CO-HOST | Make Money by Knowing When a Big Risk Becomes a Big Mistake

Summary

Travis Makes Money

Episode: CO-HOST | Make Money by Knowing When a Big Risk Becomes a Big Mistake

Host: Travis Chappell
Co-host/Producer: Eric
Date: April 6, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Travis Chappell and producer Eric dissect the massive financial implications and lessons behind ABC's unprecedented decision to cancel an already-filmed, heavily promoted season of The Bachelorette after disturbing domestic violence footage involving new star Taylor Frankie Paul was released. Pivoting from the tabloid drama, Travis breaks down the hard numbers, discusses risk-taking in business, opportunity cost, and the real-life fallout—both financial and reputational—of a bad gamble. The episode offers relatable takeaways for everyday listeners about knowing when a bold risk becomes a big mistake.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Pop Culture Setup: From Tabloids to Financial Fallout

• The episode opens with lighthearted banter about reality TV ("bachelorizing" the intro [01:03]) before shifting to real news: the sudden cancellation of The Bachelorette after violent footage of Taylor Frankie Paul emerged.
• The hosts clarify for listeners that the core topic isn’t the Bachelor franchise drama, but the enormous financial and opportunity costs ABC faces ([02:55]) and what others can learn from it.

The Numbers Behind the Disaster [04:03–16:26]

Hard Costs and Opportunity Lost

• The Hollywood Reporter reveals ABC faces a $30+ million loss for the scrapped season ([04:03]).
  • Travis reacts: “That seems low to me, frankly… My gut would tell me that they would make much more money on advertising than they typically would on a regular season because it was supposed to be like… the most popular reality show at the time.” [04:24]
• Eric confirms:
  • Production Cost: ~$2M per episode; a 10–12 episode season is $20–25M ([12:57])
  • Marketing Spend: Elevated due to the high-profile “reboot” nature.
  • Advertising Revenue: A 30-second ad costs $100k. With 30 minutes of ads per 2-hour episode, that's ~$6M per episode ([14:49]).
  • Total Potential Ad Loss: At 10 episodes, that's $60M—double the sunk cost ([15:18]).
  • Other lost revenue: international rights, streaming, reunions, restreams, after-shows ([16:23]).

Notable Quote

• Travis (calculating the ad loss):
  “On the low side, they lost out on a potential $60 million of ad revenue coming in, which obviously, they’re making—that’s where they make their profit… So much lost revenue here from it being canceled.” [15:48]

Indirect & Long-Term Damage

• The hosts highlight “opportunity cost” and long-term brand damage. ABC must now fill the prime-time slot with reruns at significantly lower ad rates ([18:44]).
• Fans of both Bachelorette and Secret Lives are alienated; hardcore supporters now lose their expected social events and parties with “brand trust” shaken ([17:52]).

Notable Quote

• Eric:
  “That’s not even counting long-term brand damage as well. There’s a lot of people that were already pissed...” [16:26]

The Human Fallout: Contestants & Careers [19:16–24:53]

• Contestants who left their jobs for filming now lose out on life-changing influencer deals and public profiles.

  • Travis laments the dashed expectations:
    “They literally thought their lives were about to change. Their lives were literally about to change.” [19:16]

• Regular contestants aren’t paid; only hosts and leads keep their salaries ([19:34]).

• Eric references viral clips of dejected contestants sharing their disappointment on social media, further highlighting unseen human costs ([24:53]).

Corporate Lessons: Risk Tolerance & Vetting [25:44–31:54]

• The $30M loss is small relative to Disney’s $11.6B entertainment division revenues, but for the reality TV line, it is a seismic blow ([25:44]).
• Shocking detail: the violent incident happened “three years ago”—proving ABC knew about the risk ([26:09]). Video footage release was the real death knell.

Notable Quote

• Travis:
  “It’s also very well branded IP that they want to continue… So, I like the idea of, hey, let’s take a big risk here. But you’d think that their legal team would’ve stepped in… there are real potential threats here… with culture being the way it is right now.” [30:00]

• Eric shares that “insiders say they skipped a lot of their normal vetting process,” speculating whether this is PR spin or an actual oversight ([31:16]).

Notable Quote

• Travis:
  “I guess the takeaway is, don’t try to make terrible people famous, I suppose. But, like—that’s sort of what you do for reality…” [31:54]

Ethics and Social Commentary [33:47–34:58]

• Eric highlights the seriousness of allowing a domestic violence perpetrator to remain a “role model,” especially on reality TV, drawing on disturbing statistics:
  • “Strangulation increases the risk of homicide that the victim faces by 750%… A victim is eight times more likely to end up dead at the hand of their abuser after strangulation occurs…” [34:20]
• Both hosts agree: pulling the season was ABC’s only option.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On aligning risk with reward:
  “They were taking a massive risk… This implodes… You could have just filmed the regular season.” – Travis [16:53]

• On the cost of a misstep:
  “Imagine the angry executives… This is the kind of thing a showrunner would lose their job over.” – Eric [12:20]

• On lessons for listeners:
  “Prioritize the attention and money machine over the right thing to do—it usually doesn’t end up working out. Imagine that.” – Travis [35:46]

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Key Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment/Topic | |-----------|------------------------------------------| | 02:55 | Transition from “drama” to financial focus | | 04:03 | News of $30M+ loss; ad revenue math begins | | 12:57 | Hollywood Reporter breakdown: production & marketing costs | | 14:49 | Ad revenue deep dive: $6M/episode calculated | | 15:48 | Potential lost revenue: $60M minimum | | 16:26 | Long-term brand and opportunity cost discussed | | 18:44 | ABC fills time slot with lower-value reruns | | 19:16 | Contestants’ individual losses and human impact | | 25:44 | Comparing the loss to Disney’s larger business | | 31:54 | Big-picture takeaways: risk vs. due diligence | | 34:20 | Domestic violence statistics and deeper consequences | | 35:46 | Closing lesson: “Do right, not just profitable” |

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Takeaways for Listeners

Entrepreneurial Lessons:

• Big, attention-grabbing risks may work—until they backfire. Assess “opportunity cost” alongside hard costs.
• Vet partners or talent thoroughly—shortcuts on due diligence can be catastrophic.
• Some mistakes, especially ethical lapses, can harm not only profit but brand trust for years.

Reflection:

• “Don’t try to make terrible people famous.”
• “Money only solves your money problems, but it’s easier to solve the rest of your problems with money in the bank. So let’s solve that one first.” – Travis [35:46]

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Rich with pop-culture references and behind-the-scenes business breakdowns, this episode delivers actionable financial lessons and a timely warning about the fine line between daring strategy and reckless oversight.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

Hey, Travis. How you doing?

[A]

I'm chilling.

[B]

Yeah, well, chilling. I'd like to give you a rose. Aw, I'm just kidding. I didn't know how to bachelorize this intro.

[A]

Well, you should have just brought a rose.

[B]

Yeah, but that's weird.

[A]

I would have. I would have brought.

[B]

This is main. This is mainly an audio show, so I'm not going to bring you.

[A]

Fine.

[B]

A rose.

[A]

Fine. So what's going on?

[B]

You know how Secret Lives of Mormon Wives ended?

[A]

No.

[B]

Spoiler alert. Taylor, Frankie Paul pulls up to the mansion of the Bachelor or the Bachelorette. I always get it mixed up and I when I tell you my wife wants to strangle me when I say, oh, she was on the Bachelor. It's the Bachelorette. Or when I say the Bachelor, it's like when I say. It's like when I short clip from Star Trek and she's like, is that Next Generation? I'm like, no, that's Enterprise. Same thing.

[A]

Totally.

[B]

But anyway, so Taylor, Frankie Paul pulls up to the Bachelorette mansion and she's on the phone with her. Exactly. Who she just hooked up with. And you know what he says? Just save a rose for me.

[A]

This is the same guy that she was throwing chairs at.

[B]

Yeah. Not good. Bad situation. So it's not a good look. For those of you that are tuning in and don't know about this, you're lying. You know all about this whether you'd like to or not. Footage of a domestic violence incident involving star of Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, the leader of MomTalk. MomTalk and who was supposed to be the Bachelorette. This clip resurfaced and paused. Secret Lives of Mormon wives from filming. It got the Bachelorette season canceled indefinitely.

[A]

Which is wild.

[B]

Which is crazy.

[A]

That happened. Yeah.

[B]

And it's got mom talk in a frenzy. You know, people are fractured.

[A]

We were talking. Jackie and I were talking at a bar on date night and the bartender, like, overheard us talking about this. She was like, wait, are you guys talking about the Bachelorette?

[B]

And everybody in America is talking about this.

[A]

It was funny because she was a fan of the secret lives stuff and she didn't even know that they had already filmed the Bachelorette. Which is. Brings us to the main topic of today's discussion. Obviously, we are not a bachelor talk show.

[B]

We're here to debate whether or not she is at full.

[A]

Crazy person talking about the financial fallout because they already filmed the entire season of the Bachelorette and then they already released an episode, right. Like the one where they do. She talks about the previous, you know, lorettes or whatever and gets advice from them. And it was like two or three days from airing, and then this footage comes out and then ABC basically hands tied. They were like, well, we don't really have an option now. We. We have to cancel it. So we were immediately started talking about, like, how much money is ABC losing from doing this deal for. From canceling the Bachelorette? So let's figure that out.

[B]

Well, I just popped. So I was waiting. There was a lot of, like, drama talkers that were conjecture, you know, putting out their thoughts and like, oh, they're gonna cost. It's gonna cost them a million, a hundred million dollars and all these sorts of things. So I was waiting for someone like the Hollywood Reporter to put out an article and they have. So go ahead and read this, cite your source, read the headline, and give me your immediate reaction.

[A]

So this is from the Hollywood reporter. ABC faces $30 million plus loss from scrapped Bachelore show was pulled after video serviced of a domestic violence incident involving star Taylor Frankie. Paul, does it give a breakdown of the $30 million?

[B]

We'll get there. Okay, but what's your immediate thought when you read that headline and you're thinking about abc?

[A]

It sounds low to me, frankly. It sounds low to me.

[B]

You mean Frankie.

[A]

Frankie, it sounds low.

[B]

We should do that the whole episode. Frankie, we have a problem. Honestly, Frankie, it seems like a big problem.

[A]

They. Yeah, that seems low to me. Just because. Because they had already filmed it, obviously you have all of the cost of producing an entire season like that. Not cheap. Including all the things like even the salaries for the host. The salary for. I. I read somewhere that she's keeping 100% of the salary that she got paid, even though it got cancelled.

[B]

So.

[A]

Oh, sorry, you're going to talk about that later. Okay. So they paid her. They paid the host. They pay for, obviously, like, all the travel of all of the people in the show to get to these different countries and wild destinations that they bring people to once they're done at the mansion. So I was thinking about all that, but then I think. I feel like that's low because my. My gut would tell me that they would make much more money on advertising than they typically would on a regular season because it was supposed to be like, this is unprecedented, first of all, because this is the first time they've ever pulled somebody from a random show rather than using somebody from their own, you know, a veteran of the Bachelor, Bachelorette world or one of the two.

[B]

Yeah, right.

[A]

So they bring somebody in who's already like, this would probably. I don't know what the actual numbers look like, but when I had Ben Higgins on the show, who was former Bachelor star, and you probably pull this clip from us talking, he told me that the viewership when he was on the show was like 10 to 15 million an episode or something like that, and that the most recent seasons are closer to like 3 to 5 million. So obviously Bachelorette, you know, ABC knew this, so they went outside of their world to pull somebody in who was the star of the potentially most most popular reality show at the time, which was Secret Lives.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Pulled them in here, and then they're like, okay, well, now we can, you know, expect that our viewership is going to, I would assume, double or triple from making this move because the Bachelor, Bachelor, Bachelorette's been going downhill in terms of viewership over the last decade. But so to me, it's like, that's why I'm curious what the 30 million breaks down to, because it's like, does it account for any, like, potential opportunity cost of what could have happened if they actually released this season and what they could have potentially made on it, you know? Or is this basically just 100% of the hard costs that they. That they incurred from filming that they're no longer going to be able to recoup?

[B]

Yeah, well, what's crazy is, and Ben Higgins was one of the franchise's highest rated seasons.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Good for him. Over 9 million total viewers for key episodes like the finale, and it was averaging around 2.36 million.

[A]

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[B]

and the premiere drew in about 9.9 million viewers. Yeah, I wonder what that season finale

[A]

about 10 million as well.

[B]

What did the Taylor Frankie Paul sneak peek episode bring in? I don't know if they have any.

[A]

Good for you, Ben. Second highest rated season of the Bachelor.

[B]

Doesn't say, but I have to imagine would have been huge because one of the things I was going to mention is Secret Lives of Modern Wives is one of the most popular Hulu shows ever and I knew it had some big metrics, so I just wanted to look it up. The show's first season. So this is season one before they became the juggernaut they are now. Sure. The first season premiered on September 6, 2024. It's crazy. They're already on season three. They're just cranking out these episodes. It outperformed.

[A]

That's what happens when you have a hit, right?

[B]

It outperformed other 2024 unscripted launches on Hulu, including the Kardashians.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Based on US streaming data from Hulu and Disney plus season two hit 5 million views in five days, fueling Hulu's earned media value growth via massive TikTok buzz. But yeah, it's the only things it's trailing is shows that are like scripted shows. Like Only Mirrors in the Building, which I think reality TV generally does on a lot of platforms. But like, like the Mandalorian is going to outperform certain shows on Disney. Yeah, it's pretty nuts. What's really crazy about this story. I don't know if you knew this. The Bachelorette has been struggling the last couple years. And ABC literally hired a new showrunner for 2026. So they hired Scott Teddy, who is known for reality tv. Like, he's been behind a lot of really big shows. Like, if you started looking up his IMDb, there's tons you'd recognize. This is his first run running the show. Yeah. Since he's taken over. So imagine the phone call and was

[A]

gearing up for record breaking. You know what I mean? Like, he went in.

[B]

Brilliant stuff. Like, I'm bringing in somebody from a massive show, got this huge name. We're going to absolutely crush it. And like, imagine the angry executives that are like, imagine this is the kind of thing a showrunner would lose their job over. So this is really scary for him. But let's go ahead and go through the article from the Hollywood Reporter. We can actually listen to the article. Do you want to just listen to it and pause it? Do you want to comment or do you want to just read.

[A]

No, let's just.

[B]

Let's just read the. A little bit. Okay, so let's go down. So the beginning. Just talks about the actual incident that led to it being canceled. Let's get to the money. Because that's what you like to do. That is what I like to do. Go ahead and start reading there. Is that big enough for you?

[A]

Yep. So the Bachelorette costs about $2 million per episode to produce, which, depending on its episode count, would likely put this season's budget in the 20 to 25 million dollars range, regardless of whether the season ever airs. ABC's on the Hook for a license fee to Warner Horizon, which produces the Bachelorette and other shows in the franchise. Marketing costs, which is another thing that I think people sometimes leave off the table.

[B]

And probably this was probably one of the higher marketing cost seasons for them.

[A]

Yeah. Cause it's like a big. It's like a reboot almost of like, hey, everybody, remember us? We're back and bigger than ever. You know?

[B]

And then Secret lies in Mormon and Wives. Like every other scene a character's like. And she has the Bachelorette. And I told her, I was like, I know that there's some deal where they have to say at a certain amount of times, at least they were

[A]

optimizing, like on screen time.

[B]

Like, I'm sure there was some. There was some payments made to the creative team behind Secret Lives.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

To talk about it.

[A]

Well, I'm sure they're making. I'm sure they were set to make money off of it because of the steam that she'd picked up.

[B]

Yeah, we'll talk about that too. Yeah.

[A]

So, yeah. So based on industry sources, a 30 second commercial on the Bachelorette costs about $100,000. So with a half hour of ads per two hour episode, that amounts to several million dollars in revenue per show. So that's kind of what I was looking at. So that's why they're saying it's costing them in hard costs about 30 million. Meaning, like the cost to produce, the money they already spent on pr, the money they already spent on billboards and advertising and marketing to. To get people to watch the show. $30 million is basically like this is what they've spent that they're not going to get a dime back from. But this is talking about, which is like, that's crazy. Bachelorette costs. So the. The 30 second commercial. A hundred grand for a 30 second commercial with a half hour of ads per two hour episode. Like what, what's the math on that? So that's a half hour of ads at a hundred thousand dollars per 30 seconds.

[B]

Give me the formula here. All right, so we're doing.

[A]

So a half hour of ads is a hundred grand or excuse me, a 30 second commercial. So 60 second spot would be 200 grand. That's a minute. 200 grand times 30 minutes.

[B]

Wait, times 30 minutes.

[A]

A half hour of ads is what it said, right?

[B]

30 second commercial with a half hour of ads.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Oh, I see. I see.

[A]

I'm saying like 200,000aminute times 30 minutes. You're right.

[B]

Yeah, you're the money guy.

[A]

Is $6 million per episode.

[B]

So how many episodes are there of a season of the Bachelor?

[A]

Well, it seems to vary a little

[B]

bit, but 20 episodes of the Bachelor are there. Oh, wait, the bat. I see the Bachelorette. Are there a season. While that's loading, is the Bachelor and the Bachelorette done at the same mansion? Is it a different mansion?

[A]

I think it's the same one.

[B]

Okay. Oh, 10 to 15 episodes. Let's just say 10. Let's say they didn't juice this one. Like, I know they did.

[A]

So on the low side, they lost out on a potential $60 million of ad revenue coming in, which obviously they're making. That's where they make their profit. They're going to spend 30 million, make 60. But that's just on the ads on the show. That doesn't anything else like rights to distribute or potential, you know, future streams or restreams and then this Is like again, guesstimating on the low end of how many episodes they would release. You know, you still have like the after the final rose and you have the reunion episode and you have. You know what I mean? Like, there's so many other things. Like there's so much lost revenue here from it being canceled.

[B]

That's not even counting long term brand damage as well.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Because like there's a lot of people that were already pissed that she was because it wasn't someone from that pool. Like, it's funny because the Secret lies are more and wise crew, except for me, who's been a Taylor Frankie Paul disliker from day one and a Whitney Levitt fan from day one. And now everyone's trying to be like, I actually like Whitney. Shut up. Where were you in season one and two? Where were you in season one and two? Everyone now is like, I kind of

[A]

jumping on the Whitney.

[B]

Yeah. Everyone's like, I kind of knew that. I kind of knew that Taylor was like this. No, you didn't. Yeah, everyone just drank up the Taylor Frankie Paul slop like there was no tomorrow.

[A]

You know what's wild is to see people still in the comments.

[B]

Let's not get into that. Cuz I don't want to make this episode.

[A]

You don't want to derail it.

[B]

Yeah, but I'm just saying, I was a disliker from day one, so I was like, already? I wasn't planning on watching the Bachelorette. I was like, I don't care to watch a season of Taylor Frankie. Really?

[A]

You weren't going to watch it at all?

[B]

I almost skipped Taylor Frankie Paul's scenes in the latest season of Secret because I do not care. And I literally, I'd be sitting there, my wife be like, are you even watching it with me? And I was like, I'm not. When she's on the screen. I'm going to check my email on the screen. So anyway, so all that happens, the Bachelorette people that were fans weren't excited that it wasn't a Bachelorette person on the show. The people that were Secret Lives and Mormons fans were going to be probably new viewership for the Bachelorette. Although I'm sure there's a lot of crossover between those demographics. So like they already were playing with fire.

[A]

Yeah. They were taking a massive risk.

[B]

This implodes. And then you've got hardcore Bachelorette fans who have viewing parties, all this stuff who are like going, okay, I was already upset about Chris Harrison. I was already upset about the way that, you know the new show's been handled. I was already upset about the fact that we see most of these relationships collapse, all the things you hear people talk about. And now they messed with the formula, and now we don't get a season.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So, like, the damage of that over time is a lot. It's.

[A]

It's. It's bad branding, but it's also the opportunity cost of. They could have just filmed the regular season. Right. And it would have released and it

[B]

would have done just. And it would have.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

And they could have done it a little.

[A]

Very predictable and would have been totally fine for their. Their fan base. So it's like the opportunity cost of. Of lost ad revenue. And of course, they're not going to lose all of this ad revenue because there's going to be other shows that are in those spots now, but they're not. Is that what it says next?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Well, ABC will of course still add. Still sell ads against whatever programming fills the Bachelorette spot on Sundays. For this week, it's an American Idol

[B]

rerun, which everyone's flocking to the couch

[A]

to watch, but at much lower rates. So it's like, it's obvious, like, the viewership is going to be pulled in on. An American Idol rerun is not going to be what it was going to be for the premiere of the Taylor.

[B]

Yeah. And it's not like you just. I doubt that all the companies are going like, yeah, just throw me on American Idol instead.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

They're going like, I want to not even be doing this. And then they have to go find new people, so their sales team has to go out.

[A]

And then the thing that I brought up to Jackie was like, sucks for all the dudes who's. Who literally thought their lives were about. Their lives were about to change. They didn't even think their lives were about to change. Their lives were literally about to change. Like, especially whatever top five, top 10

[B]

to be able to go start a podcast or go be an influencer now,

[A]

because they don't get, like, the regular contestants don't get paid. And it's something that we figured out talking to people like Ben Higgins and Jason Tardick on. On my show is that, like, when you're just a contestant on the show, they don't get paid. They pay for all your expenses to live there and things like that, but you don't get paid. So you have to take, you know, three months off of your job, take a leave of absence or something like that to go do this show. Take time away from your friends. And family to go film this thing. And then you're obviously hoping that it brings in enough popularity and that you can make this episode of the show is brought to you by Wayfair. It's Way Day at Wayfair. From April 25th through the 27th, you can score the best deals in home, like up to 80% off with free shipping on everything. Wayfair makes it easy to find exactly what fits your style and needs, from furniture and decor to home improvement and outdoor essentials. 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[B]

Some of them were posting clips of them watching a black screen on the TV and on. I forget who it was because I don't know who any of the guys are exactly. But no, I saw one that was going viral and it was a guy, he's just sitting on his like ottoman in his living room just staring at a black screen. I was like, that sucks. But yeah, so the. It says the network will also likely have to pay make goods to advertisers that bought time on the now scrapped season. This part of the article I thought was a little goofy. It says it's also worth noting that for ABC and its parent company, 30 million or so is relative pocket change. Disney's entertainment Division, which includes ABC, has 11.6 billion in Reven, an operating income of 1.1 billion in the final quarter of 2025. Yeah, but like, Disney's entertainment division is massive. And I have to imagine it's not pocket change for their reality TV section of this. Like, I, I don't get.

[A]

You don't just get a budget that goes to everybody equally.

[B]

Right.

[A]

You know what I mean? Like, they have news and they have scripted and they have reality and they have like.

[B]

Disney's entertainment division probably includes like the Mandalorian. And so like to sit there and be like, yeah, it's not that big of a deal. ABC's, you know, their biggest reality show is having this big of an issue. Like, I'm sure the president of Disney has called the showrunner to be like, what the hell right? Is happening?

[A]

So I mean, the crazy thing to me though is that I didn't know this because again, I'm not, I'm not, I'm not a Secret lives head like you are and like Jackie is. But she brought up to me that this happened like three years ago. This was just, this was just the footage being released. So that was like, that was to me where it was like, oh, they did take a big risk by bringing this person in because they knew that there were charges that she had been arrested or something for domestic violence. But then when the video footage came out, then they were like, well, now there's no way that we can back it.

[B]

Well, it's not just that. So that happened. So the original incident happened, which again, a different podcast can break that down. The original thing happened domestic violence. She's arrested, she's charged. It's in season one of Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, the first episode. But. But you don't see the footage that we've all seen now. You see her crying outside. And, like, my takeaway was, you know, they were yelling, or maybe they. Someone, like, punched a wall. Or, like, I was. Which, again, all not cool. But it played it in a way where it's just like, oh, she drank too much, and she starts screaming, and you're like, reality tv, you know, which says something about the nature of reality TV world. But. But I. I thought, like, okay, she's super messy. This seems super bad. They both seem super toxic. I don't like Dakota or her whatever. But the reason all this started was because there was a new domestic violence thing that happened. Like, Right. It was like a week before the Bachelor was Bachelorette was supposed to premiere, where she, like, choked him with a necklace and, like, left a scratch on his neck. And so, like, that was the thing that, like, prompted all this. And then after that, you know, some people are saying, oh, Dakota's leaking it. Whatever. Regardless, no matter what's happening or whether he's trying to sabotage, like, none of these things should have happened.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

Like when people say, oh, again, I'm getting into the weeds. On. But, like, again, when people say, like, oh, he tried to trap her or try to do that, it's like, well, the best way to avoid that is to, like, not throw a stool at

[A]

someone and not choke with your daughter standing. Right, Right.

[B]

And so that was, like, the more

[A]

egregious part to me was like, yeah, I know. I know. Relationships get heated and everything's tough, and you got to work through stuff and things happen. But around the kids, and, like, you're putting your own daughter in danger because you can't control. Well, just being your reaction.

[B]

Just being that drunk around your kids, to me, yeah. Is very weird. Irresponsible. Anyway, so all that to say, I guess, like, when you look at this. I mean, obviously this is reality tv. So, like, there is a very thin line when it comes to reality tv, where it's like, you want someone that's messy.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And morally weird because that's what people want to see. Again, that's a whole nother conversation. But, yeah, like, what's your big takeaway from this story when you go, like, ABC risks this much money? I mean, the one thing I will say is the first thing that came to mind when this happened, and then a lot of people have echoed it since, but I think I thought about it on my own first. But I think everyone is. Is like, Chris Harrison Lost his job as host.

[A]

Right.

[B]

For saying. For asking someone a clarifying question about

[A]

something they said it was honestly the most. The. The worst form of, quote, unquote, cancel culture that I've ever witnessed. It was like a wait he got. Because, again, I wasn't very much in the Bachelor world, but then when it happened, I was like, wait. So, like, what did he say, though? Yeah, and I kept looking for something. It was like, I remember when I

[B]

watched the clip, I was like, oh, that's not it.

[A]

Yeah, right. Exactly. Exactly. No, but where did he say the thing that got him canceled?

[B]

You know what I mean? So. But all that to say, like, then they took a huge gamble on someone that obviously was very.

[A]

A wild card.

[B]

So, like, I don't know, what's your takeaway? Like, what do you think? Like, if you're putting yourself in the shoes of, like, someone who tells, hey, maybe ABC can learn this from this situation, what would you say that is? Is there something applicable to us everyday Joes?

[A]

Yeah, I mean, I like the. I like the concept of taking a big risk because you know that the viewership's floundering.

[B]

Do it again.

[A]

Saying, like, like, when you're looking at the metrics where, like, from what I understand, the Bachelor used to be the height of primetime television. You know what I'm saying? Like, it was.

[B]

The graph is pretty jarring when you look at it.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. It was clearly like, go on. On, you know, heading. Yeah. The opposite of the direction that they wanted to head in.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But it's also. It's also very well branded IP that they want to continue, you know, building off of. So I like the idea of, hey, let's take a big risk here. But you'd think that their legal team would have stepped in and been. And been like, hey, with culture being the way that it is right now, there are real potential threats here in the background and history of this person that might make this not okay. And the fact that they were willing to take that risk, like, to me is like, well, you got what you asked for, essentially, like, you. You know what I mean? Like, you had a lot of the information, you know, like, because it wasn't just like, they weren't. Those executives had more information than what you saw on season one of Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, you know what I'm saying? Like, when they're making that big of a decision, they're like, okay, well, let's check this person out. Let's see what's going on.

[B]

Insiders say they skipped a Lot of their normal prop. Vetting process, really. But I also think that's pr. Cover their ass. Because there's no way a lawyer was like, no, she's so popular. Guys just do.

[A]

It has to be. Yeah, exactly, exactly. Like, there's too much public knowledge about. About her prior. You know what I mean? Like, public fan facing knowledge where people

[B]

have gone and looked up the court stuff on their own.

[A]

Right.

[B]

You know, not me. I'm never, like, digging deep.

[A]

That's the opposite of you. But, yeah, I mean, it's. I don't know. I guess. I guess the takeaway is don't try to make terrible people famous, I suppose. But, like, that's sort of what you do for reality.

[B]

It's really existential. That's something we all need to think about as well.

[A]

But it's also like the M.O. for reality television. Like you said, it's a weird balance because you want to find people who are naturally entertaining.

[B]

You want the person who will pour a drink on someone at a table.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But you also don't want a person that'll break the glass on the table and stab someone in the neck.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

And like, they went a little bit

[A]

more to the ladder on this.

[B]

Yeah. The person who. Yeah, But I do think they made the right call pulling it. I mean, it's the only option.

[A]

But you cannot, like, for all the. Again, you think of, like, all the little girls who idolize these bachelorettes and look at them as, you know, who they want to become and the role model that they are. Like, it's different than me. It's different to me than something like, even. Even, like an athlete or something. And obviously never condoning any sort of domestic violence or anything like that. What I'm saying is, like, when you're idolizing a reality star, you're idolizing every part of their life. You know what I'm saying? Like, because that's what. That's the thing that they became famous for, is just living their life and then filming it. That's what they became famous for. It's not. They became famous because they're an amazing athlete or an incredible entrepreneur or something like. Like, they became famous for the sake of being famous because they happen to film their lives and they're a dramatic person or whatever. So it makes it. It makes it even a little bit worse for that. That portion of it. It's like the only option at that point, once that video comes out is like, there's no way we can just air the episode tomorrow night.

[B]

Right.

[A]

You know, What? I mean, yeah, I can't imagine how. How difficult those executive meetings were, though, where they're probably just like, let's do a SWAT analysis here. You know, strengths, weaknesses, opportunities. I'm sure they were trying to pull every potential PR angle, everything they could possibly think of to try to make it go forward. And then at the end of the day, they were just like, it's impossible. Yeah, we can't work around this.

[B]

Yeah. And I will say this, too, not to bring the show to a bummer, but I feel it's my duty to say this too. But from a domestic violence side, which. This is like, hot take. And sadly, it is like, there's a lot of people who are not still supporting. But strangulation. I pulled up this stat to make sure I was right. I thought it was 700%. It's higher. But strangulation is. The act of non fetal strangulation increases the risk of homicide that the victim faces by 750%. A victim is nearly six times more likely to. Or, sorry.

[A]

Eight times.

[B]

Eight times. A victim is eight times more likely to end up dead at the hand of their abuser after strangulation occurs, which is a stat I've heard a lot, obviously, given the nature of stuff I cover on my own show. But it is something I think people should take seriously, especially with all of this, all the memes or jokes or people that go like, you know, oh, it's what he deserved. Like, the. The toxic cocktail has obviously been brewing. And I think it's like, that's why I say it's the right call. Like, pulling. Pulling something off that could in any way endorse that behavior, I think is a big misstep on ABC's part. And I hope to God that they aren't going to release it in like, three months to build controversy and get it out, but I don't think they're going to do that.

[A]

So, yeah, like I said, I think their hands are tied on that. Although her PR team went to work immediately.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And she has polished up a statement. I was. It was a wild spin. I was like, oh, my gosh.

[B]

Polishing the turd anyway.

[A]

Polishing it.

[B]

Well, go ahead and close us out here and. Yeah, let's. What are we gonna do? I mean, we. We have to cancel our Bachelorette viewing parties.

[A]

Damn it.

[B]

I guess we'll have to watch American Idol season.

[A]

Put the chardonnay away.

[B]

What season of American Idol are we on? American Idol season.

[A]

It was a rerun, bro.

[B]

Oh.

[A]

Oh, it was a rerun it wasn't

[B]

even a new oh, but they still have a show. Oh, season 24. I felt like there was more than that. That's not that bad.

[A]

That honestly blows my mind that American Idol is even still a thing.

[B]

I I, I even now's their chance.

[A]

I we I remember watching it as a family growing up with like the first couple of seasons.

[B]

There's something wrong with I know Idols,

[A]

but that still blows my mind. That's even still a thing. And then the fact that they're going to just like, well, I guess we'll go into a rerun but like, I mean, what else are you going to do? So yeah, I don't even know. I guess ABC make better decisions in the future and hopefully this is a big obviously lesson for anybody that's that's trying to prioritize the attention and money machine over the right thing to do. It's usually doesn't end up working out. Imagine that. So that's it for this episode of the show. Thanks for tuning in. Remember, money only solves your money problems, but it's easier to solve the rest of your problems. Money in the bank. So let's solve that one first here on the Travis Makes Money podcast. Guest catch next time. Peace. Liberty Mutual customizes your car and home insurance. And now we're customizing this rush hour ad to keep you calm, which could help your driving.

[B]

And science says therapy is great for a healthy mindset. So enjoy this 14 second session on us. I think you've done everything right and absolutely nothing wrong. In fact, anything that hasn't gone your way could probably be blamed on your father not being emotionally available because his father wasn't emotionally available and so on. And now that you're calm and healing,

[A]

you're probably driving better, too.

[B]

Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty.