Marilyn McCown

Summary

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Podcast Summary: True Crime All The Time Unsolved

Episode: Marilyn McCown (Episode 454)
Date: March 2, 2026
Hosts: Mike Ferguson & Mike Gibson ("Gibby")

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Main Theme

This episode delves into the mysterious 2001 disappearance of Marilyn "Nikki" McCown, who vanished just weeks before her wedding in Richmond, Indiana. The hosts, Mike Ferguson and Mike Gibson, break down the timeline, suspects, and investigations, highlighting theories, red flags, and the enduring questions in this unsolved case.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Background & Personal Life

• Marilyn "Nikki" McCown: Youngest of 10, devoted mother, and engaged to Bobby Webster at the time of her disappearance ([04:47]).
• Close relationship with family, especially her sister Michelle, described as like the "Brady Bunch" ([05:51]).
• After a tumultuous, abusive relationship with her ex, Steven Johnston, Nikki seemed happy and excited about her upcoming wedding ([06:09], [07:28]).

Events Leading Up To Disappearance

• Day of Disappearance: July 22, 2001 ([10:26]).
  • Morning: Nikki and fiancé Bobby go to church.
  • Early afternoon: Bobby gets tux fitted, Nikki takes his car to laundromat alone.
  • 1:55 PM: Spotted at laundromat.
  • 2:00 – 2:55 PM: Visits her mother to drop off her daughter. Upset about harassment from two men at laundromat.
  • 2:55 PM: Last seen returning to laundromat.
  • 3:19 PM: Caught on video at Village Pantry convenience store getting change ([13:33], [24:07]).
• Nikki reportedly expressed acute distress after the laundromat encounter—a critical detail as she told her mother, “He won’t leave me alone” ([20:46]).

Initial Search and Family Response

• Missing Person Report: Family pressured Bobby to file immediately; he hesitated, claiming he thought Nikki would return soon ([21:28]).
• Family's Belief: Nikki wouldn’t abandon her daughter or wedding plans—had a thyroid condition needing medication ([22:17], [22:51]).
• First few days: Visible family anxiety; Nikki’s 9-year-old daughter, Peyton, is shielded from worst fears but senses gravity ([23:27]).

Investigation & Theories

• Last Sightings: Surveillance confirmed Nikki alone at the store ([24:07]).
• Witness Accounts: One resident said Nikki was harassed by two Hispanic men at the store, with two Black men allegedly intervening and returning her to the laundromat. Police couldn’t locate these individuals ([25:46]).
• Bobby’s Behavior: Raised family suspicions—he canceled the wedding, sought a ring refund, and inquired about student loan money, claiming he needed funds for searching ([26:51], [28:38]).
• Polygraph Results: Bobby’s results indicated “deception”; he disputed this outcome, and hosts question reliability of polygraphs ([31:07], [32:38]).
• Vehicle Discovery: In November, Nikki’s car was found at an apartment 45 minutes away in Dayton, Ohio, where ex Steven Johnston lived. Car showed signs of tampering (lock punched, ignition tampered), clothes inside were neatly folded ([33:53], [38:27]).

Suspect Analysis

• Ex-boyfriend Steven Johnston: Lived at the complex where car was found; cleared quickly with polygraph and alibi ([39:57]).
• Fiancé Bobby Webster: Person of interest early on, cloud of suspicion, divided family opinions. Ultimately, police clear him ([51:01], [55:06]).
• Co-worker Tommy Swint:
  • Prison correctional officer, history of sexual harassment.
  • Michelle (Nikki’s sister) recounts frightening attempted rape incident ([44:42]).
  • Peyton described him as “gave me the heebie jeebies” ([45:10]).
  • Later indicted for unrelated murder of Tina Marie Ivory; killed himself when officers came to arrest him ([46:02], [48:12]).
  • Investigators still list Swint as a significant person of interest in Nikki’s case ([51:01]).

Theories & Unanswered Questions

• Was Nikki abducted at the laundromat (possibly by the harassers), or lured elsewhere?
• Did someone purposefully plant the car at Steven’s complex to mislead investigators? ([41:22], [42:10])
• Could Tommy Swint's prior violence and proximity explain her disappearance, especially in light of his proven crimes?
• New possible lead: Nikki discussed beauty products with a friend living near where her car was found, leaving open the scenario that she traveled there voluntarily ([43:11]).

Family Aftermath

• Daughter Peyton: Remained close to both Bobby and her father, Steven. She continues to advocate for her mother’s case ([51:15], [53:56]).
• Sister Michelle: Now works with the Doc Ellis Foundation to help other families of missing persons of color ([53:50]).

Current Status

• Detective Mike Wright (since 2022) still searching for answers, using Tommy Swint’s computer and seeking new technology for breakthroughs ([53:56]).
• Nikki remains missing as of this episode.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Nikki's attitude to life (Peyton):

  "She was always smiling and laughing, you know, looking for fun things to do. I always felt loved by her." —[06:37], attributed to Nikki’s daughter Peyton

• On abusive ex Steven Johnston:

  "I wasn't good to her. I wasn't. I cheated. I was abusive." —[07:28], Steven Johnston, as quoted by Ferguson

• On the laundromat harassment:

  "She stormed into her mother's kitchen, upset over two creepy men who harassed her at the laundromat..." —[10:26], Ferguson narrating the timeline

• On the significance of the harassment:

  "But for me, I mean, this is a key part of this case. Right. There's a little bit of mystery, or actually quite a bit of mystery around who are these two guys..." —[12:08], Ferguson

• On Bobby canceling the wedding and behavior:

  "I'm always concerned when someone does something. That is what you would think of as very final in the wake of someone going missing." —[26:53], Ferguson

• On polygraph tests:

  "We've talked ad nauseam about polygraph tests. ... I don't, because the courts don't." —[32:18], Ferguson

• On co-worker Tommy Swint:

  "I hear someone screaming. She found Nikki sitting on a chair with her foot pressed on Tommy's chest. She said, help. He's trying to rape me." —[44:37], Michelle, Nikki’s sister

  "He was someone who I would avoid at all costs if I ever saw him." —[45:10], Nikki's daughter Peyton

• On new detective efforts:

  "With advancements in technology, you never know..." —[53:56], Detective Mike Wright

• The hosts’ conjecture:

  "If I got to put money on it, you know, Tommy. Tommy's my man." —[57:09], Ferguson on chief suspect

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Intro & Case Overview: [03:27] – [05:51]
• Nikki’s Background: [05:51] – [07:28]
• Relationship Histories: [07:28] – [10:26]
• Timeline of Disappearance: [10:26] – [14:50]
• Family Reactions & Reporting Missing: [15:03] – [21:44]
• Investigation Begins: [22:17] – [27:09]
• Bobby’s Polygraph and Behavior: [31:07] – [32:38]
• Discovery of the Car: [33:53] – [39:57]
• Analysis of Ex Steven Johnston: [39:57] – [41:22]
• Speculating on Car Placement and Suspect Motives: [41:22] – [43:11]
• Suspect: Tommy Swint and Related Murders: [44:37] – [51:01]
• Current Standing – Who’s Cleared & Who Remains a Person of Interest: [51:01] – [56:08]
• Family Impact & Present Status: [53:50] – [55:59]
• Conclusions and Appeals for Information: [56:07] – [58:17]

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Final Thoughts & Tone

True to their style, the hosts deliver an exhaustive yet empathetic account—balancing meticulous detail with personal insights and occasional humor to lighten the heavy subject matter. They highlight the human impact on Nikki’s family, the procedural frustrations, and the struggle for closure. Both hosts agree: while the likeliest suspect may be Tommy Swint, this case remains unsolved and haunting.

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If you have any information regarding Nikki McCown’s disappearance, contact the Richmond Police Department at 765-983-7247.

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Summary prepared for listeners seeking a comprehensive, engaging recap of the Marilyn McCown episode of "True Crime All The Time Unsolved."

Transcript

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[Mike Ferguson]

Hello everyone, and welcome to episode 454 of the True Crime all the Time Unsolved podcast. I'm Mike Ferguson and and with me, as always, is my partner in true crime, Mike Gibson. Gibby, how are you?

[Mike Gibson]

Yo, yo, yo. What's up?

[Mike Ferguson]

Okay. Coming at us with that today, huh? I see how you are.

[Mike Gibson]

I just try to throw you off.

[Mike Ferguson]

That. That did throw me off. It made me laugh too. So I very much appreciate it. Hey, let's go ahead and give our Patreon shout outs. We had Steve Wilmer jump out at our highest level.

[Mike Gibson]

Hey, what's going on, Steve?

[Mike Ferguson]

Bianca Eichenboom.

[Mike Gibson]

Oh, thanks, Bianca.

[Mike Ferguson]

Angela Gillum.

[Mike Gibson]

Hi, Angela.

[Mike Ferguson]

Madison Poston.

[Mike Gibson]

What's going on, Poston?

[Mike Ferguson]

Sarah Whelan.

[Mike Gibson]

Hey, Sarah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Nikki Weaver.

[Mike Gibson]

Nikki in the house.

[Mike Ferguson]

And last but not least, Brett Stewart.

[Mike Gibson]

Look at Brett.

[Mike Ferguson]

And then if we go back into the vault this week, we selected Shannon Barber.

[Mike Gibson]

I was just thinking. I'm hoping it's Shannon. Yeah, and it was.

[Mike Ferguson]

You said that before we even started taping.

[Mike Gibson]

I know. Amazing. I got that. Esp. Is that what that's called?

[Mike Ferguson]

What am I thinking right now?

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Can't say. So we have an episode, a new one, out on true crime all the time. And to me, Gibbs, it's just a fascinating one. It's on Grady Stiles Jr. This guy was a carnival performer who called himself Lobster Boy. But, you know, he killed a man, frankly, got away with it, and then was later killed himself in a kind of a murder for hire plot by his family.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, it's. It's got some other twist.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, I don't want to give all of it away, but it's. It's a very fascinating case. And then we have a new episode coming out on Thursday, and it's on. Connie and Larry Van Oosten. They were abducted from their home by a masked man and held in a makeshift dungeon inside a basement. Yeah, there's a lot of, you know, like you would say, twists and turns in this one as well. Make sure you check it out. All right, buddy. Are you ready to get into this episode of True Crime all the Time Unsolved?

[Mike Gibson]

I am.

[Mike Ferguson]

We're talking about Marilyn McCown. Marilyn Nikki McCown disappeared just a few weeks before her wedding while doing her laundry on a Sunday afternoon. Her family doesn't believe she would leave on her own. She had her fiance and the wedding to look forward to and a daughter she loved very much. But over 20 years later, Nikki remains missing. And I think this is a common theme, right, that we see in unsolved cases. Someone disappears, but they're not found. So there is a question. Is it possible someone could up and leave? And it is possible. There's actually a story that just came out about a woman, a mother, I think, of three, who was just recently discovered to be alive.

[Mike Gibson]

Wow.

[Mike Ferguson]

And she said, hey, I just started a new life. So as much as we say it's unlikely, it does happen. But, you know, for a family, it's kind of hard to believe. She's about ready to get married. She loves her fiance, and she has a daughter.

[Mike Gibson]

So it makes you think, who, if they just wanted to get up and leave, who could do that to somebody that they are supposed to love?

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And, you know, in the case of her daughter, take care of and be responsible for Marilyn. Renee Nicole McCown, who went by the nickname Nikki, was born and raised in Richmond, Indiana. She was the youngest of 10 children. That's a big family.

[Mike Gibson]

It is a big family.

[Mike Ferguson]

Every time, you know, I hear about one of these big families, I can't help but think about the grocery bill, because I know what my grocery bill, you know, is like now and has been with just two kids, and some of those aren't even in the house half the time.

[Mike Gibson]

I'm just thinking you're really going to have to make things stretch.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, you do, right? You got to kind of maybe cut down on the streaming services or you. You gotta make big meals and make them stretch out over a couple of days or. Or something, because we know how expensive food is right now.

[Mike Gibson]

Think about how much laundry that would be.

[Mike Ferguson]

Everything. 10 kids, toilet paper.

[Mike Gibson]

Oh, man.

[Mike Ferguson]

How much toilet paper are you buying for 10 people?

[Mike Gibson]

That's a lot of toilet paper.

[Mike Ferguson]

10 kids plus, you know, adults. Nikki's sister Michelle told Dateline. It felt kind of like the Brady Bunch. Me and Nick are a year and a half apart, so we're very close. They spent a lot of time playing with dolls together, and as teenagers, they talked about boys in school.

[Mike Gibson]

What was his favorite doll that you played with?

[Mike Ferguson]

Stretch Armstrong.

[Mike Gibson]

That was your favorite one.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, except we didn't call it a doll. It was called an action figure. Action hero.

[Mike Gibson]

That's right.

[Mike Ferguson]

As a teenager, Nikki started dating Steven Johnston. Their daughter Peyton, was born in 1992. Peyton said about her mother, she was always smiling and laughing, you know, looking for fun things to do. I always felt loved by her.

[Mike Gibson]

That's what you should feel by your mom.

[Mike Ferguson]

Exactly. A far cry from kind of what we talked about in our True Crime all the Time episode this week, which was some kids not feeling a lot of love from their father, at least. Nikki and Steven split up when Peyton was about 3. They had what was described as a tumultuous relationship. According to Michelle, Stephen was abusive. In a 2018 interview, Steven admitted, I wasn't good to her. I wasn't. I cheated. I was abusive. And, you know, I think for a lot of men, that's a very hard thing to admit. It's also maybe tough to admit in the wake of someone going missing, someone you're connected to in some way.

[Mike Gibson]

It's true.

[Mike Ferguson]

But he's stepping up. Right. He's saying, I wasn't a good guy, I wasn't good to her, I cheated on her, I was abusive towards her,

[Mike Gibson]

and that's why we're no longer together.

[Mike Ferguson]

At the time of her disappearance, Nikki had worked for the Ohio Department of Rehabilitation and Correction. She was attending classes at Sinclair Community College so she could work her way up through the corrections department.

[Mike Gibson]

It's a good community college right here.

[Mike Ferguson]

It is. I mean, it's very close to where you and I Live. By 1997, Nikki was dating a man named Bobby Webster. According to Michelle, they dated in high school for a while, and then he moved to California, and then he came back to the Richmond area. He was very outgoing. It seemed like they had a lot of love. So we just talked about Sinclair. Right. Being close to us.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Ferguson]

Richmond, Indiana, is very close to us as well.

[Mike Gibson]

It is.

[Mike Ferguson]

But I think they may also have a. Maybe a satellite campus there, too, for Sinclair.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Nikki and Bobby were engaged and planned to get married on August 18, 2001. And it was said that Nikki was happy. She was excited about the wedding.

[Mike Gibson]

Most brides are.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, I was gonna say, let's face it, most brides are. If not, then why are you getting married?

[Mike Gibson]

You might want to stop and check

[Mike Ferguson]

what's going on because my daughter is set to get married later this year. Now her relationship maybe is a little different. They were high school sweethearts, They've been together for like nine years.

[Mike Gibson]

I just assume that they were already together.

[Mike Ferguson]

I know it.

[Mike Gibson]

And they are married.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, it was essentially her first boyfriend. And, and they, they've been quasi married for what seems like a very long time, but they are officially getting married later this year. Nikki's sister Michelle recalled she spent so much money on this wedding. She wanted it to be the perfect wedding. She wanted her face to be perfect, her hair to be perfect, her body to be perfect. And okay, I think we all know that weddings can be very expensive. You know, even if you go low key on a wedding, some of that stuff adds up very quickly.

[Mike Gibson]

It does, it really does.

[Mike Ferguson]

Food's expensive, flowers are expensive.

[Mike Gibson]

I mean, I just went through it a year and a half ago with my daughter getting married and it is not cheap. But I think there is a lot of expectations on the bride and I think the bride wants to like this is. A lot of brides have dreamed about this day. Well, sure, you know, so they want to look a certain way. You know, they want to body wise appearance, but they also want the whole event to look a certain way. Storybook.

[Mike Ferguson]

Well, the expectation is you're only going to do it once.

[Mike Gibson]

Well, yeah, exactly.

[Mike Ferguson]

That may or may not be the case, but that's the expectation, as it should be. Nikki went missing on July 22, 2001, just a few weeks before her wedding. That morning, Nikki and Bobby went to church. In the afternoon, Bobby met his best man to be fitted for their tuxes. Nikki took Bobby's car to the laundromat. She often went with a cousin, but this time she went alone. After getting his suit fitted, Bobby stopped at a jewelry store to pick out a wedding ring as a surprise for Nikki. Nikki was seen at the laundromat at 1:55pm Between 1:55 and 2:55, she visited her parents home, where her mother was watching her daughter. Nikki stormed into her mother's kitchen, upset over two creepy men who harassed her at the laundromat. Barbara McCown recalled that she laughed at first. Nikki was a beautiful woman and she thought a man was trying to make a move on her. However, Nikki seemed very upset by this interaction.

[Mike Gibson]

Well, one, she's got a lot going on in her life. Last thing she probably wants is someone to even mess around with her.

[Mike Ferguson]

I think the last thing that a lot of women want is for us guys to mess with them when, number one, they're already in a relationship or they're not looking for anything.

[Mike Gibson]

She's at a laundromat trying to do her laundry. She's not there to be picked up. Like at a bar.

[Mike Ferguson]

I thought that's where most meet cutes happened.

[Mike Gibson]

Is it the laundry mat?

[Mike Ferguson]

Was that the laundromat?

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

My socks.

[Mike Gibson]

Got him with her socks and separate them together.

[Mike Ferguson]

Exactly. And that's how we met. But for me, I mean, this is a key part of this case. Right. There's a little bit of mystery, or actually quite a bit of mystery around who are these two guys who are kind of messing with her or harassing her at the laundromat to the point where she's very upset when she goes to her mom's house. Her mom kind of laughs it off at first, but then I think she realized how upset Nikki really was over this interaction.

[Mike Gibson]

I mean, it had to be impactful for what happened to her at that laundromat for her to tell her mom that. Look, I'm sure women get hit on all the time. You know, they talk about how beautiful she was.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yes.

[Mike Gibson]

So I'm sure she did get hit on and probably have had dealt with

[Mike Ferguson]

that before and just brushed it aside.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah. But in this case, it wasn't so easy for her just to brush it aside.

[Mike Ferguson]

Which makes you think there was a little more to it than kind of a normal flirtation or a normal, like pick up attempts, if you want to call it that. I don't know what people call it nowadays because I've been married for 30 years. I'm out of the loop.

[Mike Gibson]

You're out. You've been out of the loop.

[Mike Ferguson]

I'm out of touch for sure. But here's the problem, Gibbs. She has to go back to that laundromat because her clothes are still there. Right. So she goes back. She was last seen there at 2:55pm According to the palladium item, at 3:19pm Nikki went to a nearby convenience store called the Village Pantry to get change. And then she went missing sometime after this. Investigators believe that when Nikki returned to the laundromat, she may have been confronted and possibly abducted by the two strangers who harassed her. And that's why I said I think this interaction, these two strangers are kind of at the heart of this story.

[Mike Gibson]

Just unknown mystery guys yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Now, there's no guarantee they had something to do with her abduction, but I mean, if you're looking at it from a common sense angle, she has this interaction, she's upset by it, she has to go back to the same place where she had the interaction, and then she disappears. Okay. Common sense would tell you more likely than not, it may have had something to do with these two individuals.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah. Either those individuals were there again, or when she went to the convenience store to get some change to come back to the laundromat, did someone at the convenience store lock in on her?

[Mike Ferguson]

In the evening, Michelle went to their sister Tammy's house and Tammy asked if she'd seen Nikki. Bobby told Tammy that Nikki wasn't home and they were supposed to finish their wedding invitations. And you mentioned it. Right. She. Nikki had a lot going on. You know, when your wedding is in a couple of weeks, there's usually still a lot of things to do, a lot of loose ends to tie up. In this case, you know, they were still working on wedding invitations. Tammy told Michelle that Bobby was going to call some of Nikki's friends and then called them back. Bobby came over and said he couldn't find Nikki. Everyone else was panicking, but Michelle tried to remain calm. She thought perhaps Nikki was out doing some shopping for the wedding. And this is the part in a lot of the unsolved cases that I kind of like to focus in on. It's that point in time where people begin to worry. Yeah, right. They can't get a hold of someone. Now, in this case, as in, I'm sure a lot of cases, people react differently. Some people probably go to worst case scenario very quickly. Obviously, Michelle is trying to not get there. She's trying to come up with other plausible theories. And, okay, the wedding's coming up. Maybe she needed to run somewhere else, do some shopping. Now it is 2001, so, you know, I don't know what the cell phone situation here was today. It's almost a given that everybody has a cell phone.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Ferguson]

But in 2001, it wasn't. They were around. A lot of people had them.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, a lot of cell phones around.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. But not everyone had one, so we don't know if Nikki had one or not. They decided to go to their parents house in Richmond to see if they knew where Nikki was. Barbara reported that she saw Nikki earlier in the day when she dropped Peyton off so that she could go to the laundromat. Nikki returned around 2pm and seemed worried. And that's the conversation that we just talked about. Right? She was upset.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

She was also apparently worried, but it was all centered around this interaction that she had at the laundry mat with these two individual you know folks, it blows my mind that to this very day many small business owners are still making post office runs or are stuck with expensive postage meter leases. It's 2026. It's not 1926. Mail and ship when you want how you want with stamps.com with stamps.com you can send from your computer or phone 24 7, so skip the long lines. You don't have to worry about supplies and it's open anytime. Print postage on demand and get up to 90% off carrier rates like FedEx, UPS and USPS for almost 30 years, millions of customers have relied on stamps.com to make mailing and shipping faster. And so simple stamps.com has definitely changed how I run my business. It saves me hours every single week. Right now you can try stamps.com risk free for 60 days. Go to stamps.com and use code tcat to get 60 days risk free. 60 days gives you plenty of time to see exactly how much time and money you're saving on every shipment. That's stamps.com code tcat. That's stamps.com, code tcatt. What do you think when I say the word fiber? Probably some old commercial about staying regular, but fiber actually plays a major role in energy, stability, recovery, focus and overall performance. Momentous Fiber plus addresses one of the most overlooked foundations of long term performance, and that's gut health. Fiber is not just about digestion. It's a key driver of gut health which directly impacts nutrient absorption, energy stability, recovery, focus, mood and overall performance. When your gut health is not dialed in, other supplements and training habits don't work as well. Momentous fiber plus is a complete 3 in 1 formula with soluble fiber, insoluble fiber and a prebiotic resistant starch. This combination is designed to support gut health from start to finish by feeding beneficial gut bacteria, improving digestion and helping stabilize blood sugar for steady energy without spikes or crashes. And I've been using Fiber plus for a few weeks now and I can really tell the difference. Right now, Momentous is offering our listeners up to 35% off your first order with promo code UNSOLVED. Head to livemomentous.com and use promo code UNSOLVED for up to 35% off your first Order. That's livemomentous.com, promo code UNSOLVED. Michelle recalled Barbara telling her that she was pacing back and forth and said, he won't leave me alone. Barbara asked Nikki who was bothering her. Nikki said some men at the laundromat were harassing her. And I thought that was very interesting, because this whole time, we've been talking about two guys. Right. Harassing her at this laundromat. But she makes this very specific statement, he won't leave me alone. That is a very singular sentence.

[Mike Gibson]

So one of the two guys must have been more persistent at harassing her.

[Mike Ferguson]

Maybe. I mean, I think that's a plausible explanation. Barbara told Nikki the men were probably just flirting with her. But if she was that worried, she should get her things and come back to the house. Nikki left, but never came back. That evening, the family told Bobby to file a police report. He wanted to wait, but Nikki's dad said if he didn't do it, he was going to do it himself. So Bobby reported Nikki missing the next morning. And I don't know what you make of that. The fiance saying, I want to wait

[Mike Gibson]

a little bit, that he maybe thought, there's no way something happened to her. She'll show up. She'll be here.

[Mike Ferguson]

Right. It could be simply someone not wanting to make a fuss over something that he thinks is going to be nothing.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

But obviously the dad is saying, no, we're reporting this right away. Either you do it, or I'm going to do it.

[Mike Gibson]

My baby girl. We're going to make sure that it gets reported.

[Mike Ferguson]

The family started searching for Nikki right away, but it took the police a bit longer. Investigators were under the impression that Nikki had cold feet about the wedding. However, her family knew Nikki wouldn't leave without telling anyone. She was happy about the wedding and wouldn't leave her daughter.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, I think that's the more important piece. She wouldn't leave her daughter.

[Mike Ferguson]

And I'm sure if you're the family, you know, you gotta be wondering if you hear that information. Okay. Where investigators getting it from that Nikki was having second thoughts about this wedding? Because obviously they didn't know that.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Ferguson]

They were saying the exact opposite.

[Mike Gibson]

So is it just them assuming that she might have been having second thoughts,

[Mike Ferguson]

or did it come from a real source?

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Additionally, Nikki had a condition called Graves disease, an autoimmune disease that affects the thyroid gland. She needed medication, which made her family even more worried about her. Peyton was only nine years old when Nicky went missing. She learned what happened a few days later when she saw the news and her grandma was on tv. Her father explained to her that they weren't sure where her mom was. And Peyton knew something was really wrong when her aunt took her to her first day of school, something Nikki always did.

[Mike Gibson]

So you wonder how a nine year old, what that would do to you at nine years old.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. You know, how much does a 9 year old really comprehend? Some 9 year olds are really, really smart.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

You know, but she's also probably not getting the full information.

[Mike Gibson]

Right, right.

[Mike Ferguson]

If you're just saying, hey, we're not sure where your mom is, you know, that's not a lie, but it's probably not the full truth. Peyton recalled the NBC in 2024. I wasn't old enough to understand my daughter's actually going to third grade this year. So I try to think back, like, how can you explain to a nine year old child your mom's missing?

[Mike Gibson]

It'd be tough.

[Mike Ferguson]

It would be tough. First of all, I mean, you don't want to unnecessarily scare them because that could be scarring.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah. You don't want to traumatize them.

[Mike Ferguson]

So I'm sure they didn't come out and say, oh, your mom's missing, maybe something really bad has happened to her. They're not going to say that to a nine year old. We're just not sure where your mom is we're looking for. Okay, that makes it sound maybe not as bad. According to Detective Mike Wright of the Richmond Police Department, detectives found the video of Nikki at the Village Pantry, the convenience store near the laundromat, at 3:19pm she often went there to get change for the machines. The video showed her walking into the store, getting change and leaving. And this is the last known sighting of Nikki. Officers searched the laundry room at but didn't find anything. The police also looked into the men who allegedly bothered Nikki. A person across from the Village Pantry reported that Nikki was harassed outside the store by two Hispanic men. And two black men intervened and gave her a ride back to the laundromat. The police spoke to the alleged witness, but couldn't locate the men who reportedly helped Nikki. So this kind of adds a different element to it. This whole time we've been talking about two men harassing her at the laundromat.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Ferguson]

And now there's a story that she was harassed by two men outside of the convenience store and. And that two other men gave her a ride. So are the two men that gave her the ride the two men that were harassing her at the laundromat? We just don't know.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah. Or was it the two men outside the convenience store that harassed her? And these two other guys showed up

[Mike Ferguson]

and were just helping.

[Mike Gibson]

Helping.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. So there's a little bit of unknown there.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Investigators also searched Nikki and Bobby's apartment, but found nothing. However, people were starting to notice that Bobby was acting strangely. Instead of postponing the wedding, he canceled the whole thing and demanded a refund from the reception hall. He tried to turn his wedding band in for cash, but the manager refused because Nikki paid for the ring and her name was on the receipt. The argument with the manager almost turned violent, and. And Bobby had to be escorted from the store.

[Mike Gibson]

So that adds another twist.

[Mike Ferguson]

It does, because I'm always concerned when someone does something. That is what you would think of as very final in the wake of someone going missing.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Ferguson]

So what happens if you cancel the wedding and Nikki shows up tomorrow? What happens if you turn in your wedding band and Nikki shows up tomorrow? You know, those kind of things just don't make sense when you don't have, like, even a shred of finality.

[Mike Gibson]

So when you hear something like this and you recall what Nikki said at her mom's house, she was talking about how these two creeps were bugging her.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Mike Gibson]

But then she makes the one standalone comment, he won't leave me alone. So now makes you wonder.

[Mike Ferguson]

Okay, is the he someone completely different?

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, I'm with you. Also, does it go back to, you know, Bobby not wanting to file the missing persons report right away and Nikki's dad having to step in and say, hey, buddy, if you don't do it, I'm doing it.

[Mike Gibson]

Well, certainly doesn't look good.

[Mike Ferguson]

It doesn't. Now, it doesn't mean that he had anything to do with it. It just doesn't look great. Right. Optics and optics are a big part of some of these cases because, let's face it, sometimes that's all we have to go on. Bobby said the reason for his behavior was that he needed money to pay for the search. He told Unsolved Mysteries. I was to the point where it was like, this wedding doesn't matter. Nikki's well being is what matters right now.

[Mike Gibson]

Well, that would be the case, right? I mean, if you don't have the money, you need the money to get some things going. You're right. The wedding is the least of your concerns.

[Mike Ferguson]

So that would or could be the explanation to kind of my question.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Ferguson]

What happens when Nikki comes back tomorrow and you've canceled the wedding and basically returned your wedding ring? Well, the answer could Be, hey, I needed that money because we were all worried about you. We were looking for you.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

If that's the case.

[Mike Gibson]

And that's going to go pretty far with her, Right? Well, you know.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, I just. I thought you were having cold feet. I wanted my money back. Yeah, that. That's not going to fly. But Bobby was also asking about Nikki's student loan money, according to NBC. And again, could you make similar arguments there? If there's student loan money lying around, could it be used to help in the search or is he just trying to get his hands on money?

[Mike Gibson]

A case? Either way, depending on how you look

[Mike Ferguson]

at it, I don't think there's any doubt that Bobby was considered a person of interest.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Ferguson]

But Nikki's family was divided and their opinions of Bobby. Her sister Michelle told Dateline I thought it was a relationship that was meant to happen. And a lot of people felt that way. But after her disappearance, there were a lot of red flags. Some people witnessed him getting physical with her. Michelle never witnessed this herself, but she did see Bobby throw things. Michelle asked Bobby directly if he was involved. He said, bobby, I know your family thinks I have something to do with it. I had nothing to do with it. I loved your sister. I wanted to marry her.

[Mike Gibson]

I find it interesting that everybody was good with you in this relationship until this type of event happens. And then you start hearing some of these negative things.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. And some things start to kind of come out. You know, was he physical with her? Somebody saw it, but they didn't want to make a big deal about it because, okay, they didn't know if it was a one time thing. They didn't know how big of a deal it was. But obviously, in the wake of someone going missing, man, you're going to make more out of certain things.

[Mike Gibson]

Oh, yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

On July 25th, Bobby was called in for an interview. He provided the timeline of his day. He went to get a suit, went to his grandmother's house, and went home. In the interview recording, he called their wedding season an exciting time and said he was confused about Nikki's disappearance. Bobby was asked to take a polygraph. He initially refused, but later agreed. One of the questions he was asked was, did you have anything to do with the disappearance of Nikki McCown? Bobby said no, but the results indicated deception. Bobby denied that he failed the test and said neither he nor his lawyer saw the results. And again, we've talked ad nauseam about polygraph tests. What does it mean when something is inconclusive? What does it mean when they say Shows deception. Do they have to be truthful, or could they be saying that to try to make him crack? I don't know the legality of that. I know police can lie to you.

[Mike Gibson]

Of course they can.

[Mike Ferguson]

So could they have told him that he showed deception when he really didn't? I don't know.

[Mike Gibson]

In hopes to get something more out of him? Yes, but like you said, we've talked about it a lot. I. And I think you feel the same way. We don't put a lot behind polygraph test.

[Mike Ferguson]

I don't, because the courts don't. And I think it's been proven that, you know, people can beat them. They can also be so nervous that they didn't have anything to do with anything, but they failed.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Ferguson]

You know, so I just don't know that it's an exact science in any way. On August 1, 2001, family and friends marched to the Richmond municipal Building to pray for Nikki's safe return. By this time, investigators suspected foul play. But with no body and no motive, they really had nothing to go on. They were also still searching for the missing vehicle. And we said it right. Nikki was driving Bobby's car that day. It was a black GMC Jimmy. Pretty popular vehicle back in the day. Yeah. Was the Jimmy the equivalent of the Chevy Blazer? I think.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Now they. They now do make a new Blazer, which is different. I don't think they make the Jimmy anymore.

[Mike Gibson]

I think they made that Jimmy and actually Dayton Moraine, Ohio, at the truck plant.

[Mike Ferguson]

Trivia tidbits from Gibby. That should be a new segment in the show.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Months later, on November 3, 2001, the missing vehicle was found parked at the Meadow of Catalpa apartment complex in Daytona, 45 minutes east of Nikki's home in Indiana.

[Mike Gibson]

And I've been at the Meadows of Catalpa.

[Mike Ferguson]

I'm sure you have. Yeah, It's a big condo slash apartment, sprawling apartment complex. So Bobby's car kind of becomes central as well. Right, but what do you make of it? It's his car, but she was driving it.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

So does that mean that whoever was involved in her disappearance drove the car over here, near where we live and dropped it off at these apartments? Or did she drive over here and then something happened after that?

[Mike Gibson]

That's a good point. Right? I mean, maybe she left Richmond fine and for whatever reason, drove to Dayton. And like you said, something happened at that point.

[Mike Ferguson]

Well, because Nikki was nowhere to be found. She wasn't found with the car. And I think these cases are so tough to go on because you know, like we said, right. Nobody, no motive. As far as we know, there's been no mention of video surveillance video besides

[Mike Gibson]

at the convenience store.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, but like no video of what actually happened to her, no video of someone taking her or anything like that.

[Mike Gibson]

We just know what was it somewhere around 3:30 was the last time she was seen on that video.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. When they found the car, the door lock was punched out and the ignition had been tampered with and the stereo was missing. But there were no obvious signs of violence. So it's entirely possible someone stole the car parts after it was parked and abandoned. It's also possible someone stole the car in Richmond.

[Mike Gibson]

That's true.

[Mike Ferguson]

And drove it to Dayton and then stole the car parts. And you know, when Gibby and I first started this podcast, we had so many nagging questions from should we do this? To how do we do this? But one thing became clear when it came to our podcast Merch and that's that it helps when you have a partner like Shopify on your side. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world and 10% of all e commerce in the US from household names like Mattel to true crime all the time. Get started with your own design studio. They have hundreds of ready to use templates. Shopify is packed with helpful AI tools that write product descriptions and even hands your product photography. Best yet, Shopify is your commerce expert with world class expertise and everything from managing inventory to international shipping to processing returns and beyond. And Shopify helps you find your customers with easy to run email and social media campaigns. And I love the fact that they're always around to share advice with their award winning 24. 7 customer support. It's time to turn those what ifs into with Shopify today. Sign up for your $1 per month trial today at shopify.com unsolved go to shopify.com unsolved that's shopify.com unsolved homes.com knows that when it comes to home shopping, it's never just about the house or condo. It's about the home. And what makes a home is more than just a house or property, its location and the neighborhood. If you have kids, it's also schools, nearby, parks and transportation options. That's why homes.com goes above and beyond to bring home shoppers the in depth information they need to find the right home. And when I say in depth, I'm talking deep. Each listing features comprehensive information about the neighborhood complete with a video guide they Also have details about local schools with test scores and state rankings and student to teacher ratio. They even have an agent directory with the sales history of each agent. So when it comes to finding a home, not just a house, this is everything you need to know, all in1place.homes.com. we've done your homework. One important clue was left behind. Nikki's clothes were neatly folded inside the car, as if she just left the laundromat. It didn't appear as though anyone rifled through the item.

[Mike Gibson]

Nobody wanted the clothes. They just wanted to break into the car and steal some parts. But if she was going to run away, wouldn't you think she'd take her

[Mike Ferguson]

clothes with her and the car? Well, yeah, both. Yeah, but what do the folded clothes mean? Do they mean that she finished her laundry or that at some point in the laundry process, she took some clothes out? Again, I don't know the answer.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, we don't.

[Mike Ferguson]

There's just a lot of unknowns here. The interesting part was that the car had been seen in the parking lot for at least two weeks prior to it being found. But it was possibly there for months, and residents just didn't notice it. Deputies checked the car early on the third because the door was ajar. A registration check flagged it as being sought. And in a criminal investigation, another important piece of information was the fact that Nikki's ex, Stephen Johnston, lived at the apartment complex where the car was found. And if that's not suspicious, I don't know what is.

[Mike Gibson]

That's really suspicious.

[Mike Ferguson]

But for me, that kind of goes back to, you know, whether Nikki drove the GMC to Dayton or somebody drove it other than her. If she drove it, is it possible that she was going to meet up with her ex?

[Mike Gibson]

So maybe she wanted to go have a, what, one more fling with the

[Mike Ferguson]

ex or just to talk to him? Yeah, didn't have to be a fling. Could it have been part of the. The doubts or cold feet, as investigators called it? We don't. We don't know. But, you know, Peyton was with her grandma on the day Nikki went missing. So as far as her daughter was concerned, there was no reason for Nikki to be at his apartment. Stephen was questioned, but he passed a polygraph. He also had a very strong alibi. He was never even a formal person of interest. And I think that tells you everything you need to know right there. Peyton never thought her father was involved. She told Dateline. I'm sure it obviously crossed my aunts and my uncles and even my grandmother's mind, but I think everybody knew deep down there's no way Steven did it. Nikki's family hoped the discovery of the car would lead to more answers. But now investigators were asking themselves, if Nikki was abducted from the laundromat, why were her clothes neatly folded in the backseat? And who drove her car to Dayton? And these questions have never been answered. These are questions that, you know, we have been asking as well, because obviously, if you can get to those answers, well, you might be able to figure some stuff out.

[Mike Gibson]

Right, Right. Just so random, though, right, for the car to end up at the complex where her ex lives?

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, it is. Now, you can go off on a bunch of different tangents. Is it someone, maybe who lived in the apartment complex who had seen her before? Maybe they knew Stephen. Maybe they actually even knew her through Stephen. They got fixated on her. They started harassing her in Richmond. I. I don't know. Maybe that's the. The he that she mentioned.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah. Or could it be someone knew that's where the ex lived and thought, you know what, the shift attention off me or us. Let's park the car down here.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yep.

[Mike Gibson]

And that's going to make the police wonder. Okay, maybe it's the ex.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, I get that. That line of thinking as well. Police later discovered that Nikki called a co worker who lived about a mile from where her SUV was found in Dayton. They talked about beauty products, and the friend told Nikki she could get what she was looking for in Dayton. So police began to wonder if something happened to Nikki in Richmond, Indiana. Dayton, Ohio, or somewhere in between. Her SUV might have been abandoned in Ohio to distract attention from the Richmond area. That's kind of the theory that. That you were talking about. But I want to go back to this conversation with the co worker about these beauty products and Nikki being told that she could find them in Dayton. Did she, on the kind of spur of the moment, after doing what she had to do at the laundromat, decide, hey, I'm going to drive over and try to get these.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, just run down the Dayton, find the things I need, and come on back.

[Mike Ferguson]

But this theory that you mentioned of the SUV being left in Dayton, it led investigators back to Bobby because, let's face it, Bobby would have known about the ex. He probably would have known where the guy lived. Nikki's sister Tammy had trouble believing Bobby was involved. Nikki's mother wasn't so sure. But she decided to keep Bobby close because of the saying, keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

[Mike Gibson]

Okay. That's a good concept to have if you can actually pull it off, Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

I think it comes from Sun Tzu's Art of War, if I'm not mistaken. I could be totally wrong about that.

[Mike Gibson]

Is that why you keep me close?

[Mike Ferguson]

Not that close, but. That came off a little creepy. But I know what you're saying. There was another person the police were looking at. According to Michelle, a co worker of Nikki's has been a person of interest since the beginning. His name was Tommy Swint. He was a CO at a prison where Nikki also worked. Their friendship eventually grew concerning. Michelle recalled. I remember one time I was on my lunch break and I said, let's go over to Nikki's house. As I'm approaching the door, I hear someone screaming. She found Nikki sitting on a chair with her foot pressed on Tommy's chest. She said, help. He's trying to rape me.

[Mike Gibson]

Wow.

[Mike Ferguson]

And that would be a very scary situation to walk into, and obviously very scary for Nikki. Michelle said Tommy tried to play it off and began chasing both of them, laughing like he was just joking. Michelle assumed he was, and Nikki told her, don't worry about it. Peyton also recalled that Tommy gave her the heebie jeebies. She said, he was someone who I would avoid at all costs if I ever saw him.

[Mike Gibson]

Oh, that's saying a lot, though.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. I mean, people don't use that term as much as they used to.

[Mike Gibson]

Now I'm wondering, maybe that's what she was trying to tell her mom. He won't leave me alone.

[Mike Ferguson]

Maybe Tommy was the heat.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Tommy remained on police radar because he didn't have a concrete alibi, and that's never good. There were also complaints of sexual harassment against him at work. Tommy worked as an officer for the Trotwood, Ohio Police Department for less than two months. He was forced to resign when it was revealed he was a person of interest in Nikki's disappearance.

[Mike Gibson]

So just for a little reference, these Meadows of Catalpa are at the border of the Trotwood limits. So if he was in Trotwood, he would easily know where the Meadows of Catalpa was.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah, very close. Right. Tommy eventually moved to Phoenix City, Alabama, where he worked as a security guard. On February 3, 2010, Tommy was indicted for the 1991 murder of 33 year old Tina Marie Ivory, who was killed in Dayton. He killed himself as officers attempted to arrest him at his home in Phoenix, Alabama. A tree trimming crew found Tina Ivory's partially nude body in a pile of trash on Dayton Liberty Road near Calumet Lane on December 17, 1991. Tina had been beaten and strangled before her body was dumped. She was wrapped in two semi transparent trash bags and a quilt. She was last seen alive on the evening of December 14, 1991. Cold case investigators working on a series of 16 unsolved sex worker homicides in the late 80s and early 90s decided to interview Tommy in the fall of 2009. He was asked for his fingerprints and DNA which were matched to Tina's case. A couple of hours after he was indicted, the Alabama Bureau of Investigation attempted to arrest him at his apartment. Investigators descended on his home to serve a warrant. They heard gunshots and then found Tommy's body inside. It was reported that investigators had planned to question Tommy about several unsolved cases. Two other young black women were beaten to death in Dayton within a few days in December 1991. On December 14th, 21 year old Carletta Roberts was found at the rear of 320 Kennard Avenue. Eight hours later, 26 year old Sonia Snowden was found next to 5363 West 3rd Street. Both had been beaten to death. And then just three days later, Tina Ivory was found. So, you know, for me, gives kind of hard not to make a connection here.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, this, this guy is really standing out.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. I mean, obviously he was a very violent individual. We know that he killed at least one woman. Then you have two other women beaten to death in a very, you know, similar kind of span of time. Does it make this scene that Michelle walked in on seem a little more sinister than maybe Nikki was willing to admit it was?

[Mike Gibson]

I 100 believe that. But I mean, we have a guy that does bad things. We know that he can dispose of a body. It's what he did with his one victim.

[Mike Ferguson]

I also found it interesting that the Trotwood Police Department let him go as soon as they found out that he was a, quote, person of interest. Yeah, I'm sure they, they were able to get more information about what police thought of this guy than the public. So that kind of leads me to believe that there were really strong feelings about this guy as possibly being responsible for whatever happened to Nikki.

[Mike Gibson]

And it's kind of scary. He was in a position of power when he was a police officer.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. Because how could he have misused that power? And did he? You're right, that's a very scary thought. So we talked about three murders.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Ferguson]

In Dayton, one of which they know this guy committed.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

At the time, authorities looked into the possibility that one killer was behind all three murders. But the only connection between the victims was their race and a history of drug use. Carleta's family described her as someone who was once ambitious and energetic. She was an honor roll student, but her grades fell in middle school. She started missing school after her brother Louis was shot and killed in Dayton in November 1986. She dropped out her junior year of high school. Then Carleta's mother was diagnosed with cancer. These family problems wore on Carletta. She started smoking and drinking, and then eventually started smoking crack. On the day of her disappearance, she was helping her grandmother Fannie clean, and she wanted to put the Christmas tree up. She left and told her grandma she would be right back, but she never returned. Detective Mike Wright stressed that Stephen Johnston and Bobby Webster are not persons of interest. However, Tommy Swin is still a person of interest in Nikki's disappearance.

[Mike Gibson]

I'm sure he's got to be the primary person on that list.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. I mean, how could he not be? Right? Just based on all of the things that we've touched on, we know he's capable of it because he killed a woman.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Peyton told Dateline she always believed in Bobby's innocence, and they maintained a close relationship until he passed away in 2021. Bobby explained to her why he did things the way he did. Peyton moved in with her grandmother, Barbara, but also kept a close relationship with her father. She never believed he was involved, but said, my mom is a very sensitive subject for him because he also blames himself. He feels like if he treated my mom better in their relationship, that maybe she would still be here. And there's that. That guilt factor that we always talk about.

[Mike Gibson]

Sure.

[Mike Ferguson]

The police have already come out and said he. He didn't have anything to do Right. With Nikki's disappearance, but he feels guilty because he came out and said he didn't treat her great, he cheated on her, and if he hadn't, he feels as though maybe she would still be here today.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Peyton said about Tommy Swin, I'm very much innocent until proven guilty. I know all signs point to Tommy, but he's also got a daughter of his own. I also believe that someone out there knows something. I don't believe Tommy was able to keep all those secrets to himself. Nikki's sister Michelle told Dateline that we may never know if Tommy did anything to Nikki. She expressed her hope that new technology could get answers for the family. Nikki's mother, Barbara McCown, died of cancer in July 2020. Peyton said that her grandmother worked hard to keep Nikki's story going and that she has since Taken on that role. Grandma didn't stop. Grandma fought hard for a very long time. We haven't stopped looking for her, and we will continue looking for her. We all love her and loved her and just want her back to. To us. Michelle McCown Luster wanted to help families in similar situations, so she joined the Doc Ellis Foundation, a nonprofit focused on missing persons of color. Michelle is the director and outreach coordinator. She said it's a rewarding job that has helped her healing journey. And you do see that a lot, right? People who go through traumatic events, such as losing a loved one, or in this case, a loved one disappearing, they often kind of dive into some of these, like, nonprofit type organizations to help other families.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, I think that's great.

[Mike Ferguson]

It is great. And she even says it has helped her healing.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Ferguson]

Detective Mike Wright took over Nikki's case in 2022. He told Dateline that his department has conducted new searches of wooded areas in Richmond. The office also has Tommy's old computer. It's possible deleted files could be recovered. With advancements in technology, you never know. Nikki is 5 foot 3 and weighed 115 pounds at the time of her disappearance. She was last seen wearing a dark swimsuit top, biker shorts and sandals. She would be 51 years old today. Anyone with information about Nikki's case is asked to call the Richmond Police Department at 765-983-7247. So, Gibbs, as we wrap this case up, you know, obviously, there were a lot of things that kind of hit close to home for us. A lot of ties to the Dayton area where you and I both live. I can't help but think about, you know, Bobby and Stephen. I think Stephen was cleared very, very quickly.

[Mike Gibson]

I think so.

[Mike Ferguson]

Bobby maybe not so quick. I mean, there were some people in Nikki's family that thought maybe possibly he had something to do with it. I don't think there's any doubt that there was a cloud of suspicion that hung over him for sometime. We said it, though, right? The current detective has come out and said that it wasn't him and it wasn't Steve.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, and I agree with everything you said. I mean, we know that Nikki's mom kept Bobby close to her because she kind of felt like maybe Bobby might have had something to do with it. But at the end of the day, I mean, he talked to Peyton, told her why he did what he did, and it seems like she felt comfortable with that. And like you said, the current detective says he's. He's not a person of interest.

[Mike Ferguson]

So for Me. You know, that leaves either Tommy Swind, who we know is a terrible guy.

[Mike Gibson]

Sure.

[Mike Ferguson]

He killed at least one woman here in Dayton. It wouldn't surprise me if he was involved in the other two deaths as well, if not more.

[Mike Gibson]

And he had a connection with her.

[Mike Ferguson]

He did. He did. Now, it's either him or it's somebody that is not on the radar at all.

[Mike Gibson]

Right?

[Mike Ferguson]

A complete stranger. But if you go by the percentages, it's somebody known to the victim.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Ferguson]

So you have Tommy, as you said, with a connection to Nikki and having what we know is a very violent past. He was a violent individual. Heck, Michelle walked in on him trying to rape Nikki. Nikki said as much, according to Michelle. Now, she also said, don't worry about it, so I don't know what that means, but obviously, that situation, the way it was unfolding, wasn't good.

[Mike Gibson]

No.

[Mike Ferguson]

So dollars to donuts if I got to put money on it, you know, Tommy. Tommy's my man.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, yeah, he's definitely.

[Mike Ferguson]

And I can say that because, you know, he's not alive, so.

[Mike Gibson]

No, no, but.

[Mike Ferguson]

No guarantee, but he doesn't look good, that's for sure.

[Mike Gibson]

Like you said, if you had a. If you had to put money down

[Mike Ferguson]

on it, that's where I'd put my money.

[Mike Gibson]

Yep. So, I feel for Peyton. We don't know what happened to her mom. She doesn't have her grandma around anymore. And I don't know if we'll ever really know what happened to Peyton's mom.

[Mike Ferguson]

We may never know what happened to Nikki, but it could be a situation where some of this new technology does tie someone to her. Yeah, I think that's tough when you don't have a body because we don't know of any evidence or DNA that was pulled from the car. We didn't talk about anything like that. So I don't know if they have it right. But, you know, maybe. Maybe someday. But that's it for our episode on Nikki McCown. We got a voicemail. You want to check that out?

[Mike Gibson]

Let's hear it. Hey, Mike and Gibby, this is Al from Delaware again.

[Mike Ferguson]

Called a few weeks ago, but just wanted to thank you guys again for keeping me company on this blizzardy day here in Delaware, trying to make it home for being out doing Instacart this morning and in the process helped other people get groceries and didn't have any myself, so hoping that I can find some on my way home. But thank you guys for keeping me company and keeping me calm while driving in the storm. And I hope you guys stay safe

[Mike Gibson]

and whatever might hit you up your way.

[Mike Ferguson]

All right? Have a great week and keep your own time ticking. Well, thanks for leaving a voicemail. You know, Gibbs, I thought we got a lot of snow. When we got about 16 inches, they got hammered up.

[Mike Gibson]

They did like 30, man.

[Mike Ferguson]

30 plus, maybe.

[Mike Gibson]

I would not enjoy that.

[Mike Ferguson]

No, not at all. So hopefully, you know, everybody is safe. And it doesn't really matter where you live. Here in the US There is something. Whether it's wildfires in California, earthquakes, you know, down south in Florida, you've got hurricanes to deal with. We have floods, we have tornadoes and blizzards. And there's, you know, when you say keep your head on a swivel, keep your own time ticking, that's not just about someone wanting to do you harm. You know, you gotta watch out for mother Nature as well.

[Mike Gibson]

It's everything.

[Mike Ferguson]

It's everything.

[Mike Gibson]

Well, at least we have an extra episode out of tcat.

[Mike Ferguson]

Yeah. Thursday and Sunday now on tcad. So a little bit more to help keep you company. All right, buddy, that is it for another episode of True Crime. All the time unsolved. So for Mike and Gibby, stay safe and keep your own time ticking.

[Mike Gibson]

Sam.

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