Eric (1:42)

Now I'm gonna, I'm gonna. You know, I love when I make you guess things. You, early on, when you started your podcast had a wallpaper on your phone with a quote from. From Gary Vee. What was that quote? If you get the answer correct, Gary Vee is going to pop out of that closet and give you a million dollars.

Travis (2:01)

Wow. How did you pull. One is greater than zero. It's not really a quote. It was More like an image. It was just a one greater than sign and a zero.

Eric (2:10)

Gary's not here. I didn't know if you'd be able to guess it, but I over committed on the promise. Gary, if you're listening, you owe us. Okay, so here's a clip from Mr. V, also known as Gary, first name Gary, last name B. And I think this is an important lesson for all content creators to hear. I like to give like long intros to clips. I like to go, this is a really good clip. It comes from Gary Vee. You're going to enjoy it. It's, it's really.

Travis (2:37)

He says this, this, this and this.

Eric (2:40)

You'll never guess what this clip's about. He says all these things in it.

Gary Vee (clip) (2:44)

One person follows you and gives a about what you say you should be.

Eric (2:49)

Why did Gary Vee. This is on his channel. Why did Gary Vee censor the word crap? That seems so off brand.

Travis (2:54)

That does seem off brand. Although I think he has a non cursing channel.

Eric (2:58)

But this is his main Gary Vee channel.

Travis (3:00)

That is funny.

Eric (3:01)

This is very weird.

Gary Vee (clip) (3:02)

If one person follows you and gives a about what you say, you should be ridiculously thankful. I'm serious. I mean that is right. I mean that's incredible. I'm blown away that 850,000 people follow me on Twitter and give a. That freaks with my brain on such a level.

Eric (3:20)

You.

Gary Vee (clip) (3:21)

I'm so grateful. So grateful. And companies and people need to start getting grateful, not chasing numbers.

Eric (3:28)

So that's if one, that's Gary Vee in 2010. Just for context, I should make that clear, that his Twitter has way more followers than he just said.

Travis (3:36)

Now what year did you say that was?

Eric (3:39)

2010. Yeah.

Travis (3:40)

That's crazy.

Eric (3:41)

Now he's got 3 million followers. But probably in no small part due to the fact that he takes it seriously that anybody was listening in the beginning. Right.

Travis (3:50)

That was a one.

Eric (3:51)

That's a good takeaway.

Travis (3:52)

The one is greater than zero thing was the thing that I tried to internalize as much as I could, which is basically that principle of saying that like if one person's willing to give you the time of day, count it like, like the only way to get to a massive audience is to treat the teeny tiny audience that you currently have as though it is a massive audience.

Eric (4:12)

Yeah.

Travis (4:12)

So you can't, you know, you can't phone it in until you get to the number, the magic number that you think is going to change your life. It's like, well, what's, you know, it doesn't make sense for me to be spending all my time doing this and outlining these shows and creating content and posting this on this channel. This just doesn't make sense for me to spend all my time doing there because nobody really pays attention to it right now. But once I have like a half million followers or a million followers or a hundred thousand followers or 50,000, whatever the number is, then it's like, then I'll take it more seriously. You know, it's like, well, let me just save you the time. You're probably not going to get there because the only way to get there is to treat the audience of one like it's an audience of 100,000 and, and treat it with the same level of precaution, the same level of care, the same level of quality that you would if you had a massive audience like that.

Eric (4:58)

Could you imagine doing that in any other field where it's like, I'm going to start really training once I make it to the Super Bowl. Yeah, I'm going to get really good at cooking. Once I get a job as a chef. I'm going to. Oh, I'm going to learn how to paint once I get a spot in an art gallery. Right. That would be a bad idea.

Travis (5:17)

Makes no sense.

Eric (5:18)

So don't do that. Is a good first point.

Travis (5:21)

And again, like, he's saying, like, we're downplaying the volume of people just because you. We've almost become numb to the idea of going viral because it happens so often now. Like, like, remember video on the Internet? When it first started, it was like a video went viral. It was on the news that night. You know what I mean? Like, literally something big is tuned into the 7 o' clock news. They're like, they're like, oh, and this viral video of Charlie bit my finger. Just went, you know, and they play the video and then all the people who didn't know YouTube was a thing are watching that video on the evening news. And it's like, we going viral is so ubiquitous now. It happens to, like, so many people all the time. That people who do not ever go viral get the sense that nobody cares about any of the stuff that they're putting out. When in reality it's like, look, you still had 750 views on this thing. And, you know, 10% of the viewers watched through the whole video. That means 70 people listened to you talk for 60 seconds. That's still a lot of people, you know that. That's still. And, and by the way, it, it is not representative of the, the total volume of people who actually saw the clip or the, the total number of likes that you got isn't representative of the total number of people who viewed the video or the total number of comments that you get don't necessarily mean, you know what I'm saying? Like, we, we, we take all these metrics and, and view them as the, as the only, as the only positive feedback that you're on to something or that you're saying something correct or doing something the right way. And in reality, it's like, how many videos do you scroll by on a daily basis from people who, like, you don't really follow their stuff, but you've seen them a couple times and you've never liked a single video, you know, like, ask yourself that question and then see, you know. Well, then that probably stands to reason that there's a bunch of people who are scrolling by your video, watched 15, 20 seconds of it, didn't like it, but kept scrolling even though they actually, in their mind they liked it, but they didn't actually just. They didn't take the time to physically hit the like button for whatever reason. Yeah, but you're allowing that pass to make you feel like this is a waste of time and nobody cares and why am I doing this? Well, it's, it's, it's just a, it's a misunderstanding of how, like the awesome part about social, which is that you can create something and put it out there and 700 people can see it. Yeah, like that's, that is impossible to have happened.

Eric (7:49)

Well, it's that corny two decades ago, it's that corny graphic on LinkedIn. That's true, but it's. I hate LinkedIn because something will be true and it's so powerful the first time you hear it. And then everyone makes their version of it and you're like, oh, it's like the guy with the pickaxe and there's diamonds right behind here. Like, now, when I said image, I want to just throw my computer out the window and just smash it on the pavement and then scream out into the. You know. You know, you feel like that sometimes. But there's the graphic where people say, my video only got 100 views and they post a picture of 100 people and then. Or a thousand views and they show an auditorium or a hundred thousand views and it's like a stadium. And it's like, it really is when you think about that. Like the idea that we've had some videos recently that like, get a million views right? Like when you comprehend how many people saw your face as they were swiping, like, that's, that's crazy.

Travis (8:37)

It's. It's literally impossible to comprehend. Like, we can't, in our minds, we can't picture.

Eric (8:43)

You can't even volume.

Travis (8:45)

You know what I'm saying? Like, when you see like, oh, 5.2 million.

Shopify Announcer (8:49)

This episode of the show is brought to you by Shopify. Starting something new isn't just hard, it's terrifying. So much work goes into this thing.

Travis (8:56)

That you're not entirely sure it'll work out.

Shopify Announcer (8:58)

And it can be hard to make.

Travis (9:00)

That leap of faith.

Shopify Announcer (9:00)

Trust me, I know this. When I started my podcast, I wasn't even sure what I was doing, to be honest with you. What if nobody listens? What if I make a fool of myself? What if I'm embarrassed? You know, what if nobody buys stuff that I put out there? Now I know that I was right in believing myself in launching this podcast and subsequent businesses that come along with it, despite all the fears and hesitations. It also helps when you have a partner like Shopify on your side to help. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world and 10% of all e commerce in the US from household names like Magic Spoon to brands just getting started. You can get started with your own design studio. With hundreds of ready to use templates, Shopify helps you build a beautiful online store that matches your brand's style, accelerate your efficiency. Whether you're uploading new products or trying to improve existing products, Shopify is packed with helpful AI tools that write product descriptions, page headlines, and even enhance your product photography. There's really no excuses anymore, people. Cuz Shopify literally does all of this stuff for you. And did I mention that the iconic purple shop pay button that's used by millions of businesses around the world is from Shopify? It's why Shopify has the best converting checkout on the planet. It also helps boost conversions, meaning less, less carts going abandoned and more sales for you. It's time to turn those what ifs into with Shopify today. Sign up for your $1 per month trial today at shopify.com go to shopify.com TMM that's shopify.com TMM.

Travis (10:32)

Billion views or like 79, 000 shares or something like that. It's like I. You can't. There's no way for your brain to process right what that truly means, except for to sit there and go, wow, that's cool, right? Like, that's the only the only reaction that you can have to something like that.

Eric (10:51)

Yeah.

Travis (10:52)

And the fact that that's free.

Eric (10:53)

Yeah.

Travis (10:54)

You know that you can just throw that out there and that could happen to you at any point. That's why I love the analogy of like every post is a lottery ticket. Because it only takes one or two posts to completely change, you know, your, the, the course of your business or you know, the, the, the people that get in contact with you because they saw this one thing. Or the fact that you can set up a retargeting campaign to target the people who viewed these last three videos to this percentage and you can put that message directly in front of like the, the, the scalability of the one to one connection is pretty wild when you start really thinking about it. Which is why it like just does not make any sense to me. To post 0 times a blows my mind.

Eric (11:37)

Well, literally before you and I met this morning, I posted a. I literally was just smoking a cigar. I had a little thought, I took like 10 seconds to say it. And like that's got like 6,000 views in the last like hour and a half or two hours and like, you know, 240 likes, which is again, that's not a banger viral post. But it's also like I was sitting by myself smoking a cigar. I thought this is an interesting thought. Yeah, put it out. And there's people that are going like wow, this, you know, and it's like that's engaging with somebody in a way that like. And it's, it's always funny to me because it's like, it's, it's like the excitement people would have if you said, hey, I'm going to get you on the news tonight. People be like, oh my God. And they would be like, they wouldn't be able to eat lunch. They'd be getting out like what outfit should I wear? What should I do?

Travis (12:31)

And it's like physically drive to this.

Eric (12:34)

To the station, you know, wait through the commercial break, get a four minute sound bite that's going to be seen by a couple thousand people who are.

Travis (12:41)

All your grandparents age right in our.

Eric (12:44)

Sleep or me waiting for Wheel of Fortune. It's like, come on, get to the segment. But it's like they're way more excited about that than like going on social and getting seen by like three times that amount of people who actually will remember this, share it to their page, be seen by more people. Right. Or, or would be excited about a billboard on the side of the road. Like the, the, the way that it's undervalued still. Even I think Gary Vee speaks to this.

Travis (13:07)

Yeah.

Eric (13:08)

Like, he's been talking about how valuable social media is since like for 20 started. And there's still people that go like, yeah, I'll do that sometime.

Travis (13:15)

Maybe not for me though. Like, I don't know if it's going to work for my business.

Eric (13:17)

Yeah, we're all, we're all value those people that are watching at some point, once I'm big enough.

Travis (13:22)

Right.

Eric (13:23)

And it's like, dude, if you have a thousand subscribers, the, the, like the.

Travis (13:27)

Crazy thing is that it keeps people from posting.

Eric (13:29)

Yeah.

Travis (13:29)

Because they think it looks bad. Yeah. You know what I mean? This is very true, especially of what I've found, like high performer entrepreneurs where they, they, they're used to coming from a world where everything is within their control. At least to a certain degree. It's within their control. Right. Like their, their leads, volume of leads or their number of sales or their operations, their systems. Everything's so dialed in and it's like they'll just follow this blueprint. We can build this company to this mount and we can so used to that idea that when they jump over to social, they've built so much credibility in this space because they built a $30 million business or $100 million business or fill in the dollar amount that's impressive to you. So they come over to the social media space and then they start putting out content and then it doesn't immediately go viral. So one of two things happens. Either one, they give up and they just go, oh, this isn't worth it because there's no way for them to impact the volume of people who share their content. Or second thing is they buy a bunch of fake followers and fake likes don't do that. Comments and fake shares and fake everything else just to keep up the perception that their stuff is actually good quality. And it's like the people who see the best results are the people who just are willing to have the 500 view videos for a year and a half until one of those videos pops off to a million. And then all of a sudden it's not 500 views a video anymore, it's 1500 views a video. And then your viral video isn't 20,000 views, it's 100,000 views. And then your baseline goes up to 2000 views a video. You know, I'm saying like, it's just going to take time, but it's 100% free, so just do it. Just throw, throw it out there. You know, and that's why I love creators. Like. Like our friend Michael Smoke. He's your friend?

Eric (15:18)

I don't. I've never met him.

Travis (15:19)

Oh, yes, that's true. I had him on.

Eric (15:21)

I mean, I have no issues with the guy.

Travis (15:22)

Yeah, I had him on Austin. I forgot about that. He wasn't here in Vegas. But he is an exaggerated example of this because there's no production quality in his videos. He's not in studio. He's not renting crazy equipment. He's not putting together, you know, super cinematic edits. And worried about this hook and this thing over here. Like, he literally just pops up the camera, talks directly to it for a minute and posts it. That's it.

Eric (15:51)

Yeah.

Travis (15:51)

And it's, you know, blown him up into the stratosphere from an influencer perspective.

Eric (15:56)

Yeah.

Travis (15:57)

Just from doing that one thing. Because it's just. It's just a matter of being willing to put yourself out there, your own ideas, your own thoughts, and see what happens.

Eric (16:06)

Well, that's the reality. If you want to succeed, do it.

Gary Vee (clip) (16:12)

Just do it. Don't let your dreams be dreams. Yesterday you said tomorrow, so just do it.

Eric (16:21)

That's what you should do.

Travis (16:22)

Yeah.

Eric (16:23)

Right.

Travis (16:23)

I agree. Thank you, Shia.

Eric (16:25)

Well, you were just saying a second ago that it's impossible to even comprehend a million views. Yeah, it would be even harder to comprehend 23.19 billion views, which is how many views Markiplier has on his YouTube channel.

Travis (16:40)

No, but really?

Eric (16:41)

Yeah.

Travis (16:42)

23 billion views.

Eric (16:43)

Yeah. Which makes his box office success seem pretty meager because with all those views, man, I mean, I'm just kidding, but I know we just talked about him. I'm not going to rehash all of this, but putting out a movie, $3 million budget, making $20 million in your first opening weekend. But he said a quote, and this is the only reason I'm mentioning it, because it ties into this, but there was an article written by the Ankler, which I've never heard of until reading this article, but it was talking about how there's been several theatrical outings from creators that have bombed or not done incredibly well. So, like, Ryan's world, the Movie, $624,000. Sam and Colby, the Legends of the Paranormal, 1.76 million. Dude Perfect had a movie. I didn't even know that. Did you know that? Wow.

Travis (17:31)

Was it a movie about Dude Perfect, or was it like a.

Eric (17:33)

It was called Film. It was Dude Perfect, the Hero Tour. Assuming it was like a documentary type thing, maybe, but they opened in 1060 screens. It was a massive release, $450,000. Wow. But then it obviously talks about the difference in this one, how it performed, but it says it turns out Fishbach, which is his real last name, it's not his Markiplier is not his real name. Just so you know, he's been steadily building this moment, growing his audience of engaged fans to more than 38 million subscribers on YouTube and bringing them along on the journey of making this film. And he said, this thing, this is good. Think about this in comparison to the Gary Vee quote, behind every subscriber is a person living their life and willing to give me their time in exchange for entertainment. I have to remember that. That's the deal.

Shopify Announcer (18:21)

Yeah.

Travis (18:23)

Jordan Harbinger told me when I first got started in podcasting, he said, every minute of the listener's time is earned. So treat it like that, you know, like instead of just putting out slop for the sake of putting out content.

Eric (18:37)

Yeah.

Travis (18:38)

Actually think about what you're doing. Treat the audience like it's an audience of a million and maybe one day you'll actually get to that point. Yeah, but I can guarantee you're not going to get to that point if you don't treat it that way. No, you have to take it seriously from the beginning.

Eric (18:51)

Dude, that was a big wake up call for me was. And it freaked. It freaked my wife out a lot. But I was looking my analytics because someone sent me a picture of them watching the show on their tv and I was like, that's weird. And then, and then I looked at my analytics and like 22 or 25% of my audience for my podcast watches on their TV.

Travis (19:14)

Wow.

Eric (19:14)

And I was like, that feels like it's one thing to be like, oh, they put me on their phone and they're half paying attention. But like, the idea that, like, they're sitting, which I'm still trying to figure out what that looks like because that's not going to ever be me. But like, sitting on the couch, do you crack a soda? And you just sit there and watch the show. But it was a wake up call where I was like, there's people that take this seriously, so I should probably take it seriously. That Jordan Harbinger thing is true. It's like they're taking an hour and 20 minutes sitting down and watching my big old fat head on their tv. Which I did. Joke. I responded and said, hey, my head's actual size when it's on your 55 inch flat screen. But they're taking the time to Commit to it. And then when you're sitting there going like, I don't need a script, I'll just wing this episode.

Travis (20:01)

It's like, well, because you make the mistake of thinking that your competitors are the people who are creating similar content to what you're creating. And that's not the, the truth.

Eric (20:11)

Your competitor is literally Beast Games.

Travis (20:13)

Right. Like it's really, it's, it's all of Tick Tock, all of Instagram, all of YouTube, all of Netflix, Amazon Prime.

Eric (20:22)

You're live.

Travis (20:23)

You're vying for attention.

Eric (20:24)

Yeah.

Travis (20:25)

You know, like literally anything else that person could be watching and they're choosing to watch something that you put out into the world. Like that's just cool.

Eric (20:33)

And also those people are absolute fools. Think of all the things they could be doing with their time.

Travis (20:40)

Start saying that in the intro of your. There are books before you watch this.

Eric (20:43)

There are timeless books.

Travis (20:46)

Think about all the other things you could be doing with your time right now.

Eric (20:48)

You could watch Lord of the Rings, the extended cut on HBO Max right now.

Travis (20:52)

You could.

Eric (20:53)

Why are you listening to this? If you're listening this podcast right now, Delete the podcast app on your phone. Never listen to this show again. It is a waste of your time.

Travis (21:02)

When was the last time you watched the Lord of the Rings?

Eric (21:04)

I watched Fellowship of the Ring and Half of Two Towers a few months ago.

Travis (21:09)

Yeah, you got to do it at least annually.

Eric (21:11)

They just re released them in theaters and I literally saw it after like I, I opened my phone and it was like halfway through. It was that 20 year anniversary or something like that. Dude, it was horrible.

Travis (21:25)

I was pretty upset about that as well.

Eric (21:26)

I'm sure they'll re release with this new one coming out. I'm sure they'll do some kind of weird.

Travis (21:30)

I'm so excited for that. The Andy Serkis one.

Eric (21:32)

It's a date. We're going.

Travis (21:34)

I'm down. Andy Circus. Andy Circus is so good. I just know they're wildly underrated.

Eric (21:38)

They're going to do something monstrous though. And they're going to go, we're rereleasing them and it's a marathon. You have to watch all of them in a row. I'll be there.

Travis (21:46)

But you're not describing a nightmare to me. Describing a dream.

Eric (21:49)

I'm talking like someone that didn't drive to Los Angeles to watch a Texas Chainsaw Massacre triple feature that started at like midnight. Can I tell a fun story about that?

Travis (21:59)

Yeah.

Eric (22:00)

About. This is a. This is actually ties into what we're talking about. Too. So I went to LA to go watch a triple feature of Texas Chainsaw Massacre, which I highly recommend doing at least once in your life. And I went to go because they had a barbecue truck, like, outside the Egyptian Theater, like, that was kind of catering it a little bit. And I'm sitting there and I'm chatting with this dude. He's like. And he was the guy that was putting on the event, and I forget what they called him. Like, but anyway, every. Every week, they were programming these movies, and they'd go to the Grumman Theater or the Egyptian Theater and put on a movie. And they had built a really cool, like, film community in la. And he's like, hey, man, are you enjoying everything? Like, is this cool? Like, where'd you come in from? And we're talking, like, literally. I think it was, like, three months later, I saw that they announced the Sonic movie, and it was written by Josh Miller, who was the guy that I was talking to, really. And so, like, he's a hardcore, like, film buff. Like, he would, like, borrow the film prints and project these movies and all this stuff. But it's a perfect example of, like, a dude that, like, actually loves it is curating these really cool events that are super niche and then getting the reins to something that is, like, big IP and pouring a ton. I don't know if you've watched the Sonic movies.

Travis (23:19)

Oh, they're.

Eric (23:19)

Those movies, rip.

Travis (23:20)

They're good.

Eric (23:21)

Like, but. But, like, that's the kind of stuff that's, like, super cool. But I had to share that story because it, like, I always. I always think about it whenever we watch Sonic. I'm like, I met that dude and he was programming a Texas Chainsaw Massacre triple feature. But. But just.

Travis (23:36)

Did you watch Knuckles?

Eric (23:37)

I did. I like Knuckles, but I. For me, Sonic 3 was, like, peak.

Travis (23:42)

Oh, dude. Even cast.

Eric (23:45)

I was like, this is. This is good again. It was one of those. I was like, this is good as a movie.

Travis (23:49)

Right?

Eric (23:50)

Like that. Now we're sidetracking this. The scenes. So I went. I took my daughter to the theater to watch it.

Shopify Announcer (23:56)

Yep.

Eric (23:57)

Because I wanted to see it. And. But the scene where he. He turns into, like, the yellow flamey Sonic, and they're fighting and they go to, like, the Parthenon. It's like sunset. And I was like, this is like a Zack Snyder. Like, what is this?

Travis (24:11)

Right?

Eric (24:11)

And then it cuts to, like, Jim Carrey being Jim Carrey doing fart jokes. Like, this is the best movie as.

Travis (24:17)

Both the grandpa and.

Eric (24:19)

Oh, that dance scene. And the thing that's such a great movie. But all that to say, like, the. The people that are valuing these small audiences, like, are there people who get the privilege of the big audience and they understand, like, Sonic. Like, Sonic's a great example. This is like, we put out a trailer and there's tons of anger and vitriol toward how this looks.

Travis (24:42)

And they went literally.

Eric (24:43)

Then they go, well, we care about the audience experience. Like, and now it's one of the biggest. Like, that's. I don't know how much those movies are made, but, like, I know it's. It's a monster franchise now.

Travis (24:53)

Oh, yeah.

Eric (24:53)

And it could have easily bombed if they just be like, nah, we know what people want. You know, we're just going to keep moving forward. Like, anyway, I. All that to say you're building the.

Travis (25:04)

Content for an audience. Yeah. So may as well listen to what. What that audience wants. They'll tell you it's a good idea. You know what I mean?

Eric (25:14)

Good idea. Well, anyway, I think the big takeaway is value your audience at any size. And maybe you too, if you meet me and feel inspired by my presence, you might write a really good Sonic movie.

Travis (25:27)

That would be a. That would be awesome.

Eric (25:28)

I think it was my responsibility that it happened, actually. Well, I actually gave him the idea for Sonic. Actually. My lawyers are reaching out.

Travis (25:35)

Yes.

Eric (25:35)

He stole the whole movie from me.

Travis (25:36)

Use shot on the script that you were working on.

Eric (25:39)

But yeah, that was me. It was all me.

Travis (25:41)

Well, that's it for today's episode. Today's co host. I keep saying today's. There's two other episodes.

Eric (25:46)

It's one of three episodes. Because we care about you, the audience.

Travis (25:49)

Yes. And we're putting our heart and soul into providing the best quality and sometimes our minds making money every once in a while. But that's it for this episode. Remember, money only solves your money problems, but it's easier to solve the rest of problems of money in the bank. So let's start there here on the Travis Makes Money podcast. Thanks for tuning in. Catch you next time. Peace.