Hilarious Comedian Jeff Dye: Why the World's Gone Crazy!

Summary

Podcast Summary: TRIGGERnometry – Hilarious Comedian Jeff Dye: Why the World’s Gone Crazy!

Podcast: TRIGGERnometry
Date: January 14, 2026
Host(s): Konstantin Kisin, Francis Foster
Guest: Jeff Dye

---

Episode Overview

In this lively episode of TRIGGERnometry, comedians Konstantin Kisin and Francis Foster welcome stand-up comic Jeff Dye for an honest, candid, and often hilarious discussion about the current state of comedy, social and cultural overcorrections, the blurring lines between politics and daily life, and why everything—from sexuality to making coffee to telling jokes—is now polarizing and tribal. The conversation explores how comedy has changed, what’s gone wrong with “wokeness,” and why Jeff believes so much of today’s culture is a reaction to collective shame, virtue signaling, and the exhausting need for identity.

---

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The Evolution of Comedy and Censorship

• Comedians Censoring Comedians:

  • Jeff and the hosts discuss how comedians themselves are now acting as censors, policing what material is "acceptable."
  • Jeff calls out "virtue signaling" from comics like Anthony Jeselnik and Marc Maron:

    “Marc Maron is now policing what comics should and shouldn’t say ... they just call it hack. You can be hack. That’s not against the rules. … Really, you’re offended.” — Jeff (11:14)

  • This seen as a troubling trend, with “hack” now weaponized as disguised moral posturing.

• Double Standards and Cancel Culture:

  • Francis points to British comic Frankie Boyle’s shift from offensive jokes to a “woke” persona after cancellation, noting the hypocrisy in criticizing others for “edgy” material.
  • Discussed how past comedy giants (e.g., Howard Stern) were once boundary-pushing but now act as gatekeepers for "acceptable" content.

2. The Shift from Artistic Rebellion to Angry Tribalism

• Seattle Then and Now:

  • Jeff reminisces about his hometown, its hippie, artsy vibe, and contrasts it with its current, militant political activism:

    “Seattle used to be... artistic and fun. We had hippies, weirdos, progressives ... but they were nice about it. Now those types are very angry, very political, very socialist ... What I don’t like.” — Jeff (03:24)

• “Everything’s Political Now”:

  • A recurring frustration is how virtually every topic has become politicized, even the weather or personal relationships:

    “When you talked about how warm it is in spring ... it didn’t launch into global warming. It didn’t launch into oil companies ... Now there’s nothing you can talk about that isn’t political.” — Jeff (26:13, 26:49)

• Tribal Identity and Performance:

  • Jeff observes how comedians and others increasingly broadcast group identities for approval—“Every female comic I know is bisexual, but they’re not. They just say it to get claps from the audience ... but they’re all liars.” — Jeff (29:26)
  • Francis quips: “Every white man is now neurodivergent ... you need something. You can’t just be a regular dude.” (29:23)

3. Overcorrection, Shame, and Cultural Amnesia

• The Overcorrection Theory:

  • Jeff posits that today’s cultural “wokeness” is a generational overcorrection for historical wrongs, rooted in a simplified, shame-based view of American history:

    “You just overcorrect. So anyone who’s not white must be good ... And anyone who’s white should feel the guilt I felt ... It’s an oversimplification.” — Jeff (16:45-18:26)

• Groupthink and Virtue Signaling:

  • Francis: “We want to eat the fries without getting fat. ... We want to be comfortable, to be safe, but the idea you might have to protect it or do something unpleasant ... We can’t live in that world anymore.” (55:26, 56:11)

• The Backlash in Youth Culture:

  • Francis and Jeff note a disturbing rebound effect: the more mainstream society mandates virtue and inclusion, the more attractive it becomes for young people to rebel in shocking ways:

    “Because it’s almost punk rock now to do that. It is less about the hate and more about rebellion ... It’s become naughty and edgy and punk rock.” — Jeff (31:21)

4. Satire, Judgment, and Where to Draw The Line

• Judgment in Comedy:

  • Jeff reflects on how, as a comedian, he’s constantly measuring what’s “OK” to judge.

    “I don’t need to approve of tennis ... similar to my opinion of being gay. But when can I start judging it? ... Can I nudge my buddy and go look at these guys?” — Jeff (36:47)

  • The conversation highlights the difference between oddity and bigotry, and society’s confusion over both.

• Majority Privilege vs. White Privilege:

  • Jeff challenges oversimplified privilege politics:

    “A lot of times the things you’re summarizing as white privilege are just majority privilege. … So many things like that happen where it’s just a majority.” (39:59-41:35)

5. Cultural Rebellion, Gender, and Identity

• Culture Wars and Kids:

  • Francis laments that kids today can’t escape politics and identity battles, whereas prior generations could ignore them:

    “I feel really sorry for young kids ... politics is now everything and everywhere.” — Francis (25:33)

• Gender, Group Identity, and Modern Feminism:

  • Jeff notes the tribal aspect of modern womanhood and the false notion of universal female interests:

    “Women have considered themselves to be like some sort of group ... you can’t even say a thing ... ‘women hate video games’ and that triggers them.” — Jeff (48:50)

  • The hosts stress the difference between statistical realities and political claims.

6. The Importance—and Limits—of Humor in Public Life

• Comedy as a Bridge:

  • All agree humor remains one of the most subversive and effective ways to communicate hard truths:

    “If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they’ll kill you.” — Match, paraphrasing Oscar Wilde (46:04)

  • Jeff: “Comedy is a great cheat code ... Sometimes when [audiences] get pissed off … they have to explain that to themselves ... so you can inspire those conversations.” (45:46)

• Drawbacks of Politician Comedy:

  • The conversation critiques politicians (especially Trump) leveraging humor—while undeniably effective, it can further polarize:

    “He’s inarguably funny. I don’t know if I want him to be ... because it just drives the people that don’t like him insane, and they act insane. ... I don’t know if I need my president to be funny. I don’t want my doctor to be funny.” — Jeff (63:32)

7. The Need for Civil Disagreement and Social Cohesion

• Tribalism vs. Unity:
  • Jeff calls for more civil debate and less “winning the argument”:

    “The goal is to win the argument, not come to a nice understanding ... we should be trying to get along is what I think.” — Jeff (70:46)

• Political Tribalism is Like Religion:
  • “They scoff at church, they publicly criticize Christianity, yet they act out their politics as religious zealots ... [you] should have friends that have all different thoughts and ideas.” — Jeff (68:50)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments (with Timestamps)

• On the Political Shift:
  — “If I was standing on this exact stage 10 years ago and I told you men could have babies, you would think I was the stupidest person ... And now you’re sitting in those exact chairs acting like you’ve always thought this.” — Jeff (08:39)
• On Wokeness and Rebellion:
  — “It is less about the hate and less about the racism ... you’ve made it so exhausting ... now you’re going to witness this terrible rebellion that you’re going to regret.” — Jeff (31:11)
• On Group Identity and Authenticity:
  — “Every female comic I know is bisexual, but they’re not ... They just say it to get the claps from the audience. ... But they’re all liars.” — Jeff (29:26)
• On Political Tribes:
  — “I moved from Seattle to Los Angeles, so I didn’t meet a Republican till I was like 34. Republicans were like Bigfoot to me.” — Jeff (05:25)
• On Comedy’s Power:
  — “Comedy is a great mask to get into their hearts and brains ... especially if it’s funny.” — Jeff (45:46)
• On American Unity:
  — “I don’t agree with a ton of the left’s policies, but I still see them as Americans ... I like to think of us as fellow man.” — Jeff (64:33)

---

Segment Timestamps for Key Topics

• Intro/Seattle & Comedy Roots: 02:38–04:43
• Seattle's Cultural Shift: 03:24–05:11
• Comedy Censorship & Woke Policing: 09:41–13:57
• Hypocrisy in Comedy (Stern, Boyle, Jeselnik): 12:59–15:00
• The Overcorrection Theory: 16:45–19:43
• Tribalization and Youth Rebellion: 29:09–32:01
• Comedy as Public Discourse/Cheat Code: 46:03–47:39
• Political Tribalism as New Religion: 68:50–70:08
• Final Reflections on Civil Disagreement: 70:46–71:24

---

Conclusion

Jeff Dye’s conversation with Konstantin and Francis is a blisteringly honest look at how comedy, culture, and politics have become hopelessly entangled—and how this breeds hypocrisy, censorship, overcorrection, and social division. The trio laments the loss of nuance, the virtue signaling plaguing creative communities, and the weaponization of identity, before rallying for humor, openness, and a renewed appetite for civil disagreement.

Jeff’s parting message:

“We should be trying to get along … not just win the argument.”

---

If you enjoyed Jeff Dye in this episode, check out his stand-up or catch more of his takes on social and political absurdity directly on his channels.

Transcript

[Francis]

What's interesting as well is how comedians try and censor other comedians.

[Match]

Jokes about jokes about disabled people.

[Francis]

Pedophilia.

[Jeff]

Right up my alley.

[Francis]

You've got more skeletons in your closet than Halloween. And then you're gonna go, you know who's really moral? This guy. Yeah, you don't really have that here as much yet.

[Jeff]

Now there's nothing you can talk about that isn't political. Every female comic I know is bisexual, but they're not. All women somehow are on the same team, which I've never experienced.

[Match]

No.

[Jeff]

I'd imagine if you laid out a reasonable person's thoughts, you'd have things in all these different categories. However, if it's all on the left, you're like, how is it conveniently all on the left? And same with all the right? Like, the odds of that are preposterous. He's inarguably funny. I don't know if I want him to be. I don't know if it's a good thing.

[Francis]

It's the start of a new year and most people I know have either upgraded a device over the holidays or. Or added another screen to the house. That's why I've been thinking more seriously about digital protection. Not just antivirus, but identity and privacy too. At Trigonometry, we've been using Webroot Total protection. What stands out straight away is how lightweight it is. It runs quietly in the background, scans fast, and doesn't constantly interrupt you with pop ups. You genuinely forget it's there, which is exactly how this stuff should work. Total protection covers real time antivirus, blocks malicious websites before you land on them, manages your passwords, and includes identity monitoring with dark web alerts and credit and financial monitoring. If you've got a family, you can protect multiple people and devices under one, plan from kids to older relatives, and decide exactly who's included. There's also a VPN built in for extra privacy, and Webroot even offers up to $1 million in expense reimbursement for certain out of pocket costs related to identity theft. Importantly, there's 24. 7 US based support if you ever need help restoring your ident. Webroot has been protecting customers for over 25 years with more than 90% retention, which tells you people stick with it once it's set up. So here's the offer. New year, new device. Whether you're upgrading tech or sticking with what you've got, now is the time to protect your digital life. Visit webroot.com trigger to get 60% off Webroot's trusted cybersecurity solutions. That's webroot.com trigger for 60% off. Again, webroot.com trigger. Live a better digital life with Webroot.

[Match]

Jeff, welcome to Trigonometry.

[Jeff]

Thanks for having me, boys.

[Match]

Well, it's great to have you on, man. We're big fans. You're hilarious. Your stuff is great. Comes up on my social feeds all the time. Tell us a little bit about you, like your story. Who are you?

[Jeff]

I was born in Kent, Washington. That's a little woods town, a little blue collar town south of Seattle, Washington. And I was like a class clown and a goofball and all I ever wanted to be was a comedian. Well, I guess I wanted to be a baseball player, but that wasn't. That wasn't in the cards. And I knew that even while that was happening. And then from, from there, I moved up to Seattle after high school to become a comedian. And that's what I've been ever since.

[Francis]

Seattle.

[Jeff]

Pretty short.

[Francis]

Yeah. I mean, that is a good summation. Was Seattle as mental as it is now?

[Jeff]

No, it wasn't. And that's why I used to love Seattle my entire life and why I still root for their sports teams. But now I'm always like, I'm from Kent. I'm not from Seattle. Is. Because Seattle used to be, at least in my memory. So some people might hear this and go, what is he talking? This was just my experience. Seattle was artistic and, like, fun and like, we had all these hippies, we had all these weirdos. We had all these, like, progressives and artists who were like, progressive sexually and they were progressive artistically. They were all the things you see now. But they were nice about it. They were hippies. They weren't angry hipsters. Now those same types are very angry and very political and very socialist and very like, it's the same stuff, but angry. And that's what I don't like.

[Francis]

And it's such a good point because I remember growing up around those people and being kind of part of those people in my late teens, early 20s, you know, and you hang out and, you know, they talk and, you know, it'd be nonsense. You're wearing a Che Guevara T shirt. And he kind of executed gay people. But let's not focus on that.

[Jeff]

But we didn't even know that. Yeah, you just go, I've seen that shit. Yeah, it's like Darth Vader or something.

[Francis]

Yeah, exactly. Cool cheekbones. What does it mean? Don't worry about it. But but and then it just went weird. Yeah. And then it got really angry. Like before, I always wanted to go to Seattle. You know the Jimi Hendrix Museum?

[Jeff]

Yes.

[Francis]

The design of the museum on fire. Will I get killed?

[Jeff]

Right? I know. And that's. It feels militant. Yeah, yeah, it feels very militant. And it's also like, I remember when I. Being a young straight white guy and.

[Match]

Thinking, has that changed?

[Jeff]

No, no, still those things. But as a. Well, I'm not young anymore, I guess, but I remember like seeing like those progressives and the artists and the poets and the comedians and musicians and thinking, I want to be like them.

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Now I see them and I want to cross the street. I'm annoyed by them. And so that's the only difference is that, like, they don't feel like something I want to be a part of anymore.

[Match]

And you've moved to LA to get away from all that.

[Jeff]

I used to joke that I moved from Seattle to Los Angeles, so I didn't meet a Republican till I was like 34. Republicans were like Bigfoot to me. I was like, what? You saw one. Are they as strong as I've heard? Yeah. It wasn't a thing necessarily to be like a conservative. It wasn't popular or cool, you know, and not that it is now either, but I don't know, like, Seattle's just changed in that way.

[Match]

But I don't get that read from you anyway. I don't get that you're a conservative. I just think you're someone who's like, thinking and seeing the world more as it is as opposed to through these ideological filters. Which is what comedians kind of supposed to do, right?

[Jeff]

Exactly. Well, I like to think that, like, if you laid out everyone's political thoughts, they would be all over because everyone tries to go, well, I'm not a Trumper, but I'm conservative or I'm not. I, I'm, I'm left leaning, but I'm not all the way over here, you know, trans ideologist. Everyone wants to be the reasonable thing. They're always claiming they're the reasonable thing. So I'd imagine if you laid out a reasonable person's thoughts, you'd have things in all these different categories. However, a red flag should be when you only have things in one category. Like, like if you, if you can, everything goes down the list. You should probably wonder where you're getting your news and where your. What your real thoughts are.

[Match]

That's a really good point. Yeah, that's a really good point.

[Jeff]

If it's all on the left you're like, how is it conveniently all on the left and same with all the right? Like how could you have all those ideas be the same? Like the odds of that are preposterous, right?

[Match]

Well, especially when you often find, I think it's like when we won Rogan just a few weeks ago, he showed this clip of a guy who goes to an anti ice protest and talks about human rights. And he's like, you believe in human rights, right? And they're all like, yeah, yeah. What about the unborn? Like, because both sides have contradictory ideas and these like little dark areas that they don't want to look into cuz it's inconvenient to the party line 100%. So if you think for yourself, you're probably never going to be all one side or the other.

[Jeff]

And it annoys my fans because some of my fans think because I'm on Gutfeld or Fox that I have to have the thoughts of everything on the right. So if I make a poke or a jab at something that doesn't perfectly fit into that, they're like, what? He shouldn't be on here anymore. And you're like, no, I'm not. I'm fighting against that. I am like leaning very right these days. But it's only because society is. Because society, that's what's most reasonable right now. And by their opinion or their definition of what is right.

[Match]

Well, this is what I always say to people about my views as well. It's exactly the same, which is like if the car is heading down the road, but instead of heading down the middle of the road, it is steering way to the left and is about to crash. Well, you yank it to the right absolutely, don't you? So it's. If you believe that you want the car to be going down the middle, that doesn't mean you're always going to be pulling in this direction. That. Because it's really about where the rest of the society is 100%. And if you think about, I think we're similar age, the stuff that is going on now, how crazy it would have sounded.

[Jeff]

Yes.

[Match]

Even to the far left 20 years ago, all this stuff about like open borders, like Bernie Sanders, it's insane. It's insane.

[Jeff]

Yeah. I have a joke that I used to like. I don't even remember what the bit was, but if I could sense that the audience was even pulling back, I would go, listen, stop for a second. If I was standing on this exact stage 10 years ago and I told you men could have babies. You would think I was the stupidest person you've ever heard. And now you're sitting in those exact chairs acting like you've always thought this. So either A, you don't really believe what you claim you believe, or B, your ideas have changed also. So this is a new idea even for you. Even you would have to admit that you've adopted the idea that you've always believed men could have babies. You didn't always think that. That's preposterous. And so I'm always kind of like, pulling, pushing on that kind of stuff.

[Francis]

And it's not just as well, being a comedian. It's not just as well, like, your audience, because everything is super polarized. And you know, you know what the algorithm is. You know what the algorithm likes. The more you, you know, the more you go to one side and it's spicy, the better it's gonna do, whether it's left spicy or right spicy.

[Jeff]

Right.

[Francis]

But what's interesting as well is how comedians try and censor other comedians.

[Jeff]

Never seen it till recently. Like, I've, I've, I've heard about it, but I've never witnessed it till now.

[Francis]

Right. Yeah. Well, it's like this is far more prevalent in the uk. So Zoran got elected. Got elected, obviously. And I put out a tweet, which is, new York is a city that never sleeps. And the reason for that is Zoran's just brought in a 5am call to prayer.

[Jeff]

That's great.

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

And then it's more of a. Yeah, that's. That's a. That's a kind of a cheeky. That's kind of like a clean joke. Yeah. Really not.

[Francis]

And I've had comedians go, francis, what the hell are you doing? What are you. Why are you saying this stuff? Because, you know, it's seen as like, you can't joke about certain things because if you do, that means that you're bigoted. So, like, for instance, you can take the piss out of Christians, but you can't take the piss out of Islam, which is preposterous. And the thing that I love about America is you don't really have that here as much yet.

[Jeff]

It's coming.

[Francis]

Is it?

[Jeff]

It feels like it's coming. I mean, look at Canada. I mean, look at, like, that's right above us. I mean, and like, look what's going on in New York. I mean, like, I feel like we're on. Unless we can really make some dramatic changes in social opinions or common think, like, then I think it's coming, but I love that joke, and I like that idea. Like, that's a very, like, funny thing. Did you ever think we would be in a time where Anthony Jeselnik is publicly saying what comics should and shouldn't be joking about? The guy has 60 minutes about killing kids and babies, but then is mad that, like, a comic would have a politician on his podcast or would do a joke about gay or trans people. Marc Maron is now policing what comics should and shouldn't say. And instead of saying that, he's clutching his pearls, and instead of these comics acting like it's a PC thing, instead they just call it hack. They go, well, it's hack. You're like, well, it's. You can be hack. That's not against the rules. We're allowed to be hack. If you want to call it hack, call it hack. But what you're really doing is you're virtue signaling, and you're pretending like that these comics shouldn't be saying it by masking it as saying it's hack, but really, you're offended. Yeah, that. Like, that, you know, these. That we're joking about subjects that you don't like.

[Match]

It's so weird as well, because we had the same thing happen in the UK but, like, a good five, six years ago when Frankie Boyle. I don't know if you know him. Frankie Boyle was a giant in British comedy with the most offensive jokes.

[Jeff]

Okay.

[Match]

Jokes about rape, jokes about disabled pedophilius.

[Jeff]

Right up my alley.

[Match]

Everything. Right?

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Match]

And then I think what happened is he got canceled for something, okay. And he came back and he became this. The most woke person you've ever met. He had an entire show that you just basically get fucking social justice activists on to give a half an hour round pretending it's comedy. And I don't. What I don't understand is, do they not see that given their particular type of comedy. You're talking about Jeselnik as well. Like, you have no legs to stand on when it comes to this.

[Jeff]

Well, that's. I mean, it's funny. The second you said that, I started thinking about Howard Stern. Howard Stern as the longest list of. Of sins when it comes to being politically correct.

[Match]

Right.

[Jeff]

You can find him saying the N word hard R like, hundreds of times on the Internet. You can see him dressing up in blackface. You can see him doing all the things that he would be against. He used to have escorts and prostitutes. I don't even know the term. Sex workers, whatever it is. Every single day on his thing, all this stuff, and now he's Super. Well, Neil DeGrasse Tyson all of a sudden is a scientist who doesn't want to talk about gender or talk about any of these what we used to call biology. And it's because he got in trouble. You know, I wonder if that's maybe the motivation of all these people to all of a sudden become this super PC woke person just for their own. I don't know. I mean, do you think that that's a possibility or like, why would this guy do that?

[Match]

Well, you tell me. I don't know if you, if this is replicated here in the us But I will tell you. When I used to do stand up on the British comedy circuit, if you watch, if you're standing backstage in the green room watching someone on stage and they bang on about how great a feminist they are.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Match]

They are a sleazebag. They are groping the other female comics in the, in the green, you know.

[Jeff]

Yeah. I don't know anyone that's ever talked to me about being a good feminist ever for even longer than a minute. But that's. That makes total sense, right? It is something. There's something suspicious about it. Anybody trying to like, anyone trying to pretend they're good actually is kind of suspicious. Like most people are like, they've been humbled and they go, you know, I've made a lot of mistakes. You know, that's a better way to live your life than pretending that you're like so open minded and great and all these.

[Francis]

I don't know, it's strange, especially for a comedian.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Francis]

Do you know what? I've never met a comedian. And you go, you know what? That dude's got his life together.

[Jeff]

Stand up guy. Right? Exactly.

[Francis]

Yeah. And all of a sudden you're gonna go on a podcast and preach to people about how to behave.

[Jeff]

Yeah. It's very strange.

[Francis]

It's like, come on, man.

[Jeff]

And socially, not even just like, like, they're not even saying that like how they should behave or you should behave, but how society should be. Like, that's crazy to me.

[Francis]

Yeah. And it's like. And I kind of admire the bulls of it. Do you know what I mean? Because you've got more skeletons in your closet than Halloween.

[Jeff]

Right.

[Francis]

And then you're going to go, you know who's really moral? This guy. And you're just thinking, my man, like, you've just put a massive target on your back.

[Jeff]

Absolutely.

[Francis]

And if there's one thing we know about women, they don't forget.

[Jeff]

Yeah, no, that's a fact. And the Internet doesn't forget either way. Like, that's a strange thing, you know?

[Francis]

So you've just made yourself an absolute target. Particularly, as we all know, there are certain comedians. They're great comics. Not good people. Not good people. And that was accepted. That was accepted.

[Jeff]

Louis CK Was telling us that he was a sexual deviant since the day he became a public figure. Like, you can find a long track record of him. He's like, I bought this violin, and then I jacked off on it. Like, just crazy stuff. And then you find out that he was masturbating on the phone with a lady or something, and then. Then now he can't work. Yeah, like, but he's been telling us the whole time he's. He's a human. He's a flawed individual. Yeah, yeah.

[Francis]

And the thing with Louis is, like, Louis never pretended to be a good.

[Jeff]

I know. That's why I like him so much. That's why he's, like my hero. Because it's like he goes, I'm flawed. You're flawed. Like, this is. You know.

[Match]

So you growing up where you grew up, near Seattle, at the very least, do you have any thoughts on, like, how we got here or how this whole thing came into being? Because it is so different to the way things were even 20 years ago.

[Jeff]

You mean, like, politically, socially?

[Match]

See, I don't. You know, people think we're, like, really interested in politics, but I don't think this is about politics. I think this is about culture.

[Jeff]

Sure.

[Match]

It's about social. Whatever. Like, the group think of society, you know?

[Jeff]

Well, my answer, I am gonna present to you more as, like, just here's what I think. I'm not that firm on it. And also, I could be swayed. And I'm just chewing on it as I say it. So keep that in mind for your listeners. But I think it's an overcorrection. I think what's happening is when I was in school learning about the civil rights and when I was in school learning about American. A tremendous amount of shame. I would go, oh, man, that's wrong. But I had, like, an. A young brain about it. So I thought, like, I must be the bad person. I must have done these things. I longed to be the guy who was the white guy marching with the black people of the civil rights. I wanted to be that guy. Like, that guy's on the right. He was on the right side of history, and he was doing a good thing. Or I would like to Think that I would never do that to like a Native American. You know, it was very simple. Brain did thoughts about these complicated subjects. And I think that you start to like, then bash yourself. You know, you start to go like, ah, shame on white people and shame on this thing. And it's such an oversimplification, you know, like, what do you mean white people, Irish Americans, French Americans, Do Spanish count? Do Jews count? Like, white is such a, like a white. And then you've done these terrible things to black. And like, what is black? Is that Haitian? Is that Jamaican? Is that. So you look at it from like a fourth grade understanding of these stories of what happened and you just overcorrect. So anyone who's not white must be good. And anyone who's white should feel the guilt I felt when I learned those things. And you just overcorrect. So, you know, a black guy beats up your dad, you go, well, you know, he's, you know, I don't want to say, yeah, I don't want to say he did anything wrong. We don't really know the whole story because if I criticize that, then I'm racist. So it's just like kind of this, like, I think it's an oversimplification of what has happened historically. And when you forget history, then. Right, forget. If you never even learn history, then you don't really know. You're just kind of repeating the things that your friends say. And I think that's what happens. I think it's like a super overcorrection. I was in, we were in Asia for months shooting this show and I remember one of the people on our show calling the people in Japan minorities. I'm like, they're not minorities here. We're in Japan, stupid. Like, they're the majority. That's not how. But in our American kind of like fourth grade understanding of everything, we've just kind of viewed it as that. And that's what happens is it gets carried away. You start to say like, oh, I don't agree with Islam. And they go, oh my God, Jeff, that's pretty racist. You're like, that's not racist. I know what they believe according to the Quran and like what I've, the studies that I've done or the little bit of homework that I've done.

[Match]

And I'm glad you made that little.

[Jeff]

Correct studies a little bit. The things I know is what I should have said. Sam Harris clips.

[Match]

Well, Sam is great on the subject of Islam.

[Jeff]

Yeah. And I, I, I feel like I don't know how to explain it. I should be able to disagree with anything I'd like and agree with anything I would like. I shouldn't factor my race or my gender or my age or any of those things. These are just our thoughts. We're, we're, we're humans. And so, like, I don't have to feel guilt when I say, oh, I think that treating a woman like that is, is, is wrong. And they go, oh, Jeff, oh my God, that's so, that's so Islam phobic or whatever the hell the term is, or, you know, that's so racist of you. And I go, no, these are just my thoughts, despite whatever the culture, religion or thing is.

[Francis]

You know how at the beginning of every year people say, this is a year things change. Then by February, everything looks the same. If you've been sitting on a business idea for months or even years, 2026 is your line in the sand. The most common thing that separates people who talk about building something from the people who actually do it is taking the first step. And if you want this to be the year you finally launch, the smartest move you can make is starting your business with Shopify.

[Match]

2026 is the year you launch your business. The year you transform into an entrepreneur, founder or boss. One powerful move puts your future firmly in your hands. Starting a business with Shopify. Maybe you've got a product you can't stop thinking about, a skill everyone tells you to monetize, or a store you've already imagined in your head. Shopify is how you make that real. Shopify provides everything you need to sell online and in person.

[Francis]

Millions of entrepreneurs have already made this leap from household names to people launching their first ever business. Shopify gives you all the tools to build your dream store easily. You can choose from hundreds of beautiful templates and customize everything to match your brand. Setup is fast thanks to Shopify's built in AI tools. They write product descriptions and headlines for you and even help you edit your product photos. Marketing is built in too. You can create email and social campaigns that reach customers wherever they scroll down.

[Match]

As you grow, Shopify grows with you. Handle more orders, expand into new markets, and manage everything from one simple dashboard. In 2026, stop waiting and start selling with Shopify. Sign up for your one pound a month trial and start selling today at shopify.co.uk trigger.

[Francis]

Go to shopify.co.uk trigger that's shopify.co.uk trigger.

[Jeff]

This podcast is sponsored by Talkspace.

[Match]

Last year I went through Many different life changes. I needed to take a pause and.

[Jeff]

Examine how I was feeling in the inside to better show up for the ones who need me to be my best version of myself. When you're navigating life's changes, Talkspace can help. Talkspace is the number one rated online therapy, bringing you professional support from licensed therapists and psychiatry providers that you can access anytime, anywhere. Living a busy life, navigating a long distance relationship, becoming a first stepfather, Talkspace made all of those journeys possible.

[Match]

I could speak with my therapist in the office. I could speak of my therapist in the comfort of my home. I was never alone.

[Jeff]

Talkspace works with most major insurers and most insured members have a zero dollar copay. No insurance, no problem. Now get $80 off your first month with promo code space80 when you go to talkspace.com match with a licensed therapist today at talkspace.com save $80 with code.

[Francis]

[e-mail] I think it's because in school we look all we really learned about in history and all the things, the only thing that we can really remember is Nazis. Yes. Do you know what I mean? So it's like, Nazi, Nazi, Nazi, Nazi. Someone's going to clip that. Nazi, Nazi, Nazi. So then when we go through the world, we see good guys and we see Nazis.

[Jeff]

Absolutely.

[Francis]

And that's how we look at everything. Are you. Jeff goes, you know what? I don't really like the way that women don't have any, really have any rights in many Muslim countries. Yeah, I don't think that's cool. And they're like, oh, good guy, Nazi, Nazi, Right.

[Jeff]

And they say, oh, you don't understand their culture. You don't understand, like what do you. I think that that would just be a basic thing. No matter what the culture is, no matter what the region is. Probably don't hit her with sticks in the courtyard. And then they go, oh my God, can you believe this guy doesn't even understand how our culture works. And I go, I don't, I don't like it. But I have a commitment or I've made a commitment to myself where I'm just going to say what I think about the thing and if I'm wrong, then I'll change my position on it. When I feel like I'm wrong, but I feel like no matter what it is, I treat a woman as the same which they don't like. They go, hey, treat me like a woman. I go, no, I'm gonna treat you the way I treat everyone else. Same with whatever religion it is or whatever culture it is, whatever race it is. I don't talk different because I'm around my black friends. I don't. I don't. I'm not more gentle with my opinions because a girl is in the room. I'm always just gonna be the way it is.

[Francis]

Yeah. And it's also, as well, like, there are things that you. That people say that sound controversial, that kind of aren't. I remember I was on a date with a guy, and she was like, you know, all cultures are equal. And I went, they're really not. And she was like, what do you mean? I'm like, well, would you prefer to live here or on the Taliban rule in Afghanistan? And she was like, yeah. And I'm like, so where's better?

[Jeff]

It's a hierarchy. Yeah. Yeah.

[Match]

And she was like, ah, how did that date go?

[Francis]

I mean, that was it.

[Jeff]

I was also gonna say, like, what a fun hour you had right after that first time. Like, just by being, like, being like, I disagree with all cultures are equal. And then you're like, oh, that's good. That's gonna be our next hour.

[Match]

You won the argument.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Match]

Yeah. You won the battle and lost the war.

[Francis]

Exactly. But that's the thing as well. It's like. And this is a thing that I get really. I feel really sorry, actually, for young kids, which is politics is now everything and everywhere. Like, we're the same. The same age. I. I don't remember being kids and, like, talking about, you know, George Bush's presidency.

[Jeff]

Yeah. You'd have to be a nerd to, like, a president or, like, a politician or a mayor or a governor or any of those things. Yeah, it was very nerdy.

[Francis]

Like, do you mean. I don't know if you went to college, but if you did it, like, if you did you remember the kids who were into politics in college?

[Jeff]

No. Yeah, but, I mean, I didn't go to college, but. But you're making a good point.

[Match]

Right?

[Jeff]

It's only. Everything has only become political in the last, like, ten or eight years in my. In my life. People go, I don't remember you being so political comedically. I'm like, everything's political. I can't even be a comedian without being political, because everything is political. The weather was not political when I was young. When you talk about how warm it is in spring or how it didn't launch into, like, them seeding the clouds. It didn't launch into global warming. It didn't launch, you know, into, like, oil Companies and the farming. Like, it was just. You just talked about the weather, whereas now there's nothing you can talk about that isn't political. It's like, now we all are forced to be political.

[Match]

That's so interesting. I just saw a clip on your Instagram, which is a great bit about how gun store owners can't take a joke, basically. And it's hilarious. And I. Now that you've said that, I go, well, actually, 10 years ago, that would not have been a political joke, because a Republican who gets humor would also go to a gun store and be like, this guy's a bit uptight. Cause that's what a gun store owner is going to be. He's got to be serious. He's got to be disciplined. He's got to take the stuff that he does seriously and communicate that to his customers. And everybody else can see that, whether they are an R or a D. Yeah. But now I. I process that bit as just go, oh, Jeff is pushing back against the. It's everything.

[Jeff]

Literally everything. Yeah, you, like, I don't recall even sexual behavior being political. And now it is.

[Match]

How do you mean?

[Jeff]

Like, you were able to just, like, whatever you liked growing up where I grew up. Like, you know, you had the gay neighbors and you had your straight parents, and that was just your neighborhood.

[Francis]

Whereas.

[Jeff]

And maybe this is just too unique to, like, Seattle area. But now, like, you have to be pro gay. You're like, what does that mean, pro gay? Like, I have to root them on or like, Like, I don't understand, like, what it means. I don't even know what it means to be anti gay. Like, does that mean you, like, you. You think it's gross? Cause I do. I do think it's gross, but I also don't engage in it. Like, that's. I don't engage in anything that I don't like. I like, even people who they're hooking up with is somehow a political statement. Like, wearing like a rain. I support this community. It's like we all. They're just people. What do you mean you support them? Like, I don't understand how even that is like a political march. It's very. It's very strange.

[Francis]

Oh, man. We were just in San Francisco and I walked into this coffee shop. By the way, it's a hack observation. Left wing people do coffee much better than the right. The right of the right. The way they do coffee is, of course, in disgrace.

[Jeff]

Yeah. Which is strange. Let's turn that around. What's going on here?

[Francis]

And I sat down in this coffee shop in San Francisco and there were eight rainbow and pride flags.

[Match]

Yeah.

[Francis]

And I'm like, boys, you won.

[Jeff]

And we get it.

[Match]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Who cares who you're.

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

I. No one gives a. Yeah. I'm not grossed out by it. Unless I had to, like, try to do it myself. That would gross me out. But. But, like, I go, okay. Like, I don't understand. I don't really understand it. Yeah.

[Francis]

And it's kind of like everything now. You have to be part of a. Of an identity. Because if you're not an identity, then you're kind of on the outside, which is why every white man is now neurodivergent.

[Match]

Yeah.

[Francis]

Because you need.

[Jeff]

Very convenient. Yeah. Yeah.

[Francis]

You need something.

[Jeff]

Right.

[Francis]

You can't just be a regular dude.

[Jeff]

Every female comic I know is bisexual, but they're not. They just say it to get the claps from the audience. Like, I'm bisexual. And the guys will go. Because that's a group. They don't have to prove they're in.

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

It makes them look very open minded. But they're. They're all liars.

[Francis]

Yeah. And it's like, blackface is unacceptable, but gay face isn't, Right?

[Jeff]

Yeah. Or drag. Drag is woman face. Yeah, that's. That's a man admitting he's a man pretending to be a woman, doing his best impression of a woman wearing that. That's woman face.

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Yeah. It makes no sense.

[Francis]

It doesn't make any sense. And it's just, you know, it's almost like it's been mandated. Like, you have to. Like this. You can't like this. You have to celebrate this. You have to be upset at this.

[Jeff]

And someone listening to this might say, well, why does it matter? Who cares? Right? Like that. Maybe the Neil Dash. Why do you care? Well, I'll tell you what. There's a big wave of young people sharing very racist reels. Sharing very pro Nazi. Pro, you know, very. I don't know the right term for it. Very alarming, I guess, for the reels. And why do you think they're doing that? Because it's almost punk rock now to do that. It is less about the hate and less about the racism and all the. Whatever. It's. You've made it so exhausting. Society has made it so exhausting to be like this virtue signaling, pro, LGBT pro. Like your. Your parents are these, like, soft people who wouldn't put hormones in their chicken, but they'll put it in their fif grade daughter, you know? And so now you're going to witness this terrible rebellion that you're really going to regret. Like they've, they've, they've fatigued everyone with all this and it's causing some, I think, some pretty alarming stuff on the Internet of like, what is becoming cool.

[Match]

Well, it's interesting, isn't it? Because that's definitely happening. And it's, it's, it's not only is it happening, kids being rebellious, you can see it bleeding into real politics.

[Jeff]

Yes.

[Match]

As well.

[Jeff]

Gypsy, whatever his name is with the clown face. You know this guy? No, he isn't Gypsy Crusader or something like that.

[Match]

Let's not give him a signal.

[Jeff]

You know, this guy or Nick Fuentes or things like you're wondering why it's taking off. Like why it's become. Because it's becoming naughty and edgy and political or not political. Naughty, edgy and like, it's becoming punk rock.

[Match]

Yeah, it's like avant garde. Yes. You're pushing.

[Jeff]

You look how naughty I'm being. Which is very attractive to young people and like. And it's very scary.

[Match]

Young men especially. Yeah, it is very scary. Well, it's an interesting dynamic. It was kind of predictable. I mean, it's one of the reasons that I was always so concerned about wokeness as someone who was never, never thought of myself as being on the right. I just was like, you guys are being retarded. Like, you do this, you're gonna cause the exact same thing from the other side. And by the way, the other thing we talked about is like, if you make it terrible to be a particular sex or a particular skin color, and that's the worst thing you can be. While you celebrate other people for their skin color and their sex, what do you think is going to happen? Yeah, what do you think all these guys you've been pointing your finger at for 10 years. What, what, they're, they're just gonna just sit there and take it?

[Jeff]

Yeah. No, they won't. Yeah, I know.

[Match]

Especially as you said with that young brain when like, no, I probably didn't affect you and didn't affect me and didn't affect Francis because we're older. I've got my wife, she's like, when she's like, she sees a girl walking around or a guy walking around with the future's female teacher, she just goes, this guy's dumb. Yeah, this is dumb. Like, what the is this? And. But if you're a 15 year old boy, you don't have anyone to tell you this is just a crazy phase. In human history, you're going, this is the world.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Match]

And then your reaction to that is going to be, what is going to be?

[Jeff]

Yeah. This shirt should say the future is robot. That's what it should say.

[Match]

That's accurate.

[Jeff]

Yeah. Because a good shirt would be the future is human, but we're not going that direction. I have always. It's funny, I think that the more I'm talking to you guys, the more I'm realizing smart people are good at just finding the double standard and then weighing the, the logic of it. You know, it's like, it is so easy. It should be easy to understand. Hey, don't treat people wrong because of the color of their skin. But that would include all skin colors, right?

[Francis]

Yes.

[Jeff]

Like, you think, like, that's a very. But they don't. They need a villain. They need. They need to have to have a. Have not. They need an oppressor to have an oppressed. And so they can't even see it as that. They've got to see it as like, let's unite white people. That's not uniting, you know, and so smart people can see that and then measure it and then try to like, deal with it or whatever. I am always in an obsessive state of mind with, like, what am I allowed to judge?

[Francis]

People who follow this show tend to think for themselves. And anyone paying attention can see that. The same carriers keep showing up in stories about data breaches, leaks and surveillance scandals. If your provider keeps losing and selling your data, it's time to look at an alternative. That alternative is cape, a premium mobile carrier built to protect your privacy rather than harvest it. Founded by experts in telecom, cybersecurity and national security, Kape gives you the same level of service you would expect from AT&T or Verizon, but without the tracking and surveillance. Kape collects almost nothing at signup. No name, no Social Security number, no address. They cannot leak what they do not store. They also fix SIM swaps. So you get a 24 word phrase that is the only way to move your number. No one, not even Cape, can transfer it without that phrase. And here's the part most people never hear about. Most carriers still rely on the big networks, cores and sims, which means the same tracking and vulnerabilities follow you. Kape's different. It owns and operates its own mobile core and provisions its own sims, giving it real control over your security. It's not the easy way to build a mobile carrier, but it is the only way to build one that actually protects you. CAPE Offers a thirty dollar first month trial for new users. If this sounds like what you've been looking for and your phone is carrier unlocked and ESIM compatible, give it a try. And if you like it, you can use our code trigger 33 to get 33 off your first six months with CAPE.

[Jeff]

Right. I think I judge everything cuz as a comedian I'm very judgmental in my brain. But then I write, I put it through reason and then I go, okay, here's where I was being wrong. Here's how I was being immature, here's I was maybe being a little afraid or here's why I was being. And then I try to weigh it out but like for example, like I don't need to be pro or anti gay. Gay just is. And their opinion of my opinion of it is almost irrelevant because I'm not a gay guy, so it doesn't matter. But I can still be respectful and I can still be nice and I can still have gay friends. I don't need to approve of any, I don't need to approve of tennis. You know, I don't. My opinion of tennis is irrelevant, similar to my opinion of being gay. But when can I start judging it? So like if I like I'm smoking a cigar with my buddy and I'm in Seattle and a guy's walking, you.

[Match]

Really are on the right.

[Jeff]

I love a cigar. I don't have booze anymore, so cigars are my thing. I'm smoking a cigar and this guy's walking his boyfriend on a leash. The boyfriend's got like a leather dog mask. And in my mind I go, listen, I don't want to hurt those guys. I don't want anyone to be mean to those guys. I don't want anyone to shout anything to those guys. But can I go, what the are we doing? When can I nudge my buddy and go look at these guys? You know what I'm saying? Like that's, that's where I try to like figure out where. Cuz I think a hundred years ago if you saw that we would be allowed to like yell at those guys, right? What do we think? They'd probably be arrested. So I'm always wondering like, when can I judge?

[Match]

That's right. Yeah, well, I think you can judge that.

[Jeff]

Yeah, I judged it.

[Match]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Pretty hard.

[Match]

Yeah, you judged it pretty hard.

[Francis]

You know, because to me when I see those guys, I go, well what you're doing, that is provocative.

[Jeff]

Sure.

[Francis]

I don't care how you want to frame it, you're doing that because you want a reaction.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Francis]

So that I. And so that you then have something to talk about. Otherwise you wouldn't walk down the road dressed all in leather in a thong with your boyfriend on a leash wearing a dog mask.

[Match]

Also, it's got nothing to do with being gay anyway. Like, if I saw a guy walking his wife on a leash.

[Jeff]

Right.

[Match]

You'd also be like, what the is this?

[Jeff]

Great point. Yes. And I also think it might even be more nefarious because they're thinking, well, if this is normalized, then we're really making progress here. We're really going down the crazy socialist, Marxist kind of. What is kind of path. And if you can get away with that. Well, we're doing pretty good in Seattle if we can, you know, like, we've made good progress here. I walked my boyfriend 10 blocks and everyone just waved. Everyone let us just get away with whatever we want, right? Yeah, there's really no see something, say something anymore.

[Francis]

You know, you say socialist and you know about the dog walking boyfriend. I can't imagine Stalin was into that shit. You know what I mean? Like, it's so weird, this kind of conflation of extreme sexual practices and socialism.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Francis]

Because in the old days, socialists were pretty socially conservative. Right. You know what I mean?

[Jeff]

But they don't want that. So even by these new people's, even by modern times definition of that, they, they do this with words, you guys are comedians, where they go, well, that's not real socialism, you know. Oh, that, that's not, that was different. Or that wasn't real Marxism. The, the good Marxism. And you're like, you do they just. That's all they do is they run with words all the time. And so the way they see it is like, well, no, this is breaking down the current system for our version of socialism.

[Francis]

And I think what we need to do as people, and I remember just saying this when we used to have a lot of conversations about trans, is just go, can we accept this is weird?

[Jeff]

Right?

[Francis]

This is just weird. You dressing up in leather, wearing a gimp mask.

[Jeff]

Pretty funny. Pretty funny.

[Francis]

Pretty funny number one. And taking your boyfriend for a walk dressed as a Pyrex dog or whatever it is. Can we just accept that's weird? Right?

[Jeff]

I'm with you. They would go, no, why is it weird? And you go, oh my God. You know, it's weird. Yeah, yeah. I, I find it fascinating too, because like, if someone would put like a bird cage on their head and just wear a bird cage around on their head and then Every time they go to the store, be like, can you believe the way everyone looked at me? It's like, well, you're doing something different than what the group is. Yeah, that's all it is. So, like, whenever people want to go off on these. These white privilege or any of the things, it's like, a lot of times the things you're summarizing as white privilege are just majority privilege. If I'm in Compton and I go to a McDonald's and I'm the only white guy within seven miles, they're probably gonna look at me. They're just trying to figure out what I'm doing there. I got my gay sweater on. I'm a white guy. I'm clean cut. They're not staring at me because they're bigoted towards white people or they don't want me in their restaurant. They're just going to. That's different than the most. What's he doing here? Why? What's he popping around about? Was he here to do taxes for us? Like, why is this white guy here? And so, so many things like that happen where it's. It's just a majority. And then they react like, can you believe it? They're staring at us because we're gay guys. And you're like, well, no, they're not. You're just doing something different than the most. And that's what this trans whole thing is, is they like, you're very clearly a male biologically, and you're allowed to dress like a woman because you're a grownup. We'll let you dress however you'd like. But let's not pretend that it's not unusual when you're doing something different than what the group is doing. And that's all it is. We look, we go, okay, yeah, we're clocking it. You know, this is different than what else is going on.

[Francis]

You know, we had a comedian on the show called Steve Hughes, Brilliant Aussie, so funny Steve, brilliant comedian. And he made the point that, you know, he sees lots of people now, like, with a mohawk. And he's an older dude, he's in his mid-50s. And he's like, look, when I was growing up, if you had a mohawk, that meant you were saying you to society. I don't want to be accepted. I don't want a job in your bank. I'm a rebel. I'm on the outside. That's my choice. I'm punk.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Francis]

Like, now you get a mohawk. You wear a swastika, like, you know, patch on your arm. And you, you know, you walk around with your nipples pierced. Everyone can see it. And you're like, why can't I get a job at Goldman Sachs?

[Jeff]

Exactly. Yeah. No, you're nailing it. That's so true. And they're going, can you believe the way everyone's looking at me? Ye. Yeah. That's kind of. That was supposed to be the motivation. Yeah, right. I love.

[Match]

That's so funny. Do you think this is changing the culture? Do you think we've probably, you know, Kevin talks about peak work. Do you think we've gone past that now we're on the way down? Certainly in American comedy, it feels like, you know, I mean, you go to Austin, you watch some shows there. Like, there's at least two retards and a faggot and a. Whatever.

[Jeff]

I know. Which is shocking.

[Match]

You know, it is. Well, it kind of is, because you almost go, well, maybe this is an overswing in the other direction.

[Jeff]

I was. This observation is actually hack now because I said it years ago, and Now I've heard 20 people say my own sentiment back to me. But, like, I've. I was kind of like one of the comedians early on, being like, let's just say what we think, you know, let's not to be afraid of it. Like, if it's funny, like, work it out. And if it isn't funny, you know, you're just trying something. But, like, we should be able to say whatever words and whatever thoughts we think about the subject. And then Austin really took that, you know, like, they were like, yeah, but then you go to, like, the open mic, and the guy's like, these faggot retard. And I was like, not like that. We meant say whatever, but not like that or not so recklessly. So there is like a kind of happy thing. But I do think that. I think it's swinging back. I don't think anything can go too absurd. So it's like, I think we have hit peak woke and it's going down. But I do think it might be swinging back a little bit. Like with the Charlie Kurt, whenever there's, like, an issue, I feel like it kind of swings a little bit back and forth.

[Match]

Yeah. Well, it's an interesting point, isn't it? Because, like you say, I think what we always thought is, like, you find a happy medium between, you know, saying things that are controversial, but doing it in a way that's not actually hateful.

[Jeff]

Sure.

[Match]

And it can feel a little bit now like you talked about earlier online, but also Sometimes elsewhere that, like, the overswing in other directions also happen. It's just. It's kind of an extreme moment, isn't it?

[Jeff]

It is. And I also. It's fascinating to me that you don't do stand up anymore. I find that very fascinating because I think that comedy we talked about a little bit before we started recording, that comedy is such a great way to have people hear you. So it's like, you know, when I'm on Fox News, there's nobody turning on Gutfeld to be persuaded. There's nobody. You know, when I did, I campaigned for Trump in this last election and just did comedy basically, at these, like, things. And I actually would do a joke where I'd go, how many of you guys are undecided voters? And it would just be quiet. My work here's done, you know, And I imagine that to be true, even though I wasn't at a Kamala Harris rally. But at there, I would imagine also there was nobody, right. That was undecided. Whereas with stand up, it's a room full of people, and very often people who don't agree with anything, I think. Yeah, but comedy is a great mask to get into their hearts and brains and, like, say something, especially if it's funny. If it's funny, they go, why am I laughing at that? Did I find some truth in that? Or did it just hit my ears as shocking? Or why they might have to ask themselves, like, why am I feeling that way about that guy's comedy? Or why am I laughing about that guy's comedy? Because sometimes when they get pissed off and they go home, they also have to explain that to themselves or who they came with, like, why did that bother me so much? And it's like, you. So you can inspire those conversations or those thoughts. And standup is such a great cheat code into that.

[Match]

Yeah, well, I would say humor is a great cheat code into that. So that's why when I'm writing satirical columns on my sub stack or whatever or talking like, I can still be funny. Sure. But I guess all that happened for me really was during the pandemic. This took off and you also couldn't do stand up.

[Jeff]

Right.

[Match]

So after, like, two years of that, I just was like, I'm really not that interested to, you know, going back to the comedy circuit while this has taken off and taken all of my time. That's really. But humor, I think your point is, I. I can't remember. I think it was Oscar Wilde who said, if you want to tell the truth, people, the Truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.

[Jeff]

I love that.

[Match]

And that's kind of like, I think humor is a superpower.

[Jeff]

Well, Rumi used to start with jokes. So he would tell a joke and his, his goal was because it opens up a different type of listening. So, like, you know, with a song, we can probably have a conversation while someone's playing something beautiful, and it's not going to affect the, the quality of the, of the environment. But with, with poetry, you need to listen, and with a joke, you damn sure need to listen, because if you even miss one word, you're not going to get the joke. And so he would always start with a joke, which also is a great icebreaker, and then drop some wisdom on you. And so I think that like, comedy or jokes are so important, but I love it to be able to get in front of people who would otherwise just write me off as a straight, white, conservative guy. And I don't, I don't know why I asked you that, but I was just.

[Match]

No, no, no. It's an interesting conversation. I don't know if you've seen any speeches I've done, but whenever I do a speech, I totally take that on board. Because the way I think about it is humor is basically every time you do a joke that makes people laugh, if you're talking, you're buying 10 seconds of their attention. They're like, oh, maybe I'll listen to the next 10 seconds. And then there's another punchline, oh, maybe I'll listen for 15. And by the time you get to the end of a 10 minute speech, you can actually say a minute's worth of actual opinion.

[Jeff]

Sure.

[Match]

And they'll go, oh, that's interesting.

[Jeff]

Yeah. Well, and also when you're writing a joke, as opposed, I've never written a column or anything or an article, but with when I'm ranting on my podcast, which I guess would be comparable to like a rant or, you know, an article, it's all my opinions. And so I find myself not trying to be as reasonable. Whereas with a joke I'll often go like, well, what's the other side of this? And I'll try to find a thing, you know, and so I'm always doing that with my jokes is like, I don't think I'm being harsh on, on, on gay people. I'm just being honest and I'm gonna get down to the bottom of this. And then I'll always like, I'm trying to think of a good example of that in My actual. Well, I guess when I talk about women, like, like it's all for women. Like everything we do is for women. And I tell them that, but that in exchange they should be pretty happy about that. Why are you being so hard on us if it's also all for you? So it's like I'll give, but I also, I expect like a little bit of like take on it, you know. So I try to do that and then I find that very fun in stand up to do and is the.

[Match]

You mentioned that everything's political now. You do a lot of material about men and women dating, which is really funny.

[Jeff]

Thanks. Do you.

[Match]

Do you think that's become political as well or is that.

[Jeff]

It has, yeah, I think. For sure.

[Match]

Really?

[Jeff]

Yeah. Because women have considered themselves to be like some sort of group, you know, just all women somehow are on the same team, which I've never experienced. But for somehow in their brain they will go, women aren't like that. You know, they're very defensive about their tribe of being women. And so, you know, you can't even say a thing. Sometimes I could say something as simple as women hate video games and that triggers them like not all women. And you're like, geez, why would you feel so passionate about this? Do you know any gals that play video games? There's like one for every 9 million guys that does. But even that somehow is some sort of statement to them. And I think it's this never ending diet they've been fed of rights and privileges and patriarchy and all these things have. I don't know if it's the, if it's the universities or if it's just modern times or what it is, but they've been fed all this stuff and they're, they're falling in line with it.

[Match]

What's interesting is that actually. Well, obviously, but there is quite a lot of variability within how women think about things even politically. Like married women with kids do not vote the same way as unmarried young women in big cities.

[Francis]

Correct.

[Match]

Like those are two very different groups of people that beyond their vagina really don't have that much in common.

[Jeff]

Yeah, no.

[Match]

100%, you know, but there is that sort of group tribal mentality with it.

[Jeff]

Nonetheless, which makes no sense. I mean, I never thought I would see millions of women in the street passionate about killing their offspring. It's almost like it's gotten to the point where they're suggesting that abortion is good.

[Francis]

A while back I pushed myself in training because I'm a bit of A legend, but ended up with a backstory strain that took far longer to recover from than it ever used to. Nothing dramatic. Just one of those moments where you realize your body isn't snapping back the way it once did. And as you get older, those moments start adding up. Turns out there's a real reason for that. Your stem cells are the repair system your body relies on. They're the internal maintenance crew that keeps you healing, recovering and functioning. But that system slows with age. Fewer cells, weaker signals, slower bounce back. That's exactly why Qualia built their stem cell formula. It uses well researched ingredients like sea buckthorn and royal jelly to support your repair system. So your body can keep doing what it's meant to do. And it isn't something you take every day, just four days a month, to help maintain your regenerative capacity over time. So if you've ever felt like your body just doesn't bounce back like it used to, whether it's after a tough workout, getting sick, or the wear and tear of life, Qualia Stem Cell is for you. Qualia Stem Cell was designed to support your body's natural repair systems, helping you heal, recover, and keep going strong. And right now, you can try it for up to 50% [e-mail] trigg and here's a bonus user code, trig for an additional 15% off your order. That's Q U A L I A life your body's built to repair itself. Qualia helps it to do that better. Big thanks to Qualia for sponsoring this episode.

[Jeff]

Like we should able. We should be able to come to the agreement that abortion's not a great day. Whether you believe you should be able to get one or not get one, you can agree that's not a great morning. No one's excited to go, hey, let's get coffee today and then go get an abortion. Where the conversation, like, we should at least be able to fundamentally agree that's a bad morning. Right?

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

And we can't. People literally are going, no, I think this is. This is my. Like they almost talk about it in a different way than the reality of.

[Match]

It is, well, you said it just now, didn't you? It's about rights. Rights have become this, like, sacred thing, so we no longer think about, well, what is it a right to do? Like, you're right to take a dump. I respect it, but I'm not going to celebrate the act. Absolutely right.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Match]

Phobia, whatever it is. Do you see what I'm saying? Like, we've fetishized this idea of rights so much now that I think that's where it's come from. So they're not even thinking about what it is that they are promoting. And also it's kind of sticking it to the man as well, I think.

[Jeff]

I agree. 100 I. It's funny you said that because I think about it with. Maybe this is another thing we were talking about earlier about how. How we got here. Is that the over correction or the idea of, like, there's nothing good about being a homeless man, but we feel so much sadness that someone would be in that position that we've now championed them almost as an underdog. Now we're almost like, rooting for them because they're a homeless person. And you're like, well, you know, you shouldn't celebrate it. Like you were just saying. Same with being like a single mom. We treat single moms very good because it's hard to be a single mom. And it's an unfortunate position to find yourself in. And it's expensive and difficult and time consuming, but it shouldn't be the goal. You shouldn't go. Good for you. You're a single mom. Like, that shouldn't be the goal. We're just saying if you find yourself in that position, we feel a certain way towards you and we'll give you, you know, you deserve your credit for being in that position. And so, like, I think that all gets lost.

[Match]

Right. It's like, you know, if you get cancer, we feel bad for you, but we don't go.

[Jeff]

Right.

[Match]

Yeah, let's celebrate this. Because it's not good. Right. I'm not comparing single moms to cancer. I think that might be going a bit far, but you know what I mean? It's like, it is not a good outcome. And statistically, the evidence is very clear on that.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Match]

What happens to kids, particularly who grow up now? There are some amazing single moms, but would, if you speak to them, would they have chosen to be in that position an ideal environment?

[Jeff]

No.

[Match]

Most of them not.

[Jeff]

Yeah. And also. Yeah. Like. Like, it's hard to explain that to people. The way I'm at least thinking about it. It's hard to articulate it. Is that, like, there's nothing wrong with being a single mom, but that you. You should even know that that's not the goal and it is your right to terminate a pregnancy, but you should know that that's not a good thing. Like, that's not the position you should want to be in to have to make that decision. So it's just, it's all tricky.

[Francis]

You know, it's. When I was teaching, I never met a kid who was like, you know what, I'm glad I don't have a dad.

[Match]

Right.

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

No, that's, that's not a sentence anyone should say.

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Match]

You know, but they don't say. Yeah, they don't say it.

[Francis]

Yeah, they don't say that. That's the point. And I just think it's like, we want all this stuff, we just don't want any responsibility with it. We want to eat the fries without getting fat.

[Jeff]

Yep.

[Francis]

You know, we want to eat, we want to.

[Match]

Sound pretty good.

[Francis]

Yeah, it sounds amazing.

[Jeff]

We want freedom, but we don't want war.

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

We want to be safe, but we don't want guns. Yeah. Like no 100.

[Francis]

Yeah. And. And that's kind of how we now live where it's just like, you know, I'm anti war and you go, like, everyone's anti. Well, there's a few people are not anti war, but. But you're like, but dude. That every, most people are anti war. But the reality is if you want peace, there are times where you're gonna have to go to war. Unfortunately, you can't be anti war if there's Adolf Hitler going, yeah, well, we go, you know, there comes a point where you got to fight.

[Jeff]

Right.

[Francis]

And I don't think people really understand that. I think we've just got so used to being comfortable, to being safe that this idea that you might have to protect it or do something unpleasant or even acknowledge that if you do something, there's going to be a trade off to it. We can't live in that world anymore.

[Jeff]

I know. I wish everyone could understand that and hear that. It's like, what's so good about being safe? Like, like, like, like in. What in your life has ever been gained by. By a safe space or by not having like a challenge or not like working hard or not like everything that is good had that balance of being like difficult or being like the worst thing I ever went through or like even having a baby, like a pregnancy is uncomfortable and it's. You feel gross. And it takes nine months, which is a long time. And it's, it's, it's painful. And even the birthing process is like the most painful thing in the world. But you get a baby at the end. That's the kind of. The point is that like everything has difficulties to it. I don't know what. These young people are very obsessed with, like being safe. And everyone's feelings and everyone accommodated. It's like, yeah, it's not really how it works. And you shouldn't want it. You shouldn't want that.

[Francis]

But it's kind of like lying in bed all day and you go, I'm comfortable. And you go, well, yeah, you are comfortable, but A, you're not going to do anything, and B, you're going to get fat and see, your muscles are.

[Jeff]

Going to rot away and it's not that great after a few hours.

[Francis]

Yeah. So. And I think that the more you become accepting of discomfort and go, you know what? Life is about being uncomfortable. And if you actually want to achieve anything, most of the time it's not going to be comfortable. You see a hot girl in a coffee shop, you're like, oh, I'm. Maybe I'll go and talk to her. That's going to be pretty uncomfortable.

[Match]

But, you know, especially for her.

[Francis]

Yeah, exactly.

[Jeff]

But that nervousness is something you overcome, right. And that's why it's rewarding. Like when I see, like, this is a strange thing, but, like, when I see like a beautiful woman, I'm like, night. I have no feeling about it. I don't even want to do anything about it. Like, I like, I go, I don't feel nothing. You know, like, you need that nervousness. You need that. Like, should I. I might get rejected like that. That's the balance of all of it.

[Francis]

Yeah. And you know what's worse is walking away because it feels good in the moment, but a couple of hours later you're like, yeah, she was. She looks great. She was there, riding in her.

[Jeff]

That was my chance.

[Francis]

That was my chance. Maybe that was. That was the right. Yeah, but you never know because you walked away.

[Jeff]

Y.

[Francis]

And that's the same with everything in life. Like, you've got this great new joke. Maybe you try it, but maybe you'll lose the room. Yeah. Maybe you'll be like, hey, you know, maybe your Nazi Muslim stuff isn't the thing for, you know, for the vegan poetry cafe.

[Jeff]

Brooklyn didn't like it. Yeah.

[Francis]

But you'll never know.

[Match]

Speaking of women changing subjects, you live in la?

[Jeff]

Yes, sir.

[Match]

Lots of beautiful women.

[Jeff]

Yes.

[Match]

But they all look about half their actual age. Now, is this just a me thing or is this real? Like, everyone seems to have got some kind of injection of some kind. The forehead.

[Jeff]

I don't know if it's the injections, but I think we're aging better as people.

[Match]

Oh, you think it's just that.

[Jeff]

Yeah, I mean, maybe I'm I don't know. Do you guys find that to be true?

[Francis]

Oh, man. Have you ever seen. Oh, this is probably the wrong reference to you, but soccer players in the 1970s, they're like, 26.

[Jeff]

Yeah. But they look old as hell. Yeah, yeah.

[Francis]

They look in their 50s.

[Jeff]

My dad. I found a photo of my dad. In the photo, we clocked that he was, like, 34 years old, and he looked way older than me now. And I'm 42. And I was just like, what? And I was like, well, he had three kids by that age, and he had, like, my mom to deal with, and he was stressed out of his mind, working all the time. But I think I was just actually having this conversation with someone last night. Is that, like. I think vanity's gone a long ways. Yeah, but in a good way.

[Match]

Right.

[Jeff]

Like, even you guys are my age. You look young to me. Like, I'm sure if we were out of college, you know, we'd all be considered old guys to them.

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

But we definitely look better than the men that were our age, like, a hundred years ago.

[Match]

Oh, dude.

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Like, it's insane. Like, we all have a full head of hair. You know, we don't.

[Francis]

Look.

[Jeff]

I don't know how to explain it, but I think. I think it's vanity is what I think we've spent. All of our. All the generations have spent so much time on moisturizing creams and healthy food and guiltiness about things. So I don't know what I chalk it up to. Vanity, but.

[Match]

Right. Well. And also, we do live in a society that is more youth conscious than I think it ever was. I think if you were a politician in the mid-40s, 30s of the last century having gravitas and status and kind of that comes with age, the wise old head would. That would have been super valued.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Match]

Whereas, you know, I mean, Biden and Trump are kind of an exception to what I'm about to say. But, but. But mostly we do think, you know, we need to change. We need young blood. We need someone who's fresh. You know, I remember when Obama first came in. Oh, my God, he was so excited.

[Jeff]

So cool, charming and.

[Match]

Right, right.

[Jeff]

He was the first, like, superstar president. Right. Like, I was the first president I've ever saw. First politician I ever saw on espn, like, explaining his NCAA bracket. And I was like, this feels strange because I like to picture the president just at a desk with stacks of paper, and he's pulling out his hair and he's trying. Like, that's what I Picture politicians are always doing. And then I saw that and I was like, I guess he has time to, like, spin a basketball on his finger and, like, talk to mtv. Like, I remember, like, that was like, the first thing.

[Match]

Yeah, yeah, he was. He also had the very best answer to the question no one asks politicians anymore in this country. But it was like, the defining question is, have you ever smoked marijuana?

[Jeff]

Oh, yeah.

[Match]

And the answer was, you know, all the Republicans would be like, yeah, yeah, I did, but I didn't inhale. Right.

[Jeff]

Clinton's answer. Yeah.

[Match]

And Clinton, basically all of them. And then they went to Obama, they went to June hell. And he went. Yeah, that was the point.

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

You know, which I think we're witnessing with Trump. Yeah, Trump. What everyone didn't like about Trump or what everyone criticized about Trump was like. Like how wild he was with his language and sentences and opinions and stuff. But they claim they hate that now they're all doing it. Look at AOC's Twitter. Look at, like, look at the way Elizabeth Warren now talks when she's talking to the press. Like, they all hate him for it, but they're doing it. They're doing the exact same thing. So, like, if they would have stuck to their guns and just, like, been like, no, we're going to keep this political kind of thing, I would give them the. I would allow them to hate Donald Trump. But it seems like they're very inspired by his antics and the way he docks.

[Francis]

You know, what's so smart about Trump is the fact that he's funny. And because he's funny, he makes a joke and no one cares what happens afterwards because we live in the social media age. He's got the clip, and the people, msnbc, they've got the clip. They can put it on their Twitter. It'll go viral. So I'll give you an example. He was asked about, I think he was on Air Force One, and the journalist went to him. What do you think about Zora Mamdani? People say that he's the Trump of the left. And he went, you know, I'm much better looking than Zara. And then they all laugh.

[Jeff]

That's funny.

[Francis]

And then that's all the people remember, Right?

[Jeff]

Boom.

[Francis]

And it went viral.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Francis]

It's so powerful and it's so smart.

[Jeff]

It's a great strategy, for sure. Yeah. It's almost like the Art of War. Like. Like, he knows exactly how to wiggle these things. I don't know if I like that. Trump's funny. He's inarguably. Funny.

[Francis]

Oh, yeah, hilarious.

[Jeff]

I don't know if I want him to be. I like him when he's just saying things he thinks, and I also like him, that he's funny. But I don't know if it's good. I don't know if it's a good thing because it just drives all the people that don't like him insane, and they act insane. They can't process it. And so for me, it's like, I don't know if I need my president to be funny. I don't want my doctor to be funny. I want my comedians to be funny. I don't mind if actors are funny or these other people, but, like, I don't know if. If it's good for us or not, because when Trump says a funny thing like that, my crazy neighbor just loses his mind. You hear what he said?

[Francis]

He said, oh, he's talking about he's.

[Jeff]

Better looking than like. And so I don't know if it's. It's very productive.

[Match]

Yeah, it sort of pandas to your base. But it's polarizing.

[Jeff]

It is polarizing.

[Match]

It's polarizing.

[Jeff]

And I'm in a. I'm in a constant mindset of, like, how can we bridge the gap?

[Match]

Right.

[Jeff]

I don't agree with a ton of the left's policies, but I still see them as Americans. I still see them as, like, I like to think of us as fellow man. You know, Like, I would like to get along with all the people. I would. I would hope someone would say the person I wanted to win didn't. But I hope that they have what's best in mind for America. Like, that's what I like to think. And that's my goal, at least.

[Match]

That's so interesting. I was at a. I was in Australia. I was doing small tour of Australia a couple years back, I think, and I was at a dinner where there was a bunch of politicians left and right. And one of them, the guy who was hosting, a good friend of mine, stood up and he went, you know, I've always known that the other party will get elected at some point, and I want them to be the best possible government for Australia. And I was like, oh, my God, I haven't heard this for, like, 20 years.

[Jeff]

Yeah, I think that's good.

[Match]

Of course.

[Jeff]

Yeah. Well, because, like, yeah, I mean, it's simple. Like. Like, in, like, any sport, you might not like your captain, but, like, at least he's. We're all trying to win, you know, we're all trying to we should have the same goal.

[Match]

Right.

[Jeff]

Like, nobody wants to see. Like, I don't like when people post, like, liberal tears or like, any of those kind of things. And I think that's kind of what Trump channels.

[Match]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

And I am a Trump guy. I like Donald Trump. I just think, you know, if I'm going to comment on his imperfections, I don't think the trolling is a good idea. Even though it is funny.

[Francis]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

I like it. The bad part of me likes it. Well, that's a naughty party.

[Match]

Very good point. Because I think, like, as just an outside observer, you hear people talking less and less about the fact that we're all American and much more about the other side.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Match]

And at the end of the day, this is a country of people who have things in common.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Match]

Like left wing Americans. Right wing Americans are more similar than people in other countries.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Match]

With similar political views to that particular thing. Do you know what I mean? Like, even left wing Americans are still, like, incredibly aspirational. We were talking about this before we started, like, your, Your time on. In Britain, on the Isle of. Isle of man or island. Right. Like, the same American dream thing is not going on in the Isle of White.

[Jeff]

Yeah, not at all. No, it was very. I. I was. I've never felt more American than when I was in the Isle of Wight. We would shoot like a scene and like, we were all aliens. It's kind of like the, the project that's. That we were shooting was the idea of like, it's. It's kind of like Star wars if it was a comedy. So like, modern times is like, now there's creatures from all these planets that are all like, on all the planets kind of diversifying, and they'd be like, all right, you're gonna come into this bar and they're like, just, you know, do something. Just. Just wing it for this take. Like, let's. You're a comedian. Just do something funny. So I'm going into this bar with all these aliens and stuff, and I. I'm an alien also. And I figured that he's drunk and they've booked me to be this, like, louder, you know, this loud, you know, American, ish, kind of alien. So I come in, I just wing it. And I was like, yeah, there's so much here. And I just watched like, everyone be like, the. Is this guy doing? And I was like, that'd be like a real normal thing for like an American bro to say, you know? And I watch all the directors that ever lay on their heads like, can you believe what he just said? Like, on the thing, I, I felt like at least the little experience I had of the week in the Isle of Wight, I was like, I was just such a big, loud ass, you know.

[Match]

But you also, you did ask some British people what their dreams were.

[Jeff]

Yeah.

[Match]

Which I, That's a sketch in itself, man.

[Jeff]

Oh, my God. Yeah. They didn't know what to do with that question. I was like, so, like, what do you guys. And they were just literally like, we have a family and we live here. This is, this is kind of the thing. And I was like, all right, sorry to ask, you know.

[Francis]

Yeah. But the point that you were making about the liberal tears is so profound because if you truly love your country, you want a good, strong left wing opposition because they're going to hold the right to account 100%. You want the Democrats, you want a kind of Obama like figure who the moment Trump steps, takes a misstep, he is on him and he's going, hey, that's wrong. What you're doing here is not cool for a, B, C, D and E reasons. Sort this out.

[Match]

Right.

[Francis]

Because if you don't have that, then the people, because it's human nature, they're going to be like, hey, I got away with this, I can get away with this. I can get away with that.

[Jeff]

Yeah. I think also too, I know this is like a kind of overlapping grand scheme kind of idea, but. Well, I think one of the biggest problems that we're having in our country is that people are treating their politics like religion. And so all these people, they've all abandoned religion. Like, it's so trendy to say, I'm not religious and I hate Christians or blah, blah, blah. Unless the religion is outside of America, then it's beautiful because it's a different race, you know, but they hate any kind of domestic religion. They hate any sort of like, religious behavior. They scoff at church, they publicly criticize Christianity, yet they act out their politics as religious zealots. Like, the behavior they claim they hate, they do for their politics. So they'll say, oh, I would, I, I don't even talk to my parents anymore. I can't believe they think like that. Or like anyone that would vote for him is, I couldn't do it. I would never date someone that like, they're acting it out. And I think that's the biggest problem is you should be interacting with the other side like you should be having, you should have friends that have all different thoughts and ideas. And in my opinion, that's the biggest problem with what we're going through.

[Francis]

It's completely true. I remember talking to this comedian, and he said to me, you know what? I don't have any friends that I disagree with. And I'm like, well, then you're a child.

[Jeff]

That's a problem. Yeah, you're a child.

[Francis]

Because what that means is you can't bear one moment of discomfort of somebody going, hang on. You know this thing you said is actually not true, Right?

[Jeff]

And how not fun must that be?

[Match]

Yeah.

[Jeff]

Yeah. That must be terrible to just. No one disagrees with you at all ever. Like, that's insane. That it. Like. Like a day in that life would be pretty boring.

[Match]

Well, man, it's been great having you on. Really enjoyed this. Your stuff is awesome. I hope people check you out. I'm sure they will. We're gonna go to Substack and ask you questions from our audience. Oh, perfect. In a second. But before we do, last question is always the same. What's the one thing we're not talking about as a society that we really should be?

[Jeff]

One thing we're not talking about that we should be talking about as a society that we should be maybe, I mean, kind of like overlapping what we were just talking about. It's just, like, getting along. Like, what do you really want? Like, what's the goal? You know, like, why do you want to view people as other? I think we live in such a debate culture that nobody's having conversations where they can just go, oh, that's an interesting perspective. Or, oh, I agree with that. Now let's chew on that. They want to win. The goal is to win the argument, not come to a nice understanding. They're trying to defeat each other. And I think that we should be talking about, you know, we should be trying to get along is what I think.

[Match]

All right, head on over to triggerpod.co.uk where we ask Jeff your questions.

[Francis]

I think it's okay to tell any joke, no matter what the setup subject or how offensive it is. If it's funny, the risk of falling out of a friend or an. Or an audience over it is on the teller. Do you agree.

[Jeff]

With sam?