
In this interview, Keyes discusses the Texas and Eagle River caches, blood on his boat, sex workers, cemeteries, Ted Bundy, Dean Koontz, his time in Texas, and more. Part 2 will be out on June 21. TROVA TRIP to Costa Rica...
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Israel Keys
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Narrator/Announcer
This is a studio both and production.
Interviewer/Investigator
Date is July 12, 2012. Time is 10:05am Case number 306A.N. 15642. This will be a meeting with Israel Keys. Present will be myself and TFO Jeff Bell. Just us today. My coffee.
TFO Jeff Bell
All right, well, we have to go through all the same. I want to make sure, obviously I tape recorder running, that we didn't interrupt any lawyer meeting or anything like that when we came over to pick you up this morning.
Israel Keys
No.
TFO Jeff Bell
Okay. I'm gonna redo your rights. You have the right to remain silent. You understand that? Yep. Anything you say can will be used against you in the court of law. Do you understand that? Yep. You have the right to talk to a lawyer and have him present with you while you're being questioned. You understand that?
Israel Keys
Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
If you cannot afford to hire a lawyer, one will be appointed to represent you before and during any questioning, if you wish. You understand that?
Israel Keys
Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
You can decide at any time to exercise these rights and not answer any questions or make any statements. You understand that?
Israel Keys
Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
You understand each of those rights I've explained to you?
Israel Keys
Yes.
TFO Jeff Bell
Okay. Also have to remind you that we're here to talk about other crimes. If we talk about anything and nothing to do with Samantha Conan, we can't talk about Samantha Conan. You understand that?
Israel Keys
Yep. Okay.
TFO Jeff Bell
You also have standby counsel, I believe, Rich Kirtner and possibly Jacqueline Walsh. Would you like either one of those attorneys present today?
Israel Keys
No.
TFO Jeff Bell
Okay.
Interviewer/Investigator
I think that's it. You probably know better if you forget anything. You probably know better than us. One thing I wanted to do before we jump into anything is I messed up the other day and I wouldn't. Well, I just wasn't as thorough as I should have been. And I want to add the bolt registration number on here.
Israel Keys
Okay.
Interviewer/Investigator
So I'm just going to add. So it's clear what bay liner we're talking about. And then I'll just have you initial it. And I'll put the plate number from the trailer too's the 12th and then I just have the initial buy over there. Just that I made the addition. With the boat. One thing I wanted to. We wanted to show you was a couple pictures. They had asked. I know you. When we talked to you about it before, I wasn't in here, but I think it was Jeff and Steve that were in here. You mentioned that there might be where there might be something. Some blood or something like that.
TFO Jeff Bell
She also didn't know how much of the motor was left.
Interviewer/Investigator
That answers that question.
Israel Keys
Yeah, I knew I'd taken it apart.
Interviewer/Investigator
But if you can look at these and if you can see. Just maybe looking at them would refresh your memory about where something might be or you know what they should look for.
TFO Jeff Bell
Doesn't really look in that bad of shape, does it?
Israel Keys
Concerns what saving me a day. Well, it's going to be in that engine. Well, yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
Where is the top end of the motor?
Israel Keys
On this side. Okay.
Interviewer/Investigator
Back in here.
Israel Keys
Anywhere on this side.
Interviewer/Investigator
Okay.
Israel Keys
My guess, if you find anything that's going to be along these trim pieces like underneath them or something.
Interviewer/Investigator
Okay.
Israel Keys
Because it got, you know, it got on the fiberglass. I cleaned it, but I don't know if I sure how well you cleaned it.
Interviewer/Investigator
Okay.
TFO Jeff Bell
Where's the top end of the motor?
Israel Keys
It probably got junked. I remember I took it apart. Figure out what was wrong with the motor and I think by the time I figured out what was wrong with it, I decided the whole motor was going to be scrapped.
TFO Jeff Bell
It wasn't worth fixing.
Israel Keys
Yeah. I think I just threw away all the parts I took off.
Interviewer/Investigator
Anything in the boat. I don't. They haven't looked in any of the stuff yet to even know what's in here or what's in the tote or anything like that that would be there.
Israel Keys
The tote. I don't remember exactly what's in the tote. Underneath the tote, there's a removable floor panel where I used to keep concrete weights and stuff.
Interviewer/Investigator
Okay.
Israel Keys
And I would say any ropes or anything that are in the boat, I don't know, one of them's gonna be like a tow rope skiing. But there were. I know I had quite a few other ropes in there as well that I would use for anchor ropes and tying the boat up and stuff.
Interviewer/Investigator
Any tools in the boat that you remember that would. We should be looking for.
Israel Keys
Anything else of interest is going to be in either those side pockets along the sides or in the glove. Glove box that I remember. I think there's. There's a lot of storage compartments all over the boat. So I don't remember what all is in them, but I know that there might be some knives in the glove box. There might be, you know, miscellaneous stuff like that that I just kept with the boat at all times.
Interviewer/Investigator
Okay. What we can do also, if you're interested, is once they go through it, we'll have pictures of everything and we can show you that stuff too, if you. If that would be helpful. I'm sure it'd probably be helpful than trying to figure out what's in all this stuff when you can't see it. So we can do that.
Israel Keys
Yeah. It doesn't look like anyone's been in there at all since.
TFO Jeff Bell
I was surprised at how good the upholstery seems. Like it's in pretty good condition still.
Israel Keys
Yeah, well, it was all brand new.
TFO Jeff Bell
Oh, was it?
Israel Keys
Yeah, that whole boat was gutted before I rebuilt it, so.
Interviewer/Investigator
So you rebuilt it like it doesn't look like a 1982 boat to me. That's why I was.
Israel Keys
Well, yeah, the interior was trashed when I got it. So it's all new seats and upholstery and everything.
Interviewer/Investigator
That makes sense.
Israel Keys
And I think I had to replace some glass and I don't know, just the carpeting and all that stuff. I replaced the carpeting a couple times. At least on the back section.
Interviewer/Investigator
Is that brand new carpeting on the back section now or is it something that should be looked at?
Israel Keys
Well, you might find stuff under the carpeting, but there was new carpet and then it got blown on it.
Interviewer/Investigator
Got it. Okay. All right, that will be helpful. So again, do you want a copy of this? I asked you the other day, but now it changes. All right. We had a couple things, a few things we wanted to talk to you about today. I think Jeff mentioned kind of different than what the meetings. You know, our meetings normally are just some of. It's kind of follow up stuff to what you have talked about before, just making clarification kind of stuff and just wrapping some of that stuff up. And then just a couple new things. But Loki, nothing.
TFO Jeff Bell
Just start with the Eagle River. Yeah, we got more photos.
Interviewer/Investigator
This place look familiar? Oops.
Israel Keys
Yeah, that stuff was still there. Huh.
Interviewer/Investigator
There's more pictures under there if you want to.
Israel Keys
Yeah, I'm sure. You saw that big ditch right next to there.
TFO Jeff Bell
Did you dig that ditch or was that there?
Israel Keys
No, that was a burn. And that was my plan, was to use that because it was already dug, so I was gonna just have to fill it in. Right. There was a. There's a big metal plate down the road that I was gonna use to cover it once I buried it. Keep it from getting dug up.
TFO Jeff Bell
Like a sheet metal?
Israel Keys
Yeah, there was. Down by that other guy's driveway, there was a big pile of trash in the woods and there was a piece of metal that I was going to use to throw over it and bury it.
TFO Jeff Bell
I tried to move that thing. I wasn't able to move it.
Interviewer/Investigator
Oh, yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
Well, it was thin piece of metal,
Israel Keys
but there was lots of buried and
TFO Jeff Bell
shit on it then like some countertops and stuff in there. And so this. I mean, it's still there, but it's. Was this time frame, if I remember right from our interview, is this like the May 2011 timeframe?
Israel Keys
Yep.
TFO Jeff Bell
Prior to. Just prior to the couriers.
Israel Keys
Right.
TFO Jeff Bell
And so with this thing, I guess I misunderstood when we were talking about it earlier, if you wouldn't mind explaining again, what was the. This was. Was this place open? Like the gates were open continuously? There's no snow. When you put this.
Israel Keys
The Eagle River. Yeah. At the parking lot there. Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
Because it's May sometime. Is it early May?
Israel Keys
It was open. Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
Was there snow on the ground?
Israel Keys
No.
Interviewer/Investigator
No.
TFO Jeff Bell
Okay, and you think it was.
Israel Keys
No, there wasn't much snow that year, but there wasn't a lot of traffic there. And I staked it out for a couple nights, but I think there was only one or two cars that came by.
TFO Jeff Bell
And when you staked it out, did you park your vehicle there or park it somewhere else?
Israel Keys
No, I parked the vehicle down the road by the nature center and then I rode my bike back down. That's why all that stuff was stashed there ahead of time, because I didn't want to have my car in the area.
TFO Jeff Bell
And how many days or nights or whatever did you.
Israel Keys
I think I was up there for two or three nights. I didn't stay all night.
TFO Jeff Bell
Just till after dark and just There wasn't much traffic there, so an opportunity never arose.
Israel Keys
Yeah, there was only one. There was only one time that I almost did it, but there was. It was two people and it would have been a lot of work. I kind of changed my mind on that. Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
And then during this time frame, this is also the time frame you talked about. Point Warren's off or out in that area, right?
Israel Keys
Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
Right after you built the Silencer.
Israel Keys
Yeah, that was. I think I went up to Eagle river after that incident because. A lot of police driving around Anchorage after dark, so.
TFO Jeff Bell
And. And the timeout at Point Warren's off. How late was that? When that. I mean, how was it?
Israel Keys
11 o'?
TFO Jeff Bell
Clock? It was about 11 o'.
Israel Keys
Clock, yeah. Okay.
TFO Jeff Bell
And you think that was mid. How far before you left for. He left on June 3rd to go to Vermont. How many days or weeks was that before that?
Israel Keys
It would have been in May sometime. Probably mid May. Okay.
TFO Jeff Bell
And do you know for sure if it was an APD officer or was it airport?
Israel Keys
It was two of them. Okay.
TFO Jeff Bell
Definitely not airport police.
Israel Keys
No, I'm pretty sure I saw their car. I think it said it had the big. It may have been an airport police if their cars looked the same, but I don't know. It looked like APD to me.
TFO Jeff Bell
Do you remember what kind of car was there, other than the police car? What car were you watching?
Israel Keys
It was a Subaru station wagon, I think.
TFO Jeff Bell
What color?
Israel Keys
Navy blue or darker maybe.
TFO Jeff Bell
Any more of these in Anchorage area?
Israel Keys
No. Okay.
TFO Jeff Bell
And maybe not specifically like this. Is there any underground? I know how sometimes you like to be somatic about questions and not specific enough.
Israel Keys
There is nothing exactly like that.
TFO Jeff Bell
Is there a five gallon bucket somewhere?
Israel Keys
Orange? I already told you I might need those again someday.
Narrator/Announcer
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TFO Jeff Bell
We just, you know, I mean, I know you don't. I just don't want somebody else. I know. In one of our conversations you made a comment about how people like buried treasure and somebody might find one of those someday and think it's their lucky day and they hit the mother loads
Israel Keys
of things it would be their lucky day.
TFO Jeff Bell
What's in it?
Israel Keys
Well, different things but you know, bank money. It's nothing that will get them into trouble.
TFO Jeff Bell
So no loaded guns?
Israel Keys
No, I don't. I don't bury them loaded. I don't even think I usually bury them with the magazines loaded. I did that once and then the springs were all screwed up after that.
TFO Jeff Bell
We like buried treasures also. We kind of had fun with it. So we were looking for something else to do with just kind of off task. I mean, it's not giving up much, but it's something for us to do.
Interviewer/Investigator
I think you told us that once before. Everybody likes a buried treasure.
Israel Keys
They do. That's why I started burying stuff
TFO Jeff Bell
when
Israel Keys
I was a kid. I always used to dream that I'd find buried treasure. And I figured, well, if I can't find it, I Might as well create it.
Interviewer/Investigator
What about outside of Anchorage? Do you have other. Do you have stuff like this outside of Anchorage? Anywhere else in Alaska?
Israel Keys
Oh,
TFO Jeff Bell
it was something to do.
Israel Keys
You guys have lots to do.
TFO Jeff Bell
True. But this weekend, this is a little more fun, actually.
Israel Keys
We just want to get out in the woods.
TFO Jeff Bell
The weather's so nice up here. We like to spend time outside.
Israel Keys
Yeah, it is. And you should all take field trip.
Interviewer/Investigator
Although the mosquitoes were kind of bad.
Israel Keys
Stuff like that, I normally don't. I only left that stuff there because I was planning on using it eventually. I normally don't like to. I didn't really consider that littering, though, because I figured I'd be back to clean it up pretty soon.
Interviewer/Investigator
Did you go back to that spot at all after you put it out there? Like between after you left for the couriers in June to when you got arrested? Had you been back there to look at that stuff or to move it or.
Israel Keys
Yeah, I've been back up there.
TFO Jeff Bell
To make sure it was still there or to do more knobs?
Israel Keys
Well, no, just looking out, checking out the area, I. I could tell it was still there just by driving by. Seems like I could see. Seems like I. Yeah, I remember I looked. Slowed down and looked back in the woods and saw the bag a couple times. I didn't figure it would go anywhere because it wasn't really close to the road, so.
TFO Jeff Bell
Just take it out. Any more times after that?
Israel Keys
Not. Not officially. I just would hang out up there for an hour or two here and there just to see what kind of traffic there was.
TFO Jeff Bell
Any. Any other places around here that you
Israel Keys
did that kind of thing?
TFO Jeff Bell
I mean, the stakeout, looking at trailheads or whatever, not having the equipment there.
Israel Keys
Oh, yeah, well, there was. I used to go up to Ekalutna quite a bit,
TFO Jeff Bell
But the hiking, it's up there.
Israel Keys
Yeah, the lake and stuff. I had. I was planning on doing a kayak trip up there eventually.
TFO Jeff Bell
Did you have kayaks?
Israel Keys
Yeah, I had a kayak. Well, mostly Kimberly's kayak, but I would use it quite often. Best thing in lieu of a motorboat. Actually, better than a motorboat because that motorboat, that bayliner of mine, it broke down in the middle of the lake. That was a long paddle to get it back to shore. Kayak's a lot faster.
TFO Jeff Bell
Yeah. Especially if it's windy or you have any type of weather with that big of a boat.
Israel Keys
Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
So no other buried treasures you'd like
Israel Keys
to share with us? No, not yet. That one wasn't buried treasure. I Was just feeling bad about leaving it out there.
TFO Jeff Bell
You just wanted it cleaned up?
Interviewer/Investigator
Yeah. An environmental thing?
Israel Keys
Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
Does that mean she don't want to give up the bucket in Texas?
Israel Keys
No.
TFO Jeff Bell
Well, if I get close to where it's at, would you?
Israel Keys
There's not a tracking device on it.
TFO Jeff Bell
Doesn't sound like you're able to.
Israel Keys
No, I have a pretty good memory. I can point it pretty good cash places. I have a good memory when I need to.
Interviewer/Investigator
If we came close to where one was, would you tell us?
Israel Keys
I don't. I don't know what you mean.
Interviewer/Investigator
Like, if we were able to tell you an area that we're pretty sure there's one in, would you tell us?
Israel Keys
Well, I assume, you know I've been kind of all over the place when I do go places. I don't know what you consider close, like state.
TFO Jeff Bell
No, no, no. I mean, just deducting where things. Especially just in Texas, because we have a little more information on specifically where you were at in Texas through cell phone towers and those kind of things. Like when you left to Dallas to drive to Houston after the bank and Nazelle, you didn't drive 45 straight to Houston, And you had to do something with that money from Azell because when you came back, you had the money with you. So you picked it up down there, Didn't have it in your suitcase and get all moldy and wet?
Israel Keys
Well, that was just the small bills,
TFO Jeff Bell
so the 20s are still in a bucket there.
Israel Keys
On that route, small bills are a nuisance. People nervous when you pull out a huge wad of small bills.
TFO Jeff Bell
And you didn't leave it in the Dallas area because you weren't planning on going back there. You knew your mom was going to be going down to Wells.
Israel Keys
No, the money was moldy because it wasn't really. I didn't even know if I was gonna go back to get it. I just. I just buried it and figured if I make it back, get it, if I don't, there's only a few hundred bucks? I think so.
TFO Jeff Bell
So you've only got a buried treasure of a few hundred bucks that somebody might find there?
Israel Keys
What, in Texas?
TFO Jeff Bell
Mm.
Israel Keys
No, I. I'm saying the money, it was. It was buried right by the airport. Just because I didn't want to risk TSA finding it in my carry on and asking questions. I don't know. A little overly paranoid maybe, but.
TFO Jeff Bell
So then when you flew back down there, you only took the small bills back out and left the bigger bills?
Israel Keys
No, the bigger bills I kept Separate from the small ones. The small one, yeah. They were just. They were just wrapped up in a bag. I didn't even really dig a hole. I just stopped at a rest stop, went behind a tree, kicked some dirt out of the way, dropped the bag in it, kicked some dirt over it and left.
TFO Jeff Bell
And it was still there.
Interviewer/Investigator
Yeah.
Israel Keys
Nobody wants to pick up trash.
Interviewer/Investigator
One of the things that I wanted to go back to was something we were talking about the other day, and just. It's not anything specific really, but you had mentioned that. And if my timing, if the dates are wrong on this, let me know. But you had mentioned that when you were in the military, when you were over in Tel Aviv, you'd gone to a couple prostitutes there, and that was when you were like in your 20s probably, right? Early 20s?
TFO Jeff Bell
Yeah.
Israel Keys
I think it was about 20 at the time.
Interviewer/Investigator
When did the whole prostitute thing come into play for you? Was that it? Or did.
Israel Keys
Heck, that was it. No, Montreal.
Interviewer/Investigator
So Montreal was before the military?
Israel Keys
Yeah. Well, that's the first time I'd gone was before, I think. Yeah.
Interviewer/Investigator
Okay. You've been to Montreal more than once then?
TFO Jeff Bell
Yeah.
Interviewer/Investigator
So. Was. Jump ahead now, Anchorage, is that. It's the process, visiting prostitutes, Is that something that you've continued to do over the years, including in Anchorage?
Israel Keys
Yeah, I mean, I've. I've done it over the years.
Interviewer/Investigator
Do you usually.
Israel Keys
Something. I do all the time.
Interviewer/Investigator
Okay. Is it something. When you. Is it something that you use the Internet for? Is it something that you do out to the street? I know there's not a lot of street walkers anymore. At least up here there are.
Israel Keys
And they're thanks to Craigslist.
Interviewer/Investigator
Yep, Craigslist and Backpage and a few others. But is Internet the way that you would usually find them or how would you.
Israel Keys
No, that was. I mean, really, I've only used computers for the last few years. I was always. Seems like every time I use computers, I get busted, so.
TFO Jeff Bell
By.
Israel Keys
By somebody who wasn't supposed to see it, put it that way.
TFO Jeff Bell
You didn't figure out how to clear your history?
Israel Keys
Well, I got better at it, but I was so paranoid about it because it seems like. Damn. They would always pop up inopportune moments.
Interviewer/Investigator
Did Kimberly ever see that stuff?
Israel Keys
Oh, yeah. She saw stuff.
Interviewer/Investigator
Yeah.
Israel Keys
We were together for a long time, so she saw. So I made my share of mistakes.
Interviewer/Investigator
Which websites did you use the most? You mentioned Craigslist. That's the most popular, I think.
Israel Keys
Yeah, I would use. I would use the Internet or phone books to get lists of phone Numbers. And I would rate the phone numbers, and then I would just, you know, when I got to whatever area that I was going to do it in, I just call down the list of numbers until I got a hit on one.
Interviewer/Investigator
How would you rate it? What was the.
Israel Keys
I would rate it just based on. The vibe I got off of the ad or the description online. And then, you know, usually only about 25% of the numbers work, so I write down a lot of different numbers.
Interviewer/Investigator
So would you actually call and talk to somebody and see what they had to say? And that would be part of the rating, too?
Israel Keys
Yeah.
Interviewer/Investigator
Okay, so with that in mind, The rating thing, tell me if that's what this means.
TFO Jeff Bell
Figured it out.
Interviewer/Investigator
Does that look familiar?
Israel Keys
Yeah.
Interviewer/Investigator
Is that what that is, the 1, 2, 3 rating system? Because we know that those are numbers and we know what those are numbers too, but. Okay, that makes sense what you're talking about with a rating system then. Did you call any of these?
Israel Keys
No.
Interviewer/Investigator
Because this was from your trip.
TFO Jeff Bell
Well, it was in the car.
Interviewer/Investigator
It was in the car. So it was on that when you're. When you were arrested.
Israel Keys
Right. That wasn't a for sure thing. That was just one of those things. If I had had the opportunity to go up there, I would have gone. It's not like I was gonna go for sure. And honestly, I probably wasn't going to go because the whole, you know, there was a lot of bullshit going on with my family there at the time. So I didn't want to. I just wanted to get out of there and just kind of wasn't really thinking about any of that stuff. So
TFO Jeff Bell
do you have cities or favorite or places to go? That or the prostitution stuff is easier or better or more. More of it. Vegas or anything like that?
Israel Keys
No, I don't actually like Vegas.
TFO Jeff Bell
Why not?
Israel Keys
Oh, I don't know.
TFO Jeff Bell
Too many people.
Israel Keys
Vegas is very predictable. Meet more interesting people and other people. Places.
Interviewer/Investigator
You don't seem like a big city person either.
Israel Keys
Only if I have to be. I can get around. I prefer more discreet locations.
TFO Jeff Bell
But you visited Montreal a lot when you were in upstate New York. Is that just because it was the closest big city or. Yeah, I mean, anything special? Attractions? Montreal. Montreal or Canada or.
Israel Keys
Oh, I like Canada. It's predictable. But no, I didn't have like a specific hotel or area I would go to. I just go to check it out.
Interviewer/Investigator
Did you do in calls or out calls with the girls or with the prostitutes? Did you go to them? Do they come to you?
Israel Keys
I wouldn't do it. Unless they were willing to come to me.
Interviewer/Investigator
Okay. What would you look for in a person or what would you be? What would you request?
Israel Keys
It would change all the time.
Interviewer/Investigator
Okay, you didn't have a preference or.
Israel Keys
I always had a preference, but it would change every time. It was different preference. What was the preference I was in the mood for at the time? I guess.
Interviewer/Investigator
What was the preference? You talked the other day, too, that you kind of have a preference, but then it doesn't. Nothing's really a deal breaker. But if there was a preference or kind of an ideal, what would it be?
Israel Keys
Well, it depends on the scenario. I don't know what you mean.
TFO Jeff Bell
The scenario that you're thinking of at the time.
Israel Keys
Right.
TFO Jeff Bell
And those changed is what you're saying?
Israel Keys
Yeah,
Interviewer/Investigator
yeah. I'm not even talking about murders or that kind of stuff. I was. The prostitutes is more of what I was getting at. I'm not getting into that. The other stuff that about. We're talking. Talking about the other day.
Israel Keys
Well, I'm sure you guys found my porn collection, so, you know, I have a wide range of tastes and it just varies.
Interviewer/Investigator
Okay?
Israel Keys
It's. That's the way I am. I go like a year obsessed with one thing and then completely, completely drop it. And then the next year it's something else.
Interviewer/Investigator
And the prostitution thing played that same. Played along that same thing.
Israel Keys
Yeah. I mean, yeah, I never really took the prostitutes that seriously because, I mean, I was never. I was. I mean, I was only calling them because they were prostitutes. I wasn't calling them because I was thinking I was gonna kill one of them.
Interviewer/Investigator
Did you have any regulars?
Israel Keys
No.
TFO Jeff Bell
Did the visiting the prostitute, did that sometimes work in lieu of or delay or satisfy you? Oh, yeah, at some point in time.
Israel Keys
So, yeah, that's, you know, it's a good outlet, but it's not the same. It's anonymous. And depending on. Depending on the prostitute, you can,
Interviewer/Investigator
you
Israel Keys
know, do a lot of different things. So
Interviewer/Investigator
were you. Were you into more S and M stuff? Type with the prostitutes? Type stuff with the prostitutes?
Israel Keys
Sometimes. Not.
Interviewer/Investigator
Not necessarily. It wasn't always part of it.
Israel Keys
Yeah, that wasn't always the agenda.
Interviewer/Investigator
Did you ever use ropes and that kind of stuff with the prostitutes as well, or practice any of that stuff with them?
Israel Keys
Not nothing real crazy, but yeah. I mean, nothing very elaborate, though.
Interviewer/Investigator
So it wasn't like you had, you know, your rope set up and you would practice on them to make sure it worked the way you wanted it to work kind of thing. Not that elaborate. Okay.
TFO Jeff Bell
You freak. A few of Them out. It sounded like you were talking about one the other day in Tel Aviv or somewhere that was mad at you for some.
Israel Keys
Yeah. Yeah, she was mad. I. I don't think. I don't think she was scared. I think she was just mad at me kind of thing.
Interviewer/Investigator
Is she the one that kicked you?
Israel Keys
Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
Took extra liberties that you didn't pay for?
Israel Keys
I think she was mostly worried about going over her allotted time or whatever.
TFO Jeff Bell
She was.
Israel Keys
She was pretty small, little Russian girl, and she and I had been drinking, so, you know, I kind of threw her around a little bit. I didn't hurt her or hit her or anything, but I wasn't gonna let her run the show, I guess. And. Yeah, so she was a little bit annoyed with me, and she didn't speak English, so
Interviewer/Investigator
that would make things a little more difficult.
TFO Jeff Bell
And you didn't speak Russian, so.
Israel Keys
No.
Interviewer/Investigator
Did you see. I don't know. I asked this before, and I don't know if we got off topic or if you just didn't answer. Did you see any prostitutes in Anchorage? Don't want to go there.
Israel Keys
Yeah, I don't think so.
Interviewer/Investigator
Okay. One of the things that was on your phone. There's a cemetery in Texas. Did you go to a cemetery in Texas?
TFO Jeff Bell
Mm.
Interviewer/Investigator
What was the cemetery about? One named Glenrose. Does that sound right?
Israel Keys
Yeah, I went to a few different cemeteries.
Interviewer/Investigator
What did you go to the cemetery for? That's the picture that was on your phone.
Israel Keys
Is that on MapQuest or something there?
Interviewer/Investigator
Yeah.
Israel Keys
I think.
Interviewer/Investigator
You took a picture of your computer is what it looks like.
Israel Keys
Some problem with technology. You're depending on it. You can't think about it in your life. No, that was mostly. I was just looking for different places, convenient locations. Didn't. Yeah, I went to a lot of different places because. Because none of them really seem like they worked out. People are very nosy in Texas, so I wasn't. It took me a while to find anywhere that I felt comfortable.
TFO Jeff Bell
Did you find that place?
Israel Keys
Well, I found a few different. I didn't take anybody on that trip, if that's what you're asking. That's what the thought process was. I didn't do it.
TFO Jeff Bell
Why a cemetery? A disposal site? Cemetery or an abduction site?
Israel Keys
Not an abduction site. Just somewhere to take somebody.
TFO Jeff Bell
Okay.
Interviewer/Investigator
So you take the cemeteries out, kind of like you talked about. Stuff taken out some of these other places?
Israel Keys
Yeah, I would go. A lot of those cemeteries have maintenance sheds and stuff that are usually pretty easy to get into, so.
Interviewer/Investigator
And pretty remote. This one's in the middle of nowhere.
Israel Keys
Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
So is that similar to the thought where you were saying you were thinking about doing some of this stuff in churches? Would that have be the same opposite, maybe of doing it in cemeteries or. Why? Just for the remoteness of it or specifically because it's a cemetery?
Israel Keys
Well, Had more to do with practicality than any kind of preference on my part.
Interviewer/Investigator
So there was no significance to a cemetery like there was to a church, like you had talked about before?
Israel Keys
Not really. I mean, I like cemeteries. I don't know beyond that. It's not really.
Interviewer/Investigator
No. The churches obviously had to do with the whole religious piece. But the cemeteries, there was none of that for you. It was just convenience, remoteness. You like them, you're right. That kind of thing.
Israel Keys
Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
Like them. Why you like cemetery, you think?
Israel Keys
I don't know. I just always have morbid fascination. Cemeteries. A lot easier to explain your presence there too, if someone happens to show up.
TFO Jeff Bell
So you'd find that the stone of someone to pretend like you were there to visit.
Israel Keys
I mean, easier to explain than something.
TFO Jeff Bell
So you're always thinking of that. You're always thinking of your. What you would say if you were to ask about your presence.
Israel Keys
Yeah, It doesn't always work, so obviously you have to have a backup plan. But at least, like I say, cemetery, it's cemetery, campground, something like that. Public places easier to explain than private property.
Interviewer/Investigator
Did you get questioned a lot? It kind of sounds like you were pretty good at picking places that. That wouldn't happen often.
Israel Keys
No, I got questioned casually a few times and it really felt like I was biped. Right. Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
So did you ever get in a position where you were or start conversation with someone that you had thought about doing something, and then they, for whatever reason, you got a vibe from them that it wouldn't be a good idea or whenever you. Are you able to make a decision, as soon as you see it, you know, see the person.
Israel Keys
No, it always has to be, I don't know, as soon as someone talks to me and sees me, then that kind of puts it on a different spectrum for me. You have to take somebody by surprise. I don't know why. Feels like it's like when I start talking to people and I go into a different mode. Like I want to be their friend or something. But obviously if I have already decided to take somebody, then I'm not their friend.
TFO Jeff Bell
But you don't give them that chance either. It's not like they have casual conversation and then overtake them or something. Do you do that? So that there isn't anything personal up front.
Israel Keys
I don't know. I hadn't really thought about it. It's just.
TFO Jeff Bell
I think we already talked about this. But you were never questioned by law enforcement about why you were ever in any of these places or anything?
Israel Keys
Well, like I said, casually.
TFO Jeff Bell
By law enforcement.
Israel Keys
Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
Like they would see you at a trailhead and just small talk with you. Are you here to fish? Are you here to hike? Those kind of things. Let me see your fishing license.
Interviewer/Investigator
Right.
Israel Keys
And I usually had every. Yeah, I always had all that stuff. Honestly, a lot of times that's what I was doing.
TFO Jeff Bell
Yeah.
Interviewer/Investigator
At first.
Israel Keys
Far back. Because I can remember it, you know, that's where I get a lot of the ideas. Either fishing or out hunting.
TFO Jeff Bell
Thinking of them.
Israel Keys
Yeah. Stalk me through the woods and see somebody in the woods. They don't see you sit there and watch them for a while. And I can remember doing that from time. I was like 13 or 14 years old.
TFO Jeff Bell
Thinking you could
Israel Keys
just.
TFO Jeff Bell
Or just the fact that you're able to watch them and they don't know you're watching them.
Israel Keys
Right. And then. Yeah, I don't know. I just. That's always. That was always the most comfortable scenario for me because it's win, win situation, out hunting or fishing. And if the opportunity comes up, then take it. If it doesn't, it's not like it's. You're out. Anything.
Interviewer/Investigator
You've talked before about, you read a lot and that's where you've gotten. You read about a lot of other serial killers and reading about other crimes and that kind of stuff might be a weird question, but who's your favorite? We've talked about it, so we're kind of curious. We're curious on who your favorite is.
Israel Keys
One of my favorite ones haven't been caught yet, so I guess I don't
Interviewer/Investigator
even know their names.
Israel Keys
That's a fair question.
Interviewer/Investigator
That's actually good response. Okay. Of the ones who have been caught that you've been able to read about, we'll see who. Who was right or who was closest for.
Israel Keys
I don't know. I favor it. I don't really feel like I didn't. I don't if what I've read about them is accurate. I don't feel that close to any of them. So I guess I identify most. Or my favorite, if you have to put it that way, would be the ones that I identify most with.
Interviewer/Investigator
Yeah. So that's a fair way. Say it.
Israel Keys
I don't know, maybe just going off of what I've read Ted Bundy maybe. I don't know, just because I don't. I don't have a lot of respect for someone because. Because of the way they lived, I guess. I don't know. It's weird. I like reading about all of them, but that's why I identify with them.
TFO Jeff Bell
When did you start reading about them? When did you realize. I mean, did you start reading about them because you were curious about you, or did you. Was it a study guide, so to speak? I mean, that'd be a weird question, too. Did you learn things from. To do not do, or was it just curiosity of. Do you have anything in common with them is that you were looking for, do you think?
Israel Keys
Well, the first book I read was. I think it was called Mindhunter, and it was written by an FBI profiler, John Douglas.
Interviewer/Investigator
Right.
Israel Keys
Yeah. I read that years and years ago, probably when I was 15 or 16. And not. I was. Yeah. Somewhat disturbed by it, just because. I don't know. It's always been that way. It's always felt like I was kind of reading about myself in a lot of those books. Not the Myself that everybody knew. But, you know, what did that.
TFO Jeff Bell
I mean, did that worry you, concern you, make you think it was.
Israel Keys
Well, at first, like I say, at first I was pretty conflicted about it. That was all just because of. The way I'd been raised and stuff. And, you know, I grew up with good people. I was never, you know, everybody's always nice to each other and everything's all sunshine and roses. And so that's why it was disturbing to me, because it seemed like for a long time I was the. I either thought everybody was. Everybody else was faking it, and everybody was like me. They just didn't act like it or I figured that I was. Demon child or whatever.
TFO Jeff Bell
I don't know.
Israel Keys
But, I mean, all that went away when I was in my 20s. I didn't feel bad about it anymore. I just.
TFO Jeff Bell
You didn't feel bad that you were. That you had those thoughts?
Israel Keys
I knew that most people didn't think the way I did by then. I just didn't feel bad about thinking differently at that time.
Interviewer/Investigator
Just kind of accepted that that's who you were and that's.
Israel Keys
Yeah.
TFO Jeff Bell
Do you know. So you said Ted Bundy, you kind of felt like maybe you had some things at least in common with or something. Do you know stuff about him? Do you.
Israel Keys
I know that he had a lot of. He was very sexually motivated in the stuff that he did, and I know that in the last few years, he had a really hard time controlling himself and separate. Separating his two lives, if you want to call it that. And I also identified with him because it seemed like. He was able to separate his two different. Two different aspects or whatever you want to call his personality.
Interviewer/Investigator
Anything specific about his crimes?
Israel Keys
No, honestly, I. Like I said, I never really. From what I've read anyway, I never felt that close to any of them. I just saw similarities in all of them. Honestly, I've always kind of thought of myself as more like the bank robbery type, except for, you know, every once in a while I do it
TFO Jeff Bell
because
Israel Keys
I can get the same adrenaline rush off of that kind of thing. Or not even bank robbery, just, you know, any kind. Even like burglary and arson to a certain extent.
Interviewer/Investigator
So safe to say probably then you've done more of those kind of crimes.
Israel Keys
Well done. Yeah.
Interviewer/Investigator
I mean, is that. Is that a safe assumption?
Israel Keys
Those are practical crimes too, so.
TFO Jeff Bell
Because lots of people do those.
Israel Keys
Well, they're practical because. Pretty easy to make money doing it.
Interviewer/Investigator
Do you ever get close to being caught doing any of those. Any arsons or any bank robberies?
Israel Keys
I think so.
Interviewer/Investigator
Which arson or bank robbery or bank robing?
Israel Keys
I think I got pretty close one time.
TFO Jeff Bell
What makes you think that?
Israel Keys
Actually, it was that one that you guys know about now, that one in New York, in Tupper Lake. Yeah, there was. I was leaving and there was a car that passed me and I knew it was a detective or somebody because they had a. They had a visor light or something, some kind of light. I knew it was a cop of some kind. Anyway, it wasn't like an official patrol car, but I think there were a couple people in was windy roads going through the mountains and stuff. And kind of on a hunch, I was thinking, well, because this was quite a while after the robbery, I was quite a ways from the scene. I was thinking, well, just in case they. In case they have a vehicle description or something, I better pull off the road. And there was a campground and I pulled off really quick and kind of backed into some trees and just sat there for a while and was counting money. And I think I saw the same car go back the other way, like it might have been looking for me. So I don't know if they. I don't even know if it was the same car. It went by really fast, but it looked like it could have been the
TFO Jeff Bell
same car, like fast, like it was trying to catch up to you.
Israel Keys
Yeah, I don't know for sure if they were but all the same, I think I sat there for quite a while, sat there for several hours and figured by then everybody who was going to be at the scene was going to be there. I remember reading about it a few days later. That one really freaked them out because it was such a small town. They locked all the schools and everything. Had SWAT teams patrolling the streets or whatever. But yeah, that was. I was thinking at the time, I was like, I'm just gonna hang out at this campground and count money and stuff.
TFO Jeff Bell
And
Israel Keys
he stops by, I'll just act like I'm fishing and.
TFO Jeff Bell
Did you have a fishing pole?
Israel Keys
I think I did on that trip. I don't think I had a license though. Not for you to take that ticket for that though.
TFO Jeff Bell
Yeah, probably.
Israel Keys
But.
TFO Jeff Bell
Why do you think you were able to, in talking about the practical crimes, why do you think you were able to get away with so successfully with it sounds like you did a lot of bank robberies and burglaries and those kind of things.
Israel Keys
Oh, my days were numbered. Too many fricking videos cameras nowadays.
TFO Jeff Bell
So times changed.
Israel Keys
Yeah, it was easy when all you had to worry about was fingerprints and witnesses and DNA. That stuff's all pretty easy.
TFO Jeff Bell
But you also had, depending on what you take, like if you commit a burglary, you still have to. If it's something, if it's not monetary, it's not money, you have to sell it or get rid of it or those kind of things. What did you. When you were doing burglaries, what kind of things did you take from houses? Well, besides people,
Israel Keys
for the most part, I. It's not like I needed the money.
Interviewer/Investigator
So what was the motivation then for the burglaries if it wasn't
Israel Keys
just for old times sake?
TFO Jeff Bell
Well, you said you get the same. They seem so different, but you describe them as kind of the same. The killings to robberies, burglaries, arsons, to some degree. I mean, they seem so different and far apart, but you seem to get some.
Israel Keys
That's because when I go in to do a burglary, I don't go in to do it like most people do. I. I go in loaded for bear,
TFO Jeff Bell
so to speak, hoping there's gonna be people there.
Israel Keys
No, not necessarily. Just knowing that if something happens, it's, you know, it's like if I ever got caught in the act doing anything, I'm not gonna go meekly away in handcuffs or whatever. I always went ready for whatever.
Interviewer/Investigator
So what would your motivation be going in? What would you be looking for? What would you.
Israel Keys
Burglaries, I usually just do jewelry and guns. Small guns. Smallish.
TFO Jeff Bell
So some of that. Are some of the guns that you still have in places, those guns, or did you always get rid of those?
Israel Keys
No, I didn't get rid of them because I was worried about them getting tracked.
TFO Jeff Bell
So you keep them, but you don't keep them with you so that you're not caught with them. So you keep them in a cache somewhere and then use them when you need them.
Israel Keys
The statute of limitations, like five or seven years or something like that, I don't even know.
TFO Jeff Bell
So you wait. I can't tell whether that's supposed to be a joke, charged with that or whether. So you hide them for the statute of limitations period before you use them.
Israel Keys
Makes it a lot less likely that they get tracked.
Interviewer/Investigator
Was part of the burglary similar to what you. Similar, but different to what you talked about with the woods, where you're sitting there and you can watch people and they don't know you're watching them. Is it similar in a burglar because when you're in somebody's house, you're going through their stuff? Yeah, that same kind of sense that you get from them.
TFO Jeff Bell
So would it be. Would you try to do it to where they didn't even know it happened or make sure they knew it happened? Like, I mean, breaking windows and breaking doors to go in or get in somehow on.
Israel Keys
No, it would depend. It would depend on situation, I guess more often than not. There was usually a lot of destruction, but sometimes I wouldn't. Sometimes I would just, you know, Sometimes I wouldn't take anything at all, necessarily. Maybe a few little things.
TFO Jeff Bell
So destruction, like damage rather than destruction, like looking for stuff. Because a lot of burglars you go into, all the drawers are open, all those clothes are on the ground. Everything's been destroyed. Looking.
Israel Keys
I never did that.
TFO Jeff Bell
So destroy. To destroy.
Interviewer/Investigator
Yeah. You like to watch people. Did you ever wait in a house and watch people or wait and watch people. People come back to see what the reaction would be?
Israel Keys
I would wait in the woods sometime. That was years and years ago, though.
Interviewer/Investigator
Not wait in the house to watch for him to come back?
Israel Keys
Not. No, not burglaries. No.
Interviewer/Investigator
That's getting on to other people. Crimes, I'm guessing by that reaction.
Israel Keys
Yeah.
Host: Studio BOTH/AND
Focus: Detailed FBI interrogation of serial killer Israel Keyes, exploring his methods, motivations, caches, and personal history.
This episode presents an unfiltered look at a pivotal FBI interrogation session with Israel Keyes on July 12, 2012. The conversation, primarily between investigators and Keyes, delves into Keyes' criminal processes, hidden caches ("buried treasures"), strategy around burglaries and robberies, his interactions with law enforcement, and the psychology behind his crimes. Personal details about his preferences and habits, and candid reflections on his sense of identity, are revealed. The overall tone is clinical, investigative, and chillingly mundane, punctuated by Keyes’ unsettling calm and frankness.
This episode is a granular, unsettling journey through the mechanics and mindset of one of America’s most enigmatic killers, as told in his own unemotional words and those of the experienced investigators seeking the truth.