B (3:36)

Okay.

A (3:36)

Some people will just be like, I'll just memorize the script. Memorizing the script is step one. You, of course, need to be familiar with the script. And. And you should absolutely memorize everything that the company gives you, especially if they're a solid. If they have, like a really solid sales training program. But beyond that, it's not just the words that you say. In fact, the majority of communication has nothing to do with the words you say. If. And there's been different studies that have come out over the years that have sort of debunked this, but there used to be the 7 3, 8, 5, 5 rule, which is basically communication is 7% the words you say, 38% your tonality, and 55 body language. I don't, I don't know exactly what that ends up being. Like I said, I think there's other. There's been studies that have come out that have sort of debunked that. But either way, there's a large percentage of your communication that is still your tonality and your body language. So that's why I say do your best impression of this person because the way that they're saying it is important. Their, their, their tonality. When they ask this question. Their, their vocal inflection or intonation goes up or it goes down when they say this particular phrase or this particular sentence or ask this particular question. Copy as like, do your absolute best impression of that person and do that at insane volume for a period of time. So find the top performer. Do your best impression number two, outperform everyone else's volume while doing that. So if you do your best impression, you memorize the script and then you, and then you do an impression of the tonality and the body language, you do everything that that person did and then you outperform that person's volume, then within two, three months of doing that, you're going to be very proficient at doing that thing. After you do that, that's when you can start sort of making it your own. That's when you can be like, okay, my personality wouldn't necessarily like, vibe with this thing that that person said. So instead of going this direction, I might take it a little bit in this direction. But you cannot. It's like in sports. You, you like, you can't work on the perfection of the game until you have first mastered the fundamentals. Until you get the footwork down, you can't work on dribbling the basketball and doing this certain, you know, and, and

B (5:44)

this episode of the show is brought to you by Chime. Chime is not just another banking app. They unlock smarter banking for everyday people with products like MyPay giving you access to up to 500 of your paycheck anytime and getting paid up to 2 days early with direct deposit. Some old banks still don't do this, so forget overdraft fees, minimum balance fees, monthly fees. Chime turns everyday spending into real rewards and progress. Plus they have this new credit card which I'm a big fan of, this Chime card. It's the new way to build credit history with your own money and actually get rewarded every single day. So A lot of cards like this, they require you to put some sort of money down and then they will give you a credit card based on the money that you put down. But when they do that, because it basically is working off of the cash that you have down as collateral for the credit line, you don't get rewards on it. Well, Chime changed the game with their new credit card as well. There's no annual fees, there's no interest, no strings attached. And when you get qualifying direct deposits, you get 1.5% cash back on eligible Chime card purchases. Chime is not just smarter banking. It is the most rewarding way to bank. So join the millions who are already banking fee free today. My younger self would have benefited from this and I know you will too. It just takes a few minutes to sign up. Head to chime.com travis that is chime.com travis this episode of the show is brought to you by Chime. Chime is not just another banking app. They unlock smarter banking for everyday people. With products like MyPay giving you access to up to 500 of your paycheck anytime and getting paid up to 2 days early with direct deposit. Some old banks still don't do this. So forget overdraft fees, minimum balance fees, monthly fees. Chime turns everyday spending into real rewards and progress. Plus they have this new credit card which I'm a big fan of, this Chime card. It's the new way to build credit history with your own money and actually get rewarded every single day. So a lot of cards like this, they require you to put some sort of money down and then they will give you a credit card based on the money that you put down. But when they do that, because it basically is working off of the cash that you have down as collateral for the credit line, you don't get rewards on it. Well, Chime changed the game with their new credit card as well. There's no annual fees, there's no interest, no strings attached. And when you get qualifying direct deposits, you get 1.5% cash back on eligible Chime card purchases. Chime is not just smarter banking. It is the most rewarding way to bank. So join the millions who are already banking fee free today. My younger self would have benefited from this and I know you will too. It just takes a few minutes to sign up. Head to chime.com travis that is chime.com

A (8:25)

travis Perfecting a crossover like you can't, you can't focus on that until you get the foundational levels of how to dribble the ball and how to move your feet around. Like in, in football it's all footwork and in soccer it's all footwork. It's like you have to master the fundamentals before you can then start reinventing some of the process. It's just that your, your, your default mode has to be completely foundationally perfect almost in order to be able to continue to improve on that thing. It, like I said, it was common sense to me, but then I started doing sales training and started realizing that it wasn't common sense to everybody else. And it blew my mind. Like, I'd bring people in the door, I teach them exactly what to do, and then they would immediately change everything that I just told them to do that I know that works. And they'd be like, yeah, but I think this is going to work better. It's like, great. I'm glad you have some opinions on what might work. But for now, why don't we just go ahead and do the thing that I said because I know it will work because I've experienced it working. Like you're just coming up with theories and you're going to like. It makes more sense for you to pursue your new theory rather than follow the tried and tested method and just trust the system and trust the process and know that it's going to work out if you just do it the way that I'm telling you to do. Just blew my mind. So you do not have to reinvent the wheel. And there will come a point where you can make it your own and use the strengths of your personality and avoid the weaknesses of your. Of your, you know, personality. But at first, man, why are you trying to reinvent the wheel? I remember when I, when I did this when I was doing door to door alarms, the guy who owned the company was a fantastic sales guy. Still to this day, one of the best salespeople I've ever met in my life. And, and he would crush alarm sales. So when he did the pitch for me the first couple times, I literally recorded it. And I did every single thing that he did during that pitch. So there was a part, you know, in door to door, especially in alarms, when, when it's a one not closed, meaning that you're not setting an appointment and coming back later. It's either I get the deal now or I'm never coming back. That was how it was for that particular industry. When you're, when you're doing that. The most important part for us was getting into the house. How do I go from this like wall is completely up. I'm a door to door sales guy that you did not expect to be here. How do I go from you having zero trust in me to you allowing me to step foot in your home? Because once I step foot in your home, I am now no longer some random sales guy at the front door. I am now psychologically have become a trusted advisor. It's somebody. There's two types of people who knock on your door. People you do not let in and people who you do let in. Once I have convinced you that I deserve to be in the category of those whom you let inside of your home, you've now, you've now given me a certain layer of trust that then is much more likely to allow this conversation to end in some sort of a sale. So when this, this particular guy, this sales guy was learning from, he was like, I'm, I'm a pretty big guy. And this was probably at my biggest as well. I was, I was not taking care of my health at that point. You know, 6:1 and maybe 225 at that point, 2:30. But this guy is probably 6:3, 2:60. Like he's a big dude. And so when you're trying to get in somebody's house, you don't want to be super intimidating. So I, when I saw him do the pitch, the, the door, we called it the door pitch. Basically like here's the one minute that will allow you to be able to get into the home and then you can go into the rest of the pitch after that. But when the at the door pitch, I noticed that when he would ask people the question to, to be able to go inside the house and show them the rest of the setup and how it was going to work for them. When he would do that, he did it crouched position. Like he would get down on his, on his knees and he's like pointing at the door, showing them something technical about the thing that we were going to be talking about on the walkthrough. But then he would look up at them and ask them the question because it was a, it's much less intimidating than staring directly at somebody who's this, you know, six three, 265 pound dude who you might be a little scared to let inside of your home. So like that was an example because I remember I was doing that and one of the, one of the guys who had been at the company for a while saw me doing that and because the owner trained everybody the same way saw me doing that and he Actually kind of made fun of me a little bit. Was like, man, I saw it like you were bought in, bro. Like you did everything they said. I was like, hell yeah, I did. And that's why I became the number one rep in the company in six weeks. Like, it's just not that difficult. I just did exactly what he said. Even if other people were like, haha, I can't believe you're actually doing the kneel down thing. I was like, yeah, why wouldn't I do that? It seems to be working out for him pretty well. So if I want similar results to the ones that he had, then I'm just going to do literally everything that he told me to do. Even if it doesn't make complete sense to me, even if I feel like I'm look, I look kind of dumb, or even if I feel like it doesn't necessarily go with what I would personally say in that situation. It was just that I'm going to do my best impression of this person down to the kneeling, the tonality, the body language, the raise of the eyebrows. Like I'm going to do as much as I can to copy what this person is doing and then I'm going to outperform everybody else's volume. Now I need to solidify this as a habit in my mind. And then once it's a habit, once it's something that I'm very comfortable in, very familiar with over the over two, three months of doing it like this, then I can allow my personality to shine through. And that's when you start getting even better at it, because then that's when it feels more natural, it feels more authentic. And then you can, you can start shifting things along the way. Just don't do it at the damn beginning. It's wild to me. Find the top performer, do your best impression, outperform everybody else's volume. And then in your free time, drill objections and scripts. Drill, drill the parts of the conversation that you are least comfortable with. Because whoever is most comfortable in the, in the discomfort ends up winning the conversation. I learned this pretty early on, was that when first of all you got to ask for the sale. And most people, there's a lot of salespeople just don't ask for the sale. They get so intimidated by just asking the question at the end of the presentation that they.

B (14:10)

This episode of the show is brought to you by Shopify. Starting something new isn't just hard, it is terrifying. So much work goes into this thing that you're just not entirely sure that's going to work out. It can be hard to make that leap of faith. Trust me, I know. When I started this podcast, when I've started several of my businesses, I just wasn't even sure what I was doing. Like, what if nobody listens to the show? What if I make a fool of myself? What if I embarrass myself? Nobody buys my stuff. Now I know that I was right in believing in myself and launching my podcast and several of my businesses despite all the fears and hesitations. But it also helps when you have an amazing partner like Shopify on your side to help. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world. And 10% of all E commerce in the US US is using Shopify like this is the place that hosts all of your favorite products and services. So if you are considering this, then Shopify is a must. Especially, especially, especially if you're going to launch some sort of an e. Comm product. So get started with your own design studio. With hundreds of ready to use templates, Shopify helps you build a beautiful online store that actually matches your brand's style. But Travis, what if I get stuck? Well, Shopify is always around to share advice with their award winning 247 customer support. Which is very, very important to people like me who are still some for some reason like caught in the 1980s and I want to talk to somebody when I actually have a problem and instead of just relying on an AI system. And did I mention that the iconic purple shop pay button that's used by millions of businesses around the world, that's from Shopify. It's why Shopify has the best converting checkout on the planet. Helps boost conversions, meaning less carts going abandoned and more sales for you. So it's time to turn those what ifs into with Shopify today. Sign up for your $1 per month trial today at shopify.com TMM go to shopify.com TMM that's shopify.com TMM. This episode of the show is brought to you by Factor. Look, everybody who's listening to the show is busy. I get it. There's kids, there's distractions, there's businesses, there's side hustles, there's podcasts, there's to prevent you from eating good quality food all the time. So for me, eating healthy isn't necessarily a willpower problem. It's just more of a setup problem. It's just easier to pick the processed food because I know I can just grab it and eat it really quick. Well, enter Factor With Factor I'm hitting my nutrition goals this season. Without the planning, the grocery runs or even the cooking, they have meals built around your goals. Whether that's weight loss, overall nutrition, more protein or GLP1 support for strength and workout recovery. Check out Factors Muscle Pro Collection. Every meal is crafted with functional ingredients. Lean proteins, colorful veggies, whole foods, healthy fats. In fact, they ban 175 plus ingredients, so no artificial colors or sweeteners, no high fructose corn syrup, no refined seed oils. Just nutrient dense food. It's fresh, never frozen. And they have over 100 rotating weekly

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A (18:23)

odds of this person being like okay, where do I sign? Is very, very, very low. You don't want to ask stupid open, open ended questions like so how are we feeling? You know, like no, that, that's not asking for the sale. That's just like a, that's just like a, a question. And they can answer that however they want to. And now you have an unpredictability about where the conversation is going to go at that point. Difficult to script the things that you're going to say if they say this thing because they can say anything to a question like that. So ask for the sale first of all. But then after you ask for the sale, what I would do is because it was an uncomfortable or awkward silence, I would just, I, I felt like I had to say something. You know, it's like I'd ask for the sale and then like I could see that they were thinking about it and then it was like, maybe, maybe, maybe they're thinking about it because I didn't polish up this part of the presentation. So let me just say this real quick. Ask for the sale and then shut. Shut the f up. Don't say anything else. Ask for the sale and be silent. And yes, it will be uncomfortable. This is why I say drill these things and practice the like. Like drill the objections, drill the scripts and have the person that you're quote, unquote, role playing with be silent for a second and actually have them count out like 10 seconds, 15 seconds. Because it doesn't sound like a lot of time, but when you're in a conversation like this and you. And you know the pinnacle of the conversation is coming and that that's going to be really uncomfortable. I'm going to ask them this question. We're going to have to get money at some point. And you know that that time is coming. You build it up in your head and you ask the question and then you have to sit in 10 seconds of silence. That 10 seconds feels like it's an hour. But I promise you, you will screw up more sales than you will. Than you will win by barfing out more information during that time just because you feel uncomfortable. You basically give them an out from working through their own decision making at that time. And you distract them from the ultimate end and you get them thinking about something that maybe they weren't even thinking about to be. So don't insert your own perception into the mind of the person that you're talking to. Allow them to sit there. Think about it. There was a sales thing that I was doing last year for, for two, three months, and the sales manager ended up showing this call to everybody else on the team because it was uncomfortable as hell. It was so uncomfortable that even when the, the, the. The manager, the sales manager was showing the call to everybody else on the team, even the team couldn't stay silent during the time that I was staying silent. Like, they started laughing and started saying like, oh my gosh, dude, I was so uncomfortable for you. Like, it was, it was wildly uncomfortable. And I was pitching like the top of the tier package. It was like a $12,000 price point or something like that. And I wanted, in my mind, I was already thinking like, I, I gotta downsell this. He's not gonna bite at the 12K. I gotta downsell and I gotta go to this other package and I gotta take some pricing off and I gotta manipulate this for Him, I gotta. I gotta figure out how to make this work. But I just stayed silent and it was no joke. Over a minute of silence. Over a minute where I was just standing there. I was just sitting there looking at the screen and just like a slight smile on my face. Just like looking, looking over here, looking over there, looking back up the screen. He's looking around, he's looking up. I was like. And before I said anything, he just

B (21:28)

goes,

A (21:30)

it, let's do it. And I was like, all right, sweet, let's do it. Let's get it done. And then we moved on into the sale. But there was so many opportunities for me to screw it up by just saying something. So. So if the sale, the close should be the natural conclus conclusion to the conversation. So if you've done everything correctly in the conversation itself, then the sale should be the natural conclusion. So you shouldn't have to add in a bunch more filler detail at the end there. If they present an actual objection at that point, then you can start talking and overcome the objection. But, you know, people start throwing out objections in their own. Like the salesperson starts throwing out objections that maybe the customer wasn't even thinking about because they're trying to push them over the finish line, when in reality, they didn't need any of that. They just needed another 12 seconds of silence in order to be able to be like, all right, this is my decision. I feel comfortable. Let's move forward. So drill the objections and scripts. Practice sitting in uncomfortable silence with somebody after you ask for a sale. And then once the person you're role playing with, you know, like, you sit in 15, 20 seconds of silence, you. You start trying to fit. You start trying to master sitting in the discomfort for a second, then they present an objection. Well, now you gotta drill the objections and the scripts to overcome those objections, handle those objections, and then move forward in the conversation. So do that in your free time when you're driving to your location or before you turn on your computer, whatever version of sales that you're doing, drill and practice. Like, what am I going to say if we get down to the end of the conversation and they say this thing? And luckily, all sales are basically the same. There's only a handful of objections that every sale ends up being about. It's usually like a decision maker thing. Are both decision makers present? You have to talk to your wife, you have to talk to the board to get approval, whatever. Like decision maker. It's a. I need to think about it. It's the Price is too high. Like there's really only three to five major objections. So that's the good news is that you don't have to be, you don't have to have done this for two years to have a laundry list of 80 different things to work through. It's usually just a matter of these three to five things. And you can build the scripts to help overcome those things. Once you get that from somebody who actually says it. So drill the objections and your scripts in your free time. And then lastly, this is just sort of an aside overall for the sales process. Cause I think this is underrated for most salespeople is increase your empathy. I think empathy led salespeople end up being the best salespeople. And maybe not at first because you know, some of like the, the bulldog closers might be able to get more people in through the door, but they also are probably going to have higher percentage of chargebacks. They're probably going to have a higher percentage of customers who are not happy with the service. They might be pushing things over the finish line in order to be able to get a sale and then it's just going to cancel within their three day right of rescission period. Whereas if you get, if you just are better at increasing your overall empathy for the person on the other side of the conversation, you're probably going to have better results in the long term. So this looks like asking better questions. You're discovering the discovery part of the sales call is probably the most important part compared to everything else. The more time I've noticed this, the more time I spend in discovery, the less time I have to spend overcoming objections in the close. The less time I spend in discovery, the more time I have to spend in overcoming objections during the close. And of those two, one of them zaps my energy significantly more than the other one. And I'll let you guess which one does. Okay. Overcoming objections is like, like is like a mental, is such a drain on mental energy because it's this, it's this constant sparring. You have to like be really, really on task. You have, you have to be on the whole time while you're battling and overcoming objections. And I've been in situations where I didn't do a good enough job in discovery. And I've spent basically the same amount of time that I spent doing the entire discovery and presentation process. I spent also that same amount of time doing the close where the clothes should be, you know, the shortest part of the whole thing thing. I was turning it into where it was like, well, I'd spend 30 minutes doing the discovery and presentation, and I'd spend 45 minutes in the close. And I was like, well, if I just spent 50 minutes in discovery and presentation, I might spend 10, 15 minutes in the close. It's a total, like, the same amount of the. The time is the same. The total amount of time for the entire pitch was about the same. But the energy that was taken from me in order to be able to get the sale was significantly less when I spent more time in the discovery part. Because.

B (25:39)

Because it.

A (25:39)

It actually increased overall empathy. It increased the connection between me and the prospect. It allowed them to feel that I was truly on their side and I wanted them to make the best decision for them. Like, it. It's just better if you spend more time there. So ask better questions. Once you ask those good questions, confirm you understand their situation. So ask a good question, but don't just write down the answer. Repeat the answer back to them in a way that makes them feel like you truly understand what. What the answer to their question was. And I've. And I've genuinely gotten people, during this part of the process before to literally say the words, like, couldn't have said that better myself. Or I've gotten people to be like, no, it's not quite that. So, like, I'll ask them a question about, like, why are we in this situation? Or what, you know, what's like the big goal for you here? Or something like that. And they'll say something. And I go, like, it sounds like you're telling me this. And I'll repeat the thing back to them in a way that is a very succinct manner to say that. Like, okay, so if theoretically, if we could do this thing, then this thing would be what you really want to accomplish by doing this. Does that sound right?

B (26:38)

And I.

A (26:39)

And I always want to confirm it with them because like I said, sometimes they'll be like, no, not necessarily that. It's more just this other thing. I'm like, okay, great. So it sounds like you're telling me this, and I'll do it again. And I want to make sure that I am confirming with them that I completely understand exactly the position that they're currently in. Because again, if. If you can. If you can articulate a prospect's problems better than they can, they'll automatically assume that you have the solution. So you want to make sure that you ask good questions, but also confirm that you understand the answers to those questions without just, like, moving on to the Next piece. So this is the part where scripting can get a little bit like, not helpful is that like if you're just reading questions on a script, then you're basically just filling out a questionnaire and that is not actually accomplishing the goal of discovery, which is to basically establish rapport and connection with the prospect within the context of the conversation that you're having. Which brings me to my last thing that I'll say on this is build rapport, but control the frame. So rapport is something that's talked about a lot in sales conversations and I've seen people do, do it horribly and, and that basically looks like trying to build rapport on anything. But the thing that you're talking about, it's like you're talking about their, whatever, selling a marketing service and then you spend the first 20 minutes of the call talking about the weather and talking about, you know, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers or whatever. Like you're trying to find all these other, your favorite TV show and you notice something like, you can mention something like that as like a quick aside and just get into it and, and, and knock it over really quick. Just like if you, if you know the person's looking you like straight faced or whatever and you want to try to get a laugh or something like there's some things you can try to play around with, with that. But ultimately like rapport doesn't matter unless it's in the context of the thing that you're trying to do, which is convince them that you are somebody who's actually good at solving the problem that they're experiencing. Has nothing to do with whether or not you both like Transformers or whatever. So build rapport, but only inside of the context of the thing that you're working on. Don't end up, end up in Timbuktu talking about the Pacers and the Heat playoff series. You know, you can do that at the end when you're taking care of paperwork, you know what I'm saying? Like at the beginning you want to build rapport, but in the context of this, I am becoming a trusted advisor for this person, which is looks like the things that we've already been talking about, asking good questions, confirming you understand their situation, those things build rapport much better within the context of like they actually feel like this is somebody who genuinely cares, who knows the problem inside it out and actually has a solution that could potentially be take care of this problem for me. So these are just some quick tips on sales in general, how to become a better salesperson. Find the top performer. Do your best impression. If you're not inside of a sales organization, this might look like actually hiring a coach who's sold the thing that you're trying to sell and then outperform everybody's volume. Just do a ton of volume. This is why in the previous episode I said reach out to 50 people a day for 90 days because you want to get as many sales calls in your calendar so you can work through the presentation as often as you you possibly can in your free time. Drill the objection handling and scripts so that when you get people on a call, you're more likely to convert them into a sale than you would have been before, and then increase your empathy overall. Ask better questions, confirm you understand the situation and build rapport, but in the context of the frame that you want

B (29:38)

it to be in.

A (29:39)

So that's some quick tips on how to get better at selling. As always, travischappel on Instagram or travis travischapel.com shoot me an email. Love to hear from you any questions you have about this stuff so we can tackle it in a future episode.

B (29:49)

Thanks for tuning in.

A (29:50)

Catch you on the next next one.

B (29:51)

Peace.

C (29:54)

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