Truer Crime – "When True Crime Becomes A Place You Can Visit"

Host: Celisia Stanton
Guest: Adam Paul Levine (Founder of Graveline Tours, Los Angeles)
Release Date: January 26, 2026

Episode Overview

This episode explores what happens when true crime stories move from the realm of media and imagination into the real, physical places where crimes occurred. Host Celisia Stanton engages with Adam Paul Levine, founder of Graveline Tours—a company that guides people through Los Angeles' most infamous crime scenes in restored vintage funeral limousines. Together, they reflect on why people are drawn to true crime, the ethics of storytelling, and how to honor real people and history without turning their tragedies into mere spectacle.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. True Crime Tourism: Bringing Stories to Real Places

• Adam describes Graveline Tours as combining traditional sightseeing with visits to crime scenes related to celebrity deaths and scandals—transporting guests in vintage funeral limousines rather than buses.
  • Quote (Adam, 06:03):
    "Instead of showing homes where celebrities live, we show homes where the celebrities were murdered, committed suicide, had overdoses, or some sort of a scandal."
• The original idea came from 1980s-90s LA grave tours using hearses, and Adam revived and updated the concept with technology (QR codes, galleries of photos).

2. Why Are People Drawn to True Crime?

• Both Celisia and Adam reflect on how trauma and a desire for vicarious safety draw people to true crime stories.
• Tours offer a way for people to face fear in a controlled environment—similar to the thrill of a rollercoaster.
  • Quote (Adam, 09:06):
    "I think that what I do have in common with other people that love true crime... is that we have unification that sometimes presents in the form of all of us have experienced some sort of a trauma in our lives and lived through it."

3. Tourism, Ethics & Exploitation

• The duo discusses the fine line between education, empathy, and exploitation in true crime tourism and media.
• Adam admits he didn't consider empathy at first when starting his tours but now sees honoring nuance and complexity as crucial.
• True crime narratives should resist simplistic good/evil dichotomies and accept the shades of grey, humanity, and the contexts behind crimes.
  • Quote (Adam, 14:15):
    "To do honor to any crime story, you have got to get it all out there... there’s good and bad and a million different shades of gray in every person."

4. Case Study: The Menendez Brothers

• The episode delves into the Menendez case, especially how sensationalism and media narratives (e.g., speculation about Eric Menendez’s sexuality) impacted public understanding and the trial itself.
• Adam explains the cultural context: the late 1980s/early 1990s, LGBTQ stigma fuelled by the AIDS crisis, and how prosecution teams weaponized these issues to sway opinion.
  • Quote (Adam, 21:33):
    "...Pam Bozanich, who was one of the prosecutors... decided that it would strengthen the case of the DA if they could make the potential argument for Eric being gay... it might imply in the juror's mind that the sex ... was not entirely forced."
• Celisia reflects on legal strategies that weaponize public opinion by circulating sensational narratives outside of court (26:12).

5. Pop-Culture & Modern Retellings: Ryan Murphy’s ‘Monster’ Series

• The Netflix series reignited interest in the Menendez case, particularly among younger audiences—a phenomenon boosted by social media.
• Adam is critical of how Ryan Murphy dramatizes and sensationalizes, blurring fact and fiction, especially around themes of sexuality and abuse.
  • Quote (Adam, 29:30): "My main bone to pick with Monsters in terms of accuracy... is that he takes something that has a kernel of truth and then he plays it up to sensationalize it... he juiced it up so much sexually.... as a gay guy who’s obsessed with true crime, I loved it, but it was completely misinformation."

6. The Menendez Family’s Background – Cycles of Abuse & Assimilation

• Both parents, Jose and Kitty Menendez, suffered childhood abuse that echoed through their parenting.
• Jose’s complicated relationship with his Cuban identity is discussed—his efforts to assimilate, even considering changing the family’s surname to "Joseph" to better fit into white American norms.
  • Quote (Adam, 39:08):
    "Jose had a very complicated relationship with his heritage... became more and more unwilling to be associated with his Cuban background."
• The episode examines how striving for status and assimilation shaped family dynamics and perhaps fueled underlying pathologies.

7. Intersecting Trials: Menendez & O.J. Simpson

• Adam and Celisia investigate the lesser-known personal ties and parallel themes between the Menendez and O.J. Simpson cases—both involving patriarchal dominance, family dynamics, and the LA elite’s intersection with race, status, and justice.
• The O.J. Simpson trial’s media frenzy eclipsed the Menendez story and directly influenced the brothers’ second trial. New legal rules severely restricted evidence about childhood abuse, limiting the defense and contributing to their conviction.
  • Quote (Adam, 46:12):
    "...the pressure from the District Attorney's office after the OJ trial was lost was so strong... it resulted in the rule changes that were imposed... as a result of that, the brothers really didn't have a fair trial."

8. Current Consequences and the Politics of Parole

• Despite public sympathy increasing and appeals for retrial or parole, both Menendez brothers remain incarcerated—decisions which Adam argues are heavily politicized and driven by the current DA’s desire to appear ‘tough on crime.’
  • Quote (Adam, 52:33):
    "I am convinced personally... you have this real clamp down, maybe breaking some of the rules to ensure that that humiliation is undone and the district attorney’s power remains unchallenged so that they can get reelected."
• Adam contrasts the denial of Menendez parole with other infamous inmates who have received more consideration, highlighting how cultural memory and politics shape justice.

9. Ethics, Empathy, and Storytelling

• The episode ends on a call for more ethical, nuanced storytelling in true crime—honoring the humanity on all sides, resisting sensationalism, and asking hard questions about complicity and spectacle.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments (with Timestamps)

• On the draw of true crime (Adam):
  "We can experience the true crime without actually being hurt, without actually being vulnerable, and then we can be safe again. It's almost like going on a roller coaster." (08:13)
• On the ethics of storytelling (Adam):
  "Nothing is going to undo a murder... but what you can do is ... understand it as deeply as you can." (14:32)
• On the Menendez trials and sexuality (Adam):
  "Her main source ... was that she heard from a prison guard that there was something going on one day with Eric in the prison showers, which is the genesis of that scene in Monsters, the nudity scene, which Ryan Murphy completely took to, like, a whole new level." (23:45)
• On Ryan Murphy’s series (Adam):
  "As a gay guy who's obsessed with true crime, I loved it, but it was completely misinformation." (30:44)
• On the intergenerational nature of abuse (Adam):
  "Abuse rarely is something that is not carried on between generations." (33:48)
• On the influence of the O.J. case (Adam):
  "...the brothers really didn't have a fair trial...the second trial was definitively rigged. And that is something that should never be forgotten." (49:22)
• On parole and politics (Adam):
  "It's really, really sad when we've come to a place where justice has to take second place to political concerns. But unfortunately... it's a very harsh reality of the world that you and I work in and that we all live in." (55:29)
• Adam's self-aware humor:
  "If anyone's obsessed with me, don't learn more because I assure you will become bored." (56:05)

Important Segment Timestamps

• Intro & context (Minneapolis): 00:00 – 04:57
• Adam explains Graveline Tours: 06:03 – 09:45
• Tourism, trauma & true crime: 09:45 – 14:15
• Ethics of exploitation: 13:15 – 15:47
• Menendez and O.J. case overlap: 16:27 – 19:54
• Media & sexuality in Menendez coverage: 19:54 – 26:12
• Ryan Murphy’s "Monster" series: 26:12 – 32:05
• Jose & Kitty’s backgrounds/cycles of abuse: 33:47 – 39:08
• Assimilation & identity (Jose’s heritage): 39:08 – 44:15
• O.J. trial's impact on Menendez retrial: 44:15 – 51:04
• Current parole politics: 51:04 – 55:44
• Outro & where to find Graveline Tours: 56:04 – 57:07

Tone & Takeaway

The conversation is thoughtful, empathetic, and curious—balancing critical questions about responsibility and spectacle in true crime with a real passion for history and for honoring the nuance of people’s lives. Both Celisia and Adam are self-reflective about the complexities of their own roles as storytellers and guides through the uncomfortable, often sensationalized narratives that shape public understanding of crime.

Where to Find More

• Graveline Tours: graveline.rip
• Social Media: @GravelineTours (IG / TikTok / YouTube)
• Host: @lisastanton (Instagram)
• Show: @truercrimepod (Instagram/X), truercrime.substack.com

Final Note:
This episode ultimately calls for a more responsible, ethics-driven approach to true crime stories—whether as tourists, podcasters, or members of a culture endlessly fascinated by crime and its shadows.