CO-HOST | Make Money Beyond the Spotlight: Turning Brand and IP Into Assets

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Travis Makes Money

Episode: CO-HOST | Make Money Beyond the Spotlight: Turning Brand and IP Into Assets
Host: Travis Chappell
Date: April 13, 2026
Featured Guest: Producer Eric

Episode Overview

In this dynamic, conversational episode, Travis Chappell and his producer Eric dive into the dazzling world of high-earning celebrity estates, exploring how brand, assets, and intellectual property (IP) continue to drive massive wealth—even after the spotlight fades. Using the recent Forbes ranking of the highest-paid dead celebrities as a launching pad, they discuss what makes these figures' estates so valuable and extract actionable lessons on building and monetizing IP. The conversation expands to how changes in technology—especially AI—are rapidly transforming the value and risks surrounding personal brand and creative assets.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Top-Earning Dead Celebrities of 2025 ([00:55]–[05:24])

• Michael Jackson still tops the list.
  • Michael Jackson’s estate earned $105 million in 2025 alone, with a staggering lifetime posthumous total around $3.5 billion.
    • Eric (01:45): “According to Forbes, Michael Jackson was the highest-paid dead celebrity of 2025, bringing in $105 million in the 12 months. And Forbes estimates his estate has generated about $3.5 billion since his death in 2009.”
• Other heavy hitters:
  • Dr. Seuss: $85 million
  • Richard Wright & Sid Barrett (Pink Floyd): $81 million each
  • Notorious B.I.G.: $80 million
  • Miles Davis: $21 million
• Revenue sources:
  • Music catalogs, licensing, streaming, book sales, and ongoing entertainment projects all factor heavily into these earnings.

Travis (02:00): “Really? Is the best case scenario that the money can keep rolling in and the kids get to be safe?”

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2. How Assets and IP Generate Wealth ([03:07]–[07:13])

• Michael Jackson’s catalog mastery:
  • Jackson bought the ATV catalog in 1985 for $47.5 million, including Lennon and McCartney hits.
  • Later deals with Sony brought in massive lump sums ($750M in 2016, $600M in 2024).
  • His brand generates through films (“This is It”), residencies, and musicals.
• Dr. Seuss’s enduring power:
  • Sold almost 5 million new books in 2024, despite no new works in decades ([06:43]).
  • Heavy Netflix licensing and new animated adaptations (the Cat in the Hat movie coming in 2026).

Travis (06:50): “Brand new book without having written a book in 60 years.”

• Licensing and asset sales as a model:
  • For Pink Floyd and Notorious B.I.G., catalog and “name, image, likeness” rights were major one-time windfalls.
  • Jimmy Buffett's Margaritaville brand generated $14 million for his estate just through hospitality and merchandise.

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3. Lessons on IP, Asset Building, and Brand Ownership ([09:01]–[10:50])

• IP may be the ultimate asset.

  Travis (09:10): “IP seems to be almost like, publicly undervalued when it is the catalyst for so many of these... every single one of these is ownership of IP.”

• Don’t just earn—own.
  • The importance of turning active income into enduring assets.
  • The real wealth is not in “hustling” for cash, but in building a catalog or brand that can be monetized repeatedly.

Eric (09:26): “It’s important to build assets, not just one-off income.”

• Strategic focus pays off.
  • Rather than jumping around, building a deep, focused catalog has outsized value—for musicians, authors, creators.

  Eric (09:50): “Thinking in terms of a broad catalog of work that can be packaged and sold...not hodgepodging 50 different pursuits.”

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4. The New Frontier—IP, AI, and the Future of Creative Work ([10:10]–[19:03])

• AI makes IP even more crucial.
  • The rise of AI-generated content makes protecting one’s “likeness, image, and voice” essential.
• Celebrities getting proactive:
  • Shaq selling 50% of his name, image, and likeness (NIL) rights—using that capital to acquire and build more brands.
• Matthew McConaughey on owning your identity ([12:16]–[13:49]):

  McConaughey (12:51): “Get your own—your own self: voice, likeness, etc. Trademark it. Whatever you gotta do...own yourself...so when it comes, no one can steal you. But they're gonna have to come to you...and you'll have the chance to be your own agency.”

• AI-generated actors, characters, and ‘slop’
  • Discussion on the threat (and inevitability) of AI actors, digital clones, and moral dilemmas about posthumous uses.
  • Hope that real art and “real stuff” will still have unique value, especially for older generations ([17:35]–[19:03]):

  Travis (17:56): "I just think our generation is not going to accept it as a form of art... but maybe it’s fantastic and maybe people go watch it, but there will still be, I think, a deep appreciation for real stuff."

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5. Standing Out in the AI Era ([21:08]–[23:11])

• Originality will keep you ahead.
  • Tim Ferriss suggests living and writing from first-hand experience—something AI can't replicate:

  Tim Ferriss (21:55): “Go out in the world, do interesting things, or observe interesting things in real life and write about those things...do experiments as a writer.”

• Copying a copy will always lose.
  • AI and content recycling makes novelty, sincerity, and authenticity even more valuable.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “[Jackson] was owning a ton of content, which is where the real money is actually made.” —Eric (04:07)
• “The takeaway is the value of IP...every single one of these is ownership of IP.” —Travis (09:10)
• “It’s important to build assets, not just one-off income.” —Eric (09:26)
• “AI is here...own yourself—so when [the opportunity] comes, no one can steal you.” —Matthew McConaughey (12:51)
• “The problem sometimes is also the solution...there will be AI programs built to combat all of the slop that's being put out there.” —Travis (17:35)
• “Go out in the world, do interesting things, or observe interesting things in real life and write about those things.” —Tim Ferriss (21:55)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [00:55] — Introduction to the highest-paid dead celebrities
• [01:45] — Michael Jackson’s estate earnings deep dive
• [03:07] — How music catalogs become massive windfalls
• [05:24] — Children’s IP: Dr. Seuss’s ongoing success
• [07:30] — Song catalog rights sales (Pink Floyd, Notorious B.I.G.)
• [08:13] — Lifestyle brands and nontraditional IP (Jimmy Buffett, Arnold Palmer, Kobe Bryant)
• [09:01] — Key takeaways: build assets, focus, and own your IP
• [10:10] — The age of AI and owning your brand/likeness
• [12:16]–[13:49] — Matthew McConaughey on trademarking your likeness
• [17:35] — The case for real, human-created art in the AI age
• [21:55] — Tim Ferriss: “Put more interesting stuff in front of the camera”

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Closing Thoughts

Travis and Eric make a compelling case that true, lasting wealth comes not from hustle or frugality, but from building assets—especially creative IP—that pay out for years or generations. The episode is peppered with wit, pop culture references, and actionable ideas. Their open, sometimes irreverent tone makes complex topics feel accessible and urgent, particularly as technology threatens to blur the line between real and artificial creativity.

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For anyone aiming to future-proof their financial journey, the recurring message is clear: Own your brand, focus on scalable assets, and keep creating authentically—you never know when your legacy might pay dividends long after the spotlight fades.

Transcript

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[Travis]

You're listening to the Travis Makes Money podcast presented by gohighlevel. Com. For a free 30 day trial of the best all in one digital marketing software tool on the planet, just go to gohighlevel.com travis. What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to the Travis Makes Money podcast, where it's a mission to help you make more money today on the show. My producer Eric is here in studio. What's up, man?

[Eric]

What's up? I got a killer episode for you today.

[Travis]

Oh, yes. What was the week for?

[Eric]

Because today we're going to be talking about the highest paid dead celebrities. So these are the celebrities whose estate has earned the most money. Okay, okay, Wait.

[Travis]

Can I make some guesses?

[Eric]

Yeah. And I just want to be clear. So this is a 2025. So it was. I think this came out in 2026. But it was like going back over 2025. It was a Forbes article. And so who do you think was the highest paid dead celebrity of 2025?

[Travis]

I'm gonna go Michael Jackson.

[Eric]

Right on.

[Travis]

Dude, sick. What was the total? Does it give you the.

[Eric]

Do you think, Travis, do you think I'm coming on the Travis Makes Money podcast? I don't have a dollar amount to give you. Come on, fella.

[Travis]

Maybe.

[Eric]

According to Forrest, Michael Jackson was the highest paid dead celebrity of 2025, bringing in $105 million in the 12 months. And Forbes estimates his estate has generated about 3.5 billion since his death in 2009.

[Travis]

Oh, my God.

[Eric]

Really? Is the best case scenario that the money can keep rolling in and the kids get to be safe? You want that cut? True, true, true. You're not going to have him on, right anyway. That's a crazy number. He's not alone. Forbes says Dr. Seuss earned 85 million. That checks out.

[Travis]

Wow.

[Eric]

And honestly, that's something about society. Like Dr. Seuss should be making the most.

[Travis]

Honestly, yes.

[Eric]

Dr. Seuss earned 85 million. Richard Wright and Sid Barrett of Pink Floyd each earned $81 million.

[Travis]

Wow.

[Eric]

The Notorious B.I.G. earned $80 million. And Miles Davis, this one surprised me. Earned $21 million. Wow.

[Travis]

Muhammad Ali wasn't on there.

[Eric]

No sir. Huh.

[Travis]

I would have guessed he would be up there somewhere.

[Eric]

So, yeah, so the ranking includes.

[Travis]

But I suppose music makes sense.

[Eric]

Yeah, streamed it's in movies, shows. Forbes says the ranking includes pre tax earnings from sales streams, licensing deals and other sources between October 1, 2024, September 30, 2025. And fees for agents, managers and lawyers are not deducted. Who are the real winners in this whole situation?

[Travis]

No kidding.

[Eric]

Imagine being like the agent for Michael Jackson, his estate. It's just like, yeah, the checks came in and here's my cut and there you go. So yeah, so that's pretty, pretty crazy. So Michael Jackson, let's dig a little deeper, deeper into him. Okay, so, okay, so the reason Jackson made so much from his stuff is that in 1985 he bought his catalog for $47.5 million. Steel or he bought the ATV catalog for $47.5 million. So he bought a huge music catalog. Forbes has included nearly 4,000 songs, which among them included like Lennon and McCartney hits, which is like some big musicians. Huh.

[Travis]

So he's making money off of other dead musicians work.

[Eric]

Yeah. So the investment layer turned into a massive payday when the estate sold its stake to Sony in 2016 for $750 million, or roughly a billion in today's dollars, according to forbes. Then in 2024, Forbes says the Jackson estate sold a 50% stake in Michael Jackson's own publishing and master recordings to Sony for another $600 million. So not only was he creating a lot of content, he was owning a ton of content, which is like where the real money is actually made. And then here's some more. You ready for more ways he made some money? On top of the catalog sales, Forbes says the Jackson brand keeps generating money through multiple channels, including a 2009 concert film, this Is it, which gross $267 million, a Cirque du Soleil tour that grossed 160 million, the ongoing Michael Jackson 1 residency in Las Vegas, and MJ the Musical, which Forbes says has generated almost 300 million dol million in sales across productions.

[Travis]

Isn't there, isn't there a movie coming out too?

[Eric]

There is. So that'll maybe he'll top the list again this year. Yeah, I think they're gonna leave certain things out of the movie. I don't know. Who knows?

[Travis]

Yeah, I mean, if they want to be authentic, but yeah.

[Eric]

Yeah. So he owns money, he owns his ip. Yeah, he owns a lot of other people's other people's IP making fat, fat stacks. Dr. Seuss. You want to know some more breakdowns about Dr. Seuss? Yeah. Dr. Seuss earned $85 million in 2025. He was the top selling children's and young adult author in the United States last year. With how many books do you think he sold in 2024?

[Travis]

I mean,

[Eric]

and what's crazy is, if you think about it, as far as

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[Eric]

Think about all the used books that aren't tracked on lists.

[Travis]

Yeah. Right on top of this, the reselling of books.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Travis]

Thrift stores and garage sales.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Travis]

25 million.

[Eric]

Oh, no. 4.8 million.

[Travis]

Oh, okay. Wow.

[Eric]

That was. Okay. Sorry.

[Travis]

Dr. Seuss, he sold 5 million books in 2024.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Travis]

Brand new.

[Eric]

That's a lot. Yeah.

[Travis]

Brand new book without having written a book in 60 years.

[Eric]

Many years. Yes. So again, all this is licensing. The estate expanded its Netflix partnership to include three separate series and an animated adaptation of the Cat in the Hat that's coming in 2026. And so, yeah, licensing has been the big key for them as well.

[Travis]

Looking forward to that movie.

[Eric]

Really? It looks right.

[Travis]

Yeah. Bill Hader.

[Eric]

Honestly, Bill. Love him. I don't hate her. All right. And then so. So they're licensing and getting their stuff out to people and then you've got this next crew here. It's a lot to do with exits, like selling off things.

[Travis]

Okay.

[Eric]

With this. So Pink Floyd and Biggie. Love Biggie Smalls, right?

[Travis]

Totally.

[Eric]

Yeah, sure. Me too. Okay. All right. So Sony Music Publishing acquired Pink Floyd's catalog and name, image, and likeness rights in October 2024 for $400 million. With the proceed split among the surviving members and the estates of Richard Wright and Sid Barrett, Forbes says the Notorious B.I.G's estate sold 50% of his catalog publishing and nil rights to Primary Wave Music in March. And so, yeah, so they held onto a little bit, but sold off a massive chunk of the catalog, which I think makes sense. Why wouldn't you do that at a certain point? So, yeah. And then Jimmy Buffett. You want to get into Jimmy Buffett?

[Travis]

Sure. I'm gonna stop saying it's the same Margaritaville.

[Eric]

Margaritaville guy. Jimmy Buffett. Forbes says Buffett earned $14 million in 2025, and that was all from the Margaritaville brand. Just expanding, so cruise line, restaurants, apparel, so.

[Travis]

And that's just what he earned from it.

[Eric]

Yeah. So just building a lifestyle brand all around that. And then, I mean, I can get into a couple others too, like Kobe Bryant, $10 million. Bryant Performance Footwear Revenue quadrupled over the past year. A dozen new products with his name released in 2025 under his sub brand. Arnold Palmer earned $11 million with his signature drink continuing to generate major sales. It's like. It's like Newman's own ranch dressing.

[Travis]

Yeah.

[Eric]

Like Paul Newman's just, like, crushing it.

[Travis]

Right.

[Eric]

I remember actually watching. Watching a Paul Newman movie and being like, my grandparents were interesting.

[Travis]

You know what the. You know what the takeaway is for me?

[Eric]

What's your takeaway?

[Travis]

Is the value of ip. That IP seems to be almost like, publicly undervalued when it is the catalyst for so many of these. I mean, basically every single one of these is. Is ownership of ip.

[Eric]

Well, I think there's a couple takeaways here. Okay. First, I would say it's important to build assets and not just one off income. Would you agree?

[Travis]

Yeah.

[Eric]

Like, it's not just, oh, I toured a lot and made a lot of money. It's like, oh, now I have a deal partnership with this group.

[Travis]

Parking your active income into other areas, parking your assets.

[Eric]

Okay. Thinking in terms of, like, a broad catalog of work that can be packaged and sold. So not jumping from one thing to another. I think that's like a big piece, too. Is like not hodgepodging 50 different pursuits. It's like drilling down onto this one thing.

[Travis]

Unless you're Shaq.

[Eric]

Unless you're Shaq.

[Travis]

Then you just do all of the above.

[Eric]

And then I think this one in. In. In the age of AI, which in many ways disturbs me. It makes me Sick to my core. What as AI As. But like, as far as, like, when it comes to creative endeavors and entertainment. Yeah, I think owning your own likeness and IP is going to be so important. Like, I was watching. I forget who it was. I think it was Matthew McConaughey when he did the Timmy. Timmy, I don't know, Timothy Chalamet interview. Did you watch that?

[Travis]

Uhuh.

[Eric]

And he just said basically, like, it's here. Like, AI is here. How else? Let me pull it up. He's like, AI's here. You need to like, trademark.

[Travis]

Oh, yes. No, I actually did see that. Yeah, it's a top, top of mind because we just did this thing with Shaq and that was one. One piece of it that I thought was really interesting because he sold 50% of his name, image and likeness. Well, when we were talking, he said, I sold 50% of my business to Authentic Brands. And I was like, can, can you clarify what business is like, is that like, nil? He was like, yeah, Yeah, I sold 50% of. So. So he saw, like, obviously got a big cash deal up front to sell 50% of his name, image and likeness and then partnered with a group of. Of people that were basically going and acquiring brands that fit inside of the Shaq Nil family. And they've resurrected past brands and dead ip like Muhammad Ali and stuff like that. And then they've signed other people like David Beckham and Kevin Hart and different people like that now.

[Eric]

Yeah.

[Travis]

So expanding, like, he's obviously expanding his own IP for the Shaq brand, but he's also acquiring all other brands and IP underneath that umbrella. When Reebok didn't do a shoe deal with them, they were just. Or Reebok's sales were going down and definitely not in the basketball space. And then he goes to Authentic Brands and he was like, what would it look like if we just bought it? So they just went and bought Reebok and then he was the president of basketball at Reebok for some time and installed Allen Iverson as like, the VP and resurrection.

[Eric]

The president of basketball is here. Yeah, here's Matthew McConaughey.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yep, it's coming. It's already here.

[Eric]

All right, all right, all right.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Don't deny it. It's not enough. It may be for you, but it's not going to be enough to sit on the sidelines and make the moral plea. The moral plea that, no, this is wrong, it's not going to last. There's too much money to be made and there's. It's it's too productive.

[Eric]

It's.

[Matthew McConaughey]

It's. It's here. All right, So I say get. Get. Get your own. Your own yourself voice, likeness, et cetera. Trademark it. Whatever you got to do.

[Travis]

So you did that.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah. Get. Own yourself. So when. And if. When it comes. Not if it comes, no one can steal you. But they're gonna have to come to you to go, can I. Or they're gonna be in breach. And you'll have the chance to be your own agency and go. Yeah. For this amount or no. Okay, it's coming. Is it going to be another category or is it going to infiltrate our category? It's damn sure going to infiltrate. Infiltrate our category. I think it'll end up. Does it become another category? Will we be in five years having films. The best AI Film. The best AI Actor. Maybe. I think it might be. That might be the thing is that becomes another category. I'm not sure it's going to be in front of us in ways that we don't even see it. It's going to get so good, we're not going to know the difference. That's one of the big questions. What we're doing right now is the question of reality. That's. It's more hazy than ever, in a very exciting way, I think. But also a scary way.

[Liberty Mutual Announcer]

Yeah.

[Eric]

That's. For those of you listening, Matthew McConaughey is. He was a guest star in Sex and City. It's probably where you recognize.

[Travis]

He was a very well known extra on Sex and the City, but he

[Eric]

was actually a guest star.

[Travis]

Oh, sorry.

[Eric]

It wasn't an extra.

[Travis]

I missed that one. Just that one episode.

[Eric]

Yeah. So I. But I. I like that take of, like. Because I don't particularly like the idea of the fact that we're gonna have, like, AI actors.

[Travis]

Yeah.

[Eric]

I think that's shitty and terrible and bad for humanity, but I also like the fact that, like.

[Travis]

But look at all the other terrible, shitty things that are bad for humanity that have done.

[Eric]

I know. Because there's too much money to be made.

[Travis]

Right.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Which.

[Eric]

Yeah. Which I. Is always the best way to determine if something's good is how much people are making on the back end of it.

[Travis]

Yeah. Anyway, it wouldn't make that much money if people didn't consume it even.

[Eric]

I know. And I wish people would stop and I. Someday I'll write a paper about a school paper.

[Travis]

That'll do it.

[Eric]

No. Someday. You know what?

[Travis]

I think I'm going to take a stand.

[Eric]

I think this is a whole nother conversation. I think Marvel. This is my theory. I think Marvel paved the way for the AI slop that we see now, because Marvel was like a franchise that made it so much more about IP than story. It's like, we're going to take all your favorite things and we're going to shove them in this.

[Matthew McConaughey]

Yeah.

[Eric]

And I think. And then it was like, look at all the things it was next. It was. It was nostalgia baiting you with, like, here's the Flash. Let's put Christopher Reeves in here and puppeteer his dead body on the screen. Here's. Here's Ghostbusters. Let's take the dead cast member and put him in a. In a spot. And it's like, it's. When you look at those scenes, your immediate thought is like, that's so cool. I never thought I'd see him on the big screen again. And then you go, oh, that's not really him. Yeah. And, like, who knows what performance they could have made or what choices they would have made at the age that they're at now. So it's like, I think that it all kind of paved the way for just going like, well, I don't really care how it happened, but Spider man and Batman are now in a scene together. You know what I mean? Like, in 20 years, you know, whatever. Like, DC and Marvel crossover.

[Travis]

That'd be kind of cool, though.

[Eric]

We have my. Yeah, but. Yeah, you have a problem.

[Travis]

Who wins? Who wins in that fight?

[Eric]

Spider man versus who? Batman. Oh, I. Spider Man.

[Travis]

Yeah.

[Eric]

He can get too high in the air.

[Travis]

Yeah.

[Eric]

I hate this. Okay. No, well.

[Travis]

And he has actual superpowers. Whatever.

[Eric]

Anyway, listen, here's the thing.

[Travis]

That's really what we're here to talk about.

[Eric]

No, but. No, but anyway, so. But I do like the idea of, like, you own it. You can say no. You get to. You know, I know he's saying, like, you could be your own agency, but I also think having agency to be able to say, like, I don't like this. I morally don't like it. But, like, you're putting the steps in to protect. Like, this is my branding. And.

[Travis]

And the AI tools will get better in the opposite direction as well. Because, like, right now, I. I feel like the. The scary part is sort of like, yeah, but there's going to be people, like, if. If they could just go to AI and be, like, in Matthew McConaughey's voice, read this script and use it in their commercial. It's like, yeah, but by the time you send a cease and desist or even figure out that that was being used. It's probably already been used 10,000 times without your knowledge or consent and you're not getting paid at any of that. But I also think that there will just be more AI tools that will combat those other AI tools that will be able to detect those things and notify you and then automatically send a cease and desist or automatically send term.

[Liberty Mutual Announcer]

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[Travis]

A superhero remake.

[Tim Ferriss]

Not exactly what we'd expect from an Oscar winning director.

[Eric]

Action Simon Williams audition for Wonder Man Man.

[Travis]

I'm gonna need you to sign this. Assuming you don't have superpowers.

[Eric]

I'll never work again if anyone found out. My lips are sealed.

[Liberty Mutual Announcer]

Marvel Television's Wonder man, all eight episodes

[Travis]

now streaming only on Disney plus for licensing. If you want to actually use my voice or my, my name, you know, in this, in this commercial or in this voiceover read or whatever. So it's the, the, the problem sometimes is also the solution is my point that there, there will be AI, There will be AI programs that are sort of built to combat all of the slop that's being put out there as well. But I do like the idea that he brought up about it being its own category. That's more where I see it going. Because I just think that our generation is not going to accept it as a form of art, if that makes sense. And you and I have talked about that, where it's like, okay, well, maybe it makes the filmmaking process easier. Maybe it makes this section cheaper. And now you can do this project for 50 million when it used to cost you 100 million to do the same project. And maybe that gives more access to creators who are more story focused and story centric and obviously extrapolate that down to whatever industry you're in. These are the types of quote unquote threats that are, that are being experienced everywhere. But I like, I like more the concept of like, okay, this is an AI film and maybe it's fantastic and maybe people go watch it, but there will still be, I think, a deep appreciation for real stuff, especially from generations who've experienced real stuff their whole life. Like, it'll take an entire new swath of people who just grew up on AI generated stuff that are, that are going to accept that as the new version of truth, if that makes sense.

[Eric]

It's good stuff. I'm so excited.

[Travis]

Yeah, love the future.

[Eric]

As a cinephile, I love, I love.

[Travis]

It's not going to just, it's not. It's. I just.

[Eric]

It's not going to destroy it. Honestly. It's. It's the same thing as like when digital video became a thing and expanded access where it's like you got a lot of really crappy stuff.

[Travis]

Yeah.

[Eric]

Because everybody can do it now.

[Travis]

Yeah. Or streaming services.

[Eric]

It's just like now I don't know if you ever see these, but someone would be like, Hollywood is terrified because look what I just generated. And they show you like the crappiest video you've ever seen in your life.

[Travis]

Yeah.

[Eric]

And it's like, like people, it's like, oh, this Sora video you did is really has no story at all and sucks. Right? Yeah. Your lifeless video is really threatening Hollywood.

[Travis]

Yeah.

[Eric]

And it's the same as when you go out with like a mini DV or it's like.

[Travis]

But also that same case could be made for like TikTok versus versus traditional entertainment. Like that's pulling attention and eyeballs away from film and TV because people just sit there, watch. Tick tock.

[Eric]

I think the only difference which is

[Travis]

creative is just non AI slop.

[Eric]

There's been no, there's been no defining of like what is like pure theft. That to me is like the. Is like. Is like which again this is our whole rabbit. I got myself going on this. But like, but it's like the thing that when someone goes like, oh look, I made a. I made a Marvel like scene in 10 minutes. It's like. Yeah. Because AI was trained and stole all of this from people that put the craft in to make that.

[Travis]

Yeah.

[Eric]

Whether you like it or not, like what Marvel looks like. And I think that's the thing over the next like 15 years is you see this with everything but it's like things are going to start feeling very redundant because it's all training on itself and just regurgitating the same thing in lesser versions. And it's the same, you know, that happens with AI that happens with people copying. You know, let me do this style subtitles. Because this creator does it this way. Right. Let me make a Mr. Beast style video. It's like if you can still do your own thing and stand out from the crowd, like you're going to win long term. Whether you're fighting with AI or copycats or whatever that is.

[Travis]

Did I. Did I send you that Tim Ferriss clip? Yeah. He was talking about like sort of combating AI writing as an author himself. And. And he's also like, he's an author but he's also a. A voracious. Reader. You know, he's, he's constantly pouring through books like, loves his favorite authors and a wide variety of different authors that he reads. So he's like a big fan of that type of creative style, obviously. But basically he was saying, like, just get out and do crazy stuff because AI will not be able to experience the world the same way that we experience it. And the thing that will make your writing more compelling is just having experienced more things.

[Eric]

You're saying it great. But let's hear him say, okay, thank you.

[Tim Ferriss]

The explosion of AI generated content out there. Now, how do you rise above the noise? I was spending time, a little bit of time drinking a Paloma with a very well known photographer. He is one of the most commercially successful photographers in the world. And he was laughing and telling a story of how he gets approached by photographers. They could be amateur, but very often they're professionals who want to know how they can become better photographers. And they're asking all these gear related questions and his answer is just put more interesting stuff in front of the camera, make what's in front of the camera more interesting. And the equivalent of that, at least for me as a nonfiction writer, is doing interesting things. Go out in the world, do interesting things, or observe interesting things in real life and write about those things. Do experiments as a writer and with the expl.

[Eric]

Yeah. Not copying a copy of a copy of a copy, which is like everyone's quickest tendency is like, how do I make an ad like this? How do I create content like Gary Vee or how do I make a video that's Mr. Beast?

[Travis]

Like, how do I write a book that's like Atomic Habits or that's like the subtle art or whatever. It's like, well, that's.

[Matthew McConaughey]

What's that?

[Travis]

I mean, and Tim Ferriss is the ultimate example of that. He's constantly running human experiments on himself and then documenting his findings, which is what makes his work unique and really interesting and super shareable. So I mean, like, like Matthew McConaughey said, like, there's a lot of things that get me excited about it. There's some things that get me scared about it. But also we as humans have always been really, really good at adapting to change. And the only variable that this introduces that hasn't existed before is the speed at which things will change once, especially once the next level of computing is figured out. And then you combine that with the popularity of AI, the rate of change, especially technologically, is going to be unfathomable as the, like, the way that we understand the world right now. So. But again, I think. I just think we're gonna. We're gonna adapt. We're gonna change. We're gonna figure it out. It's not gonna be a doomsday thing. Probably. It's gonna be just fine. And. And we'll probably introduce more opportunity into society at large and enable us to be able to worry about solving other problems that we haven't yet been able to figure out. So, anyway, that's it for this episode of the show. Thanks so much for tuning in. Remember, money only solves your money problems, but it's easier to solve the rest of problems with money in the bank on the Travis Make Money podcast. Catch you next time. Peace.

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[Travis]

12 months.

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