Nancy Ng

Summary

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Podcast Summary: True Crime All The Time Unsolved

Episode: Nancy Ng

Release Date: January 26, 2026
Hosts: Mike Ferguson & Mike Gibson ("Gibby")

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Main Theme / Purpose

This episode investigates the mysterious disappearance of Nancy Ng, a 29-year-old California woman who vanished while kayaking during a yoga retreat at Lake Atitlán, Guatemala, in October 2023. The official explanation is accidental drowning, but her family and independent investigators point to a troubling lack of transparency and conflicting witness accounts, raising questions about what really happened, possible negligence, and how authorities handled the case.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Who Was Nancy Ng? (04:37)

• Nancy lived in Monterey Park, CA, and worked as a behavioral interventionist.
• Described as deeply caring, environmentally conscious, and passionate about travel and yoga.
• Attended the "Be the Change" yoga retreat for a second year due to her positive first experience.

Quote:
"She cares so much about the environment and she's just an inner child on the outside. She will literally dance in the rain." – Nikki Ng (Nancy's sister), recounted by Mike Ferguson (05:44).

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2. Timeline of Disappearance (07:45–10:31)

• Nancy left for Guatemala on October 14, 2023; disappeared on the morning of October 19 during a group kayaking trip.
• She separated from the group; witnesses report she was last seen paddling with another woman, Christina Blaszak.
• Group waited approximately 24 hours before officially reporting her missing and left Guatemala the following day, alarming the Ng family.

Quote:
"The yoga group left Guatemala. The very next day, Nancy's family was horrified when they received a call from the retreat organizer informing them Nancy was missing." – Mike Fergus (09:35)

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3. Initial Reactions and Search Efforts (10:31–12:49)

• First air search: October 21.
• Family described their agony over the lack of information.
• Early November: Kayak video emerges showing Nancy in good spirits before entering the lake.
• Official ruling: Drowning; group reportedly delayed involving authorities.

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4. Conflicting Witness Accounts and Timeline Discrepancies (12:49–20:19)

• Prosecutor’s narrative: Nancy swam out from her kayak with a companion and drowned.
• Kayak Guatemala (rental company): Only eight of ten returned; observed two kayaks (Nancy and Christina) separated from group.
• Group’s behavior post-disappearance: Described as withdrawn, left quickly, did not communicate with rental owners or authorities.

Quote:
"It was almost like immediately clamming up and like, we're not going to say anything." – Elaine Beal, kayak rental owner, as quoted by Mike Fergus (17:23)
"Leaving within 8, 12 hours of the accident makes no sense to me." – Elaine Beal (18:06)

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5. Witness Controversy: Christina Blaszak & Retreat Organizer (21:56–26:07)

• Christina, a San Bernardino deputy public defender, identified as a key witness.
• Black Wolf Helicopters (private search team) named Christina and retreat host Eduardo Ramada as persons of interest due to lack of cooperation.
• Christina’s attorney (Christopher Gardner) insists she spoke fully to Guatemalan police and the FBI, was traumatized, and did not flee Guatemala.

Quote:
"To say my client hasn't done all she can is not true... She tried to tell her not to swim because it was rough out there... She tried to get back to her and then apparently she lost the kayak again, and when she turned back around, Ms. Ng was gone." – Christopher Gardner (Christina's attorney) (23:45–24:08)

• Official records: Guatemalan AG’s office says they never interviewed Christina; the family claims her statements are missing from the case file.

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6. Questions About Search Logistics & Negligence (32:35–37:34)

• Claims kayak company failed to require or offer life vests, provide safety instructions, or collect emergency contacts.
• Kayak company claims vests were offered and refused.
• Unclear, rushed procedures; confusion about what safety protocols (if any) were followed.

Quote:
"This was not a very well planned activity by the group, but also the vendor that was supplying the kayaks... everybody was kind of flying by the seat of their pants maybe a little bit." – Mike Gibson (37:34)

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7. Impacts on the Family, Witness Intimidation & Online Harassment (40:48–44:45)

• Ng family pressed for answers, turned to public appeals and media; expressed regret about resulting online vitriol.
• Christina faced harassment and death threats after being publicly named, further complicating dialogue.
• Christina’s account: Gave police/FBI statements, reported Nancy's kayak drifted twice, last saw her swimming, became distressed and sought help.

Quote:
"It kind of brings into focus a little bit more maybe why Christina didn't want to come forward with too much information." – Mike Fergus (41:14)

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8. Stalemate & Lingering Mysteries (54:02–62:56)

• Dispute over whether Christina’s statement exists in official records or if there was police negligence or bribery.
• Guatemalan authorities requested US assistance for additional witness interviews.
• As of January 2026, the family is planning another search; Nancy Ng remains missing.

Quote:
"You have a lot of conflicting information... the family believes one thing, and then there are other sides that believe something else." – Mike Fergus (53:01)

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9. Discussion of Motive and Possibility of Foul Play (55:56–62:08)

• Hosts note the absence of any clear motive for foul play.
• Considerations: No evidence of previous relationship strife or animosity between Nancy and any group member, including Christina.
• Possibility remains that the events unfolded exactly as described by Christina: accidental drowning in a dangerous, fast-changing natural setting.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• "What does 'disappeared in the water' really mean? ...Did they flip the kayak? Did they jump in the water?" – Mike Fergus (12:42)
• "If someone in my group is missing, I'll worry about [flight changes] later. It does seem odd." – Mike Fergus (19:15)
• "It's like guilty until proven innocent in the court of public opinion." – Mike Fergus (41:17)
• "You also have to think about the person in family that died or is missing and provide them some type of response to help them work through this." – Mike Gibson (29:14)
• "What would be the motive for Christina to have done something to Nancy Ng?" – Mike Fergus (55:57)

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Important Timestamps

• 04:01 – Episode subject introduced: the disappearance of Nancy Ng.
• 07:45 – Nancy leaves for Guatemala; context of the yoga retreat.
• 09:35 – Family learns of disappearance; group’s sudden departure.
• 12:49 – Official investigation: 24-hour reporting delay, initial ruling of drowning.
• 17:23 – Kayak Guatemala owners describe group's reserved/distressed behavior post-incident.
• 23:45 – Christina’s account (via attorney); witness controversy.
• 32:35 – Negligence allegations: life vests and safety procedures.
• 40:48 – Online harassment post-naming of witnesses.
• 46:37 – Christina's detailed statement to authorities as recounted by her lawyer.
• 55:28 – Ongoing search efforts, upcoming search scheduled for March 2026.
• 57:31–61:17 – Hosts analyze scenarios, rule out likely foul play due to lack of motive.

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Overall Tone

The hosts maintain a compassionate, thoughtful, and sometimes lightly humorous approach. They emphasize the agony of uncertainty for Nancy’s family, acknowledge complexities for witnesses, point out investigative discrepancies, and also express frustration with internet speculation and harassment.

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Conclusions & Takeaways

• Nancy Ng’s disappearance remains unresolved, shrouded in confusion, conflicting reports, and a lack of physical evidence.
• The case demonstrates challenges of US citizens going missing abroad, the unreliability of secondhand accounts, and the dangers of internet-driven persecution.
• While accidental drowning is the official explanation, the family, independent investigators, and the hosts remain troubled by the many inconsistencies in both witness conduct and the ensuing investigation.

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For further updates and to support Nancy Ng’s family, they have an active GoFundMe page (as of January 2026).

Transcript

[Tyler Meesum]

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[Mike Fergus]

This is very strange, Angie, the one you trust to find the ones you trust. Find pros for all your home [e-mail].

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[Tyler Meesum]

Cults are everywhere. They don't just live in the walls of Nexium and Scientology.

[Liz Ayakuzi]

There are sex cults, self help cults, workout cults, political cults, even legging cults.

[Tyler Meesum]

And on the podcast Was I in a Cult? We focus on the brave individuals who have lived through through them.

[Liz Ayakuzi]

I'm Liz Ayakuzi.

[Tyler Meesum]

And I'm Tyler Meesum.

[Liz Ayakuzi]

Your hosts of Was I in a Cult?

[Tyler Meesum]

Join us each week as we take you through a heroic roller coaster of someone's journey in and out of a.

[Liz Ayakuzi]

Cult with a little levity thrown in because humor is healing and cults are funny.

[Tyler Meesum]

Listen to and follow Was I in a Cult? At Apple podcast, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts, which for Tyler is.

[Liz Ayakuzi]

At Rite Aid on tape.

[Mike Fergus]

Hello everyone and welcome to episode 449 of the true Crime all the Time Unsolved podcast. I'm Mike Fergus and with me, as always, is my partner in true crime, Mike Gibson. Gibby, how are you?

[Mike Gibson]

Hey, I'm doing all right. How about you?

[Mike Fergus]

Excellent. Having an amazing week.

[Mike Gibson]

You always do.

[Mike Fergus]

Although I had did have some drama going on last weekend that we talked about on Patreon.

[Mike Gibson]

Sure did.

[Mike Fergus]

So if you're a Patreon member, make sure you check that out. If you're not and you want a little bit more content, you want the inside scoop on me and Gibby's life. Patreon's a great place to get some.

[Mike Gibson]

Absolutely it is. Plus you get to see us on video.

[Mike Fergus]

Well, that is true as well. Let's go ahead and give our Patreon shout outs. We had Sion Ackerley.

[Mike Gibson]

Hey, Sion.

[Mike Fergus]

Susan McLeod.

[Mike Gibson]

What's happening?

[Mike Fergus]

Susan Zaria.

[Mike Gibson]

Hey, Zarya.

[Mike Fergus]

Molly. B.

[Mike Gibson]

Well, thanks, B. Frankie. Well, Frinky Frankie.

[Mike Fergus]

Deborah. Bruno Dosher.

[Mike Gibson]

Hey, Deborah.

[Mike Fergus]

Holly Court.

[Mike Gibson]

Thank you, Holly.

[Mike Fergus]

And last but not least, Karen. Kelly.

[Mike Gibson]

Hey, there's Karen.

[Mike Fergus]

And then if we go back into the vault this week, we selected Jarrow.

[Mike Gibson]

What's going on, Gerald?

[Mike Fergus]

And I know I've said that name probably five different ways already, somehow, but hopefully one of them is correct.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, I think we got it, Gibbs.

[Mike Fergus]

We have a new episode out right now on True Crime all the Time, where we're talking about Joe Glenowitz. And Joe was a police officer who was found shot to death minutes after he called for backup during a pursuit of three suspects. This guy was called like GI Joe. He was kind of a hero in his community, especially after he was killed in the line of duty. Sure. But then investigators started to unravel some things about him that kind of changed the trajectory of the whole thing.

[Mike Gibson]

Never know what's going to happen when you pull on that thread.

[Mike Fergus]

All right, buddy, are you ready to get into this episode of True Crime all the Time Unsolved?

[Mike Gibson]

I am.

[Mike Fergus]

We're talking about the disappearance of Nancy Ng. In October 2023, Nancy Ng disappeared while kayaking on Lake Atitlan in Guatemala. Guatemalan officials believe Nancy drowned, but her family has questioned accounts from witnesses who were present the day she went missing. And this happens quite frequently. Right. Law enforcement or some official agency declares that a death happened a certain way. Right. But the family doesn't agree.

[Mike Gibson]

Challenges it.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah. And so we get into the details. 29 year old Nancy Ng was from Monterey Park, California. Nancy was the oldest of four siblings. She worked as a behavioral interventionist for the Alhambra Unified School District assisting students with disabilities. Nancy had special connections with many of her students. Nancy was described as a person with a kind heart who could talk to anyone. She loved yoga, traveling, hiking, and her cat. Nancy also cared about the environment. And one of the things that I thought while we were researching this case was, oh, my gosh, it sounds so much like my oldest daughter.

[Mike Gibson]

Oh, yeah.

[Mike Fergus]

You know, she works as a speech and language pathologist in the school district. She's such a kind person. She also loves some of those same things. She loves her cat, hiking, and she cares about the environment.

[Mike Gibson]

And she's been giving me free speech.

[Mike Fergus]

Lessons, which have been paying off. Yeah, I've noticed. Nancy's sister, Nikki Ng, told NBC she will stop by the side of a road to pick up litter or to pick up a bottle to recycle. She cares so much about the environment and she's just an inner child on the outside. She will literally dance in the rain.

[Mike Gibson]

Sounds like a very cool person.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, and, and happy with her life. I mean, that's the vibe that, that I'm getting. In 2022, Nancy traveled to Guatemala to attend the Be the Change Yoga retreat organized by Los Angeles instructor Eduardo Ramada. Nancy loved it so much, she decided to attend the retreat again in October 2023. The retreat was hosted near Lake Atitlan in Guatemala. Lake Atitlan is a popular tourist spot and is considered one of the most beautiful lakes in. The deepest part of the lake is around 1100ft.

[Mike Gibson]

Well, that's pretty deep.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, it's a deep lake. Especially from what I'm used to. Most of the lakes around here, I don't know, 50, 60ft deep at their deepest parts. Nancy enjoyed going out on the lake during the previous year's retreat. So she planned to spend more time there. In 2023, her sister Nikki recalled to KTLA. She was saying, it's so beautiful. Last year she woke up every morning just to spend some time there by herself without the group. And this year was going to be more exciting because they had planned activities on the lake. You ever been to Guatemala?

[Mike Gibson]

I have not been to Guatemala.

[Mike Fergus]

I have neither. But to be honest with you, there's a lot of places outside the U.S. i have not been.

[Mike Gibson]

That is true.

[Mike Fergus]

Many more than to places I have been.

[Mike Gibson]

Well, maybe one day you go to Guatemala.

[Mike Fergus]

Maybe. Nancy left for Guatemala on October 14, 2023. On October 19, Nancy went missing during a group kayaking excursion on the lake. Nancy eventually separated from the group. She was reported missing about four hours after a group member called for help. Because Nancy disappeared in the water. And you and I have talked about kayaking a number of times. We've both been kayaking. I have a kayak that I bought for the kids. My wife and I use it too. At the lake sometimes. It is a real workout. Now, maybe If I was 19, 20 years old, I wouldn't think so. But it is an upper arm workout that, you know, if you're a person who doesn't really keep in shape like I am, you're going to be sore for a while. After a lengthy kayaking session, you just.

[Mike Gibson]

Can'T really just sit there and float around. You can.

[Mike Fergus]

I guess you could, but if you want to get somewhere and get back, you're going to have to use some of those muscles and maybe you don't Use them all that often, and so, you know you're going to be sore, which is what happened to me. And that was probably my last kayaking adventure.

[Mike Gibson]

That's normally about how all your workout activities go. Yeah, you're gung ho. You do it and you typically overdo it.

[Mike Fergus]

And then I'm down for weeks, and I think, I, I don't want to do that again.

[Mike Gibson]

Never return back to it. You probably could have been a great kayaker, runner, bike biker, like an Iron man triathlon.

[Mike Fergus]

No, I. I could not do any of those.

[Mike Gibson]

I even think pickleball kicked your butt.

[Mike Fergus]

It did. It actually made me sore. But I. You know, I'm thinking about this excursion, right? You're with a group and you're out kayaking. All of a sudden, a group member doesn't see Nancy because the way it's framed, Nancy disappeared in the water. And then, you know, they can't find her. But here's the thing, Gibbs. The yoga group left Guatemala. Per News Nation. The very next day, Nancy's family was horrified when they received a call from the retreat organizer informing them Nancy was missing. And I, I really don't know what that call would be like. Hey, you know, we went on this trip, we came back. Nancy didn't come back with us because she disappeared on this lake.

[Mike Gibson]

And we couldn't stay there. So we really don't have any updates for you.

[Mike Fergus]

And it's not a state away or two states away. You can't drive there.

[Mike Gibson]

Right?

[Mike Fergus]

This is an entirely separate country. The first air search of the lake was done on October 21st. Nancy's family started speaking to the media soon after her disappearance. They said the worst part was not knowing where she was or what exactly happened to her. And I think that's a refrain that you hear in a lot of unsolved cases. What's the worst part? And it's the fact that the family just doesn't know anything.

[Mike Gibson]

The lack of information.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah. I mean, would it be horrible to find out that she was deceased? Obviously it would. But to not know either way, I think that is so tough for people. Nikki told ktla, the last two weeks have been a living hell because when we first got the news that she was missing, we just had so many questions. What happened? Where is she now? Is there a chance she's alive? We didn't know anything then. In early November, footage of Nancy from the day she went missing was released. The video shows Nancy waving happily to the camera while kayaking out onto the lake on November 7. Guatemalan prosecutors announced their belief that Nancy drowned while kayaking. It took the tour group 24 hours to report the incident to authorities.

[Mike Gibson]

Seems like a pretty good stretch of time.

[Mike Fergus]

It's a full day, right? 24 hours. Now, could they have thought that, well, you know, she went off by herself, maybe there's some little islands. Right. I don't know what was around there. Or could they have thought, you know, she just came back on her own? We just haven't seen her.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Fergus]

Sometimes at those places, you're not in constant contact with everybody in the group. But, you know, a lot of people, I think when you look online say, oh, 24 hours is a long time.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah. I just think, you know, once the sun went down, the concern should have really jumped up.

[Mike Fergus]

And when somebody uses the term disappeared in the water, well, what does that really mean?

[Mike Gibson]

Right. Did they flip the kayak? Did they jump in the water?

[Mike Fergus]

Did they just go so far that the person could no longer see them? Because those are very big differences. Huge. According to the statement by the prosecutor's office, Nancy and another woman advanced approximately two kilometers deeper into the lake, where the missing woman tells the witness that she wants to swim, and that is when she drowns. Local fire and rescue officials told ABC News that there were reports that Nancy was last seen a half a mile away from shore. Her kayak was found, but there were no signs of Nancy. And for me, this is the other thing about this. You have one person there with Nancy separate from the group. So this is where I go back to. She disappears into the water, and now we're talking about her wanting to swim, and then she drowns. So obviously, at some point, that person, that woman with her, has to come back and relay this information. So to me, that makes the 24 hours then look even more strange.

[Mike Gibson]

Sure it does. I guess you can see why the Guatemalan authorities came up with the drowning determination so quickly.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, I mean, if they've got someone who is saying they were an eyewitness to the drowning, it makes sense that they would come up with that. Nancy's parents said the prosecutor's explanation conflicts with information they received from their attorney. Nikki told ABC 7 that Nancy was not reported missing to authorities for 24 hours. She said there are people that witnessed what happened within the group that haven't come forward. We're racking our brain as to why they wouldn't want to come forward and help if nothing nefarious happened.

[Mike Gibson]

I think that's a good question, and.

[Mike Fergus]

I think it's a question that Any family member in that same situation would ask, okay, what's going on with this group she was with, especially with the person who was apparently out with her, further out than everybody else when she is supposed to have drowned.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, I don't know why you wouldn't come forward, especially if you knew nothing wrong happened besides the tragic drowning.

[Mike Fergus]

You mean nothing nefarious, right? Yeah. Nikki also revealed that their father was sleeping with his phone by his head in case a ransom call came in. In early November, the Guatemalan government announced that 95% of the lake had been searched. By this time, Nancy's family had reached out to the State Department, the FBI and local representative. They also started working with Black Wolf Helicopters, a private search and rescue team. Chris Sharp, co owner of Black Wolf Helicopter, said that the primary witnesses who may have been with Nancy that day had not been forthcoming with the investigation. Why?

[Mike Gibson]

That's the problem?

[Mike Fergus]

Well, I think it's the big question here. So far, the FBI confirmed they were in communication with the Guatemalan government and assisting with the investigation. They were not aware of any evidence of foul play and said witnesses were cooperating. So we do have some conflicting stories here. Right. Official authorities are saying one thing. Nancy's family is getting something different from other people. On November 10, the owners of the company that rented kayaks to the yoga retreat group spoke to the media. According to Lee and Elaine Beal, the owners of Kayak Guatemala, the yoga group consisted of 10 people, including Nancy. They set out on the water that morning. One of their employees took a photo of the group. Lee said that There were only eight people. When the group returned, there were two single kayaks about 100 yards away. Those kayakers were Nancy and another woman in the group. According to Lee. He said, we watched them as they continued paddling until we lost sight of them. A distress signal was called in. Elaine told ABC7, I witnessed the survivor being ushered up the steps with the yoga instructor. She was clearly distressed and they didn't say a word to us. There was no sign of Nancy. According to Lee, no one in the remaining group seemed to be interested in speaking with anyone. It was almost like immediately clamming up and like, we're not going to say anything. The Beals called the hotel the next morning because they hadn't been paid and they learned the group was gone. Elaine said, I just don't understand that part of leaving within 8 hours, 12 hours of the accident makes no sense to me. No, me neither. I get it. People have a set time of when this retreat or Vacation or, you know, trip is going to occur. You have return flights, but changes can be made.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Fergus]

You can stay an extra day. You could. People can figure that out.

[Mike Gibson]

I mean, somebody in your group, I'm assuming you knew them at some level, went missing, drowned, and you don't want to stay around to help with the search. You don't want to stay around to help provide any information you had.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, it seems very strange. And you know, what I get from this couple that owned the kayaking company is that it was almost like they were circling the wagons, Gibbs. Like, hey, let's get up to the hotel. Don't talk to anybody, pack your stuff, and boom, they're gone.

[Mike Gibson]

And why is that? Right. And that's what we just don't know.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah. Is it because that's just when they were scheduled to leave and there really wasn't anything they could do in their minds? Right. Or was there something more to it?

[Mike Gibson]

Foul play?

[Mike Fergus]

Foul play. Or something nefarious? Right. Like we said, I. I can only speak for myself. I get it. It can be very inconvenient to switch flights. It might even be costly. But if someone in my group is missing, I'll worry about that stuff later. Yeah, I get it. You might not be best friends with this person, but they're part of your group, they're from your country, They've been staying with you. You've probably been eating dinner together to just up and leave. It does seem odd.

[Mike Gibson]

And where was anybody standing up saying, wait, we can't leave here. The lake. She just came off the lake distraught, saying, something happened. Let's get these canoes. Let's go back out and see if we can find Nancy.

[Mike Fergus]

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[Mike Gibson]

It is.

[Mike Fergus]

It does fly in the face of the ABC News report that the Guatemala Attorney General's office had not been able to interview Christina. Now, maybe she spoke to other authorities there, just not them. I don't know. Gardner also said that Christina spoke to local authorities and tried to tell them where to look for Nancy, but she wasn't familiar with the lake. She was told she needed to talk to the police, and she went and gave a full statement to Guatemalan police. They told her there was nothing that could be done. Apparently that lake is known for having people drown on it.

[Mike Gibson]

So when you hear this, definitely conflicting, like you said, other news reports.

[Mike Fergus]

Well, potentially.

[Mike Gibson]

Potentially.

[Mike Fergus]

The wording, I think, is ambiguous. You know, could it be that she did speak to police but didn't speak to the Attorney General's office? And I do think that that could be absolutely true. Now, would it be strange for the police to say, well, there's nothing we can do? This lake is known for having people drown on it. Maybe, maybe not. I don't know. People do drown, you know. Yeah, that's true. It happens.

[Mike Gibson]

I still just find it strange that it was 24 hours later. Right. You just said most likely she drowned from what you visualized. But yet Nothing's reported for 24 hours and then everybody goes home.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, I don't know. There seems to be some conflicting information because if they went home the next day, does that mean they reported her missing right before they left? Right. So the 24 hours thing is a little strange to me. Nancy's family claim they attempted to reach Christina by giving their number to the yoga instructor in charge of the group. And then through other contacts, they sent two emails on October 25th and 31st, but said Christina did not respond. According to her attorney, Christina was traumatized by the experience and needed time. They tell her they understand she has been through a traumatic experience, but then they tell her she needs to come forward to assist authorities. And they say in the same email if she doesn't come forward, they'll make her come forward. The Ng family denied that the Oct. 31 email contained a threat to compel Christina. So a lot of conflicting information, right? One side says this. The family says something else. In the email shared with ABC7, the family questioned why Christina refused to speak with them and asked her to help them understand what happened to Nancy. The email specifically said, in part per NBC, please help us understand what happened and bring Nancy home. If you fail to cooperate, we will pursue this matter further. So I don't know what you make of that. I. I don't know if I would necessarily call that a threat. Pursue this matter further could mean all kinds of different things, but might be.

[Mike Gibson]

A veiled threat, kind of a firm response.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, but they're asking nicely, right? Please help us to understand what happened and, and bring Nancy home. Nancy's family said that while they were grateful Christina had shared information about the circumstances surrounding Nancy's disappearance, they had tried reaching out multiple times and received no response. Nikki Ng told ABC 7, it's like she says, it's an accident. I don't understand how she could choose to leave my family in the dark for almost four weeks and not just say that from the start. We're not blaming anybody or accusing anybody of anything. All we want is answers and we want to bring Nancy home. And I think any family Gibbs in this situation would be in that same state.

[Mike Gibson]

Oh, for sure. We've been trying to get a hold of you. We just need to know what was going on. And I understand people can be traumatized by what they see. You also have to think about the person in family that died or is missing and provide them some type of response to help them work through this.

[Mike Fergus]

In a separate interview with NBC, Nikki said, I don't know how much my family can accept that statement if it's not backed up or confirmed by authorities. Whatever she's sharing with her attorney, I don't believe it's something that's under oath and it's maybe even his interpretation of what she told him. At the end of the day, what we want is more information so that we can direct our search team. They expressed their hope that Christina would issue her own statement. Nikki expressed some of her questions in the NBC interview saying, nancy's a good swimmer. I don't understand how this could have happened. Was she struggling for a long time? Did Christina hear her scream or yell for help? What was the scope, the circumstances? Did she just disappear? Was there land nearby that she could have swam to? I had no context or not enough context of what was going on. So those are the same questions we still have today.

[Mike Gibson]

I think everybody would have those questions, right?

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. But here's the thing. If you're Christina, is there any danger in saying too much, even if, let's say, you didn't have anything to do with foul play or anything like that, is there a chance you could open yourself up to, let's say, some civil liability, maybe? I'm just thinking of reasons why an attorney would say possibly, hey, don't make a statement, don't respond to this email. There's nothing good that can come of it. You have no real information to provide them anyway, and anything you say might be used, you know, against you.

[Mike Gibson]

And I'm thinking that the attorney probably did say something like that they could take you to court. Maybe they would say you didn't do enough to try to save Nancy.

[Mike Fergus]

Nikki noted that they had not been given information about Christina's police report that she said she filed. Nikki said about the October 31 email, I think we expressed the urgency of it and said that we would just further pursue this matter. I think, as any family would do to involve the authorities to get more information. It's an active case, it's an open missing persons case, and yet the only witness to this missing person isn't being more forthcoming. I think that's an appropriate response from a family that's waited two weeks to hear from this person. And I get it. I can actually see both sides. If you're the family, you're going to try everything you can think of to get this person to tell you anything they know.

[Mike Gibson]

Absolutely.

[Mike Fergus]

Now, if you're Christina, I could see where you might be leery of saying something that could ultimately come back to bite you. Yeah.

[Mike Gibson]

So that's where I wonder if there's a way to go about that. Some type of release. Right.

[Mike Fergus]

You.

[Mike Gibson]

You tell us everything you know. You know, we will not pursue any civil charges, lawsuits, whatever, down the road based on the information you provide to us. Here's your release papers from us.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, I. I don't know how that would go, but according to a report from the Solola prosecutor's office, which NBC News saw excerpts of Christina was unable to provide testimony at her summons on October 20, as she had already left for the US in December 2023, two individuals came forward accusing the kayak company of failing to protect its clients. Yoga instructor Eduardo Ramada told NBC that Kayak Guatemala did not offer anyone a life vest and that no precautions were taken. Taken. Another participant, who requested anonymity for fear of online harassment, also alleged that the company did not provide life vests or take other safety precautions. The participant said there were no life jackets at all in sight. She added, if I saw one, I would have walked over and grabbed it myself. Without safety equipment, she was hesitant to get in the water and voiced that concern in the shop. And I said out loud, damn, we're about to get on these without a life jacket. And the kayak people didn't seem alarmed or anything. I don't know if they heard me. I don't know if they understood what I was saying. I would assume they would know what that means.

[Mike Gibson]

I think that's a problem, not to provide simple life vest jackets at that time.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, I do, too. If you're running a business where you're renting out kayaks, you would think you'd want people to wear life jackets just to minimize your exposure. Not to mention the fact that apparently this is a lake where a lot of people drown.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, I know. When I've done activities like this, typically you gotta sign something, you gotta do a quick instructional, either video, or they. They walk you through whatever piece of equipment you're taking out.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah.

[Mike Gibson]

And they want to make sure that you wear a life vest or whatever.

[Mike Fergus]

Safety equipment would go with that activity.

[Mike Gibson]

Exactly.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, I get it.

[Mike Gibson]

But we are in Guatemala, so maybe things are different there.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah. Other countries, they may not worry about, you know, the repercussions like we do here in the US Maybe they don't have the same laws where people can sue for that. That type of thing. I don't know. The employees allegedly failed to give any instruction on how to maneuver the kayaks. There was no warning of winds or currents or any guidelines on how far they could venture out into the lake. The group was hastily ushered into the water. They were also allegedly not giving any paperwork, and no emergency contact info was taken down. The participant told NBC, when I got on my paddle board, I felt rushed, like they were trying to get the other board down, but I was in the way. I don't remember what they were saying because it wasn't in English, but it was almost as though they were like, go, go. Just go. The woman recalled that at first the lake was calm, but she became uncomfortable at a certain point because the water was black and very deep. The weather changed and the current picked up. She looked out and saw Nancy, who appeared confident in her kayak. She said, the last time I vividly remember seeing Nancy was probably one hour into us being on the water. I remember sitting up and I looked out and I saw Nancy was further out on the lake and she was admiring the view. NBC reported that the owners of Kayak Guatemala spoke to the media a month prior to and said the group rejected life jackets. Elaine Beal told Inside Edition that they give people the opportunity to take a life jacket. And for this group, they all said no to taking life jackets. So again, just absolute conflicting information.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, one person saying they didn't offer it to us, and the business owners are saying they didn't take the life vest.

[Mike Fergus]

The statements from the anonymous witness and Eduardo Ramada supported a similar claim from Christina Blasek's lawyer. Chris Gardner told NBC that Christina also said there was no mention from the people at the shop about safety considerations and guidelines. No life jackets visible and no side of the shop owners that day. Ramada also claimed neither of the owners were present that day. Nikki Ng agreed that she heard from multiple participants that there were no safety jackets offered or visible at the shop. Nikki added that Ramada failed to collect emergency contact info and contacted the family about Nancy's disappearance. Four hours later. Ramada confirmed this, but declined to expand on any communications with the family.

[Mike Gibson]

Well, the one thing I can come away with this right now is that this was not a very well planned activity by the group, but also the vendor that was supplying the kayaks. I feel like everybody was kind of.

[Mike Fergus]

Flying by the seat of their pants maybe a little bit. You know, I get it. They're saying that this guy who kind of led the retreat didn't collect contact information. Would that have been a good thing to do? Yeah, obviously it would have been. And if there really were no life jackets available, no safety guidelines, you know, it's not the way to do it, probably. Right. I think everybody would agree with that. In January 2024, Nancy's family expressed their fear that authorities abroad were not investigating her case. With enough urgency, the family traveled to Guatemala to speak to prosecutors and police. But we're still waiting to hear directly from the people who were with Nancy. Nancy so they could work on piecing together her whereabouts. Nikki explained to ktla, what we want is answers. We want to know what happened to Nancy that day and where to find her. And we want that information to come from the only witness that was with Nancy at the time of her disappearance, and we want that through official channels. In February 2024, the San Gabriel Valley Tribune published an article about the effects of the allegations that Christina Blaszak and the retreat organizer refused to talk to the family or authorities. These allegations triggered speculation online, which prompted hate, harassment, cyberstalking, and even death threats against Christina. Numerous people left threatening messages on Christina's personal cell phone. One individual said, hi, Christina. Where's Nancy, huh? Stop hiding the truth. Tell us. Tell us now. Otherwise we're going to come for you. And, you know, this is just the really kind of sad side of people investigating cases on their own, whether you want to call them cyber sluice or whatever. Right, right. A lot of people are interested in. In true crime. Now, Some people just follow the cases, but some people are really invested in a particular case. And I think what often happens is people can get real nasty very quickly based on a certain piece of information, which, let's face it, may or may not be true. And I think that's so dangerous, Gibbs. It's so dangerous, especially, you know, if you get to the point where you are harassing someone, there's death threats, you're leaving them voicemails. I mean, to me, it kind of brings into focus a little bit more maybe why Christina didn't want to come forward with too much information.

[Mike Gibson]

Maybe.

[Mike Fergus]

Now, it sounded like a lot of this was prompted because of the fact that she didn't really want to talk to the family. But either way, nothing's been proven, so. And even if it had, some of this stuff would be over the line anyway. But it's definitely over the line when it's just speculation. And I think that's a real problem that we have just online in general these days.

[Mike Gibson]

Sure.

[Mike Fergus]

It's like guilty until proven innocent in the court of public opinion.

[Mike Gibson]

Exactly.

[Mike Fergus]

When it comes to what people post, say online, and I don't. I don't agree with that. I don't think that's right.

[Mike Gibson]

No, I think you need to wait till you have the correct information.

[Mike Fergus]

No, I don't think there's anything wrong with, you know, people speculating coming up with possible theories. That's done on all types of cases. But to blatantly go after somebody, say you're going to harm them, threaten to kill them, that's just. That's way over the line.

[Mike Gibson]

If you're not careful, you can also ruin their. Their careers. You can ruin their you could also.

[Mike Fergus]

Ruin your life because you could go to jail. Yeah, true Crime all the Time Unsolved is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. You chose to hit play on this podcast today. Smart Choice Progressive loves to help people make smart choices. That's why they offer a tool called Auto Quote Explorer that allows you to compare your Progressive Car Insurance quote with rates from other companies so you save time on the research and can enjoy savings when you choose the best rate for you. Give it a try after this [e-mail] Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates not available in all states or situations. Prices vary based on how you buy. Homes.com knows that when it comes to home shopping, it's never just about the house or condo. It's about the home. And what makes a home is more than just the house or property, it's location and the neighborhood. If you have kids, it's also schools, nearby, parks and transportation options. That's why homes.com goes above and beyond to bring home shoppers the in depth information they need to find the right home. And when I say in depth, I'm talking deep. Each listing features comprehensive information about the neighborhood, complete with a video guide. They also have details about local schools with test scores, state rankings and student to teacher ratio. They even have an agent directory with the sales history of each agent. So when it comes to finding a home, not just a house, this is everything you need to know all in one place. Holmes.com, we've done your homework. Christina's attorney said that these allegations were re traumatizing Christina and I don't see how they couldn't. How is somebody not going to be traumatized when they're being threatened, when they have death threats? People are saying we're going to come after you, christopher Gardner said in a phone interview with the Valley Tribune. I'm appalled at how irresponsible they were by letting her name out on purpose. What happens if something were to happen to Christina? Are they responsible for that? Everybody knows where they can find her and that is 100% their fault. Gardner noted that Christina gave a statement to the Guatemalan police at a police station, and she reached out to the FBI and gave a detailed statement in downtown San Bernardino On November 7, about a week before her name was made public. The following details come from Christina's statement given to the Guatemalan police and the FBI, she said. As the wind picked up and the water started getting choppy, Christina began paddling back to shore. She crossed paths with Nancy in the middle of the lake where the water goes from light to dark, marking the deepest part of the lake. They began chatting, and Nancy said she wanted to go for a swim. Christina cautioned her against it. She said, you shouldn't get in the water. It's too rough out there. I'm not getting in. Ms. Ng got in the water anyway. As Nancy was swimming without a life jacket, her kayak started drifting off. Christina retrieved the kayak and paddled it back to Nancy. She said, here's your kayak. Nancy kept swimming. Christina lost grip of the kayak. It started drifting off again. Christina retrieved it a second time. When she turned around to paddle the kayak back to Nancy, she didn't see her. According to Gardner, Christina realized she couldn't help Nancy and she wouldn't go in the water herself because it was too dangerous. She rushed back to the shore as quickly as she could to say what happened. There are witnesses who said they heard my client as she's paddling back, screaming for help. She was visibly shaken, visibly upset, and she was escorted by people from the yoga group to get calmed down. She was taken to the police station in Guatemala where she gave her statements. And so we go back to earlier on where it was said that, you know, she didn't talk to certain groups within the Guatemalan government. And like I said, that may be true, but if she went down to the police station and gave a detailed statement and then later on gave a detailed statement to the FBI, I don't know what more you really can expect of her. Now. There are people who are probably going to say she should have stayed there a day or two.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Fergus]

To help out or be of help, maybe changed her flight plans. But again, I don't know what was going on in her life, what she had to be home for or whatever, but there's always going to be, after the fact, people who say, well, you know, you should have done this, you should have done that.

[Mike Gibson]

I just wonder if the family would have heard that statement within, within a few hours after it was given. Would that have changed their response?

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, possibly. But I'm sure they, they had to have known it at some point. And we mentioned it. Right after Christina returned to the U.S. the Ng family sent her two emails to persuade her to talk to the family or the search team. In the October 31 email, Nikki Ng told Christina she found it suspicious that she wouldn't talk to her family about Nancy's disappearance, which made them feel she was hiding something. The email, signed by Nikki and Jonathan Ng, said, it's Been nearly two weeks since our sister has gone missing, and we're desperate to get the answers we need in order to find her. If you fail to cooperate, we will pursue this matter further. And this is where I go back to. I understand both sides here. You know, if you're the family, okay, you might find it suspicious that this person doesn't want to talk to you. You might think they're hiding something. Now, if you're Christina, you might think, I talked to the Guatemalan police. I talked to the FBI. That's all I'm going to do.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, maybe she's saying, I don't have anything else to say. I've said it all and I said.

[Mike Fergus]

It to the authority.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Fergus]

And let's face it, Gibbs, once somebody says, we find this suspicious, we think you're hiding something. Are you going to be more likely or less likely to want to talk to them?

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah. I think you're shutting down at that point.

[Mike Fergus]

I would think so. In a phone interview with the Southern California News Group, Nikki said she found it suspicious that the statement Christina reportedly gave to the Guatemalan police is not in the case file. This is according to Nikki. Her family obtained a complete copy of the file from authorities through an attorney her family retained in Guatemala.

[Mike Gibson]

That would be strange, though it would.

[Mike Fergus]

Be if that's the case. She added that a prosecutor sent a request to the US Embassy in December for international assistance to obtain Christina and Ramada's statements. Christina's lawyer told the Valley Tribune. And he has absolutely no idea about the professionalism of Guatemalan police officers. And I'm sure that's a valid statement. How could he know? How thorough are they? How detailed are they? Her lawyer added, if that's true, I would really think that the Guatemalan authorities would be reaching out to us to talk to them. If the Guatemalan authorities or the FBI, on behalf of the Guatemalan authorities, think there's something missing, they should contact me. I think it's untrue and a bunch of nonsense. He noted that he has remained in contact with the FBI and the only thing they have followed up on is the status of the death threats against Christina. Nikki Ng said in her phone interview that hearing about the death threats saddened her. And that was the last thing that I want for Christina. But the only way we can get answers is through public pressure. We did give her chances. We emailed her twice without response. We had other students from the retreat reach out to her, but she said she didn't owe the family anything. Chris Sharp, co owner of Black Wolf helicopter said he stands by the news release that named Christina Blasek, and it was part of an ongoing appeal for witnesses. He said that if Christina had stayed in Guatemala longer and assisted in the search, it might have made a difference. He acknowledged that disclosing the names would not have helped in the search for the body. When asked whether he thought releasing the names was fair, he said, absolutely without question. I'd do it again tomorrow. The company released the names to prod the two to cooperate because his team had nowhere to look. And I think that's a real polarizing issue and maybe even more polarizing because we know what happened in the aftermath. Right. Of her name being out there. Right. The death threats, the harassment online and via telephone. So he's saying why he did it. He's saying he would do it again. I think a lot of people would question whether it was responsible or not.

[Mike Gibson]

I can see why the guy did it. I mean, based on his statement. Right. They had no other leads. They needed to try to get some type of information. So he thought this was the way to do it.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah. Now people will think he's right or he's wrong. Obviously, in his mind, he thought he was right. He's working for this family, he's trying to find their daughter, and he thought it was the right thing to do, but I don't think everybody's going to feel that way. Although her attorney said Christina told the police where Nancy went missing in the lake, Sharpe said neither he nor the family had any record of her account to authorities. In a February 2024 interview with News Nation, the Ng family claimed they couldn't find a record of Christina ever talking to the police before leaving Guatemala. They hired an attorney in Guatemala and suspect they now know why. According to Nikki Ng, the investigation revealed that a bribe had occurred that allowed Christina's statement to be omitted and to prevent her from being detained. Christina's attorney told News Nation the idea that Christina would bribe anyone was nonsense. And she left the country on a regularly scheduled flight. She left the retreat early in the morning because of road closures due to civil unrest. So, again, Gibbs, I mean, we're coming, you know, towards the end of this episode, I think the one thing you would have to say is that, number one, there's a lot of conflicting information. So much and kind of going along with that is because of that, I think in large part the family believes one thing, and then there are other sides that believe something else. Right. You know, if Christina talked to the Guatemalan police, why Is there no record? If there is no record, is it because they just were sloppy? I don't know.

[Mike Gibson]

See, that's the problem with it being in a foreign country, too, right?

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, maybe. You know, not every place. Not every country. Not every place within a country operates the same way. Maybe some places are laissez faire. Right. About documentation and. And stuff like that. I mean, you know, to make the accusation that Christina bribed the police to keep her statement out of the file, then why go and give the statement?

[Mike Gibson]

That's what I was thinking. Why even give it then if you.

[Mike Fergus]

Then have to turn around and bribe them? My thought is she could have just got up in the morning probably and left. Got on the flight just like she did, just having not gone to the police.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Fergus]

Now, she might have looked worse to some people if she did it that way, but the Ng family has an active GoFundMe page set up by Jared Lopez, Nikki ng's partner. In December 2025, Lopez posted an update writing that the final search for Nancy that was set to take place that month was postponed March 2026 due to unforeseen circumstances. As of January 2026, Nancy Ng remains missing. No signs of her have been found in Lake Ottila.

[Mike Gibson]

So sounds. So it sounds like we're two months away from the next search.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, that's what it sounds like, if it actually does occur in March. But what that does tell us. Right. Is that they are still actively searching for Nancy. Now, listen, I feel for her family.

[Mike Gibson]

Absolutely.

[Mike Fergus]

And. And I don't know how anybody couldn't. At the same time, I also really feel for Christina. It sounds to me like she's gone through some hell.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Fergus]

But the one thing I do want to talk about, you know, as we kind of wrap this thing up, is motive. You know, when you start to talk about foul play, well, then you kind of have to bring motive up. Right. What would be the motive for Christina to have done something to Nancy Ng?

[Mike Gibson]

Jealousy. Some type of unknown relationship, either with another member of that group or each other or. I don't know. Right, right.

[Mike Fergus]

I mean, you're saying hypothetical. Right. There's obviously. Nobody has ever come forward and said they were both vying for the affection of the same man or the same woman or. There's never been anything like that. They're on a retreat that they go on once a year, a yoga retreat, which is typically Peace and love.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking.

[Mike Fergus]

So that's kind of what's been going through my mind. For most of the episode. Now, I don't know if the family thinks Christina actually did something to cause Nancy's death or if they just are upset because she hasn't talked to them and given them information directly. I mean, it's very possible, Gibbs, that this thing could have gone down exactly the way that Christina has said it did.

[Mike Gibson]

Oh, sure, absolutely. Yeah.

[Mike Fergus]

The currents got rough. She was swimming, she got pulled under. You know, something happened. She took in water and she drowned.

[Mike Gibson]

You know, I mean, I can see, you know, you're out on the water and someone says, I'm going to go swimming. You're like, don't go swimming. That water's rough. It's deep. I really advise you not to. And then they go swimming and they, you see their canoe get away and you're like, let me go get your canoe because you're going to need it here in a little bit. And I come back and you don't take your canoe back and you decide to keep swimming and the canoe gets away again. Some people would just say, hey, you're on your own. I'm out of here. Yeah, you know, she went back and got it again. And she's saying when she turned back around, she couldn't see her. Is that true? I mean, we have to assume it's true because that's what she's. Her statement is.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah. Now, apparently there were witnesses who saw her paddling back in screaming for. I am still very confused about this notion that there was a 24 hour wait.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah, it's really confusing me too.

[Mike Fergus]

Like, because if they left the next day and she apparently left early even to get to the airport.

[Mike Gibson]

Yeah.

[Mike Fergus]

And she had to go to the police station before that. It just doesn't seem to me like there's any way There was a 24 hour delay and in notification.

[Mike Gibson]

Oh, because it sounds like the police were notified because she was making a statement at that time.

[Mike Fergus]

Now, the one thing we did say is that that was Nikki. Right. Telling a news outlet that Nancy wasn't reported missing to authorities for 24 hours. Maybe she just has misinformation, but that just doesn't seem possible.

[Mike Gibson]

I just wonder if there's multiple agencies down there, you know, like the local police and maybe a national police and. Right. And maybe whoever Christina notified, they didn't notify who they should have notified or.

[Mike Fergus]

Who the family got their information from. Exactly. And they said, well, we Learned about it 24 hours later, but other people knew. So it's, it's, I think, tougher because we're in Guatemala.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Fergus]

You know, this is not like you went a half hour away to a lake and something happened. We would know obviously how that jurisdiction is supposed to act, and there would. There would be a little more transparency because we're in the same country when something happens in a different country. And there seems to often be a lot of disconnect between the family, the authorities. Number one, there's often a language barrier, which may come into play sometimes, but it's such a strange case in certain ways. And then in the back of my mind, there's a thought that it may not be strange at all in a way that this absolutely could have been an accidental drowning and things could have played out exactly the way that Christina has said. The family's just been given different information. I'm not blaming either side. No, but if you're getting false information, well, yeah, you're going to be a little upset because you think something else happened, then maybe what really happened. They're also upset that Christina doesn't want to talk to them directly. I, I get that, but I also understand that she doesn't have to.

[Mike Gibson]

There's no obligation, so.

[Mike Fergus]

And then for me, it comes back to motive. What motive would she have had? Not really knowing, as far as I know, knowing Nancy very well at all, to commit some kind of act that would cause her death.

[Mike Gibson]

And I don't believe the FBI, when they looked into it, called anything out.

[Mike Fergus]

Well, I'm sure they would have looked into. Is there a connection?

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Fergus]

You know, are these two both in love with the yoga instructor and, you know, things went awry. Yeah. A romantic rival or, you know, some situation like that. We just. There's nothing about that. And you would think that with the FBI being involved, all the different agencies, somebody would have found that by now if it was there.

[Mike Gibson]

For me, I think it's the concern. It's actually for the kayak company. Like, did you or did you not provide life jackets? And if you did and they declined them, do you have something with their signatures on them?

[Mike Fergus]

Well, also, one thing we haven't really talked about a lot is the owners basically saying all this stuff, and then a lot of people coming out and saying, hey, the owners weren't even there that day.

[Mike Gibson]

Right.

[Mike Fergus]

So do they really know? You know, I. Again, I don't know. There's a lot of stuff going on in this case, but there's still stuff as far as it being related to the search for Nancy. So we could have more information. Right. That. That comes out in a case like this because it's. It's definitely ongoing.

[Mike Gibson]

I. I hope her family gets the answers they want.

[Mike Fergus]

Yes, me too. Absolutely. And I hope people leave Christina alone for what is, as of now, her not having done anything that could change in the future if there's more information that comes out. But as we know right now, she doesn't deserve that type of stuff online at all. But that's it for our episode on Nancy Ng. We got a voicemail. You want to check that out?

[Mike Gibson]

Let's hear it.

[Emily]

Hi, Mike and Gibby. My name is Emily. I am from right outside of St. Louis. I've been listening to you guys for almost five years. When I started listening to you guys, I was in college. Now I'm a mom of two. So it's just crazy that throughout my life changes. You guys have still been there. I did want to. I've wanted to call for a long time, but I wanted to make sure I was. I'm not really sure why. I was just hesitating. And then this week, I decided to call because both of the stories on TCAT and TCAT unsolved were within, like, an hour of my house, which I just thought was crazy. I love you guys. I'm Team Gibby. Thanks for everything you do. Stay safe and keep your own time taken.

[Mike Fergus]

All right. Thank you so much for the voicemail. I often think about this, Gibbs. It's amazing how long we've been doing this show and how many things have changed.

[Mike Gibson]

It really, really is interesting when you.

[Mike Fergus]

Hear her talk about being in college now she's has two kids. I think about where my kids were. One of them wasn't even in high school yet. She's getting ready to graduate college.

[Mike Gibson]

I know, it's amazing.

[Mike Fergus]

It's just, you know, our lives have changed. Well, our lives haven't really changed that much, but the people around us, sure, their lives have changed quite a bit, especially our kids and stuff.

[Mike Gibson]

But it's definitely amazing to hear from our listeners that have been with us for such a long time and to hear those type of comments too.

[Mike Fergus]

Yeah, awesome. We appreciate it so much. All right, buddy, that is it for another episode of True Crime. All the Time unsolved. So for Mike and Gibby, stay safe and keep your own time ticking.

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[Mike Fergus]

You're welcome.