Podcast Summary: TranscendingX #71 – Bring Your Creativity with Dale Williams

Host: Uri Schneider
Guest: Dr. Dale Williams, Professor and Chair of Communication Sciences and Disorders at Florida Atlantic University; Board Certified Specialist in Fluency
Date: April 18, 2022

Overview

This episode explores the powerful intersection of creativity and stuttering, featuring Dr. Dale Williams. Uri and Dale dive into the journey of living with stuttering, overcoming fear and avoidance, and how creative expression can provide freedom and acceptance. The conversation traverses Dale’s backstory, his books (notably a children’s book about stuttering), practical tips for risk-taking in communication, and the importance of both the speaker and listener in meaningful exchanges. The tone is candid, insightful, and encouraging for anyone facing communication challenges.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Introducing Dr. Dale Williams and the Power of Creativity

[00:32–04:09]

• Uri highlights Dale’s diverse background as an academic, author, creative, and leader in the stuttering community.
• Dale’s children’s book, “The Can’t Be Seen Who Couldn’t Squawk,” and its striking illustrations (by Susanna Brown) are mentioned as an entry point into using creative mediums for stuttering advocacy.
• Connection drawn to Dr. Seuss’s "The Sneetches" and its lessons about belonging.

“Your creative expression, the rhymes and the creativity, the way you give talking a new word called squawking… just made me think of Dr. Seuss.”
—Uri Schneider [05:34]

Dale’s Stuttering Journey: From Avoidance to Acceptance

[06:45–14:49]

• Dale recounts his early years: embarrassment, laughter from classmates and teachers, and heavy avoidance throughout high school and college.
• Employed tricks so few people knew he stuttered; avoidance became increasingly exhausting and restrictive.
• Pivotal change in his twenties—a realization that he couldn’t go on “being defeated every day.”

“All that does is increase the word fears, increase the situational fears. And I really reached a point where it was enough… So I had to look for little victories.”
—Dale Williams [08:57]

• The shift occurred due to life transitions (jobs, grad school), and a delayed appreciation for lessons learned in therapy.

Therapy Insights: The Long-Term Power of Planting Seeds

[12:23–13:29]

• Change is often delayed: “You may have a significant impact in [a] person’s life. You’re just not going to see it because it’s going to be 10 years later.”
  —Dale Williams

• Uri reflects on the need for parents/clinicians to be patient, with a “long-term investment” view.

Choosing Speech-Language Pathology and Embracing the Field

[15:04–18:56]

• Dale’s path to becoming a speech-language pathologist was serendipitous—stemming from dissatisfaction in marketing, a chance conversation, and a personal connection to the field.
• Uri highlights the unique strength of people who have experienced stuttering entering the field, despite (in the past) facing skepticism.

Representation in SLP Programs and the Importance of Discussion

[18:56–21:55]

• Recounts a powerful classroom moment: initially denying he stuttered when asked, then opening up and witnessing how dialogue enriches teaching and destigmatizes stuttering.
• Advice for educators: seek interaction, foster critical thinking, even if it’s challenging.

“It is a class, it is a topic...that works so much better if there’s give and take...to kind of play with that with a class makes the class a lot better.”
—Dale Williams [20:40]

Excerpt from "The Can't Be Seen Who Couldn't Squawk": Acceptance and Letting Go of Shame

[24:06–29:49]

• Uri reads a rhymed passage expressing the protagonist’s journey from avoidance and fear to acceptance and fun in “squawking” (speaking).
• Dale describes how the book intentionally covers experiences like bullying, avoidance, loneliness, professional help, and ultimately, acceptance—a direct reflection of the therapeutic journey.

“You stop hiding...and suddenly you find yourself not stuttering or not squawking as much. And that did reflect my own experiences.”
—Dale Williams [27:45]

The Marriage of Science, Art, and Storytelling

[29:49–34:27]

• Dale shares his career’s evolution: from rigorous scientific research to creative, accessible books and storytelling—blending technical understanding with impactful communication.
• Emphasizes the power of diverse creative outlets (poetry, painting, comedy, dance, photography, film) for expressing stuttering experiences.

Creativity in the Stuttering Community

[34:27–37:21]

• Discussion of notable creatives—Daniele Rossi’s "Stuttering Is Cool" and John Gomez’s films, and the variety of expressive mediums available.
• Embracing individual perspectives and storytelling—even if not universally representative.

The Role of the Listener: Stereotypes and Communication Dynamics

[37:21–43:23]

• Dale’s book “Stuttering: Power Over It” categorizes types of listeners: the know-it-all, the jerk, the curious one, the benevolent one, family, friends, dates, and “the subtle one” (microaggressions).
• Subtle, often-deniable forms of exclusion can be uniquely painful—difficult to identify, but frequently experienced by people who stutter.

Practical Tips: Navigating Listener Interactions

[43:23–45:12]

• Advice: Be true to yourself; not everyone can or should challenge others directly.
• Simple strategies: If someone finishes your sentence, repeat the intended sentence anyway, subtly sending a message.

“Do what works for you...So much of stuttering is individualized. I think the way we treat listeners can be added to that list.”
—Dale Williams [44:44]

The Importance of Risk-Taking in Transfer and Generalization

[45:12–55:40]

• Uri reads from Dale’s chapter on “Risk Taking”—using a soccer analogy: mastery in practice is not the same as real-world performance; transferring skills to new contexts is essential and challenging.
• Therapy shouldn't wait until the end to focus on transfer; start generalizing skills from day one.
• The hardest part of therapy is moving beyond the comfort of the treatment room.

“Life doesn’t happen inside the treatment room.”
—Dale Williams [49:51]

Creativity as Process: Writing, Drafts, and Overcoming Perfectionism

[56:32–62:26]

• Dale shares practicalities of writing: slow, incremental work, allowing for imperfect first drafts, with the real work in editing and refining over time.
• Encourages would-be writers: just start writing; the act itself is valuable, regardless of immediate audience.

Parallels between Writing and Speaking: The Pitfall of Over-Editing

[62:26–64:47]

• Uri draws an analogy between writing drafts and speaking: constant self-editing before speaking holds many people who stutter back—just “put it out there.”

Acceptance: Gradual Change and Situation-Specific Progress

[66:00–69:28]

• Dale explains that caring less about stuttering is a gradual, situation-specific journey—acceptance increases with age and experience.

“My 13-year-old self would not listen to [‘stop hiding’]...But if I could get him to listen...You think people don’t know your speech is different, but they kind of do.”
—Dale Williams [69:38]

Final Reflections & Takeaways

[71:52–75:49]

• The path to acceptance and creative self-expression is neither quick nor linear; seeds planted today may take years to flourish.
• Different audiences (children, teens, adults) require different kinds of communication and creative engagement.
• Write, speak, and create for your own growth, and you may find your voice resonates far and wide.

Notable Quotes

• “You may have a significant impact in [a] person’s life. You’re just not going to see it because it’s going to be 10 years later.”
  —Dale Williams [12:23]

• “You stop hiding...suddenly you find yourself not stuttering or not squawking as much.”
  —Dale Williams [27:45]

• “Life doesn’t happen inside the treatment room.”
  —Dale Williams [49:51]

• “Do what works for you...So much of stuttering is individualized.”
  —Dale Williams [44:44]

• “Just start writing. Let the words flow.”
  —Dale Williams [60:18]

Resource Links

• Dr. Dale Williams’s books at HearsayResources.com
• “The Can’t Be Seen Who Couldn’t Squawk” – children’s book
• “Stuttering: Power Over It” – workbook for adults
• More episodes: TranscendingX.com/podcast

Listener Questions & Community Interaction

Throughout the episode, multiple listeners (including professionals and family members) engaged via live chat to discuss therapy transfer, risk-taking, creative courage, and the experience of receiving feedback from children who read Dale's books. Dale’s responses highlight the importance of patience, personal comfort, and celebrating small and long-term victories.

Closing

The episode concludes with mutual appreciation for curiosity, creative thinking, and the courage it takes to show up authentically. Dale's blend of science and art, and his encouragement to both “just write” and “just speak,” leave listeners with practical inspiration to move forward—creatively and courageously—on their own communication journeys.