CO-HOST | Make Money Without Falling for Faith-Based Financial Guilt

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Travis Makes Money

Episode: CO-HOST | Make Money Without Falling for Faith-Based Financial Guilt

Host: Travis Chappell
Guest/Co-Host: Eric (Producer)
Date: March 20, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Travis Chappell and his producer Eric dive into the intersection of faith and finance—specifically, how many in religious communities experience pressure, guilt, or even manipulation around giving money to churches. They examine stories of extreme sacrificial giving, critique the models that perpetuate it, and advocate for a more balanced, thoughtful approach to personal finances that honors both generosity and personal/familial responsibility.

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Main Discussion Points & Insights

1. Viral Story of “Tent Living” for Jesus

• (03:01–05:55) Eric brings up a viral Instagram post from Jess Blair Manuel, spotlighting her family’s pledge to live in a tent all summer so they could rent out their home and give the proceeds to their church, citing a divine command.
  • Travis and Eric probe the motives and real-world consequences of such “obedience.”
  • Eric expresses skepticism about the literal nature of the story and questions its context (“Did you actually move into the tent? Did you have access to a house? Did you have the shower available?” — Eric, 11:08).
  • They dig in: Is this truly sacrificial giving, or is there more going on beneath the surface?

2. The Church Giving Model: Faith or Manipulation?

• (10:02–14:43)
  • Travis and Eric discuss the regular occurrence of “sacrificial giving” in churches, where congregants are urged to give until it hurts, sometimes at the expense of their families’ wellbeing.
  • Eric questions the exclusivity of church-based charity:
    • “You can be charitable without giving to a 501(c)(3). ... There was never leeway, like, to move horizontally in those directions. It was always like, God's going to lay on your heart to get a second mortgage to give us money.” (13:23)
  • Travis breaks down how some leaders position sacrificial giving as the only path to a close relationship with God:
    • “You’re convincing the audience of one core primary thing, which is that sacrificial giving is the key to having a close relationship with God. And that the only way to feel that closeness … is to give us your money because we're going to steward it the best.” (14:16)

3. The Social Dynamics of Giving Big at Church

• (14:04–16:43)
  • They reveal the practical, sometimes transactional benefits for big givers within church communities, especially entrepreneurs and business owners.
  • “If you want to get tapped into the network of the church, then you need to be one of the people who's giving a percentage of your income to the church. ... It's a farm of hot prospects for local business owners.” (15:28)
  • The idea: Is church giving about faith, social status, or business networking?

4. Cynicism, Satire, and Self-Reflection

• Throughout
  • Travis and Eric poke fun at themselves, riffing on what kind of churches they’d run if they started their own, highlighting the marketing and sales logic often behind church operations.
  • Memorable, tongue-in-cheek lines:
    • “A church for those who don’t like church.” (20:41, Travis)
    • “Let’s just start our own together.” (20:33, Eric)
  • They admit the temptation and ease with which churches can become transactional, using emotionalism and manipulation for financial gain.

5. Healthy Boundaries for Charitable Giving

• (21:12–22:49)
  • A clear argument for balancing generosity and personal responsibility:
    • “I believe even within the context of Christianity, that God would call you as a parent to provide for your family, first of all, before you’re providing for the church to keep its doors open.” (22:13, Travis)
  • Be wary of making decisions in emotional moments:
    • “Don’t make decisions with emotion that you later justify with logic. So don’t be making commitments in the height of an emotional flow.” (22:26, Eric)
    • “Maybe write your commitment card after you have 48 hours to cool down.” (22:35, Travis)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Eric, on the “Tent for the Summer” story:

  “I think that’s a grift and a half.” (06:21)

• Travis, on giving priorities:

  “I think I would rather give my kids the priority over anything else.” (10:57)

• Eric, on ‘Give It All Sundays’:

  “They put their wedding band in, they had nothing else to give and they put their wedding. I wanna know which deacon takes it to go get, like smolted.” (11:43)

• Travis, on “sacrificial” models:

  “It's easy to call that feeling the spirit because you just heard a sermon about how it's not giving unless you feel sacrificial or it's not giving unless it hurts, you know?” (12:21)

• Travis, on leadership motives:

  “People are not doing this just for the goal of serving the Lord. There's also ulterior motives. ... When you've convinced yourself that you have the ultimate mission in life, then you also can delude yourself into believing that it’s okay to ... manipulate people.” (21:14)

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Key Takeaways

• Don’t Sacrifice Your Family for “godly” Financial Pressure:
  Prioritizing your family’s basic needs comes before extreme (and often publicized) giving challenges.
• Critical Thinking Over Emotional Giving:
  Take time to cool off before making large charitable commitments, especially in emotionally-charged church environments.
• Charitable Giving is Broad:
  Support others where you feel genuinely called—charity can be church-based or community-oriented, not just funneled through a single religious institution.
• Awareness of Manipulation:
  Not all fundraising appeals are purely spiritual—sometimes they serve social, financial, or personal agendas.

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Important Timestamps

• 03:01 – Introduction of the tent-living story
• 06:21 – Realization that the viral story is from a pastor’s family
• 10:02 – Discussion on sacrificial giving and family priorities
• 13:23 – Eric: Charity isn’t limited to church giving
• 14:16 – Travis breaks down “sacrificial giving” as marketing
• 15:28 – The social/business dynamics of church giving
• 21:12 – Advice on boundaries and emotional giving
• 22:26 – “Don’t make decisions with emotion that you later justify with logic.”
• 22:49 – Closing thoughts on balance and personal responsibility

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Episode Tone

Frank, satirical, and conversational, with a critical eye toward manipulative financial tactics in faith communities. The hosts blend humor, lived experience, and skepticism to challenge listeners to take control of their own financial destinies without succumbing to faith-based guilt.

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Transcript

[A]

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[B]

You're listening to the Travis Makes Money podcast presented by GoHighLevel.com for a free 30 day trial of the best all in one digital marketing software tool on the planet, just go to gohighlevel.com travis.

[C]

What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to the Travis Makes Money podcast, where it's a mission to help you make more money. You'll have to forgive my voice. I am at the end of being sick. I mean, I hope it's the end of it. And I have recorded, like, 27 podcast episodes this week, so my voice is on the fritz, as it were. But my producer, Eric is in studio to compliment my voice, so.

[D]

Well, you know what they say, Travis.

[C]

No, I don't.

[D]

When. If your friend comes over and you're at the end of being sick, that means they're at the beginning of being sick. So. Thank you for having me.

[C]

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[D]

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[C]

What?

[D]

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[C]

Dude, Sounds like a tea. An herbal tea.

[D]

Every. Every time I felt like I'm getting sick, I take cold calm. It's like these little tablets. You put them under your tongue and they melt and you take one every 15 minutes for like an hour. And. And literally this last time that I got sick, I bought a different thing instead of cold calm, and I got sick. So shout out cold. Call me.

[C]

Okay.

[D]

All right. Well, I wanted to get your reaction to this. I know the other day we were talking about, you know, interesting things pastors have said about money. And I know you have some, you know, you have some context for weird financial advice from pastors, but I came across this post on Social Today, actually yesterday, and I was, like, stunned by it.

[C]

Flabbergasted.

[D]

Yeah. So this is from Taken Aback Jess Blair Or Jess, Blair, Manuel, Manuel. Just Manuel on Instagram. Just Blair, Manuel. And she posted this thing and. Well, let me. Let me start with this. Don't look at it. She says, you'll never believe what happened. God asked our family of 10 to. What do you think God asked their

[C]

family of 10 to do something about money?

[D]

Yeah. What do you think it was to.

[C]

To sell all that they had and give to the poor.

[D]

Oh, okay. We're pretty close. All right, here it is. You'll never. Oh, you go ahead and read it.

[C]

Okay. You'll never believe what happened. God asked our family of eight.

[D]

Oh, sorry.

[C]

Yeah. Okay. Of eight, Mr. Exaggerator over here to live in a tent the entire summer of 2025. I did not want to. Okay, every parent needs to hear this. Especially in a time of war. The truth no one talks about. Your child doesn't want rules.

[D]

Oh, wait, this is the wrong. Hold on. Okay, hold on. All right, start over.

[C]

Okay. God has a family of eight, live in a tent. Sorry. Entire summer of 2025. I did not want to. As a Christian mama, I did not want to obey what God was asking us to do. Hang with me. We're talking about our kids and obedience. Have you ever heard from God, sensing your spirit? Got a word from the word Good one. That you were supposed to do something and you just didn't want to do it. Just last year, our family was challenged to financially give beyond what was possible for us. We told God we would do whatever he asked of us, no matter the cost. Insert famous Christian line, be careful what you pray for. An opportunity opened up for us to rent our home for the entire summer and make enough money to follow through with our giving commitment. I may have kicked and screamed my way through the summer. There's a lesson in here, too. But we did it. Parents, don't expect your kids to live obedient if you're not willing to live obedient. Many of us want to teach and command obedience, but aren't willing to obey ourselves. My tendency is to obey when it feels comfortable, when it's convenient, when it's not going to interrupt my everyday patterns of life. I want to obey on my terms, my feelings, and my way. The patterns that shape our obedience to God are the same patterns shaping our homes. Take a moment to evaluate yourself. Are you expecting from your kids where you are not willing to go yourself? This is hitting me all over again today. Follow along as we're entering a new convo about raising kids God's way. Obedience series. That is wild so what do you think about that? I just want to know, like, how they knew that this was a specific. Like, how they knew this specific time frame was the time that they needed to be doing this for, like.

[D]

Well, they. They probably had, like, whatever their set amount was, like six or seven grand or something they had to give.

[C]

So. So however many months. However many needed to sleep in a tent and. Yeah.

[D]

With eight kids that I need to see this tent. I was like, can you zoom out?

[C]

Yeah. So kicking and screaming. So meaning, like, you had a terrible summer and hated it, but God asked us to do it, so we're gonna figure out a way to do it. The, you know, the bummer part is if you go to their chur is like, p. L. And you see what they're spending their money on. Like, wait a second. Did I just give $7,000 to fully fund the new speaker system in the baptistry?

[D]

Yeah, I was. I'm kind of curious what their church looks like.

[C]

Are they a pastor? Pastor's wife. Oh, is she the pastor? Is that her?

[D]

Oh, there's levels to. Let me see. I don't know if she. Oh, no, we're getting too deep into who this. Oh, Pinewood church is. This is it.

[C]

Oh, is that her husband, the pastor?

[D]

Wait a minute.

[C]

In that case, I think. I think that's a grift and a half.

[D]

I think I know what's happening here. I think we just got to the bottom of this. About us, our team, we need to show how sacrificially. How sacrificially we give pastors Parker and Jessica. She's. She's.

[C]

I mean, honestly, I know it's a smart move.

[D]

I know what's happening.

[C]

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[C]

Oh, this is setting the example for what sacrificial giving looks like.

[D]

I can't believe that I didn't think to look, but that it all came together just now. That is so funny.

[C]

Makes a lot more sense. Oh my God, she's like up and speaking and stuff too. Which bad that's not okay.

[D]

No, that is okay. But this. Other things of this are not okay.

[C]

My Bible says women need to be quiet in the church. I don't know about yours, Eric.

[D]

Wow. Wow. God's love for you this big. No, Cap. Okay, we gotta get out of here.

[C]

But anyway, this rabbit hole is going too far.

[D]

So in terms of giving. So let's take this as not cynical, okay? Let's not assume that this is embellished for the sake of encouraging others in the church with far less to give, far more. What do you think about overextending your charitable giving to the point where you need to put your kids, your eight kids in a tent?

[C]

I. I shouldn't have to say this, but, yeah, I think that that's goofy. I mean, that's just. Here's the thing. I. I'm. I'm not trying to give people parenting advice because parenting's hard, but.

[D]

But some of it's not this hard.

[C]

The thing is like, yeah, like, if you're going to show your kids like you're prioritizing, like, I, I guess in their context that's what they're trying to do is they're showing their kids, they're prioritizing the church over them because that's what they feel called to do or whatever. But I don't know, I think I would rather give my kids the priority over anything else.

[D]

And also they had the smell. You think like they would shake hands after church and they're like, jess, you smell like you've been sleeping in a tent.

[C]

You know what I think is that, I think that they.

[D]

You don't believe they slept in a tent for the summer. Do you have doubt?

[C]

I'm somewhat doubtful. But also like, what does that exactly mean? Like, did you actually move into the tent? Did you have access to a house? Did you. Right, exactly. Did you have, have like the shower available? Yeah, that seems, there seems to be some third party reasons for having done this.

[D]

Right? Right. Yeah. I mean, what. Have you ever heard stories of like, crazy things like that people have done for.

[C]

Not outside of the church.

[D]

In, in the church, we heard stories like that. I've heard the story. The, the ones that I always heard were and was like, when they would do like, give it all Sundays and there'd be people that like, they put their wedding band and they had nothing else to give and they put their wedding. I want to know which deacon takes it to go get like smolted. What's that called?

[C]

They're taking it to a pawn shop, melting down one fifth of the value of the ring.

[D]

Right.

[C]

Yeah. This is where. This is where to me, it starts becoming sort of predatory.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

If you want to give than give, but also when you start guilting people. You know what I mean?

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

It's like, it's easy. It's easy to call that feeling the spirit because you just heard a sermon about how it's not giving unless you feel sacrificial or it's not giving unless it hurts, you know? So it's like, well, what can you sacrifice in order to give us money so that we can pay ourselves a better salary as the pastor?

[D]

Right. Yeah. I'm trying to think if there's any other good, good examples of that.

[C]

It's a strange thing, though, dude.

[D]

I just, I just saw the poster. I was like, I feel like this is a Travis Nick's money thing.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Because it just. I don't know, it's.

[C]

It's also just strange because you, like, if you have a church, you do need people to give to it in order to be able to make it sustainable. But is that a broken model or. You know what I mean?

[D]

Well, and I think this also goes to your thing that you always say about like, five.

[F]

You don't.

[D]

Like, you can be charitable without giving to a 501C3. Yeah. Is like, that was always my thing is like, there's so much about, like, is God laying this on your heart to give? Is God telling you to give? But, like, there. So there was all this freedom of, like, God's going to tell you the amount. God's going to tell you when, God's going to tell you how. But, like, when it came to where it was like, we have our vision, exact promise faith coalition giving banquet, and God will be telling you to give it there.

[C]

Right.

[D]

And it's like, what if you attended a church your whole life and God always told you to give to the homeless shelter down the street or to your family member that struggle, you know what I mean? Like, there was never leeway, like, to move horizontally in those directions. It was always like, God's going to lay on your heart to get a second mortgage to give us money.

[C]

Right. It was all, there's like, this is the destination. This is the only destination for, for your finances. It was sort of like when we were entering college and it was giving us the option of basically, you're either going to Bible college or you're not going to Bible college. But then when it was like, oh, we decided, you know, I was called to ministry or whatever, they didn't lay out options of potential seminaries and other theological schools. It was just like, if you are going this path, here's the application to this college because there's no other options, so why would you go anywhere else? This is the best one. You know, it's like, if God genuinely called me, then why wouldn't I be able to go to a different seminary? Why wouldn't I be able to go to a different college? It's like, well, this, this is the only one that's going to, you know, get you where you're trying to go. So you have to do this one. It's like that. It's like, here's, it's, it's again, when I look back on it now, it's very clear to see from a marketing perspective what they're doing. It's that they, it's though, it's the big domino effect, which is like, if you can, if you can push over this one big domino in the mind of your prospect, then objections become irrelevant and they will invest in your program or whatever. That's exactly what this is where it's like you're, you're convincing the audience of one core primary thing, which is that sacrificial giving is the key to having a close relationship with God. And that the only way to feel that closeness to him is to give us your money because we're going to steward it the best. Because who else would you trust to use your finances? And it's like, well, but there's a. Plenty of other ways to give back and, and not necessarily to a body of, of, you know, a church. Yeah, that's going to do who knows what with the money. And then it's always, it's also like if you have, if you, the, the big givers, you know, who are like the business owners, entrepreneurs in the church. It's like if you want to get tapped into the network of the church, then you need to be one of the people who's giving a percentage of your income to the church. Because the church knows which people are tithing and which people are giving big. So they're obviously going to take the people who give the most and then send them the inside of the church, you know what I'm saying? Like that it's, it's a, it's a farm of hot prospects for local business owners and things like that to be involved in a big community of believers. So of course they're going to give a percentage of their income because it's directly tied to their Ability to make more money. But they're going to call it God blessing their business because they gave. And it's like, well, did God bless your business or did you give a percentage of your income to this organization? And now you're the person who gets all the business from the church. It's like there's, there's a little bit of, you know, we got to go back to church. Yeah.

[D]

We got, we got to start a real estate company and we got to go back to church.

[C]

One of us start. One of us becomes a pastor and the other one becomes a real estate agent.

[D]

Which of. Okay. If you and I both started church plants.

[C]

Yeah. Yeah.

[D]

Whose church do you think would grow bigger? Mine.

[C]

That's. Well, yours would have more immediate growth because you have a bigger.

[D]

Oh.

[C]

And then would drop a better story.

[D]

Get out of here. Your story is pretty good. You were chasing filthy lucre.

[C]

That's true. That's.

[D]

Let's see, if you were to do your.

[C]

But, but yours is, yours is more powerful because I was a back.

[D]

I was the Paul. I, I, I'm almost Apostle Paul.

[C]

You're, you're like David Cloud for the Enemy.

[D]

Yeah, I know. I would have like the apostle Paul story. I was, I was persecuting. I was slaughtering people.

[C]

God's people.

[D]

Figuratively.

[C]

Yeah. And then you came back.

[D]

I saw the light, cuz I was listening Tony Hudson preach.

[C]

That's right.

[D]

And bless God. I'm back, brother. And yours would be. He was chasing filthy lucre. All the pleasures of.

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[D]

All the sordid pleasures of this world, like Hard Mountain Dew, seltzer.

[C]

But then I got cancer.

[D]

Dude, you should have done it when he had cancer.

[C]

Yeah, that would have been a good comeback. Got a hold of my heart.

[D]

No, I know. And I will say this, too. I. I just related to sleeping in a tent to give money to the church.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

I also think when people see these stories, they should also look at, like, what a safety net they have.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Like, the worst case scenario for them is they kick the tenant back out. They just stop doing that. And then they also are still the pastors of the church where everyone else is giving.

[C]

Yeah. Right.

[D]

So take it. Take it with a grain of salt.

[C]

That sacrificial.

[D]

But I also know that she also posted that there's people, you know, as you grow quickly, people are going to attack you. And there's spiritual battles happening because of her account.

[C]

Because she. Because she's growing her Instagram account.

[D]

Yes. And so I know that this will be perceived as that, but.

[C]

Yeah. Persecution, you know?

[D]

Yeah. Raise up your sword.

[C]

It's guaranteed. Yeah. But I think. I think that. I think that we would. We would both have fairly successful dude churches, bro.

[D]

I. I honestly, I've watched so much preaching in the last two days for myself.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

For my work. And. And I just sat there. I was like, if this is the cream of the crop.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

That gets invited to all the conferences, I could do this for sure. And I always go back to, you've been doing this for this long and you're still this bad at it.

[C]

Really. Yeah.

[D]

But the.

[C]

Anyway, but in their mind, they're not. And the congregation just eats it up, you know? I know I would. I would give the edge to myself long term, though, in our church growth activities.

[D]

You would be.

[C]

Just because of. Just because of the sales background.

[D]

Oh, brother.

[C]

So I would go. I would go grow the church more. You would crush content, though.

[D]

Okay. Let's do it together.

[C]

You know what? Let's just start our own together.

[D]

Well, guys, we're gonna go.

[C]

Hey, you know what? I got a great tagline. A church for those who don't like church.

[D]

Oh, my God, I hate that sign. There's a sign right near your house that's always. And I'm always like. That's called Anything but that. Do you want to go to a place that feels like. You mean conference? You mean Aspire Conference? You go to a church that doesn't have verses. Yeah. Aspire Conference.

[C]

Shout out, man. Anyway, all this to say, go to church, give to church. You do you. That's totally fine. But be careful of predatory type.

[D]

Manipulative.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Coercion.

[C]

Understand what's being done on the back end and that, that people are not doing this just for the goal of serving the Lord. There's also ulterior motives. Even if they believe they are doing it for the right reasons. There's some sort of subconscious level of, like you. When you've convinced yourself that you have the ultimate mission in life, then you also can delude yourself into believing that it's okay to quote, unquote, manipulate people for the sake of getting this thing, because we're doing it for this good reason. So. And justifies the means to some extent.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

So just understand that some of this stuff happens, but, you know, it's your money. Feel free to give it. If you have a church you love and you have a congregation you love, a pastor you love and you want to give to support the church, do you. Do you just understand that there's, you know, some people out there who are definitely doing this from a predatory perspective? And you should, in my opinion, and I believe, I believe even within the context of Christianity, that God would call you as a, like, as a parent to provide for your family, first of all, before you're providing for the church to keep its doors open.

[D]

So, and like always, don't. Don't make decisions with emotion that you later justify with logic. So don't be making commitments in the height of an emotional flow.

[C]

Yeah. Like during the middle of the giving conference. Like, maybe write your commitment card after you have 48 hours to cool down. Yeah, there's no cooldown period for, for buyer's remorse inside of giving to a 501C3.

[D]

Well, Travis, go ahead and close us out here and bye.

[C]

Yeah, that's it for this episode of the show. Remember, money only solves your money problems, but it's easier to solve the rest of your problems with money in the bank. So let's start there, here on the Travis Makes Money podcast. Thanks for tuning in. Catch next time. Peace.

[G]

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