← Travis Makes Money
Travis Makes Money
INTERVIEW | Make Money by Building Consistency and Leveraging Your Platform, feat. Brian Ford
00:24:37
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- [00:02]
A
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B
You're listening to the Travis Makes Money podcast presented by GoHighLevel.com for a free 30 day trial of the best all in one digital marketing software tool on the planet. Just go to gohighlevel.com travis. Yo, what's going on everybody? Welcome back to the Travis Makes Money podcast for it's a mission to help you make more money. Today on the show I have my friend Brian Ford. Brian is the founder of Self Improvement Daily, a podcast with 21 million downloads. Brian is a behavior change expert who helps busy professionals become more consistent, intentional and accountable to doing the things that matter most in life and business. He's also the co founder of the Four Purpose Foundation, a non profit that leads health and wellness challenges to fundraise for charity where they've raised over $1.1 million to date. Brian, what's up dude? Welcome to the show.
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C
What up, Travis? Appreciate you, man.
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B
Good to have you. Yeah, man, of course. Yeah, I've been looking forward to this because like I told you before, we hit the record button, it's always fun to talk to other podcasters because you just, you just get it, you know what I mean? You get the flow, you understand the structure, you know what we're doing here. So I appreciate you taking the time to. Come on, let's, let's go. Let's reverse the clock here. Tell me what you did before you started the podcast.
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C
Yeah, so I actually, my first job out of school, I studied neurobiology and psychology. I got plugged into medical device sales. So I was in spine procedures at 23 years old, which is pretty wild. I was consulting surgeons, neurosurgeons, orthopedic surgeons who'd been in their practice longer than I'd been alive, telling them what to do with their patients. And especially in med device sales, when things kind of hit the fan in those kind of more tense situations, they turned to the med device rep, which was me to be like, hey, how do we fix this? What do we do? So definitely built some thick skin in sales that way. And it was very much relationship based sale. I only had One major account with six to seven different docs on my hit list to be able to convert. So there was a lot of investment in those folks. Just like very much relationship based. From there I got an opportunity to jump into a sports recovery technology startup. So actually one of my good friends, co captains in college at UC Davis had this brilliant idea and also this crazy idea to say, hey, you know what, we're Division 1 college athletes. We don't have a better way to ice our knees than literally getting a bag of ice, putting it on our knee and then saran wrapping it. And he went out self, kind of self taught engineer developed this technology which has actually become a product line at a company called Hyperice. The company was sold at the end of 2020 and that was just a good feather in the cap and acquisition under our belt. And that's kind of proactively. I was building my personal brand doing the podcast, but you know, it really became a business after that acquisition when I decided to go full time on, on the things that I'm doing now.
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B
And so what year did you start the podcast then?
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C
Yeah, I started in 2018 actually. Okay. So I've been going for a while.
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B
Started daily.
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C
Yeah.
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B
Wow. Okay. Why? Why daily?
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C
The reason it started daily is because I was transitioning from that med device role in sales into this startup in the sports recovery space. And I had the marketing, business development, you know, kind of a bunch of different skills I had to build. And for me I was like, all right, if I'm entering this marketing space, I want to be on the cutting edge side. I want to be the best, I want to figure out what's coming and happening. And Gary Vee at the time was talking about Amazon Alexa Flash briefing and voice first services. He's like, yeah, he's bullish about it. Right? So that's when I kind of caught wind of it and I'm like, all right, if I'm going to be an expert in marketing, I'm going to be an expert in audio marketing. What's the best way to do that? Well, it's to create my own Amazon Alexa Flash briefing proof concept that I can grow it and then consult to other brands to help them implement a similar strategy for themselves. And I was like, all right, well if I'm going to create a news briefing, then what's it going to be about that I care about, that I value, that I can create every single day because that's what daily news requires, is daily content. So I'm like, all right, self improvement. That's something I'm interested in. And I was like, well, what do I call it? Self Improvement Daily. And that was. Yeah, that was 20.
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B
That was all the effort that was put into it. There wasn't any. Were you following podcasts? Were you listening to a lot of podcasts at the time?
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C
I mean, there were a handful of people, creators that I was following on LinkedIn that were talking about having podcasts. I wasn't, like, deep in the podcast rabbit hole at that point. I was really learning what the tech looked like. And I took Gary Vee's advice. It's not like I knew what it looked like, but he was like, you know what? If you're going to be creating content, might as well distribute it all channels, all platforms, as best as you can. So then I just use Anchor fm. Right? The most simple distribution strategy is like, cool, let me upload content there. It then populates on all major podcasting platforms. They've since been acquired by Spotify. Right. So it was a little. A little operation that, you know, was banging pots and pans and got some attention. And I didn't even know my podcast was growing. I was just consistent with, all right, let me produce content, build the habit of putting something out there. And then it was like seven to, you know, nine months later. I even checked my first analytics of like, all right, are people actually sent to the podcast? And I saw thousands of people had found it. And I'm like, when did this happen? And then that's when I started thinking seriously about, oh, I actually got to start recording into a microphone instead of my phone. And, like, this became a real thing, you know, but at first it was. It was not that complex.
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B
Yeah, that's sort of the annoying part about being a podcaster is that that could be happening and you have no idea, because you feel like you're almost just shouting into a void sometimes because you just are creating, whether your phone or microphone, you're just like, in a room somewhere putting out stuff, and you're just like, oh, do people care about this? You know, and even if you have big numbers, it's like, you know, you. There's not evidence or proof because there's no, like, likes and comments and notifications and engagement and things like that. It's almost like you have to engineer calls to action to see if anybod actually does something or take some action. But even if they don't take action, that's not like a, you know, a one for one tell of whether or not they're listening. Or paying attention. You know, you can have so many, you know, phantom listeners that are just out there consuming a bunch of content, but they never reach out to you to say, you know, hey, thanks for putting this out there, or, hey, I've implemented this and saw this change in my life. Like, great job. You know, they can kind of just sit there. So when you started noticing that people were actually listening, did you think of it from a monetary perspective at all?
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C
No, I didn't. I was actually. I was convinced that this was always gonna be a passion project. I was never gonna try and monetize it. That would ruin the integrity of what I'm trying to create. Like, I had that whole story around it, which I can see now was well intended, but just also not practical, because there's a lot of opportunity in their service and there are people that I can help with it. So it. It started that way where it was very much just kind of like passion project, but. But ultimately what happened, and this is an interesting kind of response that I'm realizing is once I realized people were listening, it did change the way I showed up for it. I was like, oh, well, now I've got to be a little more thoughtful about, like, positioning myself as an authority, because if they're listening, they're going to listen to someone legit. And the tone and nature of me as a podcaster changed because I was trying to be someone I wasn't. And in a lot of ways, I didn't necessarily feel like a hypocrite, and I was saying one thing and doing the other, but I did feel like I had some kind of show to maintain, like some facade and veneer to. To keep alive, which then I'm sure impacted what was actually being communicated. And it took me a couple years to unlearn that and get back into more authentic storytelling and vulnerability, which is obviously what people connected to a little bit more, and it supported further growth.
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B
And is this. Is this what you're doing full time now?
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C
Yeah.
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B
Okay. So to break down, if you can, for people listening, that, you know, sort of revenue stream, this episode is brought
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D
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C
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D
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B
Dreams potential revenue streams of what it looks like being a full time podcaster.
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C
Totally. So my path is a bit unconventional, I think, and that's because of the nature of what my podcast does and what I hope to do. So what I noticed, and this is why my podcast grew. So the podcast is called Self Improvement Daily. As I described, the reason I got so many people listening, thousands in a matter of months, was because people would go to Apple podcast and they'd type in Self Improvement and they'd click search and then they'd find Self Improvement Daily. They're like, that's exactly what I'm looking for. No kidding. Then they'd listen and it was good enough for them to stay. And then enough people did that that the audience slowly but surely grew through. Basically SEO. But SEO within podcasting platforms, not Google, not anywhere else, right? Sure. So that's how people were finding it. The problem with that is those people were really entry level. If they're looking for self improvement, go. They're probably in some major transition. Maybe they recently got divorced, they're a single mom trying to get their life back together. A lot of people incarcerated. Like, I've gotten the market research and of course there's a full, you know, the wide breadth of people that listen. But I saw these recurring themes of people who were beginners. Beginners aren't customers. Right. Beginners are not serious. So I was trying to, in my business market, to my audience. And I had a lot of resistance to that because now I'm selling to people who didn't have the ability to buy. So when I realized, oh, actually what is the business behind this? I realized that the podcast wasn't my lead generation tool. It was my point of credibility and reputation that I could then leverage in other areas. So that's where I got really creative. And that's when I launched my interview part of my show. Because I was only doing two to four minute little tidbits, I was like, wait, I have a platform. I can invite other people into this platform. I could serve them, add value, build relationships with them. Now I get more exposure opportunities to different audiences that are more aligned with who could become my clients. And that's really the way that I see it now is the podcast model is I have consistent content which helps me to continue Growing my audience and serving an audience, which gives me this pillar of credibility and that I then take into the different ecosystems for column workshops and online communities, podcasting opportunities where now I'm being featured on other people's podcasts. These other stages that then are attracting the right people who can pay me for what I do. So that's, that's where it's been an interesting transition from not trying to pull leads like necessarily from my audience. I still have the calls to actions and there are people that trickle through, but the real play is standing on the foundation of what the podcast has become and leveraging it.
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B
And what's the business now that you are pulling people into from, you know, leveraging stages and other people's audiences and stuff like that?
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C
Totally. Yeah. So it's a coaching business. So I'm a behavior change coach. What I do is I help people implement the habits, systems and routines of a true high performer. Right. What does that look like? Well, it's them implementing the different systems that I've implemented for myself and that I've shared about for years on the podcast and have gotten good feedback on that have worked for me. But the way that that works in practice is. And I have a different approach in kind of like the coaching industry where what I like doing is proving that we're a good mutual fit and over delivering with value so that a sales conversation doesn't become this weird, awkward, I didn't sign up for this, but now we're talking about your offer kind of thing. But like a very clear, okay, you already helped me. I know that this worked for me. What's next? It just puts me in the right position as a salesperson and to be able to steward people in their transformation. So the way that that works is I run people through an entry level 21 day challenge. It's your foundational system of performance tracking. You can't improve, we don't measure. We have habit stacks in place where now you get consistent with your scheduling, your pre planning, your workouts and your diet. You're on top of the different fundamentals and standards that you have for your life. If that level of intentionality, of pre planning, of accountability that I deliver was valuable, if people see results, then at that point I enroll people in either my membership, community or, you know, one on one coaching services. And that's, that's where I make my money. I actually donate every dollar that people invest in the 21 day entry level challenge as a lead acquisition piece just because that's the world that I Want to see. And I'm impact driven. So that's kind of part of my business model is the first step is this model for charity and to see if we're a mutual good fit. And then beyond that is where I earn my income.
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B
Nice, I like that. Do you do sponsors on the podcast?
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C
No, I don't.
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B
No. Zero sponsors. Okay.
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C
No.
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B
Okay. So really it's building a backend coaching business. Podcast is used as like kind of the credibility pill in order to be able to seek opportunities elsewhere to get more in front of an audience that's more willing to basically buy your stuff or able to buy your stuff. Yep. Yeah.
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C
Yeah. And it's bringing people from those different audiences into my email list, building relationships with them, getting them on calls, understanding and serving them, adding value to them, learning about them. Then when it's the right time and they're interested, introducing them into that 21 day challenge environment and then expanding upon it from there.
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B
Is this something that you really want to continue doing into the future? Like do you see yourself pivoting, moving a different direction? Do you see yourself just continuing to grow this? What are your really want to be doing?
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C
Yeah. So I see this as a part of what the future looks like that is in progress right now. And the timing of this is very much in the messy middle of two different things. So yes, I will continue to be a behavior change coach and help people with those habit systems, standards, routines that support them in their performance. But at the same time, I'm realizing that the platform and technologies that I use to deliver my coaching can be improved. In particular, I'm building a technology called Follow through OS which is meant to be an alternative. And the idea is it's actually going to be positioned more as like a B2B platform so that other coaches, other community leaders, other programs can use this to help their people show up, do the work and get results. That's the bone to pick that I have in the coaching industry is people market really hard and sell these dreams and then don't help people deliver on them. They don't hold their hand to say, hey, now you got to take action to get the result. And this can be the bridge. This is where I want people after they make that investment to then say, okay, cool, and here's how we're going to help you to make good on that investment, to get the result that you came for. And it's a strategic tool to support in delivery of those results.
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B
What lessons did you take away maybe from your early career that you now still employ on a daily basis doing what you do now, like from medical device sales all the way through to startup and now podcasting.
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E
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C
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D
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C
It's causing issues in everyone's marriage.
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D
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C
It's chaos.
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F
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C
Yeah, I mean, it's two different things. One is things happen so much faster when you're in person. So if you can get there in person, shake a person's hand, have a conversation. Like it's great to have a conversation online and that does cover some ground. But meeting in person covers five times the amount of ground. So that's part one is get there, shake a hand. And then the second kind of parlays off of that is it really is about who you know. And this is where you've become a master. Right? Like, you need to know the right people. They're going to get you in the right rooms, they're going to make the right intros. Instead of you trying to backdoor your way into a meeting. Like, literally just having someone that's trusted on, like knocking on the front door saying, hey, you should talk to this person, it just, again, it accelerates everything. So that's, that's where I am so heavily investing on building my network, building my relationships, because it's the, it's the fastest catalyst to opening new doors.
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B
Who are some of the people that you attribute a lot of your success to? Do you have mentors along the way? Whether it's somebody that actually that you know, that knows you versus somebody whose content you're just consuming a lot. Or an author you read a lot is. Are there certain people you've come back to more than. More than others?
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C
Yeah. I'm going to list three different people, three heroes of mine. So first is a guy named Darren Hardy. So he wrote the book the Compound Effect. So basically I've got it behind me, literally right behind me here. What he wrote in that book, the Compound Effect, was the first time that I really took what I was reading and implemented it. Not necessarily word for word, but I was like, all right. He said, if you want to improve anything about your life, you got to track it. I'm going to take that seriously. I'm going to implement it. And I was a personal development junkie. I was. I had the podcast, right? And I'm talking about all these great ideas of how you can change your life and you just gotta do these things. But then I wasn't, you know, implementing all those different pieces. Cause I didn't have the foundational systems and skills to be able to do. So he, in that book, changed that. So I read that book once a quarter because it's that impactful and central to my philosophies around behavior change and how I support people in my client roster. Person number one. Person number two, guy named Adam Braun. So Adam Braun wrote the book the Promise of a Pencil. I wrote. I read his book once a quarter also. His is more on the social impact side. My foundation, you're talking about a nonprofit. My foundation called the Four Purpose foundation was inspired by words that he put in his book. And my personal mission statement, Converting Human Intention into Action was inspired by words that he put in his book. I now hire him as a coach because that's how you get proximity to people. Sometimes you gotta pay for their things, right? So I hire him and I get my once a quarter touch point with him where I'm building his mission and movement for him and paying him to do it, right? So that's person number two who's left a huge impression on me. And then third person is a guy named Mike Sherbakov, one of my best friends. He's based here. I'm in San Diego. When I was moving down to San Diego, my intention was to build community. And I was randomly scrolling the Discover feed on old time Instagram. This is like 2018 or. No, this is 2019 before reels and like the Explore pages or anything like that was a thing. Just I was, for whatever reason on Instagram, I saw this guy, handsome, helping people in Africa. And I Was like, who is this jerk? And then I look and I realize he's in San Diego. And I'm like, oh, my gosh, he's exactly who I want to be. And he's going to be my best friend. And he has become one of my best friends. So I can attribute so much of the network that I've built and the opportunity that's come from being in San Diego to him, because he was just one of those epicenter catalyst explosions of opportunity and friendships and business partners that has just been extremely formative.
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B
Besides paying for proximity, which is definitely one of the ways, what are some other ways that you found have been effective for you to build a professional network that actually moves the needle for you?
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C
Oh, my gosh. Just caring, Honestly, just caring. Just doing some freaking research and seeing what someone actually cares about. And then it's as simple as writing a note to acknowledge a detail that most people overlook, or getting them a gift when you see them at an event and just saying, hey, I thought of you and I thought you'd enjoy this, right? And also, like, being strategic around the whole, who knows this person? If you're aware of who that target is that you want to connect with, then you can go and figure out, well, who might be the right person to get me in front of that. I've actually asked you for a couple of those introductions because I found the proximity there. And guess what? I got in front of those people because I reached out to you and others and I found back doors or I got, you know, front door introductions. It doesn't matter. But the more shots you take and the more seeds that you have in the soil, one's gonna grow and materialize. But really it's about caring. Because when it's that introduction, it's not like, hey, Travis, make this intro to this guy for me, it's, hey, make this intro to this guy for this reason, because I admire him in these ways and I see a future where he's doing this and I'm gonna support him with that. It's like, whoa, okay, this is a little different, right? So. And that's why it's important to have these hot networks and, you know, super connectors that you just haven't met once and then it ghosted. Like you're continuing to interact with them because they end up being those entry points into the next and the next and the next. That just kind of creates the ripple effect of networking.
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B
If you had to attribute the majority of the success that you've seen with the podcast and the online business and things like that to one or two core habits that you find to be helpful in your day to day life. What would they be?
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C
Yeah, I mean it really is consistency, right. It's a compound effect. Like that is what I've built my coaching business on. That is what I've built my career on, is doing the small things consistently without excuses that you know, when done consistently will create disproportionate, extraordinary results for you. Right? There is a reason I've reached 21 million downloads is I have 2,300 episodes over the course of almost eight years. Right. Like that doesn't happen on accident. And not only like, yeah, I have the listener count to justify opening a lot of doors. But even having this story of I've committed to this thing and have this breadth of stories and insights that I've shared, like that's enough to impress someone who gets it game sees game and they're like, okay, yeah, this guy, he can be consistent. I have a thing to learn from him. Or like, oh, he's serious about this. This isn't something that he's just like trying to spin off and he's not going to talk to me ever again. Like this is something that's really part of who he is. So I mean consistency is everything. The nuance to consistency is if you were to do the same thing consistently without feedback adjustment or increasing intensity, you eventually plateau. Sure. So that's where you need to optimize efforts. It's not doing the same thing and just like closing your eyes and blindly doing it. You need to integrate all of the learnings over time and that's how it becomes exponential. And that's the one part in the compound effect I think is overlooked. But most people don't reach that point of that trade off of, you know, compounding results because they're not consistent enough to get there there to that plateau.
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B
The consistency pie is the barrier to entry. It's the learning. That's what allows you to have exponential growth at some point because or else you're just one of those people that's got, you know, one year of experience 20 years in a row. It's like, well, I've been doing this for 20 years, so I, you know, learn from me. And it's like, yeah, but you don't have any results. So even though you've been doing it for 20 years, so what does that say? Like that those two things are not the same. You know, consistency is just, it's just the price of admission it's just what gets your foot in the door. Then you can get into all the. Like you said, now you have enough data to get feedback so you can learn from that and then implement it the next time. And that's what enables you to see growth over time.
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C
Right?
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B
I appreciate you taking the time to come on, man. I know you're a busy guy, so I don't take that lightly. Where can people go to get more from you?
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C
Yeah, I'd say listen to the podcast Self Improvement Daily. And if anything I've shared about what I've talked about is interesting. I. I've got three operational shifts that take people from this state of being hardworking but not getting results into. Okay. I'm actually getting real traction and getting the results I'm deserving for my effort. I can send you a link. It's, you know, the, the three operational shifts is a great place to start to like really immerse in my philosophies. Perfect.
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B
Self Improvement Daily. For those of you who are listening to this podcast, you like listening to podcasts about self improvement? Then go check out Brian's podcast, Self Improvement Daily. Just a quick, you know, three to five minute daily episodes on things you can improve in your life. Brian, I appreciate taking the time. Everybody else listening. Remember, money only solves your money problems, but it's easy to solve the rest of your problems. Put money in the bank. So let's solve that one first here on the Travis Makes Money podcast. Thanks for tuning in. Catch you guys next time. Peace.
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G
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