Alistair Wilson

Summary

True Crime All The Time Unsolved – "Alistair Wilson" (April 7, 2025)

Main Theme & Purpose

In this episode, hosts Mike Ferguson and Mike Gibson ("Gibby") delve into the unsolved 2004 murder of Alistair Wilson, a Scottish banker gunned down on his doorstep in the tranquil seaside town of Nairn. With a focus on the personal life of the victim, the hosts explore theories ranging from mistaken identity to business conflicts and connections to organized crime, highlighting recent investigative developments and emphasizing just how baffling—and potentially solvable—the case remains two decades later.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Introduction to the Case (03:35–06:08)

• Victim Profile: Alistair Wilson, 30, married to Veronica, with two sons aged four and two at his death.
• Setting: The Wilsons lived a seemingly idyllic life in Nairn, a crime-rare Scottish seaside town.
• Veronica’s Account: She describes Alistair as "genuine, honest … caring" (05:29).

Life Leading Up to the Murder (06:31–08:25)

• Alistair’s banking career led the family to Nairn in 2003.
• He was recently disillusioned at the bank, set to take a new job at BRE Highlands—just two weeks left in his notice period at the time of his murder.
• Notable Quote: "Does his job … have anything to do with the murder?" – Mike Ferguson (08:25)

The Night of the Murder (09:18–14:53)

• The family and friends had a typical weekend; the evening was unremarkable until a stranger came to the door (11:47).
• The visitor, described as a stocky, clean-shaven white man (35–40, 5'6"–5'10"), only asked for "Alistair Wilson".
• Alistair received a mysterious blue envelope addressed to "Paul", which was empty; visibly puzzled, he returned downstairs—then was shot (13:12).
• Memorable Quote:
  • "Safe but like what in the world just happened..." – Mike Ferguson (13:15)
  • "And the next thing you know, he [Alistair] is shot three times lying in his own blood." – Mike Ferguson (14:53)

Immediate Aftermath (15:03–18:33)

• Veronica finds Alistair badly wounded; blue envelope gone, the killer seen walking away.
• Witnesses rushed to his aid; Alistair died in the hospital about an hour later.
• Ballistics traced the weapon (an antique Haenel Schmeisser pistol) and old Eastern European ammunition found in a drain days later—not a common crime weapon.

Theories & Investigative Dead Ends (18:33–28:28)

• No evidence supporting rumors of money laundering or familial involvement. Son Andrew’s tragic memory: "The only memory of my dad I’m left with is the image of him lying on the doorstep." (18:32)
• Police examined the gun’s provenance and entertained theories involving Irish paramilitaries and money lending, but no definitive connection was established.
• Journalist Fiona Walker’s investigation into an anonymous tip ("Peter") provided plausible background details but lacked proof.
  • Notable Reflection: "Some believable information, but not solid enough to say, yeah, this is what happened." – Mike Gibson (25:07)

Theories of Mistaken Identity & Local Conflict (28:28–31:46)

• The blue envelope for "Paul" raises questions about mistaken identity.
• There was another Alistair Wilson living nearby (in his 60s).
• Alternate conflict: Alistair had recently complained—almost contemporaneously—to the council about the neighbor’s (Andy Burnett’s) hotel deck (43:21–46:11).

Suspects & Witnesses (34:00–48:37)

• Police sought Sean Douglas, a neighbor who moved away and refused to give DNA, stirring suspicion.
• Focus also turned to Andy Burnett, the hotel owner who arrived at the scene quickly, and was friends with Alistair (despite recent conflicts).
• Burnett was cleared as a suspect ("Andy Burnett is absolutely a key witness … not a suspect." – Det. Insp. Gary Winter, 40:25).
• In 2022, a new possible suspect emerged—a local man in his 20s at the time, later imprisoned for drug offenses, and linked to Burnett on social media.

The Decking Dispute & Timing (43:21–46:11)

• The decking complaint letter’s arrival at Burnett’s hotel just days before the murder frames a suspicious timeline, though few believe someone would kill over such a dispute.
• "What do you make of this decking issue? … It just is not adding up to me." – Mike Ferguson (45:45–46:11)

Possibility of Two Assailants (49:08–49:37)

• Police and ex-detective Peter Blexley theorize two men may have been involved: one to lure Alistair, another to do the killing, potentially to avoid identification.

Frustration with Investigation Progress (50:18–54:03)

• The Wilson family was told a suspect would be arrested in May 2023—didn’t happen, leading to a misconduct ruling against a senior officer.
• In September 2024, Scotland’s top law officer ordered Operation Sabine, a thorough cold case review.
• Hosts lament the lack of transparency: "They could shut down some of those rumors … but they don’t want to disclose that information." – Mike Ferguson (53:17)

Ongoing Theories & Final Thoughts (46:30–54:03)

• The hosts debate the plausibility of various scenarios—business fallout, mistaken identity, criminal underworld debt, local disputes.
• Modern forensic techniques (e.g., DNA24) have yet to yield answers.
• Hosts remain optimistic but realistic about the difficulties of solving such a cold case: "It does sound like they are going to throw some resources at this thing … I do think it’s a case that could be solved." – Mike Ferguson (54:01)

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• "Six weeks, that is really fast [to get engaged]." – Mike Gibson (04:29)
• "It was very nice having somebody who just instantly cared so much." – Veronica (as quoted by Mike Ferguson, 05:29)
• "[Alistair] was a loving father. His sons were his priority." – Mike Ferguson (06:10)
• "The Wilsons lived on a quiet street … directly across from the Havelock Hotel … a lively bar." – Mike Ferguson (07:44)
• "She didn't feel nervous … assumed he had something to do with his work." – Mike Ferguson (11:47)
• "The only thing that makes any sense to me was that it was the wrong Alistair Wilson." – Veronica Wilson (28:09)
• "Maybe he stumbled across some things that were shady. … Maybe it’s part of the reason why he wanted to leave." – Mike Ferguson (27:02)
• "Alistair's objection was discussed at the bar … but locals are skeptical about this theory." – Mike Ferguson (43:21–45:30)
• "Andy Burnett is absolutely a key witness in this investigation and not a suspect." – Det. Insp. Gary Winter (40:25)
• "It’s kind of pretty hard to take anything completely off the table." – Mike Ferguson (27:11)
• "With the reinvestigation and advancements in DNA technology, it’s possible the murder may be solved one day." – Mike Ferguson (51:44)
• "There’s a lot of rumors … the police not … saying what they found in their dissection of Alistair’s finances. They could shut down some of those rumors." – Mike Ferguson (52:57–53:17)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 03:35 – Start of Alistair Wilson case, background & family
• 09:18 – Events of the day leading to murder
• 11:47 – Description of the killer and delivery of the envelope
• 13:12 – Alistair is shot; blue envelope gone
• 15:03 – Neighbors respond, ambulance arrives
• 17:14 – Discovery of murder weapon
• 18:32 – Son Andrew’s memory & aftermath for the family
• 20:23 – Police inquiries into gun origin & paramilitary theories
• 22:36 – Media tipster “Peter” and the unexplored lead
• 25:58 – Veronica’s skepticism toward the “Peter” lead
• 28:09 – Mistaken identity theory discussed by Veronica
• 34:00 – Sean Douglas (neighbor) introduced as a person of interest
• 36:20 – Andy Burnett’s statements about the deck conflict & police interviews
• 40:25 – Police officially state Burnett is a witness, not a suspect
• 43:21 – Timeline and implications of the deck dispute
• 46:30 – Possibility of alternate suspects and two assailants
• 50:18 – Wilson family complaint regarding the investigation
• 50:51 – Launch of Operation Sabine (major new cold case review)
• 54:01 – Hosts’ reflection on the case's solvability and ongoing rumors

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Summary & Takeaway

• Decades Later, No Closure: Two decades on, the motive for Alistair Wilson’s murder remains elusive. Despite plausible theories—from mistaken identity to business or neighbor conflicts—no conclusive evidence or suspects have emerged.
• Recent Renewed Interest: New forensic techniques, suspect descriptions, and Scotland’s top law enforcement resources are being brought to bear in an effort to finally break the case.
• Enduring Impact: The episode highlights the toll unresolved cases take on families and communities, as well as the persistent shadows cast by rumor and speculation.
• Balanced Tone: As always, Mike and Gibby keep the tone conversational and occasionally light, but never lose sight of the case's tragedy and gravity.

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For listeners who missed the episode, this summary offers a clear roadmap through the twists and uncertainties of one of Scotland’s most enigmatic unsolved murders.

Transcript

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[Podcast Listener (Ashley)]

Podcast Sam.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Foreign.

[Mike Ferguson]

And welcome to episode 409 of the True crime All the Time unsolved podcast. I'm Mike Ferguson and with me, as always, is my partner in true crime, Mike Gibson. Gibby, how are you?

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Hey, I'm good. 409, man, that's like the Mr. Clean of episodes.

[Mike Ferguson]

Is it? Yeah, I think those are two different brands, but I get what you're saying.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Trying to. Trying to mix it in somehow.

[Mike Ferguson]

Let's go ahead and do our Patreon shout outs. We had Brad. Oh, hey, I o shafen.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

What's up, Brad?

[Mike Ferguson]

Audrey Fatzer.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Hey, thanks, Audrey.

[Mike Ferguson]

Tats and cats.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Like some tats.

[Mike Ferguson]

Kelly Murphy.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Hey, Kelly.

[Mike Ferguson]

I don't know why that just hit me as funny when you said I like me some tats. Oh, okay. We had Jace Thornock.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Hey, Jace. Erica C. I appreciate that, Erica.

[Mike Ferguson]

Colleen F. There's Colleen. Mary Mc.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Oh, Mary.

[Mike Ferguson]

Lonnie. Davis.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Hey, appreciate that, Davis.

[Mike Ferguson]

Brenda.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Hey, Brenda.

[Mike Ferguson]

And last but not least, Chad o'. Neill.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Good old Chad.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. Appreciate the new support. Then if we go back into the vault this week we selected Jody Searle. Hey, thanks S. So we appreciate that long term support as well. We also had a great paypal donation from Gentry Sumrall.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Hey, thanks, Sumrall.

[Mike Ferguson]

Thank you to everyone.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Absolutely.

[Mike Ferguson]

We have a great episode out right now on True crime all the Time where we're talking about Jonathan Graham. And this is a case with a lot of twists and turns. You know, we're talking murder, rape in 1986 that goes unsolved for almost 20 years. It does but the way that police get to this person and tie him back to these horrible crimes is kind of amazing. I don't want to give it away. I want to make sure everybody goes out and listens to it.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

And toss a roadblock in there, too.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, well, they were sent down the wrong path for sure at a certain point in time. All right, buddy, are you ready to get into this episode of True Crime? All the Time unsolved.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I'm ready.

[Mike Ferguson]

We're talking about the murder of Alistair Wilson. Scottish banker Alistair Wilson was having a perfectly normal Sunday evening with his family when a stranger showed up at his home. Minutes later, Alistair was gunned down outside his front door. After 20 years, the murder remains unsolved. And Alistair was just 30 years old when he was murdered. He and his wife Veronica had been married for six years and had two sons who were four and two at the time of his death. So we're talking about a young guy here. They really are with a family, two very small children. Alistair and Veronica had what was called a whirlwind romance and were engaged within six weeks of meeting. Through mutual friends, Veronica told the BBC he was one of those people you met and you just knew it all happened very fast.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Well, six weeks, that is really fast.

[Mike Ferguson]

It is. And some people, you know, are like that and they're happy for the rest of their lives.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Sure. Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Some people are, you know, have that type of beginning and it falls apart very quickly. Just never know.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

You fell in love with your wife right away, though.

[Mike Ferguson]

I know that I did very, very quickly.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Not the same for her, but for you. Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

For her it took much, much longer. Much convincing.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Still working on it.

[Mike Ferguson]

I'm still working on it. Veronica was a graphic designer in Fort Williams, Scotland. Alistair was sent there for his first posting for the bank of Scotland, where he started working after graduating from sterling University in 1996. You know, one place I've not been that I've always wanted to go was Scotland.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

And you should, because that's where your bloodline is.

[Mike Ferguson]

That's where the Ferguson clan's from.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Apparently they got a whole neighborhood for you called Ferguson, called Neighborhood of Ferguson.

[Mike Ferguson]

Thought you were thinking of something derogatory that you were going to say. Alistair was described as a genuine, honest man. Veronica said when he said he'd be there at 8 o', clock, he was there at 8 o' clock with a bunch of flowers. It was very nice having somebody who just instantly cared so much. And, you know, obviously she's saying all types of glowing things about him. Which you often hear in the wake of someone being murdered. But I'm not taking that this way. I'm taking it as you know, she was devastated. This was the love of her life and he was a great guy.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

He did everything the right way for her.

[Mike Ferguson]

Alistair was a loving father. His sons were his priority and he enjoyed spending time with his family whenever he could.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Now, that's you.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yes. Yeah. I am a family person through and through. I love spending time with my wife and my girls. Not to hurt anyone's feeling, but there is no one I'd rather be with.

[Podcast Listener (Ashley)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Eventually, Alistair was transferred to the bank of Scotland's headquarters in Edinburgh. He worked in private finance and specialist lending. He was happy when he transferred to Inverness in northern Scotland. And I won't swear to it, but I think there's a big golf course in Inverness.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I wouldn't be surprised because I'm thinking there's probably a lot of golf courses in Scotland.

[Mike Ferguson]

There's a lot of big golf courses, famous ones, but I think there's one there. In 2003, Alistair was promoted to lead a business banking team and was responsible for securing loans for small to medium sized companies. That year, the family moved to Nairn, a seaside town in northeast Scotland. Nairn was and is considered a safe, family friendly place. Now, I don't know if I'm saying it correctly, but that's what I'm going with. Before Alistair was killed, the last murder there occurred in 1986.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I mean, the BC side gotta be pretty nice.

[Mike Ferguson]

That's a long time between murders, that is. So when you talk about, say, family friendly. Okay, I can see why people would think that or say that you're feeling.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Pretty good about living there.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. You're feeling pretty safe. The Wilsons lived on a quiet street behind a main road directly across from the Havelock Hotel. Described as a family run seaside pub hotel with a lively bar. Sounds like a great place. You said you know, seaside. Now we're talking pub. It's lively. Get you a pint, maybe Guinness, Some haggis? Some haggis? I know for a fact you would not eat haggis.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I definitely would not.

[Mike Ferguson]

You won't even eat mushrooms and olives when I order pizza. So haggis is definitely off the menu for you.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

No doubt. Not gonna lie. Gonna stay away from the haggis.

[Mike Ferguson]

By late 2004, Alistair was disillusioned with his career at the bank of Scotland and accepted a job with an environmental consultancy called BRE Highlands. He had just two weeks left of his notice period when he was murdered. So that's an interesting fact. I mean, it's something that is going to have to be considered. Right. Does his job, does him leaving his job have anything to do with the murder that we're getting ready to talk about?

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Potentially?

[Mike Ferguson]

Veronica told the BBC the challenge wasn't there and he wasn't doing what he'd set out to do, helping other people. More and more, he couldn't. It didn't fit into the rules now of the bank. Okay. I think you and I have both experienced something along those lines.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah. So he's having some challenges.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. And he wants to do something else. On Sunday, November 28, 2004, Alistair Wilson was murdered on his front doorstep. The Wilsons were doing their typical evening routine after a busy weekend with friends. Veronica recalled on Saturday, we were focused on tidying and clearing away Christmas, wrapping as much as we could. Al was cleaning downstairs. I'm cleaning up and we're swapping over, passing each other on the stairs. Our friends arrived by tea time. We put all the children down to sleep and caught up with them. We had a nice evening.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Nothing like a good tea time.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. I've been watching a true crime documentary on Netflix and it takes place over in. I can't remember if it was Britain or Ireland or somewhere over there. And they're always talking about tea time.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Good old tea time.

[Mike Ferguson]

To me, tea time is associated with golf. You know, you have a tea time. But I know for. For people over there, tea time is a big deal. Tea is a big deal.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

It is a big deal.

[Mike Ferguson]

I do not like tea.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

You are not a tea person.

[Mike Ferguson]

I am a coffee person. On the 28th, the two dads went for a walk in the woods with the older kids and the moms took the younger kids to a play center. The couples had lunch and said goodbye to each other at 3pm So, I mean, it sounds like a pretty good weekend with friends.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

It does.

[Mike Ferguson]

I'm sure the kids were hanging out with the friends kids and everybody's having a good time. Alistair and his oldest son then went to the grocery store, dropped off recycling, and washed the car. Around 7pm Alistair was reading a story to the boys and Veronica was upstairs doing laundry when an unidentified man rang the front doorbell. At the time, they were babysitting a friend's child. Veronica assumed the parents were there to pick him up, so she went to answer the door. All the stranger said to her was Alistair Wilson. Veronica described him as a white man with a stocky build, wearing a dark baseball Cap pulled over his face, a dark blue bomber jacket and dark jeans. He was clean shaven, 35 to 40 years old and 56 to 5 10. Veronica didn't feel nervous and even left the front door open while she went upstairs to get Alistair. She assumed he had something to do with his work.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

This guy kind of sounds like Tom Hardy in that new show called Mobland.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, I mean I think the key to me here is her saying that obviously there was nothing that stood out about this guy who to the point where like it gave her any type of concerns whatsoever and they're in a.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

What is considered a friendly neighborhood.

[Mike Ferguson]

Right. So I mean this guy must have looked, you know, pretty normal, like he belonged there. He's clean shaven. Alistair came downstairs to the front door. The exchange between Alistair and the man lasted only a couple of minutes. Two people on the opposite side of the road witnessed two men talking at the front door but they didn't see the visitor's face. Alistair then went back into the house closing the front door behind him. He returned to the boy's bedroom holding a bright blue envelope, the kind that would hold a birthday card. The name Paul was written on the front. According to Veronica, he was a bit bewildered as to what the gentleman had said because the the envelope wasn't addressed to him. She told Alistair that the man asked for him by name. Alistair opened the envelope and found it was empty. Veronica said that he was puzzled but there wasn't fear there. The door's closed, we have a phone right next to us and we have my dad on the top floor.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

So feeling fairly safe.

[Mike Ferguson]

Safe but like what in the world just happened, you know is what I'm thinking. And especially Alistair, he seemed to be very puzzled. Obviously there was a short conversation. He was handed this envelope, there was nothing in it and it was addressed to somebody named Paul. So a very strange interaction. They talked about putting the boys to bed first and then trying to figure out what was going on. But Alistair insisted on going back down to see if the man was still there. Moments later Veronica heard a loud noise. At first she thought some wooden pallets had fallen but she ran down and found her husband on the floor. Alistair had been shot twice in the head and once in the body. Veronica told the BBC I don't know what I'm expecting to find. Al's lying there. I think he's been hit. You know the guy's punched him. I ran over and he's covered in blood. The blue envelope was gone and. And Veronica saw the stranger walking Left down Crescent R. She ran across the street to Havelock Hotel and asked for help. So I mean, I think we have to take a minute here and just kind of walk through this scenario. There's a strange interaction that could have been kind of the end of it for that moment. But I think it seems to me that, you know, Alistair was so kind of puzzled by what just happened that he wanted to go back and talk to the man and maybe get some clarification.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah. Like I'm not sure what our exchange was about.

[Mike Ferguson]

And who's Paul?

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

And you gave me this envelope that says Paul.

[Mike Ferguson]

And the next thing you know, he shot three times lying in his own blood.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

And the guy doesn't run away, he.

[Mike Ferguson]

Just walks away and he takes the. The envelope.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Lindsey Gardner and her friend ran over along with owner Andy Burnett. Lindsay recalled that Alistair's cheek was puffed out. He was conscious but struggling to breathe. Andy Burnett spoke to Sunday Times journalist David James Smith in 2005. Smith recalled about his statement per the BBC. He said that he went up the steps and saw that Alistair was lying on the ground. And he also described seeing a bullet hole just beneath his cheek. Veronica was there and it seemed to Andy that she was in shock. He described how he got hold of her and made her look at him. He asked her what happened and she said this really weird guy came to the door. I mean, I don't know how you process that. You know, man or woman, if you find your spouse after hearing a noise and the person has been shot three times, it's going to be hard to process.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I think the whole way that it went down is so bizarre. And the fact that you didn't even think about this happening would be so difficult.

[Mike Ferguson]

It's not something you ever imagine.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

And to me, the, the safer the places where you live, the less you would imagine it, the less that you would worry about it. Think about it though, I think the more shocking it would be. It's always going to be shocking, obviously, if you're spouse is shot. Alistair died of his injuries about an hour later at the hospital. You know, I go back to that image of, you know, being shot in the cheek. A bullet hole just beneath his cheek. And you know, one of the women who came over said his cheek was puffed out.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

The ammo that killed Alistair was 25 caliber made by Sally and Ballot in the Czech Republic between 1983 and 1993. So whenever it was made it was older ammo. Yeah. It was either 10 years old, 20 years old. But somewhere in that, in that range.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Somebody must have had a few boxes laying around.

[Mike Ferguson]

Ten days later, on December 8, 2004, workers doing gully cleaning on C Bank row found a gun in a drain. According to the Northern Times, it was a Hao Schmeisser 6.35mm model, believed to have been manufactured between 1922 and 1930 in Germany.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

So really an old gun?

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, and I've never heard of that brand. I don't even know if I'm pronouncing it correctly. The case which became known as the Doorstep murder was a major news story. The police appealed to the public for information, but the case remained unsolved. And how could this not be a big news story? We just described what a safe, kind of picturesque seaside town this was.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Right?

[Mike Ferguson]

It's going to be big news because you haven't had a murder there in, in quite a long time. Since 1986, Veronica chose to remain in the home with her children who had to grow up without their father. In 2020, Alistair's son Andrew revealed. The only memory of my dad I'm left with is the image of him lying on the doorstep.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

How terrible, man.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, I mean, these kids were, what'd we say, two, four years old? Two and four. Terrible to even have had to see that at all. But for that to be really the lasting memory of your father, a guy who sounds like he was by all accounts a great father, that, that is horrible. Andrew was asked about speculation that his father was involved in money laundering, which the police found no evidence of, or that his mother was involved in the murder as reported by the Guardian. He said he could not testify to his father's character because he didn't know him. But he would like to believe the positive things he's been told.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Well, absolutely, you know, how would he know?

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, a two year old or a four year old doesn't know if his dad's a money launderer.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

All you're going to know is everything you've ever been told by your mom and your grandparents and friends of his dad.

[Mike Ferguson]

But also, you know, how tough is it for people to say that they believe your mom was the one who killed your dad. Yeah, your dad's described as a great guy, your mom's described as a great person, but there are people who are saying, well, maybe she killed your dad. That's going to be hard to deal with too.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Sure it is.

[Mike Ferguson]

He added, people blaming my mom, that's the one thing I don't understand. Police have ruled her out if anyone listens to the 999 call that they released, you can hear the emotion in my mom's voice. And I know my mom, and she's not a monster that she gets made out to be. I have a hard time saying Mom.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

You do?

[Mike Ferguson]

It just doesn't come out naturally to me.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

It's okay to say mom instead.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, I could, but I'm trying to say it as the actual transcription of the person as they said it.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I could do it in my Scottish voice.

[Mike Ferguson]

Please don't. Please don't. Refocusing on the investigation, in January 2006, a senior detective traveled to eastern Germany and the Czech Republic to trace the history of the gun used in the murder and the ammunition. Okay. Pretty interesting. I mean, it is like you said, it was an old gun.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Sure it was.

[Mike Ferguson]

I mean, it's not like you're trying to trace a Glock 19 or something that there's millions and millions of. How many of these guns are still operating and people still have.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

You think that would be a little bit better?

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. That you might be able to get some information on. In 2016, two similar guns were recovered from separate addresses in Nairn, Scotland. One was an identical make and model to the murder weapon. The other weapon, Melior Bravitz handgun, was given to the police in May 2016. I never heard of that one either.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Well, there's so many different gun manufacturers across the world. How could you.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, there's a lot of them. These weapons weren't linked to the murder, but the police still wanted to speak to anyone who owned one. It was thought that soldiers brought the guns back to the UK after World War II.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I believe that.

[Mike Ferguson]

I believe that, too. Because, you know, a lot of American GIs brought back German guns. Yeah, it was kind of like a. I hate to say it, but like a trophy or viewed like that.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I know my uncle brought one back.

[Mike Ferguson]

Those Mausers and those, you know, those. What they called the. The broom handles. Those were popular guns to bring back, according to the BBC. Another theory the police looked into was a link to Irish paramilitary involvement. Okay, so that's an interesting theory. Why in the world would the Irish paramilitary want to murder this seemingly regular guy, husband, Father Alistair Wilson?

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Unless it's somehow tied into some type of money laundering or something he was.

[Mike Ferguson]

Doing that we don't know about.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Exactly.

[Mike Ferguson]

There'd have to be something along those lines, right? On November 28, 2016, the 12th anniversary of the murder, BBC Scotland presenter John Beatty received a message from a producer that someone called in to say they thought they knew what happened to Alistair. The man left the number and Beatty called him back. He didn't want to give his name and he sounded scared. This man, who Beatty gave the fake name Peter, again said he thought he knew what happened to Alistair. And they had multiple conversations where Peter named people, provided a motive and expressed fear for his life. Peter said that a friend of his, identified as Andrew, knew the killer. Andrew claimed he was doing work for a Scottish businessman who was involved with a former Loyalist paramilitary from Northern Ireland. According to the BBC, records show that bank of Scotland did the banking for at least one of the businessman's companies. When Andrew questioned the man about the work they were doing together, he allegedly threatened Andrew and his family and said he owned guns. Okay, so maybe, possibly we're getting a little bit of information about what could be the link. If this, you know, had any validity at all, it might have had to do with Alistair's banking career. According to John Beatty, the police found out and the police then put pressure on us, but we had to protect someone's identity. BBC Scotland's Fiona Walker then started speaking to Peter. She said there were things that were bothering me, things he couldn't answer directly because he wasn't the source of the allegation. It was his friend and he wouldn't put me in touch with his friend. There were holes in the story, which doesn't mean to say it wasn't true. It just needed more information. And Peter was nervous, understandably. He was talking about exposing people who he says have allegedly killed someone. Yet some key parts of his information checked out, and my instinct was that he truly believed what he was telling me. But the reality is that the evidence I could stand up was background stuff, and it didn't mean anyone had conspired to have Alistair Wilson killed.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

So some believable information, but not solid enough to say, yeah, this is what happened.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, I mean. I mean, I think if you look at it from a journalist's perspective, which this person was, there's some things that she could corroborate, but those things were, as she put it, background information. Maybe some things that other people could know.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

And some of the key points she either couldn't corroborate or he couldn't answer certain questions because, again, he's just relaying information that supposedly came from his friend Andrew.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Right. So telling enough information that has some facts tied to it, but not the type of facts you really need to go to that next level.

[Mike Ferguson]

Walker then reached out to Veronica Wilson, who did her first broadcast interview in over 10 years, Veronica was asked if Peter's claim sounded plausible. She said no, but equally, neither does the scenario of that night. So I appreciate everything needs to be investigated and people will have different ideas on it. It doesn't sound anything like our life, but if you told me that somebody would shoot my husband on our doorstep while we were all in the house, I wouldn't have believed that either. I mean, she sounds very intelligent to me.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Sure.

[Mike Ferguson]

I mean, I think this is a woman who doesn't believe that her husband was into anything shady, but she's still grasping at straws, trying to figure out, know why this happened and sounds like she doesn't want to completely close the door on anything at this point.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

You know, maybe he wasn't into anything shady. Maybe he stumbled across some things that were shady.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. In. In the course of his work.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Pluto TV Announcer]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

It's absolutely possible. Maybe it's part of the reason why he wanted to leave. Put in his notice.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

That's right.

[Mike Ferguson]

We don't know. As we often talk about in some of these unsolved cases, especially one like this, it's kind of pretty hard to take anything completely off the table.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

It really is. I mean, you have options right now.

[Mike Ferguson]

Until you can rule out options, you know, you have to kind of keep them out there.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Detective Sergeant Gary Cunningham confirmed the police looked into Peter's allegations and took a statement from the anonymous businessman, but he was not interviewed as a suspect. Veronica feels certain there were no dark secrets in Aleister's past. And if he survived, he would not have known why he was targeted. She also thinks that if Alistair thought he was in danger that night, he would have protected them, not gone downstairs, she said. The only thing that makes any sense to me was that it was the wrong Alistair Wilson.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I'm sure that's a possibility.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, it's a possibility. I also thought, you know, maybe this person wasn't looking for an Alistair Wilson. Maybe they were looking for a Paul. You know, I go back to that blue envelope. What was the meaning of that? Why was it addressed to Paul and why was it empty?

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah. What did Paul really mean?

[Mike Ferguson]

You mean besides a name?

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Exactly.

[Mike Ferguson]

I thought you were going to delve into some strange Beatles conspiracy theory there.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Paul is dead. Doesn't it say that in the one album, if you play it backwards or something?

[Mike Ferguson]

I. I don't know. Apparently the Beatles albums, if you play them backwards, say all kinds of strange things.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Depends what you're smoking that night.

[Mike Ferguson]

I've never actually played anything Backwards. So I don't know. The mistaken identity theory has not been ruled out by the police. Another man named Alistair Wilson did live in there, just a few minutes away from the crime scene. He was in his 60s and died in 2017. Another neighbor told the BBC he was uneasy about sharing the same name, but could not think of a reason he would be a target. And I think it's pretty hard to rule out the mistaken identity theory, especially when another guy with the exact same name lives just down the street, minutes away.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

And would he really be like, well, I know why they. They did what they did. They had the wrong guy. It should have been me. Because this one thing I did, because.

[Mike Ferguson]

I did this, this and this. Yeah. I don't know if I told the story on the podcast before, but I always thought, you know, my name wasn't the most common in the world. My first name is. But the place that I used to go get my hair cut in this, the little town where I grew up, there was two other people that got their hair cut there that had the same exact name.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

You're like, what's going on?

[Mike Ferguson]

And they would get me mixed up every time I went in. It got so annoying. I started going to a different place to get my haircut.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I thought you were gonna say you used a different name when you went in there.

[Mike Ferguson]

I could have done that, but I don't have all the fake passports and documentation to back it up like you do.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

You always gotta have those.

[Mike Ferguson]

According to the BBC, the investigation is ongoing into Alistair's personal finances and his career.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

And.

[Mike Ferguson]

And the police are not disclosing details. Okay. We're pretty far past this murder, Gibbs. Right? I mean, it happened 2004. Yeah. 20 years ago. Plus the fact that, you know, they're still looking into it, that doesn't surprise me. We see that all the time. And the fact that they're not disclosing details doesn't surprise me. There are a lot of, you know, authorities or agencies don't do that, but they're still looking into his personal finances. You would think that would have been something done pretty quickly and there would be some finality to it.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I would think so, too. I don't know what's going to change over the years that they couldn't have identified by now.

[Mike Ferguson]

Right? There was either large deposits or withdrawals or something that was strange in his finances, or there wasn't. As we mentioned, Alistair was about to move on from the bank of Scotland after the murder. Papers reported that Alistair was unhappy with his promotion Prospects and was upset when a multi million pound loan he thought he secured was turned down by the head office. All right, that's a sizable loan, so.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I don't know if that was him securing a loan for a potential client, or maybe he was securing it for himself.

[Mike Ferguson]

Well, I kind of thought when I read it that he was trying to take out this loan. He thought he had gotten it, but then it was turned down. But I can see where, you know, you might be headed, that he was securing it on behalf of someone else who had applied for it. But there was a report that claimed that Alistair borrowed £50,000 from money lenders with connections to the criminal underworld.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Typically not a good thing to do.

[Mike Ferguson]

Well, and when you're talking about someone who gets murdered, what's one of the motives to murder someone? Money.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah, they normally want their money back. Plus the very high interest rate that they loaned it to you in a very short period of time.

[Mike Ferguson]

When asked if Alistair was in debt, DS Cunningham emphasized that the investigation was ongoing and he could not go into detail. And I get it, I understand why they can't go into detail. But it's frustrating when you're. You're dealing with an unsolved case, Right? You want to try to figure it out, but to do that, you kind of need more detail. You need the facts. You can never get all the facts in most of these unsolved cases because police don't give it all out.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah, maybe this guy showed up and said, paul would like his money back. Put it in this envelope and come back down and bring it to me. And he came back down with an empty envelope, said, I don't have it for you right now. And the guy said, well, then, boom, you're done.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, but if he was in debt or if there were other anomalies in his finances, then maybe that would shed some light on, you know, potential motives for his murder. But without that, you know, we're. We're left to wonder. Investigators have attempted to use forensics to solve the case, but tests on the murder weapon failed to extract any DNA. In 2018, it was reported that the gun and a cigarette butt found on the Wilson's doorstep are being put through advanced testing called DNA24. Okay, I've never heard of that. But that was also seven years ago.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Also in 2018, it was reported that officers were trying to track down Sean Douglas, who previously lived near the crime scene. He wasn't interviewed by the police in 2004 and then moved to North America. His father and brother who are estranged from him urged him to get in touch with detectives who frequently asked him for information on his whereabouts. They were told he was seen in Inverness after living in Northern Canada and Alaska for seven years.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

So it's like maybe somebody wanted to get away for a while.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, and obviously the police want to talk to him. Craig Douglas claimed his brother refused to give a DNA sample at the time of the original investigation. Okay. Does that make someone look suspicious? Yeah, to a lot of people it does.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I mean, he lived near the crime scene, disappeared. So why is that? Did he have something to do with the murder? Was there some beef between him and Alistair?

[Mike Ferguson]

Or were some of these coincidences, you know, was he planning on moving already? Was he a person who I think, like me and you, we might not want to give a DNA sample. People listening might say, you know what? I didn't have anything to do with it, but I don't have to give you a DNA sample, and I'm not going to.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah, don't need my DNA in a system.

[Mike Ferguson]

It's not going to change the fact that. That the mere refusal to do so is going to make police focus on you more. But if you don't have to, if you're not compelled to by a court, there are people who are going to say, I don't want to give it to you. His father, Keith, said Sean was at the family home on the night of the murder. Keith was interviewed after the gun was found, but officers did not speak to Sean. He also said that Sean did not have a gun in 2004. In March 2022, Scottish authorities traveled to Nova Scotia, Canada, to interview a key witness later identified as former hotel owner Andy Burnett. Burnett and his family moved to Canada, where his wife is originally from, in 2013. He runs a property maintenance firm. Former New Scotland Yard Detective Peter Blexley spoke to the Sunday Mail and claimed that Alistair objected to a large decking area built outside the hotel in 2004. Blexley also noted that Burnett was at the crime scene within minutes. He helped paramedics get Alistair back onto the stretcher after he slipped off, per the Ross Shire Journal. Okay, that's never good. I mean, you have a guy who's fighting for his life and you can't stretch him to the ambulance without dropping him.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah, it's kind of like paramedic 101, right?

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, I would think so. It's probably the first thing they tell you, hey, make sure you don't drop the person you're trying to save.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Right. Strap them In.

[Mike Ferguson]

But, you know, I can see why, you know, they're looking at this Burnett guy a little bit, too. He was at the scene very quickly. He potentially might have had a beef, or Alistair might have had a beef with him. They were neighbors, I guess, essentially.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

But you would think that Veronica probably would have recognized him at the door.

[Mike Ferguson]

Well, yeah, I don't think there's any way it was him at the door, but could he have been behind it? That's probably more of the question. And then him moving to. To Canada. Burnett spoke to the Scottish son about his police interview. He said he and Alistair were friends and went golfing together before the conflict over the deck. He explained that detectives spent four days going over a statement and trying to find out if he had any links to an individual they were looking at. They had a discussion with me about something which I don't really want to talk to you about. It had no relation to me other than somebody they thought I might have known. I didn't particularly know them. I think they got the information they were looking for. So he's being very cryptic. I think maybe he was told, hey, don't. Don't give out this information. Or maybe he just didn't want to.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Right.

[Mike Ferguson]

But what I'm getting is that he's saying, yeah, I was interviewed, but they were talking to me about someone else they were looking at to see whether I knew this person or had any connections to this person. And in the end, they were satisfied. I mean, that if you believe him, that's what I'm getting from him.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And I don't know if somebody would really want to kill somebody over a.

[Mike Ferguson]

Deck, Over a conflict about a deck. I mean, people have. There's a whole show on it called love thy neighbor or something. Is just neighbors killing each other. It happens all over the world. But that's true.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

The Hatfield and McCoys, didn't they kill somebody over a pig or something?

[Mike Ferguson]

Probably less that and less, but, you know, it's kind of hard to get away with killing your neighbor. You're going to be a suspect.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

You know, especially if you're having conflicts. The two of you. Burnett said about being interviewed many years after the murder. I was surprised. We're not hiding over here, but we're trying to move on from this. It's not something we want. We understand that Veronica has her own problems to deal with. Her sons are old enough to understand what was going on at the time. But times have changed. They are so different now. I mean, this guy talks in very cryptic sentences. I don't quite understand exactly what he's trying to say all the time.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I think he's trying to be careful.

[Mike Ferguson]

Just take that one line. Her sons are old enough to understand what was going on at the time. Well, what was going on at the.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Time that they would understand.

[Mike Ferguson]

That they now understand. Detective Inspector Gary Winter told the BBC. I'm extremely grateful to Andy Burnett for allowing us to go and see him in Canada and spend time with him. Andy Burnett is absolutely a key witness in this investigation and not a suspect. Okay. That's a pretty clear delineation.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

You don't have to come out and say someone's not a suspect. I think by doing so, you're very, very confident that they're not.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

And if you're Andy, you feel good about that.

[Mike Ferguson]

In March 2022, Police Scotland issued an appeal for information about two men seen with a handgun at East Beach Nairn a month before the shooting. A witness reported seeing one man in his 20s and the other between 40 and 60 years old. It was the younger man who had the handgun. In the spring of 2022, officers altered their suspect description after reviewing witness accounts. Previous descriptions listed him as between 30 and 40 years old, but the updated description listed him as between 20 and 40. This means he would now be in his mid-30s or late 50s, early 60s. In April 2022, detectives appealed for information about a local planning application they believed may be significant to their inquiry. Officers from Police Scotland's major investigation team confirmed they now believe the answer to the murder lies within Alistair's personal life and is not connected to his employment.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Okay, that's kind of broad statement. I mean, I get it. The work is out now, so now it's either having to do with something he did, something his wife did.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, a personal life is pretty broad, but, you know, I think they were kind of focused on the banking. And we talked. Could it have been something to do with the loan? Did it have something to do with a client of the bank that may have been less than reputable, maybe even an organization, and he found out something.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Right.

[Mike Ferguson]

And had to be silenced. Now they're saying no. They don't think that's what it was.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah, it could have been the fact that he borrowed money for a bad.

[Mike Ferguson]

Habit, which would have been personal. Around May 2004, the aforementioned decking area was installed in the parking lot of the Havelock Hotel, directly opposite the Wilson home. The decking was initially built without planning permission. Andy Burnett applied for permission in November 2004. And neighbors were given the opportunity to object. Alister wrote in his objection letter that the decking caused an increase in noises and disturbances at night. His letter said, in part per the BBC, beer glasses have been found in garden areas and broken glass strewn in the street. During the summer, I and my family felt uncomfortable using our front door and even looking out our front windows, as we frequently had customers staring directly back at us.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

It doesn't sound like. Yeah, it doesn't sound like the ideal situation at all.

[Mike Ferguson]

No, not for the Wilson family. Alistair's letter was sent to the local council on the week of the murder, was copied by the planning department and sent to the business two days before the shooting. Okay, that's not great timing if you're Andy Burnett. Right, Right. He's complaining about something that. That you're doing. Two days after you receive it. This guy ends up shot to death. Police said Alistair's objection was discussed at the bar on Friday, November 26 and Saturday, November 27, 2004. But locals are skeptical about this theory. I think a lot of people question Gibbs, kind of like you did, if a conflict over a debt could lead to murder. Now, the answer is, yes, it could lead to murder. But how likely is it that it would, I think, is the question. The decking issue was also not a new revelation. Alistair's letter was read at a council meeting two months after his death, and Andy Burnett mentioned the dispute in his 2005 interview with the Sunday Times. Per the notes of reporter David James Smith. Burnett told him it was a big issue for the police and everybody else in there that he received the letter just days before the murder. He was interrogated and investigated, and the police spoke to his golfing partner in Guernsey. Burnett told the reporter. Coincidentally, when I later spoke to the senior police officer, he started telling me about some of the efforts they'd gone to. To try to track down the gun that they'd found. And he was describing to me going to Guernsey and inquiring after arms dealers there. So, I mean, what do you make of this decking issue? It wasn't a secret. Everybody knew about it. Like I said, it's. It's not great timing for Andy Burnett to have received it right before Alistair Wilson is shot to death. To me, though, it's. It's also terrible timing. You're literally going to get this letter.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

And then immediately or very soon after what? Order the hit on your neighbor across the street? What do you think? You're not going to be looked at. I. It. Something just doesn't ring there.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Doesn't really add up.

[Mike Ferguson]

It doesn't. I get it. You're the guy wouldn't be happy. He's running a business, he's trying to make money. People are objecting to it. Alistair is objecting to it. But he probably wasn't the only one.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

And you probably knew he's unhappy all this time as it was being built and through that whole period. Probably wasn't a new revelation.

[Mike Ferguson]

No, I. I don't think him getting the letter was his first inclination.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yes.

[Mike Ferguson]

That he was upset about it, but it wasn't. You know Andy Burnett who shot Alistair. Right. Veronica would have recognized him. That doesn't preclude him from hiring someone to do it. But I don't know, it just. It just is not adding up to me.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

No, not at all.

[Mike Ferguson]

Now, one thing that we haven't mentioned is could somebody else who had an issue with Alistair and who also knew about this conflict maybe use the timing of it?

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Absolutely.

[Mike Ferguson]

Knowing that. Well, police are probably going to look at Andy because of everything that's going on.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah. It's going to take the focus off of this way, my direction and they're focus on the bar across the street.

[Mike Ferguson]

In September 2022, the media reported that the police were interested in one potential suspect who has not previously been associated with the case. The BBC didn't name the new person of interest, but they did say he lived in there at the time of the murder and worked for emergency services. He was also linked to Andy Burnett on social media.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah, but in a town like that, there's probably a lot of people linked.

[Mike Ferguson]

To on social media.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. Neighbor said he was a regular at the pub and two neighbors said he kept guns in his house. He also fits the updated police description as he was 20 years old at the time of the murder.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Well, interesting.

[Mike Ferguson]

No doubt it's interesting. Someone who knows this individual told the BBC that he was a decent person, he and was not stocky in 2004, which was one of the physical descriptions of the killer. In June 2023, it was revealed that this same man was jailed for an unrelated matter involving the supply of drugs. So I don't know what you make of that. You know, we just got done talking about, you know, could Andy Burnett have hired somebody or gotten somebody to do it? Well, yeah, technically he could have. Could it have been this person? Maybe. I don't know. Yeah, but my thought is, Gibbs, what are you getting out of it if you're Andy Burnett?

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Not a lot, really.

[Mike Ferguson]

Could Veronica not just make the same objections?

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Absolutely.

[Mike Ferguson]

It doesn't seem to me as though it solves any problems over the decking. Now, if you're just mad, if you got some hatred towards this guy because you know this back and forth, then that's a different story. But detectives also looked into the theory that two men could have been involved in the murder. It's possible that one man went to the house to lure Alistair to the front door and another shot him.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Well, that's a possibility, yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

I mean, there are a lot of possibilities in this case. Former detective Peter Blexley told the Mail on Sunday. The presence of two men in the area on the night in question is now increasingly likely and I believe a line of inquiry. So if this theory is true, it's possible the man who pulled the trigger didn't want to go to the door at first because he was a known local and could be identified.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Or maybe he's the man that loaned the money and said, go up there, see if you can get my money if he's got my payment. And he came back, said, hey, he doesn't have your payment. And then when he came out the door, he said, let me go take care of this, maybe.

[Mike Ferguson]

Additionally, where the gun was found suggested it was thrown from the passenger side of a car. In December 2023, the Wilson family complained to the Police Investigations and Review Commissioner about the investigation. They claimed they were told a suspect would be arrested on May 15, 2023. The top detective later denied that a date was identified for the arrest. The senior officer has been found guilty of misconduct.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah, that's pretty shitty to do to.

[Mike Ferguson]

Tell a family we got a suspect and they're going to be arrested and then nothing happens. Yeah, that would be terrible. On September 16, 2024, authorities, Scotland's top law officer, Lord Advocate Dorothy Bain Casey, ordered a complete reinvestigation into the murder. A team of prosecutors and officers were will work on a new cold case investigation called Operation Sabine. All right. Cool name.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

But it also sounds like they're going to dive back in and kind of like redo everything.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah, sounds like nothing's off the table. Everybody go in and let's turn some things up and see what we can find. I mean, it's the top of the top, right?

[Mike Ferguson]

The top of the top.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

The top of the top.

[Mike Ferguson]

Okay.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah, Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

I don't know what that means, but I agree with you.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Good day. Top of the morning to you.

[Mike Ferguson]

So, as we wrap this one up, 20 years later, the murderer of Alistair Wilson remains one of Scotland's most high profile unsolved cases and. But based on recent announcements, investigators haven't given up. With the reinvestigation and advancements in DNA technology, it's possible the murder may be solved one day. And we say that about a lot of cases, but it does sound like they are going to, you know, throw some resources.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

At this thing and try to redo it. You know, I don't know what they'll find out, you know, second time around. I will say this Burnett guy is interesting for a number of reasons. You know, many people may go back and forth on him, kind of like I did in this episode, because you hear certain things and you're like, nah, it doesn't seem like him. Please have come out and said he's not a suspect. But then you hear other things about, you know, this younger guy who's linked to him on social media is a person of interest. I mean, he's always going to be looked at for the simple fact that, you know, he had this conflict with the victim. And that in of itself is going to make you a person of interest.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Sure.

[Mike Ferguson]

Now, the police coming out and saying you're not a suspect is a pretty big deal.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I think so normally.

[Mike Ferguson]

Right. In most cases, then you have to.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Look at the fact that there's a 50,000 pound loan taken out. Then you have the family, you know, the son saying, part of the town thinks my mom had something to do with it. So you got all kind of rumors running around.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, there's a lot of rumors. Again with the police not coming out and saying what they found in their dissection of Alistair's finances. They could shut down some of those rumors. Pretty easy to tell if he got £50,000.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Sure.

[Mike Ferguson]

I would think. I would think so too, by going through his finances. But they don't want to disclose that information. So you don't know if that rumor is true or not. But if you did borrow that from, you know, somebody in the criminal underworld and you didn't pay it back like you said earlier, that's a motive for murder right there.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Absolutely. But it sounds like they were close at one point, given the fact that the one officer said they were going to have an arrest coming any day now.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. Now he denied that. Yeah. But then was later cited for misconduct. So there had to have been something going on there, right? Yeah. I don't know. I know. I. I do think it's a case that could be solved.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I do too, and I hope it is.

[Mike Ferguson]

I mean, there. It sounds like they're just now kind of instigating this reinvestigation so we could, you know, hear something about this in the near future. More stuff could come out. Yes, but that's it for our episode on the murder of Alistair Wilson. We got a voicemail. Gibbs, you want to check that out?

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Let's hear it.

[Podcast Listener (Ashley)]

It's Ashley from Batavia. I was just listening to the Suzanne Morphew case that you guys did back in, like, 2022, and I was curious anything had been developed from it since then. And apparently they did find her body and they did do a toxicology and they found chemicals that were in her bones that they said were not natural in human. They did try to charge Barry with murder of her and it was dropped back in April of 2023. But they're hoping to cry again. Or at least her family and her daughters are hoping that they try to charge him again. The judge is saying that they didn't have key witnesses or something along those lines. But, yeah, I didn't know if you guys had heard anything about her since doing the case. Keep your own time ticking.

[Mike Ferguson]

All right, thank you. I actually had not heard that, so. I always love when people call in with updates on the unsolved cases. I do, too, because you and I don't have time to, like, keep tabs on them all.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I know we keep saying we're going to go back and update them all, but.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, it's hard because we're always working on the next case or.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Exactly.

[Mike Ferguson]

You know, and they do come out every week, so.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

But Ashley came through for us and she gave us an update right there.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. Appreciate it very, very much. Hi, buddy. That is it for another episode of True Crime, all the time unsolved. So for Mike and Gibby, stay safe and keep your own time. Tick.

[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

Jam.

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[Mike Gibson (Gibby)]

I'm a lawyer like the old TV.

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