

Jennifer instantly recognized the voice.

[Jennifer Thompson]

I knew it was him.

[Peter van Sant]

How do you know it's him?

[Jennifer Thompson]

I was married to him. I know how he talks. Michael's voice, of his disguise. But it was his speech pattern and it was him.

[Peter van Sant]

It was devastating for her. Everything she had suspected suddenly clicked because.

[Jennifer Thompson]

In that moment I knew it was all premeditated.

[Peter van Sant]

Jennifer thought back to that job Michael mentioned and remembered something else. Michael told her something he said on the day Mark Stover was shot.

[Jennifer Thompson]

He said that the people that were helping him and I had the impression that there were two, but I don't know that that was stated. People that were helping him were no longer helping him and he was on his own. No one was going to help him.

[Peter van Sant]

So who could be helping Michael? Well, when Jennifer was being questioned by detectives in those early days after the murder, she shared an intriguing detail.

[Jennifer Thompson]

The father of the woman was initiating the job.

[Peter van Sant]

That would be multi millionaire business tycoon Wally Updike, Linda's father. Later, when I got to sit down with Jennifer. She explained this further.

[Jennifer Thompson]

Wally Updike wanted to hire Michael Oakes to take out the ex husband that was stalking his daughter Linda.

[Peter van Sant]

Simple as that.

[Jennifer Thompson]

Simple as that.

[Peter van Sant]

Do you believe that Linda Updike is involved in this? That she either paid or manipulated Michael to kill?

[Jennifer Thompson]

I don't believe she manipulated because he's too smart for that. But I do believe that they served each other's needs. Meaning I think she's as guilty as he is.

[Peter van Sant]

Jennifer's testimony to police suggested that Mark's murder was a premeditated hired hit. In our interviews, Linda and Michael both denied that her father had anything to do with Mark's death.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

I believe that she knows more than what she's saying and what she's telling.

[Peter van Sant]

Detective Dan Lovera never called Linda Updike a suspect. But he has always wondered if she was involved. How would Michael Ochs know that Mark Stover always wore a hat and wore an overcoat driving a car through Linda?

[Detective Dan Luvera]

Linda was. Was his basis of information? Linda had knowledge. He had direct knowledge. You know, she was married to Mark. She. She knew him best.

[Peter van Sant]

When I spoke to Michael, he told me that he just spontaneously put on the hat after he spotted it in Mark's car that morning.

[Michael Ochs]

There was a pair of glasses and a cap or hat sitting on the seat. And when I sat down, I had to move the hat. I put it on my head and thought, this shall probably do for getting down the driveway. And that's all there was to that. It didn't have anything to do with anybody. But the moment.

[Peter van Sant]

You'Re telling me you just decided to put this hat on? Well, you hadn't been told by Linda that that's a hat that Mark Stover would wear?

[Michael Ochs]

No. I'd seen two or three pictures of Mark Stover.

[Peter van Sant]

Detective Luvera told me that he wanted to ask Linda about this and many other aspects of the case. Have you received cooperation from Linda Updike?

[Detective Dan Luvera]

No.

[Peter van Sant]

As is common in a case like this, Linda and her father, Wally Updike, hired lawyers after Michael was arrested. She won't sit down and talk to you.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

She won't sit down and talk to us.

[Peter van Sant]

She's lawyered up.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

She's lawyered up.

[Peter van Sant]

While Linda declined to take questions from Luvera, she was willing to answer mine. Investigators believe that you must have given Michael details of Mark Stover's life that would aid him in attacking Mark Stover, Knowing when he got up, what hat he wore during the day, what car he drove with the dogs. What do you say? To that. That's simply not true.

[Advertiser]

I had no interaction or contact with.

[Peter van Sant]

Mark for since the protection order was issued.

[Advertiser]

It's not something I wanted to have.

[Peter van Sant]

Any involvement with Mark again. I wanted no harm or anything to happen to Mark. I just wanted to go on with my life with Michael and I wanted Mark to go on with his life. In other words, did you brief Michael Ochs on the intricacies of Mark Stover's life, right down to the hat that he liked to wear during the day to aid him in an assassination? Of course not. The suggestion is out there. Did your father have anything to do with the killing of Mark Stover?

[Advertiser]

Absolutely not.

[Peter van Sant]

Both Linda and Michael refused to answer most of the authorities questions until they took the stand at trial. There was of course one big question Michael still had not answered. What did you do with Mark Stover's body?

[Michael Ochs]

I think that probably the nitty gritties on that. I really want to tell you about it. We're going to have to wait to court.

[Peter van Sant]

From 48 hours, this is Train to Kill, the Dog Trainer, the Heiress and the Bodyguard, produced by Sony Music Entertainment. I'm your host, Peter Van Sant. Judy Tigard is the executive producer of 48 Hours, original reporting by 48 Hours producers Ryan Smith and Liza Finley. Jamie Benson is the senior producer for Paramount Audio and Maura Waltz is the senior story editor. Recording assistance from Alan Peng and Reginald Bazile. Special thanks to Paramount Podcast Vice President Megan Marcus. It is written and produced by Alex Schuman. Stephanie Serrano is our editor. Our executive producer is Shira Morris. Our associate producer is Zoe Kulkin. Theme and original music composed by Hansdale Shih. Cedric Wilson is our sound designer and mixed the episodes. We also use music from APM and Epidemic Sounds. Fendel Fulton is our fact checker. Our production manager is Tamika Balance Kolasny. I'm Peter Van Sant. If you're enjoying the show, be sure to rate and review. It helps more people find it and hear our reporting. Follow and listen to Train to kill and other 48 Hours podcasts on the free Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening. Now streaming when everything's on the line, real heroes rise to the occasion.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

TV's hottest show is Fire Country.

[Peter van Sant]

We're firefighters. We're gonna find a way to get you out of here.

[Detective Dan Luvera]

We take the hits together. We're on the same team.

[Peter van Sant]

I'm right here with you no matter what.

[Advertiser]

I would never leave you hanging Hanging.

[Peter van Sant]

In the deep end. This place is a way of giving you. New Family Fire Country. All episodes now streaming on Paramount. Plus.