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Santa Rosa Murders ////// Suspects
01:02:48
The Santa Rosa Hitchhiker Murders is a series of unsolved homicides of young women that took place in the early 1970s. Many of the victims were confirmed or believed to have been hitchhiking in or around the Santa Rosa, California area. High School girls and College students were not safe. Often times the women and girls were not found until several days later. Many discovered in rural areas. If you have any information regarding these cases please submit a tip at sheriff-coldcase@sonoma-county.org or please call the Sonoma County Sheriff’s cold case unit at 1-707-565-2727
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SA.
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In the early 1970s in Sonoma County, California, young women and girls were turning up dead homicide victims discarded by the killer or killers, as detectives put it, like trash. Many of the crimes were similar in both nature and victimology. Despite an extensive investigation, the killer or killers remain unidentified to this day, and loved ones of the victims are still awaiting justice. Among the victims, all of the women were last seen hitchhiking in and around Santa Rosa in Sonoma county in the North Bay area of California. The remains of all of the victims, except for one whose body has never been found, were discovered in rural areas. The victims were found nude, their bodies discarded near creek beds and at the bottom of steep embankments in an area northeast or east of the city. A single gold earring was often present at the crime scene. Police believe that the perpetrators of the Santa Rosa murders had interviewed potential victims before killing them. This is thought to mean they assessed their victims based on certain characteristics, behaviors or vulnerabilities before committing the crime. If their suspicions are true, this means that the killer or killers, very likely and even perhaps on more than one occasion, let some unsuspecting individual go free as they did not fit their preferred criteria for a suitable victim. One should consider themselves very lucky to fall short of this benchmark. This is true Crime Garage Sonoma county, located in the Bay Area of Northern California, is home to the prosperous and vibrant city of Santa Rosa. This is wine country, and God bless them for that. California's Wine Country Today, Sonoma county has more than 425 wineries, ranging from small family run operations to internationally acclaimed wine houses. And this great county is host to more than 8 million tourists per year. But back in the 1970s, the city of Santa Rosa was undergoing transformative change. This is thanks to urban redevelopment at the time, and the city was growing in terms of population as well, but it was still surrounded by classic small town America. In rural areas, the 1970s saw a significant rise in violent crime such as assault, rape and murder from prior decades. The decade also has the dubious distinction of being at the Forefront of the Golden Age of serial killers the term serial killer, most likely coined by former FBI agent and profiler Robert Ressler, first entered the conversation in 1974. During this time, the country saw an extraordinary surge in in cases involving offenders who committed multiple murders over extended periods of time while operating in the shadows and eluding capture. Notorious figures like Ted Bundy, John Wayne Gacy, the Zodiac Killer and the Son of Sam dominated headlines, creating a culture of terror that rippled through our society. The breakdown of the 1950s style traditional family unit, coupled with the economic turmoil caused by urbanization and the energy crisis, combined to create an environment where serial killers could operate more freely. Sophisticated forensic technology had yet to be invented and the absence of a system supporting coordination among the various law enforcement agencies and jurisdictions contributed to the inability to track and capture these serial offenders. Within society, the fear of violent crime became widespread, influencing pop culture and media alike. But here in Sonoma county, the bodies dumped in rural areas were piling up and adding up. They were finding bodies in creek beds and steep embankments. First it was the missing girls. Marlene Sterling, age 12 and Yvonne Weber, age 13. Two middle school friends who disappeared on February 4th, 1972 after leaving a local ice rink. But their remains weren't found until 10 months later in December of 1972 on Fran's Valley Road. Then there were the hitchhiker murders. Kim Wendy Allen, age 19, an art student who frequently hitchhiked. She was last seen on March 4th, 1972. Her body was found the next day in a creek bed and she had been sexually assaulted and strangled. Someone who never came forward, never identified, mailed the victim's missing checkbook from a post office in Kentfield. This 20 days after her body was recovered. The distance between these locations is approximately a 40 to 60 minute drive from where she was found to where the checkbook was mailed. And again that checkbook mailed in Kent Field, a location very close to where she worked at a grocery store in Larkspur. Jeanette Kamahale, age 20, a college student who was last seen hitchhiking on April 25, 1972, this near Highway 101. Her body has never been found. Lori Lee Cursa, age 13, a runaway who disappeared in November of 1972. Her remains were found in a ravine of a Calistoga road in December of 72. Remember this victim, Lori was found tied up in a very specific and unique way. Of these five victims, Jeanette of course presumed a victim as she's never been found. But after the two girls bodies were found 10 months later, the two missing middle school girls. It was then that police were pretty much convinced that the four confirmed murder victims, along with the missing hitchhiker, Jeanette Kamahele, were possibly and probably linked. Whether the murders were the result of a single perpetrator or multiple assailants, they could not confirm nor 100% agree. We talked a lot about the Press, Democrat newspaper that covered this case and these victims, their cases extensively over the months that the investigation dragged on. In one article in particular, Sonoma County Sheriff Don Stripik reiterated his belief that these unfortunate young women had in fact fallen prey to the same killer or killers, citing the similarities between the victims. All four of the found victims were found nude. Their bodies had been discovered at the bottom of steep embankments off of desolate country roads. Two of the girls were known to routinely hitchhike, and the other two were deemed likely to have accepted a ride. Clothing and jewelry known to be worn by the victims were not recovered at any of these crime scenes. But in the case of Kim, Maureen and Yvonne, that weird little detail of a single earring found at each of the scenes. While it was true that the cases of death varied, the determination of how these victims were killed, strangulation for Kim, a broken neck for Lori, and an undetermined manner of death for Marine and Yvonne. The sheriff says, you know what, that's not going to rule this out. Because what they're seeing here, Captain, is very similar crime scenes where the victims are found, and also very similar ways that the killer or killers are procuring their victims, finding their victims, going to the ice rink, offering a ride, perhaps hitchhiking. Those two. We did have the witness saying that maybe they were hitchhiking or seen hitchhiking later. I am of the belief that whoever that guy was that was talking with them at the ice rink was probably a person that was able to get them into a vehicle willingly and pretty easily. But then the other victims, known to have been hitchhikers and known that they were going to be hitchhiking on the day when they were last seen, while some of the members of law enforcement, including high ranking officials, felt that the cases were unrelated, you could argue this day and night, and I'm sure that they did. And the reason for that is there's simply not enough evidence, physical evidence, to go beyond just gut instinct to make a clear cut determination one way or another. Now we know that regardless if they were agreeing or not, the investigation ramped up, and as it should, they decided that a group of up to eight investigators Would be focusing on the. What was dubbed the hitchhiker murders, as well as sharing information with neighboring counties in an attempt to crack the case wide open. I don't know what their strategy was at the time. They were not openly discussing their strategy for this team, this task force, if you will, that was put together working these homicides. If it were me, and we've talked about this in some other cases, especially we go way back in the garage archives to when there was no arrest. Rex Herman, nobody knew who he was at the time. But when we were talking about the long island serial killer case, and there was so much debate as to what victims, what cases within that were in fact related to it or belonging to and having been killed by the same perpetrator, we said the same thing, or at least I did here, captain, was. I am of the belief that the. The best way and the most clear, concise way to avoid confusion would be to work these cases independently. And here you have a unique situation where, yeah, we have the five victims, one never found. Of the four remaining victims, two of them are found together. So, you know, they were last seen together. Their bodies are found together. Those cases are absolutely connected. Right? And I hate to say this, because, you know, I believe every victim deserves a voice. Every case should be worked to its fullest. But also, time is of the essence here, right? You are working under a deadline, and pun intended, I guess I'm not trying to be funny here, but the deadline is the longer your investigation drags on, the longer that you don't find this maniac or find the persons who are responsible, very likely you're going to end up with another dead girl. So you are under the gun. You are under the clock and behind the eight ball, my friend. So what. What you got to do is you got to start making strategic moves. My move would be to, other than information coming in to you, ignore the missing girl case. Sorry, but I. I have to give some direction to this investigation. I have eight investigators. I. I'm going to take six of them and put them in and pair them up, right? So I got three sets of two. I want two detectives working the missing girls case, Maureen and Yvonne, who were eventually found ten months later. I want two detectives working independently on Kim Allen's case, and I want two detectives working independently from the other cases. On Lori Lee curse's case. That leaves me with two detectives left. I want one detective who is responsible for taking in all of the tips, all of the secret witness tips that might come in, all the phone tips. That come in, people dropping by the sheriff's office to submit information. I want just one person fielding all of that. Because what happens is, if you get all these detectives, all eight of them in the same room, the phone is ringing off the hook. They're picking it up at Rand. Captain, it's your turn to answer the phone. I took the last one. You start really muddying the waters and. And adding unnecessary confusion and chaos to your investigation. I want one detective fielding all of the incoming information, and it is their job to hand off that information to the appropriate channels. What investigation does it belong to? The two missing girls? Does it belong to Kim's case? Does it belong to Lori's case? And if it belongs to the missing girl's case, take the information and give it to the captain of the homicide unit, who should be overseeing all of these detectives. And then my remaining detective will be in charge of constantly reaching out to the surrounding jurisdictions looking for similar cases, looking to talk to anybody that may have information that's coming from outside of our county lines. As the captain of the homicide unit, it's about delegation, coordination, and management. And again, I don't know how they were working it. That's how I would have worked it.
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B
Would you give, like, daily pep talks?
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C
Yeah. Well, so that. That's. That's interesting, right? What. What? I think that's a fine line. Right. When is there too much of us of a huddle? Right. Let's huddle up, and let's share what we know. I think. I think there can be a situation where there's too much, and I think that, again, makes it more tricky than it needs to be, because here's the thing. And thank God they got some great detectives and great leadership that eventually came in on the Long island case, and. And they have an arrest. Recently, an update in that case, it was determined in court that Rex Herman's defense counsel wanted to make it so. Hey, when I go to trial, you're trying me for each one of these homicides separately, not all together.
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B
Right.
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C
After some court hearings, the judge ruled, no, we're going to. Every murder he's charged with is going to be present at that trial. We're gonna have one trial for all of these murders, Let the jury decide which ones he is, in fact, guilty of.
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B
Yeah, but I think that goes in the prosecution's favor, because you're then having a mountain of evidence.
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C
Absolutely.
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B
And that's probably bad for Rex, because in some of these cases, they don't have much of anything other than maybe a Hair sample.
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C
You're right. And what's going to happen? I think there is. It's going to become a totality of evidence situation, which most cases do. But here it won't be for one single murder. Like you just said, it's going to be, oh, here's this evidence for this murder. Here's this evidence for that murder. And let's pile it all together now. He looks like he has to be this giant ogre monster that was killing petite women for many years right underneath our nose.
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B
Well, I think the other thing that's scary is not just will we find another victim because the killer could move.
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C
Exactly.
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B
The killer could stop. The killer could go dormant and without DNA evidence, without cell phone data evidence. But my, my pep talk would be like, hey, look, I want you out there kicking nuts and sucking butts. I need somebody to get a nice.
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C
That's assault.
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B
Yeah. But hey, any means necessary. I need somebody collecting some good coffee and collecting some good donuts. And let's start off this day with a dark cup of coffee and a nice blow job.
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C
The, the thing here, why this tactic in my mind works is that you don't have to have any great understanding or agreement that these cases are connected. If you work them independently, you should end up with the same result is what I'm getting at, whether they're connected at or not. Right. If as long as you track down the killer of one of these victims, if they are in fact then later connected, you will start seeing that connective tissue much more clearly. Once you have a suspect in one of these cases, you're going to start going, oh, wait this. Your suspect in the two missing girls case matches the description of what the eyewitness said of the Caucasian man with the afro in the van that was seen picking up one of the other girls that you. Can you see what I'm saying here? It's don't allow it to be whether or not they're connected to complicate your investigations. Work them like you would any regular homicide investigation. That's what you know how to do. That's what you're good at. That's what got you to being captain of the homicide unit. So work it like that. And if they are connected, you'll start to see that after an arrest has been made, if they're not connected, worst case scenario, you've solved one or two of these homicides, where here we sit today, 50 years later and none of them have been solved.
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B
The only way I'm becoming chief of police is through Nepotism or it sounds.
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C
Like you're into butt sucking, but no.
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B
I, I wasn't into butt sucking. I was ordering the butt sucking to be done. You're delegating, let's be clear about that.
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C
So let's, let's take a quick, I want to take a quick brief look at this because there is a lot to get to still here with this case. But the, the victims that we haven't reviewed recapped yet here today is Carolyn Davis, age 15, a runaway who disappeared while hitchhiking in July of 73. Her body was found about two weeks later on Franz Valley Road. Remember, this is the one, Captain, where she was found near Sterling and Weber, the, the two missing girl victims where they were discovered. So she died, Carolyn Davis died of strychnine poisoning and was, and there was some kind of symbol that was found near her body. So if you're looking at this one, whether these are linked or not or what have you, this one's a, this one's a no brainer to me. It doesn't, you know, the simp. I think it's probably connected to the two missing girls due simply to the very close proximity that some reports say 4ft, 3 yards, 10ft to the other bodies that were previously found with the two missing ice rink girls gotta be linked. And I really wish that we had some good information as to whether or not there would have been any reason to believe that this victim, Carolyn Davis, what you have here with Caroline's case, that's different from your two missing girls case. Remember, they weren't found for about 10 months. So you're very limited on what you can tell about the body, what you can tell from the body and the evidence that would be collected at that scene. Carolyn Davis is found about two weeks later in that same location. So you have a much better, much higher likelihood of learning more about her body, what was done to her and so on and the evidence that was found at the scene. I wanted to know, and it would be helpful to know if the experts that worked this case at the time, if they had any reason to believe that Carolyn Davis was restrained, were tied up prior to or during her death because we will see signs of that with other victims.
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B
Right?
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C
So if you're looking for linkage, that would be a way to connect now three murders to probably two others, at least two others. So that's because we have Teresa Walsh, age 23, last seen hitchhiking in Malibu in December of 73. She was found hog tied and strangled, submerged under A log in Mark West Creek just a few days after she went missing. Again, if you're looking as to what is linked and what is not due simply to the hog tied and strangled victim, Lori Lee Cursa, age 13. Remember, she was found tied up in a very specific manner. Hog tied in a very specific manner. Teresa Walsh found hogtied in a very similar specific manner. That's why I want to take a look at those previous three. And is there anything, any indicators that Carolyn Davis was tied up, restrained or tortured using ligatures prior to or during her death? Now, we talk about restrained, we talk about tied up. Strangulation. One thing that is often overlooked with these ligature and binding cases, and this is trying to crawl inside the mind of the monster here, is constrictors. There can be a constrictor element to the torture. Less for strangulation, more for constricting. Again, this means something to the killer. It's part of his art. The fantasy is of his design. The signature is. Whether he can control it or not is another aspect to examine here. Then we have the Sonoma County Jane Doe. Okay, so this is many years later, In July of 1979, the skeletal remains of a young woman were found about 100 yards from where cursor was discovered. Again, you have what, six years had passed? Seven years. So seven years had passed. And now you're getting this repeat in your case where you're finding now an unknown victim Six to seven years later, 100 yards from a previous victim. Well, we've seen that movie before, haven't we? We've seen that movie before. And remember we talked about how police and the FBI believed that this killer likely would want to play games with police and taunt them. And placing Carolyn Davis's body near the two missing girls bodies, that's a taunt, that's a tease. Finding Jane Doe's body in 79, 100 yards from where Lori Lee Curse's body was found. This is very similar. So what's one thing about her? So she's found hogtied as well. Again, it goes back to these ligatures. These cases are starting to look more and more connected as you go. This victim's found hogtied. She wore hard contact corrective lenses. This was an indicator to the experts at the time that her death likely occurred between 1972 and 1974. This is really interesting. They're basing this simply off of the idea of when these kinds of the specific contact lenses that were found, that when they were manufactured and when they Were sold and available to the public. They weren't available prior to. And they stopped selling those and moved on to. I get. I guess if these are hard contact lenses. I've never had to wear lenses, but. Or contacts. But they must be soft. You know, I've seen them. They appear to be soft today, but it sounds like in 1974, 1975, at some point, they started manufacturing and selling soft contact lenses. And so they're basing this information off of that idea of, hey, this is. This is a piece of physical evidence that we found on our person, on our victim here.
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B
Right.
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C
This is an indicator of who she may be when. When the murder occurred and when she was placed here. The 1970s was the golden era of hitchhiking, especially in the state of California. And sick monsters were using this to their advantage to play out their twisted, torturous fantasies. Just ask Ed Kemper next time you're at vacaville. Kemper, at this very same time that we're discussing here, at this very same time as our Santa Rosa cases, He was down in the Santa Cruz area, driving up and down the roads, looking for pretty young college women to get into the small cabin of his car where he took up so much space. You do not want to have to fight a very large, powerful man inside of a phone booth. And that's what he did between May 7, 1972, and February 5, 1973. He simply plucked them off the street, Thumb or no thumb. He would slow down, pull over, and offer up a friendly gesture of, hey, do you want to lift? Or maybe even more sly. Hey, where you going? Kemper picked up five hitchhiking college students and one high school student and took them to isolated areas where he shot, stabbed, smothered, or strangled them. He then took their bodies back to his home where he decapitated them, engaged in acts of necrophilia with their corpses, and then dismembered them. Of course, we talked a lot about old Edward during our examination of the mindhunter show. But despite the dangers and high risk status of hitchhiking, travelers, especially students, were still seeking the cheapest mode of transportation by using their thumb to catch a ride. It could never happen to me. Getting into a vehicle that they had never seen before, driven by someone they had never met, Then only after it is far too late, regrettably, learning that hitchhiking was anything but free. Most people think that home security is just an alarm that goes off after a break in scaring the intruder off and getting a neighbor's attention. If you're lucky, but that's a reactive approach. By the time an intruder is inside of your home, it's too late. Your feeling of safety is shattered. That's why you should trust Simplisafe. Their system is designed to be proactive, not reactive. They use smart AI powered cameras to identify threats lurking outside of your home or business and immediately alert simply saves professional monitoring agents. They access two way audio to confront the person, let them know that they are being recorded, they're being filmed, trigger sirens and spotlights to scare them off and request police dispatch when needed. All helping to stop the break in, stop the intruder while they are still outside of your home. That's why I love simply Safe. It's a double layer of protection. You get the AI powered cameras with the professional monitoring and let me tell you from experience, their monitoring agents are better than other services and security systems that I have had in the past. It's a better system at a better price. Check out SimpliSafe for your home or your office. Get peace of mind. Visit simplisafe.com garage to claim 50% off a new system and that simplisafe.com garage there's no safe like simply safe.
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D
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B
All right, we are back. Tall Cans in the air. Thanks for joining us here in the garage. Cheers to you, Colonel.
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C
Cheers to you, Captain. The captain's right. If you see a tall can sitting there, grab it, open it up, take a. In the air, put it in the air.
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B
Keep your hand on it when you put it in the air, though.
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C
Yeah. And then don't TCG for life. And then look at the odd stairs that you have to deal with after that.
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B
But, yeah, but also make sure that you open your can first before you help your buddy open his can.
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C
That's right. That's right. Airplane rules always in effect. Months would pass. The police are getting no closer to solving the case. We talked about Sheriff Don Stripik, who openly speculated as to whether the Santa Rosa murders were the handiwork of a serial killer. In April of 1975, the local news there, they're showing footage of press conference of a press conference that was held by the sheriff's office regarding these Santa Rosa murders. In this press conference, they're discussing at least six or seven young women who were confirmed victims who had been murdered while hitchhiking around Santa Rosa between 1972 and 1973. Stripik affirmed his belief that there were possible connections to up to 13 other unsolved California murders. A reporter explained that Stripik had been consulting with an investigator. And we talked about this in our second part of this. They were looking into witchcraft teachings because of a symbol that was found. And I. I don't know why I did that. This is an audio show. You can't see that. I made air quotes with my fingers. A symbol that was found at one of the scenes, which they believed had some type of tie to potential English witchcraft, meaning that it was a symbol meant to speed the deceased to the afterlife. This would be interesting if you're looking at some of what serial killers have said over the years while still an unidentified. The Zodiac Killer referenced gathering slaves for the afterlife, meaning his victims would become his slaves. BTK talked about gathering slaves for the afterlife, and even Edmund Kemper talked about it.
- [35:41]
B
Is it something you think they hear from other killers and then they adopt that ideology? Or is it something that maybe is plain, you know, almost as if this is some kind of mental illness?
- [35:58]
C
I think you're right. I think it's. I think it can be both. Okay. I think maybe the rationale of it might be pointed out to them by another killer where they're like, oh, well, that makes some sense. But I think you're more on to something here with the mental illness part of it. And, and to be clear, this is not, you know, a victim of mental illness. This is. This is psychotic mental illness.
- [36:29]
B
Right.
- [36:30]
C
You know, Ted Bundy said this not only points out his own narcissism, but it also points to what he thought of the rest of us. He said something. It was. And I. I don't want to pretend to have the. The quote here in front of me, but it was something to the effect of, you know, there's millions of girls out there. What does it matter if one of them disappears? What does it matter if one of them is killed? There's millions of other girls out there. There's millions of people on this planet. What does it matter if one of them is killed?
- [37:07]
B
Well, part of mental health is an individual thinks of themselves as less than. Those are the individuals that we need to help when that individual has a mental illness that they think others are less than. Not even just less than themselves, but less than human. And they shouldn't have humanity towards those humans. Those are the ones that we might not be able to help, and those are the ones that we might need to lock away.
- [37:38]
C
Yeah. And so Zodiac claims he's collecting slaves for the afterlife. Ed Kemper said something. He. His description was a little bit different, and I don't have that in front of me today. But. But interesting that he would say something similar and then. But. But there's also no reason to believe that somebody like Ed Kemper would not have followed the Zodiac case when. When that was going down, especially considering they live in the same state.
- [38:09]
B
Right.
- [38:10]
C
And we know Kemper's fascination with police and police work. So he. There. I would wager, Franklin, that he followed the case. Then you have somebody as sick and twisted as Dennis Raider, who. I think sometimes what gets lost in the whole story of Dennis Raider, or at least people's perception of him as a killer or serial killer, is that he's also a pedophile. Very much a pedophile. While he has a lot of adult victims, he's not above being a pedophile. I mean, his first murders of half of the Otero family were two children and the parents. And later he would tell Catherine Ramslin and his correspondence with her that he always thought of the four of the Oteros as his slaves. And this is what a sick effort this guy is. He's. He's saying that they're forever his slaves, that the children are his sex slaves, the boy and girl children are his sex slaves forever for eternity. And the Joseph Otor, the. The father is his manual labor. Slave to do all the work for him in the afterlife so that he. So that he can be King Raider and not have to do anything. And the. The mother, the murdered mother who he killed would be a similar type of slave but doing more female type work. These are his words. Don't read them as mine. Please, God, don't read them as mine. But it's that God complex of oh, I did and I can and I will. I have the ability to take your life and end your life here in this moment. I am God. And I think that's why it's not much of a leap, right, to go from I am in control of whether you live or die, your existence to that, oh, Yuki, you're my slave now. I forever own you.
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B
Oh, I think he's probably wrong about that.
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C
Yeah. Yes. Yes. He's. He's. He's very wrong about many things. These guys often are. All right, let's examine this. This symbol that was found there is reporting out there. And that I can't confirm this to be exactly the case, but it sounds like this was simply a stick symbol. Sticks put together, which we've talked about this in other cases can simply be happenstance. Mother Nature is in. We are not. She could have placed those sticks there with her infinite power, completely randomly. Or in this situation. There were two boys that came forward that said that they had. They were playing around and. And set those sticks in that manner. Didn't have any meaning to it. It was just something that they had did and that they believed that they had done that while they were in the area many months before that body was even found there. And it just so happened to be lying near the body when the body was eventually found.
- [41:15]
B
Right. So most of the time nothing burger.
- [41:19]
C
Exactly. And I. I am of the belief that 90 of the time these things are nothing burgers. We talked about a profile. The profile again. A lot of this stuff looking like maybe not all of these cases, but a lot of them could be connected and reason to believe that they could be connected. The profile developed by psychologists depicted a male offender who possessed at least a high school education, grew up as a loner, had a domineering mother, likely deeply hated all women in general. As a child, this offender would have tortured and killed animals, perhaps strangling or even poisoning them, has long standing mental problems, possesses a savior complex to the point that he believes he's doing the world a favor by murdering these young women. And he would be of the type to want to play games with the investigators, taunt the investigators and tease law enforcement rubbing the. The murders in their face, rubbing it in their face that they cannot solve them or find him. The other thing that we talked about a little bit beyond the hitchhiking nature of some, if not all of the victims here is the. The single earring that was found at several of the scenes. Not all the scenes, but at several of the scenes seems to be some kind of marker or some kind of tell of this killer to point out to police. This is me. I'm still out here. I'm still doing this. I'm still doing my thing. You're doing your thing, but you ain't caught me yet.
- [43:00]
B
Well, it's interesting because I think this profile is probably pretty similar to the Zodiac profile.
- [43:07]
C
Similar to Zodiac. Similar to btk? Yes. Where with Zodiac, I would push and say that the. The game was more important. The game to him was equally as important as the murders. Where with BTK and with this perpetrator, it appears to me that the murders are probably far more significant, at least with this guy, than. Than the taunting and the playing of games with police. You know, Raider really ramped up his teasing the police and making a name for himself in the media when more. When he was not killing than when he was actively killing. This guy seems to be doing it because, like. Because he can. But the. But the kill is a large part of it. And then with the exception of one or two of the victims, I mean, we had the one victim who's found hours, believed to be hours after she was last seen, disappears less than a night, one night's time. These other victims, because of the. The delay between when they're last seen and when they're eventually found, there's. That leaves the door open for the possibility that this person was taking them elsewhere or had the ability to keep them somewhere, even if it's in a van and do some things, there's elements of torture here where the Zodiac killings were quick. Strike, strike, and kill, where BTK wants to be alone with the victim. I see some of that here with the hog tying and the very specific way that these victims were tied up. In some of the cases, that takes a lot of time and it takes.
- [44:57]
B
Privacy, but it could be escalation. If this is the Zodiac, and also maybe if this is the Zodiac, maybe you just got tired of publicly taunting law enforcement and just thought, oh, I kill these individuals. I'll place items, let's say, hypothetically, this is the Zodiac, Then you go, well, do you really want to cause attention to that? You have moved and are killing in a different location.
- [45:26]
C
Yeah, the Zodiac's a tricky one. And I think that, you know, everything that you're setting up here is a lot of the reasons why at the time, there were people who did think that there was a connection. There were even people in law enforcement, as we discussed in the. The earlier episodes on this case, that there is a direct connection here. Part of that, because of. In those tauntings and in those communications from the Zodiac. This is the Zodiac speaking. He says that he's going to change the way that he kills, that he's no longer going to announce his killings, and that going forward, it will be up to the police to determine if they were connected or not. I'm not going to say that this wasn't the Zodiac, and I'm not saying that he is incapable of change, but I. I kind of believe that. That his. We talked, what we do, five episodes on the Zodiac, and he's crept his way into many of our other cases throughout the years. And when we talk about. Actually, I think I can think of seven, at least seven or eight episodes on Zodiac over the years. But I've always believed, with Zodiac, that the game was so important to him, the teasing was so important to him, the. The being known the Zodiac name. I don't know that he would be able to let that go.
- [46:43]
B
Yeah, maybe.
- [46:44]
C
Or.
- [46:46]
B
Does the legend of the Zodiac become less than if you change your location and change your mannerisms and how you're committing these crimes?
- [46:58]
C
Same year that the profile was released, there was an FBI report that was issued that same year, and it was titled Unsolved Female Homicides, An Analysis of a Series of Related Murders in California and Western America. And this was from the US Department of Justice, Federal Bureau of Investigation. This report outlined the suspect, the suspected connection between the six established Santa Rosa hitchhiker victims and the eight possible victims that they were attributing to the same killer. So this 75 report issued by the FBI is stating that there are 14 unsolved homicides between 72 and 74 that they were working and believed to have been committed by the same perpetrator. And of course, that includes the. The victims we've already discussed. One of these victims that they cite in the report was Rosa Vasquez, a key punch operator for a hospital in the Presidio of Santa San Francisco. If you want ties to Zodiac, well, there's your tie. San Francisco, the Presidio. She's last seen there May 26, 1973. I. I do want to While we're talking about cases that are connected or, or if this is all the same killer, I do want to circle back to something that you had picked up on early in this case. That, that is quite insightful here and.
- [48:37]
B
Quite some would say, genius.
- [48:40]
C
Yes, I find it incredible that, that you had picked up on it because it's something that's just not discussed in a lot of these, in this case in particular, but not in a lot of cases. When we're talking about the last known date, day of the week when some of these victims were seen. The, the first three victims, the two missing girls who go missing the same night and the third victim all go missing on a Friday and a Saturday. And you had pointed out it's the weekend. Right? That's, that is the time where it's like, more likely that people would be out hitchhiking, there's people moving around. And when we first had that discussion, I was quickly looking at it from the victim standpoint where the, the girls happen to be at the ice rink. And the next victim, she hitchhiked to and from work every day that she worked. And so that for her, it wasn't out of necessity that it's the weekend that she needs a, a ride. It's more out of necessity that she needs a ride because she's going to. From work. You're looking at it from a smarter perspective of the perpetrator's perspective, saying, well, if, you know, if I only have limited time to go out and try to find a victim, I'm going to do it when, when there's more victims, potential victims out there.
- [50:06]
B
Right.
- [50:06]
C
And so it would stand a reason that it would. You would think that it would be more common, more people out there with their thumb in the air on a Friday, Saturday, and easier to find a victim. No different than a hunter going out to a field or, or a large property to see if there's animal activity there prior to going out and actually setting up camp and, and, and, and commencing the hunt when we, everybody has bills.
- [50:38]
B
So it's more likely that the killer would be working during the week as opposed to the weekend.
- [50:44]
C
And if I'm correct, and this killer needed some time because we do see torture playing out with some of these victims, obvious torture with some of these victims. So that requires a certain level of time. It also requires a certain level of privacy. And, and if that is in fact what he is doing, and maybe he did it in every case, it's obvious in some when it. When would he likely have more Privacy and more time. Like you said, when he's not required to be somewhere, when he's not required to work, to take that a little further down the road, it gets difficult, gets dicey with some of these victims because we don't have a great confirmation on when the last day they were seen. We get with some of the victims it's simply a month. With some of the victims it's, it's within this week. So we couldn't really pinpoint. I wanted to dig through these victims and look to see was there any kind of consistency on what days the victims were getting picked up. And there wasn't. But that doesn't mean that your analysis doesn't still hold significance here. It absolutely does. And it's almost the flip of that. Where it may be suggestive that this individual has, is not bound to the typical work week. Maybe this individual is, is in control of their time, their schedule. Maybe this individual, their job, the nature of their job, their occupation is that they are driving around, that they are out on the roadways anyway. And, and that's interesting to look at because at the time back in 73, 74, 75, one thing that they were openly discussing was could this be some kind of utility worker, A person that has, that's stuck in a van or a truck hour after hour, day after day, driving around, fixing, repairing, troubleshooting problems that's out on the road and seeing these people, seeing these young women frequently out on the road, walking, hitchhiking, and has the ability to do this on or off the clock because there is no supervision for what this individual does. The other thing it could point to too is you know, we see some victims that we can confirm last seen on a Tuesday, can confirm last seen on a Wednesday. This may also be suggestive that we are in fact talking about different killers, multiple killers that are not working together. Rosa Vasquez was last seen on a Wednesday, May 26, 1973. Her lifeless body was found three days later on May 29 at the Golden Gate park this in San Francisco. She was 20 years old at the time of her death. She had been strangled and tossed into some shrubbery several feet off of the road. A month later, on June 10, the body of 15 year old Yvonne Quillen Tang was found in a vacant lot in Bayview, California. She was pregnant at the time and she had been on her way to the grocery store when she was met with foul play. Then we have 16 year old Angela Thomas of Daly City, California was found deceased on July 2, 1973, she had been smothered to death and left on the playground of the Benjamin Franklin Junior High School. She had last been seen walking away from the Presidio in San Francisco. At approximately 9pm a locket was discovered near the crime scene. Just a few weeks later, on July 15, the lifeless body of radiologist Nancy Gidley, age 24, was found behind the gym of George Washington High School in San Francisco. The victim, who had previously served in the Air Force, had been strangled. Nancy was nude and the only item recovered from the scene was a single gold earring in the shape of a fish. We've seen that movie before, haven't we Captain? Witnesses said she'd last been seen alive at a nearby Roadway Inn motel only three days prior to the discovery of her body. It would later emerge that Nancy, who had traveled to San Francisco from her home in Idaho, had lied to her family about the reasoning for her trip, the reasons for her trip. She had told her family members that she was going to San Francisco to be an attendant at a friend's wedding. And this turns out not to be true. So she's traveling, she's out on her own and somehow it met with foul play. It's not difficult to believe that she was in need of a ride. Just days later, on July 22, 23 year old Nancy Fusee of Sacramento, California disappeared. She was the mother of five children. Separated from her husband, she vanished after a night out of dancing at a nightclub called the Plumbers Hall. Terrible name. Fishermen discovered her nearly nude body at 6:30am alongside Pleasant Grove Road and Steel Head Creek in Redding. Her clothing was recovered at the scene, which is not something that we've seen at the other crime scenes. Nancy had suffered 29 stab wounds, again not consistent with the other crime scenes. Nancy had last been spotted alive a couple miles from the nightclub about three and a half hours before the discovery of her body. So very quickly her body is discovered after she's last seen. There were shoe prints and tire tracks that were found near the body. Which of course is telling the police that this probably is just a dump site and that Nancy was very likely killed elsewhere. Things fell quiet into the fall when 21 year old Laura Albright Odell of San Francisco was reported missing in November of 73, three days later. So she's reported missing November 4th. Three days later, her remains were discovered within some bushes behind the Stow Lake Boathouse in Golden Gate Park. Bushes in Golden Gate Park. That's something we've discussed before as well. Lore's hands had been Bound behind her back, and she had been strangled to death. In addition, the young woman had sustained serious head injuries.
- [57:26]
B
But this Santa Rosa connection to San Francisco, I mean, it's only. There's only 55 miles between them. And what's the best way to go between San Francisco and Santa Rosa? U.S. 101.
- [57:43]
C
So, yes, we. We see the 101 mentioned time and time again with the earlier victims, the 72 to 73 victims. And keep in mind, one of our victims worked down near that area in Lockspur, but was later found up near Santa Rosa. And what's weird about her case was she was hitchhiking, attempting to get to travel northbound from Larkspur up back to the Santa Rosa area.
- [58:17]
B
Right.
- [58:18]
C
So, I mean, there's. There is things to. And reasons to connect these. And obviously this is a statement from law enforcement where they're starting to connect these. They're not saying 100% they're all connected. They're saying, until we can figure out otherwise, we have to look at these all. All of these cases because of the similarities that they could be possibly connected. What I think I'm seeing here, Captain, is I think, not. Not to spoil the show here, but I do think that some of these are connected. I just don't know that all of them. It seems like a lot of activity, almost too much activity for them all to be 100% connected.
- [59:05]
B
Yeah, but we've seen with other investigations where they just lump a bunch of crimes together and then if they solve one or two, they go, well, it was most likely committed by the same person, but we don't have evidence of that so much a way that they can clear the books faster than they should.
- [59:26]
C
Well, and here they've not done a good job of closing any of the books because we're sitting here, right? The books are piling up.
- [59:34]
B
They're not focused on. On busting nuts and sucking butts.
- [59:38]
C
That's how. That's how you get things done. Jensen would tell you that. So, yeah, Jensen, let me throw one out to you that they included in this report that I think is very dissimilar from all of the cases that we've talked about. So it's all. It's so dissimilar that I wonder why they even included it in the report. Okay, so this goes from January 31, 1974. So it falls into the timeline, into the time frame, and the location also falls into the general area where we're talking about. So I get. While you. Why you would bring. Bring it up. But Listen to the report on this. Brenda K. Merchant, age 19. Victimology Age is very similar. She had dinner at the apartment that she shared with her boyfriend. His name is George Stewart. They together have a young son, a baby, an infant son. After dinner, as the report goes, George left the apartment around 6pm he comes home the following morning. George returned to the apartment to find his girlfriend. She's still in her nightgown, lying in a pool of blood in the living room. She's dead. Had been stabbed over 30 times. The baby, thank God, is okay, was fine, untouched, sleeping in his crib. Despite all of these stab wounds, Brenda had actually died of asphyxiation. She suffocated, choking to death on her own blood. There was a bloody handprint that was found at the scene. What we don't ever hear I. I wanted to find. Could you please somebody. God and Moses. Somebody show me and tell me that that bloody handprint, that partial print that you were able to determine that it did not belong to the husband. Because we know the murder took place in the apartment. We do understand that he has a alibi for the time in question. But this to me screams of a domestic situation. We have the neighbors all reporting that they had heard yelling, screaming arguments going on between 9pm and midnight. And then George returns the next morning to find his poor wife killed, baby untouched. I want to know. Nowhere in this report does it say that he was ruled out. But wouldn't that be the implication here if you're choosing to include this in your batch of victims that died at the hand of an unknown unidentified perpetrator?
- [62:29]
B
Right.
- [62:30]
C
I. I don't. This one to me smells of a bad alibi. Unless you can tell me that that's not his handprint. Nowhere did they ever that's. That would seal the deal that it's not con, that it's not him. But Nowhere ever in 50 years of reporting has anybody said that. So that one I. That one I would push to the side. My apologies to Brenda Kay and her family, but push that one to the side for the sake of what we're discussing here today. The Santa Rosa case, 1974, July also saw the finding of the remains of 14 year old Donna Braun. The teen's nude strangled body was found floating in the Salinas River. Her remains were discovered by a crop duster plane pilot at around 7pm on September 29, 1974. So she went missing July 29. Remains found several months later in September of 74. She had last been seen leaving home at 2am by her mother. Investigators have not ruled out the notion that Donna, who they thought to be a runaway, had actually known her killers, but also considered the possibility that she had been a victim of a serial killer. So that is also one that you might be able to push aside with their pointing out that she may have known her killers. Okay, so let's Doc brown our way ahead to 1978. This would be more than three years after the press conference and the release of the FBI report. And again, police were no closer to solving the mystery of the murdered and missing women. After 1975, the killings had seemingly stopped and gradually fear began to fade from the public consciousness. But residents would again become panic stricken when two more teens this is Carrie Ann Graham and Francine Marie Trimble, went missing from their Santa from the Santa rosa area on December 16, 1978. Carrie, age 15, and Francine, age 14, vanished after leaving home to go shopping at a Santa Rosa mall. They lived in Forestville, California. Their decomposed bodies would be discovered the first following July, about 80 miles north of Forestville. Their remains were discovered together at the bottom of an embankment in a heavily overgrown wooded area beside a remote section off of Highway 20, a dozen miles outside of the city of Willits.
- [65:24]
B
Stick around for our conclusion of the Santa Rosa murders. If you need more True Crime Garage for your earballs, check out our bonus content on Apple Podcasts or on Patreon. And until the next episode, be good.
- [65:40]
C
Be kind, and don't litter. Sam.
- [66:22]
B
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