Transcript

Tracy (0:00)

I realized when I sat down that I'm wearing the exact same outfit I wore last time two days ago. Yeah, it's winter and I'm into flannel shirts now because I'm always cold.

Patty (0:08)

It looks super warm.

Tracy (0:09)

It's very warm. I love it very much. But they almost all. I have like five of them and they almost all look exactly the same. But this is the exact same one I wore last time.

Patty (0:16)

Okay. So, you know, thank you for your.

Tracy (0:18)

Honesty, the tube of you. But you're gonna see a lot of this shirt in the next couple of weeks.

Patty (0:22)

We don't get a lot of honesty in this documentary, so I'm glad we're starting.

Tracy (0:26)

You know what? You and I, let's vow to be honest with each other.

Patty (0:28)

Look, no problem.

Tracy (0:31)

Okay. Hi, Jillian Benavalli.

Interviewee/Expert (0:39)

Hello.

Patty (0:39)

Patrick Hines, fam.

Tracy (0:41)

We have like over 210,000 subscribers on the tube of you. Please go watch our videos. They're so fun. Subscribe, join us there. They're just really. We are entertaining. I don't know what to tell you. That's what they say, you know?

Patty (0:53)

You know, I've heard tell.

Tracy (0:55)

Yeah, it's really fun. We also have a Discord.

Patty (0:57)

We have a Discord. It's a server and then there are channels within that server and it's all really fun. And we talk about documentaries and also anything else. Like there are all different channels for all different things.

Tracy (1:06)

Yeah. And so what do they do? How do they find it?

Patty (1:08)

We have it linked in the show notes, I believe.

Tracy (1:10)

Oh, that's true. Okay, great. So go do that. What are we talking about today?

Summary

True Crime Obsessed: Episode 484 – "Satan Wants You"

Release Date: February 10, 2026
Hosts: Tracy & Patty
Subject: Recap and discussion of the documentary Satan Wants You, focused on the origins of the “Satanic Panic” and its catalyst, the book Michelle Remembers.

Episode Overview

This episode delves into the documentary "Satan Wants You," exploring the genesis and devastating ripple effects of the Satanic Panic. Tracy and Patty use their signature blend of humor, empathy, and outrage to unpack how one dubious memoir, Michelle Remembers, kindled a cultural firestorm of fear, false memories, and wrongful accusations in the 1980s and 90s. The discussion exposes the dubious evidence, exploitative psychotherapy, media circus, and lasting consequences of this era.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Origins: Michelle Remembers and Dr. Lawrence Pazder

[01:14] Patty introduces Satan Wants You as a documentary about Michelle Remembers, highlighting its role in the birth of Satanic Panic:

"It's about the origin of satanic panic and like why we're here and all of the lies and bullshit that got us here." (Patty, 01:14)
[02:28] The hosts break down Michelle Remembers, co-authored by patient Michelle Smith and her psychiatrist Dr. Pazder, noting its extreme (and uncorroborated) claims of satanic ritual abuse, animal sacrifices, and more.
[04:18] Sarah Marshall (podcaster, contributor) calls Michelle Remembers "patient zero" of the panic.

2. The Therapy Sessions and Questionable Practices

[06:23] Michelle's memories were supposedly retrieved by self-hypnosis, with Dr. Pazder encouraging her to "go where you have to go. I'll be there with you."
(Michelle describing how her 'recovered' memories surface during therapy.)
Tracy and Patty critique the lack of skepticism from Dr. Pazder and emphasize the abuse inherent in leading patients through traumatic (often false) memories.

3. The Book’s Publishing and Cultural Fallout

[09:27] Details of Michelle’s “memories”: ritualistic abuse at five years old with her own mother present, deeply sensational and horrifying claims (sacrificial ceremonies, etc.).
[13:47] Patty notes, “It became an industry,” with financial incentives for spreading and perpetuating the Satanic Panic myth.
[27:14] The book’s massive advance:

"$245,000 US advance for the book. That's $930,000 in today's money." (Interviewee, 27:40)

4. The Media Frenzy and the Expansion of Panic

[28:04] Michelle and Pazder embark on a two-year media tour, appearing on TV shows later famous for sensational stories.
Talk show culture is critiqued:

"You go on television and say, I was part of this...they want the attention. They want to be FL To New York for the guest of the Rosie o' donnell show..." (Tracy, 55:31–55:40)
Sensational stories with zero proof proliferate, e.g., pizza delivery boy sacrificed, impossibly high missing child statistics:

"At one point, we get a statistic that there are 3 million kids born in the United States every year, 2 million of them are missing." (Tracy, 31:10)

5. Institutionalization and Pseudo-Expertise

Social workers, law enforcement, and even the FBI are swept up in the panic, attending workshops and seminars:

“Anybody can just say that they're an expert and now they can lead the seminar... and you get an actual certification.” (Tracy, 35:27)
Law enforcement resources are devoted to “identifying” satanic cult victims.

6. Family Testimonies and Exposing the Lies

Michelle’s sisters and family provide a counter-narrative:

“She was never missing for 14 months. My sister was never missing for 14 months. My mom had a really fucking hard life... Did not sacrifice any one of us.” (Tracy, 57:54)
Yearbooks, French language awards, and other evidence debunk Michelle’s claims.

7. The Psychologist’s Ambition and Abuse

Dr. Pazder’s motivations scrutinized:

“All it took was him seeing that [Sybil] movie to be like, I want to be that kind of psychiatrist.” (Tracy, 47:14)
Relationship between Pazder and Michelle devolves into boundary-violating obsession—grooming, emotional enmeshment, and eventual marriage (seen as mutual blackmail/protection).

8. Unintended (and Intended) Consequences

The real panic led to wrongful convictions, destroyed reputations, traumatized children, and shaped modern-day conspiracies like Pizzagate and QAnon.
The Catholic Church’s role as a funder and cheerleader for the book is discussed as part of the wider machinery of control and fear.
Insurance companies eventually stop covering therapy, lawsuits ensue, and the panic wanes, but the legacy continues in current conspiracy culture.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Host & Interviewee Highlights

On Michelle Remembers’ impact:

“I think of Michelle remembers as the patient zero of the satanic panic." (Sarah Marshall, 04:18)
On the 'evidence’ provided in the book:

"There isn't much doubt in my mind something definitely happened to her. And I do believe it was a group of Satanists." (Chidi, Church of Satan Rep, 16:44) “No, Piper. No, Piper. No, Piper.” (Patty reacting to Chidi’s certainty, 17:01)
On unconscionable therapy sessions:

"Have I been in the middle of a therapy session? I've been like, can we do a double? And Jeff is like, absolutely sure. But, like, that's less than two hours. Six hours?” (Tracy, 18:26)
On the media circus:

“Why isn't anyone being like, like...Because I don't think anybody believes it.” (Tracy, 54:26)
Gallows humor on the popularity of ‘experts’:

“If I could levitate, I would have levitated the fuck out of Arkansas.” (Quoting Damien, West Memphis Three, 35:47)

Family Counterpoints & Revelations

Family evidence:

“They go back to her grade school and ask them for the yearbook... Her picture was right there. They said the picture was taken in the fall. Well, she was supposed to be locked up.” (Debbie Nathan, 64:44)
French fluency debunked:

“She won an award for French in high school. Michelle is an award winning French speaker.” (Patty, 65:17)
Physical evidence missing:

“There should be scars from that, right? No, the angel Michael came and took all of her scars away.” (Tracy, 65:35)

Big Picture Insights

On confirmation bias and society’s complicity:

“We are way past trying to get proof of this. Yes, that ship has sailed. Now, these two people are experts to live in fear because your kids are going to get eaten and sacrificed.” (Patty, 31:01)
On the panic’s insidiousness:

“The panic was real. And that's the problem.” (Patty, 38:45)
Social media and conspiracy:

“And it's crazy because, like, TikTok, all of these social media platforms only make it worse because they will only feed you the information that you're seeking.” (Tracy, 69:51)

Important Timestamps & Segments

[01:14] – Introduction of documentary, “Satan Wants You”
[02:28] – Overview of Michelle Remembers’ plot, outlandish claims
[06:23] – Michelle’s memory-recovery ‘methods’; Dr. Pazder’s role
[09:27] – Michelle’s first “memory” of ritual abuse
[13:47] – Monetizing the book, creation of an “industry”
[27:14] – Book’s advance, global reach
[28:04] – PR blitz, "To Tell the Truth" game show appearance
[35:29] – Seminars, certifications, and “expert” industrial complex
[38:45] – Real panic and societal harm highlighted
[41:35] – Connection to McMartin Preschool case (covered extensively)
[54:26] – Media sensationalism, lack of skeptical questioning
[57:54] – Family testimony debunking Michelle’s story
[62:32] – Geraldo special and destructive reach
[67:04] – Discussion of “Go Ask Alice” and propaganda parallels
[68:56] – Insurance companies, lawsuits, and the end of the panic
[70:12] – Aftermath: death of Dr. Pazder, ongoing fallout

Tone and Style

The discussion is lively, irreverent, and frequently tongue-in-cheek, but always returns to a core of empathy for victims and skepticism toward institutions.
Running gags (Canadian names, the “Church of Satan” suing for defamation, drag queen “Remy Deroux”), meta commentary (e.g., on talk show guest culture, memories), and rapid conversational pivots keep the tone energetic and unpredictable.

Takeaways

Michelle Remembers and Dr. Pazder’s abuses of trust and power catalyzed decades of real-world harm, fueled by credulous institutions and a complicit media landscape.
The Satanic Panic’s mechanisms—moral panic, profit, confirmation bias, and institutional irresponsibility—remain alive today, simply rebranded in contemporary conspiracy movements.
Empathy and evidence, not fear and spectacle, are the only way out.

For a rich, full breakdown including personal anecdotes and plenty of gallows humor, listen to the full episode.

wavePod

484: Satan Wants You