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- [00:00]
Tati Sirisano
Foreign.
- [00:05]
Dan Runcy
I'm Dan Runcy. Welcome to Trap Ital and you're about to hear our recap not only on music's biggest night, but music's biggest week. The Grammys are both the spectacle that you see on TV every winter, which this year the ratings were down 6%. But I do think that the show delivered and it was a great show all around with some really memorable performances and and some funny moments that we'll get into in a bit. But Grammy week itself, if you're in the industry, you already know this is the week where everyone from New York, Nashville, London, Atlanta and any other major metro hub comes to LA for all of the parties, events, dinners, coffee chats and more. If you know how to schedule your time, it can be a very productive week and it could also be some fun too. This year my week started on Thursday, flew down from San Francisco, had a few coffee chats and went to a few events later on that evening hosted by Rain, Warner Music Group and others. Friday was similar coffee chats and lunch meetings, then went to the musicare's annual fundraising gala at the LA Convention Center. This year's honoree was Mariah Carey, got to see her perform at the end as well as a number of artists giving her a tribute. Leading up to the evening Saturday, you have to pace yourself with these things, but then met up with a friend at so Soho House and then went to the Clive Davis Pre Grammy Gala. Then on Sunday took it easy in the morning, grabbed breakfast with a friend, then slowly made my way down to the crypto.com arena for the 68th annual Grammy Awards and the third straight year that I'd been there. And in this episode you'll hear me and Tati Sirasano from Media Research break it all down. We were together at both the Clive Davis Gala and the Grammys on Sunday, and her and I discussed a few things in this episode. Of course, we discussed our immediate reactions after the show, but we also talked about how different it is being in those rooms and how for us, sure it is a fun event that a lot of people watch on tv, but we're also at work. So we talk about what that dynamic is like and why that's so productive for us. But then we also talk about some of the commercial outcomes that'll happen from the event, most specifically Bad Bunny and the historic night that he had with this Grammy's win with Album of the Year, but then the super bowl the following week as the headline performer, the first person ever to have those in the same calendar year. Truly, truly incredible. You'll also hear us talk about a few other behind the scenes things, the economics and what the Grammys may look like moving forward since this is a big transition year for the show. This is the last year with Trevor Noah as the guest. This is the last year with CBS as the partner. Could this be the last year that the Grammys are at crypto.com arena? We'll talk about all that and more. We had a great time and we had a really fun time recording this episode, so I hope you enjoyed it as much as we did. Let's dive in. This episode is brought to you by Sharpmetric, which just released their brand new 2025 year end music report. One stat that I really enjoyed that I want to share with you after reading through the whole report is this for the songs released in 2025 that surpassed 1 billion total streams. They took an average of 197 days just over six months. Now that number is less than half the 511 days that it took songs from 2023 to reach that same threshold. For instance, golden from the K Pop Demon Hunters soundtrack is a great example of a quickly rising song. Another one is Lady Gaga and Bruno Mars Die With a Smile. That song came out in 2024, but again, it just goes to show how quickly all of this is happening. And those are just a few unique insights from Chartmetric's 2020 five year end report. It's a great, fun interactive analysis that is worth your time. Click the link in our show notes to read the full report or you can go to chartmetric.com and you'll see it right on the homepage. If you love listening to trapital, I want to put you on to another podcast that I think you'll really en. It's called One Song. It's hosted by Diallo, Riddle and Luxury. Each episode unpacks one iconic track. They break down the original musical stems so you can hear how the song was built while also diving into the creative choices and cultural forces that shape the song. If you're into how music, media and culture intersect, this show is very much in that lane. You'll hear songs you already love in a completely new way. Check out one song wherever you get your podcasts. All right, we are back from a full packed week in LA for the Grammys and we're joined by our partner in crime, Tati Sirisano. Have you recovered?
- [05:01]
Tati Sirisano
I have not recovered, both emotionally and physically. I had a blast and we truly were partners in crime. I feel Like I spent the whole weekend with you, which is awesome.
- [05:10]
Dan Runcy
You had a much longer week than I did because you were there earlier for another industry conference name. And then that segued into Grammy week. Mine was shorter. I just came in on Thursday morning, flew down from San Francisco and then had four nights worth of events and then flew back Monday morning. It was a lot in that I have young kids. That was the longest I'd been away from my kids for that amount of time and it was still productive. I'm glad that I did it. But you definitely feel it. I think two or three nights is normally my go to on this stuff. Anyone that's listening to this that works with me in any capacity, they're often like, oh, you're like in and out. I'm like, yeah, I'm in and out. Raising a family. I gotta go. Yeah, make this happen.
- [05:51]
Tati Sirisano
Can confirm Dan did pause in the Spotify suite at the Grammys to say goodnight to his kids. To go outside.
- [05:57]
Dan Runcy
It is some full time jobs all the way around. We're going to do a bunch of things in this episode, but we should start with our immediate reactions from the 68th Grammy Awards. What was your take?
- [06:10]
Tati Sirisano
Yeah, it's funny. We're going to get into this with how when you're in attendance at the Grammys, you weirdly miss so much of the actual show. So I had to today go back and watch some of the performances that I feel like I missed and watched some of the big moments that I couldn't hear very well. I guess the sentiment that I have is that the bar keeps rising and we keep hitting these new benchmarks that seem, how are we even gonna go beyond this? And then we keep going. Bad Bunny winning album of the year the week before, performing the super bowl halftime show. Within that notching multiple like historic record breaking moments. The first Spanish language album to win that award, being the first solo Latino artist to headline the super bowl halftime show. Like, how much higher can we get from here? And then you have Kendrick winning record of the year twice in a row, which is insane. You have Billy and Finneas with their third win of song of the year, which I'm pretty sure no one else has ever done. The main sentiment I have is, wow, we keep setting new benchmarks as an industry and it's just crazy to watch.
- [07:08]
Dan Runcy
It really is. And the first point you mentioned on Bad Bunn, looking back at this, 10 years ago, this man was bagging groceries in Puerto Rico.
- [07:17]
Tati Sirisano
That's crazy.
- [07:18]
Dan Runcy
This week just achieved something that no one else had done before. If we're looking at the super bowl halftime show headline performer and winning in one of the major four categories, obviously album of the year is the top award. No one had done that in the same calendar year. But the closest that you can get to it was in 2002 when you two was the headline performer at the Super bowl. That was at first post 911 Super bowl and it was definitely an America pride oriented one. And then they also won record of the year at the Grammys. You look at everything Bad Bunny has done, whether it's the dominance on streaming, touring, everything in his career, it truly is an impressive moment. You and I have talked about the impact of performing at the super bowl, especially on a commercial basis. A lot of people may focus on the streams that may happen the first week or so and that's great for generating headlines. But you look at those first tours, you look at how much more these artists are able to generate after that fact. It is night and day and that is the real super bowl bump more than anything. We saw it happen with the Weeknd. We saw it happen with everyone that was in that hip hop ensemble with Dr. Mary J. Blige, Snoop and others. And the streaming thing always stuck out because even though he's dominated on streaming, we've seen those numbers. They are transparent. The one thing that's not as transparent with regards to streaming is that from a revenue perspective, all streams are not necessarily weighted the same. Because if you have more streams that may come either from ad supported free tiers as opposed to paid tiers, or you have more streams coming from regions of the world that pay less for streaming in general, then you are generating less money from those streaming services. Will we see the commercial viability in all those areas also match the American superstars too?
- [09:06]
Tati Sirisano
Yeah. At first I was like, bud Bunny is already the most streamed artist in the world and he has been for years. It's like, how like can a Super bowl bump really add anything to that? How much further can we get? But you're right that not every stream counts the same. And it's possible that the revenue impact that has, if it gets him streamed more in the US and the UK and places that tend to generate more revenue for streaming, will that actually have a way bigger impact than just purely stream count alone?
- [09:34]
Dan Runcy
And of course that data isn't transparent. Only a few people, even at Spotify or any of these DSPs have the access to that. But I think it was in 2023 or 2024, one of those most recent years where Taylor Swift her music overall had generated nine figures on Spotify itself. Could we see Bad Bunny generate that level of revenue from one particular streaming service? He mentions a few other things that we should talk about with the show itself. One thing is how different the in person experience is versus the actual telecast when you're watching at home. Because first and foremost, this is an event that is made for television that is clear, especially when you're actually watching it, because you see some of the angles, especially for some of the pre recorded performances. But you have your commercial breaks and people are just hanging around, right? And it's not like they're showing the commercials on the TV inside the arena, it's just blank screens. And then you'll see a countdown when there's 60 seconds left or there's something in the corner that tells you, okay, this is a five minute commercial break. But even inside the arena, I think there's a few different experiences. Most of the people that are inside the arena, it's in the crypto.com arena, maybe 10,000 people max, that are in that arena. Most of the people that are sitting there in the seats inside the arena, those people probably have more traditional seats of, okay, you're watching a concert where there are a series of things that you're seeing presenters discuss back and forth. People that are on the floor are more likely a mix of your record label or publishing executives mixed with the actual artists and the nominees who are there, maybe a few celebrities patterned in here or there, but then in the suites, that's where you get more of the industry executive, which is where you and I were going back and forth between different rooms. And there, I would say especially it is the hardest to catch a lot of the things that are happening, conversations with people. You're going to suites, especially with all of these companies that both you and I have the either A friends at or B business relationships at. You're trying to make the rounds. You're going from one suite to the other. You're having conversations. Be like, okay, great, let's talk in a couple of weeks. That's the type of thing that you're spending a lot of the time doing. At least I know that's my mentality. So I think sometimes people could often ask me, oh, how was the show? How was this? And I'm like, I'm here on work mode. Maybe to a fault sometimes, but I'm here on work mode. And then I'll go back on Monday like you and I did and actually sit down and watch some of the experience that everyone else had.
- [12:02]
Tati Sirisano
No, I told you. When we were there, I was getting updates about what was going on from my group chat with my friends who were all watching at home, like in some ways faster than I knew they were happening. Being there because there was so much that you missed. But I think the moment where it really hit me was, I remember we were in a suite, I can't remember what, and Lady Gaga was about to perform. And I love Lady Gaga. And I was like, oh my God, I need to watch her performance. And I worked my way to the front so that I could see. And so I was locked in. I was there wanting to watch this performance. But Gaga is surrounded on stage by robot cameras that are capturing her for the TV audience. So I actually can't see anything. So I'm listening and I get the sense of the environment and that's cool. And I can see tiny Lady Gaga, like far away in her. I don't even know what to call it. Hat that she was wearing, which was amazing, but I couldn't see her at all. And even the sort of Jumbotron style TVs that they have, it's not like you're getting the same view that the TV audience is getting. It was surprising to me that even if you're there locked into the show and you're not distracted by conversations, you're right. It's not built for the audience attending, really. It's built for the people watching at home.
- [13:08]
Dan Runcy
It's only the low tech performances that can really translate in both settings in that type of way.
- [13:15]
Tati Sirisano
Cue Justin Bieber.
- [13:17]
Dan Runcy
Exactly. I think the emotion of that served from that. This man is literally stripped down performing and that impact was felt.
- [13:26]
Tati Sirisano
Yeah. And of course, like the tribute performance that we were all locked in on, the energy in the room was crazy. And you could really see because there were so many people on stage. It wasn't like the cameras were blocking like the one Lady Gaga.
- [13:38]
Dan Runcy
And on that tribute note, Lauryn Hill had that place rocking. Not only was she on time, but from some of the reporting that I had heard from Brian Hyatt from Rolling Stone, he had put it out on his podcast and talked to some of the producers and others. She was only supposed to do a few songs for a set. I think it was supposed to merge into one of the d' Angelo songs and then do Killing Me Softly and then that was it. But she was the one that pushed and said, no, I want to do some of these other songs to highlight some of the other artists that we've lost and it turned out great, turned out wonderful. And especially just given her Persona plus some of the performances or lack thereof that had happened over the past 10 plus years in her career, there was plenty of skepticism. So the fact that worked out so well, everyone deserves congratulations. That was the moment of the evening for me.
- [14:32]
Tati Sirisano
It was a highlight. I totally agree. And done really well. I remember when that performance ended, there was this moment where everyone that we were standing around turned around and looked at each other and gave that face. That's the universal. Damn. Now that was good. Now that was spectacular.
- [14:47]
Dan Runcy
That said, the production was not beyond reproach. This is a three and a half hour television product. But even with all that prep, there's still some things that may not always, always worked the best. And I think we saw that in full effect with the 79 year old diva herself, Cher, who was on stage for clearly a number of things.
- [15:08]
Tati Sirisano
I still am confused about what was going on there. I meant to try and watch it on YouTube because maybe when we were there from far away, maybe we like didn't really get what was going on and I didn't have time to. But it was very bizarre and confusing and all very Cher in a way that actually I think made it a little bit charming.
- [15:27]
Dan Runcy
I did go back and watch. Here is TL Dr. On exactly what happened. First, Harvey Mason Jr. The CEO of the recording Academy, introduces Cher as a presenter for Record of the Year. That's what he says next. Cher comes on standing ovation. People are opening and gaping, oh, it's Cher, right?
- [15:46]
Tati Sirisano
Me, People are me.
- [15:50]
Dan Runcy
Then Trevor Noah comes up next to her on stage holding a Grammy in his hand and does his whole. Hey, sorry to interrupt. I'm gonna let you finish, but you're actually receiving a lifetime achievement award. Here is your award. Trevor Noah steps off stage. Then Cher is there. And Cher then says, I first want to thank the Recording Academy for giving me this lifetime achievement award. It is a good thing that they did it now because I have good genes and I wouldn't be here much longer, end quote. He's clearly referencing the Sydney Sweeney American Eagle. Good jeans advertisement that turned into a whole cultural debate.
- [16:31]
Tati Sirisano
I didn't even catch that.
- [16:32]
Dan Runcy
Landed flat. It did get some laughs, but she continued and she said, never give up on your dreams. You have highs and lows, things like that. Then she gets her standing ovation and then she slowly starts to walk off stage. Then Trevor Noah comes back on the other stage and says, wait, Cher, no, you have to come Back because you have to announce the nominees for record of the year. So then Cher then awkwardly comes back on stage, up to the mic and is, oh, you can tell I wanted to walk off the stage. And then she says, here are the nominees. They show the nominees on the screen. And then after that she says, and the Grammy goes to 10 second pause. She's then opening up the envelope and then she says, I thought it was going to be on the teleprompter. Then another five second pause and then she opens it up and she says, oh, the Grammy goes to Luther Grandross. Verbatim is what she says. She didn't say Vandross, she said Grandross. So then everyone that was in the suite with us starts laughing because we're like, okay, you clearly know what happened. She is referencing the fact that Luther, the song by Kendrick Lamar and SZA won record of the year. And then the camera up to Kendrick and who are laughing about it, especially Kendrick. And then you can hear Cher in the background saying, oh no, sorry, Kendrick Lamar is the winner. And then they all go up on stage together what, what happened? And see what led to this. So according again, and this was from what Brian Hyatt from Rolling Stone had said, the producer said that everything was on the teleprompter and everything was planned and that Cher was briefed on this,
- [18:13]
Tati Sirisano
that and the third achievement award being like thrust at her in that moment because that was so odd.
- [18:19]
Dan Runcy
Clearly there was some miscommunication there between Harvey, Cher and Trevor as well. But then this might be a bit unfair, but you're asking a 79 year old woman, yes, she is a legend. I know that she's recently performed and she's done. If I could turn back time at SNL50 recently and others. But you're asking a 79 year old woman to own the stage and handle all those transitions herself. And I'm not saying she isn't with it or doesn't have it, but that's a lot for anyone to ask in that particular moment. Let's take a break for our chartmetric stat of the week. There's another part of the chartmetric report that I think you'll really enjoy. It's the brand section. It shows the top brands that the followers of the biggest artists in the world follow and connect with. Both Drake and Kendrick Lamar have Nike as their top brand. Rihanna has Mac Cosmetics. And given the partnerships that those artists have with those companies or similar ones, those make sense. But one that stood out to me was Billie Eilish her top brand was Polaroid. Now, I don't believe that Billie has an official partnership with Polaroid, but she's been known for taking Polaroid photos throughout her career. Google Billie Eilish of Polaroid and you'll see this yourself. So it's been interesting to see what has stuck with her throughout her career. You can check them all out with the link to our show notes where you can see the full chart metric Year End Report let's get back to the episode we should talk about Polymarket Cash and Prediction Markets I was very eager to see how it was going to play out with this award show because we saw Polymarket not only share the odds for the Golden Globes a couple weeks ago, but be one of the sponsors for the Golden Globes showing the odds for particular awards right before they were awarded. That is a conversation for another day.
- [20:15]
Tati Sirisano
Yeah, that's another podcast episode.
- [20:17]
Dan Runcy
I do not see the Recording Academy doing that, but I was still tracking to see how closely are these going to be entwined based on the totals I saw. Not every single award was its own market on Polymarket specifically, but Polymarket only got around 70 to 75% of them. Correct. There were some big outliers, including two that we saw on that main broadcast. One of the markets that got the biggest volume was Song of the Year, because that was the only category that the K Pop Demon Hunter song Golden was nominated for. At least for the big three categories. They gave it to the Billie Eilish song instead. So that was seen as a upset there. And then another one was the Best Pop Solo Performance, and that was one where the Odds had thought that Sabrina Carpenter's manchild was going to win. But then Lola Young won for Messi and she was clearly just as surprised as a lot of the Polymarket predictors probably were too, because she went up there and she did not know what to say. It was noteworthy because I always felt like the Grammys, in my opinion, were the hardest of the award shows to predict. I think that a lot of the odds can lean themselves to what the most commercially successful thing is, but the odds. And I'm not just talking about the Poly market odds, I'm even talking about the gambling odds that would be on Gold Derby and would be on other random websites beforehand. They would always lean more into the commercially popular stuff, but they never quite had a knack for the things that are seen as artistic but not as commercially successful. For instance, like John Batiste winning a couple of years ago when he won for his album or Even that year when Bonnie Raitt, you know, also stunned on camera, won for Song of the Year a couple years ago. Like they can't quite that, but they can get the bigger pop stuff when it's Taylor Swift. But yeah, that was interesting to see.
- [22:08]
Tati Sirisano
Does it mean that the polymarket users are viewing this more as a popularity contest versus obviously when the Recording Academy is voting, it's about much more than that. Maybe it's just like a misunderstanding of how people vote.
- [22:21]
Dan Runcy
One thing that Nathan Hubbard had mentioned on his podcast about it was the concept of vote splitting, which is very real. For those that are less familiar, there are informal voting blocks where certain people that are known for wanting to push a certain genre or they come from a certain genre, or they just appreciate a certain style of music, they're more likely to vote for that style of music. But if there are a few things that are competing in that same category, then that can pave the way for someone else. Right. For instance, I don't know the other nominees off the top of my head for male pop performance, but if there's another type of artist that was similar to Sabrina Carpenter that may be competing for that type of voter that would vote for Sabrina Carpenter, they could then split the votes, which could then pave the way for a Lola Young to break through. Because the type of person that's voting for Lola Young, they're probably not going to vote for Sabrina Carpenter. So that's how vote splitting can work within blocks like that. The one thing that I do like, though, is that when the randomness does happen to me, it's a reflection that, okay, we're not just awarding what is the most commercially successful thing and we're not just leaning on that. People are looking at the artistic merit and actually doing the job. One of the criticisms is that there isn't that much of a delta between what are the most commercially successful albums of the year and how close that list aligns with what are the most critically acclaimed albums that should be the nominees for Album of the Year or any other top Grammy award. Those lists can overlap quite a bit in a way that they may not necessarily form, let's say the Oscars, where, sure, you may see a few of those. Like this year, F1 was nominated for an Academy Award for Best Picture, and we've seen others like Avatar in other years, but that's really only a minority of them versus in music, it's opposite. Where most of them are the commercial titans, then maybe you have a few that sneak into that aren't so when those things do happen, it's cool to
- [24:20]
Tati Sirisano
see in that sense, when the poly market bets don't align with what actually wins, it may actually be a good thing. It means that academy voters aren't voting based on just popularity. It's that they're really thinking about the artistic merit and all these other things. And so that would account for the sort of gap. And are the people who are betting think putting themselves in Grammy voters shoes? Are they doing their research? Probably not.
- [24:44]
Dan Runcy
I thought that there was a chance that there would be that, right, Because I remember a couple of months ago when they did a segment on 60 Minutes about polymarket and Kalshi, they had one of these professional gamblers that has since moved on to Polymarket that was talking about how he has made millions off of the platform in the research that he did. And the one example that I'll go back to that he referenced was there were odds on polymarket for who Trump was going to pick as his VP in 2024. And a lot of the names were some of the more established, longstanding people that you had seen in the Republican side in Trump's circle. But this particular person put odds on J.D. vance when J.D. vance was a 2% odds. This particular better was looking at what Trump said in some interview back in 2016 about why he picked Mike Pence. And he said in that interview, Trump likes one syllable names, he likes marketing, Trump, Pence, boom, he likes the flow of that and it works. And he saw that Vance and Pence are just two letters off, they both end in nce and he ends up picking JD Vance. And that's why I was probably naively thinking, okay, if people are doing that to this type of thing, then people are definitely going to be able to do their homework, especially when they're 15,000 Grammy voters to be able to see, oh, okay, if this is how this voting block here votes that I know that I can make some money by really putting it either A on Lola Young or B, at a minimum, putting it on a no bet so that even if you don't have to pick one, you just say, okay, I don't think it's going to be K pop Demon Hunters. I don't think it's going to be Sabrina Carpenter. You can still make money betting the field on something like that.
- [26:21]
Tati Sirisano
Dan, am I putting my research skills into the wrong line of work? Should I become a professional polymarket researcher? Kidding.
- [26:28]
Dan Runcy
But is she kidding? One thing that we should talk about is the week itself leading up to this this is a big week for the people that work in the industry, but it's also a big week for a lot of the artists themselves. I want to talk about the artist side first, then the industry. So I want to talk about the artist side because a lot of people watching at home may see the best artist ensemble and you may think, okay, great, look at how involved this is or look at some of these artists on stage, whether it's clips and others, and how great those performances are. The thing that really didn't click for me until maybe my first Grammy week or so is that this is probably the fourth or fifth time that a lot of those artists are performing that same song in that same week in different venues. Olivia Dean.
- [27:13]
Tati Sirisano
I saw the Ordinary three times. The Ordinary was performed three times for me, probably even more in total over the course of that week.
- [27:22]
Dan Runcy
Yeah, Spotify, the best new artist party. I know that Olivia Dean had performed again at the Universal Music Group Showcase and then on Saturday performed it again at the Clive Davis pre Grammy gala, which you and I both went to. And then again on the show on
- [27:38]
Tati Sirisano
Sunday, you're campaigning as an artist even though the votes are already in. I forget where this was, but there was a moment where I turned to you and thought that one of the particular artists that was performing might have been saving their voice for the Grammys. Because I felt like the first time I saw them perform the song, they were singing their heart out. The middle time, they were not completely going full range. And then at the Grammys, they brought it out again. So I was like, huh, I wonder, like, it must be hard to train your vocals and keep them intact during this week, especially when the Grammys are at the very end.
- [28:06]
Dan Runcy
There was someone that I was talking to at the Clive Davis pre Grammy gala, someone who you and I both know and we're talking about Alex Warren. And he said that he had seen Alex perform at one of these events. He ended up being next to him and he was trying to talk to be like, oh, hey, that was great. How does it feel? Congrats on everything. Alex just took out a card from his suit jacket that just said, I am on vocal rest.
- [28:30]
Tati Sirisano
And then poor guy had technical issues during his actual Grammy's performance.
- [28:34]
Dan Runcy
I know for all the times he performed it flawlessly that week, one time on the biggest stage, in front of all of the television eyeballs, too. The sound is off and it clearly wasn't his fault, but yeah, of course. So that's one thing on the artist side, but on the executive side One of the reasons that I go every year, and one of the reasons that I know you go now too, is that you're getting everyone that is from New York, from Nashville, from Atlanta, from London, from other parts of the industry flying in that week. So it can be very productive to get things done. Whether you're trying to make FaceTime, make some initial connections, then have a follow up call. And even though, yes, you can do zoom, you can do all of that, FaceTime still matters quite a bit. So you, if you are in any type of business that relies on those types of things in this industry, it is very valuable to do it. And not just on the recorded side, on the live side as well. And I think that tracks from even the smaller gatherings, which frankly, I'll be honest, I probably do enjoy more than the thousand plus big parties. But even those do have some benefit because a lot of the top executives from those respective companies are there. There's extreme value at going to things like the Clive Davis pre Grammy gala that is a very hard ticket to get. But because of the nature of the work that we both do, we're able to be in those rooms and be able to see those people. So I think especially like on my side, I know I can speak to it. A lot of the people that have spoken at Both of our trapital summits in 2024, 2025 and will most likely be speaking at them in 2026 are in that room. So yes, it's helpful when you're making all the connections and the through points. And I think probably similarly for you, if you are running a consulting business, yes, it's helpful for you to be able to have those touch points, especially from people that you can't just grab coffee with in New York.
- [30:20]
Tati Sirisano
Totally. No, I got so much value out of being around for the whole week. And some people that I never met in person, other people who had been trying to connect with for so long. I will say, though it's funny when you were saying it's the most productive time to do this, I will say it's only as productive as LA traffic will let it be. Planning your day and what neighborhood you're going to be in and what neighborhood you're going to end in and trying to make sure that all works with LA traffic, trying to stack meetings in similar areas and whatever. Most people stay in West Hollywood, which makes it easy in that sense, but still, like I found myself in so many different corners of LA that took an hour and a half to get to.
- [30:55]
Dan Runcy
Sometimes you come from this used to New York, right? You're used to being at a meeting in Tribeca area and then you would just hop off the train and be like, oh yeah, my evening could end at 1:45. I could bolt down the stairs, hop on the train and still be at the next building at 2:00'. Clock.
- [31:10]
Tati Sirisano
I mean, listen, the Grammys were in New York once.
- [31:13]
Dan Runcy
That is true.
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Tati Sirisano
It happen again.
- [31:14]
Dan Runcy
And not only do I not think the Grammys are going to leave la, I don't think the Grammys are going to leave the crypto.com arena and the LA Live arena area overall. And the reason I'm saying this and the reason it's relevant is because the contract that AEG has, the exclusive contract and I believe the exclusive ownership of the crypto.com arena and they've been the partners to have the show for all this time. And this clearly is a big year of transition already for the Grammys. This was the final year for cbs. The broadcast will be moving to Disney. We saw a report recently of Puck that Steve Ballmer, the owner of the LA Clippers and recently built the Intuit Dome in Inglewood, wants to have the Grammys there. And there are a few differences, of course, given that this is a newer arena. It is state of the art in its own way. But I don't think that the surrounding area quite has the broader complex that downtown LA clearly offers the Grammys. Because it's not just the Grammys, right? It's the pre show that you have at the Peacock Theater. It's the surrounding areas. The convenience location of downtown LA and Inglewood is still close. But I do think that activities below the 10 I'm referring to the highway, are much less frequent than those that are above it. And you and I talked about this in the show that arena cryptos.com now for me, the Staples center is built for high production events. You and I were essentially in the backstage area, right by the the Chairman's Lounge. And you see the artist executives going through there, back and forth, stopping at the bar, things like that. That's not to say that those things don't exist at the Intuit Dome. But when you combine that with the lower number of premium suites, and the premium suites are clearly a big deal, especially at the Grammys. You and I were in a lot of them. It just doesn't work. Weirder things have happened, but I'd be surprised.
- [33:03]
Tati Sirisano
Yeah, I think that all makes sense. It's not my area of expertise. All your arguments make sense.
- [33:08]
Dan Runcy
I'm definitely eager to see what next year looks like, like with the new host as well, because I'll give Trevor Noah his props. I think he does a great job and I do think that his style of hosting works very well for the Grammys. Because the Grammys, in my opinion, it isn't quite like the Oscars or even the Golden Globes where I think those hosts, frankly can get away with doing a few more jokes and jabs and doing a post or a tongue in cheek type of thing. Yes, actors and actresses can be very sensitive about stuff, but not the same way that musicians can. It's to another level. Trevor Noah had a few jabs in there, but most of his jabs outside of Nicki Minaj weren't towards any particular artist. I believe he had the drag about Apple and Search not working when you opened the phones. He said something about Ticketmaster. There was a Diddy joke, but I think that's in its own category now. The Jeff Bezos joke as well. A few against Trump, which I think in that room plays pretty well. So it'll be interesting to see how they replace that and what that looks like. I think LL Cooler J did a good job the years he did it, but it's definitely a very different vibe. Alicia Keys did it before Trevor Noah as an artist. I like Alicia Keys. Even as an actress, I think that she does very great work. I probably personally wasn't a big fan of her as an award show host necessarily, so it'll be interesting to see what that looks like moving forward.
- [34:29]
Tati Sirisano
Yeah, there hasn't been any real speculation out there on who will be the next host yet, has there? Because I was googling around and I felt like I didn't really see anything.
- [34:37]
Dan Runcy
You and I were talking. I think Nikki Glaser does an amazing job at the Golden Globes, but it is very much built for that. So we'll see. I'm always interested to see how they do.
- [34:47]
Tati Sirisano
Me too. We'll be talking about it next year.
- [34:50]
Dan Runcy
No, definitely. Tati, this was fun. Anything else before we wrap things up?
- [34:54]
Tati Sirisano
I don't think so. I had a blast. It was my first actual Grammy Awards and it was amazing. And I'm psyched to hopefully go again next year and have another episode breaking it down. So, yeah, thanks for having me. And thanks for being my partner in crime.
- [35:08]
Dan Runcy
Of course. This was fun, as always.
- [35:09]
Tati Sirisano
Thanks, Dan.
- [35:12]
Dan Runcy
And that is a wrap for our episode recapping the Grammys. First and foremost, I'd like to give a big thanks to the Recording Academy. Thank you for inviting us to the show. We had a wonderful time. Thank you as well to Clive Davis and his team for inviting us to the pre Grammy gala. Another wonderful evening. Great times as always. And I also want to give a special shout out to my guy Kevin Shivers from Wasserman for the hookup on multiple suites and other access opportunities throughout the weekend. And thank you to our audio and video producers G and Eric for everything that you do to help make this trapital episode possible. But most importantly, thank you for listening. Trapital would not be trapital without you. So if you enjoyed this episode, whether it's this one on the Grammys or any of the conversations that we have, send the link of the episode to a friend, someone that you think would enjoy it. And even if it's not this episode, send them a link to another episode that you really enjoyed. Word of mouth is still the best way to grow. And if you have a few minutes and you haven't already, follow us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts wherever you get your podcast. And if you have a few moments, if you could rate the podcast or leave a review that helps Trapitol reach the right people. Thanks again. Talk to you next time.