Listener Question Extravaganza PART 6 - TRAP TALK E87

Summary

Podcast Summary: Trap Talk From The Back Fence - Listener Question Extravaganza PART 6 (TRAP TALK E87)

Release Date: August 16, 2024
Hosts: Zach Denini & Richard Marshall Jr.
Podcast Description:
Listen in as Zach Denini & Richard Marshall Jr. delve into the world of trapshooting, engaging with legends, top shots, and more to bring you insightful discussions and expert advice!

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Introduction

The episode kicks off with Zach Denini welcoming listeners back to "Trap Talk" and introducing his co-host, Richard Marshall Jr. They share their excitement about the ongoing Grand 2024 AIM weekend, highlighting the newly set-up podcast studio and expressing gratitude to contributors like John for their hard work in making the studio possible. [00:23 – 01:31]

Notable Quote:
Zach Denini: "Thanks to everyone that made it possible." [01:09]

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Listener Questions

1. Brad’s Question: Improving Post Five Performance [01:31 – 05:21]

Question Overview:
Brad inquires about his wife's struggles with trapshooting, specifically on post five where she shoots behind or to the left of the targets. He mentions that despite using a shot cam, her movement remains inconsistent, and he seeks advice on enhancing her performance.

Hosts' Insights:

• Zach suggests replacing the one-shot cam with a ShotTracker for better analysis.
• Richard recommends ensuring she's correctly aligned at the post and adjusting the combination to suit her stance. He emphasizes starting with shooting straight to identify any inconsistencies in movement or stance.

Notable Quotes:
Richard Marshall Jr.: "If she's shooting to the left of everything... I would move the comb accordingly." [02:08]
Zach Denini: "Check your brakes on all the posts." [04:03]

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2. Craig McCoy’s Question: Left-Handed Shooting Challenges [05:31 – 10:42]

Question Overview:
Craig, a class C shooter and youth team coach, discusses his difficulties as a left-handed shooter despite believing he’s right-eye dominant. He has experimented with various sighting aids but feels his field of view is obstructed when shooting with one eye.

Hosts' Insights:

• Richard addresses the issue of lens alignment and suggests adjusting the nose piece of his shooting glasses to eliminate the gap obstructing his vision.
• Zach advocates for embracing one-eyed shooting by tapering the dots to enhance peripheral vision, emphasizing depth perception benefits.

Notable Quotes:
Zach Denini: "I think closed eye is probably the hardest scenario in my mind." [09:17]
Richard Marshall Jr.: "Commit to saying, I'm going to make the taper and the dot work." [09:35]

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3. Matt’s Question: Avoiding Shooting the Blur & Slow Bird Calls [10:42 – 19:15]

Question Overview:
Matt from California seeks advice on preventing shooting blurry targets due to holding a high gun and being short on shooting angles. Additionally, he's been told he issues slow bird calls, which distracts other shooters.

Hosts' Insights:

• Richard advises lowering the hold point to reduce the blur and maintain better alignment with the target.
• Zach concurs, sharing techniques inspired by Bullard to ensure the target is clearly visible before making a move.
• On the issue of slow bird calls, Zach recommends adjusting microphone placement to prevent audio distractions and suggests refining the tempo and tone of calls to avoid disrupting fellow shooters.

Notable Quotes:
Richard Marshall Jr.: "Keep your eyes close around the barrel, maybe even 20% under it." [14:10]
Zach Denini: "Don't make the move until you see it clearly." [14:42]

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4. Corey’s Question: Reloading Ammunition for Doubles [35:06 – 43:04]

Question Overview:
Corey, a new doubles shooter, asks whether loading 1-ounce shells for the first shot to save on reloading costs and reduce recoil is advisable.

Hosts' Insights:

• Richard acknowledges the cost-saving aspect but emphasizes that more pellets generally lead to better target coverage.
• Zach argues that if recoil isn’t an issue, using heavier loads like ounce and an eighth maximizes pellet count, enhancing performance. He likens it to choosing larger steaks for better value, underscoring the benefits of higher pellet counts without significant drawbacks.

Notable Quotes:
Zach Denini: "More pellets is better. Why would I not want to use more pellets if I could?" [37:53]
Richard Marshall Jr.: "If it’s a cost issue and you love to shoot this game, then hey, do what you got to do." [41:28]

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5. Joe’s Question: Struggling with Handicap Shooting [36:12 – 55:40]

Question Overview:
Joe from Iowa, a retired shooter who previously excelled in class A, shares his struggles with handicap shooting. Despite good single scores, he fails to maintain consistency in handicap rounds and wonders if his equipment, specifically a Browning XT trap over/under with no adjustments, is the issue.

Hosts' Insights:

• Richard advises Joe to consider gun fit and mechanics, suggesting he might benefit from an adjustable comb to fine-tune his setup. He shares anecdotes of successful shooters using various equipment configurations, emphasizing that success isn’t solely dependent on high-end gear.
• Zach reinforces the importance of incremental adjustments and maintaining consistent shooting mechanics, particularly when transitioning between different yard lines. He highlights the necessity of precise gun movements and proper training to improve handicap performance.

Notable Quotes:
Richard Marshall Jr.: "You need to have the combination be good. No second guess." [48:28]
Zach Denini: "Make one clean move to the center of the target and break it." [51:12]

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Advice and Insights

Throughout the episode, Zach and Richard provide actionable advice tailored to each listener’s unique challenges. They emphasize the importance of equipment fit, consistent practice, and incremental adjustments over drastic changes. Additionally, they highlight the significance of mental preparation and maintaining focus during shoots to enhance performance.

Key Takeaways:

• Equipment Optimization: Ensure your gear fits well and is adjusted to your specific needs.
• Consistent Mechanics: Maintain steady shooting techniques across different scenarios.
• Mental Preparation: Stay relaxed and focus on the target rather than external factors.
• Incremental Adjustments: Make small, deliberate changes to your setup or technique to identify what works best.

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Conclusion

The episode concludes with Zach and Richard encouraging listeners to send in more questions via their website, as well as expressing gratitude to their sponsors who support the podcast. They reiterate their commitment to helping fellow shooters improve and enjoy the sport, wrapping up the Listener Question Extravaganza with a sense of community and shared passion for trapshooting.

Notable Quote:
Zach Denini: "We love it. With that being said, let's get back..." [55:28]

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Overall, this episode of "Trap Talk From The Back Fence" offers valuable insights and practical solutions for trapshooting enthusiasts, addressing a range of challenges from equipment issues to shooting techniques. Zach and Richard’s expert advice, combined with their engaging dialogue, makes this an informative and enjoyable listen for both seasoned shooters and newcomers alike.

Transcript

[Zach Denini]

Welcome to season two of Trap Doc.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Brought to you by Craig Off.

[Zach Denini]

With that being said, Trap Talk listeners, if you love everything about Trap Talk, please subscribe to our page. Also, throw some likes on the videos that you enjoy. It really means the world to us.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah. Comment on each episode. We read them, we respond to them with that. Let's get to the show.

[Zach Denini]

Welcome back, Trap Talk listeners. I'm your host, Zach Denini, and I'm here with the one and Only Richard.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Marshall Jr. What's up?

[Zach Denini]

We are still at the Grand.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yes, we are.

[Zach Denini]

2024 AIM weekend. We're shooting content left and right.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

That's why we got the podcast studio.

[Zach Denini]

Yeah, we got a new. What do you think about this shot, guys? We got. We got a little sign behind the white flyer.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Love. We got more signs coming.

[Zach Denini]

Thanks to everyone that made it possible. John, he's been working hard in here. All the hard work.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

So Big daddy, he's one did. I'm in this beautiful podcast studio.

[Zach Denini]

Dad did a great job. We're really, really proud of him. But, you know, we keep getting questions, more Q and A. So we're gonna. We're gonna hit some out because we got a little bit of time tonight and John says we gotta catch up. Yeah, we can't sleep, so let's get into it. John, what do we got for some.

[John]

Questions from the Sup Slink Listener extravaganza part five? Coming at everybody. We've got some great questions coming in. This question comes in from Brad. Brad is saying, my wife has been shooting trap on and off for the last couple of years. Recently, she's been having major problems on post five. She is currently using a shot cam and the videos are indicating she is shooting behind the targets, specifically straight out or from the middle of the house. She seems to be moving to the left of the target. Any advice on how to get her to make better moves at the targets?

[Zach Denini]

Easy. One shot cam needs to be replaced.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

With shot shot tracker.

[Zach Denini]

And then if we did that, we'd already be a little bit closer to it. But what do you think other than that, Rick?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I mean, if she's shooting to the left of everything. Yes, I would.

[Zach Denini]

Honestly, the last five on a hard right.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Well, no, she. He said the left. I would take and put the. The trap on straightaway, stand there on post three and shoot it. You know, a fixed straightaway target. And if she's consistently moving to the left, then I would move the comb accordingly. So I would move the combination away from her face into her face. Everybody's a little different on that. And is she lined up now? That's the other thing. I mean, did he respond with the question?

[Zach Denini]

It's a hard. It's a hard question because it's not a hard question. It's. It's.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You're making it hard right now.

[Zach Denini]

I think you have to. You have to think to yourself, what's going on and why is it only on five versus on 1, 2, 3, 4? If she's breaking center, what was she.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Doing on 1, 2, 3, and 4? Did it say?

[Zach Denini]

Nope.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

So just five.

[Zach Denini]

That's the thing. It's. It's only five.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Could be your hold point.

[Zach Denini]

Could be hold point. Could be feet. You know, right off the bat, your feet could be wrong. Your whole point could be wrong.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah.

[Zach Denini]

Maybe potentially anticipating to the right. I know a lot of people are scared of that hard right.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

If she's shooting to the left, then she's not.

[Zach Denini]

Maybe she's throwing back the other way.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I mean, yeah, honestly, without seeing her shoot, it'd be tough to comment exactly on what the problem would be.

[John]

But I think what you're saying, Rick, is let's start off with making sure we're shooting straight.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I would, honestly, in a situation like this, I would take it to a pattern board, lock it in, you're looking down it with a figure eight and shooting where you're looking.

[Zach Denini]

Yeah, I. I think that's the best thing you could do. The biggest thing I would say is check your brakes on all the posts, though, because I would say if you're shooting left on 5, if there's an issue, you're probably shooting left a little bit. On some other posts, you might not be noticing it, if that's really the issue.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Otherwise, go back and look at our videos on stance. We did it. We did a video. We were in Tucson, showed our stance. Check your stance.

[John]

Yeah. So we've got hard rights coming out. She's shooting behind or to the left of them.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

So that's.

[John]

You guys always talk about. Make sure you're getting out to that front edge.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Make sure the target.

[John]

Make sure you're not moving right. I think if just speaking from a novice shooter standpoint, on post five, hard rights, some. Sometimes we want to jump that bird a little bit. Right. Get out too much on it.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Well, the problem is with your feet. And Zach can tell you this, the same thing is if you're not turned quite right, you're going to start arm shooting.

[Zach Denini]

Correct.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

And you run out of rotation, you're.

[Zach Denini]

Going to run out of rotation. And the other problem about jumping out with the target is a lot of people that anticipate if it is the hard right and she's shooting behind it. If she's anticipating it, she's jumping out in front of it, getting ahead of it and. And then she's stopping her hands and shooting behind because she gets out in front and then stops the gun. So that's pretty common when people get that hard right bird and they're like, okay, I'm scared of it, I'm gonna. And they give it the gas and then their body says, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You can't move no further.

[Zach Denini]

Yeah, you can't go any farther.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

That's what I would recommend is check your stance and go from there.

[John]

Okay, well, thank you much for the question, Brad.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Thanks, Brad.

[John]

We're gonna keep it moving here. This next question comes in from Craig McCoy. So we've got a pretty lengthy question here with punctuation. We always love that. That helps me.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Obviously that helps John, don't help us. We're not going to read them. He just tells us we're working on.

[John]

Reading out loud this year. This is the important thing. All right, so good morning, guys. Late comer to the podcast, but 36 episodes in and I'm loving it. So thank you very much for that, Craig. So here's the question. Here's some background on my question. I'm a class C shooter who's been shooting for a few years and, but not consistently. I help with a youth team as a coach and I've been helping my kids learn how to trap shoot and I still need some help myself. Now with that being said, how am I really going to work on my game as a left handed shooter? And I always thought I was right eye dominant. So he's having some right eye dominance. Dominant shooter, he said. I've messed with the tape, the dots, the pipe sights, just shooting two eyes and even switching sides. But I feel like at 47, the best thing to do is just embrace being one of those one eyed shooters. But I don't know if I can live with that. My issue is that when I shoot one eyed, I really feel like my field of view is obstructed. Makes sense. He's shooting with absolutely less vision and it almost feels like I'm trying to look between the gap and the nose piece of my glasses or the lenses on my shooting glasses. It's not quite that extreme, but you get the idea. I also have a ton of cheek slap and Mr. Marshall helped me with that. And shoot at KCTA a few years ago. So it looks like maybe you shout out to Craig before. So he's wondering with his left eye dominance and trying some different aids here, is he going to make the move to two eyes? What do you guys suggest on that side of things?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Going back to one of the things I picked up was he said he's looking through the gap in the lenses nose piece. So that tells me is he has narrow eyes which my wife is the same way. And the most just standard off the wall lenses don't work frames. So you might have to tweak the nose piece to shift the lenses over so you can see a full view out of it because he's getting the cheek slap with probably lifting his head because he can't see right. So there's all sorts of things. So first I would work on the lenses making sure you're not seeing through that gap. You're seeing through the lens. Okay, one and then two. I would, I wouldn't change back to shooting right handed. You know, I would stick with what you're doing. The pipe sights will work if everything looks good. That's one of the things. Now if it doesn't look good, you're not seeing. You got to make sure that's the one thing people don't do is making sure the gun's like well it looks good. Well I can maybe look good but it's got to be perfect.

[Zach Denini]

It can be also even an eighth of an inch. You're done.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, you're eighth of an inch. I mean you know, 64th for you. But it's a lot, you know, that's, it's a little thing. So I would make sure that the mount and looking down it is perfect. Then we go to being able to either shoot one eye or two eyed.

[Zach Denini]

I think I've been a big fan of people that shooting one eye, going to the taper the dots. I really think that that's the evolution of the game because you get a lot more peripheral vision if you're going to do it. I don't see why if you could do it with one eye, you can't do it with an eye and a dot. Like you're, you're going to get more field of vision, you're going to get more depth.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Will you get depth perception correct with tape on a dot, whatever it might be.

[Zach Denini]

Exactly.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Versus closing, closing one eye, versus you lose covering, you get the depth reception.

[Zach Denini]

So I would say if you're going to stay on the side that you're Going to stay on. I would. I would tell you to commit to saying, I'm going to make the daughter, the tape work. That would be my advice to you. Instead of closing the eye, because I think closed eye is probably the hardest scenario in my mind. And then it goes.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Tape. Then you get fatigued.

[Zach Denini]

Two eye, right? So, I mean, ideally, if you could shoot two eyes, that's the best. But if you can't do it, you're not willing to flip sides, then I would embrace the tape and the dot. Now, be careful, because a lot of people go to the tape and the dot, they don't put enough tape or enough dot.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

And.

[Zach Denini]

And then when they turn their head this way, they look out the side, they get that hard left angle, and their left eye catches it, and they're like, oh, well, that doesn't work. Well, no, you. You're not taping the full range of that eye. So if you're over here, turned in on that gun and your eyes out here, and it goes this way, you need to have enough tape or enough dot to cover the range of whatever that left eye is moving on. Because if it gets around that tape, you're done. Right? You're done now. Not. Not too looking around.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You don't. You gotta. That's what the whole thing is. The setup is making sure, like I said, your mountain, Everything's straighter. They looks good and okay, we're good there. Now we go out and start shooting and see what's going on.

[John]

All right, I like it. And thank you again for sending in that question. If you want to send your questions in, please send them to ask [e-mail] we'll definitely get these guys to answer them for you.

[Zach Denini]

All right, folks, we got to take a quick second and give a huge shout out to our title sponsor, Craig Off. Me and Ricky both shoot them. We both love them.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yep. Best gun in the industry. I shoot them, I sell them. Nothing better. Folks, get yourself a Craig up. Your scores will increase.

[Zach Denini]

Yeah, I mean, Ricky's got hundreds and hundreds of hundreds with his. I mean, I've got a few hundreds, but. But I'm always working to get a little bit better, and they definitely help me, that's for sure. So on top of that, we also got to thank winning. I'm wearing the shirt today. Love this shirt. If you're down at the grand, pick one up.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, winning. Like I said, Zach, hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of my winning stock. You know, get a hold of Bobby, Luke, Bill, get an appointment set up. They will make you a better shooter with that winning stock.

[Zach Denini]

Of course. Yeah, the grand is the great place to do it. Give them a call, get on their book. It's worth your time.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Just remember, winners shoot winnings.

[Zach Denini]

With that being said, let's get back.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

To the show, guys.

[John]

We're moving on extravaganza. We're keeping it rolling. Keep it rolling comes in from Matt from California. He says how to avoid shooting the blur. I hold a fairly high gun, similar to Bullard, and I catch myself on slight angles, and I'm short shooting because I believe I'm only seeing the blur. Any tips for this? Move my gun closer to the house, question mark. I've been told I get slow bird calls constantly. Oh, this is number two. He slid a second question.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Slid a two.

[Zach Denini]

First two birds. You got a tip?

[John]

Yeah. We're gonna need a little tip here. Okay. All right, so Matt slides in question number two here. In addition to the short shooting of the blur, I've also been told I get slow bird calls constantly. Pretty much everyone at my club and others outside of my club. And to be honest, I've never noticed. The only time I do is if I get a speaker that gives everyone a slow bird. Should I change my call? What would you guys suggest with everyone telling me that I get slow calls and slow birds?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I would say let's start with the first question.

[John]

Okay.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Holding the gun like Bullard, you don't need to be pointing at the moon and trying to go down to the target, what you want it. And if you see in the blur what's happened, he's got his eyes disconnected from the gun so far that my to me, if he's seeing a blur, he's looking over the barrel, where if you're holding that high gun, you need to be looking around the barrel so you can see it. And. Oh, there it is. And goes back to when. Wisconsin, here, two weeks ago, when Ryan Glow and I shot off and it come down. Him and I, we end up shooting. I think it was 125 targets with 17 turns on the spring. 80 yards, and they were super high. And I held a high gun, but I looked around, and as soon as I saw the target appear, I slowly moved the gun and then zoom. It zoomed by, locked right on. Bam.

[John]

So it's not even trapped, though. You're not.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

No, I'm not trapping. And that's the one thing. So what I would recommend is, okay, your whole nigun. Like Bullard, don't go all the. All the way to the house like we do. But cut it in half. Cut in half. Try that. Keep your eyes close around the barrel, maybe even 20% under it. And that way, that target, you'll see it. It's a blur, but as soon as it passes the barrel, it's clear. Nice smooth move. Shoot it, fall through. So that's what I'd Recommend for question 1. Okay, Zach, what's your take?

[Zach Denini]

I agree with you, Rick. I think at the end of the day, I don't think it's entirely wrong if people want to hold high gun. But if you're gonna hold high gun, you better damn well be sure you see the target, see the target. So one thing Bullard told me about shooting high gun is he says the most important thing is when you're holding up there, no man's land, that target's gonna blur and it's gonna look fast. And until it starts looking slow and whole and complete, that's when he's making his approaching move. Now, in his scenario, he's not letting that target ever beat the barrel. It never gets ahead.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

It never gets ahead. He shoots it like this.

[Zach Denini]

If you're going to shoot it down, trapping the target, I think you still need to see a whole target before you start making that move and intersecting it and cutting it off. But if you're going to say, okay, I want to shoot with a higher point of a higher hold point, but me more like Rick and Zach, well, that's when you would drop that hold point halfway, and then that would be your new trap house. And then that target's going to break. And when that target breaks, you're still making an upward move. So you got to decide, are you making upward moves or are you cutting the target off? I mean, at the end of the day, the game breaks down, driving up or. Or trapping down, and both of those are moves. But you don't have to necessarily make an up move if you're trapping the target. I mean, you know, left and right.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

If you have conditions, wind, all that stuff, it's going to play in.

[Zach Denini]

I. I don't like why. I don't like shooting that way.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I'd recommend just, you know, cutting it down, trying that. If that don't work, drop down a little bit lower. I wouldn't go up any higher, but I'd cut, you know.

[Zach Denini]

Well, some people look at bollard to the question number two, I would say the first thing you need to do is check where you put the mic, because a lot of people, I've noticed this even People that have been shooting for 10 years with us, they got the mic over here. They got the mic over there. They got the mic where it doesn't hit their gun when they're closing it because they like, oh, I want it over here. And I'm like, dingus. You're the only one getting slow pulls.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

And, like, you need in front of you to.

[Zach Denini]

Wherever you.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Or to the right.

[Zach Denini]

You're turning on the side of your body and you're shooting this way, and you're blowing the call into your shoulder. Well, then you better put the mic out where you're gonna mount, because it could be in front of you when you start, but you mount the gun. Where is your mouth pointed? Right? So I really like to.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

And it depends on the. The sound. What. How are you calling? Are you going? What?

[Zach Denini]

I. What I don't like to see is. I don't like to see people get louder. Like, it's. It's a tone thing. I don't. If you're one of those guys that's calling and sitting off field two down, there's a problem.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Recommend that. Yeah, don't. Because.

[Zach Denini]

Because we've had it.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

We've had people, you know, do that. At some shoots, I mean, that stuff doesn't bother me. It just happens. But some people, it does.

[Zach Denini]

It's just a distraction. I mean, at the end of the day, it bothers people. John's not happy with this question, but with that being said, you know, you got to think.

[John]

Not when you're setting the target off.

[Zach Denini]

On two fields over to the right.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You don't want to go super loud. But basically, what I. And I don't even call pole.

[Zach Denini]

I don't.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I don't tell people to call pole.

[Zach Denini]

We go.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Because when you go pull, you have to move your mouth so the gun. Your face can come off the gun. So I'm like, yeah, yeah.

[Zach Denini]

And I'm the same with you. I believe in blowing noise from the diaphragm and getting it out, but not making a pull, right? Yeah, pull something. Something. And I don't want anything to make.

[John]

People'S head bounce off the gun.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Oh, yeah, absolutely.

[Zach Denini]

Yeah. And the more aggressive the p, the more you're gonna move, right? And we talked with that with Sean Holly when we had him on last time. He says, you're not supposed to say pull. You're supposed to hurt something to get it off. Check your tone. If everybody on the squad's getting slow.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Pulls, then it fixed. Yeah, get it fixed.

[Zach Denini]

But if it's only You.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Then it's.

[Zach Denini]

You do a little self examination and say, okay, do I need to move the mic? Do I need to change the call and maybe experiment with it a little bit?

[John]

I don't want to pick on Matt here, but he did say in here. Like I never noticed.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Right? So.

[John]

And here's the thing.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You got to be aware of the situation.

[John]

You need to be aware of it. Just like the guys who are setting off birds on other fields, those guys are unaware too, because they're not doing it intentionally. They just.

[Zach Denini]

If you're. If you're holding still enough though, that that slow pull doesn't bother you, then that's fine. Then that's your gig.

[John]

If he's not holding a high gun.

[Zach Denini]

I mean, see, that's where the blur is coming in here. And you're like, okay, pull. And then a second later comes out and you're still. Still.

[John]

Yeah.

[Zach Denini]

I don't care how slow it is, if you don't move the gun until you see it, you're gonna be fine.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Right.

[Zach Denini]

But it's when you're moving and reacting off of the ha and you're already going, that's where you get into trouble. Yep.

[John]

Well, Matt says, I've had this call for 13 years.

[Zach Denini]

Hey, Matt, sometimes it's time to get a new car.

[John]

Well, okay, Matt, we appreciate the question. A lot of good triggers here. I'm very triggered about this.

[Zach Denini]

Matt, it's a heated question.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You triggered. John, you broke your head with this one.

[John]

Matt, Leticia's also triggered. I just want to call that out because in Iowa, you guys know, we had a guy.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

She was just fine when. I understand. Yeah, well, Dish was just chilling.

[John]

Well, she's a rock. She's a rock. Okay, well, Matt, thank you for the question, guys.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Thank you, man.

[John]

Thank you.

[Zach Denini]

All right, folks, we got to take another quick break and thank some more sponsors. We've got game masters. Ricky, you're our guy over there, right?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yep. I. I sell every gun you can imagine. We got ton of Craig Offs, every other brand available. So if you guys need something, let us know. We can hook you up. Worth the shoots. We got vendor buildings in Arizona, Ohio, and then Sparta at the Grand American.

[Zach Denini]

Yeah, I do like sucking up that free AC in Sparta, that's for sure. I mean, it's a good time. Come by and say hi to us.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

That's right.

[Zach Denini]

Also shot tracker. I mean, we've. We've had great success with them. Ricky, you've been involved since day one.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

So it's like having a coach on the end of your barrel. It's a great tool, especially for doubles. That's what I really like it for. You can see the transition moving from the first target to the second target. That's where a lot of people get lost in no man's land.

[Zach Denini]

You know, I love that. And I also love the new software update, the stuff that's coming down the pipe. Those guys are constantly innovating. So with that being said, let's get.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Back to the show.

[John]

Just. Just as a play on. On some of these questions that are coming in, because a lot of the questions that come in do ask about possible changes to how they're shooting, possible changes to their mechanics. Can we talk just a little bit about what's the right approach to changes? You know, there's some adages out there about if you're gonna add a shim, don't add five shims. Like add a small shim, then add another. You know, like, if you're making changes. Can we just talk about how you guys approach when you're making. Rick, you've recently gone through some changes, right? You've got the weight loss.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

My wife quit feeding me. Times is tough in Nebraska.

[Zach Denini]

I did not quit feeding you.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

No chance. But, yeah, I mean, you know, how.

[John]

Do we approach changes?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Well, you know, in a situation like myself, I mean, I'm down over £65, right? And it's great. I feel great. I'm starting to catch, you know, seeing a Nini here. But it is one of those things that when it happens, okay, you gotta accept it. You gotta go like, I went and got a new pattern stock. Maybe we talked about that a little bit. You know, Bobby Chambers, the guys and gals that went and boom, in, out, went, practiced. And I was like, ah, this kind of feels different. It. Because it was different. We had to move the. The pad away from me, which then moved the wood into me. And I'm like, this ain't feeling good. But you right out of the box broke. 25 straight and singles. 25 straight and handicap. I was like, okay, 99 out of 100. I didn't video my doubles like Zach did that time, but that's another deal.

[Zach Denini]

It's a live show. You know, you got to show it how it is, put it on live.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

But it's one of those that you've got to accept it and. But you also got to go work at it. I mean, we didn't get to where we are from just shooting a little here, shooting a little there. It's from putting the time in and really working at it and trusting it. Don't try something for 10 shots. It's. I said, okay, I'm going to shoot this, and I'm going to shoot it just like this. At Wisconsin State shoot, which was. We shot 1300 targets. Iowa State chute, we shot 1300 targets. And I said, after the two weeks, if it don't work when I get here to the grand for the aim, I'm gonna be getting a different stock done.

[Zach Denini]

Yeah.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

And it worked, though. I mean, I broke a couple two hundreds, I think. You know, to go back to your.

[Zach Denini]

Question, it's gotta be mindset. First of all, when you're making changes, the mindset has to be committed to the changes that you're making. The second thing that I would say is incremental changes are better than massive changes. So for me, I. And unless we're talking like the feet are like way off on one or way like way off, like, okay, that's something you could say. Okay, I'm standing this way on one. Yeah, like, okay, we need it. We need to put that right. But if you're, you know, if you're off, it's incrementally off. So I think so many people go in and say, I'm gonna put five washers in the gun right off the bat because it's shooting flat.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Don't recommend that.

[Zach Denini]

No. I think if you're. Wherever you are, maybe one washer, maybe two washers, and get that look point where you're at, because it's going to feel more familiar, but it's going to get you closer to where you need to be. And then like, I like making small changes and then going to the point where you see it reverse. So like, I might go, one washer. Okay, that's good. Two washers, that's better. Three washers, that's worth. Okay, back to washers. So that that incremental movement instead of just like, oh, zing it this way, zing it that way, throw it up, we're going to change to a high hole. And don't change too many things at once. Like, if you're going to work on feet, work on feet. If you're going to work on combs, work on combs. If you're going to work on hold points, we're going to hold points. Don't change all of those things simultaneously and wreck your whole game. Right? So I think that's what the pros do is when they're willing to try something, they're willing to try Something on one piece of their game and then integrate and add to it. That's. That's the best advice I could give.

[John]

Great. Yeah, no, that's great. I think that's really helpful because massive changes, you don't know where you're at. You've lost your bearings. You don't know what's working.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

And then you're. Yeah. Then your confidence is in the, in the toilet. Poo poo.

[John]

Now you're thinking about it instead of shooting.

[Zach Denini]

No good.

[John]

Okay, that's great advice.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

So.

[Zach Denini]

All right, guys, we got to take another quick break and thanks more sponsors. We gotta say big thank you to White Flyer, America's best targets. You make them, we break them, right, Rick?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

That's right. We got the new Eco Flyer that we helped design, myself and Sean Holly, that's out now. Available out of the Channel Georgia factory. That's an awesome target. Look for that, you know, going to be available hopefully everywhere by 2025. But yeah, they are best target in the industry.

[Zach Denini]

I'm looking forward to the Blue Gray Shootout this year at the grand too. That's going to be a fun event.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, it'll. You're in that dude this year, aren't you? That.

[Zach Denini]

We both are, aren't we?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, I'm in it. I didn't know if you made it or not.

[Zach Denini]

See? Yeah, that's okay. I, I, I, I sk right in there.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Don't you worry.

[Zach Denini]

But you know, we got another sponsor we gotta thank. Shotguns West. The Pelas, baby. Check out these wings. Ricky don't got these. He ain't that stylish, folks, listen, Zach.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Tries to wear these driving down the road doing podcasts. It's okay.

[Zach Denini]

We still love it when you look good. You don't have to apologize. Remember that not only can you hit more targets, but you could look good doing it. Give Ryan a call.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

That's right.

[Zach Denini]

With that being said, let's get back to the show.

[John]

Got a great question coming in here from Alex. This is really appropriate. We are here at the 125th grand.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Boom.

[John]

Yep. Here.

[Zach Denini]

Here's the yep.

[John]

So Alex is coming in. Shameless plug never hurts, right? Alex is asking the grand. America only comes around once a year and the shoot offs take so long. Can you guys talk about what you do when your name is called for a shoot off at the Grand? Well, obviously you're excited, right? You're happy that you got called for it, right? Because you got a score. And can you talk about things that you do, like your nutrition? What do you do when you're waiting for a long night and waiting to shoot. So Alex is asking, how do I prep for these shootouts? So I think we've got the best two guys to answer this question for you.

[Zach Denini]

You want to talk health and fitness?

[John]

Yeah.

[Zach Denini]

You got the guys right here who came to the race.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

We haven't been watching a lot lately, but not as much as just one Wendy's. That's okay.

[Zach Denini]

We're doing it.

[John]

But Alex came to the right place. You've got the right two guys. I mean, we're at the Grand America.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

So starting off, you know. Yeah. Shoot offs at the grand can take a while now. The way they do it now. Honestly, I wish we could go back to the old way when we shot in Van Dy and that was shoot all started at 9 o' clock. Bam. So everybody knew 9 o' clock you could go eat, you could do your thing. You started. Now it's, you know, it kind of starts when the event's done, which is great for me personally. I normally don't eat a meal before shoot offs.

[Zach Denini]

Yeah.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Which can hurt my wife and kids when they're long because they tend to like. Tyler gets a little hangry, kind of like Zach. But have a, a protein bar, granola bar, something to snack on, a shake, something to, to, you know, get some nutrition. But lots of water.

[Zach Denini]

Lots.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Okay. Some Powerade, Gatorade, whatever. But you know, you get in the long shoot, like clay target night. That'd be a prime example. You know, they can go. I mean, last year Dagan went 700. That's multiple nights, but it's 200 for sure. So you get in those long shoot offs, you. You don't let your mind slip to hungry.

[Zach Denini]

Yeah.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Adrenaline will pull you through 100, you know.

[Zach Denini]

Yeah.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah.

[John]

Don't think about pizza.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You need to think about what your task is at hand. But you want to relax. Number one.

[John]

Yeah.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Okay. You, you don't want to worry about anything. You're out there to do a job, you know, and that's to break every target that you can. But don't for me, I go. And. And we're always talk with people sitting around, you know, shooting.

[Zach Denini]

But that's your normal setting.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

That's what we do.

[Zach Denini]

That's your normal.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Some people what I would recommend, honestly.

[Zach Denini]

What'S your normal setting?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, do you like going and sitting in your car and listen to some music, you know? You know last year's clay target runner up, Brandon Deal. Brandon Deal. Awesome shooter. You know, he reads a book in between, that's his deal, which is great. So ever I would say, what makes you comfortable?

[Zach Denini]

Yeah, you gotta. You gotta ask yourself, what's your game? If you're eating breakfast in the morning before you go out and shoot, you're eating lunch before you go out and shoot, you're eating a snack or a meal before every single event. Well, then guess what? For shoot offs, you probably want to eat the same snack or meal. Like, keep it consistent. I don't think it's like, okay, prepare and carbo load because I'm going out to shoot the clay target. And then you're out there and you're sleeping.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Right.

[Zach Denini]

I think you need to like, for me, I've always felt like I shoot a little bit better when I'm a little bit more on the hungry side instead of the full side. I don't like being full when I go out there. I just move a little bit slower.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Now we know how to get him off his game. Give him his Snickers.

[Zach Denini]

Folks, I'm not myself when I don't have a Snickers. That's a shameless plug. I'll be waiting for the chick. So what we know is don't change the script just because you're going to a shoot off. So many people rewrite the play. They're like, okay, I'm going to shoot off. I got to get ready. And like, the worst thing you can do is get done and run out there and wait for two hours before the shoot offs. Like it. I would, I would go back to your trailer, go to your car. I would go somewhere. I would relax. I retain the energy as much as possible. I prepare myself. If you're a water drinker, drink water. Gatorade drinker, drink Gatorade. Whatever it needs.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I recommend having both.

[Zach Denini]

I have.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I have been a little dehydrated here at the Grand Inspired.

[Zach Denini]

And we cut ours with the water because of the sugar. I mean, a little water, a little.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Gatorade pirate zero shameless plug. I'll be waiting for the check.

[Zach Denini]

Yeah, he's jumping on my duck.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

It's gotta get some keys. But.

[Zach Denini]

But you. I think so many people take the shoot off and set as its own thing. Yeah, it's just another event of shooting. So like I said, recognize what you're doing. Consistently do that.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Don't get outside of your realm.

[Zach Denini]

Don't get in your head. Like, think, okay, I gotta go three or four or five hours. Because the first thing you got to do is break the first target. Then you got to break Every target after that to get through the first round. And then once you do that, you go back out and do it again. There isn't three or four or five hundred straight done unless you get through the first five. I've seen many a folk break the 200 in the clay target and miss the first one out or miss one on the first post or missed.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I mean, I did that at Iowa last week, broke 200, missed the fifth target on the shoot off. And I thought, hey, I get to eat dinner early tonight.

[Zach Denini]

It's the most relieving feeling.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

My family's gonna love me today.

[Zach Denini]

If you're gonna miss, miss early.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yes, that's right.

[Zach Denini]

Cuz it, cuz then you get to go to dinner.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

That's right. You know what you gonna be. Yeah, I was there, you know.

[Zach Denini]

But no, I think nutrition wise though, I mean protein is. Stay hydrated, stay hydrated. Get, get some protein, get some protein in you. I eat some carbs too, keeping one of those protein bars in my bag.

[John]

You probably want your, you probably want your carbs closer to shoot off time. If you, if you have the ability to know, hey, I'm going out in 10 minutes. That's the carb time. If you carb too early, you're going to come down, then you're going to.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Come down, you're going to be out there. But you're, you get that adrenaline flow. And for me, I mean it's, it's all adrenaline based. I mean, I'm competitive as heck. I mean, you could ask my wife, my kids.

[John]

Do you think some of the people who get into shoot offs, especially big grand shoot offs for maybe their first time or maybe a couple of times in maybe also get mentally geared up too early?

[Zach Denini]

So yeah, I think, I think I've seen people break the 200 and they're literally like, oh my God, I got the shoot off tonight. And for the next four hours they're just thinking about this. Well, that's, hey, you gotta let that come down.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I had a past student that broke 100 straight at the Grand American in the preliminary, preliminary handicap in Vandalia. No, no, no. Preliminary handicap In Vandalia broke 100 straight. And he sat there under the TV and watched the monitor all day long. He was on the first squad and he came to me and he said, I just broke 100. And I was like, oh, and singles yesterday. And he goes, no, the handicap. I was like, and it was windy. And I said, he lived close by to Vandale. I said, you can go home, you Won. He goes, oh, no, I didn't win. I said, I'm just telling you. I'm not kidding you. And guess what? He sat there and watched that monitor all day. A thousand squats. Guess what? He was the only 100.

[Zach Denini]

We'd have went, Nate.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

And I said, yeah, yeah, turkey.

[Zach Denini]

That's what, that's what experience brings you folks. You know, when it's time to go get chili dogs.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

But.

[John]

But I think to your guys's point, right, if you gear up too early, if you carve too early, it's like anything in life.

[Zach Denini]

If you're all. If you're all mentally, like, going for a job interview, going on a date, shooting, whatever, like all.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

All.

[Zach Denini]

Oh, and you just, you. You screw it up, guys. You don't.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, go out there, just have fun, be calm. Now listen, I. I know that's easy to say versus do, but you know what? When you get in a shoot off, realistically and all right, you're not shooting off against the person there. If it's.

[Zach Denini]

This is the target, It's.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You break 25. Oh, they broke 25. Okay, we got to do it again. I broke 25. They broke 25.

[Zach Denini]

You miss, you can lose, period.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Now you're in a shoot off and you're standing there and it's down to two, and the guy misses. You don't go, I'm gonna win. First thing you do is, okay, let's look at these targets. Let's make sure we see that target. Don't move that gun. It's self talk, and that's part of the deal. And we all do it. Listen, I've been doing this a long time, and I've been in a lot of shoot offs, and I've lost a lot more than I've won.

[Zach Denini]

Hundreds and hundreds.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

That's scores, Donnie. And folks, this is why we take percentages away from Zach.

[Zach Denini]

I'm doing the best I can, folks. Thanks for sticking with me all this time.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

We love it.

[Zach Denini]

Ricky's carrying this thing on his back, and I'm just trying to stick in.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

It's John.

[Zach Denini]

It's Ricky and John.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I just, I'm feeling so that. Just listen, go out, have fun. This grand this year, though, listen, it's gonna be a memorable grand 125th. Enjoy it.

[John]

Yeah, enjoy it is a. Is a really great thing because you don't get to a lot of shoot offs, right?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Oh, absolutely.

[John]

I think the other thing is, is that sometimes you do start thinking about the competition. You do start thinking about the moment.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah.

[John]

You have to really focus on the bird. Alex, thank you for the question.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, thanks, Alex. Great question.

[John]

Yeah. For the great two questions.

[Zach Denini]

Good job on the two.

[John]

We're getting down there. Let's go a couple more. We've got some shell related, ammunition related questions here.

[Zach Denini]

All right, trap talk listeners, let's take a couple seconds, thank a couple more sponsors. First of all, Remington's been with us since day one. I've been shooting these shells since 2007. I shoot the Nitro 27 from 27 yard line, ounce and eight, seven and a half. And STS, ounce and eighth eights for singles and doubles. They've worked great for me as they do a lot of top shooters all around the country. Give them a try. Don't forget the gun club line when you're practicing and you're wanting to save a little bit of money.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

We'd also like to thank another sponsor, Outlaw engineering. Randy Freston, R2. I've known Randy since 1988. They do engineering, survey and drafting, GIS, civil structural land development, wetland permitting. They do.

[Zach Denini]

And they're friends of trap shooters. I mean, they're trap shooting family. They've been in the ATA forever. His dad's been involved. They're involved. They're beautiful family. They're great people. And we just love that they listen to the show and we love that they support trap talk.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah. His dad was past president 1989. So I really want to thank those guys for the support and really appreciate it here.

[Zach Denini]

With that being said, let's get back to the show.

[John]

This one's coming in from Peter. Peter is asking, I was just curious what your honest. He needs your honest opinion. Sorry, guys.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I'll answer this. Yeah, yeah.

[John]

We need your honest opinion. 1oz loads. Do you feel like a person is handicapping themselves with approximately 50 less BBs in a shell? Thank you in advance for what you guys are doing for the sport. It's awesome. Peter.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Okay, Peter. First, it's about 63 to 65 babies last time I checked. But I could be wrong.

[Zach Denini]

If they're seven and a half.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yes, that could be seven halfs.

[John]

He didn't.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Here's what I will say. If the ATA put out a rule tomorrow that said we could shoot an.

[Zach Denini]

Ounce and a half, we'd have.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I'm shooting an ounce and a half. I am not giving up extra BB's to break a target. So now I will say in some cases, some people cannot handle the recoil of an ounce and an eighth versus an ounce. But here's what I See, and I just had this happen in a clinic recently where they said, yeah, they were really struggling shooting the 1145 ounce and an 8. It was recall. And I said, okay, we went to an ounce. Okay, you went to. Okay, that's good. You went to an 1170. No, we went to a 1290.

[Zach Denini]

Well, it kicks more.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I said, you're getting more recoil out of it. Well, and then. And finally the kid goes, yeah, it's kind of the same. I said, go back to 11:45. Walked out there, shot him and goes, oh yeah, these feel a lot better. But is what it was is they were thinking, oh, it's an ounce. It's gonna be less felt recoil. Not always the case. Speed plays a difference in there, but powder charge. Just cut them out, shoot the ounce and an eighth and you'll be fine.

[Zach Denini]

End of the day, more pellets is better. Why would I not want to use more pellets if I could use more pellets? Now to Rick's point, smaller people, people that can't handle the recoil, we got to go to one ounce. I mean, Ray Stafford shot one ounce loads a lot. I mean, broke many, many hundreds. There's a lot of great shooters that broke many, many hundreds with 1 ounce loads out there. I don't think you can't do it. But if you're going to buy a box of shells and it's not $10 a box for the ounce and $10 a box for the ounce, an eighth, why wouldn't I want.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You're thinking, I'm going with an ounce and eight.

[Zach Denini]

I want extra. I mean, if I can get the 16 ounce ribeye or the 20 ounce ribeye for 18.99, we might as well get the 20 ounce ribeye. That's the way I look at it.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

But. And that's why Zach's going that way.

[Zach Denini]

Hey, I'm still in the two X's.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

We're good.

[Zach Denini]

You can, you can check. We verify. But that, you know, I, I think if you can handle it, ounce and an eighth all day long. Yeah, I like eights at singles. Seven and a half from the 27. Eights and doubles. Both shots I think is plenty.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

And seven half second shot.

[Zach Denini]

See, he's, he's always giving it the hammer. But the gusto. But, but that was a good question.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Absolutely.

[John]

Okay, well. But was it your honest opinion?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Honest opinion.

[John]

Okay.

[Zach Denini]

As honest as the day is long.

[John]

Okay, Peter, thank you for the question.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Good question.

[John]

I think a lot of people come up with that because they hear, oh, well, so and so shoots. Yeah, right. Okay, so it's not like it can't be done. No, but if you're asking for the general, what's absent?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

An eighth all day, baby.

[John]

More pellets.

[Zach Denini]

Give me them pellets.

[John]

Yeah, that'd be a good T shirt. We should get that one.

[Zach Denini]

Give me them. Hey, Trop Talk listeners, let's take a quick second to thank a couple more amazing sponsors. SOS Clays Shoot Management, they're doing a fantastic job. I love the app. I love being able to see everything on my phone instantaneously. It's freaking awesome. Rick, what do you think?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, Greg Pink and his group over there, I mean, they've got majority of the satellite grants, majority of the state shoots. I think it's 40 plus state shoots they're doing. But the app, honestly, we were doing a little beta testing with that at the spring grand. It's awesome. You can see your squad if they paid. You know, you can see your options, your payouts, the whole works at your fingertips. Great deal. They're just.

[Zach Denini]

Ricky, how much money he made before he even got off the line, he would say like, hey, I'm buying lunch. I'm like, yeah, good job. We're good to go. We also got gun and trophy insurance. I mean, they're the best in the business. I. I know they're, they're great price. Ricky, you're familiar with them, right?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah. Cole and Larry Cushman, been long time supporters of myself and, and I've been a supporter of them. And you know, especially with my college team, you know, we require insurance. It's so fast and easy to sign up and get your insurance and literally 10 minutes you can have your guns insured. And they're just great. They're great to deal with. Like I said, you can do your trophies also, you know, your, your wildlife animals and that such and your guns, it's just a great.

[Zach Denini]

It's always good when you're traveling around to have that peace of mind and know that you don't have to worry about losing your stuff forever. And these are expensive things, especially when you got those Craig Offs. You got to keep them insured, so. Oh. With that being said, let's get, get.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Back to the show.

[Zach Denini]

All right.

[John]

Okay, so we're gonna stay with the ammunition theme here for a little bit. We've got a question coming in from Corey. Corey said, I just started shooting doubles for the first time. I'm currently reloading ounce and an eighth loads with my Remington STS gun club holes, Remington and STS and gun.

[Zach Denini]

Okay.

[John]

Is it worth loading 1 ounce shells for the first shot to help alleviate some of the cost of reloading while also reducing recoil on the first bird? What do you guys think? I think we answered a lot of.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Questions now going into taking effect. If it is a cost issue and you love to shoot this game and that's what you got to do, then hey, do what you got to do.

[John]

You're going to save a little money.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You will save a little bit.

[Zach Denini]

You're going to get what, two boxes of shells out of a bag of shot. I know an ounce, ounce and it's.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Not, it's not reloaded.

[Zach Denini]

I reloaded a lot and oh, I did two you're going to get before you were born. Yeah, yeah. That was a long time ago. Time goes by, Rick.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I know.

[Zach Denini]

I'll be here for you. Don't worry. I'll help you.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

We love you.

[Zach Denini]

But, but, but I mean if the cost is the factor, understand. But I think that extra eighth ounce, I mean in the scheme of things, between the hotels, the travel, the, the.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

It depends on what you're doing and listen, I understand. I mean I, I grew. I had to reload shells every Friday night before I could go shoot on the weekends. So I understand the, the costume. My dad would be like, hey don't you know, I would spill shells and I'd be like, oh yeah. He'd go sweep that up.

[Zach Denini]

Like Sean Duelhere told me he had to go pick out his wads out on the field and wash him.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I don't, not buying it.

[Zach Denini]

I don't think he did that, you know, the reclaim with the bucket. But I mean it. If you could shoot the same load on both shots, I would recommend it. If you think that the one ounce is going to do the job and you feel better with the recoil, then go with it. It's not gonna hurt you.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

But if it's the recoil issue, stuff like that or save a little money, that's all fine. But an all honest opinion, if recall.

[Zach Denini]

Is not an issue.

[John]

Okay. If money is not an issue.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Right.

[John]

We go ounce in an eighth. But I think you know where what Corey is bringing up is probably something that's on a lot of shooters mind is the cost of the sport. How can I kind of stretch my dollar? I want to get out and practice. And I think we all remember when we were coming up and all we wanted to do is just put, you know, shells down range, shoot as much as we could. So I think to all the shooters out there, do whatever you can to stay on the line.

[Zach Denini]

Whatever you can do to stay in the game is what you got to do. Yeah, but if you, I mean, we get to a point where it's not an issue and you're not thinking about recoil one way or the other. I honestly like if you're hand loading. When I used to load, I really liked an ounce and 8th 1100. I loaded it down a little bit like a super light like that, that federal they used to make. And for me, I really, really, really liked ounces and 8th 1100. I thought I got better powder density. And when, when Mike Jordan tighter pattern. When Mike Jordan was here, we talked a lot about shells and he told me, he said, zach, he says the faster that shell goes, the, the more it interrupts that pattern, the slower that shell is, the tighter and more dense that pattern is going to be. And so in that scenario, I could noticeably see my smoke balls from an 1100 to 1150. I had better breaks with that slower shell.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Well, yeah. Cause it's tired of patterns.

[Zach Denini]

Exactly. Why not? I mean, why not freaking give it the gusto? All right, folks, let's take a quick second and thank some brand new incoming sponsors of the show. These are personal friends of mine, fellow clay shooters and lovers of the outdoors, Rick and carla Burke at 73 Pointers Ranch. Rick, tell them what we're doing.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Well, we're doing a giveaway at the Grand American. So they've graciously donated a one person hunt for I think it's was it 18 quail or 12 chucker or 8 pheasants, your choice, guiding dog. We've got dinner, overnight lodging, you know, breakfast. So yeah, I think it's going to be a great giveaway.

[Zach Denini]

It's a great thing. It's valued at like 1500 bucks. You can obviously bring a guest if you'd like, but you know, it's about an hour out of St. Louis Airport and if you're lucky, maybe me and Rick will go out there with you and do some bird hunting. Because this, this is an awesome place. It's a great time. And if you're local to this area, it's not that far out of the city. So you can be in the office and then be hunting in the afternoon. So they're great, great people and they love this show. So we really, really appreciate the love and support.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, we'd like to thank Rick and Carla. We really appreciate that.

[Zach Denini]

Also we've got Mid State Precious Metals, Ron Prescott. He's a great guy. For all your Gold and silver needs. Ricky, tell them about our friend.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, Ron, he Gracious donated a 10 ounce silver bar to our live in person podcast in Tucson. And you know, he has everything. I bought a bunch of silver from him. You know, we got our silver and gold for the, the fun day at the Nevada State shoot on Monday this year. You know, John got all the silver and gold for the Nevada State shoot. So look him up for your silver and gold needs. He'll give you the best price out there.

[Zach Denini]

He really is. And, and he's a friend of the trap shooters. I mean, he's looking to get gold and silver to these gun clubs for their shoots at the lowest price across the country. He's doing them a service and helping grow the sport. So, you know, thank you so much for that, Ron.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, thank you, Ron. We appreciate it.

[Zach Denini]

With that being said, let's get to the show.

[John]

Okay.

[Zach Denini]

Get us with another question.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, last question.

[Zach Denini]

What are we doing here, John?

[John]

Here we go.

[Zach Denini]

Okay.

[John]

All right, all right, all right. So guys, we're coming into our last question. We're going to wrap this extravaganza up. Part five is wrapping. We're doing it. We've got to get back out of here. Okay, here we go. This question's coming in from Joe and it's a good question. Joe says, I started shooting registered in 2000. I've shot several good single scores and I've always been a class A shooter, but I've always struggled with handicap. Occasionally I'll pull out a good score, but more than often than not, I fall on my face. I've been at the 25 yard line twice, but I haven't stayed there long. I've shot much in the past eight to 10 years because of my job, but I'm retired now and I want to get back into it. I shoot a Browning XT trap over under. There are no adjustments on it and I can see space between the beads. I wouldn't mind buying another gun, but I don't know. Excuse me. I don't want to throw money at something that might not be the problem. I love your podcast and I love the advice that you give. I, I would appreciate any advice you could give me. Thank you. Keep up the good work. Joe Todi from Iowa.

[Zach Denini]

Oh, toady. We appreciate you, Joe.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yes, thanks. I mean, one, I would say if you haven't, you know, take a class, sign up. I mean, Iowa, there's a lot of clinics around Iowa from different folks, you know, call one of us. Here's the thing. I Would say there's something that's stopping you from getting to that next level. And honestly, I mean, the gun, you shoot perfectly fine.

[Zach Denini]

If it fits, that goes back to key. If you got it and you're like, oh, it's got space in or what's left or it's right and it's like, okay, I'm not doing any adjustments. No, whatever, okay, that's fine. If you want to go and you just want to have fun with it and you want to go out to the weekend, you want to shoot the league shoot, you want to come to the ata, you're not trying to say, how do I get to the 27? How do I break big scores? Yeah, if you're asking that question, I'm telling you it's razor thin, people. You want to break scores from the fence, you need to have everything right.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You need to have the combination be good. No second guess and no, no second thoughts in your head. But it goes back to number one thing. Gun fit.

[Zach Denini]

Gun fit, you know, you gun fit the shameless plug. We got linnet. You know, you gotta, you gotta have it right. As far as the quality of the gun, I think if the gun fits, that's step one. Now if you say, okay, well, I like the adjustability or I like high ribs, or I like, you know, the service, or I like how long I can shoot before I have to worry about something or the balance or all those other things. Well, then the higher grade guns obviously have some of those features, you know, but. But to say that you can't win with, you know, any gun out there. Listen, you can win with anything.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Leo Harrison III won multiple world championships, state championships, satellite grand championships with an 1100 Remington.

[Zach Denini]

1100. He was spanking people.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I broke my first 25 with 1100. Feel great.

[Zach Denini]

What was funny and you know the story, but I mean, I was told the story that he had his 1100 stolen and then he went and got more 1100s and went finished the shoot with it and actually won the shoot with guns that weren't even his guns.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

That, that does not surprise me. Leo Harrison broke a 2,200 straight in DTL in Australia with a loaner gun he never missed. Or three. It was 100 by 300. Because that's our point as we talked to Paul about.

[Zach Denini]

One shot.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah, one. One shot barrel, you know, with a gun he didn't even own. So it's possible. But the thing is, you know what? Go out, shoot some practice. Set the targets on straight away. That's a nice thing. About having the pat trap. You can set it straightaway, stand there, you got voice calls, shoot some straightaway, see how your break, see how your brakes are. Are you left, are you right, are you high, are you low? And then adjust the gun to give it another point.

[Zach Denini]

He said he's struggling in handicap, not so much in singles. Think of the geometry of the game. When you're at the 16 yard line, if you're doing everything the same as you do at the 27 yard line, you've got a lot more gun move. At the 16 yard line, you've got a lot more area to move that gun from point A to point B to the break point, okay? So like a lot of people, they don't take time to think, I'm going to move differently. Maybe they have one move, maybe they have one speed, maybe they have one thing and they're going from the 16 yard line to the 27 yard line or whatever yard line. And when they call pull and they got a hard right, they're moving the gun X amount of inches. They're, you know, instinctively, they're kind of, hey, hey, hey. See how he acts?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

It's true though. You shoot the same. You're like, whack, whack versus where? In singles you got to be a little more deliberate.

[Zach Denini]

Well, I'm deliberate in singles. It's, it's the handicap that I get quicker on. That's the, that's the shift. It's the shift. I let them ride out. Hey, they get away out there, you know.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Oh, I see Nannini here.

[Zach Denini]

I'm smoking. The listeners have told me I'm getting smoke balls. I've gotten emails, texting, hey, Ricky's saying you don't hit them. You hit them pretty damn good. Really?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Are they blind? No.

[Zach Denini]

Average is hot, baby. We're good. But, but I think you make a shift back, you have to think to yourself, there's got to be a little.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Less, there's less movement, there's less gun movement, more precision, but you need, but you need to see the target and make the correct move. That's the problem with people is they, they see it and they just move the gun at the blur, at the. At.

[Zach Denini]

At streak at movement itself, streak, blur, whatever. Really seeing that target well from that distance and making one good clean move because you can get away with a whole lot at 16 yard line. You can make a move this way, make a move that way and still break the target. You don't have that luxury when you're shooting a distance. You've got one clean move and the best shooters are making one clean move to the center of the target and they're breaking it. And I think that's the best advice.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Just I would say sign up for a class. Get into a class. He'll help you, you know. Yeah, give me a call. We, we can work something out. Get you, get you in an hour lesson and get you changed and get you to the next level now.

[John]

Hey, guys, with Joe talking about, you know, no adjustments on the gun. Yeah, he, he, like Zach was saying, good.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

So he has no adjustable comb. So I would get an adjustable comb.

[John]

Yeah, because maybe if he needs it. But, but maybe there's a situation when, you know, some of these guys are really bangers at singles. They've got a lower pattern as they start to move back. Is there something that comes to your guys mind about his point of impact as he's moving back?

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Well, it could by the way he's.

[Zach Denini]

Shooting, but without seeing much of that, I think it's. You can get away with the gun being more off at 16 yard lines than you can from 27. Like if, yeah, if you say, okay, like, like, do we need more point of impact at 27 than we do 16? Well, I mean, we don't change our guns in between. I don't change, we're not changing anything. So I think.

[John]

I know, but your pattern is already in that 80, 20 range.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

80 20s.

[John]

So let's say, let's say Joe's is more flat.

[Zach Denini]

Right.

[John]

So he needs it to come up. I'm just saying it's something that Joe.

[Zach Denini]

Could try, could potentially be that. But, but what I think is the reality is at the 16 yard line, you can get away with more. Wrong.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah.

[Zach Denini]

And that's what I tell people all the time.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You can do.

[Zach Denini]

You can do worse. You could have the point of impact being too flat. You could have it being too high. You could have it. You got more grace. You got more grace. And you can get away with versus dinging 96, 27.

[John]

But he's saying even 25. Right.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Well, 25 to 27 is the same.

[Zach Denini]

Yes.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

You get back there, it's more technical. You got to be more precise. So I would say make sure the gun is fitting properly and then go from there.

[John]

Yeah. So go back to your mechanics. Let's check the pattern. Let's lock the house on straight away. Let's shoot some of those. How are we hitting them? You know, like you said, Rick, high.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Load left, right, whatever.

[John]

Yeah, yeah.

[Zach Denini]

So watch the brakes get that smoke ball from the top of the bird.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Yeah.

[Zach Denini]

Ideally, if you're not breaking the top of the bird, smoking it down, you're not using your whole pattern. Even if you're hitting it well and you're blowing those pieces up, you could be hitting it well and blowing everything up. You're using the top third of your pattern. All of those pellets are going waste that we talked about using those pellets. Put the pellets.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

And that's, that's one thing I'm going to miss at this grand is standing next to icy Nanini and watching the brakes and going, oh, well. Yeah.

[John]

Hey, folks, you did just say you were going to miss him.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

I did. I'm going to miss him.

[Zach Denini]

I want you to guys for about that much. Go watch me shoot. Tell them how the breaks are. Send an email to John. If you see smoke. Tell him say smoke 20, 24.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

That's because someone lit a fire out.

[John]

Nini.

[Zach Denini]

Smoke 24. I think this rumor is a Ricky only rumor. There's not a problem.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Listen, we can ask our squad mates all year and Justin Debris could tell you that he doesn't smoke the targets very hard.

[Zach Denini]

I hit a lot.

[John]

I just have to, I have to chime in. I, I've seen, I've seen a lot of black smoke.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Hey, listen, listen. I, I think Justin, we just walked in the door. We should ask him that question.

[Zach Denini]

Hey, but we're out of time.

[John]

Well, we're out of time. We're out.

[Zach Denini]

Saved by the bell.

[John]

Joe, thank you for the question.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Thanks, Joe.

[John]

Good question. And guys, thank you as always. Everybody ask us raptalkpodcast.com Send your questions in and we will get these two guys to answer them for you.

[Zach Denini]

See you next time, everybody.

[Richard Marshall Jr.]

Thanks.

[John]

And the Trap Talk podcast is brought.

[Zach Denini]

To you in part by RM Shooting Clinics. Have Ricky take your game to the next level. If you want to shoot hundreds of hundreds of hundreds, give Ricky a call today. Zach Nini Financial we believe in putting people first Sat.